# For all the drivers who supported CA prop 22



## Rideshare Dude (Aug 27, 2020)

Here's your buyers remorse.









Uber may stop letting drivers see destinations and name prices


Uber gave drivers more control over rides last year to prove they were truly independent...




www.sfchronicle.com


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Yeah I saw that coming.

No surprise, well not to me. Gonna hurt everyone who depends on these crap gigs.

There’s no maybe about it. These features are going to go away and soon. Uber is spinning the story so they can paint the California drivers as the bad guys. Expect these features to be gone any day.


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## kdyrpr (Apr 23, 2016)

So then what's the difference between before and after CA 22? 
I live on the east coast where NOTHING has changed. Can't see squat, unless your a titanium driver or whatever the F it is.


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## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

I said as much in one or two posts about Prop 22. This is standard operating playbill. We need to change things to make it better for you and more opportunities to earn! 

Welcome back to reality.


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## AvisDeene (Jun 7, 2019)

Everyone who supported LyUber deserve to get shafted by them.


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## Rideshare Dude (Aug 27, 2020)

kdyrpr said:


> So then what's the difference between before and after CA 22?
> I live on the east coast where NOTHING has changed. Can't see squat, unless your a titanium driver or whatever the F it is.


Uber used the trip information and rate setting as bribery to get drivers in California to support proposition 22. Once proposition 22 past there was no reason for Uber to leave it in place. I knew this was going to happen. So did many other intelligent drivers.


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## wallae (Jun 11, 2018)

AvisDeene said:


> Everyone who supported LyUber deserve to get shafted by them.


Well...
I support myself.

I might not be able to get in the union.
I don't believe the union can help you make great money without limiting how many drivers there are.
It's not just Uber or union

Unions are corrupt.
Friends get the cream 
The union here at the port...
You can pay a "friend" 1500 to get a card.
There's no guarantee that you're going to get work and you only will get work after all the friends and family of the people in charge get to work first.
You get the bs work that the senior guys don't want


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## _Tron_ (Feb 9, 2020)

Rideshare Dude said:


> Uber used the trip information and rate setting as bribery to get drivers in California to support proposition 22. Once proposition 22 past there was no reason for Uber to leave it in place. I knew this was going to happen. So did many other intelligent drivers.


Silly Rideshare Dude has his chronological timeline a bit juxtaposed.


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

From the article:

"........drivers cherry-pick lucrative rides and decline other requests,"

..............and their complaint is______________________________________________________?

Not F*ub*a*r* nor Gr*yft* nor the public seem to understand Capitalism 101.

1. In order to remain in business, the provider must turn something that is called a "profit".
2. The customer bears the cost of doing business.

The article has a pay gate, but you can duck it with the "X" trick.

As long as the TNCs continue to pay 1979 cab rates to drivers while charging the customers 1989 cab rates, drivers must avoid the unprofitable trips. Even when the TNCs are charging 1994 cab rates, such as a mild surge where the customer pays a 1,1-1,3 multiplier but the driver gets only base rates, still, the driver must avoid the unprofitable trips. Even under a surge factor of 1,9 or greater, even back in the days of multipliers to the drivers, still there were unprofitable trips. Those would be the trips that take you far from the surge zones.

The deficient policies of the TNCs force the drivers to extraordinary measures to turn a profit. If the TNCs would pay something close to current cab rates and charge the customers more, they could justify keeping the destinations from the drivers. Until that day comes, drivers need to know the destinations, especially during surge pricing hours; especially given the Charlotte Surge/pay cut.

Those of us who need to turn a profit need every means to avoid the unprofitable jobs. Let the ants run that garbage. They have ants for a reason.


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## Rideshare Dude (Aug 27, 2020)

_Tron_ said:


> Silly Rideshare Dude has his chronological timeline a bit juxtaposed.


Please elaborate.


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## Tnasty (Mar 23, 2016)

I was really shocked by this.lol it's classic uber and this is how they see fair business.


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## wallae (Jun 11, 2018)

F


Another Uber Driver said:


> From the article:
> 
> "........drivers cherry-pick lucrative rides and decline other requests,"
> 
> ...


Funny business 
Too easy with almost zero barrier to entry 
3000 dollar dodge 200 at the buy here pay here car lot- no problem 
Crack arrest (but no conviction yet) no problem 
No high school- no problem 
Dents all over- no problem 
423 credit- no problem 
These people could not even get hired my Walmart 
But they think with the union they can make $25 an hour

The sheet box cars I see out there 
Unreal


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## Tnasty (Mar 23, 2016)

I have no skin in the game, but if uber controls everything except, when you work you are not a contractor.They created 99 percent of their problems.


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

Another Uber Driver said:


> Not F*ub*a*r* nor Gr*yft* nor the public seem to understand Capitalism 101.


Uber and Lyft understand COMPLETELY how Capitalism 101 works.

Rule #1 screw the employee.

Rule #2 screw the employee.

Rule #3 see rules #1 and #2.


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

observer said:


> Uber and Lyft understand COMPLETELY how Capitalism 101 works.
> 
> Rule #1 screw the employee.
> 
> ...


Rule #4-Do not use K-Y
Rule #5-If the employee brings even his own drug store brand lubrication, take it away from him before you bend him over.


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## wallae (Jun 11, 2018)

Tnasty said:


> I have no skin in the game, but if uber controls everything except, when you work you are not a contractor.They created 99 percent of their problems.


True
But they don't 
As of today I can still "work" but turn down all requested trips except the ones I want


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## Rideshare Dude (Aug 27, 2020)

wallae said:


> True
> But they don't
> As of today I can still "work" but turn down all requested trips except the ones I want


True. But if Uber has an adequate supply of drivers they can control whether or not you receive any requests.


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## Dr. Saw Bones (Feb 2, 2021)

Rideshare Dude said:


> Here's your buyers remorse.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Prop 22 was the moral thing to do, both times. I stand with Pro 22 to keep gays from marrying, I stand with Prop 22 to keep you guys independent, and I stand with Bezos.


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## wallae (Jun 11, 2018)

Rideshare Dude said:


> True. But if Uber has an adequate supply of drivers they can control whether or not you receive any requests.


i agree with that... but unions do that too. Friends of union heads cherry-picking best jobs. Some friends get a check for sitting at home &#128514;
As do cab dispatchers. They call drivers on the phone with the best rides instead of a radio call to the 1st driver in line.

I would love to see someone in transport @PeteButtigieg make sure the Uber algorithm is honest and fair


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## btone31 (Jul 22, 2018)

Has Prop 22 failed, we would've been employees already and destination info at request screen would've already been gone.


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## PukersAreAlwaysYourFault (Mar 25, 2021)

A wealth of stupid ants fail to realize that everybody needs a ride. If they were only smart enough to service most people instead of rejecting 85% of requests, these features would have been able to stick around. Greed, selfishness, and ignorance will destroy the ants.


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## _Tron_ (Feb 9, 2020)

Rideshare Dude said:


> Please elaborate.


Request declined.

Debating Prop 22 is pointless. Pointing fingers at drivers who either supported, or were against 22 is pointless. This post is pointless. The fact of the matter is we were in a Kobayashi Maru situation.


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## wallae (Jun 11, 2018)

btone31 said:


> Has Prop 22 failed, we would've been employees already and destination info at request screen would've already been gone.


Yep
And worse possibly 
No more declining rights
Assigned an area and a 12 hour shift
No more part time drivers
Reduce 1/2 of the drivers


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## Basketball 9to5 (Jun 21, 2020)

All of the driver's who supported this hideous prop 22 you ho get what you voted and asked for...200+ million to create a proposition while we had to endure this pandemic..Uber/Lyft is pathetic..for just leaving it's partners hanging


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## wallae (Jun 11, 2018)

Oh bs
Most of my request are 17 to 22 minutes away with no pay to go
And then 3 dollar rides

I've played that game and it leads to eight bucks an hour before I pay for gas


PukersAreAlwaysYourFault said:


> A wealth of stupid ants fail to realize that everybody needs a ride. If they were only smart enough to service most people instead of rejecting 85% of requests, these features would have been able to stick around. Greed, selfishness, and ignorance will destroy the ants.


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## PukersAreAlwaysYourFault (Mar 25, 2021)

wallae said:


> Oh bs
> Most of my request are 17 to 22 minutes away with no pay to go
> And then 3 dollar rides
> 
> I've played that game and it leads to eight bucks an hour before I pay for gas


It isn't bs. The trouble in understanding is that it is not about you. It is about the customer, the client. You come second.


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## wallae (Jun 11, 2018)

PukersAreAlwaysYourFault said:


> It isn't bs. The trouble in understanding is that it is not about you. It is about the customer, the client. You come second.


AI is smart enough to not give you a loser 
Uber don't care
When I first started I went 17 minutes into a rural area with no rides
Took an old lady from the Food Lion to the trailer across the street
$2.34 





And then I had to drive all the way back home&#128514;
Not repeating that again


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## Dr. Saw Bones (Feb 2, 2021)

There was a study that showed experienced rideshats only make about 4 percent more than an ant.


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## wallae (Jun 11, 2018)

Dr. Saw Bones said:


> There was a study that showed experienced rideshats only make about 4 percent more than an ant.


I did a study that says it's safer to drive home drunk
I had three people who were kills sober driving home and one drunk who lived


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

_Tron_ said:


> Request declined.
> 
> Debating Prop 22 is pointless.


I disagree.


_Tron_ said:


> This post is pointless.


Again, I disagree.

Those who fail to learn from History are doomed to repeat it.

Uber and Lyft have time after time after time after time after time after time after time shown that they do not care about their drivers.

Yet, drivers ignore history.

This post is important because Prop 22 WILL be brought out by U/L in other states.

People need to remember,

This isn't just about Uber and Lyft.

It is about employee rights being diluted in EVERY other industry.

The day is coming when other industries will try to copy Uber and Lyft.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Rideshare Dude said:


> Here's your buyers remorse.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The article is a one-sided, trashy hit piece against the drivers.

Uber comes off as the heroic "consumer advocate" fighting for the consumer against the greedy, conniving drivers.

It wouldn't surprise me to find out it was ghost written by Uber.


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

observer said:


> The day is coming when other industries will try to copy Uber and Lyft.


Right. Some supermarkets have already got rid of their employee delivery drivers and replaced them with gig workers.

A future change I see is for the supermarkets to make their cashiers "revenue processing contractors". They'll get paid $.01 per item scanned, and get no benefits or job protections. When they have a customer, they earn. When they don't, they don't. The companies can't be expected to pay when the worker is between customers, right? That would lead to people just logging on and avoiding work. -o:


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## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

btone31 said:


> Has Prop 22 failed, we would've been employees already and destination info at request screen would've already been gone.


It doesn't have to be this way. Had uber played it straight and adhered to the skim 20 or 25% model and let us be ic's they could probably have cut back on all the promos and actually be turning a profit. Omg. Treat people decently, charge appropriate fares, and make money. How rad!


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

Disgusted Driver said:


> It doesn't have to be this way. Had uber played it straight and adhered to the skim 20 or 25% model and let us be ic's they could probably have cut back on all the promos and actually be turning a profit. Omg. Treat people decently, charge appropriate fares, and make money. How rad!


I haven't seen anything yet about Uber walking back the return to the 20%/25% model in California and re-implementing up-front pricing here. But they have no reason to keep it.

Upfront pricing is very beneficial to Uber as it allows the company to fine tune pax pricing and driver pay in order to retain the highest gross profit for itself. It is way better than the blunt instrument of 20%/25% plus surge, which leaves (from their point of view) way too much money on the table (read: in the drivers' pockets).


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

for tone, balance and accuracy the full info ping was born from AB5; prop 22 wasn't on the radar yet.

But yeah, any change to to getting the destination will do it for me; I'll switch to my other gig exclusively. '

Seemed to me the article was more complaining on the 'set your own surge' vs full info pings. If set your own surge goes, no problem. Same feelings I had on when 'drive pass' died just after being born. Buh bye.


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

SHalester said:


> Seemed to me the article was more complaining on the 'set your own surge' vs full info pings. If set your own surge goes, no problem. Same feelings I had on when 'drive pass' died just after being born. Buh bye.


It's also definitely about drivers rejecting Fourdolla Flo's 1 mile ride from the Bart Station to her house.

Not interested. Nope. Nuh-uh. No way.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

The Gift of Fish said:


> It's also definitely about drivers rejecting Fourdolla Flo's 1 mile ride from the Bart Station to her house.


I big portion of my rides are from my home to Dublin bart station. Gotta say, tho, I rarely pay attn to the names. Most of mine are Indian names where i can barely pronounce the first name...... &#129335;‍♂


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

It's nice the way Harry Campbell stuck his own knife into the drivers' back when he said he noticed service has become worse.

Hey Harry, there's something called Covid that's made service worse in lots and lots of industries.


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## Rideshare Dude (Aug 27, 2020)

SHalester said:


> for tone, balance and accuracy the full info ping was born from AB5; prop 22 wasn't on the radar yet.
> 
> But yeah, any change to to getting the destination will do it for me; I'll switch to my other gig exclusively. '
> 
> Seemed to me the article was more complaining on the 'set your own surge' vs full info pings. If set your own surge goes, no problem. Same feelings I had on when 'drive pass' died just after being born. Buh bye.


I would bet prop 22 was written and waiting in the wings before AB5 was passed.


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## Gone_in_60_seconds (Jan 21, 2018)

The Gift of Fish said:


> It's also definitely about drivers rejecting Fourdolla Flo's 1 mile ride from the Bart Station to her house.
> 
> Not interested. Nope. Nuh-uh. No way.


But that fare would be acceptable at 3.0X multiplier, assuming the pick up distance is <= 5 minutes?


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## Rideshare Dude (Aug 27, 2020)

Gone_in_60_seconds said:


> But that fare would be acceptable at 3.0X multiplier, assuming the pick up distance is <= 5 minutes?


A one mile ride would be barely over the ride minimum even at 3x. Just multiply one mile and a couple minutes x 3 and it ain't much.


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## Frontier Guy (Dec 27, 2015)

And people are surprised by this?



wallae said:


> i agree with that... but unions do that too. Friends of union heads cherry-picking best jobs. Some friends get a check for sitting at home &#128514;
> As do cab dispatchers. They call drivers on the phone with the best rides instead of a radio call to the 1st driver in line.
> 
> I would love to see someone in transport @PeteButtigieg make sure the Uber algorithm is honest and fair


Yeah, sorry, the U.S. will never take action to regulate these companies properly so that drivers are treated and paid properly. Two years ago, my local legislator received over 200 complaints about Uber/Lyft charging tolls on rides where tolls were not needed, the toll road was actually out of route for 90% of the rides, she shrugged her shoulders and said it was out of her hands. Even the state regulators admit, they really want to reign in and better regulate Uber/Lyft, but they simply don't have the authority or the staff.


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Rideshare Dude said:


> Here's your buyers remorse.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Prop. 22.

The lesser of evils.

That info was gone anyway if drivers were employees.

Further, rides could not be cancelled.

Accept every offer or be fired for cause.


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## Gone_in_60_seconds (Jan 21, 2018)

Judge and Jury said:


> Prop. 22.
> 
> The lesser of evils.
> 
> ...


However, if you were an employee and joined a union, you could have gone on strike and brought uber and Lyft to their knees (assuming the rideshare companies didn't leave California)? You probably would had more power as a collective than an individual?


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Gone_in_60_seconds said:


> However, if you were an employee and joined a union, you could have gone on strike and brought uber and Lyft to their knees (assuming the rideshare companies didn't leave California)? You probably would had more power as a collective than an individual?


Don't wanna be dragged down to the lowest common denominator that union membership entails.

Don't wanna make minimum wage as an employee of the devious gig app companies.

I am a profitable contractor with an extremely low acceptance rate.

Guessing I would not be offered employment status.

I want to continue making large profits and not be saddled as a part time, minimum wage employee.

How much money you making?


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

https://www.google.com/amp/s/static.theintercept.com/amp/pro-act-labor-senate-vote-filibuster.html


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## Fusion_LUser (Jan 3, 2020)

Gone_in_60_seconds said:


> However, if you were an employee and joined a union, you could have gone on strike and brought uber and Lyft to their knees (assuming the rideshare companies didn't leave California)? You probably would had more power as a collective than an individual?


Wow a union employee making minimum wage before deductions and the union dues... An employee that will work a assigned shift of 4 to 6 hours at most to avoid being classified as full time... An employee that will pick up who Uber/Lyft says they will pick up no matter what... An employee that will work where Uber/Lyft tells them to work.

Where do I sign up???

Had Prop 22 failed all the Prop 22 "benefits" wouldn't have mattered anymore. Does it suck that these may go away? Sure it does but being an minimum wage earning employee of Uber/Lyft will suck even more.

It will be minutes, not hours or days days before we see a ton of Uber/Lyft employee's complaining about the hours they have to work, where they have work, who they have to pickup and how their minimum wage pay is nowhere near the minimum wage pay they thought it would be being an employee or unionized employee for the few that actually become an employee of Uber/Lyft.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Rideshare Dude said:


> I would bet prop 22 was written and waiting in the wings before AB5 was passed.


I doubt it, but who knows for sure?

I'm glad Prop 22 blasted AB5 into dust. Being an employee is not all it is cracked up to be on this forum from many who have NEVER been employed.

honey, sugar and ice cream it ain't.


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Fusion_LUser said:


> Wow a union employee making minimum wage before deductions and the union dues... An employee that will work a assigned shift of 4 to 6 hours at most to avoid being classified as full time... An employee that will pick up who Uber/Lyft says they will pick up no matter what... An employee that will work where Uber/Lyft tells them to work.
> 
> Where do I sign up???
> 
> ...


Agreed.

Fired for cause for declining unprofitable offers.

Further, the spiffy uniforms we gonna have to wear.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Judge and Jury said:


> Fired for cause for declining unprofitable offers.


that's funny. As an employee there would not be any pings/requests/offers. They would be dispatch orders. Go and do or be fired. buh bye. next employee is up.


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## Tnasty (Mar 23, 2016)

They hide info from you.Lieing by omssion and hiding info and determining the price they charge and what you get.Its at the very least price fixing.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Tnasty said:


> very least price fixing.


doesn't that require a 2nd company to be a valid 'thing'?


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## Tnasty (Mar 23, 2016)

I know shit from shinola but a contractor that doesn't know the job and pay before they take it on?


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

PukersAreAlwaysYourFault said:


> A wealth of stupid ants fail to realize that everybody needs a ride. If they were only smart enough to service most people instead of rejecting 85% of requests, these features would have been able to stick around. Greed, selfishness, and ignorance will destroy the ants.


Service all requests?

Sounds like the road to bankruptcy for independent contractors.

Greed? No; profitable contracts; YES.

Accepting unprofitable offers is ridiculous.

Do you actually profit from the gig apps or lose money?


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## Tnasty (Mar 23, 2016)

Uber once had a option where you could stay in a certain region if anyone remembers.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Judge and Jury said:


> Do you actually profit from the gig apps or lose money?


are we talking cash flow or schedule C?

You know, there is a difference. :thumbup:



Tnasty said:


> Uber once had a option where you could stay in a certain region if anyone remembers.


oh, bring that back. I like it. Draw a boundary. Nice. Make it so.


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## Tnasty (Mar 23, 2016)

SHalester said:


> are we talking cash flow or schedule C?
> 
> You know, there is a difference. :thumbup:
> 
> ...


Ya it was forever ago. You highlighted the area and you only got jobs in that area.I dont wanna get dumped 50 miles from home with no job back, and not a job that brings me 75 miles from home.They lie by omission.

*Lies of omission* involve the intentional exclusion of important information, whereas *lies of commission* involve the intentional generation of false information.


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## PukersAreAlwaysYourFault (Mar 25, 2021)

Judge and Jury said:


> Do you actually profit from the gig apps or lose money?


I actually profit. But you go ahead and do you and enjoy it while it lasts.


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

Dr. Saw Bones said:


> Prop 22 was the moral thing to do, both times. I stand with Pro 22 to keep gays from marrying, I stand with Prop 22 to keep you guys independent, and I stand with Bezos.


_'Statchou*, *_@MiamiKid ?



PukersAreAlwaysYourFault said:


> It isn't bs. The trouble in understanding is that it is not about you. It is about the customer, the client. You come second.


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

The next thing to go in CA will be the Surge Multiplier and the 25%/75% split. Mark my words. I won't say when but I guaran-fornicating-tee it will happen. 

They didn't spend $200 million million to make sure drivers made more money. 🤦‍♂️🤷‍♂️


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## Tnasty (Mar 23, 2016)

Nats121 said:


> It's nice the way Harry Campbell stuck his own knife into the drivers' back when he said he noticed service has become worse.
> 
> Hey Harry, there's something called Covid that's made service worse in lots and lots of industries.


When you take a steamy sheet on your drivers by cutting prices 4 times.Then the insurance deducible and surge. It's gonna have a impact.Just saw an article about how Bostons wait time is up and its hard to find a ride and you are starting to see it in Vegas and other places.They know they are done soon by DiDI or someone else. They are just trying to get away with as much as they can before its game over.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Another Uber Driver said:


> If the TNCs would pay something close to current cab rates and charge the customers more, they could justify keeping the destinations from the drivers.


I disagree.

If I'm gonna be classified as an independent contractor and be required to sacrifice the benefits that come with being an employee (Comp, Unemployment, FICA, etc), no pertinent info should be hidden from me when I'm deciding whether or not to enter a business deal. That's my view regardless of the pay rates.

Profit is the top reason knowing destinations is important but it's not the only one.



Another Uber Driver said:


> Let the ants run that garbage. They have ants for a reason.


When armed with destination info, many ants become cherrypickers.

That's probably happened in California and everywhere with Eats when Uber started showing the destinations in advance in November 2019.

If the tiny percentage of decent pings is any indication, there are a lot fewer Eats ants than there used to be.


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## bsliv (Mar 1, 2016)

Tnasty said:


> a contractor that doesn't know the job and pay before they take it on


If historical evidence showed that the jobs offered were profitable despite the lack of detail, not much of a problem accepting the jobs. But the historical evidence from Uber shows many offers are not profitable which makes accepting the offers without detail a bad business decision.

How long will a driver drive while racking up expenses that exceed gross income?

Local news reports in Las Vegas show many pax with long wait times. Will pax put up with this or seek taxis? Will Uber increase rates to drivers to encourage more drivers? Is it covid or low rates that reduced the number of drivers? What came first, the chicken or the egg?


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## Rideshare Dude (Aug 27, 2020)

New2This said:


> They didn't spend $200 million million to make sure drivers made more money. &#129318;‍♂&#129335;‍♂


Why is this so difficult for some people to understand?


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

Nats121 said:


> I disagree.


...............................and_________________________________________________________?



Nats121 said:


> If I'm gonna be classified as an independent contractor and be required to sacrifice the benefits that come with being an employee (Comp, Unemployment, FICA, etc), no pertinent info should be hidden from me when I'm deciding whether or not to enter a business deal.


There is precedent in this business for keeping destinations from the drivers. In some cases, there is, and has been, regulation regarding it. Keep in mind that despite what the TNCs would have you believe, their "independent contractor" model is nothing new, especially in this business.



Nats121 said:


> *That's my view* regardless of the pay rates.


(emphasis added)

.......to which you are entitled.......................................


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## rkozy (Apr 5, 2019)

I'm lucky enough to drive in a market where the number of available drivers is now horribly inadequate for servicing the number of rider requests in a given hour. Before the pandemic, I had to be careful about rejecting requests, because there was no guarantee that another one would be waiting in the wings. Since COVID 19 happened, I'm rejecting just about every ping that isn't within a couple minutes of me.

I'm not sure having the trip details would even be that useful to me now. In fact, I'd rather do four short rides in an hour that are all very close by, than wasting some empty miles picking up a no-tip longer ride that seemed like a "sure thing" on paper. The more rides you do in an hour, the more opportunities for tipping you receive. Uber mileage doesn't pay squat, but a passenger tipping you $5 or $10 on a shorter ride sure makes up for that.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

rkozy said:


> I'm not sure having the trip details would even be that useful to me now. In fact, I'd rather do four short rides in an hour that are all very close by, than wasting some empty miles picking up a no-tip ride that seemed like a "sure thing" on paper. The more rides you do in an hour, the more opportunities for tipping you receive. Uber mileage doesn't pay squat, but a passenger tipping you $5 or $10 on a shorter ride sure makes up for that.


Trip details benefit ALL drivers because it results in cherrypicking, which pushes driver pay UP.

You like to cherrypick short rides, other drivers like to cherrypick medium rides, and others like to cherrypick long ones. You can't cherrypick unless you know the DESTINATIONS.


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## Tnasty (Mar 23, 2016)

Its not not destination discrimination it's preference for profits and minimizing loss.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Another Uber Driver said:


> There is precedent in this business for keeping destinations from the drivers. In some cases, there is, and has been, regulation regarding it.


That precendent applies to the taxi industry, which in most markets is a corrupt relic of a business model.

The TNCs adopted it because it saves them a fortune in driver payroll costs while allowing the TNCs to price their services at artificially low prices.

The IC courier industry, which predates the TNCs was so terrible as to make the TNCs look good in comparison, also hid pertinent info from their "independent contractor" drivers. But unlike the TNCs, they didn't hide the destinations, they hid the PAYOUTS from the drivers.

Declining deliveries was heavily frowned upon, and usually resulted in threats of punishment.


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## rkozy (Apr 5, 2019)

Nats121 said:


> Trip details benefit ALL drivers because it results in cherrypicking, which pushes driver pay UP.
> 
> You like to cherrypick short rides, other drivers like to cherrypick medium rides, and others like to cherrypick long ones. You can't cherrypick unless you know the DESTINATIONS.


I don't cherry-pick based on ride length. I cherry-pick based on how much I have to invest for an unknown quantity. The assumption I make is that every fare is a base fare, with no tip. In many cases, that's what they end up being...or only slightly better than that. On days where the trips are long and the tips are flowing, it's just extra gravy for me.

That's why I no longer invest any time in pick-ups. Back in the days when I had Uber Pro Gold and could see the destination information, it forced me into making some bad decisions. Of course, that was back in pre-pandemic times where rejecting a ride request might also mean sitting idle for 15-20 minutes due to an overabundance of rideshare drivers.

Now, I can reject trips that are too far away and not have to worry. There'll be another almost instantly, especially when I'm rocking both Uber and Lyft at the same time.


----------



## wallae (Jun 11, 2018)

If


Gone_in_60_seconds said:


> However, if you were an employee and joined a union, you could have gone on strike and brought uber and Lyft to their knees (assuming the rideshare companies didn't leave California)? You probably would had more power as a collective than an individual?


 If you got in the union &#128514;
The union would have to severely limit the amount of drivers in the union and on the road at any one time 
Show how well the cab drivers union did for their members. Avg wage


----------



## Livekilometers96 (Apr 5, 2021)

Nats121 said:


> I disagree.
> 
> If I'm gonna be classified as an independent contractor and be required to sacrifice the benefits that come with being an employee (Comp, Unemployment, FICA, etc), no pertinent info should be hidden from me when I'm deciding whether or not to enter a business deal. That's my view regardless of the pay rates.
> 
> Profit is the top reason knowing destinations is important but it's not the only one.


You are a part time Eats delivery driver that already gets full ping info. Hasn't seem to help you get enough $ for a rideshare eligible vehicle. Maybe you think a bit too highly of your business skills?

Drivers who would take destination info at base rates over no destination info at 2.5-2.7x (cab rates) are ****ing idiots.


----------



## PukersAreAlwaysYourFault (Mar 25, 2021)

Another Uber Driver said:


> _'Statchou*, *_@MiamiKid ?


Whatever makes you feel better.
_"Truth hurts."_ - Lizzo


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Another Uber Driver said:


> _'Statchou*, *_@MiamiKid ?


nah, no way a sock id of MK could control themselves and not mention tips are included every single post.

&#127864;&#127864;&#128526;&#128526;



New2This said:


> The next thing to go in CA will be the Surge Multiplier and the 25%/75% split. Mark my words. I won't say when but I guaran-fornicating-tee it will happen.


if the agreement is those go away and full info pings remain, fine.

Otherwise, pox on you.


----------



## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Livekilometers96 said:


> You are a part time Eats delivery driver that already gets full ping info. Hasn't seem to help you get enough $ for a rideshare eligible vehicle. Maybe you think a bit too highly of your business skills?
> 
> Drivers who would take destination info at base rates over no destination info at 2.5-2.7x (cab rates) are @@@@ing idiots.


Apparently you've missed it, but I've addressed this on more than one occasion.

I've been able to see destinations on Eats since 2019, and upon seeing that info, my earnings went up. The addition of seeing the expected totals last year increased my earnings even more.

For me, the worst part of rideshare has always been not knowing the destinations before accepting ride offers.

Now that I know the destinations doing food delivery I've become very "spoiled" and I don't want to go back to "pot luck" rideshare. If I ever do rideshare again, I'll screen my rides for destinations.

I'm making more money doing food delivery than rideshare and I'm doing it my way.



Livekilometers96 said:


> Drivers who would take destination info at base rates over no destination info at 2.5-2.7x (cab rates) are @@@@ing idiots.


A base rate ride that I can knock out quickly and be in position to get another trip could be a better choice than a pot luck 2.7 surge trip that takes you out to the boonies or into some traffic-clogged nightmare.
[automerge]1617835339[/automerge[/automerge]


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

PukersAreAlwaysYourFault said:


> I actually profit. But you go ahead and do you and enjoy it while it lasts.


Yep.

That's my plan.


----------



## Boca Ratman (Jun 6, 2018)

Another Uber Driver said:


> The article has a pay gate, but you can duck it with the "X" trick.


What is the "X" trick?


----------



## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

rkozy said:


> I don't cherry-pick based on ride length. I cherry-pick based on how much I have to invest for an unknown quantity. The assumption I make is that every fare is a base fare, with no tip. In many cases, that's what they end up being...or only slightly better than that. On days where the trips are long and the tips are flowing, it's just extra gravy for me.
> 
> That's why I no longer invest any time in pick-ups. Back in the days when I had Uber Pro Gold and could see the destination information, it forced me into making some bad decisions. Of course, that was back in pre-pandemic times where rejecting a ride request might also mean sitting idle for 15-20 minutes due to an overabundance of rideshare drivers.
> 
> Now, I can reject trips that are too far away and not have to worry. There'll be another almost instantly, especially when I'm rocking both Uber and Lyft at the same time.


It doesn't matter whether a given driver cherrypicks or not, the rising tide of overall driver cherrypicking lifts ALL boats of driver earnings. Seeing trip info enables drivers to cherrypick.

This is why Uber HATES showing destinations to the California drivers and why they've refused to do it in the other 49 states.

Uber knows if the driver payout is high enough, virtually all rides would be accepted. They don't want to pay those rates. Hiding the trip info allows Uber and Lyft to keep driver pay artificially low.

It's as simple as that.


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

Boca Ratman said:


> What is the "X" trick?


If you hit a pay gate from a link, especially to a newspaper article, you X out the page, then re-click on the link. As the page is coming up, click on the X in the upper left hand corner of your screen. It will let you slide by the pay gate. At times, it seems to be a matter of timing, so you might have to try several times.



Nats121 said:


> That precendent applies to the taxi industry, which in most markets is a corrupt relic of a business model.


Uber _ain't nothing but the worst tack-see-kabb kumpinny in th' worl'_. Uber took the worst qualities of the cab companies and made the horrid concoction that we see to-day. As for "corrupt", how do you think that Uber got where it is to-day?



Nats121 said:


> The TNCs adopted it because it saves them a fortune in driver payroll costs while allowing the TNCs to price their services at artificially low prices.


The TNCs simply adopted the worst practices of the cab companies,. threw in a little technology and many more payoffs.



Nats121 said:


> Declining deliveries was heavily frowned upon, and usually resulted in threats of punishment.


In the radio cab business, most cab companies in our market had what was often called a "voluntary bid system". If you wanted a job,. you opened your mouth. If you wanted to work the street, you kept your mouth closed and your microphone on its hanger (although half the drivers kept it on the front seat, where it slid under their butts and opened, thus tying up that channel. It was always the guys with the powerful radios that hung their microphones, not the guys with the gharbage radios). With the advent of the computer/GPS/satellite based call assignment system, the option to keep your mouth closed disappeared, as the call assignment system was tied into your meter. At that point, they had to allow you to decline jobs, as a substitute for keeping your mouth closed.

In the courier business, you could not run the street. In the cab business, you can.

In the cab business, once the dispatcher acknowledged your "bid", you could not decline a job, although sometimes you could get away with cancelling it if you got a street pickup. If you did it too frequently, often the dispatcher would tell you to bump the kerb for the rest of the shift.


----------



## Big Lou (Dec 11, 2019)

wallae said:


> True
> But they don't
> As of today I can still "work" but turn down all requested trips except the ones I want


If I ever go back to R/S, I have so much to learn now


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

AvisDeene said:


> Everyone who supported LyUber deserve to get shafted by them.


California is a long way from Missouri.

But my question is this: Do you actually want to be a part time employee of these devious gig app companies?

By the way, prop. 22 has increased my weekly gross between $175 and $250 per week, without any change to my cherry picking tactics.


----------



## Tnasty (Mar 23, 2016)

Nats121 said:


> It doesn't matter whether a given driver cherrypicks or not, the rising tide of overall driver cherrypicking lifts ALL boats of driver earnings. Seeing trip info enables drivers to cherrypick.
> 
> This is why Uber HATES showing destinations to the California drivers and why they've refused to do it in the other 49 states.
> 
> ...


This to me is price fixing with their partner Lyft.


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Rideshare Dude said:


> Here's your buyers remorse.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It wasn't there. Then it was there. Then it was gone.

Experiment, learn and adapt.

Omaha is a long way from California. Seems you have no skin in the game in our market.

Prop. 22 giving me $150 to $290 extra per week while I utilize my old cherry picking tactics.

No buyer's remorse from me for voting yes on prop. 22.



Rideshare Dude said:


> Uber used the trip information and rate setting as bribery to get drivers in California to support proposition 22. Once proposition 22 past there was no reason for Uber to leave it in place. I knew this was going to happen. So did many other intelligent drivers.


The alternative to prop. 22 was part time employee status as required by AB5.

Most profitable contractors would not be hired as ants would be the logical hires.

Please start acting as a part time employee.

Drive to the most dangerous neighborhood in your region as assigned; deliver every $3 offer or be fired for cause.

I am making an extra two hundred dollars a week utilizing my old cherry picking tactics.

Omaha is a long way from Compton.

If you're gonna tell us how to conduct business in our market, then you gotta put boots on the ground.

Otherwise, shut up, (to put it politely.)


----------



## AvisDeene (Jun 7, 2019)

Judge and Jury said:


> California is a long way from Missouri.
> 
> But my question is this: Do you actually want to be a part time employee of these devious gig app companies?
> 
> By the way, prop. 22 has increased my weekly gross between $175 and $250 per week, without any change to my cherry picking tactics.


No, I wouldn't, but there is no guarantee that they would have made drivers employees. LyUber could have changed their business model to comply with the new law in order to actually make it so their drivers are truly independent contractors.

In the end, I don't blame LyUber for the driver suffering, I blame the drivers. If they have actually come together and protested LyUbers sleazy tactics, LyUber would have been forced to improve the situations for the drivers, but the majority of drivers were to busy worrying about making money in the now and not think about the future. All it would have taken would be for everyone to turn off the app one weekend a month and it would have made them come to the bargaining table.


----------



## Rideshare Dude (Aug 27, 2020)

It wasn't there. Then it was there. Then it was gone.


Judge and Jury said:


> Experiment, learn and adapt.
> 
> Omaha is a long way from California. Seems you have no skin in the game in our market.
> 
> ...


That is a myopic view. It isn't about you. It isn't about CA per se. As CA goes, so goes the rest of the country. You are living in the test market and the results affect us all.

Uber hasn't figured out out to turn a profit. They probably never will. What we do know is they are increasing their margin on the backs of drivers. Uber doesn't care how much we earn unless it affects their ability to flood the market with drivers. Now that they have complete control in CA drivers will see pay drop and cherry pickers weeded out. It will seem less and less like a contractor arrangement until you turn off the driver app once and for all.


----------



## wallae (Jun 11, 2018)

I agree with the guy who said pointless endless debate that is all speculation (tilted towards the side you are on)
For every action there's a reaction



AvisDeene said:


> No, I wouldn't, but there is no guarantee that they would have made drivers employees. LyUber could have changed their business model to comply with the new law in order to actually make it so their drivers are truly independent contractors.
> 
> In the end, I don't blame LyUber for the driver suffering, I blame the drivers. If they have actually come together and protested LyUbers sleazy tactics, LyUber would have been forced to improve the situations for the drivers, but the majority of drivers were to busy worrying about making money in the now and not think about the future. All it would have taken would be for everyone to turn off the app one weekend a month and it would have made them come to the bargaining table.


I think guaranteed universal income of some thing in the area of say... 80,000 would solve a lot of these problems

That way the majority of drivers could be doing what they really want to do.... staying home drunk and high with hookers&#128515;


----------



## AcSlater (Oct 22, 2019)

I voted yes for prop 22... I wanted freedom of being independent... 

I thought if we were employees uber would limit drivers... 

I was wrong. F uber, hope Amazon creates something in this space and eliminates them. Not even a buy out, just let their platform die and be eliminated


----------



## Rideshare Dude (Aug 27, 2020)

AcSlater said:


> I voted yes for prop 22... I wanted freedom of being independent...
> 
> I thought if we were employees uber would limit drivers...
> 
> I was wrong. F uber, hope Amazon creates something in this space and eliminates them. Not even a buy out, just let their platform die and be eliminated


What makes you think Amazon would be any better?


----------



## AcSlater (Oct 22, 2019)

Rideshare Dude said:


> What makes you think Amazon would be any better?


They wouldn't, but right now I have a grudge with uber. I don't work for Amazon 'yet' so I can care less who takes uber down...

I'm petty , oh well. Amazon if they tried, would be the only ones to probably eliminate uber easily. Probably in 1 year if they wanted... Amazon could have AI drive or even invent teleportation and teleport people... I don't even care if they employ me. Just give uber what they deserve


----------



## Rideshare Dude (Aug 27, 2020)

AcSlater said:


> They wouldn't, but right now I have a grudge with uber. I don't work for Amazon 'yet' so I can care less who takes uber down...
> 
> I'm petty , oh well. Amazon if they tried, would be the only ones to probably eliminate uber easily. Probably in 1 year if they wanted... Amazon could have AI drive or even invent teleportation and teleport people... I don't even care if they employ me. Just give uber what they deserve


I did Amazon flex for a few months when they came to my city. It was good for a while until they started bringing on their own drivers and trucks. Then the independent flex drivers just got the shit routes clear out in the middle of nowhere.


----------



## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

wallae said:


> Well...
> I support myself.
> 
> I might not be able to get in the union.
> ...


Yes . You MAY get shaft with the Union .
But now you DO GET SHAFT with no remedy or way to complain.


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Judge and Jury said:


> Do you actually want to be a part time employee of these devious gig app companies?


no.


----------



## wallae (Jun 11, 2018)

SHalester said:


> no.


I do
Recently only accepting high airport surge trips from my couch 9 minutes away. Really 12 cause I have to wait for the elevator to the garage &#128514;


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

wallae said:


> Recently only accepting high airport surge trips from my couch 9 minutes away.


um, might have been a reply miss there. My 'no' was being an employee of Uber. I ain't going to be an employee of anybody. Been there, did my 30 years, done.

But, to what you do. I wish for what you do in that if I get 2-3 airport runs (all 3 airports are 45+ minutes away) I'm done for the day. Heck, just 2 to SFO (60+) I'm done for the day.

and yes, first ping is from media center. :thumbup: &#128250;


----------



## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

SHalester said:


> um, might have been a reply miss there. My 'no' was being an employee of Uber. I ain't going to be an employee of anybody. Been there, did my 30 years, done.
> 
> But, to what you do. I wish for what you do in that if I get 2-3 airport runs (all 3 airports are 45+ minutes away) I'm done for the day. Heck, just 2 to SFO (60+) I'm done for the day.
> 
> and yes, first ping is from media center. :thumbup: &#128250;


Why has to be either or? There is many option in the middle.


----------



## wallae (Jun 11, 2018)

SHalester said:


> um, might have been a reply miss there. My 'no' was being an employee of Uber. I ain't going to be an employee of anybody. Been there, did my 30 years, done.
> 
> But, to what you do. I wish for what you do in that if I get 2-3 airport runs (all 3 airports are 45+ minutes away) I'm done for the day. Heck, just 2 to SFO (60+) I'm done for the day.
> 
> and yes, first ping is from media center. :thumbup: &#128250;


It's a numbers game here
Some tiny $16 bucks for 10 minutes 
(Many times I get 2 of those)
Then 77 for 30


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

UberPotomac said:


> There is many option in the middle.


of course. Depends on how many pax are around. Depends on how many drivers are online. I'm happy with a few medium trips and a single long one to an airport. That's my day, I'd be done. don't ask for much. 3-4 hours, that's it.


----------



## Transportador (Sep 15, 2015)

I have no remorse voting for prop 22. It's real simple. Uber is evil and not changed due to 22. If I want to drive as a part timer, there is no way in hell I want to be an employee of Uber. Plus, even if we were to be employee of Uber, why would anybody think they would pay us more? The evil witch who put forth AB5 which became a law in CA was overreaching, meddling in labor laws that she had no idea of the impact to the workers. The world has evolved, and government still lags behind by 20 years in how to deal with new businesses and new ways of working.

If anyone wants to be an employee driver, there are the city buses, garbage trucks, and taxi companies.

Lyft has never showed upfront pricing, destination, and practically has no surge. Millions still drive for them, before and after Prop 22. Those people are making enough to keep driving.


----------



## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

As soon as driver numbers go up, next thing to go will be drivers that cancel too much.


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Seems


AvisDeene said:


> No, I wouldn't, but there is no guarantee that they would have made drivers employees. LyUber could have changed their business model to comply with the new law in order to actually make it so their drivers are truly independent contractors.
> 
> In the end, I don't blame LyUber for the driver suffering, I blame the drivers. If they have actually come together and protested LyUbers sleazy tactics, LyUber would have been forced to improve the situations for the drivers, but the majority of drivers were to busy worrying about making money in the now and not think about the future. All it would have taken would be for everyone to turn off the app one weekend a month and it would have made them come to the bargaining table.


Seems to me that AB5 required drivers to be employees. There was a little wiggle room for the lawyers, but they kept losing in courts at all state levels.


----------



## UberPotomac (Oct 8, 2016)

Judge and Jury said:


> Seems
> Seems to me that AB5 required drivers to be employees. There was a little wiggle room for the lawyers, but they kept losing in courts at all state levels.


I do think the majority of drivers want to keep a REAL IC status . The problem is with this " in between" due to U/L want the best of both worlds and do not want to concede an inch .


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

Rideshare Dude said:


> It wasn't there. Then it was there. Then it was gone.
> 
> That is a myopic view. It isn't about you. It isn't about CA per se. As CA goes, so goes the rest of the country. You are living in the test market and the results affect us all.
> 
> Uber hasn't figured out out to turn a profit. They probably never will. What we do know is they are increasing their margin on the backs of drivers. Uber doesn't care how much we earn unless it affects their ability to flood the market with drivers. Now that they have complete control in CA drivers will see pay drop and cherry pickers weeded out. It will seem less and less like a contractor arrangement until you turn off the driver app once and for all.


It is about me. I am a contractor.

Experiment, learn and adapt. Move on if it becomes unpropitable.

Prop. 22 was the lesser of evils. No ifs, ands, or buts.

No other offers were on the table. It was the horrors of AB5 or the prop. 22 alternative. I proudly voted for prop. 22 and all my numerous relatives and their contacts did likewise.

I make more than before, utilizing my same 
tactics. So far, I have had no reason to adapt.

Even though Uber and the others do not care about my profitably, I certainly care.

Weeding out cherry pickers is not as easy as it sounds. Goes to the core argument of contractors versus employees. Seems that declining non tip offers is the most effective way to side-step complaints and scammers that may lead to deactivation.

By the way, I have control, not the gig app companies, as opposed to employee status as mandated by AB5.

As CA goes, so goes the country? Hoping your state does not implement an AB5 solution.



Rideshare Dude said:


> True. But if Uber has an adequate supply of drivers they can control whether or not you receive any requests.


Yep.

That is why profitable contractors utilize more than one app.

Seems that if you stop going online for a few weeks, they will beg you to come back with outrageous quests.

While certainly limited, contractors have their own negotiating powers.

Experiment, learn and adapt.


----------



## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

Judge and Jury said:


> It is about me. I am a contractor.
> 
> Experiment, learn and adapt. Move on if it becomes unpropitable.
> 
> ...


Weeding out cherry pickers is very easy. Uber hasn't weeded you out because they need you.

For now.


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

observer said:


> Weeding out cherry pickers is very easy. Uber hasn't weeded you out because they need you.
> 
> For now.


Weeding out cherry pickers is very easy?

How would they do that?


----------



## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

You make more than the average driver.


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

observer said:


> You make more than the average driver.


Is that a contract violation?


----------



## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

When I would go through our Profit and Loss statements I would average out each product. Some locations were lower than average, some were higher.

I would single out those locations that were much higher than average and those that were much lower.

You'd be surprised at how much theft I caught that way.

In your case it wouldn't be theft, it's that you've figured out how to make more money than the average driver at Ubers expense.

You can be sure Uber knows about you. They just haven't chosen to act.



Judge and Jury said:


> Is that a contract violation?


Of course not.

But It's not in Ubers best long term interest to keep on drivers that make more than average.

They know who those drivers are and will eventually weed them out.


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

observer said:


> When I would go through our Profit and Loss statements I would average out each product. Some locations were lower than average, some were higher.
> 
> I would single out those locations that were much higher than average and those that were much lower.
> 
> ...


Your opinions regarding cherry picking seem foolish and you have no facts backing up your opinions other than a hunch.

Cherry picking is the core of the contractor versus employee status legal arguments and the gig app companies have been repeatedly spanked by the courts whenever acceptance rate is an issue.

Please provide a graph of earnings in my market showing that I am an outlier.


----------



## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

Judge and Jury said:


> Your opinions regarding cherry picking seem foolish and you have no facts backing up your opinions other than a hunch.
> 
> Cherry picking is the core of the contractor versus employee status legal arguments and the gig app companies have been repeatedly spanked by the courts whenever acceptance rate is an issue.
> 
> Please provide a graph of earnings in my market showing that I am an outlier.


Lol, YOU are the one bragging about cherry picking why do I need a graph?

Stick your neck out long enough, Uber will be sure to take a swing at it.


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

observer said:


> Lol, YOU are the one bragging about cherry picking why do I need a graph?
> 
> Stick your neck out long enough, Uber will be sure to take a swing at it.


Cuz you said I would be deactivated for making too much money.

How much is too much money?

Need a graph so I can be as unprofitable as you and avoid the risk of deactivation.


----------



## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

Let me guess

You're cherry picking the least profitable fares?



Judge and Jury said:


> Cuz you said I would be deactivated for making too much money.
> 
> How much is too much money?
> 
> Need a graph so I can be as unprofitable as you and avoid the risk of deactivation.


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

observer said:


> Lol, YOU are the one bragging about cherry picking why do I need a graph?
> 
> Stick your neck out long enough, Uber will be sure to take a swing at it.


Were you a supporter of AB5?

Assigned part time shift in nearby Inglewood from midnight 'til 4 am. Accept every offer or be fired for cause.

Experiment, learn and adapt.

Become an outlier and create above average profits.

Cherry picking is a tool. Knowing your market, and surrounding markets, out to Brea or Huntington Beach, is the path to profitability.

Why denigrate profitable contractors when you can become one one of them?


----------



## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

Judge and Jury said:


> Were you a supporter of AB5?
> 
> Assigned part time shift in nearby Inglewood from midnight 'til 4 am. Accept every offer or be fired for cause.
> 
> ...


Actually, yes I am a supporter of AB5.

I never denigrated any contractor, profitable or not.

I merely pointed out that it is in Ubers best interest to get rid of drivers that cost them too much money.

Become an outlier and you will become a target.


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

observer said:


> Let me guess
> 
> You're cherry picking the least profitable fares?


Yeah, right.

Instead of trolling profitable contractors, why don''t you become one?

Southern California is a vast market with great opportunity for all who treat their endeavors seriously.


----------



## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

BTW, I'm not saying don't cherry pick.

Do it as long as you can get away with it.


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

observer said:


> Actually, yes I am a supporter of AB5.
> 
> I never denigrated any contractor, profitable or not.
> 
> ...


AB5?

Home Depot and Costco are hiring. Great benefits and weekly paycheck security.

Still waiting on that outlier information.

As a moderator, does Uber provide you with inside information regarding secret deactivation policies?



observer said:


> BTW, I'm not saying don't cherry pick.
> 
> Do it as long as you can get away with it.


Cherry picking good.

Accept every offer bad.

Multi apping good.

Delivering two orders from competing apps bad.

Why are you so pissed regarding profitable contractors? Being profitable is the sole point of using gig app companies. What happened to you in one of the greatest markets in the world?


----------



## Woohaa (Jan 15, 2017)

Rideshare Dude said:


> Here's your buyers remorse.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm sure it was a nice read for anyone already a subscriber to that publication. &#128580;&#128530;


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

w


observer said:


> Weeding out cherry pickers is very easy.


what they need to weed out are the out of control cancel freaks. Tho shall not piss off the paying customer.......too often. &#129335;‍♂


----------



## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

observer said:


> When I would go through our Profit and Loss statements I would average out each product. Some locations were lower than average, some were higher.
> 
> I would single out those locations that were much higher than average and those that were much lower.
> 
> ...


Uber throws out offers and I accept or decline.

Are you saying that I am hacking offers sent out by Uber?

They send them out. If Uber did not want to send me an offer, that is their right.

But, they keep sending me offers.

So, you're saying I should accept all unprofitable offers and decline profitable offers so I won't be deactivated?

Do you realize how ridiculous that is?


----------



## PukersAreAlwaysYourFault (Mar 25, 2021)

Judge and Jury said:


> Weeding out cherry pickers is very easy?
> 
> How would they do that?


Comparison of acceptance rates and cancellation rates. If they aren't reasonable percentages and don't show loyalty to most opportunities, it's very easy to distinguish a picker from someone who seldom cancels and accepts most trips.


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

Judge and Jury said:


> AB5?
> 
> Home Depot and Costco are hiring. Great benefits and weekly paycheck security.
> 
> ...


:rollseyes:

Who said I was looking for work?

If you knew more about me you would know I don't care for Uber much.

Again, you read too much in to my posts.

I never said anything about being pissed about profitable contractors.



Judge and Jury said:


> Uber throws out offers and I accept or decline.
> 
> Are you saying that I am hacking offers sent out by Uber?
> 
> ...


:rollseyes:

Did you not read that I wrote Uber needs you right now?

That won't last.



SHalester said:


> w
> 
> what they need to weed out are the out of control cancel freaks. Tho shall not piss off the paying customer.......too often. &#129335;‍♂


&#129300;

Wouldn't that be the cherry pickers?


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

PukersAreAlwaysYourFault said:


> Comparison of acceptance rates and cancellation rates. If they aren't reasonable percentages and don't show loyalty to most opportunities, it's very easy to distinguish a picker from someone who seldom cancels and accepts most trips.


Unassigning is one thing and declining is another. Drivers can not cancel an order or ride, by the way.

Acceptance rate is meaningless. Completion rate is another story.

The freedom to accept or decline an offer goes to the heart of the contractor versus employee battles.

Loyalty? Lol.

So, declining unprofitable offers is our right as contractors.

Distinguishing cherry pickers is moot.



observer said:


> :rollseyes:
> 
> Who said I was looking for work?
> 
> ...


Not looking for work?

Then why are you in favor of AB5?


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## PukersAreAlwaysYourFault (Mar 25, 2021)

Acceptance rate is in fact, meaningful. It means people don't have to wait for drivers to continually bypass their request. If three nearby drivers to a client don't accept the trip, and the next closest person is 17 minutes away, that's no good for the client or the platform.

Cancellation rate is meaningful as well. Let's say you have a ******** cherry-picker with a slight conscience or who wants to pull a dick move accepting a request in the hopes of they wait it out, the customer will cancel. So they sit and wait 14 minutes on someone 21 minutes away (thanks to all of those non-accepting drivers). Probably an older lady at a subway station--who is an 8-minute drive--yet understandably doesn't want to walk 39 minutes in the dark, and is being accosted by a drugged-out wanderer and scary peeps hanging about. But the dick picker who doesn't care will wait it out. Then when they see the client isn't budging, they slowly make their way their way to them. One minute before actually arriving, the dick picker cancels. I haven't heard this story once, nor twice, nor thrice. It happens, and it happens all the time. It's sad. It's a shame. And there are many who cancel so their 87% non-acceptance rate doesn't go to 91%.

Bask in the glory of what you feel entitled to as an IC, but the truth of the matter is, is that you need Uber/Lyft, they don't need you. It's your business, but it's their platform. And if you wanna partner up, you can either give and take or be high and mighty in your corner. The latter, you will lose every time. You can't squeeze a sponge when there's nothing left.


Judge and Jury said:


> Unassigning is one thing and declining is another. Drivers can not cancel an order or ride, by the way.
> 
> Acceptance rate is meaningless. Completion rate is another story.
> 
> ...


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

PukersAreAlwaysYourFault said:


> Acceptance rate is in fact, meaningful. It means people don't have to wait for drivers to continually bypass their request. If three nearby drivers to a client don't accept the trip, and the next closest person is 17 minutes away, that's no good for the client or the platform.
> 
> Cancellation rate is meaningful as well. Let's say you have a @@@@@@@@ cherry-picker with a slight conscience or who wants to pull a dick move accepting a request in the hopes of they wait it out, the customer will cancel. So they sit and wait 14 minutes on someone 21 minutes away (thanks to all of those non-accepting drivers). Probably an older lady at a subway station--who is an 8-minute drive--yet understandably doesn't want to walk 39 minutes in the dark, and is being accosted by a drugged-out wanderer and scary peeps hanging about. But the dick picker who doesn't care will wait it out. Then when they see the client isn't budging, they slowly make their way their way to them. One minute before actually arriving, the dick picker cancels. I haven't heard this story once, nor twice, nor thrice. It happens, and it happens all the time. It's sad. It's a shame. And there are many who cancel so their 87% non-acceptance rate doesn't go to 91%.
> 
> Bask in the glory of what you feel entitled to as an IC, but the truth of the matter is, is that you need Uber/Lyft, they don't need you. It's your business, but it's their platform. And if you wanna partner up, you can either give and take or be high and mighty in your corner. The latter, you will lose every time. You can't squeeze a sponge when there's nothing left.


So, you are a charity providing rides at a loss to yourself.


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## PukersAreAlwaysYourFault (Mar 25, 2021)

Judge and Jury said:


> So, you are a charity providing rides at a loss to yourself.


What part of 'I actually profit' did you not understand? I get if your short-term recall is no bueno, but lost cause to send you a string.


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

PukersAreAlwaysYourFault said:


> A wealth of stupid ants fail to realize that everybody needs a ride. If they were only smart enough to service most people instead of rejecting 85% of requests, these features would have been able to stick around. Greed, selfishness, and ignorance will destroy the ants.


So, 85% of your offers are profitable? Must be a great market.



PukersAreAlwaysYourFault said:


> It isn't bs. The trouble in understanding is that it is not about you. It is about the customer, the client. You come second.


Nope. It is about me, my profit, food on the table and leak free roof over my head.

Ants a


PukersAreAlwaysYourFault said:


> A wealth of stupid ants fail to realize that everybody needs a ride. If they were only smart enough to service most people instead of rejecting 85% of requests, these features would have been able to stick around. Greed, selfishness, and ignorance will destroy the ants.


Ants are destroyed by accepting unprofitable offers.



Basketball 9to5 said:


> All of the driver's who supported this hideous prop 22 you ho get what you voted and asked for...200+ million to create a proposition while we had to endure this pandemic..Uber/Lyft is pathetic..for just leaving it's partners hanging


So. You wanted to be a part time employee of the devious gig app companies?

There were only two offers on the table. The horror of AB5 or prop. 22.


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

Judge and Jury said:


> Unassigning is one thing and declining is another. Drivers can not cancel an order or ride, by the way.
> 
> Acceptance rate is meaningless. Completion rate is another story.
> 
> ...


Meaningless to YOU.

I bet it's not meaningless to Uber.

Except you are NOT A CONTRACTOR. Uber has made sure of that.

Loyalty? Who said anything about loyalty. Uber has proven time and again that it has no loyalty to drivers.

You didn't mean that YOU were loyal to Uber, did you?

Again,

Distinguishing cherry pickers is moot to you. It is not moot to Uber.

That's why they are taking that feature back.


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

The Gift of Fish said:


> Right. Some supermarkets have already got rid of their employee delivery drivers and replaced them with gig workers.
> 
> A future change I see is for the supermarkets to make their cashiers "revenue processing contractors". They'll get paid $.01 per item scanned, and get no benefits or job protections. When they have a customer, they earn. When they don't, they don't. The companies can't be expected to pay when the worker is between customers, right? That would lead to people just logging on and avoiding work. -o:


Nope.

Customers can use the self scanning diy lanes.

Your scenario is already outdated.

(By the way, I always use the lanes serviced by employees.)


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

Judge and Jury said:


> Not looking for work?
> 
> Then why are you in favor of AB5?


No, I'm not looking for work.

Because Uber and its "employee/independent contractor model" is just the beginning of other industries taking away employee rights.

It may not affect you but if you have children, it will affect them.

One day you'll stop ubering, either by your choice or by Uber deactivating you.

It's just a matter of time.

But, what you will leave behind will have deep consequences to future employees.


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## PukersAreAlwaysYourFault (Mar 25, 2021)

Why was this posted under 'Advice' and not 'Complaints'?


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## alibaba40 (Mar 7, 2020)

In fact, UBER has changed now. My uber acceptance rate this week was 2%, and I only accepted 45 minutes of long ride. When there is no UBER, I open LYFT and do 3 rides with a reward of $15. If there is no reward? ? I open DOORDASH, I don't do things that don't have an hourly income guarantee.
I got a commercial driver's license, and when these are unreliable, I will drive a truck.


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## dnlbaboof (Nov 13, 2015)

as if being an employee would be better prop 22 is the lesser of 2 evils, with w-2 youd get 70% plus downsizing, no destination filter or ability to reject rides, on a shift 40 miles from your house in deadlock traffic on market st. with no health insurance for 13 bucks an hour.


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

observer said:


> No, I'm not looking for work.
> 
> Because Uber and its "employee/independent contractor model" is just the beginning of other industries taking away employee rights.
> 
> ...


My oldest son has already invested in real estate and my younger son is a couple of months from achieving a Master's degree in Business Administration.

Uber's policies have no affect on them. I'm sure they will teach their children as well as they have been mentored.

Seems your world is too tightly wound around the Uber universe.

It's a matter of time? Well, duh. We all gonna die some day. Based on my tactics, I will be deactivated a year after my death due to inactivity.

If you can't experiment, learn and adapt to the gig economy, move on and be happier.


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

Judge and Jury said:


> Nope.
> 
> Customers can use the self scanning diy lanes.
> 
> ...


No, lol, cashiers are not yet outdated, which is why they are still in supermarkets working. -o:


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## Judge and Jury (Oct 19, 2019)

dnlbaboof said:


> as if being an employee would be better prop 22 is the lesser of 2 evils, with w-2 youd get 70% plus downsizing, no destination filter or ability to reject rides, on a shift 40 miles from your house in deadlock traffic on market st. with no health insurance for 13 bucks an hour.


Seems you are doing it wrong.



observer said:


> Meaningless to YOU.
> 
> I bet it's not meaningless to Uber.
> 
> ...


Don't care about Uber. I follow their rules as required.

Experiment, learn and adapt

Be profitable.

Not rocket science.


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

Did someone say cherrypicking (cue @SHalester shocked emoji)?










Uber's not nearly as strict as Lyft is on cancellations. And no, despite my proselytizing Shuffling, those weren't Shuffles. They're unprofitable trips or going in a direction I don't want to go.

I cherrypicked like a mother****er and freely admit it.

When I turned the app on my goal wasn't to make friends, get laid, get out of the house or serve my community.

My goal was to make as much money as humanly possible. I did that by trying to take only high value trips.



observer said:


> Weeding out cherry pickers is very easy.





observer said:


> You make more than the average driver.


I personify both statements.

I exploited a glitch (that's unfortunately been fixed) that gave me access to Multiplier Surge instead of Charlotte Surge. My love of Longhauling meant on the majority of trips Uber actually lost money. This was pre-COVID. My per-trip average was insanely high, some weeks $30+/trip. If Uber did analyze stuff like that I'd have been flagged and sent packing.

I think in the grand scheme of things as long as you schlep people from Point A to B safely and not covered in bodily fluids Uber DGAF what you do, especially now.

When UI/PUA dries up it may change.


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

New2This said:


> Did someone say cherrypicking (cue @SHalester shocked emoji)?
> 
> View attachment 586661
> 
> ...


What has changed is that Uber bought the drivers seat.

They fully control drivers now.

Uber needed drivers that made money so they could show that drivers _*could*_ make good money. They no longer have to do that.

It's called _*salting the mine.*_

Hopefully I'm wrong.


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## Amos69 (May 17, 2019)

observer said:


> What has changed is that Uber bought the drivers seat.
> 
> They fully control drivers now.
> 
> ...


You are not, it's just like when they were emerging.


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## Paul Vincent (Jan 15, 2016)

observer said:


> Except you are NOT A CONTRACTOR. Uber has made sure of that.


Dara stated repeatedly prop 22 creates a third kind of worker. Also emphasized the ability to come and go as you please as a Rideshare driver.... FLEXIBILITY. Independent contractor...... hardly. Hats off to anybody who can still make decent money after all the rollbacks.

And now a $2,500 deductible.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

observer said:


> Wouldn't that be the cherry pickers?


ah, that was the point of my post¿

RS gigs will react to pissed off paying customers way sooner than disgruntled drivers. Right?



Judge and Jury said:


> So, you're saying I should accept all unprofitable offers and decline profitable offers so I won't be deactivated?


yeah, in calif that won't happen. as long as we are talking declines vs canceling after accepting.....that is....


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## ThrowInTheTowel (Apr 10, 2018)

observer said:


> No, I'm not looking for work.
> 
> Because Uber and its "employee/independent contractor model" is just the beginning of other industries taking away employee rights.
> 
> ...


True words of wisdom you speak. &#128077;


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## UrgentDilation (Mar 10, 2021)

Rideshare Dude said:


> Here's your buyers remorse.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You seem like you might have a YouTube channel.


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## Retired Senior (Sep 12, 2016)

Another Uber Driver said:


> From the article:
> 
> "........drivers cherry-pick lucrative rides and decline other requests,"
> 
> ...


This morning here in Connecticut I made (netted) $125 between 4 AM and 7 AM. I used about $15 worth of gas. I don't like driving these early hours but that is when the rides pay the best. Lyft plays a lot of games to **** with the drivers. One of the best is that I'll accept a rider and then find out it is a 2 stop trip. The first stop is usually 5 - 10 minutes (coffee and donut) when the Rider gets back into your car and you hit proceed, that's when you find out the second stop is an airport 2 hours away - and you are prohibited from picking up new rides until you are back in Ct. It took awhile for me to toughen up, but now I simply explain to the rider that coming back by myself eats any and all profit and I can not do it.
Yeah, I will never be a poster boy for Lyft, but I don't care all that much.


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## Escoman (Jun 28, 2016)

Rideshare Dude said:


> Uber used the trip information and rate setting as bribery to get drivers in California to support proposition 22. Once proposition 22 past there was no reason for Uber to leave it in place. I knew this was going to happen. So did many other intelligent drivers.


I love how they spin it to has to change because too many greedy drivers won't take shorties. Like They didn't already know it would happen? Who remembers how long giving us 6 destination filters lasted ? That also was to be temporary and We would get them back?


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## Tnasty (Mar 23, 2016)

wallae said:


> True
> But they don't
> As of today I can still "work" but turn down all requested trips except the ones I want


How do you know you want them?


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