# Just got my Hurricane Driving Notice from UBER



## EzTripp (Aug 9, 2015)

Just got my notice from Uber telling me to expect to be "VERY" busy during the hurricane this week end. I assume we are going to be busy because all sane people will not risk their cars to drowning the engine or having limbs smashed into their cars or the increased odds of having a wreck.

I have never gone through a natural weather alert as a Uber Driver before but I assume it is safe to assume that Uber doesn't increase the fares to make the risk more reasonable? 

My guess is that it will be the usual surge myth program, the one that shows a RED surge all around me but when I get my ride it seems to of just missed the surge.

So without an added motivation to risk damage to my auto, I think I will stay home and watch TV.

The thought of having doors opened and shut in torrential downpours and having soaked clothing and shoes dripping all over my leather seats and floors for $5 a ride and an hour a trip due to driving conditions doesn't turn my Happy Face on 

After all I live on a Peninsula and with the rising sea swells the water will wash straight across.....wait, since it is a Peninsula it can't wash across it will just rise . Ahhh you get to drive in water over your bumper and wait for that one little engine miss that causes your car to suck the water over the exhaust into the engine and cease it forever. Ahhhhh the joys, the blissful joy.

Thank you Uber for making the decision so EZ


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## UberXking (Oct 14, 2014)

The surge will be real and it will be high. Pax will thank you over and over again. Tell the right story and you will be tipped. Remember to turn it down 100% will insist you take it. Remember"you deserve it"


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## ocbob2 (Aug 18, 2015)

I was going to make a joke about going out there and uber on But I guess they want you to drive. Let me still give it a stab as I bring out my inner Uber asshole out...
"With Hurricane coming in and smashing the East coast, we see the potential to make life changing money. Please disregard local laws and rules set up (why not? We sure do!) and do whatever it takes to get to that rider. We hope a 10 foot wave doesn't wash you out to the ocean but rest assured, our insurance will be covering your car (but first get your regular insurance to cover it or pay James River a $1000 deductible). So you can make more money, we will be limiting surges to 1.2x. Remember, less cost in fares means more life changing money in your pocket.....if you live."


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## Trebor (Apr 22, 2015)

The surge will more than be likely capped off at 2-3x as has happened many times in the past here in Houston. Uber has already received a lot of flak for raising prices during natural disasters and tragic events (Australia).

The surge will stay on as normal until flash flood Advisory's and other weather alerts start to flow through the area. Of course, you guys are acting like it is the end of the world, so surge's may be capped off already.


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## Oh My (Dec 26, 2014)

You'll get too many 1*s because it's your fault their hair got wet or Toto got ripped right out of her arms while you were chasing her bad pin drop. Don't do it!


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## uberissohonest (Aug 7, 2015)

they definitely capped surge here in charleston today. yesterday during the flooding, the peninsula saw 4.5 regularly. today, the highest i saw was on isle of palms at 2.9, which was a red flag for me. 2.8, 3.4, 3.6 are normal surges on iop friday night. but 2."9" looked weird.


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

EzTripp said:


> The thought of having doors opened and shut in torrential downpours and having soaked clothing and shoes dripping all over my leather seats and floors for $5 a ride and an hour a trip due to driving conditions doesn't turn my Happy Face on


You mean "leather seats and *carpeted* floors", correct? Do be aware that constantly wet carpet rapidly gains a positive funk that will not go away. It is as bad as ralph or stale beer. This is why I tell those people who swear that UberXmobiles are so much nicer than taxicabs that they should come back to me in three years on that. Funny thing, I was optimistic. UberX users already are complaining about Uberhoopties.



ocbob2 said:


> Please disregard local laws and rules set up (why not? We sure do!)


The problem, Travis, is this: while you have that which is necessary to make "arrangements" with the Authorities on these local laws, rules and ordinances, we, the drivers, lack that same thing.


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## ocbob2 (Aug 18, 2015)

uberissohonest said:


> they definitely capped surge here in charleston today. yesterday during the flooding, the peninsula saw 4.5 regularly. today, the highest i saw was on isle of palms at 2.9, which was a red flag for me. 2.8, 3.4, 3.6 are normal surges on iop friday night. but 2."9" looked weird.


By any chance was the hurricane made up by the media?


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## JimS (Aug 18, 2015)

Hurricane really isn't the threat around here. But it's presence in the Atlantic is keeping other systems from moving off shore.


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## Realityshark (Sep 22, 2014)

It's really sad that Uber thinks of natural disasters as another way to make money by exploiting their drivers and passengers.


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## ginseng41 (Nov 30, 2014)

I'm wondering if this surge capping can be used in the independent contactor vs employee lawsuit. We're risking our lives, in theory, in this weather but can't get as much as we normally would. It's totally fine out here and only busy because of the game. Many industries would have Hazzard pay for dangerous conditions


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

EzTripp said:


> Just got my notice from Uber telling me to expect to be "VERY" busy during the hurricane this week end. I assume we are going to be busy because all sane people will not risk their cars to drowning the engine or having limbs smashed into their cars or the increased odds of having a wreck.
> 
> I have never gone through a natural weather alert as a Uber Driver before but I assume it is safe to assume that Uber doesn't increase the fares to make the risk more reasonable?
> 
> ...


As Horace Greeley once advised: "*Go west young man, go west.*"


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## itsablackmarket (May 12, 2015)

I wonder if Uber will send a notice to west coast drivers if there's a big earthquake there. That'll probably be a nightmare for insurance.


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## The_One (Sep 9, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> I'm wondering if this surge capping can be used in the independent contactor vs employee lawsuit. We're risking our lives, in theory, in this weather but can't get as much as we normally would. It's totally fine out here and only busy because of the game. Many industries would have Hazzard pay for dangerous conditions


You are not risking anything, no one is forcing you to drive, it's the same post in this forum, over and over again.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

Well, it does give new meaning to the phrase "STORM SURGE".


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## phillipzx3 (May 26, 2015)

Realityshark said:


> It's really sad that Uber thinks of natural disasters as another way to make money by exploiting their drivers and passengers.


To be fair, so do UberX drivers. Without surge rates, you can't make money ( when all is said and done). So....you chase the surge dragon..just like a drug addict.

Uber isn't exploiting anyone. You VOLUNTEERED to use their app. They didn't force anyone.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

phillipzx3 said:


> Uber isn't exploiting anyone.


BS

There's hardly a driver out there that is operating under the same agreement they entered into when they signed up for Uber. Uber is indeed exploiting drivers, manipulating them into driving for remuneration that doesn't even cover the drivers operating costs.

*UberXploitation* (c)2015 Michael - Cleveland


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## phillipzx3 (May 26, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> BS
> 
> There's hardly a driver out there that is operating under the same agreement they entered into when they signed up for Uber. Uber is indeed exploiting drivers, manipulating them into driving for remuneration that doesn't even cover the drivers operating costs.
> 
> *UberXploitation* (c)2015 Michael - Cleveland


The original intent was "ride sharing" which we all knew was BS. So now you guys are upset because Uber changed the "rules" to take advantage of people? Just what did you expect from these people, a good job?

Like the military, you signed up for it. Deal with it or leave.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

phillipzx3 said:


> Just what did you expect from these people, a good job?


Yeah, how very silly of the labor force to expect to believe what a company promised in their recruiting advertising and marketing:
"Make $90,000 a year"
uh- huh.

At least when the military advertises "SEE THE WORLD" and "ADVANCE YOUR EDUCATION AND OPPORTUNITIES" they aren't lying. 
The military is, well, THE MILITARY.


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## Oh My (Dec 26, 2014)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> Yeah, how very silly of the labor force to expect to believe what a company promised in their recruiting advertising and marketing:
> "Make $90,000 a year"
> uh- huh.
> 
> ...


Most that joined the military where those that barely graduated high school and they didn't know what else to do with them. Go ahead and fire away but some of them are my relatives. One is a retired Sargeant that is a legend in his own mind and truly believes he was the leader of the Civil War but hadn't even been born yet nor fought in any war.

Uber did place some false advertising though.


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## ginseng41 (Nov 30, 2014)

I'm not going to drive when it's unsafe, I just think it's unfair that they'd expect that if we'd do it, we'd do it for less and that they arbitrarily cap surges. I lost out on a fortune last night in totally safe conditions on a game day because they decided to cap them. If they'll do this, why not cap for all sporting events, concerts, pope visits etc.?


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

Oh My said:


> Most that joined the military where _[sic] _those that barely graduated high school
> 
> 
> > You really can't just make shit up and post it here as if it's a fact and expect not to be called out on it. There are way too may people here who know better and aren't going to allow you to get away with dissing the people who join the most highly educated and trained military in the world. This isn't 1964.
> ...


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> I'm not going to drive when it's unsafe, I just think it's unfair that they'd expect that if we'd do it, we'd do it for less and that they arbitrarily cap surges. I lost out on a fortune last night in totally safe conditions on a game day because they decided to cap them. If they'll do this, why not cap for all sporting events, concerts, pope visits etc.?


I've stated since the beginning that if Uber marketing were run by adults instead of 'kids' with MBAs, that SURGE pricing wouldn't exist. That instead of surge pricing during busy times, they would set the STANDARD fare at a reasonable level - just below that of the local regulated taxi rates - and the run DISCOUNTED fares during slow times to encourage more riders to use the system during those times.
Imagine Uber X at something like:
Everyday fares of $2.50 pick up fee, $2.50/mi, $0.20/min and a $6 min (incl SRF)...
and then a 50% discount on the mileage fee (to $1.25/mi) during times of low demand.

You'd have drivers on the road all the time in every location - and riders staying late or leaving early from work/events/bars...
and NO ONE would be complaining about 'surge fares'.


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## ginseng41 (Nov 30, 2014)

If your pricing scheme went into effect, I'd actually be losing a significant amount of money. The surges are expected here game weekends. People asked me last night why they were so low, laughed when I told them that it was because of the hurricane, and thought that it was ridiculous. I should have made over a grand yesterday and made just about $300.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> If your pricing scheme went into effect, I'd actually be losing a significant amount of money. The surges are expected here game weekends. People asked me last night why they were so low, laughed when I told them that it was because of the hurricane, and thought that it was ridiculous. I should have made over a grand yesterday and made just about $300.


As UberHammer says: DO THE MATH.

($1.25 x 30 mi = $37.50)
+ ($0.20 x 30 min = $6)
+ ($2.50 base)
=$46 Gross Fare (w/o SRF)
- ($46 x 20%=$9.20 Uber Fee)
----------------------------------------
= $36.80/hr earnings before expenses​
You would not be losing any money at $2.50/mi and $.020/min unless you are driving an M1 Abrams Tank to do UberX.

And while you theoretically could earn less per ride than with surge pricing, with discounted pricing you would have far more rides, making more efficient use of your time and car... 
so that even at the 50% discounted rate of $1.25 at only a 50%/hr utilization you'd generate $46/hr in fares (sans SRF) and EARNINGS of $36.80/hr before expenses... 
basically *3 times what X drivers do now*.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> I'm not going to drive when it's unsafe


*And you shouldn't!*
That's why you are an independent contractor...
you get to decide when and where you will work.

Let's face it - some of us will feel safe in areas and at times when others do not.
I don't driver (much) after midnight.
Other's like to drive the late night bar crowd because it fits their schedule and they like the surges.
That's the way it is supposed to work.


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## ginseng41 (Nov 30, 2014)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> As UberHammer says: DO THE MATH.
> 
> ($1.25 x 30 mi = $37.50)
> + ($0.20 x 30 min = $6)
> ...


I did not say you wouldn't make more money under your scheme, I said I wouldn't make as much money.

Our rates are 2.25 + 1.50/mile + 0.25/min as is. Most of the time it is dead here so it would be your discounted rate would be in effect for approximately all but 30 hours a week. I do errands and workout during the down hours. Of those 30 hours, we are typically on surge about 15-20 of them and these surges are between 2 and 3 on normal weeks and up to 10 on game day weekends. I would lose a fortune. I've been making over a thousand a week on average putting less than 500 miles on my car each week since the semester began. Rough calculations would knock this down to about 700 with the same mileage. People absolutely don't use Uber here to save money, they use it because we don't really have taxis except during those surge times and they are insanely expensive, $10 a person regardless of location and they just stuff a bunch of people in a van, dropping them off one at a time.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> I'm not going to drive when it's unsafe, I just think it's unfair that they'd expect that if we'd do it, we'd do it for less and that they arbitrarily cap surges. I lost out on a fortune last night in totally safe conditions on a game day because they decided to cap them. If they'll do this, why not cap for all sporting events, concerts, pope visits etc.?


The pricing scheme is completely fabricated and manipulative. It is what they can get away with. Nothing is to be taken for granted. If all you have to ***** about is the one night you made $300 when you should have/could have made $1,000 - you have no complaint, particularly for the reason that your market is quite the outlier.

Your complaint expresses exactly the kind of frustration most Uber drivers have in most mature markets only you are *****ing because you couldn't fleece the public properly as you have come to expect Uber to let you. Uber routinely caps surges in markets. In State College they seem to be capped at 3x. Why? Because that is what Uber corporate decided to do. In detroit, drivers contend with a base rate of $.75/mile.

You have repeatedly suggested Blacksburg is immune from the pressures of becoming saturated with drivers and therefore, rates should stay extraordinarily high. You have one night where you amde $300 and not $1000 and you complain about capping the surge????

Blacksburg should be the center of the strike. If you guys truly have as few drivers as you suggest, and this is such a grave concern, Uber drivers from all over should center the strike on Blacksburg. It could have an impact in such a small town where earnings are already sky high.

chi1cabby, you are our leading follower of the news. What do you think of Blacksburg striking? There are only 4 local drivers I'm told. Most drivers come in from Roanoke. Drivers could come in from all over the Mid Atlantic to picket and protest. This abusive practice of capping the surge must stop. It is wrong that drivers in this little college town not make 10X more money than their fellow LA drivers. My guess is that a Detroit driver isn't even making 1/10th.

Beauty.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> I did not say you wouldn't make more money under your scheme, I said I wouldn't make as much money.
> 
> Our rates are 2.25 + 1.50/mile + 0.25/min as is. Most of the time it is dead here so it would be your discounted rate would be in effect for approximately all but 30 hours a week. I do errands and workout during the down hours. Of those 30 hours, we are typically on surge about 15-20 of them and these surges are between 2 and 3 on normal weeks and up to 10 on game day weekends. I would lose a fortune. I've been making over a thousand a week on average putting less than 500 miles on my car each week since the semester began. Rough calculations would knock this down to about 700 with the same mileage. People absolutely don't use Uber here to save money, they use it because we don't really have taxis except during those surge times and they are insanely expensive, $10 a person regardless of location and they just stuff a bunch of people in a van, dropping them off one at a time.


At $10 a person, they are not insanely expensive though it is expensive. At your rates, if it is surging 20 of 30 hours, up to 3X...... You are going to be over $7 a mile, plus whatever it is to start the trip. You mentioned most your trips top out at 2- 3 miles. That is equally insane.

It sounds as if Your town would be tough as hell to run a taxi business in even without Uber. The call volume fluctuates so dramatically no doubt. That makes thing very tough for a traditional taxi business to operate. Taxi companies can't handle huge swings in volume well. The structure doesn't allow it. That is another concern however they are operating more like a shuttle than a taxi at that point. In PA a vehicle operating uder those terms would not have taxi plates. It would have bus plates, though some taxi companies have vehicles they own and operate that way in addition to taxis. Such a vehicle usually works better based at an airport, operated as a shuttle to the town and hotels and back to the port with multiple pax who are willing to wait until a particular flight has cleared out.

That is pretty much the way that setup is intended to function, it is very limited in my opinion. Not entirely a rip off, just out of its element of usefulness.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> I did not say you wouldn't make more money under your scheme, I said I wouldn't make as much money.


I understood that.
What I've suggested isn't about you, personally.
It's about how to market something in general, without creating an entire customer base, and driver network, and media that hates the business practice.


> Our rates are 2.25 + 1.50/mile + 0.25/min as is.


The rates I posted were an EXAMPLE for illustrative purposes...
not a suggestion of what the rates should be.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> I understood that.
> What I've suggested isn't about you, pesonally.
> It's about how to market something in general, without creating an entire customer base, and driver network, and media that hates the business practice.
> 
> ...


If this strike were ever to really get going, have an impact Michael, this is exactly the kind of town where drivers would benefit from going and demonstrating. For the simple reason of the complete lack of congruence. Blacksburg is a town where drivers are scarce and rates are at a premium. Uber still needs to do work there.

A lot of issues come to mind. It highlights the conflicted landscape that is Uber town to town.

I completely understand that base rates simply need to be raise. Everyone understands that. Towns like Blacksburg clearly demonstrate that having acess to an unlimited number of drivers and putting them on the road is its own problem.

This is the town to demonstrate in and picket. Pick a football weekend when people are visiting from all over the country. The town is way small enough that the demonstrators couldn't be ignored. It is one thing to picket in a city like LA, but mostly, those people living there are likely to be content with the service Uber provides. It is much harder to be disruptive there.

In Blacksburg - much easier place to be disruptive. Disruptive in a Kalanick sense, not violent, but disruptive none the less. Hit uber where they can feel it. Hit them in a town supposedly with four driver making bank and another 30 from out of town..... but they want to grow the market. Much easier place to disrupt a disruptor than in a place like LA where drivers are a dime a dozen and already expendable.

Protest smart. Slow travis down in exactly the places he is looking to WIND UP. That is my two cents worth. If you have a place where drivers are *****ing about only making $300 and not a grand..... That is where you focus your energy first.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

I don't know...


> Hit uber where they can feel it.


Somehow, I don't think a work stoppage in Blacksburg, VA would get anyone's attention,
outside of Blacksburg, VA. hehe...


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## ginseng41 (Nov 30, 2014)

Go right ahead and strike Blacksburg that weekend. Nobody will be in town, myself included . We have 6 weeks a year like that so football game income is what I count on to make it through thanksgiving, Christmas break, spring break and summer. Those games make up over 10% of my annual income so it's a huge deal. Why on earth would you all **** with a market where drivers and riders are happy? That's exactly why the media will have a negative view on the strike. Throwing out random requests in places and threats of violence are what the media will gravitate to not the rates that are too low. When damage is inflicted on the people your theoretically trying to help, you come off as self absorbed and childish.


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## Baby Cakes (Sep 6, 2015)

EzTripp said:


> Just got my notice from Uber telling me to expect to be "VERY" busy during the hurricane this week end. I assume we are going to be busy because all sane people will not risk their cars to drowning the engine or having limbs smashed into their cars or the increased odds of having a wreck.
> 
> I have never gone through a natural weather alert as a Uber Driver before but I assume it is safe to assume that Uber doesn't increase the fares to make the risk more reasonable?
> 
> ...


surge will go crazy. But Uber should really adjust rates for the duration.


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## limepro (Mar 7, 2015)

Oh My said:


> Most that joined the military where those that barely graduated high school and they didn't know what else to do with them. Go ahead and fire away but some of them are my relatives. One is a retired Sargeant that is a legend in his own mind and truly believes he was the leader of the Civil War but hadn't even been born yet nor fought in any war.
> 
> Uber did place some false advertising though.


Is that why more CEOs have military experience than not? Is it why companies look for military experience? They know we have leadership ability and knowledge. There are some rocks in the military but many are not. I had a scholarship to go to Duke but decided to join the military instead, I took my SAT at the age of 13 because I got a perfect 99 on the CAT test in elementary school. I became an air traffic controller did it while I was in and out of the military and decided to leave it behind and pursue other things as money isn't what makes me happy. I may be an outlier but there are many very smart people in the military, more so than on any college campus nationwide and more disciplined.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> Go right ahead and strike Blacksburg that weekend. Nobody will be in town, myself included . We have 6 weeks a year like that so football game income is what I count on to make it through thanksgiving, Christmas break, spring break and summer. Those games make up over 10% of my annual income so it's a huge deal. Why on earth would you all **** with a market where drivers and riders are happy? That's exactly why the media will have a negative view on the strike. Throwing out random requests in places and threats of violence are what the media will gravitate to not the rates that are too low. When damage is inflicted on the people your theoretically trying to help, you come off as self absorbed and childish.


No, the idea would not be to call fake rides or damage cars. You have never heard me cite that as an example.

The idea is that you need to have an impact with limited resources. To protest or rally, gather, demonstrate, picket, whatever you want to call it is the idea. You would want to do that in a town that is not already saturated with drivers, where the rates are high.

*"Why on earth would you all **** with a market where drivers and riders are happy? " -Excellent question and point*

For the simple reason that virtually all new markets start out that way. The high rates are used to recruit drivers. It is temporary in virtually al markets. At that point, the consumer is being exploited to bait drivers. Eventually, rates drop to noncompetitive rates in order to prevent the possibility of any and all markets.

A new market in its honeymoon phase is an easier place to have an impact, the idea is to disrupt the disruptor. That doesn't mean calling in fake calls or damaging cars. It could mean picketing busy sports events or a bar district.

Kalanick thrives on uncertainty and disruption. *It has to start somewhere. If you have tens of thousands of drivers working at $.75/mile or $.90/mile, a good place to go to vent your frustrations is a place where drivers routinely earn over $7/hour.* It creates dissonance. That, in and of itself is powerful and representative of a force Kalanick himself can recognize. He thrives off that. There is no once and done event that is going to change much of anything at Uber.

A slow down isn't going to do shit. Look at what the state of Kansas did to Uber briefly over the summer. they threatened to regulate them and at the mere threat of that, they walked away. Uber is very vulnerable to disruption themselves.

If you are driver working at $.90/mile, you are probably in a town where the people love the convenience and the fact that there is a driver on every corner. I do not buy into the fact that pax are completely cool with the super high rates in places like Blacksburg. I hear many complaints about high surge prices in SC and from what I gather we don't surge as high here....

If you drive for peanuts, there is logic behind the idea of going to a place where drivers routinely get $7/mile to plead your case that Uber uses manipulative pricing methods as a form of control. *Do not take your huge $1000 /night earning for granted, King Kalanick himself could take that away from you at a moments notice for his own benefit. That is a fact. With that fact in mind, why not go after such disparity for the benefit of those driving at a loss? Why on earth, if this is supposed to be a movement wouldn't you target such an market?*


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## ginseng41 (Nov 30, 2014)

limepro said:


> Is that why more CEOs have military experience than not? Is it why companies look for military experience? They know we have leadership ability and knowledge. There are some rocks in the military but many are not. I had a scholarship to go to Duke but decided to join the military instead, I took my SAT at the age of 13 because I got a perfect 99 on the CAT test in elementary school. I became an air traffic controller did it while I was in and out of the military and decided to leave it behind and pursue other things as money isn't what makes me happy. I may be an outlier but there are many very smart people in the military, more so than on any college campus nationwide and more disciplined.


That's why military should get paid a lot more, we need more intelligent people making decisions on life and death matters


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> Throwing out random requests in places and threats of violence are what the media will gravitate to not the rates that are too low


That is very much so, you are completely correct and needs to be held in utmost respect. Violence is not helpful. that doesn't mean you sit on your hands.


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## ginseng41 (Nov 30, 2014)

Huberis said:


> No, the idea would not be to call fake rides or damage cars. You have never heard me cite that as an example.
> 
> The idea is that you need to have an impact with limited resources. To protest or rally, gather, demonstrate, picket, whatever you want to call it is the idea. You would want to do that in a town that is not already saturated with drivers, where the rates are high.
> 
> ...


I didn't say you did support either of those. I doubt many drivers are in support of vandalism, but it's been said by a few and the press have seen it. A great number support fake calling drivers and the press will also put this out there.

I've heard comments in several markets about surge. Here people have the option of taking the bus to most places but don't mind surges for the convenience of uber on regular nights. In Richmond on nye and here during home games people can wait hours for a cab, or pay the surge for the convenience and speed of uber. I recall some telling me on nye that the cab quoted a 4 hour wait and that he was perfectly happy paying the 6x fare to go home immediately. That's why surge pricing makes sense to me. Our2-3 surges put the rate at that of the taxis here but are a lot faster.

Why not use these things as an example of how things should work and make all stakeholders happy? People were definitely not happy waiting hours for an uber last night since the people who would have normally walked at 5x were happy to pay 2x for a 3 block ride

I know something could happen at any time. I am good at saving money and my car is almost paid off. While I don't expect this soon, I'm prepared for the possibility. I like the flexibility of this, but I could easily get a job with my degree. I'd be miserable, but would do it if I had to


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> I don't know...
> 
> Somehow, I don't think a work stoppage in Blacksburg, VA would get anyone's attention,
> outside of Blacksburg, VA. hehe...


Maybe not, but is an example of a place where you could have some kind of impact. Your presence could be felt. In a city with 10,000 Uber drivers, what effect is 500 or even 1,000 drivers going to have by simply not logging on to drive? Zero. The town might surge. Drivers need a place to start where they can actually disrupt a market. That is it. Picket and print up slogans and signs... They determine the language.

You just need to disrupt him. It is Kalanick's attention you might only require at first. Whatever happens the weekend of October 16, it is going to be very minimal. I still don't even know if there are plans to gather. Are there? if it is just...... "well don't drive that night, go to a sporting event", That is nothing. It is exactly what the dynamic price model is designed to do, if your market is saturated, there would be very minimal effect on service that for damn sure.

Forget about some grand statement. Forget about immediately getting media attention. This is a struggle over agency and a balance of power. Drivers need to simply find a milieu where they can get together and have some kind of impact and be disruptive in a peaceful way, express their truth. That is it. To go in and think this needs to draw this much media attention or it is a failure. That is not the key. The key is disrupting Kalanick and breaking the pattern of abuse. It start in markets with very high initial rates. That is the initial seed.

If all it did was get people's attention in Blacksburg so be it. There are enough towns like Blacksburg and enough drivers to have an effect in several developing markets regionally. Blacksburg is just an example of a place that could be disrupted, there are more than a few. Pick one in echa region of the country for example.


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## ginseng41 (Nov 30, 2014)

Huberis said:


> That is very much so, you are completely correct and needs to be held in utmost respect. Violence is not helpful. that doesn't mean you sit on your hands.


I think it's too late to stop thus from being a focal point. I can see the headlines now quoting Abe's post about drivers being afraid to work and not being able to pay their bills or buy food. I'm glad I'm not in the situation where I'd have to risk working that weekend. I would have been totally on board for this strike if neither of these tactics had been mentioned; I now feel inclined to drive because they have. While Travis has committed many crimes, he's never threatened me with violence.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> I didn't say you did support either of those. I doubt many drivers are in support of vandalism, but it's been said by a few and the press have seen it. A great number support fake calling drivers and the press will also put this out there.
> 
> I've heard comments in several markets about surge. Here people have the option of taking the bus to most places but don't mind surges for the convenience of uber on regular nights. In Richmond on nye and here during home games people can wait hours for a cab, or pay the surge for the convenience and speed of uber. I recall some telling me on nye that the cab quoted a 4 hour wait and that he was perfectly happy paying the 6x fare to go home immediately. That's why surge pricing makes sense to me. Our2-3 surges put the rate at that of the taxis here but are a lot faster.
> 
> ...


You mean to tell me that because surge was capped it affected the number of drivers on the road last night? That seems doubtful and if show, is suggestive of problems with stability in your market. There was a published study about the effect of surge in NYC over New Year's Eve. It doesn't work as claimed often enough.

I can tell you from observation that I believe people are learning to wait out surges before booking a ride. That is not good for anyone. I was able to see over the past weekend, particularly on Friday evening, a 3X surge with lots of cars sitting. The surge dropped to nothing and the cars dropped of the map and began to move.

The speed and convenience of Uber is simply based on the transfer of burden from TNC dispatch/reservationists to TNC driver. That is a huge deal. Uber itself operates at a loss. In most mature markets, if a driver truly calculates their costs, it is not sustainable. They could be found to e losing money.

Suggesting rallies in developing, high rate markets is not in order to punish drivers in those areas, it is THE PLACE to point out the dramatic difference in reality between the two markets for drivers. Pretty simple.

The people rallying or not logging on are not suggesting that your rates should be in the same basement they find themselves in. Their hopes are to find a catalyst to raise them back up. *The point is, your town of Blacksburg is emblematic of the fact that rates are not set with respect to the operating cost for drivers, they are set to manipulate people and set them in motion. High at first to reward those wishing to drive and later, low for pax in order to suppress competition.*


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> I think it's too late to stop thus from being a focal point. I can see the headlines now quoting Abe's post about drivers being afraid to work and not being able to pay their bills or buy food. I'm glad I'm not in the situation where I'd have to risk working that weekend. I would have been totally on board for this strike if neither of these tactics had been mentioned; I now feel inclined to drive because they have. While Travis has committed many crimes, he's never threatened me with violence.


Too late to stop violence from being a focal point. It is not too late. I believe the guy already made a video asking his original tactics be dropped. Personally, I know nothing of the guy. In my mind, it is going to take many many stops and starts, in a bunch of places using various methods. Uber drivers will need to tune in to the gig economy in general and see where they fit in and who else out there is experiencing similar exploitation. People will need to get out of their head.

I have tried not to express this, but personally, I'd guess the "Strike" and I don't even see how it can be called a strike, is going to have the most minimal of impact. I have avoided sharing that, because I don't believe that is important. People just need to get going and learn what works, what is worth putting their necks on the line for...... All kinds of things.

Uber designed their business, were attracted to it because they new it would be very hard to get drivers organized in any kind of way which would really be disruptive. They don't make anything, they don't own the cars..... they just sell an app and use it to bring in research money for other, licensable ideas.

This guy Abe is just a guy named Abe. He happens to be a catalyst for this weekend's attempt at demonstrating. That i all he is. He could be gone, consumed by his own foibles tomorrow. The fact is Ginseng, despite all your earnings now, they are short term, best case scenario. How well these concerned and motivated drivers do over the course of the next few weeks, months and years could have a positive impact on your ability to do your job in a profitable way into the future. It could help me too as a taxi driver. A more stable Uber environment is to my advantage as an outsider.

*How about this: Blacksburg drivers post placard in their cars supporting sustainable base wages for their fellow drivers in mature markets? How would you feel about that? Drivers in markets mid honeymoon could post placards saying they support drivers in mature markets. That could be done anytime.*


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## ginseng41 (Nov 30, 2014)

I'm saying that surge was capped because of the non existent hurricane. Because it was capped, kids paid $10 or so for a 3 block ride that they'd planned on walking because they know how game days work. People who needed rides to hotels told me they spent hours trying to get an uber. We definitely need more drivers for game days. The towns population doubles these weekends. I've also seen Roanoke drivers not showing up on subsequent weekends after texts tricking them into expecting it to be busy.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> I'm saying that surge was capped because of the non existent hurricane. Because it was capped, kids paid $10 or so for a 3 block ride that they'd planned on walking because they know how game days work. People who needed rides to hotels told me they spent hours trying to get an uber. We definitely need more drivers for game days. The towns population doubles these weekends. I've also seen Roanoke drivers not showing up on subsequent weekends after texts tricking them into expecting it to be busy.


It understand all that. You are preaching to the choir. Let us let go of that for another day. In my mind, that indicates surge pricing fails at its objective in the end. It may improve service, but it is temporary and not part of a sustainable structure.

It is a digression.

What do you think about posting a placard as one of the fortunate few in support of those drivers losing money in mature markets? How does that sound?


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## limepro (Mar 7, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> That's why military should get paid a lot more, we need more intelligent people making decisions on life and death matters


The pay isn't the greatest but when you take into account that all your housing and food are paid for it is a bit more attractive. I spent most of my time stationed in San Diego, my housing let's say $1k a month and $400 for food + base pay as an e-4

Base pay is $2451 which isn't a lot but as a single enlisted member I have no worries about where I will live, electricity, water, or groceries. The only thing that comes out of that pay are purchases that I choose, they even pay for my uniforms yearly with a stipend.


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## ginseng41 (Nov 30, 2014)

Huberis said:


> Too late to stop violence from being a focal point. It is not too late. I believe the guy already made a video asking his original tactics be dropped. Personally, I know nothing of the guy. In my mind, it is going to take many many stops and starts, in a bunch of places using various methods. Uber drivers will need to tune in to the gig economy in general and see where they fit in and who else out there is experiencing similar exploitation. People will need to get out of their head.
> 
> I have tried not to express this, but personally, I'd guess the "Strike" and I don't even see how it can be called a strike, is going to have the most minimal of impact. I have avoided sharing that, because I don't believe that is important. People just need to get going and learn what works, what is worth putting their necks on the line for...... All kinds of things.
> 
> ...


I've always told passengers that uber sucks everywhere they live like dc, Richmond, Baltimore wtc. And why when they ask how I like it. I teach them uber math vs real math.

I can't see uber being able to drop rates and actually get Roanoke people down here. Even if gas was the only expense, nobody would drive an hour each way and 100 miles round trip to make, say $1.10 a mile before Uber's cut and I don't know where they'd get local drivers unless they lower the age requirements. We've about 50 000 people here and half are students. Most of the rest have university support positions that pay really well. The rest of the locals I've talked to about it would not qualify due to age of vehicles and criminal records or just don't want kids puking in their cars.


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## ginseng41 (Nov 30, 2014)

limepro said:


> The pay isn't the greatest but when you take into account that all your housing and food are paid for it is a bit more attractive. I spent most of my time stationed in San Diego, my housing let's say $1k a month and $400 for food + base pay as an e-4
> 
> Base pay is $2451 which isn't a lot but as a single enlisted member I have no worries about where I will live, electricity, water, or groceries. The only thing that comes out of that pay are purchases that I choose, they even pay for my uniforms yearly with a stipend.


I'll agree that it's fine if you're single bur if you're married with kids you can qualify for food stamps. Because of the nature of military it's often difficult for a spouse to maintain a decent job. And, excluding that, you're putting your lives on the line to protect ours. You should be making a fortune


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## ginseng41 (Nov 30, 2014)

Huberis said:


> It understand all that. You are preaching to the choir. Let us let go of that for another day. In my mind, that indicates surge pricing fails at its objective in the end. It may improve service, but it is temporary and not part of a sustainable structure.
> 
> It is a digression.
> 
> What do you think about posting a placard as one of the fortunate few in support of those drivers losing money in mature markets? How does that sound?


Actually, this thread was about the hurricane so the rest is the digression. A placard wouldn't do much hood since over 90% of my rides are in the dark and the rest are primarily foreign students who don't go to other markets outside of Riyadh and Istanbul. I'm told rates in both are on par with taxis but better since the drivers actually speak Arabic and turkish instead of pashtun and Indonesian. And yes, I'm a bit amused being a female driving around male Saudis


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

ginseng41 said:


> Actually, this thread was about the hurricane so the rest is the digression. A placard wouldn't do much hood since over 90% of my rides are in the dark and the rest are primarily foreign students who don't go to other markets outside of Riyadh and Istanbul. I'm told rates in both are on par with taxis but better since the drivers actually speak Arabic and turkish instead of pashtun and Indonesian. And yes, I'm a bit amused being a female driving around male Saudis


You are correct about the digression.

That 90% of your rides are in the dark, that most of your pax are either Saudi or or Turkish, I could care less. It is about standing in support for your fellow drivers in other markets who are barely able to get by doing the work, putting their cars on the line. That is what it is about. It is about posting in your car that you support their ability to make a go of it. Would you be willing to do that for someone doing what you do for a fraction of the earnings?

As for its impact, you would have no way of knowing who might be moved to act upon such a sign or sticker. It is just a small attempt at pointing out a pattern. I could care less if only 10% of your pax stand to notice the sticker, or what the demographics of your customers might be.

Would you stand up for your fellow drivers and post in your car that you support their ability to earn a sustainable wage? If the answer is no, what would prevent you from doing so? That you work after the sun goes down or mostly, haul Arabs and Turks are not reasons.

It boils down to a yes or no question I suppose.


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## Oh My (Dec 26, 2014)

Uber is hyping the $1000-1200/week thing for the Grand Rapids, Michigan market on Craigslist. There is NO F'n way that's possible. 

FLAG ALL UBER CRAIGSLISTS ADS AS SPAM OR PROHIBITED!


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Oh My said:


> Uber is hyping the $1000-1200/week thing for the Grand Rapids, Michigan market on Craigslist. There is NO F'n way that's possible.
> 
> FLAG ALL UBER CRAIGSLISTS ADS AS SPAM OR PROHIBITED!


What kind of money do you think a driver makes in my town of State College? They are at $1.75/mile 0.25 a minute. The surge seems to be capped at 3x or at least I haven't seen it go above that. That would be $6 to start the trip, $5.25/mile, $.75 min, $13 minimum. Figure often enough you are running a 2 minute mile. I routinely see Uber drivers driving like grandmas (empty or loaded truthfully, my beef is where they load and unload).

I don't even know what kind of claims they make beyond guarantees up to $50/hour if a driver works up or over 40 hours spanning a two weekend period. I would be curious how the drivers felt with respect to the guarantee. The one I was a saw advertised was comprised of one flat football weekend, the second game weekend of the deal was really quite good, much busier. If I had to guess, I'd guess they averaged out about the same. Just a guess however.

I have had plenty of people complain about what cost them $10 dollars to come into town cost them $30 or more to get home. Hard to imagine they aren't making some serious money here for the time being.

It will be interesting to see if there is much feedback here concerning marking Craig'slist ads as spam. Wouldn't take much effort to try it out.


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## Fuzzyelvis (Dec 7, 2014)

EzTripp said:


> Just got my notice from Uber telling me to expect to be "VERY" busy during the hurricane this week end. I assume we are going to be busy because all sane people will not risk their cars to drowning the engine or having limbs smashed into their cars or the increased odds of having a wreck.
> 
> I have never gone through a natural weather alert as a Uber Driver before but I assume it is safe to assume that Uber doesn't increase the fares to make the risk more reasonable?
> 
> ...


During disasters uber now caps the surge. During flooding in houston earlier this year it was capped at 2.7. Quite honestly it's not worth the risk.

I have lived in Galveston/Houston since 1978. I have lived through hurricanes. Put your car somewhere safe and don't drive would be my advice.


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## Fuzzyelvis (Dec 7, 2014)

ginseng41 said:


> If your pricing scheme went into effect, I'd actually be losing a significant amount of money. The surges are expected here game weekends. People asked me last night why they were so low, laughed when I told them that it was because of the hurricane, and thought that it was ridiculous. I should have made over a grand yesterday and made just about $300.


Wait till they get more drivers where you are. Then it doesn't surge anymore.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> *UberXploitation* *(c)2015 Michael - Cleveland*


You can have the Copyright bud, but I'd like some credit for it!


*Poll | I Will/Will Not Pitch In Towards Ending UberXPLOITATION To The Best Of My Ability*


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Huberis said:


> chi1cabby, you are our leading follower of the news. What do you think of Blacksburg striking? There are only 4 local drivers I'm told. Most drivers come in from Roanoke.


Sorry Huberis!
Don't know what to make of this #UberSTRIKE anymore.

Too much factionalism.
Abe Husein is floundering.
#UberSTRIKE is floundering.
My only advice is that Drivers keep pushing on in their efforts to Organize Locally...16th is still 11 Days away.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> You can have the Copyright bud, but I'd like some credit for it!
> *Poll | I Will/Will Not Pitch In Towards Ending UberXPLOITATION To The Best Of My Ability*


*RATS!*


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> Sorry Huberis!
> Don't know what to make of this #UberSTRIKE anymore.
> 
> Too much factionalism.
> ...


It just doesn't (strike has never seemed to be the right word) like much of anything. It sounds like driver simply not logging on for the weekend with the hope of driving surge or pushing riders over to Lyft as I just read...... In an effort to remain anonymous so as not to risk the ruin of their lives.....

I understand the concern, but I believe it would take a huge number of drivers to make it work even close to as planned. It describes business as usual for Uber I'd guess.

How in the hell can a person expect much to happen without sticking their necks out a little? This tactic here of going offline to slow down business seems like it would be more effective to implement once the movement had a real solid head of steam, for the simple reason that it requires lots and lots of drivers to have an impact. It is a an example of a mature movement's tactic. That is my opinion.

Drivers need to get together and rub elbows. -Also, I get the factious part. my guess is that is something that needs to be worked through.

I do like the idea of some sort of sticker or sign to be posted in cars. High rate developing markets would display something like "This driver supports sustainable rates for all drivers". Drivers in low rate markets "This car operates at below cost base rates. Support sustainable rates"

Something like that. That could be disruptive. Could it get you in Dutch? Yes. Not sure tere is a true alternative.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

Huberis said:


> It just doesn't (strike has never seemed to be the right word) like much of anything. It sounds like driver simply not logging on for the weekend with the hope of driving surge or pushing riders over to Lyft as I just read...... In an effort to remain anonymous so as not to risk the ruin of their lives.....
> 
> I understand the concern, but I believe it would take a huge number of drivers to make it work even close to as planned. It describes business as usual for Uber I'd guess.
> 
> ...


I think a work slow-down/stoppage is fine... but agree 100% that without a visible show of protest it will go mostly unnoticed by the public. And I believe that public education and support is needed in order for a movement of any kind to be successful.

During the 'strike' weekend, if 100 drivers in each major city were to park their cars in front of city hall, the media would take notice... other than sports, they have little else to report on over the weekend... and with city hall offices closed, and little business going on in downtown office buildings, the presence of the drivers and cars would be very noticeable, without disrupting city or public business.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> I think a work slow-down/stoppage is fine... but agree 100% that without a visible show of protest it will go mostly unnoticed by the public. And I believe that public education and support is needed in order for a movement of any ind to be successful.
> 
> During the 'strike' weekend, if 100 drivers in each major city were to park their cars in front of city hall, the media would take notice... other than sports, they have little else to report on over the weekend... and with city hall offices closed, and little business going on in downtown office buildings, the presence of the drivers and cars would be very noticeable, without disrupting city or public business.


I agree, people need to be willing, at some point to be seen in protest, standing up against Kalanick. Hard to imagine it not being needed sooner rather than later. The walk off, don't log on trick, that is for a mature movement with energy behind it, lots of active participants proven willing to walk away. That is the last phase, the finishing touch. In my opinion. First off, drivers need to get together and rub elbows, exchange ideas face to face, agree and disagree - in person. It is so much harder and much more effective for this kind of movement.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

People piss, moan and shun the idea of union, but then they very much want to borrow the notion and force that comes with a strike. It may not work that way. Slow down. Get together if not in public, in private.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

Part of the reason calling this a 'strike' feels so awkward to me is that the definition of a 'strike' is a work stoppage by EMPLOYEES.
Uber is not my employer... so who am I 'striking' against - the riders?
<shrug>
Am I just feeling uncomfortable over semantics?


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> Part of the reason calling this a 'strike' feels so awkward to me is that the definition of a 'strike' is a work stoppage by EMPLOYEES.
> Uber is not my employer... so who am I 'striking' against - the riders?
> <shrug>
> Am I just feeling uncomfortable over semantics?


Not at all. It may be a bit presumptuous to call it a strike, it is a word people know and assume they understand. That said, there are more precise descriptions that might prove more helpful in getting people involved and committed. Some people may be scared off by the word strike, others might want to take things farther than the organizers are willing to go etc. Whatever this is, the word "strike" seems kind of silly and the issues driving the effort are too important.

Precision of language is important, people don't seem to be getting together for real face time. All the lag between postings on social media allows for ideas to be distorted for example.

For your general interest: http://www.amazon.com/dp/1595582266/?tag=ubne0c-20

I am currently reading some of Howard Zinn's writing on the labor movement of the 1870s. It is an amazing history and there is much to be learned from that period.

Anti-trust is a BIG concern here. Drivers are suffering the consequences of Anti-trust behavior and that needs to be better understood. I am mostly ignorant of the history of Anti-trust practices. I am told there is a law scholar at my local law school who is an expert and cites Uber in class routinely. I intend to head up to the law library and see what I can learn. I assume it is open to the public, that'd be step one.... getting in the door. Cheers, good discussion.


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## merkurfan (Jul 20, 2015)

Another Uber Driver said:


> You mean "leather seats and *carpeted* floors", correct? Do be aware that constantly wet carpet rapidly gains a positive funk that will not go away. It is as bad as ralph or stale beer. This is why I tell those people who swear that UberXmobiles are so much nicer than taxicabs that they should come back to me in three years on that. Funny thing, I was optimistic. UberX users already are complaining about Uberhoopties.
> 
> The problem, Travis, is this: while you have that which is necessary to make "arrangements" with the Authorities on these local laws, rules and ordinances, we, the drivers, lack that same thing.


I ran my new work van (before turning it in to a work van) on uber XL for 2 nights.. my rating tanked.. Only thing I can think of it's a strip down work van. it meets uber rules but has a rubber floor, basic cloth seats, basic hard plastic door panels.. The type of stuff that takes a beating and says thank you my I have another!..

Eff those stuck up college kids.


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

merkurfan said:


> I ran my new work van (before turning it in to a work van) on uber XL for 2 nights.. my rating tanked.. Only thing I can think of it's a strip down work van. it meets uber rules but has a rubber floor, basic cloth seats, basic hard plastic door panels.. The type of stuff that takes a beating and says thank you my I have another!..


The rubber floors are a good idea. It used to be a requirement for taxis in Washington. They dropped that requirement in the late 1980s, but I still put them in mine. It is easy to keep clean. If someone does ralph, a little bleach and a good detergent scrubby and you never smell it. I would cover the cloth seats. They used to require non-absorbent material on all seats in Washington cabs, but now only in the back. I still pay to cover all mine. Again, the vinyl is easy to keep clean and if someone ralphs, pees or something, again a little bleach, rinse and a good detergent scrubby and you are done and no smell.

The hard plastic door panels make sense. If someone ralphs, again, a good scrubby and you are done.


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