# Acceptance Rate - What is Low?



## Papa Sarducci (Jun 20, 2016)

So what would be considered a low acceptance rate? 60%, 50%, 40%, even less?


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

In this market, Uber Taxi wants a sixty-five per-cent acceptance rate.

UberX/Uber Pool seems to vary between eighty and ninety per-cent.

So, I guess that anything less than the above figures would be low.

I think that Lyft wants eighty-five per-cent.


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## UberTrip (May 3, 2016)

Papa Sarducci said:


> So what would be considered a low acceptance rate? 60%, 50%, 40%, even less?


More important, why do you care. Don't take non profitable fares. Unless you are going for guarantees most drivers don't give a damn


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## ptuberx (Jun 28, 2016)

UberTrip said:


> More important, why do you care. Don't take non profitable fares. Unless you are going for guarantees most drivers don't give a damn


Well that would be a lot easier to do if we could "profile" the same way that the user/pax can. We don't know what they look like before we get there (for instance, a request from "Jessica," and when you arrive it turns out that it's a guy standing there saying "oh, my girlfriend ordered the ride for me." And more importantly, we don't know what their destination is until we get there, or unless you call them right after accepting the ping and ask (which I have not done). Or better yet, pings that come in for a typical name, let's say "Jason," then you show up and there are four high schoolers waiting for you.

The only other things that we have at our disposal are seeing how far away the pickup location is from us from the ping, the address, and the user rating. I shy away from users below 4.70, which I don't get often to begin with. A solid even number like a 4.60 could be iffy though: It could be a newer rider who had nine 5-star ratings, but was given just one 1-star rating from a disgruntled driver that either felt he/she deserved a tip and didn't get it, or felt like that particular pax may have been "the one" that gave them a 1-star rating as a driver, and went back and changed the pax rating to the same. I've read enough "feelings" on here from drivers to know that it happens. Now, if I see a more mathematically specific number, like a 4.42, I second-guess hitting the ping. A more calculated number like this tells me that the pax has had multiple trips and has had a lot of drivers give something less than 5 stars for a longer period of time. The same goes the other way: I see a lot of 5.0 ratings in pings: It could be a rider who just started Uber, got a 5-star on their last/first trip, and now this is their second. And the second trip may be unpleasant for the next driver... Or, a 5.0 could mean than it is a very pleasant passenger who always tips well. A passenger with a high rating with an odd number in the hundredth position, like "4.93" or "4.96" is usually a sure bet to take.

As far as acceptance rating as a driver, I have found an obvious pattern in the system. Yes, the system weighs heavily on two obvious criteria: 1. Who is available? And then the default after that is 2. Who is closest to the pax? BUT, I know that there is an algorithm in the system that also looks at recent driver ratings and acceptance ratings. For example, the other night I was in an outlying suburb (Johnston, IA) that fewer drivers tend to go to, even though it is a well-to-do suburb, many drivers in my area feel that it is "out of their way" from downtown Des Moines. I got the ping as an overlap before I dropped my current pax off in Johnston. The ping estimated 18 minutes / 13 miles out from downtown Des Moines. No surge. Between myself and downtown, there had to be hundreds of drivers closer in that radius. It turns out, the pax was a first-time user in my case. They had a 12-mile drive to their destination, took me about 16 minutes to drop them off, and extended me a $10 tip at their drop-off. The point here is, I know very well that at the time (evening, not too late) there were tons of new drivers around downtown who have over-saturated the market there.

I believe it is acceptance rating that determined some of this. The lowest I have seen mine go after a month of doing this is 96%. Two weeks ago it was 98%. Last week it was 99%. Today I drove for 7 hours and accepted 100%. I received an email from Uber CS last week praising me on my high numbers. The last three weeks I tend to work about 5 days a week, mostly Wednesday through Sunday, and I average about 113 trips. Last week was a bit high: Friday and Saturday alone I made 60 trips. Saturday I pulled in 30 trips, plus 2 cancellations by me after 5 minutes after arrival (legit no-shows), plus 2 cancellations from riders who cancelled after 5 minutes after I accepted their ping. Half were on a surge. So 34 paid "trips" so-to-speak on Saturday, plus $63 in cash tips netted me (after my last recalculation) $275 for the day, minus one tank of gas, and one bottle of water that I gave to an unappreciative passenger.

The upside to working "primetime" in the late afternoon through the evening and accepting every ride? $$$. The downside? Unpredictable behavior from those who had too much to drink after midnight, and there seems to always be one late-night passenger that kills your rating. In just under a month (my first week I only did it for two days), I have made 379 trips. 279 rated me, and 244 have given 5 stars. I watch my rating closely. I know that most were 5, and the remaining were 4's. You can tell when you get a "1" though, because it slams your rating quick. I dropped from a 4.78 to a 4.71 overnight just over a week ago. I've climbed back up to a 4.78. And I get compliments on how clean my interior is, how fresh it smells, how big the back seat is, how laid-back "chill," and polite I am, etc. But out of every 20+ trips I make, there is always that one pax that just kills your mojo. You just can't make everyone happy.

Bottom line, if you see a pax with a weird rating like a 4.39, look out. If it's a bad part of town, look out. But I am a firm believer that the acceptance rating by drivers runs a lot deeper in their software than some may think. You have to keep in mind the distinctive differences between the user and the partner apps. There are things that we can see and do as drivers that the pax cannot, and there are things that the pax can see that us drivers cannot. At the end of the day, Uber is a business, and they want to make money, therefore they are more forgiving to the passengers because they want their passenger pool to sustain and grow. The drivers are monitored on a stricter level. Done smartly, there are a few things you can do with your driver app to mediate some of this in your favor if you have a pax that created an issue, even after-the-fact if you didn't have the time or realization of what occurred until sometime later (for instance, last pax of the night treated the back of you car like a trash can in the dark, and you didn't find the mess until the next morning, etc).

I still stand behind accepting unless it stands out as bad like I stated, like a "4.43." A number like that suggests history of "less than perfect histories," but also shines light on the fact that the number should probably be lower, but when some drivers drop them off, they are hesitant to give a low rating at drop-off because they don't want the rider to see the downtick in their rating, and fear that the driver will receive a 1-star back in return. It's a system based on a lot of things, and unfortunately sometimes there is no way to "prove" who is right or wrong. Just make the best of it and figure out what works for you in your area.


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## Lando74 (Nov 23, 2014)

I've been running at around 30%. But I drive XL and ignore a lot of X pings. It's worth it, though. I get an XL after ignoring an average of 3-4 X pings.


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## ptuberx (Jun 28, 2016)

Lando74 said:


> I've been running at around 30%. But I drive XL and ignore a lot of X pings. It's worth it, though. I get an XL after ignoring an average of 3-4 X pings.


Uber allows 30%, even on XL, and they haven't rattled your chain? Interesting... maybe because there are so many UberX drivers in DSM and WDSM and not enough XL? It seems like every 4-5 days I have been getting pickups where 5 people want to ride in my car instead of the 4-person max. It happened again today (5), and two nights ago I had 6 that were demanding it would work. Granted I drive a Crown Vic, but I have belts for 4 pax + me. When this first started happening it was a judgment call, and I confirmed that 4 slim ladies could easily fit in my back seat, but after safety/legal consideration I decided that I cannot let pax try to squeeze the system with my car... especially the 6. I had another one two days before with 5, and in both cases I told them they either need to order UberXL instead or split apart and order a second UberX, because I wasn't doing the ride for three reasons. Liability, passenger size, and distance (drop-off in Van Meter). Funny, in the recent case of the 6-passenger debate, half of them were very tall and big people, it looked like NFL players. They tried arguing with me that they could fit... um, no, won't happen. It COULD happen, but I'm not driving down the road with 6 Shaq-sized people sitting on each other's lap. The one time when I did allow it, it was 5 gals heading to a bachelorette party, and between the 5 of them it probably added 600 pounds of extra GVWA to the vehicle, well within limits, but even then I was a little shaky on it. Since then, no more, however they were very polite and courteous regarding the train through downtown holding us up for 15 minutes, it's just a thing that I have quickly become strict on. I want safety first to and avoid liability at this point, especially with so many Pokémon-Go people wandering out into traffic these days.


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## Lando74 (Nov 23, 2014)

ptuberx said:


> Uber allows 30%, even on XL, and they haven't rattled your chain? Interesting... maybe because there are so many UberX drivers in DSM and WDSM and not enough XL? It seems like every 4-5 days I have been getting pickups where 5 people want to ride in my car instead of the 4-person max. It happened again today (5), and two nights ago I had 6 that were demanding it would work. Granted I drive a Crown Vic, but I have belts for 4 pax + me. When this first started happening it was a judgment call, and I confirmed that 4 slim ladies could easily fit in my back seat, but after safety/legal consideration I decided that I cannot let pax try to squeeze the system with my car... especially the 6. I had another one two days before with 5, and in both cases I told them they either need to order UberXL instead or split apart and order a second UberX, because I wasn't doing the ride for three reasons. Liability, passenger size, and distance (drop-off in Van Meter). Funny, in the recent case of the 6-passenger debate, half of them were very tall and big people, it looked like NFL players. They tried arguing with me that they could fit... um, no, won't happen. It COULD happen, but I'm not driving down the road with 6 Shaq-sized people sitting on each other's lap. The one time when I did allow it, it was 5 gals heading to a bachelorette party, and between the 5 of them it probably added 600 pounds of extra GVWA to the vehicle, well within limits, but even then I was a little shaky on it. Since then, no more, however they were very polite and courteous regarding the train through downtown holding us up for 15 minutes, it's just a thing that I have quickly become strict on. I want safety first to and avoid liability at this point, especially with so many Pokémon-Go people wandering out into traffic these days.


I get the texts and emails every week about acceptance rates. Sometimes I'll get a 30 minute penalty box, but mostly it's just noise.

Before I had my XL I had a 2 row SUV and I constantly picked up groups larger than 4 because they were trying to get a cheap deal or couldn't get an XL. It irritated me so much that I couldn't charge the upgrade and I realized I was missing a good chunk of the market so I bought a 3 row in May. Never ceases to amaze me how many people either order XL by accident or just have a preference for it, even if it's just one person.


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## ptuberx (Jun 28, 2016)

Lando74 said:


> I get the texts and emails every week about acceptance rates. Sometimes I'll get a 30 minute penalty box, but mostly it's just noise.
> 
> Before I had my XL I had a 2 row SUV and I constantly picked up groups larger than 4 because they were trying to get a cheap deal or couldn't get an XL. It irritated me so much that I couldn't charge the upgrade and I realized I was missing a good chunk of the market so I bought a 3 row in May. Never ceases to amaze me how many people either order XL by accident or just have a preference for it, even if it's just one person.


Well I guess we're in similar but opposite boats then. I am amazed at how many people order an X and think they can fit 6 people in it. I am curious if the single pax that orders the XL is doing it just because they think it's a nicer ride?


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## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

Wow, what the heck are they putting in the water in Des Moines? You guys are driving for .65 a mile and .15 a minute AND you are letting the cheap pax pull the overcrowding bs? I'm reading all this talk about what you accept and don't accept ratings wise. Complimentary emails from Uber CSR's. Seriously, they are laughing at you for driving this cheaply. You can't possibly be making anything approaching money, why are you driving????? OK, Uber XL is paying almost decently.


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## Bill Collector (Dec 17, 2015)

ptuberx said:


> Well that would be a lot easier to do if we could "profile" the same way that the user/pax can. We don't know what they look like before we get there (for instance, a request from "Jessica," and when you arrive it turns out that it's a guy standing there saying "oh, my girlfriend ordered the ride for me." And more importantly, we don't know what their destination is until we get there, or unless you call them right after accepting the ping and ask (which I have not done). Or better yet, pings that come in for a typical name, let's say "Jason," then you show up and there are four high schoolers waiting for you.
> 
> The only other things that we have at our disposal are seeing how far away the pickup location is from us from the ping, the address, and the user rating. I shy away from users below 4.70, which I don't get often to begin with. A solid even number like a 4.60 could be iffy though: It could be a newer rider who had nine 5-star ratings, but was given just one 1-star rating from a disgruntled driver that either felt he/she deserved a tip and didn't get it, or felt like that particular pax may have been "the one" that gave them a 1-star rating as a driver, and went back and changed the pax rating to the same. I've read enough "feelings" on here from drivers to know that it happens. Now, if I see a more mathematically specific number, like a 4.42, I second-guess hitting the ping. A more calculated number like this tells me that the pax has had multiple trips and has had a lot of drivers give something less than 5 stars for a longer period of time. The same goes the other way: I see a lot of 5.0 ratings in pings: It could be a rider who just started Uber, got a 5-star on their last/first trip, and now this is their second. And the second trip may be unpleasant for the next driver... Or, a 5.0 could mean than it is a very pleasant passenger who always tips well. A passenger with a high rating with an odd number in the hundredth position, like "4.93" or "4.96" is usually a sure bet to take.
> 
> ...


Good analysis but the problem is we have no access to actual formula. Whatever happens inside the black box we can only guess how that works. No transparency. But I do agree about high rated drivers possibly given longer rides. One time I got 200+ miles trip but cancelled it due to deadhead miles for sure.


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## ptuberx (Jun 28, 2016)

Disgusted Driver said:


> Wow, what the heck are they putting in the water in Des Moines? You guys are driving for .65 a mile and .15 a minute AND you are letting the cheap pax pull the overcrowding bs? I'm reading all this talk about what you accept and don't accept ratings wise. Complimentary emails from Uber CSR's. Seriously, they are laughing at you for driving this cheaply. You can't possibly be making anything approaching money, why are you driving????? OK, Uber XL is paying almost decently.


It's somewhat of a futile enterprise, but, don't knock Des Moines too hard. Again, there are strategies to making cash even in a swollen market.










That doesn't include the extra $20 in fares (went offline/online late) and $63 in tips on top of it.

"Disgruntled Driver," I am not sure what your idea of low is, but the water here is just fine. I see a lot of posts here of people complaining about this or that. Sure, $275 won't go as far in NYC, Chicago, or Los Angeles, but in Des Moines, it goes a lot further in one of the nicest cities in the country. I'm not even originally from Des Moines, but I can vouch for a lot of things here that I cannot say certain other markets, some of which pay less than Des Moines does, so I am not sure if I am understanding your point.

Also, keep in mind that under most circumstances, the per minute/mile thing is skewed. Try driving in or within the loop in Chicago during rush hour, it's a nightmare. You can motate 20 times faster through Des Moines usually. Less time equals more $ per minute. We can debate mileage all day long, but if half of your day is spent stuck in traffic, then you are facing other issues that are hurting your bottom line.


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## ptuberx (Jun 28, 2016)

Bill Collector said:


> Good analysis but the problem is we have no access to actual formula. Whatever happens inside the black box we can only guess how that works. No transparency. But I do agree about high rated drivers possibly given longer rides. One time I got 200+ miles trip but cancelled it due to deadhead miles for sure.


A 200 mile trip? Wow, well yes, I would have rejected that too, unless there was a ridiculous surge or tip involved. The way the system is set up, I can't think of any way to recover from heading out 200 miles without some sort of pre-conceived plan to make it back and justify profit. I got bummed the other night after a 54-mile one-way to nowhere. 200... no thanks.


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## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

ptuberx said:


> It's somewhat of a futile enterprise, but, don't knock Des Moines too hard. Again, there are strategies to making cash even in a swollen market.
> 
> View attachment 49859
> 
> ...


$63 in tips, phenomenal. You are very fortunate that people still tip there. Extra $20 cash fares, seriously, unless it's legal in your market, don't do off app fares, it's just not worth it, way too much liability if you get caught.

How many miles did you drive from start to finish to get that $275.? I'm figuring it's got to be around 300 miles minimum including dead miles, probably more. Lets assume .30 a mile for all costs which is pretty reasonable considering you are going to wear your car out doing this. So that leaves you with $185 for 11 hours work or roughly $17 an hour. That's pretty darn good these days. Tips and surge dry up like it has in most other parts of the country and it's a whole different ball game. I only pay 20% for X, we get .80 a mile but we are hard pressed to make that kind of money because there's almost no surge except at 2AM and pax don't tip, might get $10 all night if lucky.


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## ptuberx (Jun 28, 2016)

Disgusted Driver said:


> $63 in tips, phenomenal. You are very fortunate that people still tip there. Extra $20 cash fares, seriously, unless it's legal in your market, don't do off app fares, it's just not worth it, way too much liability if you get caught.
> 
> How many miles did you drive from start to finish to get that $275.? I'm figuring it's got to be around 300 miles minimum including dead miles, probably more. Lets assume .30 a mile for all costs which is pretty reasonable considering you are going to wear your car out doing this. So that leaves you with $185 for 11 hours work or roughly $17 an hour. That's pretty darn good these days. Tips and surge dry up like it has in most other parts of the country and it's a whole different ball game. I only pay 20% for X, we get .80 a mile but we are hard pressed to make that kind of money because there's almost no surge except at 2AM and pax don't tip, might get $10 all night if lucky.


Perhaps I worded myself incorrectly: The $20 I miscalculated in a different thread was for when I went offline to grab a bite to eat. When I went back online, part of my late fares went onto Sunday's total instead of Saturday, even though it was long before 4 AM.

I drove 225 miles that day. Late-night Friday and Saturday I usually average about $33/hr with relatively short trips between 12-3 AM. Of course where I am, there are a few main nightlife areas that are very predictable for this.

I also drive a well-maintained, and clean car. Not only do I get compliments on how clean it is, it was built for abuse, even though it's not necessarily always treated that way. Mileage is at 138k. Comparing it to my previous PI's that I owned, 500k is easily realistic, and much more realistic than your average Kia or other similar Uber cars that I see getting hammered on by college students here. If I happen to hit a pothole, my car lives a lot better over it than these 4-door tin cans that I see driving around at 80 mph on 30 mph streets just trying to chase a surge with no fare on-tap. I assume they will be gone soon once they figure out they are pouring what little they are making right back into their gas tank, or worse.

I do agree that tips suck on late-night fares. I do get them here and there, but it's usually about one out of five pax that will offer. Daytime/afternoon/early evening pax tip much better. One day I got two back-to-back $20 tips, followed by a $10, then a $5, then as the sun went down, it got spotty as usual... $5 here or there, $3 maybe, and then the late night crowd is almost no expectation at all of seeing a tip. When I do get tips from my late fares, it's usually females that do the tipping. Pax of men-only at 2 AM, I don't expect anything except the fact that they requested a trip on a surge and didn't realize it. The only exception at night are airport arrivals, which dry up as well by midnight, but I have had good luck (with the exception of one recent 54-mile disaster) with most of them that arrive between Sunday and Wednesday, or depart between Wednesday and Saturday. Some don't tip, but occasionally I get some business-class big tippers out there that offset the vacuum.

And yes, we get surges all the time even on weird nights, it's just luck of the draw. Tuesday night late:










My daily goal is to try to earn enough tips to cover all fuel costs. Some days like yeaterday, no tips. Other days, I may see double what I put in my tank. In the end, my tip-to-gas ratio is close to 1:1, which I personally am proud of, considering my car was designed for a lot of things, but inner-city gas mileage is not one of them. Then again, I'm not flying around at 130 mph just because a surge swells up. I stay in a populated area, watch half the other drivers exit the area when a surge hits elsewhere, and kick back. While they are busy burning the life out of their four-bangers, I circle the block at 20 mph or park, and get a ping in a minute or two as soon as they race away. I'll make 4 quick trips locally at 1X while they are racing down the interstate to chase a 1.5X surge bubble that pops before they even get there. And then I'll get a surge right on top of me because they flew out to somewhere else and left my area in demand. It's funny because I constantly see the same drivers chasing surges (and many times, each other), and I wonder if they will ever figure out.


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## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

Sounds like you guys are where we were a year ago, give it time, Uber will suck the life out of it there too. Up until about 6 months ago I was able to make low to mid 30's, sometimes even $40 per hour from 1-3am on Friday and Sat. night. Those days are gone here as they've changed the surge map to reduce the surge areas. From your screenshot I can see they haven't done it in your area yet. Just wait!!


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## UberTrip (May 3, 2016)

ptuberx said:


> Perhaps I worded myself incorrectly: The $20 I miscalculated in a different thread was for when I went offline to grab a bite to eat. When I went back online, part of my late fares went onto Sunday's total instead of Saturday, even though it was long before 4 AM.
> 
> I drove 225 miles that day. Late-night Friday and Saturday I usually average about $33/hr with relatively short trips between 12-3 AM. Of course where I am, there are a few main nightlife areas that are very predictable for this.
> 
> ...


Yes, do get it while it's there it won't last. Uber will have the market saturated and surge MIA in no time.

I'm amazed you have such good fortune with your Crown Victoria. From having worked on Interceptors as a police equipment installer I don't give them much credit. IMO, They are over weight, and under powered with Fords 4.6 OHV which only gets 16mpg, while only producing 215HP. Four cylinder engines put out more horsepower then the V8 they use in the CVPI. The cars don't handle well due to the solid rear axle and body on frame design, which is similar to SUVs and trucks. The CVPI represents all of Fords old school ways. I will say that when it comes to repairs and suspension damage they are superior to unibody design since replacement equipment is easily removed and mounted due to its frame type.

Dont do anything to call yourself out with Uber. Most of Ubers markets do not allow the crown vics on their platform and if you search the forums you will find drivers who were activated and driving then suspended due to their crown Victoria not being allowed, Uber didn't budge either on letting them drive


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## Lando74 (Nov 23, 2014)

Disgusted Driver said:


> Wow, what the heck are they putting in the water in Des Moines? You guys are driving for .65 a mile and .15 a minute AND you are letting the cheap pax pull the overcrowding bs? I'm reading all this talk about what you accept and don't accept ratings wise. Complimentary emails from Uber CSR's. Seriously, they are laughing at you for driving this cheaply. You can't possibly be making anything approaching money, why are you driving????? OK, Uber XL is paying almost decently.


I don't take X unless it's 2.0 or more. Otherwise it's XL only. There's plenty of drivers who do though, I don't get it. 65¢ is way too low, and much lower than Omaha, KC, Minneapolis and Chicago. We have extremely low unemployment, high average income and low cost of living - yet our rates are now worse than Detroit. I don't think any thought goes into rates. They probably throw darts at a board in Chicago to come up with rates for their cities (our managers are based there).


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## Way2Lucky (Jul 14, 2016)

I love how bleed-over from O'hare airport to surrounding suburbs and new requests that come in the middle of a multi-stop ride count against my acceptance rate. How about UBER give back a percentage for every dumb ass who orders and then cancels a request. This isn't like you were gonna take your own car out for a gallon of milk and loaf of bread... you went through the process of ordering a car service, causing the driver to commit to and become invested in making the requested pickup and then you cancel on him/her. I'm thinking public stoning might actually be too good for you as a total jerk-off. I should get to drag your corpse behind my car as warning to other UBERdiots.


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## Bill Collector (Dec 17, 2015)

Way2Lucky said:


> I love how bleed-over from O'hare airport to surrounding suburbs and new requests that come in the middle of a multi-stop ride count against my acceptance rate. How about UBER give back a percentage for every dumb ass who orders and then cancels a request. This isn't like you were gonna take your own car out for a gallon of milk and loaf of bread... you went through the process of ordering a car service, causing the driver to commit to and become invested in making the requested pickup and then you cancel on him/her. I'm thinking public stoning might actually be too good for you as a total jerk-off. I should get to drag your corpse behind my car as warning to other UBERdiots.


I usually call if the pickup location is more than 5 minutes. Not moving till I hear from the pax. Chance of cancelation is low if pax talks or texts the driver IMHO.


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## nash801 (Apr 17, 2016)

Papa Sarducci said:


> So what would be considered a low acceptance rate? 60%, 50%, 40%, even less?


75%


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