# Unaccompanied minor



## DrivingForYou (Aug 6, 2017)

schools in.

We need a "cancel due to unaccompanied minor" button added to the app.

WTF with all the minors using the app or having parents schedule rides for them.

California law requires riders be 18 and up, or be accompanied by a parent or guardian.


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## Dropking (Aug 18, 2017)

Totally agree. The gall of parents thinking they can send their minor child to school with a stranger. The parents are breaking the law, and the terms of service, but Lyft and Uber look the other way with a wink. Most drivers complete these trips, or so I've learned from the 12 and 14 year old boys I've refused to pick up. You get dinged with a driver cancellation and no cancel fee. The fact that these rides are occurring en masse every single school day is a scandal that a bright newspaper report ought to pick up and publish. 

Same with the toddlers missing car seats. There should be a "breaking terms of service" button that enables drivers to recoup their cancellation fee without penalty, and stop Lyft and Uber from willfully enabling illegal behavior that imperils their drivers.


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## PickEmUp (Jul 19, 2017)

Dropking said:


> Totally agree. The gall of parents thinking they can send their minor child to school with a stranger. The parents are breaking the law, and the terms of service, but Lyft and Uber look the other way with a wink. Most drivers complete these trips, or so I've learned from the 12 and 14 year old boys I've refused to pick up. You get dinged with a driver cancellation and no cancel fee. The fact that these rides are occurring en masse every single school day is a scandal that a bright newspaper report ought to pick up and publish.
> 
> Same with the toddlers missing car seats. There should be a "breaking terms of service" button that enables drivers to recoup their cancellation fee without penalty, and stop Lyft and Uber from willfully enabling illegal behavior that imperils their drivers.


Wait five minutes. Call the Pax. Cancel and collect your cancel fee. No legal pax is a no show.


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## Dropking (Aug 18, 2017)

PickEmUp said:


> Wait five minutes. Call the Paz. Cancel and collect your cancel fee. No legal pax is a no show.


Yeah sometimes that is fine, but not always. These rides are often at peak am earning time so moving on may be the more lucrative option. I actually hate school trips as they are usually short-miles high-minutes rides in congested areas, meaning poor pay. Always glad NOT to do one.

The mom may cancel herself before five minutes and then I've wasted 5 minutes during peak hours while getting a death stare by an annoying teenager and his annoying friends who may decide to do something stupid to my car. Worse, the mom may decide to come out of her house after 4 minutes and jump in and then I'll have to take mom & kid on a roundabout 2-stop journey, 30 minutes 4 miles during rush hour, and I'll get a 1-star rating for $8 bucks.


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

Legally if a parent gives permission to transport their child, its acceptable. By ordering a ride, they obviously give permission. 

The legal problems come from setting up an acct in juniors name, under 18 cannot accept a contract and therefore it's not a valid ride.


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## PickEmUp (Jul 19, 2017)

Mista T said:


> Legally if a parent gives permission to transport their child, its acceptable. By ordering a ride, they obviously give permission.
> 
> The legal problems come from setting up an acct in juniors name, under 18 cannot accept a contract and therefore it's not a valid ride.


And just how are we expected to know whether or not the child has parental permission. Uber and Lyft policies explicitly prohibit unaccompanied minors.


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

That, my friend, is a challenge.

If a kid says "the name is Sharon, that's my mom" then I take the ride.

But since most kids and teens have their cell phones glued to their hands, and people like to keep the app open while riding, I can usually tell if it's on their phone, which seems like a violation. 

Tough to judge sometimes.


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## Dropking (Aug 18, 2017)

Mista T said:


> Legally if a parent gives permission to transport their child, its acceptable. By ordering a ride, they obviously give permission.
> 
> The legal problems come from setting up an acct in juniors name, under 18 cannot accept a contract and therefore it's not a valid ride.


Neither Lyft or Uber's own terms allow transportation of an unaccompanied minor (at least in California).

Regardless, what idiot driver would actually want to be alone with a minor? Gawd help you against false accusations.


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

DrivingForYou said:


> schools in.
> 
> We need a "cancel due to unaccompanied minor" button added to the app.
> 
> ...


This is what I absoultely hated when I was driving Lyft because Lyft is the worse of the two when it comes to these pax. It's that wonderful gray area in which pax is clearly under aged (a child) but ride was paid for by legal adult (parent) who wants you to drive them to school, after school activities etc. Refusing will 99% result in a 1 star rating, pissed off pax, and most likely a nasty passive aggressive bot message from LyfUber. Refusing such riders (especially the barely legal ones who you can't ask their age but who look 18+ and are really minors) is almost equivalent to refusing a pax service animal. Regardless, LyfUber leaves you to sort out the potential bad PR carnage. And will likely deactivate you while investigating any PR incidents that arise from it. You're damned if you do and damned if you don't.

Hell, I'd swear CS would flag your account if it weren't written in black and white on the pax exclusion list.


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## john2g1 (Nov 10, 2016)

Mista T said:


> Legally if a parent gives permission to transport their child, its acceptable. By ordering a ride, they obviously give permission.
> 
> The legal problems come from setting up an acct in juniors name, under 18 cannot accept a contract and therefore it's not a valid ride.


Sure legally... However according to the Uber/Lyft ToS you can not which means if anything happens you are *not* covered by your Uber/Lyft insurance policy.

So unless you personally have commercial insurance or your personal insurance is up to $1,000,000 *and* includes rideshare coverage for *all* different liability types you are not abiding by to the rideshare/vehicle for hire/livery/taxi laws in almost every state.

Oh wait... not abiding by a law means that you are doing something illegal.


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

Dropking said:


> Neither Lyft or Uber's own terms allow transportation of an unaccompanied minor (at least in California).
> 
> Regardless, what idiot driver would actually want to be alone with a minor? Gawd help you against false accusations.


It's not that difficult really. Any elementary or secondary school child whose parent wants you to take them to school is one perfect example. I've been bullied by Uber (and formerly Lyft) into doing these in the past. Did 6 of these questionable rides driving Uber to date. All during height of rush hour in SF when parents and kids have to get to work/school.


3/6 cases parent got in and departed before minor reached their school destination point
2/6 cases parent called Uber to transport their elementary school children to a school that was located over 35 mins away and parents lacked a vehicle
1/6 cases CHILD called Uber using their barely legal looking child's Uber profile.

This last pax was a high school senior? junior? who looked older in Uber profile with make up. But was clearly more of a minor without it. Child became upset and defensive when I asked parent to confirm child's Uber profile with a legal id/driver's license. Child insisted they've never had any issues calling Uber to take themselves and parent to school/work. Child pointed out that my ride was the first time a driver was disrespectful to them.

It also became increasingly clear during trip that parent did not speak English and also appeared to be an illegal migrant. Parent got off before child's stop. Some 15 mins later, I dropped off this child at their school destination. Immediately pulled over and wrote up both pax as fraudulent riders.

The 1 star ratings on both our ends was mutual. Uber CS has yet to get around to removing this pax unfair rating. Doubtful if Uber even bothered to do anything about them to date.


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

Uber should offer a "dumb enough to drive a kid to/from school" badge


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## john2g1 (Nov 10, 2016)

On a side note and follow up to my post can UberBLACK or UberSUV drivers take minors?

Can a BLACK car answer or can someone post something verifiable?


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## PickEmUp (Jul 19, 2017)

Cynergie said:


> This is what I absoultely hated when I was driving Lyft because Lyft is the worse of the two when it comes to these pax. It's that wonderful gray area in which pax is clearly under aged (a child) but ride was paid for by legal adult (parent) who wants you to drive them to school, after school activities etc. Refusing will 99% result in a 1 star rating, pissed off pax, and most likely a nasty passive aggressive bot message from LyfUber. Refusing such riders (especially the barely legal ones who you can't ask their age but who look 18+ and are really minors) is almost equivalent to refusing a pax service animal. Regardless, LyfUber leaves you to sort out the potential bad PR carnage. And will likely deactivate you while investigating any PR incidents that arise from it. You're damned if you do and damned if you don't.
> 
> Hell, I'd swear CS would flag your account if it weren't written in black and white on the pax exclusion list.


A pax cannot rate you unless their ride is completed. If you cancel as a no show they cannot rate you. Before you cancel, do a screen capture and take a photo of the intended pax. That is all the evidence you need. I also run my video camera with audio to capture the exchange.


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

That's good to know. But even if you cancel/no show, pax will 100% complain to Lyft CS. Which will then send you a nasty passive aggressive email template. Which is a polite reminder informing you that while they sympathize with your fraudulent rider case, you've been officially blacklisted.

That's one of the top reasons why I quit working for the Better Boyfriend aka American Closet Psycho.


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## DrivingForYou (Aug 6, 2017)

Mista T said:


> Legally if a parent gives permission to transport their child, its acceptable. By ordering a ride, they obviously give permission.
> 
> The legal problems come from setting up an acct in juniors name, under 18 cannot accept a contract and therefore it's not a valid ride.


No this is illegal in California under the CPUC. No one under 18 can ride unaccompanied in Lyft or Uber.



Cynergie said:


> It's that wonderful gray area in which pax is clearly under aged (a child) but ride was paid for by legal adult (parent) who wants you to drive them to school, after school activities etc. *Refusing will 99% result in a 1 star rating,* pissed off pax, and most likely a nasty passive aggressive bot message from LyfUber. Refusing such riders (especially the barely legal ones who you can't ask their age but who look 18+ and are really minors) is almost equivalent to refusing a pax service animal. Regardless, LyfUber leaves you to sort out the potential bad PR carnage. And will likely deactivate you while investigating any PR incidents that arise from it. .


First of all, no, there is no grey area. Unaccompanied under 18 is illegal in California, PERIOD.

Just like a liquor store or bar, you have the right to ask anyone young their age and for ID before they ride in your car.

Refusing will NOT get you a 1 star rating, and you will CANCEL, and then report them to support immediately.

Lyft will not give you a bot message assuming you properly report this to support.

This is in no way like refusing a service animal. Refusing a service animal is illegal. Refusing a minor is LEGAL, and taking the minor is ILLEGAL.

STOP TAKING UNACCOMPANIED MINORS. If you are taking them, then you as part of the problem.



Cynergie said:


> I've been bullied by Uber (and formerly Lyft) into doing these in the past. Did 6 of these questionable rides driving Uber to date. All during height of rush hour in SF when parents and kids have to get to work/school.
> 
> 3/6 cases parent got in and departed before minor reached their school destination point
> 2/6 cases parent called Uber to transport their elementary school children to a school that was located over 35 mins away and parents lacked a vehicle
> 1/6 cases CHILD called Uber using their barely legal looking child's Uber profile..




How were you "bullied" into making illegal rides?

Here you admit you broke the law 6 times. How were you "bullied" into breaking the law.

It's YOUR car, and both uber and Lyft have clear polices in place.

DO NOT DRIVE UNACCOMPANIED MINORS, IF YOU DO YOU CAN BE TICKETED AND DEACTIVATED.

DO NOT DRIVE CHILDREN THAT ARE TOO SMALL WITHOUT A CHILD SEAT.

PERIOD.


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

DrivingForYou said:


> How were you "bullied" into making illegal rides?
> 
> Here you admit you broke the law 6 times. How were you "bullied" into breaking the law.
> 
> It's YOUR car, and both uber and Lyft have clear polices in place.


I don't do enough Lyft to comment but Uber does, maybe not 'bully' but will penalize you for not picking up unaccompanied minors or declining toddlers with no car seats.

Long story short, I have had numerous instances where I have pulled up, it's either too many riders, an obvious minor or parent witb toddler & no car seat, I cancelled and get no cancel fee. Going back and forth witb Rohit and the gang sometimes will get a cancel fee, sometimes won't.

I still won't pick those up, but I can imagine many drivers, having been burned before doing the right thing, will take them so they get something rather than nothing.

Does Lyft pay cancel fee for unaccompanied minors/no car seats/too many riders?

*before the armchair experts chime in, if I can I wait out the 5 minutes and cancel as no show but that doesn't always work.


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

DrivingForYou said:


> No this is illegal in California under the CPUC. No one under 18 can ride unaccompanied in Lyft or Uber.
> 
> First of all, no, there is no grey area. Unaccompanied under 18 is illegal in California, PERIOD.
> 
> ...


"bullied" = Zero CS feedback to repeated inquiries/reports and/or being flagged for high cancellation rate. Uber has apparently "forgotten" to give me closure on the last pax I took to date (the one with the non English speaking parent). This pax woman-child was borderline adult looking (with makeup like in her profile) and could've been legal adult as a high school senior. And if she were, I'd be still screwed since I cancelled on a legitimate pax.

It was hard to tell, and especially since neither pax would cooperate in providing legal id. The other ramification is a potential deactivation standby until Uber completes their "investigation" into the pax complaint of "discrimination" from the driver. Simply because the pax felt petty enough come up with a spitefully creative lie because I challenged their legal age during the ride.

Uber obviously doesn't care until an accident or law enforcement intervention at a traffic stop etc. causes them to review the pax account info. Regardless, it was clearly apparent that this particular pax had been using the Uber platform without any issues from other drivers. Her rating was very high (4.9 rank which was likely because she was an attractive female and rated so by other male drivers). Given this added factor, the problem is a potentially a wider spread one than you think.


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

I asked Lyft today about under 18 riders solo. Both Lyft local and corporate said it's against the law here.

So glad I checked, learned something important from this thread!

Thanks all who posted.


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## dnlbaboof (Nov 13, 2015)

why do these cancels count against us???????


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## PickEmUp (Jul 19, 2017)

dnlbaboof said:


> why do these cancels count against us???????


Don't cancel the ride. Wait the five minutes and make it a no-show or let the pax cancel. It really is a no-show because no legal pax showed up to take the ride.


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## dnlbaboof (Nov 13, 2015)

its even worse now that the ping doesnt show the address, its harder to avoid high schools , they need the old ping back now


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

Hence the bullying factor I mentioned earlier. It's how LyfUber passive aggressively pressures you into taking these pax so you can mak e more $$ for them. And they can claim complete innocence when they're deactivating you during any investigation that may arise down the road. Because with the cancellation metric, they've succesfully managed to transfer all the operational and legal risk to you the driver.


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## PickEmUp (Jul 19, 2017)

Cynergie said:


> Hence the bullying factor I mentioned earlier. It's how LyfUber passive aggressively pressures you into taking these pax so you can mak e more $$ for them. And they can claim complete innocence when they're deactivating you during any investigation that may arise down the road. Because with the cancellation metric, they've succesfully managed to transfer all the operational and legal risk to you the driver.


It's pretty simple. DONT CANCEL! Wait and make it a no show or let pax cancel. No legal pax = no show.


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## Gwoae (Aug 12, 2017)

I took a high school kid today kinda by accident. I backed into the driveway, and was looking to the right. The all of a sudden the back driver door opened and he got in. I thought my doors were locked so not sure why they werent. I confirmed his name and address but didn't really notice his age or that he had a backpack. 3 minutes later I realized we were going to the high school. I wasn't sure what to do. I figured just get him there safely and be more careful at 730am for now on. Ths is the first time I have been on the road during these hours. At the end of the ride I was going to report it but decided not too because I have only done 40 uber rides and only 23 have rated and I can't afford a 1 right now. I was also concerned that me reporting it might cause me problems since I did do the ride.


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## Ezridax (Aug 3, 2017)

Had one of these yesterday. Girl canceled before the 5 minutes after I told her I couldn't take her, but I called CS immediately and they gave me the cancel fee and flagged her account for review.


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

Last night I had a 17 yr old pax wanting ride about 30 miles. I would have done it but the little Fkr took 4:47 to show up. I sent him back in the house.


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## Dropking (Aug 18, 2017)

dnlbaboof said:


> why do these cancels count against us???????


Really excellent question. Cancellation rate does count against you for both Lyft and Uber. Even if they don't outright ban you for cancellations, cancellation rate will presumably determine if you or another car equidistant from the pax gets the ride request. So it matters.

Lyft is in legal jeopardy here. They do not categorize cancellations. Either the rider wasn't there after you wait for 5 minutes (or 90 seconds on a Line ride), or they were there and you canceled to your detriment. End of story. They message you in the app that your cancellation of the ride will negatively affect your ratings, no matter what the reason, even when you are canceling because a little kid wants a ride alone, or mom forgot the car seat. When a baby gets thrown through a windshield, or a minor child makes a false claim of sexual molestation, seems that Lyft has liability for misleading drivers. Based on many of the comments here, seems that Lyft has indeed fooled drivers into believing they should take these rides.

Uber is a little different. When you cancel a pax in Uber, the app presents a list of reasons for you to checkbox. One of the reasons is "fraudulent rider" so when a little kid shows up alone or mom forgets the carseat just check that fraudulent rider box. It will still count in your cancellation rate, but at least Uber is categorizing this stuff differently. Anything illegal is a fraudulent rider in my world.


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## PickEmUp (Jul 19, 2017)

Dropking said:


> Really excellent question. Cancellation rate does count against you for both Lyft and Uber. Even if they don't outright ban you for cancellations, cancellation rate will presumably determine if you or another car equidistant from the pax gets the ride request. So it matters.
> 
> Lyft is in legal jeopardy here. They do not categorize cancellations. Either the rider wasn't there after you wait for 5 minutes (or 90 seconds on a Line ride), or they were there and you canceled to your detriment. End of story. They message you in the app that your cancellation of the ride will negatively affect your ratings, no matter what the reason, even when you are canceling because a little kid wants a ride alone, or mom forgot the car seat. When a baby gets thrown through a windshield, or a minor child makes a false claim of sexual molestation, seems that Lyft has liability for misleading drivers. Based on many of the comments here, seems that Lyft has indeed fooled drivers into believing they should take these rides.
> 
> Uber is a little different. When you cancel a pax in Uber, the app presents a list of reasons for you to checkbox. One of the reasons is "fraudulent rider" so when a little kid shows up alone or mom forgets the carseat just check that fraudulent rider box. It will still count in your cancellation rate, but at least Uber is categorizing this stuff differently. Anything illegal is a fraudulent rider in my world.


Um, NO! As a driver, you are waiting for a LEGAL pax. If a LEGAL pax is not there, it is a no show. End of story.


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## Dropking (Aug 18, 2017)

I do not want to wait 5 minutes during peak hours to record a valid no-show. That inconveniences me so I dont agree that inconveniencing me is the "end of story" when i am trolling for long rides at premium rates.


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## InertialObserver (Aug 16, 2017)

My policy is to not card passengers, and not ask their age. There are adult teenagers who attend high school (until age 21 in some jurisdictions) and there are adults who have genetic conditions that make them appear child-like. If ever questioned by a LEO, that's my story and I'm sticking to it. 

In WA state, it's legal for "for hire" cars to take infants and kids without carseats. My personal policy is that if they would need a car seat in a personal vehicle, they need one in mine. I would not be okay with splattered toddler all over my car in the case of an accident. I'd never forgive myself for contributing to a preventable death. So even though it's legal here, it's not happening in my car. I also ask adults with infants in carriers if they know how to buckle it in properly, since those who primarily use public transport may not know, and I watch through the mirror to make sure.


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## dnlbaboof (Nov 13, 2015)

teenagers using uber is not going away,parents like it bc they are at work and they approve, parents would rather have this then drunk/crazed kids driving, they should just allow it with parents permission, all insurance companies cover minors like geico, its just a stupid law that puts drivers at risk of getting in trouble when they are actually saving lives


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## Jamesp1234 (Sep 10, 2016)

Wait, noshow, report the parent to uber/lyft, drive down the street and wait for the repeat ping, repeat previous steps. Usually the parent figures out they are not going to get a ride for their kid. Did it more than a few times in the same neighborhood without driving that far.
Easy money and slowly eliminating the parents from the systems.


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

PickEmUp said:


> Um, NO! As a driver, you are waiting for a LEGAL pax. If a LEGAL pax is not there, it is a no show. End of story.


Tell that to LyfUber when CS refuses or flat out keeps "forgetting" to change the spiteful 1 star rating that fraudulent pax gave you. Especially if the LyfUber account belongs to a legal adult who is the parent/guardian of that minor you flagged. If you're lucky, LyfUber may reimburse you for the fraudulent rider cancellation (and probably will be the case if you have a dash cam to prove it). But from my experience, it's highly unlikely LyfUber will ban the pax account from the platform. My guess their logic is that the account belongs to a legal adult who (in theory) was not the fraudulent rider that caused the cancellation. So there is no need to deactivate/ban the actual account holder from the platform.

Proof: the barely legal high school student I drove. Whose parent clearly wasn't eligible legally and credit wise to own a credit card you need to have an Uber account. Student insisted they never had any issues taking Uber in the past and that I was a POS driver for daring to question their chronological age. And being racist for daring to ask their non English speaking parent for proof of their child's age.

Apparently past drivers who transported this dynamic duo probably didn't question the sovereignty of this self entitled high school kid because they either 
1) thought she was a legal adult or 
2) didn't want to create a confrontational situation that would result in a crappy rating.


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## sd1303 (Nov 11, 2015)

Photo ID is not required to use Uber/Lyft... there are no CA laws that I'm aware of that dictate what is (or isn't) valid identification for this purpose... and frankly, I'm not going to be able to tell if someone gives me a fake ID anyway.

If the passenger looks like a teenager, I ask them how old they are. If they lie, it's on them. I've made a good faith effort to ensure that they are an adult. I have a dash cam. 

Not saying it's ironclad... but it seems reasonable and defensible to me.


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

Yes. And therein lies the problem. That gray, gray area which LyfUber continuously compels drivers to operate in. Judgement calls are subjective tenants that can't hold water in a court of law. Dash cams and driver's license/state id are not i.e. they are objective.

example objective:

suspecting a pax is a fraudulent rider and they can't or refuse to provide proof to the contrary (driver's license etc). Then you could cover your rear by denying them entry into your vehicle. LyfUber can't deactivate you for such a specific cancellation. Especially if you had a dash cam to back up your claim. But they could do so indirectly i.e. if you've accumulated enough cancellations in the past, and this cancellation is the one that takes you over the top.

example subjective:

You picked up a lying teen and exercised judgement by taking them at their word they aren't a minor. And then--heaven forbid--got into an accident or traffic stop while en route. It's a 100% guarantee that LyfUber would immediately deactivate your @$$. And this would likely become a permanent one, since law enforcement would likely use your under aged pax as a witness (in case of an accident). At which point, their status as a fraudulent rider would be revealed by default of the inevitable law enforcement/LyfUber investigation. 

So like I said, you're screwed if you do and screwed if you don't.


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## PickEmUp (Jul 19, 2017)

Cynergie said:


> Tell that to LyfUber when CS refuses or flat out keeps "forgetting" to change the spiteful 1 star rating that fraudulent pax gave you. Especially if the LyfUber account belongs to a legal adult who is the parent/guardian of that minor you flagged. If you're lucky, LyfUber may reimburse you for the fraudulent rider cancellation (and probably will be the case if you have a dash cam to prove it). But from my experience, it's highly unlikely LyfUber will ban the pax account from the platform. My guess their logic is that the account belongs to a legal adult who (in theory) was not the fraudulent rider that caused the cancellation. So there is no need to deactivate/ban the actual account holder from the platform.
> 
> Proof: the barely legal high school student I drove. Whose parent clearly wasn't eligible legally and credit wise to own a credit card you need to have an Uber account. Student insisted they never had any issues taking Uber in the past and that I was a POS driver for daring to question their chronological age. And being racist for daring to ask their non English speaking parent for proof of their child's age.
> 
> ...


It's pretty simple. Don't drive them and they can't rate you. A no show can't rate the driver.



Cynergie said:


> Yes. And therein lies the problem. That gray, gray area which LyfUber continuously compels drivers to operate in. Judgement calls are subjective tenants that can't hold water in a court of law. Dash cams and driver's license/state id are not i.e. they are objective.
> 
> example objective:
> 
> ...


When in doubt, kick em out. Actually, don't let them in your car. If they are 18 they will have an ID.


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

Dropking said:


> Uber is a little different. When you cancel a pax in Uber, the app presents a list of reasons for you to checkbox. One of the reasons is "fraudulent rider" so when a little kid shows up alone or mom forgets the carseat just check that fraudulent rider box. It will still count in your cancellation rate, but at least Uber is categorizing this stuff differently.


Uber may classify it differently but you will not get a cancel fee unless it's a 5 minute no show. Believe me I have gone back and forth with them on this. Showed up to a pickup with 5 people, 2 were toddlers no car seat. No cancel fee despite telling Rohit and the gang that I would've had to break 2 separate laws to transport them.

Now I just do 5 minutes no show if at all possible to make sure I get paid.


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## sd1303 (Nov 11, 2015)

Cynergie said:


> Yes. And therein lies the problem. That gray, gray area which LyfUber continuously compels drivers to operate in. Judgement calls are subjective tenants that can't hold water in a court of law. Dash cams and driver's license/state id are not i.e. they are objective.
> 
> example objective:
> 
> ...


Managed risk. Liability will be determined by a judge or jury.

I drive for Lyft only right now, and they have not set up the expectation that a driver might ask a passenger for an ID as proof of age (or for any other reason). Not sure where Uber is currently at with this.

While an ID check may save yourself from haplessly transporting a minor, you intentions may get misinterpreted, resulting in a different sort of accusation.

Same sort of scenario. An adult gets in your car with a 4'6" 7-year-old who is not in a booster seat. You ask the adult the child's age... they lie and say 8.

It's plausible that the child is 8, so you proceed on good faith that there is no violation of the child seat law.

Two blocks down the road, you get into a horrific car accident. The child is killed, and it turns out the adult is the deceased's cousin, not a parent.

Could you have gotten out a tape measure and/or demand proof of the child's age? Sure. Will a court find your diligence to be sufficient under the circumstances. Who knows?



New2This said:


> Uber may classify it differently but you will not get a cancel fee unless it's a 5 minute no show. Believe me I have gone back and forth with them on this. Showed up to a pickup with 5 people, 2 were toddlers no car seat. No cancel fee despite telling Rohit and the gang that I would've had to break 2 separate laws to transport them.
> 
> Now I just do 5 minutes no show if at all possible to make sure I get paid.


Yes, they get 5 minutes to either produce two child seats or make the decision to not bring the kids along. If you don't wait 5 minutes, then you haven't earned a no show fee. If the passenger cancels, you get the cancel fee.


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## NHDriver (Aug 6, 2017)

If you have a dash cam with audio, and the accompanying adult lies, I believe your off the hook. You did your due diligence. With a single person minor it would be different.


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## Ezridax (Aug 3, 2017)

Dropking said:


> Really excellent question. Cancellation rate does count against you for both Lyft and Uber. Even if they don't outright ban you for cancellations, cancellation rate will presumably determine if you or another car equidistant from the pax gets the ride request. So it matters.
> 
> Lyft is in legal jeopardy here. They do not categorize cancellations. Either the rider wasn't there after you wait for 5 minutes (or 90 seconds on a Line ride), or they were there and you canceled to your detriment. End of story. They message you in the app that your cancellation of the ride will negatively affect your ratings, no matter what the reason, even when you are canceling because a little kid wants a ride alone, or mom forgot the car seat. When a baby gets thrown through a windshield, or a minor child makes a false claim of sexual molestation, seems that Lyft has liability for misleading drivers. Based on many of the comments here, seems that Lyft has indeed fooled drivers into believing they should take these rides.
> 
> Uber is a little different. When you cancel a pax in Uber, the app presents a list of reasons for you to checkbox. One of the reasons is "fraudulent rider" so when a little kid shows up alone or mom forgets the carseat just check that fraudulent rider box. It will still count in your cancellation rate, but at least Uber is categorizing this stuff differently. Anything illegal is a fraudulent rider in my world.


Got Lyft CS on the phone this morning with a mom who was trying to get me to take her and her 3 y/o without a car seat. And then she wanted me to install said car seat when she did get it. Mom got fed up and said it's too much work and canceled. Twice. Two cancellation fees for me.


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## sd1303 (Nov 11, 2015)

NHDriver said:


> If you have a dash cam with audio, and the accompanying adult lies, I believe your off the hook. You did your due diligence. With a single person minor it would be different.


It is very unlikely that, on the criminal side, that a misrepresentation of age (especially one proven by audio/video) by a minor would result in any sort of conviction. If you want proof, look at some of the case law related to statutory rape.

On the civil side, it'll depend on whether a jury feels that the driver acted reasonably and/or excercised sufficient diligence under the circumstances.


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## UberLaLa (Sep 6, 2015)

Got a Ping last week with a phone call following immediately from passenger: _We are in back of the high school.
_
Me over the phone: _Are you 18 or older? Because you need to be 18 to use Uber.
_
Her: _Yes *pause* no wait, umh...what did you ask? _I nicely repeated the question. _Oh, no I'm not...
_
Asked her to Cancel the Trip and she did. Would be nice if they were all that easy.


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## Mikek999 (May 17, 2017)

Ezridax said:


> Had one of these yesterday. Girl canceled before the 5 minutes after I told her I couldn't take her, but I called CS immediately and they gave me the cancel fee and flagged her account for review.


Yea I've been reporting the underage pax this last week. I find it amazing that the pax doesn't understand and simply replyies with I'll just order another request. You'd think after several reports on their account and cancel fees they would get the point. Personally I would love it if the schools would get involved telling parents the TOS when it comes to underage pax.


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

UberLaLa said:


> Got a Ping last week with a phone call following immediately from passenger: _We are in back of the high school.
> _
> Me over the phone: _Are you 18 or older? Because you need to be 18 to use Uber.
> _
> ...


Watch your back. You're lucky this kid hasn't taken advantage of Lyfts newly improved system feedback. The one where it lets pax flag the driver if the driver asks them to cancel.


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## DrivingForYou (Aug 6, 2017)

dnlbaboof said:


> teenagers using uber is not going away,parents like it bc they are at work and they approve, parents would rather have this then drunk/crazed kids driving, they should just allow it with parents permission, all insurance companies cover minors like geico, its just a stupid law that puts drivers at risk of getting in trouble when they are actually saving lives


There are alternatives for underaged :

*Kangado
HopSkipDrive
Zum*



New2This said:


> Uber may classify it differently but you will not get a cancel fee unless it's a 5 minute no show. Believe me I have gone back and forth with them on this. Showed up to a pickup with 5 people, 2 were toddlers no car seat. No cancel fee despite telling Rohit and the gang that I would've had to break 2 separate laws to transport them.
> 
> Now I just do 5 minutes no show if at all possible to make sure I get paid.


Tell the passenger to cancel, then you still get the fee and no hit to your cancel rate. Most pax cancel as soon as you tell them to get out of your car, they are hoping to find an idiot driver to take them.


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

Gotta love the message from Lyft, thanking drivers for shuttling students around.


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## Dropking (Aug 18, 2017)

_"If the passenger cancels, you get the cancel fee."
_
If the passenger cancels within 5 minutes of requesting the ride, you do not get the cancel fee. This is the problem. All of these kiddy rides are at optimum peek rides when you might be making $1 minutes, $60 hour for a period of time. These five minutes wasted by illegal riders for no pay is killer. With Uber you only have to wait 90 seconds during peak hours. They've thought this problem through a lot more than Lyft as they are a more mature company.


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

Mista T said:


> Gotta love the message from Lyft, thanking drivers for shuttling students around.


Did I miss something? When did Lyft quietly change their corporate policy to legalize us drivers transporting minors? Or perhaps that man is just incapable of comprehending his own company's corporate policy?

How the hell has this clueless git gotten Lyft sued out of existence yet??? 

Wag the dog.


----------



## sd1303 (Nov 11, 2015)

Cynergie said:


> Did I miss something? When did Lyft quietly change their corporate policy to legalize us drivers transporting minors? Or perhaps that man is just incapable of comprehending his own company's corporate policy?
> 
> How the hell has this clueless git gotten Lyft sued out of existence yet???
> 
> Wag the dog.


I guess that there's no chance that they were referring to car-less college "students"... you know... the ones that make up a decent percentage of our customers?


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## NHDriver (Aug 6, 2017)

Well today I turned 3 teens away which is not uncommon anymore in the course of a day. However, this is the first time a mother of the teen ran up to my car screaming at me that I needed to get her daughter to field hockey practice as she has no way to get her there. The mother ranted and raved at me and would not let me get a word in edge wise. I slowly rolled up the window and started to pull away and she ran in front of my car as I was turning around to yell at me more lol. She was screaming at me nobody turns away from me. I could not move the car forward until she moved aside. She ranted for a good 5 minutes. Meanwhile the girl went back in the house and a few neighbor started gathering because she was screaming at me. I drove up on her lawn to leave and got out of there. Definitely a first for me. And yes, all on cam lol. Some crazy ass people around for sure.


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## sd1303 (Nov 11, 2015)

NHDriver said:


> Well today I turned 3 teens away which is not uncommon anymore in the course of a day. However, this is the first time a mother of the teen ran up to my car screaming at me that I needed to get her daughter to field hockey practice as she has no way to get her there. The mother ranted and raved at me and would not let me get a word in edge wise. I slowly rolled up the window and started to pull away and she ran in front of my car as I was turning around to yell at me more lol. She was screaming at me nobody turns away from me. I could not move the car forward until she moved aside. She ranted for a good 5 minutes. Meanwhile the girl went back in the house and a few neighbor started gathering because she was screaming at me. I drove up on her lawn to leave and got out of there. Definitely a first for me. And yes, all on cam lol. Some crazy ass people around for sure.


5 minutes? Impressive. No show fee earned?


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## NHDriver (Aug 6, 2017)

sd1303 said:


> 5 minutes? Impressive. No show fee earned?[/QUOT
> No she ended up cancelling the ride after I was long gone.


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## sd1303 (Nov 11, 2015)

Cancel fee, then?


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## NHDriver (Aug 6, 2017)

sd1303 said:


> Cancel fee, then?


yes $3.75 for having to deal with that... not worth it lol.


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## sd1303 (Nov 11, 2015)

NHDriver said:


> yes $3.75 for having to deal with that... not worth it lol.


No... $3.75... plus a good story... and a monetizable YouTube video... plus you got to drive on her lawn.


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## NHDriver (Aug 6, 2017)

sd1303 said:


> No... $3.75... plus a good story... and a monetizable YouTube video... plus you got to drive on her lawn.


I was afraid she was going to throw herself under my car lol.



sd1303 said:


> No... $3.75... plus a good story... and a monetizable YouTube video... plus you got to drive on her lawn.


Yeah I need to research what I can post on youtube and what I cannot. I usually delete my dash cam vids after 30 days figuring if nobody has complained for 30 days after a ride it's safe enough. However, I have a dozen or so I have kept that are youtube worthy. Just don't want to get sued by anybody.


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## sd1303 (Nov 11, 2015)

NHDriver said:


> I was afraid she was going to throw herself under my car lol.


Well, that would have been unfortunate... glad that didn't happen. Hopefully with a dash cam and an audience... you would have been fine.



NHDriver said:


> Yeah I need to research what I can post on youtube and what I cannot. I usually delete my dash cam vids after 30 days figuring if nobody has complained for 30 days after a ride it's safe enough. However, I have a dozen or so I have kept that are youtube worthy. Just don't want to get sued by anybody.


That's prudent. Working in your favor is the fact that she had no expectation of privacy (since she was loud enough to attract the neighbors). Might also ensure that there's nothing in the Lyft/Uber TOS (privacy policy?) that may cause a problem.


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## WeDreams (Sep 14, 2017)

She wanted a baby sitter


----------



## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

NHDriver said:


> Well today I turned 3 teens away which is not uncommon anymore in the course of a day. However, this is the first time a mother of the teen ran up to my car screaming at me that I needed to get her daughter to field hockey practice as she has no way to get her there. The mother ranted and raved at me and would not let me get a word in edge wise. I slowly rolled up the window and started to pull away and she ran in front of my car as I was turning around to yell at me more lol. She was screaming at me nobody turns away from me. I could not move the car forward until she moved aside. She ranted for a good 5 minutes. Meanwhile the girl went back in the house and a few neighbor started gathering because she was screaming at me. I drove up on her lawn to leave and got out of there. Definitely a first for me. And yes, all on cam lol. Some crazy ass people around for sure.


You can thank Caleb, the @$$hat General Manager from Portland from MistaT's post for that.

You really need to send that Village Idiot exec the video IMO. Or release a copy to your local news station. Because what a missed golden opportunity this was monetizing that drama queen on YouTube. Milked it for all its worth. Called the cops to cite her for attempted aggravated battery, workplace violence, disturbing the peace, and being a general overall public nuisance [email protected]


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## TeleSki (Dec 4, 2014)

john2g1 said:


> Sure legally... However according to the Uber/Lyft ToS you can not which means if anything happens you are *not* covered by your Uber/Lyft insurance policy.
> 
> So unless you personally have commercial insurance or your personal insurance is up to $1,000,000 for *all* different liability types you are not abiding by to the rideshare/vehicle for hire/livery/taxi laws in almost every state.
> 
> ...


That's okay. You can ignore whatever law you want and be rewarded for it, as we see by DACA, etc. I take the rides. You have to have a credit card for an uber/lyft account, and credit cards aren't issued to minors. Therefore, by the parents giving their kids access to the account, they are giving consent to use the app. Maybe not 100% correct, but that's my thinking.


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## PickEmUp (Jul 19, 2017)

TeleSki said:


> That's okay. You can ignore whatever law you want and be rewarded for it, as we see by DACA, etc. I take the rides. You have to have a credit card for an uber/lyft account, and credit cards aren't issued to minors. Therefore, by the parents giving their kids access to the account, they are giving consent to use the app. Maybe not 100% correct, but that's my thinking.


Good luck with that defense if something happens or accusations are made. Parents can just say the kid got credit card from their purse while sleeping and you violated uber / lyft terms by picking up a minor. Also illegal in some states regardless of circumstances


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## NHDriver (Aug 6, 2017)

PickEmUp said:


> Good luck with that defense if something happens or accusations are made. Parents can just say the kid got credit card from their purse while sleeping and you violated uber / lyft terms by picking up a minor. Also illegal in some states regardless of circumstances


U/L takes debit cards. Teens have debit cards. That's how they get their own accounts set up.


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## JFrancis (May 25, 2017)

Thanks to this thread I am more aware and just turned out a pax for the first time. Looked young and on my asking replied that he is 16.


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## NHDriver (Aug 6, 2017)

JFrancis said:


> Thanks to this thread I am more aware and just turned out a pax for the first time. Looked young and on my asking replied that he is 16.


It sucks when you see the look of disappointment on their face but you have no choice. They have nothing to lose, you have everything to lose. Shitty situation to be in.


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## Mikek999 (May 17, 2017)

NHDriver said:


> Well today I turned 3 teens away which is not uncommon anymore in the course of a day. However, this is the first time a mother of the teen ran up to my car screaming at me that I needed to get her daughter to field hockey practice as she has no way to get her there. The mother ranted and raved at me and would not let me get a word in edge wise. I slowly rolled up the window and started to pull away and she ran in front of my car as I was turning around to yell at me more lol. She was screaming at me nobody turns away from me. I could not move the car forward until she moved aside. She ranted for a good 5 minutes. Meanwhile the girl went back in the house and a few neighbor started gathering because she was screaming at me. I drove up on her lawn to leave and got out of there. Definitely a first for me. And yes, all on cam lol. Some crazy ass people around for sure.


That's when you call Lyfts critical response number. People like this will eventually get kicked off the system.


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

I just found this in an article from March of this year. WTF.


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## sd1303 (Nov 11, 2015)

Mista T said:


> I just found this in an article from March of this year. WTF.


I actually think they are/were on the right track with UberTeen. Apparently, there's nothing illegal about transporting UMs in a TNC vehicle in the states UberTeen is offered.

In CA, you have to have a special permit to offer UM transport service (different permit than TNC). Drivers have to be fingerprinted, receive specific training, etc.

I'd consider driving for UberTeen if it paid more (not the case in the pilot cities). Expanding this service would also give X drivers a better answer to give than "can't do it."


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

What are the rules on unaccompanied minors in Miami?

And what made this guy think that forcing a 12 yr old to give him oral sex was okay?

The kid was 16 but he thought he was only 12. As if that makes it okay.


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## Docaces (Aug 12, 2015)

Just make them cancel. Or take no show fee.


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## Bob fox (May 18, 2016)

Mista T said:


> Legally if a parent gives permission to transport their child, its acceptable. By ordering a ride, they obviously give permission.
> 
> The legal problems come from setting up an acct in juniors name, under 18 cannot accept a contract and therefore it's not a valid ride.


Minors use parents' log-ins.. All types of problems. Accident? Great. Explain why you have an unaccompanied minor. May have vodka in his bag. Kid gets hurt? Lyft will deactivate you in 0.5 seconds.

I refuse to pick up minors. It sucks they're wasting everyone's time.

I pick 'em up, drive them around the block and drop them back off at their doorstep. "When you're a bit older, we'll go a bit farther!" Fair is fair.


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

I stand corrected on the previous statement. Unaccompanied minors are illegal, even with parental permission.


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## Docaces (Aug 12, 2015)

JUST SAY NO. Sorry Brother. I am sending pre-emptive text. One girl had her ID ready to prove she was 19 and still in High school.


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## Jenny01 (Apr 12, 2015)

DrivingForYou said:


> schools in.
> 
> We need a "cancel due to unaccompanied minor" button added to the app.
> 
> ...


I don't cancel on those rides, I tell them an adult must be present throughout the ride and then I procede to pick up and drop off rider in the app. I need to get paid somehow.


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## DrivingForYou (Aug 6, 2017)

Jenny01 said:


> I don't cancel on those rides, I tell them an adult must be present throughout the ride and then I procede to pick up and drop off rider in the app. I need to get paid somehow.


You will get deactivated for doing that.

Wait and get the $5 cancel fee


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## Jennyma (Jul 16, 2016)

I had an issue where someone called and said that I was picking up his family, his cousins to bring them to where he lived. Said 3 girls and a little guy. I thought they were going to be older. The 3 girls looked like teens and their was a boy like 8 the most. The oldest looking sat up front and I asked her how old she was. She said 18. The others girls looked about 14 or 15. I had my doubts but accepted the ride and it was a far one. I said to one of the younger ones in back so xyz called and we are going to Hollywood. I got a "who", uh uh I don't know...The older girl said that's right and cut off the other girl.

Now I could have been bringing minors up to some child pornographer if this man wasn't who he said he was and these were his cousins. I felt uneasy the whole trip. The older looking one was obviously still in high school as their conversation starting talking about people in their school, she would say x girl is in the llth grade or so in so was in your grade. So I hope she was an 18 year old senior. What are you supposed to do if you already accepted the ride, in the middle of the night when you've come to believe you have minors in your car?


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## DrivingForYou (Aug 6, 2017)

Jennyma said:


> . What are you supposed to do if you already accepted the ride, in the middle of the night when you've come to believe you have minors in your car?


The key is to ask for ID for people that look under 25 before you take them anywhere.

And demand that children under 8 have a car seat. That one is a $500 minimum fine AND A POINT ON YOUR RECORD.

If their knees don't bend at the seat edge when they are sitting all the way back in the seat, they need a booster seat.


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## Jenny01 (Apr 12, 2015)

DrivingForYou said:


> You will get deactivated for doing that.
> 
> Wait and get the $5 cancel fee


I won't get deactivated for that, but OK, keep wasting your time for a $4 cancel fee.


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## DrivingForYou (Aug 6, 2017)

Jenny01 said:


> I won't get deactivated for that, but OK, keep wasting your time for a $4 cancel fee.


It's $5 and better than a $3 short ride which is what most kids are getting.


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## Jenny01 (Apr 12, 2015)

DrivingForYou said:


> It's $5 and better than a $3 short ride which is what most kids are getting.


Are u newbie? Don't U know That cancel fee is $4 for the driver.


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

Cancel fee varies by city


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## Jennyma (Jul 16, 2016)

Jenny01 said:


> Are u newbie? Don't U know That cancel fee is $4 for the driver.


Other Jenny - cancellation fee in Los Angeles is $5 for Lyft. You are in a Lyft thread so, be careful about assumptions. Don't give us a bad rap.


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## bm1320 (Sep 14, 2017)

3 minors in a row going to school. $15 take, even called trust and safety while waiting on the timer to get them deactivated. Winning.


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## Ezridax (Aug 3, 2017)

bm1320 said:


> 3 minors in a row going to school. $15 take, even called trust and safety while waiting on the timer to get them deactivated. Winning.


Yeah, I have to say I love Lyft for being awesome in their response about these nitwit kids.


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## DidIDoThat (Jan 9, 2017)

Mista T said:


> I just found this in an article from March of this year. WTF.


What is crazy about this, is that the TOS says we can not take unaccompanied minors, yet they are going to offer the service and "not tell the driver it is a minor", which means the driver will (if they follow the TOS) reject the very rider Uber told the minor they could take when they get there to pick them up.


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## PickEmUp (Jul 19, 2017)

DidIDoThat said:


> What is crazy about this, is that the TOS says we can not take unaccompanied minors, yet they are going to offer the service and "not tell the driver it is a minor", which means the driver will (if they follow the TOS) reject the very rider Uber told the minor they could take when they get there to pick them up.


Um, NO! First of all, this is a Lyft thread. Second, the most common abuse is children using their parents account. Whether the parent knows or not, it needs to be brought to the attention of Lyft. Also, you should not pick up the unaccompanied minor to protect yourself from any potential legal or civil liability.


----------



## DidIDoThat (Jan 9, 2017)

PickEmUp said:


> Um, NO! First of all, this is a Lyft thread. Second, the most common abuse is children using their parents account. Whether the parent knows or not, it needs to be brought to the attention of Lyft. Also, you should not pick up the unaccompanied minor to protect yourself from any potential legal or civil liability.


 Fully aware that this is the Lyft forum and if you read this thread, and the comment I was commenting on, you would see that Uber is being discussed in this thread as well, so chill.

Down here it is often the parents providing the kids with the means to use Lyft, and it is also Lyft's fault, as "any" kid can get a credit card to use with Lyft, they are called "Pre Paid Visa Cards", Vanilla reload cards etc. If Lyft can process the card provided, they will accept it. Uber doesn't allow this, they want to verify the rider is 18 by making them use a bank issued card. Lyft wants to support the lower income and thus allows practically any Debit/Credit card that they can process thus enabling anyone (even minors) to use the system.


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## bm1320 (Sep 14, 2017)

DidIDoThat said:


> Fully aware that this is the Lyft forum and if you read this thread, and the comment I was commenting on, you would see that Uber is being discussed in this thread as well, so chill.
> 
> Down here it is often the parents providing the kids with the means to use Lyft, and it is also Lyft's fault, as "any" kid can get a credit card to use with Lyft, they are called "Pre Paid Visa Cards", Vanilla reload cards etc. If Lyft can process the card provided, they will accept it. Uber doesn't allow this, they want to verify the rider is 18 by making them use a bank issued card. Lyft wants to support the lower income and thus allows practically any Debit/Credit card that they can process thus enabling anyone (even minors) to use the system.


I had an 8 year old trying to get a Lyft once. Shitty parents.


----------



## TCANN (Jun 29, 2017)

At the end of the day, it is all on the driver.
Ignorance is no excuse of the law.
Violation of ToS and your insurance is nullified.


----------



## DrivingForYou (Aug 6, 2017)

TCANN said:


> At the end of the day, it is all on the driver.
> Ignorance is no excuse of the law.
> Violation of ToS and your insurance is nullified.


Violating TOS does not nullify insurance.

However, in states like California it is illegal as in a misdemeanor to take unaccompanied minors.


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## LEAFdriver (Dec 28, 2014)

_Just want to let you all know something that probably won't shock you._

Lyft doesn't _REALLY_ want you to not pick up minors. 

They just don't want to be_ responsible_ if something happens during a ride with a minor. Accident/molestation/etc.

I just got a scheduled ride request this morning.....from a passenger that I reported a few weeks ago as an unaccompanied minor.

I got my $10.....after emailing back and forth with Lyft several times a few weeks ago because the app 'conveniently FROZE' when I clicked on NO-SHOW.

Well....fast forward to this morning. I get the same person's scheduled ride request. I get there, click arrived, and 3 minutes later....TWO underage girls come walking out to the car. I tell them I cannot bring them. They CALL their Mother (the requesting pax, I assume) and I hear the girl complaining to her Mother that '_THIS DRIVER_ says they can't bring us because we aren't 18.'

Like they JUST HEARD THIS FOR THE FIRST TIME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Excuse me. Who paid the $10 scheduled ride cancel fee a few weeks ago when I reported them the FIRST time? LYFT apparently.

If they don't charge the PAX for their illegal/against the TOS practices......HOW WILL THEY KNOW they are doing anything WRONG? 

And....conveniently, AGAIN.....the app FREEZES when I click on No-show AGAIN this morning!!!!

No. This is not a coincidence. It is BUILT into the Lyft app to discourage drivers from reporting unaccompanied minors so that they just pick them up, drive them and reap the consequences if God Forbid something bad happens.

Stepping off soapbox now.


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## Kevin D (Feb 7, 2018)

LEAFdriver said:


> _Just want to let you all know something that probably won't shock you._
> 
> Lyft doesn't _REALLY_ want you to not pick up minors.
> 
> ...


I find it impressive that someone could intentionally program an app to freeze, "conveniently", when attempting to report unaccompanied minors as no shows. I didn't give Lyft enough credit for their technical prowess.


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## LEAFdriver (Dec 28, 2014)

Kevin D said:


> I find it impressive that someone could intentionally program an app to freeze, "conveniently", when attempting to report unaccompanied minors as no shows. I didn't give Lyft enough credit for their technical prowess.


I know, right?!  I can't think of any other logical explanation. Since my app was working fine in both instances.....until it came time to cancel as a no-show. Then....all of the sudden....the ride screen disappears with a message saying I was having 'connectivity issues'. LOL I'm about ready to try doing a screen recording from trip acceptance to drop off now.....just to show the shadiness of how the Lyft app works!!


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## Ardery (May 26, 2017)

I'm going to give this thread a bump.

these issues are absolutely getting worse. 

the reason: too many drivers are setting a precidence by accepting unaccompanied minors and accepting babies without car seats. 

so when a law abiding driver refuses to accept them, it's such a rare occasion with the passenger, since more drivers accept minors and babies - than not. 

it's almost a losing battle.


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## dnlbaboof (Nov 13, 2015)

they should use the facial recognition for riders as well to catch the minors lol


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## LEAFdriver (Dec 28, 2014)

Ardery said:


> I'm going to give this thread a bump.
> 
> these issues are absolutely getting worse.
> 
> ...


Yup. I agree. Just last night....I was heading home and I get a ping 1.5 miles away and thought I'd take just one more. I get there, and it's 2 parents with 3 (THREE!) children ages 4 and under! OK. Multiple problems here. You have 5 people....and 3 of them are small children with no car seats. I open my window and let the parents know why I can't pick them up. The mother....starts cursing....saying she's been taking Lyft 'all week' with no problem. She asks if she need to '*cancel and re-request*'.  I told her* NO*. ALL Lyft drivers have the same orders to not take more people than they have seat belts for and especially not to take children with no car seats.

So...do they cancel? No. I had to wait out the 5 minutes and cancel no-show.

Mind you....the FIRST request was under_ a female's name._ About a minute after I cancel.....*after I told them 'NO-DON'T RE-REQUEST!'* I get a ping with a man's name. I thought it was a DIFFERENT pax. NOPE. Same people. Had to do the same thing.....wait out the timer...and cancel no-show.

They paid $10 and didn't get anywhere. They were only going about 1.5 miles from their pick-up location.

Because SO MANY drivers are ignoring the law and taking: too many pax and children with no car seats.....people don't even TRY to make PROPER legitimate plans for their transportation. And the drivers that DO take the law seriously get chewed out and cursed at.


----------



## Ardery (May 26, 2017)

LEAFdriver said:


> Yup. I agree. Just last night....I was heading home and I get a ping 1.5 miles away and thought I'd take just one more. I get there, and it's 2 parents with 3 (THREE!) children ages 4 and under! OK. Multiple problems here. You have 5 people....and 3 of them are small children with no car seats. I open my window and let the parents know why I can't pick them up. The mother....starts cursing....saying she's been taking Lyft 'all week' with no problem. She asks if she need to '*cancel and re-request*'.  I told her* NO*. ALL Lyft drivers have the same orders to not take more people than they have seat belts for and especially not to take children with no car seats.
> 
> So...do they cancel? No. I had to wait out the 5 minutes and cancel no-show.
> 
> ...


take the $10 happily.
they KNOW they need car seats. THEY ABSOLUTELY KNOW THEY NEED CAR SEATS.

gawd damn what piece of garbage mothers and fathers would put their kids into cars unprotected like that.


----------



## LEAFdriver (Dec 28, 2014)

Ardery said:


> take the $10 happily.
> they KNOW they need car seats. THEY ABSOLUTELY KNOW THEY NEED CAR SEATS.
> 
> gawd damn what piece of garbage mothers and fathers would put their kids into cars unprotected like that.


Oh yes. I took it happily. I told them: "Do NOT re-request" but they wanted to be stubborn and play Lyft/Uber Roulette. This morning, I reported them to Lyft. Because nothing will stop them. BTW....the mother looked about 6 months pregnant with child #4.


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