# Startup entrepreneur sues Uber, claims CEO stole idea for on-demand taxis



## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/...ber-claims-ceo-stole-idea-for-on-demand-taxi/


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

I guess this just goes to show that if you have a good idea, be careful whom you share it with! 

I can't see that the ridesharing is patentable, so I don't think he has a case. All this shows, if true, is that Kalanick was better at attracting investors and launching the business.


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## Brooklyn (Jul 29, 2014)

elelegido said:


> I guess this just goes to show that if you have a good idea, be careful whom you share it with!
> 
> I can't see that the ridesharing is patentable, so I don't think he has a case. All this shows, if true, is that Kalanick was better at attracting investors and launching the business.


But "surge pricing" can be patented? Lol.

Stop calling it ride share.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Celluride vs Uber Press Conference (May 14, 2015)


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## Lidman (Nov 13, 2014)

Brooklyn said:


> But "surge pricing" can be patented? Lol.
> 
> Stop calling it ride share.


I agree. Ride sharing is when two or more pax share a ride. It's that obvious. It's like what Seinfeld says about dry cleaning.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Much more detail in this:
http://www.buzzfeed.com/johanabhuiy...ravis-kalanick-and-others-for-stea#.fwgddv4mb


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Grand Theft Uber: *


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## Kalee (Feb 18, 2015)

Travis is a good man. He wouldn't steal.


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## Lidman (Nov 13, 2014)

That's right. Travis is a good boy.


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

Isn't Christopher Dolan also the lawyer sueing Uber in the Sofia Liu case?


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

He is the same lawyer, funny it isn't mentioned anywhere.

http://www.cbdlaw.com/Uber.shtml


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

Brooklyn said:


> Stop calling it rideshare


Rideshare rideshare rideshare rideshare rideshare


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## Brooklyn (Jul 29, 2014)

elelegido said:


> Rideshare rideshare rideshare rideshare rideshare


Lmaooo


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## ReviTULize (Sep 29, 2014)

elelegido said:


> I guess this just goes to show that if you have a good idea, be careful whom you share it with!
> 
> I can't see that the ridesharing is patentable, so I don't think he has a case. All this shows, if true, is that Kalanick was better at attracting investors and launching the business.


There is a Co called Amaranth that claims to have a patent on all forms of online ordering using an API. They are "patent trolls". Companies like them are the scum of the earth!! They have a patent alright. But it is so broad in scope that it would inhibit innovation. They are suing Apple, Micros, Domino's, and many more.

The little guy with a great idea would spend years and millions in litigation and would have trouble getting angel investors. I have reached out to them to see what their patent fees are and they just say "create your idea, and then we'll talk". They are not legitimate.


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## moni4nuttin (Oct 22, 2014)

Join somebody else's idea...Travis you damn crook.


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## ReviTULize (Sep 29, 2014)

moni4nuttin said:


> Join somebody else's idea...you damn crook.


not sure who's that is directed towards


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## moni4nuttin (Oct 22, 2014)

ReviTULize said:


> not sure who's that is directed towards


Travis


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## Kalee (Feb 18, 2015)

elelegido said:


> Rideshare rideshare rideshare rideshare rideshare


LOL ... Classic!


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

Sounds like what happened with Facebook. I wonder if Messrs Kalanik and Zuckerman have anything else in common?


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

"Until Travis came on the scene and pissed everyone off it wasn't clear Kalanick was the puppet master."

LOL


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## Kalee (Feb 18, 2015)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> Sounds like what happened with Facebook. I wonder if Messrs Kalanik and Zuckerman have anything else in common?


Kalanicks mother's last name is Horwitz.
Go figure.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Email from Atty. Chris Dolan*

COMPLAINT FILED IN CELLURIDE'S LAWSUIT AGAINST UBER, KALANICK et. all.

STATEMENT OF PLAINTIFF HALPERN ATTACHED

PRESS CONFERENCE TODAY Thursday May 14 @ Dolan Law Firm 1438 Market
Street San Francisco 12:00 p.m.

8:30 a.m., PST, May 14, 2015 San Francisco: This morning Celluride
Wireless Inc., a wireless startup founded in 2002 by Kevin Halpern has
filed suit in the San Francisco Superior Court against Uber. Also
sued are Uber's co-founders Travis Kalanick, and Garret Camp as well
as early VC funds in Uber; Benchmark Capital, First Round Capital, and
Founder Collective, along with their principals Scott Belsky, Bill
Trenchard and Bill Gurley. The suit alleges that Halpern and
Celluride, between 2002 through 2009, developed the technology and
business model behind Uber's entire business including the App
interface itself and that Celluride and Halpern's trade secrets and
intellectual property rights were violated when Uber and the other
Defendants misappropriated their technology.

Plaintiff Kevin Halpern has released a statement on the Lawsuit;






Press and others are authorized by Halpern to use the statement, its
Audio and Video components freely and with an express license to any
copyrights and property rights he has in the statement.

A copy of the verified Complaint can be found atwww.dolanlawfirm.com.
For more information contact Christopher Dolan 415-279-2604 text
preferred or via email [email protected]

Attached is the face page of the Complaint showing it has been filed.
UBER HAS HAD A DRAFT OF THIS COMPLAINT SINCE DECEMBER 2014.
Celluride's Attorney Dolan says "This is an important day for not only
Celluride and Halpern; this lawsuit is an entrepreneur fighting back
against a multi-billion dollar company and its billionaire founders
and investors who used Celluride's intellectual property for their
financial gain while cutting out the true pioneer of the ridesharing
industry, Halpern. The lawsuit will expose the unlawful method in
which Uber, using Halpern's technology and trade secrets, developed
over seven years, to leap frog past the years of R&D and business
planning that would have been required to have launched Uber as soon,
and as successfully, as it did."

tweet #grandtheftuber


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## CityGirl (Nov 29, 2014)

Three words:
Statute of Limitations.


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## limepro (Mar 7, 2015)

CityGirl said:


> Three words:
> Statute of Limitations.


If he has a patent it is the duration of the patent +6 years so he would be within his limits.


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

Brooklyn said:


> But "surge pricing" can be patented? Lol.


The summary of the case from the plaintiff's lawyer's website is:

"Halpern provides attachments to the complaint which reflect ongoing discussions with Trenchard and others that detail his exchange of trade secrets in what he thought was a common enterprise to develop Celluride."

Looks like he thought wrong!

You mention patent infringement, but there is no allegation of this anywhere in the case summary. Not even once, so patents are not an issue here.

This is simply about a man who is academically bright, but business dumb. He "thought" they were working with him, indeed. In business, "think" is not enough. If you have a great business idea, then you guard its secrets closely. And if you bring in partners, you make them sign non-compete and non-disclosure agreements. So if any involved party profits from an idea, the originator of the idea has a big fat legal hammer to clout the offenders with in court. Did he get anyone whom he naively shared his secrets to sign either of these documents? No.

It's unfortunate and sad if it's true that Travis et al stole this man's work, but business is tough, full of sharks and not for the naive.


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## CityGirl (Nov 29, 2014)

limepro said:


> If he has a patent it is the duration of the patent +6 years so he would be within his limits.


Not finding anything about his patent. Uber, OTOH, has patents.


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

CityGirl said:


> Not finding anything about his patent. Uber, OTOH, has patents.


They patented supply and demand?

Maybe they patented gouging.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

CityGirl said:


> Not finding anything about his patent. Uber, OTOH, has patents.


AFAIK, Kevin Halpern or CelluRide don't have any patents or patent applications.
Uber has zero patents, 12+ patent applications.
*As Uber, Lyft, and Sidecar count patents, warning signs ahead*


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## arto71 (Sep 20, 2014)

*Uber founder hit with $1 billion suit for allegedly stealing idea*
*http://money.cnn.com/2015/05/15/technology/uber-celluride-lawsuit/*


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## CityGirl (Nov 29, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> AFAIK, Kevin Halpern or CelluRide don't have any patents or patent applications.
> Uber has zero patents, 12+ patent applications.
> *As Uber, Lyft, and Sidecar count patents, warning signs ahead*


Correct, I should have been more specific. However, those will be granted and they will take priority over later filers.
The Halpern dude is a schmuck, did not protect himself if it really was his idea. He has no patent applications. In the tech game, he is a loser because he waited way too long to come to market and to come to court, both. 
http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2015/05/14/uber-suit-ken-halpern/27347047/
This article says he tried to create a copyright by mailing the idea to himself. We don't know how specific it was and that would not be sufficient in the changing intellectual property market, unfortunately. It's a patent he needs, not a copyright. I can bet that Uber can show older documents, this kind of thing takes a long time to conceive and develop.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

CityGirl said:


> However, those will be granted and they will take priority over later filers.


*UBER RECEIVES FIRST UTILITY PATENT*
*http://patentvue.com/2015/05/15/uber-receives-first-utility-patent/*
*







*

_The NOA was issued for US 20140011522, entitled "System and method for providing dynamic supply positioning for on-demand services." The patent application is directed towards determining an under-supplied service region based on the number of drivers and requesting passengers in an area, and subsequently notifying drivers of these areas._

In layman's words, this is a patent for Heat Maps.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

elelegido said:


> I guess this just goes to show that if you have a good idea, be careful whom you share it with!
> 
> I can't see that the ridesharing is patentable, so I don't think he has a case. All this shows, if true, is that Kalanick was better at attracting investors and launching the business.


That sounds like a better model than uber. With uber, you get whatever is closest and you can cancel and rerequest. If you could select from the types of vehicles in the area, that could make a better experience and a slightly different service than a typical taxi/Uber.


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## Sacto Burbs (Dec 28, 2014)

This crackpot is advocating boycotting… That's heresy… Or sacrilege… Or merely a hit my pocket I'm not really sure which


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## arto71 (Sep 20, 2014)

*Could Sidecar's patent trip up Uber, Lyft?*
*http://www.sfgate.com/business/article/Could-Sidecar-s-patent-trip-up-Uber-Lyft-6267124.php*
Publication number US6356838 B1
Publication type Grant
Application number US 09/625,069
Publication date Mar 12, 2002
Filing date Jul 25, 2000
Priority date Jul 25, 2000
Fee status Paid
Inventors Sunil Paul
Original Assignee Sunil Paul
Export Citation BiBTeX, EndNote, RefMan
Patent Citations (19), Non-Patent Citations (3), Referenced by (85),Classifications (11), Legal Events (5)
External Links: USPTO, USPTO Assignment, Espacenet


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

arto71 said:


> *Could Sidecar's patent trip up Uber, Lyft?*
> *http://www.sfgate.com/business/article/Could-Sidecar-s-patent-trip-up-Uber-Lyft-6267124.php*


Interesting - I was wondering why Lyft or Uber wasn't suing the other for patent infringement; they can't both have had the idea first, but it turns out Sidecar may have had it all along.


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

He who runs/walks away lives to fight another day.


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

observer said:


> He who runs/walks away lives to fight another day.


Legal action is a last resort. Like this current IC / employee business against UberLyft. Even if the court does decide in favor of the drivers and does again in all appeals, it'll be years before anyone receives any money. Still worth fighting for, but not necessarily for monetary gain.


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## UberThis (Nov 8, 2014)

elelegido said:


> The summary of the case from the plaintiff's lawyer's website is:
> 
> "Halpern provides attachments to the complaint which reflect ongoing discussions with Trenchard and others that detail his exchange of trade secrets in what he thought was a common enterprise to develop Celluride."
> 
> ...


I'm sure Travis is no angel. What I don't understand is why Halpern took seven years to sue Travis, et al, when Travis appears to have cofounded Uber in 2009.

http://techcrunch.com/topic/person/travis-kalanick/

By 2010, Uber was up and running enough to warrant a cease and desist order in San Francisco.

http://techcrunch.com/2010/10/24/ubercab-ordered-to-cease-and-desist/

I quickly watched first couple minutes of video and I don't get how anyone could or would continue to devote his time and resources developing a platform for another 4 or 5 years after Travis, et al, started Uber.

Does the claim that Travis and others not only stole his ideas from 2007-2009 to start Uber, they then also somehow colluded to gain access to Halpern's ongoing work for the next 4 or 5 years as they scaled Uber up and received multiple rounds of funding?

If Travis did use Halpern's ideas, Uber would likely benefit in either inviting Halpern to join Uber in a senior role suiting his talents or settling the suit with Halpern asap to make him go away.

No doubt the lawyer representing Halpern addresses my questions and plugs in the timeline by the end of the video I'll finish watching.

I think this would be a great An American Life: Startup Serial.

An independent journalist, unbeholden to a court of law or a judge or a jury presents her research with live testimony and reading us sections of the transcripts of the depositions as the CEO's are firmly warned not to participate in this investigation by their lawyers.

The star witness "Startup is my middle name" Jay tells a story which doesn't quite line up with the timeline described in the depositions of each CEO.

As Jay keeps tweaking the details to account for the inconsistencies, he learns more about where and what everyone else was doing, and he begins to insert himself into the story as being the only truly injured party. 

Jay describes how the executives colluded in driving him out (pun intended) of the company he worked hard to build. This caused a rift resulting in the company he founded to break apart into three separate companies.

This revelation by Jay confuses the audience, startles the CEO's of all three companies causing each company to depose Jay again, who further leads the journalist and the audience astray so that every previously known fact comes into question.

Ah, if 50 Shades of Gray originated as fan fiction of the Twilight series, I should be able to create a fan podcast of Serial.

Now I've started to lay down the foundation of my next career move as a backup for when this Uber gig starts to unravel. And here I thought I wasn't very creative.

Hey, nobody better steal my idea. I'm copyrighting it right now. It's fairly well documented as being my exclusive creation as witnessed by whoever actually reads this.

Have a good day. And Uber On!


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## CityGirl (Nov 29, 2014)

That's a good article about Sidecar's patent. It is likely that Uber's "System and method for determining an efficient transportation route" is significantly different, too. In a world where technology is moving so fast, there can be distinct ways to accomplish the same thing, and the need itself cannot be the determining factor. You can't patent the need, but possibly the method to fulfill the need. And if two methods differ significantly, there would be no case anyway. I'm guessing that is the actual truth, because if he had received legal advice that he had a good case, his business' value is nothing considering what he would have to gain.

Besides, think about the bigger picture. Uber, Lyft and Sidecar are facing serious challenges to their operations in a variety of cities. If Sidecar goes after Uber, it will lose its biggest, most powerful, ally in getting the market ready to accept and properly legislate (if it must) rideshare. Strange but necessary bedfellows.


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## J. D. (May 13, 2015)

Kalee said:


> Travis is a good man. He wouldn't steal.


Winner: Best Comment EVER!


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## J. D. (May 13, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> Celluride vs Uber Press Conference (May 14, 2015)


You know, even if Celluride doesn't have a real legal leg to stand on and Uber wins this, it just continues to demonstrate just what a scumbag group of people is Uber's founders.

"Hey, we know we can legally develop our own service around your idea, but we have ethics so we'd like to 1.) buy it from you. 2.) Invite you to join us 3.) hire you. 4.) Pay you royalties." Lots of other options that just taking, taking, taking...


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## Just one more trip (Jun 14, 2015)

observer said:


> Isn't Christopher Dolan also the lawyer sueing Uber in the Sofia Liu case?





observer said:


> He is the same lawyer, funny it isn't mentioned anywhere.
> 
> http://www.cbdlaw.com/Uber.shtml


He said so during the video.


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## Just one more trip (Jun 14, 2015)

CityGirl said:


> Three words:
> Statute of Limitations.


That was addressed in the video. Did anyone bother to watch it?


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## forkedover (Oct 26, 2014)

Hopefully the patent troll will die from horse dick.


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## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

Just one more trip said:


> He said so during the video.


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Bison IS a Rocker!


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## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

J. D. said:


> You know, even if Celluride doesn't have a real legal leg to stand on and Uber wins this, it just continues to demonstrate just what a scumbag group of people is Uber's founders.
> 
> "Hey, we know we can legally develop our own service around your idea, but we have ethics so we'd like to 1.) buy it from you. 2.) Invite you to join us 3.) hire you. 4.) Pay you royalties." Lots of other options that just taking, taking, taking...


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## naplestom75 (May 3, 2015)

elelegido said:


> Interesting - I was wondering why Lyft or Uber wasn't suing the other for patent infringement; they can't both have had the idea first, but it turns out Sidecar may have had it all along.


What's next, somebody is going to patent "social media" None of this stuff should be able to be patented anyway.


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## CityGirl (Nov 29, 2014)

Just one more trip Yep. His method of securing his 'patent' is not adequate. The statute has run.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Lawyer in Uber idea theft case slowly backs away from his client*
*https://pando.com/2015/09/14/lawyer...ent/c3c93a42cf5c53f60ab941bc541a434c085ed295/*

Remember that weird Winkelvoss-aspirational lawsuit filed against Uber for idea theft that was publicized by uh&#8230; an amateur movie trailer? The Uber lawsuit that even Pando didn't think had much merit?

Yeah, some news on that.

The lawyers who went very aggressive with a big PR splash telling Pando-- "It is deadly serious, it is not someone grasping at straws"-- are ever so slowly backing away from the case. The reason? "An irreparable and complete breakdown of communications."

As we noted, plaintiff Kevin Halpern had already sued cofounders before.

From an article on Law360:

_"This isn't the first time Halpern has faced problems in court. In February 2013, a state judge sanctioned him for not meeting discovery requests in a case in which he accused a former business partner of breaking an oral agreement to collaborate on an Internet product and a company that would market it._

_The lower court said Halpern, who allegedly claimed he couldn't sit in a chair in a deposition room because it had too much dust and its chairs were uncomfortable, was "clowning around." An appeals court upheld the ruling the following year."_

This is the thing you always have to bear in mind with legal threats against controversial startups-- and yes at both TechCrunch and Pando I've lived through more than I can count on two hands. Sometimes controversial companies get in a lot of lawsuits because they are constantly doing things wrong. And sometimes, people file a lot of threatening legal letters or suits against controversial companies because they guess it's an easy payday because these companies are so blighted that people will believe any bad behavior.

This case-- unlike other recent cases Uber has settled related to the death of a child by an Uber driver and the infamous Delhi rape incident-- has always seemed like the latter. I'm no fan of Uber and don't think they're troubled by too many ethics. But I knew Travis Kalanick and Garrett Camp in the early days of this company and there was no evidence they stole the idea. Even Halpern's case seemed to detail a company sketched out pre-iPhone and Android-- the devices that really gave birth to an opportunity on the scale of Uber.

If the lawyer is losing confidence, this may be one of the only Uber-headaches that's going away on its own. Good news for Uber. With Kalanick's third "personality reboot" flailing, an unwinnable war in China, and laughable efforts to take on food delivery (literally according to Stephen Colbert) the company needs some good news.


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## UberNorthStar (Jul 7, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> Heat Maps.


I am not knowledgeable on this one.

Heat map =Underserved-served area ??

Or Surge Areas = Heat Maps?

(I might be catching on.)


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

UberNorthStar said:


> Surge Areas = Heat Maps


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