# Breaking: UBER driver in Kalamazoo on killing spree



## UberPissed

Kzoo police ID suspect in deadly random shootings
http://woodtv.com/2016/02/20/multiple-fatally-shot-at-2-locations-in-kalamazoo-co/

TEXAS TOWNSHIP, Mich. (WOOD) - Six people are dead and two seriously wounded after a shooter opened fire at three different locations in the Kalamazoo area over the course of nearly five hours Saturday night.

Michigan State Police on Sunday identified the four victims killed at one of the crime scenes, the Cracker Barrel restaurant in Texas Township, as:


Mary Lou Nye, 63, of Baroda, Mich.
Mary Jo Nye, 60, of Battle Creek
Dorothy Brown, 74, of Battle Creek
Barbara Hawthorne, 68, of Battle Creek
The names of the two other victims killed were not expected to be released Sunday.


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## UberCemetery

Wow - Our prayers are with the victims.


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## TwoFiddyMile

He drove PAX between shootings? 
Shocking story.


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## everythingsuber

Frost thought stressed out driver. Incredibly sad if true.


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## backstreets-trans

http://woodtv.com/2016/02/21/kzoo-county-deadly-rampage-suspect-who-is-jason-dalton/

His erratic behavior was posted on facebook and 911 called. Uber is pushing drivers over the edge. They can't be solely blamed but the rate cuts could of added to his instability. My thoughts and prayers go out to the families.


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## scrurbscrud

Holy Crap. Can Uber have any worse PR than that?! Uber driver runs amok and randomly kills 6-7 ppl!

Almost unreal. But, we have observed here for quite some time, the difficulties drivers face. Financial pressure and general hopelessness, even when working like a slave to get ahead, can and does break people. Particularly if they are weak minded to begin with.

And what better example than Mich. where Uber has slashed driver sustainability rates to absurdity negative.


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## backstreets-trans

scrurbscrud said:


> Holy Crap. Can Uber have any worse PR than that?! Uber driver runs amok and randomly kills 8 pax!
> 
> Almost unreal. But, we have observed here for quite some time, the difficulties drivers face. Financial pressure and general hopelessness, even when working like a slave to get ahead, can and does break people. Particularly if they are weak minded to begin with.
> 
> And what better example than Mich. where Uber has slashed driver sustainability rates to absurdity negative.


So sad but true.


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## everythingsuber

backstreets-trans said:


> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/21/kzoo-county-deadly-rampage-suspect-who-is-jason-dalton/
> 
> His erratic behavior was posted on facebook and 911 called. Uber is pushing drivers over the edge. They can't be solely blamed but the rate cuts could of added to his instability. My thoughts and prayers go out to the families.


They can largely be blamed. Über is solely responsible for placing thousands of drivers under unbelievable stress. You can dress it up anyway you like the callous disregard for the people that work with them their "partners" does have consequences. The first thought that went to my mind when the police said there was no motive was That's a driver.


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## Just_in

There was already a complaint from a passenger that this driver (shooter ) was driving erratically. The trouble is there is no one to call and complain too. If there was they would have removed this mad man from the system ASAP. Side swiping a car is hit and run. Police are called.


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## osii

If you shoot your pax in the car and they bleed on the seats, can you get a cleaning fee reimbursement?


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## backstreets-trans

Just_in said:


> There was already a complaint from a passenger that this driver (shooter ) was driving erratically. The trouble is there is no one to call and complain too. If there was they would have removed this mad man from the system ASAP. Side swiping a car is hit and run. Police are called.


The complaint probably went overseas. Then it has to be sifted through. It takes 24-48 hrs for it to even be read. I guess 30 cents/mile is the tipping point.


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## nutzareus

More blood on Fuber and Travis. Good! Karma has come to collect. RIP to all of the innocent victims, wake up Fuber and raise rates!


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## No More Mr. Nice Guy

Maybe he got tired of not getting five star ratings.


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## Bart McCoy

The link here:

http://woodtv.com/2016/02/21/kzoo-county-deadly-rampage-suspect-who-is-jason-dalton/

Says he did Uber BEFORE doing any shootings. I hear reports he was doing Uber in between shootings. But that makes no sense for him to shoot other people, but NOT his Uber passengers.

I still don't see a clear link to UBER and him shooting people. Somebody explain to me how Uber is to blame for any of this (all joking aside)

What if he had just got off work from McDonalds and threw some fries. Then he got to shooting people. Would you blame McDonalds?

If he was picking up passengers and riding around shooting them, clearly that's a direct link to the shootings. But as of right now, it doesn't seem to matter what his job was, since what he did for a living looks to be unrelated to the shooting.

Not trying to defend Uber, but if something bad happens and Uber name is put in it, I would just like to see a good reasoning to blame uber for somebody shooting people. Like is it safe to say if he didn't Uber he wouldn't have shot anybody? Clearly this guy was just a crazy person that had a job


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## backstreets-trans

Can you say public relations nightmare. I hope a news channel actually does a real expose on the stress uber has put drivers through and the fact we are losing money on every trip. Uber's unicorn bubble status is about to burst.


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## Just_in

Bart McCoy said:


> The link here:
> 
> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/21/kzoo-county-deadly-rampage-suspect-who-is-jason-dalton/
> 
> Says he did Uber BEFORE doing any shootings. I hear reports he was doing Uber in between shootings. *But that makes no sense for him to shoot other people, but NOT his Uber passengers.*
> 
> I still don't see a clear link to UBER and him shooting people. Somebody explain to me how Uber is to blame for any of this (all joking aside)


Nothing makes sense when it comes murder.

Ask Why
Answer : Why Not.

learned that in philosophy 101...years ago.


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## Dang

he coulda have said uber lower the rate so he was mad that why he shoot people now to get uber attention..and add tip option


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## Bart McCoy

I guess I'll wait on further reports. Some say he shot people inbetween uber rides, some outlets say he ubered people BEFORE doing any shootings. But in all reports, none state any victum was an Uber passenger. So why he spared Uber passenger lives rather than other random people has me confused


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## everythingsuber

Just_in said:


> There was already a complaint from a passenger that this driver (shooter ) was driving erratically. The trouble is there is no one to call and complain too. If there was they would have removed this mad man from the system ASAP. Side swiping a car is hit and run. Police are called.





Bart McCoy said:


> The link here:
> 
> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/21/kzoo-county-deadly-rampage-suspect-who-is-jason-dalton/
> 
> Says he did Uber BEFORE doing any shootings. I hear reports he was doing Uber in between shootings. But that makes no sense for him to shoot other people, but NOT his Uber passengers.
> 
> I still don't see a clear link to UBER and him shooting people. Somebody explain to me how Uber is to blame for any of this (all joking aside)
> 
> What if he had just got off work from McDonalds and threw some fries. Then he got to shooting people. Would you blame McDonalds?
> 
> If he was picking up passengers and riding around shooting them, clearly that's a direct link to the shootings. But as of right now, it doesn't seem to matter what his job was, since what he did for a living looks to be unrelated to the shooting.
> 
> Not trying to defend Uber, but if something bad happens and Uber name is put in it, I would just like to see a good reasoning to blame uber for somebody shooting people. Like is it safe to say if he didn't Uber he wouldn't have shot anybody? Clearly this guy was just a crazy person that had a job


 What are McDonald's paying an hour. Do their employees have commitments they cannot meet owing to a pay cut? If a McDonald's employee was involved in something like this I would be asking those questions


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## Bart McCoy

everythingsuber said:


> What are McDonald's paying an hour. Do their employees have commitments they cannot meet owing to a pay cut? If a McDonald's employee was involved in something like this I would be asking those questions


A lot of people don't have high paying jobs. Everytime someone commits a crime,you not sayin you would blame their employer now are you?

Uber pays low rates, but I havent seen anything that says that's what drove this guy to shooting all these folks


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## TwoFiddyMile

If he was logged in while shooting, its an Uber problem.
Think.
He was in the middle of his shift and went on a killing spree.
If he were a McDonalds employee killing on his lunch hour, it would still be a McDonalds PR problem.


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## backstreets-trans

Bart McCoy said:


> The link here:
> 
> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/21/kzoo-county-deadly-rampage-suspect-who-is-jason-dalton/
> 
> Says he did Uber BEFORE doing any shootings. I hear reports he was doing Uber in between shootings. But that makes no sense for him to shoot other people, but NOT his Uber passengers.
> 
> I still don't see a clear link to UBER and him shooting people. Somebody explain to me how Uber is to blame for any of this (all joking aside)
> 
> What if he had just got off work from McDonalds and threw some fries. Then he got to shooting people. Would you blame McDonalds?
> 
> If he was picking up passengers and riding around shooting them, clearly that's a direct link to the shootings. But as of right now, it doesn't seem to matter what his job was, since what he did for a living looks to be unrelated to the shooting.
> 
> Not trying to defend Uber, but if something bad happens and Uber name is put in it, I would just like to see a good reasoning to blame uber for somebody shooting people. Like is it safe to say if he didn't Uber he wouldn't have shot anybody? Clearly this guy was just a crazy person that had a job


I don't think uber is entirely to blame. But when a person is somewhat imbalanced and stressed out at a job that keeps lowering your rates and makes it impossible to make ends meet you lose hope. The lack of hope and seeing that there is no light at the end of the tunnel can push a person over the edge. I can't justify his actions but the betrayals from uber didn't help. I honestly believe that this forum helps drivers to vent their frustrations. I find it therapeutic.


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## Thatendedbadly

Yeah, blaming Uber is pointless. That being said, it will be interesting to see if the driver was online while any of this happened.


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## Bart McCoy

TwoFiddyMile said:


> If he were a McDonalds employee killing on his lunch hour, it would still be a McDonalds PR problem.


It still would need to be shown he was unhappy or disgruntled while working with/for/at McDonalds.

Just think about it, lots of people who kill other people HAVE JOBS. But its not brought up unless the job was actually related to the killings.....


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## everythingsuber

Bart McCoy said:


> A lot of people don't have high paying jobs. Everytime someone commits a crime,you not sayin you would blame their employer now are you?
> 
> Uber pays low rates, but I havent seen anything that says that's what drove this guy to shooting all these folks


You start with a decent wage you make financial commitments and somebody takes that away from you I was see that could cause the degree of stress and as for not shooting passengers that would mess up the car and stop you from working. No work no money


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## backstreets-trans

Bart McCoy said:


> I guess I'll wait on further reports. Some say he shot people inbetween uber rides, some outlets say he ubered people BEFORE doing any shootings. But in all reports, none state any victum was an Uber passenger. So why he spared Uber passenger lives rather than other random people has me confused


You should never try to make sense about something that is so senseless. Certain triggers can send people off. I believe uber was one of those triggers that helped send this guy off.


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## Bart McCoy

Uber could very well be a trigger, I just haven't seen evidence to this yet.

Lets say he was driving for Uber 3 days out the week. Lets say he had a regular mon-fri job. Why blame uber instead of his day job? Obviously his day job doesn't pay that much if he chose to drive for uber part time...... That's like a lawyer driving for Uber on the weekends....

Ive been souring reports to find out if Uber was his only job. Nothing yet...


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## UberBlackDriverLA

TwoFiddyMile said:


> He drove PAX between shootings?
> Shocking story.


Sad, but not shocking at all. There have been multiple instances where Uber drivers have shot their passengers. Uber drivers being involved in assaults is actually very common.


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## ChinatownJake

The Facebook post from the fiancee of Uber passenger Matt is unreal. She writes that:

1) After sideswiping the car, driver refused Matt's request to stop and let him out.
2) Sped up to 80 mph on West Main Hill, "swerving in and out of oncoming traffic."
3) When the car finally slowed down, Pax bailed.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/701428731517214720
That is a nightmare ride right there.


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## IUberGR

backstreets-trans said:


> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/21/kzoo-county-deadly-rampage-suspect-who-is-jason-dalton/
> 
> His erratic behavior was posted on facebook and 911 called. Uber is pushing drivers over the edge. They can't be solely blamed but the rate cuts could of added to his instability. My thoughts and prayers go out to the families.


I think it's way to early to jump to the conclusion that Uber is in any way to blame. The guy went freaking crazy. Could have been anything that tipped him over the edge.

As a side note, I'm not sure they've cut rates in Kzoo, I know they haven't here in Grand Rapids.


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## AintWorthIt

This is a disaster for Uber, every headline right now reads Uber driver shoots 6...... What if this guy starts talking and says Uber is what set him off? People have now got to start asking why there is not a number for people to call for pax in danger or to report someone instead of this bullshit email support.


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## UberPartnerDennis

what happens when you pay your driver 35 cents a mile? Nutjobs like this are the only ones working.....My thoughts are with the victims and their families


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## Urban Uber

Jobs are available all over the country... Some communities are not at full employment yet and some good people are working for Uber as Independent Contractors between jobs.. This tragedy is not related to UBER.. All drivers have the option to NOT drive if costs are not being covered.. If income is not supporting them or their families... If an unstable person passes the back ground checks ( minimal at best) and commits a crime while approved to drive for UBER.. This does not become an UBER crime... " going postal" did not mean that the pressures working for the United States Postal Service caused the tragic crimes that occurred... There are mentally unstable people amongst us all.. Diagnosed and undiagnosed... It's tragic for the families and the shooter... It's not related to UBER.


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## osii

Bart McCoy said:


> A lot of people don't have high paying jobs. Everytime someone commits a crime,you not sayin you would blame their employer now are you?
> 
> Uber pays low rates, but I havent seen anything that says that's what drove this guy to shooting all these folks


You think if he was making a grand a week he would have gone on a killing spree?


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## Lando74

Bart McCoy said:


> I guess I'll wait on further reports. Some say he shot people inbetween uber rides, some outlets say he ubered people BEFORE doing any shootings. But in all reports, none state any victum was an Uber passenger. So why he spared Uber passenger lives rather than other random people has me confused


Always tip your driver..


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## IUberGR

osii said:


> You think if he was making a grand a week he would have gone on a killing spree?


Who knows? He's freaking crazy!!!


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## Bart McCoy

IUberGR said:


> I think it's way to early to jump to the conclusion that Uber is in any way to blame. The guy went freaking crazy. Could have been anything that tipped him over the edge.
> 
> As a side note, I'm not sure they've cut rates in Kzoo, I know they haven't here in Grand Rapids.


I know detroit is 30cent/mile, but exactly what is the uber rate where he lives?



UberPartnerDennis said:


> what happens when you pay your driver 35 cents a mile? Nutjobs like this are the only ones working.....My thoughts are with the victims and their families


was that his rate though?



osii said:


> You think if he was making a grand a week he would have gone on a killing spree?


so you saying rich people never kill people?

if he's crazy he's crazy, no matter what job he holds


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## EricHaley

Did this driver have a vehicle lease through Uber? If so, this may be a factor as well...


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## AintWorthIt

_Uber driver arrested in the killing of 6,_ front page of CNN right now. This may be the straw that breaks the camels back for Uber.


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## Urban Uber

A star football player is in prison today because he killed at least 2 people... Was this an NFL killing or a mentally unstable player who killed and was signed to an NFL contract... He was certainly making more than 1000 a week for the NFL... Salary ... Wages... Does not equal killer..


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## Bart McCoy

AintWorthIt said:


> _Uber driver arrested in the killing of 6,_ front page of CNN right now. This may be the straw that breaks the camels back for Uber.


Yeah, if all outlets brand this with Uber in the title(whether Uber played a role in it or not), then its a horrible look for the company.

Not like it'll make Uber raise rates. All it will do is make different markets press for fingerprints and stricter background checks. As if mass shooter always have done something illegal previously smh. Human have free will, you can't always find in the past what a person will do in the future...


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## Bart McCoy

EricHaley said:


> Did this driver have a vehicle lease through Uber? If so, this may be a factor as well...


if it's shown in any way he was stressed out because of Uber (low rates, lease, etc) then it'll play a role and I can agree to this being an uber related incident. I just don't want Uber to be used as a scapegoat for a person who was simply crazy though. Meaning he'd have shot people regardless of who he worked for.


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## IUberGR

Bart McCoy said:


> I know detroit is 30cent/mile, but exactly what is the uber rate where he lives?
> 
> was that his rate though?
> 
> so you saying rich people never kill people?
> 
> if he's crazy he's crazy, no matter what job he holds


Appears that they are the same as in GR, $.15/minute, $.75/ mile.

http://uberestimator.com/cities/kalamazoo

Had a great weekend here, making $305 in 16 hours online, with a whopping $11 in tips.

I doubt very much that this had ANYTHING to do with Uber's rates, and claiming it does without a shred of evidence is shameful.


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## Bart McCoy

Welp, doesn't look good for Uber


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## Bart McCoy

Like I said, they'll press for more background checks, FBI livescan and all that but....

"Jason Dalton, 45, has no prior criminal record and was taken into custody without a struggle, Getting said."


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## osii

Most of those ball players who go berserk are broke. Some are not. 

But it's a fact that more crime is committed by poor folks than rich folks. Well, at least rich folks get away with it more than poor folks.


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## osii

The pay there is $.84 a mile after commissions if he's at 20%. That could drive anyone to madness.


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## Bart McCoy

osii said:


> The pay there is $.84 a mile after commissions if he's at 20%. That could drive anyone to madness.


After? so that's around $1.00 a mile or so.
that's still higher than Atlanta and Chicago and other major cities


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## Jack Pavlov

I'm going to be brutally honest. The majority of people in this thread are jumping to some extreme assumptions that somehow Uber is responsible. You may not like Uber, and may be having a negative experience with them but they are not liable for this nor is their act of cutting rates. Clearly this man had far worse problems than Uber not paying him enough. People also need to realize that there is a level of personal responsibility. He CHOSE to work Uber, he CHOSE to live a lifestyle he couldn't afford, he CHOSE to commit these acts (unless there are other psychological reasons at play. Pointing a weapon at someone with the intent to kill, is a very very difficult task, let alone pulling the trigger.

It is more than likely that he just happened to work for Uber and people are prematurely making that correlation that uber is to blame.


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## HiFareLoRate

I blame the rate cuts.
Excessive working causes erratic behavior. 

Kenny Rogers anyone?


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## TakinItUpWithUber




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## Michael - Cleveland

Bart McCoy said:


> I guess I'll wait on further reports. Some say he shot people inbetween uber rides, some outlets say he ubered people BEFORE doing any shootings. But in all reports, none state any victum was an Uber passenger. So why he spared Uber passenger lives rather than other random people has me confused


Becuase if you harm your passenger, it's pretty easy to identify you through records.


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## chi1cabby

IUberGR said:


> I'm not sure they've cut rates in Kzoo, I know they haven't here in Grand Rapids.


https://www.uber.com/cities/kalamazoo/?int=a
*uberX **The low-cost Uber*
Base Fare $0.90
+
Per Minute $0.15
+
Per Mile $0.75
Booking Fee $1.15
Minimum Fare $3.95
Cancellation Fee $5.00
*The min fare includes the Booking Fee.


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## forqalso

Name the profession of any other mass killer. No fair using google.


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## sidewazzz

It would be cool if someone knew the amount of each deal so I can put them in. I'd imagine they are rather large numbers.


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## KevinH

The connection for me is that there is no employment history considered during Uber's hiring, no interview, no reference checking, and applicants are never met by an Uber employee. Applicants with 4 jobs in the last three years, or fired/laid off from the last two jobs, or drivers that would have fidgeted or be unable to make eye contact during an interview are all hired.

We know that Uber's low rates are certainly pushing the driver base to the bottom. That means not only poor, unskilled or immigrant workers, but also workers that can't otherwise keep a job, or get along with co-workers/customers or simply lack social skills are now becoming more prevalent. Just in the last 10 days, a driver was charged with walking into a female passenger's home, another was given a restraining order to keep away from a female passenger and yet another driver was charged with jumping in the back seat and fondling a female passenger. I think it is reasonable to see Uber become a Darwinian employment filter, taking the workers that are social misfits. At the "Crunchies" tech awards 10 days ago, an awards host asks, “Are Uber drivers recruited from mental hospitals? I feel like I’m talking to someone with a personality disorder.”


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## SafeT

TakinItUpWithUber said:


> View attachment 28824


Quite a beer belly on that guy.


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## UberBlackDriverLA

Jack Pavlov said:


> I'm going to be brutally honest. The majority of people in this thread are jumping to some extreme assumptions that somehow Uber is responsible. You may not like Uber, and may be having a negative experience with them but they are not liable for this nor is their act of cutting rates. Clearly this man had far worse problems than Uber not paying him enough. People also need to realize that there is a level of personal responsibility. He CHOSE to work Uber, he CHOSE to live a lifestyle he couldn't afford, he CHOSE to commit these acts (unless there are other psychological reasons at play. Pointing a weapon at someone with the intent to kill, is a very very difficult task, let alone pulling the trigger.
> 
> It is more than likely that he just happened to work for Uber and people are prematurely making that correlation that uber is to blame.


And I will give a brutally honest reply to why I believe your opinion is wrong.

UBER DOES NOT PROPERLY VET THEIR EMPLOYEES.

Uber does not require fingerprinting
Uber does not do face to face interviews
Uber does not check with previous employers
Uber does not do drug screening
Uber hires felons (In California)
Uber does not train their employees
Uber does not provide proper healthcare for their employees
Uber does not supervise their employees.
Uber provides little support for their employees

I agree that many drivers are trying to tie wages to this incident with the hopes Uber will raise rates. But the system Uber has set up has many flaws and when one of their drivers goes crazy, its proper to look at the system.


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## Uberelitescv1

Shitty pax, crap pay will drive you over the edge ...


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## USArmy31B30

It would be insane if he went on a rampage over Uber's rate cuts...


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## BurgerTiime

Making 90k a year driving for Uber made him go insane. He didn't know how to spend all that money he was making.


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## Ziggy

Bart McCoy said:


> I know detroit is 30cent/mile, but exactly what is the uber rate where he lives?


Kalamazoo @ 75¢/mi on X


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## SafeT

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...t-year-old-child-shooting-spree-Michigan.html


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## TwoFiddyMile

Urban Uber said:


> A star football player is in prison today because he killed at least 2 people... Was this an NFL killing or a mentally unstable player who killed and was signed to an NFL contract... He was certainly making more than 1000 a week for the NFL... Salary ... Wages... Does not equal killer..


Yeah, but he didnt perform the murder at halftime and then finish the game.


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## Bart McCoy

sidewazzz said:


> View attachment 28830
> 
> 
> It would be cool if someone knew the amount of each deal so I can put them in. I'd imagine they are rather large numbers.


So a high number of uber Drivers are out here raping and killing pax?


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## Bart McCoy

TwoFiddyMile said:


> Yeah, but he didnt perform the murder at halftime and then finish the game.


So if he did, you would blame football?


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## TwoFiddyMile

Bart McCoy said:


> So if he did, you would blame football?


Id blame the management of his team partially. 
See, if you commit crime on your shift, it drags your company into it.
I had a driver who got caught peeing in a backyard while renting one of my cabs. 
Owner of the house complained to me and to the police agency which licensed my company.
So since this guy was on a rampage in the middle of his shift, youre GD right Uber is partially on the hook for this.
As is Kalamazoo, and the state of Michigan.


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## rtaatl

There's already been posts from previous passengers about erratic driving and behavior. I'm sure they sent in a complaint to Uber about it. So yeah, Uber is somewhat to blame for this. Especially after they eased up on background checks that were already sketchy.


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## TwoFiddyMile

Try this on for size. Remember, im a cabbie owner op.
A cabbie hustles a fare off the Amtrak, then, cab empty, shoots a random person dead. Then he gets a ping going to the airport, gets paid, drops the pax, kills another random civilian. Wash, repeat, rinse.
His "cab company", Acme Cab, would be answering questions for well over a year, and lose tons of customers, even if the driver/killer owned his own cab like i do, like all Uber drivers do.
This is intimately tied to Uber, like it or not.


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## HiFareLoRate

SafeT said:


> Quite a beer belly on that guy.


Comes with the job. You're telling me you're not packing? Hahahahahahaa


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## rtaatl

TwoFiddyMile said:


> Try this on for size. Remember, im a cabbie owner op.
> A cabbie hustles a fare off the Amtrak, then, cab empty, shoots a random person dead. Then he gets a ping going to the airport, gets paid, drops the pax, kills another random civilian. Wash, repeat, rinse.
> His "cab company", Acme Cab, would be answering questions for well over a year, and lose tons of customers, even if the driver/killer owned his own cab like i do, like all Uber drivers do.
> This is intimately tied to Uber, like it or not.


Indirectly, a lot of us here know the pressure some drivers go through. Especially the ones trapped in leases they can't afford and have to put in 16hr+ a day to make ends meet. Also constant rate cuts, an unfair rating system...etc. We know how it can drink someone to the brink of instanity, yet it's funny how people go on the defensive for companies that treat their people unethical...like its not an issue. So yeah, Uber is definitely to blame on this...maybe now someone will realize how those cheap fares are being subsidized.


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## Teksaz

*"He was an Uber driver*, and police are investigating reports that he took fares in between the shootings."

Quite the multi-tasker.

I'm sure it was the pax that told him..."Takes me to the WalMarts. Imma be about 15minutes, and then yous gonna takes me back home." that broke the camels back.


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## backstreets-trans

TwoFiddyMile said:


> Try this on for size. Remember, im a cabbie owner op.
> A cabbie hustles a fare off the Amtrak, then, cab empty, shoots a random person dead. Then he gets a ping going to the airport, gets paid, drops the pax, kills another random civilian. Wash, repeat, rinse.
> His "cab company", Acme Cab, would be answering questions for well over a year, and lose tons of customers, even if the driver/killer owned his own cab like i do, like all Uber drivers do.
> This is intimately tied to Uber, like it or not.


Especially because uber has the deep pockets. A lawyer knows uber is the sugar daddy in all lawsuits.


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## uberpa

It's inevitable! Have you ever seen a happy uber driver?
This is the milestone uber is going downward!


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## Archie8616

Crazy if this is true...but you hardly hear anything about Lyft drivers getting assaulted by their passengers or vice versa.

"edit" Just saw that CNN has now just picked this news story up!

http://www.cnn.com/2016/02/21/us/michigan-kalamazoo-county-shooting-spree/index.html


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## howo3579

Don't worry riders. Uber will increase safe rider I mean booking fee to do 'better' background checks on its drivers. The rate will maintain the same or cheaper.


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## Millio007

SafeT said:


> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...t-year-old-child-shooting-spree-Michigan.html


.90 + 6.52 + 3.24 =10.66 -1.60 BF - 20%(1.81) or -25%(2.27)

6.79-7.25 Net for about 30 mins Just turn the gun on yourself Jason


----------



## vesolehome

howo3579 said:


> Don't worry riders. Uber will increase safe rider I mean booking fee to do 'better' background checks on its drivers. The rate will maintain the same or cheaper.


I hate to say that's funny, but that's pretty funny...and ironic Uber calls it a safe riders fee! It sounds like this guy was driving erratic with one of is PAX.

As for this blaming Uber pay cuts, that's nuts. This guy snapped but unless he says it's because of Uber payouts I find that hard to believe.


----------



## PoorBasterd

osii said:


> If you shoot your pax in the car and they bleed on the seats, can you get a cleaning fee reimbursement?


I doubt it. You made that mess yourself.


----------



## DriverX

I heard he was getting screwed out of guaranteed minimums because of NETWORK FAILURE jacking up his Acceptance Rate.


----------



## DriverX

osii said:


> If you shoot your pax in the car and they bleed on the seats, can you get a cleaning fee reimbursement?


YAAAASSS!


----------



## PoorBasterd

Does anyone know what Jason's driver rating was? That will tell us allot about him.


----------



## DriverX

TwoFiddyMile said:


> If he was logged in while shooting, its an Uber problem.
> Think.
> He was in the middle of his shift and went on a killing spree.
> If he were a McDonalds employee killing on his lunch hour, it would still be a McDonalds PR problem.


Well at least his victims families can sue uber for an insurance claim! Uber insures death by driver right,,, I wonder what Tier he was in.

"Going UBER" is the new "Going POSTAL"


----------



## DriverX

backstreets-trans said:


> I don't think uber is entirely to blame. But when a person is somewhat imbalanced and stressed out at a job that keeps lowering your rates and makes it impossible to make ends meet you lose hope. The lack of hope and seeing that there is no light at the end of the tunnel can push a person over the edge. I can't justify his actions but the betrayals from uber didn't help. I honestly believe that this forum helps drivers to vent their frustrations. I find it therapeutic.


People have gotten off on less. Remember the famous "Twinkie Defense"

Besides if he was logged in Uber IS responsible because he was under their insurance. Uber's is screwed, they are gonna have to pay hundreds of millions to the victims families. this actually could be Ubers death nell. With PR like this LYFT must be popping bottles right now!!


----------



## Teksaz

PoorBasterd said:


> Does anyone know what Jason's driver rating was? That will tell us allot about him.


I hope you're joking because Ubers rating system is the biggest joke of all and it's totally manipulated by Uber themselves. I'm sure his 4.7 rating or what ever it was, isn't going to say...OMG!! Murderer. C'mon dude. lol


----------



## DriverX

IUberGR said:


> Appears that they are the same as in GR, $.15/minute, $.75/ mile.
> 
> http://uberestimator.com/cities/kalamazoo
> 
> Had a great weekend here, making $305 in 16 hours online, with a whopping $11 in tips.
> 
> I doubt very much that this had ANYTHING to do with Uber's rates, and claiming it does without a shred of evidence is shameful.


You might get better tips if you put some pants and a shirt on.


----------



## Bart McCoy

Teksaz said:


> I hope you're joking because Ubers rating system is the biggest joke of all and it's totally manipulated by Uber themselves. I'm sure his 4.7 rating or what ever it was, isn't going to say...OMG!! Murderer. C'mon dude. lol


exactly


----------



## DriverX

Bart McCoy said:


> So if he did, you would blame football?


If he was logged in, Uber has a HUGE problem. He was under their insurance!


----------



## Dontmakemepullauonyou

I launch uber rider app and go to the city of Kalamazoo and shocker a pop up popped up saying "Uber 20% off for the winter".

$0.12 min and $0.75 mile. After uber cut that's $0.09 min and $0.60 mile.

Travis the blood is on your hands first for the rate cuts and then for discouraging riders from tipping.


----------



## LA Cabbie

TwoFiddyMile said:


> If he was logged in while shooting, its an Uber problem.
> Think.
> He was in the middle of his shift and went on a killing spree.
> If he were a McDonalds employee killing on his lunch hour, it would still be a McDonalds PR problem.


Terrorists like this uber murderer don't have jobs because employers pass over them and co workers will sniff them out.

Uber to this terrorist is what day care is to a pedophile.

This is entirely uber's fault.


----------



## LA Cabbie

Thatendedbadly said:


> Yeah, blaming Uber is pointless. That being said, it will be interesting to see if the driver was online while any of this happened.


No it's not. Animals don't lash out because they feel like it. There had to have been a trigger. I know for fact that pax provocations can get to the level where you want to beat someone to a bloody pulp. Almost happened with me. Luckily security came and literally carried the punk away. I quit days after that.

In this sad instance, uber the very least enabled acts of terrorism.


----------



## J1945

If he gets fired by Uber, he's going to lose tens of dollars a year. Then he might really lose it.


----------



## DetroitReal Cab Driver

It's what I've said all along. You'll all feel the public wrath after this fiasco, you better believe it.

Nobody's going to ping for a ride.


----------



## LA Cabbie

TwoFiddyMile said:


> Id blame the management of his team partially.
> See, if you commit crime on your shift, it drags your company into it.
> I had a driver who got caught peeing in a backyard while renting one of my cabs.
> Owner of the house complained to me and to the police agency which licensed my company.
> So since this guy was on a rampage in the middle of his shift, youre GD right Uber is partially on the hook for this.
> As is Kalamazoo, and the state of Michigan.


Happened with us once. We did number one behind the bushes of an alley that belonged to a fancy apartment complex. Management called our management and we were warned that if we get caught doing number one there again it would be termination.


----------



## Just_in

LA Cabbie said:


> No it's not. Animals don't lash out because they feel like it. There had to have been a trigger. I know for fact that pax provocations can get to the level where you want to beat someone to a bloody pulp. Almost happened with me. Luckily security came and literally carried the punk away. I quit days after that.
> 
> In this sad instance, uber the very least enabled acts of terrorism.


 Uber publicly stated that it's reaching out to help law enforcement anyway it can.


----------



## Jack Pavlov

None of which those caused this man to go and do this. There are plenty of crimes that occur with no warning indicators. 
I think there is nothing wrong with uber taking a progressive stance and not discriminating a persons criminal history. It's those kinds of moves that companies continue to make that help reduce the recidivism rates.

Train their employees? This isn't a technical position, it's a very SIMPLE job. They provide a video tutorial and documentation. Lots of jobs "training" actually consists of the employee watching videos. In the government, annual training requirements are fulfilled by the employee logging onto the training website and watching videos or slideshows.

Contractors are rarely supervised by their hiring authority...

Everyone always looks for every reason to blame Uber. He could've worked for McDonald's and everyone would somehow tie this into Uber.

By the way I know lots of jobs that don't actually check with previous employers, none of those are a reason to blame uber.

All of your reasons are really irrelevant to this. 
Is there a reason that some people are perfectly content with their employment with uber? Me for instance, I'm entirely okay. Could it be better and are there improvements to be made, yes... Is any of the shortcomings going to stop me from making money, no. You adapt to the changes and overcome. It again comes down to personal responsibility and how much work people are really willing to put into their own well being... Or is uber ultimately responsible for every single employees needs and concerns?



UberBlackDriverLA said:


> And I will give a brutally honest reply to why I believe your opinion is wrong.
> 
> UBER DOES NOT PROPERLY VET THEIR EMPLOYEES.
> 
> Uber does not require fingerprinting
> Uber does not do face to face interviews
> Uber does not check with previous employers
> Uber does not do drug screening
> Uber hires felons (In California)
> Uber does not train their employees
> Uber does not provide proper healthcare for their employees
> Uber does not supervise their employees.
> Uber provides little support for their employees
> 
> I agree that many drivers are trying to tie wages to this incident with the hopes Uber will raise rates. But the system Uber has set up has many flaws and when one of their drivers goes crazy, its proper to look at the system.


----------



## Ziggy

Jack Pavlov said:


> Contractors are rarely supervised by their hiring authority...


Most companies do not hire "sight unseen" without some sort of face-to-face interview


----------



## UberTaxPro

Jack Pavlov said:


> None of which those caused this man to go and do this. There are plenty of crimes that occur with no warning indicators.
> I think there is nothing wrong with uber taking a progressive stance and not discriminating a persons criminal history. It's those kinds of moves that companies continue to make that help reduce the recidivism rates.
> 
> Train their employees? This isn't a technical position, it's a very SIMPLE job. They provide a video tutorial and documentation. Lots of jobs "training" actually consists of the employee watching videos. In the government, annual training requirements are fulfilled by the employee logging onto the training website and watching videos or slideshows.
> 
> Contractors are rarely supervised by their hiring authority...
> 
> Everyone always looks for every reason to blame Uber. He could've worked for McDonald's and everyone would somehow tie this into Uber.
> 
> By the way I know lots of jobs that don't actually check with previous employers, none of those are a reason to blame uber.
> 
> All of your reasons are really irrelevant to this.
> Is there a reason that some people are perfectly content with their employment with uber? Me for instance, I'm entirely okay. Could it be better and are there improvements to be made, yes... Is any of the shortcomings going to stop me from making money, no. You adapt to the changes and overcome. It again comes down to personal responsibility and how much work people are really willing to put into their own well being... Or is uber ultimately responsible for every single employees needs and concerns?


Uber has no way to respond to customer complaints in real time. If you find rats tail in a big mac you can show it to the manager. If you get a rat driver when you call an uber good luck. Send an email and wait for Uber to "reach out to you" after 6 people are dead.


----------



## sidewazzz

Bart McCoy said:


> So a high number of uber Drivers are out here raping and killing pax?


Not at all, just that uber and it's practices have basically enabled these people. ShItty pay, shItty background and shItty hiring practice = lots of room for stuff like this to happen. If Uber were held to a higher standard we wouldn't have pay issues let alone hardly any of the criminal stuff.


----------



## hangarcat

TwoFiddyMile said:


> He drove PAX between shootings?
> Shocking story.


Did those pax get SRF refund?


----------



## DriverX

Jack Pavlov said:


> None of which those caused this man to go and do this. There are plenty of crimes that occur with no warning indicators.
> I think there is nothing wrong with uber taking a progressive stance and not discriminating a persons criminal history. It's those kinds of moves that companies continue to make that help reduce the recidivism rates.
> 
> Train their employees? This isn't a technical position, it's a very SIMPLE job. They provide a video tutorial and documentation. Lots of jobs "training" actually consists of the employee watching videos. In the government, annual training requirements are fulfilled by the employee logging onto the training website and watching videos or slideshows.
> 
> Contractors are rarely supervised by their hiring authority...
> 
> Everyone always looks for every reason to blame Uber. He could've worked for McDonald's and everyone would somehow tie this into Uber.
> 
> By the way I know lots of jobs that don't actually check with previous employers, none of those are a reason to blame uber.
> 
> All of your reasons are really irrelevant to this.
> Is there a reason that some people are perfectly content with their employment with uber? Me for instance, I'm entirely okay. Could it be better and are there improvements to be made, yes... Is any of the shortcomings going to stop me from making money, no. You adapt to the changes and overcome. It again comes down to personal responsibility and how much work people are really willing to put into their own well being... Or is uber ultimately responsible for every single employees needs and concerns?


The phrase "Going Postal" was coined when a postal worker did this in the 80s. So its only expected that it'll be linked to the job. The background check thing is irrelevant unless this guy had a record, the issue Uber will face is the families suing saying Uber's policies created a antagonistic environment between uber-driver-pax which caused the driver to have a mental breakdown triggered by his last pax who one starred him and then wrote a nasty facebook post about him. Which has now been removed. easy case, he could self represent and still win.

He probably saw his 4.62 rating drop to a 4.54 and had a complete meltdown knowing that he would be deactivated and not be able to feed his pet snakes live bunnies anymore.


----------



## stuber

scrurbscrud said:


> Holy Crap. Can Uber have any worse PR than that?! Uber driver runs amok and randomly kills 8 pax!
> 
> Almost unreal. But, we have observed here for quite some time, the difficulties drivers face. Financial pressure and general hopelessness, even when working like a slave to get ahead, can and does break people. Particularly if they are weak minded to begin with.
> 
> And what better example than Mich. where Uber has slashed driver sustainability rates to absurdity negative.


My news feed featured stories about this. I noticed the headline from the SF newspaper read: Uber Driver In Mass Shooting Had No Prior Record.

Obviously, that editor is very concerned his reporters will continue having access to Uber HQ.

I'm not sure if even the Uber PR machine can ride this one. My thoughts and prayers go out to these families


----------



## Tenzo

It's strange how some posters are spamming the thread saying it's not Ubers fault.
OK, I might have agreed on the first post, second, by the third post I wondered why, now it's seven posts by the same guy. Red Flag.

The guy was employed by the company and worked out of his car.
If I walk into any business and an employee comes jumping over the counter and kills 6 people, you can be damned sure the store is going to be held responsible. If it's a chain store, even more so. If it's a chain store with vaults of cash, well.........

In a hospital if a nurse makes a mistake, they sue the nurse, the doctors on staff, the supervisors, the supervisors and doctors who didnt even see the patient and the hospital. Uber is going to get sued and get reamed for no background checks, no safeties, no supervision, no training, etc.
And they are going to lose.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

backstreets-trans said:


> Can you say public relations nightmare. I hope a news channel actually does a real expose on the stress uber has put drivers through and the fact we are losing money on every trip. Uber's unicorn bubble status is about to burst.


Hey Travis.......PHONE FOR YOU!!!!!


----------



## DelaJoe

We know as of 12/15/14 that uber had over 162,000 active drivers in the USA. Today they are probably well over 200,000. I think the background checks are working because we have had very few incidents like this one. Mental illness is a tough one and people can show signs of it. If this guy had mental issues in the past, then Uber should have never hired him. Of course, something more recent could have set him off. Perhaps a divorce or death of a friend or loss of a job....who knows. 

Hopefully this does not hurt our business and people still trust us to get them around.

There are negative comments in here about the rating system but overall I think it is pretty good way to judge a driver/passenger. I do notice a difference between passengers that have 5.0 ratings and those that are below 4.5. 5.0 passengers don't make you wait...more likely to tip you...more pleasant to talk to. I also notice the UberX drivers with the higher ratings either have nice cars or are pleasant to talk to or both. The rating system works especially when your rating hardens over hundreds of trips. If you are an Uber driver unhappy with your rating, I suggest you take some rides as a passenger with drivers who have ratings above yours and try to figure out what you are doing wrong. Personality, offering people gum/water, lack of body/car odors, cleanliness car/driver, nice comfortable quiet ride, nice music system, following directions and driving within the law.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Tenzo said:


> It's strange how some posters are spamming the thread saying it's not Ubers fault.
> OK, I might have agreed on the first post, second, by the third post I wondered why, now it's seven posts by the same guy. Red Flag.
> 
> The guy was employed by the company and worked out of his car.
> If I walk into any business and an employee comes jumping over the counter and kills 6 people, you can be damned sure the store is going to be held responsible. If it's a chain store, even more so. If it's a chain store with vaults of cash, well.........
> 
> In a hospital if a nurse makes a mistake, they sue the nurse, the doctors on staff, the supervisors, the supervisors and doctors who didnt even see the patient and the hospital. Uber is going to get sued and get reamed for no background checks, no safeties, no supervision, no training, etc.
> And they are going to lose.


Ohhhh you can count on lawsuits all the way to SF.....


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> Ohhhh you can count on lawsuits all the way to SF.....


PS and I agree about Trolls.....If they are reading this.....wake up boys.....the [email protected]^t just hit the fan...."Your honor, the state would like to call 100 random UBER drivers to describe working conditions within that organization. After that your honor, we would anticipate calling every state direct UBER employee who interacts with drivers on behalf of UBER Corporate"......


----------



## naplestom75

Looks like they stopped calling it a "safe rider fee" just in time!


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Bart McCoy said:


> A lot of people don't have high paying jobs. Everytime someone commits a crime,you not sayin you would blame their employer now are you?
> 
> Uber pays low rates, but I havent seen anything that says that's what drove this guy to shooting all these folks


Wake up Bart!!!! The criminal thing is straight forward but the civil suits (on behalf of victims) will have UBER brass in courtrooms for a long time


----------



## backstreets-trans

Tenzo said:


> It's strange how some posters are spamming the thread saying it's not Ubers fault.
> OK, I might have agreed on the first post, second, by the third post I wondered why, now it's seven posts by the same guy. Red Flag.
> 
> The guy was employed by the company and worked out of his car.
> If I walk into any business and an employee comes jumping over the counter and kills 6 people, you can be damned sure the store is going to be held responsible. If it's a chain store, even more so. If it's a chain store with vaults of cash, well.........
> 
> In a hospital if a nurse makes a mistake, they sue the nurse, the doctors on staff, the supervisors, the supervisors and doctors who didnt even see the patient and the hospital. Uber is going to get sued and get reamed for no background checks, no safeties, no supervision, no training, etc.
> And they are going to lose.


I think it's called damage control. Travis has his minions trying to put a good spin on this travesty. It will be interesting when all details come out. I'm sure the girl that posted on facebook and called 911 will give her side. She probably tried to notify uber but an overseas email won't be looked at for days. Uber has conveniently not had a phone number or any way to reach them directly. How a 60 billion dollar company doesn't have a call center for emergencies is beyond belief.

http://woodtv.com/2016/02/21/kzoo-county-deadly-rampage-suspect-who-is-jason-dalton/


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Jack Pavlov said:


> I'm going to be brutally honest. The majority of people in this thread are jumping to some extreme assumptions that somehow Uber is responsible. You may not like Uber, and may be having a negative experience with them but they are not liable for this nor is their act of cutting rates. Clearly this man had far worse problems than Uber not paying him enough. People also need to realize that there is a level of personal responsibility. He CHOSE to work Uber, he CHOSE to live a lifestyle he couldn't afford, he CHOSE to commit these acts (unless there are other psychological reasons at play. Pointing a weapon at someone with the intent to kill, is a very very difficult task, let alone pulling the trigger.
> 
> It is more than likely that he just happened to work for Uber and people are prematurely making that correlation that uber is to blame.


He was an UBER driver.....Driving for UBER the same part of the day or perhaps the same time as committing these crime. UBER is linked to this crime in every headline.....ARE YOU SERIOUS????


----------



## naplestom75

Does this mean that he is deactivated?


----------



## DriverX




----------



## AllenChicago

A government contractor screwed up and caused a Navy jet to crash, killing 4. Was the Navy sued? Nope! The contractor was.


----------



## DriverX

AllenChicago said:


> A government contractor screwed up and caused a Navy jet to crash, killing 4. Was the Navy sued? Nope! The contractor was.


The Fed doesn't get sued, it either pays out or has you suicided.


----------



## DriverX

Wow I didn't think it could get worse:

*A TAXI driver killed at least six people as he gunned down innocent pedestrians while terrified passengers cowered in the back of his car.*

https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/646199/Six-killed-cabbie-drive-by-shooting

classic,,, look at the suggested article at the bottom of the bloomberg story LOLOL

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...n-killing-spree-as-police-probe-tie-to-routes


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

forqalso said:


> Name the profession of any other mass killer. No fair using google.


student


----------



## nowiwannabeyourdog

backstreets-trans said:


> I think it's called damage control. Travis has his minions trying to put a good spin on this travesty. It will be interesting when all details come out. I'm sure the girl that posted on facebook and called 911 will give her side. She probably tried to notify uber but an overseas email won't be looked at for days. Uber has conveniently not had a phone number or any way to reach them directly. How a 60 billion dollar company doesn't have a call center for emergencies is beyond belief.
> 
> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/21/kzoo-county-deadly-rampage-suspect-who-is-jason-dalton/


Murders suicides 
Doesn't look like the algorithm manages real people with real lives very good at all.
Grown men have to all learn an important lesson there are consequences for your actions.
It's time for uber to grow up and learn this lesson.


----------



## naplestom75

There's already an article and witness interviewed that was his last fare 20 minutes before he was arrested. He was giving rides during the whole spree.


----------



## forqalso

Michael - Cleveland said:


> student


"profession"


----------



## DriverX

WHen PAX ask what I do in between rides I tell them I clean my gun.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

IUberGR said:


> I think it's way to early to jump to the conclusion that Uber is in any way to blame.


Blame entirely? No, of course not.
But if Uber had any kind of REAL customer service, the pax's report of the driver's erratic behavior would have been reviewed immediately and at the very least he would have been taken offline... and at best, reported to the police (BOLO) because a crime was committed (sideswiping another car). Uber is not responsible for the actions of the driver - but they ARE responsible for running a system where customers and drivers can't get to anyone in real-time in the event of an emergency.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

forqalso said:


> "profession"


oh, occupation doesn't count?
ok. Postal Worker.


----------



## simpsonsverytall

surprised it hasn't trended harder on facebook

not surprised that an uber driver snapped.


----------



## forqalso

Michael - Cleveland said:


> oh, occupation doesn't count?
> ok. Postal Worker.


Student isn't an occupation or profession. But, your answer, "postal worker" proves my point. You'll have to go back at least ten years to find a postal worker that did mass shooting. There's been more than enough shootings but no other job gets mentioned like an Uber driver.


----------



## simpsonsverytall

someone should make a cult-classic filmed in 8mm about some down and dirty ubering

any of u happen to be rich kids in film school? Lets do this


----------



## DriverX

simpsonsverytall said:


> surprised it hasn't trended harder on facebook
> 
> not surprised that an uber driver snapped.


Sunday is a slow news day. It will be huge monday morning when all the office slaves start gathering around the water cooler.


----------



## Dontmakemepullauonyou

DriverX said:


> Wow I didn't think it could get worse:
> 
> *A TAXI driver killed at least six people as he gunned down innocent pedestrians while terrified passengers cowered in the back of his car.*
> 
> https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/646199/Six-killed-cabbie-drive-by-shooting
> 
> classic,,, look at the suggested article at the bottom of the bloomberg story LOLOL
> 
> http://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...n-killing-spree-as-police-probe-tie-to-routes


LMFAO

"The Kalamazoo Gazette reported that a resident identifying himself on Twitter as IamKeithBlack claimed in a tweet that he booked a 4.8-mile ride with Dalton at 8 p.m. on the night of the shootings. He uploaded a picture showing a receipt with Dalton's picture, the route and a payment of $7.18. The shootings took place at three sites between 5:42 p.m. and 10:24 p.m., the Gazette reported."

4.8mile ride and with Safe Rider Fee cost the rider $7.18. Driver looked at the payout after the ride and well you know the rest.


----------



## JuanIguana

Just_in said:


> There was already a complaint from a passenger that this driver (shooter ) was driving erratically. The trouble is there is no one to call and complain too. If there was they would have removed this mad man from the system ASAP. Side swiping a car is hit and run. Police are called.


 Yours is one of the few excellent points brought to the surface regarding this incident. Still, the police would have to be first responders so they should've called 911, if they could.


----------



## 49matrix

osii said:


> If you shoot your pax in the car and they bleed on the seats, can you get a cleaning fee reimbursement?


Sick SOB!


----------



## chi1cabby

*Uber Passenger Joked With Alleged Kalamazoo Shooter: 'You're Not The Shooter, Are You?'*

In a dark and grisly series of events Saturday night, police allege that Uber driver Jason Dalton shot 8 people in three different locations, killing six. But the story gets even crazier, as Dalton allegedly not only picked up passengers between shootings, he continued to drive people around after his last shooting at 10:24pm at a Cracker Barrel restaurant. One of his last passengers before Dalton was arrested even joked, "You're not the shooter, are you?"

A man from Indianapolis who was visiting the Kalamazoo area talked with the local news and wished to be known only as "Derek." He, his wife, and his in-laws were at a restaurant, Bell's Eccentric Cafe, when they heard about the shootings. They decided that they'd be safer using Uber than walking. They were picked up at 12:12am, roughly a half hour before Dalton was arrested.

"My father mentioned from the back seat, you know, the situation with the shooter," Derek told Wood TV-8. "I kind of jokingly said to the driver, 'You're not the shooter, are you?' He gave me some sort of a 'no' response&#8230; shook his head&#8230;'"

At that point, nobody knew that the alleged shooter was an Uber driver, but for some reason Derek pushed him for another response.

"I said, 'Are you sure?' And he said, 'No, I'm not, I'm just tired,'" Derek told the local news. "And we proceeded to have a pretty normal conversation after that."

Derek and his family were dropped off at 12:19am and Dalton was arrested roughly twenty minutes later. Derek provided the news channel with his receipt as proof that he was likely Jason Dalton's last passenger that night.

Previously it had been reported that the ride he gave to one man between Dalton's alleged murder of two people at a Kia dealership and the Cracker Barrel shooting was chaotic and frightening. Derek said that Dalton seemed calm during their entire ride.

It has also been reported that a woman had hailed an Uber around 11pm, roughly a half hour after Dalton's last shooting spree at Cracker Barrel. There's no word yet on precisely how many people Dalton drove around that night. Nor the more inappropriately macabre question of what ratings he received for his rides.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

forqalso said:


> Student isn't an occupation or profession. But, your answer, "postal worker" proves my point. You'll have to go back at least ten years to find a postal worker that did mass shooting. There's been more than enough shootings but no other job gets mentioned like an Uber driver.


Student is an occupation if they work p/t (census def) - but that's beside the point...
The majority of mass shootings (4 or more shot) that have occurred in the US since 1999 have been committed by students.

Heritage High - GA, Columbine - CO, Century 15 Movie Theater - Aurora, CO, Sandy Hook - CT, FT Gibson - OK, VA Tech, Roseburg, OR, Santana High - Santee, CA, Granite Hills High - ElCajon, CA, UofA -Tuscon, AZ, Redlake, MN, Oikos Univ - Oakland, CA, Marysville, WA, Chardon High - Chardon, OH... and on and on...


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

forqalso said:


> There's been more than enough shootings but no other job gets mentioned like an Uber driver.


There aren't many 'occupations' as memorable as a worldwide brand name.


----------



## scrurbscrud

The fact that the driver was still doing fares between shootings could be a real *"Oh snap"* moment for any Uber pax going forward.

One more notch down on the sight scale for Uber drivers from the pax. "Are you sure you're not a shooter?" The new question of every pax.


----------



## Ref

forqalso said:


> Name the profession of any other mass killer. No fair using google.


postal workers
Math professor/Unabomber
Army major/psychiatrist, Ft. Hood shooter
Environmental worker, San Bernardino shooter
And of course, Islamic terrorists...who go by the euphemisms of student, pilot, tourist, etc., in addition to whatever profession they use to gain trust and access to targets.


----------



## AllenChicago

Uber or Lyft's liability for the actions of drivers is extremely limited..

Excerpt:
"In general, a company is liable for the actions of its employees while they're working. A company is not liable, on the other hand, for the actions of third-party contractors. Uber has already expressly denied liability for the death of a 6-year-old in San Francisco because the driver that hit her was between fares."

Source: http://www.ohiotiger.com/uber-crashes-law/


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

AllenChicago said:


> Uber or Lyft's liability for the actions of drivers is extremely limited..
> 
> Excerpt:
> "In general, a company is liable for the actions of its employees while they're working. A company is not liable, on the other hand, for the actions of third-party contractors. Uber has already expressly denied liability for the death of a 6-year-old in San Francisco because the driver that hit her was between fares."
> 
> Source: http://www.ohiotiger.com/uber-crashes-law/


There is an ocean of difference between a traffic fatality and a murderous rampage. Denied liability is fine until a judge says otherwise. Uber can expect an army of litigants.


----------



## CityGirl

AllenChicago said:


> Uber or Lyft's liability for the actions of drivers is extremely limited..
> 
> Excerpt:
> "In general, a company is liable for the actions of its employees while they're working. A company is not liable, on the other hand, for the actions of third-party contractors. Uber has already expressly denied liability for the death of a 6-year-old in San Francisco because the driver that hit her was between fares."
> 
> Source: http://www.ohiotiger.com/uber-crashes-law/


That's an Ohio article quoting Uber's own feeling on the law in CA, which they were ultimately required to compensate for AND had to change their entire insurance structure to account for. Not to mention it's 2 years old and the industry has changed.

It's important to use actual law, relevant to the state where the incident occurred, and of course, current information.

I do not know MI law but in general, and in CA, we have a rule that the insurer is not responsible for criminal actions of an insured. However, an employer who is negligent in hiring and supervising, even an independent contractor, could be found to be responsible in negligence or gross negligence (read: includes punitive damages) ...even though the insurance company could deny payment based on the criminal actions, the company could still be held responsible. If an actual Uber customer were injured (from scattered reports and articles I've seen, I can't really determine if any of the victims had been passengers), then the liability is even clearer. Uber is going to have to take some responsibility here, depending on how the facts emerge.


----------



## Feisal Mo

Here we go...not happy about his rating. This is from nytimes....

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/02/22/us/kalamazoo-michigan-random-shootings.html?_r=0

According to one passenger, he started working as an Uber driver recently. The passenger, Sara Reynolds, 25, said Mr. Dalton drove her and a friend to a movie theater on Feb. 14 so they could see "Deadpool."

In an interview, Ms. Reynolds recounted how Mr. Dalton told her that he and his son had also seen the movie. But he also told Ms. Reynolds, unsolicited, that he was a new driver for Uber and that he had quickly picked up poor marks.
He had just started doing Uber as a driver a day or two ago and that he had already gotten some bad reviews, which was a little weird, so I asked him about it," Ms. Reynolds said. "And he said it was just drunk kids and his car messing up a little bit."

"I could tell that he didn't really want to talk about it anymore," said Ms. Reynolds, who described Mr. Dalton as "a little shy and awkward, but he was pretty normal for the most part." Ms. Reynolds said she had no complaints about his driving that night.


----------



## GrandTheftUber

"Hey man, don't go all Uber on us ok?"

Uber just became the new 'Postal'.


----------



## AintWorthIt

Wow this is so bad for uber.


----------



## forqalso

Michael - Cleveland said:


> Student is an occupation if they work p/t (census def) - but that's beside the point...
> The majority of mass shootings (4 or more shot) that have occurred in the US since 1999 have been committed by students.
> 
> Heritage High - GA, Columbine - CO, Century 15 Movie Theater - Aurora, COSandy Hook - CT, FT Gibson - OK, VA Tech, Roseburg, OR, Sanatana High - Santee, CA, Granite Hills High - ElCajon, CA, UofA -Tuscon, AZ, Redlake, MN, Oikos Univ - Oakland, CA, Marysville, WA, Chardon High - Chardon, OH... and on and on...


Student is an occupation if they work p/t at a job that is not being a student? OOOOOOOOOOOOOK. 
The point I'm trying to make is "why does 'Uber driver' need to be in the headline of any story about a driver committing a crime. If it was a 7/11 clerk, the story would never mention it.


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

forqalso said:


> Student isn't an occupation or profession. But, your answer, "postal worker" proves my point. You'll have to go back at least ten years to find a postal worker that did mass shooting. There's been more than enough shootings but no other job gets mentioned like an Uber driver.


Yet. There was more than one instance of a postal worker shooting. Hence the term. The post office actually has tried to make the jobs less stressful since DUE to these incidents.

You think this won't happen again? You think Uber will change?


----------



## stuber

New Uber Feature: Uber Homicide. Be Part of the Action.


----------



## Ara

UberPissed said:


> Kzoo police ID suspect in deadly random shootings
> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/20/multiple-fatally-shot-at-2-locations-in-kalamazoo-co/
> 
> TEXAS TOWNSHIP, Mich. (WOOD) - Six people are dead and two seriously wounded after a shooter opened fire at three different locations in the Kalamazoo area over the course of nearly five hours Saturday night.
> 
> Michigan State Police on Sunday identified the four victims killed at one of the crime scenes, the Cracker Barrel restaurant in Texas Township, as:
> 
> 
> Mary Lou Nye, 63, of Baroda, Mich.
> Mary Jo Nye, 60, of Battle Creek
> Dorothy Brown, 74, of Battle Creek
> Barbara Hawthorne, 68, of Battle Creek
> The names of the two other victims killed were not expected to be released Sunday.


Uber people save killer


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

AllenChicago said:


> Uber or Lyft's liability for the actions of drivers is extremely limited..
> 
> Excerpt:
> "In general, a company is liable for the actions of its employees while they're working. A company is not liable, on the other hand, for the actions of third-party contractors. Uber has already expressly denied liability for the death of a 6-year-old in San Francisco because the driver that hit her was between fares."
> 
> Source: http://www.ohiotiger.com/uber-crashes-law/


Except that UberX drivers are employees. No amount of misclassification by Uber will change that.


----------



## Ara

Maybe that guy is fake uber driver ?!?!?!?<><><>


----------



## Bart McCoy

Tenzo said:


> It's strange how some posters are spamming the thread saying it's not Ubers fault.
> OK, I might have agreed on the first post, second, by the third post I wondered why, now it's seven posts by the same guy. Red Flag.
> 
> The guy was employed by the company and worked out of his car.
> If I walk into any business and an employee comes jumping over the counter and kills 6 people, you can be damned sure the store is going to be held responsible. If it's a chain store, even more so. If it's a chain store with vaults of cash, well.........
> 
> In a hospital if a nurse makes a mistake, they sue the nurse, the doctors on staff, the supervisors, the supervisors and doctors who didnt even see the patient and the hospital. Uber is going to get sued and get reamed for no background checks, no safeties, no supervision, no training, etc.
> And they are going to lose.


You are totally reaching here, jumping way ahead of yourself predicting the future without having all the facts. Yes he worked for uber, but if he was happy driving for them, why would you blame Uber? Are you saying everytime a person that works for Uber commits a crime outside of Uber, its Uber's fault anyway? All news outlets say "Uber driver shoots people". I haven't seen one that says "A disgruntled, upset with uber's low rates driver kills people". You guys have to put your hate for uber aside at get all the facts first before jumping to blaming a crazy person on uber



Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> Wake up Bart!!!! The criminal thing is straight forward but the civil suits (on behalf of victims) will have UBER brass in courtrooms for a long time


We'll just have to wait and see. NONE of the victims was an Uber passenger. None got shot while he was on the Uber clock. Exactly what would be the basis of a victim blaming Uber for getting shot? Are they really gonna say in court because Uber legally charges 75cents a mile is why their loved one died? Clearly if he picked up a pax and killed somebody in his car, they would have a very good case. But looks like every person that died, had nothing to do with him working as an uber driver


----------



## Just one more trip

Bart McCoy said:


> The link here:
> 
> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/21/kzoo-county-deadly-rampage-suspect-who-is-jason-dalton/
> 
> Says he did Uber BEFORE doing any shootings. I hear reports he was doing Uber in between shootings. But that makes no sense for him to shoot other people, but NOT his Uber passengers.
> 
> I still don't see a clear link to UBER and him shooting people. Somebody explain to me how Uber is to blame for any of this (all joking aside)
> 
> What if he had just got off work from McDonalds and threw some fries. Then he got to shooting people. Would you blame McDonalds?
> 
> If he was picking up passengers and riding around shooting them, clearly that's a direct link to the shootings. But as of right now, it doesn't seem to matter what his job was, since what he did for a living looks to be unrelated to the shooting.
> 
> Not trying to defend Uber, but if something bad happens and Uber name is put in it, I would just like to see a good reasoning to blame uber for somebody shooting people. Like is it safe to say if he didn't Uber he wouldn't have shot anybody? Clearly this guy was just a crazy person that had a job


Ever heard of the term "going postal"? Uber has been pressing and stressing the drivers with many dramatic rate reductions and other nefarious devices to take money from the drivers. It was only a matter of time until one exploded. Frankly I'm surprised he did not shoot up the local office and "deactivate" the Uber employees there. That would have made the nightmare even worse.

Prayers for the innocent victims. Blame will not bring them back.


----------



## simpsonsverytall

Is there really a loophole where someone can use a fake facebook acct and a prepaid cc to be an Uber Pax?


----------



## CIncinnatiDriver

TwoFiddyMile said:


> Id blame the management of his team partially.
> See, if you commit crime on your shift, it drags your company into it.


Heck yeah.

My step-son works as an independent contractor repairing cars. 
If he was violent in any way while one job when the supervisor wasn't there (as Uber isn't there),
his company would be SEEN as responsible for his action because they are supposed to VET him, SUPERVISE hiim, and PROVIDE CUSTOMER SERIVCE. 
Uber IS ground-breaking, nifty, etc, but it does NOT do much to protect people. 
Uber = limited vetting, NO direct contact supervising, and NO customer support. 
IMO they should do a little more.
I don't know much about IC's in other companies...but I cannot immediately think of a company that has IC's doing direct customer service face-to-face without some kind of supervisor interacting with IC.

Honestly, it just stands to reason that sooner or later, someone on the edge would take the job.



Dontmakemepullauonyou said:


> I launch uber rider app and go to the city of Kalamazoo and shocker a pop up popped up saying "Uber 20% off for the winter".
> 
> $0.12 min and $0.75 mile. After uber cut that's $0.09 min and $0.60 mile.
> 
> Travis the blood is on your hands first for the rate cuts and then for discouraging riders from tipping.


yep.



sidewazzz said:


> Not at all, just that uber and it's practices have basically enabled these people. ShItty pay, shItty background and shItty hiring practice = lots of room for stuff like this to happen. If Uber were held to a higher standard we wouldn't have pay issues let alone hardly any of the criminal stuff.


Yep.

The one thing Uber CAN'T say is that did all they could to screen for and supervise their drivers.



naplestom75 said:


> Looks like they stopped calling it a "safe rider fee" just in time!


LOLOLOLOLOLOL



backstreets-trans said:


> I think it's called damage control. Travis has his minions trying to put a good spin on this travesty. It will be interesting when all details come out. I'm sure the girl that posted on facebook and called 911 will give her side. She probably tried *to notify uber but an overseas email won't be looked at for days.* Uber has conveniently not had a phone number or any way to reach them directly. How a 60 billion dollar company doesn't have a call center for emergencies is beyond belief.
> 
> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/21/kzoo-county-deadly-rampage-suspect-who-is-jason-dalton/


SHAMEFUL !!!
they should have some words flagged to escalate to sooner as needed



naplestom75 said:


> Does this mean that he is deactivated?





DriverX said:


>





Michael - Cleveland said:


> Blame entirely? No, of course not.
> But if Uber had any kind of REAL customer service, the pax's report of the driver's erratic behavior would have been reviewed immediately and at the very least he would have been taken offline... and at best, reported to the police (BOLO) because a crime was committed (sideswiping another car). Uber is not responsible for the actions of the driver - but they ARE responsible for running a system where customers and drivers can't get to anyone in real-time in the event of an emergency.


Let's be honest. When an employee's behaviour is erratic but not criminal (or criminal but hard to verify), 
management is the FIRST line of defense.
Once again
Agreed.
CUSTOMER SERVICE is needed


----------



## stuber

sidewazzz said:


> Not at all, just that uber and it's practices have basically enabled these people. ShItty pay, shItty background and shItty hiring practice = lots of room for stuff like this to happen. If Uber were held to a higher standard we wouldn't have pay issues let alone hardly any of the criminal stuff.


A closer look may find background information the Uber "screening" possibly missed. Regardless, look at the photo! That's not a guy I would ever assign to pick up one of my customers.

Those guys in LA who are trying to crowdsource funds for a billboard...well just reproduce the news article with that photo. Caption: Drivers are ashamed of Uber. Passengers, demand changes!


----------



## Bart McCoy

Just one more trip said:


> Ever heard of the term "going postal"? Uber has been pressing and stressing the drivers with many dramatic rate reductions and other nefarious devices to take money from the drivers. It was only a matter of time until one exploded. Frankly I'm surprised he did not shoot up the local office and "deactivate" the Uber employees there. That would have made the nightmare even worse.
> .


Do you have ANY proof whatsoever that this guy killed people because of ubers low rates????????????????????????????????? uber sucks, but do you know his true reason for killing this people? I guess being crazy isn't a valid answer, it has to be because of Uber right?



simpsonsverytall said:


> Is there really a loophole where someone can use a fake facebook acct and a prepaid cc to be an Uber Pax?


what does Facebook have to do with anything? You just need a credit card and email address


----------



## Jack Pavlov

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> He was an UBER driver.....Driving for UBER the same part of the day or perhaps the same time as committing these crime. UBER is linked to this crime in every headline.....ARE YOU SERIOUS????


Yeah if I worked an 8-5 shift at McDonald's and then got off work to go kill 3 people, does that mean McDonald's is responsible for my actions? What if I killed them because I was denied a promotion or raise or denied more hours, does that make McDonald's liable? 
No.

I'm sure uber will take the right steps in this situation, we are all just speculating a lot, and most people here are working off of their own bias with the company to pass judgements or state their opinions. When an event like this occurs, you have to take an objective position and think rationally within the confines of the event and confines of the law.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Bart McCoy said:


> You are totally reaching here, jumping way ahead of yourself predicting the future without having all the facts. Yes he worked for uber, but if he was happy driving for them, why would you blame Uber? Are you saying everytime a person that works for Uber commits a crime outside of Uber, its Uber's fault anyway? All news outlets say "Uber driver shoots people". I haven't seen one that says "disgruntled, upset with uber's low rates drivers, kills people". You guys have to put your hate for uber aside at get all the facts first before jumping to blaming a crazy person on uber
> 
> We'll just have to wait and see. NONE of the victims was an Uber passenger. None got shot while he was on the Uber clock. Exactly what would be the basis of a victim blaming Uber for getting shot? Are they really gonna say in court because Uber legally charges 75cents a mile is why their loved one died? Clearly if he picked up a pax and killed somebody in his car, they would have a very good case. But looks like every person that died, had nothing to do with him working as an uber driver


No doubt none were passengers (as far as we know) but I don't think it's required that they were passengers. They were victims of a man who at the time they were killed, was working in a capacity as a contracted driver for Uber.....But we shall see how this plays out. It has been said by more than a few on this thread that no matter what happens, the PR blowback from this is going to be brutal.


----------



## Bart McCoy

stuber said:


> A closer look may find background information the Uber "screening" possibly missed. Regardless, look at the photo! That's not a guy I would ever assign to pick up one of my customers.


the guy had a clean criminal history. so now the blame game is uber doesn't vet its drivers? if he's never committed a crime before, how you gonna use a clean history to NOT let him drive? how bout the guy was just crazy?

and now you gonna not let people drive for Uber soley on the basis of how they look????????????????


----------



## Jack Pavlov

Oh and by the way, everyone who's saying "uber should be doing this and that and etc... " if uber began making all of these changes, the cost of making those changes would be passed on to two people... The drivers, and the customers in which case, there would not be a ride share service to work for and many would be out of a job. If I spent as much time as all of you do complaining about the problems, instead of devising a solution to ending my own misery, I wouldn't make any money either. But luckily, I prioritize my time better and make a considerable amount, enough to pay my bills and sustain me through school.


----------



## Bart McCoy

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> No doubt none were passengers (as far as we know) but I don't think it's required that they were passengers. They were victims of a man who at the time they were killed, was working in a capacity as a contracted driver for Uber.....But we shall see how this plays out. It has been said by more than a few on this thread that no matter what happens, the PR blowback from this is going to be brutal.


Normally when you file lawsuits, who you are suing is somebody directly connected to what the person was doing when something bad happened. Meaning if you ordered an Uber, then a company has some responsibility of your safety(of course this didn't happen here). If you slip and fall in Giant, you were a shopper and giant has some duty to make sure the floors are clean. If you are hurt in an accident, the person that hit you has a duty to drive safely and not hurt other people. If a person shot you and you lived, you can sue THAT person sure, but not his job when he was off the clock!!

In this case, the people that died, had no contract or service agreement with Uber. They had absolutely nothing to do with Uber. That's like saying a cab driver gets off work and then does a drive by shooting. You going to sue the cab drivers company just because he worked for a cab company? makes no sense. The sad fact is, at the time of the shooting, the crazy guy was not acting on the behalf of Uber, he was acting as his crazy self.

A lawsuit is possible if and only if its proven without a doubt low rates and frustration with Uber was the reason he went on a killing spree.Surely none of this has been brought to light yet. Good luck proving that,when he spared ALL his passengers when he allegedly did Uber rides with no shootings of the pax in his car.

You guys make it seem like if you're an Uber driver then what you do AROUND THE CLOCK reflects upon uber, smh. It doesn't really matter if he did rides inbetween shootings if none of those shooting happened while he was on Uber's clock.

I wouldn't be surprised if Uber sued the major news outlets for defamation!


----------



## simpsonsverytall

Bart McCoy said:


> what does Facebook have to do with anything? You just need a credit card and email address


That's kinda scary. 
seems exploitable for certain crimes not to mention carjackers etc... 
also if 'going uber' does actually become synomous w/ 'going postal' you could have drivers and random nutcases doing that


----------



## GrandTheftUber

Jack Pavlov said:


> Yeah if I worked an 8-5 shift at McDonald's and then got off work to go kill 3 people, does that mean McDonald's is responsible for my actions? What if I killed them because I was denied a promotion or raise or denied more hours, does that make McDonald's liable?
> No.
> 
> I'm sure uber will take the right steps in this situation, we are all just speculating a lot, and most people here are working off of their own bias with the company to pass judgements or state their opinions. When an event like this occurs, you have to take an objective position and think rationally within the confines of the event and confines of the law.


If you had a giant McDonalds 'M' sticker on your side window, McDonald decaled plates, and customers from McDonalds complaining you almost killed them? I'd say the association to McDonalds is well founded. OF COURSE the Uber association is fair.


----------



## simpsonsverytall

I'd guess that Uber escapes criminal liability here, but they may end up paying some settlements.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Jack Pavlov said:


> Yeah if I worked an 8-5 shift at McDonald's and then got off work to go kill 3 people, does that mean McDonald's is responsible for my actions? What if I killed them because I was denied a promotion or raise or denied more hours, does that make McDonald's liable?
> No.
> 
> I'm sure uber will take the right steps in this situation, we are all just speculating a lot, and most people here are working off of their own bias with the company to pass judgements or state their opinions. When an event like this occurs, you have to take an objective position and think rationally within the confines of the event and confines of the law.


If you were working for Mcdonalds at the time you killed those people??? You bet your ass Mcdonald's would be on the hook. This is a driver forum and objectivity, while appreciated isn't always easy.....You see, many of us are trying to earn money doing this, some trying to feed families. It is not our hobby or some common enthusiasm that brings us together. It is the ability to have a compensatory relationship with a company that has no problems exploiting in some cases one of the few assets these folks have left. If you drive for Uber then you have a vested interest in what goes on here and therefore should find it difficult to be objective about such grim matters. If on the other hand you are not a driver then who the hell cares what you think????


----------



## AllenChicago

Right off the top of my head I can think of 2 Lyft passengers who would say that Uber is the catalyst behind this guy blowing up, and killing innocent people the way he did. They quit taking Uber because too many drivers started complaining about how bad the company treats them. These 2 switched from Uber to Lyft as a protest against Uber. One also grew uneasy with entrusting his well-being to an increasing number of upset Uber drivers.


----------



## Zebonkey

Kalamazoo is a goofy ****ing name, and that dude looks like a registered sex offender.


----------



## Bart McCoy

GrandTheftUber said:


> If you had a giant McDonalds 'M' sticker on your side window, McDonald decaled plates, and customers from McDonalds complaining you almost killed them?


Yes but you're talkign about 2 different people. As i mentioned in my previous post, the people who said the Uber driver almost killed them were Uber passengers in an Uber car, so Uber had a reasonable responsibility for their safety. BUT, um, NOTHING happened to those people. They just had a scary ride. Yeah Uber may be at fault for that, BUT, are you going to sue Uber for $47mil for a scary ride?

See , the people in question what we're talking about is the people whom the Uber driver shot. None of them were in an Uber car, none were pax, none were killed while the driver was on active Uber duty. So again to me why this is Uber driver shot people, instead of crazy person shot people??? Most people keep that silly Uber sticker up on their car 24/7, so no matter what time of the day if that person commits a crime, you're going to blame Uber because that that symbol on his car? beyond crazy


----------



## DriverX

Bart McCoy said:


> Do you have ANY proof whatsoever that this guy killed people because of ubers low rates????????????????????????????????? uber sucks, but do you know his true reason for killing this people? I guess being crazy isn't a valid answer, it has to be because of Uber right?
> 
> what does Facebook have to do with anything? You just need a credit card and email address


Your explanation of "going crazy" is a lot less informative than our speculation that his experience with Uber probably led to his acts of brutality. It's too easy to just say someone went 'crazy' there are always triggers and usually a trail of circumstances that lead to a family man losing his sh*t and going on all Uber on the public.

Clearly when you have a bunch of drivers that are all saying this was bound to happen considering the way Uber treats drivers, there MIGHT BE SOME MERIT TO THEIR CLAIMS


----------



## DuberOn

Some thoughts:

-Uber did not force this guy to do anything, let's be honest, with a clean background no one aside from close family could have seen this coming.

-Uber WILL be affected by this, regardless how you feel about what pushed this man to do these horrible acts. Put yourself in the shoes of pax, knowing something like this has happened is in the back of your head when you get picked up.

-I see some responses in this thread from some strategically placed "new members" looks like uber is on the PR rebuttal already.

As mentioned earlier in this thread, this might be the straw (albeit a huge one) that breaks the Ubers Camels back.


----------



## Bart McCoy

stop jumping to conclusions people, smh


----------



## Rakos

_"The phrase "Going Postal" was coined when a postal worker did this in the 80s. So its only expected that it'll be linked to the job. The background check thing is irrelevant unless this guy had a record, the issue Uber will face is the families suing saying Uber's policies created a antagonistic environment between uber-driver-pax which caused the driver to have a mental breakdown triggered by his last pax who one starred him and then wrote a nasty facebook post about him. Which has now been removed. easy case, he could self represent and still win."_

Sounds a lot like what used to be called "going postal" so I agree the new way of talking about these things just may end up being "Going Uber Crazy"

I have noticed a lowering of the bar lately in UberX riders and not sure why. It could be they are allowing debit cards now. I have always noticed that the bar seemed to be higher because you needed a REAL credit card in the past. I have stopped taking UberX pax except on rare occasion. I found it damned hard to make money on UberX rates and so I am using my UberXL capability now that it has been restored. I have to wait a bit longer but make substantially more with XL rides.

As to the drivers Uber is using now, I noticed and agree with the figure of 200,000 drivers in the USA and have noticed in the Tampa area I always seem lately to be passing drivers with their app opened and flashing for everyone to see. In the last year or so it was not in your interest to let cabbies or cops know that you were driving Uber because doing so could have escalated to a ticket or in some cases a physical intimidation by a cabbie.

Here's to hoping that Uber raises the rates back to a workable amount that makes things better but not confident it will happen soon enuff!

My little monkey brain still cannot get a handle on just how that they expect to run a business while running the drivers into the ground.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Bart McCoy said:


> Normally when you file lawsuits, who you are suing is somebody directly connected to what the person was doing when something bad happened. Meaning if you ordered an Uber, then a company has some responsibility of your safety(of course this didn't happen here). If you slip and fall in Giant, you were a shopper and giant has some duty to make sure the floors are clean. If you are hurt in an accident, the person that hit you has a duty to drive safely and not hurt other people. If a person shot you and you lived, you can sue THAT person sure, but not his job when he was off the clock!!
> 
> In this case, the people that died, had no contract or service agreement with Uber. They had absolutely nothing to do with Uber. That's like saying a cab driver gets off work and then does a drive by shooting. You going to sue the cab drivers company just because he worked for a cab company? makes no sense. The sad fact is, at the time of the shooting, the crazy guy was not acting on the behalf of Uber, he was acting as his crazy self.
> 
> A lawsuit is possible if and only if its proven without a doubt low rates and frustration with Uber was the reason he went on a killing spree.Surely none of this has been brought to light yet. Good luck proving that,when he spared ALL his passengers when he allegedly did Uber rides with no shootings of the pax in his car.
> 
> You guys make it seem like if you're an Uber driver then what you do AROUND THE CLOCK reflects upon uber, smh. It doesn't really matter if he did rides inbetween shootings if none of those shooting happened while he was on Uber's clock.
> 
> I wouldn't be surprised if Uber sued the major news outlets for defamation!
> 
> Hey Bart....please don't take this the wrong way brother but you sound like you work for UBER....not as a lawyer (the above is high testiment to that) but in some way.....anyway, we will just have to see how this shakes out. Might need to dust off the old CV if ya know what I'm sayin because the times they might be getting a tad rougher in the house that Travis built....GOOD LUCK!!!!


----------



## GrandTheftUber

Message to UBER.

Unhappy employees will end up destroying your reputation, and ultimately your company. In various ways. Sometimes slowly; sometimes in one fell swoop. Stories like this are Uber's 'canary in the Coal mine.'

I don't need to bring out a list of example's from history. Travis my friend, your days are numbered if you don't treat your drivers like people. I started Uber because of your drivers. They beamed with pride when recommending Uber as a partner. 

Now? Your work force is depressed and pissed off. That pride is gone. Next? Your investors and passengers will dry up. You are about to lose your baby. It's your call.


----------



## Jack Pavlov

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> If you were working for Mcdonalds at the time you killed those people??? You bet your ass Mcdonald's would be on the hook. This is a driver forum and objectivity, while appreciated isn't always easy.....You see, many of us are trying to earn money doing this, some trying to feed families. It is not our hobby or some common enthusiasm that brings us together. It is the ability to have a compensatory relationship with a company that has no problems exploiting in some cases one of the few assets these folks have left. If you drive for Uber then you have a vested interest in what goes on here and therefore should find it difficult to be objective about such grim matters. If on the other hand you are not a driver then who the hell cares what you think????


But I am a driver, I just take a more level headed approach. Instead of wasted efforts in meaningless arguments, I go out there... And drive. I drive roughly 35 hours a week, go to school full time and take care of a 2 year old. If there is anyone on this forum that has a clue about what this job means for sustainability, it's me. I have roughly 1500 in bills. I clear about 800-1000 per week after ubers 25% cut, and I make it work.


----------



## Bart McCoy

DriverX said:


> Clearly when you have a bunch of drivers that are all saying this was bound to happen considering the way Uber treats drivers, there MIGHT BE SOME MERIT TO THEIR CLAIMS


So now you are saying Uber is actively breeding murderers? and more and more shootings like this is going to happen?



DuberOn said:


> Some thoughts:
> 
> -Uber did not force this guy to do anything, let's be honest, with a clean background no one aside from close family could have seen this coming.
> 
> -Uber WILL be affected by this, regardless how you feel about what pushed this man to do these horrible acts. Put yourself in the shoes of pax, knowing something like this has happened is in the back of your head when you get picked up.
> 
> -I see some responses in this thread from some strategically placed "new members" looks like uber is on the PR rebuttal already.
> 
> As mentioned earlier in this thread, this might be the straw (albeit a huge one) that breaks the Ubers Camels back.


If the guy shot people and went back to work at mcdonalds, then left out again to kill more people, would you be afraid to go into any mcdonalds restaurant again? even though he shot NOBODY in mcdonalds or any customers of mcdonalds? would you think mcdonalds breeds murderers because they pay min wage to drop fries into the grease?

I wouldnt call it PR rebuttal, I'd call it looking at the facts,which there is none yet, to solidly say he killed because of low rates. Most people hatred of Uber can not let them think straight anyway. People just want Uber to crumble, so sure they are happy that Uber's name is attached to this, irregardless of facts!

Straw that broke the camels back? huge reach and way too early to say anythign remotely like that. Uber is in several countries, and this isnt the first "uber-related" (and I say that loosely) shooting to happen. Why would this shooting ultimately change things? Why negligence did Uber do in hiring this guy? he had NO criminal record. For Uber to be responsible they had to do some negligent,or neglect to do something prudent that they reasonably saw was coming.

Other than this guy happening to work for Uber, I havent seen ONE person give me any reasonable reason Uber should be at fault for this crazy guy!!!


----------



## Bart McCoy

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> Hey Bart....please don't take this the wrong way brother but you sound like you work for UBER....not as a lawyer (the above is high testiment to that) but in some way.....anyway, we will just have to see how this shakes out. Might need to dust off the old CV if ya know what I'm sayin because the times they might be getting a tad rougher in the house that Travis built....GOOD LUCK!!!!


Well if you read any of my posts on the forum, you clearly know I dont work for Uber, and have always decried Uber's low rates,smh

Like I said, you have to put your hate for Uber aside and look at what actually happened. Most people commenting are biased against Uber, which is understandable, but obviously that clouds your judgement.

And yes we have to see how this plays out, but thanks to the media, reading the headlines one would think an uber driver was picking up passengers and killing them. No, he just happened to work for Uber. He "spared" all his Uber pax, which doesnt make any sense, since if he was outrage at Uber, it would seem that the people he picked up would be the first to die. None did.

Still waiting on ANYONE to tell me how Uber is at fault for this shooting. You cant point at the hiring process because he had no prior criminal history. So what else will yall reach for?

I'll wait..................


----------



## sidewazzz

Bart McCoy said:


> the guy had a clean criminal history. so now the blame game is uber doesn't vet its drivers? if he's never committed a crime before, how you gonna use a clean history to NOT let him drive? how bout the guy was just crazy?
> 
> and now you gonna not let people drive for Uber soley on the basis of how they look????????????????


Lyft mentors have failed people just for being strange and unconformable. Look you can't ignore the facts Uber hires just about anyone, it's rare to here someone got passed up lol. On the other hand Lyft denies a lot of Uber drivers.

Weather this guy had no history or not... He's and Uber driver and was driving while killing people at random. Other cases drivers were driving and raping, kidnapping, robbing and stealing identities... the list goes on. I can't think of any other Billion $$$$ company that carries that type of rap sheet "partners". Lets face it, A LOT (not all) OF DRIVERS ARE UNEMPLOYED FOR A REASON. We are basically at the point were you are more likely to die by an Uber driver than lighting, shark attack or snake bite combined. All the shitty changes Uber does on the daily may have something to do with this event.... maybe not.


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

Bart McCoy said:


> Yes but you're talkign about 2 different people. As i mentioned in my previous post, the people who said the Uber driver almost killed them were Uber passengers in an Uber car, so Uber had a reasonable responsibility for their safety. BUT, um, NOTHING happened to those people. They just had a scary ride. Yeah Uber may be at fault for that, BUT, are you going to sue Uber for $47mil for a scary ride?
> 
> See , the people in question what we're talking about is the people whom the Uber driver shot. None of them were in an Uber car, none were pax, none were killed while the driver was on active Uber duty. So again to me why this is Uber driver shot people, instead of crazy person shot people??? Most people keep that silly Uber sticker up on their car 24/7, so no matter what time of the day if that person commits a crime, you're going to blame Uber because that that symbol on his car? beyond crazy


Define "active driver duty".

If his app was on inbetween trips (had to be at some point) then he was as active as he was when a pax was in the car. If he was in a market with guarantees then he was going to get paid for the time online if he qualified. So time online is "active" IMHO.


----------



## simpsonsverytall

going to get even worse... 
2015 = You still had a lot of people 'enthused' about Uber, passengers who thought it was cutting-edge and who believed drivers 'make good money'

2016 = Word has gotten out (often from drivers themselves complaining after rate cuts). People joke about driving uber, the quality of driver has gone down... It's lost some of that technological breakthrough excitement



GrandTheftUber said:


> Message to UBER.
> 
> Unhappy employees will end up destroying your reputation, and ultimately your company. In various ways. Sometimes slowly; sometimes in one fell swoop. Stories like this are Uber's 'canary in the Coal mine.'
> 
> I don't need to bring out a list of example's from history. Travis my friend, your days are numbered if you don't treat your drivers like people. I started Uber because of your drivers. They beamed with pride when recommending Uber as a partner.
> 
> Now? Your work force is depressed and pissed off. That pride is gone. Next? Your investors and passengers will dry up. You are about to lose your baby. It's your call.


----------



## Bart McCoy

sidewazzz said:


> Lyft mentors have failed people just for being strange and unconformable. Look you can't ignore the facts Uber hires just about anyone, it's rare to here someone got passed up lol. On the other hand Lyft denies a lot of Uber drivers.
> 
> Weather this guy had no history or not... He's and Uber driver and was driving while killing people at random. Other cases drivers were driving and raping, kidnapping, robbing and stealing identities... the list goes on. I can't think of any other Billion $$$$ company that carries that type of rap sheet "partners". Lets face it, A LOT (not all) OF DRIVERS ARE UNEMPLOYED FOR A REASON. We are basically at the point were you are more likely to die by an Uber driver than lighting, shark attack or snake bite combined. All the shitty changes Uber does on the daily may have something to do with this event.... maybe not.


what a total reach, smh. I'm more likely to die at the hands of an Uber driver? you can be remotely serious are you?
go look at the people on death row, how many drove for uber?
instead of reaching, do some fact checking. of all the murders in the US, what percentage were from Uber drivers? You wouldnt even be able to include this one for actually committing a crime while being a passenger, because none of the victims had ordered an Uber ride

Lets see how far you willl reach. If i order an Uber car today, what are my chances of getting shot,killed, or raped?


----------



## Bart McCoy

Fuzzyelvis said:


> Define "active driver duty".
> 
> If his app was on inbetween trips (had to be at some point) then he was as active as he was when a pax was in the car. If he was in a market with guarantees then he was going to get paid for the time online if he qualified. So time online is "active" IMHO.


He clearly had NO pax in his car when he shot people.
Do you know if his app was on?
See, I'm going with facts. No Uber pax was shot. People can only guess that his app was on.
How bout we only comment on the facts, we can speculate forever


----------



## DuberOn

Bart McCoy said:


> Well if you read any of my posts on the forum, you clearly know I dont work for Uber, and have always decried Uber's low rates,smh
> 
> Like I said, you have to put your hate for Uber aside and look at what actually happened. Most people commenting are biased against Uber, which is understandable, but obviously that clouds your judgement.
> 
> And yes we have to see how this plays out, but thanks to the media, reading the headlines one would think an uber driver was picking up passengers and killing them. No, he just happened to work for Uber. He "spared" all his Uber pax, which doesnt make any sense, since if he was outrage at Uber, it would seem that the people he picked up would be the first to die. None did.
> 
> Still waiting on ANYONE to tell me how Uber is at fault for this shooting. You cant point at the hiring process because he had no prior criminal history. So what else will yall reach for?
> 
> I'll wait..................


I agree, waiting for the facts would be the best.

But you can't say the masses won't be concerned about their uber drivers due to this outlier. Like you mentioned about McDonald's, I'll take it a step further and say, after the Colorado theatre shooting, people were hesitant to go to theatres. I know it wasn't an employee but it's the situation that creates our doubt or uncertainty.

For the record, I don't hate uber, I think they have made some bad decisions, but as soon as it didn't benefit me, I jumped ship.

I think we are on the same page but arguing different points.


----------



## GrandTheftUber

Bart McCoy said:


> So now you are saying Uber is actively breeding murderers? and more and more shootings like this is going to happen?
> 
> If the guy shot people and went back to work at mcdonalds, then left out again to kill more people, would you be afraid to go into any mcdonalds restaurant again? even though he shot NOBODY in mcdonalds or any customers of mcdonalds? would you think mcdonalds breeds murderers because they pay min wage to drop fries into the grease?
> 
> I wouldnt call it PR rebuttal, I'd call it looking at the facts,which there is none yet, to solidly say he killed because of low rates. Most people hatred of Uber can not let them think straight anyway. People just want Uber to crumble, so sure they are happy that Uber's name is attached to this, irregardless of facts!
> 
> Straw that broke the camels back? huge reach and way too early to say anythign remotely like that. Uber is in several countries, and this isnt the first "uber-related" (and I say that loosely) shooting to happen. Why would this shooting ultimately change things? Why negligence did Uber do in hiring this guy? he had NO criminal record. For Uber to be responsible they had to do some negligent,or neglect to do something prudent that they reasonably saw was coming.
> 
> Other than this guy happening to work for Uber, I havent seen ONE person give me any reasonable reason Uber should be at fault for this crazy guy!!!


It's not so much FAULT as it is PERCEPTION. You are barking up the wrong tree. You will not win the PR war with the public, and especially this forum, by painting Uber as sparkling clean. In fact, doing so makes one look like a paid damage control operative (not saying that you are... Again, perception).


----------



## Bart McCoy

So one of the pax that got a ride during the shooting rampage, rated the shooter 5 stars.


----------



## Just_in

Bart McCoy said:


> stop jumping to conclusions people, smh
> 
> View attachment 28874


There is no motive yet. According to some news reports.

One or more of the victims was shot at a used car lot. Another in front of restaurant. Another at a apartment complex..

It's random,,,,for now.Fact is this shooter was taken alive. So there will be a trial..There might or will be motive...eventually...

So this shooter did not shoot passengers. The motive might tie in to where these victims were shot...might not..while Ubering.

Speculation so far..


----------



## Bart McCoy

GrandTheftUber said:


> It's not so much FAULT as it is PERCEPTION. You are barking up the wrong tree. You will not win the PR war with the public, and especially this forum, by painting Uber as sparkling clean. In fact, doing so makes one look like a paid damage control operative (not saying that you are... Again, perception).


I'm talking moreso in lawsuit, and simply proving Uber is at fault.

PR wise I already know uber is shot to hell because the media outlets threw Uber's name out there without having all the facts


----------



## Bart McCoy

Just_in said:


> There is no motive yet. According to some news reports.
> 
> One or more of the victims was shot at a used car lot. Another in front of restaurant. Another at a apartment complex..
> 
> It's random,,,,for now.Fact is this shooter was taken alive. So there will be a trial..There might or will be motive...eventually...
> 
> So this shooter did not shoot passengers. The motive might tie in to where these victims were shot...might not..while Ubering.
> 
> Speculation so far..


we can speculate for days....yet people are crucifying Uber without having the facts
The only solid fact right now is that he didnt shoot any pax he picked up while working for Uber and at least one of his pax gave him 5 stars!


----------



## UberXTampa

SafeT said:


> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...t-year-old-child-shooting-spree-Michigan.html


low rates constantly reinforce animosity between driver and pax. 
Since this is an attack on driver dignity, I expect more drivers that have nothing left to lose to tip over to the dark side and reciprocate by acts of violence like this one.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bart McCoy said:


> I'm talking moreso in lawsuit, and simply proving Uber is at fault.
> 
> PR wise I already know uber is shot to hell because the media outlets threw Uber's name out there without having all the facts


Here's a fact for you... The NY Times reported the first report of eratic driving was posted on FB at 5:30. The passenger contacted Uber at that time. This was before their driver went on a killing spree. Leaving this driver unsupervised and on the road after this incident without a way to immediately contact Uber (other than email) is definitely a major issue.


----------



## AllenChicago

One thing for certain is that the damage-control will kick into high gear at Uber headquarters tomorrow. This Kalamazoo rampage is being broadcast on a lot more channels across the country than it would have been if this murderer was not a UBER driver. Maybe 50% off of all Uber fares nationwide will be the first step taken?


----------



## Just_in

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Here's a fact for you... The NY Times reported the first report of eratic driving was posted on FB at 5:30. The passenger contacted Uber at that time. This was before their driver went on a killing spree. Leaving this driver unsupervised and on the road after this incident without a way to immediately contact Uber (other than email) is definitely a major issue.


Beat me to it. Just typing the same thing. Anyways....exactly..


----------



## sidewazzz

Bart McCoy said:


> what a total reach, smh. I'm more likely to die at the hands of an Uber driver? you can be remotely serious are you?
> go look at the people on death row, how many drove for uber?
> instead of reaching, do some fact checking. of all the murders in the US, what percentage were from Uber drivers? You wouldnt even be able to include this one for actually committing a crime while being a passenger, because none of the victims had ordered an Uber ride
> 
> Lets see how far you willl reach. If i order an Uber car today, what are my chances of getting shot,killed, or raped?


Your reading comprehension sucks. good night


----------



## Onlyonereese

So much for the background check lol


----------



## GrandTheftUber

Bart McCoy said:


> we can speculate for days....yet people are crucifying Uber without having the facts
> The only solid fact right now is that he didnt shoot any pax he picked up while working for Uber and at least one of his pax gave him 5 stars!


If a PAX wasn't hit, you must acquit.


----------



## simpsonsverytall

UberXTampa said:


> low rates constantly reinforce animosity between driver and pax.
> Since this is an attack on driver dignity, I expect more drivers that have nothing left to lose to tip over to the dark side and reciprocate by acts of violence like this one.


Driving is a STRESSFUL OCCUPATION lol ...

Uber is flooding the market. 
There's a difference between Uber drivers and taxi drivers. 
Taxi = you kinda know what you are getting into. And a lot of cab companies weren't looking for guys who didn't want to put in the grind. 
Uber you've got new drivers thinking they will be earning $1000/ week and you've got guys that even if they know the bleak realities maybe don't have the discipline to drive 60 hrs/week.

Don't get me wrong. Uber has some amazing individual drivers that know the city blindfolded down to the lanes and potholes of each route and are true professionals. I'm talking about the sheer volume of drivers and the amount of stress that driving all day brings.


----------



## Bart McCoy

UberXTampa said:


> low rates constantly reinforce animosity between driver and pax.
> Since this is an attack on driver dignity, I expect more drivers that have nothing left to lose to tip over to the dark side and reciprocate by acts of violence like this one.


so you expect and anticipate more drivers to randomly shoot people off the clock? crazy



UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Here's a fact for you... The NY Times reported the first report of eratic driving was posted on FB at 5:30. The passenger contacted Uber at that time. This was before their driver went on a killing spree. Leaving this driver unsupervised and on the road after this incident without a way to immediately contact Uber (other than email) is definitely a major issue.


Yeah, and another pax gave him 5 stars during that same "did uber rides inbetween shootings", so point? Driver unsupervised? when is a driver ever supervised? Do you think Uber is the only company that operates email only? Was Uber supposed to deactivate the driver soley bases on a pax account? do you know how much outrage this would be to other drivers if this happened after only hearing the pax side? So you cant have it both ways. Even if he was driving erratically, are you saying that Uber should have forseen when he got off work he was going to kill people? That's the only way you can hold Uber liable for this act of violence



sidewazzz said:


> Your reading comprehension sucks. good night


so personally attack me because you cant counter my claims, just great
dont get mad just because of your wild reachings


----------



## Archie8616

There probably won't be any surge's in that area for awhile until the facts are out there.


----------



## DriverX

Bart McCoy said:


> So now you are saying Uber is actively breeding murderers? and more and more shootings like this is going to happen?
> 
> If the guy shot people and went back to work at mcdonalds, then left out again to kill more people, would you be afraid to go into any mcdonalds restaurant again? even though he shot NOBODY in mcdonalds or any customers of mcdonalds? would you think mcdonalds breeds murderers because they pay min wage to drop fries into the grease?
> 
> I wouldnt call it PR rebuttal, I'd call it looking at the facts,which there is none yet, to solidly say he killed because of low rates. Most people hatred of Uber can not let them think straight anyway. People just want Uber to crumble, so sure they are happy that Uber's name is attached to this, irregardless of facts!
> 
> Straw that broke the camels back? huge reach and way too early to say anythign remotely like that. Uber is in several countries, and this isnt the first "uber-related" (and I say that loosely) shooting to happen. Why would this shooting ultimately change things? Why negligence did Uber do in hiring this guy? he had NO criminal record. For Uber to be responsible they had to do some negligent,or neglect to do something prudent that they reasonably saw was coming.
> 
> Other than this guy happening to work for Uber, I havent seen ONE person give me any reasonable reason Uber should be at fault for this crazy guy!!!


In a civil suit, which this will ultimately become after the DA has decided weather or not to prosecute Uber staff in Kalamazoo and possibly Execs in SF, the burden of proof of proof is much lower than a criminal matter. The lawyers just have to convince a jury to hold Uber negligible and award damages to the victims.


----------



## UberXTampa

Bart McCoy said:


> so you expect and anticipate more drivers to randomly shoot people off the clock? crazy
> 
> Yeah, and another pax gave him 5 stars during that same "did uber rides inbetween shootings", so point? Driver unsupervised? when is a driver ever supervised? Do you think Uber is the only company that operates email only? Was Uber supposed to deactivate the driver soley bases on a pax account? do you know how much outrage this would be to other drivers if this happened after only hearing the pax side? So you cant have it both ways. Even if he was driving erratically, are you saying that Uber should have forseen when he got off work he was going to kill people? That's the only way you can hold Uber liable for this act of violence
> 
> so personally attack me because you cant counter my claims, just great
> dont get mad just because of your wild reachings


All I am saying is, this job in many markets is for the desperate that still wants to put hard work and support his family. By removing this opportunity with with deep rate cuts, by telling pax there is no need to tip, by spreading lies telling people drivers make a lot of money, you constantly insult the drivers. There is a breaking point for every person. When you are taking uber drivers as a group of 400,00 people and start subjecting them to this Uber culture, the weak ones will break first.


----------



## DriverX

Bart McCoy said:


> what a total reach, smh. I'm more likely to die at the hands of an Uber driver? you can be remotely serious are you?
> go look at the people on death row, how many drove for uber?
> instead of reaching, do some fact checking. of all the murders in the US, what percentage were from Uber drivers? You wouldnt even be able to include this one for actually committing a crime while being a passenger, because none of the victims had ordered an Uber ride
> 
> Lets see how far you willl reach. If i order an Uber car today, what are my chances of getting shot,killed, or raped?


There are many more Uber drivers than Lyft so it is true you are more likely to get shot by an uber driver than a lyft driver.


----------



## Uber-Doober

UberPissed said:


> Kzoo police ID suspect in deadly random shootings
> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/20/multiple-fatally-shot-at-2-locations-in-kalamazoo-co/
> 
> TEXAS TOWNSHIP, Mich. (WOOD) - Six people are dead and two seriously wounded after a shooter opened fire at three different locations in the Kalamazoo area over the course of nearly five hours Saturday night.
> 
> Michigan State Police on Sunday identified the four victims killed at one of the crime scenes, the Cracker Barrel restaurant in Texas Township, as:
> 
> 
> Mary Lou Nye, 63, of Baroda, Mich.
> Mary Jo Nye, 60, of Battle Creek
> Dorothy Brown, 74, of Battle Creek
> Barbara Hawthorne, 68, of Battle Creek
> The names of the two other victims killed were not expected to be released Sunday.


^^^
My God!!!
Just four seniors out for a meal and then this nutcase walks in blazin. 
I'm not what you would call an emotional person, but this really raises a lump in my throat.


----------



## simpsonsverytall

Praying for the victims, and I wish this guy had found help.

This guy was dedicated! He kept doing trips!!!

I'm sorry. I'm sorry. This guy was doing 5 star trips


----------



## Uber-Doober

scrurbscrud said:


> Holy Crap. Can Uber have any worse PR than that?! Uber driver runs amok and randomly kills 8 pax!
> 
> Almost unreal. But, we have observed here for quite some time, the difficulties drivers face. Financial pressure and general hopelessness, even when working like a slave to get ahead, can and does break people. Particularly if they are weak minded to begin with.
> 
> And what better example than Mich. where Uber has slashed driver sustainability rates to absurdity negative.


^^^
Nothing can be discounted. 
Some people might say that blaming it on rates isn't a good idea.... but when you get an unstable person that has other problems, and then pile on a few more setbacks and he sees himself up against a wall, this nut snaps.

I hope that nobody thinks that I'm giving this guy a pass on anything, because he's clearly unstable in the first place.... but in his addled brain something drove him over the edge to commit this heinous crime. 
Just too bad that there wasn't anybody in there with a CCW to at end the carnage early. 
What the hell kind of thought processes go through the mind of a person like this is a complete mystery. 
WTF was he thinking, and how could he have been pushed over the edge like this? 
And in a death penalty state at that.


----------



## Bart McCoy

DriverX said:


> In a civil suit, which this will ultimately become after the DA has decided weather or not to prosecute Uber staff in Kalamazoo and possibly Execs in SF, the burden of proof of proof is much lower than a criminal matter. The lawyers just have to convince a jury to hold Uber negligible and award damages to the victims.


Sure the burden of proof is lower. But exactly what did Uber do that was negligent? Please answer that. Nobody has said anything that leads me to believe this was Uber's fault



DriverX said:


> There are many more Uber drivers than Lyft so it is true you are more likely to get shot by an uber driver than a lyft driver.


um, this is basic math, but whats your point?
I'm debating the probability of dying by ordering any rideshare service. Your post seemed to reflect that a high number of deaths are related to Uber. Math tells me that the number of deaths divided by the millions even billions of Uber rides done is a low percentage number meaning a low probability of dying having ordered an Uber ride


----------



## Uber-Doober

osii said:


> If you shoot your pax in the car and they bleed on the seats, can you get a cleaning fee reimbursement?


^^^
Talk about dark humor! LOL


----------



## Uber-Doober

backstreets-trans said:


> The complaint probably went overseas. Then it has to be sifted through. It takes 24-48 hrs for it to even be read. I guess 30 cents/mile is the tipping point.


^^^
Yeah... and then the complaint is answered with a cut and paste beginning with "Thank you for reaching out.....".


----------



## Uber-Doober

Thatendedbadly said:


> Yeah, blaming Uber is pointless. That being said, it will be interesting to see if the driver was online while any of this happened.


^^^
He was clearly off line.... in more ways than one, if you catch my drift.


----------



## uber strike

my friend uber driver was expressing suicide after rate cuts. he had quit his job to drive for uber not expecting these cheap rates. i just hope he doesn't go on a rampage. this is the beginning of stressed drivers going mad....


----------



## Feisal Mo

Uber should have taken him off the road with the complaints he was getting from people on uber...I see a lawsuit in the making.


----------



## tohunt4me

backstreets-trans said:


> The complaint probably went overseas. Then it has to be sifted through. It takes 24-48 hrs for it to even be read. I guess 30 cents/mile is the tipping point.


Tipping ?
Someone was tipping ?


----------



## Bart McCoy

uber strike said:


> my friend uber driver was expressing suicide after rate cuts. he had quit his job to drive for uber not expecting these cheap rates. i just hope he doesn't go on a rampage. this is the beginning of stressed drivers going mad....


you do know he can just get another job right? i bet mcdonalds is paying more



Feisal Mo said:


> Uber should have taken him off the road with the complaints he was getting from people on uber...I see a lawsuit in the making.


This is a slippery slope. Do drivers really want entitled pax to get Uber to automatically and quickly deactivate you at any rating 3 or less or an email complaint without ever consulting with you the driver first? Do you REALLY want Uber to operate like that?

Also, you say Uber should have taken him off the road. For what? he wasnt shooting ANY of his pax. But lets say Uber did deactivate him as soon as a pax complained. What in the world does that do? It only stops him from picking up more pax and not harming them. It in no way stops him from riding around with app off /no pax in car (which is what happened in real life) and killing people!!!!

You say a lawsuit is coming. The person suing, they are going to claim their loved one would not have died if Uber deactivated him on the spot(after first complaint)??? How so does that stop the driver from using his car as he did to ride around and still kill people? No matter what Uber does they cant stop that man from driving off the clock for Uber

If people really think Uber is to blame, give me one thing Uber could have done to stop him from killing people?????????????????????


----------



## Uber-Doober

forqalso said:


> Name the profession of any other mass killer. No fair using google.


^^^
Not exactly a "mass" killer, but how about a former football great / movie star / Heisman Trophy winner.


----------



## tohunt4me

Bart McCoy said:


> I guess I'll wait on further reports. Some say he shot people inbetween uber rides, some outlets say he ubered people BEFORE doing any shootings. But in all reports, none state any victum was an Uber passenger. So why he spared Uber passenger lives rather than other random people has me confused


He liked his passengers.

Apparently he DIDNT like CRAKER BARREL !


Bart McCoy said:


> I guess I'll wait on further reports. Some say he shot people inbetween uber rides, some outlets say he ubered people BEFORE doing any shootings. But in all reports, none state any victum was an Uber passenger. So why he spared Uber passenger lives rather than other random people has me confused


He liked his passengers.

Apparently,he DIDNT like CRAKER BARRELL !

Otherwise , it would have been "Death Cab for Cutie ".


----------



## DriverX

Bart McCoy said:


> Sure the burden of proof is lower. But exactly what did Uber do that was negligent? Please answer that. Nobody has said anything that leads me to believe this was Uber's fault
> 
> um, this is basic math, but whats your point?
> I'm debating the probability of dying by ordering any rideshare service. Your post seemed to reflect that a high number of deaths are related to Uber. Math tells me that the number of deaths divided by the millions even billions of Uber rides done is a low percentage number meaning a low probability of dying having ordered an Uber ride


If an Uber driver drove over a bunch of people on a sidewalk killing and maiming them, Uber would be held liable and an insurance claim would be paid. This won't even go to court, it'll be settled for hundreds of millions.

Uber got CARMA (sic) slapped for taking food off drivers tables. They couldn't be more deserving of this.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Bart McCoy said:


> So if he did, you would blame football?


^^^
Blame the Astroturf.


----------



## Uber-Doober

vesolehome said:


> I hate to say that's funny, but that's pretty funny...and ironic Uber calls it a safe riders fee! It sounds like this guy was driving erratic with one of is PAX.
> 
> As for this blaming Uber pay cuts, that's nuts. This guy snapped but unless he says it's because of Uber payouts I find that hard to believe.


^^^
Now Kracker Barrel will have to institute a Safe Dining Fee.... errr, uhhhh.... table booking fee.


----------



## tohunt4me

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Sad, but not shocking at all. There have been multiple instances where Uber drivers have shot their passengers. Uber drivers being involved in assaults is actually very common.


When ?
When have Uber Drivers shot passengers ?
The media just likes tossing Ubers name around.


----------



## tohunt4me

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Now Kracker Barrel will have to institute a Safe Dining Fee.... errr, uhhhh.... table booking fee.


Thats TERRBLE !

Funny.

But terrible.


----------



## tohunt4me

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Blame the Astroturf.


It "rubbed"hin wrong . . .


----------



## tohunt4me

Bart McCoy said:


> Yeah, if all outlets brand this with Uber in the title(whether Uber played a role in it or not), then its a horrible look for the company.
> 
> Not like it'll make Uber raise rates. All it will do is make different markets press for fingerprints and stricter background checks. As if mass shooter always have done something illegal previously smh. Human have free will, you can't always find in the past what a person will do in the future...


Cascading avalanches of regulation due to media feed outcry.


----------



## Kalee

backstreets-trans said:


> You should never try to make sense about something that is so senseless. Certain triggers can send people off. I believe uber was one of those triggers that helped send this guy off.


Well we know one thing for certain - Uber certainly wasn't _helping_ this poor guy's mental state!


----------



## Bart McCoy

DriverX said:


> If an Uber driver drove over a bunch of people on a sidewalk killing and maiming them, Uber would be held liable and an insurance claim would be paid. This won't even go to court, it'll be settled for hundreds of millions.
> s.


So you're going to compare an incident with him driving for uber with pax and running over people........................with.......... him driving off the clock and shooting non-uber related people? really?

Its no secret that when you drive for uber, and you have an accident, you're covered by Uber's million dollar insurance policy. But you saying uber would pay out for a incident that occurred outside of uber? really?


----------



## Kalee

Urban Uber said:


> Jobs are available all over the country... Some communities are not at full employment yet and some good people are working for Uber as Independent Contractors between jobs.. This tragedy is not related to UBER.. All drivers have the option to NOT drive if costs are not being covered.. If income is not supporting them or their families... If an unstable person passes the back ground checks ( minimal at best) and commits a crime while approved to drive for UBER.. This does not become an UBER crime... " going postal" did not mean that the pressures working for the United States Postal Service caused the tragic crimes that occurred... There are mentally unstable people amongst us all.. Diagnosed and undiagnosed... It's tragic for the families and the shooter... It's not related to UBER.


With that said... yeeeaahhhh... this is definitely an UBER issue.


----------



## tohunt4me

rtaatl said:


> Indirectly, a lot of us here know the pressure some drivers go through. Especially the ones trapped in leases they can't afford and have to put in 16hr+ a day to make ends meet. Also constant rate cuts, an unfair rating system...etc. We know how it can drink someone to the brink of instanity, yet it's funny how people go on the defensive for companies that treat their people unethical...like its not an issue. So yeah, Uber is definitely to blame on this...maybe now someone will realize how those cheap fares are being subsidized.


So this guy developed his own "ratings system"?


----------



## tohunt4me

Kalee said:


> With that said... yeeeaahhhh... this is definitely an UBER issue.


I think its a CRACKER BARREL issue.


----------



## tdsu

This is so sad!!!! My prayers go out to the poor families.
a couple of weeks ago my buddy and I were talking about how, it's a matter of time before something like this happens. Uber might not be at fault, but they sure as hell have created the environment where people are stressed out with low fares, long hours, demanding/entitled passengers, and false promises. I drove Uber full time and just had to stop, because the next (5.00 gross) rider that asked me for water, gum, mints, and expected the doors to be opened and closed for him was going to end up in the hospital and me in jail. I drive Lyft full time ( 6 days a week, 13-15hrs a day, 120-130 rides a week) and the passengers are a little better, the company does a better job of "pretending" to care about us drivers, but lets be honest; its still the same shit and the low rates and long hours are going to wear all of us down. both companies need to be regulated like Taxi's, buses, truck drivers...... No regulation is as bad as over regulation.


----------



## tohunt4me

Just_in said:


> Uber publicly stated that it's reaching out to help law enforcement anyway it can.


A nice "donation" to the F.O.P. fund . . . .


----------



## secretadmirer

"With that said... yeeeaahhhh... this is definitely an UBER issue" Especially if it turns out that this guy has a rap sheet of felony convictions, that slipped thru the cracks of uber's so called "fool proof" back ground checks.

I didn't get chance to read that many comments on here, so I apologize if this was mentioned already.


----------



## Bart McCoy

secretadmirer said:


> "With that said... yeeeaahhhh... this is definitely an UBER issue" Especially if it turns out that this guy has a rap sheet of felony convictions, that slipped thru the cracks of uber's so called "fool proof" back ground checks.
> 
> I didn't get chance to read that many comments on here, so I apologize if this was mentioned already.


yes, obviously you didnt
he had no criminal record


----------



## tohunt4me

DriverX said:


>


Sounds like a terrifying ride.


----------



## tohunt4me

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> He was an UBER driver.....Driving for UBER the same part of the day or perhaps the same time as committing these crime. UBER is linked to this crime in every headline.....ARE YOU SERIOUS????


Job flexibility


----------



## tohunt4me

simpsonsverytall said:


> someone should make a cult-classic filmed in 8mm about some down and dirty ubering
> 
> any of u happen to be rich kids in film school? Lets do this


"Death Cab for Cutie".


----------



## DriverX

Bart McCoy said:


> So you're going to compare an incident with him driving for uber with pax and running over people........................with.......... him driving off the clock and shooting non-uber related people? really?
> 
> Its no secret that when you drive for uber, and you have an accident, you're covered by Uber's million dollar insurance policy. But you saying uber would pay out for a incident that occurred outside of uber? really?


He was logged on driving around picking up pax and shooting up random pedestrians on Ubers insurance. Lawyers are frothing for these cases.


----------



## tohunt4me

stuber said:


> New Uber Feature: Uber Homicide. Be Part of the Action.


Just press a button ,and Uber will send out a killer.
That easy.
No need to get your hands dirty.
All payments handled by Uber.


----------



## Bart McCoy

DriverX said:


> He was logged on driving around picking up pax and shooting up random pedestrians on Ubers insurance. Lawyers are frothing for these cases.


how do you know he was logged on?
he didnt shoot, hurt or harm any pax
he didnt shoot anyone WHILE he had a pax in the car

do you work for Uber? how do you know he was logged on at the time he shot people

even if he was logged in, how is it Uber's fault this man was crazy?


----------



## Uber-Doober

uber strike said:


> my friend uber driver was expressing suicide after rate cuts. he had quit his job to drive for uber not expecting these cheap rates. i just hope he doesn't go on a rampage. this is the beginning of stressed drivers going mad....


^^^
Oh my God, yes... 
Sometimes those kind of comments get brushed off by others but in reality they can be really serious even if expressed in an offhand manner. 
Just like those workers in China who work for Foxconn that makes all of the iPhones (And others) jumping off of buildings due to some really horrendous work conditions where they are treated like machines and work in excess of 14 hours per day with not even a chance to get to know the seven room mates in the company dorms. 
That too is all over youtube, and it looks like Uber's treatment of their "partners" isn't much better but treat the drivers electronically with never any personal contact.


----------



## secretadmirer

"yes, obviously you didnt
he had no criminal record"

I said that already. No need to throw it back at me. Go flame bait somewhere else.


----------



## tohunt4me

Bart McCoy said:


> So now you are saying Uber is actively breeding murderers? and more and more shootings like this is going to happen?
> 
> If the guy shot people and went back to work at mcdonalds, then left out again to kill more people, would you be afraid to go into any mcdonalds restaurant again? even though he shot NOBODY in mcdonalds or any customers of mcdonalds? would you think mcdonalds breeds murderers because they pay min wage to drop fries into the grease?
> 
> I wouldnt call it PR rebuttal, I'd call it looking at the facts,which there is none yet, to solidly say he killed because of low rates. Most people hatred of Uber can not let them think straight anyway. People just want Uber to crumble, so sure they are happy that Uber's name is attached to this, irregardless of facts!
> 
> Straw that broke the camels back? huge reach and way too early to say anythign remotely like that. Uber is in several countries, and this isnt the first "uber-related" (and I say that loosely) shooting to happen. Why would this shooting ultimately change things? Why negligence did Uber do in hiring this guy? he had NO criminal record. For Uber to be responsible they had to do some negligent,or neglect to do something prudent that they reasonably saw was coming.
> 
> Other than this guy happening to work for Uber, I havent seen ONE person give me any reasonable reason Uber should be at fault for this crazy guy!!!


Uber drivers on hunger strikes and committing suicide in India :

No , it is not looking good.


----------



## DriverX

Bart McCoy said:


> how do you know he was logged on?
> he didnt shoot, hurt or harm any pax
> he didnt shoot anyone WHILE he had a pax in the car
> 
> do you work for Uber? how do you know he was logged on at the time he shot people
> 
> even if he was logged in, how is it Uber's fault this man was crazy?


The news is reporting him picking up pax in between the murders, of course he's logged in, probably trying to get some 75 cent/mile fares so he can feed his kids. There will be an investigation, and Uber will settle.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Bart McCoy said:


> So you're going to compare an incident with him driving for uber with pax and running over people........................with.......... him driving off the clock and shooting non-uber related people? really?
> 
> Its no secret that when you drive for uber, and you have an accident, you're covered by Uber's million dollar insurance policy. But you saying uber would pay out for a incident that occurred outside of uber? really?


^^^
In the total scope of things, I don't think that just because he turned off the app in between shootings will put him "off the clock" when he gets back in his vehicle and turns the app on again and proceeds to pick up the next pax. That's a thin defense.


----------



## Uber-Doober

tohunt4me said:


> So this guy developed his own "ratings system"?


^^^
I can't believe that I didn't think of that comment.
That's a double-groaner.


----------



## tohunt4me

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> My God!!!
> Just four seniors out for a meal and then this nutcase walks in blazin.
> I'm not what you would call an emotional person, but this really raises a lump in my throat.


Hate crime.
Senior discrimination.


----------



## uberpa

Let's wait and see. I think the shooter will sue uber as well!


----------



## Jack Pavlov

DriverX said:


> Clearly when you have a bunch of drivers that are all saying this was bound to happen considering the way Uber treats drivers, there MIGHT BE SOME MERIT TO THEIR CLAIMS


Just because a thousand and one idiots think the same thing, doesn't make it true. Wars have been waged on this logic and it's devastating at it's core.



UberXTampa said:


> low rates constantly reinforce animosity between driver and pax.
> Since this is an attack on driver dignity, I expect more drivers that have nothing left to lose to tip over to the dark side and reciprocate by acts of violence like this one.


In my mind, low rates have absolutely no relation to my animosity with pax. If ANYTHING, there would be animosity towards Uber. It wasn't those Pax that locked in that rate for us, it was uber. At the end of the day, I logged on and chose to drive knowing the rates. That's my responsibility. A pax is only taking advantage of an opportunity extended by our company. DON'T DRIVE if you disagree with the rate. It's really quite simple.



UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Here's a fact for you... The NY Times reported the first report of eratic driving was posted on FB at 5:30. The passenger contacted Uber at that time. This was before their driver went on a killing spree. Leaving this driver unsupervised and on the road after this incident without a way to immediately contact Uber (other than email) is definitely a major issue.


LOL, so let me get this straight, you're saying it's a FACT that this guy was driving erratically? In what way is that a FACT? That sounds like someone's interpretation of someone else's ability to drive. Short of an investigation, you can't know the facts of that situation. As a Pax, I can receive a perfectly safe ride and still email Uber saying that they were swerving and speeding. What evidence do they have to corroborate it is the question, and the answer ends up being none, unless there is a police report involving that incident. I'm not saying he wasn't driving erratically, but I wouldn't want the company I work for to completely disregard all proper evidentiary procedure in a grievance claim against a driver and take swift action.


----------



## GrandTheftUber

uberpa said:


> Let's wait and see. I think the shooter will sue uber as well!


Can bullets be considered an Uber business expense like gas and vehicle maintenance?


----------



## Bart McCoy

DriverX said:


> The news is reporting him picking up pax in between the murders, of course he's logged in, probably trying to get some 75 cent/mile fares so he can feed his kids. There will be an investigation, and Uber will settle.


Uber will settle. If you can foresee the future , why dont you pick the winning lottery numbers?

Even if he was logged on with no pax in the car, how is Uber responsible for him killing random people who had nothing to do with Uber?


----------



## Ziggy

DelaJoe said:


> I do notice a difference between passengers that have 5.0 ratings


Most pax with 5.0 are brand new pax ... never taken Uber. You might be able to tell the difference between a 4.9 and 4.5 or lower ... but personally, I'd rather p/u the 4.7-4.9 pax than a 5.0 pax


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

tohunt4me said:


> When ?
> When have Uber Drivers shot passengers ?
> The media just likes tossing Ubers name around.


This one for example...
http://www.breitbart.com/big-govern...oots-passenger-who-was-allegedly-choking-him/
or this one for example...
http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20150608/news/150608923/
or this one for example...
http://www.thetrace.org/2015/07/uber-gun-austin-car/

Of course, these are just a few examples.


----------



## uberpa

GrandTheftUber said:


> Can bullets be considered an Uber business expense like gas and vehicle maintenance?


He's alive! With a little bit of planning, uber will lose!


----------



## Ziggy

DriverX said:


> classic,,, look at the suggested article at the bottom of the bloomberg story LOLOL
> 
> http://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...n-killing-spree-as-police-probe-tie-to-routes


Brilliant ... perfect segway to the Uber "Safe Ride Fee" fraud


----------



## LA Cabbie

Jack Pavlov said:


> None of which those caused this man to go and do this. There are plenty of crimes that occur with no warning indicators.
> I think there is nothing wrong with uber taking a progressive stance and not discriminating a persons criminal history. It's those kinds of moves that companies continue to make that help reduce the recidivism rates.
> 
> Train their employees? This isn't a technical position, it's a very SIMPLE job. They provide a video tutorial and documentation. Lots of jobs "training" actually consists of the employee watching videos. In the government, annual training requirements are fulfilled by the employee logging onto the training website and watching videos or slideshows.
> 
> Contractors are rarely supervised by their hiring authority...
> 
> Everyone always looks for every reason to blame Uber. He could've worked for McDonald's and everyone would somehow tie this into Uber.
> 
> By the way I know lots of jobs that don't actually check with previous employers, none of those are a reason to blame uber.
> 
> All of your reasons are really irrelevant to this.
> Is there a reason that some people are perfectly content with their employment with uber? Me for instance, I'm entirely okay. Could it be better and are there improvements to be made, yes... Is any of the shortcomings going to stop me from making money, no. You adapt to the changes and overcome. It again comes down to personal responsibility and how much work people are really willing to put into their own well being... Or is uber ultimately responsible for every single employees needs and concerns?


1) if this guy was under the influence of illegal medication, uber would be totally liable because they refuse industry standard practices of drug testing pre driving and continual enrollment in a random drug testing program.

2) his act of terrorism might be directly related to uber for putting him in a situation where the stress of low ratings or poor pay was the mechanism end that triggered the criminal acts.

Only time will tell.


----------



## Jack Pavlov

LA Cabbie said:


> 1) if this guy was under the influence of illegal medication, uber would be totally liable because they refuse industry standard practices of drug testing pre driving and continual enrollment in a random drug testing program.
> 
> 2) his act of terrorism might be directly related to uber for putting him in a situation where the stress of low ratings or poor pay was the mechanism end that triggered the criminal acts.
> 
> Only time will tell.


Oh I can tell your knowledge of the law will take you far. I'm not even going to waste my time except to waste my time to tell you that I'm not wasting my time.

You guys are all on a steep slope to a society that will begin to blame fork manufacturers for your obesity, coffee makes for your inability to stay awake, and Yelp for the reasons that your business is failing... because of poor ratings.

I came to this forum thinking there were rational like-minded individuals, but most of what I see is people working for a company that "doesn't vet it's employees" because they couldn't get a job anywhere else. I wouldn't even flinch at refusing to hire the majority of people here who are so GRACIOUSLY employed by Uber. You should be thanking Uber for your opportunity to work and go out there and work. I apologize if this hits home for anyone but some of you need a wake up call. I see a lot of entitlement and ignorance in most of the posts made.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Jack Pavlov said:


> Just because a thousand and one idiots think the same thing, doesn't make it true. Wars have been waged on this logic and it's devastating at it's core.
> 
> In my mind, low rates have absolutely no relation to my animosity with pax. If ANYTHING, there would be animosity towards Uber. It wasn't those Pax that locked in that rate for us, it was uber. At the end of the day, I logged on and chose to drive knowing the rates. That's my responsibility. A pax is only taking advantage of an opportunity extended by our company. DON'T DRIVE if you disagree with the rate. It's really quite simple.
> 
> LOL, so let me get this straight, you're saying it's a FACT that this guy was driving erratically? In what way is that a FACT? That sounds like someone's interpretation of someone else's ability to drive. Short of an investigation, you can't know the facts of that situation. As a Pax, I can receive a perfectly safe ride and still email Uber saying that they were swerving and speeding. What evidence do they have to corroborate it is the question, and the answer ends up being none, unless there is a police report involving that incident. I'm not saying he wasn't driving erratically, but I wouldn't want the company I work for to completely disregard all proper evidentiary procedure in a grievance claim against a driver and take swift action.


I know you think the sun rises and shines on Uber but let me try to explain this to you.

I run a small and growing limo company. I just picked up the house account for a big hotel in Hollywood tonight so I'm kind of gloating right now. But let me talk some common sense to you.

If I had a client call, email or text that one of my drivers sideswiped another car, was running stop signs and excessively speeding I would drop everything and immediately investigate it. This is common sense. I certainly wouldn't let the driver continue on with multiple other clients. The car would be damaged so it wouldn't take much to figure it out.

Uber doesn't have a system in place to do this. That's a MAJOR problem.

I do background checks on my drivers, I personally interview them, train them and check with previous employers. My drivers are drug tested and I interact with the drivers on a daily basis. This is what proper management is supposed to do. If I had a "crazy" driver, I would be able to detect it. But having over a million drivers out there without vetting and any supervision whatsoever is asking for trouble... and Uber is in trouble.


----------



## Bart McCoy

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> This one for example...
> http://www.breitbart.com/big-govern...oots-passenger-who-was-allegedly-choking-him/
> or this one for example...
> http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20150608/news/150608923/
> or this one for example...
> http://www.thetrace.org/2015/07/uber-gun-austin-car/
> 
> Of course, these are just a few examples.


NONE of those incidents you listed are of an Uber going around and randomly shooting someone. ALL of them seem to be in self defense or an action done AFTER the pax made a dangerous action FIRST.

Only ONE of those incidents did the pax actually get shot. Nice try though.


----------



## Ziggy

simpsonsverytall said:


> Is there really a loophole where someone can use a fake facebook acct and a prepaid cc to be an Uber Pax?


You don't even need the fake FB account. I had a pax who said he setup an account for his dog.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bart McCoy said:


> NONE of those incidents you listed are of an Uber going around and randomly shooting someone. ALL of them seem to be in self defense or an action done AFTER the pax made a dangerous action FIRST.
> 
> Only ONE of those incident did the pax actually get shot. Nice try though.


Nor did I say these drivers were randomly shooting people. I said there were drivers that shot passengers. And you cannot shoot somebody because they damaged your vehicle. Thats not self defense. Nor can you use excessive force in defending yourself.


----------



## Bart McCoy

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> If I had a client call, email or text that one of my drivers sideswiped another car, was running stop signs and excessively speeding I would drop everything and immediately investigate it. This is common sense. I certainly wouldn't let the driver continue on with multiple other clients. The car would be damaged so it wouldn't take much to figure it out.
> 
> Uber doesn't have a system in place to do this. That's a MAJOR problem.
> 
> I do background checks on my drivers, I personally interview them, train them and check with previous employers. My drivers are drug tested and I interact with the drivers on a daily basis. This is what proper management is supposed to do.


So let me get this straight. If one of your drivers sideswiped someone, you'll fire them on the spot I guess. And then somehow because you fired them, they wouldn't be able to drive their own car anyway and kill someone else after this? Really? How does taking quick action on a customer report stop someone from driving their own car and committing a crime that had nothing to do with their job?

Background checks and drug checks. Nice. However the guy who killed people had a clean criminal history so......


----------



## Bart McCoy

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Nor did I say these drivers were randomly shooting people. I said there were drivers that shot passengers. And you cannot shoot somebody because they damaged your vehicle. Thats not self defense. Nor can you use excessive force in defending yourself.


so you didn't see the word "or" in my reply, smh
Point is, you still haven't listed an incident where a driver just went crazy and shot someone. If an Uber driver pulls a gun on a pax AFTER a pax has made a dangerous maneuver first, I don't have a problem with that. Nor do I see your point in pointing out incidents that fit what I just described,unless you want pax to do whatever they want to drivers


----------



## tohunt4me

So now we know how cops feel.
When one of theirs breaks the
Law.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> Uber can expect an army of litigants.


How so? The shooter didn't commit the murders while performing 'Uber work'... or use any Uber tools to target the victims.


----------



## LA Cabbie

Jack Pavlov said:


> Yeah if I worked an 8-5 shift at McDonald's and then got off work to go kill 3 people, does that mean McDonald's is responsible for my actions? What if I killed them because I was denied a promotion or raise or denied more hours, does that make McDonald's liable?
> No.


1) uber should have administered a drug test before commencing him as a driver.

2) uber should have evaluated their work environment that they have created.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bart McCoy said:


> So let me get this straight. If one of your drivers sideswiped someone, you'll fire them on the spot I guess. And then somehow because you fired them, they wouldn't be able to drive their own car anyway and kill someone else after this? Really? How does taking quick action on a customer report stop someone from driving their own car and committing a crime that had nothing to do with their job?
> 
> Background checks and drug checks. Nice. However the guy who killed people had a clean criminal history so......


I love how try to put words into my mouth to make your argument. I never said fire them on the spot. I said I would investigate amd not let them drive more clients in the meantime. That is reasonable and prudent.

At this point, we do not know if this had nothing to do with his job so I am not going to speculate on that.


----------



## Ziggy

Rakos said:


> It could be they are allowing debit cards now.


They've been letting pax use their PayPal accounts for months ... not sure why debit cards would not be allowed too.


----------



## LA Cabbie

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> In the total scope of things, I don't think that just because he turned off the app in between shootings will put him "off the clock" when he gets back in his vehicle and turns the app on again and proceeds to pick up the next pax. That's a thin defense.


I too can sign off and drive the cab around. Workers representing a company are like animals. You are responsible for your pet.


----------



## Bart McCoy

LA Cabbie said:


> 1) uber should have administered a drug test before commencing him as a driver.


why is drugs being brought up? if he was never on drugs, why effect would a drug test have?



UberBlackDriverLA said:


> I love how try to put words into my mouth to make your argument. I never said fire them on the spot. I said I would investigate amd not let them drive more clients in the meantime. That is reasonable and prudent.
> .


What is your point of bringing up that you would investigate? How does you not allowing your guy to drive more clients have anything to do with him continuning to drive around the area and shoot NON-clients just like the Uber driver did?

How could what YOU do prevent him from doing what this Uber driver did?? are you following along? If you get fired for sideswiping someone, how does that stop you from going out and shooting someone unrelated to your job? that's the topic being debated. Not investigating some incident that in no way could prevent the people from getting shot


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bart McCoy said:


> so you didn't see the word "or" in my reply, smh
> Point is, you still haven't listed an incident where a driver just went crazy and shot someone. If an Uber driver pulls a gun on a pax AFTER a pax has made a dangerous maneuver first, I don't have a problem with that. Nor do I see your point in pointing out incidents that fit what I just described,unless you want pax to do whatever they want to drivers


I never said there were other instances of a drivers going crazy and shooting someone, although shooting somebody for throwing a rock at your car is pretty crazy. If you would have read my original post, I stated drivers have shot passengers before. A poster asked for example and I provided them and he was satisified. You then injected with your nonsense and trying to put words into my mouth and I will not address this further.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

CIncinnatiDriver said:


> Heck yeah.
> 
> My step-son works as an independent contractor repairing cars.
> If he was violent in any way while one job when the supervisor wasn't there (as Uber isn't there),
> his company would be SEEN as responsible for his action because they are supposed to VET him, SUPERVISE hiim, and PROVIDE CUSTOMER SERIVCE.
> Uber IS ground-breaking, nifty, etc, but it does NOT do much to protect people.
> Uber = limited vetting, NO direct contact supervising, and NO customer support.
> IMO they should do a little more.
> I don't know much about IC's in other companies...but I cannot immediately think of a company that has IC's doing direct customer service face-to-face without some kind of supervisor interacting with IC.
> 
> Honestly, it just stands to reason that sooner or later, someone on the edge would take the job.
> 
> yep.
> 
> Yep.
> 
> The one thing Uber CAN'T say is that did all they could to screen for and supervise their drivers.
> 
> LOLOLOLOLOLOL
> 
> SHAMEFUL !!!
> they should have some words flagged to escalate to sooner as needed
> 
> Let's be honest. When an employee's behaviour is erratic but not criminal (or criminal but hard to verify),
> management is the FIRST line of defense.
> Once again
> Agreed.
> CUSTOMER SERVICE is needed


Your comments are applicable to employers and their customers. But passengers are not customers of Uber for transportation, they are the driver"s customer... as detailed in the rider and driver agreements and terms of use. Uber 'just' provides drivers with 'leads'. Remember? Uber is just a "Technology" company and acts as a 'third party payor'.


----------



## Bart McCoy

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> I never said there were other instances of a drivers going crazy and shooting someone, although shooting somebody for throwing a rock at your car is pretty crazy. If you would have read my original post, I stated drivers have shot passengers before. A poster asked for example and I provided them and he was satisified. You then injected with your nonsense and trying to put words into my mouth and I will not address this further.


There's no point behind you just saying "Uber drivers have shot pax", without actually looking into the incidents as to why the Uber drivers fired the shots. It seems you are only bringing up shooting incidents to inflame the situation. In all your examples, NONE of those shootings would happen if you are a normal pax that gets in an Uber car, plays with their phone during the ride, and gets out at the destination. But all your example show that when you at a fool as a pax, don't be surprised if the Uber driver acts a fool back!!

If you aren't bringing up instance where an Uber driver fired at a pax for no reason at all whatsoever, I don't understand your point of even mentioning shootings other than to further give Uber a bad name regardless of pax initiating the whole event

so you say

"If you would have read my original post, I stated drivers have shot passengers before. "

oh really
that's just like saying "This cab driver shot this passenger"
but later saying "oh yeah, because the passenger tried to rob him"
smh


----------



## Uberelitescv1

Teksaz said:


> *"He was an Uber driver*, and police are investigating reports that he took fares in between the shootings."
> 
> Quite the multi-tasker.
> 
> I'm sure it was the pax that told him..."Takes me to the WalMarts. Imma be about 15minutes, and then yous gonna takes me back home." that broke the camels back.


Bha hahahaha!


----------



## LA Cabbie

Bart McCoy said:


> So let me get this straight. If one of your drivers sideswiped someone, you'll fire them on the spot I guess. And then somehow because you fired them, they wouldn't be able to drive their own car anyway and kill someone else after this? Really? How does taking quick action on a customer report stop someone from driving their own car and committing a crime that had nothing to do with their job?
> 
> Background checks and drug checks. Nice. However the guy who killed people had a clean criminal history so......


When I started driving cab, I was new to the computer system. So I fiddle with it while driving. Once I got a call from dispatch that a motorist reported that I was driving erratically. I saw the motorist behind me flashing his high beams at me!

Plus, we have a liaison committee, any significant complaint, you must meet with real people and explain your self.

Uber does not have real time notification nor do they have any supervision apparatus.

All I can say, uber can no longer consider itself just a hobby people can do in their spare time.


----------



## Jack Pavlov

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Nor did I say these drivers were randomly shooting people. I said there were drivers that shot passengers. And you cannot shoot somebody because they damaged your vehicle. Thats not self defense. Nor can you use excessive force in defending yourself.


And those two things heavily depend on a couple key laws that vary from state to state, i.e. Laws like "king of the castle". Use of excessive force in a legitimate case of self defense is historically been upheld in court when dealing with civilians. Police (who are trained) adhere to a different interpretation of excessive. Either way, both self defense and excessive force are very heavily litigated terms in court and no definitive answer can be given, certainly not from these forums.


----------



## Bart McCoy

LA Cabbie said:


> When I started driving cab, I was new to the computer system. So I fiddle with it while driving. Once I got a call from dispatch that a motorist reported that I was driving erratically. I saw the motorist behind me flashing his high beams at me!
> 
> Plus, we have a liaison committee, any significant complaint, you must meet with real people and explain your self.
> 
> Uber does not have real time notification nor do they have any supervision apparatus.
> .


I'm not disputing Uber could have a better customer service system , real time notification, or supervision apparatus. Nor is that the topic. My point is, EVEN if Uber had all that in place, how in da hell does it prevent the guy from using his own car to go out and shoot non-uber related people?????????????????????????????????????????????

If the sideswipe was the first Uber knew that something was wrong with this driver, please tell me what Uber could have done to PREVENT that man from shooting people?


----------



## LA Cabbie

Bart McCoy said:


> why is drugs being brought up? if he was never on drugs, why effect would a drug test have?
> 
> What is your point of bringing up that you would investigate? How does you not allowing your guy to drive more clients have anything to do with him continuning to drive around the area and shoot NON-clients just like the Uber driver did?
> 
> How could what YOU do prevent him from doing what this Uber driver did?? are you following along? If you get fired for sideswiping someone, how does that stop you from going out and shooting someone unrelated to your job? that's the topic being debated. Not investigating some incident that in no way could prevent the people from getting shot


This guy could have been on many legal or illegal drugs or a combination of both that a drug test outcome could prove that he was abusing drugs and thus cannot be accepted as a driver.


----------



## LA Cabbie

Bart McCoy said:


> I'm not disputing Uber could have a better customer service system , real time notification, or supervision apparatus. Nor is that the topic. My point is, EVEN if Uber had all that in place, how in da hell does it prevent the guy from using his own car to go out and shoot non-uber related people?????????????????????????????????????????????
> 
> If the sideswipe was the first Uber knew that something was wrong with this driver, please tell me what Uber could have done to PREVENT that man from shooting people?


What happens if your good natured pit bull attacked and killed several people while you were away?


----------



## uberdriverfornow

Just_in said:


> There was already a complaint from a passenger that this driver (shooter ) was driving erratically. The trouble is there is no one to call and complain too. If there was they would have removed this mad man from the system ASAP. Side swiping a car is hit and run. Police are called.


Exactly, with no support team to reach out to, passengers(and drivers) are helpless in situations like this.


----------



## 45821

Jack Pavlov said:


> I'm going to be brutally honest. The majority of people in this thread are jumping to some extreme assumptions that somehow Uber is responsible. You may not like Uber, and may be having a negative experience with them but they are not liable for this nor is their act of cutting rates. Clearly this man had far worse problems than Uber not paying him enough. People also need to realize that there is a level of personal responsibility. He CHOSE to work Uber, he CHOSE to live a lifestyle he couldn't afford, he CHOSE to commit these acts (unless there are other psychological reasons at play. Pointing a weapon at someone with the intent to kill, is a very very difficult task, let alone pulling the trigger.
> 
> It is more than likely that he just happened to work for Uber and people are prematurely making that correlation that uber is to blame.


Dude, I had worked for the fortune 50 company for over 15 years, and I can tell that your articulation level is very high. You are not the driver, you either work for PR firm of for Uber. See, you are not that smart after all, you are the King Troll. Of course uber is to blame.


----------



## SanPedroLover

Uber has *NOTHING* to do with this. It was this guy's mental state/psyche that caused this.

He could have been working at a local gas station...same thing would have probably happened.


----------



## Leo.

osii said:


> If you shoot your pax in the car and they bleed on the seats, can you get a cleaning fee reimbursement?


What a wicked comment and what a wicked mentally of many of you who seem to justify this man because of the rate cuts.

Evil is growing in the hearts of man


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bon Jovi said:


> Dude, I had worked for the fortune 50 company for over 15 years, and I can tell that your articulation level is very high. You are not the driver, you either work for PR firm of for Uber. See, you are not that smart after all, you are the King Troll. so STF UP. Of course uber is to blame.


Just reread some of his posts. Yes, definitely PR guy. That's why his posts make zero sense.


----------



## 45821

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Just reread some of his posts. Yes, definitely PR guy. That's why his posts make zero sense.


Of course, corporate language at its best.


----------



## 45821

Jack Pavlov said:


> And those two things heavily depend on a couple key laws that vary from state to state, i.e. Laws like "king of the castle". Use of excessive force in a legitimate case of self defense is historically been upheld in court when dealing with civilians. Police (who are trained) adhere to a different interpretation of excessive. Either way, both self defense and excessive force are very heavily litigated terms in court and no definitive answer can be given, certainly not from these forums.


Seriously dude, you are so obvious.


----------



## 45821

Michael - Cleveland said:


> How so? The shooter didn't commit the murders while performing 'Uber work'... or use any Uber tools to target the victims.


Some "good" lawyers will find the way.


----------



## driveLA

Wooowwww

Uber is not gonna dodge this bad press


Bye bye Travis


----------



## TwoFiddyMile

driveLA said:


> Wooowwww
> 
> Uber is not gonna dodge this bad press
> 
> Bye bye Travis


I hope you are correct. 
My fear is, with all the berserker gun violence in the past 18 months or so, the public and the media are jaded towards this kind of action.
I slept on this, and woke very angry.
If me or one of my cabbie breathrren had done this during a shift, there would be an instant motion in (fill in city name) to outlaw cabs overnight.
This incident SHOULD slow down ridership considerably for pax using Uber.

You never know, though.


----------



## Darrell Green Fan

Every report starts by describing the shooter as an Uber driver. This is devastating PR to a company who is already in trouble. I really do not understand the position that Uber is not responsible in any way. Again there was a report of terribly dangerous erratic behavior being reported to Uber. But because of their system nothing was done. As the limo company owner pointed out there should be a way to contact a live body at Uber who could have taken steps to locate and get this guy off the road.

Not enough attention is being paid to the report that the 911 operator appeared uninterested in trying to get this guy. That needs serious investigation. Back to Uber they could have called 911 again. They would have no doubt gotten a different 911 operator who gave a damn who could have put out an alert for a very dangerous driver. With his drivng he was certainly a huge risk to the public long before the shooting started. And obviously since it is being reported that his app was on they could have helped locate him


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

Bart McCoy said:


> He clearly had NO pax in his car when he shot people.
> Do you know if his app was on?
> See, I'm going with facts. No Uber pax was shot. People can only guess that his app was on.
> How bout we only comment on the facts, we can speculate forever


His app had to be on inbetween trips at some point in order to get a ping. Dud he turn it off, shoot, then turn it back on? Who knows? But if you have a job as an employee taking a break up to 20 minutes is not usually counted as time off. I would argue that he was obviously planning on taking more trips and that if he did go offline, it was only to take a short break, while still "working". Whether he used that break to piss or to shoot someone it's still a short break WHILE WORKING.

And for all we know he never went offline. We do know for sure he was online AT SOME POINT after dropping off pax, either before or after shooting.


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

Bart McCoy said:


> you do know he can just get another job right? i bet mcdonalds is paying more
> 
> This is a slippery slope. Do drivers really want entitled pax to get Uber to automatically and quickly deactivate you at any rating 3 or less or an email complaint without ever consulting with you the driver first? Do you REALLY want Uber to operate like that?
> 
> Also, you say Uber should have taken him off the road. For what? he wasnt shooting ANY of his pax. But lets say Uber did deactivate him as soon as a pax complained. What in the world does that do? It only stops him from picking up more pax and not harming them. It in no way stops him from riding around with app off /no pax in car (which is what happened in real life) and killing people!!!!
> 
> You say a lawsuit is coming. The person suing, they are going to claim their loved one would not have died if Uber deactivated him on the spot(after first complaint)??? How so does that stop the driver from using his car as he did to ride around and still kill people? No matter what Uber does they cant stop that man from driving off the clock for Uber
> 
> If people really think Uber is to blame, give me one thing Uber could have done to stop him from killing people?????????????????????


Uber has our phone numbers. A human being could have called him and may have been able to ascertain he was a danger and called 911. They could have given police his exact location. They could also block him.from getting pings while not actually having his app appear to be malfunctioning.

Of course, they might csll, he appears fine, and they do nothing.

But we'll never know. Uber has no trained "critical response team" to call drivers and make an assessment when a panicked pax calls, says they hsve slready called 911 they were so concerned, says the driver had an accident with the pax in the car, appeared unbothered, and kept driving.


----------



## Bro1999

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-shooting-says-about-ubers-background-checks/

A damning article. OUCH.

_""We learned of systemic failures in Uber's background checks," San Francisco District Attorney George Gascon said in reference to the lawsuits, according to Forbes. "We have learned they have drivers who are convicted sex offenders, thieves, burglars, kidnappers and a convicted murder.""_

AND

_"Mellen said he contacted police and Uber about the wild ride. Then, he recognized the face after local media posted photos of the alleged shooter.

"I'm upset because I tried contacting Uber after I had talked to the police, saying that we needed to get this guy off the road," Mellen told WWMT."_


----------



## LADriver

osii said:


> If you shoot your pax in the car and they bleed on the seats, can you get a cleaning fee reimbursement?


I once worked with a limo dispatcher in Los Angeles that told me this story: A cab driver returned to base with a dead passenger in his back seat. He told the dispatcher that the passenger had tried to rob him, so he pulled his gun and shot through the divider to kill the robber. The cab driver wanted the company to clean up his back seat so he could get back to work! ---Only in L.A.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile

Unbelievable. 
He killed people from his Uber car, during his Uber shift. 
Some chick DID call 911 on his ass. 911 needs to take ownership too.

Yes, it will be a worse PR nightmare if he didnt log off in order to kill someone.

Are we really going to split hairs at that level?


----------



## I have nuts

People don't go "postal" anymore, they go Uber.


----------



## Archie8616

I'm at work now, at my primary job. I do Uber as a part time job which has helped me tremendously in paying other bills. I'm wondering what passengers will be saying, or if there will still be people wanting to use Uber? Questions running through my mind are...

Will this cause Uber to drop prices even more?
Is this a good time to jump ship and stick with another rideshare like Lyft?
When I log in today, what questions will passengers be asking, and how should I answer them?

Regardless, reading the list of who was killed, and who was injured, and now they have the victims pictures online, honestly truly brought tears to my eyes....My heart truly goes out to all those who were affected by this jerk. 

I don't care what the prices are, no one should ever turn to this kind of violence because of it. Just LEAVE and get another job. I worked at Taco Bell as a second job before Uber, and if driving for Uber gets to the point where I'm not happy, well guess what, I'll be happy to go back to working with Taco Bell. 

No matter what your beliefs are, if you believe in God or not, who you drive for or if you don't drive anymore...take a moment of your own personal time in remembering the victims. 

There are some really awesome drivers out there, and many of you have your regular passengers that you may see from time to time, lets just hope as drivers that our regular customers will know and understand that not all of us are like this.


----------



## I have nuts

LA Cabbie said:


> No it's not. Animals don't lash out because they feel like it. There had to have been a trigger. I know for fact that pax provocations can get to the level where you want to beat someone to a bloody pulp. Almost happened with me. Luckily security came and literally carried the punk away. I quit days after that.
> 
> In this sad instance, uber the very least enabled acts of terrorism.


I'm not saying they deserve to be shot, but there are definitly some pax who at the very least are asking for a ass whooping.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Attention Uber Trolls (and you are sooooo not hard to spot) Are any of you weenies watching the networks this morning????.....Can you tell me the magic word that comes up in almost every sentence uttered by the talking heads???? Got a text this morning from my local Uber handlers that "special guarantees are in effect this morning".....now THAT"S GOOD MANAGEMENT!!!!! You people need to take your "talents" to another gigger site cause this mutha is goin down!!!!


----------



## Just one more trip

Bart McCoy said:


> Do you have ANY proof whatsoever that this guy killed people because of ubers low rates????????????????????????????????? uber sucks, but do you know his true reason for killing this people? I guess being crazy isn't a valid answer, it has to be because of Uber right?


Do you know anything about psychological trigger points, or are you just another pretty face?


----------



## space ghost

TwoFiddyMile said:


> Id blame the management of his team partially.
> See, if you commit crime on your shift, it drags your company into it.
> I had a driver who got caught peeing in a backyard while renting one of my cabs.
> Owner of the house complained to me and to the police agency which licensed my company.
> So since this guy was on a rampage in the middle of his shift, youre GD right Uber is partially on the hook for this.
> As is Kalamazoo, and the state of Michigan.


Uber is going to take a bath over this. They absoluetly are resposible because of their lack of transparency. If the rider who bailed out of the ride in the beginning could have actually spoken with someone with uber then they could have tracked hjm and probably prevented some or all of the deaths. Their way of doing business may have ckst some lives this time. These folks are going to sue them into next week.


----------



## Modern-Day-Slavery

This is very sad for all the families involved. Unfortunately Uber's unconscionable attitude has pushed one driver too far. Uber should take more responsibility for the well being of their 'partners'.


----------



## Modern-Day-Slavery

space ghost said:


> Uber is going to take a bath over this. They absoluetly are resposible because of their lack of transparency. If the rider who bailed out of the ride in the beginning could have actually spoken with someone with uber then they could have tracked hjm and probably prevented some or all of the deaths. Their way of doing business may have ckst some lives this time. These folks are going to sue them into next week.


You are absolutely right. Uber doesn't even provide a phone number for drivers yet they will happily spam drivers with condescending text messages and emails as they monitor you with GPS. It's a VERY arrogant company.


----------



## elelegido

Maybe this guy's favorite cereal was Cinnamon Cheerios. But the headlines would not say Cinnamon Cheerios Eater Goes On Murder Rampage. Uber's not to blame for this in any way.


----------



## MattStone

I am really confused too no pattern, no connection between victims, and none of the Uber riders were shot. What the hell the reports say he wasn't mental that his mind was healthy but people with a healthy mind don't run around killing people these days. Also in order for a crazed person to stop killing in between kills to pick up a rider they would have to have a clear mind or partial control of his faculties. Well here in VA they already don't trust Uber and I look like a serial killer so I guess there goes my rides.  
My thoughts go out to the victims and their families.


----------



## Bart McCoy

Fuzzyelvis said:


> Uber has our phone numbers. A human being could have called him and may have been able to ascertain he was a danger and called 911. They could have given police his exact location. They could also block him.from getting pings while not actually having his app appear to be malfunctioning.
> 
> Of course, they might csll, he appears fine, and they do nothing.
> 
> .


Or he could have not answered.
Regardless of any of that, the best Uber could do is deactivate him immediately. But exactly how does that stop him from killing people on his own time like he did? Everyone in this 14 page topic has dodged my question about that.



Bro1999 said:


> _
> "I'm upset because I tried contacting Uber after I had talked to the police, saying that we needed to get this guy off the road," Mellen told WWMT."_


How can Uber get that guy off the road? The most they could have done was deactivate him. How does that stop him from getting in his own car and shooting people off the clock like he did? Deactivation doesn't stop shootings, so what could Uber do to prevent him shooting all those people he did NOT pick up and did NOT order an Uber? Again, another dodged question that no one can answer



TwoFiddyMile said:


> Unbelievable.
> He killed people from his Uber car, during his Uber shift.
> Some chick DID call 911 on his ass. 911 needs to take ownership too.
> 
> Are we really going to split hairs at that level?


Yes we are. Uber drivers don't have a "shift". If turned app off, shot someone. Then turn app on, gave a ride(without hurting any pax I may add)then turn app off, then shot someone again. Exactly when did he kill people during your shift as you say? You as with other are jumping to conclusions without all the facts. An Uber driver can got out and do 1 trip and then turn the app off. At that point he can be done for the day. But according to you guys what ever he does after that 1 trip reflects upon Uber simply because he didn't take down the Uber sign on his window??? Ridiculous. Don't let hate for Uber cloud your judgement


----------



## Bart McCoy

*So its being reported the killer was an insurance adjust who wasnt happy with his job*.
There's no mention of him being unhappy with his Uber job

But people's hate for Uber will make his Uber job that he was happy with,trump the main mon-fri job that he was unhappy with.

sad, just sad,smg


----------



## TwoFiddyMile

Bart McCoy said:


> Or he could have not answered.
> Regardless of any of that, the best Uber could do is deactivate him immediately. But exactly how does that stop him from killing people on his own time like he did? Everyone in this 14 page topic has dodged my question about that.
> 
> How can Uber get that guy off the road? The most they could have done was deactivate him. How does that stop him from getting in his own car and shooting people off the clock like he did? Deactivation doesn't stop shootings, so what could Uber do to prevent him shooting all those people he did NOT pick up and did NOT order an Uber? Again, another dodged question that no one can answer
> 
> Yes we are. Uber drivers don't have a "shift". If turned app off, shot someone. Then turn app on, gave a ride(without hurting any pax I may add)then turn app off, then shot someone again. Exactly when did he kill people during your shift as you say? You as with other are jumping to conclusions without all the facts. An Uber driver can got out and do 1 trip and then turn the app off. At that point he can be done for the day. But according to you guys what ever he does after that 1 trip reflects upon Uber simply because he didn't take down the Uber sign on his window??? Ridiculous. Don't let hate for Uber cloud your judgement


About as weak as Ubers argument that the turd who ran down the 6 year old girl in San Francisco 2 years ago was "not currently on or chasing a job, so its not Ubers problem".
That little PR blunder cost them at least a million.
6 murders on shift are gonna cost at least 5 billion out of court.
But dont let that stop you, Bart McCoy.
Uber On.


----------



## naplestom75

Even if he was unhappy with his Uber job, it's still not the reason he killed a bunch of people. He was a nut job, that's why he killed a bunch of people.

They are responsible for anything that happens to anyone while he is logged-on to their app though, that's the reality, like it or not.


----------



## Uberamstel

Uber rider in the car with Jason Dalton after the shootings:

'you're not the shooter are you?'

Uber driver Jason:

'No, I'm just tired'

http://woodtv.com/2016/02/21/daltons-uber-fare-youre-not-the-shooter-are-you/


----------



## Bart McCoy

TwoFiddyMile said:


> About as weak as Ubers argument that the turd who ran down the 6 year old girl in San Francisco 2 years ago was "not currently on or chasing a job, so its not Ubers problem".
> That little PR blunder cost them at least a million.
> 6 murders on shift are gonna cost at least 5 billion out of court.
> .


Im not arguing the PR battle, obviously it looks bad for Uber the way you, others, and definitely the media are throwing Uber's name into the mix. Im arguing Uber being legally responsible for the shootings. You have no proof he killed anyone "on shift". Now you talking Uber is going to pay 5 billion,smh. Can't even have a reasonable discussion/debate with you, smh



naplestom75 said:


> They are responsible for anything that happens to anyone while he is logged-on to their app though, that's the reality, like it or not.


No, that just isn't flat out true. Surely this works on a case by case basis. You too must work for Uber or the police, otherwise you have no clue if he was logged in during the time of the shootings.


----------



## Bart McCoy

TwoFiddyMile said:


> About as weak as Ubers argument that the turd who ran down the 6 year old girl in San Francisco 2 years ago was "not currently on or chasing a job, so its not Ubers problem".
> .


So you too join the rack of folks that dodge my question. When I'm right, yall dodge, that seems to be the theme. You just go off on a tangent about an incident that is in no way similar to the shooting?

Nobody can answer still: Explain how Uber was supposed to prevent this guy from killing people off the clock in his own car, smh


----------



## MattStone

I thought we did, it is not Ubers responsibility all they could have done was inform the police they had an erratic driver that was acting unstable.


----------



## MattStone

The problem is they they do not have a phone number for anyone to contact so how was that supposed to happen


----------



## Bart McCoy

MattStone said:


> The problem is they they do not have a phone number for anyone to contact so how was that supposed to happen


If they had a phone number, would that have prevented the shootings? If not, why blame Uber?


----------



## Skunk in a Bucket

My thoughts and prayers go out to the victims. With so many of these senseless acts going on, it's easy to become somewhat numb to them, but the fact that this was carried out by a fellow driver makes this one much more personal to me. As I contemplate the usual questions that most of us have when we think about atrocities like this, several things occur to me.

First, I'm not going to let this psychopath's name pass my lips. These guys want fame (or more accurately, _infamy_) - and unfortunately they tend to get it - but I don't want to add to it in that way. I wish the media would make it a policy not to reward them by using their names. I believe it just encourages more of it.

Second, UBER didn't cause this! Sure, it's hard to make a living sometimes, but whatever they were paying per mile in Kalamazoo was no excuse to go around killing people, most especially random, innocent ones. No one's holding a gun to our heads - we can quit anytime. Travis himself could torch my car and shoot my dog, but I still wouldn't dream of doing what that piece of garbage in Michigan did.

Third, I'm going think through ahead of time what I'll say to riders and anyone else who knows of my association with UBER. I'm guessing I'll be asked for my thoughts about it, and I should have something to say about the perp that doesn't involve richly deserved, yet emphatically impolite expletives.

Just my two cents worth.


----------



## Just_in

Bart McCoy said:


> Or he could have not answered.
> Regardless of any of that, the best Uber could do is deactivate him immediately. But exactly how does that stop him from killing people on his own time like he did? Everyone in this 14 page topic has dodged my question about that.


Ok. If it makes you feel better. Uber did not pull the trigger. Everyone already knows that. That's probably why they aren't debating you, or you getting the answer you want.


----------



## Jack Pavlov

Bon Jovi said:


> Dude, I had worked for the fortune 50 company for over 15 years, and I can tell that your articulation level is very high. You are not the driver, you either work for PR firm of for Uber. See, you are not that smart after all, you are the King Troll. Of course uber is to blame.


Lol, It's amazing to me that this forum not only is comprised of people who are inept, but anyone who's NOT inept gets outed as a "troll working for the corporation". This is almost straight out of a movie. It's too funny... please continue, i'll enjoy my cereal and milk and go off to work a SUCCESSFUL 7-4 shift and make a couple hundred dollars that you guys will be missing out on; by being attached to your keyboards and impatiently waiting for the next response.


----------



## MattStone

Um read my two posts I said Uber is not responsible, no one is but the shooter.


----------



## Bart McCoy

Just_in said:


> Ok. If it makes you feel better. Uber did not pull the trigger. Everyone already knows that. That's probably why they aren't debating you, or you getting the answer you want.


You really aren't reading my question right at all. common sense says Uber didn't pull the trigger, everyone knows this, so why would I debate that?

Unless you are having a real hard time reading the replies in this 16 page topic, lots and lots of folks are saying Uber is liable for the shootings. I mean, you do know you can be liable for a shooting without pulling the trigger right? smh

The debate is: is Uber legally responsible/liable for the shootings. aka can they get sued for millions and have to pay. I mean you do know you can be forced to pay big money without ever pulling the trigger on the gun right?

smh


----------



## MattStone

Yup I'm inept and stupid with one Engineering Degree in Marine Technology and working on my Masters in Healthcare Administration which is why I'm Ubering to focus on my studies. I was simply stating no one is truly responsible except for the person who committed the act himself. Outside of that there could have been a few things done by a few people that may have stopped him sooner but that's the past and there is no way to know for sure. Hope you are enjoying your popcorn.


----------



## DuberOn

Bart McCoy said:


> Nobody can answer still: Explain how Uber was supposed to prevent this guy from killing people off the clock in his own car, smh


That's not a fact, we don't know whether he was on or off the clock.

I agree that uber had really no way of preventing this persons actions, but as a few have stated maybe a direct contact with uber (i.e. Emergency hotline, live operator) could have ended this sooner than later.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bart McCoy said:


> Or he could have not answered.
> Regardless of any of that, the best Uber could do is deactivate him immediately. But exactly how does that stop him from killing people on his own time like he did? Everyone in this 14 page topic has dodged my question about that.
> 
> How can Uber get that guy off the road? The most they could have done was deactivate him. How does that stop him from getting in his own car and shooting people off the clock like he did? Deactivation doesn't stop shootings, so what could Uber do to prevent him shooting all those people he did NOT pick up and did NOT order an Uber? Again, another dodged question that no one can answer
> 
> Yes we are. Uber drivers don't have a "shift". If turned app off, shot someone. Then turn app on, gave a ride(without hurting any pax I may add)then turn app off, then shot someone again. Exactly when did he kill people during your shift as you say? You as with other are jumping to conclusions without all the facts. An Uber driver can got out and do 1 trip and then turn the app off. At that point he can be done for the day. But according to you guys what ever he does after that 1 trip reflects upon Uber simply because he didn't take down the Uber sign on his window??? Ridiculous. Don't let hate for Uber cloud your judgement


I see Uber's PR machine is working overtime this morning.


----------



## MattStone

Anyone can be sued for anything it's America and part of our rights. Are they going to be held accountable by a court? That's doubtful, I don't see how they can be sued or held liable. Is it going to effect how we Uber? Probably, but only time will tell us how.


----------



## MattStone

Lol, Uber PR machine. Honestly I hate Uber but it's a means to an end. School right now is my primary focus everything else is tertiary.


----------



## Just_in

Bart McCoy said:


> You really aren't reading my question right at all. common sense says Uber didn't pull the trigger, everyone knows this, so why would I debate that?
> 
> Unless you are having a real hard time reading the replies in this 16 page topic, lots and lots of folks are saying Uber is liable for the shootings. I mean, you do know you can be liable for a shooting without pulling the trigger right? smh
> 
> The debate is: is Uber legally responsible/liable for the shootings. aka can they get sued for millions and have to pay. I mean you do know you can be forced to pay big money without ever pulling the trigger on the gun right?
> 
> smh


It's a moral responsibility. Other than that what your doing is holding some members of this forum to proving impossible standards.


----------



## Bart McCoy

DuberOn said:


> That's not a fact, we don't know whether he was on or off the clock.
> 
> I agree that uber had really no way of preventing this persons actions, but as a few have stated maybe a direct contact with uber (i.e. Emergency hotline, live operator) could have ended this sooner than later.


You can't have it both ways. If they had a number and deactivated him right away, what's preventing him to kill off the clock (would have to be off teh clock since he's deactivated right?). Please explain how having a live number "could have ended this sooner"????? Please don't dodge and answer that



UberBlackDriverLA said:


> I see Uber's PR machine is working overtime this morning.


Nope, im just one of the few people who can put the hate aside for Uber and look at the incident in an unbiased way.
There's nothing Uber could have done, and nobody has mentioned anything Uber could have done, to prevent those shootings. You are just making excuses for a crazy man, I'm blaming the shooter


----------



## Bart McCoy

Just_in said:


> It's a moral responsibility. Other than that what your doing is holding some members of this forum to proving impossible standards.


A moral responsibility to do what?
what could Uber have morally done to stop/prevent the shooting?

no driver wants to be deactivated quick off a pax alleged claim, but yet I guess you think thats what Uber should have done? smh


----------



## FishTaco

I google: taxi driver murderer

First result: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cumbria_shootings

The *Cumbria shootings* was a killing spree that occurred on 2 June 2010 when a lone gunman, Derrick Bird, killed 12 people and injured 11 others before killing himself in Cumbria, England. it is one of the worst criminal acts involving firearms in British history.

Bird, a 52-year-old local taxi driver, was later found dead in a wooded area, having abandoned his vehicle in the village of Boot.

Is it bad press for Uber, yes. Are they getting what they deserve, no. Nobody deserves this.


----------



## Bart McCoy

Bart McCoy said:


> *So its being reported the killer was an insurance adjust who wasnt happy with his job*.
> There's no mention of him being unhappy with his Uber job
> 
> But people's hate for Uber will make his Uber job that he was happy with,trump the main mon-fri job that he was unhappy with.
> 
> sad, just sad,smg


so people are just gonna ignore this huh?


----------



## MattStone

He could have been stopped sooner. Quite a few rider reported erratic behavior and try to notify Uber but had difficulty because of the email thing. They then notified the police but the police didn't take them seriously because they thought it was just a pissed off rider. So in retrospect is it possible he could have been stopped before he killed a few more people? Yes, but there's no way to confirm that.


----------



## MattStone

Bart McCoy said:


> so people are just gonna ignore this huh?


No I saw it but it's buried underneath Uber not made the focal point. Besides what I read said he was with Progressive Insurance in 2011 not currently.


----------



## Uberamstel

MattStone said:


> The problem is they they do not have a phone number for anyone to contact so how was that supposed to happen


911?


----------



## Kalee

Bart McCoy said:


> you do know he can just get another job right? i bet mcdonalds is paying more
> 
> This is a slippery slope. Do drivers really want entitled pax to get Uber to automatically and quickly deactivate you at any rating 3 or less or an email complaint without ever consulting with you the driver first? Do you REALLY want Uber to operate like that?
> 
> Also, you say Uber should have taken him off the road. For what? he wasnt shooting ANY of his pax. But lets say Uber did deactivate him as soon as a pax complained. What in the world does that do? It only stops him from picking up more pax and not harming them. It in no way stops him from riding around with app off /no pax in car (which is what happened in real life) and killing people!!!!
> 
> You say a lawsuit is coming. The person suing, they are going to claim their loved one would not have died if Uber deactivated him on the spot(after first complaint)??? How so does that stop the driver from using his car as he did to ride around and still kill people? No matter what Uber does they cant stop that man from driving off the clock for Uber
> 
> If people really think Uber is to blame, give me one thing Uber could have done to stop him from killing people?????????????????????





chi1cabby said:


> https://www.uber.com/cities/kalamazoo/?int=a
> *uberX **The low-cost Uber*
> Base Fare $0.90
> +
> Per Minute $0.15
> +
> Per Mile $0.75
> Booking Fee $1.15
> Minimum Fare $3.95
> Cancellation Fee $5.00
> *The min fare includes the Booking Fee.


Thanks for setting the shills straight on Kzoo's rates so I didn't have to.


----------



## MattStone

There is a delay with the forum go back up and read some of my posts. I do address a lot of what you guys are bringing up. Although these are just my thoughts and I'm a nobody. I still hope it gives you guys some type of insight.


----------



## Jack Pavlov

MattStone said:


> Yup I'm inept and stupid with one Engineering Degree in Marine Technology and working on my Masters in Healthcare Administration which is why I'm Ubering to focus on my studies. I was simply stating no one is truly responsible except for the person who committed the act himself. Outside of that there could have been a few things done by a few people that may have stopped him sooner but that's the past and there is no way to know for sure. Hope you are enjoying your popcorn.


If the shoe fits, wear it but the people know who that message was intended for.


----------



## MattStone

Jack Pavlov said:


> If the shoe fits, wear it but the people know who that message was intended for.


How's the popcorn and porn?


----------



## Kalee

Jack Pavlov said:


> None of which those caused this man to go and do this. There are plenty of crimes that occur with no warning indicators.
> I think there is nothing wrong with uber taking a progressive stance and not discriminating a persons criminal history. It's those kinds of moves that companies continue to make that help reduce the recidivism rates.
> 
> Train their employees? This isn't a technical position, it's a very SIMPLE job. They provide a video tutorial and documentation. Lots of jobs "training" actually consists of the employee watching videos. In the government, annual training requirements are fulfilled by the employee logging onto the training website and watching videos or slideshows.
> 
> Contractors are rarely supervised by their hiring authority...
> 
> Everyone always looks for every reason to blame Uber. He could've worked for McDonald's and everyone would somehow tie this into Uber.
> 
> By the way I know lots of jobs that don't actually check with previous employers, none of those are a reason to blame uber.
> 
> All of your reasons are really irrelevant to this.
> Is there a reason that some people are perfectly content with their employment with uber? Me for instance, I'm entirely okay. Could it be better and are there improvements to be made, yes... Is any of the shortcomings going to stop me from making money, no. You adapt to the changes and overcome. It again comes down to personal responsibility and how much work people are really willing to put into their own well being... Or is uber ultimately responsible for every single employees needs and concerns?


Ever notice it's always the " New Members" that are just now creating memberships on this forum to try to limit the damage to Uber ... er ... I meant coming on to have rational discussions around current events ?


----------



## MattStone

Um not that new been here for a little bit but as I said before I hate Uber and their unfair practices but this is not the chat for that. If your having difficulty I can start a new chat about you being paranoid that every new member is uber.


----------



## MattStone

Matt Stone is my nom de plume I use it on the deep dark web or most things on the web.


----------



## hanging in there

Bart McCoy said:


> I guess I'll wait on further reports. Some say he shot people inbetween uber rides, some outlets say he ubered people BEFORE doing any shootings. But in all reports, none state any victum was an Uber passenger. So why he spared Uber passenger lives rather than other random people has me confused


Obviously he wasn't thinking clearly. He could have made a "killing" with Uber that night by shooting the pax instead of random people, because he could have then driven them to some remote area 100 miles away, dumped the body or bodies, stolen the phone and rated himself 5 stars in addition to getting paid for the long ride. Then rinse and repeat all night long.


----------



## MattStone

Lol, so very wrong but funny.


----------



## Ziggy

MattStone said:


> Matt Stone is my nom de plume I use it on the deep dark web or most things on the web.


Ziggy is my nom de plume .... but I've been on this forum for 8+ months and have participated in 1,500+ threads ... so "new member" is the same as "5* driver" ... brand new, uber shill, whatever ... you have no cred here


----------



## MattStone

That's fine but remember you all were new here at one time and you are showing what a-holes you are. I made sound reasonable opinions based on facts and you guys chose to attack me and call me Uber. Shows how stupid and ignorant you guys are.


----------



## vesolehome

I live in the Detroit area and since this shooting is in our state it's all over the local news and papers. Radio talks shoes today are all over it and the focus is Uber and background checks.

Regardless of this guy not having a record, the local reports are he loved guns and would shoot them in the air at times and the police were aware of him.

Uber is going to take a beating in this one.


----------



## I have nuts

Modern-Day-Slavery said:


> You are absolutely right. Uber doesn't even provide a phone number for drivers yet they will happily spam drivers with condescending text messages and emails as they monitor you with GPS. It's a VERY arrogant company.


A phone number would mean they would actually have to talk to drivers.


----------



## MattStone

I agree man and sad too, I use to live in West Bloomfield, Michigan. I feel bad for you guys out there, I hope you don't lose too many fairs.


----------



## SafeT

vesolehome said:


> I live in the Detroit area and since this shooting is in our state it's all over the local news and papers. Radio talks shoes today are all over it and the focus is Uber and background checks.
> 
> Regardless of this guy not having a record, the local reports are he loved guns and would shoot them in the air at times and the police were aware of him.
> 
> Uber is going to take a beating in this one.


No problem, Uber will just roll out more UberPuppies.


----------



## Jinxstone

A local radio show spoke to an attorney who had the opinion that since drivers are independent contractors, and not Uber employees, it is unlikely that victim's families will have much success suing Uber, unless they can somehow prove negligence. Uber may settle a suit without accepting responsibility just to avoid bad publicity but then again...


----------



## 45821

Jack Pavlov said:


> Lol, It's amazing to me that this forum not only is comprised of people who are inept, but anyone who's NOT inept gets outed as a "troll working for the corporation". This is almost straight out of a movie. It's too funny... please continue, i'll enjoy my cereal and milk and go off to work a SUCCESSFUL 7-4 shift and make a couple hundred dollars that you guys will be missing out on; by being attached to your keyboards and impatiently waiting for the next response.


Please, be careful and do not choke on your cereal. This would be really heartbreaking, not too mention great loss for the Uber community. You are the brightest person on this forum period. Oh, do not forget to take your lunch break, I hope it will not be cereal again.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile

Ill respond to the insurance job question Bart McCoy .
If he had been on break from his insurance job I.E. on shift, it would be on their shoulders (the insurance company which employs him).
1000 years of British based common law states the onus is on the company he was working for at the time.
If The Uber Killer WAS logged in during the killings, then it will be worse for Uber than it already is.
No, Uber didn't pull the trigger, but they will be accused of being liable in civl court.
And like all things Uber, this will be settled out of court, this time with FAR larger amounts of money than ever before.
If i were on the legal team of the plaintiffs (family of the deceased), id be seeking 2.5 billion per death.
That would provide a ton of wiggle room for the inevitable out of court settlement.

Uber gave him a trade dress, he was definitively working a "shift" I.E. multiple pax transfers AROUND the slayings.

This may prove to be an albatross Uber cannot remove from their necks.


----------



## Uberamstel

hanging in there said:


> Obviously he wasn't thinking clearly. He could have made a "killing" with Uber that night by shooting the pax instead of random people, because he could have then driven them to some remote area 100 miles away, dumped the body or bodies, stolen the phone and rated himself 5 stars in addition to getting paid for the long ride. Then rinse and repeat all night long.


Hmmm, interesting strategy


----------



## tohunt4me

Qa


Bro1999 said:


> https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-shooting-says-about-ubers-background-checks/
> 
> A damning article. OUCH.
> 
> _""We learned of systemic failures in Uber's background checks," San Francisco District Attorney George Gascon said in reference to the lawsuits, according to Forbes. "We have learned they have drivers who are convicted sex offenders, thieves, burglars, kidnappers and a convicted murder.""_
> 
> AND
> 
> _"Mellen said he contacted police and Uber about the wild ride. Then, he recognized the face after local media posted photos of the alleged shooter.
> 
> "I'm upset because I tried contacting Uber after I had talked to the police, saying that we needed to get this guy off the road," Mellen told WWMT."_


Mountains of regulation are on the Horizon !


----------



## Bro1999

https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...a-11e5-891a-4ed04f4213e8_story.html?tid=a_inl

_Sara Reynolds, 25, of Kalamazoo said Dalton gave her and a friend a ride on Valentine's Day. She described him as "shy and awkward" and said he didn't seem threatening.

"He said he had just started driving just a couple days prior to our ride, and *he already had some bad reviews*," Reynolds said. "I asked him why and he said it was because his car was acting up while he was doing bar runs. But he mumbled it like he didn't want to talk about it."_

Obviously, negative Uber reviews were on this killer's mind. This shows how inadequate UBer's background check process is. I bet you not even 10% of the "safe rider fee" or whatever the hell they call it now even went towards background checks....just pure profit in the CEO's pocket.


----------



## AllenChicago

MattStone said:


> Um read my two posts I said Uber is not responsible, no one is but the shooter.


Millions of dollars will be paid to the victim families. Smart lawyers will see to that. We just don't know yet who/what will pay the judgements.


----------



## rtaatl

TwoFiddyMile said:


> Ill respond to the insurance job question Bart McCoy .
> If he had been on break from his insurance job I.E. on shift, it would be on their shoulders (the insurance company which employs him).
> 1000 years of British based common law states the onus is on the company he was working for at the time.
> If The Uber Killer WAS logged in during the killings, then it will be worse for Uber than it already is.
> No, Uber didn't pull the trigger, but they will be accused of being liable in civl court.
> And like all things Uber, this will be settled out of court, this time with FAR larger amounts of money than ever before.
> If i were on the legal team of the plaintiffs (family of the deceased), id be seeking 2.5 billion per death.
> That would provide a ton of wiggle room for the inevitable out of court settlement.
> 
> Uber gave him a trade dress, he was definitively working a "shift" I.E. multiple pax transfers AROUND the slayings.
> 
> This may prove to be an albatross Uber cannot remove from their necks.


And it shouldn't be hard to prove negligence since passengers were scared and trying to contact Uber directly to report a serious issue at the time. We all know there is no immediate response, but in terms of litigation is a problem for the company. Lawyers will follow the money and there should be enough ties to Uber in this to hold them accountable. Maybe some don't see it as fair, but someone has to pay.


----------



## Ziggy

There is a "Panic Button" on the Uber app in India ... but that's only because the Indian government threatened to kick Uber out of the entire country in the wake of an Uber driver raping a pax. *Uber definitely has the ability to do the right thing, they just are greedy suckers that won't take the moral high ground unless they are forced to










Like the Tip button ... Uber has the ability to do the right thing ... but won't until it's in their best interest


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

Bon Jovi said:


> Some "good" lawyers will find the way.


<sigh> I think that probably makes them 'bad' lawyers.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

sidewazzz said:


> View attachment 28830
> 
> 
> It would be cool if someone knew the amount of each deal so I can put them in. I'd imagine they are rather large numbers.


I thought you were saying all these crimes were committed by UberX drivers - and people should use UberSELECT, UberSUV, UberLUX and UberBLACK.


----------



## AllenChicago

In the USA, a lot of drunks will use the "panic" button just for the fun of it...or hit it by accident.


----------



## Coachman

AllenChicago said:


> Millions of dollars will be paid to the victim families. Smart lawyers will see to that. We just don't know yet who/what will pay the judgements.


I don't believe Uber bears any responsibility for this. But they will probably settle any lawsuits just to avoid more bad publicity. What's a few million dollars to Uber?


----------



## Chauncey Bivitz

Jinxstone said:


> A local radio show spoke to an attorney who had the opinion that since drivers are independent contractors, and not Uber employees, it is unlikely that victim's families will have much success suing Uber, unless they can somehow prove negligence. Uber may settle a suit without accepting responsibility just to avoid bad publicity but then again...


Agreed. They are always wanting to have it both ways. The time of reckoning is upon them. In the long run they will dodge teh bullet, but it is a serious ding.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

LA Cabbie said:


> All I can say, uber can no longer consider itself just a hobby people can do in their spare time.


Sure they can - but to your point: lots of 'hobbies' are regulated. Gunmanship comes to mind. Know any private pilots? Even my drones have to have an ID on them, identifying me and registered with the FAA.


----------



## Ziggy

AllenChicago said:


> In the USA, a lot of drunks will use the "panic" button just for the fun of it...or hit it by accident.


Not saying that the Panic button is perfect ... but just like 911 ... people that make prank 911 calls could get fined and end up in jail in most states (source); considering that the Panic button will be connected to 911 ... I'm certain that the same penalties would apply. No matter how drunk someone is ... most, if not all, will avoid from pranking 911


----------



## Manotas

What the Michigan shooting spree reveals about Uber's background checks
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-shooting-says-about-ubers-background-checks/


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

Bart McCoy said:


> I'm not disputing Uber could have a better customer service system , real time notification, or supervision apparatus. Nor is that the topic. My point is, EVEN if Uber had all that in place, how in da hell does it prevent the guy from using his own car to go out and shoot non-uber related people?????????????????????????????????????????????
> 
> If the sideswipe was the first Uber knew that something was wrong with this driver, please tell me what Uber could have done to PREVENT that man from shooting people?


By receiving the report live, immediately deactivating the driver and reporting the illegal activity to law enforcement. While there's no guarantee that WOULD have prevented the shootings - it MIGHT have prevented them - or the ones after the first one (remember: it took law enforcement until AFTER three separate incidents to catch this guy with a BOLO - 'Be On The Look Out".


----------



## Bart McCoy

vesolehome said:


> I live in the Detroit area and since this shooting is in our state it's all over the local news and papers. Radio talks shoes today are all over it and the focus is Uber and background checks.
> 
> Regardless of this guy not having a record, the local reports are he loved guns and would shoot them in the air at times and the police were aware of him.
> .


But this doesn't make any sense. At all. If he has a clean record, what could tougher background checks include? If he committed no crimes....he committed no crimes!



Jinxstone said:


> A local radio show spoke to an attorney who had the opinion that since drivers are independent contractors, and not Uber employees, it is unlikely that victim's families will have much success suing Uber, unless they can somehow prove negligence. n...


Exactly, Uber wasnt negligent in the background check. He had a clean history. You can't say Uber was negligent in deactivating him after a sideswipe because he didn't harm any pax and deactivating him still wouldn't have stopped or prevented him from using his own car to shoot out of and kill people



Bro1999 said:


> Obviously, negative Uber reviews were on this killer's mind. This shows how inadequate UBer's background check process is. I bet you not even 10% of the "safe rider fee" or whatever the hell they call it now even went towards background checks....just pure profit in the CEO's pocket.


lets use some common sense here. 1st, thousands of Uber drivers don't like the rating system nor their current rating. 2nd, how does any background check discover that a person will not like their rating...before they even get hired to get a rating???????? You guys are just reaching for anything to get Uber to take the fall for this, smh



AllenChicago said:


> Millions of dollars will be paid to the victim families. Smart lawyers will see to that. We just don't know yet who/what will pay the judgements.


Smart lawyers huh? Again, another reach. If you know this for sure you pick the lottery numbers, since you think this is a slam dunk case against uber



rtaatl said:


> And it shouldn't be hard to prove negligence since passengers were scared and trying to contact Uber directly to report a serious issue at the time. We all know there is no immediate response, but in terms of litigation is a problem for the company. Lawyers will follow the money and there should be enough ties to Uber in this to hold them accountable. Maybe some don't see it as fair, but someone has to pay.


What happened during the Uber ride pretty much had nothing to do with the shooting. The pax in the car MAY want to file a frivolous suit for being scared, but no way they will sue and get millions for an alleged scary ride. You are mixing Uber's liability for the scary ride, with the shootings that occurred with NO pax. HUGE difference


----------



## naplestom75

Bart McCoy said:


> So you too join the rack of folks that dodge my question. When I'm right, yall dodge, that seems to be the theme. You just go off on a tangent about an incident that is in no way similar to the shooting?
> 
> Nobody can answer still: Explain how Uber was supposed to prevent this guy from killing people off the clock in his own car, smh


They weren't. What I am getting at is that they MAY prove is that he was logged-on at the time the shooting ocurred, which still makes you partially liable, that's just how it works with being liable for subcontractors, that's why alot of insurance companies are reluctant to cover you while you are employing them. I'm not making a determination of what or if there should be damages, I'm just saying that's the legal precedent that has been set for the most part.


----------



## Bart McCoy

Michael - Cleveland said:


> By receiving the report live, immediately deactivating the driver and reporting the illegal activity to law enforcement. While there's no guarantee that WOULD have prevented the shootings - it MIGHT have prevented them - or the ones after the first one (remember: it took law enforcement until AFTER three separate incidents to catch this guy with a BOLO - 'Be On The Look Out".


Once again, this is a slippery slope. So you telling me the vast majority of Uber drivers will have no problem with uber deactivating And sending the police to your house because a pax makes a report? Mind you Uber is temporarily "firing" you without even attempting to hear your side of the story. Do you REALLY think that will fly over well with drivers if that's Uber's policy? REALLY? Pax already have too much power by being able to rate you, now you apparently okay with them being able to deactivate you instantly if you don't kiss their ass during the ride?????????????????

And its definitely no guarantee. You think police anywhere rush out to a sideswipe report where NO ONE WAS INJURED? Police aren't superheroes so don't act like a phone call to them would save the day.The only way police could have prevented him would be if they came out and arrested him. What if they arrest him but pax as lying? What if they found no damage to his car? so much would have to fall into place for police to arrest him. Being arrested is the only way that he could be stopped from getting into his car and killing people while off the clock for Uber


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

Bart McCoy said:


> What happened during the Uber ride pretty much had nothing to do with the shooting. The pax in the car MAY want to file a frivolous suit for being scared, but no way they will sue and get millions for an alleged scary ride. You are mixing Uber's liability for the scary ride, with the shootings that occurred with NO pax. HUGE difference


I'd think that the pax have no (civil) claim, but a prosecutor could certainly present a case to a grand jury for criminal negligence. Whether that would have legs would depend on the law, the prosecutor, and the make up of the grand jury.


----------



## naplestom75

James River will get hosed, and Uber will make them eat the whole thing otherwise they are fired and Uber moves on to the next taker.


----------



## tohunt4me

Bart McCoy said:


> *So its being reported the killer was an insurance adjust who wasnt happy with his job*.
> There's no mention of him being unhappy with his Uber job
> OBut people's hate for Uber will make his Uber job that he was happy with,trump the main mon-fri job that he was unhappy with.
> 
> sad, just sad,smg


Did any of the deceased ever even use Uber ?
Did they EVEN have Uber accounts ?

Perhaps they all bought progressive insurance from him ?


----------



## Actionjax

Funny how people on this forum will grasp at straws to negatively slam Uber. Fact is Uber is unrelated to the shootings and in no way was Uber negligent. If later there was something to sat that this individual had charges during a background check and was passed through Uber I would get this as a separate story.

But as it sits putting Uber on this story is to sell the story as Uber is a headline grabber. Mass shootings don't stand out in the US anymore. But Uber in the headline it stands out to the public. The journalists who are running a story with the link to Uber have no journalistic integrity in my opinion. And if I was working at Uber i would look at a slander suit.

They are completely unrelated events and not even worth the discussion.


----------



## rtaatl

Bart McCoy said:


> What happened during the Uber ride pretty much had nothing to do with the shooting. The pax in the car MAY want to file a frivolous suit for being scared, but no way they will sue and get millions for an alleged scary ride. You are mixing Uber's liability for the scary ride, with the shootings that occurred with NO pax. HUGE difference


I'd like to see someone in their operations department testify to this. Especially as to what type of active management does Uber have in place to deal with real time rider issues. Multiple people are complaining about this one driver and there he's still on the road. Since Uber has no dispatch or any live person on site working a shift in each market I'm sure they're going to be found negligent in some form for not addressing rider concerns. What if someone was to talk to him after one complaint? Would it have kept him preoccupied to not still be driving to shoot people? What if there was an active dispatch to bring him in for a while....would that have kept him off to road to reconsider his actions? Of course these are things we will never know, yet I'm sure a decent attorney is going to expose all of the holes in this company. 
As for frivolous lawsuits not getting settled...lol...really, ever heard of a burglar who sued and actually won because he was trying to break into a house and got stuck in the garage for a couple of days and had to eat dog food? Then of course we can all go back to the lady spilling hot coffee on herself....people are stupid and sue happy. Guess that's why we don't have real pools with diving boards anymore...I really miss those days.


----------



## tohunt4me

Bart McCoy said:


> Once again, this is a slippery slope. So you telling me the vast majority of Uber drivers will have no problem with uber deactivating And sending the police to your house because a pax makes a report? Mind you Uber is temporarily "firing" you without even attempting to hear your side of the story. Do you REALLY think that will fly over well with drivers if that's Uber's policy? REALLY? Pax already have too much power by being able to rate you, now you apparently okay with them being able to deactivate you instantly if you don't kiss their ass during the ride?????????????????
> 
> And its definitely no guarantee. You think police anywhere rush out to a sideswipe report where NO ONE WAS INJURED? Police aren't superheroes so don't act like a phone call to them would save the day.The only way police could have prevented him would be if they came out and arrested him. What if they arrest him but pax as lying? What if they found no damage to his car? so much would have to fall into place for police to arrest him. Being arrested is the only way that he could be stopped from getting into his car and killing people while off the clock for Uber


Put a switch in their cars and shut the cars off on customer heresay.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

naplestom75 said:


> They weren't. What I am getting at is that they MAY prove is that he was logged-on at the time the shooting ocurred, which still makes you partially liable, that's just how it works with being liable for subcontractors, ...


yeah, but Uber Drivers are NOT _SUB_-contractors. We are _INDEPENDENT_ contractors - different animal. Depending on their contracts, subs are liable to the employer and/or master contractor for carrying out work 'to spec' (ie: the employer has control). In our situation as independent contractors, we (supposedly) retain all control over what work we accept and how, when and where it is performed.


----------



## tohunt4me

Going watch "TAXI DRIVER"and Listen to Jim Morrison,"Riders of the Storm"---"Theres a killer on the road,his brain is squirming like a toad" . . . . .


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

tohunt4me said:


> Put a switch in their cars and shut the cars off on customer heresay.


If it weren't such a very sad situation, I'd be LMAO.


----------



## Coachman

Just as a sanity check, I went over to my political board which has a 3-page thread on the Michigan shooting spree. In that entire thread there were exactly two mentions of Uber. And these were just "Oh by the way, the guy's an Uber driver."

There's no story here.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

TwoFiddyMile said:


> If he had been on break from his insurance job I.E. on shift, it would be on their shoulders (the insurance company which employs him).


You said it: "...the insurance company which EMPLOYS him."


> 1000 years of British based common law states the onus is on the company he was working for at the time.


He wasn't working FOR Uber at the time. *He may or may not have been 'on-app' (ie: using the services of Uber that he pays for) at the time*.


----------



## AllenChicago

Coachman said:


> Just as a sanity check, I went over to my political board which has a 3-page thread on the Michigan shooting spree. In that entire thread there were exactly two mentions of Uber. And these were just "Oh by the way, the guy's an Uber driver."
> 
> There's no story here.


If UBER rides don't decrease in number today, you're right. I would say that it's important only to us.. and not for very long at that. This thread will slow to a crawl, stop, and be replaced by matters of more immediate and personal concerns.


----------



## docswife

scrurbscrud said:


> Holy Crap. Can Uber have any worse PR than that?! Uber driver runs amok and randomly kills 8 pax!
> 
> Almost unreal. But, we have observed here for quite some time, the difficulties drivers face. Financial pressure and general hopelessness, even when working like a slave to get ahead, can and does break people. Particularly if they are weak minded to begin with.
> 
> And what better example than Mich. where Uber has slashed driver sustainability rates to absurdity negative.


Couldn't have stated it any better. So very true.


----------



## rtaatl

Michael - Cleveland said:


> yeah, but Uber Drivers are NOT sub-contractors. They are INDEPENDENT contractors - different animal. Depending on their contracts, subs are liable to the employer and/or master contractor for carrying out work 'to spec' (ie: the employer has control). In our situation as independent contractors, we (supposedly) retain all control over what work we accept and how, when and where it is performed.


Yet (in most cities) UberX drivers have no independent commercial insurance or licensure outside of what Uber allows them to do. Also to keep driving all drivers had to agree to the new drivers addendum (contract) or have no access to the platform. As well as given the rate cuts drivers have no control over fare structure or terms. I'm sure it's not going to be hard to tear through Uber's weak classifications. They call people anything they want in their minds, but that doesn't make it so. Just my opinion.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

Coachman said:


> Just as a sanity check, I went over to my political board which has a 3-page thread on the Michigan shooting spree. In that entire thread there were exactly two mentions of Uber. And these were just "Oh by the way, the guy's an Uber driver."
> 
> There's no story here.


yeah... in MI this a gun control and gun control background check issue.
But it is entirely reasonable and to be expected that we here are talking about the Uber connection.


----------



## AllenChicago

docswife said:


> Couldn't have stated it any better. So very true.


Indeed! There's a thread in the forum describing how UBER has slashed Michigan rates to 30 cents minute / 30 cents a mile, with a minimum fare of just $1.75.


----------



## tohunt4me

AllenChicago said:


> If UBER rides don't decrease in number today, you're right. I would say that it's important only to us.. and not for very long at that. This thread will slow to a crawl, stop, and be replaced by matters of more immediate and personal concerns.


This "seat stain"on Uber wont affect ridership at all !
No matter how much the cabbies hope and pray.
I did have a rider ask me yesterday if i owned a gun . . .


----------



## Ziggy

AllenChicago said:


> Indeed! There's a thread in the forum describing how UBER has slashed Michigan rates to 30 cents minute / 30 cents a mile, with a minimum fare of just $1.75.


Actually, only Detroit rates were slashed to 30¢/mi. The city where this happened has 75¢/mi rates ... not great; but better than the 30¢ in Detroit


----------



## Uberelitescv1

Timmmmeh!!!


----------



## Uberelitescv1

Man you guys are so lucky to carry guns ... If we had the same laws as the US I would pull a gun on any mfker that needed it. Go all "get on the ground beech" on them. Steal their wallets then bounce like a bowss player.

Life is so much more cooler in my head ...


----------



## Feisal Mo

Uber should be run like Lyft. One interview by a Lyft Mentor and a real background check.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Michael - Cleveland said:


> yeah, but Uber Drivers are NOT sub-contractors. They are INDEPENDENT contractors - different animal. Depending on their contracts, subs are liable to the employer and/or master contractor for carrying out work 'to spec' (ie: the employer has control). In our situation as independent contractors, we (supposedly) retain all control over what work we accept and how, when and where it is performed.


Uber claims UberX drivers are ICs. Under law, UberX drivers are likely employees. Nothing has been detrmined yet.


----------



## Darrell Green Fan

Actionjax said:


> Funny how people on this forum will grasp at straws to negatively slam Uber. Fact is Uber is unrelated to the shootings and in no way was Uber negligent. If later there was something to sat that this individual had charges during a background check and was passed through Uber I would get this as a separate story.
> 
> But as it sits putting Uber on this story is to sell the story as Uber is a headline grabber. Mass shootings don't stand out in the US anymore. But Uber in the headline it stands out to the public. The journalists who are running a story with the link to Uber have no journalistic integrity in my opinion. And if I was working at Uber i would look at a slander suit.
> 
> They are completely unrelated events and not even worth the discussion.


I see it both ways. Yes he passed the background check, a check we are now learning is pretty flawed. And yes a bus driver could have done the same thing.

But Uber remains the headline because he was not only open for business as an Uber driver he was taking fares between killing people. So yeah the headlines screaming Uber driver apply because he was an active Uber driver when the murders took place. Same thing would have applied had he been delivering pizza for Dominoes in between killings.

As for it being undeserved bad PR again they have culpability by not having anyone available for the passenger to contact immediately. Uber could have then called the police and notified them of his exact location.


----------



## Uberme4450

Deactivate no notice, Business venture gone. Deactivate Him Mr Uber, Yes Sir but what about his family. Send him a Uber sticker.​


----------



## Uberme4450

I and out burger 13.75
Starbucks 11.50 
Jack In The Box $8.75
Uber $4 to $7 hourly Top Drivers 26 hours 42 riders 4.89 rating 98% 
Acceptance / car 2015 Electric Slot Car / Top driver Age 64 Retired
Location Culver City Office Front Porch of house


----------



## CIncinnatiDriver

Bart McCoy said:


> Yeah, and another pax gave him 5 stars during that same "did uber rides inbetween shootings"... when is a driver ever supervised?


Communication goes both ways. If they had a customer service phone number listed in the app, the passenger could call in and say hey I just got a ride from a guy and he's erratic and I think there's a problem. Same with the driver, he could call in if something terrible seems to be possibly going on.


----------



## CIncinnatiDriver

uber strike said:


> my friend uber driver was expressing suicide after rate cuts. he had quit his job to drive for uber not expecting these cheap rates. i just hope he doesn't go on a rampage. this is the beginning of stressed drivers going mad....


You are morally bound to call emergency psych to let them know.

Therapists and psychologists are LEGALLY bound to do so.

Call. (Call your local emergency room. They'll connect you )


----------



## tohunt4me

CIncinnatiDriver said:


> You are morally bound to call emergency psych to let them know.
> 
> Therapists and psychologists are LEGALLY bound to do so.
> 
> Call. (Call your local emergency room. They'll connect you )


Uber insurance will cover his medical costs . . .


----------



## DriverX

Bart McCoy said:


> So let me get this straight. If one of your drivers sideswiped someone, you'll fire them on the spot I guess. And then somehow because you fired them, they wouldn't be able to drive their own car anyway and kill someone else after this? Really? How does taking quick action on a customer report stop someone from driving their own car and committing a crime that had nothing to do with their job?
> 
> Background checks and drug checks. Nice. However the guy who killed people had a clean criminal history so......


Uber got multiple reports from concerned pax on the psycho driver. They could have deactivated him immediately and ended the relationship but they did not which only increases their culpability. He was clearly logged on driving around under Uber insurance and shooting people. Ubers screwed regardless in civil court but this latest revelation that there were reports made to Uber about the guy and they did not take steps to deactivate him and report his last known location to the police could very well create CRIMINAL CHARGES. lol the plot thickens. meanwhile uber eliminated San Diego guarantees. guess I'll be switching to lyft.

Your beating a dead pax at this point. You have lost the argument admit defeat or go on a gun rampage.


----------



## Sacto Burbs

forqalso said:


> "profession"


Sandy Hook - the gun owner was a volunteer at the school, a gun enthusiast, who was shot and killed by the shooter, her son.

At home he could have used a knife. At the school those people are dead because of a semi-automatic gun. Period.

#enough


----------



## DriverX

Darrell Green Fan said:


> Every report starts by describing the shooter as an Uber driver. This is devastating PR to a company who is already in trouble. I really do not understand the position that Uber is not responsible in any way. Again there was a report of terribly dangerous erratic behavior being reported to Uber. But because of their system nothing was done. As the limo company owner pointed out there should be a way to contact a live body at Uber who could have taken steps to locate and get this guy off the road.
> 
> Not enough attention is being paid to the report that the 911 operator appeared uninterested in trying to get this guy. That needs serious investigation. Back to Uber they could have called 911 again. They would have no doubt gotten a different 911 operator who gave a damn who could have put out an alert for a very dangerous driver. With his drivng he was certainly a huge risk to the public long before the shooting started. And obviously since it is being reported that his app was on they could have helped locate him


In the very least Uber was responsible for deactivating this guy as soon as they got a report about the hit and run, which they did not. This exposes Uber's complete lack of will to take proper measures to insure rider's safety. Uber can instantly deactivate a driver and can report that drivers last known location to police if they want to. The FACT is that they have NO interest in doing this which exposes their negligence. The victims families are looking at a HUGE settlement.


----------



## Actionjax

DriverX said:


> Uber got multiple reports from concerned pax on the psycho driver. They could have deactivated him immediately and ended the relationship but they did not which only increases their culpability. He was clearly logged on driving around under Uber insurance and shooting people. Ubers screwed regardless in civil court but this latest revelation that there were reports made to Uber about the guy and they did not take steps to deactivate him and report his last known location to the police could very well create CRIMINAL CHARGES. lol the plot thickens. meanwhile uber eliminated San Diego guarantees. guess I'll be switching to lyft.
> 
> Your beating a dead pax at this point. You have lost the argument admit defeat or go on a gun rampage.


Funny you mention that. You don't know that Uber didn't deactivate him or reported it to police. This all happened in 24 hours. While I agree that responses could have been faster by Uber, how many drivers get this kind of email to Uber.

"My Driver was driving very bad and almost killed us."

As a CSR would you do one of the following.

1) Deactivate the driver immediately?
2) Investigate further with both driver and passenger to find out the story?

I can say I am sure that Uber receives thousands of complaints a day. And deactivation is done after it is investigates. No one sent an email to Uber to say my driver has a gun and is shooting people.

We would all go ballistic if a driver here got deactivated because of a wrongful comment made by a passenger. But the moment Uber does what their due diligence here we want to point the finger that this is Uber's fault.

Last i checked no passengers were hurt here, and that a madman may have only had one report against him. From a customer complaint that had yet to be substantiated. The police didn't report it to Uber till after the arrest from the way it reads.

Sorry but I can't hold Uber at all liable. It's a situation that we can all look back on and say things could have been done better but that's after the fact. and with the short amount of time no one could do anything.

What happened was going to happen.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Uber claims UberX drivers are ICs. Under law, UberX drivers are likely employees. Nothing has been detrmined yet.


Uber drivers have not been determined to be employees, under the law, anywhere in the US - with the sole exception of individual labor cases. The first federal worker misclassification suit goes to trial in June.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

Darrell Green Fan said:


> Yes he passed the background check, a check we are now learning is pretty flawed.


The guy had no criminal records history. Medical records are private and cannot be accessed under a PEER (pre-employment) background check. Until companies engage the services of psychics, there is no way to screen out everyone who might do something evil in the future.


----------



## driveLA

Bart McCoy said:


> *So its being reported the killer was an insurance adjust who wasnt happy with his job*.
> There's no mention of him being unhappy with his Uber job
> 
> But people's hate for Uber will make his Uber job that he was happy with,trump the main mon-fri job that he was unhappy with.
> 
> sad, just sad,smg


im sure uber paid for that story

its called deflection


----------



## Just_in

Actionjax said:


> Funny you mention that. You don't know that Uber didn't deactivate him or reported it to police. This all happened in 24 hours. While I agree that responses could have been faster by Uber, how many drivers get this kind of email to Uber.
> 
> "My Driver was driving very bad and almost killed us."
> 
> As a CSR would you do one of the following.
> 
> 1) Deactivate the driver immediately?
> 2) Investigate further with both driver and passenger to find out the story?
> 
> I can say I am sure that Uber receives thousands of complaints a day. And deactivation is done after it is investigates. No one sent an email to Uber to say my driver has a gun and is shooting people.
> 
> We would all go ballistic if a driver here got deactivated because of a wrongful comment made by a passenger. But the moment Uber does what their due diligence here we want to point the finger that this is Uber's fault.
> 
> Last i checked no passengers were hurt here, and that a madman may have only had one report against him. From a customer complaint that had yet to be substantiated. The police didn't report it to Uber till after the arrest from the way it reads.
> 
> Sorry but I can't hold Uber at all liable. It's a situation that we can all look back on and say things could have been done better but that's after the fact. and with the short amount of time no one could do anything.
> 
> What happened was going to happen.


 "My Driver was driving very bad and almost killed us."

I read that quite often on twitter. My Uber driver smells like weed...My Uber Driver is Drunk...My Uber Driver is driving the wrong way down a one way street..

Those events are going to happen and apparently still happen...

And the worst so far did happen.

In hindsight what your actually saying is everything that's wrong with Uber. It's like the boy who cried wolf scenario.


----------



## observer

Just heard on the radio (KFI of course) that the family of the 14 year old girl was discussing donating her organs; because they thought she was brain dead, when she squeezed her moms hand.

Hope she gets better!


----------



## Uber Kraus

Just_in said:


> "My Driver was driving very bad and almost killed us."
> 
> I read that quite often on twitter. My Uber driver smells like weed...My Uber Driver is Drunk...My Uber Driver is driving the wrong way down a one way street..
> 
> Those events are going to happen and apparently still happen...
> 
> And the worst so far did happen.
> 
> In hindsight what your actually saying is everything that's wrong with Uber. It's like the boy who cried wolf scenario.


"smells like weed...".

I drove a guy to DIA yesterday. As we are arriving he says, "Can you get rid of this for me?". A half smoked bowl. Well, that does indeed smell like ganja and there were a couple time I could smell it in the car later that day but I was sober until I got home for the night.


----------



## Sacto Burbs

Bart McCoy said:


> Well if you read any of my posts on the forum, you clearly know I dont work for Uber, and have always decried Uber's low rates,smh
> 
> Like I said, you have to put your hate for Uber aside and look at what actually happened. Most people commenting are biased against Uber, which is understandable, but obviously that clouds your judgement.
> 
> And yes we have to see how this plays out, but thanks to the media, reading the headlines one would think an uber driver was picking up passengers and killing them. No, he just happened to work for Uber. He "spared" all his Uber pax, which doesnt make any sense, since if he was outrage at Uber, it would seem that the people he picked up would be the first to die. None did.
> 
> Still waiting on ANYONE to tell me how Uber is at fault for this shooting. You cant point at the hiring process because he had no prior criminal history. So what else will yall reach for?
> 
> I'll wait..................


The little girl run over by an Uber driver in SF had his App ON not matched

Uber settled with the girl's family.

It is not court precedent, but Uber paid.


----------



## Altima ATL

SanPedroLover said:


> Uber has *NOTHING* to do with this. It was this guy's mental state/psyche that caused this.
> 
> He could have been working at a local gas station...same thing would have probably happened.


Unless of course it could be shown that you had something to do with causing 'this guys mental state', then some liability could be proven to be yours.


----------



## Feisal Mo

*So its being reported the killer was an insurance adjust who wasnt happy with his job*.


driveLA said:


> im sure uber paid for that story
> its called deflection


LOL yep....We will see few more stories in the next couple of days paid by uber...like "he was angry with his wife" -- "some domestic problem, maybe she was leaving him (maybe his odd behavior), it was his seventh anniversary" ...


----------



## Uber Kraus

Altima ATL said:


> Unless of course it could be shown that you had something to do with causing 'this guys mental state', then some liability could be proven to be yours.


Ugh.... At what point are we simply responsible for ourselves and the choices we make?

Here's an analogy based on your example:

I am driving up I-25. I accidentally cut off another driver while changing lanes. The driver, not realizing it was a mistake becomes furious. He starts swerving all over the road, beeping his horn and ultimately crashes into another car. Am I responsible for his actions because I "had something to do with causing this guys mental state"?


----------



## Altima ATL

Uber Kraus said:


> Ugh.... At what point are we simply responsible for ourselves and the choices we make?
> 
> Here's an analogy based on your example:
> 
> I am driving up I-25. I accidentally cut off another driver while changing lanes. The driver, not realizing it was a mistake becomes furious. He starts swerving all over the road, beeping his horn and ultimately crashes into another car. Am I responsible for his actions because I "had something to do with causing this guys mental state"?


And you keep cutting off other drivers because 'you can' and is your way of driving - then yes: you had something to do with his mental state, even though hundreds of others you cut off are still driving normally.

If you had only ever cut off the one driver, and had never done anything else negative to other drivers on the road - then is a good analogy. But the analogy should put in that you are a very inconsiderate driver to all others on the road.


----------



## Actionjax

Altima ATL said:


> Unless of course it could be shown that you had something to do with causing 'this guys mental state', then some liability could be proven to be yours.


Good luck with that. If it was that easy I'm turning you all in on this board. Something is bound to stick.

Hey come to think of it wonder if he had posts on this board.


----------



## Sacto Burbs

Bart McCoy said:


> If people really think Uber is to blame, give me one thing Uber could have done to stop him from killing people?????????????????????


On boarding questions.

Do you have a concealed carry permit?
Do you have access to any firearms?


----------



## Uber Kraus

Altima ATL said:


> And you keep cutting off other drivers because 'you can' and is your way of driving - then yes: you had something to do with his mental state, even though hundreds of others you cut off are still driving normally.
> 
> If you had only ever cut off the one driver, and had never done anything else negative to other drivers on the road - then is a good analogy. But the analogy should put in that you are a very inconsiderate driver to all others on the road.


Non sequitur. Invalid argument. Unable to process response. System will shut down in 5, 4, 3, ....


----------



## Uber Kraus

Sacto Burbs said:


> On boarding questions.
> 
> Do you have a concealed carry permit?
> Do you have access to any firearms?


Feeding the trolls today Sacto?


----------



## Feisal Mo

Actionjax said:


> Funny you mention that. You don't know that Uber didn't deactivate him or reported it to police. This all happened in 24 hours. While I agree that responses could have been faster by Uber, how many drivers get this kind of email to Uber.
> 
> "My Driver was driving very bad and almost killed us."
> 
> As a CSR would you do one of the following.
> 
> 1) Deactivate the driver immediately?
> 2) Investigate further with both driver and passenger to find out the story?
> 
> I can say I am sure that Uber receives thousands of complaints a day. And deactivation is done after it is investigates. No one sent an email to Uber to say my driver has a gun and is shooting people.
> 
> We would all go ballistic if a driver here got deactivated because of a wrongful comment made by a passenger. But the moment Uber does what their due diligence here we want to point the finger that this is Uber's fault.
> 
> Last i checked no passengers were hurt here, and that a madman may have only had one report against him. From a customer complaint that had yet to be substantiated. The police didn't report it to Uber till after the arrest from the way it reads.
> 
> Sorry but I can't hold Uber at all liable. It's a situation that we can all look back on and say things could have been done better but that's after the fact. and with the short amount of time no one could do anything.
> 
> What happened was going to happen.


As a CSR I would call someone in the USA to call 911 on the driver since they outsourced their customer service to the Philippines...
Within the UBER Rider app, there's a title called "Critical safety response line" tells users to call 911 in case of an emergency. Their riders and local government agencies will get a better insight on who UBER really is, how much their drivers really make, maybe actually have a phone # someone can actually call to reach a live person at UBER. But that might cut into UBER profit margin and UBER may not like it. Oh wait, maybe UBER can cut their rates again so that they can hire realtime people to answer the phone.


----------



## Actionjax

Feisal Mo said:


> As a CSR I would call someone in the USA to call 911 on the driver since they outsourced their customer service to the Philippines...
> Within the UBER Rider app, there's a title called "Critical safety response line" tells users to call 911 in case of an emergency. Their riders and local government agencies will get a better insight on who UBER really is, how much their drivers really make, maybe actually have a phone # someone can actually call to reach a live person at UBER. But that might cut into UBER profit margin and UBER may not like it. Oh wait, maybe UBER can cut their rates again so that they can hire realtime people to answer the phone.


Not sure what that has to do with what I just said. How can a CSR determine a fake complaint from a legitimate one. Don't think there was a complaint that said the driver was driving around shooting people. Lots of drivers get emails or comments about erratic driving behavior. They don't deactivate right away for that. The person getting the email can't determine the truth of a email of that nature.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Bart McCoy said:


> So one of the pax that got a ride during the shooting rampage, rated the shooter 5 stars.


Hey Bart.....did you read what you wrote? Know what that means?.....Means he was working for UBER while killing people.....REACH THAT


----------



## Sacto Burbs

Jack Pavlov said:


> Short of an investigation, you can't know the facts of that situation.


When I rent a car it knows my speed. It is attached to the car monitoring system. Uber need a to require that device is on if the app is on.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Michael - Cleveland said:


> Uber drivers have not been determined to be employees, under the law, anywhere in the US - with the sole exception of individual labor cases. The first federal worker misclassification suit goes to trial in June.


Didn't my post say "nothing has been determined yet"? The converse to your statement is also true... Uber drivers have not been determined to be IC's under the law. So you can stop citing law about IC's until that determination is made.

Interesting in the Cali lawsuit, the drivers were declared presumptive employees. Basically, the ball is in Uber's court to prove the driver's are not employees.


----------



## Feisal Mo

Actionjax said:


> Not sure what that has to do with what I just said. How can a CSR determine a fake complaint from a legitimate one. Don't think there was a complaint that said the driver was driving around shooting people. Lots of drivers get emails or comments about erratic driving behavior. They don't deactivate right away for that. The person getting the email can't determine the truth of a email of that nature.


Michigan news has a short video of a passenger who was riding with this shooter. This rider pleaded with driver to stop. When the rider jumped out, he called 911 and then he tried to contact UBER by EMAIL? Don't you think that warrants an emergency. My point is UBER has to get a real time phone number if people have to get a hold of them. But then again that's how UBER saves $$$. They have poor customer/driver service relationships. However, with this bad PR uber right now is probably working on having a realtime phone number if people have to get hold of them.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

driveLA said:


> im sure uber paid for that story its called deflection


No. But what the post above neglected to mention was the article said he'd hadn't worked for Progressive in 5 years.


----------



## J W

Guy was cooc'd obviously not bc of uber


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> The converse to your statement is also true... Uber drivers have not been determined to be IC's under the law.


That's not how the law works.
It is up to me as an employer to determine the classification of my workers - under the law.* 
IRS publishes 'guidelines' for how to determine the classification - but can only offer guidance - an opinion.*
It is up to the Dept of Labor or IRS or the worker to challenge the classification I chose, if they believe it's wrong.

An employer can file an SS-8 Form with the IRS to request clarification, but even their determination isn't binding. Only a court can order the change of classification as declared by the employer. I have filed at least a dozen SS-8's since 1999... and have had replies (which usually take 6 months to get) that contradict each other.


----------



## naplestom75

Uber is already setting-up it's call center as we have this discussion.


----------



## J W

He knew he was going to be fired so he went postal


ChinatownJake said:


> The Facebook post from the fiancee of Uber passenger Matt is unreal. She writes that:
> 
> 1) After sideswiping the car, driver refused Matt's request to stop and let him out.
> 2) Sped up to 80 mph on West Main Hill, "swerving in and out of oncoming traffic."
> 3) When the car finally slowed down, Pax bailed.
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/701428731517214720
> That is a nightmare ride right there.


----------



## Archie8616

**New** 
Video of his arraignment. No remorse, nothing except for a sigh...

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/jason-brian-dalton-suspected-kalamazoo-shooter-faces-justice


----------



## Bart McCoy

Michael - Cleveland said:


> I'd think that the pax have no (civil) claim, but a prosecutor could certainly present a case to a grand jury for criminal negligence. .


As pertaining to the SHOOTINGS, and not the scary ride, exactly what was Uber negligent of?



DriverX said:


> Uber got multiple reports from concerned pax on the psycho driver. They could have deactivated him immediately and ended the relationship but they did not which only increases their culpability. He was clearly logged on driving around under Uber insurance and shooting people. .


Once again, you are talking about an incident where the pax in his car wasnt even hurt. You want Uber to pay millions of dollars just for a scary ride? Please, but I know you wont, explain how deactivating the guy immediately(without even getting the drivers side of the story) would have prevented the guy from going out in his own car and shooting people? If deativation couldnt stop it, then Uber isn't responsible, and they werent negligent in the SHOOTINGS. You may have a case in beging negligent in the scary ride, smh. But it now way could Uber reasonably forsee this guy was about to go shoot 6 people



DriverX said:


> In the very least Uber was responsible for deactivating this guy as soon as they got a report about the hit and run, which they did not. This exposes Uber's complete lack of will to take proper measures to insure rider's safety. Uber can instantly deactivate a driver and can report that drivers last known location to police if they want to. The FACT is that they have NO interest in doing this which exposes their negligence. The victims families are looking at a HUGE settlement.


All the drivers would be in a huge uproar if Uber would now deactivate drivers on a report from a pax. Uber has no idea if its any truth in the matter if its not coming from law enforcement, which they never received. Victims get huge settlement? why? They didn't order an Uber. They werent in an uber. You don't know if his app was on when he pulled the trigger unless you were riding shotgun. My my , how all yall claim to know the facts



Sacto Burbs said:


> On boarding questions.
> 
> Do you have a concealed carry permit?
> Do you have access to any firearms?


Yes and yes, but what does that have to do with the price of tea in China?



Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> Hey Bart.....did you read what you wrote? Know what that means?.....Means he was working for UBER while killing people.....REACH THAT


you are assuming he had the app on the whole time, smh. Clearly he could have app off. shoot people. turn app on enough to give one ride.turn app off. WAIT an hour(app off), then kill again (with app still off). Between does nto automatically mean app is on and he's working the whole time. you're just reaching to try to boost your viewpoint


----------



## Bart McCoy

Feisal Mo said:


> Michigan news has a short video of a passenger who was riding with this shooter. This rider pleaded with driver to stop. When the rider jumped out, he called 911 and then he tried to contact UBER by EMAIL? Don't you think that warrants an emergency. My point is UBER has to get a real time phone number if people have to get a hold of them. But then again that's how UBER saves $$$. They have poor customer/driver service relationships. However, with this bad PR uber right now is probably working on having a realtime phone number if people have to get hold of them.


yes, uber should get a telephone number
however, many companies work via email only
more importantly, this having a working phone number only helps pax that have taken rides in an uber

The people who were shot, never did. Meaning a working phone number does not save the lives of the victims


----------



## Sacto Burbs

MattStone said:


> Yup I'm inept and stupid with one Engineering Degree in Marine Technology and working on my Masters in Healthcare Administration which is why I'm Ubering to focus on my studies. I was simply stating no one is truly responsible except for the person who committed the act himself. Outside of that there could have been a few things done by a few people that may have stopped him sooner but that's the past and there is no way to know for sure. Hope you are enjoying your popcorn.


Follow the money. Who put a gun in his hand that is a weapon of mass destruction? And made money doing it? Look around and then look up and then look in the mirror, and then look at all those posters who encourage drivers to keep a gun their car, and then Claim that it would be impossible for them ever be in a mental state where they don't look at that gun and think Im gonna use that weapon.

#enough


----------



## driveLA

Bart McCoy said:


> you are assuming he had the app on the whole time, smh. Clearly he could have app off. shoot people. turn app on enough to give one ride.turn app off. WAIT an hour(app off), then kill again (with app still off). Between does nto automatically mean app is on and he's working the whole time. you're just reaching to try to boost your viewpoint


who cares if the app was on or off

he's an uber driver murdering people while ubering, in between ubering, who cares.

a lot of people are making assumptions that its because uber but you are making assumptions (that its not because uber) as well.

nobody know anything

but its ridiculous how hard you're trying to protect a shitty company that has created a toxic environment


----------



## uber fool

Deactivation warning en route


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bart McCoy said:


> As pertaining to the SHOOTINGS, and not the scary ride, exactly what was Uber negligent of?
> 
> Once again, you are talking about an incident where the pax in his car wasnt even hurt. You want Uber to pay millions of dollars just for a scary ride? Please, but I know you wont, explain how deactivating the guy immediately(without even getting the drivers side of the story) would have prevented the guy from going out in his own car and shooting people? If deativation couldnt stop it, then Uber isn't responsible, and they werent negligent in the SHOOTINGS. You may have a case in beging negligent in the scary ride, smh. But it now way could Uber reasonably forsee this guy was about to go shoot 6 people
> 
> All the drivers would be in a huge uproar if Uber would now deactivate drivers on a report from a pax. Uber has no idea if its any truth in the matter if its not coming from law enforcement, which they never received. Victims get huge settlement? why? They didn't order an Uber. They werent in an uber. You don't know if his app was on when he pulled the trigger unless you were riding shotgun. My my , how all yall claim to know the facts
> 
> Yes and yes, but what does that have to do with the price of tea in China?
> 
> you are assuming he had the app on the whole time, smh. Clearly he could have app off. shoot people. turn app on enough to give one ride.turn app off. WAIT an hour(app off), then kill again (with app still off). Between does nto automatically mean app is on and he's working the whole time. you're just reaching to try to boost your viewpoint


You have your work cut out for you today! I hope they are paying you better than they pay their drivers!


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

Bart McCoy said:


> As pertaining to the SHOOTINGS, and not the scary ride, exactly what was Uber negligent of?


Come on - it's already been stated: lots of IFs and COULDs nad MAYs - but Uber *_may_* have been negligent in not providing the pax the means to report a driver who was endangering the riders and the public to a live person - or law enforcement.

By failing to do so, a prosecutor *_could_* chose to pursue contributory negligence charges because_ if_ they did have a system in place - and _if _it is reasonable to expect that they _should_ have had a system in place, then their inaction of reporting the driver to authorities, *_could_* be deemed to have contributed the inability of law enforcement to identify and apprehend the driver sooner and preventing loss of life.

Hey - I didn't say it was LIKELY!


----------



## Bart McCoy

driveLA said:


> who cares if the app was on or off
> 
> he's an uber driver murdering people while ubering, in between ubering, who cares.
> 
> a lot of people are making assumptions that its because uber but you are making assumptions (that its not because uber) as well.
> 
> nobody know anything
> 
> but its ridiculous how hard you're trying to protect a shitty company that has created a toxic environment


I don't disagree that Uber is a horrible company. But what type of company Uber is has nothing to do with the shooting. You cant think clearly because of how you feel about Uber, I can. I simply look at the incident from an unbiased view. Theres nothing Uber could have done that day to stop that crazy man from shooting people

Just because somebody drives for Uber, you can't blame uber for everything that individual does. Nobody finds it ironic that they blame Uber for it, but the guy didn't harm any Uber passenger? when he clearly had the chance? doesn't make any sense.

My whole problem in this topic is everybody and their momma is blaming uber. Nobody is blaming the guy that pulled the trigger, smh


----------



## Bart McCoy

Michael - Cleveland said:


> Come on - it's already been stated: lots of IFs and COULDs nad MAYs - but Uber *_may_* have been negligent in not providing the pax the means to report a driver who was endangering the riders and the public to a live person - or law enforcement.
> 
> By failing to do so, a prosecutor *_could_* chose to pursue contributory negligence charges because_ if_ they did have a system in place - and _if _it is reasonable to expect that they _should_ have had a system in place, then their inaction of reporting the driver to authorities, *_could_* be deemed to have contributed the inability of law enforcement to identify and apprehend the driver sooner and preventing loss of life.
> 
> Hey - I didn't say it was LIKELY!


Uber provides a way. via email. Is Uber breaking some type of law by not providing a phone number? if not, they not negligent! What do you think would work fast to stop an alleged sideswiper: 1) call Uber 2) call police????? You really think police are running out to reports of wild driving? with no injuries to report??? Again, there would be a very high chance of Uber being held legally liable IF and Only if he hurt and kill a pax that was in his car. We all know the people that died had nothing to do with Uber.

Your 2nd paragraph is a looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong reach. Main thing is its assumed anytime a pax complain to uber they are telling the truth. You expect Uber to investigate,deactivate, and I guess arrest that guy, in 5min??????

How you watched civil cases? Would a reasonable person or company know or expect that the driver would go on to shoot/kill other people? nobody could forseen that, so why place that burden on Uber? Are you saying 85% of people who sideswipe cars go on to shooting people right after so Uber should have known this death was comign????? There's simply NOTHING Uber could have done to stop this guy from gettin g in his car WITHOUT PAX and riding around shooting people. Yall expect Uber to be some type of savior here, they aren't superheros


----------



## Feisal Mo

naplestom75 said:


> Uber is already setting-up it's call center as we have this discussion.


LOL...


----------



## Just_in

driveLA said:


> who cares if the app was on or off
> 
> he's an uber driver murdering people while ubering, in between ubering, who cares.
> 
> a lot of people are making assumptions that its because uber but you are making assumptions (that its not because uber) as well.
> 
> nobody know anything
> 
> but its ridiculous how hard you're trying to protect a shitty company that has created a toxic environment


Ain't that right.


----------



## uber fool

He got this message from uber
Killing to many passenger
*Killing passengers provides a bad experience for both riders and drivers. Riders think a car is coming for them only to find out its a deranged gunman.*


Killing passengers may lead to deactivation
Negatively impacts your earnings. You earn less because there are less passengers
Killing also hurts the passenger. The next request goes to a driver that will not kill passengers.
Frustrating experience for all riders and drivers on the platform
IMPORTANCE OF NOT KILLING PASSENGERS


----------



## Sacto Burbs

Bart McCoy said:


> Exactly, Uber wasnt negligent in the background check. He had a clean history. You can't say Uber was negligent in deactivating him after a sideswipe because he didn't harm any pax and deactivating him still wouldn't have stopped or prevented him from using his own car to shoot out of and kill people


Talk him down. If they know his attitude to guns and have a bad driving report, they should of tried called him to determine his mental state.

Facts Uber had

New driver
Bad ratings
Knowing that this alone creates a neurotic mental state
Unsafe driving report.

My suggestion of finding out his attitude to guns would provide the red flag that May have stopped the shootings.

Call him. Try and determine his mental state. He thinks lethal weapons that Uber bans are neat. Talk to him.

Would it have worked? Who knows. But they didn't even try.


----------



## Uber Lyft Dude

Alleged shooter Jason Dalton Uber driver saw his Pax Earnings made him cracked. I would not be surprised if we see more Uber drivers go crazy with these price drops trying to pay for their cars and bills. He was a married with 2 kids. Clearly he cracked and felt he had nowhere to get help.


----------



## driveLA

Bart McCoy said:


> I don't disagree that Uber is a horrible company. But what type of company Uber is has nothing to do with the shooting. You cant think clearly because of how you feel about Uber, I can. I simply look at the incident from an unbiased view. Theres nothing Uber could have done that day to stop that crazy man from shooting people
> 
> Just because somebody drives for Uber, you can't blame uber for everything that individual does. Nobody finds it ironic that they blame Uber for it, but the guy didn't harm any Uber passenger? when he clearly had the chance? doesn't make any sense.
> 
> My whole problem in this topic is everybody and their momma is blaming uber. Nobody is blaming the guy that pulled the trigger, smh


How do you know that he wasn't upset by being swindled by uber though.

You are making assumptions to protect uber as well. You are pissing against the tide.

im not saying people shouldn't be responsible for themselves but at the end of the day the environment that Uber is creating is not helping the matter.

If Uber was a good company nobody would be making assumptions.


----------



## Uber Lyft Dude

Shooter must of been working those guarantee UBER hours.


----------



## Archie8616

I'm done with Uber. It did help me with getting my bills paid, but honestly, I'm going to just switch over to lyft. I have my first mentor meeting today. It's a small way to protest as just being one individual. I've read a few of the comments here, and it seems folks are getting heated over details that they have no idea as to what the real circumstances were or are now. No matter what your feeling or whatever, just remember that UBER in some way be it the driver or the app...there is a connection. 

And again...Lets keep in mind of those that lost their lives and the families affected....may they RIP....


----------



## DriverX

Bart McCoy said:


> yes, uber should get a telephone number
> however, many companies work via email only
> more importantly, this having a working phone number only helps pax that have taken rides in an uber
> 
> The people who were shot, never did. Meaning a working phone number does not save the lives of the victims


You can't escape this FACT:

Uber had a report from a pax about a dangerous driver. Uber continued sending this driver ride requests!

GAME OVER

Any lawyer will have a field day with this. It doesn't matter if the victims of the shooting were Uber pax or not. Uber was sending this driver requests despite being warned about his dangerous behavior.


----------



## Slavic Riga

Jack Pavlov said:


> Just because a thousand and one idiots think the same thing, doesn't make it true. Wars have been waged on this logic and it's devastating at it's core.
> 
> In my mind, low rates have absolutely no relation to my animosity with pax. If ANYTHING, there would be animosity towards Uber. It wasn't those Pax that locked in that rate for us, it was uber. At the end of the day, I logged on and chose to drive knowing the rates. That's my responsibility. A pax is only taking advantage of an opportunity extended by our company. DON'T DRIVE if you disagree with the rate. It's really quite simple.


Him & BartMcCoy. They definitely work for PR Company. Dead give away. A pax is only taking advantage of an opportunity extended by our company. Want to read the spin that will be put on this line now.



Bon Jovi said:


> Dude, I had worked for the fortune 50 company for over 15 years, and I can tell that your articulation level is very high. You are not the driver, you either work for PR firm of for Uber. See, you are not that smart after all, you are the King Troll. Of course uber is to blame.


Him & BartMcCoy. They definitely work for PR Company. Dead give away.  A pax is only taking advantage of an opportunity extended by our company. Want to read the spin that will be put on this line now.


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

Michael - Cleveland said:


> Your comments are applicable to employers and their customers. But passengers are not customers of Uber for transportation, they are the driver"s customer... as detailed in the rider and driver agreements and terms of use. Uber 'just' provides drivers with 'leads'. Remember? Uber is just a "Technology" company and acts as a 'third party payor'.


Says them.


----------



## Kalee

I'm thinking that Uber has always realized the stress put on the drivers and the possibility of a mental breakdown as they continue to ratchet up their relentless driver abuse. I'm guessing that may be why months ago, Uber attempted to make drivers believe that Uber has authority to dictate to we "independent contractors" are not allowed to carry firearms legally for our protection whilst driving our personal vehicles.

I would bet my last Uber 60 hour paycheck of $204 that ole Travis surrounds himself with well armed guards at all times.

Nice try Uber, but butt out.


----------



## LA Cabbie

SanPedroLover said:


> Uber has *NOTHING* to do with this. It was this guy's mental state/psyche that caused this.
> 
> He could have been working at a local gas station...same thing would have probably happened.


Perhaps he was on mood altering medication and knowingly or unknowingly abusing the meds and some situation caused his triggering mechanism (no pun intended) to fire?

1) a standard drug test issued to cab drivers would have returned a positive and this man would never be behind the wheel as a for hire driver.

2) I know from personal fact that some pax can push a driver over the edge. Almost happened to me once. I was fortunate that night club security whisked the punk away. I quit cabbing days later.

So what we have is a mentally unstable man working in an environment that exclusively served those who exasperated his psyche.

Both problems are uber's.

For those saying he could have done the same thing at a gas station; if you had heart issues, what environment would most likely cause s heart attack: folding clothes at the gap or digging trenches in the hot and humid heat?


----------



## Bart McCoy

DriverX said:


> You can't escape this FACT:
> 
> Uber had a report from a pax about a dangerous driver. Uber continued sending this driver ride requests!
> 
> GAME OVER
> 
> Any lawyer will have a field day with this. It doesn't matter if the victims of the shooting were Uber pax or not. Uber was sending this driver requests despite being warned about his dangerous behavior.


smh, what does that have to do with him shooting people while he didn't accept a request, didn't have a live request, didn't have a uber pax in the,didn't have the app on, wasnt working for uber????

uber gets reports all the time, I just can't believe you expect uber to deactivate drivers on the whim of a pax report. Just unbelievable man, smh

Again, yes uber may be liable for possibly sending him pings,when he could endanger people he picked up. But he didn't hurt or shoot anybody he picked up. he instead found other people, WITHOUT the help or use of uber's app, and randomly shot them. People who didn't order the app, people who didn't send the killer a ping request....

So ive already said, Uber maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay be liable for the scary ride. But they wont be paying millions for scaring a pax but not hurting them.

Uber is NOT liable for the "Uber" driver shooting people on his own time. Uber didn't do anything negligent in preventing him from shooting people, uber only MAYBE possibly did something negligent in allowing him to continue to pick up more passengers. But you can't sue for something that didn't happen (he didn't pick up more passengers and shoot , hurt, or harm any of them)


----------



## DriverX

Bart McCoy said:


> Uber provides a way. via email. Is Uber breaking some type of law by not providing a phone number? if not, they not negligent! What do you think would work fast to stop an alleged sideswiper: 1) call Uber 2) call police????? You really think police are running out to reports of wild driving? with no injuries to report??? Again, there would be a very high chance of Uber being held legally liable IF and Only if he hurt and kill a pax that was in his car. We all know the people that died had nothing to do with Uber.
> 
> Your 2nd paragraph is a looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong reach. Main thing is its assumed anytime a pax complain to uber they are telling the truth. You expect Uber to investigate,deactivate, and I guess arrest that guy, in 5min??????
> 
> How you watched civil cases? Would a reasonable person or company know or expect that the driver would go on to shoot/kill other people? nobody could forseen that, so why place that burden on Uber? Are you saying 85% of people who sideswipe cars go on to shooting people right after so Uber should have known this death was comign????? There's simply NOTHING Uber could have done to stop this guy from gettin g in his car WITHOUT PAX and riding around shooting people. Yall expect Uber to be some type of savior here, they aren't superheros


BS Uber insurance has to cover anyone injured by their drivers. If the driver caused an injury while logged in Uber will be held liable. I guarantee you that there isn't anything in the policy that says injury caused by bullets aren't covered. Any jury, especially in Kalamazoo, is going to find Uber liable. stop embarrassing yourself beating this dead pax. It's obvious you are an uber employee who has been assigned damage control.


----------



## observer

notfair said:


> One person interviewed said "they" regarding the shooters. The clown who allegedly did it is not saying a word today in court. Surely PAX would have smelled gun smoke in the car? Did you hear him speak? His voice was weird. Very high pitched like he was talking out of voice box. Why didn't he commit suicide? CNN just interviewed his alleged last PAX and they said they are happy to take Uber again. Either this clown is 100% screwed-up or he had help. Are his boyfriends in prison? Did he want to go to jail? A registered car in a small town especially an odd HHR is very easy to find. I think this clown wants to be in prison.


Report on radio just now says he may have used two cars.


----------



## Bart McCoy

LA Cabbie said:


> 1) a standard drug test issued to cab drivers would have returned a positive and this man would never be behind the wheel as a for hire driver.
> 
> 2) I know from personal fact that some pax can push a driver over the edge. Almost happened to me once. I was fortunate that night club security whisked the punk away. I quit cabbing days later.
> 
> So what we have is a mentally unstable man working in an environment that exclusively served those who exasperated his psyche.
> 
> Both problems are uber's.


how da heck are you blaming the man's drug problem on uber? there hasnt even been a report that this man was on drugs or had any in his system, yet you're using it as a piece of "evidence" to say Uber is at fault, smh.


----------



## Sacto Burbs

Uber Kraus said:


> Feeding the trolls today Sacto?


Bart's back. Happy to throw him some bones. Not a troll. Just wordy.


----------



## LA Cabbie

Bart McCoy said:


> smh, what does that have to do with him shooting people while he didn't accept a request, didn't have a live request, didn't have a uber pax in the,didn't have the app on, wasnt working for uber????
> 
> uber gets reports all the time, I just can't believe you expect uber to deactivate drivers on the whim of a pax report. Just unbelievable man, smh
> 
> Again, yes uber may be liable for possibly sending him pings,when he could endanger people he picked up. But he didn't hurt or shoot anybody he picked up. he instead found other people, WITHOUT the help or use of uber's app, and randomly shot them. People who didn't order the app, people who didn't send the killer a ping request....
> 
> So ive already said, Uber maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay be liable for the scary ride. But they wont be paying millions for scaring a pax but not hurting them.
> 
> Uber is NOT liable for the "Uber" driver shooting people on his own time. Uber didn't do anything negligent in preventing him from shooting people, uber only MAYBE possibly did something negligent in allowing him to continue to pick up more passengers. But you can't sue for something that didn't happen (he didn't pick up more passengers and shoot , hurt, or harm any of them)


I took out the taxi and in between orders I shoot and kill people. Is my company that authorized me use of their system liable for my actions while I'm logged on?


----------



## DriverX

Bart McCoy said:


> smh, what does that have to do with him shooting people while he didn't accept a request, didn't have a live request, didn't have a uber pax in the,didn't have the app on, wasnt working for uber????
> 
> uber gets reports all the time, I just can't believe you expect uber to deactivate drivers on the whim of a pax report. Just unbelievable man, smh
> 
> Again, yes uber may be liable for possibly sending him pings,when he could endanger people he picked up. But he didn't hurt or shoot anybody he picked up. he instead found other people, WITHOUT the help or use of uber's app, and randomly shot them. People who didn't order the app, people who didn't send the killer a ping request....
> 
> So ive already said, Uber maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay be liable for the scary ride. But they wont be paying millions for scaring a pax but not hurting them.
> 
> Uber is NOT liable for the "Uber" driver shooting people on his own time. Uber didn't do anything negligent in preventing him from shooting people, uber only MAYBE possibly did something negligent in allowing him to continue to pick up more passengers. But you can't sue for something that didn't happen (he didn't pick up more passengers and shoot , hurt, or harm any of them)


YOU ARE WRONG

If a driver runs into a crowd of people on a side walk while logged on, Uber's insurance is responsible!!! doesn't matter if it was an accident or an intentional act by a crazy driver, Uber insurance must pay!

THese people aren't Uber customers they were just standing on a sidewalk and this Uber ran them down. THerefore UBER is liable! any lawyer will easily be able to extend that to the driver shooting people while crusing Uber Tier 1, 2, or 3.

just give it up dude, your not gonna get a raise for defending these priks


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

Bart McCoy said:


> If they had a phone number, would that have prevented the shootings? If not, why blame Uber?


MAYBE if they had a number and police got a second 911 call from uber the shooter would have been stopped. MAYBE he wouldn't.

But WITHOUT a number to contact we KNOW they can't and won't do anything in time to even ATTEMPT to stop anything.


----------



## Bart McCoy

DriverX said:


> . Any jury, especially in Kalamazoo, is going to find Uber liable. stop embarrassing yourself beating this dead pax. It's obvious you are an uber employee who has been assigned damage control.


you are so sure, tell me the winning lottery numbers this week then, smh


----------



## Archie8616

DriverX said:


> YOU ARE WRONG
> 
> If a driver runs into a crowd of people on a side walk while logged on, Uber's insurance is responsible!!! doesn't matter if it was an accident or an intentional act by a crazy driver, Uber insurance must pay!
> 
> THese people aren't Uber customers they were just standing on a sidewalk and this Uber ran them down. THerefore UBER is liable! any lawyer will easily be able to extend that to the driver shooting people while crusing Uber Tier 1, 2, or 3.
> 
> just give it up dude, your not gonna get a raise for defending these priks


I think your probably on the right course. This guy was an insurance salesman. Maybe he was a lone vigilante knowing that if he was logged in, taking out people, that he could single handily take down Uber..... 6 murders, one possibly may die due to injuries... That's a HUGE lawsuit...Millions of dollars for maybe just one victim.


----------



## Bart McCoy

DriverX said:


> YOU ARE WRONG
> 
> If a driver runs into a crowd of people on a side walk while logged on, Uber's insurance is responsible!!! doesn't matter if it was an accident or an intentional act by a crazy driver, Uber insurance must pay!
> 
> THese people aren't Uber customers they were just standing on a sidewalk and this Uber ran them down. THerefore UBER is liable! any lawyer will easily be able to extend that to the driver shooting people while crusing Uber Tier 1, 2, or 3.
> 
> just give it up dude, your not gonna get a raise for defending these priks


so you're assuming you know his app was on during the shooting? were you riding shotgun with him? smh


----------



## Uberana

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> And I will give a brutally honest reply to why I believe your opinion is wrong.
> 
> UBER DOES NOT PROPERLY VET THEIR EMPLOYEES.
> 
> Uber does not require fingerprinting
> Uber does not do face to face interviews
> Uber does not check with previous employers
> Uber does not do drug screening
> Uber hires felons (In California)
> Uber does not train their employees
> Uber does not provide proper healthcare for their employees
> Uber does not supervise their employees.
> Uber provides little support for their employees
> 
> I agree that many drivers are trying to tie wages to this incident with the hopes Uber will raise rates. But the system Uber has set up has many flaws and when one of their drivers goes crazy, its proper to look at the system.


Yes, I agree. Uber should suspend signing up drivers until they fix the system.


----------



## DriverX

Bart McCoy said:


> so you're assuming you know his app was on during the shooting? were you riding shotgun with him? smh


HAHAHA so you are finally realizing that you are standing on seriously schakey ground. Thats your best angle at a defense that the app was off.... well neither of us knows the answer to that question but the cops will figure it out very easily and I'm betting he was logged in, because that's a smart bet.

Furthermore, even if he wasn't logged in. Any lawyer can easily make a case in civil court that the driver snapped because of Ubers treatment and policies. CHA-CHING

Your welcome


----------



## Bart McCoy

DriverX said:


> Furthermore, even if he wasn't logged in. Any lawyer can easily make a case in civil court that the driver snapped because of Ubers treatment and policies. CHA-CHING
> 
> Your welcome


He's not an employee though. Uber has the right to set their rates as low as they want. You think this is a slam dunk case, I guarantee you it is not. 
Don't worry, when Uber is not liable im coming back in this topic and bumping all 82 of the people who swore Uber would be paying millions (even billions apparently from one poster, smh)


----------



## Modern-Day-Slavery

AllenChicago said:


> If UBER rides don't decrease in number today, you're right. I would say that it's important only to us.. and not for very long at that. This thread will slow to a crawl, stop, and be replaced by matters of more immediate and personal concerns.


Don't forget that Uber gives out free credit to people in the media who portray them in a positive light. In many cities, Uber employees also receive a few hundred dollars of credit per week as a perk. They have also gone after the individuals who speak honestly.


----------



## Modern-Day-Slavery

AllenChicago said:


> Indeed! There's a thread in the forum describing how UBER has slashed Michigan rates to 30 cents minute / 30 cents a mile, with a minimum fare of just $1.75.


Really, $1.75? How do you even survive on that without cutting corners on servicing and compromising your own health?


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

uber fool said:


> Deactivation warning en route


Maybe he got one of those shitty "You have been cancelling too many trips" texts while driving and that was what set him off.


----------



## Feisal Mo

Bart McCoy said:


> yes, uber should get a telephone number
> however, many companies work via email only
> more importantly, this having a working phone number only helps pax that have taken rides in an uber
> 
> The people who were shot, never did. Meaning a working phone number does not save the lives of the victims


All in all, there will be new uber regulations....Looks like surge pricing isn't the only thing Uber riders have to worry about.


----------



## Uber Lyft Dude




----------



## Slavic Riga

Guys let not give these peeps any more info. They are here on an info gathering mission on how to fight it in court. Plus a strategy on Damage control. 
Lets wait for statement from the police. It will definitely become. I hope Travis rewrite the civil & criminal laws in Kalamazoo MI, just like how he tells all countries their rules & regulations are old & outdated.
STOP volunteering any more pros & cons.


----------



## tohunt4me

Feisal Mo said:


> As a CSR I would call someone in the USA to call 911 on the driver since they outsourced their customer service to the Philippines...
> Within the UBER Rider app, there's a title called "Critical safety response line" tells users to call 911 in case of an emergency. Their riders and local government agencies will get a better insight on who UBER really is, how much their drivers really make, maybe actually have a phone # someone can actually call to reach a live person at UBER. But that might cut into UBER profit margin and UBER may not like it. Oh wait, maybe UBER can cut their rates again so that they can hire realtime people to answer the phone.


And deliver kittens !


----------



## tohunt4me

Sacto Burbs said:


> When I rent a car it knows my speed. It is attached to the car monitoring system. Uber need a to require that device is on if the app is on.


Waze detects speed.
It asks if you want speed displayed.


----------



## tohunt4me

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> Hey Bart.....did you read what you wrote? Know what that means?.....Means he was working for UBER while killing people.....REACH THAT


Did he kill Uber Passengers ?
Noooooo . . .
The only relevence to Uber in this case is the "job flexibility" that Uber offered the shooter .
Thats it .


----------



## Slavic Riga

ubersuperbowlstrike said:


> I was deactivated within 5 minutes because a pax "may" of left something in my back seat & flooded with calls till I returned it, yet this guy sideswipes someone has 911 called what a joke, it's only gonna get worse, there is no excuse for this crazy dude I just hope if he's smart he says the low fares & bad ratings made him snap


His mantra should be 'LOW FARES', LOW FARES, LOW FARES should not mention Ratings.


----------



## tohunt4me

Sacto Burbs said:


> When I rent a car it knows my speed. It is attached to the car monitoring system. Uber need a to require that device is on if the app is on.


And yet they always assign me new cars to break in for them . . .


----------



## tohunt4me

naplestom75 said:


> Uber is already setting-up it's call center as we have this discussion.


Its Ikran !


----------



## gg mh

UberPissed said:


> Kzoo police ID suspect in deadly random shootings
> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/20/multiple-fatally-shot-at-2-locations-in-kalamazoo-co/
> 
> TEXAS TOWNSHIP, Mich. (WOOD) - Six people are dead and two seriously wounded after a shooter opened fire at three different locations in the Kalamazoo area over the course of nearly five hours Saturday night.
> 
> Michigan State Police on Sunday identified the four victims killed at one of the crime scenes, the Cracker Barrel restaurant in Texas Township, as:
> 
> 
> Mary Lou Nye, 63, of Baroda, Mich.
> Mary Jo Nye, 60, of Battle Creek
> Dorothy Brown, 74, of Battle Creek
> Barbara Hawthorne, 68, of Battle Creek
> The names of the two other victims killed were not expected to be released Sunday.


Prayers for the victims and their families. On another note. I hope this make riders scared and stop their rude behavior!


----------



## tohunt4me

Kalee said:


> I'm thinking that Uber has always realized the stress put on the drivers and the possibility of a mental breakdown as they continue to ratchet up their relentless driver abuse. I'm guessing that may be why months ago, Uber attempted to make drivers believe that Uber has authority to dictate to we "independent contractors" that we are not allowed to legally carry firearms for our protection whilst driving our personal vehicles.
> 
> I would bet my last Uber 60 hour paycheck of $204 that ole Travis surrounds himself with well armed guards at all times.
> 
> Nice try Uber, but butt out.


Stress is good for you !

Stress keeps you alert !


----------



## tohunt4me

gg mh said:


> Prayers for the victims and their families. On another note. I hope this make riders scared and stop their rude behavior!


Now they will rate you on speculation and hairstyle.


----------



## everythingsuber

Feisal Mo said:


> As a CSR I would call someone in the USA to call 911 on the driver since they outsourced their customer service to the Philippines...
> Within the UBER Rider app, there's a title called "Critical safety response line" tells users to call 911 in case of an emergency. Their riders and local government agencies will get a better insight on who UBER really is, how much their drivers really make, maybe actually have a phone # someone can actually call to reach a live person at UBER. But that might cut into UBER profit margin and UBER may not like it. Oh wait, maybe UBER can cut their rates again so that they can hire realtime people to answer the phone.


 Maybe they could add a dollar to each booking and that will cover the cost. They could call it a rider safety fee or something like that.


----------



## I works for no man

No way we can blame uber for this. Uber is soul crushing work but f this guy, on the other hand perception is everything and no way they escape this unscathed. It is starting already, abc 7 is running a story about an uber driver carrying a gun in Chicago, the customer got butt hurt, claimed to feel unsafe then complained to uber and the news. She
was whining about not being able to call anyone and said they gave her a refund, said she still uses uber x, I guess cheapness trumps safety. Chicago people are some of the cheapest bastards I have ever run into.In other news cabbie killed in Rogers park last night.


----------



## driveLA

Bart McCoy said:


> so you're assuming you know his app was on during the shooting? were you riding shotgun with him? smh


were you?

stop trying so hard

uber is efff'd whether or not it can prove to not be at fault

i'd like to see how well the law and public opinion plays into uber's hand when their track record of abuse and scoffing at laws and regulation at every single turn comes into play


----------



## groot

Bart McCoy said:


> I don't disagree that Uber is a horrible company. But what type of company Uber is has nothing to do with the shooting. You cant think clearly because of how you feel about Uber, I can. I simply look at the incident from an unbiased view. Theres nothing Uber could have done that day to stop that crazy man from shooting people
> 
> Just because somebody drives for Uber, you can't blame uber for everything that individual does. Nobody finds it ironic that they blame Uber for it, but the guy didn't harm any Uber passenger? when he clearly had the chance? doesn't make any sense.
> 
> My whole problem in this topic is everybody and their momma is blaming uber. Nobody is blaming the guy that pulled the trigger, smh


Driving is professional job cab driver truck driver Bus driver shuttle driver when they apply for job they know or should know natur of the job U can't hire anybody crossing in the street Fuber is wrong business model wake up T K baby boy


----------



## tohunt4me

Ziggy said:


> There is a "Panic Button" on the Uber app in India ... but that's only because the Indian government threatened to kick Uber out of the entire country in the wake of an Uber driver raping a pax. *Uber definitely has the ability to do the right thing, they just are greedy suckers that won't take the moral high ground unless they are forced to
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Like the Tip button ... Uber has the ability to do the right thing ... but won't until it's in their best interest


The newspapers in India are available on the internet in English.
I subscribe to 3 of them via the internet.
Taxi rape happens often in India.
Men also behave badly on the busses.
This is not an Uber thing.


----------



## Dontmakemepullauonyou

scrurbscrud said:


> The fact that the driver was still doing fares between shootings could be a real *"Oh snap"* moment for any Uber pax going forward.
> 
> One more notch down on the sight scale for Uber drivers from the pax. "Are you sure you're not a shooter?" The new question of every pax.


I don't get how anyone didn't smell any gun powder after the shootings. Like I don't think he got out of the car right so if he shot from inside of the car it would be obvious.


----------



## sidewazzz

Michael - Cleveland said:


> I thought you were saying all these crimes were committed by UberX drivers - and people should use UberSELECT, UberSUV, UberLUX and UberBLACK.


X was simply a placement until actual numbers would replace it. Either way x is by far the most popular service so why not target it.


----------



## EricHaley

This is not a reply about who is and isn't at fault...

That being said, there was an article recently about how Uber can monitor your speed and driving style via the accelerometers in our phones. They have also recently requested microphone access (at least for iPhone users). I believe we're going to learn the extent of what Uber does and doesn't know about their drivers because of this incident.


----------



## LA Cabbie

Slavic Riga said:


> Him & BartMcCoy. They definitely work for PR Company. Dead give away. A pax is only taking advantage of an opportunity extended by our company. Want to read the spin that will be put on this line now.
> 
> Him & BartMcCoy. They definitely work for PR Company. Dead give away.  A pax is only taking advantage of an opportunity extended by our company. Want to read the spin that will be put on this line now.


That's too bad. I always thought Bart was cool. Then again I associate any Bart with Bart Simpson.


----------



## driveLA

i dont know but if any pax that brings this up to me and asks me questions like im some uber rep is getting a 1 star

Bart McCoy whats your email so I can forward question and you can reassure pax its not Uber's fault


----------



## Slavic Riga

EricHaley said:


> This is not a reply about who is and isn't at fault...
> 
> That being said, there was an article recently about how Uber can monitor your speed and driving style via the accelerometers in our phones. They have also recently requested microphone access (at least for iPhone users). I believe we're going to learn the extent of what Uber does and doesn't know about their drivers because of this incident.


Would want to know UBER reasoning when demanding regulatory bodies in gaining approval for microphone access. UBER never requests, always demands or breaks the law. Privacy laws are in place for a reason. If no access is granted than maybe Uber CEO will request his barrage of lawyers to sue the respective Govt. stating that their rules & regulations are old & have to be re-written to accommodate UBER"S demand. Imagine a cell phone with microphone access into sensitive research & defense areas, where all your trade secrets could be heard & revealed. 'TECHNOLOGY always evolves & can be hacked & manipulated.


----------



## LA Cabbie

Slavic Riga said:


> Him & BartMcCoy. They definitely work for PR Company. Dead give away. A pax is only taking advantage of an opportunity extended by our company. Want to read the spin that will be put on this line now.
> 
> Him & BartMcCoy. They definitely work for PR Company. Dead give away.  A pax is only taking advantage of an opportunity extended by our company. Want to read the spin that will be put on this line now.


That's too bad. I always thought Bart was cool. Then again I associate any Bart with Bart Simpson.


----------



## HitmanXXX

Uber is dropping rates! That's what happening. This guy ain't contempt & neither are we as uber drivers.


----------



## LA Cabbie

Bart McCoy said:


> how da heck are you blaming the man's drug problem on uber? there hasnt even been a report that this man was on drugs or had any in his system, yet you're using it as a piece of "evidence" to say Uber is at fault, smh.


People like this guy don't break. He had a real job, a family, clean criminal record. This would be the perfect Uber driver. Killing people (innocent/women/children) in a methodical fashion, with no emotions, is the work of either a highly trained assassin, I'm talking Mossad caliber, or somebody with a severely unbalanced brain. It's safe to rule out the former.

Unfortunately in these cases, BIG PHARMA does an amazing job of eliminating any data collaborating psychiatric medication with the shooter. We all can tell these James Holmes and the Sandy Hook kid just don't look right. Hopefully in this case, police did their work and attained blood samples. The fact that this case deals with for hire drivers that are required drug testing AND enrollment in a random program but Uber doesn't do it because they are 'technology company', this shooters medication history must come to light.

I would not be surprised at all if the shooter testified that Uber's work environment is what pushed him over the edge.

If I was trashyK, I would be in China now filing as an asylum seeker.


----------



## LA Cabbie

Uber should drug test ALL its drivers AND hire a 3rd party and unbiased firm to evaluate the Uber work environment.


----------



## metal_orion

SafeT said:


> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...t-year-old-child-shooting-spree-Michigan.html


Look at that picture. He fits the profile of a psycho.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile

This is a tort lawyers dream.
Even a moronic lawyer will make a connection between the reported hell ride and the subsequent killings.
"Uber did not perform adequate background checks. They spent years collecting a "safe rider fee'. 
Uber admitted they cannot keep people safe, and paid out 28 million for this lie.
They were warned about their driver, yet since they have no live operator intervention, their on shift logged in driver killed 6 people during his shift.

Therefore ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I urge you to find Uber liable for the damages requested, 1 billion for each victim".


----------



## driveLA

the news reports say he started his rampage after a some incident on a previous ride

it really does look like he snapped

i wonder how long till the next driver does something similar


----------



## scrurbscrud

Dontmakemepullauonyou said:


> I don't get how anyone didn't smell any gun powder after the shootings. Like I don't think he got out of the car right so if he shot from inside of the car it would be obvious.


Note to self: Get gunpowder scent for my ride.

Did anyone see he had a 4.73 driver rating?


----------



## TwoFiddyMile

driveLA said:


> the news reports say he started his rampage after a some incident on a previous ride
> 
> it really does look like he snapped
> 
> i wonder how long till the next driver does something similar


Wrong question. 
Heres the right question.
I wonder how long the government and the general public are going to put up with this nightmare of a robber baron company?


----------



## metal_orion

Ziggy said:


> Most pax with 5.0 are brand new pax ... never taken Uber. You might be able to tell the difference between a 4.9 and 4.5 or lower ... but personally, I'd rather p/u the 4.7-4.9 pax than a 5.0 pax


That used to be me. Now we don't have pax ratings here in Chicago.


----------



## DriverX

I heard on the radio he was rated 4.73 

maybe he was just killing time after getting put in the penalty box for cancels. That's a great headline:

Uber punishment drives man to kill!


----------



## Slavic Riga

Bart McCoy & Jack Pavalov have now left the bldg.
Public Relations Dept. now closed
Office hours 1000am to 0700 pm. 
Have not received any new replies to posts.


----------



## Bart McCoy

TwoFiddyMile said:


> This is a tort lawyers dream.
> s.
> "Uber did not perform adequate background checks. They spent years collecting a "safe rider fee'.
> Uber admitted they cannot keep people safe, and paid out 28 million for this lie.
> They were warned about their driver, yet since they have no live operator intervention, their on shift logged in driver killed 6 people during his shift.
> ".


I swear some folks be typing just to be practicing typing.
Didn't perform adequate background checks? The guy had a clean criminal history and no mental illness history. How in da world are you going to deny the man a job without finding ANYTHING that showed red flags in his past? The guy didn't slip through the cracks, he simply hadnt flipped out before. But I guess Uber should have seen this coming so they should pay billions? There were NO red flags until MAYBE the day of, when most of you guys say Uber should have known since he sideswiped a car, that the next thing he was gonna do was kill 6 people off the clock,because when people get into fender benders, killing people is always the nex step. smh, just wild man, just wild

yes they were warned about the driver, but the killer didn't kill any pax, nor any uber customers. He didn't kill anybody that had anything to do with Uber that day, YET, yall want Uber held responsible. The guy worked for Uber, yes thats fact, but stop blaming Uber for everything that man did under his own free will with no pax in his car and with his app turned off. Put your hate to the side for once and look at the incident in an unbiased way

*We are going on day 3, and still no evidence that he went "postal" over his hate or dislike of Uber. The only people that say Uber was the cause of all this are the people on this forum! You don't see ONE reputable news reporter, nor can you link me to ONE article from any REPUTABLE news site saying Uber is responsible or liable, you ONLY see that here!! *But I guess you guys are smarter than the people who get paid big bucks to report the news huh? really? smh

people want Uber to burn in hell that they can't see the obvious staring them in the face, sad case of folks here


----------



## Just_in

Bart McCoy said:


> I swear some folks be typing just to be practicing typing.
> Didn't perform adequate background checks? The guy had a clean criminal history and no mental illness history. How in da world are you going to deny the man a job without finding ANYTHING that showed red flags in his past? The guy didn't slip through the cracks, he simply hadnt flipped out before. But I guess Uber should have seen this coming so they should pay billions? There were NO red flagh until MAYBE the day of, when most of you guys Uber should have known since he sideswiped a car, that the next thing he was gonna do was kill 6 people off the clock. smh, just wild man, just wild
> 
> yes they were warned about the driver, the the killer didn't kill any pax, any uber customers. He didn't kill anybody that had anythign to do with Uber that day, YET, yall want Uber held responsible. The guy worked for Uber, yes thats fact, but stop blaming Uber for everything that made did under his own free will with no pax in his car and with is app turned off. Put your hate to the side for once and look at the incident in an unbiased way


 Your outnumbered get over it.


----------



## Bart McCoy

Just_in said:


> Your outnumbered get over it.


yeah, deflect. deflect and dodge, thats all people have done when ive asked questions about liabity that they simply cannot answer

point me to any reputable report or article who has said uber is responsible or liable
the only link you could give me would be back to this wack topic where posters claim Uber will pay out in the billions of dollars,thats why most of these folks should keep their day jobs


----------



## Joepatb

Bart McCoy said:


> I guess I'll wait on further reports. Some say he shot people inbetween uber rides, some outlets say he ubered people BEFORE doing any shootings. But in all reports, none state any victum was an Uber passenger. So why he spared Uber passenger lives rather than other random people has me confused


I'm just wondering if this guy had the crazy thought- drive for Uber-shoot up a few people-drive some more-shoot some more- drive etc. Use Uber as the alibi. How could I be a shooter if I was driving for Uber all night? And everyone knows Uber drivers aren't allowed to carry guns. Just a thought


----------



## Sacto Burbs

I works for no man said:


> It is starting already, abc 7 is running a story about an uber driver carrying a gun in Chicago, the customer got *butt hurt*, *claimed to feel unsafe then complained to uber and the new*s. She was *whining *about not being able to call anyone and said they gave her a refund, said she still uses uber x,
> 
> In other news cabbie killed in Rogers park last night.


Uber has an official policy to keep lethal weapons out of the cars to prevent gun violence. The customer reported a driver carrying a lethal weapon in contravention of Uber policy and contacted the relevant authorities to highlight the problem so it could be addressed and fixed. She is a responsible person who took action to protect herself and others from gun violence.

Your characterization of the situation is disrespectful toward someone who has the right to make sure no whack job is packing while she is in the car - contrary to company policy. It is her right as a customer to make sure no lethal weapon is in the car. You are the driver I suggest Uber asks at on-boarding if you a) Have a concealed carry license b) Have access to firearms. If you answer yes, you need to be on a red flag list.

And to the cabbie - his company suggested this

"A simple preventative measure such as a silent alarm linked to GPS, that would dispatch the nearest CPD squad car, would give Chicago's cab drivers the backup they need should they be placed in a dangerous situation with a potentially violent passenger," the group said.​
"I works for no man" is rubbish. You work for the person who pays you - just like everyone else - the passenger.


----------



## forqalso

Fuzzyelvis said:


> Uber has our phone numbers. A human being could have called him and may have been able to ascertain he was a danger and called 911. They could have given police his exact location. They could also block him.from getting pings while not actually having his app appear to be malfunctioning.
> 
> Of course, they might csll, he appears fine, and they do nothing.
> 
> But we'll never know. Uber has no trained "critical response team" to call drivers and make an assessment when a panicked pax calls, says they hsve slready called 911 they were so concerned, says the driver had an accident with the pax in the car, appeared unbothered, and kept driving.


Uber could direct him to any place where the police could be waiting, he would think it is his next ride, if they knew he was the shooter.


----------



## gg mh

everythingsuber said:


> Maybe they could add a dollar to each booking and that will cover the cost. They could call it a rider safety fee or something like that.


They already have that.


----------



## Bart McCoy

forqalso said:


> Uber could direct him to any place where the police could be waiting, he would think it is his next ride, if they knew he was the shooter.


Nobody knew he was the shooter. Not uber, not the police, not even people who were riding in his car!! So lets fault Uber, even though police couldnt find him, and the pax in the car looked him dead in the face and asked him if he was the shooter,killer said no, and pax believe him. But Uber somehow was supposed to know their driver was the killer, soley because somebody called and said he sidewiped a car??????!!!!!!!!!!!! Go back through all these replies in the topic. Note how many LACK blaming the killer for actully doing the killings, its sad


----------



## Feisal Mo

Bart McCoy said:


> I swear some folks be typing just to be practicing typing.
> Didn't perform adequate background checks? The guy had a clean criminal history and no mental illness history. How in da world are you going to deny the man a job without finding ANYTHING that showed red flags in his past? The guy didn't slip through the cracks, he simply hadnt flipped out before. But I guess Uber should have seen this coming so they should pay billions? There were NO red flags until MAYBE the day of, when most of you guys say Uber should have known since he sideswiped a car, that the next thing he was gonna do was kill 6 people off the clock,because when people get into fender benders, killing people is always the nex step. smh, just wild man, just wild
> 
> yes they were warned about the driver, but the killer didn't kill any pax, nor any uber customers. He didn't kill anybody that had anything to do with Uber that day, YET, yall want Uber held responsible. The guy worked for Uber, yes thats fact, but stop blaming Uber for everything that made did under his own free will with no pax in his car and with is app turned off. Put your hate to the side for once and look at the incident in an unbiased way
> 
> *We going on day 3, and still no evidence that he went "postal" over his hate or dislike of Uber. The only people that say Uber was the cause of all this are the people on this forum! You don't see ONE reputable news reporter, nor can you link me to ONE article from any REPUTABLE news site saying Uber is responsible or liable, you ONLY see that here!! *But I guess you guys are smarter than the people who get paid big bucks to report the news huh? really? smh
> 
> people want Uber to burn in hell that they can't see the obvious staring them in the face, sad case of folks here


Uber is tied to this because the killer was driving uber fares in between his killings.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bart McCoy said:


> yeah, deflect. deflect and dodge, thats all people have done when ive asked questions about liabity that they simply cannot answer
> 
> point me to any reputable report or article who has said uber is responsible or liable
> the only link you could give me would be back to this wack topic where posters claim Uber will pay out in the billions of dollars,thats why most of these folks should keep their day jobs


Is Uber paying you overtime to post your propaganda? I doubt it because they probably use "contractors" to do their PR work to avoid labor laws. Are you posting this from Indonesia in a cubicle next to the CSR's?


----------



## Just_in

Bart McCoy said:


> yeah, deflect. deflect and dodge, thats all people have done when ive asked questions about liabity that they simply cannot answer
> 
> point me to any reputable report or article who has said uber is responsible or liable
> the only link you could give me would be back to this wack topic where posters claim Uber will pay out in the billions of dollars,thats why most of these folks should keep their day jobs


Consider yourself a internet legend. Self proclaimed.


----------



## Bart McCoy

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Is Uber paying you overtime to post your propaganda? I doubt it because they probably use "contractors" to do their PR work to avoid labor laws. Are you posting this from Indonesia in a cubicle next to the CSR's?





Just_in said:


> Consider yourself a internet legend. Self proclaimed.


more deflections
proves ive ran yall into a brick wall


----------



## Sacto Burbs

Just_in said:


> Consider yourself a internet legend. Self proclaimed.


I second the motion. Keep at 'em Bart.


----------



## MoneyUber4

My sincere condolence to the family of all the victims. 

And in the name of all the drivers and ex drivers of New Jersey, we are really sorry for what Mr. Dalton did to your families.


----------



## TeamCruze

From a Aussie perspective, this issue is about the lack of gun control and out of control gun culture in American society. Nothing to do with Uber. Open gun culture increases the chances of violent acts to occur. You only have to look at the some states of Texas allowing gun owners to display a sidearm. Are they expecting to have a shoot-out in public like in western movies and that on edge that someone is going to rob them. 

Nothing will change until the the big gun lobbies and the general public get some real perspective on the massive problem. Here in Australia I only grew up using .22 bolt actions with the clip limited to 6 rounds and double barrel shot guns and no hand-guns. I'm glad we have tight regulations on all weapons in Australia and at least I know my children can go to school without the fear of being shot in class or walking down the street....rant over...

Plus all condolences to all victims of gun violence....It is avoidable..


----------



## EX_

TeamCruze said:


> From a Aussie perspective, this issue is about the lack of gun control and out of control gun culture in American society. Nothing to do with Uber. Open gun culture increases the chances of violent acts to occur. You only have to look at the some states of Texas allowing gun owners to display a sidearm. Are they expecting to have a shoot-out in public like in western movies and that on edge that someone is going to rob them.
> 
> Nothing will change until the the big gun lobbies and the general public get some real perspective on the massive problem. Here in Australia I only grew up using .22 bolt actions with the clip limited to 6 rounds and double barrel shot guns and no hand-guns. I'm glad we have tight regulations on all weapons in Australia and at least I know my children can go to school without the fear of being shot in class or walking down the street....rant over...


Yeah, getting rid of all the guns will solve everything... please get real.

Such a arrogant and rudimentary holier-than-thou response, because I'm pretty sure with enough rage, frustration, and determination he could've did the same, if not more damage by other means.


----------



## Sacto Burbs

He had a dog in the car, too.

*Uber Acknowledges Getting Complaints About Shooting Suspect*

*The Uber ride-hailing service acknowledged Monday that it received complaints about erratic driving by the suspect *in the random shootings that killed six people in Kalamazoo, and a prosecutor said the man admitted carrying out the attacks.

As authorities pieced together Jason Dalton's actions, the prosecutor said he picked up Uber fares after the first shooting and probably got more riders after the subsequent shootings.

Dalton, the 45-year-old former insurance adjuster, appeared briefly in court by video link and was charged with six counts of murder. A judge denied him bail.

During a talk with investigators, Dalton waived his right against self-incrimination and confessed his role in the Saturday night shootings, Kalamazoo County Prosecutor Jeff Getting said.

Dalton admitted "that he took people's lives," Kalamazoo police Det. Cory Ghiringhelli told the court. The murder charges carry a mandatory life sentence. Michigan does not have the death penalty.

*An Uber passenger said he called police to report that Dalton was driving erratically more than an hour before the shootings began.*

Matt Mellen told Kalamazoo television station WWMT that he hailed a ride around 4:30 p.m. Saturday. He said driver Jason Dalton introduced himself as "Me-Me" and had a dog in the backseat.

Mellen sat in front. About a mile into the trip, Dalton got a phone call, and when he hung up, he began driving recklessly, blowing through stop signs and sideswiping cars, Mellen said.

"We were driving through medians, driving through the lawn, speeding along, and when we came to a stop, I jumped out of the car and ran away," Mellen said. He said he called police and that when he got to his friend's house, his fiancée posted a warning to friends on Facebook.

*Uber said riders complained Saturday about Dalton's driving. When alerted to unsafe driving, company policy is to contact the driver. But Uber officials would not say whether anyone at the company spoke to Dalton, deferring to law enforcement.*

Dalton passed a background check and *became a driver on Jan. 25. He had given about 100 rides, *the company said.

Since Dalton's arrest, several people have come forward to say that he picked them up for Uber in the hours after the first attack. The Associated Press could not confirm those accounts.

Kalamazoo County Sheriff Richard Fuller said Uber is cooperating with law enforcement officials, and he believes the company will "help us fill in some timeline gaps."

*Investigators are particularly interested in communication between Dalton and Uber, as well as customers he might have driven, the sheriff said.*

The attacks began outside the Meadows apartment complex on the eastern edge of Kalamazoo County, where a woman was shot multiple times. She survived.

A little more than four hours later and 15 miles away, a father and his 17-year-old son were fatally shot while looking at cars at a car dealership.

Fifteen minutes after that, five people were gunned down in the parking lot of a Cracker Barrel restaurant. Four of them died. A 14-year-old girl survived with a head wound and was hospitalized in critical condition.

Police and prosecutors have not provided a motive. The victims had no apparent connection to the gunman.

Getting dismissed the idea that Dalton was seeking a particular person when authorities say he shot the first victim. The prosecutor said Dalton called the woman by a different name only "to get her attention" before shooting her outside of her apartment.

Questions about motive and Dalton's frame of mind are "going to be the hardest to answer for anybody," Fuller said. He expects some answers to emerge in court, but he doubts they will be satisfying.

"In the end, I ask people, because I keep hearing this question of why, 'What would be the answer that would be an acceptable answer for you?' They have to think about it for a moment, and they say, 'Probably nothing.'

"I have to say, 'You are probably correct.' I can't imagine what the answer would be that would let us go, 'OK, we understand now.' Because we are not going to understand," the sheriff said.
*
Uber prohibits both passengers and drivers from possessing guns of any kind in a vehicle. Anyone found to be in violation of the policy MAY be prohibited from using or driving for the service.*

Many handguns and long guns were seized from Dalton's home. But there was no indication that he was prohibited from owning the weapons, said Donald Dawkins, a Detroit-based spokesman for the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, which was assisting police.

In a statement issued Monday, Dalton's family offered condolences to the families of the victims and thanked law-enforcement officials, saying their "quick and decisive action prevented any further acts of violence."

The family said it planned to help authorities with the investigation.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/suspect-fatal-michigan-shootings-expected-court-37105560


----------



## bezi_NY

TwoFiddyMile said:


> He drove PAX between shootings?
> Shocking story.


Incredible indeed!! What made go off? I know pax can be abusive with this ratings bs system but couple that with predatory leases and loans and falling earnings... It becomes insult to injury.. I have always said when people loose everything... They loose it!!! (so it seems in this case, I could be wrong)


----------



## TeamCruze

EX_ said:


> Yeah, getting rid of all the guns will solve everything... please get real.
> 
> Such a arrogant and rudimentary holier-than-thou response, because I'm pretty sure with enough rage, frustration, and determination he could've did the same, if not more damage by other means.


We still have hand-guns but is kept under tight controls and I can go to a shooting range and hire a hand gun. It has nothing to do getting rid of all hand-guns but limiting them in communities where they don't belong. I enjoy hunting but why do you need a military weapon with armor piercing bullets to kill a deer...because it's fun and makes one feel powerful to have a over-sized weapon. It's all about perspective, responsibility and getting the balance right.


----------



## bezi_NY

Bart McCoy said:


> I swear some folks be typing just to be practicing typing.
> Didn't perform adequate background checks? The guy had a clean criminal history and no mental illness history. How in da world are you going to deny the man a job without finding ANYTHING that showed red flags in his past? The guy didn't slip through the cracks, he simply hadnt flipped out before. But I guess Uber should have seen this coming so they should pay billions? There were NO red flags until MAYBE the day of, when most of you guys say Uber should have known since he sideswiped a car, that the next thing he was gonna do was kill 6 people off the clock,because when people get into fender benders, killing people is always the nex step. smh, just wild man, just wild
> 
> yes they were warned about the driver, but the killer didn't kill any pax, nor any uber customers. He didn't kill anybody that had anything to do with Uber that day, YET, yall want Uber held responsible. The guy worked for Uber, yes thats fact, but stop blaming Uber for everything that man did under his own free will with no pax in his car and with his app turned off. Put your hate to the side for once and look at the incident in an unbiased way
> 
> *We are going on day 3, and still no evidence that he went "postal" over his hate or dislike of Uber. The only people that say Uber was the cause of all this are the people on this forum! You don't see ONE reputable news reporter, nor can you link me to ONE article from any REPUTABLE news site saying Uber is responsible or liable, you ONLY see that here!! *But I guess you guys are smarter than the people who get paid big bucks to report the news huh? really? smh
> 
> people want Uber to burn in hell that they can't see the obvious staring them in the face, sad case of folks here


Ok, so he took the one star to a whole new level then as you suggest.. He's clearly not talking to the Judge because he doesn't want to hurt his rating.
You're right maybe he's working for ISIS with a hipster cover.


----------



## Txchick

Bart McCoy said:


> Nobody knew he was the shooter. Not uber, not the police, not even people who were riding in his car!! So lets fault Uber, even though police couldnt find him, and the pax in the car looked him dead in the face and asked him if he was the shooter,killer said no, and pax believe him. But Uber somehow was supposed to know their driver was the killer, soley because somebody called and said he sidewiped a car??????!!!!!!!!!!!! Go back through all these replies in the topic. Note how many LACK blaming the killer for actully doing the killings, its sad


A voice of reason.


----------



## LA Cabbie

TeamCruze said:


> From a Aussie perspective, this issue is about the lack of gun control and out of control gun culture in American society. Nothing to do with Uber. Open gun culture increases the chances of violent acts to occur. You only have to look at the some states of Texas allowing gun owners to display a sidearm. Are they expecting to have a shoot-out in public like in western movies and that on edge that someone is going to rob them.
> 
> Nothing will change until the the big gun lobbies and the general public get some real perspective on the massive problem. Here in Australia I only grew up using .22 bolt actions with the clip limited to 6 rounds and double barrel shot guns and no hand-guns. I'm glad we have tight regulations on all weapons in Australia and at least I know my children can go to school without the fear of being shot in class or walking down the street....rant over...
> 
> Plus all condolences to all victims of gun violence....It is avoidable..


It's BIG PHARMA mate. Have you ever seen a commercial for psychiatric medication here in America?

Liver damage
Death
Internal bleeding
Stroke
Dry mouth
Loss of breath
Sweaty palms
Anxiety

All of that so I can go to sleep a couple of minutes earlier!

Listen folks, I know what I say might be inflammatory here in the U.S., I feel more comfortable with foreign cab drivers. Why? Mentally balanced.

Do you have any idea how many Americans young or old, even with great health, are addicted to psychiatric medication. Most of the times the legal stuff is worse than the illegal. And self medicating is an American mainstay.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland

Just_in said:


> Your outnumbered get over it.


being in the minority opinion does not make you wrong.
look at the GOP presidential race.


----------



## LA Cabbie

Wow. A dog in the car. That can certainly mask the smell of gun powder. He's only been with Uber a mere month and a hundred rides. Shock, that's what caused it. Happened to me first week of driving. Some dirt bag was raping a passed out girl in the back seat. Thought I was going to die. Apparently this shooter did the opposite, he made others die.


----------



## LA Cabbie

Michael - Cleveland said:


> being in the minority opinion does not make you wrong.
> look at the GOP presidential race.


I agree. Look at all the Hilary supporters.


----------



## TeamCruze

LA Cabbie said:


> It's BIG PHARMA mate. Have you ever seen a commercial for psychiatric medication here in America?
> 
> Liver damage
> Death
> Internal bleeding
> Stroke
> Dry mouth
> Loss of breath
> Sweaty palms
> Anxiety
> 
> All of that so I can go to sleep a couple of minutes earlier!
> 
> Listen folks, I know what I say might be inflammatory here in the U.S., I feel more comfortable with foreign cab drivers. Why? Mentally balanced.
> 
> Do you have any idea how many Americans young or old, even with great health, are addicted to psychiatric medication. Most of the times the legal stuff is worse than the illegal. And self medicating is an American mainstay.


Yes I have..Big Pharma is here in Australia but is better regulated. Doctors still push antidepressant on to everyone feeling down.

What America has got right is regulation in the cannabis industry. The Government just needs to apply the same strict regulations to weapons as they actually kill people.


----------



## bezi_NY

Bart McCoy said:


> yeah, deflect. deflect and dodge, thats all people have done when ive asked questions about liabity that they simply cannot answer
> 
> point me to any reputable report or article who has said uber is responsible or liable
> the only link you could give me would be back to this wack topic where posters claim Uber will pay out in the billions of dollars,thats why most of these folks should keep their day jobs


Bart, you're taking this to personal. No attorney would argue either way on the subject..( with the investigation still on going..) Like us here rambling a professional at this would have his hunches too. As experts in the sense (as drivers) one could definitely get the sentiment on this board in the overall sense.. In part maybe a pharmaceutical is to blame... We can only speak of our experiences as drivers... And you may have noticed that drivers have had their fair share of traumatic experiences as well. It does not however excuse the taking of someone's life senselessly as such.. So, how can you ask the question of liability in a civil case when the criminal case is still open and under investigation? We all know people that have won criminal cases and have lost civil cases? This is a very sensitive subject here and drivers are speaking based on their own experiences of dealing with Uber and it's passengers. I mean lets face i,t its fact that drivers are routinely having cars impounded and being ticketed for doing this service illegally in many cities and no one can argue that.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

ubersuperbowlstrike said:


> Haha give it up Bart no one thinks Uber is responsible for this crazy dude snapping, but cutting rates 60%, constantly lying, 4 stars meaning fired, no tip, paying less than min wage sure isn't helping, would this guy of snapped if 4 stars didn't matter & he made $4 instead of $2 on most rides who the EF knows but I sure hope he gets sane enough to fall on the sword for the rest of us & say he snapped cuz Uber treats humans like dogs cuz he will never see the outside of a cage again & this Ponzi scheme of a company def deserves this kinda of exposure & it's only gonna get worse it's the Titanic, it's a tragedy period but most likely dudes app was on while he was murdering people if not it went on right after and before ...perception is reality sad it took lives for this to spread but the snowballs rolling downhill now


I think Uber MAY be held at least partially liable. The shooting happened under their watch and while working for them. There is a good history of gun violence with this young company. Yes, it is ultimately Dalton's responsiblity, nobody is denying that, but I think Uber may be cupable as well. Despite the star rating system, the lack of oversight, lack of training, lack of enforcement of policies and lack of proper vetting is huge safety problem for Uber.

Regardless of who is wrong or right or liable, lawmakers will become more leery of Uber. There is too much violence associated with this company. Lawmakers will eventually start regulating them.


----------



## observer

Sacto Burbs said:


> He had a dog in the car, too.
> 
> *Uber Acknowledges Getting Complaints About Shooting Suspect*
> 
> *The Uber ride-hailing service acknowledged Monday that it received complaints about erratic driving by the suspect *in the random shootings that killed six people in Kalamazoo, and a prosecutor said the man admitted carrying out the attacks.
> 
> As authorities pieced together Jason Dalton's actions, the prosecutor said he picked up Uber fares after the first shooting and probably got more riders after the subsequent shootings.
> 
> Dalton, the 45-year-old former insurance adjuster, appeared briefly in court by video link and was charged with six counts of murder. A judge denied him bail.
> 
> During a talk with investigators, Dalton waived his right against self-incrimination and confessed his role in the Saturday night shootings, Kalamazoo County Prosecutor Jeff Getting said.
> 
> Dalton admitted "that he took people's lives," Kalamazoo police Det. Cory Ghiringhelli told the court. The murder charges carry a mandatory life sentence. Michigan does not have the death penalty.
> 
> *An Uber passenger said he called police to report that Dalton was driving erratically more than an hour before the shootings began.*
> 
> Matt Mellen told Kalamazoo television station WWMT that he hailed a ride around 4:30 p.m. Saturday. He said driver Jason Dalton introduced himself as "Me-Me" and had a dog in the backseat.
> 
> Mellen sat in front. About a mile into the trip, Dalton got a phone call, and when he hung up, he began driving recklessly, blowing through stop signs and sideswiping cars, Mellen said.
> 
> "We were driving through medians, driving through the lawn, speeding along, and when we came to a stop, I jumped out of the car and ran away," Mellen said. He said he called police and that when he got to his friend's house, his fiancée posted a warning to friends on Facebook.
> 
> *Uber said riders complained Saturday about Dalton's driving. When alerted to unsafe driving, company policy is to contact the driver. But Uber officials would not say whether anyone at the company spoke to Dalton, deferring to law enforcement.*
> 
> Dalton passed a background check and *became a driver on Jan. 25. He had given about 100 rides, *the company said.
> 
> Since Dalton's arrest, several people have come forward to say that he picked them up for Uber in the hours after the first attack. The Associated Press could not confirm those accounts.
> 
> Kalamazoo County Sheriff Richard Fuller said Uber is cooperating with law enforcement officials, and he believes the company will "help us fill in some timeline gaps."
> 
> *Investigators are particularly interested in communication between Dalton and Uber, as well as customers he might have driven, the sheriff said.*
> 
> The attacks began outside the Meadows apartment complex on the eastern edge of Kalamazoo County, where a woman was shot multiple times. She survived.
> 
> A little more than four hours later and 15 miles away, a father and his 17-year-old son were fatally shot while looking at cars at a car dealership.
> 
> Fifteen minutes after that, five people were gunned down in the parking lot of a Cracker Barrel restaurant. Four of them died. A 14-year-old girl survived with a head wound and was hospitalized in critical condition.
> 
> Police and prosecutors have not provided a motive. The victims had no apparent connection to the gunman.
> 
> Getting dismissed the idea that Dalton was seeking a particular person when authorities say he shot the first victim. The prosecutor said Dalton called the woman by a different name only "to get her attention" before shooting her outside of her apartment.
> 
> Questions about motive and Dalton's frame of mind are "going to be the hardest to answer for anybody," Fuller said. He expects some answers to emerge in court, but he doubts they will be satisfying.
> 
> "In the end, I ask people, because I keep hearing this question of why, 'What would be the answer that would be an acceptable answer for you?' They have to think about it for a moment, and they say, 'Probably nothing.'
> 
> "I have to say, 'You are probably correct.' I can't imagine what the answer would be that would let us go, 'OK, we understand now.' Because we are not going to understand," the sheriff said.
> *
> Uber prohibits both passengers and drivers from possessing guns of any kind in a vehicle. Anyone found to be in violation of the policy MAY be prohibited from using or driving for the service.*
> 
> Many handguns and long guns were seized from Dalton's home. But there was no indication that he was prohibited from owning the weapons, said Donald Dawkins, a Detroit-based spokesman for the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, which was assisting police.
> 
> In a statement issued Monday, Dalton's family offered condolences to the families of the victims and thanked law-enforcement officials, saying their "quick and decisive action prevented any further acts of violence."
> 
> The family said it planned to help authorities with the investigation.
> 
> http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/suspect-fatal-michigan-shootings-expected-court-37105560


I wonder if Uber got a complaint from another customer and the call he recieved was FROM Uber. This story kind of insinuates something like that may have happened. What doesn't make sense is why shoot the random people on the street and not the pax.


----------



## forqalso

Bart McCoy said:


> Nobody knew he was the shooter. Not uber, not the police, not even people who were riding in his car!! So lets fault Uber, even though police couldnt find him, and the pax in the car looked him dead in the face and asked him if he was the shooter,killer said no, and pax believe him. But Uber somehow was supposed to know their driver was the killer, soley because somebody called and said he sidewiped a car??????!!!!!!!!!!!! Go back through all these replies in the topic. Note how many LACK blaming the killer for actully doing the killings, its sad


I said "if Uber knew" not "Uber should have known".


----------



## bezi_NY

observer said:


> I wonder if Uber got a complaint from another customer and the call he recieved was FROM Uber. This story kind of insinuates something like that may have happened. What doesn't make sense is why shoot the random people on the street and not the pax.


In one instance he got out and asked for someone by name.. (does that instruction sound familiar)


----------



## Jack Pavlov

Sacto Burbs said:


> When I rent a car it knows my speed. It is attached to the car monitoring system. Uber need a to require that device is on if the app is on.


What relationship does that have to this?



driveLA said:


> who cares if the app was on or off
> 
> he's an uber driver murdering people while ubering, in between ubering, who cares.
> 
> a lot of people are making assumptions that its because uber but you are making assumptions (that its not because uber) as well.
> 
> nobody know anything
> 
> but its ridiculous how hard you're trying to protect a shitty company that has created a toxic environment


No one's trying to protect Uber, there are a horde of senseless posts being made...



Slavic Riga said:


> Him & BartMcCoy. They definitely work for PR Company. Dead give away. A pax is only taking advantage of an opportunity extended by our company. Want to read the spin that will be put on this line now.
> 
> Him & BartMcCoy. They definitely work for PR Company. Dead give away.  A pax is only taking advantage of an opportunity extended by our company. Want to read the spin that will be put on this line now.


simply put. I was going to respond but then I realized that nothing anyone else says will be taken with anything other than a grain of salt. I have higher hopes for the homeless people in SF than I do for you clowns.



LA Cabbie said:


> Perhaps he was on mood altering medication and knowingly or unknowingly abusing the meds and some situation caused his triggering mechanism (no pun intended) to fire?
> 
> 1) a standard drug test issued to cab drivers would have returned a positive and this man would never be behind the wheel as a for hire driver.
> 
> 2) I know from personal fact that some pax can push a driver over the edge. Almost happened to me once. I was fortunate that night club security whisked the punk away. I quit cabbing days later.
> 
> So what we have is a mentally unstable man working in an environment that exclusively served those who exasperated his psyche.
> 
> Both problems are uber's.
> 
> For those saying he could have done the same thing at a gas station; if you had heart issues, what environment would most likely cause s heart attack: folding clothes at the gap or digging trenches in the hot and humid heat?


Rideshare is here to stay, you should give up trying to discredit the business model and move on. It's shitty what happened to SOME cab drivers but that's capitalism. Hold a monopoly for so many years and you lose your competitive edge...
I've been driving 40 hours a week, for the last 5 months and I have had ZERO incidents with any pax...
Do you know how many drugs do NOT show up on a standard 5 panel test? Even if he was under the influence of one of those 5 classes of drugs, there is only one that has any long lasting residuals that show up in Urine so the chances of them finding it even with a drug test are slim to none. Drug tests aren't mandatory and certainly aren't regulatory. In some states, it's actually illegal for a company to conduct a blanket drug test on it's employees. Look up your local state's laws on employee drug testing. The only way Uber can drug test us and justify it, is if they have it laid out in the contract, but seeing as they have near 200,000 drivers... it is unlikely they will do that.



DriverX said:


> HAHAHA so you are finally realizing that you are standing on seriously schakey ground. Thats your best angle at a defense that the app was off.... well neither of us knows the answer to that question but the cops will figure it out very easily and I'm betting he was logged in, because that's a smart bet.
> 
> Furthermore, even if he wasn't logged in. Any lawyer can easily make a case in civil court that the driver snapped because of Ubers treatment and policies. CHA-CHING
> 
> Your welcome


Lol Ubers treatment and policies....


Slavic Riga said:


> Guys let not give these peeps any more info. They are here on an info gathering mission on how to fight it in court. Plus a strategy on Damage control.
> Lets wait for statement from the police. It will definitely become. I hope Travis rewrite the civil & criminal laws in Kalamazoo MI, just like how he tells all countries their rules & regulations are old & outdated.
> STOP volunteering any more pros & cons.


This made me laugh, I can't tell if you're serious but there is a level of humor. If you are serious, than you are severely delusional and Uber should probably suspend your driving account



EricHaley said:


> This is not a reply about who is and isn't at fault...
> 
> That being said, there was an article recently about how Uber can monitor your speed and driving style via the accelerometers in our phones. They have also recently requested microphone access (at least for iPhone users). I believe we're going to learn the extent of what Uber does and doesn't know about their drivers because of this incident.


I can tell you right now that Apple will be the first to deny access and will fight this tooth and nail. Apple is notorious for denying federal warrants and winning that battle in court.



Slavic Riga said:


> Bart McCoy & Jack Pavalov have now left the bldg.
> Public Relations Dept. now closed
> Office hours 1000am to 0700 pm.
> Have not received any new replies to posts.


Yeah if you missed my post, I said I was working. Clearly something none of you know how to do because you're still on this thread, 15 pages later.



TeamCruze said:


> From a Aussie perspective, this issue is about the lack of gun control and out of control gun culture in American society. Nothing to do with Uber. Open gun culture increases the chances of violent acts to occur. You only have to look at the some states of Texas allowing gun owners to display a sidearm. Are they expecting to have a shoot-out in public like in western movies and that on edge that someone is going to rob them.
> 
> Nothing will change until the the big gun lobbies and the general public get some real perspective on the massive problem. Here in Australia I only grew up using .22 bolt actions with the clip limited to 6 rounds and double barrel shot guns and no hand-guns. I'm glad we have tight regulations on all weapons in Australia and at least I know my children can go to school without the fear of being shot in class or walking down the street....rant over...
> 
> Plus all condolences to all victims of gun violence....It is avoidable..


Are you blind to the actual statistics surrounding gun control?
"A recent study published in the _Harvard Journal of Law & Public Policy_ concluded that there is a negative correlation between gun ownership and violent crime in countries internationally (more guns = less crime)."
Feel free to browse for yourself, the source links for all of that data is at the bottom.
http://americangunfacts.com/


----------



## uber strike

it's really sad that even after such tragedy uber still will not provide better working conditions (pay) for drivers. Juno might be the only answer.


----------



## cooberpedy15

who would want to ride Uber after the Kalamazoo incident?
On top of paying so little for so much driving ...now this. Im poorly motivated to keep driving.


----------



## TeamCruze

Jack Pavlov said:


> Are you blind to the actual statistics surrounding gun control?
> "A recent study published in the _Harvard Journal of Law & Public Policy_ concluded that there is a negative correlation between gun ownership and violent crime in countries internationally (more guns = less crime)."
> Feel free to browse for yourself, the source links for all of that data is at the bottom.
> http://americangunfacts.com/


(more guns = less crime)= more unnecessary deaths...
Single shooting deaths by guns still happens here in Australia but in very low numbers and are isolated cases. With tighter laws since our Port Arthur massacre on high powered weapons, has decreased the chances of massacre happening on a large scale. The recent shooting in Sydney ended badly with the police running in with stun grenades causing the gunman to open fire with an old double barrel shotgun.

Also how one measures crime and perceives crime in studies.

All I know I feel safe walking down the street in Australia towns/cities without the fear of being shot.


----------



## LA Cabbie

Jack Pavlov said:


> What relationship does that have to this?
> Rideshare is here to stay, you should give up trying to discredit the business model and move on. It's shitty what happened to SOME cab drivers but that's capitalism. Hold a monopoly for so many years and you lose your competitive edge...
> I've been driving 40 hours a week, for the last 5 months and I have had ZERO incidents with any pax...
> Do you know how many drugs do NOT show up on a standard 5 panel test? Even if he was under the influence of one of those 5 classes of drugs, there is only one that has any long lasting residuals that show up in Urine so the chances of them finding it even with a drug test are slim to none. Drug tests aren't mandatory and certainly aren't regulatory. In some states, it's actually illegal for a company to conduct a blanket drug test on it's employees. Look up your local state's laws on employee drug testing. The only way Uber can drug test us and justify it, is if they have it laid out in the contract, but seeing as they have near 200,000 drivers... it is unlikely they will do that.


1) No such thing as illegal drug testing for transportation industry. Federal laws.
https://www.transportation.gov/odapc

2) This ain't some do it yourself $19.99 kit, we are talking pros here:
http://www.nortonmedical.com/recources.html

Rideshare don't bother me at all.


----------



## Jack Pavlov

Lol yes pro's do a standard 5 panel.


----------



## Ziggy

metal_orion said:


> That used to be me. Now we don't have pax ratings here in Chicago.


That blows ... I guess I'd have to call all pax ... to determine if I wanted to deal with their demeanor.


----------



## Ziggy

tohunt4me said:


> The newspapers in India are available on the internet in English.
> I subscribe to 3 of them via the internet.
> Taxi rape happens often in India.
> Men also behave badly on the busses.
> This is not an Uber thing.


Not saying it's only an Uber thing ... just saying that Uber added a Panic Button to the Uber app in India. There is nothing that should prevent Uber from adding a Panic button in US connected to 911


----------



## tohunt4me

Ziggy said:


> Not saying it's only an Uber thing ... just saying that Uber added a Panic Button to the Uber app in India. There is nothing that should prevent Uber from adding a Panic button in US connected to 911


Should be universal


----------



## Ziggy

tohunt4me said:


> Should be universal


Totally agreed.


----------



## wethepeople

It's actually too sad and serious to make jokes but.... will they be reversing the Safe rides Fee ??
I mean Uber seems to be anything than safe, right?

I say Travis K. uses the SRF for his Cocaine problem. A guy who knows him once said he would do a lot of the white stuff.


----------



## driveLA

Did Travis say anything or is he just going to ignore this like all the drivers who have been beaten, robbed, and murdered and tell us how awesome disruption is.


----------



## Sacto Burbs

Jack Pavlov said:


> "A recent study published in the _Harvard Journal of Law & Public Policy_ concluded that there is a negative correlation between gun ownership and violent crime in countries internationally (more guns = less crime)."
> Feel free to browse for yourself, the source links for all of that data is at the bottom.


Only those without a legitimate argument - or those who *profit *from arms sales - suggest to weak minds that "correlation" means the same thing as "causation". Nice try. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation

Here is another report showing correlation and causation:

"States with more gun laws have fewer gun-related deaths, according to a new study released Wednesday by Boston Children's Hospital."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/03/07/gun-violence-study-chicago/1969227/​
The gun industry site uses a clever trick to eliminate all the relevant reasons why something happens and replace it with a single irrelevant one. Data from overseas - where there is little the Police can do protect citizens from the violence in society in the countries listed - is used. Also, there are some states that legally forbid gun death and injuries from be reported. So the data used leaves out a hefty number of the gruesome facts. Lumping Urban and Rural together is also a clever ploy to dilute the data. And, of course, follow the money - who paid for the reports and decides what to include and what to leave out.

I personally believe that anyone who comes here lobbying for the arms industry and linking to their sites is in violation of the terms of UP and the posts should be reported and deleted.


----------



## TeamCruze

Another perspective : http://www.vox.com/2015/10/3/9444417/gun-violence-united-states-america

Where does Australia sit, we have tight gun controls ?


----------



## Sacto Burbs

Sacto Burbs said:


> Getting dismissed the idea that Dalton was seeking a particular person when authorities say he shot the first victim. The prosecutor said Dalton called the woman by a different name only "to get her attention" before shooting her outside of her apartment.


This article


----------



## secretadmirer

"It's actually too sad and serious to make jokes but.... will they be reversing the Safe rides Fee ??
I mean Uber seems to be anything than safe, right?"

I highly doubt it. But they have changed the name of it to a "booking fee",

So as bart pointed out this dalton had no criminal record. I'm certain though there was something wrong with him.


----------



## GrandTheftUber

> So as bart pointed out this dalton had no criminal record. I'm certain though there was something wrong with him.


Something was definitely wrong. He wasn't being paid anything close to what he needed to survive and keep his car running safely. That causes a huge amount of stress. (Trust me, I know, and so does 99% of Uber drivers on this forum.)

Secondly, his emotional problems led him to obsessing over Uber's subpar ratings systems. Remember, he's already stressed over Uber's slave wages, and when combined with his mental state... The dude went full Uber.


----------



## Darrell Green Fan

From the article posted earlier. Identify the caller and we go a long way towards understanding the reason.

_Mellen sat in front. About a mile into the trip, Dalton got a phone call, and when he hung up, he began driving recklessly, blowing through stop signs and sideswiping cars, Mellen said._


----------



## Dontmakemepullauonyou

Just now on MSNBC they did the report on this mass shooter and reporter said "uber driver had a high rating". 

Since when is 4.73 high? Oh yeah cause the real world thinks an almost 5 star rating is amazing except with uber it's near deactivation. 

Travis your app in the App Store is currently at 3 out of 5 stars lmao and mostly cause of the logo change/fail. 

If I had an app in the App Store that's the main product for my company worth $62,500,000,000 but with a rating of 3 out of 5 stars, I would be fired by my investors, let's hope they wake up soon!


----------



## vesolehome

I noticed it's now just called "rider fee" and 'safe' has been dropped.


----------



## Uber-Doober

I hope that this isn't a prediction of the "caliber" of TNC drivers in general.


----------



## Dontmakemepullauonyou

vesolehome said:


> I noticed it's now just called "rider fee" and 'safe' has been dropped.


Not in my city yet. Still safe rides fee.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Jack Pavlov said:


> Lol, It's amazing to me that this forum not only is comprised of people who are inept, but anyone who's NOT inept gets outed as a "troll working for the corporation". This is almost straight out of a movie. It's too funny... please continue, i'll enjoy my cereal and milk and go off to work a SUCCESSFUL 7-4 shift and make a couple hundred dollars that you guys will be missing out on; by being attached to your keyboards and impatiently waiting for the next response.





Archie8616 said:


> I think your probably on the right course. This guy was an insurance salesman. Maybe he was a lone vigilante knowing that if he was logged in, taking out people, that he could single handily take down Uber..... 6 murders, one possibly may die due to injuries... That's a HUGE lawsuit...Millions of dollars for maybe just one victim.


I am retired and ran a co. in the transportation industry for many years so I am familiar with insurance applications in certain special circumstances. You are both onto something here and I must admit it hadn't occurred to me that since the driver was in the insurance game he may have some insight that most drivers wouldn't have. I would also not be surprised that Uber with it's 1.00 per ride insurance surcharge is likely administering its own insurance coverage. This is done by buying a HUGE umbrella policy but administering all but the biggest claims on your own dime. This case will obviously bring out the umbrella. This is going to be a very interesting thing to follow and I have no doubt most of us on here will be watching closely. I find it interesting that UBER has NOTHING to say to its PARTNERS....The smartest guys in the room are are starting to keep one eye on the door. FASCINATING.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile

My pax and i have been discussing "The Uber Killer" all morning. 
The Uber Killer. 
Yep.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

TwoFiddyMile said:


> My pax and i have been discussing "The Uber Killer" all morning.
> The Uber Killer.
> Yep.


That was just a matter of time wasn't it Fiddy???......Wouldn't you think that the smart guys who run a 50 Billion dollar corporation (their valuation, certainly not anyone else's.....see PS at the bottom) would have some concern for the people who are the only ones who talk to the customer and who have to field the "UBER Killer" questions? NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO....."bump up the guarantees" seems to be the best they can do. This millennial clown car is being driven by lawyers and accountants....always a solid way forward for an innovative little startup burning through 3 or 4 rounds of funding and hiding profits like little mofos...... all under the steady hand of "The TRUSTBUSTER"....

PS I bet the VCs have calls into Travis this morning.....I bet UBER warrants are being set up for a quick sale is case something in SF goes boom...."The smartest guys in the room" are loosing "smirkforce" as I write this


----------



## space ghost

The fact that this looney tune was reported to be highly unsafe by a passenger, then continued to drive, while uber was contacted to no avail, will make uber responsible to some extent. If the exact same scenario had played out in a cab you can bet that the phone call made to report him would have resulted in the dispatcher having the cops on his back bumper before he could blink.


----------



## space ghost

If he still intended to carry out his plan he would have been riding his hush puppies to do it, and his profession would have nothing to do with it.


----------



## scrurbscrud

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> I think Uber MAY be held at least partially liable. The shooting happened under their watch and while working for them. There is a good history of gun violence with this young company. Yes, it is ultimately Dalton's responsiblity, nobody is denying that, but I think Uber may be cupable as well. Despite the star rating system, the lack of oversight, lack of training, lack of enforcement of policies and lack of proper vetting is huge safety problem for Uber.
> 
> Regardless of who is wrong or right or liable, lawmakers will become more leery of Uber. There is too much violence associated with this company. Lawmakers will eventually start regulating them.


The very real legal difficulty they may have is in the prior written notification by a pax with no response.

That smells like deep pocketed liability all the way to me.


----------



## Bart McCoy

No mention of Uber on major websites. The Only talk of Uber being liable and the killers motive was of their low rates, is here in this topic, smh. How about we just wait until all the facts come out before we go running blaming the world biggest enemy: Uber









Fox News


----------



## scrurbscrud

It's going to be quite difficult to say Uber didn't know something was afoul with this driver:

"*Uber Acknowledges Getting Complaints About Shooting Suspect*

*The Uber ride-hailing service acknowledged Monday that it received complaints about erratic driving by the suspect"*

Not only erratic, but wildly illegal and unsafe.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Bart McCoy said:


> No mention of Uber on major websites. The Only talk of Uber being liable and the killers motive was of their low rates, is here in this topic, smh. How about we just wait until all the facts come out before we go running blaming the world biggest enemy: Uber
> 
> View attachment 29089
> 
> Fox News
> 
> View attachment 29090


Bart.....you should be working on your resume instead of shoveling this stuff against a tide that is going to drown you......Your just a silly little shill .....Dig?


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bart McCoy said:


> No mention of Uber on major websites. The Only talk of Uber being liable and the killers motive was of their low rates, is here in this topic, smh. How about we just wait until all the facts come out before we go running blaming the world biggest enemy: Uber
> 
> View attachment 29089
> 
> Fox News
> 
> View attachment 29090


These reports don't say anything either way. Here on this forum, people are free to speculate and participate in discussion. Please report back to Travis that your spin is getting nowhere on UP.


----------



## Bart McCoy

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> These reports don't say anything either way. Here on this forum, people are free to speculate and participate in discussion. Please report back to Travis that your spin is getting nowhere on UP.


Cool
I'll be back to comment when more FACTS are reported
Until then, happy speculating. I mean while you're at it, speculate that Uber will raise everyone's rates by an extra $1 per mile.

Me reporting back to Travis or being a shill? You and Beachbum in a cornfield being a veteran poster I would think you would investigate a user's postings before making such an absurd claim. I'm a lil ashamed of yall, *thats a newb move*. If you read all my prior postings BEFORE I ever commented in this topic and comprehend from those posts that I'm a shill...... then I have to compare yall to this deranged guy that went on a killing spree.

Now yall take care, and continue to show that people and entities are guilty until proven innocent. I'll see yall again when more facts arise


----------



## GrandTheftUber

Bart McCoy said:


> Cool
> I'll be back to comment when more FACTS are reported
> Until then, happy speculating. I mean while you're at it, speculate that Uber will raise everyone's rates by an extra $1 per mile.
> 
> Me reporting back to Travis or being a shill? You and Beachbum in a cornfield being a veteran poster I would think you would investigate a user's postings before making such an absurd claim. I'm a lil ashamed of yall, *thats a newb move*. If you read all my prior postings BEFORE I ever commented in this topic and comprehend from those posts that I'm a shill...... then I have to compare yall to this deranged guy that went on a killing spree.
> 
> Now yall take care, and continue to show that people and entities are guilty until proven innocent. I'll see yall again when more facts arise


Guys, give Bart a break. He doesn't shill 'for' Travis. Please. That's crazy talk.

Things like this are handled via third party.


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

space ghost said:


> The fact that this looney tune was reported to be highly unsafe by a passenger, then continued to drive, while uber was contacted to no avail, will make uber responsible to some extent. If the exact same scenario had played out in a cab you can bet that the phone call made to report him would have resulted in the dispatcher having the cops on his back bumper before he could blink.


They reported the wrong thing. Had they said he had a TIP JAR, Uber would have been all over it.


----------



## stuber

Bart McCoy said:


> the guy had a clean criminal history. so now the blame game is uber doesn't vet its drivers? if he's never committed a crime before, how you gonna use a clean history to NOT let him drive? how bout the guy was just crazy?
> 
> and now you gonna not let people drive for Uber soley on the basis of how they look????????????????


You have a point. I'm just saying I know my customers, and I know they don't want to be in a car with that guy. And yes, based on appearance. Other customers (like Uber customers) may view that differently. Or, they may wish they could have more control and choose their driver. But to each their own.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bart McCoy said:


> Cool
> I'll be back to comment when more FACTS are reported
> Until then, happy speculating. I mean while you're at it, speculate that Uber will raise everyone's rates by an extra $1 per mile.
> 
> Me reporting back to Travis or being a shill? You and Beachbum in a cornfield being a veteran poster I would think you would investigate a user's postings before making such an absurd claim. I'm a lil ashamed of yall, *thats a newb move*. If you read all my prior postings BEFORE I ever commented in this topic and comprehend from those posts that I'm a shill...... then I have to compare yall to this deranged guy that went on a killing spree.
> 
> Now yall take care, and continue to show that people and entities are guilty until proven innocent. I'll see yall again when more facts arise


EXCELLENT!!!

These are some facts you should report on...
Under what circumstances did Dalton leave his job at the insurance company? Did he have a good record with previous employers?
Did Dalton seem qualified for the job during his interview? Was he able to explain his employment history?
How did Dalton perform during his driving test?
Did his supervisors notice anything in the days/weeks leading up to this incident?

Please don't offer your opinion on these questions... JUST THE FACTS!


----------



## tohunt4me

Fuzzyelvis said:


> They reported the wrong thing. Had they said he had a TIP JAR, Uber would have been all over it.


Tip jar !!!???
Thats not allowed. . .
I keep a bunch of ones in the cup holder . . .
Self explanatory.
Keeps the money handy for tolls (officially)

Hand one out to the occasional street urchin who shows originality or plays a musical instrument.


----------



## tohunt4me

Sacto Burbs said:


> Only those without a legitimate argument - or those who *profit *from arms sales - suggest to weak minds that "correlation" means the same thing as "causation". Nice try. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation
> 
> Here is another report showing correlation and causation:
> 
> "States with more gun laws have fewer gun-related deaths, according to a new study released Wednesday by Boston Children's Hospital."
> 
> http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/03/07/gun-violence-study-chicago/1969227/​
> The gun industry site uses a clever trick to eliminate all the relevant reasons why something happens and replace it with a single irrelevant one. Data from overseas - where there is little the Police can do protect citizens from the violence in society in the countries listed - is used. Also, there are some states that legally forbid gun death and injuries from be reported. So the data used leaves out a hefty number of the gruesome facts. Lumping Urban and Rural together is also a clever ploy to dilute the data. And, of course, follow the money - who paid for the reports and decides what to include and what to leave out.
> 
> I personally believe that anyone who comes here lobbying for the arms industry and linking to their sites is in violation of the terms of UP and the posts should be reported and deleted.


One word :

"CHICAGO"

that is all . . .


----------



## tohunt4me

scrurbscrud said:


> The very real legal difficulty they may have is in the prior written notification by a pax with no response.
> 
> That smells like deep pocketed liability all the way to me.


The police were notified also.
What is their liability ?


----------



## tohunt4me

space ghost said:


> The fact that this looney tune was reported to be highly unsafe by a passenger, then continued to drive, while uber was contacted to no avail, will make uber responsible to some extent. If the exact same scenario had played out in a cab you can bet that the phone call made to report him would have resulted in the dispatcher having the cops on his back bumper before he could blink.


Were any customers injured in the car ?
That is Ubers only liability.


----------



## tohunt4me

TwoFiddyMile said:


> My pax and i have been discussing "The Uber Killer" all morning.
> The Uber Killer.
> Yep.





observer said:


> I wonder if Uber got a complaint from another customer and the call he recieved was FROM Uber. This story kind of insinuates something like that may have happened. What doesn't make sense is why shoot the random people on the street and not the pax.


Thus PROVING that this deranged individuals actions had ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with Uber !


----------



## rtaatl

TwoFiddyMile said:


> My pax and i have been discussing "The Uber Killer" all morning.
> The Uber Killer.
> Yep.


Had a passenger too this morning "Did you hear about that crazy Uber driver?" 
Also Sway in the morning on SiriusXM...story of crazy Uber driver. Yeah, their name is attached to it.

If a limo operator or cabbie did something like this Uber would be eating it up, but that's not the case so Uber just enjoy your S#&@ sandwich for now. You take credit for the good so take credit for the bad....such is life.


----------



## Sacto Burbs

tohunt4me said:


> One word :
> 
> "CHICAGO"
> 
> that is all . . .


*Why Do Nearly One in Five Crime Guns in Chicago Originate at Just Four Gun Dealers?*

There's probably only one gun store that's located throughout the whole city of Chicago which is famous," an inmate told Professor Phil Cook and his fellow researchers in one of their two new studies. "It's Chuck's Gun Store."

Indeed, Chuck's has been identified in multiple sources for two decades as a major supplier of crime guns. It is near or at the top of the 5% of gun dealers that supply 90% of the guns used in crime. How can so many guns from just a few gun shops end up in criminal hands?

http://www.bradycampaign.org/blog/w...in-chicago-originate-at-just-four-gun-dealers


----------



## tohunt4me

Sacto Burbs said:


> *Why Do Nearly One in Five Crime Guns in Chicago Originate at Just Four Gun Dealers?*
> 
> There's probably only one gun store that's located throughout the whole city of Chicago which is famous," an inmate told Professor Phil Cook and his fellow researchers in one of their two new studies. "It's Chuck's Gun Store."
> 
> Indeed, Chuck's has been identified in multiple sources for two decades as a major supplier of crime guns. It is near or at the top of the 5% of gun dealers that supply 90% of the guns used in crime. How can so many guns from just a few gun shops end up in criminal hands?
> 
> http://www.bradycampaign.org/blog/w...in-chicago-originate-at-just-four-gun-dealers


CHICAGO . . .

BANG BANG


----------



## Sacto Burbs

tohunt4me said:


> Were any customers injured in the car ?
> That is Ubers only liability.


Their liability is everything to third parties when the app is on. Property and third party injuries. They have a no guns policy, yet the driver had a gun. APP ON is the key fact we don't know.


----------



## Sacto Burbs

tohunt4me said:


> CHICAGO . . .
> 
> BANG BANG


Follow the money:

Despite having some of the toughest gun regulations of any city in the country, Chicago continues to record thousands of shootings per year. As President Obama has pointed out, * that isn't a failing of the city's gun laws. *

The problem is that most of the guns used in crimes in Chicago come from neighboring states with lax gun laws. A study released last year by the city found that almost 60 percent of firearms recovered at Chicago crime scenes were first bought in states that do not require background checks for Internet or gun show sales, like neighboring Indiana and Wisconsin. Of the remaining crime guns, nearly half were purchased at three gun shops just outside the city.

http://www.thetrace.org/2016/01/chicago-crime-guns-chart/


----------



## tohunt4me

Sacto Burbs said:


> Their liability is everything to third parties when the app is on. Property and third party injuries. They have a no guns policy, yet the driver had a gun. APP ON is the key fact we don't know.


No gun policy.
The driver was willingly in violation of Uber no gun policy.
So he should be terminated at once.
No Uber passengers were harmed.
Uber did not own the car.
Uber did not own the gun.
Uber application being on harmed no one.

IF ANYTHING, THE DRIVER PICKING UP UBER PASSENGERS BETWEEN SHOOTINGS
. . .PREVENTED MORE DEATHS !

THANK GOD UBER INTERRUPTED HIS SHOOTINGS !


----------



## scrurbscrud

tohunt4me said:


> The police were notified also.
> What is their liability ?


IF I was the attorney of any of the victims family I would certainly question Uber's judgment in not disconnecting the driver from the app or reporting the illegal activity to the authorities. Uber knew where the guy was at all times and that he was driving pax unsafely, at least according to the report and they could have easily confirmed that report by the app as well by just matching up speed and erratic car path. Easily done on their part. That would have at least put him off the app and not have put any more pax in potential danger until they could question the driver.

The last place to look for liability would be to the government i.e. the police.


----------



## GrandTheftUber

tohunt4me said:


> No gun policy.
> The driver was willingly in violation of Uber no gun policy.
> So he should be terminated at once.
> No Uber passengers were harmed.
> Uber did not own the car.
> Uber did not own the gun.
> Uber application being on harmed no one.
> 
> IF ANYTHING, THE DRIVER PICKING UP UBER PASSENGERS BETWEEN SHOOTINGS
> . . .PREVENTED MORE DEATHS !
> 
> THANK GOD UBER INTERRUPTED HIS SHOOTINGS !


Uber doesn't kill people, underpaid and unhinged Uber drivers kill people.

I agree, this man deserves an Uber termination before he terminates again.

Looks like Uber pays damage control .80 a mile as well.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bart McCoy said:


> Cool
> I'll be back to comment when more FACTS are reported
> Until then, happy speculating. I mean while you're at it, speculate that Uber will raise everyone's rates by an extra $1 per mile.
> 
> Me reporting back to Travis or being a shill? You and Beachbum in a cornfield being a veteran poster I would think you would investigate a user's postings before making such an absurd claim. I'm a lil ashamed of yall, *thats a newb move*. If you read all my prior postings BEFORE I ever commented in this topic and comprehend from those posts that I'm a shill...... then I have to compare yall to this deranged guy that went on a killing spree.
> 
> Now yall take care, and continue to show that people and entities are guilty until proven innocent. I'll see yall again when more facts arise


It's time for you to post more spin because a new FACT has come out.

MR. DALTON HAS A CRIMINAL HISTORY.

Uber lied about this as well.


----------



## Just_in

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> It's time for you to post more spin because a new FACT has come out.
> 
> MR. DALTON HAS A CRIMINAL HISTORY.
> 
> Uber lied about this as well.


Wow. Have not heard this yet.


----------



## driveLA

lol its hilarious how hard a couple of you are trying to captain for uber

quoting almost every single negative post in this thread 

"what problem. there's no problem."

its only right there at the top when you type uber in google lol

and lol @ uber saying 4.7 is a good rating. now its a good rating. its borderline deactivation in uberland.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Just_in said:


> Wow. Have not heard this yet.


On 7/30/2014 Dalton had a CRIMINAL arrest for a probation violation.

It hasn't been determined what he was on probation for yet, but Uber outright lied about no criminal history.

Hello Bart McCoy! Why the silence? Waiting for your spin on this FACT!


----------



## stuber

UberPissed said:


> Kzoo police ID suspect in deadly random shootings
> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/20/multiple-fatally-shot-at-2-locations-in-kalamazoo-co/
> 
> TEXAS TOWNSHIP, Mich. (WOOD) - Six people are dead and two seriously wounded after a shooter opened fire at three different locations in the Kalamazoo area over the course of nearly five hours Saturday night.
> 
> Michigan State Police on Sunday identified the four victims killed at one of the crime scenes, the Cracker Barrel restaurant in Texas Township, as:
> 
> 
> Mary Lou Nye, 63, of Baroda, Mich.
> Mary Jo Nye, 60, of Battle Creek
> Dorothy Brown, 74, of Battle Creek
> Barbara Hawthorne, 68, of Battle Creek
> The names of the two other victims killed were not expected to be released Sunday.


I'd be curious...Was the shooter a member of UP.N? Administrators may know.


----------



## cferrel

Maybe they should of tipped.


----------



## Bart McCoy

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Hello Bart McCoy! Why the silence? Waiting for your spin on this FACT!


Because im waiting on the facts. ive only seen that one non reputable news site report this. But please, tag me again when you ACTUALLY find out what he was allegedly on parole for,until then, continue to speculate about what he was on parole for, smh. I don't know what the hold up is, if he committed a crime this is not a top secret clearance needed information. People should be able to pull this up real quick. I'm still waiting.

I'll respond back when more facts come out


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bart McCoy said:


> Because im waiting on the facts. ive only seen that one non reputable news site report this. But please, tag me again when you ACTUALLY find out what he was allegedly on parole for,until then, continue to speculate about what he was on parole for, smh. I don't know what the hold up is, if he committed a crime this is not a top secret clearance needed information. People should be able to pull this up real quick. I'm still waiting.
> 
> I'll respond back when more facts come out


probation violation, not parole. fyi


----------



## LA Cabbie

space ghost said:


> The fact that this looney tune was reported to be highly unsafe by a passenger, then continued to drive, while uber was contacted to no avail, will make uber responsible to some extent. If the exact same scenario had played out in a cab you can bet that the phone call made to report him would have resulted in the dispatcher having the cops on his back bumper before he could blink.


Damn straight. Like I said in an earlier post on this thread, I was driving erratic on the 405 due to still learning the new cab computer system, I got a call from dispatch saying a motorist complained about my driving. I look in the rear mirror SOB is flashing his high beams.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Bart McCoy said:


> Because im waiting on the facts. ive only seen that one non reputable news site report this. But please, tag me again when you ACTUALLY find out what he was allegedly on parole for,until then, continue to speculate about what he was on parole for, smh. I don't know what the hold up is, if he committed a crime this is not a top secret clearance needed information. People should be able to pull this up real quick. I'm still waiting.
> 
> I'll respond back when more facts come out


Is CNN reputable?

http://www.cnn.com/2016/02/22/us/kalamazoo-shooting-suspect-jason-brian-dalton-profile/

" Kalamazoo Public Safety Chief Jeff Hadley said. "He didn't have a lengthy criminal history. He wasn't a known troublemaker. And yet here he is, having shot eight people and killed six."

He didn't have a LENGTHY criminal history. That is completely different than NO criminal history that Uber is claiming.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile

LA Cabbie said:


> Damn straight. Like I said in an earlier post on this thread, I was driving erratic on the 405 due to still learning the new cab computer system, I got a call from dispatch saying a motorist complained about my driving. I look in the rear mirror SOB is flashing his high beams.


When i owned my mom and pop cab company, i had the auspicious honor of fielding my own complaint calls about ME.
"Oh the 22 driver? Hes going through domestic issues. Ill have a talk with him...".


----------



## trickynikki

Background and security checks mean little. An interview that is face to face, proper training, on going mentoring with field supervisors, a call in center for complaints and concerns can go a long way in weeding out bad apples. Uber's rating system is flawed. The drivers know this and it is just a plow to keep all drivers in fear and to give a sense of power to an ungrateful populace with a sense of entitlement. 

You all know own now that this Uber thing is flawed and is on a downhill slope. The money has gone. The stress is high and most of you don't like it. At least this what the comments reveal.


----------



## cferrel

I thought the safety fee protected all?


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> It's time for you to post more spin because a new FACT has come out.
> 
> MR. DALTON HAS A CRIMINAL HISTORY.
> 
> Uber lied about this as well.





UberBlackDriverLA said:


> On 7/30/2014 Dalton had a CRIMINAL arrest for a probation violation.
> 
> It hasn't been determined what he was on probation for yet, but Uber outright lied about no criminal history.
> 
> Hello Bart McCoy! Why the silence? Waiting for your spin on this FACT!


UBER lied???................Yer puttin me on!!!


----------



## driveLA

Bart McCoy said:


> Because im waiting on the facts. ive only seen that one non reputable news site report this. But please, tag me again when you ACTUALLY find out what he was allegedly on parole for,until then, continue to speculate about what he was on parole for, smh. I don't know what the hold up is, if he committed a crime this is not a top secret clearance needed information. People should be able to pull this up real quick. I'm still waiting.
> 
> I'll respond back when more facts come out


You've typed up a couple of novels worth of text up to this point

You haven't been waiting for facts at all


----------



## UberPissed

Bart McCoy said:


> Uber could very well be a trigger, I just haven't seen evidence to this yet.
> 
> Lets say he was driving for Uber 3 days out the week. Lets say he had a regular mon-fri job. Why blame uber instead of his day job? Obviously his day job doesn't pay that much if he chose to drive for uber part time...... That's like a lawyer driving for Uber on the weekends....
> 
> Ive been souring reports to find out if Uber was his only job. Nothing yet...


Hey! I'm a lawyer and I [used to] drive for uber!


----------



## UberPissed

ChinatownJake said:


> The Facebook post from the fiancee of Uber passenger Matt is unreal. She writes that:
> 
> 1) After sideswiping the car, driver refused Matt's request to stop and let him out.
> 2) Sped up to 80 mph on West Main Hill, "swerving in and out of oncoming traffic."
> 3) When the car finally slowed down, Pax bailed.
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/701428731517214720
> That is a nightmare ride right there.


I'm from Kalamazoo originally and this one hits too close to home. West main is a busy road. 2 lanes each way, with a turn lane in the middle. It runs on the north side of the WMU campus. So sad.


----------



## UberPissed

Bart McCoy said:


> Yeah, if all outlets brand this with Uber in the title(whether Uber played a role in it or not), then its a horrible look for the company.
> 
> Not like it'll make Uber raise rates. All it will do is make different markets press for fingerprints and stricter background checks. As if mass shooter always have done something illegal previously smh. Human have free will, you can't always find in the past what a person will do in the future...


Safety is our #1 priority - as such, we are charging riders a new security anti-postal fee of $2 per ride. UBER on!


----------



## Slavic Riga

driveLA said:


> You've typed up a couple of novels worth of text up to this point
> 
> You haven't been waiting for facts at all


Asking everybody for Facts while he can produce none & why should he?
Because he has to do the bidding of his Masters. "Go on the Forum, Check, Twist their statements & DEFEND, DEFEND, DEFEND. 
We as UBER have to know whether we will win in court or not or should we (UBER) SETTLE after denying all wrong doing.
Guys! Make your observations He is on the post throughout & similarly on another post DEFENDING.


----------



## Sacto Burbs

Hope your having fun Bart McCoy. You troll well ... 6 people dead and this thread decides to spend its time attacking and playing judge and jury over the baseless claim that you are an "Uber shill". Just because you want the facts first. smh

And Slavic Riga proves that the stereotype of Canadians being polite does not always fit.


----------



## trickynikki

Sacto Burbs said:


> Hope your having fun Bart McCoy. You troll well ... 6 people dead and this thread decides to spend its time attacking and playing judge and jury over the baseless claim that you are an "Uber shill". Just because you want the facts first. smh
> 
> And Slavic Riga proves that the stereotype of Canadians being polite does not always fit.


Can you please tell me why you brought up his nation? If you want to make a statement about him, then leave his nationality out of it.


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

rtaatl said:


> Had a passenger too this morning "Did you hear about that crazy Uber driver?"
> Also Sway in the morning on SiriusXM...story of crazy Uber driver. Yeah, their name is attached to it.
> 
> If a limo operator or cabbie did something like this Uber would be eating it up, but that's not the case so Uber just enjoy your S#&@ sandwich for now. You take credit for the good so take credit for the bad....such is life.


I was talking to one of the biomed techs at my regular job a few weeks ago and explaining the Houston fingerprinting etc. and how Uber's background checks are not that great in comparison.

He saw me today and said "You were right about Uber and safety!"

So I explained this driver likely would have passed anyway, but my point is, folks don't look at the details. If they have heard anything about issues with Uber's vetting of drivers, they will assume Uber did not do a good job vetting this one.

This is bad for Uber when they are fighting fingerprinting, drug testing, etc. regardless if those would have not helped this time. It makes them look as if they don't care about safety. which they don't, but now more people will see that if they don't change.


----------



## driveLA

Sacto Burbs said:


> Hope your having fun Bart McCoy. You troll well ... 6 people dead and this thread decides to spend its time attacking and playing judge and jury over the baseless claim that you are an "Uber shill". Just because you want the facts first. smh
> 
> And Slavic Riga proves that the stereotype of Canadians being polite does not always fit.


If he's trolling it's really amateurish

Who wastes so much time and typing on just trolling


----------



## Actionjax

Sacto Burbs said:


> Hope your having fun Bart McCoy. You troll well ... 6 people dead and this thread decides to spend its time attacking and playing judge and jury over the baseless claim that you are an "Uber shill". Just because you want the facts first. smh
> 
> And Slavic Riga proves that the stereotype of Canadians being polite does not always fit.


You have my apologies for Slavic Riga. Not sure how he got out of his box in the Toronto area of this board. But you are welcome to keep him or sell him for spare parts.


----------



## Sacto Burbs

trickynikki said:


> Can you please tell me why you brought up his nation? If you want to make a statement about him, then leave his nationality out of it.


My sincere apologies for characterizing Canadians as polite, in general. Mea culpa.


----------



## Sacto Burbs

driveLA said:


> If he's trolling it's really amateurish
> 
> Who wastes so much time and typing on just trolling


It's fun. Try it sometime. Take a set of blowhard, knee jerk responsive posters, trapped in a clique mindset of us-against-them, and ask them to ponder the facts instead of speculation. Hilarious responses - usually vicious, catty and dismissive. Jr. High stuff. I'm just waiting for someone to post "well you're stupid and ugly". Go Bart McCoy


----------



## Uberpoordriver

Dontmakemepullauonyou said:


> LMFAO
> 
> "The Kalamazoo Gazette reported that a resident identifying himself on Twitter as IamKeithBlack claimed in a tweet that he booked a 4.8-mile ride with Dalton at 8 p.m. on the night of the shootings. He uploaded a picture showing a receipt with Dalton's picture, the route and a payment of $7.18. The shootings took place at three sites between 5:42 p.m. and 10:24 p.m., the Gazette reported."
> 
> 4.8mile ride and with Safe Rider Fee cost the rider $7.18. Driver looked at the payout after the ride and well you know the rest.


Wow $7.18 dam uber needs to raise rates maybe if it said $20 I'm sure this would not have happend


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Sacto Burbs said:


> It's fun. Try it sometime. Take a set of blowhard, knee jerk responsive posters, trapped in a clique mindset of us-against-them, and ask them to ponder the facts instead of speculation. Hilarious responses - usually vicious, catty and dismissive. Jr. High stuff. I'm just waiting for someone to post "well you're stupid and ugly". Go Bart McCoy


Bart is wisely remaining silent because the facts that are coming out do not support his position.


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> This one for example...
> http://www.breitbart.com/big-govern...oots-passenger-who-was-allegedly-choking-him/
> or this one for example...
> http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20150608/news/150608923/
> or this one for example...
> http://www.thetrace.org/2015/07/uber-gun-austin-car/
> 
> Of course, these are just a few examples.


Let's add this to the list.

http://wach.com/news/local/uber-driver-charged-with-pointing-gun-at-taxi-driver


----------



## UberBlackPr1nce

TwoFiddyMile said:


> He drove PAX between shootings?
> Shocking story.


I was reading an article online and someone posted this comment.

"This isn't about security. This is about Uber paying so little that serial killers have to pick up fares between kills"


----------



## TwoFiddyMile

UberBlackPr1nce said:


> I was reading an article online and someone posted this comment.
> 
> "This isn't about security. This is about Uber paying so little that serial killers have to pick up fares between kills"


"Coming soon to YOUR city, UberBerserker!
We pay these clowns even less than X!
Enjoy your Russian Roulette. 
Will you be a winner?
Or will you be a victim?
Our background checks are so seamless they hardly count at all.


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

UberBlackPr1nce said:


> I was reading an article online and someone posted this comment.
> 
> "This isn't about security. This is about Uber paying so little that serial killers have to pick up fares between kills"


Gotta pay for those bullets somehow.


----------



## Darrell Green Fan

notfair said:


> Matt Mellen was one of the passengers Dalton picked up before the bloodshed started.
> 
> About 1 mile into the trip, Mellen told CNN's "AC360," Dalton received a phone call. Mellen heard Dalton tell the caller he had a rider at the moment, and that he would call back after dropping him off.
> 
> Dalton hung up, and then started driving erratically, Mellen said.
> 
> Source: http://alturl.com/kjmnb
> 
> ---
> All victims white? All victims heterosexual with strong belief in God? KIA chose a different state for manufacturing plant by the way. Random shooting? No way. My guess is he wanted to go to prison.


I brought the phone call up several pages ago, surprised nobody commented on it. That phone call appears to be the key that unlocks this entire mystery.


----------



## Darrell Green Fan

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Is CNN reputable?
> 
> http://www.cnn.com/2016/02/22/us/kalamazoo-shooting-suspect-jason-brian-dalton-profile/
> 
> " Kalamazoo Public Safety Chief Jeff Hadley said. "He didn't have a lengthy criminal history. He wasn't a known troublemaker. And yet here he is, having shot eight people and killed six."
> 
> He didn't have a LENGTHY criminal history. That is completely different than NO criminal history that Uber is claiming.


I do not agree with Bart McCoy at all in this thread. Of course Uber is a huge part of the story. But you really need to pay more attention to the articles you are using in your argument. From the article:

"Uber Chief Security Officer Joe Sullivan said Dalton passed a background check. *Police also said Dalton did not have a criminal record."*

Saying he did not have a lengthly criminal history could mean anythung including nothing more than speeding tickets.


----------



## Just_in

Darrell Green Fan said:


> I do not agree with Bart McCoy at all in this thread. Of course Uber is a huge part of the story. But you really need to pay more attention to the articles you are using in your argument. From the article:
> 
> "Uber Chief Security Officer Joe Sullivan said Dalton passed a background check. *Police also said Dalton did not have a criminal record."*
> 
> Saying he did not have a lengthly criminal history could mean anythung including nothing more than speeding tickets.


Speeding tickets, driving without proof of insurance...in multiples. More than one. Or one time.

It's a big red flag..It shows a pattern for disregard..

I seriously doubt this shooter (Dalton) would have got hired by a Taxi or Limo Company..


----------



## rtaatl

Just_in said:


> Speeding tickets, driving without proof of insurance...in multiples. More than one. Or one time.
> 
> It's a big red flag..It shows a pattern for disregard..
> 
> I seriously doubt this shooter (Dalton) would have got hired by a Taxi or Limo Company..


He sure wouldn't...too much of a premium on commercial insurance. Oh wait, Uber doesn't really care about that.
Really this brings up a big question, if he can get on boarded with this driving record, one that any livery company would instantly reject, then does Uber really have this umbrella coverage that's viable.


----------



## Bart McCoy

rtaatl said:


> He sure wouldn't...too much of a premium on commercial insurance. Oh wait, Uber doesn't really care about that.
> Really this brings up a big question, if he can get on boarded with this driving record, one that any livery company would instantly reject, then does Uber really have this umbrella coverage that's viable.


I guess it all depends on how far back you go. Do you count all infractions since he was 16 years old? From what I read, his last ticket was in 2006, 10 years ago.....

How far back of a clean record do you need to join a cab or livery company?

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...-history-driving-violations-article-1.2539870


----------



## Slavic Riga

trickynikki said:


> Can you please tell me why you brought up his nation? If you want to make a statement about him, then leave his nationality out of it.


Give Sacto Burbs the benefit of doubt.
Was making a point people round the world acknowledge & state that "Canadians are polite".


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Apparently you guys have never been to Montreal .......(Just kidding.....I KID THE QUEBECUA!!!!.....relax ...just some levity)


----------



## UberBlackDriverLA

Another thread to read on this topic...
https://uberpeople.net/threads/uberrampage-some-questions-that-need-answers.62774/

Dalton was arrested for a criminal probation violation. I doubt he was on probation for minor traffic offenses.


----------



## trickynikki

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Another thread to read on this topic...
> https://uberpeople.net/threads/uberrampage-some-questions-that-need-answers.62774/
> 
> Dalton was arrested for a criminal probation violation. I doubt he was on probation for minor traffic offenses.


 Looks like someone lied if this is accurate.


----------



## trickynikki

everythingsuber said:


> What are McDonald's paying an hour. Do their employees have commitments they cannot meet owing to a pay cut? If a McDonald's employee was involved in something like this I would be asking those questions


McDonald's hires many part timers who are also too young to drive for UBER. I have never read any exaggeration of what McDonald's pay. A person who works at McDonald's knows what the pay is and what the deductions are. Many people don't drive cabs because of certain risks involved, but Uber is always touting high incomes, flexible work hours (you have to work when it's busy or starve) making it sound so good and so cool.For most of us we have come to know that this is a joke. If McDonald's was promising high incomes, and their employees were being exploited the way Uber does its drivers, then one could have so excited sympathy for the workers. However, if people who thought that Uber was going good to help people make money they should have seen the warning signs. Uber is the the American dream of a free market, and the road to hell for its drivers. Why does Uber have such a high turn over?


----------



## wethepeople

yeah "above industry standard background checks" rrrriight...

They are so full of shit.


----------



## backstreets-trans

http://fox6now.com/2016/02/23/police-kalamazoo-rampage-suspect-had-no-mental-health-history/

*Circling a parking lot*

Tiana Carruthers was the first victim, authorities said. She was shot in front of her children, and survived.

Carruthers' neighbor, Tammy George, told CNN Carruthers had an instinct that something was wrong.

George, who was inside her home when the shooting happened, but talked with witnesses, said Carruthers was looking after some children, including her own, at a playground.

A car drove up and the driver asked for someone named "Missy" or "Misty," before circling the playground in his vehicle.

At that point, George said, Carruthers "just knew something was wrong and told (the children) to run."

Carruthers had been shot.

The neighbor said she believes the shooting was random. Even though the suspect asked for someone by name, George thinks it was just a ploy to drive around the complex.

About 15 casings were found on the property, George said. Four of the bullets hit her apartment, including one that penetrated the wall and entered a closet. It was stopped by an insulated cooler stored inside.

What if the first shooting started because this missy/misty ordered an uber but no showed on the killer. Just a theory but they should look into whether the shooting locations were places the shooter got ride requests from. Very easy to find out.


----------



## driveLA

it been kinda dead the last couple days since this happend

is travis fired yet?


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

notfair said:


> This whole thing is super weird.


You better believe it....the other car had better have been approved by UBER.... otherwise this dude could be in some trouble!!!


----------



## Tim54913

I wonder how many people he would have shot if he hadn't kept getting pinged to go back to work?


----------



## doyousensehumor

I dont think Uber is totally liable or totally not liable. Of course the priamary person responsible is the shooter... but Uber's lack of action and background screening may have been FACTORS in this tragity.

Most times tragaties are a chain of mistakes or failures. Each may be a factor that contributed to the outcome. A proper investigation would determine what should have happened in reaction to the events unfolding and could a better background check done anything. What red flags were missed? Hindsight may be 20-20, and but decisions that are made when an incident is unfolding can only be made based on what is known at that time. 

The exact status of his app is over rated. But may be a technicality that Uber gets out of some resposibility.

IMO Ubers reputation wont be signaficantly damaged by this. They are the largest transportation company in the world. Some where in the world there might be a rouge driver on a rampage... but rates are around 75 cents per mile. Pax just dont give a **** at those rates its almost free.

Does driving for Uber make you crazy, or are crazy people more likely to be attracted to driving for Uber?


----------



## RockinEZ

What are you folks doing? Grasping at straws? Looking for anything that is negative that can be blamed on Uber?

This is actually the stupidest link to an Uber driver I have seen so far. 

I hate Uber, and Uber has nothing to do with this news post.


----------



## Darrell Green Fan

I seriously have to question how anyone can continue to claim this won't hurt Uber. Even if they are not held liable what company on Earth wants their brand linked to a mass murder? And make no mistake they are a part of the story when the company name appears in every headline.

Still looking to understand what the phone call was all about. It's obviously the key to this entire thing.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile

Darrell Green Fan said:


> I seriously have to question how anyone can continue to claim this won't hurt Uber. Even if they are not held liable what company on Earth wants their brand linked to a mass murder? And make no mistake they are a part of the story when the company name appears in every headline.
> 
> Still looking to understand what the phone call was all about. It's obviously the key to this entire thing.


Id be interested to hearfrom Kalamazoo drivers at this point to see what impact this nut job has had on business flow.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

RockinEZ said:


> What are you folks doing? Grasping at straws? Looking for anything that is negative that can be blamed on Uber?
> 
> This is actually the stupidest link to an Uber driver I have seen so far.
> 
> I hate Uber, and Uber has nothing to do with this news post.


Stupid, hate, Bart....starting to see a pattern here. This thread is making troll hunting easy as shooting fish in a barrel!!! "Anything that can be blamed on Uber" Well let's see ....6 dead 2 in ICU all done by a man who seemed to have been working for Uber at the time he did this sick stuff. Uber's response to all of this??? Nothing.....anything to help it's "partners" deal with current customers who have some valid concerns (IE "do you feel Uber has effective screening of driver")?? Hell no!!!! Only paid shills assuring us Uber has nothing to do with this and that we are stupid and not dealing with facts. This is my new favorite pastime..... outing Uber trolls......


----------



## Bart McCoy

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> Only paid shills assuring us Uber has nothing to do with this and that we are stupid and not dealing with facts.


I am real interested in hearing your alleged "facts" that Uber is responsible for the shooting. Me, I'm still waiting for those facts to come out.



doyousensehumor said:


> but Uber's lack of ............. background screening may have been FACTORS in this tragity.


I am real interested in hearing about this lack. The shooter (despite the speculative topic by ch1cabby) has no known criminal history other than some traffic violations, that EVERYBODY has. He has no known mental illess history. So exactly how did Uber lack in that background process? I guess you want Uber to somehow predict the future on somebody who had no red flags in his past?


----------



## rtaatl

Say what you want about who's to blame, but I've received more random Uber black pings this week than I can remember in the past year. So there definitely seems to be some sort of effect towards UberX after this incident.


----------



## Bart McCoy

rtaatl said:


> Say what you want about who's to blame, but I've received more random Uber black pings this week than I can remember in the past year. So there definitely seems to be some sort of effect towards UberX after this incident.


Lol, so this isn't an Uber problem, but only an UberX problem? Right, because pax know Uber black drivers could never possibly do something an UberX driver does.

Im pretty sure if any pax thinks uber is at fault for the shootings, they are clearly thinking UBER as the problem, not UberX, but any driving platform of uber. I don't even remember one report even mention which level of uber it was. And I know no one believes uber always get it right on Uber black hires, but only screws up on background checks and things on UberX?


----------



## rtaatl

Bart McCoy said:


> Lol, so this isn't an Uber problem, but only an UberX problem? Right, because pax know Uber black drivers could never possibly do something an UberX driver does.


It's about half and half. I've ran into a number of pax that know the difference, at least here in Atlanta where as the X drivers are pretty much anyone and the Black drivers are vetted and insured a little more. Than there's always the ones who think Uber is just Uber along with the the few that go Black because they couldn't find an X available. It just depends, but what I can say is this week has been great for catching random pings in between my regular work.....wanna take a guess what came up as a topic of conversation with several of the pax this week, lol!


----------



## Bart McCoy

rtaatl said:


> It's about half and half. I've ran into a number of pax that know the difference, at least here in Atlanta where as the X drivers are pretty much anyone and the Black drivers are vetted and insured a little more. Than there's always the ones who think Uber is just Uber along with the the few that go Black because they couldn't find an X available. It just depends, but what I can say is this week has been great for catching random pings in between my regular work.....wanna take a guess what came up as a topic of conversation with several of the pax this week, lol!


I agree somewhat, some pax know the different levels, but mainly just by price. I'll even say that black drivers may be better drivers than X, but I surely doubt many pax know about the insurance part. They just think they are covered.

But if you are making money, good for you, capitalize as much as you can. I'm not an Uber fan because of the low rates, but I don't blame them for things out of their control just because I hate them.

But curios, as you say you talk about the incident,how do most feel on average? Uber has a big problem with drivers, just an isolated incident, or they feel safer with Black? Or on lyft? Serious question.

I haven't driven since the incident(totally unrelated reasons of course)


----------



## rtaatl

Bart McCoy said:


> But curios, as you say you talk about the incident,how do most feel on average? Uber has a big problem with drivers, just an isolated incident, or they feel safer with Black? Or on lyft? Serious question.


 Out of the seven passengers three brought it up. One was a little tipsy, said he usually takes UberX a lot...inconclusive whether I was hailed because of the incident, but thought it was diferrent. The other two seemed fairly concerned, but there's no telling how they might feel after a month or so. With all that goes on news cycles are fairly short and most people's attention span don't last more than a week. Yet as of right now there seems to be an effect. I'm sure this incident sits more with every state's regulators instead of the general public since they have a lot more to lose if something like this happens again.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Bart McCoy said:


> I am real interested in hearing your alleged "facts" that Uber is responsible for the shooting. Me, I'm still waiting for those facts to come out.
> 
> Bart.....you know I love you man but this is getting old....You know my position on this...dude was workin Uber while killing people. I wonder why you don't address the rest of my post which deals with the lack of support from Uber for it's partners while fielding questions from pax....does that not bother you and if not...why?
> 
> I am real interested in hearing about this lack. The shooter (despite the speculative topic by ch1cabby) has no known criminal history other than some traffic violations, that EVERYBODY has. He has no known mental illess history. So exactly how did Uber lack in that background process? I guess you want Uber to somehow predict the future on somebody who had no red flags in his past?


----------



## Bart McCoy

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> Bart.....you know I love you man but this is getting old....You know my position on this...dude was workin Uber while killing people. I wonder why you don't address the rest of my post which deals with the lack of support from Uber for it's partners while fielding questions from pax....does that not bother you and if not...why?!


Couple things, facts simply aren't clear that he was working WHILE killing people, lets leave that at alleged. I would have to 100% know for a fact he was doing that before I can comment on him doing that....

The rest of your post which deals about lack of support from Uber, is not what I believe the topic is about. The topic is about a crazy guy that killed people. I don't think Uber has anything to do with his crazyness.

However, does or should Uber have a way for pax to have direct contact with them? or a public safet number to give out? sure.But thats neither here nor there. You're mixing 2 different things here

1) the wild ride the guy took WITH a pax. Sure uber may have some problems with that, no doubt
2) the shooter shooting people with NO pax in the car. Nothing to do with uber, just a crazy man riding around on his own time doing stupid crazy stuff


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Bart McCoy said:


> Couple things, facts simply aren't clear that he was working WHILE killing people, lets leave that at alleged. I would have to 100% know for a fact he was doing that before I can comment on him doing that....
> 
> The rest of your post which deals about lack of support from Uber, is not what I believe the topic is about. The topic is about a crazy guy that killed people. I don't think Uber has anything to do with his crazyness.
> 
> However, does or should Uber have a way for pax to have direct contact with them? or a public safet number to give out? sure.But thats neither here nor there. You're mixing 2 different things here
> 
> 1) the wild ride the guy took WITH a pax. Sure uber may have some problems with that, no doubt
> 2) the shooter shooting people with NO pax in the car. Nothing to do with uber, just a crazy man riding around on his own time doing stupid crazy stuff


OK...I think we may be on the verge of a breakthrough here Bart. Let's stipulate to the facts aren't in as to whether he was working for UBER during the killing spree....cool? But then you must please admit to me that UBER has been mentioned in almost all reportage regarding this matter ...cool? Now here is where it gets interesting brah so stick with me.

I have on 3 different occasions mentioned the FACT that UBER has said nothing to it's partners about potential reactions from the customer base. You have ignored it each time until I kind of dragged it out of you per our last exchange. Your only reaction was that you don't think it belongs in this thread. Now, since we are now almost BFFs I'm going to fight the urge to suggest that only a skilled publicist would try to parse this very important subject from the rest of the thread. You see, part of good stewardship and corporate management is to protect those in the organization who interact with the customers and the public (I believe that may even be PR 101) after a high visibility incident such as a killing spree involving our trade name.

Could you please tell me why you think this rather key issue should be dealt with elsewhere and would you mind responding to the notion that NOT supporting it's partners after such an incident is indicative of UBER's generally condescending attitude towards it's "partners"?....please.


----------



## secretadmirer

I certainly don't blame uber for this driver that went postal. However I do question there response time when one of the pax earlier complained about adriver's erratic driving. For example, if a cabbie was driving like that, all the pax would have to do is contact their dispatcher (or 911) and in turn could call the cops and give them all the details of the car. That driver would be off the road with in 1/2 hour. and most likely fired etc. But the point is is that if uber had a call center they might have prevented that from happening. (while he was still driving for uber).


----------



## Bart McCoy

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> OK...I think we may be on the verge of a breakthrough here Bart. Let's stipulate to the facts aren't in as to whether he was working for UBER during the killing spree....cool? But then you must please admit to me that UBER has been mentioned in almost all reportage regarding this matter ...cool? Now here is where it gets interesting brah so stick with me.
> 
> I have on 3 different occasions mentioned the FACT that UBER has said nothing to it's partners about potential reactions from the customer base. You have ignored it each time until I kind of dragged it out of you per our last exchange. Your only reaction was that you don't think it belongs in this thread. Now, since we are now almost BFFs I'm going to fight the urge to suggest that only a skilled publicist would try to parse this very important subject from the rest of the thread. You see, part of good stewardship and corporate management is to protect those in the organization who interact with the customers and the public (I believe that may even be PR 101) after a high visibility incident such as a killing spree involving our trade name.
> 
> Could you please tell me why you think this rather key issue should be dealt with elsewhere and would you mind responding to the notion that NOT supporting it's partners after such an incident is indicative of UBER's generally condescending attitude towards it's "partners"?....please.


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>But then you must please admit to me that UBER has been mentioned in almost all reportage regarding this matter ...cool
Yes, but because media mentions it, its not fact. All media is saying is "Uber driver killed 6 people". No reputable media has said "Uber is responsible" or "killer hate/problems with Uber forced him to kill"

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Could you please tell me why you think this rather key issue should be dealt with elsewhere
Simple, as mentioned, 2 different issues. Uber's only real concern and culpability should be the wild ride he gave one back. And in that aspect uber should make some changes/adjustments. No debate there, and I never debated that. The shooting was out of Uber's reach and control, Uber cannot play god. I've always debated that (that uber is not at fault)

Yes it "involves" their trade name, but its no different if the guy shot 3 people,then went back to work for mcdonalds for an hour,left mcdonalds and then immediately shot more people. The headlines would be "Mcdonald's worker shoots 6" or "McDonalds worker kills people inbetween his work shift". the media of course instantly looks at Mcdonald's background hiring process. But none of that matters, because the guy killed off work outside of mcdonalds jurisdiction. There's nothing mcdonalds can do to control any human outside of work. The same goes for the Uber driver riding around with no pax in his car shooting random folks



secretadmirer said:


> response time when one of the pax earlier complained about adriver's erratic driving. For example, if a cabbie was driving like that, all the pax would have to do is contact their dispatcher (or 911) and in turn could call the cops and give them all the details of the car. That driver would be off the road with in 1/2 hour. and most likely fired etc. But the point is is that if uber had a call center they might have prevented that from happening. (while he was still driving for uber).


So that cab driver would be off the road in a half hour huh? Lets say he was. Now not sure how taxis work, but if thats his car he can go out and kill. Or if its not his car, he can go home and get his personal car and still go out and kill. So how exactly does you calling your dispacther isntant "get that guy off the road" in relation to not being able to shoot people?????????????Now if Uber somebody magically took deactivation action within 10min of that guy swideswiping and his pax jumping out to effectively "take him off the road" as you say. Obviously, uber doesn't own his car. So how could uber forcibly stop this guy from still going out in his own personal car and shooting people,which is exactly what he did?


----------



## Uber 1

scrurbscrud said:


> Holy Crap. Can Uber have any worse PR than that?! Uber driver runs amok and randomly kills 6-7 ppl!
> 
> Almost unreal. But, we have observed here for quite some time, the difficulties drivers face. Financial pressure and general hopelessness, even when working like a slave to get ahead, can and does break people. Particularly if they are weak minded to begin with.
> 
> And what better example than Mich. where Uber has slashed driver sustainability rates to absurdity negative.


It would have been WORSE for Uber had the driver started killing PAX rather than randoms.... ;-O

If "afflenza" can get somebody off for a crime , I wonder if financial frustrations can get Uber in trouble ?

Andy


----------



## doyousensehumor

I understand Barts point.. one word to sum it up is "scapegoat." The shooter can't say Uber made me do it. It might take Uber hours to respond to a hit and run complaint while a cab company would have in minunts. But Uber nor the police had reason at the time to link a traffic complaint to an active shooter.

I guess the Uber Connection discussion would be like people who don't like cops reading a headline that reads "White cop shoots black teen" and beleving _without any facts_ it was because he was a racist cop.


----------



## doyousensehumor

If another driver went homicidal within a few weeks we could expect Ubers PR to take a huge hit.


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

doyousensehumor said:


> If another driver went homicidal within a few weeks we could expect Ubers PR to take a huge hit.


LOL.....If this happens again, you can expect UBER to close it's doors and the rideshare industry to fold it's tent!!!!

Bart; you didn't answer my question (again)....sorry man but I am moving on from you.


----------



## Uberme4450

UberPissed said:


> Kzoo police ID suspect in deadly random shootings
> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/20/multiple-fatally-shot-at-2-locations-in-kalamazoo-co/
> 
> TEXAS TOWNSHIP, Mich. (WOOD) - Six people are dead and two seriously wounded after a shooter opened fire at three different locations in the Kalamazoo area over the course of nearly five hours Saturday night.
> 
> Michigan State Police on Sunday identified the four victims killed at one of the crime scenes, the Cracker Barrel restaurant in Texas Township, as:
> 
> 
> Mary Lou Nye, 63, of Baroda, Mich.
> Mary Jo Nye, 60, of Battle Creek
> Dorothy Brown, 74, of Battle Creek
> Barbara Hawthorne, 68, of Battle Creek
> The names of the two other victims killed were not expected to be released Sunday.


Uber makes all drivers on edge as their Livelihood is controlled by a APP Uber APP Razor APP Who is Uber Tech ?? nobody gets it do you? Please reply


----------



## Uberme4450

How many employees does Uber have since we are Independent Contractors and if I am rite very few and all the money to a hand full of billionaires and we start to junk our cars and what has Uber done for you lately in a war of pricing the West side Story Continued !

Drivers Unite Uber and Razor are not people UBER is a scary APP that has you by the balls but Not ME Uninstall that Btch!


----------



## Bart McCoy

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> Bart; you didn't answer my question (again)....sorry man but I am moving on from you.


Hmmm, I thought I did. Did you ask a question in secret code or something?


----------



## Uberme4450

Cross the line make history, ride share is here to stay, lets unite in locals Deactivate Uber and Solicit a app that is not judge and jury we will have a board of directors, we will vote for.

We have the power / Uber is a app ? razor is crap Uninstall no need to picket - Junno Temp contract to work for us!!!


----------



## simpsonsverytall

Uber needs to improve their process on dealing with acts of violence like the side-swipe incident.


----------



## Bart McCoy

The latest on the killers motive: there is none. He only drove for Uber for a couple of weeks,he experience no rates cuts like many of us drivers have. 2 weeks is a very short time to have enough alleged hate for Uber to kill people that had nothing to do with Uber.....

Of course we can speculate forever why he did it. This whole topic is a testament to that! smh









http://news.yahoo.com/family-michigan-man-charged-uber-shootings-know-no-175053356.html


----------



## Uberme4450

Uber is a big problem with a easy solution uninstall them Ouch Novel Idea who is in charge here ?????? gee let me think YOUUUUUUU


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Bart McCoy said:


> The latest on the killers motive: there is none. He only drove for Uber for a couple of weeks,he experience no rates cuts like many of us drivers have. 2 weeks is a very short time to have enough alleged hate for Uber to kill people that had nothing to do with Uber.....
> 
> Of course we can speculate forever why he did it. This whole topic is a testament to that! smh
> View attachment 29688
> 
> 
> http://news.yahoo.com/family-michigan-man-charged-uber-shootings-know-no-175053356.html


Hmmmm....just read the Reuters piece....says nothing about how long he drive for UBER....are these those facts that you so desperately want us to wait for? How do you know how long he drove for UBER?? Seems to me that is something only UBER would know. Nonetheless Bart, these facts of yours are pretty damn thin....Not sure I can call Bart's facts..... facts. Maybe Farts?


----------



## Just_in

Bart McCoy said:


> The latest on the killers motive: there is none. He only drove for Uber for a couple of weeks,he experience no rates cuts like many of us drivers have. 2 weeks is a very short time to have enough alleged hate for Uber to kill people that had nothing to do with Uber.....
> 
> Of course we can speculate forever why he did it. This whole topic is a testament to that! smh
> View attachment 29688
> 
> 
> http://news.yahoo.com/family-michigan-man-charged-uber-shootings-know-no-175053356.html


Give it time. Eventually a motive will come out. Either directly or indirectly. A individual such as this all the sudden decides to shoot innocent people.

The FBI, law enforcement,, detectives are digging thru this shooters background and interviewing people as we speak..looking thru his computers..cell phone...credit cards..something will show up..


----------



## Bart McCoy

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> Hmmmm....just read the Reuters piece....says nothing about how long he drive for UBER....are these those facts that you so desperately want us to wait for? How do you know how long he drove for UBER??


''

The fact is he was only approved to drive for Uber on January 25th of 2016!!!! he drove for 2-3 weeks TOPS since he was arrested a week ago and its only Feb 27th!! But for the people that hate UBer so much, all he needs to do is drive for 48hours and they believe that enough to build up pent up frustration to kill 6 people that had nothing to do with Uber












Just_in said:


> Give it time. Eventually a motive will come out. Either directly or indirectly. A individual such as this all the sudden decides to shoot innocent people.
> The FBI, law enforcement,, detectives are digging thru this shooters background and interviewing people as we speak..looking thru his computers..cell phone...credit cards..something will show up..


I agree, give it time,but not sure why you quoted me. You need to quote the 92 other posters who are blaming Uber for the shooting and not waiting for the FBI and detectives to dig through!


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

doyousensehumor said:


> I guess the Uber Connection discussion would be like people who don't like cops reading a headline that reads "White cop shoots black teen" and beleving _without any facts_ it was because he was a racist cop.


But that's the whole point. If a white cop shoots a black kid that police department immediately has a problem. It may be a perfectly justified shooting, and no racism involved, but that's still the assumption of many people, and their perception still has to be addressed.

So this is a problem for Uber no matter what. And ignoring it makes them look worse. The fact that they also have no way to report ANY issue quickly to them just makes them seem even more uncaring and out of touch.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

UberPissed said:


> Kzoo police ID suspect in deadly random shootings
> http://woodtv.com/2016/02/20/multiple-fatally-shot-at-2-locations-in-kalamazoo-co/
> 
> TEXAS TOWNSHIP, Mich. (WOOD) - Six people are dead and two seriously wounded after a shooter opened fire at three different locations in the Kalamazoo area over the course of nearly five hours Saturday night.
> 
> Michigan State Police on Sunday identified the four victims killed at one of the crime scenes, the Cracker Barrel restaurant in Texas Township, as:
> 
> 
> Mary Lou Nye, 63, of Baroda, Mich.
> Mary Jo Nye, 60, of Battle Creek
> Dorothy Brown, 74, of Battle Creek
> Barbara Hawthorne, 68, of Battle Creek
> The names of the two other victims killed were not expected to be released Sunday.


POST #:1/UberPissed: I am delighted
that after 18.3
MONTHS of Dedicated Efforts, your FIRST
"Featured Thread" has Gone Viral with
662 Posts & Replies inside of a WEEK!

I WILL have to Check Stats on this, but
preliminarily, it is the 4th Biggest Thread
in the UPNF DataBase, a Very Deserving
Result for a Senior Member.

Bison Admires. Bison Inspires!


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

backstreets-trans said:


> Can you say public relations nightmare. I hope a news channel actually does a real expose on the stress uber has put drivers through and the fact we are losing money on every trip. Uber's unicorn bubble status is about to burst.


POST #:15/backstreets-trans: From your
lips to God's Ear!


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

ChinatownJake said:


> The Facebook post from the fiancee of Uber passenger Matt is unreal. She writes that:
> 
> 1) After sideswiping the car, driver refused Matt's request to stop and let him out.
> 2) Sped up to 80 mph on West Main Hill, "swerving in and out of oncoming traffic."
> 3) When the car finally slowed down, Pax bailed.
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/701428731517214720
> That is a nightmare ride right there.


POST #:29/ChinatownJake: Good Find!


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Urban Uber said:


> Jobs are available all over the country... Some communities are not at full employment yet and some good people are working for Uber as Independent Contractors between jobs.. This tragedy is not related to UBER.. All drivers have the option to NOT drive if costs are not being covered.. If income is not supporting them or their families... If an unstable person passes the back ground checks ( minimal at best) and commits a crime while approved to drive for UBER.. This does not become an UBER crime... " going postal" did not mean that the pressures working for the United States Postal Service caused the tragic crimes that occurred... There are mentally unstable people amongst us all.. Diagnosed and undiagnosed... It's tragic for the families and the shooter... It's not related to UBER.


POST #:33/Urban Uber :..... WRONG &
WRONG !
Five Months a UPNF Member, yet you
are FIRST WITH A COMPLETE EXONER-
TION OF #[F]Uber ?

Hailing from the City where"Going Postal"
went Airborn [Boston/ 09MAY 1989] AND 
having Friends AND Relatives Employed 
by USPS I CAN CATEGORICALLY say that Unrelenting Pressure to Perform CAN 
and DOES create Sufficient Anger/Hopeless-
ness to Trigger a Psychotic Episode of this
Magnitude.

Mentoring Bison: Anger Kills.
BTW: He DID have a Criminal Record:
☆ ☆ ☆ #[F]UberFail !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Urban Uber said:


> A star football player is in prison today because he killed at least 2 people... Was this an NFL killing or a mentally unstable player who killed and was signed to an NFL contract... He was certainly making more than 1000 a week for the NFL... Salary ... Wages... Does not equal killer..


POST # 40/Urban Uber: WRONG AGAIN!
I guess you've
NEVER heard of Football Players with
CTE/Brain Injury Induced Violent Beha-
vior ?

Just Google "Junior Seau" a Retired
New England Patriot ! He KNEW of
his own TBI. Although he committed sui-
cide, he shot himself through the CHEST,
BECAUSE he wanted Boston University
Med. School Researchers to examine his
Brain...Post Mortem!

I'm CERTAIN Other Members will provide Examples from THEIR "Home NFL Teams".

Mentoring Bison: S....M....H....!


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

Casuale Haberdasher said:


> POST #:1/UberPissed: I am delighted
> that after 18.3
> MONTHS of Dedicated Efforts, your FIRST
> "Featured Thread" has Gone Viral with
> 662 Posts & Replies inside of a WEEK!
> 
> I WILL have to Check Stats on this, but
> preliminarily, it is the 4th Biggest Thread
> in the UPNF DataBase, a Very Deserving
> Result for a Senior Member.
> 
> Bison Admires. Bison Inspires!


Well not to burst his bubble, but didn't we do like 30 pages once on whether to offer pax water? Lol


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Fuzzyelvis said:


> Well not to burst his bubble, but didn't we do like 30 pages once on whether to offer pax water? Lol


POST # 668/Fuzzyelvis : As a Man from
Missouri once
SO NOTABLY SAID: "I am from Missouri,
Sir. You will have to SHOW ME."

Mentoring Bison: MO. State Motto, BTW.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Jack Pavlov said:


> I'm going to be brutally honest. The majority of people in this thread are jumping to some extreme assumptions that somehow Uber is responsible. You may not like Uber, and may be having a negative experience with them but they are not liable for this nor is their act of cutting rates. Clearly this man had far worse problems than Uber not paying him enough. People also need to realize that there is a level of personal responsibility. He CHOSE to work Uber, he CHOSE to live a lifestyle he couldn't afford, he CHOSE to commit these acts (unless there are other psychological reasons at play. Pointing a weapon at someone with the intent to kill, is a very very difficult task, let alone pulling the trigger.
> 
> It is more than likely that he just happened to work for Uber and people are prematurely making that correlation that uber is to blame.


POST #:49/Jack Pavlov: What IS "Pav-
lovian" is the
"Knee Jerk" reaction to ABSOLVE 
#[F]Uber of ANY RESPONSIBILITY by
the Participants in this Thread!

Bison : U N B E L I E V E A B L E !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> And I will give a brutally honest reply to why I believe your opinion is wrong.
> 
> UBER DOES NOT PROPERLY VET THEIR EMPLOYEES.
> 
> Uber does not require fingerprinting
> Uber does not do face to face interviews
> Uber does not check with previous employers
> Uber does not do drug screening
> Uber hires felons (In California)
> Uber does not train their employees
> Uber does not provide proper healthcare for their employees
> Uber does not supervise their employees.
> Uber provides little support for their employees
> 
> I agree that many drivers are trying to tie wages to this incident with the hopes Uber will raise rates. But the system Uber has set up has many flaws and when one of their drivers goes crazy, its proper to look at the system.


POST #:58/UberBlackDriverLA: O M G !
F I N A L L Y !
"Light Dawns...................on Marblehead."


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

DriverX said:


> If he was logged in, Uber has a HUGE problem. He was under their insurance!


POST # 88/DriverX: I certainly H O P E
that Kalamazoo P.D./
County Sheriff has POSSESSION of Jason's
SmartPhone: I bet that Travi$ WOULD
PAY $10 MILLION for it !

P.O.ed Bison: TK's "Goose is COOKED"!


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

Casuale Haberdasher said:


> POST # 668/Fuzzyelvis : As a Man from
> Missouri once
> SO NOTABLY SAID: "I am from Missouri,
> Sir. You will have to SHOW ME."
> 
> Mentoring Bison: MO. State Motto, BTW.


I checked. Was 22 pages. But my point (that we are quite capable of dragging a discussion out for an absurdly long time) still stands. I don't know how to reference a thread, but here's a screenshot.


----------



## Bart McCoy

So I guess the multi quote button is broke? Smh


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Fuzzyelvis said:


> I checked. Was 22 pages. But my point (that we are quite capable of dragging a discussion out for an absurdly long time) still stands. I don't know how to reference a thread, but here's a screenshot.
> View attachment 29799


POST # 673/Fuzzyelvis: My Esteemed Follower AND
2nd Notable: may I share MY Workaround
to THIS VERY CONUNDRUM ?

GREAT! I too, haven't figured out HOW
to Hyperlink to the Thread Header, yet.
However, My Simple Solution is to mere-
ly Link to the First Post in That Thread.
Example:
https://uberpeople.net/posts/849319

...will Link to the OP of this Featured
Thread, Authored by UberPissed.
Although NOT as Stylish as the "Other
Way" it provides a Glock Solution to
a Heckler & Koch Problem.

WHOOPSIE...too soon for that Analogy?


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Just_in said:


> Uber publicly stated that it's reaching out to help law enforcement anyway it can.


POST # 95/Just_in : How do YOU
Spell
O B F U S C A T I O N ?
O B S T R U C T I O N O F J U S T I C E ?
TORTIOUS P R O C R A S T I N A T I O N ?


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

CityGirl said:


> That's an Ohio article quoting Uber's own feeling on the law in CA, which they were ultimately required to compensate for AND had to change their entire insurance structure to account for. Not to mention it's 2 years old and the industry has changed.
> 
> It's important to use actual law, relevant to the state where the incident occurred, and of course, current information.
> 
> I do not know MI law but in general, and in CA, we have a rule that the insurer is not responsible for criminal actions of an insured. However, an employer who is negligent in hiring and supervising, even an independent contractor, could be found to be responsible in negligence or gross negligence (read: includes punitive damages) ...even though the insurance company could deny payment based on the criminal actions, the company could still be held responsible. If an actual Uber customer were injured (from scattered reports and articles I've seen, I can't really determine if any of the victims had been passengers), then the liability is even clearer. Uber is going to have to take some responsibility here, depending on how the facts emerge.


POST # 138/CityGirl : H O O R A Y.for
a Member who
knows Her Stuff ! I KNEW I shouldn't
listen to that TroubleMaker
secretadmirer !

Bison Admires. Bison Inspires !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

AintWorthIt said:


> Wow this is so bad for uber.


POST # 141/AintWorthIt: M E M E S ?


----------



## secretadmirer

"POST # 138/@CityGirl : H O O R A Y.for
a Member who
knows Her Stuff ! I KNEW I shouldn't
listen to that TroubleMaker
@secretadmirer !

Bison Admires. Bison Inspires !"

So what does that post have 
to do with me? Where's 
optimus uber when 
we need him? 
lolololo
lolol

The secretadmirer inspires!
The secretadmirer desires!
the secretadmirer requires!!!
the secretadmirer conspires!!

the secretadmirer is chortling and snorkling!!!


----------



## Jack Pavlov

Let's absolve all humans of any and all responsibility and accountability. 
Hmm...

There is a ghastly trend on this forum with disgruntled individuals who can't see the lights at the end of the tunnel. Who end up convincing others and dragging them along for the ride. You are all at the pinnacle point in your lives where YOU are responsible for what happens. The suffering that you are allegedly going through (whether it's true or false) is subjective to your experiences and perspective, but they are not the responsibility of others to change. You are at the compassion of others and their will to do right by those around them. If all that fails, what will you do? Revert to wallowing in pity and a self perpetuating cycle of suffering? 

Be the change you wish to see in the world.
You have three things you can do in any given situation. (Speak out and change what it is that's bothering you, run away, or accept it). 

Unlike many here, I've been fortunate to be placed in an area where even with lowered rates, I can make a sustainable source of income while I'm getting through school. It's a geographic limitation for many others to do the same, so I advise you to seek other means of employment. But in the end, I accept it. I accept the fact that some rides will be 5 dollars, some will be 20 and I look towards the more important goals in life. 

Hopefully you all do the same.


----------



## secretadmirer

If Bart feels that uber is blameless for not responding to the pax complaint of the shooters reckless driving (in timely fashion) then that's his opinion. But I don't think any of the so-called 90 posters are blaming uber for the shooting themselves.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

tohunt4me said:


> When ?
> When have Uber Drivers shot passengers ?
> The media just likes tossing Ubers name around.


POST # 216/tohunt4me: Just use the
"Search Function"
Feature, here, on UP.Net Forums !
Go through chi1cabby 's Threads:
LOADS [too soon?] of Similar Stories
...without 6 Lives lost.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile

Jack Pavlov said:


> Let's absolve all humans of any and all responsibility and accountability.
> Hmm...
> 
> There is a ghastly trend on this forum with disgruntled individuals who can't see the lights at the end of the tunnel. Who end up convincing others and dragging them along for the ride. You are all at the pinnacle point in your lives where YOU are responsible for what happens. The suffering that you are allegedly going through (whether it's true or false) is subjective to your experiences and perspective, but they are not the responsibility of others to change. You are at the compassion of others and their will to do right by those around them. If all that fails, what will you do? Revert to wallowing in pity and a self perpetuating cycle of suffering?
> 
> Be the change you wish to see in the world.
> You have three things you can do in any given situation. (Speak out and change what it is that's bothering you, run away, or accept it).
> 
> Unlike many here, I've been fortunate to be placed in an area where even with lowered rates, I can make a sustainable source of income while I'm getting through school. It's a geographic limitation for many others to do the same, so I advise you to seek other means of employment. But in the end, I accept it. I accept the fact that some rides will be 5 dollars, some will be 20 and I look towards the more important goals in life.
> 
> Hopefully you all do the same.


We dont believe you.


----------



## Jack Pavlov

It's okay, you don't have to. And I'm not sure what part you don't believe. Don't you find it interesting that there are successful people utilizing this platform. Now the measure of success is another discussion and what we consider successful can be two different meanings based on our own expectations but I think it's worthy noting that sometimes it's best to listen and observe the people and your surroundings and then evaluate and initiate a course of action that will put you on the path you'd like to be on (I'm assuming that's the path of success, happiness, freedom, etc...) whatever the goal is, if you make active and progressive steps towards it, you'll be that much closer to achieving it.


----------



## Bart McCoy

secretadmirer said:


> If Bart feels that uber is blameless for not responding to the pax complaint of the shooters reckless driving (in timely fashion) then that's his opinion. But I don't think any of the so-called 90 posters are blaming uber for the shooting themselves.


You obviously didn't read this topic then, people are clearly laying blame for the shooting and/or holding Uber liable for it.

Also, if you gonna talk about my point of view: come correct. I never said Uber was blameless about the sideswipe. My only defense of uber is of them being responsible for or liable for the shooting. Go back and read my posts. Its the least you can do instead of slandering my name


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Michael - Cleveland said:


> Student is an occupation if they work p/t (census def) - but that's beside the point...
> The majority of mass shootings (4 or more shot) that have occurred in the US since 1999 have been committed by students.
> 
> Heritage High - GA, Columbine - CO, Century 15 Movie Theater - Aurora, CO, Sandy Hook - CT, FT Gibson - OK, VA Tech, Roseburg, OR, Santana High - Santee, CA, Granite Hills High - ElCajon, CA, UofA -Tuscon, AZ, Redlake, MN, Oikos Univ - Oakland, CA, Marysville, WA, Chardon High - Chardon, OH... and on and on...


POST # 132/Michael - Cleveland: B - B - 
B - B - B - B
B - B - B - B - B - B - O - O - Y - A - H ! ! !


----------



## bezi_NY

TwoFiddyMile said:


> We dont believe you.


I agree with Twofiddyamile, and if I may add, we don't just take it in the rear! Be a man and call a spade a spade! A corporation is a group of organized individuals and at the other side of that table is is in ( in the case of Uber) and they don't own us! Other apps are coming and taxis are readily available as other options for people to drive! You can even get a CDL and drive a truck.. But never be a lamb. Sorry Jack! Make America Great Again!!!


----------



## Jack Pavlov

If Uber or Lyft isn't working for you, then by all means, go exercise your other employment opportunities. But a lot of people fail at this for reasons external to the ride sharing system. If you really want to understand why the rates were lowered, you first need to understand that the rates are set by a mathematical algorithm (much like the one that every other business uses to determine the price of a product or service. It uses data analytics to evaluate current supply and demand. The rate increases can be the fault of the company but it was one made during its infancy and probably was unforeseen. That is the mistake of saturating the market with Drivers. Once they committed to it, the only option they have to bring demand to match supply, and one of the few options and possibly only options they really have is lowering rates to increase number of users. The company unfortunately didn't cap registration or hiring or limit its weekly incoming drivers to match natural attrition rates. If this was done, you might see better rates. 

That's over with, it's done, now you have a choice, either you continue working for uber and lyft or change your employment. Demanding higher rates is not the answer and will leave you with even less money due to the lower demand spread across the same number of drivers. 

Everyone on this forum should take a economics course so they understand equilibrium pricing and supply/demand curves.


----------



## bezi_NY

Jack Pavlov said:


> If Uber or Lyft isn't working for you, then by all means, go exercise your other employment opportunities. But a lot of people fail at this for reasons external to the ride sharing system. If you really want to understand why the rates were lowered, you first need to understand that the rates are set by a mathematical algorithm (much like the one that every other business uses to determine the price of a product or service. It uses data analytics to evaluate current supply and demand. The rate increases can be the fault of the company but it was one made during its infancy and probably was unforeseen. That is the mistake of saturating the market with Drivers. Once they committed to it, the only option they have to bring demand to match supply, and one of the few options and possibly only options they really have is lowering rates to increase number of users. The company unfortunately didn't cap registration or hiring or limit its weekly incoming drivers to match natural attrition rates. If this was done, you might see better rates.
> 
> That's over with, it's done, now you have a choice, either you continue working for uber and lyft or change your employment. Demanding higher rates is not the answer and will leave you with even less money due to the lower demand spread across the same number of drivers.
> 
> Everyone on this forum should take a economics course so they understand equilibrium pricing and supply/demand curves.


-Lyft and Uber are trying to hire even more drivers and are still offering bonuses to guys like my self to bring more drivers in.. What's the point in doing this if you feel it's wrong? 
-NYC has always set the rates for theYellow Cab industry preventing medalion owners from rising rates. You still think it's wrong for guys here to call The peers that be out and challenge them by what ever legal means? 
-NYC also sets the number of yellows that can exist. By NYC law a cap was set in the 1930s by mayor Laguardia because there were more taxis than passengers and guys were working a lot of hours and their cars were poorly maintained due to a saturated market/markets.. You think drivers should only asses the economics and not point out the public safety issues here?
-The National Labor Relations Act of 1935 gives employees of any industry in the US the right to Unionize. Do you think Uber and Lyft drivers are wrong to invoke their rights to organize?


----------



## Jack Pavlov

I'm all for drivers exercising their rights but their barking up the wrong tree, making uneducated assumptions and coming to conclusions that are far from the reality of the situation. The cab industry is a plagued industry and at the forefront of technology, it's time to move forward. Doesn't mean we need to revert to the same methodology that we used in the 1930s. I do not think that the same statewide regulation that was put in place then even needs to be brought up today. I think the companies, if they want, can exercise their own measures of control on supply and demand, or otherwise feel its repercussions from a responsive and interactive market place. The cab industry was able to accomplish a lot of its political goals due to reasons other than public interest. In time, I think things will level out and stabilize but you also need to realize that this industry has a pivotal position in history, it's new, it's exciting, it's in its infancy. As it matures and grows and learns from its mistakes, it will improve as its in the best interests of themselves to stay competitive.

The people on this forum are hardly being informative when it comes to safety, that is probably a very low percentage of the complaints that get logged here. 

So far there hasn't been a metric measured to assess the real dangers in public safety, there haven't really been any issues yet so it's premature to say that there will be or that we need to do something about a problem that doesn't exist yet. 

There is always two ways to approach economic stabilization, more or less fiscal/monetary policy and its been shown in the decades that have passed that the economy is self stabilizing and that interference can actually a aggravating factor in a potential downturn or collapse of an industry/economy. 

This is just one school of thought and this topic can be widely debated for a long time so im not presenting it as a factual representation but rather a strongly informed opinion and an educated conclusion.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

simpsonsverytall said:


> I'd guess that Uber escapes criminal liability here, but they may end up paying some settlements.


POST # 161/simpsonsverytall: O. K.....
Ya think ?
Really ? H o w... i n s i g h t f u l !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Zebonkey said:


> Kalamazoo is a goofy &%[email protected] name, and that dude looks like a registered sex offender.


POST # 165/Zebonkey: "....g o o f y...
& % $ @ i n g
n a m e . . ." sayeth the M E M B E R
N A M E D " Z E B O N K E Y " !

Bison: Rhymes with "Donkey" ?


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Rakos said:


> _"The phrase "Going Postal" was coined when a postal worker did this in the 80s. So its only expected that it'll be linked to the job. The background check thing is irrelevant unless this guy had a record, the issue Uber will face is the families suing saying Uber's policies created a antagonistic environment between uber-driver-pax which caused the driver to have a mental breakdown triggered by his last pax who one starred him and then wrote a nasty facebook post about him. Which has now been removed. easy case, he could self represent and still win."_
> 
> Sounds a lot like what used to be called "going postal" so I agree the new way of talking about these things just may end up being "Going Uber Crazy"
> 
> I have noticed a lowering of the bar lately in UberX riders and not sure why. It could be they are allowing debit cards now. I have always noticed that the bar seemed to be higher because you needed a REAL credit card in the past. I have stopped taking UberX pax except on rare occasion. I found it damned hard to make money on UberX rates and so I am using my UberXL capability now that it has been restored. I have to wait a bit longer but make substantially more with XL rides.
> 
> As to the drivers Uber is using now, I noticed and agree with the figure of 200,000 drivers in the USA and have noticed in the Tampa area I always seem lately to be passing drivers with their app opened and flashing for everyone to see. In the last year or so it was not in your interest to let cabbies or cops know that you were driving Uber because doing so could have escalated to a ticket or in some cases a physical intimidation by a cabbie.
> 
> Here's to hoping that Uber raises the rates back to a workable amount that makes things better but not confident it will happen soon enuff!
> 
> My little monkey brain still cannot get a handle on just how that they expect to run a business while running the drivers into the ground.


POST #:170/Rakos: With ALL DUE
Respect to
NewMember with SIMIAN AVATAR,
am I the only Participant Here that
remembers the Scary THREAT Expres-sion:
"Gonna'go SanDiegoChimp'on [email protected]$$"?

Like Pepperidge Farm...
Mentoring Bison Remembers.


----------



## UberXTampa

Uber Lyft Dude said:


> View attachment 28972


The 4 senior citizens he killed were probably very good tippers.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

simpsonsverytall said:


> Praying for the victims, and I wish this guy had found help.
> 
> This guy was dedicated! He kept doing trips!!!
> 
> I'm sorry. I'm sorry. This guy was doing 5 star trips


POST # 201/simpsonsverytall: Is it me
or is this
WRONG on many levels...Insincere,
Inhumane and Inappropriate !

Bison: Kinda like Emil Michael, y'know?


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

tohunt4me said:


> When ?
> When have Uber Drivers shot passengers ?
> The media just likes tossing Ubers name around.


POST # 216/tohunt4me: H E L L O !
UPNF is TWENTY
THREE MONTHS-OLD in a Week's Time!
Why is THAT Important?

Because, being set up in a SEARCHABLE
DataBase Format, YOU...yeah....YOU the
"Doubting Thomas"...can/ Should access
ANSWERS to ANY A-B TNC Question via
the 900,000 Posts & Replies from 42,324
Members on 6 Continents over the Last
6 8 3 D a y s ! The Fact$ that we ALL need
to $ucceed are ...I N ...H E R E ! ! !

While you're "At it" say "THANKS !" to
Our # 1 Notable Member chi1cabby 
whose Marathon of News Threads appro-
aches ...T E N.....T H O U S A N D !

Mentoring Bison: Thanks, St. Comity !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Bart McCoy said:


> yes, obviously you didnt
> he had no criminal record


POST # 228/Bart McCoy: Au Contraire
my Esteemed
Fellow Notable [hey...my pants are onfire]
I, with my Little Eye, spied a ScreenShot
that mentioned Jason's PAROLE OFFICER.

I'm CERTAIN that Salient Detail will
be UNCOVERED if only to CASTIGATE
Travi$ for his El Cheap-O "Background
Checks" TOUTED as "Be$t in Indu$try".

P.O.edBison: RocketSled-2-HELL-4-U-TK!


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Jack Pavlov said:


> Oh I can tell your knowledge of the law will take you far. I'm not even going to waste my time except to waste my time to tell you that I'm not wasting my time.
> 
> You guys are all on a steep slope to a society that will begin to blame fork manufacturers for your obesity, coffee makes for your inability to stay awake, and Yelp for the reasons that your business is failing... because of poor ratings.
> 
> I came to this forum thinking there were rational like-minded individuals, but most of what I see is people working for a company that "doesn't vet it's employees" because they couldn't get a job anywhere else. I wouldn't even flinch at refusing to hire the majority of people here who are so GRACIOUSLY employed by Uber. You should be thanking Uber for your opportunity to work and go out there and work. I apologize if this hits home for anyone but some of you need a wake up call. I see a lot of entitlement and ignorance in most of the posts made.


POST #:251/Jack Pavlov: Your TOTALLY
SHILLTASTIC Performance
is Insufferable ! ENOUGH of the Rasier-
esque #[F]Uber-Puffery.

Your Materializing Magically for THIS
Thread, AND EXCEEDING the Self-Impor-
tance of Previous "ALL About Me" Cham-
pion, "Ex-CSR...with Equity" Long Island
City's Own john djjjoe, is,
as Other Posters have Commented, Highly 
Suspicious!

In a 20FEB'15 "Complaints" Thread, he
berated UPNF's Membership for Failing
to Comprehend "Why Drivers Don't
Matter":

https://uberpeople.net/posts/187189

Your "Open Schadenfreude" is Trademark
Kalanickian Shamelessness and borders on
Outright HateSpeech.

Bison: An "Ignore Lister"? Oh, yeeeaaaahhh !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Jack Pavlov said:


> And those two things heavily depend on a couple key laws that vary from state to state, i.e. Laws like "king of the castle". Use of excessive force in a legitimate case of self defense is historically been upheld in court when dealing with civilians. Police (who are trained) adhere to a different interpretation of excessive. Either way, both self defense and excessive force are very heavily litigated terms in court and no definitive answer can be given, certainly not from these forums.


POST#270/Jack Pavlov: C H O R T L E ! "Castle Doctrine" applies
to Residences in Certain States.

"King of the Castle" was a line from the
Sacha Baron Cohen Film "Borat". Who
could forget his comment on the "Mus-
cle Tone" of his, then 12 y.o. "Wife" ?

Bison: "Loose...like sleeve of Wizard."


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

MattStone said:


> There is a delay with the forum go back up and read some of my posts. I do address a lot of what you guys are bringing up. Although these are just my thoughts and I'm a nobody. I still hope it gives you guys some type of insight.


POST # 329/MattStone : Oh, the Male
Posters among us
have "...some type of insight" alright !
Unfortunately...they've been WICKED
DISTRACTED by "Dominatrix with MP-5"
Avatar that you're sporting there !


----------



## observer

observer said:


> Just heard on the radio (KFI of course) that the family of the 14 year old girl was discussing donating her organs; because they thought she was brain dead, when she squeezed her moms hand.
> 
> Hope she gets better!


http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/abigail-kopf-teen-shot-uber-driver-kalamazoo-improving-n529126


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

observer said:


> http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/abigail-kopf-teen-shot-uber-driver-kalamazoo-improving-n529126


POST # 702/observer: Bostonian Bison
Thanks You for this
Hyperlinked NBC News.com Story of
interest to Any Human with Blood [vs.
Ice Water] in their Veins!

Mentoring Bison: Pray. Today!


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Kalee said:


> Ever notice it's always the " New Members" that are just now creating memberships on this forum to try to limit the damage to Uber ... er ... I meant coming on to have rational discussions around current events ?


POST # 332/Kalee: B-B-B-B I N G O !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

MattStone said:


> Matt Stone is my nom de plume I use it on the deep dark web or most things on the web.


POST # 334/Matt Stone: Y I P P E E !
Where ELSE
can we follow "Blondie with H&K" ?

Bison: Chef Haberdasher said "Hubba, hubba!"


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

MattStone said:


> I agree man and sad too, I use to live in West Bloomfield, Michigan. I feel bad for you guys out there, I hope you don't lose too many fairs.


POST #:341/Matt Stone: Oh, dear.......
"FAIR": What many
Counties hold in the Summer, featuring
Funnel Cake, Petting Zoos and Ferris
Wheel Accidents.

"FARE": The Remuneration for Accepting/
Delivering an A-B TNC "Ride" to PAX.

S W.A.T.: Spells Words and Things.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

driveLA said:


> who cares if the app was on or off
> 
> he's an uber driver murdering people while ubering, in between ubering, who cares.
> 
> a lot of people are making assumptions that its because uber but you are making assumptions (that its not because uber) as well.
> 
> nobody know anything
> 
> but its ridiculous how hard you're trying to protect a shitty company that has created a toxic environment


POST#426/driveLA: AMEN BROTHER !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Archie8616 said:


> I'm done with Uber. It did help me with getting my bills paid, but honestly, I'm going to just switch over to lyft. I have my first mentor meeting today. It's a small way to protest as just being one individual. I've read a few of the comments here, and it seems folks are getting heated over details that they have no idea as to what the real circumstances were or are now. No matter what your feeling or whatever, just remember that UBER in some way be it the driver or the app...there is a connection.
> 
> And again...Lets keep in mind of those that lost their lives and the families affected....may they RIP....


POST # 440/Archie8616 : Although Fellow
5th Notable
scrurbscrud MAY growse about the
Incremental Competition in your Mutual
"Territory", he will, Undoubtedly Sup-
port Your Deci$ion in the "Herbal High"
State.

Bison Chortling !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Kalee said:


> I'm thinking that Uber has always realized the stress put on the drivers and the possibility of a mental breakdown as they continue to ratchet up their relentless driver abuse. I'm guessing that may be why months ago, Uber attempted to make drivers believe that Uber has authority to dictate to we "independent contractors" are not allowed to carry firearms legally for our protection whilst driving our personal vehicles.
> 
> I would bet my last Uber 60 hour paycheck of $204 that ole Travis surrounds himself with well armed guards at all times.
> 
> Nice try Uber, but butt out.


POST # 444/Kalee: It will take some
AMAZING
MARKSMANSHIP to Shoot Down the
ISIS RPG that has FrattyBoi's name on it!


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

metal_orion said:


> Look at that picture. He fits the profile of a psycho.


POST # 491/metal_orion : Look at YOUR
Avatar
Photo: who owns the Most Handsome
Cavy in ALL of UPNF ?

Bison: Settle down, Haberdasher !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Sacto Burbs said:


> He had a dog in the car, too.
> 
> *Uber Acknowledges Getting Complaints About Shooting Suspect*
> 
> *The Uber ride-hailing service acknowledged Monday that it received complaints about erratic driving by the suspect *in the random shootings that killed six people in Kalamazoo, and a prosecutor said the man admitted carrying out the attacks.
> 
> As authorities pieced together Jason Dalton's actions, the prosecutor said he picked up Uber fares after the first shooting and probably got more riders after the subsequent shootings.
> 
> Dalton, the 45-year-old former insurance adjuster, appeared briefly in court by video link and was charged with six counts of murder. A judge denied him bail.
> 
> During a talk with investigators, Dalton waived his right against self-incrimination and confessed his role in the Saturday night shootings, Kalamazoo County Prosecutor Jeff Getting said.
> 
> Dalton admitted "that he took people's lives," Kalamazoo police Det. Cory Ghiringhelli told the court. The murder charges carry a mandatory life sentence. Michigan does not have the death penalty.
> 
> *An Uber passenger said he called police to report that Dalton was driving erratically more than an hour before the shootings began.*
> 
> Matt Mellen told Kalamazoo television station WWMT that he hailed a ride around 4:30 p.m. Saturday. He said driver Jason Dalton introduced himself as "Me-Me" and had a dog in the backseat.
> 
> Mellen sat in front. About a mile into the trip, Dalton got a phone call, and when he hung up, he began driving recklessly, blowing through stop signs and sideswiping cars, Mellen said.
> 
> "We were driving through medians, driving through the lawn, speeding along, and when we came to a stop, I jumped out of the car and ran away," Mellen said. He said he called police and that when he got to his friend's house, his fiancée posted a warning to friends on Facebook.
> 
> *Uber said riders complained Saturday about Dalton's driving. When alerted to unsafe driving, company policy is to contact the driver. But Uber officials would not say whether anyone at the company spoke to Dalton, deferring to law enforcement.*
> 
> Dalton passed a background check and *became a driver on Jan. 25. He had given about 100 rides, *the company said.
> 
> Since Dalton's arrest, several people have come forward to say that he picked them up for Uber in the hours after the first attack. The Associated Press could not confirm those accounts.
> 
> Kalamazoo County Sheriff Richard Fuller said Uber is cooperating with law enforcement officials, and he believes the company will "help us fill in some timeline gaps."
> 
> *Investigators are particularly interested in communication between Dalton and Uber, as well as customers he might have driven, the sheriff said.*
> 
> The attacks began outside the Meadows apartment complex on the eastern edge of Kalamazoo County, where a woman was shot multiple times. She survived.
> 
> A little more than four hours later and 15 miles away, a father and his 17-year-old son were fatally shot while looking at cars at a car dealership.
> 
> Fifteen minutes after that, five people were gunned down in the parking lot of a Cracker Barrel restaurant. Four of them died. A 14-year-old girl survived with a head wound and was hospitalized in critical condition.
> 
> Police and prosecutors have not provided a motive. The victims had no apparent connection to the gunman.
> 
> Getting dismissed the idea that Dalton was seeking a particular person when authorities say he shot the first victim. The prosecutor said Dalton called the woman by a different name only "to get her attention" before shooting her outside of her apartment.
> 
> Questions about motive and Dalton's frame of mind are "going to be the hardest to answer for anybody," Fuller said. He expects some answers to emerge in court, but he doubts they will be satisfying.
> 
> "In the end, I ask people, because I keep hearing this question of why, 'What would be the answer that would be an acceptable answer for you?' They have to think about it for a moment, and they say, 'Probably nothing.'
> 
> "I have to say, 'You are probably correct.' I can't imagine what the answer would be that would let us go, 'OK, we understand now.' Because we are not going to understand," the sheriff said.
> *
> Uber prohibits both passengers and drivers from possessing guns of any kind in a vehicle. Anyone found to be in violation of the policy MAY be prohibited from using or driving for the service.*
> 
> Many handguns and long guns were seized from Dalton's home. But there was no indication that he was prohibited from owning the weapons, said Donald Dawkins, a Detroit-based spokesman for the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, which was assisting police.
> 
> In a statement issued Monday, Dalton's family offered condolences to the families of the victims and thanked law-enforcement officials, saying their "quick and decisive action prevented any further acts of violence."
> 
> The family said it planned to help authorities with the investigation.
> 
> http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/suspect-fatal-michigan-shootings-expected-court-37105560


POST # 516/Sacto Burbs: Bostonian Bison
Thanks You for this
Hyperlinked ABC.go.com News Story on
details pertinent to This Featured Thread.

The Courtesy of including the "Print Out"
is a Nod to those Drivers/Readers that
have a Cap on their Data Plan !

Mentoring Bison: "Try a Little Tenderness".


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Txchick said:


> A voice of reason.


POST # 520/Txchick: On behalf of #1
Notable , chi1cabby ,
and with ALL DUE RESPECT to you, as
Moderator AND Thread Participant,
I, WE, hasten to "Beg to Differ".

Mentoring Bison: "So...it is Written.
☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ So...it shall be Done!"


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

LA Cabbie said:


> It's BIG PHARMA mate. Have you ever seen a commercial for psychiatric medication here in America?
> 
> Liver damage
> Death
> Internal bleeding
> Stroke
> Dry mouth
> Loss of breath
> Sweaty palms
> Anxiety
> 
> All of that so I can go to sleep a couple of minutes earlier!
> 
> Listen folks, I know what I say might be inflammatory here in the U.S., I feel more comfortable with foreign cab drivers. Why? Mentally balanced.
> 
> Do you have any idea how many Americans young or old, even with great health, are addicted to psychiatric medication. Most of the times the legal stuff is worse than the illegal. And self medicating is an American mainstay.


POST # 521/LA Cabbie: Although we
MAY see an 
"Aspartame/Saccharin" Defense even-
tually, your reminder of "End of the Pitch" Caveats for Dubiously Effective TV Phar-maceuticals brought to mind a Recently Heard "4 Horsemen-esque" finale:

"...New or Worsening Heart Failure,
Syncope, Coma AND Death have been
Reported. Ask your Doctor if 'Shkrelli-
ES&D' is right for YOU !"

Bison: STOP IT...you're Killing Me !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

observer said:


> I wonder if Uber got a complaint from another customer and the call he recieved was FROM Uber. This story kind of insinuates something like that may have happened. What doesn't make sense is why shoot the random people on the street and not the pax.


POST #:528/observer: As our GRAND-
Parents may have
heard on Great Depression Era Radio 
in the 1930's .......

"Who K N O W S what Evil L U R K S...
intheHeartsofMen ? The SHADOW knows!"


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

cooberpedy15 said:


> who would want to ride Uber after the Kalamazoo incident?
> On top of paying so little for so much driving ...now this. Im poorly motivated to keep driving.


POST#533/cooberpedy15: Cor'Blimey !
"Dinkum
'Strine" ?! What a change in Climate vs.
SA, Mate. You're only about 80 miles
downhill from Donner Summit, just
East of Soda Springs, CA. where I spent
4 months in Fall/Winter of 1974. If
you're a History Buff just Google "The
Donner Party/1846", but DO NOT do
that BEFORE Dinner.

Mentoring Bison: Now I'M not hungry.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

TeamCruze said:


> (more guns = less crime)= more unnecessary deaths...
> Single shooting deaths by guns still happens here in Australia but in very low numbers and are isolated cases. With tighter laws since our Port Arthur massacre on high powered weapons, has decreased the chances of massacre happening on a large scale. The recent shooting in Sydney ended badly with the police running in with stun grenades causing the gunman to open fire with an old double barrel shotgun.
> 
> Also how one measures crime and perceives crime in studies.
> 
> All I know I feel safe walking down the street in Australia towns/cities without the fear of being shot.


POST #:534/TeamCruze: All I know is
that BOTH Chef
Haberdasher and myself feel GREAT
about living in the SAFEST CITY......in
"The GunShine State" without the fear
of being shot.

Feisty Seniors on Runaway Rascals ?
THAT'S another thing Entirely!


----------



## Beachbum in a cornfield

Jack Pavlov said:


> Let's absolve all humans of any and all responsibility and accountability.
> Hmm...
> 
> There is a ghastly trend on this forum with disgruntled individuals who can't see the lights at the end of the tunnel. Who end up convincing others and dragging them along for the ride. You are all at the pinnacle point in your lives where YOU are responsible for what happens. The suffering that you are allegedly going through (whether it's true or false) is subjective to your experiences and perspective, but they are not the responsibility of others to change. You are at the compassion of others and their will to do right by those around them. If all that fails, what will you do? Revert to wallowing in pity and a self perpetuating cycle of suffering?
> 
> Be the change you wish to see in the world.
> You have three things you can do in any given situation. (Speak out and change what it is that's bothering you, run away, or accept it).
> 
> Unlike many here, I've been fortunate to be placed in an area where even with lowered rates, I can make a sustainable source of income while I'm getting through school. It's a geographic limitation for many others to do the same, so I advise you to seek other means of employment. But in the end, I accept it. I accept the fact that some rides will be 5 dollars, some will be 20 and I look towards the more important goals in life.
> 
> Hopefully you all do the same.


Hey Pavlov.....stop drooling!!!!Low end fares in this market start at 1.65 retained by the driver and there are loads of those. It's very nice that you are in the right spot and if people took your advice (which I do) then Uber would be dead within a year....The "F U , I got mine" mentality is typical of a certain age group and serves no useful purpose in my opinion.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Dontmakemepullauonyou said:


> Just now on MSNBC they did the report on this mass shooter and reporter said "uber driver had a high rating".
> 
> Since when is 4.73 high? Oh yeah cause the real world thinks an almost 5 star rating is amazing except with uber it's near deactivation.
> 
> Travis your app in the App Store is currently at 3 out of 5 stars lmao and mostly cause of the logo change/fail.
> 
> If I had an app in the App Store that's the main product for my company worth $62,500,000,000 but with a rating of 3 out of 5 stars, I would be fired by my investors, let's hope they wake up soon!


POST #:549/Dontmakemepullauonyou:
Easy there
Tom Cruise-as-"Maverick"-
USN-Fighter-Pilot you are Totally Over-
looking the W O W Factor of "Godview"
Software and the TechnoIlluminati's
Reverence for the Wii "Onanist" Singles
World Champion.

Bison: I'm surprised he's NOT BLIND !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> That was just a matter of time wasn't it Fiddy???......Wouldn't you think that the smart guys who run a 50 Billion dollar corporation (their valuation, certainly not anyone else's.....see PS at the bottom) would have some concern for the people who are the only ones who talk to the customer and who have to field the "UBER Killer" questions? NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO....."bump up the guarantees" seems to be the best they can do. This millennial clown car is being driven by lawyers and accountants....always a solid way forward for an innovative little startup burning through 3 or 4 rounds of funding and hiding profits like little mofos...... all under the steady hand of "The TRUSTBUSTER"....
> 
> PS I bet the VCs have calls into Travis this morning.....I bet UBER warrants are being set up for a quick sale is case something in SF goes boom...."The smartest guys in the room" are loosing "smirkforce" as I write this


POST # 555/Beachbum in a cornfield :
AHHH...
The "SmirkForce" Detection Capability
is S T R O N G in this one !

Bison: Hello ? Oxford English Dictionary?


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

Bart McCoy said:


> Cool
> I'll be back to comment when more FACTS are reported
> Until then, happy speculating. I mean while you're at it, speculate that Uber will raise everyone's rates by an extra $1 per mile.
> 
> Me reporting back to Travis or being a shill? You and Beachbum in a cornfield being a veteran poster I would think you would investigate a user's postings before making such an absurd claim. I'm a lil ashamed of yall, *thats a newb move*. If you read all my prior postings BEFORE I ever commented in this topic and comprehend from those posts that I'm a shill...... then I have to compare yall to this deranged guy that went on a killing spree.
> 
> Now yall take care, and continue to show that people and entities are guilty until proven innocent. I'll see yall again when more facts arise


POST # 563/Bart McCoy: You're right....
NUberers
not realizing that you reside in Maryland
AND, as such, are Limited to 2 "Y'all"s
Per Post. That is all. Carry on.


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## Casuale Haberdasher

Sacto Burbs said:


> *Why Do Nearly One in Five Crime Guns in Chicago Originate at Just Four Gun Dealers?*
> 
> There's probably only one gun store that's located throughout the whole city of Chicago which is famous," an inmate told Professor Phil Cook and his fellow researchers in one of their two new studies. "It's Chuck's Gun Store."
> 
> Indeed, Chuck's has been identified in multiple sources for two decades as a major supplier of crime guns. It is near or at the top of the 5% of gun dealers that supply 90% of the guns used in crime. How can so many guns from just a few gun shops end up in criminal hands?
> 
> http://www.bradycampaign.org/blog/w...in-chicago-originate-at-just-four-gun-dealers


POST # 574/Sacto Burbs: As much as I'd
like to Rail
Against # 44's Original AG, at whose
Feet the Abject Failure of BATFE's
"Fast & Furious" FIASCO deserves to be
laid, I'm going to "UPNF UP" and Thank
You for the Hyperlink to bc.org.....from
which I found a SWEET 44 PAGE PDF
from the Journal of Criminal Law and
Criminology:Some Sources of GunCrimes
in Chicago: Dirty Dealers, Straw Purchas-
ers and Traffickers.

Bison : Would you be referring to........
☆ ☆ ☆ Eric-Holding-the-Bag-O'AR-15s ?


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## Casuale Haberdasher

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> It's time for you to post more spin because a new FACT has come out.
> 
> MR. DALTON HAS A CRIMINAL HISTORY.
> 
> Uber lied about this as well.


POST # 581/UberBlackDriverLA: I
KNEW that
I saw "that" s o m e w h e r e !


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## Casuale Haberdasher

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> Bart is wisely remaining silent because the facts that are coming out do not support his position.


POST # 611/UberBlackDriverLA: C'MON,
YOU'VE been
an UPNF Member for 1 0 9 Days longer
than Bison and I. Bart's been a Gleeful
Contrarian since before the Big Bang!


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## Bart McCoy

hey chi1cabby are you off duty this week? because surely if I was doing what Casuale Haberdasher has done in this topic, you would have reported me 50 replies ago,smh. Proof you only pick on/report people who don't agree with you


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## Beachbum in a cornfield

Bart McCoy said:


> hey chi1cabby are you off duty this week? because surely if I was doing what Casuale Haberdasher has done in this topic, you would have reported me 50 replies ago,smh. Proof you only pick on/report people who don't agree with you


Bart.....Bruddah!!! Not everything here is serious. Sometimes people like our Bovine Clothes Horse here are being light hearted and mirthful.....Ya gotta loosen up kid!!!!


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## Bart McCoy

Beachbum in a cornfield said:


> Bart.....Bruddah!!! Not everything here is serious. Sometimes people like our Bovine Clothes Horse here are being light hearted and mirthful.....Ya gotta loosen up kid!!!!


loosen up? you don't know the history. At all. He reports me to the mods for multiple replies in a topic. Not for breaking the rules, but He calls it "spamming". ONLY because my view doesn't support his. Anybody with a decent pair of eyes can clearly see causel haberdash "spamming" the topic like chicabby defines. But I don't see him quoting his posts and tagging the mods like he does me anytime I reply more than 3 times in one topic, smh

History proves he wouldn't have allowed me to do what haberdash has done without reporting me. FACT


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## Beachbum in a cornfield

Bart McCoy said:


> loosen up? you don't know the history. At all. He reports me to the mods for multiple replies in a topic. Not for breaking the rules, but He calls it "spamming". ONLY because my view doesn't support his. Anybody with a decent pair of eyes can clearly see causel haberdash "spamming" the topic like chicabby defines. But I don't see him quoting his posts and tagging the mods like he does me anytime I reply more than 3 times in one topic, smh
> 
> History proves he wouldn't have allowed me to do what haberdash has done without reporting me. FACT


I'm becoming more than a a bit concerned here Bart. This is the kind of suppressed aggression that pushes rideshare drivers to do ummmmmm.....ya know ....unspeakable things. Perhaps a trip to the day spa or maybe out to the eastern shore for some fresh seafood and cold beers? You need to let off a little steam so that you don't go....ya know...UBER!!!


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## chi1cabby

Bart McCoy said:


> hey chi1cabby are you off duty this week? because surely if I was doing what Casuale Haberdasher has done in this topic, you would have reported me 50 replies ago,smh. Proof you only pick on/report people who don't agree with you


Hey Bart McCoy, you still take the cake in repetitive/redundant posting in this thread. You have 80 posts on this thread, compared to Casuale Haberdasher's 60 posts.

And fyi, I don't pick on/report anyone. If I have an issue with anyone's posts, I openly take it up with them on the thread itself. If you recall, I had openly requested you not to engage in the repetitive/redundant posting in the #UberRAMPAGE thread. It was the Admin who decided to intervene and messaged us both about it.

I've elected not to engage you in past few months, even after you've gone out of your way to take pokes at me.


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## Bart McCoy

chi1cabby said:


> Hey Bart McCoy, you still take the cake in repetitive/redundant posting in this thread.


Fine, no need to reply back. Im not trying to go back and forth with you.
I simply posted so that everybody can see the clear repetitive posting casual haberdash has done, and your non response/non mod reporting to it. I'll just sit back and let everybody make their own assumptions about it.

Have a good day


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## Archie8616

To the MODS....This thread is way, way way out of topic...Needs to be locked down. Buffalo head keeps posting and it's truly getting annoying! "unwatching Thread" nothing here to read that is important anymore.


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## I works for no man

Sacto Burbs said:


> Uber has an official policy to keep lethal weapons out of the cars to prevent gun violence. The customer reported a driver carrying a lethal weapon in contravention of Uber policy and contacted the relevant authorities to highlight the problem so it could be addressed and fixed. She is a responsible person who took action to protect herself and others from gun violence.
> 
> Your characterization of the situation is disrespectful toward someone who has the right to make sure no whack job is packing while she is in the car - contrary to company policy. It is her right as a customer to make sure no lethal weapon is in the car. You are the driver I suggest Uber asks at on-boarding if you a) Have a concealed carry license b) Have access to firearms. If you answer yes, you need to be on a red flag list.
> 
> And to the cabbie - his company suggested this
> 
> "A simple preventative measure such as a silent alarm linked to GPS, that would dispatch the nearest CPD squad car, would give Chicago's cab drivers the backup they need should they be placed in a dangerous situation with a potentially violent passenger," the group said.​
> "I works for no man" is rubbish. You work for the person who pays you - just like everyone else - the passenger.


Lighten up , it's satire from o brother where art thou, I also have no name. curious how many drivers have been shot in your area?If you are a responsible gun owner you would be a moron not to carry in Chicago. Liberals like you and miss crybaby are the reason Chicago has a higher murdet rate than Iraq. The uber driver who used his conceal carry permitted weapon to stop a mass shooting in Chicago this year is my hero. The only people who have been shot inside a ride share or taxi are drivers.


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## UberBlackDriverLA

I works for no man said:


> Lighten up , it's satire from o brother where art thou, I also have no name. curious how many drivers have been shot in your area?If you are a responsible gun owner you would be a moron not to carry in Chicago. Liberals like you and miss crybaby are the reason Chicago has a higher murdet rate than Iraq. The uber driver who used his conceal carry permitted weapon to stop a mass shooting in Chicago this year is my hero. The only people who have been shot inside a ride share or taxi are drivers.


False, there are several instances where drivers have shot passengers.


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## I works for no man

UberBlackDriverLA said:


> False, there are several instances where drivers have shot passengers.


Random shootings or cases of self defense where and when.


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## TwoFiddyMile

Worst taxi massacre ever was in England, a supposedly gun free country.


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## AllenChicago

March 14, 2016

Abigail Kopf, the seriously wounded 14 year old, is recovering nicely. The family shared the first photo of her today. 
*Link: http://abcnews.go.com/Health/family...oting-survivor-abigail-kopf/story?id=37633992

*


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## Beachbum in a cornfield

AllenChicago said:


> March 14, 2016
> 
> Abigail Kopf, the seriously wounded 14 year old, is recovering nicely. The family shared the first photo of her today.
> *Link: http://abcnews.go.com/Health/family...oting-survivor-abigail-kopf/story?id=37633992
> *


I wish her the greatest of recoveries.... I also wonder if the other breaking thread about CSR responsiveness is going to find it's way into a courtroom connected with this horrible tragedy.


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## ChortlingCrison

It is true that this pyschopath had no criminal record, but this exposes a lot of ubers coverup on other driver offenses like assault/rape etc. Now this guy could have shot these people at any time uber or no uber but there was some 911 calls earlier in the day about his reckless driving.


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## Ca$h4

*Accused Michigan Uber shooter to use insanity defense: prosecutor*

*http://www.reuters.com/article/us-uber-shooting-idUSKCN0YS2EP*


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## Bart McCoy

ChortlingCrison said:


> It is true that this pyschopath had no criminal record, but this exposes a lot of ubers coverup on other driver offenses like assault/rape etc. Now this guy could have shot these people at any time uber or no uber but there was some 911 calls earlier in the day about his reckless driving.


But wait, i thought somebody posted his rap sheet saying he was on probation or something? So that was just a hoax?


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