# Autonomous cars without backup drivers could come to California roads before June



## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/10/...s-could-come-to-california-roads-before-june/


Fully autonomous vehicles - without backup drivers - could be on California public roads by June or earlier, the state's Department of Motor Vehicles said Wednesday as it unveiled a new version of proposed rules.


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

tomatopaste said:


> http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/10/...s-could-come-to-california-roads-before-june/
> 
> 
> Fully autonomous vehicles - without backup drivers - could be on California public roads by June or earlier, the state's Department of Motor Vehicles said Wednesday as it unveiled a new version of proposed rules.


I HATE YOU TOMATO!


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## airportsedan (Sep 24, 2015)

So congratulations to all UBERX drivers for paving the way....soon UBER will not need you anymore....


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

airportsedan said:


> So congratulations to all UBERX drivers for paving the way....soon UBER will not need you anymore....


You can't blame Uber for SDC's. It was going to happen eventually, Google just moved the time line up by five years.


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## airportsedan (Sep 24, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> You can't blame Uber for SDC's. It was going to happen eventually, Google just moved the time line up by five years.


So UBERX drivers making $1/mile will soon be replaced?


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

airportsedan said:


> So UBERX drivers making $1/mile will soon be replaced?


Yuppers


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## Sueuber (Jul 29, 2017)

Hooray!!!!!


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/10/...s-could-come-to-california-roads-before-june/
> 
> 
> Fully autonomous vehicles - without backup drivers - could be on California public roads by June or earlier, the state's Department of Motor Vehicles said Wednesday as it unveiled a new version of proposed rules.


1. Bring it
2. I miss Monica
3. Regardless of the SDC debate, Tomato is just a tool


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## roadman (Nov 14, 2016)

airportsedan said:


> So congratulations to all UBERX drivers for paving the way....soon UBER will not need you anymore....


who is going to change the flat tires?


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> 1. Bring it
> 2. I miss Monica
> 3. Regardless of the SDC debate, Tomato is just a tool


Tomato is a national treasure



roadman said:


> who is going to change the flat tires?


AAA. Google sends a new car for the pax and AAA for the car. Next question.


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

The lovely and smart (or at least smarter than Tomato) Monica once wrote:

"Clients ask us how they can convince people [who sincerely believe that self driving cars will never happen] , and we've started telling them, you can't. It's something people will have to watch unfold."

So... I say this to you Monica and Tomato:

How can we, professional workers in the transportation business, convince you that the numbers you are throwing around are not nearly enough to cover all the costs you will incur to run a transportation business?

Well.. we can't. It's something you will have to watch unfold.


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> The lovely and smart (or at least smarter than Tomato) Monica once wrote:
> 
> "Clients ask us how they can convince people [who sincerely believe that self driving cars will never happen] , and we've started telling them, you can't. It's something people will have to watch unfold."
> 
> ...


Gonna be fun, ain't it?


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> Gonna be fun, ain't it?


You missed your calling Tomato

You should have been a hype man for hip hop artists


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> You missed your calling Tomato
> 
> You should have been a hype man for hip hop artists


Opportunity costs are too great.


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## Gung-Ho (Jun 2, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/10/...s-could-come-to-california-roads-before-june/
> 
> 
> Fully autonomous vehicles - without backup drivers - could be on California public roads by June or earlier, the state's Department of Motor Vehicles said Wednesday as it unveiled a new version of proposed rules.


Just curios Tomato.

What is your stake in this sdc game? How do you benefit?

For informational purposes and perspective.

I am not a ride share driver these things pose no threat to me and my business.


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

Gung-Ho said:


> Just curios Tomato.
> 
> What is your stake in this sdc game? How do you benefit?
> 
> ...


Tomato will not reply because I think for legal reasons he's only contracted to give smart alec posts.

But, here's the deal. Google and GM will roll out SDC rideshare "very" soon. (Think of it like two companies out there like Uber and Lyft). How soon? "As early as June 2018."

So, who is Tomato? Well, he works for a company that is supposed to measure people's reaction to SDCs and the effects they will have on the existing economy. Apparently, the reason why his posts are very abrasive and arrogant and smart alec-y is because when he first started, they got like NO replies at all because people were so disbelieving that SDCs were really going to happen that no one cared. So then Tomato started being a jerk and all of a sudden the replies flowed like a river.

There's also this girl who goes by the name of "Monica" who at first claimed she was Tomato's intern but really she talks much more intelligently than he does. She is clearly the boss.

She laid out exactly what they do and why. I'll attach screenshots of her words below.

The general consensus among Uber drivers is that there will be a ton of reasons why it will be later rather than sooner that SDCs can successfully roll out as a rideshare company.

In a nutshell, the professional drivers have laid out a ton of logistical complications that Tomato and Monica have poo-poo'd.

In the end, it boiled down to Tomato saying "look, we know what we're doing and it's just going to work, ok?" At that point the uber drivers just sort of shrugged and walked away one by one.

I think what's happening here is both Google and GM have hired Tomato/Monica's company and they want to hear only affirmations that they can roll out SDCs very very soon and it will be a big hit.

In other words, Tomato literally HAS to put on the face that SDCs will be here and they will be successful because his bosses and clients are making him. Hey maybe at this point he even believes it himself.

Everyone else, every sane person, knows that if the SDC rideshare plan rolls out as quickly as they say and with little regard to all of the logistical concerns it will be a complete failure. Of course to hear Tomato put it, they all "thought of everything that could possibly be thought of," even though none of them has any practical business experience.

So, at this point we just wait and see.

It was a war of words/ideas for a hot minute back there, but ultimately now we just have to let things play out.

And that's who Tomato is. Or... maybe he's just some nut in his mom's basement? Anything is possible.


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## Gung-Ho (Jun 2, 2015)

Well thats a good explanation of Tomato. 

I disagree with Monica when she says drivers NEVER think sdc's will come. But as always the timetable for the roll out is ridiculously over optimistic.

Then it comes down to definition of what constitutes sdc's "arrival". Having one operate in a controlled area under ideal conditions even comercially in my mind does not mean they are here.

This technology isn't going from 0 to 100 in one second. when there are 1 million of them on the roads( still a small fraction of total vehicles) in all places under all conditions would be my definition of "arrived" and thats not happening for at least 10 years.


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

Gung-Ho said:


> Well thats a good explanation of Tomato.
> 
> I disagree with Monica when she says drivers NEVER think sdc's will come. But as always the timetable for the roll out is ridiculously over optimistic.
> 
> ...


Couple things:

1. I think "Monica" was talking more about society in general accepting SDCs not just uber drivers. I'm sure this is not the only social media board they are posting on.

2. It really doesn't matter about "reality" and being "overly optimistic", because no matter what, people like Tomato and Monica have to say that and pretend to believe it to be true. (Or hey maybe they believe it anyway).


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> Tomato will not reply because I think for legal reasons he's only contracted to give smart alec posts.
> 
> But, here's the deal. Google and GM will roll out SDC rideshare "very" soon. (Think of it like two companies out there like Uber and Lyft). How soon? "As early as June 2018."
> 
> ...


What is your stake in this sdc game? How do you benefit? 
_I don't benefit directly, other than some small insider trading. That was a joke. THAT WAS A JOKE!, SEC._​Tomato will not reply because I think for legal reasons he's only contracted to give smart alec posts.
_You don't know what Tomato will do, he's very unpredictable._​As early as June 2018.
_Google will launch as early as this month, October._​...but really she talks much more intelligently than he does...
_Bullshit!_​The general consensus among Uber drivers is that there will be a ton of reasons why it will be later rather than sooner that SDCs can successfully roll out as a rideshare company.
_The general consensus among 'Uber People drivers' who can't be bothered to do any actual research but rather spend all day giving each other reach-arounds, is it's a long way off. "Do you have any facts to back up that claim?" "No, we voted on it after careful consideration of everyone's feelings."_​In a nutshell, the professional drivers have laid out a ton of logistical complications that Tomato and Monica have poo-poo'd.
_"In a nutshell we made up a bunch of crap when we were unable to refute Tomato and Monica's numbers."_​In the end, it boiled down to Tomato saying "look, we know what we're doing and it's just going to work, ok?" At that point the uber drivers just sort of shrugged and walked away one by one.
_In the end Tomato and Monica refused to buy their bs. This is not new, in fact Tomato and Monica even coined a term called 'The Lord of The Flies' effect._​
_Where the loudest Cliff Clavins in any particular group start throwing around 'F' bombs and calling anyone that fails to accept the agreed upon norm, idiots and clowns, and demand they be shunned from the group. This tends to drown out most dissenting voices and gives a false picture of unanimity._​I think what's happening here is both Google and GM have hired Tomato/Monica's company and they want to hear only affirmations that they can roll out SDCs very very soon and it will be a big hit.
_"I really have no idea what's going on and have too much time on my hands so I make up false personas about people I know almost nothing about it order to denigrate them. People like Tomato that slap me around in public."_​


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> What is your stake in this sdc game? How do you benefit?
> _I don't benefit directly, other than some small insider trading. That was a joke. THAT WAS A JOKE!, SEC._​Tomato will not reply because I think for legal reasons he's only contracted to give smart alec posts.
> _You don't know what Tomato will do, he's very unpredictable._​As early as June 2018.
> _Google will launch as early as this month, October._​...but really she talks much more intelligently than he does...
> ...


1. You really need to treat Monica with more respect. Are you another Harvey Weinstein?
2. We the drivers are not making up BS, we are talking about the REAL costs that we experience everyday. We are not sitting around an office "dreaming up" what expenses we may encounter.
3. I wouldn't say I "have no idea" I like to say I'm making educated guesses on just about everything I've said here.
4. Re: tomato "slapping me around in public" I have to wonder what reason you have for "slapping" anyone around? That's not professional in the least. You want to debate ideas, fine. But there should be no "slapping around". That's... weird.
5. Your arrogance is especially... strange. Perhaps you need therapy?

Again, I'll repeat myself since you tend to forget things: if you wish to debate ideas with me that's fine. But when you get personal, and immature about it, and especially when you try to be cute or funny, there's just no reason for any of that.

Finally, I just want to say: I think maybe it's best if Monica takes over the Tomato account. I think she's a far better professional representation of your firm than the Tomato is.


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

Also, let's say I am right. Do you know how long it's going to be before everything plays out to prove me right?

Years. 

Tomato could just keep saying "0h you're wrong" over and over again whether or not it's true because he knows that by the time anything could happen to prove me right it would be so far down the road.

Politicians use this same tactic all the time.


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> Also, let's say I am right. Do you know how long it's going to be before everything plays out to prove me right?
> 
> Years.
> 
> ...


So you think Google is going to launch in Phoenix then just sit around for years with their thumb up their butt?


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> So you think Google is going to launch in Phoenix then just sit around for years with their thumb up their butt?


It will be years before it expands from one market to all. And if there's a hiccup, even longer.

You are assuming that this is going to roll out smoothly. Nothing is ever smooth.

Also, let's say a month after the Phoenix debut and the results are, shall we say, not so great. You think Google is going to admit defeat? No way! They are going to spin the PR and say something like "we need to give this time to develop..." hence, years.


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> It will be years before it expands from one market to all. And if there's a hiccup, even longer.
> 
> You are assuming that this is going to roll out smoothly. Nothing is ever smooth.
> 
> Also, let's say a month after the Phoenix debut and the results are, shall we say, not so great. You think Google is going to admit defeat? No way! They are going to spin the PR and say something like "we need to give this time to develop..." hence, years.


Yes I am assuming it's going to roll out smoothly. What's on your list of horribles that's going to prevent it from snowballing?


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> Yes I am assuming it's going to roll out smoothly. What's on your list of horribles that's going to prevent it from snowballing?


I already told you. But you apparently didn't hear me.

In the words of Monica: "I can't convince you. We're just going to have to let it all unfold."


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> I already told you. But you apparently didn't hear me.
> 
> In the words of Monica: "I can't convince you. We're just going to have to let it all unfold."


Ok what's your top horrible? If you were granted one wish, what would you wish for to go wrong with Google's SDC launch in Phoenix?


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> Ok what's your top horrible? If you were granted one wish, what would you wish for to go wrong with Google's SDC launch in Phoenix?


There is no "top" horrible- there are like ten horribles that any or all could happen. I already told you what all ten are. To refresh your memory, in no particular order:

1. With no "human" to call if the pax cannot find the car, it will be very frustrating and you will lose customers.
2. The operating costs will be much higher than you think
3. Vandalism
4. Building a recharging infrastructure will be harder and costlier than you think
5. Deadmiles. There will be many
6. Recharging will be a hassle. You can't just pull up to a gas station on any corner-- you will have to drive all the way back to a charging station-- that you have to build.
7. Where will the car park between rides? Humans know how to finesse it, does a machine?
8. Maintenance 
9. What if it takes longer than "17 days"(your words) for people to accept a driverless car?
10. Insurance, regulations, laws, and lawsuits.

These are just off the top of my head. There are probably more.

But here's the thing. You already said on other posts that, basically, all of these "horribles" are not important and they will turn out to be not a big deal at all. So at this point, again, I simply cannot convince you

Again, I just have to, as Monica said: "wait until things unfold".


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> There is no "top" horrible- there are like ten horribles that any or all could happen. I already told you what all ten are. To refresh your memory, in no particular order:
> 
> 1. With no "human" to call if the pax cannot find the car, it will be very frustrating and you will lose customers.
> 2. The operating costs will be much higher than you think
> ...


With no "human" to call if the pax cannot find the car, it will be very frustrating and you will lose customers.
_There will be a number to call and a human will pick up. "Are you in the red coat two feet in front of me?"_​The operating costs will be much higher than you think.
_Based on what? Do you have hard numbers or is this just your hope?_​Vandalism.
_How will vandalism be more of a problem for a car that is monitored 24/7 as opposed to a car sitting in a parking lot with no cameras or sensors?_​Building a recharging infrastructure will be harder and costlier than you think.
_Again, based on what? What you hope will happen?_​Dead miles. There will be many.
_There will be far fewer dead miles when the company assigning the rides, and driving the rides is one in the same._​Recharging will be a hassle. You can't just pull up to a gas station on any corner-- you will have to drive all the way back to a charging station-- that you have to build.
_No human's time is spent driving anywhere, the car drives itself._​Where will the car park between rides? Humans know how to finesse it, does a machine?
_Humans will be in the command center if the car needs help. The car will learn where to park between rides just like humans do._​Maintenance.
_Google's launch in Phoenix is going to fail due to maintenance?_​What if it takes longer than "17 days"(your words) for people to accept a driverless car?
_What if it takes less than seventeen days?_​Insurance.
_Insurance liability will be greatly reduced due to the fact SDC's don't cause accidents. Just like they haven't caused an accident in the 3.5 million miles Google cars have driven thus far in everyday traffic_.​Regulations, laws.
_There are no regulations or laws that will hinder Google's launch in Phoenix. _​_Lawsuits._
_Lawsuits about what?
_​This is why you are not taken seriously by either myself or Monica.

Now let's make a list why self driving cars are better for the company and better for the passenger.


Safer to send your 6 yr old in a self driving car than have her walk to school.
Far more profitable for the company.
Less hassle, more privacy. Don't have to have an awkward conversation with the driver and don't have to ride with a stranger, the driver.
Mothers won't have to be in three places at once. One kid at band practice, one at dance, one at soccer.
Nicer newer cars.
Ten times safer than human driven cars.
Costs less than Uber or taxis.
More reliable, no drivers canceling on you.


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> With no "human" to call if the pax cannot find the car, it will be very frustrating and you will lose customers.
> _There will be a number to call and a human will pick up. "Are you in the red coat two feet in front of me?"_​The operating costs will be much higher than you think.
> _Based on what? Do you have hard numbers or is this just your hope?_​Vandalism.
> _How will vandalism be more of a problem for a car that is monitored 24/7 as opposed to a car sitting in a parking lot with no cameras or sensors?_​Building a recharging infrastructure will be harder and costlier than you think.
> ...


Sir, I believe I predicted you would reply this way and I thought I directly or indirectly asked you not to bother.

I already heard all of your arguments before and they amount to I say one thing and you come back with something else. I'm tired of it. Don't listen to me. Just wait for it to unfold.

Oh by the way.... there will be a number to call? There will be a camera on the car that a person at a call center will be able to have access to and can see the pax in real time?

Gee, I don't see any mention of the cost of running this call center nor the cost of maintaining the hardware and software of a camera system like that... but you "thought of every cost" right?

Also... I don't mean vandalism like the pax are going to take a baseball bat to the car... I mean they will be careless. Spilling drinks which will seep into the carpet and have mold grow, smearing lipstick, dropping gum, etc etc.

Again, another cost that will add up but you are unaware of.

It's not the major destruction vandalism that will do you in, it's the little costs for this kind upkeep that will spiral out of control unless they are looked after-- and if they are looked after they will need to be paid for. And you haven't accounted for any payment for this.

And before you come back to me with the same reply about how you will have cameras in the car, you will capture all vandalism, you will charge the pax a cleaning fee...
What about things not caught on camera? How can you tell for example who's lipstick got on the upholstery? And what of the cost for some kind of team to inspect the cars?

And on and on we go again....


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> This is what happens when you force these yahoos to put their cards on the table. They end up looking foolish. Your list of horribles was truly pathetic, sad, and quite embarrassing.


OMG.. you're like a broken record!* All you ever do is say I'm dumb and my arguments are weak.

Didn't we go over this?

I'll repeat it one last time:

I give you insight that's based on years of business experience, yet you say I'm a "yahoo".

Ok, that's fine, I'm not mad at you. I just can't convince you. The only way you will be convinced is to see it unfold. So let's just let that happen.

* "broken record" is an expression you might not understand. You see, before there was Spotify, and iTunes, and aux chords, the way we listened to our music was on VINYL. And if the vinyl got a scratch on it the song would skip and then loop over and over again. Hence the term "you're like a broken record"


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## Dug_M (Feb 16, 2017)

I have a random thought.... How are driver-less cars going to keep people from eating in the car? Or leaving the leftover remains of a bucket of chicken in the back seat and maybe some greasy chicken parts on the seat.... Another thought will they have a puke detector? hmmm or a way to prevent graffiti on the inside/outside of the cars... People without supervision can and will do bad things. I don't see having a camera would be deterrent if they were not live feeds. And if the camera were live who would be watching them and what would that cost? I guess that was more then 1 thought...


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

Dug_M said:


> I have a random thought.... How are driver-less cars going to keep people from eating in the car? Or leaving the leftover remains of a bucket of chicken in the back seat and maybe some greasy chicken parts on the seat.... Another thought will they have a puke detector? hmmm or a way to prevent graffiti on the inside/outside of the cars... People without supervision can and will do bad things. I don't see having a camera would be deterrent if they were not live feeds. And if the camera were live who would be watching them and what would that cost? I guess that was more then 1 thought...


Sir, you cannot bring questions like this to the Tomato. I've done it before and all I got in reply was "we got cameras! If you mess up the car we will know it's you and we charge you the clean up charge. It's all taken care of!"

Let's see if he can give an answer that's a little more detailed than that.... (doubtful)


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> Sir, I believe I predicted you would reply this way and I thought I directly or indirectly asked you not to bother.
> 
> I already heard all of your arguments before and they amount to I say one thing and you come back with something else. I'm tired of it. Don't listen to me. Just wait for it to unfold.
> 
> ...


Van´dal`ism
*n.* *1.* The spirit or conduct of the Vandals; ferocious cruelty; hostility to the arts and literature, or willful destruction or defacement of any object of beauty or value.

So you were referring to: hostility to the arts and literature


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> Van´dal`ism
> *n.* *1.* The spirit or conduct of the Vandals; ferocious cruelty; hostility to the arts and literature, or willful destruction or defacement of any object of beauty or value.
> 
> So you were referring to: hostility to the arts and literature


Dug_M you see what we're dealing with over here?


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## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

tomatopaste said:


> Van´dal`ism
> *n.* *1.* The spirit or conduct of the Vandals; ferocious cruelty; hostility to the arts and literature, or willful destruction or defacement of any object of beauty or value.
> 
> So you were referring to: hostility to the arts and literature


He is referring to "willful destruction or defacement of any object of value".

So you are trolling us here, because (like your friend describes it) "you are quite good at it"?

All you are good at is to be be publicly humiliated...


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

jocker12 said:


> He is referring to "willful destruction or defacement of any object of value".
> 
> So you are trolling us here, because (like your friend describes it) "you are quite good at it"?
> 
> All you are good at is to be be publicly humiliated...


The Tomato is being paid to Troll because trolling is how he gets replies and his company analyzes every reply so they can study how society lives because apparently none of them have lives and they have no idea how humans interact with each other.


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

jocker12 said:


> He is referring to "willful destruction or defacement of any object of value".
> 
> So you are trolling us here, because (like your friend describes it) "you are quite good at it"?
> 
> All you are good at is to be be publicly humiliated...


This is why we coined the term 'Lord of the Flies effect'. No one is allowed to disagree with the accepted norms of the ruling Cliff Clavins or you're accused of trolling and possibly a civil rights violation.



jocker12 said:


> He is referring to "willful destruction or defacement of any object of value".
> 
> So you are trolling us here, because (like your friend describes it) "you are quite good at it"?
> 
> All you are good at is to be be publicly humiliated...


"Also... I don't mean vandalism like the pax are going to take a baseball bat to the car... I mean they will be careless. Spilling drinks which will seep into the carpet and have mold grow, smearing lipstick, dropping gum, etc etc."

You can understand my confusion, right?


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> This is why we coined the term 'Lord of the Flies effect'. No one is allowed to disagree with the accepted norms of the ruling Cliff Clavins or you're accused of trolling and possibly a civil rights violation.
> 
> "Also... I don't mean vandalism like the pax are going to take a baseball bat to the car... I mean they will be careless. Spilling drinks which will seep into the carpet and have mold grow, smearing lipstick, dropping gum, etc etc."
> 
> You can understand my confusion, right?


Cliff Clavin is a character on a tv show that was on the air before the Tomato was even born



tomatopaste said:


> This is why we coined the term 'Lord of the Flies effect'. No one is allowed to disagree with the accepted norms of the ruling Cliff Clavins or you're accused of trolling and possibly a civil rights violation.
> 
> "Also... I don't mean vandalism like the pax are going to take a baseball bat to the car... I mean they will be careless. Spilling drinks which will seep into the carpet and have mold grow, smearing lipstick, dropping gum, etc etc."
> 
> You can understand my confusion, right?


I understand the Tomato more than the Tomato thinks I do.


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> 1. You really need to treat Monica with more respect. Are you another Harvey Weinstein?
> 2. We the drivers are not making up BS, we are talking about the REAL costs that we experience everyday. We are not sitting around an office "dreaming up" what expenses we may encounter.
> 3. I wouldn't say I "have no idea" I like to say I'm making educated guesses on just about everything I've said here.
> 4. Re: tomato "slapping me around in public" I have to wonder what reason you have for "slapping" anyone around? That's not professional in the least. You want to debate ideas, fine. But there should be no "slapping around". That's... weird.
> ...


Our company motto is: If you want someone to kiss your ass, hire a hooker.


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> Our company motto is: If you want someone to kiss your ass, hire a hooker.


I would never expect such vile and juvenile language from Monica


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## UberLaLa (Sep 6, 2015)

Er umh....uh tomatopaste _Stupid much?_


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

UberLaLa said:


> Er umh....uh tomatopaste _Stupid much?_


Come on, the Tomato is not stupid

It takes skill to cut and paste the copy points his boss emailed to him


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## itsablackmarket (May 12, 2015)

I for one knew they would come very quickly. But then again, I'm smart.

It has already effected me. Just knowing that they're coming has prevented me from certain decisions. If they had not been coming so soon, I would have invested more deeply into this venture and my life would have been completely different. Now, I will be 30+ living at home with my parents with no income, when I could've instead been living independently and moving onto my next venture. That's okay though. What goes around comes around.

We all know the main motivation for removing the driver from the equation is greed, not need.


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## Spotscat (May 8, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> Come on, the Tomato is not stupid
> 
> It takes skill to cut and paste the copy points his boss emailed to him


The choice of "TomatoPaste" as a username is quite revealing!

Whereas a tomato used to be a robust, flavorful fruit, bursting with delicious goodness in every bite, years of genetic modifications have left us with the cardboard flavored item found in grocery stores and on your double-cheese Whopper.

400+ species of tomatoes, and science has reduced the commercially readily available fruit down to three or four types.

"Better living through chemistry"? Hardly.


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

UberLaLa said:


> Er umh....uh tomatopaste _Stupid much?_


Take it up with your DMV, ok Sparky?

Fully autonomous vehicles - without backup drivers - could be on California public roads by June or earlier, the state's Department of Motor Vehicles said Wednesday as it unveiled a new version of proposed rules for self-driving cars.

http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/10/...s-could-come-to-california-roads-before-june/



iheartuber said:


> Come on, the Tomato is not stupid
> 
> It takes skill to cut and paste the copy points his boss emailed to him


Well the whole, "if you wish to debate ideas with me that's fine. But when you get personal" thing lasted about an hour and a half. Good job.

"Again, I'll repeat myself since you tend to forget things: if you wish to debate ideas with me that's fine. But when you get personal..."



Spotscat said:


> The choice of "TomatoPaste" as a username is quite revealing!
> 
> Whereas a tomato used to be a robust, flavorful fruit, bursting with delicious goodness in every bite, years of genetic modifications have left us with the cardboard flavored item found in grocery stores and on your double-cheese Whopper.
> 
> ...


Uh oh, it's the Tomato against the entire UP reach-around brigade. Oh the humanity!


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> Take it up with your DMV, ok Sparky?
> 
> Fully autonomous vehicles - without backup drivers - could be on California public roads by June or earlier, the state's Department of Motor Vehicles said Wednesday as it unveiled a new version of proposed rules for self-driving cars.
> 
> ...


I gotta get a little personal. It's no fun otherwise

As for the state of California pushing SDCs thru fast, you must not know a lot about Cali politics. The short answer: they want kickback$. A lot of them. Didja budget for those?


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> I gotta get a little personal. It's no fun otherwise
> 
> As for the state of California pushing SDCs thru fast, you must not know a lot about Cali politics. The short answer: they want kickback$. A lot of them. Didja budget for those?


You must not understand markets very well. Silicon Valley owns California. Did that fact slip right past you? Shocking.


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> You must not understand markets very well. Silicon Valley owns California. Did that fact slip right past you? Shocking.


you are one arrogant SOB! And you wonder why I get personal with you...


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

Get yer paintball guns and Silly string... Open season on SDC uber cars...


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## Strange Fruit (Aug 10, 2016)

Why didn't it post the whole article?
In 18 months they'll be allowed in places with light traffic and a few other restrictions like that. 
I've seen video of someone sleeping while their Tesla drove in traffic.


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> you are one arrogant SOB! And you wonder why I get personal with you...


but you're allowed to post stuff like this, cause, otherwise it's no fun, right?

"As for the state of California pushing SDCs thru fast, you must not know a lot about Cali politics. The short answer: they want kickback$. A lot of them. Didja budget for those?"


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## UberLaLa (Sep 6, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> Take it up with your DMV, ok Sparky?
> 
> Fully autonomous vehicles - without backup drivers - could be on California public roads by June or earlier, the state's Department of Motor Vehicles said Wednesday as it unveiled a new version of proposed rules for self-driving cars.
> 
> ...


I don't completely disagree with what you say...it's the how that sux.



tomatopaste said:


> You must not understand markets very well. Silicon Valley owns California. Did that fact slip right past you? Shocking.


No it don't....Entertainment Industry owns California.


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> but you're allowed to post stuff like this, cause, otherwise it's no fun, right?
> 
> "As for the state of California pushing SDCs thru fast, you must not know a lot about Cali politics. The short answer: they want kickback$. A lot of them. Didja budget for those?"


Hey man, I'll say it again:

I cannot convince you that an SDC taxi service will be riddled with challenges. You're just gonna have to watch it unfold.

The barbs we each throw on either side is just a by-product of frustration. No need to be frustrated, we just wait.


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## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

tomatopaste said:


> So you think Google is going to launch in Phoenix then just sit around for years with their thumb up their butt?


Do you know how many important projects, that looked very promising (and sometime humanitary) Google shut down? You probably are not very familiar with or educated about their biggest failures.

*Google confirms the end of its modular Project Ara smartphone

Why Google Glass Broke
Founder Of Google Eyewear Partner "Embarrassed" By Glass

Why Google's secret lab gave up on space elevators, hoverboards, and teleportation

Project Loon - *Google says that "We believe that it might actually be possible to build a ring of balloons, flying around the globe on the stratospheric winds, that provides Internet access to the earth below." but "You won't be surprised to learn that Google hasn't specified what spent on this project, nor how much it intends to spend. Neither has the company offered any cost data for any of the equipment used or any indication of how many of its own employees are Loonies." Anyway "Google is giving away hugely expensive fiber-based Internet access (in the U.S.), but not because it's a charity. Google knows that the more people that spend time online, the more likely they will spend money with Google."

*Boston Dynamics employees were frustrated with Google's plan for a household robot

Google tries to breathe new life into Google+ with site redesign

...and all these 68 other failed projects

*
Now, all of us adults here know how launching a product has no connection whatsoever with the idea of actually making that product a real success.

I understand your initial job was "to monitor driver's reaction to the upcoming self-driving transformation" and had nothing to do with you trolling the internet. Monitoring is something, trolling is something else. Follow my finger please........ *stop trolling*, because Google doesn't want this. If you cannot monitor, or there is nothing to monitor, tough luck. Spreading fake news, fake advertisements or trying to irritate drivers into saying something, it will end up badly on your part. You could be the next Google's failure. Seriously!


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

jocker12 said:


> Do you know how many important projects, that looked very promising (and sometime humanitary) Google shut down? You probably are not very familiar with or educated about their biggest failures.
> 
> *Google confirms the end of its modular Project Ara smartphone
> 
> ...


Tomato's boss "Monica" (prob not her real name) let it slip once that they NEED to get replies, any replies. And only by "shaking things up" (her words), aka "trolling" were they able to get any reply at all.

In short, Tomato's boss told him to troll


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## Spotscat (May 8, 2017)

UberLaLa said:


> No it don't....Entertainment Industry owns California.


Lex Luthor owns California - except for Otisburg.


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## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

iheartuber said:


> Tomato's boss "Monica" (prob not her real name) let it slip once that they NEED to get replies, any replies. And only by "shaking things up" (her words), aka "trolling" were they able to get any reply at all.
> 
> In short, Tomato's boss told him to troll


There is a fundamental error in judgement to try to have an input as long as Google asked you to monitor and not to have any inputs. Why is Google doing this? Because they don't want to have random entities speak in their name because people do and say stupid things. Google wants their PR work to be handled by Google, not by children thinking they are doing Google a favor.

If you don't know how to do the PR, there is a high risk of getting opposite effects to what you initially wanted to achieve. If we stay on this example, by trolling UberPeople and not knowing what you are doing (engaging in childish exchanges instead of valuing your partners of dialogue opinions), eventually you will find few people that are very familiar with your topic of interest, that will destroy you publicly. The problem for Google is that, along with the messenger (which they don't care about) getting humiliated and destroyed, their message will also get publicly humiliated and destroyed.

The difference here is made by the people having the information and the knowledge which are engaging and unfolding their data gradually in only one place. Because of that, any person interested in that topic is going to be able to rapidly understand the mind game all the corporations are playing with the general public. In other words, if the children wouldn't have had the pathetic initiative to troll the internet, the general public interested in the topic, otherwise confused and divided, wouldn't have had the chance to access those knowledgeable people work so easily.

In this case, anybody is only few clicks away from the inevitable and inconvenient truth about the self driving cars scam.

This is the one of the main reasons Google wants their partners to monitor forums on internet, instead of having them interacting with the users. This is not about a transportation revolution or saving lives, like all the corporations involved are pretending. This is about them constantly lying about their intentions and their products in order to extract money from the idiots and make profits for themselves. The corporations will always try to shift the discussion in case they are called about this, because once exposed they will face the great danger of losing their customers trust, the only psychological trigger they need to control in order to increase their profits.


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

jocker12 said:


> There is a fundamental error in judgement to try to have an input as long as Google asked you to monitor and not to have any inputs. Why is Google doing this? Because they don't want to have random entities speak in their name because people do and say stupid things. Google wants their PR work to be handled by Google, not by children thinking they are doing Google a favor.
> 
> If you don't know how to do the PR, there is a high risk of getting opposite effects to what you initially wanted to achieve. If we stay on this example, by trolling UberPeople and not knowing what you are doing (engaging in childish exchanges instead of valuing your partners of dialogue opinions), eventually you will find few people that are very familiar with your topic of interest, that will destroy you publicly. The problem for Google is that, along with the messenger (which they don't care about) getting humiliated and destroyed, their message will also get publicly humiliated and destroyed.
> 
> ...


If the business plan of Google for a SDC taxi service was to extract the cost of paying a driver and keep all the money themselves that's fine-- just so long as they operate from a point where they are taking in enough revenue to cover their expenses.

The uber model may pay drivers 75%+ of the revenue but uber also benefits by pushing most of the responsibilities on to the driver. In a driverless situation those costs of responsibility need to be accounted for in order to see a profit and I'm sorry, but at 35 cents a mile no way!


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> This isn't an Uber forum, it's a virtual bathhouse for sad sack lonely social justice warriors


I'm an uber driver. I face a certain set of challenges in my job and I come here to discuss them and vent with other drivers.

I appreciate the fact that this forum exists and allows a place where ideas can be exchanged.

My job is far from a perfect situation but it's not all bad either. I acknowledge that.


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## roadman (Nov 14, 2016)

tomatopaste said:


> Tomato is a national treasure
> 
> AAA. Google sends a new car for the pax and AAA for the car. Next question.


If you think for $59 per year per vehicle, AAA is going to service these vehicles you are mistaken. A sdc car on the road 24/7 is going to get a lot more flats then an average car. AAA will do it but they are going to charge a lot more money.

All AAA is going to do is swap on the donut. The car still has to limp back to home base and have the tire repaired and put back on.


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## PrestonT (Feb 15, 2017)

Welp if SDC are going to be out next June or even this month, I hope it has better GPS than we do.

And I can't wait to sit and watch the first SDC trying to turn off the Las Vegas Strip into Paris North Entrance, where a steady stream of zombie tourists walk across the driveway and only let you through if you start nudging forward.

I'm a little jealous of tomato.....who knew one could get paid to troll by someone other than Russia?


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## UberLaLa (Sep 6, 2015)

PrestonT said:


> Welp if SDC are going to be out next June or even this month, I hope it has better GPS than we do.
> 
> And I can't wait to sit and watch the first *SDC trying to turn off the Las Vegas Strip into Paris North Entrance, where a steady stream of zombie tourists walk across the driveway* and only let you through if you start nudging forward.
> 
> I'm a little jealous of tomato.....who knew one could get paid to troll by someone other than Russia?


An SDC will simply sit there and sit there and sit there...passengers will be stepping out into traffic and what not, right and left in the early SDC's.


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## PrestonT (Feb 15, 2017)

UberLaLa said:


> An SDC will simply sit there and sit there and sit there...passengers will be stepping out into traffic and what not, right and left in the early SDC's.


Exactly.

"I'm sorry, Dave. I'm afraid I can't do that"


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## UberLaLa (Sep 6, 2015)

PrestonT said:


> Exactly.
> 
> "I'm sorry, Dave. I'm afraid I can't do that"


Navigation always tries to tell me to take the _Regular_ on ramp transition from the 105 East bound to 110 North bound, rather than staying in the FastTrak. Certain time of days this would easily add 20-30 minutes time to the drive. Since the regular ramp is Metered and can back up for a half mile to two lane Yuk...then one can't get back into the FastTrak lane for a couple miles of dead stopped traffic.

I can only imagine passenger sitting in SDC as it exits the speeding along FastTrak to sit in that nightmare. _Hey, where you going!? Nooooooooooooooooooo.........._


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

roadman said:


> If you think for $59 per year per vehicle, AAA is going to service these vehicles you are mistaken. A sdc car on the road 24/7 is going to get a lot more flats then an average car. AAA will do it but they are going to charge a lot more money.
> 
> All AAA is going to do is swap on the donut. The car still has to limp back to home base and have the tire repaired and put back on.







Next question please. Yes you in the back.


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## PrestonT (Feb 15, 2017)

Actually, even with traditional tires, any city that would have a large number of SDCs, like Las Vegas, would have a dedicated service department that repaired or recovered their cars. Volume would be high enough to do it in-house.


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

PrestonT said:


> Welp if SDC are going to be out next June or even this month, I hope it has better GPS than we do.
> 
> And I can't wait to sit and watch the first SDC trying to turn off the Las Vegas Strip into Paris North Entrance, where a steady stream of zombie tourists walk across the driveway and only let you through if you start nudging forward.
> 
> I'm a little jealous of tomato.....who knew one could get paid to troll by someone other than Russia?


SDC's don't use GPS. 






PrestonT said:


> Actually, even with traditional tires, any city that would have a large number of SDCs, like Las Vegas, would have a dedicated service department that repaired or recovered their cars. Volume would be high enough to do it in-house.


Correct. Eventually Google will bring it in house for now:
*Waymo and Avis Reach Deal Over Self-Driving Cars' Maintenance*
*https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/26/business/waymo-avis-deal-self-driving-cars-maintenance.html*



tomatopaste said:


> SDC's don't use GPS.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


delete the


tomatopaste said:


> SDC's don't use GPS.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Whoops. Here is the video showing the 3d maps SDC's use.


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## roadman (Nov 14, 2016)

PrestonT said:


> Actually, even with traditional tires, any city that would have a large number of SDCs, like Las Vegas, would have a dedicated service department that repaired or recovered their cars. Volume would be high enough to do it in-house.


but tomatopaste said AAA would do it. then he changed his mind and said they would be using airless tires.
I didn't get to asking tomatopaste about oil changes but he probably would have said jiffy lube.


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## PrestonT (Feb 15, 2017)

roadman said:


> but tomatopaste said AAA would do it. then he changed his mind and said they would be using airless tires.
> I didn't get to asking tomatopaste about oil changes but he probably would have said jiffy lube.


Electric cars don't need oil changes. But oh wait gasoline engines.


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

roadman said:


> but tomatopaste said AAA would do it. then he changed his mind and said they would be using airless tires.
> I didn't get to asking tomatopaste about oil changes but he probably would have said jiffy lube.


Ok, I was afraid of this, I went too fast, my bad. 
Google/Waymo is launching their self driving taxi service in Phoenix in a few weeks. Google/Waymo has contracted with Axis Budget Group Inc. to handle minor maintenance and cleaning of their 600-some-odd self driving Chrysler Pacifica internal combustion engine mini vans in Phoenix.

*Alphabet (Google/Waymo) Inks Deal for Avis to Manage Self-Driving Car Fleet*
*https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/26/business/waymo-avis-deal-self-driving-cars-maintenance.html
*
Time at this point is more important than money and the Avis deal allows them to launch in Phoenix within weeks. So what does this tell us? This tells us Waymo will be competing with Uber and Lyft drivers in the Phoenix market with 600 brand new self driving Chrysler Pacifica mini vans before Christmas.

Right now people choose Uber over a taxi to take them to the airport cause it's much cheaper and the cars are generally nicer and cleaner. What do you think is going to happen when Google/Waymo unleashes 600 self driving Chrysler Pacifica mini vans into the Phoenix market? Not only will it be cheaper than Uber but you won't have to listen to Jockey whine about evil corporations the whole way.


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

UberLaLa said:


> Navigation always tries to tell me to take the _Regular_ on ramp transition from the 105 East bound to 110 North bound, rather than staying in the FastTrak. Certain time of days this would easily add 20-30 minutes time to the drive. Since the regular ramp is Metered and can back up for a half mile to two lane Yuk...then one can't get back into the FastTrak lane for a couple miles of dead stopped traffic.
> 
> I can only imagine passenger sitting in SDC as it exits the speeding along FastTrak to sit in that nightmare. _Hey, where you going!? Nooooooooooooooooooo.........._


The self driving car will learn everything you know and everything every other driver knows. It will also know in real time there was an accident on the 405 interchange 3 seconds ago and avoid the 405, while you blissfully merge onto 405 and sit in bumper to bumper traffic for an hour.


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## UberLaLa (Sep 6, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> The self driving car will learn everything you know and everything every other driver knows. It will also know in real time there was an accident on the 405 interchange 3 seconds ago and avoid the 405, while you blissfully merge onto 405 and sit in bumper to bumper traffic for an hour.


Key word there 'learn' 

Everything, EVERYTHING has a learning curve. It won't be overnight for SDC's either. That was my point...


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

UberLaLa said:


> Navigation always tries to tell me to take the _Regular_ on ramp transition from the 105 East bound to 110 North bound, rather than staying in the FastTrak. Certain time of days this would easily add 20-30 minutes time to the drive. Since the regular ramp is Metered and can back up for a half mile to two lane Yuk...then one can't get back into the FastTrak lane for a couple miles of dead stopped traffic.
> 
> I can only imagine passenger sitting in SDC as it exits the speeding along FastTrak to sit in that nightmare. _Hey, where you going!? Nooooooooooooooooooo.........._


So what you're saying is we need to speed up the adoption of self driving cars. You learned thru trial and error, or because a pax called you an idiot for not staying in the FastTrak. The 500 newbies that start tomorrow will have to learn this the hard way, whereas it'll be programmed into the self driving software once and every car on the system immediately knows to stay in the FastTrak.


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## UberLaLa (Sep 6, 2015)

tomatopaste said:


> So what you're saying is we need to speed up the adoption of self driving cars. You learned thru trial and error, or because a pax called you an idiot for not staying in the FastTrak. The 500 newbies that start tomorrow will have to learn this the hard way, whereas it'll be programmed into the self driving software once and every car on the system immediately knows to stay in the FastTrak.


Actually, I simply see it on the Navigation and think how lame it is that it tries to send drivers there.

And, enjoy the vacation...


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## tomatopaste (Apr 11, 2017)

UberLaLa said:


> Actually, I simply see it on the Navigation and think how lame it is that it tries to send drivers there.
> 
> And, enjoy the vacation...


Yes, but you'll agree that's one of the downsides of human drivers. Each new driver is basically starting from scratch, whereas each new self driving car has millions of miles (and billions if you include simulation miles) of experience and the same driving skills and knowledge of the city as the best driver on the road.


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## RamzFanz (Jan 31, 2015)

Dug_M said:


> I have a random thought.... How are driver-less cars going to keep people from eating in the car? Or leaving the leftover remains of a bucket of chicken in the back seat and maybe some greasy chicken parts on the seat.... Another thought will they have a puke detector? hmmm or a way to prevent graffiti on the inside/outside of the cars... People without supervision can and will do bad things. I don't see having a camera would be deterrent if they were not live feeds. And if the camera were live who would be watching them and what would that cost? I guess that was more then 1 thought...


The internal computer compares before and after pictures within a fraction of a second. The rider is notified they left something behind be it an item or trash. If the pax doesn't return and correct the situation they are charged a fee.

Humans are not needed to detect the issue.

Messes and lost items become a profit center, not a hinderence.


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

UberLaLa said:


> Navigation always tries to tell me to take the _Regular_ on ramp transition from the 105 East bound to 110 North bound, rather than staying in the FastTrak. Certain time of days this would easily add 20-30 minutes time to the drive. Since the regular ramp is Metered and can back up for a half mile to two lane Yuk...then one can't get back into the FastTrak lane for a couple miles of dead stopped traffic.
> 
> I can only imagine passenger sitting in SDC as it exits the speeding along FastTrak to sit in that nightmare. _Hey, where you going!? Nooooooooooooooooooo.........._


Lame Nav = More $ for Uber!!


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## iheartuber (Oct 31, 2015)

RamzFanz said:


> The internal computer compares before and after pictures within a fraction of a second. The rider is notified they left something behind be it an item or trash. If the pax doesn't return and correct the situation they are charged a fee.
> 
> Humans are not needed to detect the issue.
> 
> Messes and lost items become a profit center, not a hinderence.


Seems like science fiction


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

A year later and still no chance in hell these death traps will ever being driving themselves.


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