# Potential Racial Discrimination Lawsuit



## grams777 (Jun 13, 2014)

*POTENTIAL $10,000,000 RACIAL DISCRIMINATION LAW SUIT*
*
I went to 12 Uber training sessions for deactivated drivers in LA. We counted and recorded over 360 deactivated drivers undergoing reactivation training. Out of the 360 deactivated drivers, 343 were African American, Arab and Africans from Africa --only 6 Caucasian males and 11 white females. I also have many *​*
http://uberdriverdiaries.com/diarie...ntial-10000000-racial-discrimination-law-suit*


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## grams777 (Jun 13, 2014)

I don't know that this is something that this specific party will pursue, or to what extent it is valid. However, I've been thinking that if there's any hope of eventually dismantling or overhauling this bizarre rating system, it will be through some type of action similar to this. If the numbers are based on valid observations, the insinuation is that 95% of the deactivated drivers are Arab/ African American. Someone could have a field day with that. Also, twice as many Caucasian women were deactivated compared to men?










The ratings system is basically a form of mob rule (aka 'the fickle crowd'). One of the problems with mob rule, is it provides no protection to individuals or minorities. It would be similar to having governments without constitutional protections.

See also - http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ochlocracy

The ratings system has no transparency, appeals, or safeguards to make sure people are not being unlawfully denied service. So it's ripe for an action like this eventually. It could turn into an issue similar to the Disability Act lawsuits.


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## grams777 (Jun 13, 2014)

Here's an example of a complaint form where the person must actually select a valid reason. Since anything less than 5 stars is basically a vote to have the driver fired, a valid reason such as this should be required.


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## dominant7th (Jun 24, 2014)

grams777 said:


> I don't know that this is something that this specific party will pursue, or to what extent it is valid. However, I've been thinking that if there's any hope of eventually dismantling or overhauling this bizarre rating system, it will be through some type of action similar to this. If the numbers are based on valid observations, the insinuation is that 95% of the deactivated drivers are Arab/ African American. Someone could have a field day with that. Also, twice as many Caucasian women were deactivated compared to men?
> 
> The ratings system is basically a form of mob rule (aka 'the fickle crowd'). One of the problems with mob rule, is it provides no protection to individuals or minorities. It would be similar to having governments without constitutional protections.
> 
> ...


But does this apply to Indie Contractors? I thought that's why so many startups go 1099 because it releases them of any liability when it comes to these kinds of situations. Also, there's data that will be used and they'll say the numbers are color/gender neutral. I think it'll be very difficult to prove and if its a Class Action type of suit, the only ones who ever get any money are the attorneys, not the plaintiffs, so why even bother? I had a discrimination case/unlawful term that a judge found in my favor, but the company's attorneys threatened me with a countersuit if I continued the case. My attorney said I wasn't going to get any sympathy from a jury (too youthful, virile and still has a future).

Also this is a second chance at being a partner, correct? This means that they're in need of training. I don't see anything wrong with that.


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## ubearx (Jun 29, 2014)

I get a weekly newsletter from uber and see in it uber top drivers of the week. Those are minority drivers most of the time who drive both on uberBlack and uberX platforms. Their portraits are supplied with scores of 4.9 and above. The newsletter also shows that those drivers make more than 100 trips a week on uberX and more then 60 trips on uberBlack.

Make what you want out of it


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## LAuberX (Jun 3, 2014)

Ratings are fickle, but I keep seeing drivers of the week who are NOT white and have fantastic ratings.... Great service is color blind it would appear.

Also some drivers of the week who do 150+ trips, how many hours does that take? Yet still have amazing ratings!


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## LookyLou (Apr 28, 2014)

Would be interesting to know what the breakdown is across the entire driver base for that area. It might just match up percentage wise to the breakdown of that retraining class.


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## Jordan9K (Jul 6, 2014)

All I have to say about this is *superior* customer service is king. Your personality and how you compose yourself dictate how others engage with you. I'd put money down to say that if you're below a 4.7, you need to shape up (no matter what your race is). Uber has nothing to do with which race gets deactivated. It's solely the riders.


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## Moofish (Jun 13, 2014)

I'd also like to know the breakdown, I've heard from customers that I was 1 of 2/10 drivers they've had that are white, another rider told me that one of his last drivers came straight from India when he heard about Uber to drive. I would suspect that many cab drivers migrated straight to Uber when they got the chance.


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## LAuberX (Jun 3, 2014)

I talked to a customer about the lawsuit on a long trip to the airport today.

she said:

in Seattle lots of Uber drivers are from Africa, and in Santa Monica 3 of 4 were white on this weekend visit.

She said customer service and city knowledge are color blind.

I agreed.


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## Just Some Guy (Jun 10, 2014)

I suspect it may be more complicated than simply the driver's race. In many cases I'd bet that the driver's ability to speak English fluently without a strong accent may be more of a factor. I know that's one of the biggest complaints I hear about why people hate taking cabs.


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## grams777 (Jun 13, 2014)

Just Some Guy said:


> I suspect it may be more complicated than simply the driver's race. In many cases I'd bet that the driver's ability to speak English fluently without a strong accent may be more of a factor. I know that's one of the biggest complaints I hear about why people hate taking cabs.


I met a driver the other night who talked and acted just like taxi drivers. English was strained .... responses were very short and abrupt. He was driving for both uber and lyft. Perhaps with the way things are going over time, there won't be so much different from a taxi.

Also, the point about discrimination is not necessarily that it has any merit. But, that due to the arbitrary, hidden and unchecked nature of the ratings system, it is ripe for being a reason to attack the rating system as it currently stands. This isn't the first time it's been raised.

See also:

*Florida Taxicab Association Assails Uber's Rating of Passengers - Cites Safety, Privacy and Discrimination*

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/florida-taxicab-association-assails-ubers-112600262.html

*Uber, Privacy, and Discrimination*

http://www.nancyleong.com/race-2/uber-privacy-discrimination/


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## dominant7th (Jun 24, 2014)

Y'know the good thing is we're all very passionate about our ratings. Bad ratings hurt my pride and my ego too. I really do try my best for each trip. We're not nonchalant about them so that means we're striving to meet or exceed expectations. This is a good thing. I think a lot of confusion is on Uber's communication with users about the rating system. Passengers may be expecting Black/SUV kind of service and amenities when ordering X cars, and now that they've crossed over in this market (L.A.), the lines have been erased. Judging from the links above, I'm certainly going to do whatever I can to avoid a retraining class including avoiding surges, driving during the A.M., etc. Thanks for the info grams777


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## Sydney Uber (Apr 15, 2014)

At the risk of upsetting the PC Brigade, but here I go.

A lot of new arrivals who have to pay their bills end up in Cabs and UBERX these days. Many unfortunately have grown up in cultures that don't treat other demographics respectfully or fairly.

An experience I had with an educated Indian driver of one of my Private Hire Cars was a report that he didn't assist some clients with luggage or open doors. (I have spies out on the road who look out for me). Yet with my top clients he was a gem. Doing all and more than expected.

He had professional qualifications from India and was having to take bridging courses before he was recognised here in Australia. So he wasn't dumb.

I broached the question as to why he chose not to assist some folk.

It transpired that those folk that he considered were below his station or status in life he wouldn't lift a finger to assist. This included single white females, other dark - skinned folk of indeterminate heritage or education, "surfie" types, tradesmen amongst some he openly discriminated against.

Coming from a culture that still subscribed to a strong caste system wasn't his fault. But not readily accepting the new cultural values in his new country, a country that he wished to become a citizen of is wrong.

Good Customer service IS colour blind, I get a thrill when I surprise folk who may have copped a hard time because of a minority they are be part of, with a greeting that makes them feel welcome and transport needs catered for. Conversation that flows and allows us to learn about each other. A destination that is arrived at swiftly and smoothly, and an experience that will get me repeat bookings and good referrals.


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## u_no_me (Jun 27, 2014)

What about younger people (most passengers) not giving older people good ratings?


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## Just Some Guy (Jun 10, 2014)

u_no_me said:


> What about younger people (most passengers) not giving older people good ratings?


What about thin people rating fat people poorly? Or fat people rating thin people poorly? Or attractive people rating unattractive people... I'm sure you get the point... there's simply no way to know what riders/drivers are actually rating. Which is why I think they should need to explain their reason for anything other than 5 stars, and invalid reasons should not be included in the ratings.


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## Roberto (Jul 16, 2014)

How is it Uber's fault if people don't like the blacks, arabs, etc? We need to start giving them additional points just for being black like we do in college admissions?


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## u_no_me (Jun 27, 2014)

Just Some Guy said:


> What about thin people rating fat people poorly? Or fat people rating thin people poorly? Or attractive people rating unattractive people... I'm sure you get the point... there's simply no way to know what riders/drivers are actually rating. Which is why I think they should need to explain their reason for anything other than 5 stars, and invalid reasons should not be included in the ratings.


and short people, and people with small cars, and...


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## Allaffair (Jul 21, 2014)

Roberto said:


> How is it Uber's fault if people don't like the blacks, arabs, etc? We need to start giving them additional points just for being black like we do in college admissions?


That's is the point of the post, people are questioning exactly what are the riders rating??? Right now only uber knows, yes you can provide excellent service, but if the riders don't appreciate it then what?? It's a blow to morale.


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## TomNashville (Jul 20, 2014)

I read the original e-mail. A $10M lawsuit isn't a huge concern to a company worth as much as Uber. I think this guy just wants a payout, he used the "nazi" tactic and the lawyer and public shame tactics, all union designed. I agree that the ratings system is flawed as a 4-star rating is a vote to fire a driver, and anything less is multiple votes to fire a driver, so it tilts the tables strongly towards the clients that have a problem instead of all of the clients receiving excellent service. Also, there are always some who believe that 4 stars is a good rating, or those like the teachers who never believes that anyone deserves 100%. I believe that if a single driver needs to threaten a racially based lawsuit to get his job back, then there is a problem with the driver himself.


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## TomNashville (Jul 20, 2014)

Here is a scenario that is probably playing out: drivers are disproportionately minorities as the cab industry is. Drivers are also disproportionately foreign as the cab industry is. Riders are the public at large, locals and wealthy tourists. There will be a clash of cultures including how people expect to be treated and how they treat each other. In some cultures, strong scents are popular, in others they are annoying. The culture clash will play out in the driver ratings system. Not necessarily because anyone is prejudiced or racist, but because the treatment or service that they receive does not meet their expectations based upon their own culture and experiences.


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## Chip Dawg (Jul 27, 2014)

dominant7th said:


> Y'know the good thing is we're all very passionate about our ratings. Bad ratings hurt my pride and my ego too. I really do try my best for each trip. We're not nonchalant about them so that means we're striving to meet or exceed expectations. This is a good thing. I think a lot of confusion is on Uber's communication with users about the rating system. Passengers may be expecting Black/SUV kind of service and amenities when ordering X cars, and now that they've crossed over in this market (L.A.), the lines have been erased. Judging from the links above, I'm certainly going to do whatever I can to avoid a retraining class including avoiding surges, driving during the A.M., etc. Thanks for the info grams777


I guess a great strategy is to avoid surges and late night pickups if you're 4.84 or below. IMO 4.85 and above gives you a little cushion to be aggressive on picking up surge runs and late night bar pickups.


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## Driver8 (Jul 29, 2014)

As a female driver one thing I notice time and again is that there are a number of men out there who will not allow a woman to pick up their luggage, hold their doors, etc. I don't believe it's irrational to suspect there are some cases where such passengers give lower ratings to women, especially here in the South, because of the service they won't allow to be given. 

Aside from that, from conversations I've had with passengers, there is a relief that some feel when they get into a car and the driver is from their own culture. In Nashville, give a passenger that wants to go to Pharmacy Burgers or Marathon Music Works the choice between getting into my car, or the car of someone who has no idea of what those places are about, and they're going to choose my car. 

Not saying there's no racist element at all, but for many, culture and communication are a HUGE part of the reason why so many people prefer Uber over taxis.


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## Denouber (Jan 9, 2015)

This rating system open doors for discremination !!


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