# I did an expense analysis of the true numbers of working with rideshare



## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

Uber and Lyft wonder where all the drivers have gone? I think I found out. 

The prices of everything are going up. Everything. Gas, car repairs, groceries, phone bills, internet, you name it. Up drastically in the last few months. You know what hasn't gone up in the last few months? The rates drivers are being paid.

I drive an older car so that built-in equity is no longer there. Things wear out, and I have to replace them. The honeymoon is over, in other words. I did some averaging cost analysis over the last 3 years of repairs driving for Uber and Lyft. I found it my car requires $24 every day that I drive it just to keep it safely on the road. We'll keep that figure in mind.

Now let's look at the price of gas. I'm averaging about $100 every week to put in the tank.

I drove for 7 hours on a Wednesday in Gainesville Florida. I came home with about $8 per hour, which is on the low end of the usual $8 to $20 an hour.

Factoring in the previous figures for maintenance and gas, I came up with this.

Gas - $2.04 per hour
Maintenance - $3.42 per hour

What's left? $2.54 per hour

On a slower day I can be working for Uber and Lyft and taking home $2.54 per hour. Take out your own calculator and do your math. It's the hidden costs that get you. 

Yes, I am indeed looking for other sources of income.


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## SpinalCabbage (Feb 5, 2020)

My vehicle costs me $0.29 per mile to operate when gas is $5 a gallon (it was $5 a gallon when I figured out my per mile cost and I never bothered to recalculate).

I used an online calculator. Not sure which one I used, but here is the first one to pop up when I do a search:





__





Calculate Total Vehicle Cost Per Mile - MilesGallon.com


Calculate what it will cost you to own a specific vehicle per mile over the lifetime of the vehicle, including cost to aquire it, repairs, insurance and gas



www.milesgallon.com


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

I have been using the actual figures from my bank account. It's a simple matter to search for Shell, for instance, over the last month.

For car repairs, I depend on the printed invoices.

I would trust my actual numbers more than a calculator or rule of thumb, especially with prices changing so rapidly.


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## SpinalCabbage (Feb 5, 2020)

IDriveGNV said:


> I have been using the actual figures from my bank account. It's a simple matter to search for Shell, for instance, over the last month.
> 
> For car repairs, I depend on the printed invoices.
> 
> I would trust my actual numbers more than a calculator or rule of thumb, especially with prices changing so rapidly.


You spelled "I don't know what in the hell I am talking about" wrong.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

I'd be curious to know how other drivers are faring these days. (Pun unintentional.) Using your actual numbers from receipts, bank account and such, how do your numbers look after gas and maintenance?


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## SpinalCabbage (Feb 5, 2020)

Depreciation and replacement cost should be factored in. Unless you're going to pretend that such things don't factor in to this calculation.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

That would be if you're using a formula to find your numbers, for instance to plug them into a tax form. I'm not using a formula in this case, I'm using the actual numbers using my real life car and expenses.

I see what you're suggesting. Instead of using a formula for my maintenance cost, I'm just using the actual paper invoices. And as for depreciation, I'm not interested in that for these purposes. I'm just determining what's going out and what's coming in.

I can almost guarantee if I were to use a formula I would come up with entirely different numbers, compared to the actual expenses showing up on my bank account.


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## SpinalCabbage (Feb 5, 2020)

IDriveGNV said:


> That would be if you're using a formula to find your numbers, for instance to plug them into a tax form. I'm not using a formula in this case, I'm using the actual numbers using my real life car and expenses.
> 
> I can almost guarantee if I were to use a formula for myself I would come up with entirely different numbers, compared to the actual expenses.


Nothing wrong with your numbers. You're just not factoring in enough variables.... in my opinion.


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## JeanOcelot0 (Dec 30, 2020)

IDriveGNV said:


> I drove for 7 hours on a Wednesday in Gainesville Florida. I came home with about $8 per hour ...


Yes, but you get to taxi around drunk Gatorette coeds.


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## JeanOcelot0 (Dec 30, 2020)

IDriveGNV said:


> I'd be curious to know how other drivers are faring these days. (Pun unintentional.) Using your actual numbers from receipts, bank account and such, how do your numbers look after gas and maintenance?


I think most ants are in denial.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> I'd be curious to know how other drivers are faring these days. (Pun unintentional.) Using your actual numbers from receipts, bank account and such, how do your numbers look after gas and maintenance?


2020 Year to date: Actual numbers: Gross hourly $30.78. After all expenses including depreciation, $25.11 per hour. Gross per mile $1.36, profit per mile $1.11. Been doing this a LONG time and I know my market. I work the peak hours and a lot of late late nights on weekends until the sun comes up.


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## justaGoober (Mar 12, 2019)

IDriveGNV said:


> I drove for 7 hours on a Wednesday in Gainesville Florida. I came home with about $8 per hour, which is on the low end of the usual $8 to $20 an hour.


I’m really surprised that anyone would work for $8/hr…..or even $20/hr, before expenses. You must really enjoy it. Not trying to be flippant.


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## JeanOcelot0 (Dec 30, 2020)

justaGoober said:


> I’m really surprised that anyone would work for $8/hr…..or even $20/hr, before expenses. You must really enjoy it. Not trying to be flippant.


Yes, I'm sure the ant enjoys eating ...


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

JeanOcelot0 said:


> Yes, but you get to taxi around drunk Gatorette coeds.


Actually I try to avoid the bar hopping crowd. They're usually going less than a mile, so the $2.24 minimum that Lyft pays could actually put you into debt.

This time of year the University students are away, so supply and demand goes to crap across the city. The same fleet of drivers are out driving but a large part of the population is gone. I am indeed looking at some other reliable income streams.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

justaGoober said:


> I’m really surprised that anyone would work for $8/hr…..or even $20/hr, before expenses. You must really enjoy it. Not trying to be flippant.


Gig work is great because it's available when I need it. I do enjoy meeting the passengers and learning to avoid the bad apples. I'm finding the hidden cost of vehicle maintenance can make it hardly profitable though.

It was much better years ago.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

Ted Fink said:


> 2020 Year to date: Actual numbers: Gross hourly $30.78. After all expenses including depreciation, $25.11 per hour.


Are you doing that in Gainesville Florida? I know every city is a test tube to Uber. Gainesville appears to be one of the lowest paying areas I've heard of.


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## Seamus (Jun 21, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> I'd be curious to know how other drivers are faring these days. (Pun unintentional.) Using your actual numbers from receipts, bank account and such, how do your numbers look after gas and maintenance?


In all seriousness many ants can’t even be bothered keeping a mileage log let alone tracking expenses. I applaud you for attempting to figure out your profit and tracking expenses/keeping receipts.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> Are you doing that in Gainesville Florida? I know every city is a test tube to Uber. Gainesville appears to be one of the lowest paying areas I've heard of.


No, I'm in Pennsylvania. And yeah, sounds like you are definitely in a low paying area. How much do you get paid per mile for UberX there?


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

The rate is $0.83 per mile here. And 10 cents per minute. You?


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> Uber and Lyft wonder where all the drivers have gone? I think I found out.
> 
> The prices of everything are going up. Everything. Gas, car repairs, groceries, phone bills, internet, you name it. Up drastically in the last few months. You know what hasn't gone up in the last few months? The rates drivers are being paid.
> 
> ...


You're claiming you are spending $6k+ annually on maintenance? You'd be well served to find a more reliable vehicular.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> The rate is $0.83 per mile here. And 10 cents per minute. You?


$1.35 / 19c. That in and of itself doesn't do much, most trips here very short. But the hours I work I'm usually nonstop pings.


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## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

IDriveGNV said:


> Are you doing that in Gainesville Florida? I know every city is a test tube to Uber. Gainesville appears to be one of the lowest paying areas I've heard of.


I have a few issues with your posts on this topic, here goes:
This gig has to make sense to do, otherwise you shouldn't be doing it.
There probably is not a lot of business during the day in Gainesville and you are competing with bored lonely retirees who don't care what they make.
Coming up with a per day expense for your vehicle doesn't make a lot of sense to me. $24 a day for 50 miles, 100 miles, ???, what if you are busy and go a long distance? Per mile cost is a better indicator. 
Bottom line: it's not profitable for you to drive where you are when you are so you probably shouldn't be doing it.

I have an old beat up van, do XL etc... 
my costs are approx. 33 cents a mile whether I have a passenger or not.: 
5 cents a mile for the vehicle assuming I get 100K miles out of it then it's worthless
18 cents a mile for gas assuming $3 a gallon
10 cents mile for insurance, registration and maintenance. 

Roughly 2 paid miles for every dead mile so my cost per pax mile is 50 cents. I only drive when there is surge or incentives, i.e. Friday and Saturday nights. I simply can't make a decent amount of money driving X passengers during the day.


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## Johnny Mnemonic (Sep 24, 2019)

The method I used to calculate net was a calculator like the one mentioned here. I know that my car costs .30 to .35/ mile depending on gas prices.

I also would use my trip computer in my car to get my average mph while anting, which was 28 mph.

28mph times .35 cents per mile is $9.8 dollars/hour in expenses. I would just take my gross and subtract (hours times 9.8)

If I grossed $25/hour I knew I was making $15-16 /hour pre-tax. Not worth risking my car and body if minimum wage California is $14/hour.


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

Ted Fink said:


> 2020 Year to date: Actual numbers: Gross hourly $30.78. After all expenses including depreciation, $25.11 per hour. Gross per mile $1.36, profit per mile $1.11. Been doing this a LONG time and I know my market. I work the peak hours and a lot of late late nights on weekends until the sun comes up.





Johnny Mnemonic said:


> The method I used was a calculator like the one mentioned here. I know that my car costs .30 to .35/ mile depending on gas prices.
> 
> I also would use my trip computer in my car to get my average mph while anting, which was 28 mph.
> 
> ...


How did you get to the $0.35/mile? I think folks are grossly inflating the actual marginal costs. Gas should be $0.10/mile. Mileage depreciation is $0.05/miles. Insurance is not an incremental cost, it is something you would have for the vehicle anyways. Vehicle depreciation do to time/aging is not an incremental cost - the vehicular would lose that value regardless just from being in existence with the passage of time. You can buy 4 tires at $48/pop that last 40k miles - thats another $0.0048/mile. An oil change is $20. A Honda Civic costs $368/year for maintenance (due to increased mileage, I'll increase it 3x to $1,104) - over 40k miles/year, that's $0.0276. Total, I'm getting $0.1824/mile.


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## DallasFortWorthDriver (Jun 10, 2021)

IDriveGNV said:


> Uber and Lyft wonder where all the drivers have gone? I think I found out.
> 
> The prices of everything are going up. Everything. Gas, car repairs, groceries, phone bills, internet, you name it. Up drastically in the last few months. You know what hasn't gone up in the last few months? The rates drivers are being paid.
> 
> ...


You will have higher income if you work for Target for $15/hr than if you drive for UBER or Lyft. Think about it. They manipulate you any way they want without you even knowing. They will not pay all tolls, they will starve you of rides if you decline short-trip rides for any reason whatsoever, be it your voluntary or involuntary choice. In this game, you are the one that renders the service and they are the ones who profit the most on your back, and still complain and make your life miserable if you don't comply to their rules.
These are my rules: 

if the trip to the ride is less than 50% of the ride itself, I will not take it or will cancel it if I do.
if I make less than $30/hr in rides, I will drive back home, and be done for the day.
if I get stuck with rides within a suspicious neighborhood, I will go offline and resurface someplace else.
if the GPS takes me to the wrong pickup location and the turnaround will take more than 2 miles or it will take more than 10 minutes due to traffic conditions in the area, I cancel the ride.
Both, UBER and LYFT are full of BS and their system has been programmed to hurt you, the driver.
I am in the process of getting another job right now. But for those continuing in this torment activity, consider getting together, form a union and use this site to coordinate all the regional activities, such as a strike, a protest, etc. Without solidarity, we are just pawns on their hands and we will ALWAYS lose. 
United, we can find out all the tricks they play and inform other location groups around the country, like airport queues, rides starvation, area confinement, how they remunerate our trips (including tolls, time spent, trip to pickup driver, the trip itself - all in full detail, and compare with what they do. You will be disappointed and very p-off to find out!


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## DallasFortWorthDriver (Jun 10, 2021)

ftupelo said:


> How did you get to the $0.35/mile? I think folks are grossly inflating the actual marginal costs. Gas should be $0.10/mile. Mileage depreciation is $0.05/miles. Insurance is not an incremental cost, it is something you would have for the vehicle anyways. Vehicle depreciation do to time/aging is not an incremental cost - the vehicular would lose that value regardless just from being in existence with the passage of time. You can buy 4 tires at $48/pop that last 40k miles - thats another $0.0048/mile. An oil change is $20. A Honda Civic costs $368/year for maintenance (due to increased mileage, I'll increase it 3x to $1,104) - over 40k miles/year, that's $0.0276. Total, I'm getting $0.1824/mile.


Gee, guys! I was at the airport waiting area the other day, and I overheard some naïve drivers bragging they bought their vehicles just to offer a better ride to UBER passengers, certain they were getting the best part of the deal. Can you believe it? I want to see what these guys would do as their trips start starving and they end up making $100 by the end of the day (if they were lucky).


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## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

ftupelo said:


> How did you get to the $0.35/mile? I think folks are grossly inflating the actual marginal costs. Gas should be $0.10/mile. Mileage depreciation is $0.05/miles. Insurance is not an incremental cost, it is something you would have for the vehicle anyways. Vehicle depreciation do to time/aging is not an incremental cost - the vehicular would lose that value regardless just from being in existence with the passage of time. You can buy 4 tires at $48/pop that last 40k miles - thats another $0.0048/mile. An oil change is $20. A Honda Civic costs $368/year for maintenance (due to increased mileage, I'll increase it 3x to $1,104) - over 40k miles/year, that's $0.0276. Total, I'm getting $0.1824/mile.


I think it depends on your situation and whether you do the work yourself or not. 
I drive a 2009 Dodge Grand Caravan just for rideshare so insurance and registration are valid expenses.Mileage depreciation is 5cents for me going from a 5K purchase price assuming I get 100K miles and then throw the thing away. If you bought one new it would be higherand even a used 10K vehicle, can you count on getting 200K out of it without increased maintenance expenses? I don't know where you are getting your oil changes for $20 unless you are doing them yourself and $48 tires, again, are you mounting and balancing yourself? With that said, if you were still able to get a cheap low mileage older Civic or Corolla I would think you can get it into the 22 to 25 cent range.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

ftupelo said:


> How did you get to the $0.35/mile?


Hmm... some ting not right. I'm using $0.25/mile. $1.36 minus $1.11 is $0.25... ?


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## Johnny Mnemonic (Sep 24, 2019)

ftupelo said:


> Gas should be $0.10/mile.


Your numbers might work in Texas, but in CA all those numbers are different.

The gas, average price/gal my market is $4.38










My real world mileage (not the fairy-tale EPA highway numbers) on my 09 Corolla is 29 mpg. Thats 0.151, not ten cents.

Registration is $302/year in CA for my car.



ftupelo said:


> An oil change is $20.


Lol, okay.

Cheapest set of tires at Costco is $524 for set of 4 80,000 mi warranty. $0.0065/mi (doesn't include 9.75% state/county sales tax or tire recycling fee.)










Et Cetera, Et Cetera. There's other stuff too, but you get the idea.

Your numbers work on paper in Texas, but in real world San Francisco Bay Area they do not.

Even if they did, that's 19$/hour. No workman's comp, no disability, no SSI contribution. $2500 deductible, no healthcare, no sick/vacation.

And all of the above assumes no interest cost from financing, no tickets, and no accidents.

I can get paid that pushing shopping carts at the above Costco with full benefits.


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

So, gas is slightly more. I pulled the tires from a site, so it’s possible. Registration is a cost you would pay regardless. Sounds like we generally agree and the $0.35 is entirely too high. Perhaps adding $0.05 to the $0.18 I quoted is more accurate.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

ftupelo said:


> So, gas is slightly more. I pulled the tires from a site, so it’s possible. Registration is a cost you would pay regardless. Sounds like we generally agree and the $0.35 is entirely too high. Perhaps adding $0.05 to the $0.18 I quoted is more accurate.


Really depends what you drive. My wife's Honda Pilot gets 18mpg and my Accord Hybrid gets 44. HUGE DIFFERENCE.

Also depends whether or not your car is a piece of crap. Maintenance needy cars cost more because they break alot.


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## Johnny Mnemonic (Sep 24, 2019)

ftupelo said:


> So, gas is slightly more. I pulled the tires from a site, so it’s possible. Registration is a cost you would pay regardless. Sounds like we generally agree and the $0.35 is entirely too high. Perhaps adding $0.05 to the $0.18 I quoted is more accurate.


I see your point. Yes, if you drop insurance, registration, and time depreciation cost it would be closer to your number.

But I still think you're underestimating the risk premium involved. I'm sure risk is minimal doing Lyft Lux around Highland Park, but that's not everyone's market.









Open Forum: Driving for Uber, Lyft, GrubHub and others is one of the most dangerous jobs in the country


Thinking about becoming a gig driver for Uber, Lyft, GrubHub or others? You may be...




www.sfchronicle.com


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

Johnny Mnemonic said:


> I see your point. Yes, if you drop insurance, registration, and time depreciation cost it would be closer to your number.
> 
> But I still think you're underestimating the risk premium involved. I'm sure risk is minimal doing Lyft Lux around Highland Park, but that's not everyone's market.
> 
> ...


What risks do you refer to? Carjackings/robbery or more like accidents?

I’ve seen the news stories like everyone else, but I’m not certain how frequentthe crimes really are. I certainly understand the risk of being on the road and putting oneself in danger from logging so many hours.

I think I started a thread asking when enough was enough. I pondered out loud whether the extra scratch I was making was worth the risk, particularly when I don’t need the money whatsoever.


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## SpinalCabbage (Feb 5, 2020)

ftupelo said:


> What risks do you refer to? Carjackings/robbery or more like accidents?
> 
> I’ve seen the news stories like everyone else, but I’m not certain how frequentthe crimes really are. I certainly understand the risk of being on the road and putting oneself in danger from logging so many hours.
> 
> I think I started a thread asking when enough was enough. I pondered out loud whether the extra scratch I was making was worth the risk, particularly when I don’t need the money whatsoever.


"I think I started a thread asking when enough was enough. I pondered out loud whether the extra scratch I was making was worth the risk, particularly when I don’t need the money whatsoever."

It would be a silly waste of a rich man's time to drive rideshare. If you had some desire to serve the community there are better, more profitable, uses of your time. Rideshare is for bored retirees and bored housewives and desperate people in need of a buck.


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

SpinalCabbage said:


> "I think I started a thread asking when enough was enough. I pondered out loud whether the extra scratch I was making was worth the risk, particularly when I don’t need the money whatsoever."
> 
> It would be a silly waste of a rich man's time to drive rideshare. If you had some desire to serve the community there are better, more profitable, uses of your time. Rideshare is for bored retirees and bored housewives and desperate people in need of a buck.


I don’t need the bucks, but I enjoy bucking the trend. I also drive because it keeps me humble and grounded. I live in one of the richest zip codes in the country and can see how snobby some neighbors can be. It’s humbling to be of service to others and rewarding to keep my community moving. It allows me to give back to my community and give back to this community.


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## Johnny Mnemonic (Sep 24, 2019)

ftupelo said:


> What risks do you refer to? Carjackings/robbery or more like accidents?
> 
> I’ve seen the news stories like everyone else, but I’m not certain how frequentthe crimes really are. I certainly understand the risk of being on the road and putting oneself in danger from logging so many hours.
> 
> I think I started a thread asking when enough was enough. I pondered out loud whether the extra scratch I was making was worth the risk, particularly when I don’t need the money whatsoever.


Fatalities, accidents, and crime (personal and property).

From the article I linked: 

_I used recent BLS data to estimate risks and job percentile rankings. The non-fatal injury rate estimate for Uber and Lyft drivers is 173.8 per 10,000 full-time workers, with percentile rank 13.0. This indicates that 86.9% of jobs have lower injury rates and 12.9% have higher injury rates.
The fatality rate for Uber and Lyft drivers is 14.6 per 100,000 full-time workers, with percentile rank 19.4. This indicates that 80.5% of jobs have lower fatality risks and 19.3% have higher fatality risks.
For GrubHub drivers, the non-fatality rate is 205.7 per 10,000 with percentile rank 9.0; the fatality rate is 24.8 per-100,000 with percentile rank 10.6._

The Author : Paul Leigh is professor emeritus in the Department of Public Health Sciences at UC Davis, and the author of two books about dangerous jobs and occupational safety and health.

These are not inconsequential numbers or one in a million risks. You do Lux in a SUV around Highland Park, very low risk. But what about the ant that does GrubHub on a bicycle in the Bronx after 11pm in the rain?


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

Johnny Mnemonic said:


> Fatalities, accidents, and crime (personal and property).
> 
> From the article I linked:
> 
> ...


I appreciate you providing facts - this is the yep of dialogue that adds immense value to these discussions. I would not have pegged the risks to be that high.

I’ve acknowledged the collison risks associated with driving and asked for input from others on how they think about that risk vs the reward from driving. Of course, I don’t believe I receive much thoughtful feedback.

I have not, until now, appreciate the full spectrum and frequency of the risks experienced by Ants. You are right that I have consciously avoided all services except for Lux primarily to select for higher quality pax. Plus, the dollars from X really aren’t worth my while.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

ftupelo said:


> You are right that I have consciously avoided all services except for Lux primarily to select for higher quality pax. Plus, the dollars from X really aren’t worth my while.


If your goal is to serve the community as you stated, you might try driving all platforms you are eligible for. Doing lux only - you're serving mostly people with $

Also you said you drive to stay grounded and stay humble. Is it working? Some of your posts in this thread would seem to contradict that... gigabrain for example? Just sayin.


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

Ted Fink said:


> If your goal is to serve the community as you stated, you might try driving all platforms you are eligible for. Doing lux only - you're serving mostly people with $
> 
> Also you said you drive to stay grounded and stay humble. Is it working? Some of your posts in this thread would seem to contradict that... gigabrain for example? Just sayin.


Well I live in one of the wealthiest and most exclusive zip codes on the planet, so driving lux does allow me to serve my community. During the acute driver shortage, Lux was often cheaper than regular Lyft, so I did get a mix of pax. One of my most rewarding rides recently involved taking a young African-American gentleman to his job early one weekend morning. He had been cancelled on numerous times (even on Lux) before I came through to save the day. In fact, many of my early morning weekend trips are taking folks to work (and not just sex workers).

Anting has kept me quite humble. What may come off as braggadocio here is really just extreme transparency. To best educate the Ants and serve as a role model for success and achievement, it’s important for me to be an open kimono regarding my career, education, wealth, etc.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

ftupelo said:


> You're claiming you are spending $6k+ annually on maintenance? You'd be well served to find a more reliable vehicular.


I agree. I like the car I've got, and it's paid for. It should be reasonable enough to be able to cover the maintenance costs. But I'm discovering the hidden secret of working for rideshare. You're donating the equity of your car to the rideshare company. I could buy a newer car but in time I think I would be in the same position.


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## BestInDaWest (Apr 8, 2021)

yawn....


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> I agree. I like the car I've got, and it's paid for. It should be reasonable enough to be able to cover the maintenance costs. But I'm discovering the hidden secret of working for rideshare. You're donating the equity of your car to the rideshare company. I could buy a newer car but in time I think I would be in the same position.


I don't care how much you like the car, if you are really spending that much annually, you need to switch it out for a low-cost option. In your case, instead of donating automobile equity to UBER, you are donating your time and labor to your mechanic.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

Update. Yesterday I drove for 5 hours and came home with $7 per hour. Subtracting the $5.50 cost from my earlier comments leaves $1.50 per hour that I get to keep. Thanks Uber for such a fair deal.

Here are the headwinds I'm dealing with. It's a college town and classes are out so one third of the population is missing. Slowest time of the year. As I mentioned previously the rate of pay is $0.83 a mile plus $0.10 per minute. I believe that's lower than most places in the country. I don't know why Uber/Lyft are crapping on Gainesville.

The students that are still in town are rebelling en masse against wearing masks. Their behavior is gradually getting worse. For instance last night around 9 p.m. I ended my shift because I had two pick ups in a row standing there with no mask even after ignoring the reminder text I send them. About half of the drivers here do not require masks, and many students have decided that's the way it's going to be. You may know my feelings about the pandemic from other threads. I reject any passenger that shows me they don't possess a mask after a year-and-a-half of the pandemic. This means they're spending hundreds of hours in the bars and socializing without any PPE. Putting a leaky mask on the face of such a person does not reduce my risk very much. And so several times a day I have to waste time rejecting an unhygienic passenger.

This is why I don't dispense masks for them. I've seen them getting out of Ubers and tossing their masks on the ground. Students often make no effort to block covid spread. People have different opinions, but what I've chosen to do is protect myself from the new variants and actual spike proteins being spread between people these days.

So I'm not willing to put myself at extra risk for every $3 ride that comes along. Especially since it's often a $2.24 ride.

Uber and Lyft, this is why you suck and drivers know it.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> It's a college town and classes are out so one third of the population is missing. Slowest time of the year. As I mentioned previously the rate of pay is $0.83 a mile plus $0.10 per minute. I believe that's lower than most places in the country. I don't know why Uber/Lyft are crapping on Gainesville.


I'm in a college town too. So I drive a lot when the students are in and only a little when students are out. I buffer the swings by saving 1/2 of my $ when students are in, then can draw on that when they are out. Takes the pressure off to work even more hours for lower returns in the summer, which is what I did the first few years and it sucked.

As to the pay rate, most of my state is around that 82.5c per mile rate. The market I'm in is an oddity. And there are two markets in the state that pay way low like 62 cents or something. I haven't looked around the whole country, but 82.5c per mile might be about the middle of the pay rates available. 

So advice, to you, is drive more when it's busy, save $ for when it's not, and take a look at nearby markets to see if there are any with a higher pay rate that are reasonable to drive to.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

ftupelo said:


> I don't care how much you like the car, if you are really spending that much annually, you need to switch it out for a low-cost option. In your case, instead of donating automobile equity to UBER, you are donating your time and labor to your mechanic.


Good points, and I am considering it. But I'm also aware that buying a newer vehicle to beat up just hides the cost. The time and labor I'm paying to my mechanic ends up in Uber's pocket much more than mine. I would have to go into debt to buy a newer vehicle, just to see its equity siphoned off in the same manner.


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> Putting a leaky mask on the face of such a person does not reduce my risk very much.


This comment does not foot with the rest of your post. You admit they are essentially useless yet waste 5 paragraphs saying otherwise.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

ftupelo said:


> This comment does not foot with the rest of your post. You admit they are essentially useless yet waste 5 paragraphs saying otherwise.


The store bought masks people use have been shown to leak about 30% past the nose and around the sides. I did some research and I have built a much better mask for myself. I have found that shop towels, the light blue felt-like material used by mechanics, makes an excellent addition to a mask as it's claimed it is a 93% filter when tested by one company. I eliminate most of the leakage by fashioning a copper grounding wire to fit around the edges of the mask and hold it against my face. I can tell that I am now breathing through the mask filter and not past it. Removing the wire makes it much easier to breathe, which shows how much the mask was leaking without it.

I probably wouldn't drive in this environment if I wasn't able to fashion a better alternative. Fresh air circulation, and not letting dirtbags in my car keeps my risk at a manageable level.

A carelessly infected person who has to borrow a leaky mask to get a cheap ride from you is a serious risk. However, the person who keeps the mask with them and puts it on without being asked probably washes their hands and socially distances when appropriate. A much better, lower-risk passenger.

It's much easier to reduce pandemic risks than to reduce Uber's greed. I can see my ridesharing coming to an end soon.


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## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

IDriveGNV said:


> Update. Yesterday I drove for 5 hours and came home with $7 per hour. Subtracting the $5.50 cost from my earlier comments leaves $1.50 per hour that I get to keep. Thanks Uber for such a fair deal.
> 
> Here are the headwinds I'm dealing with. It's a college town and classes are out so one third of the population is missing. Slowest time of the year. As I mentioned previously the rate of pay is $0.83 a mile plus $0.10 per minute. I believe that's lower than most places in the country. I don't know why Uber/Lyft are crapping on Gainesville.
> 
> ...


After Uber's cut I get 61 cents per mile and 11 cents a minute on X, 94 cents a mile, 14 cents a minute for XL. There is no way you can make money at those rates UNLESS you have some combination of surge, quest, consecutive ride bonuses etc... I average over $1.25 a mile driven because I understand that you don't work when there's no work to be had. Why would you even consider going out under your circumstances?


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> The store bought masks people use have been shown to leak about 30% past the nose and around the sides. I did some research and I have built a much better mask for myself. I have found that shop towels, the light blue felt-like material used by mechanics, makes an excellent addition to a mask as it's claimed it is a 93% filter when tested by one company. I eliminate most of the leakage by fashioning a copper grounding wire to fit around the edges of the mask and hold it against my face. I can tell that I am now breathing through the mask filter and not past it. Removing the wire makes it much easier to breathe, which shows how much the mask was leaking without it.
> 
> I probably wouldn't drive in this environment if I wasn't able to fashion a better alternative. Fresh air circulation, and not letting dirtbags in my car keeps my risk at a manageable level.
> 
> It's much easier to reduce pandemic risks than to reduce Uber's greed. I can see my ridesharing coming to an end soon.


Questions. Are you vaccinated and with which company’s jab? Why not just wear an N95? If you are so satisfied with the level of protection provided by your device and the ineffectiveness of surgical masks, why do you care about Pax wearing a mask?


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> Good points, and I am considering it. But I'm also aware that buying a newer vehicle to beat up just hides the cost. The time and labor I'm paying to my mechanic ends up in Uber's pocket much more than mine. I would have to go into debt to buy a newer vehicle, just to see its equity siphoned off in the same manner.


Don't buy a new car for rideshare. Buy a new car if that's what you want or need. Unless you are full time, this is a side gig and is not important enough to buy a car for.

If your car is paid for, it's almost always cheaper to keep it going than it is to replace it. Ever listen to Car Talk on NPR?


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

ftupelo said:


> Questions. Are you vaccinated and with which company’s jab? Why not just wear an N95? If you are so satisfied with the level of protection provided by your device and the ineffectiveness of surgical masks, why do you care about Pax wearing a mask?


 Disgusted Driver, I am indeed considering why I'm going out. Until I took out the calculator I had no idea the numbers were so bad.

I'm not going to be accepting a fake vaccination, as I truly believe it does more damage than good. The reasons I believe so belong in a different thread. I take a naturopath approach, by supporting my immune system and doing nothing to compromise it.

I could use an N95, but as they are an electrical device using static electricity, I realize I would have to use a fresh one almost daily. Still, it's not a bad idea.

Risk is accumulative. Two maskers being careful is much less risk than a masker and a dirtbag.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

Ted Fink said:


> If your car is paid for, it's almost always cheaper to keep it going than it is to replace it. Ever listen to Car Talk on NPR?


Exactly! So either that rule of thumb is entirely wrong, or there is some fückery afoot on Ubers part.

I haven't yet heard the show on NPR. The more you know the better off you are.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

Disgusted Driver said:


> After Uber's cut I get 61 cents per mile and 11 cents a minute on X, 94 cents a mile, 14 cents a minute for XL. There is no way you can make money at those rates UNLESS you have some combination of surge, quest, consecutive ride bonuses etc... I average over $1.25 a mile driven because I understand that you don't work when there's no work to be had. Why would you even consider going out under your circumstances?


Take a look at the markets around your city. Major cities seem to be lower than rural areas around them. For example, Philadelphia is I think 62c a mile but once you get outside that market, most of the rural markets in PA are around 82.5c. You do also have to factor in the travel to and from said other markets though, both in time and cost. In my case I drive almost an hour, but the market I drive to is worth doing that both economically and time wise.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> The store bought masks people use have been shown to leak about 30% past the nose and around the sides. I did some research and I have built a much better mask for myself. I have found that shop towels, the light blue felt-like material used by mechanics, makes an excellent addition to a mask as it's claimed it is a 93% filter when tested by one company. I eliminate most of the leakage by fashioning a copper grounding wire to fit around the edges of the mask and hold it against my face. I can tell that I am now breathing through the mask filter and not past it. Removing the wire makes it much easier to breathe, which shows how much the mask was leaking without it.
> 
> I probably wouldn't drive in this environment if I wasn't able to fashion a better alternative. Fresh air circulation, and not letting dirtbags in my car keeps my risk at a manageable level.
> 
> ...


If you have had the vaccine, masks really don't matter, in my opinion. I continue to wear mine even though I'm vax'd and wax'd... but it's because I don't want anyone to report me to Uber for not wearing it. No other reason. As far as the pax, if they are not wearing a mask, I don't make an issue of it, because again, I've had the vaccine. Also I've had COVID already, and my immune system worked well. So I feel pretty confident. Of course, nothing is perfect and I could possibly still get real sick. But I think the chances are low.


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> Disgusted Driver, I am indeed considering why I'm going out. Until I took out the calculator I had no idea the numbers were so bad.
> 
> I'm not going to be accepting a fake vaccination, as I truly believe it does more damage than good. The reasons I believe so belong in a different thread. I take a naturopath approach, by supporting my immune system and doing nothing to compromise it.
> 
> ...


You are one rare unit. Deathly afraid of Covid yet refuses to get vaccinated.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

ftupelo said:


> You are one rare unit. Deathly afraid of Covid yet refuses to get vaccinated.


OMG Weird Al... Aluminum Foil, to the tune of Royals by Lorde... good shit!


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

Ted Fink said:


> OMG Weird Al... Aluminum Foil, to the tune of Royals by Lorde... good shit!







First part is about food, but then at 1:14 he delves deeply into conspiracy... good stuff.


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## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

Ted Fink said:


> Take a look at the markets around your city. Major cities seem to be lower than rural areas around them. For example, Philadelphia is I think 62c a mile but once you get outside that market, most of the rural markets in PA are around 82.5c. You do also have to factor in the travel to and from said other markets though, both in time and cost. In my case I drive almost an hour, but the market I drive to is worth doing that both economically and time wise.


Thanks for the suggestion. I've looked and surrounding regions are either too far or not enough differential. I have a totally different approach which during covid has been netting (not gross) me high 30's per hour. It's not that hard. I only go out when there is red on the map and/or there are promos I can stack on top of each other. So I might get a surge ride, on a consecutive ride streak with a quest bonus for the weekend. A $3.20 ride suddenly becomes a $12 to !8 ride. Knock out 4 or 5 of those just before bar close and you got something.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

The only times I see much red on the map here is at bar closing time. I avoid picking up the bar hoppers due to their bad behavior and total lack of pandemic hygiene.

Lyft has stopped offering 3 ride streaks over the last few weeks. And I find I'm not hitting Uber's quests, as the number of ride requests are too low to get there.

After hundreds of hours of podcasts and other research I've come to the conclusion that all you can count on the vaccine for is to reduce your risk of dying from covid. Hell, just taking a decent vitamin D supplement reduces fatality by three quarters. Many people believe the vaccine will prevent infection and transmission, but other doctors and immunologists say that is not true. They say it's even less effective against Delta variant. However there are talking heads on television that will tell you the exact opposite. "Vaccines are perfectly safe and 100% effective and no one has ever died from a vaccine, ever ever ever." With absolutely conflicting positions, it comes down to something akin to religious faith. Bill Gates is on camera sharing how excited he is of the possibility of reducing the world's population by 15% through the use of vaccines. Do you trust him with your life? He has a substantial financial interest in Moderna, and has already made a fortune on this pandemic.

So no, I don't trust a fake vaccine, and this is the worst time in my opinion to drop your guard and drop your mask.

That said, just assume I'm a tinfoil hat idiot. I don't want to change the subject here of drivers pay rates and cost analysis.

It looks like I'm just in a really crappy area, in the worst time of the year, while trying to remain healthy in the third or fourth wave of a pandemic with half the drivers encouraging the public to go maskless.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

ftupelo said:


> You are one rare unit. Deathly afraid of Covid yet refuses to get vaccinated.


Not deathly afraid, as I'm aware of the fatality rates. I believe covid is man-made, and was designed as conditioning to make us voluntarily take any vaccine they offer. I believe the vaccine is the actual bio weapon. No one can possibly know at this point the long-term effects of man-made viruses and untested vaccines. I'm not giving them a chance to affect me with this crap.

If vaccines were real, between those and masking we should be done with this pandemic by now don't you think? Perhaps you think your vaccine doesn't work until I take mine? That is truly tinfoil-hat territory.


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> Not deathly afraid, as I'm aware of the fatality rates. I believe covid is man-made, and was designed as conditioning to make us voluntarily take any vaccine they offer. I believe the vaccine is the actual bio weapon. No one can possibly know at this point the long-term effects of man-made viruses and untested vaccines. I'm not giving them a chance to affect me with this crap.
> 
> If vaccines were real, between those and masking we should be done with this pandemic by now don't you think? Perhaps you think your vaccine doesn't work until I take mine? That is truly tinfoil-hat territory.


When you say untested are you referring to Pfizer's trial with 43,661 participants? The 30,000 enrolled in the Moderna trial? The 60,000 in the JNJ trial? The 30,000 in the AstraZeneca trial? Or, something else?


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

ftupelo said:


> When you say untested are you referring to Pfizer's trial with 43,661 participants? The 30,000 enrolled in the Moderna trial? The 60,000 in the JNJ trial? The 30,000 in the AstraZeneca trial? Or, something else?


Vaccines take years to determine the long-term effects. My understanding is that most of the vaccinated animals died on the 2nd challenge with the covid virus. So they just stopped the animal trials. But I'm sure the people you listen to tell you differently.


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> Vaccines take years to determine the long-term effects. My understanding is that most of the vaccinated animals died on the 2nd challenge with the covid virus. So they just stopped the animal trials. But I'm sure the people you listen to tell you differently.


Maybe they do take years to determine the exact long-term effects. How long have vaccines been around? Do we therefore have a pretty extensive understanding of the technology that underlies vaccines? Why can't we use other vaccines as analogs for this vaccine?


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

Because vaccines, as the public has come to understand them, present the actual virus in a weakened state to an intact immune system to generate natural antibodies.

These so-called vaccines don't do any of that. These injections are an experimental gene altering therapy, never having been tested in the history of this planet. It's brand-new technology! Step right up to be part of the testing. We are calling them vaccines so you'll accept them! 

I have been paying close attention since the first days, and I'm not buying it.


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> Because vaccines, as the public has come to understand them, present the actual virus in a weakened state to an intact immune system to generate natural antibodies.
> 
> These so-called vaccines don't do any of that. These injections are an experimental gene altering therapy, never having been tested in the history of this planet. It's brand-new technology! Step right up to be part of the testing. We are calling them vaccines so you'll accept them!
> 
> I have been paying close attention since the first days, and I'm not buying it.


What you said may be true for the Pfizer and Moderna mRNA vaccines, but it is not true for JNJ or AstraZeneca. Why are you shunning vaccines based on tried and true technologies?


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

This may help. It can give you some insight on how untested the mRNA technology is. Borrowing this from another forum.

[begin quote]

Using the Google Tools, set the search for mRNA vaccine articles written in 2019.(You have to use a desktop for setting the time frame).

There will be numerous science journals and articles that appear on this emerging technology.

The overall scientific consensus in 2019 was this was an exciting medical development, and it would probably become available in FIVE YEARS.

I could not understand most of the journals, but it was clear that despite their optimism for this new technology, there were many known issues caused to the primate test subjects that they would have to overcome before making it ready.

18 months later, a billion people have been injected with this!

[end quote]


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## ftupelo (Mar 18, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> This may help. It can give you some insight on how untested the mRNA technology is. Borrowing this from another forum.
> 
> [begin quote]
> 
> ...


I'm very familiar with mRNA. What's your beef with the other vaccines?


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

Tell you what, this was a great thread until we got sidetracked on the vaccine stuff. I will refrain from addressing vaccine questions in this thread. If you would like to engage me on this subject please meet me over here. Thanks!

Now, back to discussing cost analysis of working for Uber and Lyft.


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## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

IDriveGNV said:


> This may help. It can give you some insight on how untested the mRNA technology is. Borrowing this from another forum.
> 
> [begin quote]
> 
> ...


I'm not even going to get into this vaccine BS with you but it's clear that Uber driving and you are not a good fit. I get a sense of you do what you want, how you want, and expect it to work for you, not how the world works and certainly not how it goes in Uber land. You have to be willing to adapt and change up as needed and you appear a bit set in your ways and thinking.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

Fair enough.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> Now, back to discussing cost analysis of working for Uber and Lyft.


I commented this in @ftupelo other thread but meant it for you and so i'll repeat it...

When things are in full swing in your market, are your earnings double or triple what you are experiencing now? If so, your long term average is probably on par with the study and or DLC's poll.[IN THE OTHER THREAD]

You have to play to the averages. I've made $0 per hour and I've made $60 per hour and everything in between. But my overall average is over 25. Main reason - I do most of my driving when it's "poppin" #JackHarlow


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

@Disgusted Driver - Fair enough. Once I've done the research and it seems trustworthy to me, I tend to stick with it.

Now that you have judged me, and have belittled everything I've said, how does that help this thread? Your position at this point appears to be that Uber and Lyft are just fine, and we have nothing to complain about. Is that your position, or are you just doing battle with me?


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> are you just doing battle with me?


If you guys are doing battle I got five on @Disgusted Driver


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

Ted Fink said:


> I commented this in @ftupelo other thread but meant it for you and so i'll repeat it...
> 
> When things are in full swing in your market, are your earnings double or triple what you are experiencing now? If so, your long term average is probably on par with the study and or DLC's poll.[IN THE OTHER THREAD]
> 
> You have to play to the averages... I do most of my driving when it's "poppin"


That's a good point. I've been driving for over 5 years and I have been able to keep up with maintenance during better times. Lately the costs of everything are creeping up, and driver rates have remained flatlined. Straw. Camel.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

IDriveGNV said:


> That's a good point. I've been driving for over 5 years and I have been able to keep up with maintenance during better times. Lately the costs of everything are creeping up, and driver rates have remained flatlined. Straw. Camel.


There was a question there, are your earnings double or triple what you are experiencing now, when your market is in full swing.

I mean, just throwing this out there, the college is gone right now... so what would a realistic expectation be right now? It's slow. In August you'll be happy.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

Yes, with my earnings averaging $8 and $7 per hour the past couple of days, my usual average of $12 to $20 an hour doesn't compare.

And you're right, in August it should pick up. I've known how bad summer break earnings can be, but with the rising cost of living it's Double Bad Plus.

For anyone chiming in next about how much more than that you make per hour, please include your local rates per mile and minute. Here it's $0.83 and ten cents.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

I'd love to see a chart of driver earnings per mile/minute nationwide... does anyone know if such a thing exists? Not pax costs, but driver pay.


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## Disgusted Driver (Jan 9, 2015)

IDriveGNV said:


> @Disgusted Driver - Fair enough. Once I've done the research and it seems trustworthy to me, I tend to stick with it.
> 
> Now that you have judged me, and have belittled everything I've said, how does that help this thread? Your position at this point appears to be that Uber and Lyft are just fine, and we have nothing to complain about. Is that your position, or are you just doing battle with me?


"Done the research": I don't think most people in America, given the apparent contempt for science, even know what that means. But again, I don't really want to get into that.

As far as Uber goes, you've been driving for 3 years right? That's enough time to know (like I do) that Uber is like a lying thieving pimp that will turn you out on the street for pennies. Not saying that at all. I have plenty to complain about, so much so that I sued them over up front pricing when that turd rolled down the street. But that's the facts of the game, you either make it work for you, get victimized by it or do something else. What I'm having an issue with you about is how you are complaining that you don't make any money when you drive and then go out and do it again, the same way. And then, you are disappointed that you got the same results. After a year or two of doing this, you should have a decent idea of how to have a sense for how busy it is to determine whether it's worth it to drive or not. I'm having a hard time understanding where you are coming from if it isn't just complaining about how Uber is doing you dirty. They are doing us all dirty, you have to figure out how to make the algorithm work for you if it's even possible. It's also possible that you are just in an area where this simply isn't a good idea.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

Ted Fink said:


> I'd love to see a chart of driver earnings per mile/minute nationwide... does anyone know if such a thing exists? Not pax costs, but driver pay.


I would like to see that with the local cost of living factored in. Obviously, Florida rates and California rates would not be relatable without that data.


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

Disgusted Driver said:


> As far as Uber goes, you've been driving for 3 years right? ... They are doing us all dirty, you have to figure out how to make the algorithm work for you if it's even possible. It's also possible that you are just in an area where this simply isn't a good idea.


Five years actually. It's getting tougher this year than ever before. You're quite right, it may be that their algorithm fails in a college town during spring break. You'd think they'd find a way to fix it and keep their more experienced drivers from quitting en mass.

It could very well be that Uber's algorithm is as we suspect it is, only for suckers and those that don't yet realize they're suckers. 

Uber and Lyft are saving billions in fleet maintenance costs with this scheme.


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## bobby747 (Dec 29, 2015)

The problem is to much Anal its ing


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

bobby747 said:


> The problem is to much Anal its ing


I would have thought you liked to be anal-ized, [email protected]!


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## bobby747 (Dec 29, 2015)

Ted the math is nuts. Most here know jack shit about math


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## IDriveGNV (Mar 10, 2018)

That would be Uber's idea of the perfect driver.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

bobby747 said:


> Ted the math is nuts. Most here know jack shit about math


I hear ya @bobby747 ... I've sat back and watched all these discussions and I actually HAVE picked up some little tidbits for example I now look at my hourly and per mile rates only in terms of NET PROFIT. after ALL expenses.

Gross profit numbers are nice if you're telling someone else "I make $xxx per hour", but other than bragging, they have no purpose. The real important thing for me to know myself is how much I'm actually KEEPING per hour and per mile. I'm still satisfied with those numbers, although obviously they are about $5/hr and $0.25/mile lower than the gross. But those numbers are more useful to ME because I'm looking at how much actual benefit I'm getting from doing the side work.


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## bobby747 (Dec 29, 2015)

Ted great point . A few of my uber buddy's used to say. It's not what you make. It's what you keep$$$. I do wav . In my city 4 years plus now.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

bobby747 said:


> Ted great point . A few of my uber buddy's used to say. It's not what you make. It's what you keep$$$. I do wav . In my city 4 years plus now.


yes i know, i've been reading your posts for a while now. i think you have a good handle on how this works. i think sometimes people don't take your thoughts seriously because of typing and spelling and grammar. do you get a lot of wav trips in Philly? i'm out in State College near Penn State


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## bobby747 (Dec 29, 2015)

typing and spelling and grammar..so true. the forum is at all time low imho. guys dont want to work anymore. many are hoping for a delta covid. for more cash.?
i been back for awhile. state college hopefully this season very good.
i work now 5 days or less driving uber lyft. i dont need $2500 a week . quality of life is most important. others sources of income too.
uber no, private yes


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## oldfart (Dec 22, 2017)

IDriveGNV said:


> Uber and Lyft wonder where all the drivers have gone? I think I found out.
> 
> The prices of everything are going up. Everything. Gas, car repairs, groceries, phone bills, internet, you name it. Up drastically in the last few months. You know what hasn't gone up in the last few months? The rates drivers are being paid.
> 
> ...



sorry, I cant understand your numbers. You are calculating expenses per hour, I calculate expenses per mile

My car is 10 years old and currently has 310.000 miles In the last 3 years Ive spent just over $10,000 for maintenance and repairs/ I get about 20 miles per gal and drive about 75000 miles per year and Ive spent $13000 for commercial insurance

on a per mile basis 
gas $0.150
insurance $0.055
maint & repair $0.045


So far this year Ive grossed 80 cents a mile less 25 cents expenses = net income 55 cents a mile and Ive driven 42000 miles... net income $23000 in 30 weeks

I also keep a record of hours spent devoted to driving. Its been 1555 hours (Yes I know 52 hours a week) so net income $15/hr 

I know thats crap but it woks for me. and Im happy doing it... If it doesn't work for you and/or if you are unhappy, You gotta make some changes

Good Luck


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## Kurt Halfyard (Dec 13, 2017)

IDriveGNV said:


> I'd be curious to know how other drivers are faring these days. (Pun unintentional.) Using your actual numbers from receipts, bank account and such, how do your numbers look after gas and maintenance?


It costs me $1 per 100km in fuel (EV)
There is little to no maintenence or parts to break on the vehicle, except for tires, and perhaps suspension, but those are very rare expenses.
Incidentals (I've lost both a front and a rear windshield in the 4 years since doing Ridehail.)
Car Washes at my discretion.
I have to pay about a 20% premium on my regular insurance to do U/L in my vehicle, which adds to about $100/month extra for 'Gap Insurance' and to be doing Ridehail in general in the car. (Of course, I can write some of this off*)

Part Time Driver here, and the only reason I do this is because of the low expense EV vehicle I owned prior to starting on LYFT/UBER in 2017.

*The tax incentives (Candian Taxes) also make things worth while. about 75% of the kilometers I put on the vehicle are ridehail kilometers, and I can write off part of my smart-phone, monthly data plan (cellular data in Canada is very expensive for some reason, that put us at odds with the rest of the world), and insurance.

It is difficult to calculate depreciation of the car, as I typically drive my vehicles to the end of life, with very little resale value left. I do not know how to calculate this loss. I do not forsee 'getting rid of my car' any sooner or later than I typically offload them (Usually around 10-12 years on the road).


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

Kurt Halfyard said:


> It costs me $1 per 100km in fuel (EV)
> There is little to no maintenence or parts to break on the vehicle, except for tires, and perhaps suspension, but those are very rare expenses.
> Incidentals (I've lost both a front and a rear windshield in the 4 years since doing Ridehail.)
> Car Washes at my discretion.
> ...


What kind of EV do you drive?


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## Kurt Halfyard (Dec 13, 2017)

Ted Fink said:


> What kind of EV do you drive?


2nd Generation Chevrolet VOLT (2017)


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

Kurt Halfyard said:


> 2nd Generation Chevrolet VOLT (2017)
> 
> View attachment 606935
> 
> ...


Nice. I'm rocking a 2015 Accord Hybrid over here.


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## Gone_in_60_seconds (Jan 21, 2018)

Ted Fink said:


> Nice. I'm rocking a 2015 Accord Hybrid over here.


How is the reliability and mileage on the Hybrid Accord?


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## 25rides7daysaweek (Nov 20, 2017)

IDriveGNV said:


> Vaccines take years to determine the long-term effects. My understanding is that most of the vaccinated animals died on the 2nd challenge with the covid virus. So they just stopped the animal trials. But I'm sure the people you listen to tell you differently.


Most of them will tell you that they are alive and that most of the people in the hospitals are unvaccinated


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## Philly heretic (May 27, 2020)

SpinalCabbage said:


> My vehicle costs me $0.29 per mile to operate when gas is $5 a gallon (it was $5 a gallon when I figured out my per mile cost and I never bothered to recalculate).
> 
> I used an online calculator. Not sure which one I used, but here is the first one to pop up when I do a search:
> 
> ...


Calculator doesn't show repairs or maintenance.


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## Philly heretic (May 27, 2020)

Johnny Mnemonic said:


> The method I used to calculate net was a calculator like the one mentioned here. I know that my car costs .30 to .35/ mile depending on gas prices.
> 
> I also would use my trip computer in my car to get my average mph while anting, which was 28 mph.
> 
> ...


What about maintenance and depreciation 🤣?


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## Johnny Mnemonic (Sep 24, 2019)

Philly heretic said:


> What about maintenance and depreciation 🤣?


That's included in the .35 cent/mile figure I gave. That's pretty standard expenses for my type of vehicle. ('09 Corolla/no loan)

That particular calculator was given by someone else, it's not the one I used. You're right, it doesn't have a figure for registration and maintenance/repairs. Depreciation is calculated by the "paid for/sold for number."

I'm going by my actual expenses which I have kept track of.


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## Philly heretic (May 27, 2020)

Johnny Mnemonic said:


> That's included in the .35 cent/mile figure I gave. That's pretty standard expenses for my type of vehicle. ('09 Corolla/no loan)
> 
> That particular calculator was given by someone else, it's not the one I used. You're right, it doesn't have a figure for registration and maintenance/repairs. Depreciation is calculated by the "paid for/sold for number."
> 
> I'm going by my actual expenses which I have kept track of.


You sir have the gold standard of what a Uber car should be 👍


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## Johnny Mnemonic (Sep 24, 2019)

Philly heretic said:


> You sir have the gold standard of what a Uber car should be 👍


Yes, but it has an Achilles heel, being a 5-speed manual transmission (I bought it long before doing Uber). I would go into downtown San Francisco and after a few hours on the hills the clutch would overheat and start to chatter. That pretty much kept me confined to my East Bay homebase, which had much lower rates.


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## Ted Fink (Mar 19, 2018)

Gone_in_60_seconds said:


> How is the reliability and mileage on the Hybrid Accord?


100% reliable. Real world mileage for me, long term, 42-44mpg. That's 75% city and 25% highway driving. I can't say enough good things about it. Buy one and see!


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