# (Updated) Uber Fined $7.3 Million by California PUC for Failing to File Required Data



## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*California regulator fines Uber millions of dollars*
*http://fortune.com/2015/07/15/uber-fined-california/*


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## zMann (Feb 21, 2015)

It seems that most local, state and federal agencies start shrinking the Uber's power.
Records show that the GOV will always win ::))


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*JUDGE MOVES TO SUSPEND UBER STATEWIDE*
*http://www.laweekly.com/news/judge-moves-to-suspend-uber-statewide-5806232*


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)




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## UberComic (Apr 17, 2014)

This company continues to show that it's being run by complete morons.


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

UberComic said:


> This company continues to show that it's being run by complete morons.


Moron isn't the right word. They've made a lot of money. If he loses all the money when the game is over & TravisK has just another taxi co., or he bails & sells to Google or whatever, if he loses all the money, then we'll use the word moron. Even tho I don't like how TravisK plays the game, no one can deny him the fact that he's winning. My bet is he has several exit plans in place, none of which leave him with less than a billion.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Best article so far:*
*Uber Fined, Faces Possible Suspension in California for Not Reporting Accessibility Data*
*http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slat...0002&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter*


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## ubershiza (Jan 19, 2015)

What's millions when you've got billions. RIGHT? After all its OPM (other peoples money) anyway.


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## ElectroFuzz (Jun 10, 2014)

ubershiza said:


> What's millions when you've got billions. RIGHT? After all its OPM (other peoples money) anyway.


In the last 6 month Uber's evaluation went up from 42 billion to 50 billion.
That's 8 billion with the B.
7 million is 1/1000 of that.
It's the same as if you earn $4000 and now you got a $4 fine.

Just for perspective......


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

ElectroFuzz said:


> In the last 6 month Uber's evaluation went up from 42 billion to 50 billion.
> That's 8 billion with the B.
> 7 million is 1/1000 of that.
> It's the same as if you earn $4000 and now you got a $4 fine.
> ...


Right! I think we should say $50,000millions instead of $50 billion. Makes it crystal clear to everyone.


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## ubershiza (Jan 19, 2015)

CA ain't playin. NYC sold their soles to the devil


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## toi (Sep 8, 2014)

ElectroFuzz said:


> In the last 6 month Uber's evaluation went up from 42 billion to 50 billion.
> That's 8 billion with the B.
> 7 million is 1/1000 of that.
> It's the same as if you earn $4000 and now you got a $4 fine.
> ...


50B is on paper , $7.3 is hard cash.
But i am sure its just pocket change with their billions dollars investor money.


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

toi said:


> 50B is on paper , $7.3 is hard cash.
> But i am sure its just pocket change with their billions dollars investor money.


It's not just the fine, it's also a shut down in the most populated state in the country.


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## GooberX (May 13, 2015)

It isn't the money. 

It's the symbolic lashing, and the sign of things to come. 

They have been warned about uber pool.


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## Just_in (Jun 29, 2014)

What is there to hide I don't get it.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Just_in said:


> What is there to hide I don't get it.


Submission of this Trip Data is a requirement of Uber's CPUC licence. This fight has been going on since Sept 2014 deadline for submission.

Even if there is nothing to hide, Uber just doesn't wanna provide the Data without a drawn out fight. It wants it's aggregate Data to be it's propriety property. In NYC, TLC had suspended 5 of 6 Uber_NYC bases and was on the verge of suspension of service, when Uber turned over the required Data.

There are nuggets of gold in that Data and there are lumps of coal in there too.

*Nuggets Of Gold:*

Rides Requested by Zip Code
Rides Completed by Zip Code
Cost of Rides
Number of Drivers
*Lumps Of Coal:*

Wheelchair Accessible Rides given.
Accident Data
*EDIT: *All of this data is aggregate or anonymized, but Uber Spox Eva Bernhardt said "Sharing it would jeopardize Rider & Driver Privacy".
Both Lyft & Sidecar complied fully with the reporting requirements in a timely fashion.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*CPUC Decision:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/srq6nlsvrwsic44/cpucuberdecision.pdf?dl=0*


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## GooberX (May 13, 2015)

I see a lot of trouble in Uber's future.

Specifically the line of them being required to report reported incidents involving drivers and any compensation paid to passengers because of those incidents.

This is what they call chickens coming home to roost.

The low pricing implemented in their lame attempt to kill cabs have resulted in such a poor driver pool, and such a bad attitude, that incidents reported are sky high.

Whether Uber compensated riders in any way, or not, this data will become public.

Cluck, cluck, chickens sitting on the regulation eggs.

Well done, you arrogant pricks.


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## UberScam (Jul 12, 2015)

ElectroFuzz said:


> In the last 6 month Uber's evaluation went up from 42 billion to 50 billion.
> That's 8 billion with the B.
> 7 million is 1/1000 of that.
> It's the same as if you earn $4000 and now you got a $4 fine.
> ...


You are really confusing a companies valuation ... and cash on hand.. recent documents show that Uber is LOSING millions in operating cost. No wonder between, lawsuit, settlements, attorney fees and paying off whoever they need to. Money is all gone.


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## UberScam (Jul 12, 2015)

Just shows that you don't want to piss off CAPUC... Uber's arrogance is writting a check that their Butts can't cash.


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## riChElwAy (Jan 13, 2015)

UberScam said:


> You are really confusing a companies valuation ... and cash on hand.. recent documents show that Uber is LOSING millions in operating cost. No wonder between, lawsuit, settlements, attorney fees and paying off whoever they need to. Money is all gone.


gotta wonder if this is indeed the master plan, to create a really chaotic messy environment for as long as you can, meanwhile you're skimming from the $$$billions that "investors" are pouring in ... the ones at the top, and i include the guys at Goldman Sachs, a justified raid on that company's free cash flow .. they found an excuse to extract the money, "this exciting new growth machine called Uber!!" whereas what it really is is a goliath cash skim for a few .. "invest" it with Kalanick, he'll make things really messy and chaotic, in this process we meet, he slides us huge chunks .. Goldman Sachs brass simply robbing their own free cash flow


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

Demon said:


> It's not just the fine, it's also a shut down in the most populated state in the country.


I thought the shut down was only if they don't hand over the data or appeal. ????


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## riChElwAy (Jan 13, 2015)

UberRidiculous said:


> I thought the shut down was only if they don't hand over tbe data or appeal. ????


they've already stated OF COURSE that they will appeal. they appeal everything. they extend everything. so after the appeal, that is the issue, what happens.. if they comply with the reporting requirements, they will be revealing that they have 1 maybe 2 WAV vehicles in the State of California.. they will be admitting "we don't service those handicapped old people, we leave that crap for those hungry taxi dogs" .. so the question i want answered is When they show they've made zero effort to provide service for that handicapped junk, then what? another stupid fine?


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

UberRidiculous said:


> I thought the shut down was only if they don't hand over tbe data or appeal. ????


They of course get a chance to appeal. My point was that I don't think UBER is worried over a 7.3M fine, but they would be worried about a California shut down.


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## GooberX (May 13, 2015)

Demon said:


> They of course get a chance to appeal. My point was that I don't think UBER is worried over a 7.3M fine, but they would be worried about a California shut down.


They are more worried about what the data will show.


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## ElectroFuzz (Jun 10, 2014)

riChElwAy said:


> gotta wonder if this is indeed the master plan, to create a really chaotic messy environment for as long as you can, meanwhile you're skimming from the $$$billions that "investors" are pouring in ... the ones at the top, and i include the guys at Goldman Sachs, a justified raid on that company's free cash flow .. they found an excuse to extract the money, "this exciting new growth machine called Uber!!" whereas what it really is is a goliath cash skim for a few .. "invest" it with Kalanick, he'll make things really messy and chaotic, in this process we meet, he slides us huge chunks .. Goldman Sachs brass simply robbing their own free cash flow


No, the master plan is to get as high of an evaluation as possible.
The VC investors and Goldman Sacks will all make huge profits once the company goes public.
Once public, the "new owners" aka middle class America 401K share holders
will be the ones to take the hit.

The whole idea is to transfer those 50 billion dollars from middle class America
into the pockets of the VC investors and Goldman Sacks.
Of course Kalanick will get a bone too but the investors are the ones who are really "in control"
and they are the ones who will end up with the big profits on the back of middle class America.

Kalanick is just like a puppet, a figurehead.
Do you really believe powerful people will give him 5 billion dollars as an investment
and he can simply turn around and screw them?
Trust me he will die really young if he did that.


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## UberScam (Jul 12, 2015)

riChElwAy said:


> gotta wonder if this is indeed the master plan, to create a really chaotic messy environment for as long as you can, meanwhile you're skimming from the $$$billions that "investors" are pouring in ... the ones at the top, and i include the guys at Goldman Sachs, a justified raid on that company's free cash flow .. they found an excuse to extract the money, "this exciting new growth machine called Uber!!" whereas what it really is is a goliath cash skim for a few .. "invest" it with Kalanick, he'll make things really messy and chaotic, in this process we meet, he slides us huge chunks .. Goldman Sachs brass simply robbing their own free cash flow


.
Very good point. Not as if Travis has actually cared about the drivers doing well. His net worth now is around 5.3-billion dollars. In the same breath, bringing up how Uber is operating 537-millions dollars in the red. How does that work?
Agree they can pay the 7.3-million dollars. What scares them more than anything is CAPUC getting the data, THAN ACTING ON IT WITH FURTHER REGULATIONS. Which is going to happen any way.. If Uber really thinks they can operate with no Regulatory oversight.. They are more stupid than I thought.


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## riChElwAy (Jan 13, 2015)

ElectroFuzz said:


> No, the master plan is to get as high of an evaluation as possible.
> The VC investors and Goldman Sacks will all make huge profits once the company goes public.
> Once public, the "new owners" aka middle class America 401K share holders
> will be the ones to take the hit.
> ...


this is a great post, but will the SEC approve an IPO, that is a huge question


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## riChElwAy (Jan 13, 2015)

<<Agree they can pay the 7.3-million dollars.>>

Uber cannot pay the $7.3 million but Goldman Sachs will


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

riChElwAy said:


> <<Agree they can pay the 7.3-million dollars.>>
> 
> Uber cannot pay the $7.3 million but Goldman Sachs will


Uber can pay 7.3 million. The investor funds are helping pay for things like self-driving cars etc.
That P&L was a joke. Just bcuz Uber decided it is in Uber's best interest to spend a little more than it's taking in doesn't mean Uber doesn't make money.
...
Here's the quick math on Uber cash flow:
Uber is now in 300 markets.
How many rides per day does Uber do per market? Multiply that by 300.
(Example: If Uber does 1000 rides per day per market, Uber's doing 300,000 rides per day.)
Now multiply that # by 30 days to get #Uber rides per month.
(Ex: If Uber does 300,000 rides per day, Uber does 9,000,000 rides per month)
So, how much does Uber make on those rides? That's $9,000,000 per month SRF PLUS pick an average # for Uber's 20-30% cut and multiply that by 9,000,000 and add it in.
Real question is, how many rides does Uber do per day per market? All the other math is dependent on that #.

Edit: Detroit is probably a smaller market because everyone owns a car here. And I bet Uber can probably sneeze 1000 rides a day here.
Another Uber Driver give us your guess on #s please. I'm thinking your guess will be the best guess considering your background.


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## riChElwAy (Jan 13, 2015)

<<Uber can pay 7.3 million. The investor funds are helping pay for...>>

you just made my point . . . Uber has $zero from its operations but it got $5.9 billion payPal'ed in from outside their operations


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## Uber-Doober (Dec 16, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> *JUDGE MOVES TO SUSPEND UBER STATEWIDE*
> *http://www.laweekly.com/news/judge-moves-to-suspend-uber-statewide-5806232*


Yup... heard about this earlier this week on the radio in the car.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

What happens when the biggest scam ever gets shut down in the state which houses it's corporate headquarters? 
The Emperors new clothes are rashes!

This initial ruling is the greatest news since the $4,000.00 employee expense ruling.
here in NC we have Senate Bill 541 which Uber WROTE for this ferkakte free market state which goes so far as to forbid CITIES or AIRPORT AUTHORITIES to make or enforce existing laws to (police Uber).
All on the eve of me coughing up a grand to paint my cab and change affiliations in another straw attempt to get enough revenue to live.


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

TwoFiddyMile said:


> What happens when the biggest scam ever gets shut down in the state which houses it's corporate headquarters?
> The Emperors new clothes are rashes!
> 
> This initial ruling is the greatest news since the $4,000.00 employee expense ruling.
> ...


I highly doubt that will happen. Uber always pushes the envelope right to the edge, then like a Mission Impossible Ninja, Uber narrowly escapes. Money buys a lot of narrow escapes.


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## secretadmirer (Jul 19, 2015)

In a couple of years, uber will fill up several episodes of "American greed".


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## Dts08 (Feb 25, 2015)

Everyone alway speak of Uber's valuation but don't seem to realize that us drivers are what they place their value on...none of it works with out us...I wish more we awake to this fact..


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

Dts08 said:


> Everyone alway speak of Uber's valuation but don't seem to realize that us drivers are what they place their value on...none of it works with out us...I wish more we awake to this fact..


Yes and no. Uber needs drivers yes, but drivers are too easy to replace at almost any fare rate. Apparently it's so easy to con people into driving at 'loss inducing rates/per mile' which eat away at most driver's car equity, that 'the drivers' are really a 'non-issue'. 
As long as Uber has enough drivers who confuse 'cash flow' for 'income' then Uber's business model (the con) along with Uber's valuation is sustainable.


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

Also Uber's valuation is only based on drivers to the extent that Uber has enough drivers to collect riders SRF $1 plus the %. 300 Uber markets! Thousands of riders per day, per market. Even if only 1000 rides per day per market, that is 300,000 rides per day for Uber in SRF $1, THAT'S $300,000/day! And certainly markets are doing well more than only 1000 rides a day.


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## phillipzx3 (May 26, 2015)

Dts08 said:


> Everyone alway speak of Uber's valuation but don't seem to realize that us drivers are what they place their value on...none of it works with out us...I wish more we awake to this fact..


UberX drivers are a dime a dozen. Like roaches, one leaves....three take his/her place.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Opinion
*Cracked Down Upon by Government? There's an App for That.*
*http://www.latimes.com/opinion/opinion-la/la-ol-rall-0720-uber-california-20150717-story.html*
*







*


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## GooberX (May 13, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> Opinion
> *Cracked Down Upon by Government? There's an App for That.*
> *http://www.latimes.com/opinion/opinion-la/la-ol-rall-0720-uber-california-20150717-story.html*
> *
> ...


I need a 1.000 likes button.

You'd get all 1,000.

Fantastic.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Lyft pays $30,000 in settlement to CPUC over Data Reporting Requirements:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/iiwfzue60qfpwud/153332247.pdf?dl=0








*


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## driver_dude (Aug 7, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> *California regulator fines Uber millions of dollars*
> *http://fortune.com/2015/07/15/uber-fined-california/*


_We don't need the government looking at the Uber data and we don't need the government telling us who we should be giving rides to. We are independent contractors and we don't need private riders data revealed to anyone. The less government interference the better. We just want to do our job and make some money._


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## driver_dude (Aug 7, 2015)

driver_dude said:


> _We don't need the government looking at the Uber data and we don't need the government telling us who we should be giving rides to. We are independent contractors and we don't need private riders data revealed to anyone. The less government interference the better. We just want to do our job and make some money._


_The reason for Uber's existence is to combat communism. Everyone knows that taxi permit holders get most of the money from cabbies. It's almost criminal the way taxi companies have rigged the system. The FTC should get involved - it's probably against the law to run a Ponzi scheme the way taxi companies do. Local city councils are not supposed to be price-fixing fares. The Supreme Court should ban all taxi companies for breaking the law and trying to restrict interstate trade.

It's just amazing how much influence you can buy with a $1000 cash donation to a city council member!_


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## ubershiza (Jan 19, 2015)

_"It's just amazing how much influence you can buy with a $1000 cash donation to a city council member! " David Ploufee has done a wonderful job with millions of uber dollars._


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## #responseuber (Aug 5, 2015)

driver_dude said:


> _We don't need the government looking at the Uber data and we don't need the government telling us who we should be giving rides to. We are independent contractors and we don't need private riders data revealed to anyone. The less government interference the better. We just want to do our job and make some money._


 holy zombie Jesus


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## GooberX (May 13, 2015)

driver_dude said:


> _The reason for Uber's existence is to combat communism. Everyone knows that taxi permit holders get most of the money from cabbies. It's almost criminal the way taxi companies have rigged the system. The FTC should get involved - it's probably against the law to run a Ponzi scheme the way taxi companies do. Local city councils are not supposed to be price-fixing fares. The Supreme Court should ban all taxi companies for breaking the law and trying to restrict interstate trade.
> 
> It's just amazing how much influence you can buy with a $1000 cash donation to a city council member!_


Quoting your own posts is a sign of serious mental issues.


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## #responseuber (Aug 5, 2015)

GooberX said:


> Quoting your own posts is a sign of serious mental issues.


I really think this poster broke something in me. It's like I want to respond, but it just seems like simply reading the posts have drained the life out of me. I have all these things going on in my head with the many, many things wrong with these comments, but the closer I get to the keyboard the more I feel like I would be picking on the handicapped or like I have just ran a marathon and have nothing left. 
No! Wait it's exactly the feeling I had after a buddy (for laughs) forced me to watch a tv show explaining how Bigfoot was actually aliens first attempt at making slave labor to build the ancient pyramids, but when they couldn't be controlled the aliens flooded the earth to wipe out their mistake and then created humans who could be more easily controlled and the Bigfoots that people see today are the few remaining survivors of the flood. I felt the exact same way after watching that show as I did after reading those posts.

My brain is just broken.


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## Hackenstein (Dec 16, 2014)

driver_dude said:


> _The reason for Uber's existence is to combat communism. Everyone knows that taxi permit holders get most of the money from cabbies. It's almost criminal the way taxi companies have rigged the system. The FTC should get involved - it's probably against the law to run a Ponzi scheme the way taxi companies do. Local city councils are not supposed to be price-fixing fares. The Supreme Court should ban all taxi companies for breaking the law and trying to restrict interstate trade.
> 
> It's just amazing how much influence you can buy with a $1000 cash donation to a city council member!_


Fleet Medallion holders do not take most of the money from cabbies. It's roughly the same split it's always been.

It's clearly Uber which is an actual ponzi scheme.

Try to wrap your head around municipalities setting rates which offer a reliable base income for drivers so they dont become desperate Uberites who dont know when the next rate cut/uber cut raise will come or when another 20,000 cars will hit the road trying to divide up the same pie.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> *Lyft pays $30,000 in settlement to CPUC over Data Reporting Requirements *


SOOOooo... It's 8/15... has Uber supplied the required information? Is there an order for Uber to cease and desist is CA?
This is so exciting...


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> SOOOooo... It's 8/15... has Uber supplied the required information? Is there an order for Uber to cease and desist is CA?


I'm quite sure Uber filed a last minute appeal, as expected. I will update the thread when I hear about it.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

driver_dude said:


> _We don't need the government looking at the Uber data and we don't need the government telling us who we should be giving rides to. We are independent contractors and we don't need private riders data revealed to anyone. The less government interference the better. We just want to do our job and make some money._


Yeah...
Good luck with that dude!
LMAO.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Uber Lawyers Push Back on PUC in Records Case*
*http://m.therecorder.com/module/alm/app/ca.do#!/article/1752322239*

_SACRAMENTO -- Lawyers for Rasier-CA LLC say the company has turned over all the data that state regulators declared was withheld when an administrative law judge last month slapped the Uber Technologies Inc. subsidiary with $7.3 million in fines and threatened to pull its license to operate in California.

But that doesn't mean the ride-hailing service is dropping its fight against a Public Utilities Commission judge's July 15 order that found Rasier in contempt for failing to produce required documents. Rasier on Friday filed a 74-page appeal "to correct factual and legal errors, to protect its due process rights, and to address the penalties imposed," according to the filing signed by Davis Wright Tremaine partner Robert Maguire.

The judge's order "failed to take into account the substantial amounts of data already provided by Uber as well as the fact that these requests go well beyond the authority of the commission and will not improve public safety," Uber spokeswoman Eva Behrend said in an email.

Administrative Law Judge Robert Mason III will now review the appeal and decide whether to make any changes to his original order. The matter will then go before the full commission.

Last month, Mason found that Rasier had failed to submit a host of required information required under terms of its permit, including data that would indicate how well it served certain neighborhoods and how it responded to requests for rides from the disabled. Mason concluded that while Rasier argued that certain data weren't available or were beyond the PUC's authority to demand, the company had provided the same information to regulators in other states. What's more, Mason wrote, other ride-hailing companies licensed by the commission supplied the same data for their own operations.

In Rasier's appeal, Maguire wrote that the company had offered to show regulators its rides-by-zip-code data at a "neutral third-party site." Rasier also offered to pay for an auditor, chosen by the PUC, to sift through the numbers, so long as the company could retain custody of its documents, according to the appeal.

"Rasier-CA was seeking to balance the Commission's need to analyze the data with its needs to maintain the confidentiality of its trade secrets," Maguire wrote. There was no "discovery dump," of paperwork, he continued, just aggregate trip information that was intended to be easier for PUC regulators to interpret.

As for what information Uber supplied to other regulatory agencies, the cities of Boston and New York didn't require the same level of detail that California's PUC was seeking, the appeal said. The filing contends Mason tried to improperly pierce the corporate veil between Rasier and Uber in determining the correct level of sanctions. And the ultimate seven-figure fine is "disproportionate, unreasonable and contrary to due process," especially given that Lyft Inc. and the PUC settled a similar document dispute for $30,000.

Rasier "should not be sanctioned for raising legitimate concerns and honest legal arguments, even if the [judge] did not ultimately agree with those arguments, and it certainly should not be fined an amount 240 times greater than Lyft," Maguire said._


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Uber Blows a Gasket*

*







*
*"Maybe it's surge pricing."*


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Incredibly arrogant response. Maybe they should have turned in the paperwork and asked to settle for 30 grand.


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

I believe Lyft settled, theres a difference between settlement (Lyft) and fine (Uber).


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## arto71 (Sep 20, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> In Rasier's appeal, Maguire wrote that the company had offered to show regulators its rides-by-zip-code data at a "neutral third-party site."


By zip-code rides or wheelchair accessible vehicle are not major issue yet,it will eventually ,how is it ppl at CPUC can't or don't want to see 
why uber doesn't want to turn data over.
One of the condition on its agreement with CPUC is,vehicle on uber platform can't be used someone else other then owner of the vehicle .
http://www.cpuc.ca.gov/NR/rdonlyres/E3470797-2DCB-463F-B898-E5F2697850BE/0/RaiserCALLCPermit.pdf


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## Ca$h4 (Aug 12, 2015)

New York City has yellow and green taxis that are WAV (wheel chair accessible). They all have meters and top lights. Do they violate item 10 if they do WAV pick-ups?


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## Ca$h4 (Aug 12, 2015)

Item 9 not item 10.


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## stuber (Jun 30, 2014)

UberRidiculous said:


> Moron isn't the right word. They've made a lot of money. If he loses all the money when the game is over & TravisK has just another taxi co., or he bails & sells to Google or whatever, if he loses all the money, then we'll use the word moron. Even tho I don't like how TravisK plays the game, no one can deny him the fact that he's winning. My bet is he has several exit plans in place, none of which leave him with less than a billion.


Rich doesn't require being smart. There's lots of ways to get rich if you don't have any scruples. Bernie Madoff was a "smart" guy too.


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## driver_dude (Aug 7, 2015)

#responseuber said:


> My brain is just broken...


Better call the medical doctor. LoL!

GooberX wrote:

"Quoting your own posts is a sign of serious mental issues."


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## driver_dude (Aug 7, 2015)

I'm opposed to almost all government price-fixing. It would be better to let the free market decide what people are willing to pay for a ride. That would be better for everyone, passengers and drivers.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

driver_dude said:


> I'm opposed to almost all government price-fixing. It would be better to let the free market decide what people are willing to pay for a ride. That would be better for everyone, passengers and drivers.


That might have been - in the last century, before the gap between the wealthy and everyone else became the Grand Canyon. Now, with so many for whom 'money is no object' and so many who can't afford basic housing, food and services, an unregulated free market would not mean 'what people are willing to pay' - it would mean only those who could afford to pay. That's not a path to a sustainable society... as history has shown, repeatedly.


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## driver_dude (Aug 7, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> That might have been - in the last century, before the gap between the wealthy and everyone else became the Grand Canyon. Now, with so many for whom 'money is no object' and so many who can't afford basic housing, food and services, an unregulated free market would not mean 'ehat people are willing to pay' - it would mean only those who could afford to pay. That's not a path to a sustainable society... as history has shown, repeatedly.


The path to success in any business is a free market without a lot of trade restrictions. For the record, I am opposed to the city council fixing the price for ground transportation for hire. It is arbitrary - the free market should set the price for ride fares.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wealth_of_Nations


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Michael - Cleveland please stop replying to driver_dude's non sequiturs. This is the troll who wants the City of Austin to subsidise his Uber earnings!


driver_dude said:


> Now we Ubers and Lyft drivers are trying to rescue the people and get them safely home. The city should be paying US - seeing as how they have proved themselves to be incompetent for decades up to and including the present. Go figure.


*https://uberpeople.net/threads/what...documents-and-video.34073/page-14#post-450401*


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

driver_dude said:


> The path to success in any business is a free market without a lot of trade restrictions.


There is truth in that 'the path to success' is much easier when you can steal, manipulate, monopolize and exploit.
Survival of the fittest is biology - not sociology.
We can't claim to be better than other animals on this planet - and then behave just like them.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> Michael - Cleveland please stop replying to driver_dude's non sequiturs. This is the troll who wants the City of Austin to subsidise his Uber earnings!
> *https://uberpeople.net/threads/what...documents-and-video.34073/page-14#post-450401*


Naaa... I'm not fond of labeling someone a troll just because I disagree with them. I think driver_dude is expressing his beliefs - not trolling. I agree with some of his statements, find others intersting. But I enjoy the conversation! Is that a bad thing?


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> I think driver_dude is expressing his beliefs - not trolling. I agree with some of his statements, find others intersting. But I enjoy the conversation! Is that a bad thing?


Knock your self out, bud!
My heads up was based on prior interactions & it is the considered opinion of Austin Forum Members.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> Knock your self out, bud!
> My heads up was based on prior interactions & it is the considered opinion of Austin Forum Members.


I hear ya... and will be happy to disengage if it gets to that.
(I haven't been following the Austin threads)


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## driver_dude (Aug 7, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> Michael - Cleveland please stop replying to driver_dude's non sequiturs. This is the troll who wants the City of Austin to subsidise his Uber earnings!


Just for the record, I think paying the city $450 a year for a permit to drive a few hours on weekends is just outrageous. I am opposed to setting arbitrary fees for ride-sourcing. I am opposed to arbitrary price fixing by local governments. Local vested interests should not be allowed to dictate in a free market society.

The whole Austin system of rules and regulation for driving for hire are obsolete and should be reformed or discarded. It's a Potemkin Village all the way down.


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## driver_dude (Aug 7, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> We can't claim to be better than other animals on this planet - and then behave just like them.


What we need are more jobs and less regulation so we can make some money. It's not complicated.


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## driver_dude (Aug 7, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> I agree with some of his statements, find others intersting - and disagree with his politics entirely...


Free enterprise and a market economy - the base-fare-vortex-of-hell. So, I expect everything to get far more regulated from here on out. If it isn't taxable, it's probably illegal. LoL!


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

driver_dude said:


> What we need are more jobs and less regulation so we can make some money. It's not complicated.


It's only NOT 'complicated' to those who don't to want consider anything or anyone other than themselves.


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## UPModerator (Jul 14, 2014)

This is an important topic. Please stay on topic and do not post personal attacks or engage in confrontational banter.


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## JHawk (Oct 27, 2015)

UberScam said:


> .
> Not as if Travis has actually cared about the drivers doing well. His net worth now is around 5.3-billion dollars. In the same breath, bringing up how Uber is operating 537-millions dollars in the red. How does that work?


Statements about these tech startup founders/CEO's and their net worth always make me shake my head, especially with a company like Uber that's still private. Maybe I'm becoming a grumpy-old-man already but in my book, you're only worth $xxx if you can actually easily liquidate $xxx whenever needed. Guys like Travis have all their "net worth" tied to the value of their company's stock which they control....and in the case of Uber, that's not a liquid asset. In fact there have been a couple of stories of investors who wanted to cash out, and Travis actually said "the only way you can sell your stock is to sell it at a lower price/valuation than what you paid." So in other words....if Travis wanted out tomorrow...by his own policy, he wouldn't be able to cash out at the current $62B valuation or whatever they're currently claiming. I'm sure he's not hurting for money...but when people's egos and opinions of them are influenced by things like net worth, it never hurts to take them down a notch with a dose of reality.

Mark Zuckerberg has a net worth of about $40billion....but his wealth is tied to Facebook which is publicly traded....in theory, he could liquidate his position with the touch of a button and actually realize that worth (technically probably less because due to market forces, once he started selling off such a large position the price he'd get would dramatically decrease) ...but for privately held guys like Travis...it's not that easy. I guess I've just always had more respect for people who have net worth with real liquidity...or in other words, if they needed to....they could write a check for a $100m and not blink an eye at it.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Uber Told to Pay $7.6 Million Fine for Dragging Feet on Data*
*http://m.therecorder.com/module/alm...ditorial&bu=The+Recorder#!/article/1758399323*

SACRAMENTO - California's utility regulators on Thursday fined Uber Technologies Inc. subsidiary Rasier-CA LLC $7.6 million for failing to submit operations records on time last year.

Without comment, the Public Utilities Commission (PUC) unanimously upheld an administrative law judge's July 2015decision to slap Rasier-operator of UberX-with $7.3 million in penalties for withholding data, including documentation about safety-related incidents and service to disabled passengers. The commission tacked on another $300,000 for the company's 28-day delay in complying with a final order demanding the records.

Uber must pay the fine within 30 days or the commission will suspend its operating license in California.

An Uber spokeswoman said the company will pay the $7.6 million to ensure ride-hailing operations continue. But the fight isn't over.

"While we are disappointed with the decision, we look forward to making our case to the California Courts of [Appeal]," said Eva Behrend.

No shrinking violet when it comes to challenging regulators, Uber initially complained last year that the data sought by the PUC weren't available or, if submitted, would risk passengers' privacy. After the judge issued his order, the company began supplying records to the PUC but still insisted in its appeal to the commission that the fine was excessive, especially in light of a $30,000 settlement competitor Lyft Inc. reached with state regulators over a similar document dispute.

Uber was represented by Davis Wright Tremaine in the PUC proceedings.

_Contact the reporter at [email protected]._


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

VERY nice to see this thread reactivated!


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