# The how much should you get paid game, Lets play Ubermath!!



## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

Hi Boys and Girls,

With the Winter Guarantees going on I thought it might be fun to play a little game. I will give you a scenario and you guess how much the driver got paid (net). After much going back and forth with a csr I have figured out how to come up with the answer, will share once you've all had a little fun. 

Show all work for full credit ;-) 

A driver is working one day during non-peak hours where the gross fare guarantee is $12.00 an hour.
The driver has the following happen:

Go online at 1:00PM
Get $6.00 ride at 1:10PM
Get $6.00 ride at 2:10PM
Get $17.00 ride at 3:05PM
Go Offline at 3:30PM
Go online at 4:00 PM
Get $6.00 ride at 4:10PM
Go offline at 5:00PM

What should the drivers gross and net be?


----------



## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

$36.00


----------



## The Kid (Dec 10, 2014)

3 hours guarantee $36.00
no guarantee hr 3 $17.00
___________________
Gross ....$53.00

Net......$39.20

Profit after all cost and depreciation... Maybe $10

UBER ON ! but, only during peak guarantees of $25 hour or more.

PS, Never in my life did I even imagine you could find Tens of Thousands of Americans to take such risk for so little.


----------



## Bigg Will (Jan 14, 2015)

Here's my best stab at the verbiage you received (the less than 3 hour number is just a guess):

Winter Warm Up Non-Peak Hours February [x] Payments ---> Congrats, our log shows that you were online for 2.89 hours and grossed $12.11 per hour in gross fares. Since you grossed more than $12 per hour, you will not receive any additional payment. Uber On!

As far as I can tell, Uber does not calculate the guaranteed fare by the hour. So, you don't have to log in at 1pm sharp and log out at 2pm sharp for that 56-60 minutes to count toward your total payout. Plus, the app does log you out briefly to drop off PAX, does it not? So it's impossible to clock 60 minutes straight. Am I wrong?


----------



## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

The Kid said:


> 3 hours guarantee $36.00
> no guarantee hr 3 $17.00
> ___________________
> Gross ....$53.00
> ...


The Kid: You are on the money for what I THOUGHT it would be but alas in Uber Math Land you are incorrect. Keep playing folks!

Bigg Will, I don't think the app logs you off as long as you provide feedback and submit within a reasonable time (a minute or so). As to whether it's by the hour or not, I still can't tell you but yes I know the answer to this problem). What's amazing is that a billion dollar corporation can't take the time to clearly communicate.


----------



## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

OK, here goes, straight from the horses mouth, an Uber csr.:



Disgusted Driver said:


> Go online at 1:00PM
> Get $6.00 ride at 1:10PM
> Get $6.00 ride at 2:10PM
> Get $17.00 ride at 3:05PM
> ...


You were online 3.5 hours. Take the fares earned, 35.00 /3.5 hours to get $10.00 per hour average, top up $2.00 per hour * 3.5 to get 7.00 top up.

Gross = $42.00 - 4 trips* 1.00 SRF - 7.60 (Uber's 20%) = $30.40

Whereas the kid and I were expecting to receive $39.20

What I have been told is that if you worked 25 minutes or more during the hour they counted the minutes worked. I assume this means they didn't give you credit for a full hour if you worked 54 minutes of an hour either. Whatever the case, this is BS. The 50 minute per hour rule was simply put in there to keep you from driving for Lyft, it is not being enforced. Some people will benefit from the way this is calculated, others will lose such as myself because I actually took the time and trouble to read, understand and follow the rules as they could best help me. They refuse to pay me the funds I am owed nor would they show me my time records so I'm going to war. I believe what they are doing is illegal and I plan on fighting it. Tired of playing the victim.


----------



## UberHammer (Dec 5, 2014)

$35 in total fares divided by 3.5 total hours equals $10 average per hour
$12 guarantee rate minus $10 average per hour equals $2 MISC per hour
$2 MISC per hour times 3.5 hours equals $7 times 80% = $5.60 total MISC
Drivers earnings is $35 in total fares minus $4 in safe riders fees ($31) times 80% equals $24.80
Drivers earnings of $24.80 plus $5.60 in total MISC equals $30.40

Drivers check would be $30.40


----------



## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

UberHammer said:


> $35 in total fares divided by 3.5 total hours equals $10 average per hour
> $12 guarantee rate minus $10 average per hour equals $2 MISC per hour
> $2 MISC per hour times 3.5 hours equals $7 total MISC
> Drivers earnings is $35 in total fares minus $4 in safe riders fees ($31) times 80% equals $24.80
> ...


Close but the MISC is gross not net, gets added to the $35. to get 42.00 then SRF and 20% taken out as I outlined above. It's $30.40 BUT why is it 3.5 hours when they say you need to drive 50 minutes for the hour to count.

What I'm surprised at is that no one seems to be to concerned or pissed about this. Perhaps we are all just used to getting beaten down. I'm royally pissed that as a good rat, I figured out the best way to run the maze and get the most pellets I could and they are simply saying screw you, we are going to give you whatever the f we want to.


----------



## UberHammer (Dec 5, 2014)

Disgusted Driver said:


> Close but the MISC is gross not net, gets added to the $35. to get 42.00 then SRF and 20% taken out as I outlined above. It's $30.40 BUT why is it 3.5 hours when they say you need to drive 50 minutes for the hour to count.
> 
> What I'm surprised at is that no one seems to be to concerned or pissed about this. Perhaps we are all just used to getting beaten down. I'm royally pissed that as a good rat, I figured out the best way to run the maze and get the most pellets I could and they are simply saying screw you, we are going to give you whatever the f we want to.


I forgot to take Ubers 20% out of the $7 Misc. I've edited it, and it comes to $30.40.

As for why Uber says what it says... I don't know. Uber lies about a TON of shit. This is just one lie of many.


----------



## Bigg Will (Jan 14, 2015)

Why is the SRF being factored into the winter time guarantee payout? My statement shows the SRF as separate from the gross fare. I always sort of figured it was a $1 charge that only the customer saw.

Last week for example, my gross was $367 (fare + surge). The SRF was added and immediately subtracted, as though it had hit the PAX apart from my numbers. Then 80% of that equaled my payout: $293.60.

If the SRF is subtracted the way you showed it, then did I not see $49 subtracted from my earnings? I'm sorry to take it back to Uber 101, but I'm new.

TRIP EARNINGS$293.57
>
Fare
362.80
>
Surge
4.20
>
Rider Fee (payment)
49.00
>
Rider Fee (deduction)
(49.00)
>
Uber Fee
(73.43)


----------



## UberAZ (Feb 1, 2015)

Good grief, we don't have any of these guarantees or other nonsense in Arizona. You'd have to be a New York attorney to figure all that crap out. Forget it - Pay us fairly and knock off the stupid 'incentives' that only reward Uber.


----------



## The Kid (Dec 10, 2014)

UberAZ said:


> Good grief, we don't have any of these guarantees or other nonsense in Arizona. You'd have to be a New York attorney to figure all that crap out. Forget it - Pay us fairly and knock off the stupid 'incentives' that only reward Uber.


Bite your tongue. I love playing the Winter Guarantee Game. Hopping for short rides and hide. Will they ping me up here in the hills? Big Fun!


----------



## Kasra321 (Jan 26, 2015)

Disgusted Driver said:


> BUT why is it 3.5 hours when they say you need to drive 50 minutes for the hour to count.


I'm pretty sure they calculate your online hours by minutes. I drive for both Uber and Lyft at the same time, and I'm hardly ever online for one full hour on Uber (since I go offline as soon as I get a ping from Lyft.) However, my total online time was around 20hr in my last statement. If they wanted to count my whole hours online, I'd have none!

In fact, I think what they mean is every 50min is counted as an hour. In this example, 3.5_hrs_ (210_min_) should be counted as 4.2_hrs_(252_min_): (210/50)x60=252

4.2 x 12 = $50.4 --> Gross guaranteed income
35-4(safe ride) = $31 --> Actual gross income

Since your actual income is less than the guaranteed amount, they'll pay you according to the guaranteed.

$50.4 - 20% = $40.32 --> what your net earnings should be
$31 - 20% = $24.8 --> what you actually earned
40.32 - 24.8 = $15.52 --> the difference that Uber should compensate = Misc.

In your statement, it will appear as:

Trip earnings = $24.8
Miscellaneous = $15.52
Total Payout = $40.32

I hope it helps,
Kasra


----------



## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

Kasra321 said:


> I'm pretty sure they calculate your online hours by minutes. I drive for both Uber and Lyft at the same time, and I'm hardly ever online for one full hour on Uber (since I go offline as soon as I get a ping from Lyft.) However, my total online time was around 20hr in my last statement. If they wanted to count my whole hours online, I'd have none!
> 
> In fact, I think what they mean is every 50min is counted as an hour. In this example, 3.5_hrs_ (210_min_) should be counted as 4.2_hrs_(252_min_): (210/50)x60=252
> 
> ...


Kasra,

The problem is that what you think they mean and what they do mean is two completely different things. This is a billion dollar company and no one can agree on what their email meant. That's BS. My calculation above is the "fact", that's what they are actually paying ($30.40) . The Kid and I came up with the same number for what it should be (39.20). The 50 minutes per hour thing is complete CRAP. They put that in there just to get people not to drive for both lyft and uber at the same time. They are counting by the minute but they are not counting a 50 minute hour, the hour is 60 minutes and if you are offline for 6 of those minutes you only get credit for .9 hours etc... So in your case this worked out well for you since you weren't online for 50 minutes of any hour. According to their stated rules you shouldn't have gotten any bonus for hours where you worked less than 50 minutes.


----------



## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

The Kid said:


> 3 hours guarantee $36.00
> no guarantee hr 3 $17.00
> ___________________
> Gross ....$53.00
> ...


Artificial intelligence is on the horizon. It'll only get worse. Although 20th century ppl like elevator operators and gas station attendants survived, it was a smaller, slower wave of tech introductions.

The hololense accompanied by AI will give any 1¢/hr 3rd world worker global opportunity. 
With AI and google translate, all will speak fluent English.

45% of all jobs will disappear within the next decade. Only engineers will survive until 2030, at that point 99% of all jobs will disappear. Designer babies will change the species entirely. The billionaire class will be the new dominant and lucky regular humans will be lucky to be their pets.

The rest of us will likely be gassed.


----------



## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

Bigg Will said:


> Why is the SRF being factored into the winter time guarantee payout? My statement shows the SRF as separate from the gross fare. I always sort of figured it was a $1 charge that only the customer saw.
> 
> Last week for example, my gross was $367 (fare + surge). The SRF was added and immediately subtracted, as though it had hit the PAX apart from my numbers. Then 80% of that equaled my payout: $293.60.
> 
> ...


Bigg Will: Again, another ambiguity from a billion dollar company that is incapable of communicating clearly. The SRF is included in the fare you see on your driver app when you finish a call (if you wait for it to come up). But it's misleading because they use the word fare in the guarantee differently from the word fare in your statement. You are correct that fare in the statement is w/o the SRF whereas the "gross fare" includes it which they are using to calculate it from. This would make great fodder for a class action but I'm getting to old for this.


----------

