# Personal Miles Mileage Log



## kingmartin06 (May 17, 2016)

Do you keep track of your personal miles each day in your mileage log as well as business mileage? Or do you just record the odometer reading at the beginning of the year and again at the end of the year and only keep a mileage log of business miles and trips and then come up with the difference?


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

I record my mileage at the beginning of the year and at the end of the year in my mileage log. I record my business mileage by trip in my mileage log. At the end of the year I can easily calculate percentage of personal & business.


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

FLKeys said:


> I record my mileage at the beginning of the year and at the end of the year in my mileage log. I record my business mileage by trip in my mileage log. At the end of the year I can easily calculate percentage of personal & business.


Mileage from dead miles can be recorded as a trip also. start would be location you drop pax off and end would be your next pickup location. So the log will have alternating trips, with and without pax.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

UberTaxPro said:


> Mileage from dead miles can be recorded as a trip also. start would be location you drop pax off and end would be your next pickup location. So the log will have alternating trips, with and without pax.


Correct my log has entries for each destination regardless of having a passenger or not. I make notes on each entry like "Drive to Pick-up" "Uber Pick-up" "Lyft Pick-up" "Relocate looking for rides" etc.


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## jaystonepk (Oct 30, 2017)

Start car, go online, start mileage tracking, followed later by, pull in garage, go offline, end mileage tracking. Everything in between is deductible miles as I'm driving for work. You don't need to have a ride arranged to count as deductible miles.

Disclaimer: I am not a tax accountant. For professional services, contact a local tax attorney.


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

jaystonepk said:


> Start car, go online, start mileage tracking, followed later by, pull in garage, go offline, end mileage tracking. Everything in between is deductible miles as I'm driving for work. You don't need to have a ride arranged to count as deductible miles.
> 
> Disclaimer: I am not a tax accountant. For professional services, contact a local tax attorney.


You're right, as long as you don't get audited!


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## Skinny1 (Sep 24, 2015)

UberTaxPro said:


> You're right, as long as you don't get audited!


If you have not been as precise as the few posting above, would the irs really disallow all miles based on that technicality?

Those rules were in place before rideshare existed. Say they refused that basic log (start stop no listing of each and every drop), could it be feasible the mileage app you used or paid Uber miles would be accepted as Business miles...after all how would you have earned the income in the first place?

Sure you may lose dead miles but I'm saying worst case scenario, your miles on app would be accepted... it would make no sense if not.


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## daave1 (Oct 24, 2017)

All miles driven while you are "on the clock" with Uber or Lyft are deductible. If you log out to drive to McDonald's for lunch, those miles are not deductible. Download an app such as Hurdlr and track your miles automatically whenever you log in and out of Uber. When you go online with Uber, start your mileage tracking on Hurdlr. Whenever you logout of Uber, stop the mileage tracking on Hurdlr, it's that simple. At the end of the year, you can send your mileage report in Excel format directly to your email. You can also track the myriad of other expenses and take pictures of your receipts through that app as well!


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## islanddriver (Apr 6, 2018)

Does anyone know if stride tax or one of those apps that track miles is tax compliant. Ido it on paper myself but I would love something easyer


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## kingmartin06 (May 17, 2016)

About the Beginning odometer and End of Year odometer, I started close to the middle of the year in May, so yeah of course I don't know my Beginning Odometer starting from January 2018, hmm.


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## islanddriver (Apr 6, 2018)

Did you have any services in December or January you could use the machine mileage from them


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## kingmartin06 (May 17, 2016)

Unfortunately, no I did not, I wasn't expecting to be taken by the Uber Train lol.


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## islanddriver (Apr 6, 2018)

Then I would guess . I started about 7 months ago and I'm at about 50% , 50% business personal


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

Skinny1 said:


> If you have not been as precise as the few posting above, would the irs really disallow all miles based on that technicality?
> 
> Those rules were in place before rideshare existed. Say they refused that basic log (start stop no listing of each and every drop), could it be feasible the mileage app you used or paid Uber miles would be accepted as Business miles...after all how would you have earned the income in the first place?
> 
> Sure you may lose dead miles but I'm saying worst case scenario, your miles on app would be accepted... it would make no sense if not.


From my experience the IRS is not out to disallow miles based on technicalities. Yes, most of the laws and regulations about vehicle expenses have been on the books before ride-share existed. I wouldn't expect any change in tax laws or regulations due to the new ride-share business model. From a tax perspective ride-share as a business is not that different from other transportation businesses that have been operating for many years, the taxi business being the most obvious comparison. The IRS expects all businesses to follow the tax code and regulations. Anything short of that is not necessarily a "technicality".

If your mileage log is rejected by the IRS you'd be given a chance to come up with a re-constructed log. Your uber miles would not be accepted by themselves, they would have to be incorporated into your re-constructed log. Same with your mileage app if it was non-compliant. Re-constructed logs are very difficult and time consuming. Most are rejected by the IRS. When you submit a contemporaneous mileage log you don't need supporting evidence. With a re-constructed log you have to submit supporting evidence (proof) for every item in the re-constructed log. So yes, you could use your uber records and non compliant mileage app as evidence for your re-constructed log, but without the log and/or your testimony they are useless.

Under the law you can attempt to use your own testimony and other evidence to substantiate expenses if you don't have the proper bookkeeping (log). However, also under the law, the IRS can reject your evidence if it doesn't equal the reliability of a contemporaneously kept mileage log and that is what almost always happens.

The tax court has been very consistent on vehicle expense substantiation. Here are just a few example cases:

https://ustaxcourt.gov/UstcInOp/OpinionViewer.aspx?ID=11622

https://www.ustaxcourt.gov/UstcInOp/OpinionViewer.aspx?ID=11628

https://ustaxcourt.gov/UstcInOp/OpinionViewer.aspx?ID=11357


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## Skinny1 (Sep 24, 2015)

UberTaxPro said:


> From my experience the IRS is not out to disallow miles based on technicalities. Yes, most of the laws and regulations about vehicle expenses have been on the books before ride-share existed. I wouldn't expect any change in tax laws or regulations due to the new ride-share business model. From a tax perspective ride-share as a business is not that different from other transportation businesses that have been operating for many years, the taxi business being the most obvious comparison. The IRS expects all businesses to follow the tax code and regulations. Anything short of that is not necessarily a "technicality".
> 
> If your mileage log is rejected by the IRS you'd be given a chance to come up with a re-constructed log. Your uber miles would not be accepted by themselves, they would have to be incorporated into your re-constructed log. Same with your mileage app if it was non-compliant. Re-constructed logs are very difficult and time consuming. Most are rejected by the IRS. When you submit a contemporaneous mileage log you don't need supporting evidence. With a re-constructed log you have to submit supporting evidence (proof) for every item in the re-constructed log. So yes, you could use your uber records and non compliant mileage app as evidence for your re-constructed log, but without the log and/or your testimony they are useless.
> 
> ...


We will just have to wait and reserve judgement. I have yet to see any case you posted that referred to "driving" as the main business. Taxi, Trucking etc . These guys all do something else and are trying to claim high $ driving expenses.

We have not had a report on any forum that i know of where IRS denied a driver any and all mileage expenses due to log or lack of detail.

Time will tell....

But you are if great help and are posting what you know so thanks.


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

Skinny1 said:


> We will just have to wait and reserve judgement. I have yet to see any case you posted that referred to "driving" as the main business. Taxi, Trucking etc . These guys all do something else and are trying to claim high $ driving expenses.
> 
> We have not had a report on any forum that i know of where IRS denied a driver any and all mileage expenses due to log or lack of detail.
> 
> ...


Car expenses are treated the same under the tax code whatever your main line of business is. But your point about not finding a case involving a professional driver is correct.... I'll see if I can find one for you. In the meantime here's one involving a CPA and his mileage going to see clients. The CPA operates under the same tax code and regulations as ride-share drivers.
https://www.cpapracticeadvisor.com/news/12258234/cpa-loses-business-car-deductions-in-tax-court-case



Skinny1 said:


> We will just have to wait and reserve judgement. I have yet to see any case you posted that referred to "driving" as the main business. Taxi, Trucking etc . These guys all do something else and are trying to claim high $ driving expenses.
> 
> We have not had a report on any forum that i know of where IRS denied a driver any and all mileage expenses due to log or lack of detail.
> 
> ...


Ok here's a tax court case involving an Uber driver with basically no records. The Court did allow evidence kept by uber but nothing else. This is a fairly new case Oct 2018 so now we have precedent to argue that uber's mileage records will be accepted. Very interesting....thank you for motivating me to check this out! He still would have been much better off with a good mileage log however! 
https://www.ustaxcourt.gov/ustcinop/opinionviewer.aspx?ID=11787


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## Skinny1 (Sep 24, 2015)

UberTaxPro said:


> Car expenses are treated the same under the tax code whatever your main line of business is. But your point about not finding a case involving a professional driver is correct.... I'll see if I can find one for you. In the meantime here's one involving a CPA and his mileage going to see clients. The CPA operates under the same tax code and regulations as ride-share drivers.
> https://www.cpapracticeadvisor.com/news/12258234/cpa-loses-business-car-deductions-in-tax-court-case
> 
> Ok here's a tax court case involving an Uber driver with basically no records.
> https://www.ustaxcourt.gov/ustcinop/opinionviewer.aspx?ID=11787


Nice find..... some of these idiots really press on the expenses. $6k for travel?

Also note the IRS did allow for the miles driven on Uber to go ahead and be claimed , the 9,500 they had on record with no other supporting documentation. This guy claimed 40k+ miles and way more expenses than Uber showed..... wonder why the audit?

That at least is promising for those of us not writing every stop and address during a shift.
To me it is unreasonable on a busy night shift in the dark where rides are accepted before a ride is finished to stop, make other customers wait while i jot down an address and other details.

Just is not going to happen for me. Its an impedement to business where time, is of the essence for customer satisfaction and driver rating. Your job depends on it!

Good post and find.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

Skinny1 said:


> We will just have to wait and reserve judgement. I have yet to see any case you posted that referred to "driving" as the main business. Taxi, Trucking etc . These guys all do something else and are trying to claim high $ driving expenses.
> 
> We have not had a report on any forum that i know of where IRS denied a driver any and all mileage expenses due to log or lack of detail.
> 
> ...


In another post on this subject I said I would continue keeping detailed mileage logs until I see a determination stating otherwise from the IRS. In my opinion your approach of not keeping one until there is a determination from the IRS could be very costly.

Yes it is a pain to keep detailed logs, but hey pretty much every job I ever had involved things that were a pain to do.

If you are in a busy market that could make keeping written record as you work difficult, get a voice recorder and record your mileage,destination, and other details as the day goes on and then transfer that into a log at the end of the day or as you have down time.


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

Skinny1 said:


> Nice find..... some of these idiots really press on the expenses. $6k for travel?
> 
> Also note the IRS did allow for the miles driven on Uber to go ahead and be claimed , the 9,500 they had on record with no other supporting documentation. This guy claimed 40k+ miles and way more expenses than Uber showed..... wonder why the audit?
> 
> ...


I edited the post a bit after you wrote this. Thanks again!


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## Skinny1 (Sep 24, 2015)

FLKeys said:


> In another post on this subject I said I would continue keeping detailed mileage logs until I see a determination stating otherwise from the IRS. In my opinion your approach of not keeping one until there is a determination from the IRS could be very costly.
> 
> Yes it is a pain to keep detailed logs, but hey pretty much every job I ever had involved things that were a pain to do.
> 
> If you are in a busy market that could make keeping written record as you work difficult, get a voice recorder and record your mileage,destination, and other details as the day goes on and then transfer that into a log at the end of the day or as you have down time.


I just looked at my Mile IQ report and although it does not list every address you pick up and stopped at, it shows start and stop details. I also keep a manual spreadsheet log.

One could make the case my business shift started in X city at X miles, and ended in X city X miles @ X time.

Its all there listed. Now feel free to cross reference this with Uber Miles reported.

To me that is more than reasonable we will agree to disagree on the details of every pickup and drop off address. I wil not be going down that path.


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

Skinny1 said:


> Nice find..... some of these idiots really press on the expenses. $6k for travel?
> 
> Also note the IRS did allow for the miles driven on Uber to go ahead and be claimed , the 9,500 they had on record with no other supporting documentation. This guy claimed 40k+ miles and way more expenses than Uber showed..... wonder why the audit?
> 
> ...


So the judge rightly determined that the uber records equaled the reliability of a contemporaneously kept mileage log! Watching tax law evolve....right here on uberpeople.net!!!
Trip Log used in manual mode makes a great mileage log. Basically you just start and stop the app every-time you pick up or drop off a pax. Doesn't take much time at all and your log will look like this with actual addresses in place of pick-up and drop-off

1. Home (start mileage app) Pick-up 1 (stop mileage app) Dead miles
2. Pick-up 1 (start mileage app) drop-off 1 (stop mileage app) Passenger miles
3. drop-off 1 (start mileage app) pick-up 2 (stop mileage app) Dead miles
4. pick-up 2 (start mileage app) drop-off 2 (stop mileage app) Passenger miles
5. drop-off 2(start mileage app) pick-up 3 (stop mileage app) Dead miles
6. pick-up 3 (start mileage app) drop-off 3 (stop mileage app) Passenger miles
7. drop-off 3 (start mileage app) pick-up 4 (stop mileage app) Dead miles


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## Launchpad McQuack (Jan 8, 2019)

FLKeys said:


> If you are in a busy market that could make keeping written record as you work difficult, get a voice recorder and record your mileage,destination, and other details as the day goes on and then transfer that into a log at the end of the day or as you have down time.


This is what I started doing yesterday after reading some of the discussions on this forum. I carry an old smartphone (not connected to a carrier) that has a voice recorder app on it. It's basically the modern equivalent of one of those old minicassette recorders. Before I head out on my first run, I turn on recording and say, "Home, <<insert odometer reading>>" (since I know my home address I don't state the address). Then when I get to my first pickup location, I park, turn on recording and say, "<<insert restaurant name>>, <<insert address read from Uber app>>, <<insert odometer reading>>." Then I make the pickup and drive to the customer. When I get to the customer address, I park, turn on recording and say, "<<insert customer name>>, <<insert address read from Uber app>>, <<insert odometer reading>>." Then I make the delivery and repeat that process over and over until I get home. Then I turn on recording and say, "Home, <<insert odometer reading>>." Each recording is stored in an audio file with a date and time stamp. Every so often, I plan to transfer the files to my computer and enter them into a spreadsheet. The individual audio files are my contemporaneous record. The spreadsheet is reconstructed from the information in the audio files. The only problem I see with this is that there is no hard copy (which you would have with a written log), so you need to make sure you regularly back the files up in case the hard drive crashes.

I tried this method out last night. Each audio file takes about 10 seconds to record and it doesn't add a lot of hassle to the delivery process. It doesn't take very long for it to just become routine. Based on what I have read here, I would think it would be legitimate evidence. Any individual trip can be cross referenced against Uber's trip records, and they should match up pretty closely.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

Skinny1 said:


> I just looked at my Mile IQ report and although it does not list every address you pick up and stopped at, it shows start and stop details. I also keep a manual spreadsheet log.
> 
> One could make the case my business shift started in X city at X miles, and ended in X city X miles @ X time.
> 
> ...


I would not be comfortable keeping drop off and pick up addresses for obvious liability reasons.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

BigRedDriver said:


> I would not be comfortable keeping drop off and pick up addresses for obvious liability reasons.


What liability reasons? If you are not committing crimes you should have nothing to worry about. IRS regulations require mileage logs to have specific information and that includes addresses.


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## JohnnyBravo836 (Dec 5, 2018)

jaystonepk said:


> Start car, go online, start mileage tracking, followed later by, pull in garage, go offline, end mileage tracking. Everything in between is deductible miles as I'm driving for work. You don't need to have a ride arranged to count as deductible miles.
> 
> Disclaimer: I am not a tax accountant. For professional services, contact a local tax attorney.


This is the way I'm doing it, and I have to believe that it's sufficient. However, just using your odometer readings from the beginning and the end of the year invites trouble: unless you have a dedicated vehicle that you use for ridesharing and ridesharing _only_, you will clearly be trying to deduct miles that were from personal use, and that is going to raise red flags. But if you have a daily log that shows start and stop mileage for each time you worked, and not all the miles on the car are included in what you're claiming, you should be on quite solid ground.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

JohnnyBravo836 said:


> This is the way I'm doing it, and I have to believe that it's sufficient. However, just using your odometer readings from the beginning and the end of the year invites trouble: unless you have a dedicated vehicle that you use for ridesharing and ridesharing _only_, you will clearly be trying to deduct miles that were from personal use, and that is going to raise red flags. But if you have a daily log that shows start and stop mileage for each time you worked, and not all the miles on the car are included in what you're claiming, you should be on quite solid ground.


You record your beginning and ending year mileage to determine the percent of use between personal and business. Take your total for the year and deduct you business miles and calculate percent of usage. Some deductions are based on percent of use and some are actual miles driven for business.


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## JohnnyBravo836 (Dec 5, 2018)

FLKeys said:


> You record your beginning and ending year mileage to determine the percent of use between personal and business. Take your total for the year and deduct you business miles and calculate percent of usage. Some deductions are based on percent of use and some are actual miles driven for business.


If you don't record the mileage at the beginning and end of each work shift -- which obviously makes it possible to also calculate the personal mileage that is in between those work shifts -- I don't see how you are going to reliably and accurately calculate percentages of use. Anything else is going to be a rough, ball-park guess.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

FLKeys said:


> What liability reasons? If you are not committing crimes you should have nothing to worry about. IRS regulations require mileage logs to have specific information and that includes addresses.


Cool. I am not keeping the addresses of college girls in a log for obvious liability reasons. Those girls (and everyone else I give rides to) contract through one of the rideshare companies, not me. If the IRS or anyone else wants that information, Uber/Lyft can give it to them.


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## AuxCordBoston (Dec 3, 2016)

UberTaxPro said:


> Car expenses are treated the same under the tax code whatever your main line of business is. But your point about not finding a case involving a professional driver is correct.... I'll see if I can find one for you. In the meantime here's one involving a CPA and his mileage going to see clients. The CPA operates under the same tax code and regulations as ride-share drivers.
> https://www.cpapracticeadvisor.com/news/12258234/cpa-loses-business-car-deductions-in-tax-court-case
> 
> Ok here's a tax court case involving an Uber driver with basically no records. The Court did allow evidence kept by uber but nothing else. This is a fairly new case Oct 2018 so now we have precedent to argue that uber's mileage records will be accepted. Very interesting....thank you for motivating me to check this out! He still would have been much better off with a good mileage log however!
> https://www.ustaxcourt.gov/ustcinop/opinionviewer.aspx?ID=11787


The Uber tax case involves much more than just a mileage log. He put himself on IRS's radar by taking the other deductions.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

JohnnyBravo836 said:


> If you don't record the mileage at the beginning and end of each work shift -- which obviously makes it possible to also calculate the personal mileage that is in between those work shifts -- I don't see how you are going to reliably and accurately calculate percentages of use. Anything else is going to be a rough, ball-park guess.


If I record the mileage at the beginning and ending of each work shift, which I do, how can I use that number to calculate personal use?

Jan 4th start 26000 end 26500 total 500 miles
Jan 5th start 27000 end 27500 total 500 miles
Jan 8th start 29000 end 29500 total 500 miles

What percentage is personal and what percentage is business?



BigRedDriver said:


> Cool. I am not keeping the addresses of college girls in a log for obvious liability reasons. Those girls (and everyone else I give rides to) contract through one of the rideshare companies, not me. If the IRS or anyone else wants that information, Uber/Lyft can give it to them.


I guess I agree that I disagree with you. I see no obvious liability reasons. The only liability I see is the IRS saying I'm not able to deduct all my miles because my trip log was incomplete.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

FLKeys said:


> If I record the mileage at the beginning and ending of each work shift, which I do, how can I use that number to calculate personal use?
> 
> Jan 4th start 26000 end 26500 total 500 miles
> Jan 5th start 27000 end 27500 total 500 miles
> ...


I record the start of every business use of the car, then the end of every business use. And the date of course. It's all I claim for business miles.



FLKeys said:


> If I record the mileage at the beginning and ending of each work shift, which I do, how can I use that number to calculate personal use?
> 
> Jan 4th start 26000 end 26500 total 500 miles
> Jan 5th start 27000 end 27500 total 500 miles
> ...


The IRS has every right to ask the rideshare companies this information. Check your way bills, see if that information is available on them.

Reason?


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

BigRedDriver said:


> I record the start of every business use of the car, then the end of every business use. And the date of course. It's all I claim for business miles.


I understand that, however some car related expenses are deductible based on percentage of use of the car for personal and business use. If you are not claiming these deductions you are possibly missing out, if you do want to claim them you need the starting and ending mileage for the year to calculate percentage of use.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

FLKeys said:


> I understand that, however some care related expenses are deductible based on percentage of use of the car for personal and business use. If you are not claiming these deductions you are possibly missing out, if you do want to claim them you need the starting and ending mileage for the year to calculate percentage of use.


Hmmmmm, excellent point.

But I don't, although I do keep the receipts.

Another way to show I'm not trying to pull a fast one on the IRS. Under reporting applicable deductions.

And I also show a profit.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

BigRedDriver said:


> The IRS has every right to ask the rideshare companies this information. Check your way bills, see if that information is available on them.
> 
> Reason?


Waybill has the information for insurance purposes and for other reasons related to airports and sea ports.

It is not the IRS's job to verify your mileage, it is yours. Yes they could possibly request this information to try and disprove your records if they thought they were fake but I highly doubt they are going to request this to prove your logs are correct.

There are a lot of threads on mileage logs I have not seen a single determination from the IRS that a start and stop for beginning of day and end of day is compliant. The mileage publication clearly states what is required. Destinations are in that requirement.



BigRedDriver said:


> Hmmmmm, excellent point.
> 
> But I don't, although I do keep the receipts.
> 
> ...


Luckily I can show a taxable profit as well, however I make sure I can get every deduction I legally can. When you factor in income tax and SS & Med tax I'm paying at a minimum 30% + in taxes. I don't want to over pay.


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## JohnnyBravo836 (Dec 5, 2018)

FLKeys said:


> If I record the mileage at the beginning and ending of each work shift, which I do, how can I use that number to calculate personal use?
> 
> Jan 4th start 26000 end 26500 total 500 miles
> Jan 5th start 27000 end 27500 total 500 miles
> ...


This is precisely what I said I was doing, so I really don't know what you're taking issue with.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

FLKeys said:


> Waybill has the information for insurance purposes and for other reasons related to airports and sea ports.
> 
> It is not the IRS's job to verify your mileage, it is yours. Yes they could possibly request this information to try and disprove your records if they thought they were fake but I highly doubt they are going to request this to prove your logs are correct.
> 
> ...


So let me ask you this, because it is a topic that has also been hotly debated.

Dead miles. Those miles put in between drop off and next pick up.

While app on, looking for ping.

Deductible or not?


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## JohnnyBravo836 (Dec 5, 2018)

BigRedDriver said:


> So let me ask you this, because it is a topic that has also been hotly debated.
> 
> Dead miles. Those miles put in between drop off and next pick up.
> 
> ...


Obviously, a google search will bring up many pages which will say "yes" -- for example:

https://ttlc.intuit.com/questions/4...a-ride-request-are-those-miles-tax-deductible

Is this an official opinion from IRS? No, but it certainly appears that informed tax professionals regard them as deductible.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

JohnnyBravo836 said:


> Obviously, a google search will bring up many pages which will say "yes" -- for example:
> 
> https://ttlc.intuit.com/questions/4...a-ride-request-are-those-miles-tax-deductible
> 
> Is this an official opinion from IRS? No, but it certainly appears that informed tax professionals regard them as deductible.


OK, exactly how then are those miles to be logged?

Drive safe while taking notes?

See, we are not like other transportation companies.

Thank you.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

BigRedDriver said:


> So let me ask you this, because it is a topic that has also been hotly debated.
> 
> Dead miles. Those miles put in between drop off and next pick up.
> 
> ...


Yes they are deductible. You are still working and or looking for work. App on looking for work or driving to next pick-up miles are deductible. If you are not actively looking for work than they are not deductible.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

FLKeys said:


> Yes they are deductible. You are still working and or looking for work. App on looking for work or driving to next pick-up miles are deductible. If you are not actively looking for work than they are not deductible.


Thank you. Then all miles, either with rider, and backed up by waybills are deductible. And all miles looking, which are also therefore back up by waybills, unless otherwise noted in my mileage log (for example I turn off app to go pick up my grandson from school) are also deductible.

Thank you.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

JohnnyBravo836 said:


> This is precisely what I said I was doing, so I really don't know what you're taking issue with.


In your earlier post you said: which obviously makes it possible to also calculate the personal mileage that is in between those work shifts

My point is you can not accurately calculate personal use if you don't have the starting and ending mileage for the year meaning get up Jan 1st and record mileage record mileage on Dec 31st. Just having in between miles of shifts is not a full picture of percentage of use.

If I miss read the context of post #25 I apologize. I read it as you don't keep beginning and end of year mileage readings.


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## JohnnyBravo836 (Dec 5, 2018)

FLKeys said:


> In your earlier post you said: which obviously makes it possible to also calculate the personal mileage that is in between those work shifts
> 
> My point is you can not accurately calculate personal use if you don't have the starting and ending mileage for the year meaning get up Jan 1st and record mileage record mileage on Dec 31st. Just having in between miles of shifts is not a full picture of percentage of use.
> 
> If I miss read the context of post #25 I apologize. I read it as you don't keep beginning and end of year mileage readings.


I said "However, _just_ using your odometer readings from the beginning and the end of the year invites trouble". My point was obviously that you need more than _just those two_ numbers. Some people were suggesting that they intended to try and simply deduct all the vehicle miles for the entire year. I didn't say that you don't need the numbers for the beginning and end of the year. If you record start and stop numbers every day, then you obviously have those numbers too.


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

BigRedDriver said:


> OK, exactly how then are those miles to be logged?
> 
> Drive safe while taking notes?


You do it by voice recording into a voice recorder app. Drive and talk. Who can't handle that? I drive with a Bluetooth earpiece so I don't even have to hold the recorder/phone in one hand. Each entry takes about 5-7 seconds. Us those recordings to fill out a log book or spread sheet.

Entry: P1 > location > mileage
Entry: P2 > location > mileage
Entry: P3 > location > mileage
Entry: P1 > location > mileage
And so on.


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

AuxCordBoston said:


> The Uber tax case involves much more than just a mileage log. He put himself on IRS's radar by taking the other deductions.


Yes, most tax cases involve multiple issues. He was lucky to have the case remain civil vs criminal.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

JohnnyBravo836 said:


> I said "However, _just_ using your odometer readings from the beginning and the end of the year invites trouble". My point was obviously that you need more than _just those two_ numbers. Some people were suggesting that they intended to try and simply deduct all the vehicle miles for the entire year. I didn't say that you don't need the numbers for the beginning and end of the year. If you record start and stop numbers every day, then you obviously have those numbers too.


Apologize I miss read/understood it. In relation to my original Post #2


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

JohnnyBravo836 said:


> Obviously, a google search will bring up many pages which will say "yes" -- for example:
> 
> https://ttlc.intuit.com/questions/4...a-ride-request-are-those-miles-tax-deductible
> 
> Is this an official opinion from IRS? No, but it certainly appears that informed tax professionals regard them as deductible.


The IRS requirement is that the miles(expense) be "ordinary and necessary" business miles (expense). That's it! If your dead miles were put under scrutiny by the IRS that is all they will be concerned with, and exactly what you'd need to prove to them.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

BCS DRIVER said:


> You do it by voice recording into a voice recorder app. Drive and talk. Who can't handle that? I drive with a Bluetooth earpiece so I don't even have to hold the recorder/phone in one hand. Each entry takes about 5-7 seconds. Us those recordings to fill out a log book or spread sheet.
> 
> Entry: P1 > location > mileage
> Entry: P2 > location > mileage
> ...


Yet sooooo easy to fabricate.

So I'm taking a zig zag pattern, which I often do. I start at A and end at B. The map might show that as 2.5 miles, but my pattern made it 7.5 miles. I'm deadheading, looking for pings.

Makes no sense to detail the route. Of course to an auditor that wants to find a dishonest driver will look at that and deny it unless I detail the route taken.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.



UberTaxPro said:


> The IRS requirement is that the miles(expense) be "ordinary and necessary" business miles (expense). That's it! If your dead miles were put under scrutiny by the IRS that is all they will be concerned with, and exactly what you'd need to prove to them.


I actually see this point. Might start tracking my dead miles between trips. The waybills can be used to justify the rest if needed.


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

BigRedDriver said:


> Yet sooooo easy to fabricate.
> 
> So I'm taking a zig zag pattern, which I often do. I start at A and end at B. The map might show that as 2.5 miles, but my pattern made it 7.5 miles. I'm deadheading, looking for pings.
> 
> ...


Yes it can be fabricated. But it doesn't matter what route you took while dead heading. I too take many different routes with zig zags while waiting for that ping. It's the nature of ride share. Rarely does one do a direct route while dead hauling, at least when it's slow. Enter the info honestly and put the burden of proof (disproof) on the auditor.


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

BigRedDriver said:


> Yet sooooo easy to fabricate.
> 
> So I'm taking a zig zag pattern, which I often do. I start at A and end at B. The map might show that as 2.5 miles, but my pattern made it 7.5 miles. I'm deadheading, looking for pings.
> 
> ...


You should always track all business miles, dead or alive!
Even miles to the repair shop, accountant etc... are deductible as business expenses (pro rated perhaps)


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## vtcomics (Oct 9, 2018)

UberTaxPro said:


> Mileage from dead miles can be recorded as a trip also. start would be location you drop pax off and end would be your next pickup location. So the log will have alternating trips, with and without pax.


Exactly! I "link" that mileage on my spreadsheet (drop off address of current pax to pick up address of next pax). The problem I have is Uber and Lyft no longer show the addresses in my ride history; just a lame ultra-generalized Google map picture. I guess I'm going to have to keep a damn log in the car.


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## islanddriver (Apr 6, 2018)

Go to earnings details trip log tape a trip show street pickup and street drop off plus milage


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

vtcomics said:


> Exactly! I "link" that mileage on my spreadsheet (drop off address of current pax to pick up address of next pax). The problem I have is Uber and Lyft no longer show the addresses in my ride history; just a lame ultra-generalized Google map picture. I guess I'm going to have to keep a damn log in the car.


With trip log you use manual mode and very easily record all your stop and start addresses. Some of the other mileage apps don't have manual mode.


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## Alexxx_Uber (Sep 3, 2018)

When I look at Uber and Lyft end of year tax summary documents, they include number of online miles. In my case, my total car ofometer in 2018 is 26000 miles. I have 15000 online miles in Uber and 9000 online miles in Lyft. Altogether 24000 online miles. 
Can I submit that number for tax return? 
I don’t log any miles, because when we are online, Uber and Lyft keep calculating the miles for us. When I’m deadheading, I’m always online to earn those miles.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

UberTaxPro said:


> With trip log you use manual mode and very easily record all your stop and start addresses. Some of the other mileage apps don't have manual mode.


Gonna check that app out. Sounds like it would cure all problems.

Thanks for the info.


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

UberTaxPro said:


> With trip log you use manual mode and very easily record all your stop and start addresses. Some of the other mileage apps don't have manual mode.


When you say "very easily record all your stop and start addresses" how exactly do you you record this? Does it use GPS to automatically enter the addresses or do you have to manually enter them in?


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

UberTaxPro said:


> You should always track all business miles, dead or alive!
> Even miles to the repair shop, accountant etc... are deductible as business expenses (pro rated perhaps)[/QUOTE]
> 
> That was one question I had. If I record miles to get my oil changed can I deduct those miles based on percentage of use between business and personal? Do I include that figure with my regular mileage deduction or in another place?


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

BCS DRIVER said:


> When you say "very easily record all your stop and start addresses" how exactly do you you record this? Does it use GPS to automatically enter the addresses or do you have to manually enter them in?


GPS does it. When you leave your base you start the app, when get to your first pickup you stop the app (records destination address for your first dead mile trip). Then you start the app (records pickup address for first trip with pax). You keep repeating this at each stop. Your destination address will always be the same as the next pickup address and ALL miles will be logged.
It's easy to get used to, every time you hit a button on your ride-share app you hit a button on your mileage app.

FLKeys 
"That was one question I had. If I record miles to get my oil changed can I deduct those miles based on percentage of use between business and personal?" Yes

"Do I include that figure with my regular mileage deduction or in another place?" On your mileage log and on your schedule c with all your other business miles. You might want to code the mileage different from 100% business miles on your app so you or your tax pro will remember to pro rate certain miles.


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## Karen Stein (Nov 5, 2016)

I use an ordinary "composition book" as a log book. Every day I drive gets a page. 

Each page starts with an odometer reading. I then set the trip odometer to track ALL my miles while driving for hire that day.

I record each trip, and the trip odometer reading at the end of the trip.

Each day I transfer this information to a spreadsheet on my computer. Come tax time, it only takes moments to total my income and miles for the year.


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## tryingforthat5star (Mar 12, 2017)

I write down on a little note pad in my center console - Date, mileage in mileage out.


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

UberTaxPro said:


> GPS does it. When you leave your base you start the app, when get to your first pickup you stop the app (records destination address for your first dead mile trip). Then you start the app (records pickup address for first trip with pax). You keep repeating this at each stop. Your destination address will always be the same as the next pickup address and ALL miles will be logged.
> It's easy to get used to, every time you hit a button on your ride-share app you hit a button on your mileage app.


That sounds like an easy was to track all miles. Next question is how do you get that info into a form acceptable to the IRS like a log book or spread sheet? Is it downloadable or do you have to look at and manually enter it?

Also, since I'm already juggling between U & L apps on my phone could this go on a 4G tablet I use while driving?


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## moJohoJo (Feb 19, 2017)

FLKeys said:


> Correct my log has entries for each destination regardless of having a passenger or not. I make notes on each entry like "Drive to Pick-up" "Uber Pick-up" "Lyft Pick-up" "Relocate looking for rides" etc.


I do 200 miles a day unless i get a trip one way that's over 100 miles each way then i may end up doing up to 300 miles a day and that's just for Uber . If i drove for Lyft it'll probally be 1,470 miles a day since Lyft sends you trips so far away you'll end up losing money but i don't drive for Lyft ( they are the worse ) and by the way, Moron LYFT DRIVERS.........YOUR ACCEPTANCE RATE IS TOO LOW.........


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

BCS DRIVER said:


> That sounds like an easy was to track all miles. Next question is how do you get that info into a form acceptable to the IRS like a log book or spread sheet? Is it downloadable or do you have to look at and manually enter it?
> 
> Also, since I'm already juggling between U & L apps on my phone could this go on a 4G tablet I use while driving?


Trip Log keeps it it in a downloadable IRS compliant log that you can edit if necessary. I would think it would work on an internet connected tablet.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

UberTaxPro said:


> Trip Log keeps it it in a downloadable IRS compliant log that you can edit if necessary. I would think it would work on an internet connected tablet.


I downloaded and used it today. Quite easy. It appears I screwed up a couple of times, missed out on what appears to be 8 miles.

I also kept a separate log, so no worries.

I'm going to keep using it and see if it's accurate, if so, then it's what I'm going to continue with.


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

BigRedDriver said:


> I downloaded and used it today. Quite easy. It appears I screwed up a couple of times, missed out on what appears to be 8 miles.
> 
> I also kept a separate log, so no worries.
> 
> I'm going to keep using it and see if it's accurate, if so, then it's what I'm going to continue with.


Yep, takes a little getting used to, then it's easy! By the way you don't have to worry about the odometer readings, just make sure you have beginning of year and end of year mileage. You can choose to not include the odometer columns when you print or save to pdf.


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## vtcomics (Oct 9, 2018)

UberTaxPro said:


> GPS does it. When you leave your base you start the app, when get to your first pickup you stop the app (records destination address for your first dead mile trip). Then you start the app (records pickup address for first trip with pax). You keep repeating this at each stop. Your destination address will always be the same as the next pickup address and ALL miles will be logged.
> It's easy to get used to, every time you hit a button on your ride-share app you hit a button on your mileage app.
> 
> FLKeys
> ...


Dang I hope this works as described!  Goodbye spreadsheet!



moJohoJo said:


> I do 200 miles a day unless i get a trip one way that's over 100 miles each way then i may end up doing up to 300 miles a day and that's just for Uber . If i drove for Lyft it'll probally be 1,470 miles a day since Lyft sends you trips so far away you'll end up losing money but i don't drive for Lyft ( they are the worse ) and by the way, Moron LYFT DRIVERS.........YOUR ACCEPTANCE RATE IS TOO LOW.........


Never accept long distance pickups for Lyft. You will indeed lose money. That said, if it's a typical/reasonable pickup, then basically it's the same fare you'd make with Uber; give or take a buck or two; including long distance trips. Lyft has its uses; you just have to be selective about what you accept.


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

UberTaxPro said:


> Trip Log keeps it it in a downloadable IRS compliant log that you can edit if necessary. I would think it would work on an internet connected tablet.


Is this the right one?

https://triplogmileage.com/


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## UberTaxPro (Oct 3, 2014)

BCS DRIVER said:


> Is this the right one?
> 
> https://triplogmileage.com/


yep


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

UberTaxPro said:


> yep


Many thanks.


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## islanddriver (Apr 6, 2018)

According to IRS PUB 463 Page 27

States the following .

It also show a sample business Daily Business Mileage and Expense Log     

Date. Destination (City, Town, Or Area ) Odometer Start ,StopMiles ( this trip) Expenses Gas tolls Etc.

Does not say each individual address .

"Combining items. You can make one daily entry in your record for reasonable categories of expenses. Examples are taxi fares, telephone calls, or other incidental travel costs. Meals should be in a separate category. You can include tips for meal-related services with the costs of the meals. Expenses of a similar nature occurring during the course of a single event are considered a single expense. For example, if during entertainment at a cocktail lounge, you pay separately for each serving of refreshments, the total expense for the refreshments is treated as a single expense.

Car expenses. You can account for several uses of your car that can be considered part of a single use, such as a round trip or uninterrupted business use, with a single record. Minimal personal use, such as a stop for lunch on the way between two business stops, isn't an interruption of business use.

Example. You make deliveries at several different locations on a route that begins and ends at your employer's business premises and that includes a stop at the business premises between two deliveries.

You can account for these using a single record of miles driven."

The way i read all this is if you record the date , odometer reading start and stop for the day ., and ube and or rideshare as reason you are covered for the IRS. If you get audided and need to proove more Uber Has address and mileage in you pay statement . They is all ready a case that says IRS will take Uber records. Here.

https://www.ustaxcourt.gov/ustcinop/opinionviewer.aspx?ID=11787


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

Until the IRS specifically puts out a decision regarding rideshare mileage logs I am going to error on the side of caution and I'll continue to keep my detailed log.


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## Karen Stein (Nov 5, 2016)

If you're keeping a log just for the taxman, you're doing it wrong.


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## islanddriver (Apr 6, 2018)

what i quoted was from the IRS pub 463. 
And the case was an Uber driver he didn't
record any expences., the court did accept Uber's mileage report .

Karen Which log are you saying is all wrong.?


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

kingmartin06 said:


> Do you keep track of your personal miles each day in your mileage log as well as business mileage? Or do you just record the odometer reading at the beginning of the year and again at the end of the year and only keep a mileage log of business miles and trips and then come up with the difference?


Dailey entries into log book.

Start writing !

Its simple.
Keep several cars.
One for personal use.


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## Karen Stein (Nov 5, 2016)

Quote all the government papers you like and it changes nothing.

Keeping ANY record for the sole purpose of pleasing a bureaucrat defeats the purpose of records. You might as well advise a painter to wear a blindfold- you've severely handicapped yourself.

What are records for? They exist to serve YOU, to you run your business. You should be looking to your records to discover business trends, control expenses, and improve your business.

That these records also provide you with information helpful in filling out forms is purely secondary. It's just a number, and doesn't help you understand what it means.

Look at it this way: would you rather drive two miles to earn a roller, or one? Driving one mile means you have taxable income left after the mileage deduction. Does driving more miles - increasing your expenses - just to reduce your taxes make financial sense? 

Keeping a beautiful log of meaningless numbers is sheer idiocy - especially if your only purpose is to please a government idiot.

Government can afford to be foolish because it can print money. You can't.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

Karen Stein said:


> Quote all the government papers you like and it changes nothing.
> 
> Keeping ANY record for the sole purpose of pleasing a bureaucrat defeats the purpose of records. You might as well advise a painter to wear a blindfold- you've severely handicapped yourself.
> 
> ...


The purpose is to keep as much money as I can. And not go to prison

If that what it takes, then it's what I will do.

I suppose my changing oil 1000 miles early is pleasing big oil?

OK, I'm cool with that.


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## Darrell Green Fan (Feb 9, 2016)

Karen Stein said:


> Quote all the government papers you like and it changes nothing.
> 
> Keeping ANY record for the sole purpose of pleasing a bureaucrat defeats the purpose of records. You might as well advise a painter to wear a blindfold- you've severely handicapped yourself.
> 
> ...


What on Earth are you rambling about? The big bad government has tax laws we are required to follow. This is not wrong, the government needs taxes to be sustainable. We need to adhere to these laws or we risk huge financial penalties. The business mile deduction is huge, it's the difference between paying full taxes on $40,000 should you not keep an accurate mileage log or paying no taxes if you log your miles correctly and account for all dead miles. But to get this deduction you need to keep adequate documentation. Again this is not unreasonable and as business people it's our responsibility, not the government's, to remain in compliant with the rules and what is required.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

Karen Stein said:


> If you're keeping a log just for the taxman, you're doing it wrong.


I understand what you are saying. and yes I am always analyzing my log for patterns, prime times, and prime spots. My mileage log is in a spread sheet and it is tied to earning per trip and other information. So I keep my log for many reasons, and in keeping my log I want to be sure it covers the IRS requirements with out question.



Karen Stein said:


> Quote all the government papers you like and it changes nothing.
> 
> Keeping ANY record for the sole purpose of pleasing a bureaucrat defeats the purpose of records. You might as well advise a painter to wear a blindfold- you've severely handicapped yourself.
> 
> ...


I'm about making a profit. Burning gas and putting miles on my car is not worth it to me.


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## Karen Stein (Nov 5, 2016)

More direct answer for the OP: I do NOT keep a specific "mileage" of. No record is made of my activities away from business.

I keep a "business" log. This record tracks all my business activities, and counts miles driven as part of operating my business.

It's an old-fashioned notebook. I tried one of those automated phone apps, only to be swamped with entire. Often a trip to the store would generate multiple "trips." More confusing than helpful.

Too busy to fill it out? Reexamine your assumptions. It takes only moments to make a half-line entry. Customers take that long to buckle up.

Assume you're driving when you get a trip, and the customer meets you on the street. How long does it take to write "7:25 PM PU 123 Main DO 345 North OD104.5 mi.?" Thats all you need note. If the customer gives you a cash tip, just add "$3" to the line.

One day per page. One trip per line. Total your dollars at the bottom of each page.

Numbers from a recent day:
Cash $3 Uber 58.76 Lyft 47.82 Total 109.58.
Gas 16.60 Net 92.98. Miles 135.9.

I get home, and the tax picture looks like this:
$109.58 income
74.07 mileage deduction
35.51 taxable income

Cash in pocket? $92.98

As a bonus I know that a week from now, or maybe tomorrow, there might be that same customer calling again. Plus, I know how much of my work comes from Uber, and I can recreate my day if anyone doubts the miles 

It's not that hard.


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

UberTaxPro said:


> yep


I have a couple of nights driving and using this app. My question to you is do you do a start-stop for each period?


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

BCS DRIVER said:


> I have a couple of nights driving and using this app. My question to you is do you do a start-stop for each period?


Never used the app. I would do a start and stop on every leg of my driving.

Turn on app record odometer reading leave home: Start app tracking.
Receive first ping and drive to pick-up location. Stop app, Start app.
Drive PAX to location. Stop app, start app.
Continue driving for next ping. Stop app start app.
etc
Record Odometer at end of day.


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

FLKeys said:


> Never used the app. I would do a start and stop on every leg of my driving.
> 
> Turn on app record odometer reading leave home: Start app tracking.
> Receive first ping and drive to pick-up location. Stop app, Start app.
> ...


That's pretty much what I've been doing except I do a stop/start at the ping (P2). I was wondering if that was necessary to do. It's kind of a hassle since I'm usually driving for pings and doing it is distracting while driving, especially with already juggling between the U/L apps.


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## Darrell Green Fan (Feb 9, 2016)

OK I had a long conversation with my tax person, even sent her a link that showed the IRS does not require recording each drive. But she said she had 2 clients who ride share and only kept the miles at the start and end of the day and in both cases the deduction was denied. She says it's kind of the luck of the draw, you could get an auditor who is OK doing this method or you could get a hard ass. I'm not willing to take that risk, so I'll be forced to turn the app on and off with each stop. But let's be honest, you really can skip a few if it's really crazy. As long as the app is recording the miles and you do stop and start throughout the shift you should be OK. 

I don't see a reason to start and stop it at the start and end of of each ride, your dead miles count too. My plan is to keep it on as I drive and to the ride after the ping, then run it until the drop, not when you get the ping as you are busy getting to the rider. Then as I rate the rider I'll get in the habit of turning on and off the mile app..


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## Driver100 (Aug 1, 2015)

IRS rules require a contemporraneous mileage record for the standard mileage deduction on your taxes; In practice,
it should roughly correlate with Uber tax summary mileage reported.


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## jaystonepk (Oct 30, 2017)

JohnnyBravo836 said:


> This is the way I'm doing it, and I have to believe that it's sufficient. However, just using your odometer readings from the beginning and the end of the year invites trouble: unless you have a dedicated vehicle that you use for ridesharing and ridesharing _only_, you will clearly be trying to deduct miles that were from personal use, and that is going to raise red flags. But if you have a daily log that shows start and stop mileage for each time you worked, and not all the miles on the car are included in what you're claiming, you should be on quite solid ground.


That's exactly what I have. My log has start and end-of-year mileage, date, start time, end time, start mileage, and end mileage. I already know my business use for 2018 was 52%. I'll be claiming 52% of the interest I paid on my vehicle's note as a deduction.

I relied on the Uber/Lyft mileage last year but I don't exactly trust them to get it correct.


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## Grunions (May 25, 2018)

kingmartin06 said:


> Do you keep track of your personal miles each day in your mileage log as well as business mileage? Or do you just record the odometer reading at the beginning of the year and again at the end of the year and only keep a mileage log of business miles and trips and then come up with the difference?


I have a log book and jot down the mileage when I stop to pick someone up and stop to drop someone off. I also have tracking apps, but still have the old school method. I've had the tracking apps miss trips or double them up, so I'd have to go back and audit those trips.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

BCS DRIVER said:


> That's pretty much what I've been doing except I do a stop/start at the ping (P2). I was wondering if that was necessary to do. It's kind of a hassle since I'm usually driving for pings and doing it is distracting while driving, especially with already juggling between the U/L apps.


I would stop and start it at every leg of the driving. From start point to first pick-up. From pick-up to drop off. From drop off to next pick-up. From pick-up to drop-off. Continue until done for day. Every segment of your travel would have its own record.


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## Peterson (Jul 9, 2015)

I was driving for Uber and Lyft for 2 years. Found that Lyft gives mileage that includes miles without passenger and when I was driving to pick up. It covers all mileage but not "dead miles" when I was driving home (sometimes 30-40 miles away). Uber gives report with only mileage with passenger and pickup miles, but doesnt include miles between rides.
I had a simple daily log with start day odometer log and daily mileage that included "all" miles made with and without passenger and
"dead miles". Difference was approx 2 times more comparing with Uber and 25%-40% more comparing with Lyft.
Some days were not logged.
At the end I reported my own calculation, including ALL possible dead miles, like going to gas stations, McDonalds, tires and oil changing, etc. Both times I made this work slightly unprofitable like 10%-15%. No problems with IRS.
My accounter said: do not make it too unprofitable, otherwise you might get audit.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

My first ride today was a good one. He saw me recording my information in my log as he was getting in. After confirming destination he asked me if I was keeping a trip log. I replied yes, he said I am the first person in over 500 rides that he had seen keeping a log book. He was going 8 miles away so we had a good amount of time to talk about my log book. He asked several question and said great job I am keeping exactly what I need to get through an Audit. Turns out he is a tax accountant specializing in IRS audits. I asked him about just keeping begin and end of day records and he said that an auditor will shoot that down and disallow it. He asked me what mileage information Uber provided us and his opinion was they would accept that over a starting and ending day recording.

Nice guy from South Carolina, as of yet he did not leave a tip. I'm okay with that the knowledge he shared as better than a tip.


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## islanddriver (Apr 6, 2018)

I've been using trip log for the last week . Start and stop after each trip records date time address miles both trip and dead. It's great .should have been using this last ueat


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## Butter3031 (Oct 13, 2018)

Skinny1 said:


> Nice find..... some of these idiots really press on the expenses. $6k for travel?
> 
> Also note the IRS did allow for the miles driven on Uber to go ahead and be claimed , the 9,500 they had on record with no other supporting documentation. This guy claimed 40k+ miles and way more expenses than Uber showed..... wonder why the audit?
> 
> ...


Stupid question(s)which I have yet to find answers to. I drive 47 miles to a city for Uber/Lyft. I was under the impression that the drive to and from any work was counted as a personal choice of location so it can not be counted as mileage. So that leaves the mileage with a passenger, and mileage without to next pick up. Which ones can be deducted, if the rideshare company already pays for mileage? And if you have half your day for personal, and half not how is it logged. And are we supposed to be putting location address and times down? And don't passengers get upset at waiting...it's either start ride or wait time...can't see them liking that. Would a screen shot of way bills work? I am so confused. I drove the first two months without knowing it could be claimed. And there is not a list of ' to-do's' when you start. 
Sorry to ask so much, and thank you if you are able to help.


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

Butter3031 said:


> I drive 47 miles to a city for Uber/Lyft. I was under the impression that the drive to and from any work was counted as a personal choice of location so it can not be counted as mileage


You're thinking these are commuting miles, which are not deductible. But if you are not crossing over into the state you are authorized to drive in you can start the Uber app at your home as you're leaving. You are now in period 1. Period 1 miles (on app waiting for a ride request). These miles are deductible. If by chance you are crossing a state line start the app when you cross.



Butter3031 said:


> Which ones can be deducted, if the rideshare company already pays for mileage?


They are all deductible. P1, P2, and P3. U/L are not reimbursing you for mileage. It's a part of your pay, just as the minutes while with passenger are.

A log file will have as the first entry the odometer reading for January 1st of that year. The last entry for the year will be the odometer reading on December 31st. Subtract the January 1st reading from the December 31st reading to give total miles, business and personal. Use total miles and business miles to calculate the percentage used for personal and business.

Example: Jan 1 odometer is 80,000. Dec 31 odometer is 100,000. This equals 20,000 miles driven. Your log indicates you drove 15,000 business miles. Percentage of business versus personal miles is 75% . Multiply business miles by .75 and this gives you 11,250. Multiply 11,250 by (2019 rate) $.58 giving you a deduction off income of $6,525.00.

I use an app called Trip Log. I start trip on it at home when logged in to U/L. After getting a ride request and arriving at the pickup point I stop trip and immediately start another trip. Pick up the pax and let them off at the destination. Stop trip and start another. And so on. Pax never have to wait a second for me to do my log. The app sends me an email weekly with Excel and PFD file downloads summarizing all trip details including addresses and mileage.


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## Butter3031 (Oct 13, 2018)

BCS DRIVER said:


> You're thinking these are commuting miles, which are not deductible. But if you are not crossing over into the state you are authorized to drive in you can start the Uber app at your home as you're leaving. You are now in period 1. Period 1 miles (on app waiting for a ride request). These miles are deductible. If by chance you are crossing a state line start the app when you cross.
> 
> They are all deductible. P1, P2, and P3. U/L are not reimbursing you for mileage. It's a part of your pay, just as the minutes while with passenger are.
> 
> ...


Thank you for explaining all that to me. I was lost, and really didn't have a clue of even what miles can be logged. You are wonderful at explaining. Thank you again!!!


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

Butter3031 said:


> Thank you for explaining all that to me. I was lost, and really didn't have a clue of even what miles can be logged. You are wonderful at explaining. Thank you again!!!


You're most welcome. Now get out there and get those tax deductions


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## SamuelB (Aug 29, 2018)

The new iPhone iOS has shortcuts. I created one that keeps a log. I say "Hey Siri, Miles." Siri then asks me for my odometer reading which i say. Then Siri asks me for the purpose to which I reply "start Uber," "pick up John," "drop off John," or any other purpose for a trip. It then opens a note titled "Mileage." Siri then creates an entry that includes date, time, odometer, location address, and purpose all separated with commas and copied to the clipboard. I then paste it to the end of the note which ends up looking like this:
1/29/19,12:20,122486,,,10851 Imperial Hwy,Norwalk,Gas at Costco
1/29/19,13:03,122500,,,11800–11858 Crenshaw Blvd,Hawthorne,DLA8 starting Amazon route
1/29/19,17:27,122530,,,1250 Fourth St,Santa Monica,End Amazon route
1/29/19,17:51,122530,,,802 Santa Monica Blvd,Santa Monica,Start Uber
1/29/19,17:54,122530,,,1400–1418 Seventh St,Santa Monica,Pick up
1/29/19,18:01,122532,,,235 Ocean Park Blvd,Santa Monica,Drop off Steven
1/29/19,18:03,122532,,,2009 Main St,Santa Monica,Pick up JR
1/29/19,19:24,122550,,,841 W Cesar E Chavez Ave,Los Angeles,Drop off JR

At the end of the day I import it into my mileage log spreadsheet as a comma delimited file. I then insert the formulas to calculate total miles between Amazon and Uber. Been doing it a couple week and works pretty well. Only PIA is if the pax is right there when I pull up and they open the door and start talking while I am trying to dictate my mileage/purpose and it picks them up.


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

SamuelB said:


> The new iPhone iOS has shortcuts. I created one that keeps a log. I say "Hey Siri, Miles." Siri then asks me for my odometer reading which i say. Then Siri asks me for the purpose to which I reply "start Uber," "pick up John," "drop off John," or any other purpose for a trip. It then opens a note titled "Mileage." Siri then creates an entry that includes date, time, odometer, location address, and purpose all separated with commas and copied to the clipboard. I then paste it to the end of the note which ends up looking like this:
> 1/29/19,12:20,122486,,,10851 Imperial Hwy,Norwalk,Gas at Costco
> 1/29/19,13:03,122500,,,11800-11858 Crenshaw Blvd,Hawthorne,DLA8 starting Amazon route
> 1/29/19,17:27,122530,,,1250 Fourth St,Santa Monica,End Amazon route
> ...


I use Android after years of using Apple. Got burnt out on the obsessive propriety as well as their extremely over priced phones.

I understand how that works well for you. I did something similar for a while without the convenience of being able to download to a SS. Had to listen to my notes and manually input them into a SS. Really love the simplicity of Trip Log though. I run it on a 4G enabled 10" Android tablet rather than my phone since I'm already having to juggle between the U/L apps. At each stop a few presses of buttons stops each leg and starts a new one. It keeps a running total for each week as well as a running total with an email each week containing DLs in Excel and PDF format. I DL the SS into a folder nested within another UBER/LYFT folder on my home PC. I them move the email into a label in Gmail call Trip Log. So I have backup outside my PC.

Yes the monthly cost of the 4G tablet creates what some would consider an unnecessary expense. Same for the yearly cost of Trip Log. At least those costs are deductible.

I strongly believe in using the KISS method in all that I do.


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## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

BCS DRIVER said:


> I use Android after years of using Apple. Got burnt out on the obsessive propriety as well as their extremely over priced phones.
> 
> I understand how that works well for you. I did something similar for a while without the convenience of being able to download to a SS. Had to listen to my notes and manually input them into a SS. Really love the simplicity of Trip Log though. I run it on a 4G enabled 10" Android tablet rather than my phone since I'm already having to juggle between the U/L apps. At each stop a few presses of buttons stops each leg and starts a new one. It keeps a running total for each week as well as a running total with an email each week containing DLs in Excel and PDF format. I DL the SS into a folder nested within another UBER/LYFT folder on my home PC. I them move the email into a label in Gmail call Trip Log. So I have backup outside my PC.
> 
> ...


I would love to see some hard core true numbers between an app mileage log and a paper log for the same period of maybe 2 weeks. I wonder how close they would be. Often when I am sitting waiting for a ping on the rider app my car is jumping around on the screen as much as 50 feet. Is this a result of fluctuations in the GPS signal? How much would that fluctuation change for better or worst an electronic log? Is the difference even worth it?


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

FLKeys said:


> I would love to see some hard core true numbers between an app mileage log and a paper log for the same period of maybe 2 weeks. I wonder how close they would be. Often when I am sitting waiting for a ping on the rider app my car is jumping around on the screen as much as 50 feet. Is this a result of fluctuations in the GPS signal? How much would that fluctuation change for better or worst an electronic log? Is the difference even worth it?


I actually tested this when I first started using Trip Log. I would zero out the trip odometer when starting out. At the end of my shift I compare the trip odometer reading with what Trip Log said for that day. It was always within a mile or so as being the same.


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