# Made $6,895 dollars last month GROSS ($6,020 pre tax net)



## R W (Jan 14, 2016)

Hello Uber people,

I just wanted to let this forum know that it is possible to make some money Ubering. Need and still need cash to pay some old bills. I am sort of a do it now and worry about it later so I am putting the tax stuff out of my head for the time being to take care of the now. I paid $875 dollars in gas for the month so my NET before taxes was $6,020 (wear and tear on the car might hurt me later)

I worked every day in the month last month. So 31 days of August. Some days I worked 18 hours and others I worked 4 hours to be with family. I researched what events were going to take place in my city and mapped out where they are. I also had ways to avoid traffic during events to get going as fast as you can instead of wait in traffic to pick up a 5 dollar ride. 

If it was slow I would go to one of my 20 locations in Charlotte that I use as a (wait spot) where I know i wont wait long at all. The airport I only use once a day unless I go to drop someone off (its where I start my day) you could get lucky and get a 30 dollar or more ride - also you can network the customer and see if they need a ride on a regular. The only problem is waiting in the line....that takes too long.

I basically made around $22 dollars an hour (not great overall, but all we are doing is driving).........I haven't talked about the tips that you may get sometimes. 

Im tired but its worth it for the short term.


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

R W said:


> Hello Uber people,
> 
> I just wanted to let this forum know that it is possible to make some money Ubering. Need and still need cash to pay some old bills. I am sort of a do it now and worry about it later so I am putting the tax stuff out of my head for the time being to take care of the now. I paid $875 dollars in gas for the month so my NET before taxes was $6,020 (wear and tear on the car might hurt me later)


"might"? You drove thousands of miles (10k?). That puts wear on everything in the car, and particularly depreciation. You could run your car through kelly blue book right now and compare what it would be worth with and without those miles on it. Unless it's really old that 10k cost you at least a grand in value right off the top. If your car is newish it might have cost you $2k in value. This is a business, you need to figure out what it actually costs you. "do it now and worry about it later" is not the way to go.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

R W said:


> Hello Uber people,
> 
> I just wanted to let this forum know that it is possible to make some money Ubering. Need and still need cash to pay some old bills. I am sort of a do it now and worry about it later so I am putting the tax stuff out of my head for the time being to take care of the now. I paid $875 dollars in gas for the month so my NET before taxes was $6,020 (wear and tear on the car might hurt me later)
> 
> ...


All you are doing is driving ?
And sacrificing 14-18 hours a day of Your Life for 31 days.
And sacrificing Your Car.

Yet you Devalue Yourself by saying " all we are doing is driving".
That is a Poor attitude.

Actually, it sounds like the UNREALISTIC ATTITUDE OF MANAGEMENT !

" All we are doing is driving".

Please do Not say " We".


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

R W said:


> Hello Uber people,
> 
> I just wanted to let this forum know that it is possible to make some money Ubering. Need and still need cash to pay some old bills. I am sort of a do it now and worry about it later so I am putting the tax stuff out of my head for the time being to take care of the now. I paid $875 dollars in gas for the month so my NET before taxes was $6,020 (wear and tear on the car might hurt me later)
> 
> ...


The quality of life issue is yours to decide. If you needed the short term cash flow, you did good. If you want to determine how well you did, it takes a bit more work.

If you're driving a new Bentley, you probably lost money during the month. If you're driving a car that you determined was worthless last month, you did good.

Do as Mr. Chrome suggests on kbb. Then add in maintenance and repair costs. The total won't look as good. Then there's taxes. You grossed $6895. If you drove 10k miles, subtract $5350 for the IRS standard mileage deduction and you'll only be taxed on $1545. Uncle Sam may want up to $500 for YOUR labor. On the other hand, an hourly employee who grossed $6895 and in the same tax bracket with no mileage deduction would pay $2200 in taxes.

Math is your friend.


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## kk21912003 (May 5, 2017)

R W said:


> Hello Uber people,
> 
> I just wanted to let this forum know that it is possible to make some money Ubering. Need and still need cash to pay some old bills. I am sort of a do it now and worry about it later so I am putting the tax stuff out of my head for the time being to take care of the now. I paid $875 dollars in gas for the month so my NET before taxes was $6,020 (wear and tear on the car might hurt me later)
> 
> ...


First, congratulations. You think you got what you need.

Second, I agree with most of what you said. But you separate your most important conclusion into two sentences which you put at the beginning and the end. Please allow me to put them together:

"I just wanted to let this forum know that it is possible to make some money Ubering BY getting myself tired in a very short time. It's worth if you do not mind or have more important financial needs to meet"

Third, be safe! Any car accident could change your ridesharing career and your attitude to it dramatically


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## Telsa34 (May 7, 2017)




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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

kk21912003 said:


> First, congratulations. You think you got what you need.
> 
> Second, I agree with most of what you said. But you separate your most important conclusion into two sentences which you put at the beginning and the end. Please allow me to put them together:
> 
> ...


It's been known for James River Insurance to under pay out insurance claims.

So if you total your car you might very well end up paying $1000 deductible and being $2,000 less than the cost of repairing your car. Or $5,000+ or even $10,000 or $15,000 short of getting a new car, especially because they CAN under the law pay out based on the number of miles on your car at the time of the accident.

So putting 50,000+ miles a year on your car, you total it and the $10,000 in depreciation goes straight into the toilet. You might not get enough to pay off an auto loan either OR EVEN pay off a lease.


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## Frustrated!!!! (Jul 7, 2017)

R W said:


> Hello Uber people,
> 
> I just wanted to let this forum know that it is possible to make some money Ubering. Need and still need cash to pay some old bills. I am sort of a do it now and worry about it later so I am putting the tax stuff out of my head for the time being to take care of the now. I paid $875 dollars in gas for the month so my NET before taxes was $6,020 (wear and tear on the car might hurt me later)
> 
> ...


Dude good job!! Some of these broke drivers are haters and mad that they can't make money. You could buy a 6000 dollar 09 Nissan Altima and these idiots will still talk about wear and tear ,depreciation to your car and other cry baby tactics!!! Do what's best for you and your family.


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

Frustrated!!!! said:


> Dude good job!! Some of these broke drivers are haters and mad that they can't make money. You could buy a 6000 dollar 09 Nissan Altima and these idiots will still talk about wear and tear ,depreciation to your car and other cry baby tactics!!! Do what's best for you and your family.


This is what a post from somebody who failed highschool math looks like. There is good advice out there but you have to put your pride aside and be willing to take it. If you can find me an 09 Altima that doesn't suffer the effects of driving on its value and condition, I will defer to your wisdom.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Frustrated!!!! said:


> Dude good job!! Some of these broke drivers are haters and mad that they can't make money. You could buy a 6000 dollar 09 Nissan Altima and these idiots will still talk about wear and tear ,depreciation to your car and other cry baby tactics!!! Do what's best for you and your family.


Since when is determining one's costs a "cry baby tactic"? How can one determine their profit from a business without know their cost to do business? An $6000 '09 Altima will depreciate roughly $0.03 per mile, roughly 1/3 of the cost of gas. That's nearly $300, nothing to cry about but a significant amount none the less. As a car ages, depreciation rates decline but repair costs increase. I estimate a transmission alone would be an additional $0.02 per mile.

I can make $2000 next week. But it would cost me $800 for the flight, $700 for lodging, and $100 for food. Taking costs into account, the trip doesn't look so good.

Hater or realist?


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## Frustrated!!!! (Jul 7, 2017)

ShinyAndChrome said:


> This is what a post from somebody who failed highschool math looks like. There is good advice out there but you have to put your pride aside and be willing to take it. If you can find me an 09 Altima that doesn't suffer the effects of driving on its value and condition, I will defer to your wisdom.


If you have a car like a Altima that don't even cost alot of money why care about wear and tear making 4 figures a week. As stated it's always the barely breaking even drivers that cry.


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

Frustrated!!!! said:


> If you have a car like a Altima that don't even cost alot of money why care about wear and tear making 4 figures a week. As stated it's always the barely breaking even drivers that cry.


see the post above yours. Your inability to analyze this topic competently does not exempt its importance.


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## Frustrated!!!! (Jul 7, 2017)

ShinyAndChrome said:


> see the post above yours. Your inability to analyze this topic competently does not exempt its importance.


So since your the analytics guy what should he do quit??? Or work part time. Since he's not making money???



bsliv said:


> Since when is determining one's costs a "cry baby tactic"? How can one determine their profit from a business without know their cost to do business? An $6000 '09 Altima will depreciate roughly $0.03 per mile, roughly 1/3 of the cost of gas. That's nearly $300, nothing to cry about but a significant amount none the less. As a car ages, depreciation rates decline but repair costs increase. I estimate a transmission alone would be an additional $0.02 per mile.
> 
> I can make $2000 next week. But it would cost me $800 for the flight, $700 for lodging, and $100 for food. Taking costs into account, the trip doesn't look so good.
> 
> Hater or realist?


What are you talking about?? Your post is confusing 2000 then 800 whattttt!!!


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Frustrated!!!! said:


> If you have a car like a Altima that don't even cost alot of money why care about wear and tear making 4 figures a week. As stated it's always the barely breaking even drivers that cry.


$6000 may not be "alot <sic> of money" to you but it is to us crying drivers. What if if not a 8 year old car with 100k on the clock. What if its a 2017 Bentley with 100 miles on the odometer? Would your opinion change? What if the op's car is somewhere between an old Altima and a new Bentley?

The only car that will not depreciate is a car that is worthless or a classic collector car. There hasn't been a car made that doesn't require regular maintenance and occasional repairs. There are some on this forum that believe cars cost $0.535 per mile to operate. Using their numbers, that $6895 gross turns into $1545.

The op shouldn't quit, yet. He should do the math and make his decision based on the result. Guessing is not a smart way to do business.



Frustrated!!!! said:


> So since your the analytics guy what should he do quit??? Or work part time. Since he's not making money???
> 
> What are you talking about?? Your post is confusing 2000 then 800 whattttt!!!


I'm talking about costs involved to run a business. If I ignored costs, like some suggest, I'd take the trip. But instead of the $2000 profit, it turns into $400 with costs deducted. Clear?


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## Frustrated!!!! (Jul 7, 2017)

bsliv said:


> $6000 may not be "alot <sic> of money" to you but it is to us crying drivers. What if if not a 8 year old car with 100k on the clock. What if its a 2017 Bentley with 100 miles on the odometer? Would your opinion change? What if the op's car is somewhere between an old Altima and a new Bentley?
> 
> The only car that will not depreciate is a car that is worthless or a classic collector car. There hasn't been a car made that doesn't require regular maintenance and occasional repairs. There are some on this forum that believe cars cost $0.535 per mile to operate. Using their numbers, that $6895 gross turns into $1545.
> 
> ...


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Frustrated said, "how about this how much you average??? Me 1500 Honda Accord oil changes and 2 tires and I feeds my family well"

You don't know how much you profit. You know how much you gross. Its a short sighted approach. It takes more than oil changes and 2 tires to keep that Accord running. What happens when the other 2 tires blow? What happens when the ****** won't engage? What happens when the water/fuel/oil pump goes out? You may not realize it until you try to sell it or repair it, but the costs are there and should be calculated.

I did the math for my driving. I have 2 cars, one gets about 15 mpg the other gets 40 mpg. Who would believe its cheaper to drive the 15 mpg car? Me. The 40 mpg car is fairly new with few miles on it. It takes a huge depreciation hit. The 15 mpg car sucks gas but with 200,000 miles on it, its depreciation rate per mile is nearly nil. I do the maintenance and repairs myself, which saves a lot on costs. Those costs are driving costs.

My costs to drive are too high. At $1.80/mile, I could bring home some change. I thought $1.10/mile was too little and stopped driving. Uber has since lowered it to $0.90. I haven't driven in 18 months. I have lots of free time to drive. I am not math illiterate. I don't drive for rideshare. I can, I'd like to, but its more rewarding to try to explain reality. And it might be more profitable to go fishing for stripers than driving rideshare.


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

Frustrated!!!! said:


> So since your the analytics guy what should he do quit??? Or work part time. *Since he's not making money???*


He's not? Show your work.  I have a friend who dumps a bunch of time into uber and when I try and explain costs his eyes glaze over. He just isn't interested in figuring out his real costs. Beyond gas it's like he's just incapable of understanding it. That's strange, because he has a couple of degrees and a high-paying job.


> I did the math for my driving. I have 2 cars, one gets about 15 mpg the other gets 40 mpg. Who would believe its cheaper to drive the 15 mpg car? Me. The 40 mpg car is fairly new with few miles on it. It takes a huge depreciation hit.


Likewise I have a minivan that gets 21 MPG and a hybrid sedan that gets about 38 MPG and the cost to operate them, by my math, is essentially dead-even on a per-mile basis.


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## Frustrated!!!! (Jul 7, 2017)

So to sum it up. The driver did well. More than most. I can understand the complaints about pay,pax,gas etc.But to be negative about this thread makes me question why some of you even drive at all


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Frustrated!!!! said:


> So to sum it up. The driver did well. More than most. I can understand the complaints about pay,pax,gas etc.But to be negative about this thread makes me question why some of you even drive at all


If a comet is going to hit the earth in 2 days and I tell you a comet is going to hit the earth in 2 days, am I negative? If yes, then so be it. I prefer to think of it as a realist. Costs are a negative on your balance sheet. Like comets, they don't go away if you ignore them.

Most of us are our own Chief Financial Officer. That's a bean counter. You should know how many blue beans (costs) you give out or will have to give out in order to get the red beans (income) you want.

Congratulations are due for a large short term cash flow. Was it a long term positive cash flow? Probably. But we don't know until costs are included. Posting high incomes is very similar to Uber advertising, "Make up to $XXXX per week." It tends to lure in more drivers that aren't fully aware of the situation. That's not good for the new or existing drivers.


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## Buddywannarideagain (Jun 29, 2017)

R W said:


> Hello Uber people,
> 
> I just wanted to let this forum know that it is possible to make some money Ubering. Need and still need cash to pay some old bills. I am sort of a do it now and worry about it later so I am putting the tax stuff out of my head for the time being to take care of the now. I paid $875 dollars in gas for the month so my NET before taxes was $6,020 (wear and tear on the car might hurt me later)
> 
> ...


I suppose this is technically possible averaging 27 rides everyday. I'm in Charlotte. I know it's tough at 60 cents a mile and 11 cents a minute.


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## bestpals (Aug 22, 2015)

Congratulations and uber loves you for it. Now they can legally advertise $1500/week. It only takes one person to do it and they are legally telling the truth. But do you actually believe they are telling you the truth? Haven't seen any proof he actually made this much. If you did actually make this much your the kind of goober uber wants to drive for them and your one of the reasons the prices are so low.


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## SEAL Team 5 (Dec 19, 2015)

R W said:


> I paid $875 dollars in gas for the month so my NET before taxes was $6,020 (wear and tear on the car might hurt me later)


Almost $900 a month is a hell of a lot of gas for a vehicle on the X platform. How many miles did you drive?


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

I hope we didn't drive the op away.
Making some assumptions: 
$875 @ $2.50/gal = 350 gallons. 350 gal * 30 mpg = 10,500 miles. 
$6020 / $22/hr = 274 hours (8.8 hrs/day).
If it was a typical new $32k car, the cost were around $5617 leaving a profit of $1277 or an hourly rate of $4.66.
If it was an older car, the cost were around $2625 leaving a profit of $4270 or an hourly rate of $15.58.
If the car was worthless at the start of the month and no plans to ever repair it, just junk it, then it was $22 / hr.
This demonstrates the importance of controlling costs.

On the plus side, not many other gigs will allow one to bust their butt one month and take the next off. Or to trade $x in car value for cash today. Even netting less than $4/hr is worth it for some.


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## Taxi2Uber (Jul 21, 2017)

Earning $6895 for 31 days is ~$222/day
He said he earned around $22/hr, so that averages to 10 hrs/day for 31 days.
Gas was $875 for the 31 days, or ~$28/day.
With gas at $2.50/gal, that's 11.2 gal used per day.
With a car getting 25 MPG that's 280 miles driven per day, if driven continuously.
(Less miles, likely, given idle times waiting for pings. say 250 miles or 7750 miles in 31 days)
To achieve those numbers, your paid miles and paid hours would have to be remarkably and consistently high all 31 days.
With bonuses and surge, I guess it could be possible. Kudos to you.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

First off, I doubt the OPs initial numbers.
Browse the Charlotte board for 10 minutes.
NOBODY nets like that here, even Uber Black.
I'll have a $5000 gross in my cab this month but expenses eh?

The average Charlotte UberX takes home $400 per week full time. It's .62 per mile and rarely surges.
To post $6000 here one would rack up 6000 to 12000 miles on the X car.

Not believable, and even if the OP had a marathon moment month...

Not sustainable.


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## Buddywannarideagain (Jun 29, 2017)

I estimate 15,000 miles for 27 rides a day x 30 days. That's a brain fog of a month.


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## renegaid (Sep 3, 2017)

That's really not much money for so many hours. That's why I see uber as something on the side and not for bread and butter. Too many hours for such little money.


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

That's what Orlando number are 400 full time with uber as well.

Yet in a taxi it's like $750 - ($300 expenses) in a 3 day weekend (Friday-Sunday night)

Something's wrong here, and it's ubers rates...


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## Merc7186 (Jul 8, 2017)

Frustrated!!!! said:


> If you have a car like a Altima that don't even cost alot of money why care about wear and tear making 4 figures a week. As stated it's always the barely breaking even drivers that cry.


I'm not a barely breaking even driver nor crying....I just think that some of have a knack for identifying stupid when we see it.


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## MSUGrad9902 (Jun 8, 2016)

It's impossible to know your true expenses in only one month. I keep very detailed records so I know exactly how much it takes to operate my car (and I know there is a difference between IRS profits and actual profits too, a point which is lost on some people). This takes at least 2 years of driving while recording every gas purchase, every oil change, every bit of maintenance. Using KBB is not going to give you accurate answers because your car would be depreciating even if you just had it sitting in the garage in all likelihood. Also - some of the expenses would be constant whether I ubered on the weekends or not - i.e. a car note, phone bill, etc. So you also have to account for that too.

It's probably possible to do what the OP said in one month. However over the long run likely not sustainable. Uber is great for cash flow especially short term like this.


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## htboston (Feb 22, 2016)

So after all that is said and done, your real net profit after EVERYTHING is $4.7K maybe? Working so many hours, I would say you made 10-12 an hour. Same as a McDonalds' worker in NYC?


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## MSUGrad9902 (Jun 8, 2016)

htboston said:


> So after all that is said and done, your real net profit after EVERYTHING is $4.7K maybe? Working so many hours, I would say you made 10-12 an hour. Same as a McDonalds' worker in NYC?


For a one month span 4700 is a pretty good cash flow and much better than what you can make at McDonalds.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

MSUGrad9902 said:


> It's impossible to know your true expenses in only one month. I keep very detailed records so I know exactly how much it takes to operate my car (and I know there is a difference between IRS profits and actual profits too, a point which is lost on some people). This takes at least 2 years of driving while recording every gas purchase, every oil change, every bit of maintenance. Using KBB is not going to give you accurate answers because your car would be depreciating even if you just had it sitting in the garage in all likelihood. Also - some of the expenses would be constant whether I ubered on the weekends or not - i.e. a car note, phone bill, etc. So you also have to account for that too.
> 
> It's probably possible to do what the OP said in one month. However over the long run likely not sustainable. Uber is great for cash flow especially short term like this.


I agree one cannot know their exact expenses, mostly due to unforeseen repairs. But the unforeseen repairs can be estimated. One of the decisions is how long of a time period does one average the costs. The IRS uses a 5 year period starting when the car is new. If they only used a 1 year period, the costs would be much higher due to depreciation being the highest on a new car. While depreciation is high in the first few years, repairs are low. While depreciation is lower the older the car gets, the expected repair costs go up.

Maintenance costs can be accurately calculated by referring the the owner's manual and calculating each items costs.

Gas costs can be accurately calculated by the cost per gallon divided by the car's mpg.

Services like kbb can be used to calculate depreciation. Look up what you car is currently worth. Then subtract the miles you drove for rideshare and check the value again. The difference is the depreciation related to driving the car for rideshare.

The fixed expenses one incurs when not driving rideshare are not costs to drive rideshare. Those expenses are cost to own a car for personal use. When making the decision to drive for rideshare or stay home and do nothing, the personal ownership expenses should not be included. When itemizing the cost to drive for tax purposes, those ownership cost can and should be distributed to personal or business expenses based on percentage of use in each. For example, if you use your car only for personal errands for one month it may cost you $500/mo. You have the same errands next month and it will cost $500 again. But you also do rideshare that added another $500 in costs. Total cost for owning and operating the car for the month would be $1000 but only $500 is attributed to driving for rideshare.

If you bought a car strictly for rideshare, there are no personal costs, its all business. And if you do the math, it may not a good idea. Rideshare makes the most financial sense to use a personal car. There may be tax benefits for using a business only car, but taxes shouldn't concern most rideshare drivers.


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## htboston (Feb 22, 2016)

MSUGrad9902 said:


> For a one month span 4700 is a pretty good cash flow and much better than what you can make at McDonalds.


Yeah, but he said he worked around 18 hours per day a lot during that month


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## gizmotheboss (Jul 5, 2017)

Is it really worth it to risk your life for $22 an hour you on the road. You being tired And sleepy, you're not only putting passengers lives in danger you put yourself and other cars on the road in danger as well. Shame on you


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## htboston (Feb 22, 2016)

ShinyAndChrome said:


> particularly depreciation


You don't have to calculate depreciation if he is not planning to sell his car


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## Kodyhead (May 26, 2015)

gizmotheboss said:


> Is it really worth it to risk your life for $22 an hour you on the road. You being tired And sleepy, you're not only putting passengers lives in danger you put yourself and other cars on the road in danger as well. Shame on you


And what's the difference between this driver and lets say a registered nurse who just got off a 12 hour shift and decides to drive for 3-6 hours?


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## Misaelz28 (Aug 29, 2016)

Screenshot or never happened


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Kodyhead said:


> And what's the difference between this driver and lets say a registered nurse who just got off a 12 hour shift and decides to drive for 3-6 hours?


Not much. Although doing the same thing for long periods of time tends to induce boredom and then drowsiness. I wouldn't want a nurse or driver that is drowsy.



htboston said:


> You don't have to calculate depreciation if he is not planning to sell his car


Typically you would. If you bought a car for $5000 and its now worthless, that $5000 is depreciation. The only time depreciation isn't a factor is when the car is worth the same after driving it as it was before driving it.


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

htboston said:


> You don't have to calculate depreciation if he is not planning to sell his car


Even if we allow that he's going to keep it until it is scrap, when he drives uber it's going to become scrap that much sooner. There is no way to get around the costs to the vehicle--costs that go beyond obvious consumables (gas, tires, brakes).


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## pomegranite112 (May 14, 2017)

Low mileage, 2 years newer than the min req and pref a prius will be the most optimal

Change it every 2 years


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

pomegranite112 said:


> Low mileage, 2 years newer than the min req and pref a prius will be the most optimal
> 
> Change it every 2 years


Nope you want an El-cheapo Minivan so you can do XL trips.


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

chances are, after all costs, if true, he probably barely broke even...


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## Kodyhead (May 26, 2015)

wb6vpm said:


> chances are, after all costs, if true, he probably barely broke even...


Explain this how he barely broke even, it is not efficient but how did he break even?


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

bsliv said:


> Since when is determining one's costs a "cry baby tactic"? How can one determine their profit from a business without know their cost to do business? An $6000 '09 Altima will depreciate roughly $0.03 per mile, roughly 1/3 of the cost of gas. That's nearly $300, nothing to cry about but a significant amount none the less. As a car ages, depreciation rates decline but repair costs increase. I estimate a transmission alone would be an additional $0.02 per mile.
> 
> I can make $2000 next week. But it would cost me $800 for the flight, $700 for lodging, and $100 for food. Taking costs into account, the trip doesn't look so good.
> 
> Hater or realist?


Depreciation or Repair

He WILL PAY.

THERE IS NO ESCAPE !

The only one riding for Free is Uber !


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## pomegranite112 (May 14, 2017)

Break even my ass. Only chumps break even. The second theres a major issue, you hide it and sell it. Cars are like hot potatoes

Uber or not, you're losing value. Cars lose value by time and miles. Not just miles. Buying from a dealer = auto loss. Buy private, sell private


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

wb6vpm said:


> chances are, after all costs, if true, he probably barely broke even...


Uber will Review.

If it is determined he has made Any Profit Whatsoever ,
THERE WILL BE A RATE CUT !


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

pomegranite112 said:


> Break even my ass. Only chumps break even. The second theres a major issue, you hide it and sell it. Cars are like hot potatoes
> 
> Uber or not, you're losing value. Cars lose value by time and miles. Not just miles. Buying from a dealer = auto loss. Buy private, sell private


Did the op make money, break even, or lose money? We don't know.

I agree most cars lose value sitting in the garage. If the car sits in the garage, you not driving rideshare. This thread concerns the profit made during a month of driving for rideshare. One cannot know the profit without knowing both the income and the cost.

If I can't make a payment on my $40k car this month, I could drive, take a loss on each ride, and have more cash in my hand at the end of the month than I had at the beginning. I get to keep my car for another month. Or I could let them repossess my car. Which is being a chump? There are situations where breaking even or losing money is preferable to not driving. That would be a short term solution to a longer term problem. Sometimes one must take one day at a time.

A lot of people won't buy a used car from a non-dealer because there may be a major issue that has been hidden. Suggesting one be deceptive when selling and suggesting one buys from a potential deceptive seller is not right. I suggest if you find an issue with your car that you fix it or sell it, giving fair warning to the buyer that there may be an issue.


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

Kodyhead said:


> Explain this how he barely broke even, it is not efficient but how did he break even?


Depreciation, accelerated maintenance & repair costs due to much higher than normal usage, insurance, car note (if any). The big 2 are the depreciation (extremely high mileage usage compared to average vehicle), and the maintenance/repair costs. The OP will be spending money on things like oil changes, spark plugs, transmission services, and so on. That doesn't take into account the unexpected repairs, such as failed transmission or blown engine. I use bsliv's post as a decent example of the cost calculations that include things like depreciation, but even his does not take into account costs of maintenance or repairs:



bsliv said:


> Making some assumptions:
> $875 @ $2.50/gal = 350 gallons. 350 gal * 30 mpg = 10,500 miles.
> $6020 / $22/hr = 274 hours (8.8 hrs/day).
> If it was a typical new $32k car, the cost were around $5617 leaving a profit of $1277 or an hourly rate of $4.66.
> ...


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Kodyhead said:


> Explain this how he barely broke even, it is not efficient but how did he break even?


If he had a car that cost as much to drive as the income produced during that drive, $income - $cost = $0.


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## Kodyhead (May 26, 2015)

wb6vpm said:


> Depreciation, accelerated maintenance & repair costs due to much higher than normal usage, insurance, car note (if any). The big 2 are the depreciation (extremely high mileage usage compared to average vehicle), and the maintenance/repair costs. The OP will be spending money on things like oil changes, spark plugs, transmission services, and so on. That doesn't take into account the unexpected repairs, such as failed transmission or blown engine. I use bsliv's post as a decent example of the cost calculations that include things like depreciation, but even his does not take into account costs of maintenance or repairs:


So you are telling me the cost to run that car is 5600 a month or 67000 a year for a car that costs 32000?


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Kodyhead said:


> So you are telling me the cost to run that car is 5600 a month or 67000 a year for a car that costs 32000?


The IRS tells us the typical, new, $32k car costs $0.535 per mile, if driven for 15,000 miles per year, for a five year period.


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## Kodyhead (May 26, 2015)

bsliv said:


> The IRS tells us the typical, new, $32k car costs $0.535 per mile, if driven for 15,000 miles per year, for a five year period.


I am asking you if you put on 100k miles in a year ON A BRAND NEW CAR is your expectation that you would spend 67000 in that year maintaining that car even if that car depreciated to absolute zero based on original calculation or lets say 53,500 a year based on its calculation?


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Kodyhead said:


> I am asking you if you put on 100k miles in a year is your expectation that you would spend 67000 in that year maintaining that car even if that car depreciated to absolute zero based on original calculation or lets say 53,500 a year based on its calculation?


No, it would not be $53,500 to own and operate that car for 100,000 miles in one year, given the data available, although it could be close.

One can and should calculate the cost to own and operate a car for 100,000 miles in one year, if that is their business plan.

For example:
car $32,000
oil 2,000
tires 800
brakes 700
fuel 10,000
repairs 2,000
may have to add insurance, licensing, finance charges, car storage, parking fees, etc., if applicable.


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## Kodyhead (May 26, 2015)

bsliv said:


> No, it would not be $53,500 to own and operate that car for 100,000 miles in one year, given the data available, although it could be close.
> 
> One can and should calculate the cost to own and operate a car for 100,000 miles in one year, if that is their business plan.
> 
> ...


8
Throw everything in there please. And i believe everything is included in that irs deduction but i am still learning myself

And for the record even a 1 year old car in fair condition with 100000 miles can be sold for $10000 at least btw but lets assume it's value has been nibbled down to zero

2000 for oil? Are you changing oil every 10 days? Lol lets just throw the excess towards repairs


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Kodyhead said:


> 8
> Throw everything in there please. And i believe everything is included in that irs deduction but i am still learning myself
> 
> And for the record even a 1 year old car in fair condition with 100000 miles can be sold for $10000 at least btw but lets assume it's value has been nibbled down to zero
> ...


I just spit wadded the numbers as an example. It would be an oil change every 18.25 days (5k oil changes @ $100/per = $2000, a Mercedes dealer may charge triple, a diy would be less). When you mentioned, "even if that car depreciated to absolute zero", I used $0 to simplify.

Even with the same car, everyone's costs are going to be slightly different. One can't rely on other's calculations for their situation. One can rely on some formulas to calculate costs.


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## Kodyhead (May 26, 2015)

bsliv said:


> I just spit wadded the numbers as an example. It would be an oil change every 18.25 days (5k oil changes @ $100/per = $2000, a Mercedes dealer may charge triple, a diy would be less). When you mentioned, "even if that car depreciated to absolute zero", I used $0 to simplify.
> 
> Even with the same car, everyone's costs are going to be slightly different. One can't rely on other's calculations for their situation. One can rely on some formulas to calculate costs.


I agree with many things you say, i just find any number between $54k to $67k with 100k miles on a 32000 car to be absurd high and i may be wrong and not claiming to be an expert by any means


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Kodyhead said:


> I agree with many things you say, i just find any number between $54k to $67k with 100k miles on a 32000 car to be absurd high and i may be wrong and not claiming to be an expert by any means


I don't think anyone is an expert. Everyone should be questioned. I agree those numbers are high.

The IRS standard mileage deduction for business is $0.535/mile and for moving/medical is $0.17/mile. Per the IRS, "The standard mileage rate for business is based on an annual study of the fixed and variable costs of operating an automobile. The rate for medical and moving purposes is based on the variable costs."

Digging a little deeper reveals the IRS calls depreciation a fixed cost, not a variable cost. Variable costs ($0.17/mile) include fuel, maintenance and repairs. I figure fuel is about $0.10/mile for most cars in most areas. That leaves $0.07/mile for maintenance and repairs.

A 2016 Prius with 15,000 miles in very good condition is worth $24,884. A 2016 Prius with 115,000 miles in fair condition is worth $12,323. That works out to $0.126/mile for depreciation due to the extra 100,000 miles on that Prius. Any added fixed costs like business license, commercial insurance, added cell service, etc., have to be added too. I guestimate $1000/yr. or $0.01/mile. My math says $30,600 to drive that Prius an extra 100k miles.

More believable?


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## Kodyhead (May 26, 2015)

bsliv said:


> I don't think anyone is an expert. Everyone should be questioned. I agree those numbers are high.
> 
> The IRS standard mileage deduction for business is $0.535/mile and for moving/medical is $0.17/mile. Per the IRS, "The standard mileage rate for business is based on an annual study of the fixed and variable costs of operating an automobile. The rate for medical and moving purposes is based on the variable costs."
> 
> ...


Same ballpark

Do you have a business license? Is that required where you are?


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Kodyhead said:


> Same ballpark
> 
> Do you have a business license? Is that required where you are?


Yep. $200 to the state and another $25 to the county. Its being enforced by Uber having to send to the state a list of drivers and their business license number or photo of the license.

The cost numbers seem high because the cars are new and 100,000 miles is a lot of extra miles in a year. If we used a different car it might be cheaper. If we broke down the actual maintenance and repairs it might be different. Doing it yourself is a whole lot cheaper than a stealership. Use numbers for your car and situation.


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## Kodyhead (May 26, 2015)

bsliv said:


> Yep. $200 to the state and another $25 to the county. Its being enforced by Uber having to send to the state a list of drivers and their business license number or photo of the license.
> 
> The cost numbers seem high because the cars are new and 100,000 miles is a lot of extra miles in a year. If we used a different car it might be cheaper. If we broke down the actual maintenance and repairs it might be different. Doing it yourself is a whole lot cheaper than a stealership. Use numbers for your car and situation.


Are all the laws for tnc on a state level over there? and can you only do pickups in that county that you have a license in?


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Kodyhead said:


> Are all the laws for tnc on a state level over there? and can you only do pickups in that county that you have a license in?


There is a clause in the state law that is supposed to prohibit local governments from additional restrictions but its vague, as is typical of our state laws. The state business licence (tax) was always a requirement but the latest legislature is forcing Uber to turn over the data. Uber is requiring drivers to upload a pic of their license or get deactivated.


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## Kodyhead (May 26, 2015)

Out of curiosity do any drivers set up a corporation or some proprietorship?


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## pomegranite112 (May 14, 2017)

bsliv said:


> The IRS tells us the typical, new, $32k car costs $0.535 per mile, if driven for 15,000 miles per year, for a five year period.


Every cars also diff. A beatup old KIA vs a 2010 prius

Which will cost more? Yet they all go by the standard 54 cent deduction. 54 is an aggressive est



bsliv said:


> No, it would not be $53,500 to own and operate that car for 100,000 miles in one year, given the data available, although it could be close.
> 
> One can and should calculate the cost to own and operate a car for 100,000 miles in one year, if that is their business plan.
> 
> ...


Everything on that list is overstated. Change your own oil, drive an uber car (prius) for gas and maintenance, repairs are really high too. Brakes are fine

Cars dont last only 100k so no you dont lose the 32k.

A new prius = 23k. A prius with 100k and 1 years old = 10k. Major depreciation.

A 2013 prius with 40k = 13k, 2012 prius with 140k miles = 7-8k. Only 5k depreciation

Picking the right car is half the battle

Might only cost 10k on 100k but 100k is a LOT of miles. Thats going from dc to california about 16 times. Off 100k miles, you should easily be able to make 70k-10k cost. Irs has it at 54k cost, 17k taxed, 4k goes to irs. Thats 56k you put in your pocket. Now if you had a job that let you put 56k in your pocket, it woukd have to pay you 100k cause you're taxed on 100k AND YOU GOTTA GET TO WORK SOMEHOW.


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

If I saw a 1 year old car with 100K+ miles on it, the seller couldn't pay me to take that car. That car will have had the sh!t beat out of it!


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## pomegranite112 (May 14, 2017)

wb6vpm said:


> If I saw a 1 year old car with 100K+ miles on it, the seller couldn't pay me to take that car. That car will have had the sh!t beat out of it!


so you buy an undermileaged used car and put 100k on it. Will take about 2 years to do that anyways.


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

pomegranite112 said:


> Which will cost more? Yet they all go by the standard 54 cent deduction. 54 is an aggressive est
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What is overstated? If you put 100K+ miles on a brand new car in 1 year, that car is effectively going to be worthless, KBB be damned. Oil, most new cars require synthetic oil, which can cost anywhere from $50-150 per oil change, with oil changes being done every 5-10K that works out to a range of $1000-3000, so his number is reasonably right in the middle of the ballpark. Tires, even if you use $70 cheap-o tires, you still need mounting and balancing, so estimate 100 per tire installed, those tires will probably give you about 50K before wearing out, so again, estimate is right on the nose. Brakes, you are accepting as being accurate, however, I think this one could be less if you can do them yourself, and just buy the lifetime pads from AutoZone (they cover even normal wear and tear under warranty). Fuel, that calculation was based off average fuel economy of 25 MPG, at a average cost of $2.50 a gallon. Repairs, the first time that car has a major transmission issue, or failed motor outside of warranty, that $2000 will be eaten up and then some, but even without that, smaller mechanical or sensor failures, as well as general maintenance (such as timing chain) over course of 100K will easily eat up $2000. Lets remember, most vehicles (notable exceptions being things like semis, police vehicles, ambulances) were not designed to be driven 100K miles in a 1 year period, so things are not going to hold up like they normally would on an average mileage car (12-18K per year).



pomegranite112 said:


> so you buy an undermileaged used car and put 100k on it. Will take about 2 years to do that anyways.


Agreed, however, I was specifically replying to the comment about a new car having 100K+ miles put on it in its first year.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

And my number are just an example. Plug in your own numbers. 

Choosing the right car is more than half the battle.

I believe most of our results will be much closer to the IRS's moving/medical deduction of $0.17/mile than the business deduction of $0.535. But that $0.17 doesn't include depreciation which can add a lot or a little, depending on your car, miles driven and atypical condition deterioration. The $0.535 includes stuff like finance charges, insurance, registration, etc., that most of us have to pay to use our cars for personal use. The $0.535 is for a new car. Most rideshare drivers are not using a new car. Depreciation could be $6000 the first year but only $4000 the second year, $3000 the third year, with the same miles driven per year. 

100,000 miles a year probably isn't realistic for most of us. Although the op was on a pace to exceed that. A taxi used for multiple shifts could reach that number, too. 

For what its worth, I calculate my 2015 economy car that I bought and use for personal use to cost me roughly $0.25 per mile for a relatively low amount of rideshare miles per year, doing my own maintenance and repairs, etc.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

An ant chasing base rate rides in a highway based community could easily rack up 60,000 or more miles per year full time.


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## Hallie (Sep 20, 2017)

Frustrated!!!! said:


> So to sum it up. The driver did well. More than most. I can understand the complaints about pay,pax,gas etc.But to be negative about this thread makes me question why some of you even drive at all


Honestly I think a lot don't get the business side of this rideshare thing as it stands. It is quite logical that no matter how much you earn, you have to make the deductions to fully understand how little money you actually make and what it looks like in the long run. Simply many just don't get it! They would need better examples or a more complete example.
Some of us are using it to make ends meet while working on other things. Maybe make a few dollars if someone is heading your way. I'm sure there are lots of reasons but, for those that do it as a sole means of support, it's clearly not a good career choice. Yet, it could be if the companies would charge more reasonable rates and resolve issues with their poor ratings system. So, complaints from people that are making them the money is the way to get them to move. Discussion is an avenue to base decisions on or to make change.


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

bsliv said:


> And my number are just an example. Plug in your own numbers.
> 
> Choosing the right car is more than half the battle.
> 
> ...


I wonder if people will ever get it. I refer to the $.54 people as the 54 cent cultists. Strangely, though they will insist that you can't run a car for less than $.54/mile they realize their inconsistency if you ask them what it costs per mile to run a Porsche Panamera or Aventador.


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## Kodyhead (May 26, 2015)

Somebody down here claims he got a prius from fleet iirc a city of county i think with 250k miles on it for a few grand, not a bad car to do uber at that price.


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

Kodyhead said:


> Somebody down here claims he got a prius from fleet iirc a city of county i think with 250k miles on it for a few grand, not a bad car to do uber at that price.


old Prius is the perfect uber car. Lots available and they are absurdly reliable.


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## Taxi2Uber (Jul 21, 2017)

bsliv said:


> ....If you bought a car strictly for rideshare, there are no personal costs, its all business. And if you do the math, it may not a good idea. Rideshare makes the most financial sense to use a personal car. There may be tax benefits for using a business only car, but taxes shouldn't concern most rideshare drivers.


Quote:"Rideshare makes the most financial sense to use a personal car"
I don't agree with that. If the personal car is newer, depreciation is the killer, as you know, so getting a beater just for rideshare might make more sense.

Quote:"There may be tax benefits for using a business only car,"
Like what?...I'm all ears.

Quote:"but taxes shouldn't concern most rideshare drivers."
Are you saying most drivers earn approximately $.54/mile?
Certainly not the case for me.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Taxi2Uber said:


> Quote:"Rideshare makes the most financial sense to use a personal car"
> I don't agree with that. If the personal car is newer, depreciation is the killer, as you know, so getting a beater just for rideshare might make more sense.
> 
> Quote:"There may be tax benefits for using a business only car,"
> ...


Dedicating a car for rideshare means getting insurance, registration, taxes, and other assorted costs that one wouldn't have using a personal car for rideshare. It could be those costs are low enough that it still makes sense.

The tax benefit would be the ability to depreciate the business car 100% over 5 years. But that means itemizing the costs for deductions instead of using the standard mileage rate. I don't see a tax benefit to itemizing for most people especially with an old car. There something about a 6000lb gross vehicle weight for taxes but I can't remember.

Net income = gross - cost. A personal deduction of $6k or so leaves the taxable income. If your still paying taxes and your car is super cheap to operate, you need more dead miles or some other legal deductions. If it costs you $0.235/mile to drive and the IRS will allow a deduction of $0.535/mile, that's $0.30 less net income per mile driven. Since I owe taxes due to my day job and my car is fairly cheap to run, I've thought about driving around the city and refusing pings but not sure how legal that would be. Uber could pay me zero and it would still be a benefit for me to drive under these circumstances. In fact, the more Uber paid, the more I'd have to drive to reduce my tax bill.

Don't take my tax advice other than to lead you to your own research. I don't do taxes other than my own.


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## Taxi2Uber (Jul 21, 2017)

bsliv said:


> Dedicating a car for rideshare means getting insurance, registration, taxes, and other assorted costs that one wouldn't have using a personal car for rideshare. It could be those costs are low enough that it still makes sense.
> 
> The tax benefit would be the ability to depreciate the business car 100% over 5 years. But that means itemizing the costs for deductions instead of using the standard mileage rate. I don't see a tax benefit to itemizing for most people especially with an old car. There something about a 6000lb gross vehicle weight for taxes but I can't remember.
> 
> ...


If the expenses of a separate business car is cheaper than the depreciation of the personal car, then it makes sense to get a dedicated business car, which is why if felt the blanket statement was a little misleading.

Using the SMD is not unique to business only car. I thought you knew of other things I wasn't aware of.

I would have to drive A LOT of dead miles to get to $.54/mile. Question is would gas, depreciation, wear&tear cost me more than just paying the taxes. Intentionally putting dead miles on the car seems wrong to me, but I haven't done the math, so I can't say for sure.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Taxi2Uber said:


> If the expenses of a separate business car is cheaper than the depreciation of the personal car, then it makes sense to get a dedicated business car, which is why if felt the blanket statement was a little misleading.
> 
> Using the SMD is not unique to business only car. I thought you knew of other things I wasn't aware of.
> 
> I would have to drive A LOT of dead miles to get to $.54/mile. Question is would gas, depreciation, wear&tear cost me more than just paying the taxes. Intentionally putting dead miles on the car seems wrong to me, but I haven't done the math, so I can't say for sure.


My main point was to urge others to do the math their self. Gross income alone doesn't tell us much. Using other's assumptions is not the way to calculate costs.

I just ran a few number concerning more dead miles. Don't do it unless your car costs a lot less than $0.25/mile to run or your tax rate is higher than 30%.


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## Hallie (Sep 20, 2017)

bsliv said:


> My main point was to urge others to do the math their self. Gross income alone doesn't tell us much. Using other's assumptions is not the way to calculate costs.
> 
> I just ran a few number concerning more dead miles. Don't do it unless your car costs a lot less than $0.25/mile to run or your tax rate is higher than 30%.


Isn't it stated something like, "they can see the trees but, cant see the forest for the trees"?

To be overwhelmed by detail to the point where it obscures the overall situation.

It appears that explaination is futile. :-/
If you know something about creating a spreadsheet to do the math using cells to plug in an individuals numbers (mpg, depreciation for miles driven or cost of vehicle, money spent on maintenence, etc), it might help the folks that dont get it.


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## Taxi2Uber (Jul 21, 2017)

bsliv said:


> My main point was to urge others to do the math their self. Gross income alone doesn't tell us much. Using other's assumptions is not the way to calculate costs.
> 
> I just ran a few number concerning more dead miles. Don't do it unless your car costs a lot less than $0.25/mile to run or your tax rate is higher than 30%.


Of course, do the math. I usually agree with what you say, but you made a few assumptions and generalizations yourself that were misleading and I wanted to clarify and expand on them.

I started Uber mid-year, and at this point, I would have to drive nearly 13,000 dead miles to "break even" with the IRS SMD.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Taxi2Uber said:


> Of course, do the math. I usually agree with what you say, but you made a few assumptions and generalizations yourself that were misleading and I wanted to clarify and expand on them.
> I started Uber mid-year, and at this point, I would have to drive nearly 13,000 dead miles to "break even" with the IRS SMD.


And you did right by correcting my wrong assumptions. And better yet, didn't have to resort to name calling. Thank you!
Don't drive that 13k miles! I failed to account for the tax rate. My quick and dirty spreadsheet shows taxable income going down as the deducted miles went up, but the lower taxes didn't make up for the increased cost to drive. Again, my mistake. I used $0.25 cost per mile and 30% tax rate. It traded too much equity for too little tax savings.



Hallie said:


> Isn't it stated something like, "they can see the trees but, cant see the forest for the trees"?
> To be overwhelmed by detail to the point where it obscures the overall situation.
> It appears that explaination is futile. :-/
> If you know something about creating a spreadsheet to do the math using cells to plug in an individuals numbers (mpg, depreciation for miles driven or cost of vehicle, money spent on maintenence, etc), it might help the folks that dont get it.


There are some good spreadsheets available but I don't think they're the most user friendly. I have some programming experience and I'll see what I can cobble together.


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## Jorgeletsee (Jun 26, 2017)

People need to treat uber for what it is. A temporary job. Most people who complain think they can make a career out of this. If you are a us citizen and cant get a better job either you are ******ed as in you have difficulties learning or deserve this job. Stop complaining get off thede forums and go do something with your life. Uber is not a career or even a good job.



bsliv said:


> Frustrated said, "how about this how much you average??? Me 1500 Honda Accord oil changes and 2 tires and I feeds my family well"
> 
> You don't know how much you profit. You know how much you gross. Its a short sighted approach. It takes more than oil changes and 2 tires to keep that Accord running. What happens when the other 2 tires blow? What happens when the ****** won't engage? What happens when the water/fuel/oil pump goes out? You may not realize it until you try to sell it or repair it, but the costs are there and should be calculated.
> 
> ...


 Lol who the he'll drives a car that gets 15 mpg? Alot of older cars can get up to 30 mpg. Do the math and get yourself a car that wastes less.


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

Jorgeletsee said:


> Lol who the he'll drives a car that gets 15 mpg? Alot of older cars can get up to 30 mpg. Do the math and get yourself a car that wastes less.


Could be an older V8.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Jorgeletsee said:


> Lol who the he'll drives a car that gets 15 mpg? Alot of older cars can get up to 30 mpg. Do the math and get yourself a car that wastes less.


I have 2 cars, one gets about 15 mpg ('99 4wd >4000lb suv) the other gets 40 mpg. I did the math. Depreciation is a real cost.


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

gizmotheboss said:


> Is it really worth it to risk your life for $22 an hour you on the road. You being tired And sleepy, you're not only putting passengers lives in danger you put yourself and other cars on the road in danger as well. Shame on you


He was never on the road for more than 18 hours. That leaves up to 6 hours per night for sleeping. No evidence he endangered anyone.


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

Trafficat said:


> He was never on the road for more than 18 hours. That leaves up to 6 hours per night for sleeping. No evidence he endangered anyone.


Driving for 18 hours in a day is not safe in any situation. Driving 12 hours straight isn't even safe. It's why OTR drivers have to stop after driving 11 hours (and up to 14 hours on duty total) for a at least 10 hours, 8 of which, if equipped, are to be spent in the berth.


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

wb6vpm said:


> Driving for 18 hours in a day is not safe in any situation. Driving 12 hours straight isn't even safe. It's why OTR drivers have to stop after driving 11 hours (and up to 14 hours on duty total) for a at least 10 hours, 8 of which, if equipped, are to be spent in the berth.


That may be the law but that doesn't prove anything. Different people require different amounts of sleep. They legislate towards the lowest common denominator sometimes and other times it seems like they use made up BS numbers created by unions to increase the demand for drivers by reducing the amount a driver can drive in one day.


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## Jorgeletsee (Jun 26, 2017)

bsliv said:


> I have 2 cars, one gets about 15 mpg ('99 4wd >4000lb suv) the other gets 40 mpg. I did the math. Depreciation is a real cost.


 A $1500. Dollar can be used on uber.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Jorgeletsee said:


> A $1500. Dollar can be used on uber.


I have 2 cars, neither bought for Uber and neither currently driving for Uber. A third car in my 1 person household seems a bit much. Thanks for your concern.


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## Jorgeletsee (Jun 26, 2017)

bsliv said:


> I have 2 cars, neither bought for Uber and neither currently driving for Uber. A third car in my 1 person household seems a bit much. Thanks for your concern.


people can drive older cars that get almost 30 mpg. Your example is A stupid example. You come on here trying to sound all smart yet you give a dumbass example. You talk about people not knowing how much they profit but you cant even give a good example to back up your claims


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Jorgeletsee said:


> because people can drive older cars that get almost 30 mpg. Your example is A stupid example. You come on here trying to sound all smart yet you give a dumbass example. You talk about people not knowing how much they profit but you cant even give a good example to back up your claims


Do the math yourself.


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## Jorgeletsee (Jun 26, 2017)

bsliv said:


> Do the math yourself.


I did I drive an 04 focus that I got for 1300 at auction. Gets combined 27 mpg. I make 4400 a month.

And its only a temporary job


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## kdyrpr (Apr 23, 2016)

Congratulations. Here's a cookie.


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## SSFLNE (May 19, 2017)

Trafficat said:


> That may be the law but that doesn't prove anything. Different people require different amounts of sleep. They legislate towards the lowest common denominator sometimes and other times it seems like they use made up BS numbers created by unions to increase the demand for drivers by reducing the amount a driver can drive in one day.


During my training for CDL we learned federal studies revealed " Sleep-deprived or fatigued 6 hours of sleep or less triples your risk of a vehicle related accident". That's right, simply missing two hours of sleep triples your risk. Could there be exceptions out there, sure I guess, but the data is pretty solid.


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## Jorgeletsee (Jun 26, 2017)

kdyrpr said:


> Congratulations. Here's a cookie.


Save it you probably need it


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## gofry (Oct 20, 2015)

Sorry, there's no way the OP made $22 per hour in the Charlotte market. $10-12 is more like it.


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## midtownhm (Apr 17, 2016)

ShinyAndChrome said:


> This is what a post from somebody who failed highschool math looks like. There is good advice out there but you have to put your pride aside and be willing to take it. If you can find me an 09 Altima that doesn't suffer the effects of driving on its value and condition, I will defer to your wisdom.


exactly, and good luck when your 200k miles nissan altima dies on you in the middle of traffic after 3 months of ubering


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

SSFLNE said:


> During my training for CDL we learned federal studies revealed " Sleep-deprived or fatigued 6 hours of sleep or less triples your risk of a vehicle related accident". That's right, simply missing two hours of sleep triples your risk. Could there be exceptions out there, sure I guess, but the data is pretty solid.


Bunch of other crap, too. Long term impacts of "insufficient" sleep jack up all sorts of lovely ailments like cancer, cardiovascular issues, alzheimers, etc. but hey we can drive drunks around for net $15 hour and pay for it in a few decades so it's well worth it I guess!


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

Mears Troll Number 4 said:


> It's been known for James River Insurance to under pay out insurance claims.
> 
> So if you total your car you might very well end up paying $1000 deductible and being $2,000 less than the cost of repairing your car. Or $5,000+ or even $10,000 or $15,000 short of getting a new car, especially because they CAN under the law pay out based on the number of miles on your car at the time of the accident.
> 
> So putting 50,000+ miles a year on your car, you total it and the $10,000 in depreciation goes straight into the toilet. You might not get enough to pay off an auto loan either OR EVEN pay off a lease.


Isn't Lyft's deductible @ $2,000?


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## Eric1234 (Oct 9, 2017)

R W said:


> Hello Uber people,
> 
> I just wanted to let this forum know that it is possible to make some money Ubering. Need and still need cash to pay some old bills. I am sort of a do it now and worry about it later so I am putting the tax stuff out of my head for the time being to take care of the now. I paid $875 dollars in gas for the month so my NET before taxes was $6,020 (wear and tear on the car might hurt me later)
> 
> ...


Yeah forget the negative, I'm a mechanic by trade (20 years in biz) I do all my own repairs and diagnostics so I save money on that end too, the money is good and I'm happy


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

Trafficat said:


> He was never on the road for more than 18 hours. That leaves up to 6 hours per night for sleeping. No evidence he endangered anyone.


If you think a person is safe who has just spent 17-18 hours on the road, I'm sorry to say you are misinformed (in the extreme).


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## Serby (Sep 6, 2017)

TwoFiddyMile said:


> An ant chasing base rate rides in a highway based community could easily rack up 60,000 or more miles per year full time.


Easy. I put 42000 since December. I made half that. Lot of empty miles. The 6 DFs were nice.


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## Sueuber (Jul 29, 2017)

Only the people who gets paid by UBER to write on this forum makes that kind of money.UNREALISTIC!


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

Sueuber said:


> Only the people who gets paid by UBER to write on this forum makes that kind of money.UNREALISTIC!


If i rented a taxi by the week i could bring in that much per month, *in revenue*... but that would require 70+ hour weeks and paying $880 a week to rent a taxi with airport stickers.


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## Jacob THE DRIVER (Dec 4, 2016)

ShinyAndChrome said:


> "might"? You drove thousands of miles (10k?). That puts wear on everything in the car, and particularly depreciation. You could run your car through kelly blue book right now and compare what it would be worth with and without those miles on it. Unless it's really old that 10k cost you at least a grand in value right off the top. If your car is newish it might have cost you $2k in value. This is a business, you need to figure out what it actually costs you. "do it now and worry about it later" is not the way to go.


Your right this is a business and worrying about the devaluation of the car is meaningless unless u made a idiotic decision and financed a car to work you lose the minute you sign up for uber. Instead ill focus on saying good job to that driver you can make money doing uber . Why do people these days always focus on a negative instead of the accomplished .


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Jacob THE DRIVER said:


> Your right this is a business and worrying about the devaluation of the car is meaningless unless u made a idiotic decision and financed a car to work you lose the minute you sign up for uber. Instead ill focus on saying good job to that driver you can make money doing uber . Why do people these days always focus on a negative instead of the accomplished .


Why focus on the negative? Because its an extremely important part of doing business.

Devaluation of a car is very important. It doesn't matter if its financed, paid cash, or even given as a gift. If someone gave me a gift of a $5000 car and I drove it for rideshare till it was worth $500, that's a $4500 cost to drive rideshare. I'd have to subtract the $4500 depreciation, fuel, maintenance, and expected repairs from my gross to calculate my pre-tax net.

I could say I made $1000 in 1/2 hour. Just empty my bank account. Of course, it cost me $200/month for 5 months but why dwell on the negative? I'd have a $1000 in my pocket.

I could make $10,000 next month on investments. But it might cost me $15,000 to do it. But don't focus on the negative. Should I do it?

You need to know the cost of doing business before you can give congrats or call someone an idiot based on their business.


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

Jacob THE DRIVER said:


> Your right this is a business and worrying about the devaluation of the car is meaningless unless u made a idiotic decision and financed a car to work you lose the minute you sign up for uber. Instead ill focus on saying good job to that driver you can make money doing uber . *Why do people these days always focus on a negative instead of the accomplished .*


I'm not sure I understand your post here. Did you really just question why I pointed out the necessity of understanding the actual costs involved in one's business venture? It almost seems like you're questioning the wisdom in understanding the cost to offer a service and that instead a person offering it should only focus on the amount of money they collected to offer it.

But, like you said, this is a business, so I must have misinterpreted your post, because understanding what it costs to provide a service or a product is a critical part of any business.


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## Jacob THE DRIVER (Dec 4, 2016)

bsliv said:


> Why focus on the negative? Because its an extremely important part of doing business.
> 
> Devaluation of a car is very important. It doesn't matter if its financed, paid cash, or even given as a gift. If someone gave me a gift of a $5000 car and I drove it for rideshare till it was worth $500, that's a $4500 cost to drive rideshare. I'd have to subtract the $4500 depreciation, fuel, maintenance, and expected repairs from my gross to calculate my pre-tax net.
> 
> ...


 before UBER and all this bullshit rideshare i owned a transportation company so i dont need entertain the rookie negative attitude about running a business im also about to become a uber fleet partner so yea lmao .... to that guy who made that 6 grand thats how u do it dont let the haters tell u different....


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Jacob THE DRIVER said:


> before UBER and all this bullshit rideshare i owned a transportation company so i dont need entertain the rookie negative attitude about running a business im also about to become a uber fleet partner so yea lmao .... to that guy who made that 6 grand thats how u do it dont let the haters tell u different....


If I make $6k/month driving UberX in my new Chevy Suburban that I bought for rideshare exclusively, am I doing good? I calculate my cost to drive a mile at $1.75 if I drive at least 20,000 miles the first year. If I take a loss each mile I drive, can I make it up in volume?

Am I being referred to as a "hater"? I don't hate anyone. I don't hate any company. I don't hate the rates Uber pays. I don't like depreciation but I don't hate it, its a fact one must live with. I do hate misinformation being passed to those looking for correct information.


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

Jacob THE DRIVER said:


> before UBER and all this bullshit rideshare i owned a transportation company so i dont need entertain the rookie negative attitude about running a business im also about to become a uber fleet partner so yea lmao .... to that guy who made that 6 grand thats how u do it dont let the haters tell u different....


You owned a transportation company and now drive for uber. I don't want to get snippy about it, but you opened yourself up for it with the rookie comment.

If you're calling people rookies for analyzing the cost of business, maybe your lack of attention to this crucial component it is one of the reasons your ownership of a transportation company is past-tense.


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## Aerodrifting (Aug 13, 2017)

On X platform, Unless you are driving 12 hours a day, 30 days straight I dont believe those numbers. 
Liars usually add too much details to their stories to make it believable, Thats a common mistake you made there. Maybe Uber needs to pay more to find someone more competent than you to write this story.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Aerodrifting said:


> Maybe Uber needs to pay more to find someone more competent than you to write this story.


You might be on to something. The original poster hasn't been seen since the day of the original post.


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

Mears Troll Number 4 said:


> It's been known for James River Insurance to under pay out insurance claims.


 They overpaid on mine - $2,200 above what the leasing company wanted as a payoff figure. The lease company wanted James River to pay them the full settlement amount including the extra $2,200. I told them no; they weren't getting the extra and asked JR to only pay the lease company the amount it was owed and to send me a check for the difference. They said no problem and Fedexed me a check.


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

The Gift of Fish said:


> They overpaid on mine - $2,200 above what the leasing company wanted as a payoff figure. The lease company wanted James River to pay them the full settlement amount including the extra $2,200. I told them no; they weren't getting the extra and asked JR to only pay the lease company the amount it was owed and to send me a check for the difference. They said no problem and Fedexed me a check.


I'm not doubting your story...

I've probobly just only seen/heard the horror stories.


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

Mears Troll Number 4 said:


> I'm not doubting your story...
> 
> I've probobly just only seen/heard the horror stories.


In my case, James River hired a small, independent loss adjuster to physically examine the car and appraise its value. I may have got lucky - each adjuster will appraise different vehicles differently. I know I got lucky with the mileage - the salvage yard apparently lost the key, so the adjuster was not able to get the mileage off the odometer. The car was 14 months old and had 44,000 miles on it - had they seen that then the assessed value may have been lower.


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

The Gift of Fish said:


> In my case, James River hired a small, independent loss adjuster to physically examine the car and appraise its value. I may have got lucky - each adjuster will appraise different vehicles differently. I know I got lucky with the mileage - the salvage yard apparently lost the key, so the adjuster was not able to get the mileage off the odometer. The car was 14 months old and had 44,000 miles on it - had they seen that then the assessed value may have been lower.


It seems have dodged quite a few bullets there that got you a much higher insurance payout. (as you seem to know)

He could have used an average value on the make/model, not based on the obscene mileage put on it. for a 14 month old car, one would expect about 12,000 miles a year.


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## DCNewbie17 (Aug 20, 2017)

Some of us buy cars to get from point A to point B and do not include the value into our net worth because we know the vehicles are depreciating assets to invest in. I took the loss when I purchased the vehicle. I'm going to keep it for 10 years, whether it has 90K or 240K miles and then get another vehicle. I personally think its asinine to have a hybrid car waiting in the driveway to drive another car that gets 15mpg.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

DCNewbie17 said:


> Some of us buy cars to get from point A to point B and do not include the value into our net worth because we know the vehicles are depreciating assets to invest in. I took the loss when I purchased the vehicle. I'm going to keep it for 10 years, whether it has 90K or 240K miles and then get another vehicle. I personally think its asinine to have a hybrid car waiting in the driveway to drive another car that gets 15mpg.


No matter what one buys a car for, they should include its value in their net worth. If one is upside down on a loan, its a liability and not an asset. If one applies for a loan or gets sued or any number of other things, the value of all your assets will be considered, including one's car.

If you buy a car for $10k and after 10 years its worth $1k, the $9k loss is depreciation. If one knows the mileage driven, one can calculate the depreciation per mile. That part isn't tough. The next part is determining what the business miles contributed. That isn't too tough either.

I'm not entirely clear on your accounting method but it appears you'd take a $10k loss one day and 10 years later make $1. I'm not sure that would fly with most accountants, business managers, etc.

Some people drive a 15 mpg car to haul their boat, fishing gear, and wet dogs to the lake and back. Asinine?


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

bsliv said:


> I'm not entirely clear on your accounting method but it appears you'd take a $10k loss one day and 10 years later make $1. I'm not sure that would fly with most accountants, business managers, etc.


It doesn't really matter which accounting method he's using; the whole point of accounting is to _account for _money, not exclude parts of the finances that it'd be easier to ignore.

When you buy a car, it's not an expense. If you buy a $10,000 car with cash all you're doing is converting $10,000 of assets from one category (cash) into another category (vehicle). Depreciation is the expense that eats away at the value of the vehicle asset month after month, whether we ignore it or not.


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

The Gift of Fish said:


> It doesn't really matter which accounting method he's using; the whole point of accounting is to _account for _money, not exclude parts of the finances that it'd be easier to ignore.
> 
> When you buy a car, it's not an expense. If you buy a $10,000 car with cash all you're doing is converting $10,000 of assets from one category (cash) into another category (vehicle). Depreciation is the expense that eats away at the value of the vehicle asset month after month, whether we ignore it or not.


yup..

Depreciation is the act of taking a car, and driving the wheels off it by putting 1000+ miles a week on the odometer.

My Sienna got sold for scrap just 3 1/2 years after i bought it new... because i didn't want to fix it anymore because i wasn't going to sink $5,000 into a car with 230,000 taxi miles on it.

Take a $30,000 purchase, divide that by 230,000 miles, and you have roughly... 13c per mile

It's not hard to figure out this depreciation stuff. Had i not used that car as a taxi, i'm fairly confident i'd still have it now. (well i would never have bought it but that's beside the point)

If i take a $15,000 car and put 100,000-150,000 miles on it. (that's roughly what i would expect a used car to last) and that's still 10-15c a mile.

It's not voodoo mathematics going on here, I know i'm Asian but it doesn't take an Asian to calculate this stuff.

Of the cars i've bought since 2000,

96 ford taurus- bought used with 110,000 miles, sold with 250k miles 10 years later for next to nothing)
04 Harley motorcycle bought new, I sold to my dad, with 48,000 miles on it (i couldn't ride it after losing my leg)
02 dodge Neon 60,000 miles, still in my driveway modded as an amateur race car
2010 ford focus- bought new, my daily driver, _*120,000 (1 1/2 years of ubering would be 40K without uber)*_
2010 Toyota Sienna- bought new used as a taxi for 3 1/2 years _*sold for scrap at 230,000 miles*_
2011 Harley tricycle- 20,000 miles (road trips, day to day stuff not involving shopping)

Which of these cars stands out? (aside from the obvious highlighting)
the ones not used as a taxi at all are fairly low mileage... Still... the ones i used as a taxi or for uber, they are WAY over the hill compared to where they should be considering I have had bikes for riding and road trips on top of the cars. (and a race car..)

Everything else still has value, and is still a functional automobile... except the one i used as a taxi.. these days it could have just as easily been used as an uber. The one i used for uber... it has an extra 80,000 miles on it. The 02 i have is probably going to last longer than the 2010 focus i still have.

depreciation is a real thing and using a car for a taxi will kill them far sooner than they would otherwise go.

I know uber isn't a taxi service.... in name... in every other sense it is.


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

DCNewbie17 said:


> Some of us buy cars to get from point A to point B and do not include the value into our net worth because we know the vehicles are depreciating assets to invest in. I took the loss when I purchased the vehicle. I'm going to keep it for 10 years, whether it has 90K or 240K miles and then get another vehicle. I personally think its asinine to have a hybrid car waiting in the driveway to drive another car that gets 15mpg.


Except when the vehicle doesn't last 10 years/240K because it got rode hard and just fails, or the costs to maintain it at that usage rate become too expensive to be economical.


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

wb6vpm said:


> Except when the vehicle doesn't last 10 years/240K because it got rode hard and just fails, or the costs to maintain it at that usage rate become too expensive to be economical.


ubering full time is like 4 years or 250,000 miles...


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

Mears Troll Number 4 said:


> ubering full time is like 4 years or 250,000 miles...


Yep, I was just using his numbers


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## Aerodrifting (Aug 13, 2017)

Mears Troll Number 4 said:


> yup..
> 
> Depreciation is the act of taking a car, and driving the wheels off it by putting 1000+ miles a week on the odometer.
> 
> ...


How many miles do you think you have left on that Focus? I heard American cars need some major expensive maintenance after 100k miles, I wonder if that's true.


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

Aerodrifting said:


> How many miles do you think you have left on that Focus? I heard American cars need some major expensive maintenance after 100k miles, I wonder if that's true.


I've already had to rebuild the suspension, other than that even the Ford garage says it's in great shape. But when the ford mechanic says everything looks fine... everything is fine (cause if they had ANY possible thing they could try to rip me off with, they would try)

I blame the high number of speed bumps for the suspension woes..

I also had to redo the engine mounts... got that done on the cheap. It was vibrating and sounded a LOT worse than it was.

The brakes of course needed new pads and 1 rotor got warped.. complete mystery how that happened. It was making weird sounds on braking... took it to the shop ASAP..

The only issue i have even had all year was a single sensor that went bad. It was the tire pressure sensor. It was about $50 fix installed.

Everything else it needed was just regular maintenance on stuff.

My next Sedan is going to be a toyota camry thou... i honestly prefer just prefer the camry's to the focus.


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

Here is a link that everyone can use to calculate their mileage, and let others see. Please put username and vehicle description at the top of the column, and please make sure to not mess with others columns. If it starts to fill up, please let me know and I can add more columns as needed.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xW2qMveTgIm0RUeXKl6YRg_GgP7keG3YZrHaLfqRTqE/edit?usp=sharing

And please, work from left to right so there aren't empty slots.

Enter your data in the light gray cells, and dont change anything in the white or dark gray fields


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

wb6vpm said:


> Here is a link that everyone can use to calculate their mileage, and let others see. Please put username and vehicle description at the top of the column, and please make sure to not mess with others columns. If it starts to fill up, please let me know and I can add more columns as needed.
> 
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xW2qMveTgIm0RUeXKl6YRg_GgP7keG3YZrHaLfqRTqE/edit?usp=sharing
> 
> ...


Your spreadsheet is a good idea. We can quibble on the content but first, unprotect it!. When I tried to enter data I get, "You are trying to edit a protected cell or object. Please contact the spreadsheet owner to remove protection if you need to edit."


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

bsliv said:


> Your spreadsheet is a good idea. We can quibble on the content but first, unprotect it!. When I tried to enter data I get, "You are trying to edit a protected cell or object. Please contact the spreadsheet owner to remove protection if you need to edit."


I went ahead and just made a Google form.

https://goo.gl/forms/M373J2MotFwgUi4K2

Results from form:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1N1R1YS2oIc49OiwyriAV4znY8NeVAlAc_rQjSdC4yqI/


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## Davestave (Nov 12, 2017)

bsliv said:


> Frustrated said, "how about this how much you average??? Me 1500 Honda Accord oil changes and 2 tires and I feeds my family well"
> 
> You don't know how much you profit. You know how much you gross. Its a short sighted approach. It takes more than oil changes and 2 tires to keep that Accord running. What happens when the other 2 tires blow? What happens when the ****** won't engage? What happens when the water/fuel/oil pump goes out? You may not realize it until you try to sell it or repair it, but the costs are there and should be calculated.
> 
> ...


So you refuse to drive for 18 months but you feel your voice is needed? Sounds like you need a hobby, try model airplanes... or maybe meet a girl. If I'm still trolling uber 18 months after I quit driving someone plz point this out to me


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Davestave said:


> So you refuse to drive for 18 months but you feel your voice is needed? Sounds like you need a hobby, try model airplanes... or maybe meet a girl. If I'm still trolling uber 18 months after I quit driving someone plz point this out to me


I average 10 - 20 hours per week at my main job. Some weeks I may work 50 hours, other I may work 0 hours. I have a car that get 40 mpg. What other job than rideshare would fit my schedule? I've lived in the same town 35 years, I know the streets. I enjoyed driving. I would drive again but the rates are just too pathetic.

For your information, I have 8 airplanes hanging from my ceiling. The largest has a 6' wingspan. And they all fly via radio control. I have parts for another 10, I think. I have a gun safe as big as most refrigerators. I have a progressive reloading press. I have 2 boat, 2 cars and live alone. The only trolling I do is in a boat.

Judging by the incredible amount of ignorance I find on this forum, yes, I believe a realistic voice is needed. I'm willing to do my part.

I didn't quit Uber, I'm on strike for better rates.


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## Davestave (Nov 12, 2017)

You serious? I was right with the airplanes? Lol that’s awesome! Your strike is appreciated, as it made room for me, who can get paid to be a scab!


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

tohunt4me said:


> All you are doing is driving ?
> And sacrificing 14-18 hours a day of Your Life for 31 days.
> And sacrificing Your Car.
> 
> ...


Exactly. The only way I would sort of believe this is if the poster said " Look I work at corporate. I have xYZ salary and did this while being employed  to see what would happen...hopefully working 12+ hour days will get me fast tracked to a promotion, etc....

Something along those lines ,then I would believe the troll.
Until then..

#fübrn


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Davestave said:


> You serious? I was right with the airplanes? Lol that's awesome! Your strike is appreciated, as it made room for me, who can get paid to be a scab!


Yes, serious. I've been flying drones long before they were called drones. I have at least a 5 mile line of sight range with one radio system. I've been over 5000' agl. I'm pretty sure helicopters were dispatched out of Nellis AFB to find me.

One of my reasons for staying active here is to squash thoughts of a strike. It hasn't, won't and can't work in the current system.

Another reason is dispelling the myth that as long as one gets a deposit every week they are making money. Take a look at the spreadsheet a post or two above yours. My market pays about $0.90/mile. The spreadsheet indicates it costs me $1.18/mile to drive. How much do you think I should drive? Take a loss per mile and make it up in volume?


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

Davestave said:


> You serious? I was right with the airplanes? Lol that's awesome! Your strike is appreciated, as it made room for me, who can get paid to be a scab!


Don't knock some one for expressing their opinions.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

wb6vpm said:


> I went ahead and just made a Google form.
> 
> https://goo.gl/forms/M373J2MotFwgUi4K2
> 
> ...


Good spreadsheet but I have a few thoughts. It appears the spreadsheet is designed for someone who acquires a car to drive exclusively for rideshare, no personal or other business miles. That's fine, but it should be stated. If one uses their personal car, the cost of the car (monthly payments) and insurance should not be included as they would be a cost with or without rideshare. So, for an exclusive rideshare car, the cost of the car has to be included. But you only included monthly payments. What if one pays cash? What if one pays a large down payment? Same car, same costs, but different monthly payments. Instead, I think using the purchase price (including financing costs) of the car divided by its expected lifetime in miles would be a more accurate method.


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

bsliv said:


> The spreadsheet indicates it costs me $1.18/mile to drive. How much do you think I should drive? Take a loss per mile and make it up in volume?


What type of vehicle do you drive?


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

2Cents said:


> What type of vehicle do you drive?


2015 Mazda 3, 30mpg city, 40mpg highway, 33mpg combined. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1N1R1YS2oIc49OiwyriAV4znY8NeVAlAc_rQjSdC4yqI/edit#gid=0


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

Too bad all drivers don't have this broken down the way you do.

Kudos for understanding this.


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## stephan (Aug 25, 2016)

R W said:


> Hello Uber people,
> 
> I just wanted to let this forum know that it is possible to make some money Ubering. Need and still need cash to pay some old bills. I am sort of a do it now and worry about it later so I am putting the tax stuff out of my head for the time being to take care of the now. I paid $875 dollars in gas for the month so my NET before taxes was $6,020 (wear and tear on the car might hurt me later)
> 
> ...


To eran this sum you may have to at least 18k miles and driving this mileages


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

bsliv said:


> Good spreadsheet but I have a few thoughts. It appears the spreadsheet is designed for someone who acquires a car to drive exclusively for rideshare, no personal or other business miles. That's fine, but it should be stated. If one uses their personal car, the cost of the car (monthly payments) and insurance should not be included as they would be a cost with or without rideshare. So, for an exclusive rideshare car, the cost of the car has to be included. But you only included monthly payments. What if one pays cash? What if one pays a large down payment? Same car, same costs, but different monthly payments. Instead, I think using the purchase price (including financing costs) of the car divided by its expected lifetime in miles would be a more accurate method.


To answer your questions:
that is why I asked for annual miles, so that it can allow you calculate your business miles vs personal as it is still part of the operating cost of the vehicle. 
If you paid cash, you would just enter 0 for your monthly payment 
I had for reasonable statistical analysis, I needed something reasonably standardized, which was why I went with the annual mileage, since some people will cycle cars every 2 years, while others will drive a car for 10+ years.

To clarify more on the business vs personal miles part, the reason that I don't differentiate in the calculations is 2 fold. 1, for ease in calculations, and 2, it really isn't necessary. Since the annual miles question asks for overall miles, the number is still accurate (the cost is the same per mile whether it is personal or business)

Hope this helps.

Also, forgive any typos, I typed this up on my phone.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

OK. The spreadsheet attempts to tell one what it costs to drive their car, given their circumstances. More quibbles, tho. I don't think the monthly payments should be used. For instance, if one financed a $24k car for one year, the monthly payments would be $2k/mo. If another paid cash, the monthly would be $0. At the end of the year they have the same car and paid the same amount. But the spreadsheet will show the person who paid cash has a cheaper per mile cost when they both paid the same, drove the same, and have the same residual value at the end of the year.

I'm trying to offer constructive criticism. I think you did a good job, just needs to be refined. Maybe make the username optional or inform people that any name will work.

Then I'd like to see another spreadsheet that answers the question, "should I drive my personal car for rideshare?"


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## REX HAVOC (Jul 4, 2016)

R W said:


> Hello Uber people,
> 
> I just wanted to let this forum know that it is possible to make some money Ubering. Need and still need cash to pay some old bills. I am sort of a do it now and worry about it later so I am putting the tax stuff out of my head for the time being to take care of the now. I paid $875 dollars in gas for the month so my NET before taxes was $6,020 (wear and tear on the car might hurt me later)
> 
> ...


Good job on making those kind of numbers. That comes out to around 68 hours a week, almost 10 hours a day. Those hours are hard to consistently maintain week after week. That's the problem with this job, it just burns you out.


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

bsliv said:


> OK. The spreadsheet attempts to tell one what it costs to drive their car, given their circumstances. More quibbles, tho. I don't think the monthly payments should be used. For instance, if one financed a $24k car for one year, the monthly payments would be $2k/mo. If another paid cash, the monthly would be $0. At the end of the year they have the same car and paid the same amount. But the spreadsheet will show the person who paid cash has a cheaper per mile cost when they both paid the same, drove the same, and have the same residual value at the end of the year.
> 
> I'm trying to offer constructive criticism. I think you did a good job, just needs to be refined. Maybe make the username optional or inform people that any name will work.
> 
> Then I'd like to see another spreadsheet that answers the question, "should I drive my personal car for rideshare?"


Thanks. The biggest issue for me is mainly the limitations of the tool being used. I will look at making a separate chain to try to handle that situation of cash payments


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

bsliv said:


> OK. The spreadsheet attempts to tell one what it costs to drive their car, given their circumstances. More quibbles, tho. I don't think the monthly payments should be used. For instance, if one financed a $24k car for one year, the monthly payments would be $2k/mo. If another paid cash, the monthly would be $0. At the end of the year they have the same car and paid the same amount. But the spreadsheet will show the person who paid cash has a cheaper per mile cost when they both paid the same, drove the same, and have the same residual value at the end of the year.
> 
> I'm trying to offer constructive criticism. I think you did a good job, just needs to be refined. Maybe make the username optional or inform people that any name will work.
> 
> Then I'd like to see another spreadsheet that answers the question, "should I drive my personal car for rideshare?"


Who pays 2K a month for a $24,000 dollar car?? Where is your logic in that? 
On my $110K vehicle payments were $1,800 so if you think some one buying a $24k car would pay $2k per month for it, then I have a bridge to sell you in New York City. I think it's named after a president.

#fübrn


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

2Cents said:


> Who pays 2K a month for a $24,000 dollar car?? Where is your logic in that?
> On my $110K vehicle payments were $1,800 so if you think some one buying a $24k car would pay $2k per month for it, then I have a bridge to sell you in New York City. I think it's named after a president.
> 
> #fübrn


It was just an example of payments.


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

wb6vpm said:


> It was just an example of payments.


Horrible example. Might as well said if you drive 18 hours a day and 87% of the people tip, you will earn $161,000 per year.
Either way I have this ride share scheme, I mean app to sell you if you don't want to buy that famous bridge in New York that I think is named after a president.
#fübrn


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

2Cents said:


> Who pays 2K a month for a $24,000 dollar car?? Where is your logic in that?
> On my $110K vehicle payments were $1,800 so if you think some one buying a $24k car would pay $2k per month for it, then I have a bridge to sell you in New York City. I think it's named after a president.
> 
> #fübrn


Ok, what would the payment be on a $24k car with 0% financing cost and financed for 1 year?


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

What state do you live in where people finance cars for 1 year at 0% interest?


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

2Cents said:


> What state do you live in where people finance cars for 1 year at 0% interest?


Same state that people pay cash for cars. Imagine that someone spent $24k in one month for a $24k car.

Answer my question.


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

Have you ever financed a car before out there in Niceville?


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

2Cents said:


> Have you ever financed a car before out there in Niceville?


Several. Have you ever paid cash for a car? Answer my questions.

Then read the posts again. We are discussing a cost to drive. The term of the loan should not effect the cost per mile. Want to argue that too? It would make more sense.


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

bsliv said:


> Same state that people pay cash for cars. Imagine that someone spent $24k in one month for a $24k car.
> 
> Answer my question.


That's called One lump Sum.
I hear his cousin Dim Sum is available on fübr Eats. Nice thing is like your finance charge logic is included at 0% finance charge, so is the tip.

#fübrn


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

2Cents said:


> Horrible example. Might as well said if you drive 18 hours a day and 87% of the people tip, you will earn $161,000 per year.
> Either way I have this ride share scheme, I mean app to sell you if you don't want to buy that famous bridge in New York that I think is named after a president.
> #fübrn


Most examples are. It was used just to illustrate a point to the extreme, which it did.


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

wb6vpm said:


> Most examples are. It was used just to illustrate a point to the extreme, which it did.


When you post something as absurd like that it makes it look like you've never financed a car..
Which then again if most drivers did math, they wouldn't be driving their vehicles in to the ground at a loss in order to make a company whom they will never meet, Billions.


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

2Cents said:


> When you post something as absurd like that it makes it look like you've never financed a car..
> Which then again if most drivers did math, they wouldn't be driving their vehicles in to the ground at a loss in order to make a company whom they will never meet, Billions.


I've both financed and paid cash outright for many cars. As I said, it wasn't meant to be realistic, just to make a point about payments. Would you have felt better if he would have said $2400 over a 12 month period?

I mean really, your getting worked up over an example that was just being used to easily illustrate a point... which was all he was trying to do.


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

wb6vpm said:


> I've both financed and paid cash outright for many cars. As I said, it wasn't meant to be realistic, just to make a point about payments. Would you have felt better if he would have said $2400 over a 12 month period?


Geez here we go again..


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

wb6vpm said:


> I've both financed and paid cash outright for many cars. As I said, it wasn't meant to be realistic, just to make a point about payments. Would you have felt better if he would have said $2400 over a 12 month period?
> 
> I mean really, your getting worked up over an example that was just being used to easily illustrate a point... which was all he was trying to do.


Thanks and thanks for the spreadsheet.


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

wb6vpm said:


> I've both financed and paid cash outright for many cars. As I said, it wasn't meant to be realistic, just to make a point about payments. Would you have felt better if he would have said $2400 over a 12 month period?
> 
> I mean really, your getting worked up over an example that was just being used to easily illustrate a point... which was all he was trying to do.


No I'm not getting worked up over an example that was illustrated to prove a point.The point is ridesharing does not make sense when is at a loss. There is a lot of misinformation out there so I personally want to raise awareness to such.I see all of the ads advertised...
Make great $$$ doing ride sharing when ever...
Blah blah.
No where on any of the ads does it say make $25 per hour on your own schedule...
But..
You're on your own in every aspect. Weather it's repairs, gas, tires, insurance, payment on vehicle or technical support we've got ourselves covered. Also you are not at liberty to set your own rates but that's ok because we know what's right for you. And of course we will never unwillingly charge a passenger more than what we are telling you what we're charging them because that would be wrong. Also we will never unwillingly ever display an area in your map as having an additional fare surcharge unless there is immenant demand for it. And we will never have you drive 18 minutes in order to pick up a passenger at .41 per mile paid to you, during peak demand times.

When I see what I've included above in any of the recruiting advertisements then I'll say..
Wow, that's setting the bar.
Until then, this forum is to inform drivers and that is what I will continue to do.


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## Leo1983 (Jul 3, 2017)

R W said:


> Hello Uber people,
> 
> I just wanted to let this forum know that it is possible to make some money Ubering. Need and still need cash to pay some old bills. I am sort of a do it now and worry about it later so I am putting the tax stuff out of my head for the time being to take care of the now. I paid $875 dollars in gas for the month so my NET before taxes was $6,020 (wear and tear on the car might hurt me later)
> 
> ...


So after expenses you made $7 an hr. Sounds about right.


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