# Toyota Venza is back



## Muhammad D (Apr 26, 2020)

But it is 100% hybrid. Sienna gets 2.5 L hybrid. The V6 is gone.
I wish Toyota brought FJ Cruiser back. I would buy the FJ instead of 4Runner.


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## Rockocubs (Jul 31, 2017)

Muhammad D said:


> But it is 100% hybrid. Sienna gets 2.5 L hybrid. The V6 is gone.
> I wish Toyota brought FJ Cruiser back. I would buy the FJ instead of 4Runner.


my 2012 venza is still going strong at 180k


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## waldowainthrop (Oct 25, 2019)

It looks like a Lexus RX crossed with a Lincoln.

Without looking at the specs, my guess is it exactly splits the difference in cost, specs, and design between a Camry and an RX.

It looks like this is one of those niche mid-mid-sized crossovers that slots between the formerly compact and now mid-sized (Rav4) and mid-multirow (Highlander), like the new Honda Passport and the VW Atlas Cross Sport. There are even more distinct sizes of crossover than there ever were for passenger cars.


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## Muhammad D (Apr 26, 2020)

waldowainthrop said:


> It looks like a Lexus RX crossed with a Lincoln.
> 
> Without looking at the specs, my guess is it exactly splits the difference in cost, specs, and design between a Camry and an RX.
> 
> It looks like this is one of those niche mid-mid-sized crossovers that slots between the formerly compact and now mid-sized (Rav4) and mid-multirow (Highlander), like the new Honda Passport and the VW Atlas Cross Sport. There are even more distinct sizes of crossover than there ever were for passenger cars.


Yes it is smaller than Rav4 and much more comfortable. New Rav4 has more ground clearance and the comfort kind of sucks. But they share the same 2.5 L powertrain. Toyota is really pushing their new 2.5 L


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## 051293848 (Aug 25, 2019)

https://www.caranddriver.com/photos/g32500803/2021-toyota-venza-revealed-gallery/
AWD and hybrid it's nice fire a personal crossover but might not be practical because it's only a 5 passenger


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## Muhammad D (Apr 26, 2020)

Venza has a powerful card. It is made in Japan.


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## losiglow (Dec 4, 2018)

Muhammad D said:


> It is made in Japan.


There's a lot to say about that. All my "Japanese" vehicles built in the US have been very reliable, but the fit and finish isn't like the ones I've had from Japan. Rattles and gaps are all over with the US built ones.

For example, the quality of my '07 TSX and '17 ES300h (built in Japan) have been considerably better than my '06 and '12 TL's (built in Ohio). All of them have mechanically been solid but fit and finish has been considerably better from Japan.


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## Muhammad D (Apr 26, 2020)

losiglow said:


> There's a lot to say about that. All my "Japanese" vehicles built in the US have been very reliable, but the fit and finish isn't like the ones I've had from Japan. Rattles and gaps are all over with the US built ones.
> 
> For example, the quality of my '07 TSX and '17 ES300h (built in Japan) have been considerably better than my '06 and '12 TL's (built in Ohio). All of them have mechanically been solid but fit and finish has been considerably better from Japan.


You can't beat "Made in Japan". There is a premium on those cars and for a good reason. Take the example of the Toyota 4Runner. Those things last decades.


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

Isn't Venza slightly a Female car :smiles: 51% female and 49% male:thumbup:

I really mean 99% female , but I put 49% not to offend anyone :smiles:
Corvette is a male car, you know 50.1 male and 49.9 female :smiles:


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## Muhammad D (Apr 26, 2020)

mbd said:


> Isn't Venza slightly a Female car :smiles: 51% female and 49% male:thumbup:
> 
> I really mean 99% female , but I put 49% not to offend anyone :smiles:


It is. It is sexy &#128513;


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

Muhammad D said:


> It is. It is sexy &#128513;
> 
> View attachment 467643


Image of a soccer mom with her workout outfit pops into the mind  her daughters name will be Haley , and she is into gymnastics:thumbdown:


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## TomTheAnt (Jan 1, 2019)

At least it's slightly better looking that the previous ugliness that was called Venza. 🤷‍♂️


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## Muhammad D (Apr 26, 2020)

mbd said:


> Image of a soccer mom with her workout outfit pops into the mind  her daughters name will be Haley , and she is into gymnastics:thumbdown:


Venza is nice but it can't do things that I want. This is for me.


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

TomTheAnt said:


> At least it's slightly better looking that the previous ugliness that was called Venza. &#129335;‍♂


Didn't Ian drive a Venza, or used to :smiles:


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## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

losiglow said:


> There's a lot to say about that. All my "Japanese" vehicles built in the US have been very reliable, but the fit and finish isn't like the ones I've had from Japan. Rattles and gaps are all over with the US built ones.
> 
> For example, the quality of my '07 TSX and '17 ES300h (built in Japan) have been considerably better than my '06 and '12 TL's (built in Ohio). All of them have mechanically been solid but fit and finish has been considerably better from Japan.


Yes, the Japanese are the best builders on the planet.


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## TomTheAnt (Jan 1, 2019)

mbd said:


> Didn't Ian drive a Venza, or used to :smiles:


Yup. I believe he mentioned that at some point. -o:


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## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

mbd said:


> Didn't Ian drive a Venza, or used to :smiles:


Thats a very expensive car to be doing rideshare even used.


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## Muhammad D (Apr 26, 2020)

In order to compete with Subarus, Toyota raised the Rav4 ground clearance. And that makes the Rav4 very uncomfortable. When you hit a pothole, it gives you like a 4Runner feeling. Not as bad as 4Runner, but much worse than previous generation Rav4s. So now there is a vaccum created. And Venza is filling that. Venza must be Lexus-like comfortable. RX350 is in trouble now. Venza is much cheaper but looks good. Plus, it is made in Japan. You can't beat that.


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## TomTheAnt (Jan 1, 2019)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Thats a very expensive car to be doing rideshare even used.


Yeah, but lemme tell ya, Sir @Ian Richard Markham ain't no ordinary ant... :biggrin: :whistling:


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## Muhammad D (Apr 26, 2020)

To give you further perspective. Toyota 4Runner has 9.6" of ground clearance, the new Rav4 has 8.6, and the smooth comfortable Acura MDX has 5.6". So the more you go up, the rougher the ride.


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## Ubervader (Mar 20, 2020)

Muhammad D said:


> And Venza is filling that. Venza must be Lexus-like comfortable. RX350 is in trouble now. Venza is much cheaper but looks good. Plus, it is made in Japan. You can't beat that.


They say in article that Venza is sold in Japan as Harrier which is actually Lexus RX with different badge in Japan.
Toyota never sold Lexus as a brand in Japan until recently Lexus models been sold under Toyota so RX is Harrier or GS is Aristo from memory vehicles are exactly the same.
Not sure does new RX coming out will they sell same vehicle under both names in States.
Venza looks awesome we will not get them down under


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## Muhammad D (Apr 26, 2020)

Ubervader said:


> They say in article that Venza is sold in Japan as Harrier which is actually Lexus RX with different badge in Japan.
> Toyota never sold Lexus as a brand in Japan until recently Lexus models been sold under Toyota so RX is Harrier or GS is Aristo from memory vehicles are exactly the same.
> Not sure does new RX coming out will they sell same vehicle under both names in States.
> Venza looks awesome we will not get them down under


We are also getting a 302 hp Rav4 Prime here. It has as much hp as the Lexus GX with a 4.6 L V8. Crazy!


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## Jihad Me At Hello (Jun 18, 2018)

Rockocubs said:


> my 2012 venza is still going strong at 180k


Yes! 2009 4 cyl here! Almost 160k, never a day of problems


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Yes, the Japanese are the best builders on the planet.


Maybe Toyota has really good manufacturing, but I've seen some pretty bad manufacturing and assembly work from the inside of Japanese factories。

My Mitsubishi Outlander was also made in Japan. I find different pieces of the interior on the floor on a weekly basis, and all sorts of other issues like plastic fasteners coming undone below the vehicle causing the plastic shield to fall into the asphalt and get chewed up. The same thing happened with the wheel wells.

Don't get me wrong, I think Japan has awesome engineering and awesome manufacturing operations, and in a lot of areas they are #1 for sure. Japanese Hex Wrenches are WAY better than American and German hex wrenches, for instance (and cheaper than the German ones too). I know, because I used exclusively Japanese tools in Japan and used the heck out of them and never bent a single one, and then came to work along American mechanics with half of their smallest wrenches bent. I had to give up my Japanese hex wrenches (Tone and Eight) when I left that line of work an I bought the leading American brand Bondhus. Not nearly as good. And don't get me started on Home Depot made in China wrenches. I'm glad they have a warranty because I had to return my Huskies multiple times. I love the DESIGN of a lot of the Husky tools but the metallurgy is often garbage.



losiglow said:


> There's a lot to say about that. All my "Japanese" vehicles built in the US have been very reliable, but the fit and finish isn't like the ones I've had from Japan. Rattles and gaps are all over with the US built ones.
> 
> For example, the quality of my '07 TSX and '17 ES300h (built in Japan) have been considerably better than my '06 and '12 TL's (built in Ohio). All of them have mechanically been solid but fit and finish has been considerably better from Japan.


Here's my guess: The parts on the American cars are built *to specification*. That's how business is done in American manufacturing jobs. There is a tolerance of +- 0.5mm? Then you put it at +- 0.5 mm. The guy turning the part out on the mill will not spend time to make it more precise than that. The robot assembling something will be so cheap that it can barely meet precision requirements. So you will have tolerance stack between multiple parts and it will rattle a bit but it will work because the engineers designed it to work with that tolerance stack and everyone wants to make it as cheaply as possible and still work. That's practically the definition of engineering.

In the Japanese factory, they will cheat a lot and often not meet engineering specification, but it is more important to them that the product looks right than it meeting specification. So I kind of feel like you're more likely to get something that feels better built if assembled from the same drawings if it is made in Japan. They will do much better than the specifications if it is within reason, and skip the specification altogether or at times the mechanics will override the engineering specification if they think it doesn't produce a result that looks right. There could be a problem with the design, but the engineers are unlikely to find out about it very rapidly because the assembly contractor will not report the issues.

That's just my gut feeling on American vs. Japanese manufacturing, from having worked in factories in both countries.


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## Ubervader (Mar 20, 2020)

Muhammad D said:


> We are also getting a 302 hp Rav4 Prime here. It has as much hp as the Lexus GX with a 4.6 L V8. Crazy!


Yeah saw that plug in hybrid awesome


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## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Trafficat said:


> Maybe Toyota has really good manufacturing, but I've seen some pretty bad manufacturing and assembly work from the inside of Japanese factories。
> 
> My Mitsubishi Outlander was also made in Japan. I find different pieces of the interior on the floor on a weekly basis, and all sorts of other issues like plastic fasteners coming undone below the vehicle causing the plastic shield to fall into the asphalt and get chewed up. The same thing happened with the wheel wells.
> 
> ...


But at the end of the day isn't the finish product more important than the specifications?


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> But at the end of the day isn't the finish product more important than the specifications?


Generally I would say so, it just depends on the specific product. When it comes to making a machine work to feed parts through it, as long as the machine does it's job that's great. And from what I've seen calibrating machines to feed parts, it is not uncommon for the machines to not work based on the original drawings. Personally, I think that means that the designers need to be notified though and this is not always happening.

On the other hand, I've also seen where the factory is setting up a machine and calibrating it and simply could not get the machine to produce parts that were within consistently within specification and they were passed as long as they worked. If they had to send back 5 samples from the machine that were within spec before sending the machine out of the factory, they would churn out 15 samples with the same final calibration setup if they needed to, and send back the lucky 5 that were right and the other 10 that weren't quite right just go in the garbage and no one knows they existed. Even the out of spec parts apparently are functional, but that's still not the point.

In some cases, the parts were required to deal with very specific chemical reactions so the end result is going to be a product that doesn't perform quite as well as if they could get the chemical ratios to be more correct through more precise manufacturing. But they might not report that there was an issue in calibration of the machine because they don't want the appearance of failing, even when the problem could be the original design of the machine and have nothing to do with their aptitude to calibrate it. On the other hand, it is very common for Japanese engineers and the companies that direct them to require unnecessarily high precision for parts in general anyway, where an American engineer would simply not require that level of precision because it isn't worth the cost. So while the specs are not met, it doesn't necessarily create an inferior part from a competitor.

In the case of this particular machine that established proper ratios of reactants, I became convinced that the machine itself was impossible to be calibrated precisely enough, and shifted slightly out of calibration all on its own in short order. But years later, I wonder if any improvement has been done for these machines or the end user has simply putting up with a difficult to resolve issue of inconsistency in their output that they can't pin down exactly what it is... not knowing if it is variation in chemical quality, differences between theoretical and practical models, or what, when a large part of the inconsistency can simply be accounted for by the fact that there are unreported difficulties in actually making the machines produce dimensionally consistent product.

Every now and then, I'd see some catastrophic issue occur somewhere and all I can think of is all the fake certifications everywhere along the manufacturing process, making tracing the problem very difficult. And sometimes, the standards for designing something really do need to be VERY precise. That's the problem with requiring impossibly high standards everywhere and then faking to meet them, is what happens when you really do have a manufacturing process that requires close to the limits of what is technically possible to achieve, and when getting a small air bubble could result in your product exploding?

Of course, I've not seen the inside of every factory. These are just my observations within a couple of factories. Perhaps different companies have different internal cultures.


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