# We need to bargain with Uber or unionize against them for better pay



## Chillax (Nov 29, 2015)

Uber treats drivers like crap! We have to stand up for ourselves! This is what we should start bargaining, possibly sueing, for:

1. Uber must collect sales tax from passengers and pay it to the government for us. The law states that the entity collecting money is responsible for collecting sales tax. Uber says drivers need to collect it but they know we cant because we dont know the fare for many trips for 48 hours after the trip is over and uber is advertised as cashless so many passengers dont have cash. Passengers wouldnt pay drivers tax anyway because they would think its already been charged to their card.
2. Uber should stop telling passengers that tipping isnt necessary and stop training drivers to decline tips. Tipping is always optional, thats why its a tip and not a charge. Uber just shouldnt say anything about tipping and should train drivers to not say anything about it.
3. Bring back flat rate fees for very long trips to compensate for the gas used on the ride back and money lost from not getting trips on the ride back.
4. Uber should not lower the driving age to 19. Itd be unsafe and there would be so many young drivers that we wouldnt make any money.
5. Better gas and cell phone plan discounts.
6. 24/7 Minimum wage guarantee.
7. Better pay.

Any ideas about how to bargain for this?


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## scrurbscrud (Sep 11, 2014)

There are a LOT of things I'd like to see from ride share companies.

Beside better pay, which is the complaint of every employee and most sub and independent contractors.

A. Mandatory full coverage insurance suitable for the work obtained by every driver.
B. Mandatory random substance testing for drivers.
C. A rotational call system to add drivers to the field, favoring full time drivers/seniority, first.
D. Mandatory increases in fares for adverse weather conditions, coverage area wide.
E. A tip option built into the app, for sure.
F. Some type of system to spread/rotate drivers to provide predictable services to broader areas rather than packing up in hot spots. Maybe drivers have to do 8 available online hours a week in outlying areas or something of that nature. This one would be a little more complex to work out but with the tech systems that these companies have options C-F are achievable.
G. I'd like to see some type of a driver peer review setup for/from other drivers, to help service along to the pax. I've had some really incredible drivers using the services as a pax, but also a couple of really bad ones that could easily up their game with a little help. In the long haul it won't pay to have bad service.
H. In areas that have licensing/compliance issues of various sorts, I'd like to see ride share drivers either comply or be banned from service by these companies, such as what transpires in NYC. In other words no enticing drivers to perform illegal actions by these companies. That's just not right on their part no matter how "right" they think it is to pay for drivers fines when they break the law. I say this in concern for drivers taking hits on their records for doing this activity, even though it may be technically done at ride share companies expense. I'm not a fan of paying people to purposefully break the law. The executives always go unpunished, but they really should be in jail for this type of activity.

I would not be in favor of a min. wage if supply/demand quotients keep a driver busy coupled with reasonable pay. I'd expect that a driver who wants to bust it could do much better than mere min. wage. But a min. wage would perhaps stop drivers flooding the market because it would then be mandatory on the companies part to not flood the streets with drivers unless they want to pay up to do so.

None of the above seems unreasonable to me and may also avoid going the employee route, which I would NOT be in favor of.

The difficulty in any collective bargaining arrangement, even if done by independent contractors reps, is gaining collective consensus among same. I personally detest an "us vs. them" mentality that comes about from "union" relationships with their management and or paymasters.

Oddly enough, I have yet to speak to any actual employee of either Uber or Lyft since I started this gig, and I kind of like it that way. Get the setup right and then leave me alone to do my work.


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## sellkatsell44 (Oct 25, 2015)

Chillax said:


> Uber treats drivers like crap! We have to stand up for ourselves! This is what we should start bargaining, possibly sueing, for:
> 
> 1. Uber must collect sales tax from passengers and pay it to the government for us. The law states that the entity collecting money is responsible for collecting sales tax. Uber says drivers need to collect it but they know we cant because we dont know the fare for many trips for 48 hours after the trip is over and uber is advertised as cashless so many passengers dont have cash. Passengers wouldnt pay drivers tax anyway because they would think its already been charged to their card.
> 2. Uber should stop telling passengers that tipping isnt necessary and stop training drivers to decline tips. Tipping is always optional, thats why its a tip and not a charge. Uber just shouldnt say anything about tipping and should train drivers to not say anything about it.
> ...


1. You're funny. 
2. instead, uber should create a bonus system where if you end up with 4.6 over a course of 2000+ trip (arbitrary numbers) you should get a bonus your year anniversary of $2000-4000. No sign up bonus. This makes it so that drivers have more incentive to stay for a year and less of a revolving door for uber.
3. Not sure
4. Ahahhahaha so you have less competition. Well, at least you're being honest.
5. Collective bargaining, if you have a huge pool of uber drivers in your area you guys can always group yourself to buy a plan at a discount, same for medical/dental, good luck with that
6. And 7. Are kind of tied aren't they? I guess it's always good to ask for everything and than some and see what really funnels through. I would ask uber for a pay cut on their end after x amount of rides/$$ in a year. Uber would never lower the % cut unless it makes sense for them. So after driving 2000+ rides and getting a 4.6 rating I think you've proven that it would be worth it for uber to keep you on than let you walk and therefore makes your end of trying to "bargain" stronger. Making yourself valuable is the only way you can get the opponent to listen and potentially concede.


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## Tony DePalma (Sep 18, 2015)

Our Country is in a shambles. We just passed a budget bill that will break our kids and grand kids for sure! Our workforce has less workers in it then it did on 1978. Uber gets people to drive for .75 a mile. I opted only for XL now. I lose too much on X. union??? Keep dreaming until we grow the economy nothing will change so change Washington!


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## Chillax (Nov 29, 2015)

I hear lyft pays better so maybe we all just have to switch to lyft and then uber will take the hint


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## Tony DePalma (Sep 18, 2015)

Chillax said:


> I hear lyft pays better so maybe we all just have to switch to lyft and then uber will take the hint


The riders like Uber it's Econ 101 supply and demand. Prices will go back up hopefully. Until then all UberXL. Athens pays $1.22 a mile we are at .75 for X I just can't drive X


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## MR5STAR (May 18, 2015)

Chillax said:


> I hear lyft pays better so maybe we all just have to switch to lyft and then uber will take the hint


Just go out and find a better job or raise your skill level. Uber is a low skill job that anyone can do. Mcdoalds workers want 15$ an hr blah blah blah. Everyone wants more $, go raise your skill level.


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## Lag Monkey (Feb 6, 2015)

MR5STAR said:


> Just go out and find a better job or raise your skill level. Uber is a low skill job that anyone can do. Mcdoalds workers want 15$ an hr blah blah blah. Everyone wants more $, go raise your skill level.


Good point, Iv been stuck in this low wage bull for a little over a year now. I could go and hustle to up my skill like going to college or learning a trait but Iv just been chilling enjoying my early 20s and smoking good weed and drinking with the boys


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## sellkatsell44 (Oct 25, 2015)

U can make more money outside uber, without college, depending on where you are living @

You can also just go back to college and still come out winning because apparently it costs soMe uber drivers $ to drive........


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## zanememjade (Dec 9, 2015)

My friend and I will be at the airport today 12/23 at 6pm speaking with drivers to sign a petition to unionize. I encourage all drivers to meet at airport staging area for your input


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## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

Chillax said:


> Uber treats drivers like crap! We have to stand up for ourselves! This is what we should start bargaining, possibly sueing, for:
> 
> 1. Uber must collect sales tax from passengers and pay it to the government for us. The law states that the entity collecting money is responsible for collecting sales tax. Uber says drivers need to collect it but they know we cant because we dont know the fare for many trips for 48 hours after the trip is over and uber is advertised as cashless so many passengers dont have cash. Passengers wouldnt pay drivers tax anyway because they would think its already been charged to their card.
> 2. Uber should stop telling passengers that tipping isnt necessary and stop training drivers to decline tips. Tipping is always optional, thats why its a tip and not a charge. Uber just shouldnt say anything about tipping and should train drivers to not say anything about it.
> ...


1. In my state, we don't have to collect sales tax. If we did, I surely would quit, that sucks. 
3. Remember, Uber has an hourly rate on top of the per mile rate, and you can look at it like a surcharge for gas. 
Taximeters only do the hourly rate if the car goes slower than 12 miles per hour. But, taxis, usually, on long trips, have a surcharge
for the return trip.

4. I think most insurance carriers command that drivers be at least 25.

6. That will never happen, unless the uberlawsuit that that begins next June is won, and uberX drivers are classified as employees.

7. Yes, the rates should be raised, and not just a little, but they should be at least doubled ( for UberX ).


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## Atlwarrior (Nov 2, 2014)

MR5STAR said:


> Just go out and find a better job or raise your skill level. Uber is a low skill job that anyone can do. Mcdoalds workers want 15$ an hr blah blah blah. Everyone wants more $, go raise your skill level.


Maybe low technical skill, but high emotional intelligence needed.


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## Uber 1 (Oct 6, 2015)

Lag Monkey said:


> Good point, Iv been stuck in this low wage bull for a little over a year now. I could go and hustle to up my skill like going to college or learning a trait but Iv just been chilling enjoying my early 20s and smoking good weed and drinking with the boys


BEWARE.....THAT is the thinking of a Middle Class Person (I am Middle Class too so no insult intended JUST to point out something....)

The OTHER 2 groups (the Poor AND the rich) DON'T think like that.....BUT they get what they want for the most part (The poor have PLENTY of programs to help them (The I want I want mentality WITHOUT necessarily having to do anything to get it , the rich have tax loop holes (made by the best PAID for legislators) and US to work for THEM).....

The Middle Class GETS to work to support BOTH sides because we THINK we have to do more to get more....(Most Middle Class people have worker mentality and fail to THINK they DESREVE better...Well news flash...WE DO DESERVE BETTER).

WE middle class need to unite to fight and since there are more of us (at least in mind not necessarily in finances now that the Middle Class is being decimated)..

WE do the work so we need to get PAID period!!....Uber OR Otherwise!

Andy


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## bluewarrior7 (Dec 17, 2015)

An option in the app to request a specific driver. We all know everyone has a few regulars


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## Tony DePalma (Sep 18, 2015)

Blah Blah Blah


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## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

Uber 1 said:


> BEWARE.....THAT is the thinking of a Middle Class Person (I am Middle Class too so no insult intended JUST to point out something....)
> 
> The OTHER 2 groups (the Poor AND the rich) DON'T think like that.....BUT they get what they want for the most part (The poor have PLENTY of programs to help them (The I want I want mentality WITHOUT necessarily having to do anything to get it , the rich have tax loop holes (made by the best PAID for legislators) and US to work for THEM).....
> 
> ...


You really need to cool it with the caps key, very annoying. Suggestion: use it very sparingly, like maybe ONCE, in your post.

See how much more impact that has?


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## ColdRider (Oct 19, 2015)

MR5STAR said:


> Just go out and find a better job or raise your skill level. Uber is a low skill job that anyone can do. Mcdoalds workers want 15$ an hr blah blah blah. Everyone wants more $, go raise your skill level.


Careful brother, you might get labeled a troll for telling people something they don't want to hear.


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## Tony DePalma (Sep 18, 2015)

Also class envy is garbage we are all Americans dividing by class is evil


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## Uber 1 (Oct 6, 2015)

Tony DePalma said:


> Also class envy is garbage we are all Americans dividing by class is evil


IF we DON'T divide by class, the OTHER 2 CLASSES CAN and WILL TAKE advantage of us...

Here is what it looks like now....

The Poor get help from the government (now I don't mind the truly needy getting help BUT there are TONS of abuses going on).

The Rich make the rules to benefit themselves.

The Middle Class gets the bills (Also , on the average our income is taxed the MOST) AND we do all the work !! (at least the jobs that haven't exported overseas)....THAT is OUR situation....

Sooo UNLESS we ban together as Middle Class people we WILL get the short end of the stick (well, UNLESS its going up ....well you know where!) 
;-O

Andy


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## Enlightmee (Jan 6, 2016)

We better do something now b4 it's 2late


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## UberEddie2015 (Nov 2, 2015)

Drivers are to desperate for money. They will never stop driving even if they were unionized and were on strike. Uber has managed to get the most desperate of the desperate to drive and therefore it does not matter what rate they charge, they will be out there driving. It's a lost cause trying to do anything as a group. The drivers will just see it as a way to earn more money with less drivers on the road.


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## DelaK (Dec 17, 2015)

Chillax said:


> I hear lyft pays better so maybe we all just have to switch to lyft and then uber will take the hint


barley anyone uses lyft unfortunately =/


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## Cou-ber (Jul 23, 2015)

Sure, there is abuse but when you discover that these "handouts" to which you fondly refer make up less than 1% of our federal budget, you must ask yourself if you've overestimated the windfall the Koch-s and the Trump-s of the world want and need you to believe are first even real.

I've relied on these programs. I couldn't have fed my children otherwise. They qualified, I did not. Have you ever looked into the population specifics that receives assistance? Percentages are misleading, I think we all agree, but a significant percentage that do are single mothers not receiving their court ordered child support. Billions of unpaid support force such mothers to turn to assistance because the courts have completely failed them and there is very little recourse for her to take. This costs our country and your precious middle class more than 5 years of subsidy programming combined.

I wouldn't have needed food stamps for my girls if the government had held up its end of our bargain and enforced its own mandates. It is highly unlikely for a deadbeat parent to see any consequence for failing to follow to court orders. It's comparable to the parent that constantly claims "on the count of three..." hell will unleash but nothing does. This population wouldn't have to burden your victimized middle class by turning to these programs if it made children a priority and non-payment a criminal act with immediate and severe consequences. They simply wouldn't.

On the flip side, if I withheld visitation to punish my deadbeats, I'd be taken into custody and put before a judge within a month. I promise.

Our system protects scumbags and forces one income households with multiple dependents to perish. The middle class isn't suffering what that parent suffers. They don't even have any idea. They don't care enough to even consider what causes someone to have to apply.

And even after you apply, the help is negligible and doesn't allow any frivolity whatsoever because section 8 is capped and TANF is minuscule and extremely difficult to get and where I am, Texas, limited to $130/month for a finite time.

The abuse you refer to that I e encountered is actually perpetrated by the peeps you so fiercely wish to protect. Doctors bill Medicaid for phantom treatments at exorbitant prices without even treating a single condition. They'll order an ultrasound for every single visit for a teen mother that has low risk of the infrequent conditions that require such extensive monitoring so they can bring that money back to their middle class neighborhoods and spend it at the malls where their teenaged children are employed and the gymnastics camps that they and all their middle class friends send their 5, 6, 7 and 8 year olds to when the nanny gets her week or two off of unpaid vacation. That's the abuse that you've been fooled to believe is being masterminded by these poor, disenfranchised, system milking, hungry poor who have so much free time outside the 2-3 jobs they hold Junior League-like luncheons to organize the next quarter of abuse.

Have you ever even seen the applications for these abused programs and the paperwork and forms that must be compiled to accompany the them? Ever seen the renewal for the piddly you might qualify that comes every 8 weeks and is defaulted to deny instead of extend so then appeals are needed?

This suffering middle class you revere serves themselves and themselves only. They are stingy and intolerant and completely out of touch and think that the struggle to get two kids to two different state of the art facilities in less than 30 minutes is analogous to skipping a meal so your kids dont have to or showering in cold water because paying the gas bill was less important than the water bill.

Your middle class is just fine daddio. Don't you worry. The only abuse really happening is the abuse of reason and compassion that has allowed you to promote the victimization of a class that has been insulated from hardship always and brainwashed to believe you even have the right to attempt to say otherwise.

You do not know anything about abuse, Sir, at all.


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## Usmansherazi (Jan 9, 2016)

uber fare cut is just wrong we r the one paying for car insurance gas tickets mileage on the car car payment and end of the have ZERO control on how much we get paid how is that fair uber have to realize they are making billion of $$ because of drivers like us 
If uber wants to give customer discount they should lower there commission to 10% and give rest to the passenger as a discount I think if all uber drivers decide to take 1 day off and do not drive on that day uber will learn there lesson super quick


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## Tony DePalma (Sep 18, 2015)

Cou-ber said:


> Sure, there is abuse but when you discover that these "handouts" to which you fondly refer make up less than 1% of our federal budget, you must ask yourself if you've overestimated the windfall the Koch-s and the Trump-s of the world want and need you to believe are first even real.
> 
> I've relied on these programs. I couldn't have fed my children otherwise. They qualified, I did not. Have you ever looked into the population specifics that receives assistance? Percentages are misleading, I think we all agree, but a significant percentage that do are single mothers not receiving their court ordered child support. Billions of unpaid support force such mothers to turn to assistance because the courts have completely failed them and there is very little recourse for her to take. This costs our country and your precious middle class more than 5 years of subsidy programming combined.
> 
> ...


A lot of what you say is fact and as Milton Friedman one of the greatest souls ever to live said its the system we created. Period all of what you said is because Government is to big and needs to be Riened in the States have that Power lets do it.


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## Uber 1 (Oct 6, 2015)

Tony DePalma said:


> Free Market has noting to do with Medallions. Union thugs such as Obama and the teamsters come up with those schemes to buy votes. The free market is Wal-Mart as the greatest example they bring low prices everywhere by purchasing as they do. They in turn created many many millionaires $6 cashiers who benefited from their stock holding. Read Made in America by sam Walton thats business. Godspeed enjoy your day. I did $305 on XL yesterday not a single surge all regular rides. The Market somewhat works but like The Donald says we have idiots in Washington


The $6 cashiers don't really make enough to survive on so many of them go on government "help" programs (admittedly at least they are trying by working NOT like the true abusers who can work but choose not to) that you and I pay for THUS WE essentially subsidize Wal Mart through our tax $$ (and don't forget WE Middle Class people pay the highest percentage of our income out as taxes when compared to the poor and the rich).

Andy


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## Tony DePalma (Sep 18, 2015)

*Big


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*New Partner Agreement, Binding Arbitration Provision, Opting Out & UberLAWSUIT Explained*


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## ColdRider (Oct 19, 2015)

Lag Monkey said:


> Good point, Iv been stuck in this low wage bull for a little over a year now. I could go and hustle to up my skill like going to college or learning a trait but Iv just been chilling enjoying my early 20s and smoking good weed and drinking with the boys


Continue partying it up and see how much longer you will remain stuck on that low wage lifestyle.


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## nobody (Jun 11, 2015)

Chillax said:


> I hear lyft pays better so maybe we all just have to switch to lyft and then uber will take the hint


Or you could go out and get a real job...


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## ColdRider (Oct 19, 2015)

nobody said:


> Or you could go out and get a real job...


Ding ding ding!!!


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## Vinman93 (Feb 3, 2016)

MR5STAR said:


> Just go out and find a better job or raise your skill level. Uber is a low skill job that anyone can do. Mcdoalds workers want 15$ an hr blah blah blah. Everyone wants more $, go raise your skill level.


I am not a union guy and don't want to go that way but let me lay something out for you since you think you're so smart. Good driving is a skill, as is maintaining a car, insurance, and a good driving record. That already makes rideshare drivers a cut above 50% of the population from a driving standpoint. Not to mention most of the rideshare drivers I've met are more educated than the general public, and deal with drunk and unruly riders fairly often, while maintaining a good attitude. If a drunk customer came in to your business, how much slack would you cut him/her, if he/she used profanity, and sometimes damaged your property? That is what happens when you are driving rideshare. To put on a happy face and provide safe and efficient service to unruly riders often requires skills similar to those faced daily by taxi, police, and EMS responders, without the blood and danger, but with a lot of the same disrespect. It's not anywhere close to those jobs, but just saying it can get a lot more dangerous and weird than your typical day selling windows at Home Depot. I am fairly certain that Uber realizes how far they can squeeze drivers to boost rider utilization, but does that make it right? I say no. Many of my riders are INCREDULOUS and very pleased at Uber's low rates and love it in part for that reason. A frequent comment I get is "it's less than half the price of a taxi." Maybe, maybe, taxi services have been a little overpriced in the past. However, Uber should be using it's own marketing dollars, from service fees collected, to come up with better marketing campaigns, instead of just lowering rates on the backs of drivers to boost ridership. Customers already love the service, and keep in mind that while part of that service is Uber's queuing and billing technology, the tangible aspect of the service is the driver and the car. Uber has already built the technology and it is a sunk cost, albeit with frequent updates. The driver, who represents at least 90% of the customer experience, is relegated to 75-80% commissions, an unrealistic rating system which doesn't account for the times you go above and beyond (examples - trying to wake up a passed out rider after you've reached their destination and ended their ride; or waiting for 10+ minutes for a customer even though you're allowed to cancel after 5 minutes of a no-show), unreliable surge pricing maps (I can't count the number of times my car has been in surge on the map and the ride didn't complete as a surge ride), and "company store" type policies which change often, without driver input. Drivers are a huge part of the Uber platform, and while it may not be a skilled position in terms of book-smart education, it is a skilled position from the standpoint of multitasking and human relations. Not to mention most of the depreciating hard assets (cars and phones) are provided by the DRIVERS, and must be maintained by the drivers at a level which far exceeds the average car on the road. To build off of your McDonalds example, McDonalds supplies a point of sale system and a menu much like Uber, but doesn't require its employees to supply the property, plant, and equipment, as in the Uber model. I believe 100% in free enterprise and agree it is Uber's right to pay drivers whatever the market will bear. In my opinion, however, RIDERS would willingly pay higher rates, yet Uber continues to lower them, taking advantage of drivers in order to reduce their own marketing costs. Right now, the service is so cheap it sells itself. Uber provides an awesome platform, and their per trip liability insurance and payment system is a huge plus and super cool for drivers and riders. I have no issues with the platform nor Uber's right to pay drivers what the market will bear, only pointing out it could be much more of a win-win than it currently is. One last story to reinforce my point...I used to trade nickles for dimes with my little brother when we were kids, because I convinced him that since nickles were bigger than dimes they were worth more. Both of us agreed to the bargain, but I was not operating from moral high ground and it was WRONG of me to take advantage of my brother, who was in a weaker position due to his lack of knowledge/skill. Just because you CAN do something, or know that drivers are easy to replace, doesn't mean you should take advantage of that situation.


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## JaxUbermom (Jan 26, 2016)

When is some very smart bunch of people going to build a driver owned/operated Uber like object? You know, buy in to drive, (even on a percentage basis of rides driven for profit share) so it covers your real insurance, bargain for some sweet maintenance deals with some big companies, (brand endorse each other) keep a high quality standard of vehicles and drivers, and market it as such... Sell ourselves to the public along with some snappy ad campaign one of the many geniuses here (not sarcasm) would come up with and crush these two low balling POS companies(for their various reason each still POS)... I am just saying... We talk about the drivers and our cars Are these chucklehead's bread and butter, assets. Take them away and make them work for ourselves. The original premise of Uber has been twisted and manipulated and it's broken so many backs, but there is a HUUUUUUUUUGE hole that could be filled. Again... Juuuuuuust saying!


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## tomabq (Jan 14, 2015)

Tony DePalma said:


> The riders like Uber it's Econ 101 supply and demand. Prices will go back up hopefully. Until then all UberXL. Athens pays $1.22 a mile we are at .75 for X I just can't drive X


Heck I was complaining when it was $1.30 per mile on x and you drive xl for $1.22. Your crazy, dtop driving!


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