# The Gig Is Up: Rep. Deb Haaland Introduces Bill to Make Uber & Lyft Pay Their Fair Share of Taxes



## IGotDrive (Oct 8, 2018)

https://www.democracynow.org/2019/5/9/the_gig_is_up_rep_deb
"As Uber and Lyft drivers staged a strike on Wednesday, Rep. Deb Haaland (D-NM) announced legislation that would require Uber and Lyft to pay for drivers' Social Security and Medicare costs. Because drivers are considered "independent contractors," they are currently required to pay Social Security & Medicare costs themselves. Haaland's legislation would place that burden entirely on Lyft, Uber, and other multinational corporations employing large numbers of so-called independent contractors in the gig economy. Rep. Deb Haaland said in a statement "The gig is up." She joins us from Capitol Hill."

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From the article/interview:

*NERMEEN SHAIKH:*_ Congresswoman Haaland, just to give a sense of the massive disparity, as you've pointed out, a large number-half-of Uber drivers don't even make minimum wage, and Uber's top five executives last year took home $143 million. Five executives, $143 million last year.
*REP. DEB HAALAND:* That's sickening. That's the inequity I'm talking about. It is so unfair that the big executives can make that much money when there are people that can't afford to buy groceries. It is fundamentally unfair, it isn't right, they don't have a conscience and they need to pay up._

It *is* sickening and disgusting. I stopped driving for those companies for a while now, but still support drivers' fight for fair wages because I can't get over the existence of this type of labor exploitation and what I experienced and witnessed working with U/L. I strongly deplore both Uber and Lyft because of what I learned and now know, but despise Lyft just a tad bit more because they pretend to be a friendly and ethical company and spends a tiny fragment of their profits on trendy social causes to keep up that facade rather than rectify the social issue of extremely low wages to workers that they're causing themselves. To pay those million dollar bonuses/wages when you're driving many drivers into poverty and running an unprofitable company that is making a public offering is so morally corrupt and twisted - sickening is great way to describe it.


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## RabbleRouser (Apr 30, 2019)

DOA


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## swathdiver (Apr 18, 2019)

IGotDrive said:


> https://www.democracynow.org/2019/5/9/the_gig_is_up_rep_deb
> "As Uber and Lyft drivers staged a strike on Wednesday, Rep. Deb Haaland (D-NM) announced legislation that would require Uber and Lyft to pay for drivers' Social Security and Medicare costs. Because drivers are considered "independent contractors," they are currently required to pay Social Security & Medicare costs themselves.


Another government hack that wants to control everyone's lives and force people to do what she wants. This is a Statist folks; a person who believes that you are too dumb to manage your own affairs and only a select breed of elitists in a land far far away can better make decisions for you.

For those of you jealous or not liking these big corporate salaries, choose not to patronize them with your private property and consider starting your own company. But please tell us, after you've started your own company and have overcome all the hurdles to make it sound and profitable, do let us know what you make compared with your average worker bee. We'll decide, not you, if that is a proper salary.


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## peteyvavs (Nov 18, 2015)

swathdiver said:


> Another government hack that wants to control everyone's lives and force people to do what she wants. This is a Statist folks; a person who believes that you are too dumb to manage your own affairs and only a select breed of elitists in a land far far away can better make decisions for you.
> 
> For those of you jealous or not liking these big corporate salaries, choose not to patronize them with your private property and consider starting your own company. But please tell us, after you've started your own company and have overcome all the hurdles to make it sound and profitable, do let us know what you make compared with your average worker bee. We'll decide, not you, if that is a proper salary.


That's why you'll never be more then a flunky, you drank too much of the corporate kool aid.


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## Lee239 (Mar 24, 2017)

The problem is that so many people don't claim any income, or have negative earnings when they deduct miles that I don't think Uber will pay their share either if it even did pass.


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## Bob Reynolds (Dec 20, 2014)

IGotDrive said:


> https://www.democracynow.org/2019/5/9/the_gig_is_up_rep_deb
> "As Uber and Lyft drivers staged a strike on Wednesday, Rep. Deb Haaland (D-NM) announced legislation that would require Uber and Lyft to pay for drivers' Social Security and Medicare costs. Because drivers are considered "independent contractors," they are currently required to pay Social Security & Medicare costs themselves. Haaland's legislation would place that burden entirely on Lyft, Uber, and other multinational corporations employing large numbers of so-called independent contractors in the gig economy. Rep. Deb Haaland said in a statement "The gig is up." She joins us from Capitol Hill."
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ...


I believe the bill has got right to the heart of the matter and I believe some form of it will pass because now the awareness of this issue is widespread. Most Americans believe that workers should NOT be earning poverty wages. Yes there are some jerks that think people should make 50 cents an hour and be happy they have a job, but most Americans do not feel that way.

This comes down to the drivers not being paid enough for what they do in the United States Of America. We have minimum wage laws in effect so that this is not supposed to happen. Those laws were put in place decades ago to prevent this very thing from happening. For example you can't open a McDonalds and classify you employees as independent contractors and have them make less than the minimum wage. You can't have all of those McDonalds employees sitting around in the lobby ("on call") waiting for the business to come in and then activate them once you have customers.

Lyft and Uber have come in, not even paid minimum wages to most drivers and in the meantime put established competitive transportation companies out of business that were paying the minimum wage and withholding and paying payroll taxes.

This means the government is not getting their tax money from the transportation companies that are no longer in business. As most of us know, the government does not like to lose.

This scheme of underpaying drivers should have been stopped on day one. The problem is that Uber hired some pretty powerful Obama era Democrats, and paid them millions of dollars, to move this scheme past state and federal regulators before they could really figure out what was going on here. There was not a effort made to do the right thing. There was every effort made to do the wrong thing.

Everyone wanted a cheap ride. Now the bills are coming due.


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## Woohaa (Jan 15, 2017)

swathdiver said:


> Another government hack that wants to control everyone's lives and force people to do what she wants. This is a Statist folks; a person who believes that you are too dumb to manage your own affairs and only a select breed of elitists in a land far far away can better make decisions for you.
> 
> For those of you jealous or not liking these big corporate salaries, choose not to patronize them with your private property and consider starting your own company. But please tell us, after you've started your own company and have overcome all the hurdles to make it sound and profitable, do let us know what you make compared with your average worker bee. We'll decide, not you, if that is a proper salary.


Another rideshare shill. ?


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

swathdiver said:


> Another government hack that wants to control everyone's lives and force people to do what she wants. This is a Statist folks; a person who believes that you are too dumb to manage your own affairs and only a select breed of elitists in a land far far away can better make decisions for you.
> 
> For those of you jealous or not liking these big corporate salaries, choose not to patronize them with your private property and consider starting your own company. But please tell us, after you've started your own company and have overcome all the hurdles to make it sound and profitable, do let us know what you make compared with your average worker bee. We'll decide, not you, if that is a proper salary.


Yeah, like the way these statists won't let 12 year olds work factory jobs. The very nerve of them.


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## NotanEmployee (Apr 20, 2019)

Um no...just no. I pay nothing into them now as my taxibile income isnt enough. I work as an independent contractor to keep MORE of my money not LESS! The whole point is to take deductions BEFORE you pay taxes! I want no part of this employee scheme.


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## Taxi Driver in Arizona (Mar 18, 2015)

NotanEmployee said:


> Um no...just no. I pay nothing into them now as my taxibile income isnt enough. I work as an independent contractor to keep MORE of my money not LESS! The whole point is to take deductions BEFORE you pay taxes! I want no part of this employee scheme.


A wise man once said, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one." More drivers will benefit from this than will be harmed. Stop being so selfish.


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## UberTrent9 (Dec 11, 2018)

swathdiver said:


> Another government hack that wants to control everyone's lives and force people to do what she wants. This is a Statist folks; a person who believes that you are too dumb to manage your own affairs and only a select breed of elitists in a land far far away can better make decisions for you.
> 
> For those of you jealous or not liking these big corporate salaries, choose not to patronize them with your private property and consider starting your own company. But please tell us, after you've started your own company and have overcome all the hurdles to make it sound and profitable, do let us know what you make compared with your average worker bee. We'll decide, not you, if that is a proper salary.


When did you become a member of Uber's payroll?


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## NotanEmployee (Apr 20, 2019)

Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> A wise man once said, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one." More drivers will benefit from this than will be harmed. Stop being so selfish.


The rich get rich by owning their own businesses, investing smart and using the tax system to avoid paying taxes. Rich people do not get a W2 at the end of the year. Now, im not saying doing uber will get me rich, far from it! But if i pay $2000 less in taxes than i would earning the same as an employee.....i just made $2000 more than that employee and paid less to the feds. Learn to work the system, dont let it work you.


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## peteyvavs (Nov 18, 2015)

If U/L had treated the drivers fairly and with respect this wouldn’t even be an issue, but since U/L have the drivers so ruthlessly they brought this upon themselves.
U/L have opened the door to be regulated like the taxi and limo business. KARMA


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

This will have zero impact on the drivers. As almost none owe any taxes whatsoever after deducting mileage.


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## peteyvavs (Nov 18, 2015)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> This will have zero impact on the drivers. As almost none owe any taxes whatsoever after deducting mileage.


What's the point of tax deductions when you can't afford a can of dog.


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

This is great news! I was worried these companies weren’t losing money quick enough. Hopefully this just speeds up their inevitable demise. That way we can all stop complaining and go back to the McDonalds from whence we came. McDonalds work may suck but at least they pay these taxes, which is all that matters.


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## dauction (Sep 26, 2017)

That would be very helpful ..having them pay Social Security and Medicare tax

*The self-employment tax rate is 15.3%. The rate consists of two parts: 12.4% for social security (old-age, survivors, and disability insurance) and 2.9% for Medicare (hospital insurance).

*


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## TomH (Sep 23, 2016)

Be careful of what you wish for. If you are classified as an employee, the driver is on the hook for 7.65% of gross earnings.


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## swathdiver (Apr 18, 2019)

peteyvavs said:


> That's why you'll never be more then a flunky, you drank too much of the corporate kool aid.





Woohaa said:


> Another rideshare shill. ?





Taxi Driver in Arizona said:


> Yeah, like the way these statists won't let 12 year olds work factory jobs. The very nerve of them.





UberTrent9 said:


> When did you become a member of Uber's payroll?


Liberalism, find a cure!


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## Bob Reynolds (Dec 20, 2014)

TomH said:


> Be careful of what you wish for. If you are classified as an employee, the driver is on the hook for 7.65% of gross earnings.


Just like any employee of any job in this country (private company or the government). It's for the FICA which is what will allow you to receive a Social Security check when you get to the point that you need it.

Last time I checked the government is still sending out Social Security checks to those folks that are retired or on disability. If you don't pay into the system, then the government will pay you much less, if at all, when you retire.

You are just screwing yourself if you don't have sufficient earnings in your Social Security account. 

It's not Uber and Lyft that are going to collect Social Security--it's you the worker. The more you pay in, the bigger the check you receive each month. The less you pay in, the less you will receive every month.


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## TomH (Sep 23, 2016)

Bob Reynolds said:


> Just like any employee of any job in this country (private company or the government). It's for the FICA which is what will allow you to receive a Social Security check when you get to the point that you need it.
> 
> Last time I checked the government is still sending out Social Security checks to those folks that are retired or on disability. If you don't pay into the system, then the government will pay you much less, if at all, when you retire.
> 
> ...


Your points are true. I am retired and do not need any more contributions.


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## Polomarko (Dec 20, 2016)

IGotDrive said:


> https://www.democracynow.org/2019/5/9/the_gig_is_up_rep_deb
> "As Uber and Lyft drivers staged a strike on Wednesday, Rep. Deb Haaland (D-NM) announced legislation that would require Uber and Lyft to pay for drivers' Social Security and Medicare costs. Because drivers are considered "independent contractors," they are currently required to pay Social Security & Medicare costs themselves. Haaland's legislation would place that burden entirely on Lyft, Uber, and other multinational corporations employing large numbers of so-called independent contractors in the gig economy. Rep. Deb Haaland said in a statement "The gig is up." She joins us from Capitol Hill."
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ...


Apsolutly correct


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## swathdiver (Apr 18, 2019)

Bob Reynolds said:


> We have minimum wage laws in effect so that this is not supposed to happen. Those laws were put in place decades ago to prevent this very thing from happening.


No, minimum wage laws suppress wages. They were put in place to keep black folks heading north after the civil war from taking white yankee jobs. The higher the minimum wage, the higher the unemployment rate for young and old and low-skilled citizens.


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## Bob Reynolds (Dec 20, 2014)

swathdiver said:


> No, minimum wage laws suppress wages. They were put in place to keep black folks heading north after the civil war from taking white yankee jobs. The higher the minimum wage, the higher the unemployment rate for young and old and low-skilled citizens.


You are wrong Uber Shill. The federal minimum wage laws were put in place by Franklin Delano Roosevelt (the Democratic US President) in 1938. That was 73 years after the Civic War ended and had nothing to do with black folks heading north. At that time the minimum wage was set at .25 cents an hour.

The minimum wage laws do not suppress wages. It is a baseline that is used to determine a fair wage for a fair days work. A business always has the option to pay MORE than the minimum wage and most do to attract and retain workers. The minimum wage is the MINIMUM AMOUNT that MUST be earned.

Unfortunately most Uber and Lyft drivers do not earn at least the minimum wage and this is now an issue. If the drivers were paid at least the minimum wage, after expenses, this would never have been an issue.

During difficult economic times, the minimum wage will often create a higher unemployment rate as businesses have to make a strict determination on whether it is economically feasible to pay an employee the minimum wage for the job that is being done. Once the economy improves, those jobs do come back, often at a wage higher than the minimum wage. That keeps everyone on a level playing field.


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## swathdiver (Apr 18, 2019)

Bob Reynolds said:


> You are wrong Uber Shill. The federal minimum wage laws were put in place by Franklin Delano Roosevelt


Well, no, you've successfully regurgitated the Party (Communist Party) lies about minimum wage laws. If you're interested in the truth and not your feelings, check these out for starters.

http://www.aei.org/publication/thomas-sowell-on-the-cruelty-of-minimum-wage-laws/
https://www.creators.com/read/walter-williams/07/14/please-stop-helping-us
https://www.capitalismmagazine.com/2003/11/why-racists-and-unions-support-minimum-wages/
http://walterewilliams.com/minimum-wage-and-discrimination/
http://www.aei.org/publication/thom...-support-raising-wages-for-unskilled-workers/


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## Polomarko (Dec 20, 2016)

peteyvavs said:


> That's why you'll never be more then a flunky, you drank too much of the corporate kool aid.


Internet mafija needs regulation. Dara 200 mil. Dollars., plus 45 million dollars for one year.


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## Amsoil Uber Connect (Jan 14, 2015)

I'm not surprised by this. I always said the Treasury Dept is losing perhaps Millions in revenue because U/L rates are way to low. 

The Gig Economy does not pay into SS so there's not going to be anything for the Millenials.


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## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

NotanEmployee said:


> Um no...just no. I pay nothing into them now as my taxibile income isnt enough. I work as an independent contractor to keep MORE of my money not LESS! The whole point is to take deductions BEFORE you pay taxes! I want no part of this employee scheme.


Me too, when you pay almost $0 in taxes being an independent contractor, yeah I'll foot the bill for the 6% medicare tax, lol.


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## IR12 (Nov 11, 2017)

IGotDrive said:


> https://www.democracynow.org/2019/5/9/the_gig_is_up_rep_deb
> "As Uber and Lyft drivers staged a strike on Wednesday, Rep. Deb Haaland (D-NM) announced legislation that would require Uber and Lyft to pay for drivers' Social Security and Medicare costs. Because drivers are considered "independent contractors," they are currently required to pay Social Security & Medicare costs themselves. Haaland's legislation would place that burden entirely on Lyft, Uber, and other multinational corporations employing large numbers of so-called independent contractors in the gig economy. Rep. Deb Haaland said in a statement "The gig is up." She joins us from Capitol Hill."
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ...


Drama.


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

TomH said:


> Be careful of what you wish for. If you are classified as an employee, the driver is on the hook for 7.65% of gross earnings.


True.

However.....

If my pay goes up (during the slow times) by 100%, I'm okay paying that 7.65%. Over the past 2 years, my take-home pay has been slashed by approximately 40%, gross. What's another 7.65%?

The new law in NYC is estimated to cause the _AVERAGE_ full time driver to have an increase in pay of about $10,000 per year. And roughly 85% of drivers are categorized as full time, even though the companies categorize them as part time (because they drive for multiple companies).


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## NotanEmployee (Apr 20, 2019)

Mista T said:


> True.
> 
> However.....
> 
> ...


But are you okay with NOT being able to deduct mileage and other expenses? Those things are NOT deductible and your employer us NOT required to reimburse you.

Full federal income taxes on my gross income and wear and tear on my car....no thanks


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

NotanEmployee said:


> But are you okay with NOT being able to deduct mileage and other expenses? Those things are NOT deductible and your employer us NOT required to reimburse you.
> 
> Full federal income taxes on my gross income and wear and tear on my car....no thanks


Agreed.

It's all about the money, that's the bottom line.

Two years ago I drove an average of 50-60 hrs per week, and my take home pay (before ANY expenses) was $75k. For $75k a year, I will take care of my own gas and buy a new car every 2 years, and pay the taxes, no problem! Taxes aren't an issue for me, I own a home and have 2 kids in college.

Now I'm doing maybe 30 hours per week (because the pay has gotten so bad) and my take home annually is closer to $30k. I have picked up other part time jobs that work with my schedule needs, and continually ask myself: why should I even bother with Lyft and Uber anymore?

It's all about how much we take in, and how much we get to keep.


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## The Entomologist (Sep 23, 2018)




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## IGotDrive (Oct 8, 2018)

The most surprising things I've read in the replies is (1) people think they're getting over by not paying SS tax that they just won't be eligible for come retirement time, and (2) people think the IC SS tax rate is the same as the employee SS tax rate (ICs pay double (15.3%) because there is no employer to pay half).

From the official Social Security Administration *and *IRS websites:

_In 2019, however, if your wages are $87,700, and you have $45,500 in net earnings from a business, you don't pay dual Social Security taxes on earnings more than $132,900. Your employer will withhold 7.65 percent in Social Security and Medicare taxes on your 
$87,700 in earnings. You must pay 15.3 percent in Social Security and Medicare taxes on your first $45,200 in self-employment earnings, and 2.9 percent in Medicare tax on the remaining $300 in net earnings._

-SSA

https://www.ssa.gov/pubs/EN-05-10022.pdf
_The self-employment tax rate is 15.3%. The rate consists of two parts: 12.4% for social security (old-age, survivors, and disability insurance) and 2.9% for Medicare (hospital insurance)._

-IRS

https://www.irs.gov/businesses/smal...oyment-tax-social-security-and-medicare-taxes


TomH said:


> Be careful of what you wish for. If you are classified as an employee, the driver is on the hook for 7.65% of gross earnings.


As an independent contractor, one is actually on the hook for the full amount of 15.3%, as opposed to half of that (7.65%) as an employee.


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