# shuffling



## Bdj (Oct 29, 2014)

Please tell me what shuffling means. I need to know. Thanks in advance.


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Bdj said:


> Please tell me what shuffling means. I need to know. Thanks in advance.


The basic def is to allow the five minute clock to run out, thereby collecting the time out fee.

There are variations, and enhancements ... but, that's the basic definition.


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## Whosyourdaddy (9 mo ago)

Bdj said:


> Please tell me what shuffling means. I need to know. Thanks in advance.


It's what the casino does just before they take all your money


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## Atavar (Aug 11, 2018)

Shuffling also implies underhanded doings like hiding around the corner or driving around the block and hitting cancel as you pass by the pickup spot. The intent is to get a cancel fee without giving the pax an honest chance of getting in the car.
Some drivers have been known to go so far as to park down the block then walk to the pickup spot with their phone to cancel. 
It sounds like a lot of work for a cancel fee to me.


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## Jcedwards3232 (Jul 7, 2018)

An example would be when I got a request from the Hospital earlier today and it took me to a location near the door but not directly in front of it. I called the rider who proceeded to quickly say are you at the front door because I am at the front. He then told me the ride was for his grandmother. I tried to explain to him where the app directed me to go but he had already hung up. I then let the time run out canceled and collected my no show fee. Don’t hang up on me when I am trying to find you because I immediately lose interest in doing so.


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## Be Right There (9 mo ago)

Atavar said:


> Shuffling also implies underhanded doings like hiding around the corner or driving around the block and hitting cancel as you pass by the pickup spot. The intent is to get a cancel fee without giving the pax an honest chance of getting in the car.
> Some drivers have been known to go so far as to park down the block then walk to the pickup spot with their phone to cancel.
> It sounds like a lot of work for a cancel fee to me.


While I'd never do anything so underhanded and dishonest, I'll put the car in drive around the 4:40 mark and start to slowly move away from the pickup spot. My cancel finger gets really itchy by that point.


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## Illini (Mar 14, 2019)

Bdj said:


> Please tell me what shuffling means. I need to know. Thanks in advance.


Why do you "need" to know?


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## circuitsports (Apr 19, 2020)

its code for far left foot fetishes involving used socks and mustard.


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

I used to have a guy that would put the order in for Uber from inside the WalMart. He was always way at the back of the store, and would make me wait two or three minutes till he came out.
I know ... WalMart ... I was a young ant then. I hadden't fully figured it out yet.

But, I couldn't get the timer to start till I pulled around to where the loading docks were. Then I'd sit. Tick tick. About two minutes in I'd get the 'where are you' text. I'd **** with him for the next two or three. "I am here. Where are you?"
Tick tick.

Finally it would be TICK TICK BOOM. 

Did it to him four or five times over the course of a month or so.
My favorite WalMart run.

I finally figured out that WalMart wasn't worth it. Didn't even take WMs any more. But HIS were profitable.

That's what I meant when I said there are many variations, and fancy iterations ... but a shuffle is basically running down the clock to get the canx fee.

If I didn't do ONE shuffle every hour I figured I wasn't doing my job. It paid for the gas. My own tip system.




:


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## Seamus (Jun 21, 2018)

What most describe as a shuffle is way too nice and would barely count as a real shuffle in historical terms. A true shuffle involves intent. Not intending to give a ride and hiding until the timer expires.

What we call a shuffle today evolved from the “Shirlington Shuffle”, the OG. (Nod to the DC Crew).

The best, most impressive shuffling is done without even ever being in a car, never driving to a pickup. 

Long ago I gave up on Uber Support when I get screwed out of money that they clearly owe me. My first occurred when Uber did not pay me a bonus I earned. I uselessly spent days documenting that they clearly owed me the bonus. Then I gave up and decided I would Shirlington Shuffle until I got what they owed me. I sat down at a bar, ordered a beer and shuffled until I got my money back whilst enjoying a few.

Several months later Uber blatantly screwed me out of money again. I got a nice hot coffee and a bagel and sat on a park bench. Shuffled my money back.

Most I’ve done didn’t start out with intent. I arrived at a pick up only to see too many people, no car seat, a mangy dog, a pre-puking drunk, or some other reason that made me decide not to give the ride but still get paid for my efforts.

You get the idea. Intent.


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

Shuffling


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## Uber's Guber (Oct 22, 2017)

Bdj said:


> Please tell me what shuffling means.


It means you get paid for keeping the back seat clean and free of trash.


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## SJUberLyftDriver2016 (Jan 25, 2016)

New2This said:


> Shuffling
> 
> View attachment 658778


so you were online for over 3 hours and made 60 bucks. so 15-18 bucks an hour. you can argue that it was free money and you didnt do sh1t, but i would rather actually drive people and make 40-50 an hour, or 60 like today.

i spent probably the same amount of time online as you today... maybe slightly less. you can say oh but you risked getting vomit and your car a mess; and while that is true, but men lie, women lie, numbers don't lie.


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## Seaside_Slider (9 mo ago)

It’s basically just a ***** move used by “drivers” who desperately need that $3.80 cancel fee.


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## Classical Telecaster (Dec 12, 2019)

Seaside_Slider said:


> It’s basically just a *** move used by “drivers” who desperately need that $3.80 cancel fee.













This was was not an intended shuffle, but it was a long pickup on a Friday evening. 

Walmarts are turning into a battle similar to Spy versus Spy in Mad Magazine. Recently pings started showing up as McD’s at such and such address. Cannot fool me, that is the McD’s in the Walmart. I accept, but the pax better be waiting for me. 

In my market WM is the breeding ground for pax scammers. When I am in my bright red Escape with trade dress and within 20’ of the pax and they start texting “where are you?” It is time for that swinging rhythm of the Walmart Shuffle.


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## 25rides7daysaweek (Nov 20, 2017)

SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> so you were online for over 3 hours and made 60 bucks. so 15-18 bucks an hour. you can argue that it was free money and you didnt do sh1t, but i would rather actually drive people and make 40-50 an hour, or 60 like today.
> 
> i spent probably the same amount of time online as you today... maybe slightly less. you can say oh but you risked getting vomit and your car a mess; and while that is true, but men lie, women lie, numbers don't lie.
> View attachment 658792


@New2This understands exacting vengeance
has a cost and if its the pax that get hurt it's their own fault for dealing with a company as greasy as uber.
Well that and probably not giving a cash up front tip 😉


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

25rides7daysaweek said:


> @New2This understands exacting vengeance
> has a cost and if its the pax that get hurt it's their own fault for dealing with a company as greasy as uber.
> Well that and probably not giving a cash up front tip 😉


When I get screwed over by Uber I Shuffle to get made whole.

I Shuffle the amount Uber owes me then I Shuffle that amount again as Uber's penance.


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## SJUberLyftDriver2016 (Jan 25, 2016)

25rides7daysaweek said:


> @New2This understands exacting vengeance
> has a cost and if its the pax that get hurt it's their own fault for dealing with a company as greasy as uber.
> Well that and probably not giving a cash up front tip 😉


what cost? from the looks of it, it hurts you a lot more than them. instead of making 40-50 an hour, you made less than half of that. so instead of 120-150 bucks, you made 60. you know what the pax is gonna do after you "shuffle" them? order another ride. oooooooo you made them wait an extra 5 min... all while cheating yourself out of 60-90 bucks. who loses? YOU DO.


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> what cost? from the looks of it, it hurts you a lot more than them. instead of making 40-50 an hour, you made less than half of that. so instead of 120-150 bucks, you made 60. you know what the pax is gonna do after you "shuffle" them? order another ride. oooooooo you made them wait an extra 5 min... all while cheating yourself out of 60-90 bucks. who loses? YOU DO.


Zero miles driven.

That screenshot was done at a Meetup whilst upon a barstool.


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## 25rides7daysaweek (Nov 20, 2017)

New2This said:


> Zero miles driven.
> 
> That screenshot was done at a Meetup whilst upon a barstool.


Wouldnt it have been hilarious if someone
shuffled you when you tried to get a ride home?


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## Bdj (Oct 29, 2014)

Illini said:


> Why do you "need" to know?


Because Lyft screwed me out of $50 bucks and I want to even up.


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## Bdj (Oct 29, 2014)

Seamus said:


> What most describe as a shuffle is way too nice and would barely count as a real shuffle in historical terms. A true shuffle involves intent. Not intending to give a ride and hiding until the timer expires.
> 
> What we call a shuffle today evolved from the “Shirlington Shuffle”, the OG. (Nod to the DC Crew).
> 
> ...


 Please explain how I do the Shirlington Shuffle. I want my $$ back from Lyft.


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## Bdj (Oct 29, 2014)

SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> so you were online for over 3 hours and made 60 bucks. so 15-18 bucks an hour. you can argue that it was free money and you didnt do sh1t, but i would rather actually drive people and make 40-50 an hour, or 60 like today.
> 
> i spent probably the same amount of time online as you today... maybe slightly less. you can say oh but you risked getting vomit and your car a mess; and while that is true, but men lie, women lie, numbers don't lie.
> View attachment 658792


Very nice. I average about $30 here in Detroit.


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## Rideshare Dude (Aug 27, 2020)

Seamus said:


> What most describe as a shuffle is way too nice and would barely count as a real shuffle in historical terms. A true shuffle involves intent. Not intending to give a ride and hiding until the timer expires.
> 
> What we call a shuffle today evolved from the “Shirlington Shuffle”, the OG. (Nod to the DC Crew).
> 
> ...


Must be a market specific thing. We don’t get a cancel fee unless we make progress toward the pax. Been like that for years.


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

Rideshare Dude said:


> Must be a market specific thing. We don’t get a cancel fee unless we make progress toward the pax. Been like that for years.


If you go to a very busy area with lots of restaurants it's a breeze.

Alternatively you can employ Bike Shuffles. Nothing like getting paid to exercise.


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## Seamus (Jun 21, 2018)

Rideshare Dude said:


> Must be a market specific thing. We don’t get a cancel fee unless we make progress toward the pax. Been like that for years.


No need to make progress if your already there!!!


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## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

Jcedwards3232 said:


> I tried to explain to him where the app directed me to go but he had already hung up. I then let the time run out canceled and collected my no show fee.


Here's what happened to my Significant Other twice this past Monday.

The S.O. had jury duty and got released in the middle of the day. Requested a ride from Uber.

The driver kept going around the block. The S.O. called the driver and said "I'm right in front of the jury assembly room entrance."

So the driver says "That's not where the app said to go." And keeps going around the block. And around the block again.

Now, on what planet does that actually make sense?

So my SO called me at home, and I said "I'll come get you."

Apparently they don't actually want to pick up a rider. Kind of difficult to make any money when all you do is drive to the pickup point, and then not actually let anyone get into your car.


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## SJUberLyftDriver2016 (Jan 25, 2016)

Christinebitg said:


> Here's what happened to my Significant Other twice this past Monday.
> 
> The S.O. had jury duty and got released in the middle of the day. Requested a ride from Uber.
> 
> ...


i made a thread while back where i don't understand the purpose of shuffling. if its some entitled dbag or karen, i get it, but lets say you spent 5 min driving to pax location to where the timer starts counting down, then you wait out the 5 min to earn a cancellation fee, so 10 min spent... made 3.75 for the cancellation. lets say in a perfect world, you can do 5-6 of these an hour. you're sitting at 15-20 bucks an hour, and honestly if thats your hourly take doing uber, then ya might wanna consider another profession, because you will most likely be below minimum wage threshold after vehicle operating costs and expenses.


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## SJUberLyftDriver2016 (Jan 25, 2016)

New2This said:


> Zero miles driven.
> 
> That screenshot was done at a Meetup whilst upon a barstool.


not true. you still drove in route to customers pickup location. so still miles were driven. i have a hard time believing you can sit on a bar stool, get that many trips at EXACTLY the same bar you are where you don't have to move an inch to where the timer starts to count down.. if so, proof.


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## CJfrom619 (Apr 27, 2017)

SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> i made a thread while back where i don't understand the purpose of shuffling. if its some entitled dbag or karen, i get it, but lets say you spent 5 min driving to pax location to where the timer starts counting down, then you wait out the 5 min to earn a cancellation fee, so 10 min spent... made 3.75 for the cancellation. lets say in a perfect world, you can do 5-6 of these an hour. you're sitting at 15-20 bucks an hour, and honestly if thats your hourly take doing uber, then ya might wanna consider another profession, because you will most likely be below minimum wage threshold after vehicle operating costs and expenses.


You have to understand that these drivers don't actually drive to the pickup though??

Let's say I went to a popular casino tonight and spent 3 or 4 hours there..now say I have my app on the entire time taking any request from the casino I'm currently at. Now I'm already at the pickup so the timer starts as soon as the requests is takin. You wait 5 minutes. Ignore a few phone calls and messages and there you go. I'm sure if you were there for 3 or 4 hours then you could probably do this a few times. This is what most would call a true shuffle. Not saying I have done this just explaining to you how some could do it without wasting gas and to much time.


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> not true. you still drove in route to customers pickup location. so still miles were driven. i have a hard time believing you can sit on a bar stool, get that many trips at EXACTLY the same bar you are where you don't have to move an inch to where the timer starts to count down.. if so, proof.


Ok there was slight walking involved occasionally. 

We had numerous Meetups in the Shirligton area of Arlington VA at a place called Samuel Beckett's, circled in red.










There were maybe a dozen more restaurants and bars not shown on the map above. It was VERY easy to get ping after ping and never have to go far.

Do a search of the D.C. Board using "Samuel Beckett's" or "Meetup" keywords.


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## Juggalo9er (Dec 7, 2017)

Ok but listen there are "correct"ways to shuffle...
Have two cars, use one that's not on your account
Wanna piss pax off .. Let them see you but keep the doors locked.... Who's cares if they try and open the door....
Park near the busiest bar in town and accept everything... Don't ever move the car

Those airport pax got you down.... Accept their trip requests and when you get to pick up... No matter their destination say you can't go there and profusely apologize... Let them know you'll make sure they don't get charged... Collect cancel fee


Btw Evan Williams isn't all that bad... Not good but not bad


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## SJUberLyftDriver2016 (Jan 25, 2016)

CJfrom619 said:


> You have to understand that these drivers don't actually drive to the pickup though??
> 
> Let's say I went to a popular casino tonight and spent 3 or 4 hours there..now say I have my app on the entire time taking any request from the casino I'm currently at. Now I'm already at the pickup so the timer starts as soon as the requests is takin. You wait 5 minutes. Ignore a few phone calls and messages and there you go. I'm sure if you were there for 3 or 4 hours then you could probably do this a few times. This is what most would call a true shuffle. Not saying I have done this just explaining to you how some could do it without wasting gas and to much time.


casino is usually a very large property with lots of traffic (and ride requests). some hole in the wall bar is not going to offer you the same. certainly not 15-20 trips worth in a couple hours from EXACTLY the same bar.


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## DriveLV (Aug 21, 2019)

Juggalo9er said:


> Those airport pax got you down.... Accept their trip requests and when you get to pick up... No matter their destination say you can't go there and profusely apologize... Let them know you'll make sure they don't get charged... Collect cancel fee


I actually did that accidently once. Asked pax for their name for confirmation, loaded luggage in the trunk and guys got in the car, I swiped to start the ride and start to pull out of the space. I start to say "just to confirm we're going to 123 Elm Street?"

One guy says "Oh damn, that's my old address - weird. Good thing you confirmed. We're going to *___*." I tell him to update in the app while I start to put it into Waze. In Waze I realize it's a 35 min drive, where I likely wouldn't get another ping.

I say "oh man. I'm sorry - I can't go all the way up there. I had a filter on to go toward home after. Wife is heading to work and I have to be home to watch the kids. This ride would make me late." FYI - filters don't work for our airport, and I don't have kids/wife. I just really didn't want this ride.

The guy was totally cool and said he was really sorry and he understood. I had stopped near the exit for the Airport pickup area and can't backup. They would have either had to walk back to the pickup area or I'd have to drive all around the airport to circle back and drop them. The were really cool guys, so I tell them I'll cancel with no cancellation fee, and I'll drop them at a drugstore outside the airport. It'll be cheaper for them to get a ride from there anyway (airport had a surge).

I swipe to end the ride (since I can't cancel) and I truly assumed it would be no charge to pax (I had an instant pickup/dropoff once where I booted the rider for their behavior before I even put the car in gear, and got paid $0 - I was pissed).

Drop the guys at the drugstore, the guy gives me a $20 and thanks me profusely - apologizing again for the mixup.

I later check the app - and I got paid $15 for the ride (some minimal fare for the 200 feet I drove + the surge) PLUS the $20 cash tip. $35 - not bad for what was essentially a cancellation.


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## CJfrom619 (Apr 27, 2017)

SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> casino is usually a very large property with lots of traffic (and ride requests). some hole in the wall bar is not going to offer you the same. certainly not 15-20 trips worth in a couple hours from EXACTLY the same bar.


You might be right about a hole in the wall bar. Probably not too many requests fly8ng out but a popular bar on a Friday night would probably work. I'm sure most drivers do this at an event they are going too. It would be very easy at a big big concert or event. 

I don't have any experience in this as I don't look to cancel rides. I am more on the lines of the way you think. I'm always looking to maximize my time. Just wanted to explain to you how some do it.


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## OldBay (Apr 1, 2019)

A shuffle is what you do when the passenger(s) don't meet their end of the bargain. Too many passengers, open drink, luggage that won't fit in UberX, etc. If you cancel, you are out all the time/expense of the pickup which kills your earnings. A shuffle is where you recoup $5 by waiting out the timer. Instead of arguing with customer, you have to drive to a place where they can't be picked up.


There are so many variations of bad passengers that you have to shuffle. But most of the time, its lack of courtesy, Its a $3.50 trip down the street, and they aren't there when you arrive to pickup. Shuffle.


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## OldBay (Apr 1, 2019)

SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> i made a thread while back where i don't understand the purpose of shuffling. if its some entitled dbag or karen, i get it, but lets say you spent 5 min driving to pax location to where the timer starts counting down, then you wait out the 5 min to earn a cancellation fee, so 10 min spent... made 3.75 for the cancellation. lets say in a perfect world, you can do 5-6 of these an hour. you're sitting at 15-20 bucks an hour, and honestly if thats your hourly take doing uber, then ya might wanna consider another profession, because you will most likely be below minimum wage threshold after vehicle operating costs and expenses.


Enter multi-apping. While you are shuffling, you accept a ride on the other platform and the shuffle is a nice $5 bonus.


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## Phoenix123 (Sep 2, 2016)

Bdj said:


> Very nice. I average about $30 here in Detroit.


There was a promotion in there from the week after he gave so many rides, he did not really make that per hour... oh the deception....


SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> so you were online for over 3 hours and made 60 bucks. so 15-18 bucks an hour. you can argue that it was free money and you didnt do sh1t, but i would rather actually drive people and make 40-50 an hour, or 60 like today.
> 
> i spent probably the same amount of time online as you today... maybe slightly less. you can say oh but you risked getting vomit and your car a mess; and while that is true, but men lie, women lie, numbers don't lie.
> View attachment 658792


 🤷‍♂️


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

New2This said:


> Shuffling
> 
> View attachment 658778


So that's 12 *consecutive* accepted and then driver-cancelled trips?

And *nobody* from Uber raised an eyebrow and tried to temporarily block your account?

Color me confused.


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

Heisenburger said:


> So that's 12 *consecutive* accepted and then driver-cancelled trips?
> 
> And *nobody* from Uber raised an eyebrow and tried to temporarily block your account?
> 
> Color me confused.


16 actually but nope.


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

New2This said:


> 16 actually but nope.


Not saying you're lying, but I'm really struggling to conceive that a tightwad company like Uber doesn't have some sort of alert for them on a day like this because that's a huge anomaly for any neighborhood in any US market.


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## DriveLV (Aug 21, 2019)

Heisenburger said:


> Not saying you're lying, but I'm really struggling to conceive that a tightwad company like Uber doesn't have some sort of alert for them on a day like this because that's a huge anomaly for any neighborhood in any US market.


I’ve had 10 legit cancels in a row multiple times. Las Vegas. Drunk / dumb people who can’t find the designated pickup locations. People who insist on being picked up on the strip (illegal) or at the taxi pickup area/valet (prohibited) instead of the designated spot.

That said, it does seem extreme in any other city.


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## Juggalo9er (Dec 7, 2017)

New2This said:


> 16 actually but nope.


Such a beautiful kill streak..... I'm jealous


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

DriveLV said:


> I’ve had 10 legit cancels in a row multiple times. Las Vegas. Drunk / dumb people who can’t find the designated pickup locations. People who insist on being picked up on the strip (illegal) or at the taxi pickup area/valet (prohibited) instead of the designated spot.
> 
> That said, it does seem extreme in any other city.


I'm merely envisioning the sheer improbability of 16 *consecutive* no-shows. At an absolute minimum of a five minute timer elapsed for each one, that's 80+ minutes of sitting still and zero rides starting after 16 accepted trips.

I'm in the Atlanta market and I've never seen anything remotely close. Perhaps 3 consecutive no-shows at the highest.

Just seems highly suspicious that Uber is clueless to this. I don't think Uber wouldn't be keen to the jig.


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## Seamus (Jun 21, 2018)

Heisenburger said:


> I'm merely envisioning the sheer improbability of 16 *consecutive* no-shows. At an absolute minimum of a five minute timer elapsed for each one, that's 80+ minutes of sitting still and zero rides starting after 16 accepted trips.
> 
> I'm in the Atlanta market and I've never seen anything remotely close. Perhaps 3 consecutive no-shows at the highest.
> 
> Just seems highly suspicious that Uber is clueless to this. I don't think Uber wouldn't be keen to the jig.


This is not an exaggeration on anyone’s part. Several well known members have posted the same. There have even been “shuffle parties” at region meet ups. As hard as it might be for you to imagine it’s real.

There used to be a lot of manipulation drivers could do (like create surges) that have fallen by the wayside. At certain points Uber’s AI got too good and was able to stop it. For whatever reason I don’t know, they have never been able to stop shuffling until it’s gotten ridiculous. There is a member on here who gave NO rides only shuffles and it took 3-4 months to catch up and get deactivated.


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## Juggalo9er (Dec 7, 2017)

Heisenburger said:


> I'm merely envisioning the sheer improbability of 16 *consecutive* no-shows. At an absolute minimum of a five minute timer elapsed for each one, that's 80+ minutes of sitting still and zero rides starting after 16 accepted trips.
> 
> I'm in the Atlanta market and I've never seen anything remotely close. Perhaps 3 consecutive no-shows at the highest.
> 
> Just seems highly suspicious that Uber is clueless to this. I don't think Uber wouldn't be keen to the jig.





Seamus said:


> This is not an exaggeration on anyone’s part. Several well known members have posted the same. There have even been “shuffle parties” at region meet ups. As hard as it might be for you to imagine it’s real.
> 
> There used to be a lot of manipulation drivers could do (like create surges) that have fallen by the wayside. At certain points Uber’s AI got too good and was able to stop it. For whatever reason I don’t know, they have never been able to stop shuffling until it’s gotten ridiculous. There is a member on here who gave NO rides only shuffles and it took 3-4 months to catch up and get deactivated.


Meeeeee


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

Seamus said:


> There is a member on here who gave NO rides only shuffles and it took 3-4 months to catch up and get deactivated.


From the same app developer who moves users offline after either ignoring or declining two consecutive requests... every single time without fail?

Truly tough to believe that particular story. I call BS on that one story being on a single user account and allege that it's being pushed as some urban myth. Of course, I concede that screenshots wouldn't even suffice as evidence as those *could* be manipulated. Obviously, I can't prove that it didn't happen but anyone would be a true sucker to try it themselves just to see if worked for a few months. They'd sooner than later discover what deactivation is.


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## Juggalo9er (Dec 7, 2017)

Heisenburger said:


> From the same app developer who moves users offline after either ignoring or declining two consecutive requests... every single time without fail?
> 
> Truly tough to believe that particular story. I call BS on that one story being on a single user account and allege that it's being pushed as some urban myth. Of course, I concede that screenshots wouldn't even suffice as evidence as those *could* be manipulated. Obviously, I can't prove that it didn't happen but anyone would be a true sucker to try it themselves just to see if worked for a few months. They'd sooner than later discover what deactivation is.


I shuffled on Lyft for months before getting deactivated...I paid for gas in my boat all summer doing it


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

Juggalo9er said:


> I shuffled on Lyft for months before getting deactivated...I paid for gas in my boat all summer doing it


Congratulations!

Attention would be suckers reading this thread:

Please take note of what you *might* be able to accomplish. But if you try it and fail by getting deactivated on your second day of trying it, don't cry your tears here.


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## Juggalo9er (Dec 7, 2017)

Heisenburger said:


> Congratulations!
> 
> Attention would be suckers reading this thread:
> 
> Please take note of what you *might* be able to accomplish. But if you try it and fail by getting deactivated on your second day of trying it, don't cry your tears here.


I was a good ant for a few years....I only gamedc surges on occasion


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## DRB720 (Nov 5, 2018)

Classical Telecaster said:


> View attachment 658799
> 
> 
> 
> ...


At least they use the Queen's English. A couple times in my area (Jersey Shore) I've received a text of "Wya" or somebody calling and saying the same. I don't look like somebody who responds well to "where you at?" and I generally don't pick in places where people use this vernacular.


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Juggalo9er said:


> I was a good ant for a few years....I only gamedc surges on occasion


I used to cover my gas bill shuffling.
If I didn't do one an hour, I figured I wasn't doing my job.

My personal best was THREE shuffles on ONE pax, in a row.
LoL.

He was a d!ck, and deserved it.
A doctor, local hospital. I was supposed to be impressed ... Oh, I was. 
LoL

#good times


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## SJUberLyftDriver2016 (Jan 25, 2016)

so you guys are risking deactivation for earning a measly 3.75 and waiting 5 min. why not start the trip, drive around the block, end trip 1 star. yeah occasionally you will get the retaliatory 1 star. thats fine. in my market minimum payout is 5.20 for any completed trip. if i happen to be in a promotion zone where im getting $4 per additional trip, ill get 9.20... the only way that amount gets subtracted back from your earnings is if the customer goes and contacts uber support and wastes their own time the same way we do when we try and call support to get earnings adjusted. 

done this about 20 times. had 1 (indian) customer do it. so 95 percent success rate. making 9.20 and done in about 3 min versus 5. if i get a trip request and im there and within the first 2 min before it says (charging rider for wait time), you're not out to my car, and you haven't contacted me in the app to say on my way, ill start the trip drive around the block end trip and 1 star your azz.


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## Juggalo9er (Dec 7, 2017)

SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> so you guys are risking deactivation for earning a measly 3.75 and waiting 5 min. why not start the trip, drive around the block, end trip 1 star. yeah occasionally you will get the retaliatory 1 star. thats fine. in my market minimum payout is 5.20 for any completed trip. if i happen to be in a promotion zone where im getting $4 per additional trip, ill get 9.20... the only way that amount gets subtracted back from your earnings is if the customer goes and contacts uber support and wastes their own time the same way we do when we try and call support to get earnings adjusted.
> 
> done this about 20 times. had 1 (indian) customer do it. so 95 percent success rate. making 9.20 and done in about 3 min versus 5. if i get a trip request and im there and within the first 2 min before it says (charging rider for wait time), you're not out to my car, and you haven't contacted me in the app to say on my way, ill start the trip drive around the block end trip and 1 star your azz.


Look up the rates in traverse city for cancelling....
With Lyft if you take a round about way to the PAxhole a shuffle can pay quite well


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## SJUberLyftDriver2016 (Jan 25, 2016)

Juggalo9er said:


> Look up the rates in traverse city for cancelling....
> With Lyft if you take a round about way to the PAxhole a shuffle can pay quite well



don't have access to lyft. got deactivated many years ago back in the day when uber was giving those 40-50 bucks an hour if you do at least 1 trip and maintain 50 min online and lyft had the same promo, but lyft's was contingent on acceptance rating. after hitting my ride an hour, i would accept the following pings and force the pax to cancel while being simultaneously logged into uber hitting 1 ride an hour and my 40-50 an hour for the bonus there too. was making like 80-100/hr at the time double dipping. quite proud of that actually.

but new2this was posting about his 60 bucks worth of cancels, in 3+ hours time... like i said, that equates to around 18 an hour... which in my market would be below minimum wage. also in my market, where a cancel pays 3.75. you would need about 18 of them to hit 60 bucks, and outside of the airport, theres not a single place i can think of where you can literally sit there and get 18 trips in a row from the same spot within a 3 hour time span where you could start the countdown timer without moving. obviously each market is different.


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## Mad_Jack_Flint (Nov 19, 2020)

If I want to really do all I have to do is sit outside or near Minute Maid Park and wait for the pings to roll in and the shuffle begins!!!

Easiest money and never worrying…

The other day sent a text to the guy and he did not respond and he waited ten seconds before I could cancel to notify me the trailer he was in and I just waited at my spot and canceled because you do not do nonsense like that…


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## SJUberLyftDriver2016 (Jan 25, 2016)

Mad_Jack_Flint said:


> If I want to really do all I have to do is sit outside or near Minute Maid Park and wait for the pings to roll in and the shuffle begins!!!
> 
> Easiest money and never worrying…
> 
> The other day sent a text to the guy and he did not respond and he waited ten seconds before I could cancel to notify me the trailer he was in and I just waited at my spot and canceled because you do not do nonsense like that…


obviously, that is a deserved cancel, but im not wasting my time to make 18/hr even if its sitting on my a## monitoring pings that come in.


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## Mad_Jack_Flint (Nov 19, 2020)

SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> obviously, that is a deserved cancel, but im not wasting my time to make 18/hr even if its sitting on my a## monitoring pings that come in.


Let do the math and I am sitting outside or near Minute Maid park and the shuffle is every five minutes and I average 3.88 x 12 ( every five minutes ) you can see the amount you can make in a shuffle if done correctly…

Now you run a risk of getting a Pax but then you made money either way…


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## SJUberLyftDriver2016 (Jan 25, 2016)

Mad_Jack_Flint said:


> Let do the math and I am sitting outside or near Minute Maid park and the shuffle is every five minutes and I average 3.88 x 12 ( every five minutes ) you can see the amount you can make in a shuffle if done correctly…
> 
> Now you run a risk of getting a Pax but then you made money either way…


here, at any stadium event (levi's stadium, chase center etc), there is a designated ride share pickup zone usually adjacent to the stadium... you have to pull in there (you can get cited for just pulling over on the street and trying to pick up or drop off). now. if you pull in there and just sit in your car, you will be forced to move by the people who work that lot... not to mention you run the risk of your pax spotting your car and getting in before the 5 min timer. i guess the other option would be to go to the stadium, park your car a short distance away, bring your phone and blend in, but that seems fishy, even if i could get 10-12 shuffles an hour, not gonna just stand outside for 30-40 bucks an hour either.

honestly last stadium event i worked was the coldplay world tour at levis stadium. 60k people going to a coldplay concert. surge was there for almost 2 hours. i think i made 250 or so in just over 2 hours driving, on a sunday. would have made maybe 1/3 of that if i did the shuffle all night.


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

Seamus said:


> There is a member on here who gave NO rides only shuffles and it took 3-4 months to catch up and get deactivated.


If that's a fact, then those users on here who are warning us against doing several ghost rides (riding empty from A to B, just sans rider(s)) per month and insisting that Uber will swiftly and harshly deactivate us for it are just not making any sense. If Uber just doesn't care about hundreds of shuffles per month, then why'd they care about a half dozen ghost rides per month?


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

Heisenburger said:


> If that's a fact, then those users on here who are warning us against doing several ghost rides (riding empty from A to B, just sans rider(s)) per month and insisting that Uber will swiftly and harshly deactivate us for it are just not making any sense. If Uber just doesn't care about hundreds of shuffles per month, then why'd they care about a half dozen ghost rides per month?


Shuffles and ghost rides are very different things.

Uber's got an automated system for cancels. They'll eat the Shuffle cost.

Ghost rides are more cumbersome and expensive if Uber eats it.

Plus you can get rated on ghost rides. 

Although it might give you that elusive and coveted 2*.


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

New2This said:


> Ghost rides are more cumbersome and expensive if Uber eats it.


Even that's* automated now, at least on the first pass.

*Fare reviews and complaints of a trivial nature (less than like a $10 value).



New2This said:


> Plus you can get rated on ghost rides.


That's why the volume is limited per month and to the shorter trips under 10 minutes.


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

Heisenburger said:


> Even that's* automated now, at least on the first pass.
> 
> *Fare reviews and complaints of a trivial (money only) nature.
> 
> ...


Ok. I haven't used Uber as a passenger a lot. Never had issues and DGAF enough to explore the app after a trip.


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## Seamus (Jun 21, 2018)

Heisenburger said:


> If that's a fact, then those users on here who are warning us against doing several ghost rides (riding empty from A to B, just sans rider(s)) per month and insisting that Uber will swiftly and harshly deactivate us for it are just not making any sense. If Uber just doesn't care about hundreds of shuffles per month, then why'd they care about a half dozen ghost rides per month?


Of the top 3 "bad boy behaviors", Shuffling, Longhauling, and Ghost Rides, only Ghost Rides will get you pretty quick trouble. Too many pieces to hide.

Shuffling and Longhauling are a lot harder for them to ascertain. (NOT that I endorse any bad behavior).


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Seamus said:


> (NOT that I endorse any bad behavior).


Is that a _new _policy?
There was a day when you'd not only endorse it - you'd encourage it.

Getting old?


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

Seamus said:


> only Ghost Rides will get you pretty quick trouble


I understand the assertion, but why or how specifically? I don't see the distinction that several others apparently see as obvious.

That's the trouble: many are long on claims of certainty, but very short on evidence or rationale. This makes it difficult to accept at face value because there exist many users who just blurt nonsense.


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

UberBastid said:


> Is that a _new _policy?
> There was a day when you'd not only endorse it - you'd encourage it.
> 
> Getting old?


It's the badge. 🤷‍♂️


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## Seamus (Jun 21, 2018)

Heisenburger said:


> I understand the assertion, but why or how specifically? I don't see the distinction that several others apparently see as obvious.
> 
> That's the trouble: many are long on claims of certainty, but very short on evidence or rationale. This makes it difficult to accept at face value because there exist many users who just blurt nonsense.


Yes, there are many members who just blurt nonsense without knowing what they are talking about. All you have to do is go to the tax forum and start reading some of the absolute nonsense people post as facts there. You’ll get some of the worst tax advice you’ve ever received in your life! (And some of the best but no way to distinguish which is which.

The mistake that many make is they draw from their own experience as an individual and transfer their individual experience onto the general population as if everything that’s happened to them as an individual, applies to the whole. Any one individual experience no matter how long they’ve done this, is not valid to the population as a whole.

Very few things that define the relationship between Uber, Lyft, food delivery apps, and the AI that runs it all can be substantiated with evidence. Unless you’re in insider at any of those organizations, there is no way to prove it scientifically or factually. However, some things can be. For example, it’s been commonly used data that says only 4% of Uber drivers last more than a year. That can be backed up by anyone that knows how to use Google and wants to know bad enough. Ubers on data that they released uses those numbers. So there’s an example of an assertion that can be backed up with evidence.

However, just like an insurance company uses pooling of large amounts of data, the same could be inferred from The results of longtime drivers with many thousand rides and years of experience. There are many people on this forum that have each done many thousand rides. When you pool them all together, you are now looking at data generated by hundreds of thousands of rides. There are boatloads of longtime members who have shuffled and never even received a warning from Uber or Lyft. Based on that, although we cannot prove with evidence we can draw pretty good inference that it is exceptionally difficult for them to catch shuffling. Same with long hauling. However, of the same group of longtime members, many have been warned or received emails from Uber about ghost rides. So while there is no evidence to support it, the inference from large poolings of data, One could infer that giving ghost rides is an easier catch than shuffling. Specifically why? No one except a select few that work at these gigs could tell you.

so I guess a lot of it comes down to which people you validate what they say and which people from experience you know spout garbage.


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

New2This said:


> It's the badge. 🤷‍♂️


Ya know, back in the 'wild west' days, when a town had a 'law and order problem', too many cowboys shooting up the town, pestering the women folk and such, the city fathers would hire their own outlaw to be the sheriff. Most lawmen of the 1800 to 1900 era were outlaws. They were killers, gun slingers, mercenaries, bank and train robbers and ex cons. 
You hired YOUR badass to represent YOU.
Because they were hard to BS, and hard to out draw.

Not implying that this is the situation with Seamus, of course, because I don't want to have to meet him on a dusty street at high noon.
Just sayin ....


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

UberBastid said:


> Ya know, back in the 'wild west' days, when a town had a 'law and order problem', too many cowboys shooting up the town, pestering the women folk and such, the city fathers would hire their own outlaw to be the sheriff. Most lawmen of the 1800 to 1900 era were outlaws. They were killers, gun slingers, mercenaries, bank and train robbers and ex cons.
> You hired YOUR badass to represent YOU.
> Because they were hard to BS, and hard to out draw.
> 
> ...


If that's the case then I'd have been Super Moderator long ago.


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

New2This said:


> If that's the case then I'd have been Super Moderator long ago.


You need an agent.


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## painfreepc (Jul 17, 2014)

Seaside_Slider said:


> It’s basically just a *** move used by “drivers” who desperately need that $3.80 cancel fee.


it's a move by uber clowns that need to be removed from the app.


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## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

Seamus said:


> One could infer that giving ghost rides is an easier catch than shuffling. Specifically why? No one except a select few that work at these gigs could tell you.


I could be missing something here.

But I would think that an "average" ghost ride (if such an average exists) would cost Uber more than a shuffle. The shuffle is only a cancellation fee. Certainly less than $5.

But a ghost ride could be $10, maybe in a more extreme case even $30 or $50. Probably a lot harder for Uber to swallow.

And then there's the issue with locating where the rider's phone is. For a ghost ride to be detected, all you need to do is establish that the two phones (rider and driver) are not in the same place, at a time when the driver says the trip has started.

Contrast that with a shuffle. In a shuffle, the driver says that the driver and the rider have not ever been in the same place. It's a bit harder for Uber to know with any certainty who's telling the truth, in the case of a shuffle.


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

Christinebitg said:


> But I would think that an "average" ghost ride (if such an average exists) would cost Uber more than a shuffle.


With UF/UP, a 4 mile ride (minimum fare) is about $4.50 to the driver with about $7 paid by customer. Equivalent to a shuffle if you ask me. And the ghost counts towards quest but shuffle doesn't. In any case, with UF/UP, we can easily screen for the shorter trips to ghost more judiciously.



Christinebitg said:


> And then there's the issue with locating where the rider's phone is. For a ghost ride to be detected, all you need to do is establish that the two phones (rider and driver) are not in the same place, at a time when the driver says the trip has started.


Not so much, here's why:

New "guest rides" feature completely breaks that "gotcha"
Even on non guest rides, friends and family *very* routinely request rides for their friends and family members, so again, GPS data remains inconclusive and far from proof
Given how lax Uber has been towards non account holders (friends and family) riding without the account holder being present in the vehicle (whether set up as an "official" guest ride or not), it's highly unlikely they'd ever *prove* any particular ghost. It's literally a rider's word against a driver's word. The best they can do is silently track any allegations and then take action after some secret threshold of unconfirmed reports has been exceeded.

As bad as they need drivers in 2022, Uber won't do squat anytime soon.


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

New2This said:


> if Uber eats it.


does that mean I can eats it?


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

I find this fairly relevant to the topic here. All quotes from: Uber Driver Cheats and Frauds – Gaming Uber Cancellation Fee

*



How often do drivers earn legitimate Uber cancellation fees?

Click to expand...

*


> In my experience the circumstances required to earn a legitimate cancellation fee don't happen very often… I’d guess on average 2-3 times per week rideshare driving full-time hours.
> 
> *A driver who earns a statistically higher number of Uber cancellation fees compared to the average ridesharing driver will stand out if support has reason to look*… this scrutiny from support could happen when a passenger complains.


*



Why are cancellation fees a problem for Uber?

Click to expand...

*


> Ridesharing drivers gaming the system for more cancellation fees apparently happens often enough that *Uber is beginning to take notice.*
> 
> Uber earns part of the cancellation fee so unless passengers complain, there's no business reason for Uber to explore the problem and look for solutions. Cancellation fees represent a small, but steady revenue stream for Uber Technologies Inc.
> 
> ...


*



Enhanced Uber driver app technology may expose driver fraud

Click to expand...

*


> *Uber reports they are addressing the issue of drivers collecting illegitimate cancellation fees* (from the referenced article):
> 
> 
> > *“We have an in-app Help section where riders can report issues around cancellation fees and we follow up with driver partners who regularly have cancelled trips. We are also working on an enhanced technology solution to further examine cancellations that will be rolled out in April."*
> ...


All quotes from:
Uber Driver Cheats and Frauds – Gaming Uber Cancellation Fee


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

Heisenburger said:


> I find this fairly relevant to the topic here. All quotes from: Uber Driver Cheats and Frauds – Gaming Uber Cancellation Fee
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This jabroni knows not what he's talking about regarding Lyft or is severely outdated:

With Uber cancellation fees drivers receive about 75% of the $5. Lyft passes the whole cancellation fee to the driver.


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

New2This said:


> This jabroni knows not what he's talking about regarding Lyft or is severely outdated:
> 
> With Uber cancellation fees drivers receive about 75% of the $5. Lyft passes the whole cancellation fee to the driver.


It's definitely dated, but many details one is highly unlikely to know unless they either:

Actually did several thousand trips or
Have both insane patience and mad Google Fu skills


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## Boca Ratman (Jun 6, 2018)

Seaside_Slider said:


> It’s basically just a *** move used by “drivers” who desperately need that $3.80 cancel fee.


Hey, I get 3.91 and 4.20 futher south. 

Like I'd waste my time for 3.80. Pffft


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## Boca Ratman (Jun 6, 2018)

New2This said:


> This jabroni knows not what he's talking about regarding Lyft or is severely outdated:
> 
> With Uber cancellation fees drivers receive about 75% of the $5. Lyft passes the whole cancellation fee to the driver.


Pfft. Lyft's is 2.00 now or time & distance, whichever is greater.


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## Emptynesst (6 mo ago)

Boca Ratman said:


> Hey, I get 3.91 and 4.20 futher south.
> 
> Like I'd waste my time for 3.80. Pffft
> View attachment 672954


Mine was 4.5 or so , never a chance they will find me


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## Volvonaut (May 1, 2016)

New2This said:


> Shuffles and ghost rides are very different things.
> 
> Uber's got an automated system for cancels. They'll eat the Shuffle cost.
> 
> ...


I’ve got three 2 stars right now. I don’t know how but I think the key is to always be playing your own shuffle, ironically. Dance to your own drum at all times.


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## Boca Ratman (Jun 6, 2018)

A card shuffle 











Who can forget 1985s Chicago bears' super bowl shuffle? 

We ain't here to cause no trouble we're just here to do the super bowl shuffle.







Or the ickey shuffle 



















Speaking of 1985, from the movie The Goonies, my favorite, the truffle shuffle


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

Boca Ratman said:


> Who can forget 1985s Chicago bears' super bowl shuffle?


Oh man the cringe meter is pegged!


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## Boca Ratman (Jun 6, 2018)

Heisenburger said:


> Oh man the cringe meter is pegged!


For an encore how about the 1986 Mets' "Get Metsmerized."


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## night_driver (5 mo ago)

SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> here, at any stadium event (levi's stadium, chase center etc), there is a designated ride share pickup zone usually adjacent to the stadium... you have to pull in there (you can get cited for just pulling over on the street and trying to pick up or drop off). now. if you pull in there and just sit in your car, you will be forced to move by the people who work that lot... not to mention you run the risk of your pax spotting your car and getting in before the 5 min timer. i guess the other option would be to go to the stadium, park your car a short distance away, bring your phone and blend in, but that seems fishy, even if i could get 10-12 shuffles an hour, not gonna just stand outside for 30-40 bucks an hour either.
> 
> honestly last stadium event i worked was the coldplay world tour at levis stadium. 60k people going to a coldplay concert. surge was there for almost 2 hours. i think i made 250 or so in just over 2 hours driving, on a sunday. would have made maybe 1/3 of that if i did the shuffle all night.


How far were the trips? So you picked up a pax, dropped them off and completed the ride, and went back to the stadium? No long trips out where it wouldn't make sense to deadhead back?


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## night_driver (5 mo ago)

Seamus said:


> Of the top 3 "bad boy behaviors", Shuffling, Longhauling, and Ghost Rides, only Ghost Rides will get you pretty quick trouble. Too many pieces to hide.
> 
> Shuffling and Longhauling are a lot harder for them to ascertain. (NOT that I endorse any bad behavior).


What is longhauling?


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## Heisenburger (Sep 19, 2016)

SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> even if i could get 10-12 shuffles an hour,


10 is absolute max.



SJUberLyftDriver2016 said:


> not gonna just stand outside for 30-40 bucks an hour either.


I certainly would, weather permitting of course.


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## Emptynesst (6 mo ago)

Once I had to use the bathroom at a target in suburbs , as I was parking 7 rows deep I got a 4.3 rated ride from said target , accepted it , used bathroom and even chatted up the pax who was looking around as I no showed her , sorry but my shuffles are principle ones , 4.79 or less and I’ll shuffle you , my way of paying it forward so to speak , I grew up near shirlington and although I’m far from home now , I remember and visit the area 6 times a year .


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

night_driver said:


> What is longhauling?


You're welcome. 









To Longhaul Or Not To Longhaul?


I admit it. I am a Longhauler extraordinaire. I specifically look for ways to Longhaul whenever humanly possible, looking to maximize my earnings and screw Uber/Lyft. I'm curious about UPNet's view on Longhauling. Note I am NOT talking about taking a ridiculous out of the way route like these...




www.uberpeople.net


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## Seamus (Jun 21, 2018)

night_driver said:


> What is longhauling?


@New2This both explained and illustrated it perfectly. You don’t hear much about it anymore, but several years ago there was a different breed of drivers. When the band of pirates making $$$$ were around (2015 to 2019) it was pretty common


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## Emptynesst (6 mo ago)

Seamus said:


> @New2This both explained and illustrated it perfectly. You don’t hear much about it anymore, but several years ago there was a different breed of drivers. When the band of pirates making $$$$ were around (2015 to 2019) it was pretty common


Some of us are still here , and I’ll shuffle a good restaurant every now and again to stay sharp😁


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Bdj said:


> Please tell me what shuffling means. I need to know. Thanks in advance.


OMG.

How far has this forum fallen.

Used to be ten or twelve posts a day regarding how drivers shuffled.

And they were proud of it.

Seems, nowadays, they all trying to figure out how to make a dollar a mile on offers.


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## Emptynesst (6 mo ago)

Judge and Jury said:


> OMG.
> 
> How far has this forum fallen.
> 
> ...


Laughing at $1 a mile , 3 shuffles as well cause they were rated so low , they never find me


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Emptynesst said:


> Laughing at $1 a mile , 3 shuffles as well cause they were rated so low , they never find me
> View attachment 673857
> View attachment 673856
> View attachment 673855
> ...


Ok.

I stand corrected. 

XL is a different category.

However, seems that the expenses of an XL quality vehicle gotta be enormous. 

By the way, is the mileage depicted from offer acceptance to final destination or from pickup to destination?


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Emptynesst said:


> Laughing at $1 a mile , 3 shuffles as well cause they were rated so low , they never find me
> View attachment 673857
> View attachment 673856
> View attachment 673855
> ...


HaHa!

Bunch of drives that don't include miles to pick up pax.


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## Emptynesst (6 mo ago)

Judge and Jury said:


> Ok.
> 
> I stand corrected.
> 
> ...


Pictures speak for themselves , did they drop you a lot as a baby


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## Emptynesst (6 mo ago)

Judge and Jury said:


> HaHa!
> 
> Bunch of drives that don't include miles to pick up pax.


My market everything is close , wrong again . And by the way , are you a child . What adult leads with , haha


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Emptynesst said:


> Laughing at $1 a mile , 3 shuffles as well cause they were rated so low , they never find me
> View attachment 673857
> View attachment 673856
> View attachment 673855
> ...


So,

Your profitable?

Seems you are flexing your profits.

Again, are the miles indicated from acceptance til drop off or from pick up til drop off?

Guessing you are basing your profitability on gross revenue.

Seems your offers are not as profitable as they appear.

Revenue minus expenses equal profits.


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Emptynesst said:


> Pictures speak for themselves , did they drop you a lot as a baby


So, 

Mileage indicated was from acceptance of offer until delivery of pax to destination, or 

From pickup til destination?


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## Emptynesst (6 mo ago)

Judge and Jury said:


> So,
> 
> Your profitable?
> 
> ...


I’ll throw you a bone , avg pickup is 3/4 mile in my market , most are 150’ . I got thousands of these


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## Emptynesst (6 mo ago)

Judge and Jury said:


> So,
> 
> Mileage indicated was from acceptance of offer until delivery of pax to destination, or
> 
> From pickup til destination?


Now since I have been answering your questions, please answer one of mine, did they drop you a lot as a baby?


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Emptynesst said:


> Pictures speak for themselves , did they drop you a lot as a baby


So,

Based on those pictures, what is your dollar to mile ratio?

Are the mileage estimates from acceptance of offer til drop off or from pickup of meat bag til delivery?

Seems you don't wanna answer the question.


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## Emptynesst (6 mo ago)

Judge and Jury said:


> So,
> 
> Based on those pictures, what is your dollar to mile ratio?
> 
> ...


See post 101 and answer the question , did they drop you a lot as a baby


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Emptynesst said:


> I’ll throw you a bone , avg pickup is 3/4 mile in my market , most are 150’ .





Emptynesst said:


> See post 101 and answer the question , did they drop you a lot as a baby


Ha Ha!

Again:

Are you profitable? 

Have not seen any evidence..

Plus, reverting to insults.

By the way, I was dropped on my head. Took decades to heal and lots of rehabilitation.

Finally, after I recovered, I considered XL as a way to be profitable.

Then I realized that the pandemic was a short lived phenomenon and that XL drivers without private books were gonna fail.

So, I did delivery.

Two bucks per mile from driveway until return.

Finally, I ask again, are you profitable or merely flexing revenues cus you losing money every day?


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## Emptynesst (6 mo ago)

Judge and Jury said:


> Ha Ha!
> 
> Again:
> 
> ...


Mamas don’t drop your baby’s 🤡


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Emptynesst said:


> Mamas don’t drop your baby’s 🤡


So, 

An unprofitable contractor,

That resorts to third grade humor,

Instead of admitting that he doesn't have a clue:

How to be profitable. 

Bases his profitability on gross revenues;

Instead of the equation:

Revenue minus expenses equals profit. 

Much to my surprise, seems some XL drivers are unprofitable. 

How is that even possible?


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Emptynesst said:


> Mamas don’t drop your baby’s 🤡


Ha Ha!

Ashamed to document your dollars per mile.

Unprofitable contractor that reverts to third grade humor. 

How are you even still in the business? 

Guessing you should have filed for bankruptcy long ago.

Parents paying for the lease on your XL vehicle?

Or, you living in the basement?

A time honored scenario for unprofitable contractors who post on this forum that they making bank while Mom and Dad pay all the expenses. 

HaHa!

Yu Funy.


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## ubermikeo (Feb 10, 2021)




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