# Lyft should close shop & leave the ride-sharing to Uber



## Pascal O. (Sep 23, 2014)

Before any1 gets on my throat about how competition is great & an Uber monopoly would be worse, I genuinely feel it can't be any worse than what it is now (@ least here in Atlanta, GA)

I do Uber & Lyft part-time, mainly on the weekends, and w/ out a doubt, there is NO "competition" going on here in the south.

In a typical week here in Atlanta, GA -- and I leave by downtown so am in a prime location -- I get about 10-20 Uber pax request for every 1 Lyft request. Furthermore, the Lyft requests are often at least 8-15mins -- and yes I said 15mins -- drive away from my location where as the Uber ones are usually a 2-7min drive. Ofcourse I end up canceling the lyft ones & take the Uber one.

Moreover, Lyft is already showing sings of defeat. I recently noticed that without notifying the drivers, Lyft reduced the pax referral from $10 to $5 bonus & also the 1st free ride is now $10 vs the previous $25. Thus, I have to change all my custom made referral cards which currently say $25 for trying out Lyft -- which I am not doing as I KNOW it's not worth it.

Even the pax that I sometimes converse w/ often tell me the main reasons they prefer Uber over Lyft is:

no "stupid" pink mustache (which I never put on my car since day one)
the drivers take longer to get there (probs cause every1 is going to Uber now since demand is higher)
the cars aren't as nice (Lyft should increase the requirement from 2000 to 2005 like Uber)
Its so bad for me personally now that often my Lyft "daily summary" is what I get in Uber in less than 1hr. Am not kidding!

Its a shame as I like the tip option in Lyft -- although pax still tip 5% of the time as I have come to realize these ppl are plain cheap.

And surprisingly, I get MORE tips via Uberx (cash of course) than on Lyft

Just give up Lyft. Uber has won this ride-sharing battle. Let's be honest


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## scrurbscrud (Sep 11, 2014)

I LIKE Lyft! Most of the drivers in my area do both. The rides for Lyft are better paying, (NET $4 on min. fare hauls) plus about 1/2 of my pax will tip a buck or 2 to top it off. Waaaayyyyy BETTER than Uber. They have some issues too, but don't they all?

I can actually justify doing min. fare runs for Lyft, which are the MAJORITY of rides with ride share. With Uber it's utterly pointless and I just have to turn off the app without surges.


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## Pascal O. (Sep 23, 2014)

scrurbscrud said:


> I LIKE Lyft! Most of the drivers in my area do both. The rides for Lyft are better paying, (NET $4 on min. fare hauls) plus about 1/2 of my pax will tip a buck or 2 to top it off. Waaaayyyyy BETTER than Uber. They have some issues too, but don't they all?
> 
> I can actually justify doing min. fare runs for Lyft, which are the MAJORITY of rides with ride share. With Uber it's utterly pointless and I just have to turn off the app without surges.


Like I said, it might just be an Atlanta thing. Over here, the pax rarely if ever tip. It's quite sad that I get more tips from Uberx rides which don't even have a tip option. Yet, Lyft claims to be "your friend w/ a car."

It might just be that the Atl pax here are just plain cheap but yeah, if I had to choose btw the lesser of the two evils, I would go with Uber over Lyft anyday. And often when I talk to Uber pax -- looking to hopefully give them a Lyft referral card if they haven't tried the service -- they usually are too happy w/ Uber or have had a bad experience w/ Lyft

The other day I had this Uber pax get in my car w/ his work buddies and the first thing he said was "this is why I love Uberx, you rarely get a nice car like this w/ Lyft." He then went on to tell me how his 1st & last Lyft ride was with a driver whose car had faded paint all over the hood of the car & the interior was unkept


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## scrurbscrud (Sep 11, 2014)

Pascal O. said:


> Like I said, it might just be an Atlanta thing. Over here, the pax rarely if ever tip. It's quite sad that I get more tips from Uberx rides which don't even have a tip options. Yet, Lyft claims to be "your friend w/ a car" It might just be that the Atl pax here are just plain cheap but yeah, if I had to choose btw the lesser of the two evils, I would go with Uber over Lyft anyday


It's a well proven fact that lower fares will NOT produce more income for drivers, evidenced by simply turning off the app. Lyft is doing well in my area with both numbers of pax and numbers of drivers. Were it not for surge fares I won't even turn on the Uber app.

*No driver can make money at a net $2.40 and that's the bottom line!* I'll do it ALL day for net $4 amounting to net $5+ with Lyft. At least you can almost justify it financially. *With Uber it's pointless.* They'll eventually burn out every single X driver with this bullshit other than their captive lease slaves. (I'd hate to see their default rate on leases for X in a year or 2!)

Lyft also handles their surges properly. Waaay less gouging. Much happier customers.


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## Pascal O. (Sep 23, 2014)

scrurbscrud said:


> It's a well proven fact that lower fares will NOT produce more income for drivers, evidenced by simply turning off the app. Lyft is doing well in my area with both numbers of pax and numbers of drivers. Were it not for surge fares I won't even turn on the Uber app.
> 
> *No driver can make money at a net $2.40 and that's the bottom line!* I'll do it ALL day for net $4 amounting to net $5+ with Lyft. At least you can almost justify it financially. *With Uber it's pointless.* They'll eventually burn out every single X driver with this bullshit other than their captive lease slaves. (I'd hate to see their default rate on leases for X in a year or 2!)
> 
> Lyft also handles their surges properly. Waaay less gouging. Much happier customers.


Again, glad to hear you have good demand in your area but here in Atl, the demand gap btw Uber & Lyft is just too much to call it competition. Am not in 100% agreement w/ the way Uber is handling the drivers pay and all but I would rather have some $$ than barely any $$ as is the case w/ my weekly Lyft paychecks that are bread crumbs compared to my Uberx pay.

Plain & simple


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## scrurbscrud (Sep 11, 2014)

Pascal O. said:


> Again, glad to hear you have good demand in your area but here in Atl, the demand gap btw Uber & Lyft is just too much to call it competition. Am not in 100% agreement w/ the way Uber is handling the drivers pay and all but I would rather have some $$ than barely any $$ as is the case w/ my weekly Lyft paychecks that are bread crumbs compared to my Uberx pay.
> 
> Plain & simple


That's the way it was in my area for AWHILE. After Uber's pax and driver screwing things took an upturn for Lyft. The game is still ON for LYFT and I wouldn't count them out. Besides a driver really does need them both at times to make this gig work full time. I certainly do. If I had to do one or the other I'd have to do neither. And it might come to that if either of these jokers try to get uppity with their drivers.


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## ChrisInABQ (Oct 21, 2014)

Pascal O. said:


> Again, glad to hear you have good demand in your area but here in Atl, the demand gap btw Uber & Lyft is just too much to call it competition. Am not in 100% agreement w/ the way Uber is handling the drivers pay and all but I would rather have some $$ than barely any $$ as is the case w/ my weekly Lyft paychecks that are bread crumbs compared to my Uberx pay.
> 
> Plain & simple


You're absolutely correct that it's city dependent. Just when I thought I had the Uber/Lyft market share ratios down, a night like last night throws me for a loop. Last night I had 7 Lyft rides to 3 Uber (not the busiest of nights). The more impressive number, however...$5.42/ride average for Uber and $18.81/ride for Lyft. Tips...71% (5 of 7 rides tipped for an adding another 21% to night) with Lyft...0% with Uber. More Lyft please!

It sounds to me like Lyft may actually be working against your bottom line in Atlanta. The answer, however, isn't to shut down Lyft, I'm sure it's working for somebody. Your answer may be to leave the Lyft app off for a couple weeks to see how it affects things. As for me, running both apps has resulted in 30-35% more fare totals over the past 2 weeks, so I'll maintain the double fistin' (you know...a phone in each hand)!


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## duggles (Aug 25, 2014)

Totally disagree bro.

In Denver Lyft is alive and kicking on almost every _night _of the week. In fact, since I've started Lyfting this past month, I've found on nights that Lyft is always PrimeTiming when Uber doesn't surge anymore.

The majority, the vast majority, of my Lyft riders are people who've been burned by the Uber surge. I ask them why they like Lyft, they tell me because it's cheaper. Which is funny, because I'm only Lyfting because Uber isn't surging and I make far more money with Lyft at base rates. So they're all paying more but they have the impression that it's cheaper. A lot of them also say Uber is snoodier, the drivers are quite and awkward (which I assume is because of the fear of ratings with Uber pax).

That being said, when it's not after 5pm-2am on a given night, Lyft is slow as shit. I can't get pings from them any other time than during the evenings. Morning and day Lyfting is dead, and Uber is where the action is, unfortunately, including weekend mornings. But Lyft is definitely alive and kicking in Denver. The bulk of the riders are Uber-haters and they seem to be growing. A lot of the ones that have never even used Uber bring up the Halloween "horror stories" about the $500+ surge fares.

At this point, Uber has earned itself quite a lot of negative feelings and they seem to be getting slower. I'm sure it's not that reason alone but growing negativity, riders switching to Lyft after getting burned, more drivers by the week, all of these combine to make Uber a far less desirable choice for drivers in Denver these days. I used to only Uber because it was most profitable, now I find myself barely Ubering unless it's a busy weekend with lots of city-wide events that drive the surge.


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## scrurbscrud (Sep 11, 2014)

Anymore I'm to the point of just going with who is winning the battles on any given day/night and turn the other off. They really are running a competition and they vacillate daily. I'll sometimes go with the one that's keeping me the busiest with the highest yield. Sometimes it's Uber, sometimes Lyft. It's really HARD to turn off the Uber app when it's surge at 2+ though! You just have to watch out for the lowballs with their new range quotes, which is utter bullshit on Uber's part! Lyft really is putting up a good show from my perspective. But in reality I do NEED them both and when I run them both I've been pretty much able to run non-stop on Fri-Sat. and keep up a fairly decent round for 2 out of 4 remaining weekdays. Even running both there are always 1-3 days of the week that suck major ass regardless.

Sundays are turning into a waste of time and infringing on football watching time! Turned on the apps early this morning and the streets were swarming with drivers, no surge. No thanks!


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## Pascal O. (Sep 23, 2014)

ChrisInABQ said:


> You're absolutely correct that it's city dependent. Just when I thought I had the Uber/Lyft market share ratios down, a night like last night throws me for a loop. Last night I had 7 Lyft rides to 3 Uber (not the busiest of nights). The more impressive number, however...$5.42/ride average for Uber and $18.81/ride for Lyft. Tips...71% (5 of 7 rides tipped for an adding another 21% to night) with Lyft...0% with Uber. More Lyft please!
> 
> It sounds to me like Lyft may actually be working against your bottom line in Atlanta. The answer, however, isn't to shut down Lyft, I'm sure it's working for somebody. Your answer may be to leave the Lyft app off for a couple weeks to see how it affects things. As for me, running both apps has resulted in 30-35% more fare totals over the past 2 weeks, so I'll maintain the double fistin' (you know...a phone in each hand)!


Although I am not happy with the performance of Lyft over here in Atlanta, I still keep both apps running regardless. Even if its breadcrumbs compared to Uber most of the time, its still better than no bread crumbs at all 

Moreover, I was surprised this past thursday evening when I actually got more Lyft requests than Uber. Only time that it has happened since I have been driving -- about 3 months now

I like Lyft as I feel it caters more to the driver than Uber even though both their rates aren't good for what they expect of us. My two favorite things about Lyft are:

the the cancellation fee is straight forward -- no 1st time free cancel @ driver's expense nonsense
the driver can cancel the trip at any time after pick up & NOT get a rating. Where as with Uber, once I "slide to begin trip" I can't cancel & must get rated -- this sucks as I would get a 1-star if I had to kick out a pax
So again, I am not just hating to hate. In a perfect world, Lyft would have as much if not more demand than Uber. And I would GLADLY cancel Uber requests over Lyft if that were the case

For now, I just have both apps always running on my iPhone 6 & accept whichever request is closer and take the passengers rating into consideration

This Uber/Lyft driver (me) ain't LOYAL


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## Guest (Nov 16, 2014)

duggles said:


> Totally disagree bro.
> 
> In Denver Lyft is alive and kicking on almost every _night _of the week. In fact, since I've started Lyfting this past month, I've found on nights that Lyft is always PrimeTiming when Uber doesn't surge anymore.
> 
> ...


Why does my bro Lyft? Got burned on Uber surge oh hollowen. Having a rider base built off people who have been burned by uber or a bad experience dosnt seem sustainable


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## duggles (Aug 25, 2014)

CabbieGuy93 said:


> Why does my bro Lyft? Got burned on Uber surge oh hollowen. Having a rider base built off people who have been burned by uber or a bad experience dosnt seem sustainable


I just think it's funny though, because at base rates, Lyft costs a couple of dollars more, between the clock starting a minute into arrival, or higher minimums, the 50 cent higher Trust & Safety Fee. A lot of my Lyft riders say they use it because it is cheaper. If only they knew that Uber was truly cheaper.

Which leads me to believe that's why Lyft riders are by and large better people, because Uber's riders are TRULY the cheaper, more selfish bastards.


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## Orlando_Driver (Jul 14, 2014)

I like driving a cab, the rates don't go down, no insurance worries, no permit worries, and your ****ing up someone else's car !


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## Pascal O. (Sep 23, 2014)

duggles said:


> I just think it's funny though, because at base rates, Lyft costs a couple of dollars more, between the clock starting a minute into arrival, or higher minimums, the 50 cent higher Trust & Safety Fee. A lot of my Lyft riders say they use it because it is cheaper. If only they knew that Uber was truly cheaper.
> 
> Which leads me to believe that's why Lyft riders are by and large better people, because Uber's riders are TRULY the cheaper, more selfish bastards.


I have to disagree a little with you on that conclusion. You are right, I too have often heard Lyft pax tell me that they use Lyft because it friendlier and above all CHEAPER -- which I smile @ as I know Uber is the cheaper of the two.

Moreover, since most Lyft pax use Lyft because THEY think it's cheaper, why do you come to the conclusion that the Uber pax are the cheap ones? Let's be honest, most ppl that use ride-sharing services use it because its cheaper than a taxi 

Also, If I were to come to the conclusion of who is cheaper btw Uber & Lyft pax, I would say Lyft mainly because like I said in my original post, although Lyft as a company has done a GREAT job of making the tip option easy to use, I get tips 5% of the time.

I get MORE tips from Uber pax (via cash) from all demographics -- from college students to business consultants & waitresses.

Yesterday, I took this old couple home. The trip was a $6 trip ($4.80 after Uber's cut). At the end of the trip, the old man hands me $5 bill & says "thanks for this trip, I know its a short distance"

That NEVER happens w/ Lyft passengers 

They sometimes claim they will tip me but on my daily summary the next day --> $0 tips


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## ElectroFuzz (Jun 10, 2014)

Let's assume I agree with everything you said.... I still don't get why should Lyft close shop.
Is there only room for 1 company or something?
I have a feeling once all the legal issues will be resolved by these 2 pioneering companies
there will be lots of small new ride share companies entering the market.





Pascal O. said:


> Before any1 gets on my throat about how competition is great & an Uber monopoly would be worse, I genuinely feel it can't be any worse than what it is now (@ least here in Atlanta, GA)
> 
> I do Uber & Lyft part-time, mainly on the weekends, and w/ out a doubt, there is NO "competition" going on here in the south.
> 
> ...


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## duggles (Aug 25, 2014)

Pascal O. said:


> Moreover, since most Lyft pax use Lyft because THEY think it's cheaper, why do you come to the conclusion that the Uber pax are the cheap ones? Let's be honest, most ppl that use ride-sharing services use it because its cheaper than a taxi


Because truly cheap people are smart enough to make sure they're paying the cheapest price. A lot of the Lyft riders that have told me they use Lyft because they believe it's cheaper have also not used Uber at all. It's merely perception.

Also, I've gotten tipped on less than 1% of nearly 600 Uber riders. I'm up to 50 Lyft riders and am tipped on 30% of the rides, including Prime Time rates.


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## Pascal O. (Sep 23, 2014)

duggles said:


> Because truly cheap people are smart enough to make sure they're paying the cheapest price


This statement makes no sense. So although Lyft pax say they use Lyft because they think it's cheaper than Uber -- which used to be true b4 Uber had their nationwide rates cuts -- the Uber pax are the cheap ones because the Lyft pax aren't smart enough to go online and compare the new rates of Uber in contrast to Lyft in their respective cities?

I give up...


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## No-tippers-suck (Oct 20, 2014)

Very interesting post I want to participate 

I drive for both Uber and Lyft ( I am also a mentor )
However, region to region is really very different some Areas Lyft is busier others it's Uber.

*TIPS:*
I have my best rides with Uber, and most of my tips are Uber cash tips. Sometimes on longer trips some people even drop a $20.

*LYFT SHUTDOWN:*
I wouldn't go that far to say Lyft should shutdown... but if we had to decide for only one App I definitely go with Uber.
I think it's good that the riders and we the drivers have options and it should stay that way. But Lyft shouldn't try just to get riders by being cheaper.
(fares may be different from city to city LA Inland Empire Lyft charges 15cents less per mile, they are little more busy than Uber I assume but I boycott
that concept and will not start driving sooner unless their price is equal with Uber)
Still way enough Uber people out here and most said they would have tried Lyft as well but prefer Uber.

*SURCHARGE burnt people:*
Hey man, those people didn't even understand the concept of surcharging at all and they seriously deserve no better than old crappy 2000' cars

Compared to a taxi we give around 50% discount at about 98% of all day and night.
Now that a certain area is getting busier and Uber (or Lyft Primetime) goes on, people show us how much they appreciate our great service and free waters.
If I have a ride during surcharge I do make my best to show them how much I appreciate them for supporting us and that they are always the most welcome.
I try to explain them that the idea of surcharging is to keep the cars in a busy area instead giving them away to a long distance trip.
I further explain that the basic concept is to get the short trips home first because usually nobody cares paying $10 instead of $5 but the cars are available a few minutes later at the same busy spot and can now where things calmed down take the long distance trips without the surcharge.

However I had a few discussions with people about surcharge (yeah.. go to hell if we are not worth a normal taxi price once in while..)

I stopped loving Lyft since the only concept Lyft has to get "Uber's" riders is too be cheaper than Uber and I do not agree with that at all, so Lyft is just my Plan B if it's not busy out there"
I rather wear a black tie than a pink mustache 

*THE 20% CONCLUSION:*
I always read that Lyft and Uber would charge us a 20% fee, Dear fellow drivers please wake up.
did you (I did only for LA) ever consider the base fare and the so called additional rider fee ?

*Hey, seriously* on a $5 dollar ride (assume $1 is called rider safety fee) plus the 20% then they took $1.80 which is exactly 36% to me and any electronic calculator in the world.
Just calling it a safety fee doesn't change the fact that they take away 36% on a $5 ride.

On a $20 dollar ride the 20% are $4 calculate the $1 Safety fee then it is still 25% !!! and I guess most of the rides will be anything between that, right?

Did anybody here ever calculate how much net profit we really make per mile? per day? per year? how much less worth our cars will be when we want to sell them with all those extra miles?

I'm saying if we make less than $40 gross profit we are making less than minimum wage and have to risk a lot.

I was driving 5 sometimes 7 days a week when I started and then I could easily make 250-300 on a slow weeknight and 400-600 on Friday or Saturday night,
paying an average of 25% as Uber or Lyft Fee was still somehow worth it.
Then I calculated just my Gas expenses (6 cyl Premium gas and usually around 18-20mpg with my car) it was another 20-25% compared to how much I made per week.

Well should I now add my tires, my brakepads, my cleaning and maintenaince the deduction of the value of my car to the bill?
If I did that I probably would ask for a Job at McDonald's since my hourly pay might even be higher or equal.

Sorry I wrote a lot and I apologize :-(


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## Justin H (Sep 24, 2014)

Lyft is still catching up to Uber in a lot of cities like Atl. Phx from what I hear was similar a while back but now there is pretty steady work for the most part.


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## osii (Aug 21, 2014)

well, rideshare driving sucks on so many levels, but driving for Lyft definitely pays better for now at least.

I made $740 this week with Lyft. Doing the exact same amount of rides for uber would have gotten me $520. ($510 when you factor in the phone charge)

Between bonus, tips, and cancellations, I made $220 more driving for Lyft. That's real money for 4 days of work.

Uber here in PHX is super over-saturated with drivers.


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## UberRey (Sep 1, 2014)

Uber over saturates the DFW market as well. Lyft should, in no way, close shop. It is a different service for a different type of rider. I am making better money with Lyft than Uber now that the rates are virtually the same and Lyft has a tipping feature in the app. Lyft has saved my bacon on what could have been a severe shortage of cash when driving for Uber alone.


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## UberxD (Aug 4, 2014)

We need competition. Lyft needs to continue to innovate and improve. Without competition there is only complacency and Uber is no exception.


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## Justin H (Sep 24, 2014)

osii said:


> well, rideshare driving sucks on so many levels, but driving for Lyft definitely pays better for now at least.
> 
> I made $740 this week with Lyft. Doing the exact same amount of rides for uber would have gotten me $520. ($510 when you factor in the phone charge)
> 
> ...


Gotta love drunk ASU kids driving for Lyft and everyone on whiskey row lol


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## osii (Aug 21, 2014)

I won't go anywhere near Tempe or Old town at night.


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## Justin H (Sep 24, 2014)

osii said:


> I won't go anywhere near Tempe or Old town at night.


It's not so bad once you get used to the people and their general demeanor. It's by far Lyft's busiest times and places so i pretty much have to in order to make a decent amount of money....


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## osii (Aug 21, 2014)

It's gotten so bad with me that I just will do whatever I have to in order to avoid drunks. I don't know what decent money is to you but I can make more working days and the airport with way less stress. I pulled $150 in 8 hours tonight and got one drunk guy that wasn't too bad. Those Tempe rides are a lot of short hops. And that's a lot of risk for not much money. and it's not just Tempe, it's everywhere. If I can pull $150 a day, that's $900 for a 6 day week. I'm actually looking for a good hiding place so I can work the Saturday/Sunday peak hours and not get a call. I need that bonus to make this deal work.


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## AK916 (Nov 19, 2014)

I don't care for the peer/mentor review. I was rejected by Lyft. I then made some upgrades to my vehicle and got on with UBER. I have requested another review from LYFT and have received no response. At least UBER gets back to you.


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## Justin H (Sep 24, 2014)

AK916 said:


> I don't care for the peer/mentor review. I was rejected by Lyft. I then made some upgrades to my vehicle and got on with UBER. I have requested another review from LYFT and have received no response. At least UBER gets back to you.


Did they tell you why they rejected you? I was rejected initially and for some reason a week later i got the approved email. Oh and they wanted a receipt from having the interior of my car cleaned.


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## ElectroFuzz (Jun 10, 2014)

Justin H said:


> Gotta love drunk ASU kids driving for Lyft and everyone on whiskey row lol


I sit here in north Phoenix, mesmerized by Lyft Prime time that seems to be always on 
in downtown Tempe.

I know it's probably short trips only but still, it has to be great to have constant
Prime Time.


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## DjTim (Oct 18, 2014)

ElectroFuzz said:


> I sit here in north Phoenix, mesmerized by Lyft Prime time that seems to be always on
> in downtown Tempe.
> 
> I know it's probably short trips only but still, it has to be great to have constant
> Prime Time.


I've noticed on Lyft for Chicago there are 3 or 4 blocks that are always PT areas, even at 1pm 9am - doesn't matter. they are very small blocks. I am not sure why they are always PT - they are not arenas or bus stops. One area is just a bunch of store fronts, and nothing special.


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## AK916 (Nov 19, 2014)

No they didn't. Ironically I inquired again, and they responded this afternoon. I have a chance to get another inspection.


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## Struggling Actor (Jan 9, 2015)

No-tippers-suck said:


> Very interesting post I want to participate
> 
> I drive for both Uber and Lyft ( I am also a mentor )
> However, region to region is really very different some Areas Lyft is busier others it's Uber.
> ...


You would make more if you drove a Prius, 40 mpg and brakes last over 100,000 miles.


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