# Self-Driving Cars



## Scott Thatcher (Jul 8, 2017)

Is anyone of us seriously worried about this? I would always pick a human driver over a non-human driver. Think of an airplane, would you rather have a pilot or a computer flying it. I don't see this as any threat to Uber/Lyft at all


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## grabby (Nov 5, 2017)

I am not concerned over it, as I expect I will be long dead before this is common in the state where I live.


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## Drivincrazy (Feb 14, 2016)

They will be too slow. Maybe take a ride for novelty sake, but I have no interest sitting in traffic about 30-40% longer.


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## Cableguynoe (Feb 14, 2017)

Scott Thatcher said:


> Is anyone of us seriously worried about this?


Even if this happens sooner than we think, no one should be seriously worried about it.
For those that this is your only source of income, there is enough time to start looking for something else. No one will be blindsided by this.


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## afsmart (Mar 16, 2018)

This type of service is here but we have many hurdles to climb over before it to be at our door step today. Legislation has to be written (i.e. the drones) changed from the Congress to the General Assembly. Law Enforcement will have to adapt to policing this new tech. Cities, Towns, Villages and Communities will have to be re-engineered for the operation of this service. The Population on a large scale will have to be educated to the new service and embrace it like it has done ride sharing. I must say the work we do driving is providing analytical data for drive-less commuting in dense populated areas.


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

Scott Thatcher said:


> Is anyone of us seriously worried about this? I would always pick a human driver over a non-human driver. Think of an airplane, would you rather have a pilot or a computer flying it. I don't see this as any threat to Uber/Lyft at all


Do you not realize modern airplanes are under autopilot most of a flight?


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## Rakos (Sep 2, 2014)

ShinyAndChrome said:


> Do you not realize modern airplanes are under autopilot most of a flight?


What....????

I thought monkeys...

Were flyin them planes...8>O

Rakos


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## IERide (Jul 1, 2016)

Let’s pretend that self driving cars were “ready to go” next week (in reality, it will be years, but play along).. 
So, here is what Uber needs to do:
1) Purchase 100’s of thousands, if not millions of these cars, at $20k-$50k each.. or, maybe they’ll lease them, but it’s still a lot of money
2) Pay for insurance for every one of those cars
3) Pay for fuel for every one of those cars
4) Hire a fleet of 10’s of thousands of employees to keep the cars clean (or, contract someone to do it)
5) Hire another fleet of 10’s of thousands of employees to maintain and repair the cars (or, contract someone to do it)
6) after 3-4 years, throw all the cars away or sell them as scrap, and buy millions more

Now - do you think Uber would rather do all of that, and spend all that money, or, just pay you $1.01 per mile to drive people around?

This whole “self driving cars replacing Uber drivers” is nothing more than a farce to fool investors into dumping more cash into Uber to keep it afloat..


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## 1974toyota (Jan 5, 2018)

IERide said:


> Let's pretend that self driving cars were "ready to go" next week (in reality, it will be years, but play along)..
> So, here is what Uber needs to do:
> 1) Purchase 100's of thousands, if not millions of these cars, at $20k-$50k each.. or, maybe they'll lease them, but it's still a lot of money
> 2) Pay for insurance for every one of those cars
> ...


BINGO


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## Pawtism (Aug 22, 2017)

Scott Thatcher said:


> Is anyone of us seriously worried about this? I would always pick a human driver over a non-human driver. Think of an airplane, would you rather have a pilot or a computer flying it. I don't see this as any threat to Uber/Lyft at all





ShinyAndChrome said:


> Do you not realize modern airplanes are under autopilot most of a flight?


In fact, autopilot does most of the landings automatically now too, only the take off is still primary human controlled. Of course human pilots ("safety pilots" ) are there in case there is a hiccup, but 98%+ of the flight (including most landings), are automated. In fact from about 20,000 feet up (it can be turned on at 1,000 feet but usually they wait a bit and hand fly it up) until all wheels are on the ground (often until it's ready to come off the runway and onto a taxiway).. A computer is your pilot (has been for many years now).

"On the 737 that I currently fly we have a two autopilot system that can control almost all aspects of the airplane's movement and an autothrottle system that is able to fully control the speed of the airplane. The autopilot can be turned on at 1,000 feet above the ground on takeoff. On landing, if the second autopilot is engaged concurrently with the first one, the airplane can actually land itself and will remain in control of the airplane until all three sets of wheels are on the ground. The second autopilot is engaged with the first one to add a layer of redundancy to the autopilot. Yes, the airplane can land itself and apply its own brakes, but it cannot track the runway centerline while it completes the landing roll. This means that the pilot must take over as soon as all three wheels are on the ground and guide the airplane down the runway as the speed decreases.

The 757 and 767 that I previously flew have autopilot systems that are similar to the 737 except they actually have three autopilots. Typically, only one autopilot is engaged at a time, but for low visibility approaches all three are engaged concurrently. When in the three autopilot mode the 757/767 can land by itself and come to a full stop on the runway centerline. This is especially useful in very low visibility situations like fog or snow where the pilots will have some difficulties seeing the runway markings or lights." - Paul Templeton - ATP's Regional Jet Program Director

Personally, I look forward to the day when all cars are self driving, it's been too long as it is.


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## Saltyoldman (Oct 18, 2016)

Rakos said:


> What....????
> 
> I thought monkeys...
> 
> ...


Have you ever been in a men's locker room?

Have you ever seen a grown man naked?


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## unadhesived (Jul 7, 2017)

The autopilot helps, but most aviation mishaps can be attributed to a failure of the autopilot system, and then a failure of the pilot to take over properly when autopilot fails. thankfully, most commercial pilots are trained regularly and have enough manual flight hours to make corrections when autopilot comes across a situation it is not programmed to handle.


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## Pawtism (Aug 22, 2017)

unadhesived said:


> The autopilot helps, but most aviation mishaps can be attributed to a failure of the autopilot system, and then a failure of the pilot to take over properly when autopilot fails. thankfully, most commercial pilots are trained regularly and have enough manual flight hours to make corrections when autopilot comes across a situation it is not programmed to handle.


Actually most aviation mishaps are due to (human) pilot error, with mechanical issues being a close second (autopilot systems are almost never the cause). As you say though, thankfully most (at least US) commercial pilots still have some hand flying skills (for when the autopilot does have to shut off). Sadly, that's becoming a lost art though, especially in countries outside the US/EU. There have been a number of accidents where the autopilot shut off (it's designed to shut off if there is a malfunction or mechanical issue, which is why it doesn't cause many accidents), but the human pilots had so little stick time (hand flying time) that they didn't react correctly. See? That's one of those misconceptions everyone always has (but few actually do the research to back it up, and just accept it as fact). Why is everyone so anti automated systems? They've been proven to be far safer and more reliable than human judgement. Do they still have issues from time to time, of course, and that's why they are still being improved. Have people just watched "Terminator" too many times and think their plane/car/fridge is going to go all "skynet" on them?

https://waltontelken.com/common-causes-aviation-accidents/

I'm a student pilot myself, not commercial jets or anything, small planes (like the Liberty XL2 which is a joy to fly, and has no automated systems yet). I do get to chat with commercial pilots (usually cargo pilots actually, fedex, etc) often and follow aviation very closely though.


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## SaintCl89 (May 21, 2017)

And then you were stuck in the middle lane with cars whizzing by at 70 mph.


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## Pawtism (Aug 22, 2017)

SaintCl89 said:


> View attachment 215934
> 
> And then you were stuck in the middle lane with cars whizzing by at 70 mph.


LOL, well thankfully most automated systems are Linux based (and that's likely part of the reason hehe). While planes, just turn off the automatic systems and revert to human flight, most SDC (such as the Teslas) are actually designed to pull over and put on the hazzards when a fault is detected. Of course if there is a "safety human" p), they would stop pulling over if the human takes over. They even have a sensor in the steering wheel so that if the driver falls asleep, they will pull over too (although there are videos of people defeating this feature with an orange.. yup, an orange.. YouTube it ).


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## SaintCl89 (May 21, 2017)

Honestly, I’m not worried about it. If they want self driving cars. Awesome. Knock yourself out. But they’ll realize real soon after that maintaining a fleet of vehicles and cleaning these vehicles of vomit and piss and all sorts of wonderful things isn’t worth it. Perhaps they should just pay their drivers more. But hey, what do I know.


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## Pawtism (Aug 22, 2017)

SaintCl89 said:


> Honestly, I'm not worried about it. If they want self driving cars. Awesome. Knock yourself out. But they'll realize real soon after that maintaining a fleet of vehicles and cleaning these vehicles of vomit and piss and all sorts of wonderful things isn't worth it. Perhaps they should just pay their drivers more. But hey, what do I know.


Agreed, they really haven't thought it through.


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## Flier5425 (Jun 2, 2016)

How are these SDC's going to deal with unaccompanied minors and children needing a car seat/booster?


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## SaintCl89 (May 21, 2017)

It’s just so they can say, “we did it!!!! We beat all of you!!!” Then the nonsense will begin. Who is to say someone doesn’t jump in the drivers seat and try to take over the car? Or vandalize the car. But in all seriousness. Who cares. It’s their venture. Let them have their fun, but pay me a fair wage in the meantime.


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## Wonkytonk (Jan 28, 2018)

IERide said:


> Let's pretend that self driving cars were "ready to go" next week (in reality, it will be years, but play along)..
> So, here is what Uber needs to do:
> 1) Purchase 100's of thousands, if not millions of these cars, at $20k-$50k each.. or, maybe they'll lease them, but it's still a lot of money
> 2) Pay for insurance for every one of those cars
> ...


I'm pretty sure they have actuaries, and plenty of analysts on many fronts who've already reviewed this and concluded the same.

My thinking is they aren't, and probably never were looking to accept those costs. What I suspect is that Uber/Lyft both are planning on having a second party absorb the majority of the costs as they're currently doing with their drivers.

What I mean is I suspect they're planning on pushing their services to auto manufacturers of autonomous vehicles first, but I suspect that might not work, and I also suspect their second step will be to push the benefits of autonomous vehicle ownership on private partners "independent contractors" and have those contractors provide all cost related services related to providing a ride as they currently are with current drivers. Plenty of drivers have been burned by uber on this before so I'm thinking they'll rely on new drivers.

Since owners won't be drivers they'll allow each and every highly profitable short ride for uber/lyft. Those contractors will be responsible for all maintenance, monitoring, legal, and cleaning costs, and 24 hour vehicle monitoring costs won't be cheap, and if anything happens those contractors can expect the same level of "support" current riders "experience" from uber.

Any way you look at it it's not much if any win for autonomous vehicle owners, and really who the hell would rush out and buy an autonomous vehicle to put in either uber, or lyft's service under the current terms of service they're demanding especially given the way uber screwed over so many many many drivers who purchased vehicles in the past.


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## IERide (Jul 1, 2016)

https://uberpeople.net/threads/here...placed-by-self-driving-cars-read-this.249039/


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

I am scared of AI killing us, not kidding.

But self driving cars will be great.

I do see issues with uber making them work financially, though maybe in certain markets they could be cheaper.


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## Wonkytonk (Jan 28, 2018)

SaintCl89 said:


> Honestly, I'm not worried about it. If they want self driving cars. Awesome. Knock yourself out.


Yeah, same here. I'm not particularly worried about it.


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