# A twelve hour shift in a taxi.



## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

I got a cab this morning and worked a twelve hour shift from 6am to 6pm.

I thought you U/L drivers might be interested in how the other side lives.

Gross bookings - $354

Cab lease and fees - $125

Gas - $17 (250 miles on a very old Prius)

Wash - $5

Net profit - $206

Per hour $17.16


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## Lag Monkey (Feb 6, 2015)

Sign me up!


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## 20yearsdriving (Dec 14, 2014)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> I got a cab this morning and worked a twelve hour shift from 6am to 6pm.
> 
> I thought you U/L drivers might be interested in how the other side lives.
> 
> ...


Not bad money , couple of naps on the job priceless!!!


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

20yearsdriving said:


> Not bad money , couple of naps on the job priceless!!!


No naps, I was fairly busy, and I lost an hour because my meter went **** up and I had to get it replaced at the shop.

I also spent all day not worrying about my pax rating me. LOL


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## 20yearsdriving (Dec 14, 2014)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> No naps, I was fairly busy, and I lost an hour because my meter went **** up and I had to get it replaced at the shop.
> 
> I also spent all day not worrying about my pax rating me. LOL


You always need the nap time , make up for it mañana


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

20yearsdriving said:


> You always need the nap time , make up for it mañana


That's the great thing about driving a taxi. I turned their cab in at 6pm, and I'm taking a three day weekend. Might go back Monday, or Tuesday. Maybe.


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## MKEUber (Aug 20, 2014)

How much of that was in tips?


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

MKEUber said:


> How much of that was in tips?


I don't really keep track, but tips usually run 15% - 30% on cash and credit fares.

My company does a lot of voucher account work, and there's no tip on those rides, but they help you stay busy.


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## 20yearsdriving (Dec 14, 2014)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> That's the great thing about driving a taxi. I turned their cab in at 6pm, and I'm taking a three day weekend. Might go back Monday, or Tuesday. Maybe.


Sweet !!!


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Gross bookings? That would be your "fares" reading off the meter? Vouchers are from ER, Airlines, doctor's offices I'm guessing..... Are you driving for a company with enough cars that you can simply jump on the schedule, or do you need to sub for people? How is the dispatching?


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

Huberis said:


> Gross bookings? That would be your "fares" reading off the meter? Vouchers are from ER, Airlines, doctor's offices I'm guessing..... Are you driving for a company with enough cars that you can simply jump on the schedule, or do you need to sub for people? How is the dispatching?


Gross bookings is what I keep track of on my trip sheet. For a $10 voucher, I write down $10. For a cash/credit call that is $16 on the meter and they give me an even $20, I write down $20.

Vouchers are mostly medical, paid for by the state for people on medicare/medicaid.

The company I drive for is one of the largest single fleets in the country, they have somewhere between 800 and 1000 cabs in Arizona. All I do is show up and get a cab.

The only requirement to keep my contract is to drive one shift every 30 days. I can work one day month or thirty. All they care about is that I pay them and don't wreck the cab.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

6 to 6 is a killer cab shift. In any decent city those numbers should simply be like that every day.
sadly, Charlotte is a $0.75 UberX town so I NEVER have a day like that in my cab unless there's a convention of 8000 people or more in town.
ffk you Uber Charlotte!
I was a cabbie before there was Uber
I'll outlast Uber
but the belt is getting tight.


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## Bart McCoy (Nov 4, 2014)

i could make the same doing UberX gurantees though


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## Lidman (Nov 13, 2014)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> No naps, I was fairly busy, and I lost an hour because my meter went **** up and I had to get it replaced at the shop.
> 
> I also spent all day not worrying about my pax rating me. LOL


Since uber/lyft started with that ratings nonsense, I've come to appreciate more and more driving a cab and not having to concern myself with that and the bullshit acceptance rate.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Bart McCoy said:


> i could make the same doing UberX gurantees though


You would be doing it while using your personal car. That is a profound difference. Arizona isn't leveraging or risking the equity he has in his car to earn the same amount of money.


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## BostonTaxiDriver (Nov 23, 2014)

Those profits are almost unheard of in Boston driving days. So I drive nights and still make nowhere that on average over 5-7 nights.

Very slow this week for Boston day taxi drivers. My guess is $4-$8 per hour profit with tips. 

Slow season after Christmas and New Years? I heard some made less than $2 per hour profit.

It is Passover/Easter weekend. Can't imagine good earnings for most cabbies. But do you think Phoenix was highly profitable?


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## Sydney Uber (Apr 15, 2014)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> That's the great thing about driving a taxi. I turned their cab in at 6pm, and I'm taking a three day weekend. Might go back Monday, or Tuesday. Maybe.


Sounds like how I started in Cabs in 1986. In the Summer I'd take out a cab for a "semi-double" which was a 24hr hire. I'd work about 20hrs take the next day off then 2 solid 12hr night shifts. That would leave about 3 days to go fishing, ride motorbikes or just hang with my mates. Cab driving allowed a fairly good, non-commital lifestyle for a 20 yr old.

But it doesn't last for ever, you gotta grow up!


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## Showa50 (Nov 30, 2014)

Huberis said:


> You would be doing it while using your personal car. That is a profound difference. Arizona isn't leveraging or risking the equity he has in his car to earn the same amount of money.


What's the difference? Yes there's the Insurance thing, we all know. But when you look at the numbers, $600+ a week just to use a car? A full-time UberX driver can afford a nice car and now that policies are becoming available be way ahead just from a numbers stand point. I'd rather take the risk and make the investment in myself and after 8-10 hrs I can quit with no worries about that lease fee.

The part time UberX driver is the real loser.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Showa50 said:


> What's the difference? Yes there's the Insurance thing, we all know. But when you look at the numbers, $600+ a week just to use a car? A full-time UberX driver can afford a nice car and now that policies are becoming available be way ahead just from a numbers stand point. I'd rather take the risk and make the investment in myself and after 8-10 hrs I can quit with no worries about that lease fee.
> 
> The part time UberX driver is the real loser.


It isn't simply to use a car. The taxi company has real dispatching with the ability to give good lineups. Taxi companies have accounts with various local businesses that help keep the cars moving in a good way. Pax are able to make reservations through the office people. If you have a difficult pax who gives you trouble, you can quickly and easily inform dispatch and move on.

UberX doesn't strike me as investing in myself. I see it more a matter of leveraging the equity of your personal car for Uber's benefit. The company is so mercurial. Their policy is to change their policies on a dime. The guarantees Bart talks about making: they could be taken or modified at any time. Then there is the car issue. The hybrid insurance doesn't look to be too cheap. It doesn't look to be outrageous either I suppose...... I agree with you, th part time UberX driver is out of luck on those terms.

I suppose I question as to whether or not you are really accounting for the wear and tear on your car driving UBER full time. If you are in UberX for the long haul and the money is rather similar....... You aren't making enough to cover the repairs on your car, the deductible you are likely to need set aside and the eventual replacement of your car.

That's just my perspective: you aren't so much investing in you, as you are lending Travis the equity in your car so he can charge you 20% plus a buck.


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## 20yearsdriving (Dec 14, 2014)

Huberis said:


> It isn't simply to use a car. The taxi company has real dispatching with the ability to give good lineups. Taxi companies have accounts with various local businesses that help keep the cars moving in a good way. Pax are able to make reservations through the office people. If you have a difficult pax who gives you trouble, you can quickly and easily inform dispatch and move on.
> 
> UberX doesn't strike me as investing in myself. I see it more a matter of leveraging the equity of your personal car for Uber's benefit. The company is so mercurial. Their policy is to change their policies on a dime. The guarantees Bart talks about making: they could be taken or modified at any time. Then there is the car issue. The hybrid insurance doesn't look to be too cheap. It doesn't look to be outrageous either I suppose...... I agree with you, th part time UberX driver is out of luck on those terms.
> 
> ...


Specially the last 2 lines


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Rideshare. UberX is still in its infancy. The list of gripes against the taxi industry has been accruing for 80 plus years by now. Has Uber been around for more than 5? I'm shit with dates. 

How many drivers have gone out, driven their car and really pounded out the work to the point where they wore their car out and had to replace it? I hear little or no talk about drivers talking about getting ready for their next car because the current one is about done. There is a reason for that:

It seems to be for the reason that drivers don't drive for Uber all that long (most taxi drivers don't last either). It may also be for the reason that the car is a personal car too. Everyone suggest that buying a car just to drive X is bad idea. My assumption is that any new car is going to be paid for by the full time job, from a spouse's income and it will be justified along those lines too.

If you are driving UberX........ full time balls to the wall and you started with a $25 or $30,000 or more car that was a couple years old, you aren't going to come close to replacing it by way of driving X. I simply don't see how it is possible. That is one of the reasons I think the claim that you are only lending Travis your equity is reasonable.

A taxi driver doesn't have to struggle with that illusion of "investing in yourself."


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## ElectroFuzz (Jun 10, 2014)

BostonTaxiDriver said:


> But do you think Phoenix was highly profitable?


Winter is the high season here.
There are 1 million visitors/snowbirds here right now.
Spring training, last week most hotels were at 100% capacity.
Car rentals were asking for $150 per day because there were simply no cars. 
But come summer it will be super dead here.


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## CapeCodDriver (Mar 21, 2015)

Huberis is right on. I'd wager there are very few UberX drivers deducting maintenance and depreciation before they come up with their hourly wage. Without those, you seriously overestimate what you're making and it may not be worth it.


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## The Kid (Dec 10, 2014)

they call me TK !


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

BostonTaxiDriver said:


> Those profits are almost unheard of in Boston driving days. So I drive nights and still make nowhere that on average over 5-7 nights.
> 
> Very slow this week for Boston day taxi drivers. My guess is $4-$8 per hour profit with tips.
> 
> ...


Do we know each other? I leased the 880 medallion 12 years ago for a few years.
is this RFT?
PM me.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Given the kind of income that is possible and he fact that you pretty much need to maintain your current set of wheels and save up for the next car, pretty much at the same time, I don't see how a person could manage to afford any kind of decent car let alone something that would impress the pax which kind of part of Travis' illusion. If you are currently allowed a car ten years or newer (that could change in either direction) well, that might mean you might need a car that is four to six years old. They don't come cheap. I just don't se how Uber Algebra adds up. I can't imagine it being sustainable for most people or anyone for that matter.


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## johnywinslow (Oct 30, 2014)

the problem is still that a taxi is just STUPID EXPENSIVE!


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Stupid expensive for who? The pax or the driver? Uber rates are a reflection of Uber Algebra. The people setting the rates do are not the people who own the car or have to maintain it etc. Uber rates in my humble opinion are not set to be sustainable for a driver to do it beyond their first call.

Taxi rates may be expensive, but they are real. I drive taxi for a living - it isn't my hobby. If you are talking about rates being expensive from the perspective of a driver: get real. Uber drivers by and large are not looking very far ahead, they aren't taking out what they will need to pay back in terms of maintenance and replacement costs as far as I can tell.

Taxi rates are closer to reflecting real operating costs. An UberX driver operating at taxi rates would still have a tough time making ends meet....... Taxis (each car) run almost around the clock in order to be real.


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## Fuzzyelvis (Dec 7, 2014)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> No naps, I was fairly busy, and I lost an hour because my meter went **** up and I had to get it replaced at the shop.
> 
> I also spent all day not worrying about my pax rating me. LOL


I'm assuming if a pax pukes you can go pick up another car? LOL


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

Fuzzyelvis said:


> I'm assuming if a pax pukes you can go pick up another car? LOL


Yup. I call dispatch, they put me on downtime and I go get a loaner car. Our operation is large enough that we have a full-time detailer on staff who cleans up that mess.

All our cars are detailed once every 90 days too.


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## BostonTaxiDriver (Nov 23, 2014)

TwoFiddyMile said:


> Do we know each other? I leased the 880 medallion 12 years ago for a few years.
> is this RFT?
> PM me.


No. Is the guy's name Turner?


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> I got a cab this morning and worked a twelve hour shift from 6am to 6pm.
> 
> I thought you U/L drivers might be interested in how the other side lives.
> 
> ...


Does "gross bookings" include tips? If not, how much in tips, if so, what is the breakdown between fares and tips?


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> That's the great thing about driving a taxi. I turned their cab in at 6pm, and I'm taking a three day weekend. Might go back Monday, or Tuesday. Maybe.


No, the great thing is that it was all using someone else's car!


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

BostonTaxiDriver said:


> No. Is the guy's name Turner?


Yeah- Turner is an old buddy of mine. Spoke on the phone about a month ago. Great guy!
You hear two stories about the Harvard business school stand- his version and my version.
his version is he freedom fought it back for Boston from Cambridge. 
My version is I wrote an article about it in the now defunct "rear view mirror" and did most of the heavy lifting.
either way, happy to have been of service.


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## Big Machine (Jun 19, 2014)

Huberis said:


> I see it more a matter of leveraging the equity of your personal car for Uber's benefit..


It's pretty hard to be "leveraging the equity of your personal car" considering cars don't have equity. Gotta love the lack of education of drivers


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Big Machine said:


> It's pretty hard to be "leveraging the equity of your personal car" considering cars don't have equity. Gotta love the lack of education of drivers


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equity_(finance)


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

You can call it what you want if you don't like the word equity use "assets" . You are just being a ****** bag arguing semantics Big Machine.

The equity in your car is how much you own versus how much you owe. Uber doesn't have to borrow or invest in a fleet of cars. They leave that up to the driver to figure out or finance. Generally, it isn't something anyone could ever actually borrow against..... Yet Uber manages to do just that.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

That being said, apparently there are such things as car equity loans which seem like a horrible idea.
https://www.carequityloans.com/


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## DrJeecheroo (Feb 12, 2015)

I don't think driving 12 hour shifts for a taxi company is always mandatory.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Ten and twelve hour shifts are pretty common. The company I lease from has six and eight hour shifts too. I suspect that isn't too common in the grander scheme of things. Most of the companies in my area have the driver sign up for a month at a time, a month ahead. You are responsible for the shift whether you work it or not. I rarely need a sub to take a shift. If I do, I usually know a couple drivers who are able and looking to pick up a shift or two. We also get vacation hours by way of working holidays. I rarely need to use them, but they would allow me to drop a shift if I gave an hour's notice.


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## 20yearsdriving (Dec 14, 2014)

Huberis said:


> Rideshare. UberX is still in its infancy. The list of gripes against the taxi industry has been accruing for 80 plus years by now. Has Uber been around for more than 5? I'm shit with dates.
> 
> How many drivers have gone out, driven their car and really pounded out the work to the point where they wore their car out and had to replace it? I hear little or no talk about drivers talking about getting ready for their next car because the current one is about done. There is a reason for that:
> 
> ...


You can buy a 2007 ford crown Victoria ( ex-police) for 2200.00 plus paint & equipment 1200.00
Total 3400.00 it will last you 2 years 
Compare that with that 24,000.00 car 
Taxi has a bad engine !!! time for a new car ( used)
But like you said some times we like to learn the hard way 
Blueprint exists , UBER said to hell with the blue print we going digital 
Now the ask can we see the blueprint please
Sure you can its public information


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## 20yearsdriving (Dec 14, 2014)

Huberis said:


> Stupid expensive for who? The pax or the driver? Uber rates are a reflection of Uber Algebra. The people setting the rates do are not the people who own the car or have to maintain it etc. Uber rates in my humble opinion are not set to be sustainable for a driver to do it beyond their first call.
> 
> Taxi rates may be expensive, but they are real. I drive taxi for a living - it isn't my hobby. If you are talking about rates being expensive from the perspective of a driver: get real. Uber drivers by and large are not looking very far ahead, they aren't taking out what they will need to pay back in terms of maintenance and replacement costs as far as I can tell.
> 
> Taxi rates are closer to reflecting real operating costs. An UberX driver operating at taxi rates would still have a tough time making ends meet....... Taxis (each car) run almost around the clock in order to be real.


Taxi rates reflect drivers : child education , retirement , savings , mortgage , health care , etc


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

20yearsdriving said:


> You can buy a 2007 ford crown Victoria ( ex-police) for 2200.00 plus paint & equipment 1200.00
> Total 3400.00 it will last you 2 years
> Compare that with that 24,000.00 car
> Taxi has a bad engine !!! time for a new car ( used)
> ...


A 2007 Crown Victoria sure doesn't fit the Uber mold! The taxi company I driver for never had much luck with ex CV police cruisers. The drivers didn't care for them, they sucked in the rain let alone snow. For such a massive machine, there isn't a lot of trunk or storage space from what I recall. Gas mileage wasn't so good...... I steered away from them when we had 'em.

I would guess we try to get a good three years out of a car with about 100,000 miles per year. I think we are on the same page.


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## 20yearsdriving (Dec 14, 2014)

Huberis said:


> A 2007 Crown Victoria sure doesn't fit the Uber mold! The taxi company I driver for never had much luck with ex CV police cruisers. The drivers didn't care for them, they sucked in the rain let alone snow. For such a massive machine, there isn't a lot of trunk or storage space from what I recall. Gas mileage wasn't so good...... I steered away from them when we had 'em.
> 
> I would guess we try to get a good three years out of a car with about 100,000 miles per year. I think we are on the same page.


True crown Vic's are considerd dinosaur's but they are the weapon on choice ( maybe not for longer) to UBER competition 
I'm pointing the low cost to star driving 
The most I ever spent in a work vheicle is 12,200.00 plus tax& lic. 13,900.00
For a 2007 suburban seats 8 plus luggage 
I see the vheicle like the # 2 strategic move in this bussiness ( the nearest UBER SUV in my area is 18 miles away 
Plus my cost of operation is slightly higher than on my 2003 town car ( retiring now )
But I can charge a premium I'm most cases or keep the town car rate in other cases 
Like a Swiss knive 
In my taxi days I whent thru 5 crown Vic's ( my personal choice)


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

I certainly agree with the you with respect to vehicle choice as a function of controlling costs. Travis has used as the car itself as one of his keystones for vilifying taxis. The idea of some shitty old taxi. That certainly has some validity. One reason you don't see it amongst Uber cars is for the reason that currently, the cars seem to outlast the drivers. It is the drivers who seem to take the bigger knocks. 

That is my impression. Have many people been Ubering beyond their second or third work car? Maybe, but I don't hear much about it and I cant figure out how it could work.

Well 20 years "o Driving- Here's to personal choice.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Minivans have been my Taxi of choice for 8 years. Seat 6, plenty of luggage room, 6.cylinders. 
uber doesn't give a crap if you have no replacement Plan for your vehicle.
uber is non sustainable for the long term driver.
BTW- first decent cab day in a while.
12 hours, $150 pure profit after expenses.
everything lined up right- the contract work, then the taxi jobs.

And every customer I get, i Say "Thanks for Trusting a legit cab and not riding with gypsy Uber! ".


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

Big Machine said:


> It's pretty hard to be "leveraging the equity of your personal car" considering cars don't have equity. Gotta love the lack of education of drivers


Wow. Not only are you wrong, but you follow it up by insulting the people who are right.

This explains why you drive for Uber.


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## 20yearsdriving (Dec 14, 2014)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> Wow. Not only are you wrong, but you follow it up by insulting the people who are right.
> 
> This explains why you drive for Uber.


There is no equity when you owe more than is worth


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> Wow. Not only are you wrong, but you follow it up by insulting the people who are right.
> 
> This explains why you drive for Uber.


I didn't care for his personal insult. Obviously, I should have paid better attention in school- fifteen years a taxi driver. I'm addicted to the abuse. That being said. Perhaps he didn't think I have enough brain cells in my oversized melon to rub together - because he knows that a car depreciates in value over a short period of time and perhaps he assumes I don't know that.

Bottom line: a driver's car is just another donation to Uber's ever growing war chest.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

20yearsdriving said:


> There is no equity when you owe more than is worth


Are you suggesting I shouldn't have taken on that Uber/Santander loan??? I thought 27% with weekly cash payments wrapped in a wallet made from the skin off my own ass to be quite reasonable.


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## 20yearsdriving (Dec 14, 2014)

Huberis said:


> Are you suggesting I shouldn't have taken on that Uber/Santander loan??? I thought 27% with weekly cash payments wrapped in a wallet made from the skin off my own ass to be quite reasonable.


I wonder what is ubers cut from that Santander loan ?


Huberis said:


> Are you suggesting I shouldn't have taken on that Uber/Santander loan??? I thought 27% with weekly cash payments wrapped in a wallet made from the skin off my own ass to be quite reasonable.


If you involve UBER math it should be ok they are geniuses


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Uber's cut? That'd be your sweat in buckets. They use it to brew tea. If they couldn't do that Travis would just drink your blood.


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## 20yearsdriving (Dec 14, 2014)

Huberis said:


> Uber's cut? That'd be your sweat in buckets. They use it to brew tea. If they couldn't do that Travis would just drink your blood.


 I've had the blood taken from me before ( taxi kingpin ) for 7 years


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Blood is blood.


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## Sacto Burbs (Dec 28, 2014)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> Yup. I call dispatch, they put me on downtime and I go get a loaner car. Our operation is large enough that we have a full-time detailer on staff who cleans up that mess.
> 
> All our cars are detailed once every 90 days too.


FULL TIME JOB AVAILABLE. Do you want to clean puke out if cars all night? Then sign up with us!


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

Sacto Burbs said:


> FULL TIME JOB AVAILABLE. Do you want to clean puke out if cars all night? Then sign up with us!


Actually, the cabs sit on the lot all night so by the time the detail guy gets in at 7 am, it's probably dried up.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

I remember driving a pax once who told me he once was a taxi driver until one fateful evening. He had a pax up front who seemed to be about to puke. He quickly turned the guys head toward the window and out - with the hope of keeping most of the vomit outside the car. The only problem was he failed to notice the window was up. I believe the pax had a bit of a broken nose.


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## usedkarguy (Apr 8, 2015)

MKEUber said:


> How much of that was in tips?


Hey guy! Tell me about the sign=in for the bonuses. Are you getting the guaranteed money?


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

usedkarguy said:


> Hey guy! Tell me about the sign=in for the bonuses. Are you getting the guaranteed money?


It isn't a guarantee. You still need to meet a long list of requirements as I understand it. That could even include maintaining a specific driver rating during that time. If you fall short on just one of those requirements, they wont pay. Someone on UP suggested even if you do jump through the hoops they don't have to pay out, but I'm not sure about that.


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

I thought I'd update this thread with a few more shift examples.

April 6, Monday:

Gross bookings - $234

Cab lease and fees - $125

Gas - $15

Wash - $4

Net profit - $81

Per hour $ 6.75


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

Apr 10, Friday

Gross bookings - $312

Cab lease and fees - $136

Gas - $14

Wash - $3

Net profit - $159

Per hour $13.25


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

Apr 13, Monday:

Gross bookings - $196

Cab lease and fees - $119

Gas - $12

Wash - $3

Net profit - $62

Per hour $5.16


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

So for four days work, total profit was $508 for an average of $10.58 per hour.


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## Yankee (Feb 22, 2015)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> I got a cab this morning and worked a twelve hour shift from 6am to 6pm.
> 
> I thought you U/L drivers might be interested in how the other side lives.
> 
> ...


Taxi Driver in Arizona, I admire your initiative. For you $200 in 12 hours might seem like a good payday, but for me that is near poverty and not sustainable. You did not figure in taxes to be paid on that, so your $200 is "gross", not "net". But even if it were "net", fact is, you have to be in the car all day to do that. That's 12 hours hustling to make a few bucks. I've done that gig before and found that it wrecked my body, ruined my diet, destroyed my fitness routine, wiped out my social life, and allowed me zero time to cultivate any opportunities or creative ventures. That's not a life. That's how people become stuck being "cab drivers". I might be willing to make $200 a day if the day ended after 6 hours, but not 12. That's a prescription for a lifetime as a wage-slave. You don't really want to be a wage-slave, my friend.


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

Yankee said:


> Taxi Driver in Arizona, I admire your initiative. For you $200 in 12 hours might seem like a good payday, but for me that is near poverty and not sustainable. You did not figure in taxes to be paid on that, so your $200 is "gross", not "net". But even if it were "net", fact is, you have to be in the car all day to do that. That's 12 hours hustling to make a few bucks. I've done that gig before and found that it wrecked my body, ruined my diet, destroyed my fitness routine, wiped out my social life, and allowed me zero time to cultivate any opportunities or creative ventures. That's not a life. That's how people become stuck being "cab drivers". I might be willing to make $200 a day if the day ended after 6 hours, but not 12. That's a prescription for a lifetime as a wage-slave. You don't really want to be a wage-slave, my friend.


I agree about taxi driving not being very profitable and not much of a life. That's why I only work 2-3 days a week. If I did this everyday I'd want to kill myself.

Driving a taxi has never been a high-paying gig, that's one of the reasons most cab drivers are immigrants with few other prospects. The only reason I still do it is that I don't need much money to live on, and I like being able to work when I want.

The ridesharing industry is very new and going through a lot of growing pains. I predict that within a few years, most rideshare drivers will be immigrants, just like most taxi drivers are today. Sure, there will be a few hipsters who Uber part time for a laugh, but they'll quit after their first puker/fender bender, etc...


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## Yankee (Feb 22, 2015)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> I agree about taxi driving not being very profitable and not much of a life. That's why I only work 2-3 days a week. If I did this everyday I'd want to kill myself.
> 
> Driving a taxi has never been a high-paying gig, that's one of the reasons most cab drivers are immigrants with few other prospects. The only reason I still do it is that I don't need much money to live on, and I like being able to work when I want.
> 
> The ridesharing industry is very new and going through a lot of growing pains. I predict that within a few years, most rideshare drivers will be immigrants, just like most taxi drivers are today. Sure, there will be a few hipsters who Uber part time for a laugh, but they'll quit after their first puker/fender bender, etc...


Yeah, I think you've hit the nail on the head here. Totally agree.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> I thought I'd update this thread with a few more shift examples.
> 
> April 6, Monday:
> 
> ...


driving the cab onto the lift for free repairs- $ priceless.


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

TwoFiddyMile said:


> driving the cab onto the lift for free repairs- $ priceless.


Don't forget getting a loaner cab so I can get back to work while they fix their cab. Priceless.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

The biggest differences between being a taxi hack or UberX hack is that, the taxi driver holds no delusional dream that the work is going to be easy or lead toward riches. It isn't for everyone and requires a bit of sacrifice. Taxi driving is good for someone that doesn't perhaps want to be too tied doesn't as far as I can see. 

I have known taxi drivers who tally up their income not on a daily basis but seem to do it every couple of hours. It all comes out in the wash. From my experience, there seems to be only so much money I can make in the course of a week. How a I accrue that money seems to be a little different from week to week. Weeks with huge, money making, hand in fist paydays often seem to be followed by a succession of slower days. Some days mine time is perfect and everything lines up for me, other days, it's a struggle. It all seems to average out.

Taxi companies own their cars. They can't own too many more cars than is needed or they lose money on the car. They can't support a fleet that is going to be sitting half the time, nor can they put so many drivers on the road that none of them aren't making a decent go of it. Uber's model is designed to get around/ignore that. I happen to belief that philosophy of theirs is going to be a problem for them.

The taxi company I driver for has a bunch of good people, but I don't think any of them are truly in it for the money. I think it seems to be more about opting out of some sort of conformity that is inherent in the corporate world. That is the sense I get. Uber seems to want to sell sunshine to their partners and let them figure out the rest.......

In the end, taxi drivers most certainly ride a roller coaster, but it all comes out in the wash, they aren't donating their personal car for the cause and they are leasing from a company which has to conform to some sort of constraints.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

^uber has no ceiling on fleet numbers.
in fact, Uber makes money on EVERY car you drop into their fleet, regardless of how far it waters down the pool of work.

When I dropped my cab on the road 3 months ago, I got a lot of dirty looks from seasoned owner operators in this city.
first off, I'm American born. I operate at a different level.
second, they know it's a share they don't want to participate in. It's not an endless party, and when a savvy hack like me hits the streets I take a fare from them.
cabbies are conservationists- we inherently know the pool is finite- hence medallion caps.
Uber will build the fleet until they don't miss one customer. Pings half an hour away will become coveted. 
The new Uber driver 2 years from now will be saying "wow! Busy day, 5 pings!".

Because that's the Uber way.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Travis doesn't need to pay for the car a partner drives, he doesn't worry about maintaining it. He sure knows how to cash in on it. That in my opinion is one of the most troublesome components of the rideshare model. The guy setting the rates has assumed zero risk and responsibility. Travis acts like a man well prepared to run with that advantage, 

I am fortunate in that I drive for a good taxi company. I am also lucky in that there happen to be a couple other good companies around. Given that Uber has nothing real or tangible to keep their behavior in check, the thought of having to drive for them strikes me personally as irresponsible. You would be slitting your own throat.

It will be very interesting to see what happens in California with respect to their definition of an independent contractor and how the Uber model meets the test. If Uber lost that, that would be a very real game changer I'm guessing.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Today's 13 hour shift:
Gross receipts $205
Total miles driven 240
expenses $50
(I'm insanely anal about tallying expense, I even factor in vehicle replacement and maintenance)
Profit $155
Hourly wage, still crappy.

Welcome to the cab business. 
Only bad wages this way come.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

TwoFiddyMile said:


> Today's 13 hour shift:
> Gross receipts $205
> Total miles driven 240
> expenses $50
> ...


How did you drive so many miles and have so few of them on the meter if you don't mind my asking? Did you run some sort of poor paying courier/luggage maybe? If I drive 12 hours on a busy night, I would hope to run between 180 and 220 miles while staying in town......

There are plenty of ways to work 13 hours and only make $155 bucks....... sounds as if you had a kind of screwball evening.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Huberis said:


> How did you drive so many miles and have so few of them on the meter if you don't mind my asking? Did you run some sort of poor paying courier/luggage maybe? If I drive 12 hours on a busy night, I would hope to run between 180 and 220 miles while staying in town......
> 
> There are plenty of ways to work 13 hours and only make $155 bucks....... sounds as if you had a kind of screwball evening.


1) I'm in Charlotte and Uber is eating us alive- that's a great day shift here.
2) the majority of my day I drive paratransit, medical jobs which only pay $1.54 per PAID mile with long chases to get there.
The taxi part of My day was good tho- two airports and a few short jobs off my favorite hotel, $71 in 26 miles.

I'm almost sad I sold My cab company and moved south, until I come home and see this beautiful 2500 square foot house (that I have to pay for).


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Paratransit explains a lot. I know how that works. 

Bill Moyers made some sort of reference to "an economy of scraps" It's a sad paradox in that the people who are eating you alive, as individuals probably aren't doing any better. UnderUber, even the winners are left with nothing but ****ing scraps. Hooray for the future.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

I just looked through the threads on the Charlotte forum. Looks like the same old same old. Did you see there was a reporter from SanFrancisco looking around the forum? He wants to do a piece on Uber's financing program, which is a fleecing program. Of all the subjects I could think of being investigated, the financing program, is so over the top absurd, that in my mind, it's simply absurd.

I would love to more stories centered around the idea that Uber, self branded face of the future, is using drivers to make a huge fortune of wealth for themselves at the expense of the drivers time and energy..... and the value of their car. They simply keep selling bullshit and new people keep mindlessly signing up for their own round of abuse. 

Unfortunately, we have a long history of such behavior in this country, we really do. It is a source of pride often enough.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Charlotte is bad, that's for sure.
I'm still in shock that I left Waltham Ma 6 months ago and grossing $1300 per week was fairly routine.
Uber going to .75 here was just evil for everyone. We sit around uptown and watch Uber pax literally waiting for their X from a packed cabstand. 
I've had a cab on the road 3 months here. I'm still hoping I'm in the learning curve here, that at some point I'll learn how to break the $1000 per week gross barrier at some point. 
The only plus is that the south is cheap. I can pay my bills on almost no income.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

TwoFiddyMile said:


> Charlotte is bad, that's for sure.
> I'm still in shock that I left Waltham Ma 6 months ago and grossing $1300 per week was fairly routine.
> Uber going to .75 here was just evil for everyone. We sit around uptown and watch Uber pax literally waiting for their X from a packed cabstand.
> I've had a cab on the road 3 months here. I'm still hoping I'm in the learning curve here, that at some point I'll learn how to break the $1000 per week gross barrier at some point.
> The only plus is that the south is cheap. I can pay my bills on almost no income.


In PA, taxi companies petition the PUC for rate changes. They go under review, the process takes time. I have all kinds of beefs about the PUC but that in the end isn't one of them. The rates need to be fair to the consumer and they wont allow someone to operate at a loss to destroy competition.

That is correct and fair. The notion of a free market economy, let the consumer decide what is a fair rate....... That is all bullshit in this arena. I think it is pretty safe to sasert that under the UberX model, the poor suffer for one. Now, there are just new kinds of inconveniences emerging. Now, I read about riders waiting for a surge to pass during the bar rush. They don't want to pay the surge. It's just a new kind of problem.

Do you consider UberX drivers to be true independent contractors? I can tell you,at the end of each shift, I pay the taxi company, they don't pay me. I think there is a different relationship.


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

That's the genius behind Uber. Their partners don't really know how little money they're actually making because depreciation/maintenance is hard to accurately quantify.

I know exactly how much I've made at the end of my shift, pre-tax of course. The Uber/Lyft crowd knows their gross, but not really their net.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> That's the genius behind Uber. Their partners don't really know how little money they're actually making because depreciation/maintenance is hard to accurately quantify.
> 
> I know exactly how much I've made at the end of my shift, pre-tax of course. The Uber/Lyft crowd knows their gross, but not really their net.


I believe they are encouraged not to worry about those concerns. Uber talks it up as a part time kind of thing at first, lets them have easy money in new markets as they get established, encourages them to avoid disclosure with their personal insurance agent......

Those things are very well calculated by Travis. He kind of works like a drug dealer that way. The drivers taste that easy money for just long enough, not much else matters for many people after that.


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

houcabbie said:


> I drive in Houston, but I'm an owner operator. I pay $330 a week which covers medallion, dispatch, insurance, and $40 a week that goes into a maintenance account for repairs.
> 
> Yesterday worked 10 hours for $292 gross fares.


What kind of vehicle? With my company you can own a Prius and it's around $500 per week for insurance and dispatch. If I wanted to do this full time, I might consider buying a car, but I only work 2-3 days per week right now.


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## Yankee (Feb 22, 2015)

I drive in Austin, Select/X. I drove 11 hours yesterday (minus about 2 hours for breaks, so make it 9). I grossed $360. 
Of that $360, two fares brought in a full $100 each, one at the beginning of the shift (rainstorm = big surge) and one at the end (surge). If not for those two fares, I was averaging to the tune of a $200 night for the full 9 hours. 

After Uber takes their cut, I am left with about $290. $30 for gas. $20 car wash inside/out. Approx. $75 for taxes. That leaves me with a net profit of $160. Approximately $16 an hour to now pay into getting new tires and maintainance due soon. 

No. This gig is soon over for me.


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

houcabbie said:


> I have a 2011 Dodge Grand Caravan I bought at an auction and brought online. You can buy one directly from the company or buy one outside and bring it online. Best thing about minivan is space for luggage and taking groups to the strip clubs which pay you $20 per person.


I don't like vans. Too much gas and too many people. I have friends who drive vans and love it, it's just not for me.

And I work the day shift so there's not a lot of strip club runs. LOL


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## jiwagon (Feb 19, 2015)

houcabbie said:


> Last one before this was a Chrysler 300. Which was nice but missed a lot of trips not having a van, so this time around got a van. I usually work 12pm-10pm unless I have a pre-scheduled trip from one of my personals. Sometimes one of my personals will want me to take them to the airport at 5am so I'll wake up, take them go back home go to sleep then come back at 12-1pm.


When Uber first came to Houston and there was only UberX, you could make good money. Now it sucks dick because Uber's reputation has gone down the toilet and all one gets is cheapo trash trying to get as much as they can from a $5 ride. Before, it was higher end clients who normally used UberBlack in other cities, and the mileage rate was $1.48/mile instead of $1.10/mile now. So my point is, I took home $200 in 5 hours easily one morning with no surge pricing. Now, I'd be lucky to make $60, and these cheaper losers drive me crazy with their judgmental vibes, so I have to sign off after only a few hours. Before, every day was an easy $150-$300 take home in 5-7 hours.


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## uberwatcher (Sep 18, 2014)

In reality though most cab drivers make around $5 an hour or $60 take home per average 12 hour shift. In great locations you can do good as well as during special events but on average it's usually not that great because if it were the cab companies (and/or regulatory bodies) would tend to put out as many drivers as they possibly can until your earnings are below minimum wage again.

Around here (in Florida) it seems like most cab drivers are living on the edge and close to homeless. I know many living in hotels and who cannot afford a personal vehicle. 

To see the real story where you are get the public records for the cab drivers in your town and investigate where they live (usually the registered address and name is public record). If they are really making $1000-$1200+ a week on averagethen they should own a middle class home at least. If however you find most are living in a no-tell motel for $150/week then there you go. I think you will find that many BS about things too.


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## 20yearsdriving (Dec 14, 2014)

uberwatcher said:


> In reality though most cab drivers make around $5 an hour or $60 take home per average 12 hour shift. In great locations you can do good as well as during special events but on average it's usually not that great because if it were the cab companies (and/or regulatory bodies) would tend to put out as many drivers as they possibly can until your earnings are below minimum wage again.
> 
> Around here (in Florida) it seems like most cab drivers are living on the edge and close to homeless. I know many living in hotels and who cannot afford a personal vehicle.
> 
> To see the real story where you are get the public records for the cab drivers in your town and investigate where they live (usually the registered address and name is public record). If they are really making $1000-$1200+ a week on averagethen they should own a middle class home at least. If however you find most are living in a no-tell motel for $150/week then there you go. I think you will find that many BS about things too.


In SoCal you can not afford a hotel with 60bucks

True there are cab drivers that live in hotels & in their cars sometimes

The great majority have a decent income

Many are running a very profitable model

Just like anywhere else


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## limepro (Mar 7, 2015)

My take today even with over an hour break, drove 92 miles total and this is after uber fees.


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

limepro said:


> My take today even with over an hour break, drove 92 miles total and this is after uber fees.


I appreciate you posting that, but what do you figure your car expenses were for the day? Gas, maintenance and depreciation?


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

uberwatcher said:


> In reality though most cab drivers make around $5 an hour or $60 take home per average 12 hour shift. In great locations you can do good as well as during special events but on average it's usually not that great because if it were the cab companies (and/or regulatory bodies) would tend to put out as many drivers as they possibly can until your earnings are below minimum wage again.


That might be true is some places, but my personal experience here in Phoenix is that if you put in the hours, you'll make $80 - $150 per shift.



> Around here (in Florida) it seems like most cab drivers are living on the edge and close to homeless. I know many living in hotels and who cannot afford a personal vehicle.


I have a buddy who used to drive cab in the Tampa/St. Pete area, and he lived in a weekly motel for a while before he moved to Arizona. He says the cab business is better here, but he's been driving for Uber for the last year or so.



> To see the real story where you are get the public records for the cab drivers in your town and investigate where they live (usually the registered address and name is public record). If they are really making $1000-$1200+ a week on averagethen they should own a middle class home at least. If however you find most are living in a no-tell motel for $150/week then there you go. I think you will find that many BS about things too.


There are drivers here who own their own cabs and put in the hours to make a grand a week or more. It is possible, you just have to work every damn day.


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## Lidman (Nov 13, 2014)

Ach-so


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## limepro (Mar 7, 2015)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> I appreciate you posting that, but what do you figure your car expenses were for the day? Gas, maintenance and depreciation?


It costs me about .30 to run my car so $27 accounting for everything. It would have been a lot less but I dead headed back from ft Lauderdale because I don't like taking rides up there.


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

April 20, Monday: (That's right, I only worked one day last week)

Gross bookings - $301

Cab lease and fees - $123

Gas - $14

Wash - $3

Net profit - $161

Per hour $13.41


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## 20yearsdriving (Dec 14, 2014)

houcabbie said:


> A lot of the foreign drivers will live in a shitty house or apartment regardless of how much money they have. They are putting it away in the bank to start some other business.


Bingo!!!!


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## BostonTaxiDriver (Nov 23, 2014)

I


Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> So for four days work, total profit was $508 for an average of $10.58 per hour.


I think that's better than if renting a day shift here in Boston.

And Boston is a more expensive city in which to live. Heck, the night shift here is a similar or not much better average if also driving the slower M-W evenings and not just busier Thurs-Sat. nights.

But there's lots of downtime just sitting at the airport or at cabstands -- so I spend some of that downtime here.


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## LACheckerDr (Apr 22, 2015)

Driving a cab in LA. 
Full time lease (cab is in my possession 24/7, owner covers repairs, I cover the gas) - $650/week for a minivan. 
Average gross revenue per month - $9K. 
Working about 5-6 days/week, 12-15 hrs/day. Total milage - roughly 1K/week. And you won't hear me complaining.


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