# Uber's third largest market is in jeopardy



## BurgerTiime (Jun 22, 2015)

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...l-bill-regulating-ride-software-idUSKBN1CZ2Q3








BRASILIA (Reuters) - Hundreds of drivers for the internet based ride-hailing firm Uber drove through Brazil's largest cities on Monday to protest legislation that would turn them into regular taxi drivers subject to the same local licensing and taxation rules.

Uber drivers protest against a legislation threatening the company's business model that is to be voted in Brazil's national congress, in Sao Paulo, Brazil October 30, 2017. REUTERS/Paulo Whitaker
The chief executive of Uber Technologies Inc, Dara Khosrowshahi, arrived in Brazil to lobby against the bill that is due to be voted on by the Senate on Tuesday and which threatens the company's business in a fast-growing foreign market.

Brazil is Uber's third-largest market, with 17 million users, and the city of Sao Paulo sees more trips on the ride-hailing service than any other city in the world, ahead of New York and Mexico City, according to the company.

A spokesman for the company said the application as it exists could not operate under the new rules, including the use of a taxi license plate on cars owned by Uber drivers.

"The business model we have today would not longer be viable," Uber's executive spokesman in Brazil Fabio Sabba told Reuters.

Uber is already battling to keep operating in London after the city's transport regulator deemed it unfit to run a taxi service and refused to renew its license.









Uber drivers protest against a legislation threatening the company's business model that is to be voted in Brazil's national congress, in Sao Paulo, Brazil October 30, 2017. REUTERS/Paulo Whitaker
Police said 800 Uber drivers drove through the center of Brazil's capital Brasilia to protest the bill that many say will put them out of business. Similar protests in Sao Paulo and Rio de Janeiro snarled downtown traffic.

Uber did not organize the drivers' protests but alerted authorities that they would happen.
"The bill will create so much bureaucracy that it prevents the 500,000 drivers in Brazil from earning income for their families," Uber said in a statement.

Uber said it has paid 495 million reais ($150 million) in federal and municipal taxes so far this year.

The bill, which has already been approved by the lower house of Congress, would define ride hailing applications as public transport instead of private services and require drivers to get a special permit from city authorities. It would also establish additional regulations and taxes.

If the Senate votes to approve the bill, it will be up to President Michel Temer to sign or veto the legislation or parts of it.

($1 = 3.2887 reais)

Reporting by Anthony Boadle


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

no way in hell there are 500,000 drivers in Brazil, nor have there ever been combined


----------



## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

BurgerTiime said:


> http://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...l-bill-regulating-ride-software-idUSKBN1CZ2Q3
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I think what they are doing is fair and just. I never believed the Uber model was fair and just -- taxis pay a lot of money for the priviledge, why should a city allow Uber to avoid what are expected of taxis? That never made sense to me. But for the manner and method of how a rider requests a fare, how are they different than a taxi? Okay, many taxis switched to computer dispatch systems, which, by the way, are far more reliable than the Uber smartphone based App, over 20 years ago.


----------



## Strange Fruit (Aug 10, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> no way in hell there are 500,000 drivers in Brazil, nor have there ever been combined


U know that how?


----------



## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> no way in hell there are 500,000 drivers in Brazil, nor have there ever been combined


It's the size of the United States.


----------



## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

TwoFiddyMile said:


> It's the size of the United States.


Not even close. The US has over 115 million more people.


----------



## 7Miles (Dec 17, 2014)

Put almost topless women on top of those cars and it’s carnival.


----------



## YourPrivateDriver (Jul 5, 2016)

BurgerTiime said:


> http://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...l-bill-regulating-ride-software-idUSKBN1CZ2Q3


"The business model we have today would not longer be viable," Uber's executive spokesman in Brazil Fabio Sabba told Reuters.

Well of course it wouldn't work. It doesn't even work without all the regulations in place. Unless you consider losing a couple billion a year viable in the long run.


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

YourPrivateDriver said:


> "The business model we have today would not longer be viable," Uber's executive spokesman in Brazil Fabio Sabba told Reuters.
> 
> Well of course it wouldn't work. It doesn't even work without all the regulations in place. Unless you consider losing a couple billion a year viable in the long run.


lol even the business model they have today doesn't work 



Strange Fruit said:


> U know that how?


have you even stopped to think about how many drivers that is ? they probably don't have that many drivers if you add up all the drivers they've ever had in the world combined


----------



## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

uberdriverfornow said:


> no way in hell there are 500,000 drivers in Brazil, nor have there ever been combined


It's sounds high but NYC has 30,000 Uber drivers so Brazil might have a half million.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

It's not like jobs are falling out of trees in Brazil.


----------



## PrestonT (Feb 15, 2017)

uberdriverfornow said:


> have you even stopped to think about how many drivers that is ? they probably don't have that many drivers if you add up all the drivers they've ever had in the world combined


Wut?


----------



## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

goneubering said:


> It's sounds high but NYC has 30,000 Uber drivers so Brazil might have a half million.


Uber loves to exaggerate. My guess is there are 500k that have SIGNED UP TO DRIVE over the years.


----------



## Jo3030 (Jan 2, 2016)

Brazil, you know what to do!


----------



## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Mista T said:


> Uber loves to exaggerate. My guess is there are 500k that have SIGNED UP TO DRIVE over the years.


Of course that's the interpretation of that metric.


----------



## Cableguynoe (Feb 14, 2017)

Really? No one is going to say anything about the dude on the car with an erection?


----------



## Bpr2 (Feb 21, 2017)

Jo3030 said:


> Brazil, you know what to do!


GGGGOOOOOOOAAAAAALLLLLLL


----------



## d0n (Oct 16, 2016)

Good, **** Uber.


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

YourPrivateDriver said:


> "The business model we have today would not longer be viable," Uber's executive spokesman in Brazil Fabio Sabba told Reuters.
> 
> Well of course it wouldn't work. It doesn't even work without all the regulations in place. Unless you consider losing a couple billion a year viable in the long run.


Depiction of Uber " Business Model" at work.
Uber management " working" investors.

Investors to be invited to Steak Dinner later . . .


----------



## Ride-Share-Risk-Manager (Mar 16, 2017)

This is typical Uber strategy to try and pressure politicians and regulators by creating a fake driver protest. I wonder what each driver who shows up gets as compensation ? The notion that this is some spontaneous protest in support of Uber is garbage. Uber drivers couldn't organize themselves to protest anywhere in the USA where there are no obstacles to doing it. This is a fake protest. Uber tried to generate one here in NJ when the Democrats brought in legislation requiring more stringent background checks for drivers. I hope the politicians in Brazil grow some backbone and tell Uber where to go shove it. Brazil is a very violent and dangerous country and there is no way in hell I would get in an Uber there as you have no clue who is driving you.


----------



## Ezridax (Aug 3, 2017)

Cableguynoe said:


> Really? No one is going to say anything about the dude on the car with an erection?


Can't un-see that.


----------



## Ride-Share-Risk-Manager (Mar 16, 2017)

Ezridax said:


> Can't un-see that.


But once somebody points something like that out, you just cannot un-see it ! LOL.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Cableguynoe said:


> Really? No one is going to say anything about the dude on the car with an erection?


In Brazil, everyone has an erection.


----------



## BAKAD (Feb 22, 2016)

*The new CEO has to wonder what he got himself into. *

Two markets London and Brazil have big issues. The board is fighting again with TK getting in the way. Lawsuits and criminal investigations. I suspect Uber need more funds fairly fast, since they have not had a CFO since 2015 and TK been able to do what he wants. I bet they have been spending like mad draining the investor funds.

*And the business model generates large volumes of rides and revenue, but it doesn't work it's not profitable.* 

We should see some* BOLD changes soon from the NEW CEO to make Uber work/profitable in order to hit an IPO by 2019* or with all the issues Uber has he may *just toss his hat in the ring and let TK take it back.*


----------



## Brewsster (Oct 3, 2017)

Ah yes, leave it up to the Brazilian government to make things more difficult for the average working person...smh...


----------



## EpicSwoleness (Jun 21, 2017)

*1-7 *


----------



## roadman (Nov 14, 2016)

Good job Brazil. Good job London. Chase uber out of every corner of the globe country by country.


----------



## Cableguynoe (Feb 14, 2017)

roadman said:


> Good job Brazil. Good job London. Chase uber out of every corner of the globe country by country.


You wont be saying that if it ever happens in your city.


----------



## roadman (Nov 14, 2016)

Cableguynoe said:


> You wont be saying that if it ever happens in your city.


Sure I will. I am doing my part. No show cancelling and stranding as many uber pax as possible.


----------



## Cableguynoe (Feb 14, 2017)

roadman said:


> Sure I will. I am doing my part. No show cancelling and stranding as many uber pax as possible.


But you're making money doing that right?


----------



## Ububu (Jun 17, 2015)

Cableguynoe said:


> But you're making money doing that right?


 Yaaaawn. Clearly a negligible amount he wouldn't lose sleep over, given his comments.


----------



## PrestonT (Feb 15, 2017)

TwoFiddyMile said:


> In Brazil, everyone has an erection.


\
Understandably. I have to lean forward to drive whenever I have a female brazilian pax....


----------



## JimKE (Oct 28, 2016)

Cableguynoe said:


> Really? No one is going to say anything about the dude on the car with an erection?


That's an erection? Aw...poor little thing!


----------



## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Oscar Levant said:


> I think what they are doing is fair and just. I never believed the Uber model was fair and just -- taxis pay a lot of money for the priviledge, why should a city allow Uber to avoid what are expected of taxis? That never made sense to me. But for the manner and method of how a rider requests a fare, how are they different than a taxi? Okay, many taxis switched to computer dispatch systems, which, by the way, are far more reliable than the Uber smartphone based App, over 20 years ago.


The big difference at least here in the US is STREET HAILS.

Unlike taxis, Uber isn't allowed to do street hails. That's the game changer, especially in large cities like NY and Chicago.


----------



## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Cableguynoe said:


> Really? No one is going to say anything about the dude on the car with an erection?


Happens every day.
I get SO excited to drive.
Just can't wait.


----------



## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

Nats121 said:


> The big difference at least here in the US is STREET HAILS.
> 
> Unlike taxis, Uber isn't allowed to do street hails. That's the game changer, especially in large cities like NY and Chicago.


 I've driven in L.A. and lived in NYC., and in L.A, the second largest city, the street hail advantage is no where near what it is in NYC. so, for the vast majority of the US, street hails only counts for a smaller percentage of the overall business. When I drove in L.A, the street hails were mostly in Bev Hills and Hollywood at night and even then, street was about 1/3 of the total faire count. The rest of the day, you really needed the radio biz. In NYC, it's all day and night long, street hails.


----------



## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

LA is the exception, rather than the rule.

Along with NYC and Chicago, there's DC, Philly,Atlanta,San Fran, Baltimore, Miami,Boston,etc,etc that do large street hail business

All of the older, more compact cities are big markets for street hails.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Nats121 said:


> LA is the exception, rather than the rule.
> 
> Along with NYC and Chicago, there's DC, Philly,Atlanta,San Fran, Baltimore, Miami,Boston,etc,etc that do large street hail business
> 
> All of the older, more compact cities are big markets for street hails.


Not so much since Uber. In downtown areas now we see uberpax staring at smart phones waiting for ants.


----------



## phillipzx3 (May 26, 2015)

Nats121 said:


> The big difference at least here in the US is STREET HAILS.
> 
> Unlike taxis, Uber isn't allowed to do street hails. That's the game changer, especially in large cities like NY and Chicago.


They might not be allowed, but they do it all the time. Craigslist is full of ads from Uber drivers offering "deals" if you call them direct. Many Uber drivers are former taxi drivers. They know how to work the streets. Legal or not.



TwoFiddyMile said:


> Not so much since Uber. In downtown areas now we see uberpax staring at smart phones waiting for ants.


And will stand there waiting 15-20 minutes for that car "only" 2 minutes away.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Understand, pax wait for ants due to financial savings. They have trained themselves to look away from the cabstsnds knowing they already could have been dropped at the airport. "But the price, Lisa! I must wait for the Uber!".

So cheap they would risk starving for a free meal right outside of an expensive restaurant.


----------



## Brewsster (Oct 3, 2017)

EpicSwoleness said:


> *1-7 *


We'll get them in the world cup next year


----------



## bandit13 (Mar 31, 2017)

goneubering said:


> It's sounds high but NYC has 30,000 Uber drivers so Brazil might have a half million.


Uber has 57,000 drivers in Toronto / GTA with PTC licences.


----------



## mKat (May 19, 2016)

Cableguynoe said:


> Really? No one is going to say anything about the dude on the car with an erection?


If that's an erection I feel sorry for his lady.


----------



## Jo3030 (Jan 2, 2016)

lol @ this manufactured protest


----------



## Blatherskite (Nov 30, 2016)

mKat said:


> If that's an erection I feel sorry for his lady.


Your avatar looks like a mashup of Sigmund Freud and Walter White.








So does your above post.


----------



## Milito (Apr 26, 2016)

A lot of poor people, Uber is cheaper than a Bus and it takes you door to door . Plus many desperate drivers buying new cars in order to make less than minimum wage


----------



## Too Many Miles (Jan 26, 2016)

BurgerTiime said:


> http://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...l-bill-regulating-ride-software-idUSKBN1CZ2Q3
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I find this to be hilarious, 500,000 drivers prevented from "earning money for their families. Uber always said that this was never meant to be a real fob for drivers, just something on the side to makes some extra money. Now they make it sound like half a million people will be unemployed.
"The business model would not be viable", of course, Uber is not capable of competing under fair conditions. When they had fair competition in China, they lost.
Pablo Escobar to the Colombian goverment: "My business model does not work with your regulations"
"Uber has paid 150 million", and how much more on bribery? Everything in Brasil works like that.



TwoFiddyMile said:


> It's not like jobs are falling out of trees in Brazil.


But most of the people with those cars have jobs. Taxi drivers in Brasil used to drive 2 door cars like VW Beetle, not the new ones, I don't know if they still do.



BAKAD said:


> *The new CEO has to wonder what he got himself into. *
> 
> Two markets London and Brazil have big issues. The board is fighting again with TK getting in the way. Lawsuits and criminal investigations. I suspect Uber need more funds fairly fast, since they have not had a CFO since 2015 and TK been able to do what he wants. I bet they have been spending like mad draining the investor funds.
> 
> ...


All of these issues are the consequences of having TK running the company for so long. They should just give it back to him and let it die.



Cableguynoe said:


> You wont be saying that if it ever happens in your city.


Why not? It would open up the market.


----------



## kdyrpr (Apr 23, 2016)

Ladies of Brazil are arguably the sexiest women in the world - thus, the dude on the car. Also, for the record the US population is just over 310 Million.


----------



## canyon (Dec 22, 2015)

YourPrivateDriver said:


> "The business model we have today would not longer be viable," Uber's executive spokesman in Brazil Fabio Sabba told Reuters.
> 
> Well of course it wouldn't work. It doesn't even work without all the regulations in place. Unless you consider losing a couple billion a year viable in the long run.


If there was ever a company that loves to shoot themselves in the foot over and over it has to be Uber. You have a bunch of snowflakes who have never worked a day in their lives. It wont last too much longer. I give it 4yrs.


----------



## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

Oscar Levant said:


> I think what they are doing is fair and just. I never believed the Uber model was fair and just -- taxis pay a lot of money for the priviledge, why should a city allow Uber to avoid what are expected of taxis? That never made sense to me. But for the manner and method of how a rider requests a fare, how are they different than a taxi? Okay, many taxis switched to computer dispatch systems, which, by the way, are far more reliable than the Uber smartphone based App, over 20 years ago.


The proper question is why are taxis forced to pay all this money when uber has proven people can be serviced by hired cars without it.

Uber is not the problem, the taxis are. I have driven so many people who hate taxis in my city. Uber is a lot of things bad but obliterating the obscene monopoly and absurd rules taxis have is a great thing indeed.


----------



## Dontmakemepullauonyou (Oct 13, 2015)

BurgerTiime said:


> http://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...l-bill-regulating-ride-software-idUSKBN1CZ2Q3
> 
> 
> 
> ...


From the stuff I've seen out of Brazil on bestgore I wouldn't drive uber there for triple the rates.


----------



## Sydney Uber (Apr 15, 2014)

YourPrivateDriver said:


> "The business model we have today would not longer be viable," Uber's executive spokesman in Brazil Fabio Sabba told Reuters.
> 
> Well of course it wouldn't work. It doesn't even work without all the regulations in place. Unless you consider losing a couple billion a year viable in the long run.


Now isn't that the truth!!



PrestonT said:


> Wut?


I'm glad I'm not the only one here confused by that post !


----------



## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

ShinyAndChrome said:


> The proper question is why are taxis forced to pay all this money when uber has proven people can be serviced by hired cars without it.
> 
> Uber is not the problem, the taxis are. I have driven so many people who hate taxis in my city. Uber is a lot of things bad but obliterating the obscene monopoly and absurd rules taxis have is a great thing indeed.


No, the problem is the uneven playing field. Everyone should play on a level playing field, whatever that playing field is.


----------



## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Oscar Levant said:


> No, the problem is the uneven playing field. Everyone should play on a level playing field, whatever that playing field is.


Why is that?
Where is that written?
Are you talking about "fair"?
That is a four letter word, that begins with F. Stop using it, or expecting it.

When you were born were you promised "a level playing field", cause I sure wasn't.
Otherwise I'd have nine inches and ten million bux.


----------



## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

UberBastid said:


> Why is that?
> Where is that written?
> Are you talking about "fair"?
> That is a four letter word, that begins with F. Stop using it, or expecting it.
> ...


No one has promised anything nor is it written anywhere nor did I expect it nor did I ever imply any such thing,
it's just the right thing to do, or at least to be striven for, but, apparently that is not within your grasp.

So, some person in your community is oppressing you, and you just shrug your shoulders and accept it?

I think people who have a sense of justice and fairness would at least attempt to do something about it,
but, according to you, you just just bend over and accept it, because "you weren't promised anything in the way of fairness therefore you shouldn't try to prevent it" or that is the gist of what I'm getting from what you wrote.

That's nuts. You haven't thought your line of thinking through.


----------



## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

UberBastid said:


> Why is that?
> Where is that written?
> Are you talking about "fair"?
> That is a four letter word, that begins with F. Stop using it, or expecting it.
> ...


Life's not fair. This is a basic truth I used to fight against but that was futile.


----------



## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Oscar Levant said:


> No one has promised anything nor is it written anywhere nor did I expect it nor did I ever imply any such thing,
> it's just the right thing to do, or at least to be striven for, but, apparently that is not within your grasp.
> 
> So, some person in your community is oppressing you, and you just shrug your shoulders and accept it?
> ...


It is nuts. It's life.
People with more power than me make decisions about my life all the time; sometimes I don't even know them or what the decision is, but it happens. 
Sometimes, too often, I have to "accept the things I can not change" and shrug and move along, yes.

When I become King things will be different -- till then ...


----------



## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

UberBastid said:


> It is nuts. It's life.
> People with more power than me make decisions about my life all the time; sometimes I don't even know them or what the decision is, but it happens.
> Sometimes, too often, I have to "accept the things I can not change" and shrug and move along, yes.
> 
> When I become King things will be different -- till then ...


Just what we need, an appeaser king.


----------



## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Oscar Levant said:


> Just what we need, an appeaser king.


You ever hear the parable about the Old Bull and the Young Bull?


----------



## Too Many Miles (Jan 26, 2016)

Oscar Levant said:


> No, the problem is the uneven playing field. Everyone should play on a level playing field, whatever that playing field is.


Uber is not capable of succeeding on an even field. That is why they have to lobby, to make sure that they have the advantage.


----------



## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

Too Many Miles said:


> Uber is not capable of succeeding on an even field. That is why they have to lobby, to make sure that they have the advantage.


They, like many or most corporations, do whatever they can get away with.



UberBastid said:


> You ever hear the parable about the Old Bull and the Young Bull?


Without knowing that story, or it's a story I've heard long ago but forgotten, I've often preached that life isn't about intelligence, it's about wisdom, and if both resided in the same human being, it is a coincidence. History proves a modestly intelligent person can achieve more wisdom than someone who scores very high in IQ tests. I think the story has something to do with intelligence versus wisdom.


----------



## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Oscar Levant said:


> They, like many or most corporations, do whatever they can get away with.
> 
> Without knowing that story, or it's a story I've heard long ago but forgotten, I've often preached that life isn't about intelligence, it's about wisdom, and if both resided in the same human being, it is a coincidence. History proves a modestly intelligent person can achieve more wisdom than someone who scores very high in IQ tests. I think the story has something to do with intelligence versus wisdom.


Young bull and Old bull standing on top of a hill, chewing and just hanging out - like bulls do.
Down in a nearby valley is a half dozen or so cows.
Young bull gets an idea, runs up to Old bull and says, breathlessly: "Hey, see those cows down there? I got an idea. Lets run down there and have us one of them."
Old bull, looks, chews, contemplates.
Young bull says: "So. What ya think? Lets go. Come on!"
He's so excited he can hardly stand still. "Lets run down there and nail us a cow."
Old bull chews, contemplates some more and finally says, "I got a better idea ... lets WALK down and nail them ALL."

Save your strength for what's important.


----------



## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

UberBastid said:


> Young bull and Old bull standing on top of a hill, chewing and just hanging out - like bulls do.
> Down in a nearby valley is a half dozen or so cows.
> Young bull gets an idea, runs up to Old bull and says, breathlessly: "Hey, see those cows down there? I got an idea. Lets run down there and have us one of them."
> Old bull, looks, chews, contemplates.
> ...


so, with this, we can't banter about on Uberpeople? Not sure what the point is.


----------



## Leo1983 (Jul 3, 2017)

Oscar Levant said:


> I think what they are doing is fair and just. I never believed the Uber model was fair and just -- taxis pay a lot of money for the priviledge, why should a city allow Uber to avoid what are expected of taxis? That never made sense to me. But for the manner and method of how a rider requests a fare, how are they different than a taxi? Okay, many taxis switched to computer dispatch systems, which, by the way, are far more reliable than the Uber smartphone based App, over 20 years ago.


I love how when the city needs a cut people protest. But uber and Lyft have been raping drivers since the beginning and no one cared. 
The rates will go up and they will go straight to the government and skip the drivers altogether.


----------



## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Oscar Levant said:


> so, with this, we can't banter about on Uberpeople? Not sure what the point is.


the point is the last sentence


----------

