# Uber and Lyft drivers' default commission has been slashed from 75% to 66% in many if not most markets



## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Uber and Lyft have recently raised their base rate prices in many markets but have kept driver pay rates the SAME.

The result is that drivers are no longer being paid 75% of the fare on base rate rides, they are being paid 66% or even less.

This is for BASE RATE rides. Surged rides are an even bigger ripoff.

And that 66% doesn't include the hefty Booking Fees both companies collect from pax. If the Booking Fees are included, the drivers cut drops even more, especially on short rides.

Uber and Lyft originally did this to drivers in Florida, Louisiana, and some other markets in 2018, and now the drivers in DC and other markets are getting hit the same way.

This was apparently Uber and Lyft's way of "thanking" the drivers who worked during the pandemic.

I'm gonna check on it but I believe that Uber and Lyft raised non-surge prices again in at least some of the original 2018 markets, and if this is correct, the drivers in those markets are being paid even less than 66% of the fare. They could very well be receiving less than 60%, depending on the size of the second fare hikes.


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## pizzaladee (May 23, 2018)

Drivers are not paid a percentage of the total. You are paid per mile and per minute.


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## Taxi2Uber (Jul 21, 2017)

What year is this, 2017? LMAO


Title reads:
_"Uber and Lyft drivers' default commission *has been slashed*..."_

Then the post reads:
_"... but have kept driver pay rates *the SAME*._


Taking CLUELESS to a whole other level.


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## Classified (Feb 8, 2018)

Not here. Prices are still the same. And Uber is still only taking 20% off me


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## Kilroy4303 (Jul 31, 2020)

I think in the higher market areas ( Like New York, LA, Boston. . big cities) they are taking a lot more from the drivers than in the smaller markets. . .. still BS. they are hiding the fact from the drivers. They occasionally thro the drivers a bone with some of the "special" deals. . but in the long run they are still tilting the favor toward the company and not the drivers. .. 

I use to argue the other side in complaints from drivers. . .. but I think I have driven for far too long. . . . I am now on the side of the drivers are being screwed by the company financially. . . and yet I still drive. . .. 

I am a frigging masochist


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

beyond the sky is falling. Both of them have a certain cash burn rate issue that needs to be adjusted. they can increase revenue, or decrease expenses. Or a combo of both. And it must be done or both will run out of cash. Like real cash that pays to keeps the HQ lights on.

Huh. 

but yeah, drivers aren't getting a percent of the pot; they get time and miles and sometimes some other fees here and there. Shocking.


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## Taxi2Uber (Jul 21, 2017)

Kilroy4303 said:


> I think in the higher market areas ( Like New York, LA, Boston. . big cities) they are taking a lot more from the drivers than in the smaller markets


How are they "taking" from drivers?
Are they not paying the amounts based on time and miles that you agreed to?


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## The super uber (May 23, 2020)

Nats121 said:


> Uber and Lyft have recently raised their base rate prices in many markets but have kept driver pay rates the SAME.
> 
> The result is that drivers are no longer being paid 75% of the fare on base rate rides, they are being paid 66% or even less.
> 
> ...


Boo Hoo...do a few more rides or quit...yes, quit bellyaching


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## bobby747 (Dec 29, 2015)

Your in New Zealand. In usa. We get per mile and minute.
What nat. Is saying is they raised the rates up to customers. And did nothing 4 us. They gave themselves a raise. Look at you per mile on passenger app. It's not say $1.01 x 20% 
Its uber charging us 20 % of example $1.01 passenger paying $1.20 now or whatever.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Taxi2Uber said:


> Are they not paying the amounts based on time and miles that you agreed to?


It's funny that someone who either hasn't read the contract or read it but failed to comprehend it would try to tell me what the terms were I "agreed" to.

If you had read and/or comprehended the contract, you would have known that according to the contract, the PAX pay the drivers and the drivers PAY Uber to act as a sort of "agent" on our "behalf".




Taxi2Uber said:


> How are they "taking" from drivers?


As I stated above, Uber's own contract states that Uber "takes" money from the drivers as a "fee" for "acting as an agent on our behalf" in our "business relationship" with the pax.

Of course Uber's contract is a big fat lie with contradictory clauses.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Taxi2Uber said:


> What year is this, 2017? LMAO
> 
> 
> Title reads:
> ...


Your ignorance of how this business works and how drivers are paid clearly shows in your stupid post.

If you had a clue, you'd know what the terms I used mean and you wouldn't have made the foolish comments that you made.

You obviously don't know what a default/base/book rate is.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

pizzaladee said:


> Drivers are not paid a percentage of the total. You are paid per mile and per minute.


Up until recently, our pay rates were not based on thin air, they were always based on the Base Rate or Default Rate or "Non-Surge" rate.

For every market, Uber and Lyft have a listed Base Rate that was probably required by the govt.

From Day One until recently, the driver pay rates were based on a fixed percentage (75 or 80%) of the Base Rate.

That system remained in place even after the establishment of Upfront Pricing in 2016-17.

What changed was the driver's percentage of the SURGES. When Upfront Pricing was created, drivers were no longer guaranteed to receive 75 or 80% of the SURGE, but they were always guaranteed to receive 75 or 80% of Base Rate rides.

In 2018, Uber and Lyft eliminated that guarantee in Florida, Louisiana, and a few other markets when they RAISED the Base Rates in those markets but shared little to none of the increase with the drivers. That meant that for non-surge rides, drivers were no longer being paid 75 or 80% of the fare.

Recently, Uber and Lyft have eliminated that guarantee for many if not all markets in the US, which means no more 75 or 80% guaranteed commissions for Base Rate trips.

That's massive pay cut that very few drivers know about.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Kilroy4303 said:


> I think in the higher market areas ( Like New York, LA, Boston. . big cities) they are taking a lot more from the drivers than in the smaller markets. . .. still BS. they are hiding the fact from the drivers. They occasionally thro the drivers a bone with some of the "special" deals. . but in the long run they are still tilting the favor toward the company and not the drivers. ..
> 
> I use to argue the other side in complaints from drivers. . .. but I think I have driven for far too long. . . . I am now on the side of the drivers are being screwed by the company financially. . . and yet I still drive. . ..
> 
> I am a frigging masochist


NYC is a special case with a totally unique driver pay system.

My post is a different topic from what has been heavily discussed, which is how drivers are getting screwed on SURGE PAY.

My post is about a massive pay cut on BASE RATE rides.

Up until recently, our pay rates were always based on the established (and probably govt-mandated) Base Rates for every market.

Now, our pay rates are based on THIN AIR... Uber and Lyft's thin air.

We are now being paid LESS than 75% of the Base Rates, around 66%.

This means a non-surge $100 ride that used to pay the driver $75 will now pay the driver only $66. That's a 12% pay cut.

Very few drivers know about this new pay cut.


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## Taxi2Uber (Jul 21, 2017)

Nats121 said:


> My post is about a massive pay cut on BASE RATE rides.





Nats121 said:


> ...have kept driver pay rates the SAME.


These "pay cuts" are SO "massive"....they are kept......the SAME. 
Can't argue with that logic. LMAO



Nats121 said:


> You obviously don't know what a default/base/book rate is.


No one does.
No where is that term used in any Uber contract. (that I've seen)



Nats121 said:


> Uber's own contract states that Uber "takes" money from the drivers as a "fee" for "acting as an agent on our behalf"


Yes in THAT context, but you know full well that's not what was meant.



Nats121 said:


> Recently, Uber and Lyft have eliminated that guarantee for many if not all markets in the US, which means no more 75 or 80% guaranteed commissions for Base Rate trips.


Guarantee?
You sure about that? LOL



Nats121 said:


> NYC is a special case


You and NYC have something in common.



Nats121 said:


> Up until recently, our pay rates were always based on the established (and probably govt-mandated) Base Rates for every market.


Probably? 



Nats121 said:


> Now, our pay rates are based on THIN AIR... Uber and Lyft's thin air.


Always has been ...
_(2015 TOS)
"Company reserves the right to change the Fare Calculation at any time in Company’s discretion based upon local market factors..."
(2020 Addendum)
"a “Fare” for each Ride, calculated as a base amount plus amounts based on the Ride’s distance and/or time. The Fare may also include additional fees paid by a Rider, such as a fee based on certain trip attributes, and may be adjusted based on marketplace factors, such as supply and demand."_

...and no specific percentage or guarantee or mention of government mandates in the TOS (that I've seen).



Nats121 said:


> This means a non-surge $100 ride that used to pay the driver $75 will now pay the driver only $66.


<sigh>
How can you still not get something so basic?


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## Cvillegordo (Oct 30, 2019)

I'm seeing Uber take as much as 45%, for example this trip last night which included $7 surge;


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## Taxi2Uber (Jul 21, 2017)

Cvillegordo said:


> I'm seeing Uber take as much as 45%


It's routinely higher here especially on min fare rides.
Rider pays $9.07. 
Driver receives $3.98 (or $3.97 or $3.99, depending on rounding numbers)
Uber gets $1.53 service fee + $3.25 booking fee = $4.78
3rd party gets $.30

Uber 53%
Driver 44%
3rd party 3%
That is the scenario of 90%+ of min fare rides here, which there are A LOT.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Nats121 said:


> Of course Uber's contract is a big fat lie with contradictory clauses.


...but it is legal. and stands up in court. every time.

and you agreed to it when it was changed (multi times) and each and every time you go online for pings/requests. So, you have confirmed it is legal.

Hum. 

and the hs that RS is just an 'agent' with software is just for the whole employee/contractor crap. nobody believes it.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

SHalester said:


> ...but it is legal. and stands up in court. every time.


The contract hasn't stood up in court because it hasn't been challenged in court.


SHalester said:


> and you agreed to it when it was changed (multi times) and each and every time you go online for pings/requests. So, you have confirmed it is legal.


That's nonsense.

Whether or not I "agree" to the terms of a contract doesn't make it legal. The courts decide whether or not a contract is legally enforceable.



SHalester said:


> and the hs that RS is just an 'agent' with software is just for the whole employee/contractor crap. nobody believes it.


After all that arguing you admit that Uber lied in their contract.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Nats121 said:


> Whether or not I "agree" to the terms of a contract doesn't make it legal.


nonsense to you, maybe. And it's not a contract. AT best it is an agreement that Uber can change whenever they want. A contract requires both parties to agree IN ADVANCE, fyi.

But, back to the point: they have an agreement, you accepted it. Then, each time you went online you accepted it again indirectly. 

Beyond venting here, what else do you do? did you opt out of arbitration? If so, why not launch a legal attack to get your point across?

too much work, huh. Easier to just vent. Seems this type of gig doesn't suit your needs. Everybody is hiring; W2 jobs that are also part-time, but w/out all the freedoms. 

There's an organized strike that starts today too. I'm participating, well actually going out of town for the first time since Covid landed, but still...... STRIKE! 🤷‍♂️


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## Amos69 (May 17, 2019)

Cvillegordo said:


> I'm seeing Uber take as much as 45%, for example this trip last night which included $7 surge;
> 
> View attachment 605697
> View attachment 605698


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## Atom guy (Jul 27, 2016)

Uber and Lyft have been taking an average of 35% off my total fares for the last several years (including the booking fee).


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## 25rides7daysaweek (Nov 20, 2017)

Nats121 said:


> Up until recently, our pay rates were not based on thin air, they were always based on the Base Rate or Default Rate or "Non-Surge" rate.
> 
> For every market, Uber and Lyft have a listed Base Rate that was probably required by the govt.
> 
> ...


Recently a couple year ago the started upfront pricing qouted that decoupled our rate to what they were getting paid. In the 4 months I've been back my pay has actually gone up 33-50% higher than what I was getting before matter of fact looks like $40 an hour so far this week..


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

25rides7daysaweek said:


> Recently a couple year ago the started upfront pricing qouted that decoupled our rate to what they were getting paid. In the 4 months I've been back my pay has actually gone up 33-50% higher than what I was getting before matter of fact looks like $40 an hour so far this week..
> View attachment 606395


Since the creation of Upfront Pricing, driver pay has been decoupled from SURGE PAY, not from BASE RATE PAY.

Until recently, in most markets, drivers pay rates were COUPLED to the BOOK RATE fares of every market.

Thus, if drivers wanted to know what the pay rates were for a given market, all they had to do was find out what the Book Rate fares were and multiply them by 75%.

In 2018, Uber and Lyft decoupled driver pay from Book Rates in Florida, Louisiana, and a few other markets.

Now, they've decoupled them from MOST markets. They've RAISED the BOOK RATE pay in most markets but kept driver pay rates the SAME.

Previously, only surge rides were decoupled.

Hardly any drivers know about this.


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## Wild Bill Yahoo (Jan 22, 2018)

Nats121 said:


> Since the creation of Upfront Pricing, driver pay has been decoupled from SURGE PAY, not from BASE RATE PAY.
> 
> Until recently, in most markets, drivers pay rates were COUPLED to the BOOK RATE fares of every market.
> 
> ...


And yet you keep on driving. Uber is under no obligation to raise driver pay as they increase the book rate. You agree to drive for the posted driver rate every time you decide to give rides. Quit complaining. Either drive or don't drive, no one is forcing you into anything.


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

Taxi2Uber said:


> Title reads:
> _"Uber and Lyft drivers' default commission *has been slashed*..."_
> 
> Then the post reads:
> ...


So what you're saying is that the OP should get his information _correct_ before he posts it? A novel idea, to be sure. Probably a bridge too far, though. 🤣


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Wild Bill Yahoo said:


> And yet you keep on driving. Uber is under no obligation to raise driver pay as they increase the book rate. You agree to drive for the posted driver rate every time you decide to give rides. Quit complaining. Either drive or don't drive, no one is forcing you into anything.


First of all, this is the COMPLAINTS FORUM. If you don't complaints, go elsewhere.

Take the worthless advice you gave me... no one is forcing you to read complaint posts, and since it bothers you so much, don't read em.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

The Gift of Fish said:


> So what you're saying is that the OP should get his information _correct_ before he posts it? A novel idea, to be sure. Probably a bridge too far, though. 🤣


Since you're claiming I didn't get my info correct before I posted, including the numbers from my own market, let's see you post the CORRECT numbers and factually refute my point about the drivers' percentage of the base rate being cut.


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

Nats121 said:


> Since you're claiming I didn't get my info correct before I posted, including the numbers from my own market, let's see you post the CORRECT numbers and factually refute my point about the drivers' percentage of the base rate being cut.


Meh, let's not. I'm not going to work out your numbers for you!


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

The Gift of Fish said:


> Meh, let's not. I'm not going to work out your numbers for you!


What a pathetic response. 

You shot your mouth off so to speak claiming I post without the correct info, and when I challenged you to rebut with the correct info your lame response above is what you posted.

Get lost.


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

Nats121 said:


> What a pathetic response.


I'll be sure to send your complaint straight over to my Customer Experience Team and mark it urgent


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## Wild Bill Yahoo (Jan 22, 2018)

Nats121 said:


> First of all this is the COMPLAINTS FORUM. If you don't complaints, go elsewhere.
> 
> Take the worthless advice you gave me... no one is forcing you to read complaint posts, and since it bothers you so much, don't read em.


The problem is you keep rehashing the same complaint over and over again ad naseum. Why drive if you are constantly unhappy with the compensation? Is rideshare your only option?


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## Wild Bill Yahoo (Jan 22, 2018)

Hardly any drivers know about this.
[/QUOTE]

And if they did, what could they do about it? Most drivers don't care.


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

Wild Bill Yahoo said:


> The problem is you keep rehashing the same complaint over and over again ad naseum. Why drive if you are constantly unhappy with the compensation? Is rideshare your only option?


He's done a lot to develop his Mr. Angryman persona here on the site, ranting and raving each week and raging against other posters. 

👿😠😡 GGRRRRRRrrrrrr!

To what end, I have no idea. He certainly does take his diatribes _very_ seriously. Worryingly so, given that it's just an internet forum. I think there's something else that would be concerning going on with this individual, beneath the surface.


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## PukersAreAlwaysYourFault (Mar 25, 2021)

Remember, you're not employed by Uber, you're partnered with them. Unhappy? Unpartner. They're not going to negotiate with you. They need to turn a profit after 10 years of not. They thought they could get autonomous vehicles on the road faster to replace you. They had to sell off that division for the time being. Ultimately, you're the middle man, and they want you on just long enough before they show you you're expendable.


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## PukersAreAlwaysYourFault (Mar 25, 2021)

I'd pay to see a celebrity death match between @Nats121 and @warsaw and @natemansi11


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Nats121 said:


> What a pathetic response.
> 
> You shot your mouth off so to speak claiming I post without the correct info, and when I challenged you to rebut with the correct info your lame response above is what you posted.
> 
> Get lost.


How long since you drove a pax ? In DC base pay is 60c a mile .225c a min on UBER X . That’s it . No percentages . No more BS .When multiplier stoped working this is what you get .The SURGE is a wishlist. They show you a minimun surge but it could go up depending on the timing and what can they charge the pax . They do not give us a exact way to calculate surge . I can tell you that if you get a minimun surge and UBER is charged multiple X times the rate , you’ll MAY BE get a better surge payout but it is not all the time .


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

UberPotomac said:


> How long since you drove a pax ? In DC base pay is 60c a mile .225c a min on UBER X . That’s it . No percentages . No more BS .When multiplier stoped working this is what you get .The SURGE is a wishlist. They show you a minimun surge but it could go up depending on the timing and what can they charge the pax . They do not give us a exact way to calculate surge . I can tell you that if you get a minimun surge and UBER is charged multiple X times the rate , you’ll MAY BE get a better surge payout but it is not all the time .


I'm gonna go over it once more so pay attention...

In EVERY market in which Uber and Lyft operates, there's a pax Rate Card which in all likelihood is required by law.

All drivers in all markets also have rate cards.

The rates that are listed on the Pax Rate Cards are the base or default rates that in the absence of any type of surge or discount are the rates a pax will pay for their ride.

From 2012-2018, every Uber and Lyft drivers' pay rates were 75% or 80% of the default rates.

Every time the default rates changed, the drivers' pay rates would change by the same percentage.

For example, when DC drivers' per mile rate was cut to 60 cents in 2019, the pax default rate was cut by the SAME percentage. When the per minute rate was increased to 22.5 cents per minute, the pax default rate was increased by the SAME percentage.

In 2018, Uber and Lyft decided to screw the drivers in Florida, Louisiana, and a couple of other markets by raising the default rates but keeping the drivers' pay rates the SAME.

In most other markets including DC, the drivers' were still paid 75 or 80% of the default rates.

A few months ago, Uber and Lyft decided to screw most of the rest of the drivers in the US by doing the same thing they had done to Florida and Louisiana in 2018, which was to raise the default rates while keeping the drivers' pay rates the SAME.

The zillions of driver complaints over the years about Uber and Lyft taking too large of a cut from rides are NOT pax base/default rate rides, they're SURGE rides.

In most markets up until a few months ago, when Uber charged pax base rates, the drivers were always paid 75% of the fare. That has now changed and very few drivers even know about that change. I found out about it by accident a month ago. Uber and Lyft have been keeping it a secret.

Check out the pax rate card for DC and you'll see the prices are HIGHER than they were a few months ago. Meanwhile, the drivers' pay rates are the SAME.

This is the first time this has ever happened in the DC market.


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Nats121 said:


> I'm gonna go over it once more so pay attention...
> 
> In EVERY market in which Uber and Lyft operates, there's a pax Rate Card which in all likelihood is required by law.
> 
> ...


You keep over complicating things . Rate cards and pax prices , surge , NONE of that matters since UBER implemented UPFRONT PRICING .
First of all , ARE YOU DRIVING ? Because for all I know , for you all this is just research.
Take it from the guys that are out there . And do not tell me we don’t know because I check my earning daily . In DC drives like myself we get .60c a mile and .225,a min .
The charges to the pax, DOES NOT CHANGE our pay . There is percentage or any link between my pay and pax pay. Uber made sure if they when they separate our pay from pax charges. They did that creating a fluid “ service fee” that looks like “chewing gum “
Stop arguing about and get it in your head .
Drivers pay in DC for UBER X
60c a mile
22.5 a minute

Then you got SURGE . Minimun surge is on the map.It is just an baseline . If the pax get charge a multiplier , we MAY get a bigger surge but unfortunately we do not have a way to predict other than use a third party app.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

So essentially your title should read:

Uber and Lyft did away with percentage based fares and now pays base rates in many if not most markets

Yes Uber and Lyft are charging the PAX more and drivers are still making the preset rates of a base amount + distance + time at a preset rate. It sucks because PAX are paying more and think drivers are making more so in theory they tip less.


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

FLKeys said:


> So essentially your title should read:
> 
> Uber and Lyft did away with percentage based fares and now pays base rates in many if not most markets
> 
> Yes Uber and Lyft are charging the PAX more and drivers are still making the preset rates of a base amount + distance + time at a preset rate. It sucks because PAX are paying more and think drivers are making more so in theory they tip less.


Of course it is sucks . But we all should know where we stand . What the pax paid is irrelevant on your earnings. There is no correlation . It is just wishful thinking . This thinking like they cut this and that is not factual . They do it all the r time and they fatten their service fee as they see fit. Is it right ? Of course not but it happens everyday .


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

UberPotomac said:


> Of course it is sucks . But we all should know where we stand . What the pax paid is irrelevant on your earnings. There is no correlation . It is just wishful thinking . This thinking like they cut this and that is not factual . They do it all the r time and they fatten their service fee as they see fit. Is it right ? Of course not but it happens everyday .


I agree 100%, except I have found there is a minor correlation when it comes to tips, in my market tips are slightly down and this is very relevant to my earnings. Rates have gone up enough that regulars have noticed it and those regulars that normally tip $5 are now tipping $3.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

UberPotomac said:


> Stop arguing about and get it in your head .


This thread was started by me and I'm reiterating it's point. You're the one doing the arguing with your rebuttals.



UberPotomac said:


> You keep over complicating things .


There's nothing complicated about it at all. Uber and Lyft have found a new way to take a higher cut from many if not most rides and they correctly bet that drivers like you would say "nothing has changed I'm still getting my 60 cents per mile".



UberPotomac said:


> First of all , ARE YOU DRIVING ? Because for all I know , for you all this is just research.


I don't do rideshare, this was "research". Meanwhile you drive rideshare and you knew nothing about it.


UberPotomac said:


> Take it from the guys that are out there .


Take what? Virtually none of them knew this change occurred.



UberPotomac said:


> The charges to the pax, DOES NOT CHANGE our pay


It changes driver commission percentage. It changes drivers' POTENTIAL earnings. It's a lost earnings opportunity (opportunity cost). It's a NEW screwing over that YOU'RE arguing "doesn't matter"

Fine, be a stubborn fool.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

FLKeys said:


> So essentially your title should read:
> 
> Uber and Lyft did away with percentage based fares and now pays base rates in many if not most markets


I wouldn't use that title because it's factually incorrect.

Drivers USED to get 75% of "base rates" but now they get rates that are linked to NOTHING.

Before Covid, the majority of Uber rides were base rate/non-surge rides in which the drivers received 75% in most markets. With this change, that's gone out the window.

Here in DC, your average run-of-the-mill non-surge ride will pay the driver around 67% of the fare. Six months ago, the drivers were getting 75% of the fare on those very same rides.

For most markets of the US, this is an entirely new screwing over of the drivers.

Now that driver pay isn't coupled to anything the possibility exists that Uber and/or Lyft could experiment with paying drivers the same way Eats and Doordash pay theirs, which is to literally make up out of whole cloth how much drivers will be paid for each trip.

Doing that would eliminate longhauling of course.


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Nats121 said:


> This thread was started by me and I'm reiterating it's point. You're the one doing the arguing with your rebuttals.
> 
> 
> There's nothing complicated about it at all. Uber and Lyft have found a new way to take a higher cut from many if not most rides and they correctly bet that drivers like you would say "nothing has changed I'm still getting my 60 cents per mile".
> ...


 Fool ? There is only one fool here and it is definitely not me . You need an UPDATE , pal. Has been 2 years since upfront pricing . You still stuck on the 75%. and the multiplier. You always get obsessed on things that we cannot control . Before we’re destinations for a whole year and now upfront pricing . Do I like that features ? Of course I do but they are GONE . DONE . FINITO .

People don’t know because nothing changed for them . They always drove under upfront pricing .

There are new ways to squeeze extra money out this gig and unfortunately we adapt or die.


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## Wild Bill Yahoo (Jan 22, 2018)

Nats121 said:


> Drivers USED to get 75% of "base rates" but now they get rates that are linked to NOTHING.


That should be the title of this thread. And it's true. Drivers no longer earn a percentage of anything, and most drivers understand this. It's just a select few who still hold on to the old way of thinking that somehow they get a percentage of anything. So the fact that the math came out to 75% or 80% like you say, so be it. Uber is under no obligation to maintain that going forward. 

Where is it written that drivers are entitled to 75% or 80% of the rate card for base rate rides? I can't find that in the TOS or anywhere else on their website. All it says is that drivers will be paid via miles and minutes. Period. 

So they can't "cut" what your not entitled to in the first place. 

Please show us where we can find this so called 75% to 80% commission entitlement in any of Ubers literature. 

Please!


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Wild Bill Yahoo said:


> Where is it written that drivers are entitled to 75% or 80% of the rate card for base rate rides?


Your post is a series of strawman arguments. Post a screenshot of me saying drivers were "entitled" to anything or that the percentage is "written anywhere". I said the drivers' percentage of the non-surge fares have been reduced in DC and other markets which is a fact. Are claiming that's not factual?


Wild Bill Yahoo said:


> Where is it written that drivers are entitled to 75% or 80% of the rate card for base rate rides? I can't find that in the TOS or anywhere else on their website. All it says is that drivers will be paid via miles and minutes. Period.
> 
> So they can't "cut" what your not entitled to in the first place.


That's like saying an employee pay cut isn't a pay cut if the pay rates weren't "written" on the job application or employee handbook (if the employer even has one).


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

UberPotomac said:


> Fool ? There is only one fool here and it is definitely not me . You need an UPDATE , pal. Has been 2 years since upfront pricing . You still stuck on the 75%. and the multiplier. You always get obsessed on things that we cannot control . Before we’re destinations for a whole year and now upfront pricing . Do I like that features ? Of course I do but they are GONE . DONE . FINITO .
> 
> People don’t know because nothing changed for them . They always drove under upfront pricing .
> 
> There are new ways to squeeze extra money out this gig and unfortunately we adapt or die.


You're in denial and stubborn and there's no point going on about this. Believe what you want.


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Nats121 said:


> Your post is a series of strawman arguments. Post a screenshot of me saying drivers were "entitled" to anything or that the percentage is "written anywhere". I said the drivers' percentage of the non-surge fares have been reduced in DC and other markets which is a fact. Are claiming that's not factual?
> 
> That's like saying an employee pay cut isn't a pay cut if the pay rates weren't "written" on the job application or employee handbook (if the employer even has one).


Talking about stubborn fool ? It wasn’t reduced . It been GONE. We are on a different pay scheme for the last 2 years .There is no correlation between pax pay and driver pay . The Service fee is whatever UBER likes.Drivers get pay time , mileage and surge , if any.


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Nats121 said:


> You're in denial and stubborn and there's no point going on about this. Believe what you want.


Sure . Sorry , the actual facts do not “ fit” on your research . I am more concern on make a living.


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## Wild Bill Yahoo (Jan 22, 2018)

Nats121 said:


> Your post is a series of strawman arguments. Post a screenshot of me saying drivers were "entitled" to anything or that the percentage is "written anywhere". I said the drivers' percentage of the non-surge fares have been reduced in DC and other markets which is a fact. Are claiming that's not factual?
> 
> That's like saying an employee pay cut isn't a pay cut if the pay rates weren't "written" on the job application or employee handbook (if the employer even has one).



All true. Pay as a percentage of the total fare has been reduced. That has been established. What's your freakin point? 

Drivers aren't entitled to ANYTHING except established time and distance. PERIOD. 

You can't cut what you're not entitled to. That's the point everyone is trying to make, but you're not listening.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Wild Bill Yahoo said:


> You can't cut what you're not entitled to.


When drivers were being paid more than $2.00 per mile in 2013 they weren't "entitled" to that amount either. Then as now, Uber and Lyft set the rates and had total authority to change them anytime they wanted, which is what they've always done and the drivers have always had zero say in the matter. By your illogical argument, the drivers have NEVER taken a pay cut because they were never "entitled" to any particular pay rate.

The same is true about the "commission" percentage. Uber has always had the authority to change that at any time as well.

The ONLY things drivers are "entitled" to is what the law says we're entitled to. Everything else is subject to the authority and whims of Uber and Lyft.



Wild Bill Yahoo said:


> That's the point everyone is trying to make


It's funny that you'd try to claim to be speaking for "everyone" considering how out of step you are with the vast majority of drivers.

Unlike you, the vast majority of drivers are dissatisfied with their pay and the hefty cuts these companies are taking from surge rides. More than 98% quit every year as a result of that dissatisfaction. 

They don't buy into your "you agreed to what whatever Uber pays you so you've got nothing to complain about" argument. Even Dara has acknowledged that Uber's "relationship" with their drivers needs improvement.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Nats121 said:


> The zillions of driver complaints over the years about Uber and Lyft taking too large of a cut from rides are NOT pax base/default rate rides, they're SURGE rides.


I wonder how many of those drivers really understand they are paid on time/miles and occasionally 'other' items that aren't guaranteed? Can any those zillion drivers point to a ride they weren't paid the correct time/miles?

Also, of those zllion of drivers who complained how many went right back online the very next instant after venting?

It's a gig. Easy in, easy out. Think about it.


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Nats121 said:


> When drivers were being paid more than $2.00 per mile in 2013 they weren't "entitled" to that amount either. Then as now, Uber and Lyft set the rates and had total authority to change them anytime they wanted, which is what they've always done and the drivers have always had zero say in the matter. By your illogical argument, the drivers have NEVER taken a pay cut because they were never "entitled" to any particular pay rate.
> 
> The same is true about the "commission" percentage. Uber has always had the authority to change that at any time as well.
> 
> ...


You sound insane now . Reading the comments , I can not see anyone defending the actual rates or the company practices . You are wrongly framing the issue.
They are not cut because we haven’t get the higher rates from the beginning . They may change the pax rates and keep drivers the same at any time . There is no correlation on one to another and it hasn’t been for a long time .


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

SHalester said:


> Can any those zillion drivers point to a ride they weren't paid the correct time/miles?


Use the search engine and you'll see about a zillion posts from drivers who were shortchanged on their pay. Of those, many chose to write it off rather than spending lots of time playing phone and text tag with Rohit.



SHalester said:


> Also, of those zllion of drivers who complained how many went right back online the very next instant after venting?


The same applies to many millions of workers who complain about their jobs and go back to work the next day.



SHalester said:


> It's a gig. Easy in, easy out. Think about it.


For hundreds of thousands of drivers, it's not a "gig", it's what they do for a living. And recent data has been emerging that shows the full timers do a disproportionately high amount of the rides. I'm well aware you don't like to be reminded of this because of the threat it poses to your little "positive cash flow/tax write-off" bubble, but that's too bad. 

My points above are factual, despite my being a "disgruntled driver" .

You can't rebut my posts with facts so all you can muster is to endlessly use the "you're a disgruntled driver" routine. Don't waste your time because I've already done it.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Nats121 said:


> Use the search engine and you'll see about a zillion posts from drivers who were shortchanged on their pay.


oh, back to dancing. I see the same posts you do. In your 'type' of venting I've seen very few drivers say they weren't paid correctly as it related to miles and time. Certainly there have been NAV issues they say it was more miles and maybe a tiny few on time. But overall, non-material to the level of whine you bring here over and over. Unless you are confused on surges, quests and bonuses; all of those are not guaranteed and come and go at a whim. I was referring to miles and times and even alluded to other other fees we 'might' get. sheesh. Less dancing, more reading.

I see you missed the point (as usual). If one is not happy with a 'changed' fee or a new agreement they are totally free to make decisions that are greater than just whining full time. They can quit. They can try and launch an arbitration or case if they opted out (but they will lose horribly). 

What you fail to grasp is your efforts here will make no difference. The other drivers make decisions to continue or not vs non-stop venting that has zero impact. Yes, yes you will say you can post your opinion as much as you want. Yup, and there are consequences to that you have to live with. 

You do have a much longer history with RS, I'll give you that. But drivers who started in 2019 won't really share or agree with your venting. Even in calif, which until recently we WERE getting 75%, the complaints that were here when that went up in flames was not significant for the BIGGEST market Uber has. Drivers decided and went with their decision.

Seems you are stuck in limbo; can't make a decision. that sucks.

Get a different gig; get a real job that makes you enough $$ where a gig is not needed. You will have a richer life in more ways then one.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

UberPotomac said:


> You sound insane now . Reading the comments , I can not see anyone defending the actual rates or the company practices .


Now you're lying, because you know damn well there's been plenty of Uber apologists on this website over the years who defended most everything they've done including the pay rates. Some have been banned such as the Miami Kid or whatever his name was.



UberPotomac said:


> They are not cut because we haven’t get the higher rates from the beginning .


Another factually incorrect statement.

Are you claiming that Uber and Lyft didn't cut the per mile rate to 60 cents in 2019?



UberPotomac said:


> There is no correlation on one to another and it hasn’t been for a long time .


Wrong again. Up until a few months ago, our pay rates were 75% of the default rates for DC. Those default rates were raised a few months ago but the drivers' pay was kept the same. 

You obviously don't know what a default rate is and it's relationship to driver pay. Up until a few months ago it was ALWAYS coupled to the driver pay rates. Drivers always received 75% of those default rates as I've already pointed out over and over again. 

When Uber slightly raised the default rates in 2017, the drivers' pay rates went up by the same percentage.

When Uber CUT the default per mile and RAISED the default per minute rates in 2019, the drivers' pay rates changed by the SAME percentage. 

That's how it was in DC from 2012-2020. Even AFTER Upfront Pricing was instituted in 2016, that's how it was.

A few months ago that changed. 

Do your homework and look it up. You'll see that up until months ago, our pay rates were always 75% of those default rates.


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## Wild Bill Yahoo (Jan 22, 2018)

Nats121 said:


> Wrong again. Up until a few months ago, our pay rates were 75% of the default rates for DC. Those default rates were raised a few months ago but the drivers' pay was kept the same.
> 
> You obviously don't know what a default rate is and it's relationship to driver pay. Up until a few months ago it was ALWAYS coupled to the driver pay rates. Drivers always received 75% of those default rates as I've already pointed out over and over again.


True. The point is that UBER has no obligation to continue coupling driver pay rates to the rate card. So now that it has been pointed out, great. 

There is no issue here. Drivers are being paid what they were promised. Which is .60 cents a mile in DC. 

Time to move on....


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## Amos69 (May 17, 2019)

DC might be different, but the majority of markets were uncoupled three years ago. 75% is distant past.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

SHalester said:


> You do have a much longer history with RS, I'll give you that. But drivers who started in 2019 won't really share or agree with your venting. Even in calif, which until recently we WERE getting 75%, the complaints that were here when that went up in flames was not significant for the BIGGEST market Uber has. Drivers decided and went with their decision.


I missed out on the "good ole days" of $2.50 per mile and 80% commissions. I don't need to have experienced the old days to know the pay rates suck, and neither do the drivers who started years after I did. All a driver has to do is look at low little they've got to show for the time and wear and tear they put on their cars to know this job isn't worth it.



SHalester said:


> What you fail to grasp is your efforts here will make no difference. The other drivers make decisions to continue or not vs non-stop venting that has zero impact.


Maybe so, but as long as I continue to visit this site I'm gonna be an "activist" by posting what I've learned about this business, and I'll immodestly say I learned a lot about this business. When most others said major change was impossible I said it was doable. I got lots of flak about it but I turned out to be right. Witness NYC, AB5 in CA, and Seattle.
And other states are working on major reforms right now.



SHalester said:


> Seems you are stuck in limbo; can't make a decision. that sucks.


You're just blowing hot air. I'm not in any "limbo". So long as I can make tolerable money doing delivery I'll continue to do so. If that becomes no longer possible, I'll quit. Very simple.



SHalester said:


> Get a different gig; get a real job that makes you enough $$ where a gig is not needed. You will have a richer life in more ways then one.


Ok father, I'll take your advice in the spirit in which it was given.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Nats121 said:


> All a driver has to do is look at low little they've got to show for the time and wear and tear they put on their cars to know this job isn't worth it.


and each driver makes that decision. They don't 'not' make a decision and then go straight to venting full time. You STILL don't get it.

I make positive cash flow w/out trying very hard (limited hours/days). It really, really isn't hard. Full time, different story. And if a lost soul is trying to have a career of RS alone, well they are lost. Unless they do Black or something.

RS is not for you. You just need to own it. It's that simple.

over n out. Sign over the door spells E X I T


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Nats121 said:


> Now you're lying, because you know damn well there's been plenty of Uber apologists on this website over the years who defended most everything they've done including the pay rates. Some have been banned such as the Miami Kid or whatever his name was.
> 
> 
> Another factually incorrect statement.
> ...


Did you realize that 15 months if COVID happen ?
Upfront pricing was change on 2018-19. Since we are under mile and time . But of course , when is the last time YOU drove a pax ?
You may need to get out more . Losing touch with reality .


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Do you know is July 2021 ? Just checking .


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

SHalester said:


> and each driver makes that decision. They don't 'not' make a decision and then go straight to venting full time. You STILL don't get it.
> 
> I make positive cash flow w/out trying very hard (limited hours/days). It really, really isn't hard. Full time, different story. And if a lost soul is trying to have a career of RS alone, well they are lost. Unless they do Black or something.
> 
> ...


I disagree with your characterization.You are mistaking positive flow without considering your full expenses. There is no way to make a profit a .60c .
And part time drivers act like there is no depreciation on the car . You are exchanging your car for money now . When your car runout , you won’t be able to replace it with your earnings . 
I am sure you don’t disagree rates are bad and UBER is a riippoff on customers and drivers . 
@Nats121is so involved on his rage , that does not allow him to have a factual conversation on the matter but he is no wrong in some points as you are not wrong to say is the drivers choice to continue.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Amos69 said:


> DC might be different, but the majority of markets were uncoupled three years ago. 75% is distant past.


DC's not different. In 2018, Uber's pax default rates were $1.08 per mile and .18 per minute. The drivers' pay rate was .81 per mile and .135 per minute which is 75%.

In 2019, Uber pax default fares were changed to .80 per mile and 30 cents per minute. The drivers' pay rates were changed to 60 cents per mile and .225 per minute which is once again 75%

For EVERY pax default fare change from 2012-2020, this 75% (or 80% for the old timers) ratio NEVER changed.

It wasn't just the case in DC, it was the case in all or almost all markets until 2018, when Uber and Lyft decoupled the pax default rates from the drivers' pay rates in Florida, Louisiana, and a couple of other states.

Pax fares for SURGE rides were decoupled in 2016-17 with the creation of Upfront Pricing. 

After the creation of Upfront Pricing, Uber's official policy was to VOID the Upfront Price and use the DEFAULT or BASE rates when drivers veered "significantly" from the original route. This is STILL the policy.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

UberPotomac said:


> Did you realize that 15 months if COVID happen ?
> Upfront pricing was change on 2018-19. Since we are under mile and time . But of course , when is the last time YOU drove a pax ?
> You may need to get out more . Losing touch with reality .
> 
> View attachment 607268


NYC has a completely different fare and driver pay structure from the rest of the US. You can't compare it with any other market.


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Nats121 said:


> NYC has a completely different fare and driver pay structure from the rest of the US. You can't compare it with any other market.












upfront pricing DC


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Wild Bill Yahoo said:


> True. The point is that UBER has no obligation to continue coupling driver pay rates to the rate card. So now that it has been pointed out, great.
> 
> There is no issue here. Drivers are being paid what they were promised. Which is .60 cents a mile in DC.
> 
> Time to move on....


I never used the terms "obligation" or "entitled to", you did as part of your strawman arguments.

Uber and Lyft can and does pay us whatever the hell they want, including this recent money grab. The fact they can do something doesn't make it ethical. The object of this thread was to inform the drivers about this change.

And now after all of your arguments and denials, you're acknowledging that I was correct about Uber and Lyft decoupling driver pay rates from the pax rate cards. That's what this whole thread's been about. Congratulations.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

UberPotomac said:


> .You are mistaking positive flow without considering your full expenses.


I'm mistaking? Or am I ignoring the word 'depreciation' which gets thrown about here a lot (incorrectly). Or was I very very precise to only include cash income and cash expenses?

A full timer certainly needs to 'worry' about and budget for a replacement car. But did you know replacing a car is not an expense? It is an asset that gradually depreciates via accepted IRS methods (only). Buying a car certainly effects cash flow, tho. But i drift.

If one can't make positive cash flow doing RS they need to end it or make changes. It's that simple. For a part-timer with a vehicle already owned, it is quite easy; well depending on the market. 

Not sure any of that is a mistake tho a bunch will jump up and down about depreciation, to which I respond it is a non-cash expense only bothered with when you sell the vehicle. But that is more value, then net book. Oh, again with the drifting....


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

SHalester said:


> I'm mistaking? Or am I ignoring the word 'depreciation' which gets thrown about here a lot (incorrectly). Or was I very very precise to only include cash income and cash expenses?
> 
> A full timer certainly needs to 'worry' about and budget for a replacement car. But did you know replacing a car is not an expense? It is an asset that gradually depreciates via accepted IRS methods (only). Buying a car certainly effects cash flow, tho. But i drift.
> 
> ...


I was being polite but you manage to clarify . You purposely ignore it . Ok then. I am getting out here .


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

UberPotomac said:


> You purposely ignore it


Ignore it? Or realiize the tiny depreciation I could assign based on percentage is like pennies and therefore not material? Plus as noted a billion times depreciation is not a cash expense....ever.... Has zero effect on cash flow. GAAP fact check true.


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

SHalester said:


> Ignore it? Or realiize the tiny depreciation I could assign based on percentage is like pennies and therefore not material? Plus as noted a billion times depreciation is not a cash expense....ever.... Has zero effect on cash flow. GAAP fact check true.


Like I said before , getting out this. Nonsense on continue this conversation .


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

UberPotomac said:


> Fool ? There is only one fool here and it is definitely not me .


Yes, the OP's arguments are wide open to criticism as having no rational basis. However, in spite of several people telling him where he is going wrong in his analysis, he is unable to understand, process or digest any of what is being said to him. It's a waste of time, unfortunately.


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## Amos69 (May 17, 2019)

Nats121 said:


> DC's not different. In 2018, Uber's pax default rates were $1.08 per mile and .18 per minute. The drivers' pay rate was .81 per mile and .135 per minute which is 75%.
> 
> In 2019, Uber pax default fares were changed to .80 per mile and 30 cents per minute. The drivers' pay rates were changed to 60 cents per mile and .225 per minute which is once again 75%
> 
> ...


$$SOOOOoooo$$


You really are an Uber Shill.

That is an Uber talking point straight from corporate. If You were to audit 10,000 drivers from every market you would find this true in less than .001% of all their rides.



Dara loves you


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

Nats121 said:


> You're in denial and stubborn and there's no point going on about this. Believe what you want.


Do you ever get the feeling that nobody's on your side?










This thread may be one of those times.


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## Wild Bill Yahoo (Jan 22, 2018)

Nats121 said:


> I never used the terms "obligation" or "entitled to", you did as part of your strawman arguments.
> 
> Uber and Lyft can and does pay us whatever the hell they want, including this recent money grab. The fact they can do something doesn't make it ethical. The object of this thread was to inform the drivers about this change.
> 
> And now after all of your arguments and denials, you're acknowledging that I was correct about Uber and Lyft decoupling driver pay rates from the pax rate cards. That's what this whole thread's been about. Congratulations.



Now that you have made your point, and no one is denying it or even cares that they decoupled the % from the rate card, how do feel? Do you feel better now arguing a point that most drivers don't care about based on the responses of this thread?

It's a dead issue... time to move on to the next gripe.


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Wild Bill Yahoo said:


> Now that you have made your point, and no one is denying it or even cares that they decoupled the % from the rate card, how do feel? Do you feel better now arguing a point that most drivers don't care about based on the responses of this thread?
> 
> It's a dead issue... time to move on to the next gripe.


You are dreaming . Considering past behavior , we will be listen about this til 2050.


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

UberPotomac said:


> You are dreaming . Considering past behavior , we will be listen about this til 2050.


But did you know though that driver pay is no longer coupled to rider prices?


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

The Gift of Fish said:


> Do you ever get the feeling that nobody's on your side?
> 
> View attachment 607327
> 
> ...


No, I don't have that feeling, and even if I did it wouldn't change my comments one iota.

You shot your mouth off so to speak the other day with your usual generic, fact free, and specific-free comments about how erroneous this thread is. I challenged you to list specifics in which I was in error, and you wussed out.

Now here you are talking trash.

You've got ZERO credibility.

Every point I've made on this thread stands. They're backed with facts including numbers. If you or anyone else doesn't like it, that's tough shit.


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Nats121 said:


> No, I don't have that feeling, and even if I did it wouldn't change my comments one iota.
> 
> You shot your mouth off so to speak the other day with your usual generic, fact free, and specific-free comments about how erroneous this thread is. I challenged you to list specifics in which I was in error, and you wussed out.
> 
> ...


Numbers ? What numbers ? You haven’t driven in years . You stuck 2017. There is no facts on your comments and you missing the point .The reality of driving fir UBER changed. Pay scheme is different to use to be. Whole different game . You still living in the past . We keep trying I tell you that you acting like , what did you call me ? “ stubborn fool “.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

UberPotomac said:


> Numbers ? What numbers ? You haven’t driven in years . You stuck 2017. There is no facts on your comments and you missing the point .The reality of driving fir UBER changed. Pay scheme is different to use to be. Whole different game . You still living in the past . We keep trying I tell you that you acting like , what did you call me ? “ stubborn fool “.


This is the present...

Here's the numbers...

2017 Pax Base/Default Rates... Base Fare $1.15 / Per Mile $1.02 / Per Minute $0.17 / Minimum Fare $5.00 / Cancellation Fee $5.00

2017 Driver Pay Rates... Base Fare $0.8625 (75%) / Per Mile $0.7650 (75%) / Per Minute $0.1275 (75%) / Minimum Fare $3.75 (75%) / Cancellation Fee $3.75 (75%)


2018 Pax Base/Default Rates... Base Fare $1.21 / Per Mile $1.08 / Per Minute $0.18/ Minimum Fare $5.00 / Cancellation Fee $5.00

2018 Driver Pay Rates...Base Fare $0.90 (75%) / Per Mile $0.81 (75%) / Per Minute $0.135 (75%) / Minimum Fare $ 3.75 (75%) / Cancellation Fee $3.75 (75%)


2019 Pax Base/Default Rates... Base Fare $1.21 / Per Mile $0.80 / Per Minute $0.30 / Minimum Fare $5.00 / Cancellation Fee ($5.00)

2019 Driver Pay Rates...Base Fare $0.90 (75%) / Per Mile $0.60 (75%) / Per Minute $0.225 (75%) / Minimum Fare $3.75 (75%) / Cancellation Fee $3.75 (75%)

2020 No change in rates

*2021 Pax Base/Default Rates*... Base Fare $1.30 / Per Mile $0.87 / Per Minute $0.33 / Minimum Fare $5.38 / Cancellation Fee $5.75

*2021 Driver Pay Rates*... Base Fare $0.90 (*69%*) / Per Mile $0.60 (*69%*) / Per Minute $0.225 (*68%*) / Minimum Fare $3.75 (*69.7%*) / Cancellation Fee $3.75 (*65.3%*)

As you can see, thru all of the changes up or down, the drivers were always paid *75%* of the base/default fares until 2021

This is a brand new screwing over which is different from the Upfront Pricing screwing over that's been taking place since 2017.


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Nats121 said:


> This is the present...
> 
> Here's the numbers...
> 
> ...


You keep repeating the same . No matter how many times you do it ,does not make factual . We haven’t been paid a percentage since 2017.
There is no correlation between what pax pays to what we get pay .Upfront pricing is calculated not only on miles and time . It depends on the route and distance . They may get charge for the longer route but UBER pays only mile and time.
Also when they make changes , the scheme changes . Uber will use the service fee to stuff all the inexplicable charges . Sometimes the driver pay may be 75% others may be 40% . We are in 2 different pay schemes . Man, you need professional help. Go out and drive and when you have a spreadsheet with a 100 trips , came back .I’ll prove you wrong .


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Show me where is your 75 % or even you 68%?
Some trips only pay close to 50% .
Others one 49% and others ones 70% . There is no correlation with pax price . Uber charge pax whatever and pay driver mile and time plus surge that is whatever they feel like .In addition, two drivers may get pay different rates .


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

UberPotomac said:


> Show me where is your 75 % or even you 68%?
> Some trips only pay close to 50% .
> Others one 49% and others ones 70% . There is no correlation with pax price . Uber charge pax whatever and pay driver mile and time plus surge that is whatever they feel like .In addition, two drivers may get pay different rates .


Take a look at the two screenshots I just did and you'll see the price for the ride on one and the default rates on the other.

Even though it's slow right now, Uber feels they can get away with charging surge rates because of the driver shortage.

Normally at this time of day during the weekend they would charge the default rates listed on the rate chart.

Before 2021, the drivers pay rates were set at 75% of the rates on the second screenshot. Now they're only around 68%. Uber raised the default rates but kept the drivers pay rates the same by lowering the "commission" from 75% to around 68%.

Notice too that there's no mention of surge even though they're charging the pax a whopping $14 to drive only a couple of blocks.


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## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Stop being stubborn . YOU DONT KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALIKING ABOUT .Still living in the past . We are telling you . Things changed . 
Your research is based on estimators that are just for play .Use real data . There is no correlation between pax pay and driver pay . It is call UPFRONT PRICING . . We do t get NO PERCENTAGE of anything . We get plain mile and time .
You are starting to be among annoying and stop embarrassing your yourself because you just want to be right .Get behind the wheel and get and make affirmations with REALDATA .


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## Wild Bill Yahoo (Jan 22, 2018)

Nats121 said:


> This is the present...
> 
> Here's the numbers...
> 
> ...



Again... you point out that Uber raised the base rates charged to riders and didn't pass along any of it to drivers.

As you can tell by the responses on this thread... NO ONE CARES as they understand the current business model. 

NEXT!!


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

Nats121 said:


> No, I don't have that feeling, and even if I did it wouldn't change my comments one iota.
> 
> You shot your mouth off so to speak the other day with your usual generic, fact free, and specific-free comments about how erroneous this thread is. I challenged you to list specifics in which I was in error, and you wussed out.
> 
> ...


🤣 Rage on, Mr. Angryman


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

UberPotomac said:


> There is no facts on your comments and you missing the point .





Wild Bill Yahoo said:


> As you can tell by the responses on this thread... NO ONE CARES as they understand the current business model.


Fellas, trying to engage this clown in any meaningful debate is an exercise in futility. 

As we see above, he'll argue that the sky is not blue until the end of time. I'm not sure if he's a troll or he really is that dim. Either way, he's not going to get it.


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