# Move Over Ambulances, Uber’s Coming



## Cary Grant (Jul 14, 2015)

EXCERPT: As a mode of transportation to a hospital when a patients' illness, injury or affliction precludes them from driving, ambulances are a blunt method that is far from perfect. Patients sometimes find themselves hit with substantial bills or end up at out-of-network hospitals that raise the price of care. Recent policy changes may also be exacerbating the situation, as one study found that the Affordable Care Act slowed ambulance response times by almost 20 percent.

According to a new working paper by David J. G. Slusky of the University of Kansas and Leon S. Moskatel of Scripps Mercy Hospital, some people are foregoing ambulances and opting for ride-hailing services instead.

https://fee.org/articles/move-over-ambulances-uber-s-coming/

https://economics21.org/html/move-over-ambulances-uber’s-coming-2785.html


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## Uber's Guber (Oct 22, 2017)

Cary Grant said:


> According to a new working paper by David J. G. Slusky of the University of Kansas and Leon S. Moskatel of Scripps Mercy Hospital, some people are foregoing ambulances and opting for ride-hailing services instead.


Because even with the $150 blood & puke cleaning fee, it's still more affordable than an ambulance. AND, the tip is already included in the fare!


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## Cdub2k (Nov 22, 2017)

I'm not trying to be cold blooded but if I receive a text from a PAX like "Please hurry my ___ just had a heart attack we need to get to the hospital quick" I'll cancel that ride with the quickness. I am not an emergency ambulance. Who in their right mind calls an Uber in the middle of a real emergency?

I am sure or at least I hope that the article is referring to preemptive ER visits that people take but if they are talking about real emergencies that is ridiculous. I still have thoughts about that cheap a%% woman who was in labor and instead of calling an ambulance they called an Uber.


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## Uber's Guber (Oct 22, 2017)

Cdub2k said:


> Who in their right mind calls an Uber in the middle of a real emergency?


Somebody who earned free ride credits when they scammed the last Uber driver.


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## jazzapt (May 16, 2016)

Cdub2k said:


> I'm not trying to be cold blooded but if I receive a text from a PAX like "Please hurry my ___ just had a heart attack we need to get to the hospital quick" I'll cancel that ride with the quickness. I am not an emergency ambulance. Who in their right mind calls an Uber in the middle of a real emergency?
> 
> I am sure or at least I hope that the article is referring to preemptive ER visits that people take but if they are talking about real emergencies that is ridiculous. I still have thoughts about that cheap a%% woman who was in labor and instead of calling an ambulance they called an Uber.


Yet another risk we take as Uber drivers. If they tell you before hand they are having a heart attack, you cancel, and that person dies, can the family sue? Or if you take them and don't take a route that's fast enough and they die, can the family sue?

All for $0.70 a mile!


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## Uber's Guber (Oct 22, 2017)

Seriously, if somebody is experiencing a heart attack, the risk of dying is lower if you are transported by ambulance, because you are stabilized during transport and admitted immediately into care upon arrival to the hospital. If you arrive to the emergency room in an Uber or some other form of transportation, you will be waiting to seek attention behind a line of other waiting patients that include illegal aliens who are there to seek free treatment for a common cold.


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## Cary Grant (Jul 14, 2015)

I've taken perhaps a dozen pax to a walk-in clinic, after hours, with serious sprains, possibly simple fractures, from extra curricular activities at a nearby university (softball, volleyball, etc.). They invariably come in groups, with one or two helping the injured walk.

The only thing I've cancelled for are people that are bleeding (had several of those, too). If they have an injury that requires pressure to stop the bleeding, my car is not an appropriate form of transportation. Yet, these pax will still try to argue with me, but I'm not doing anything that will result in my car being out of service for possibly a week or more while I have a potential hazardous material removed, and then have to fight tooth and nail with Uber or Lyft for some kind of reimbursement. I've already been there, done that. Bleeding pax are _no bueno. _That includes oozing bandages, bloody hands and fingers, and fresh blood smears on clothing. Every point of contact becomes a bio-hazard problem, and I'm going to exercise my right to refuse them service.

Pax aren't stupid, though. The figure things out, they read what we write here, or other sources. I'm sure we'll have pax load up in our cars while they are are having a medical emergency, who don't inform the driver prior to the trip beginning (or maybe never, we'll just be guessing when they moan in pain as we pull into the Emergency Room _porte cochère_). Heart attacks aren't always like what you see on TV. I've known people to go take a shower and do their hair while having one, because the didn't want to go to the hospital with bed head and no make up.

If pax don't tell you, then you don't know. I'm not sure how one can prevent this.

Here's an additional curve ball: What do you do if you are on a regular non-emergency trip, and your pax has a medical emergency occur during the trip? For example, heart attack, or stroke?


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## 7Miles (Dec 17, 2014)

I had twice had passenger who took Pool/line to ER.
Onc I had a lady not doing well, weird spots on her face , headache etc asking me to change direction from ER to a cheaper private Emergency Care because her boyfriend on the phone was telling her not to waste money on real ER. I told her I disagree with him because she doesn’t look too god but will take her where she wants me to.


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## homelesslawnmowers (May 25, 2018)

i only accept pings from hotels 30+ miles away from the airport, moved near a bunch of em, they tend not to go to hospitals

if you dont live near one or cant move near one make them your queue & ignore every other ping

drive long & prosper


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Cary Grant said:


> EXCERPT: As a mode of transportation to a hospital when a patients' illness, injury or affliction precludes them from driving, ambulances are a blunt method that is far from perfect. Patients sometimes find themselves hit with substantial bills or end up at out-of-network hospitals that raise the price of care. Recent policy changes may also be exacerbating the situation, as one study found that the Affordable Care Act slowed ambulance response times by almost 20 percent.
> 
> According to a new working paper by David J. G. Slusky of the University of Kansas and Leon S. Moskatel of Scripps Mercy Hospital, some people are foregoing ambulances and opting for ride-hailing services instead.
> 
> ...


Great !

Now Uber self Driving cars

Will rush bicyclists they run down

To the Hospital !

What could Possibly Go Wrong !?!?



Uber's Guber said:


> Seriously, if somebody is experiencing a heart attack, the risk of dying is lower if you are transported by ambulance, because you are stabilized during transport and admitted immediately into care upon arrival to the hospital. If you arrive to the emergency room in an Uber or some other form of transportation, you will be waiting to seek attention behind a line of other waiting patients that include illegal aliens who are there to seek free treatment for a common cold.


Carry Aspirin.
Chewing a few aspirin and swallowing can help a heart attack victim.



Cary Grant said:


> EXCERPT: As a mode of transportation to a hospital when a patients' illness, injury or affliction precludes them from driving, ambulances are a blunt method that is far from perfect. Patients sometimes find themselves hit with substantial bills or end up at out-of-network hospitals that raise the price of care. Recent policy changes may also be exacerbating the situation, as one study found that the Affordable Care Act slowed ambulance response times by almost 20 percent.
> 
> According to a new working paper by David J. G. Slusky of the University of Kansas and Leon S. Moskatel of Scripps Mercy Hospital, some people are foregoing ambulances and opting for ride-hailing services instead.
> 
> ...


Coming SOON :

UBER AMBULANCE POOL !



jazzapt said:


> Yet another risk we take as Uber drivers. If they tell you before hand they are having a heart attack, you cancel, and that person dies, can the family sue? Or if you take them and don't take a route that's fast enough and they die, can the family sue?
> 
> All for $0.70 a mile!


Then get RE ROUTED to another Hospital!

Just like a REAL AMBULANCE !

Only NOT by Radio . . .

Because YOU DONT HAVE ONE !

Or any OTHER means of Notifying Hospital you are en route and for them to have PROPER PERSONEL AWAKE AND READY !!!

ER personell " Sorry, we just got 5 shooting victims. We are stacked past capacity.
Wait time in ER is 8 hours" . . .

Doctors & E.R. R.N.'s are going to HATE uber drivers !

I see LAWS BEING PASSED.
MUCH LEGISLATION IN UBERS NEAR FUTURE .

CALL ME PSYCHIC . .

Now
I will Gladly 
Drive a Kidney
To the airport in a Lunch box.


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## JimKE (Oct 28, 2016)

VERY old news, and the subject of numerous threads here on UP for several months.

One thing rideshare drivers need to clearly understand about providing any kind of medical care to pax -- *you are NOT covered by Good Samaritan Laws* if your state has one. If they are your pax, you are being paid to drive them, and that eliminates GS coverage.

So 100% of the liability for trying to play doctor falls squarely on your family.


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

JimKE said:


> VERY old news, and the subject of numerous threads here on UP for several months.
> 
> One thing rideshare drivers need to clearly understand about providing any kind of medical care to pax -- *you are NOT covered by Good Samaritan Laws* if your state has one. If they are your pax, you are being paid to drive them, and that eliminates GS coverage.
> 
> So 100% of the liability for trying to play doctor falls squarely on your family.


When did that law get passed and do you have a link to it?


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## Wonkytonk (Jan 28, 2018)

Cary Grant said:


> According to a new working paper by David J. G. Slusky of the University of Kansas and Leon S. Moskatel of Scripps Mercy Hospital, some people are foregoing ambulances and opting for ride-hailing services instead.


That needs to be made illegal. No driver wants or needs a rider experiencing a medical emergency in their vehicle.


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## SatMan (Mar 20, 2017)

Cary Grant said:


> I've taken perhaps a dozen pax to a walk-in clinic, after hours, with serious sprains, possibly simple fractures, from extra curricular activities at a nearby university (softball, volleyball, etc.). They invariably come in groups, with one or two helping the injured walk.
> 
> The only thing I've cancelled for are people that are bleeding (had several of those, too). If they have an injury that requires pressure to stop the bleeding, my car is not an appropriate form of transportation. Yet, these pax will still try to argue with me, but I'm not doing anything that will result in my car being out of service for possibly a week or more while I have a potential hazardous material removed, and then have to fight tooth and nail with Uber or Lyft for some kind of reimbursement. I've already been there, done that. Bleeding pax are _no bueno. _That includes oozing bandages, bloody hands and fingers, and fresh blood smears on clothing. Every point of contact becomes a bio-hazard problem, and I'm going to exercise my right to refuse them service.
> 
> ...


Call for an ambulance and stay put.


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

Wonkytonk said:


> That needs to be made illegal. No driver wants or needs a rider experiencing a medical emergency in their vehicle.


Thankfully it remains legal.


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## Uber's Guber (Oct 22, 2017)

The way I drive, most pax are ready to have a heart attack by the time the ride is ending.....


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## rex jones (Jun 6, 2017)

I think everyone on this forum would choose the Uber price over an ambulance ride that could cost a couple grand. This conversation shouldn't be about Uber, should be why it cost that much money to take an ambulance ride. Depending on where you live, Uber could totally be quicker.


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## Uber's Guber (Oct 22, 2017)

rex jones said:


> I think everyone on this forum would choose the Uber price over an ambulance ride that could cost a couple grand. This conversation shouldn't be about Uber, should be why it cost that much money to take an ambulance ride. Depending on where you live, Uber could totally be quicker.


No thanks....... if I'm bleeding out or having a heart attack, I'll rely on the professional services of a trained medical team to stabilize me and transport me to a facility that will have a trained medical staff on hand awaiting my arrival.
No way would I put my trust on some pos non-English-speaking Uber driver waiting to cancel on me because he drove to an ally behind the home and let the 5-minute timer run out.


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## Bus Bozo (May 25, 2018)

Uber's Guber said:


> No thanks....... if I'm bleeding out or having a heart attack, I'll rely on the professional services of a trained medical team to stabilize me and transport me to a facility that will have a trained medical staff on hand awaiting my arrival.
> No way would I put my trust on some pos non-English-speaking Uber driver waiting to cancel on me because he drove to an ally behind the home and let the 5-minute timer run out.


I totally agree with you regarding a personal situation, but the masses are ignorant. As an aside, I often get the alley in my neighborhood as my arrival destination, when the address is on the street around the corner. So why would I drive into and wait in the nasty alley?


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## rex jones (Jun 6, 2017)

Uber's Guber said:


> No thanks....... if I'm bleeding out or having a heart attack, I'll rely on the professional services of a trained medical team to stabilize me and transport me to a facility that will have a trained medical staff on hand awaiting my arrival.
> No way would I put my trust on some pos non-English-speaking Uber driver waiting to cancel on me because he drove to an ally behind the home and let the 5-minute timer run out.


I am with you, It depends on the situation and where you live. I would think in most places if you call 911 for a medical issue they are sending an ambulance and billing you.

This is a sensationalized story. Yeah people are calling Uber for a trip to the ER, the same way they call them to go anywhere else.

I think it all depends on where you live. Have you ever called 911 and been put on hold? Happens a lot in Atlanta during peak times.


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## SatMan (Mar 20, 2017)

As long as I get the cleaning fee for delivering a corpse!!!


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## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

Uber's Guber said:


> If you arrive to the emergency room in an Uber or some other form of transportation, you will be waiting to seek attention behind a line of other waiting patients that include illegal aliens who are there to seek free treatment for a common cold.


Incorrect as they triage and those in the most immediate need receive treatment first regardless how the person arrives. They use triage nurses for a reason.


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## Uber's Guber (Oct 22, 2017)

Bus Bozo said:


> As an aside, I often get the alley in my neighborhood as my arrival destination, when the address is on the street around the corner. So why would I drive into and wait in the nasty alley?


To collect 5 bucks and shuffle.


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## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

JimKE said:


> VERY old news, and the subject of numerous threads here on UP for several months.
> 
> One thing rideshare drivers need to clearly understand about providing any kind of medical care to pax -- *you are NOT covered by Good Samaritan Laws* if your state has one. If they are your pax, you are being paid to drive them, and that eliminates GS coverage.
> 
> So 100% of the liability for trying to play doctor falls squarely on your family.


Providing transportation in the back of your vehicle is not providing medical care. Do you have any relevant case law where an Uber / Taxi was convicted of anything simply for providing transportation?

In DC the 911 operators are actually calling rideshare rides for people who their process identifies as needing urgent care but not emergency care.


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## Uber's Guber (Oct 22, 2017)

rex jones said:


> I think it all depends on where you live. Have you ever called 911 and been put on hold? Happens a lot in Atlanta during peak times.


That's Atlanta for you.... drunk boyfriends in Atlanta tie up the system dialing 911 asking where their crack-addicted girlfriend went.


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## Cary Grant (Jul 14, 2015)

I talked to my attorney today, and he guffawed when I suggested that some lay person thinks we're not protected by our state's Good Samaritan Law.

To the contrary, we're potentially liable if we fail to do what a "common sense person" should do, which is drive to the hospital. The rideshare compensation element is not relevant, because we are not medical professionals, expecting compensation specifically for medical treatment.

Bottom line: Talk to your attorney, and ignore the bovine scat urban legend and mythology spread by lay people.


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## Koolbreze (Feb 13, 2017)

Cary Grant said:


> EXCERPT: As a mode of transportation to a hospital when a patients' illness, injury or affliction precludes them from driving, ambulances are a blunt method that is far from perfect. Patients sometimes find themselves hit with substantial bills or end up at out-of-network hospitals that raise the price of care. Recent policy changes may also be exacerbating the situation, as one study found that the Affordable Care Act slowed ambulance response times by almost 20 percent.
> 
> According to a new working paper by David J. G. Slusky of the University of Kansas and Leon S. Moskatel of Scripps Mercy Hospital, some people are foregoing ambulances and opting for ride-hailing services instead.
> 
> ...


fake news


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## JimKE (Oct 28, 2016)

Cary Grant said:


> I talked to my attorney today, and he guffawed when I suggested that some lay person thinks we're not protected by our state's Good Samaritan Law.


Your attorney is wrong. (I have TAUGHT this stuff in EMS classes for 10 years.)

There are two criteria for Good Samaritan law coverage:

*You have to render aid "in good faith."* If you are being _*compensated*_ in any way for being in that place, you are NOT covered by Good Samaritan laws. You don't have to get paid for medical care -- if you are on a ride, you are NOT covered. If you are not on a ride and stop to render aid at the scene of an accident, you most likely ARE covered.
The second criteria is that you must provide treatment *within the scope of your training* (if any), or must provide treatment that a *normal, rational person would think appropriate.*
For example, in a post earlier, someone mentioned giving *aspirin* to a person you think is having a *heart attack*. EMS professionals would be like  to that. Why? 

Well, have you been trained to give aspirin to cardiac patients?
What are the *CONTRA-*indications for aspirin in cardiac patients?
Have you been trained to recognize cardiac issues? 
Have you been trained to ask the appropriate questions to _qualify_ that patient for aspirin treatment? 
What does aspirin do for a heart attack patient? 
Would it be a problem if the patient were having an ischemic stroke instead of a heart attack? 
What about a hemorrhagic stroke?
How do you tell the difference between ischemic and hemorrhagic stroke? (Hint: the world's foremost neurosurgeon couldn't tell the difference in the field.)
If you can't answer all of those questions correctly, you would be blown right out of the water if you gave that patient aspirin...because you violated the scope of your training. You gave a level of care you were not qualified to give -- based on some Internet discussion group posting. No Good Samaritan for you...sorry.



Cary Grant said:


> To the contrary, we're potentially liable if we fail to do what a "common sense person" should do, which is drive to the hospital. The rideshare compensation element is not relevant, because we are not medical professionals, expecting compensation specifically for medical treatment.


I checked your Texas Good Samaritan Law, and you have a VERY broad law. Good for you.

First of all, *driving someone to a hospital is NOT providing care*. Totally different.

Under Texas GS law, an untrained person is protected unless they do something that is *"willfully and wantonly negligent." * That is extremely broad -- much more liberal than most state laws.

Giving treatment you are not trained to give *would* probably be classified as willfully and wantonly negligent," but normal first aid would probably not. So if you made a cardiac patient more comfortable while you waited for rescue, you'd be fine. If you gave them aspirin with no clue what you were doing, you'd be less than fine.


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## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

JimKE said:


> Your attorney is wrong. (I have TAUGHT this stuff in EMS classes for 10 years.)


That means absolutely nothing. What are your qualifications for giving legal advice that makes your opinion of law of greater value than that of a lawyer?


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## rex jones (Jun 6, 2017)

Uber's Guber said:


> That's Atlanta for you.... drunk boyfriends in Atlanta tie up the system dialing 911 asking where their crack-addicted girlfriend went.


This is Atlanta dude. Drunk boyfriends calling the cops on their crack addicted boyfriends!


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## Cary Grant (Jul 14, 2015)

I'll take my attorney's advice over any lay person, all day long, every day of the week.


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## melusine3 (Jun 20, 2016)

jazzapt said:


> Yet another risk we take as Uber drivers. If they tell you before hand they are having a heart attack, you cancel, and that person dies, can the family sue? Or if you take them and don't take a route that's fast enough and they die, can the family sue?
> 
> All for $0.70 a mile!


If someone told me they thought they were having a heart attack, i would simply call 911 and wait for the paramedics to arrive. I know from cardiac, but I'm not going to be driving the patient to the hospital. Bleeding? NOPE. Sick? Naw.

I arrived to pick someone up about a week ago, took him a while to shuffle out and he took a sudden detour to the side of the yard where he was coughing/hacking/puking. It took me ten seconds to mull this over, but I cancelled and booked it out of there. 1) I've picked up a guy from an urgent care center who said he had eaten bad food. It was the flu and I came down with it in 2 days. For a $3 ride these inconsiderate punks foist themselves on the unwitting Uber driver. I had another guy when I first started driving also obviously sick, think nothing of expose me. I was sick 4 days over that one. This is why I check everyone out through the window before I let them in my car now. Life is too short.



Cary Grant said:


> I've taken perhaps a dozen pax to a walk-in clinic, after hours, with serious sprains, possibly simple fractures, from extra curricular activities at a nearby university (softball, volleyball, etc.). They invariably come in groups, with one or two helping the injured walk.
> 
> The only thing I've cancelled for are people that are bleeding (had several of those, too). If they have an injury that requires pressure to stop the bleeding, my car is not an appropriate form of transportation. Yet, these pax will still try to argue with me, but I'm not doing anything that will result in my car being out of service for possibly a week or more while I have a potential hazardous material removed, and then have to fight tooth and nail with Uber or Lyft for some kind of reimbursement. I've already been there, done that. Bleeding pax are _no bueno. _That includes oozing bandages, bloody hands and fingers, and fresh blood smears on clothing. Every point of contact becomes a bio-hazard problem, and I'm going to exercise my right to refuse them service.
> 
> ...


Pull over at the safest and earliest place and dial 911. If they are arresting, get them out of the car (if you can) check to see if they're breathing, if they have a pulse and if no pulse, start compressions. Taking a CPR class is a good idea, just generally.



Uber's Guber said:


> No thanks....... if I'm bleeding out or having a heart attack, I'll rely on the professional services of a trained medical team to stabilize me and transport me to a facility that will have a trained medical staff on hand awaiting my arrival.
> No way would I put my trust on some pos non-English-speaking Uber driver waiting to cancel on me because he drove to an ally behind the home and let the 5-minute timer run out.


No kidding! Five minutes and you're brain dead. Good luck with trying to go on the cheap.


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## JimKE (Oct 28, 2016)

melusine3 said:


> Pull over at the safest and earliest place and dial 911. If they are arresting, get them out of the car (if you can) check to see if they're breathing, if they have a pulse and if no pulse, start compressions. Taking a CPR class is a good idea, just generally.


A CPR class is a good idea for anybody, and you can usually find inexpensive layperson CPR classes from either the American Heart Association (AHA) or the Red Cross. Certainly something anybody with kids or elderly parents should know -- not for pax, but for your own loved ones.

If you don't want to spend a couple hours taking an actual class, at least go to YouTube and watch any of the excellent AHA videos on "Hands-Only CPR." Here's a link to one of them -- playful, but good info: 




"Hands-Only" works because the body consumes only about 1/4 of the oxygen taken in during each respiration cycle. The remaining 75% stays in the body, and circulating the blood with chest compressions moves that remaining oxygen back through vital organs. Two simple steps:

*Dial 911*
*Push hard and fast* (with your elbows locked) *on the center of the chest.* (And yes, do it to the beat of "Stayin' Alive!")
It really IS that easy.


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

Cary Grant said:


> I talked to my attorney today, and he guffawed when I suggested that some lay person thinks we're not protected by our state's Good Samaritan Law.
> 
> To the contrary, we're potentially liable if we fail to do what a "common sense person" should do, which is drive to the hospital. The rideshare compensation element is not relevant, because we are not medical professionals, expecting compensation specifically for medical treatment.
> 
> Bottom line: Talk to your attorney, and ignore the bovine scat urban legend and mythology spread by lay people.


What law did your attorney cite when you spoke with him?


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## Cary Grant (Jul 14, 2015)

Demon said:


> What law did your attorney cite when you spoke with him?


The only law that matters to me: Texas State Law.


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

Cary Grant said:


> The only law that matters to me: Texas State Law.


Yes, which Texas state law did he cite?


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## Cary Grant (Jul 14, 2015)

Demon said:


> Yes, which Texas state law did he cite?


I pay for my legal advice. You should pay for your own.


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

Cary Grant said:


> I pay for my legal advice. You should pay for your own.


If your lawyer couldn't cite a law relevant to this subject you either didn't speak to an attorney or should find a new one.


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## Cary Grant (Jul 14, 2015)

Demon said:


> If your lawyer couldn't cite a law relevant to this subject you either didn't speak to an attorney or should find a new one.


Nice try, but you get an epic F minus. I work with attorneys every single day, and have for over thirty years. I can hit one with a paperwad from my desk during business hours, without trying hard. When I need cheap (but not free) legal advice, I just ask my girlfriend. She's laughing at YOU right now.

If you can't afford an attorney, then you get to rely on free advice from anonymous lay people, fools, and assorted trolls. Enjoy.


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

Cary Grant said:


> Nice try, but you get an epic F minus. I work with attorneys every single day, and have for over thirty years. I can hit one with a paperwad from my desk during business hours, without trying hard. When I need cheap (but not free) legal advice, I just ask my girlfriend. She's laughing at YOU right now.
> 
> If you can't afford an attorney, then you get to rely on free advice from anonymous lay people, fools, and assorted trolls. Enjoy.


You're girlfriend is laughing at me because you can't answer a question??? I'm not so sure she's laughing at me. A few hours ago your lawyer was a guy, now it's suddenly your girlfriend.


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## Cary Grant (Jul 14, 2015)

Demon said:


> You're girlfriend is laughing at me because you can't answer a question??? I'm not so sure she's laughing at me. A few hours ago your lawyer was a guy, now it's suddenly your girlfriend.


You lose again.

She looked over my shoulder, read your drivel, laughed out loud, and said "That's a moron. Stop wasting your time with that pigeon. You know he can't play chess."

She's right. Bye, Felicia!


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

Cary Grant said:


> You lose again.
> 
> She looked over my shoulder, read your drivel, laughed out loud, and said "That's a moron. Stop wasting your time with that pigeon. You know he can't play chess."
> 
> She's right. Bye, Felicia!


Not surprised at all that you're turning tail and running.


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