# New Contract as of 9/28/2016



## FlexZone (Aug 25, 2015)

Thought it would be a good idea to highlight some of the changes and quirks in the new contract. Discuss..


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## Shangsta (Aug 15, 2016)

It seemed fairly standard to me I think the major question left is how many times can you bring back unfinished deliveries after 4 hours before they deactivate you? I assume most people will not even take the risk.


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## GMan01 (Aug 6, 2016)

Shangsta said:


> It seemed fairly standard to me I think the major question left is how many times can you bring back unfinished deliveries after 4 hours before they deactivate you? I assume most people will not even take the risk.


And that's what they want


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## FlexZone (Aug 25, 2015)

I think if you at least attempt to deliver we'll be alright. If I get sent to the heart of Downtown Dallas area on a 4pm or later shift 80% of my packages get returned because of the main access areas of the buildings being closed or no available parking


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## GMan01 (Aug 6, 2016)

I'm also wondering if they are going to enact a load limit since we can't bring it back after 4 hrs


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## Shangsta (Aug 15, 2016)

GMan01 said:


> I'm also wondering if they are going to enact a load limit since we can't bring it back after 4 hrs


Lol, you know they would never do that.


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## GMan01 (Aug 6, 2016)

Also read they basically have control of your vehicle during blocks that makes it a Company car, meaning I'm an employee using a company car during block. Isn't this part of reason they got sued? Making Contractors feel like employees.


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## FlexZone (Aug 25, 2015)

Nope they want exclusive rights to your vehicle while carrying their customer parcels. I've seen actual Taxi's and ridesharing stickers on cars at our location in Dallas. They don't want you contracting other work while "working" for them. Same way Uber doesn't want you picking up a Lyft passenger at the same time you are carrying one of theirs


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## GMan01 (Aug 6, 2016)

FlexZone said:


> Nope they want exclusive rights to your vehicle while carrying their customer parcels. I've seen actual Taxi's and ridesharing stickers on cars at our location in Dallas. They don't want you contracting other work while "working" for them. Same way Uber doesn't want you picking up a Lyft passenger at the same time you are carrying one of theirs


I guess this is why I haven't seen any cabs @Coppell lately.


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## limepro (Mar 7, 2015)

I think the added reasons for termination is the largest change, not that they couldn't before but now it is in writing exactly what will get you deactivated.


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## flexology (Jan 28, 2016)

In the event of a dispute between a driver and Amazon, neither the driver nor Amazon can call a customer as a witness.


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## UberPasco (Oct 18, 2015)

Shangsta said:


> It seemed fairly standard to me I think the major question left is how many times can you bring back unfinished deliveries after 4 hours before they deactivate you? I assume most people will not even take the risk.


_Delivery not attempted or undeliverable packages not returned to Amazon timely. Amazon expects that you will deliver all the packages you picked up as part of your Delivery Block. In an instance where delivery is not possible, you are required to return all packages to the Amazon delivery station, unless otherwise directed by Amazon. If you repeatedly do not attempt to deliver all the packages you picked up during a Delivery Block or you do not return the undeliverable packages to a location specified by Amazon, you will no longer be eligible to participate in the Program.
_
Repeatedly means more than once. After that it is a roll of the dice. Also note that they don't give a timeframe for any of the parameters. It also says nothing about refusing packages that you feel would cause you to not be able to meet expectations.


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## limepro (Mar 7, 2015)

UberPasco said:


> _Delivery not attempted or undeliverable packages not returned to Amazon timely. Amazon expects that you will deliver all the packages you picked up as part of your Delivery Block. In an instance where delivery is not possible, you are required to return all packages to the Amazon delivery station, unless otherwise directed by Amazon. If you repeatedly do not attempt to deliver all the packages you picked up during a Delivery Block or you do not return the undeliverable packages to a location specified by Amazon, you will no longer be eligible to participate in the Program.
> _
> Repeatedly means more than once. After that it is a roll of the dice. Also note that they don't give a timeframe for any of the parameters. It also says nothing about refusing packages that you feel would cause you to not be able to meet expectations.


Repeatedly is normally 3 times in a set period either amount of packages, blocks or time frame. We don't know which but I am sure some will find out soon enough. I do prime now and it is well known by the warehouse staff when packages are just marked undeliverable because they are going to be late and every driver knows if you are late to many times you will be deactivated. Now this adds another layer for amazon to get rid of you and meet customer expectations, I know I have been close to being late a few times including today when I made my last delivery at 9:59 and the warehouse staff commented on how close I was or have called me 2 minutes prior to let me know they marked it delivered as they saw I was right next to the house.

For me if I am going to be late I would rather call the customer and let them know I am on my way, that if it shows delivered prior to me actually arriving not to worry. Then I can mark the package delivered on time and the people still get their package, this avoids a complaint call to amazon about me and them.


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## aeiou_- (Jul 5, 2015)

limepro said:


> Repeatedly is normally 3 times in a set period either amount of packages, blocks or time frame. We don't know which but I am sure some will find out soon enough. I do prime now and it is well known by the warehouse staff when packages are just marked undeliverable because they are going to be late and every driver knows if you are late to many times you will be deactivated. Now this adds another layer for amazon to get rid of you and meet customer expectations, I know I have been close to being late a few times including today when I made my last delivery at 9:59 and the warehouse staff commented on how close I was or have called me 2 minutes prior to let me know they marked it delivered as they saw I was right next to the house.
> 
> For me if I am going to be late I would rather call the customer and let them know I am on my way, that if it shows delivered prior to me actually arriving not to worry. Then I can mark the package delivered on time and the people still get their package, this avoids a complaint call to amazon about me and them.


I haven't used the app yet, waiting on background check confirmation. Buy wouldn't that place a timestamp on your gps location when you claimed to have delivered the package?


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## flexology (Jan 28, 2016)

aeiou_- said:


> I haven't used the app yet, waiting on background check confirmation. Buy wouldn't that place a timestamp on your gps location when you claimed to have delivered the package?


It would, but then again if you're the type of delivery guy who has the warehouse scanning packages in as "delivered" on your behalf because they are looking out for you and don't want you to be late, then chances are your gps location for the delivery won't matter. Neither will it likely matter that the customer would be receiving their packages outside of the agreed-upon delivery window.

In other words, "repeatedly" is if they just decide you're not worth keeping around or if they just don't like you for whatever reason, much like the clause about rude behavior.


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## UberPasco (Oct 18, 2015)

flexology said:


> It would, but then again if you're the type of delivery guy who has the warehouse scanning packages in as "delivered" on your behalf because they are looking out for you and don't want you to be late, then chances are your gps location for the delivery won't matter. Neither will it likely matter that the customer would be receiving their packages outside of the agreed-upon delivery window.


Believe me, it is not for the drivers benefit that they do this. (Not that we don't benefit greatly). I had them do this to me when they thought I'd be late. I knew I'd make it in time and was ticked because of the 'what ifs' associated with an attended delivery. Their answer was that they "couldn't take the chance" of another late delivery.


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## limepro (Mar 7, 2015)

flexology said:


> It would, but then again if you're the type of delivery guy who has the warehouse scanning packages in as "delivered" on your behalf because they are looking out for you and don't want you to be late, then chances are your gps location for the delivery won't matter. Neither will it likely matter that the customer would be receiving their packages outside of the agreed-upon delivery window.
> 
> In other words, "repeatedly" is if they just decide you're not worth keeping around or if they just don't like you for whatever reason, much like the clause about rude behavior.


Very true but for those that need it constantly, they have no business doing this job and need to be cut.


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## UTX1 (Dec 7, 2015)

Just last week, I had been thinking out loud about some of these same issues:

https://uberpeople.net/threads/amazon-prime-flex-delivery.37893/page-134#post-1510617

Well, looks like those and some other questions have been addressed or answered.

There are some 'catch-22's in there: one of the most notable is if packages are late,
means delivered after 21:00 hrs for same-day & dot.com, then you're up the creek.
If package is marked undeliverable because it's going to be late, then up the creek again
because it was picked up and wasn't delivered as agreed in the time window specified.

Which is better or worse ? A late package, or an undelivered package ?

As a customer, I can tell you if I order a same day for delivery by 9:00 pm and it's 9:05,
or even 9:02 and you've got my stuff and you deliver it at that time, it's cool with me.
Knowing what I know, I'd understand if it took until 9:30 or 10 o'clock some nites.

It is not cool with AMZN logistics or the Flex app. It will flash late at 9:00:00

You have to mark the package delivered by or before 20:59 hrs. Do not wait until 9.

SO I think late is worse. Driver doesn't want to deliver the package late. He's afraid to.
Fears it will lead to deactivation. But this could keep a customer from receiving their order
that they would otherwise expect to receive, even though the time is now 9:05.
At 8:55, the pack gets marked as cannot deliver because it will be "too late" .
Otherwise the driver gets an email stating he delivered a package late.
Wouldn't happen if a route consisting of 40 re-attempts wasn't held for dispatch
until at 6pm or was split according to density. (got one with 33 the other evening).

This is a reality. Sometimes it just doesn't work. The condition is being actively managed.
There is no remedy in place, other than to play games within the system. <----- current solution

Terms and the Contract have some other 'gotcha's, as well....


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## flexology (Jan 28, 2016)

limepro said:


> Very true but for those that need it constantly, they have no business doing this job and need to be cut.


Or once, if at all 

If anything, it sounds like the drivers marking 'undeliverable' to avoid lateness are being punished for their honesty. No doubt if they were aware that special coddling support from the warehouse were available to them, they'd change their ways - and keep their job - a win-win situation if I ever heard one.


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## limepro (Mar 7, 2015)

flexology said:


> Or once, if at all
> 
> If anything, it sounds like the drivers marking 'undeliverable' to avoid lateness are being punished for their honesty. No doubt if they were aware that special coddling support from the warehouse were available to them, they'd change their ways - and keep their job - a win-win situation if I ever heard one.


The problem is the ones with the problems have a pattern.

They wait outside the warehouse until 10-15 after the hour to avoid getting to many packages or none at all, just want to do bare minimum for $18/h.

When they get shifts in a row even if they are done early they will park somewhere and wait til after the hour to return, warehouse hates this as they will open the 1 hours thinking they have someone free on their way back when they in fact have a lazy driver.

Will consistently have late or undeliverable deliveries and never contact support once.

If you are a hard worker the warehouse will absolutely give you preferential treatment within their power, they can't assign you blocks but they can give you preferred routes or if you do happen to be late they can have your back, etc. Why would the warehouse want to help someone that does the bare minimum and usually screw that up to?


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## UTX1 (Dec 7, 2015)

flexology said:


> No doubt if they were aware that special coddling support from the warehouse were available to them,
> they'd change their ways - and keep their job - a win-win situation if I ever heard one.


Yes, we have an active "special driver" program where i'm at too ! 

It's not what some might think. One shift, you might take a few packs that are
guaranteed to be a pain in the ass. Knowing this upfront, you just drive around 
and make it look good. Next shift, you come back and whadaya know, it's Cadillac time.
Here's half a rack with maybe an hour to hour and a half of work. Coincidence ?


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## flexology (Jan 28, 2016)

limepro said:


> Will consistently have late or undeliverable deliveries and never contact support once. If you are a hard worker the warehouse will absolutely give you preferential treatment within their power


I think it's clear by now that "late" is dependent on the whims of the warehouse. That is the issue at hand here, the point we are discussing. As far as being a hard worker translating to preferential treatment, that may be true for your warehouse, but I don't think that's the case at mine. I hope there's nothing obvious I'm missing.


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## flexology (Jan 28, 2016)

New contract says you can't let other people use your "Program Account" or "Licensed Materials" including the Flex app. Assuming they enforce this (which should be trivially easy to do) that should free up a very large number of blocks.


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## limepro (Mar 7, 2015)

flexology said:


> I think it's clear by now that "late" is dependent on the whims of the warehouse. That is the issue at hand here, the point we are discussing. As far as being a hard worker translating to preferential treatment, that may be true for your warehouse, but I don't think that's the case at mine. I hope there's nothing obvious I'm missing.


I do Prime Now so late is a very dark line, left side you made it, to the right of that line you are delivering late.


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