# Stopping trips into NYC



## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

Here’s the scenario:

I drive with LYFT with a NJ license 

I am not allowed to pick up in NYC because I don’t have a “for hire” license issued by the T&LC

Yesterday, a ride took me to NYC during rush hour on a Friday night. I dropped off my rider at 4:40 and it took me two full hours to get back to NJ to where I’m allowed to drive and earn. 

Two hours of wasted time and gas for which I will see no income. The base fare was $25. That $20 fee for all trips ending in NY gave me another 7 after tolls. So 32 bucks for one ride that took, in essence, 3 hours. 

Surely there has to be a way to request I not be sent to NYC if I’m not allowed to work there. 

Per usual, messages to support aren’t helping.


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## Watup (Jan 24, 2017)

How about canceling ride after you see they are going to NY and then calling CS to let them know why you cancelled so they can adjust your cancelation percentage. Take a screen shot of ordinance about you can't pick up from NY and send it to lyft every time you cancel due ti thus reason .


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

How can I see where I’m going before I pick up the passenger?


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## Drastic (Dec 25, 2017)

You cannot see where the ride is to until you arrived to the customer pickup location. Watup is saying you have to cancel after you arrived and seen that the trip is to NYC. On Lyft line, you can see where 2nd & 3rd rider is going b4 pickup


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

Drastic said:


> You cannot see where the ride is to until you arrived to the customer pickup location. Watup is saying you have to cancel after you arrived and seen that the trip is to NYC. On Lyft line, you can see where 2nd & 3rd rider is going b4 pickup


Great. So I'm canceling them as they're climbing in my car?


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## Friendly Jack (Nov 17, 2015)

Erika G. said:


> Great. So I'm canceling them as they're climbing in my car?


Not if you keep your doors locked!


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## Drastic (Dec 25, 2017)

Erika G. said:


> Great. So I'm canceling them as they're climbing in my car?


Your call but it comes with the territory.


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## delaynomore (Jan 29, 2018)

sometimes you maybe able to get a rematch ride from nyc going back to nj.


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

delaynomore said:


> sometimes you maybe able to get a rematch ride from nyc going back to nj.


How? I cannot pick up in NYC. I don't have the TLC license.


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## delaynomore (Jan 29, 2018)

if uber sends it then you taketh.



Erika G. said:


> How? I cannot pick up in NYC. I don't have the TLC license.


i meant lyft.


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## Garbage Plate (Aug 13, 2017)

When you see you're going to NYC, and it's not going to be worth it, ask your rider for cash upfront to cover your dead mile costs. $20, $40 whatever you think is fair. They don't accept cancel and move on.


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## delaynomore (Jan 29, 2018)

Garbage Plate said:


> When you see you're going to NYC, and it's not going to be worth it, ask your rider for cash upfront to cover your dead mile costs. $20, $40 whatever you think is fair. They don't accept cancel and move on.


its illegal to ask for cash. risk a whole lot for a little.


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

delaynomore said:


> if uber sends it then you taketh.
> 
> i meant lyft.


My app blacks out. Rides don't even pop up until I'm back in NJ.


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## delaynomore (Jan 29, 2018)

Erika G. said:


> My app blacks out. Rides don't even pop up until I'm back in NJ.


oh ok. nevermind.


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## Garbage Plate (Aug 13, 2017)

delaynomore said:


> its illegal to ask for cash. risk a whole lot for a little.


How can it be illegal to ask for cash? And I'm pretty sure asking to be paid for dead miles is acceptable to Uber and Lyft TOS. Can anyone confirm that?


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

delaynomore said:


> its illegal to ask for cash. risk a whole lot for a little.


Yeah. I won't be doing that


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## Garbage Plate (Aug 13, 2017)

You can probably use square reader (not sure of what it's called) to accept a credit card payment on your phone as well for dead miles.


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## delaynomore (Jan 29, 2018)

Garbage Plate said:


> How can it be illegal to ask for cash? And I'm pretty sure asking to be paid for dead miles is acceptable to Uber and Lyft TOS. Can anyone confirm that?


this is from lyft support, the app is designed to avoid cash exchanges, and passengers are required to enter a credit card before requesting a ride. Keeping the platform cash-free (except for tips) is ultimately safer and easier for both passengers and drivers. Requesting or accepting cash in exchange for a ride on the Lyft platform is a violation of our Terms of Service.

If we receive any report of this nature may result in further actions being taken against your account. Rest assured that every ride is calculated to be paid correctly if you think that the ride is not being paid correctly, please let us know to review the ride in question.



Erika G. said:


> Yeah. I won't be doing that


This is from lyft support.

The app is designed to avoid cash exchanges, and passengers are required to enter a credit card before requesting a ride. Keeping the platform cash-free (except for tips) is ultimately safer and easier for both passengers and drivers. Requesting or accepting cash in exchange for a ride on the Lyft platform is a violation of our Terms of Service.

If we receive any report of this nature may result in further actions being taken against your account. Rest assured that every ride is calculated to be paid correctly if you think that the ride is not being paid correctly, please let us know to review the ride in question.


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

I think I’m just going to start using this. I have it saved as a text shortcut:

Hello, this is your driver. I have been informed that your trip is classified as longer than 45 minutes. I would love to help your reach your destination. That said, at this time I cannot drive into any NYC borough. Per the NYC TLC laws, I am not allowed to pick up fares in NYC thereby preventing me from earning money once I drop you off. The return time at this hour of the day would be in excess of 1 hour. Please cancel this ride at no cost to you and allow another driver the chance to help you out today. Thank you in advance for your understanding.


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## Garbage Plate (Aug 13, 2017)

delaynomore said:


> this is from lyft support, the app is designed to avoid cash exchanges, and passengers are required to enter a credit card before requesting a ride. Keeping the platform cash-free (except for tips) is ultimately safer and easier for both passengers and drivers. Requesting or accepting cash in exchange for a ride on the Lyft platform is a violation of our Terms of Service.
> 
> If we receive any report of this nature may result in further actions being taken against your account. Rest assured that every ride is calculated to be paid correctly if you think that the ride is not being paid correctly, please let us know to review the ride in question.
> 
> ...


Looks like it's not illegal to take cash, but it does look like you would be violating Lyft's TOS. Guess I won't be taking my own advice about taking cash for dead miles. Thank you for the info.


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## Drastic (Dec 25, 2017)

Erika G. said:


> I think I'm just going to start using this. I have it saved as a text shortcut:
> 
> Hello, this is your driver. I have been informed that your trip is classified as longer than 45 minutes. I would love to help your reach your destination. That said, at this time I cannot drive into any NYC borough. Per the NYC TLC laws, I am not allowed to pick up fares in NYC thereby preventing me from earning money once I drop you off. The return time at this hour of the day would be in excess of 1 hour. Please cancel this ride at no cost to you and allow another driver the chance to help you out today. Thank you in advance for your understanding.


Sounds great but Pax arent going for that shit. A few my report you.


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

Drastic said:


> Sounds great but Pax arent going for that shit. A few my report you.


That's a risk I'll take. I've got strings of emails back and forth with Lyft about not wanting to be sent to nyc if I can't work there. Unless they're going to pay me for sitting in Hellish return traffic it ain't happening.


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## Drastic (Dec 25, 2017)

All my money is in Manhattan. I dead head everywhere. (Except Greenpoint-Williamsburg BK). Any Pax going to the BX, QNS, BK, I make the drop & I shut the App down and hustle my way back to Manhattan and power up App. Avoid Williamsburg Bridge coming into Manhattan at all cost, FYI, ahahah.


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

Except I can’t get rides in NYC. No TLC license. That’s my issue. Don’t send me to a region where I can’t earn. After 4pm there’s no such thing as hustling back to NJ.


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## Watup (Jan 24, 2017)

Erika G. said:


> How can I see where I'm going before I pick up the passenger?


Hit arrived about block bfr you reach the destination and see where the pax going , of NY then cancel.


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## Hagong (Jan 17, 2017)

Erika G. said:


> I think I'm just going to start using this. I have it saved as a text shortcut:
> 
> Hello, this is your driver. I have been informed that your trip is classified as longer than 45 minutes. I would love to help your reach your destination. That said, at this time I cannot drive into any NYC borough. Per the NYC TLC laws, I am not allowed to pick up fares in NYC thereby preventing me from earning money once I drop you off. The return time at this hour of the day would be in excess of 1 hour. Please cancel this ride at no cost to you and allow another driver the chance to help you out today. Thank you in advance for your understanding.


Your text message is too long. Just keep it short.
Say something like "I'm only accepting trips within NJ. If your destination is in NYC, please cancel. You won't be charged."
Pax don't care that you won't be making any money on the return trip.


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

Hagong said:


> Your text message is too long. Just keep it short.
> Say something like "I'm only accepting trips within NJ. If your destination is in NYC, please cancel. You won't be charged."
> Pax don't care that you won't be making any money on the return trip.


I don't care that they don't care. I care about communicating in a way that shows I'm not discriminating about the location for any other reason than not being allowed to work where I'm being sent.


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## NJAudiDriver (Oct 16, 2017)

Erika, it's actually against state regulations to deny a ride based on the destination. In other words, it's against the law. I am in the same boat you are. The best thing to do is to ask before confirming the trip. Calling and or texting that messsge will most likely get you deactivated especially if you do it over and over. I do not recommend this. If the person is going into the city be polite and say that you cannot be outside the state for whatever reason. Doctors appointment, sick aunt, whatever. Make it personable and don't communicate your unwillingness through the app.


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

NJAudiDriver said:


> Erika, it's actually against state regulations to deny a ride based on the destination. But I am in the same boat you are. The best thing to do is to ask before confirming the trip. Calling and or texting that messsge will most likely get you deactivated especially if you do it over and over. I do not recommend this. If the person is going into the city be polite and say that you cannot be outside the state for whatever reason. Doctors appointment, sick aunt, whatever. Make it personable and don't communicate your unwillingness through the app.


That's helpful. Thank you. I really don't mind NYC but during rush hour and having to dead head so long going back? It's not worth it.


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## NJAudiDriver (Oct 16, 2017)

Yeah I know. It sucks big time. My last trip to JFK took me almost 3 hours to get back to Jersey. Pretty brutal.


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

NJAudiDriver said:


> Yeah I know. It sucks big time. My last trip to JFK took me almost 3 hours to get back to Jersey. Pretty brutal.


That's definitely the word: brutal


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## Cigars (Dec 8, 2016)

Erika G. said:


> That's helpful. Thank you. I really don't mind NYC but during rush hour and having to dead head so long going back? It's not worth it.


Just throw them out of your car.
The better info regarding NYC trips is the NJ forum.
I take NYC trips but only at surge or shore rate and only during off hours of low traffic.

One key is to go through Staten Island for East side trips.
Get paid for the Verrazano and then take the tunnel out.

NYC base rate is a "get out of my car" moment.
I have even thrown shore rate out of my car at rush hour.

Each customer you take needs to be profitable. If its not throw them out of your car.
LGA is worse than Manhattan.
JFK can be useful if it is off hour.

I have heard stories of pax denied five times straight from 5 different drivers trying to get to JFK before they found a sucker like you who would not do what has to be done and throw them out of your car.


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## Goduckies (Mar 23, 2017)

You can cancel via time... Not destination. Tell them you need to be home to pick up cooknetc for your real or imaginary kid.


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

Cigars said:


> Just throw them out of your car.
> The better info regarding NYC trips is the NJ forum.
> I take NYC trips but only at surge or shore rate and only during off hours of low traffic.
> 
> ...


I wasn't going to JFK but thanks.


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## LEO2112 (Jul 23, 2016)

Since 99% of the 45+ minute rides that pop up on my screen are NYC trips, I just won't accept them unless there is a minimum 2.0x surge. Never go into the city unless there is some type of surge or primetime attached. As long as there is, you won't have to worry about cancelling. Everyone has their own minimum threshold for surge/PT so take what you feel would be worth it to you to take the trip.


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## Julescase (Mar 29, 2017)

delaynomore said:


> its illegal to ask for cash. risk a whole lot for a little.


Not illegal at all, in fact Uber's TOS specifically states that drivers can negotiate a "return fee" for miles going back after a long trip out of one's earning zone.

We're absolutely allowed to request money from pax.


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

Julescase said:


> Not illegal at all, in fact Uber's TOS specifically states that drivers can negotiate a "return fee" for miles going back after a long trip out of one's earning zone.
> 
> We're absolutely allowed to request money from pax.


Where you do you see that in the TOS?


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## freeFromUber (Mar 1, 2016)

Erika G. said:


> I don't care that they don't care. I care about communicating in a way that shows I'm not discriminating about the location for any other reason than not being allowed to work where I'm being sent.


You should never send them a text message like that.....someone will forward it to Lyft, and you are done. If you think it might be a long trip to NY, due to the long trip notification, call them and say you have to pick up your kid or something, if you find out NY is their destination. If you don't want to call, ask them their destination before they get in you car, if it's NY, give them an excuse and more on.


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## Julescase (Mar 29, 2017)

Erika G. said:


> Where you do you see that in the TOS?


Someone posted it on another thread recently - I'll try to find it and post it here.


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## Phantomshark (Jan 21, 2018)

If you call or text a pax and they cancel, it triggers a red flag on Lyft’s end. If it happens multiple times they will deactivate


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## Julescase (Mar 29, 2017)

Erika G. said:


> Where you do you see that in the TOS?


Here you go- this is from the recent thread entitled "What has been your favorite "Surprises long ride"? - Pawtism negotiates a return fee for dead miles OR texts pax an agreement for them to allow him to keep the meter running until he returns to his general market. Links and the TOS quotes are included:



Pawtism said:


> I just show them this Uber link (which used to be worded better, but still conveys the info), and the one where I can refuse long distance rides (both links below) and then text them something to the effect of "per our conversation I agree to take you on a long distance ride to (insert destination here) and you agree to leave the ride going until I return to my home market of (market) at which point I will end the ride. Do you agree?" If yes, they go for a ride, if no, cancel and move on.
> 
> Why everyone doesn't do this, I'll never understand. Work smarter, not harder. Maybe it's the "law dog" in me (pardon the pun), but I actually go through and read the policies, terms, etc.
> 
> ...


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

Julescase said:


> Here you go- this is from the recent thread entitled "What has been your favorite "Surprises long ride"? - Pawtism negotiates a return fee for dead miles OR texts pax an agreement for them to allow him to keep the meter running until he returns to his general market. Links and the TOS quotes are included:


Yeah, that's not what that means. It doesn't give the driver authority to accept cash. Having the rider to agree to keep the trip running is one thing, negotiating a return fee is quite another.


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## Pawtism (Aug 22, 2017)

Make sure to get them to agree through the uber relay text though. It would be easy for them to say that you made it up and they didn't agree to it later. That text (and your dash cam, but getting Uber to look at dash cam can be challenging to say the least) will be your only proof. The pax know this as well, and if they texted it, they are far less likely to try to pull a "I didn't agree to that!" stunt on you.



Erika G. said:


> Yeah, that's not what that means. It doesn't give the driver authority to accept cash. Having the rider to agree to keep the trip running is one thing, negotiating a return fee is quite another.


Well, it doesn't say you can't get those fees in cash (a venue entrance fee would be near impossible to add in the app directly, that would almost certainly have to be cash). It's silent on how you can collect them (I suspect Uber doesn't care because they can't claim a cut of them anyway). You could take bearer bonds for it, if you're willing. 

Personally, I've just left the meter running (it's easier, and I'm still covered by their insurance for return trip), but if you can negotiate an upfront tip to cover it, you should be good. The only time you're definitely going to have an issue is if you get them to cover part of the ride that uber normally could claim (the actual drop off). Something like "if you give me X amount, I'll end the ride right now and just take you for the cash"... That's going to get you deactivated every time.

You could negotiate a cash tip ahead of time for just about any service (that was otherwise legal hehe). Guy wants you to drop off his suit to the dry cleaners for example (some liability there, so I don't know that I would, but you see my point). I mean it's up to you, if you don't want those rides, don't take those rides hehe. We're just proposing a way you could make them work for you, if you wished.


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## Wh4tev3r!!!! (Jul 21, 2017)

delaynomore said:


> sometimes you maybe able to get a rematch ride from nyc going back to nj.


This is NOT TRUE. You will never be rematched back to New Jersey. Lots of sting operations set up to lure you into taking a passenger back to NJ but it will be a set up and you will get ticketed.


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## Phantomshark (Jan 21, 2018)

You can accept cash. You cannot ask for cash. So if you try and negotiate a ‘leave the meter running’ deal and they say ‘here’s $20 instead’ you are fine. Just make sure you have the exchange on dash cam in case pax decides to lie.


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## UberLaLa (Sep 6, 2015)

What I would add to this is, have passenger agree that they will change destination in their app (after getting them to their's) to closest point inside NJ.


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## polar2017 (Jul 1, 2017)

Just hit arrived on the lyft app 100 feet from pick location. See the destination in the app. If you dont like it cancel.
I refuse all nyc, long island trips with lyft.
Uber has me on their non ny state ping list.


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## NJAudiDriver (Oct 16, 2017)

polar2017 said:


> Just hit arrived on the lyft app 100 feet from pick location. See the destination in the app. If you dont like it cancel.
> I refuse all nyc, long island trips with lyft.
> Uber has me on their non ny state ping list.


There is no such thing as a non NYC list. Whoever told you this lied to you. They lied to me about it too.


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## unitxero (Jul 10, 2016)

People have already said it, but here is what yellow cab drivers, and NYC uber drivers do when someone wants to go to NJ and its not EWR. "Sorry, I'm not going to NJ" followed by pressing cancel on your end, and taking your 1 star rating and moving on. 

You got to stand firm when doing this to pax, don't offer any elaborate explanation, just say I'm not going to NYC I work in NJ. Cancel the ride on your end, take your 1 star.


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## Dropking (Aug 18, 2017)

Erika, this thread is much better with your pic included now. 

Your scenario is a no win situation for drivers. If pax complain that you refused their destination, this is a recent red flag for deactivation. You will get an email warning the first offense. I don't recommend your email idea as this is smoking gun evidence.

Once arriving, your best bet at this point in time until uber learns their stupid ways is to cancel the trip but make an excuse that has nothing to do with destination. Hubby called. Flat tire. Gotta pee break. 

You CAN learn destination ahead of arrival by calling pax. I learn when I call to "confirm your pickup location". Then you are free to get stuck in traffic forever, flat out cancel with risks, or do the drive.


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## freeFromUber (Mar 1, 2016)

UberLaLa said:


> What I would add to this is, have passenger agree that they will change destination in their app (after getting them to their's) to closest point inside NJ.


And what's to keep them from cancelling 30 seconds after they get out of the car?


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## UberLaLa (Sep 6, 2015)

freeFromUber said:


> And what's to keep them from cancelling 30 seconds after they get out of the car?


Nothing...that's why y0u have them agree via text or dash cam to return trip, and I add have them change final destination to closest NJ point. Personally, I don't have this problem...live in L.A. - just a thought.


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## easteuropeboy (Apr 9, 2016)

Dropking said:


> Erika, this thread is much better with your pic included now.
> 
> Your scenario is a no win situation for drivers. If pax complain that you refused their destination, this is a recent red flag for deactivation. You will get an email warning the first offense. I don't recommend your email idea as this is smoking gun evidence.
> 
> ...


Yes she looks hot on pic


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## Freshout75 (Feb 20, 2018)

Erika G. said:


> Yeah, that's not what that means. It doesn't give the driver authority to accept cash. Having the rider to agree to keep the trip running is one thing, negotiating a return fee is quite another.


Same thing as a cash tip.


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## Cigars (Dec 8, 2016)

unitxero said:


> People have already said it, but here is what yellow cab drivers, and NYC uber drivers do when someone wants to go to NJ and its not EWR. "Sorry, I'm not going to NJ" followed by pressing cancel on your end, and taking your 1 star rating and moving on.
> 
> You got to stand firm when doing this to pax, don't offer any elaborate explanation, just say I'm not going to NYC I work in NJ. Cancel the ride on your end, take your 1 star.


The difference is that TLC drivers are allowed to deny non-EWR NJ trips.
In NJ its the law that a rideshare driver cannot deny a pax based on destination.
The law in NY was written by NYC lawmakers (protecting TLC income). 
The law in NJ was written by Uber and handed to NJ lawmakers to pass with political donations.

The NYC TLC can pick up in NJ and bring back to NY.
The NJ driver deadheads back to NJ.
The NJ driver gets paid a lot less than the NYC ride per mile.
Lyft will also screw every NJ driver on the toll. And when Lyft finally concedes tolls, they pay NY EZpass rates for NY bridges while NJ EZPass holders pay the higher cash rates. Lyft also fails in sorting NYC rides to NYC drivers at Newark and elsewhere in NJ.

Uber has created a situation where the NJ driver loses money by going to NYC (even the ones with beat up jalopies).
Then Uber wrote a law and had NJ pass that law that forces the NJ driver to accept.
Then when in NYC, NYC TLC launches sting operations that target NJ Ubers.

The only thing worse for a NJ Uber to NYC is a Lyft to NYC.


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## Dr. Jim Sadler (Dec 13, 2016)

Erika G. said:


> That's a risk I'll take. I've got strings of emails back and forth with Lyft about not wanting to be sent to nyc if I can't work there. Unless they're going to pay me for sitting in Hellish return traffic it ain't happening.


Not long ago, I asked Lyft to blackout VSU (Virginia State University) for all pickups. Trust and Safety responded, along the lines of: "Thanks for your concern... If we blackout VSU from your pickups that would kill your earnings... We hope you understand... Thank you for your understanding."

Bear in mind, I had two or theee rides from hell from VSU. Two safety incidents reported on my behalf.


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## Adieu (Feb 21, 2016)

Erika G. said:


> I think I'm just going to start using this. I have it saved as a text shortcut:
> 
> Hello, this is your driver. I have been informed that your trip is classified as longer than 45 minutes. I would love to help your reach your destination. That said, at this time I cannot drive into any NYC borough. Per the NYC TLC laws, I am not allowed to pick up fares in NYC thereby preventing me from earning money once I drop you off. The return time at this hour of the day would be in excess of 1 hour. Please cancel this ride at no cost to you and allow another driver the chance to help you out today. Thank you in advance for your understanding.


Tmi dont tell em that

Just "Hi this your driver. Fyi, I don't have NYC-required commercial licensing and cannot operate in NYC. If trip to NYC, please reorder, otherwise disregard. Thx."

Do NOT say cancel their st00pid data miner tracks the word and will try to deactivate you for it eventually.

PS alas 45+ only shows on base rate calls....then again, enough PT% and it'll be a lot more palatable


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

Any way to close this? I’ve already come to a decision based on some valid and constructive advice here. 

No reason to beat this dead horse. 

Thanks to everyone who contributed


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## Adieu (Feb 21, 2016)

Phantomshark said:


> If you call or text a pax and they cancel, it triggers a red flag on Lyft's end. If it happens multiple times they will deactivate


You people need to go on the Los Angeles or San Fran forum to get a real feel of just how much calling it takes to even start getting nag screens, much less straight up fired.

Hint: a looooooooot

The ONLY thing lyft will quickly shut you down for is cancel no-chargeing...

If you arrive it anf it's an NY trip you need to dodge, your safest plays are to hide and noshow WITH CHARGE (yes bizarrely THAT doesnt get you in trouble, it's the NOT charging they think is suspect) or to go dark escape and wait for cancel


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## unitxero (Jul 10, 2016)

Erika G. said:


> Any way to close this? I've already come to a decision based on some valid and constructive advice here.
> 
> No reason to beat this dead horse.
> 
> Thanks to everyone who contributed


The thread will remain open for others, in case they have follow up questions. You can unwatch the thread so you don't get any more notifications. That button is located on the top of the screen.


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## Erika G. (Mar 10, 2018)

unitxero said:


> The thread will remain open for others, in case they have follow up questions. You can unwatch the thread so you don't get any more notifications. That button is located on the top of the screen.


Thanks.


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