# Uber is ending its subprime car leasing program in the US (NOT WSJ ARTICLE)



## Ca$h4 (Aug 12, 2015)

*Uber is ending its subprime car leasing program in the US*
*Written by*
Alison Griswold@alisongriswold

Uber plans to shutter Xchange Leasing, its US subprime car leasing operation, the Wall Street Journals reports. Uber executives decided to wind down Xchange, a wholly owned subsidiary, after realizing that the average loss per vehicle was 18 times what they had thought. From the Journal:

The Xchange Leasing division had been estimating modest losses of around $500 per auto on average, these people said. But managers recently informed Uber executives that the losses were actually about $9,000 per car-about half the sticker price of a typical leased vehicle.

Uber executives last month briefed a board committee on the unit's growing losses and agreed to put an end to it, the people said.

A source familiar with Xchange told Quartz that Uber and its board know big changes are needed at the leasing division, which employs at least 500 people. The person said Uber is exploring options that include a partnership or outright sale of Xchange, a reduction in the number of cities it serves, or layoffs in the unit with some employees switching to Uber proper. The Journal, citing sources, said the company aims to close or sell most of the business by the end of the year.

Xchange owns and operates about 40,000 vehicles and has 14 showrooms in the US. The program was a unique bet for Uber, whose ride-hailing business was originally premised on an "asset-light" model of owning no cars and employing no drivers. But as Uber grew it also needed a way to get more drivers on the road, and in the US that meant helping more Americans who wanted to drive get the right kind of cars. Xchange started in July 2015 and had received a $1 billion credit facility from Goldman Sachs. Two years later the company has decided owning and operating vehicles as it did with Xchange was too capital-intensive to be sustainable.

Uber has dabbled in other car-rental and leasing options. It partnered with Enterprise Rent-A-Car in late 2015 to let drivers rent a vehicle for $210 a week, a deal that makes little financial sense. That program still operates today, with rates starting at $225 a week plus taxes and fees. In Boston, it debuted a program with Zipcar earlier this year that let prospective drivers rent by the hour, starting at $12 an hour plus a monthly membership fee of $7-rates that practically guaranteed the driver would make less than minimum wage by working for Uber. In Singapore, the Journal reported last week that Uber had purchased and knowingly leased Honda SUVs that were subject to a recall. One of them caught fire.

In New York, Uber for years rented and leased cars to drivers through a network of shady subprime auto-dealers that operate without much scrutiny. Uber halted lease referrals to those dealers in June after Quartz reported on its auto-financing practices.

*https://qz.com/1049117/uber-is-shutting-down-xchange-leasing-its-us-subprime-car-leasing-program/*


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

the harder it is for new drivers to come aboard the better


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## Buckiemohawk (Jun 23, 2015)

I just want to laugh, so hard its not funny. That's going to be less drivers on the road.


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## KMANDERSON (Jul 19, 2015)

Buckiemohawk said:


> I just want to laugh, so hard its not funny. That's going to be less drivers on the road.


Bring on the surge.


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## Buckiemohawk (Jun 23, 2015)

KMANDERSON said:


> Bring on the surge.


they wont be able to get a new flock of drivers either


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## KMANDERSON (Jul 19, 2015)

Buckiemohawk said:


> they wont be able to get a new flock of drivers either


Uber exchange probably killed surge more then anything uber ever did.You got drivers driving 15 hr a day 7 days a week just to make a living.


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## Maven (Feb 9, 2017)

Only Uber could lose money after overcharging drivers huge sub-prime interest rates, often over 20%.
What happens now to all the drivers that signed these deals?


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## Kalee (Feb 18, 2015)

I refuse to believe that Honest Uber could have been directly involved with "shady sub-prime auto dealers".

I mean, do these shady practices really fit Uber's modus operandi?
< smirk>


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

$9000 in loss per car, that probobly has a lot to do with vehicles losing value harder than they expected them to lose value.

That ALONE could account for $9000 per car in loses.


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## majxl (Jan 6, 2017)

<In New York, Uber for years rented and leased cars to drivers through a network of shady subprime auto-dealers that operate without much scrutiny.>

Could there finally be more scrutiny ?


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## Buckiemohawk (Jun 23, 2015)

majxl said:


> <In New York, Uber for years rented and leased cars to drivers through a network of shady subprime auto-dealers that operate without much scrutiny.>
> 
> Could there finally be more scrutiny ?


Most likely not. When you lease a car, its because you can't afford a car. Most leased cars have an average 30 mile per day. With Uber they couldnt charge for extra miles because you used the car and had to pay Uber over the app. The price is so low the average drive does easily 150-200 miles a day just to make some kind of money


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## Maven (Feb 9, 2017)

http://www.businessinsider.com/uber-employees-fear-layoffs-in-car-leasing-unit-2017-8
*Uber employees fear layoffs as the company plans to shut down its 500-employee car leasing unit*
August 8 2017 by Julie Bort

Uber employees are nervous about an expected round of layoffs, according to a source familiar with the company.

This after news broke that the company is considering shuttering its US car leasing business.

The two-year old leasing program, founded under then CEO Travis Kalanick, is losing far more money than planned, reports the Wall Street Journal's Greg Bensinger.

Uber currently has about 40,000 vehicles in the program, which it leases to drivers. The company had expected to lose about $500 per car but is losing about $9,000 per car, sources told Bensinger.

The problem? Being in the car leasing business was harder than Uber imagined. All told, about 500 people work for the unit. Uber is apparently looking for a buyer for the unit, or even a partner for it, but short of that, the company will be make big changes, Quart's Alison Griswold reports. Some employees will find new roles within the company but layoffs are not out of the question, the source told Griswold.

Kalanick was forced to step down as Uber CEO in June in the wake of a long series of scandals at the company. Uber is currently being led by a committee of 14 executives. Uber lost $2.8 billion in 2016 and this team is said to be trying to stem those losses.

Uber did not immediately respond to a request for comment.


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## Uberyouber (Jan 16, 2017)

Yea let's give new cars to people with no job and bad credit. And then let's have them drive 3000 miles a month. Sounds solid...


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

KMANDERSON said:


> Uber exchange probably killed surge more then anything uber ever did.You got drivers driving 15 hr a day 7 days a week just to make a living.


You mean, just to make their lease payments!



Maven said:


> What happens now to all the drivers that signed these deals?


No car - and no work.
Exactly where they were when they entered the program.


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## westsidebum (Feb 7, 2015)

This is it. This shows that Ubers rates are so low for drivers that leasing cars to drivers at zero profit to uber causes huge internal loses rather than a net benefit. Uber,claims we should use a fractional depreciation method for rideshare costs, which is bogus, and this,proves that even ubers is .most likely taking the full depreciation hit.


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## Uberyouber (Jan 16, 2017)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> You mean, just to make their lease payments!
> 
> No car - and no work.
> Exactly where they were when they entered the program.


Driving 10 hours a day just to have transportation to get your family around. Sad


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/8/16112498/uber-phase-out-xchange-car-leasing-losses
*Uber is phasing out its subprime car-leasing division after massive losses*
*Losses per vehicle ended up being 18 times more than Uber expected*
The VERGE by Andrew J. Hawkins Aug 8, 2017

Uber plans to discontinue its subprime car-leasing operation as it currently exists, according to _The_ _Wall Street Journal_. Uber created Xchange Leasing LLC in 2015 in a bid to disrupt the auto loan industry, but it will now sell off or close most of the business by the end of the year, the _Journal _reports.

The decision to shutter its auto-lending division could result in hundreds of layoffs. Around 500 jobs could be affected, or around 3 percent of Uber's total 15,000-employee workforce. Not everyone will lose their job, however. Some of those employees could be shifted to Uber's customer service call centers, for example.

A source familiar with the discussion said that Uber isn't planning on completely abandoning its auto leasing ambitions. In the wake of Travis Kalanick's resignation as CEO, the company is taking a new look at some of its more cash-losing enterprises in the hopes of becoming more financially responsible. Uber is weighing selling off some of Xchange's assets as well as reducing the number of cities it serves.

[ _click to read the full article_ ]


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## KMANDERSON (Jul 19, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> You mean, just to make their lease payments!
> 
> No car - and no work.
> Exactly where they were when they entered the program.


That probably a more accurate statement.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

westsidebum said:


> This is it. This shows that Ubers rates are so low for drivers that leasing cars to drivers at zero profit to uber causes huge internal loses rather than a net benefit. Uber,claims we should use a fractional depreciation method for rideshare costs, which is bogus, and this,proves that even ubers is .most likely taking the full depreciation hit.


Uber is too stupid to realize that instead of not raising rates to prevent drivers from making money(which we know Travis and the rest of Uber hate so much), they could raise the rates and have plenty of drivers to pay for the lease program. Instead, the keep rates low and drivers don't have enough money to pay for the cars which have lost significant value. lol



Mears Troll Number 4 said:


> $9000 in loss per car, that probobly has a lot to do with vehicles losing value harder than they expected them to lose value.
> 
> That ALONE could account for $9000 per car in loses.


Remember, not just the value loss but I'm sure that includes the money they have to spend on each car...maintenance, reposessing, etc etc.


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## corniilius (Jan 27, 2017)

Less competition is always a good thing.


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## Jo3030 (Jan 2, 2016)

How do you lose 18X more than you EXPECTED?

Imagine if you expected to lose 10 dollars and lost 180? How does that happen?


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## Maven (Feb 9, 2017)

Jo3030 said:


> How do you lose 18X more than you EXPECTED? Imagine if you expected to lose 10 dollars and lost 180? How does that happen?


Many, many ways. To name a few:

Really big hole in your pocket.
Wife, kid, etc. needed a few extra bucks and "forgot" to tell you.
Professional Pickpocket that you didn't even notice until it was too late.
Skimming by the employees that will soon be treated to cement overshoes.

Money laundering or other means of "creative" accounting.
You forgot due to Alzheimer's or other mental impairment.


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## Jo3030 (Jan 2, 2016)

Theft / Fraud / Debauchery, essentially.

Don't tell me Uber is buying hookers and blow.


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## Maven (Feb 9, 2017)

Jo3030 said:


> Theft / Fraud / Debauchery, essentially. Don't tell me Uber is buying hookers and blow.


Shhhhh! TK is trying to turn over a new leaf as part of his rehabilitation and reinstatement to CEO.


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## Jo3030 (Jan 2, 2016)

Maven said:


> Shhhhh! TK is trying to turn over a new leaf as part of his rehabilitation and reinstatement to CEO.


Read an article that he's not coming back and those were just rumors.


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## Buckiemohawk (Jun 23, 2015)

Jo3030 said:


> Read an article that he's not coming back and those were just rumors.


if he came back, it would be a total poop storm on a level one couldn't imagine. Investors do not want him there.


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## Maven (Feb 9, 2017)

Jo3030 said:


> Read an article that he's not coming back and those were just rumors.


I saw that story, which was obviously leaked by the majority of the Uber board that is trying to replace TK and is starting to get desperate after repeated failures with the best (female) candidates.


Buckiemohawk said:


> if he came back, it would be a total poop storm on a level one couldn't imagine. Investors do not want him there.


Not entirely true. A majority of the Uber board does not want him there. However, TK effectively continues to sabotage all CEO candidates from behind the scenes. The longer and the more Uber's valuation plummets, the more investors will support TK's return, hoping Uber's pre-TK ouster, $70 Billion valuation is restored and exceeded.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

T


Michael - Cleveland said:


> https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/8/16112498/uber-phase-out-xchange-car-leasing-losses
> *Uber is phasing out its subprime car-leasing division after massive losses*
> *Losses per vehicle ended up being 18 times more than Uber expected*
> The VERGE by Andrew J. Hawkins Aug 8, 2017
> ...


The STORY of Ubers Life !

MASSIVE LOSSES !

As Drivers
We Relate.



Maven said:


> I saw that story, which was obviously leaked by the majority of the Uber board that is trying to replace TK and is starting to get desperate after repeated failures with the best (female) candidates.
> 
> Not entirely true. A majority of the Uber board does not want him there. However, TK effectively continues to sabotage all CEO candidates from behind the scenes. The longer and the more Uber's valuation plummets, the more investors will support TK's return, hoping Uber's pre-TK ouster, $70 Billion valuation is restored and exceeded.


Why are they being Sexist ?
Why are they ' seemingly' only actively recruiting Female Candidates?

Who is the Architect of this ?

( i have an idea)



KMANDERSON said:


> Uber exchange probably killed surge more then anything uber ever did.You got drivers driving 15 hr a day 7 days a week just to make a living.


Price Cuts did that to most Full Time Drivers.
This is the way they want it.
This is why Drivers are willfully impoverished when there was never a need for it to be so.


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## Spotscat (May 8, 2017)

40,000 vehicles losing an average of $9,000 each = $360,000,000 in losses.

Whomever the Einstein is that dreamed up this idea should write a farewell note to the wife and kids, then dive headfirst out an upper floor window!

Jeezus, can you imagine putting that on a resume? "I was responsible for my company losing $360 million dollars. Not $3.6 million, not $36 million, but $360 million dollars."

You could sign two decent starting pitchers, a set-up relief pitcher, a power hitting first baseman, and a good switch-hitting left fielder all to three year contracts for that kind of money!


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## NorthNJLyftacular (Feb 2, 2017)

Maven said:


> Only Uber could lose money after overcharging drivers huge sub-prime interest rates, often over 20%.
> What happens now to all the drivers that signed these deals?


That's what I was thinking...they screwed people, fooled them into indentured servitude...for THIS? They sold their soul to the devil and got an I.O.U.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Jo3030 said:


> How do you lose 18X more than you EXPECTED?
> 
> Imagine if you expected to lose 10 dollars and lost 180? How does that happen?


Because they are stupid. There is absolutely zero difference between a cab which burns 60,000 miles per year and a TNC which also burns 60,000 miles per year.


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## Uber Crack (Jul 19, 2017)

Uberyouber said:


> Yea let's give new cars to people with no job and bad credit. And then let's have them drive 3000 miles a month. Sounds solid...


*5,000 miles a month


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## Uberingdude (May 29, 2017)

So Uber learns Ubering is not worth it.


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## Uber_Yota_916 (May 1, 2017)

It will be a show for sure when all those cars get returned. Maybe there will be a deal on a cheap car purchase.


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## Cableguynoe (Feb 14, 2017)

Uberingdude said:


> So Uber learns Ubering is not worth it.


Some day us drivers will figure it out


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## corniilius (Jan 27, 2017)

I'm waiting for deep discounts on their inventory. $3k for a Prius sounds very tempting.


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## KMANDERSON (Jul 19, 2015)

Cableguynoe said:


> Some day us drivers will figure it out


The world will come to a end before that happens.


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

Jo3030 said:


> How do you lose 18X more than you EXPECTED?


It's a pretty simple recipe. Take $15bn of investor cash, marinate in incompetence and inexperience then add a dash of arrogance. Voila.

The clever part about Uber was copying someone else's idea (London's eCourier company had the idea of automatically assigning courier jobs based on distance from pickup years before Uber), repackaging it and selling it to investors. The rest was easy - any fool can spend $3bn a year of someone else's money and build an organisation that subsidizes rides for the public.

They could give me a billion or so and I'd have no problem building a leasing company that loses 9 grand per vehicle. I'd only charge a million to set it up for them.


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## empresstabitha (Aug 25, 2016)

I actually have an xchange lease vehicle. When my car broke down I needed a replacement. It was at a time when I had to make 5k in a month so my mom wouldn't lose her house. I succeeded but my old car couldn't take it. My dad a former cab worker had a stroke several years before and another 6 months before I joined Uber and Lyft (despite losing over 100 pounds and curing his diabetes) and because of xchange lease I was able to continue doing it and help my family. 

Yes I got a 2015prius. I actually called around for one because I've wanted a prius for years and knew the benefit of having one. Having this car has been a dream and I plan to keep it going. I plan to keep this car through thick and thin. 

Its been a little over a year and a half and it has about 75k miles on it. I was only ubering part time until recently and even now I tend to do about 30 hours of drive time. I'd do more but my medications and illness make me sleepy and I take frequent naps. And I dont drive when I'm tired. 

My point is I know many are hoping all us xchange leasers get shut out and are joking about us losing our cars. But maybe consider that for some these cars were a life saver.


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## dirtylee (Sep 2, 2015)

empresstabitha

I know it's a life saver but you should have someone show you the math on it. There's no point in going the full 3 years.

Half way through means you still have ~15k to pay on a lease before you can buy it for $1. 
Listen to me & listen well.
If you wreck before then, you are left with nothing!!! 
If you get sick & can't work, you are left with nothing!!!
If it's stolen, hit by a natural disaster, any kind of total loss, insurance claim, uber gets the payout, you get nothing!!!
Go out & look at real prices for that prius with 75k miles. It's not 15k.


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## empresstabitha (Aug 25, 2016)

dirtylee said:


> empresstabitha
> 
> I know it's a life saver but you should have someone show you the math on it. There's no point in going the full 3 years.
> 
> ...


It's been wrecked more than once. Not all thr times me driving amd 3 out of 4 times it was thr other persons fault and their insurance paid. It's been repaired. One time I swerved to avoid an animal and the ither admitedly I wasn't paying attention but the damage wad minor.I know it's not worth it but for some it's the option we have until we get a better one.

Btw

Accidents

1. Red light runner hit( sister driving)
Other drivers insurance paid
2. Teen hit back of car when it was parked
Other drivers insurance paid
3. Teen backed into car while car was trapped in an in n out line
Other drivers insurance paid
4. I tboned a red light runner
Other drivers insurance paid
5 I swerved to avoid an animal
My insurance $500 deductible
6. Old lady dented the rear bumper
She had no insurance and has been paying me. I just got a patch job.
7. I was distracted and rear ended someone.
My insurance will cover $500 deductible.

The first 5 we're all fixed at the same time because they happened within three months of each other. The seventh I'm waiting on.I mean I'm sure it's cursed but we made it through somehow


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## dirtylee (Sep 2, 2015)

That car is at most worth 5k with dirty carfax like that. If you know any independent car dealers that go to manhiem auctions & have enough cash to outright buy it. Turn it in & pick up dirt cheap from the auction.

My stance is still correct about you getting nothing if you lose the car.


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## Spotscat (May 8, 2017)

dirtylee said:


> empresstabitha
> 
> I know it's a life saver but you should have someone show you the math on it. There's no point in going the full 3 years.
> 
> ...


I'm glad that this was able to work out for empresstabitha! After all the stories I've read about the shenanigans Uber has pulled, it's good to read about how Uber actually helped someone!

I may be wrong, but I get the impression the the Xchange leasing program was something along the lines of a rent to own store (Aaron's, Rent-A-Center, etc.) - merchandise to people who are outside the more traditional methods of purchase. The terms and conditions of the contract are heavily skewed towards the merchant, and the consumer always pays far more above market value for the merchandise.

But, for some there is no other option.

I wonder if since Xchange is going out of business, it would be possible to buy the Prius at a lower price than what is owed on it?


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## empresstabitha (Aug 25, 2016)

dirtylee said:


> That car is at most worth 5k with dirty carfax like that. If you know any independent car dealers that go to manhiem auctions & have enough cash to outright buy it. Turn it in & pick up dirt cheap from the auction.
> 
> My stance is still correct about you getting nothing if you lose the car.


Yeah I know and I'm going to look into that idea


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## KenJ (Dec 24, 2016)

Ca$h4 said:


> *Uber is ending its subprime car leasing program in the US*
> *Written by*
> Alison Griswold@alisongriswold
> 
> The Xchange Leasing division had been estimating modest losses of around $500 per auto on average, these people said. But managers recently informed Uber executives that the losses were actually about $9,000 per car-about half the sticker price of a typical leased vehicle.


Having read this article, I wonder what Uber/Lyft drivers think of their "real" loss is by driving for Uber or Lyft using their own vehicles.


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## Buckiemohawk (Jun 23, 2015)

KenJ said:


> Having read this article, I wonder what Uber/Lyft drivers think of their "real" losses is by driving for Uber or Lyft using their own vehicles.


Is a huge loss, to drive your own vehicle at the low uber prices


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

dirtylee said:


> empresstabithaHalf way through means you still have ~15k to pay on a lease before you can buy it for $1.


Here's the kicker - the "buy the car for $1 at lease end" was never part of the Xchange deal. That was for the Santander leases.

I leased an Xchange vehicle. The terms were $150 per week, and then at lease end if I wanted the vehicle I'd also have to pay the agreed lease-end value of $6,300. Which would turn a $19k car into a $34k car.


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## empresstabitha (Aug 25, 2016)

elelegido said:


> Here's the kicker - the "buy the car for $1 at lease end" was never part of the Xchange deal. That was for the Santander leases.
> 
> I leased an Xchange vehicle. The terms were $150 per week, and then at lease end if I wanted the vehicle I'd also have to pay the agreed lease-end value of $6,300. Which would turn a $19k car into a $34k car.


Yeah but I'm pretty sure it's negotiable. Ii never planned to pay full price at the end. And I wanted to kerp it so my parents would have a good car to drive around.As I'm already saving uo for a different ride.


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

empresstabitha said:


> Yeah but I'm pretty sure it's negotiable. Ii never planned to pay full price at the end. And I wanted to kerp it so my parents would have a good car to drive around.As I'm already saving uo for a different ride.


That'd be nice, but I wouldn't bank on it. This is Uber we're talking about. The only thing they wanted to change on my contract was a few weeks after signing. They said they had made a mistake on the pricing, that the actual amount should be $10 more per week from me and they wanted me to sign a new contract to reflect that. I declined their request and suggested that it's a good idea to make sure one is happy with a contract _before_ signing it  .

Giving you a break on the residual value would be effectively the same as giving you free cash and Uber's not known for that. I hope they do, but I'd suggest factoring a "no" into your plans.


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## roadman (Nov 14, 2016)

the end is near.


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## fxcruiser (Apr 17, 2014)

dirtylee said:


> empresstabitha
> 
> I know it's a life saver but you should have someone show you the math on it. There's no point in going the full 3 years.
> 
> ...


You just used the word that none of these Gomers can comprehend or understand....MATH!


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## Ca$h4 (Aug 12, 2015)

*GM expands its car sharing service for Uber and Lyft drivers*
*https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/10/16122592/gm-maven-gig-economy-car-share-rideshare*
*Coming soon to LA, Boston, Detroit, DC, and Phoenix*
The Verge Aug 10 2017

Maven Gig, the car-sharing service for gig economy workers owned by General Motors, is expanding to a few more cities. Starting today, the service is available in Los Angeles. Later this fall, it will launch in Boston, Phoenix, and Washington, DC. And Baltimore and Detroit will follow soon after.

The program is aimed at drivers for rideshare apps like Uber and Lyft, and delivery apps like Postmates, GrubHub, and InstaCart. Someone who's interested in driving for any of these on-demand services, but doesn't own a vehicle, can rent a Chevy Bolt through Maven Gig for $229-a-week. The weekly price includes insurance, maintenance, and electric vehicle charging.

(_click the title to read the full story_)


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## Buckiemohawk (Jun 23, 2015)

Ca$h4 said:


> *GM expands its car sharing service for Uber and Lyft drivers*
> 
> *https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/10/16122592/gm-maven-gig-economy-car-share-rideshare*


Have fun not making any money


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## Maven (Feb 9, 2017)

Ca$h4 said:


> *GM expands its car sharing service for Uber and Lyft drivers*
> 
> *https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/10/16122592/gm-maven-gig-economy-car-share-rideshare*


Total ripoff! $229-a-week. Over $916-a-month. Should be less than half even including car payment, insurance, maintenance, and electric vehicle charging.


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## tootsie (Sep 12, 2015)

Only 40k cars??!! This won't put a dent in my city.


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

Maven said:


> Many, many ways. To name a few:
> 
> Really big hole in your pocket.
> Wife, kid, etc. needed a few extra bucks and "forgot" to tell you.
> ...


you forgot

$20 billion in cumulative investor capital flushed down the toilet since 2009...to the tune of $2-$3 billion a year subsidizing all negative cash flow streams your treasury is hemorrhaging


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## Adieu (Feb 21, 2016)

Jo3030 said:


> Theft / Fraud / Debauchery, essentially.
> 
> Don't tell me Uber is buying hookers and blow.


Uber is 100% buying hookers and blow

There was some scandal about escorts at employee parties wasnt there???



empresstabitha said:


> It's been wrecked more than once. Not all thr times me driving amd 3 out of 4 times it was thr other persons fault and their insurance paid. It's been repaired. One time I swerved to avoid an animal and the ither admitedly I wasn't paying attention but the damage wad minor.I know it's not worth it but for some it's the option we have until we get a better one.
> 
> Btw
> 
> ...


Please start TAKING uber instead of driving it

Cheaper & safer that way


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## empresstabitha (Aug 25, 2016)

Adieu said:


> Uber is 100% buying hookers and blow
> 
> There was some scandal about escorts at employee parties wasnt there???
> 
> ...


I was only in the car four of the times 4-7, well three, two bwing my fault. I was parked with the old lady. The other times my sister or mom had it and most the times they were parked or couldn't move. Before I got this car I had been in one accident all my life


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## corniilius (Jan 27, 2017)

How's that predatory leasing working out for ya?


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## Flier5425 (Jun 2, 2016)

Maven said:


> Total ripoff! $229-a-week. Over $916-a-month. Should be less than half even including car payment, insurance, maintenance, and electric vehicle charging.


This is over 992/month {(229 x 52) / 12 = 992.333}


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## THE MAN! (Feb 13, 2015)

Travis has a clear distain for drivers just because he couldn't completely control them. Ultimately causing him to become a big time failure! If I didn't know better I would of thought Travis father was a cab driver that abused him!


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

> Total ripoff! $229-a-week. Over $916-a-month.






Flier5425 said:


> This is over 992/month {(229 x 52) / 12 = 992.333}


Like an Operation Market Garden for Uber drivers; converting weekly amounts to monthly is just a bridge too far.


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## Steveyoungerthanmontana (Nov 19, 2016)

Lol these people are morons! At every corner there is a blaring sign that says "Raise the rates!" And UBER just looks at and says "Nah!"

I mean they can't even make money off of owning the cars, and renting them out to drivers for 3x the price, as they already make 25% of each fare. I mean what kind of moron business are you running where you have the prices so low, that you still can't make money!


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## 2Cents (Jul 18, 2016)

Buckiemohawk said:


> Most likely not. When you lease a car, its because you can't afford a car. Most leased cars have an average 30 mile per day. With Uber they couldnt charge for extra miles because you used the car and had to pay Uber over the app. The price is so low the average drive does easily 150-200 miles a day just to make some kind of money


Are you talking about a standard lease?
People that do standard leases don't do them because they can't afford a car.
When some one puts a lot a lot a lot of miles is typically best to purchase the car out right unless you're going to purchase a car at the end it doesn't matter how many miles you out on a lease. With the exchange lease there was no purchase price meaning that the leassee could not purchase it there fore the leasing company took the hit.
They got a Billion dollars through Goldman Sach's (because of their high valuation) to launch this program and their now figuring out that it doesn't make financial sense.
Let me give you a hint. The new rates do not make drivers money. The ride sharing companies make money. They burned through a Billion dollars and decided it was not profitable to put excessive miles on a leased vehicle, why should drivers who use their own cars, pay for their own insurance , supply their own fuel drive for such a company, and offer below cost fares to passengers in order to drive out transportation companies?
And makes themselves $$$ in the process by retaining over 50% of the fares, cheat revenues from drivers, and over charge your customers.

The best thing would be for TK to light a match to all of the servers back at HQ and say "See you. I'm out" and just torch the whole place, take his money and run.


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## empresstabitha (Aug 25, 2016)

2Cents said:


> The best thing would be for TK to light a match to all of the servers back at HQ and say "See you. I'm out" and just torch the whole place, take his money and run.


Don't give him anu ideas although that would be a funny youtube video. ( As long as no human was hurt)


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

elelegido said:


> Like Operation Market Garden, converting weekly amounts to monthly is just a bridge too far.


lol

That's practically 1 week wages for PT/casual drivers and some 60%+ for FT drivers. So you're really making 3 weeks wages in a 4 week month--before Uber takes their cut.

Scaling up to the month creates some painfully inconvenient truths


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## empresstabitha (Aug 25, 2016)

Cynergie said:


> lol
> 
> That's practically 1 week wages for PT/casual drivers and some 60%+ for FT drivers. So you're really making 3 weeks wages in a 4 week month--before Uber takes their cut.
> 
> Scaling up to the month creates some painfully inconvenient truths


But with an all electric vehicle yu save on gas, depreciation , and maintenance which is partially offset on how using an all electric car will limit you. The other vehicles they have are gas powered and about $200 a week, and the benefits aren't so good.


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## Matthew Thomas (Mar 19, 2016)

Cool story now when are they gonna raise rates?


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## empresstabitha (Aug 25, 2016)

Matthew Thomas said:


> Cool story now when are they gonna raise rates?


Pray for a blizzard in hell


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## Abraxas79 (Feb 7, 2016)

Uberyouber said:


> Yea let's give new cars to people with no job and bad credit. And then let's have them drive 3000 miles a month. Sounds solid...


These cars when returned after a year or two must be worthless with all the high mileage. I assume the warranties covered all the blown transmissions, engine failures and everything else associated with driving a car 300 miles a day. UBER ON.


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

Abraxas79 said:


> These cars when returned after a year or two must be worthless with all the high mileage. I assume the warranties covered all the blown transmissions, engine failures and everything else associated with driving a car 300 miles a day. UBER ON.


That's probobly how they are losing money, they are getting cars back from drivers who quit and instead of having 25,000 miles on them like they thought they have 85,000 and need a whole lot of work (both of which will be deducted off the value of the car when it's sold)

It's also why it's just now they are figuring it out, it will take until the end of the lease of each car to discover how much they lost per car.

And it's a LOT per car.


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## Buckiemohawk (Jun 23, 2015)

Not to mention, non payment and I suspect the inevitable lawsuits from these leases


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## wb6vpm (Mar 27, 2016)

lol


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## Strange Fruit (Aug 10, 2016)

I heard sub-prime car loan bundling is the new 2008-like banking scam. Praise be to Free Market and the holy Job Creators


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## Hoof Hearted (Jul 17, 2017)

I do the xchange lease in San Diego. Happy to share details: 
$250 down on my CC. No tax, title or fees. I was in and out of the Xchange showroom in 50 minutes.
It's a 2016 Nissan Sentra with 25K miles. Pristine condition. I assumed the lease from a guy who walked from it.
I got the warranty, free oil changes, and tire rotation. Got to ride the free registration thru July and just paid $200 to get the 2018 sticker. 
I took over the remaining 28 months on the 36 month lease, doubtful I'll finish it out, but maybe I will.
We get UNLIMITED mileage on the lease.
The weekly payment is $150. The monthly rideshare/ collision insurance (Allstate) is $110 a month.

I got the car for our daughter to drive. She does not drive Uber. I do. 
All I have to do is drive 8 hours each weekend. 
I always Saturday and Sunday 5am-9am when I used to walk on the beach with the dog, now I Uber instead.
Mostly airport runs, people getting to work, the usual walk of shame and drive backs to where pax left their car at a bar on Fri/Sat night.
I drive until I hit $80 on Saturday and the $80 on Sunday. Always within 4 hours. Sometimes faster, sometimes slower- but I stop when I hit $80.
No pressure.
I always hit the $160 and I'm done and then give the keys back to my 16 year old, so she has the car. Usually, before she is up and showered.
Thus by using xchange, my teenager gets a really decent, dependable car and all I have to do is drive 4 hours each weekend day.
If she is not using the car maybe I'll pick up some rides to cover the $110 for insurance, but it's not a priority. 
In fact, with tipping, that covers my $110 monthly Allstate bill. 

Tell me how else you get a late model car for $250 down? The 8 hours I do Ubering is highly entertaining, informative and an enjoyable way to spend my weekend mornings. When I need to travel to LA or AZ or LV my wife and I take the Sentra (unlimited miles) and give our daughter the SUV to drive locally so we don't put miles on the SUV lease. If I ever want 'out' of the lease, I give 30 days notice and turn it in on the spot. 
I then forfeit the $250 deposit I made at the beginning and that's it. 
Hope that is helpful and in line with your expectations.


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## jjub40 (Aug 11, 2017)

Sounds like $600 a month to borrow a car to me. Does gas come with this lease package? I have 2017 Honda SUV with payments under $300 per month, with unlimited miles and it 48 short months it's all mine......


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## Hoof Hearted (Jul 17, 2017)

jjub40 said:


> Sounds like $600 dollars a month to borrow a car to me. Does gas come with this lease package? I have 2017 Honda SUV with payments under $300 per month, with unlimited miles and it 48 short months it's all mine......


Sadly gas is not included. But I can walk away from the lease in 30 days, so when she goes to school or is tired of the Sentra, or it gets damaged, totaled or needs a major repair, I walk. I like that. Also, I'm not committed for 4 years. I like that.


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## Mido toyota (Nov 1, 2015)

I wonder how are they going to do with the huge fleet of driverless cars ****en uber


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## Flier5425 (Jun 2, 2016)

jjub40 said:


> Sounds like $600 a month to borrow a car to me. Does gas come with this lease package? I have 2017 Honda SUV with payments under $300 per month, with unlimited miles and it 48 short months it's all mine......


Math works well when used correctly. (150/week x 52 weeks in a year) + (110/month for insurance x 12 months per year) = 9,120 / year. That equates to 760/month.


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## CarterPeerless (Feb 10, 2016)

Just wait until they are trying to field a fleet of autonomous vehicles. They will require 3x the cost of a prius just to get it in the field, have 10x the operating cost, and will have no resale value at the end of their useful life.


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## jjub40 (Aug 11, 2017)

Flier5425 said:


> Math works well when used correctly. (150/week x 52 weeks in a year) + (110/month for insurance x 12 months per year) = 9,120 / year. That equates to 760/month.


Seems worth it


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## Buckiemohawk (Jun 23, 2015)

The insurance will cost you over 200 a month. If you don't lie to them


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## Jorgeletsee (Jun 26, 2017)

Steveyoungerthanmontana said:


> Lol these people are morons! At every corner there is a blaring sign that says "Raise the rates!" And UBER just looks at and says "Nah!"
> 
> I mean they can't even make money off of owning the cars, and renting them out to drivers for 3x the price, as they already make 25% of each fare. I mean what kind of moron business are you running where you have the prices so low, that you still can't make money!


You morons are idiots. The top guys ar uber are rolling in money. They have a handful of offices and servers needed to run their business are super cheap. Uber might go down but a few hundred people will make shit loads of money


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## Cableguynoe (Feb 14, 2017)

Jorgeletsee said:


> The top guys ar uber are rolling in money.


Isn't this the case in any company?


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## Jorgeletsee (Jun 26, 2017)

Cableguynoe said:


> Isn't this the case in any company?


Yes uber is making money. Im sure the losses posted are because of them stealing money from thr company


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

Jorgeletsee said:


> Yes uber is making money. Im sure the losses posted are because of them stealing money from thr company


It's possible but i doubt it,

The truth is uber is spending way too much in incentives lobbying, lawsuits, and the like.

You also are not seeing how much Uber is paying to James River for insurance, that bill is much much higher than most people realize.

For most cab companies, the insurance bill (or self insurance payouts) is a sizable % of the operational costs. This is something that uber is getting billed for as well.

Between politicians Lawyers and insurance companies, hiring bonuses... uber is spending way more than they should be.

Politicians require lobbying (AKA bribes) are a multimillion $ problem that uber spends huge sums of money on.
Lobbying is a very costly endevour that may or may not pay off. Hand in hand with lobbying is bribery.

Plus uber is hitting the advertising infinitely harder than the cab companies ever have. I can't go 5 minutes without running into an uber add, on every job site, TV station, Radio station... they are spending entirely too much money recruiting drivers.

You also have fines, this results in Millions a year. Uber keeps paying fines...

Plus you have money losing operations, like their leasing department that lost thousands on every car they leased out. While this seems illogical the cars were simply driven a lot more miles than they ever thought they would and depreciated a lot worse.

You also have new customer sign up bonuses... "$20 off your first ride" and the like. $20 off your first ride is still easily and $8-10 loss on uber's books.

Some people churn new uber accounts so fast they never have to pay.

Combine that with new driver bonuses and it's easy to see all the ways that money gets $($(ed down the drain.


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## Cableguynoe (Feb 14, 2017)

Jorgeletsee said:


> Yes uber is making money. Im sure the losses posted are because of them stealing money from thr company


They are not making money. 
However you are right about the people on top being filthy rich. 
A company could be losing money but everyone up top is paying themselves millions and millions


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## Jo3030 (Jan 2, 2016)

These Uber leases are huge scams.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Cableguynoe said:


> They are not making money.
> However you are right about the people on top being filthy rich.
> A company could be losing money but everyone up top is paying themselves millions and millions


Ya gotta eat. My accountant told me to name my salary.


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## negeorgia (Feb 1, 2015)

Run up high miles on cars that cost 2017 dollars with a per miles fare from 1970's taxis. Only a 10 year old would think that just might work.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

negeorgia said:


> Run up high miles on cars that cost 2017 dollars with a per miles fare from 1970's taxis. Only a 10 year old would think that just might work.


It's a Giant Shell Game using Other People's Money.
Step Right Up and Try Your Luck.


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## Cableguynoe (Feb 14, 2017)

negeorgia said:


> Run up high miles on cars that cost 2017 dollars with a per miles fare from 1970's taxis. Only a 10 year old would think that just might work.


Cars were made for one thing and one thing only... To be driven


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## negeorgia (Feb 1, 2015)

Cableguynoe said:


> Cars were made for one thing and one thing only... To be driven


Absolutely, and there are smart ways and there are dumb ways to drive their usefulness and value away.


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## itsablackmarket (May 12, 2015)

If this is not proof that Uber's business model is a failure, then what is?


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## roadman (Nov 14, 2016)

Jorgeletsee said:


> You morons are idiots. The top guys ar uber are rolling in money. They have a handful of offices and servers needed to run their business are super cheap. Uber might go down but a few hundred people will make shit loads of money


Us morons are all idiots.


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