# Are hybrids worth it?



## Ubergoober6 (Sep 27, 2017)

I still have 1.5 years left on my lease but I was wondering if investing in a hybrid next is a good idea. Are the gas savings actually worthwhile?


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Ubergoober6 said:


> I still have 1.5 years left on my lease but I was wondering if investing in a hybrid next is a good idea. Are the gas savings actually worthwhile?


Know what 80% of the cabs in NYC are?


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## Ubergoober6 (Sep 27, 2017)

UberBastid said:


> Know what 80% of the cabs in NYC are?


I never knew that NYC had many hybrid taxis. 99% of the cabs in my area are Kia Souls


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## Over/Uber (Jan 2, 2017)

Yes, but not new. No new car is worth rideshare at base rates. Payments and depreciation cut into revenue too deeply. Buy as new a model as you can with little-to-no loan. 

The fuel savings may be worth the premium you'll pay over a non-hybrid car.


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## 1.5xorbust (Nov 22, 2017)

I get 45-50 mpg with my 2015 Prius and it’s roomier than it looks. I spent $18k out the door with 10k miles and absolutely no problems.


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Prius is the best.
In my market, I can buy (with hard shopping) a barely Uber ok Prius, clear title for about $5k.
Like any Toyota, they just don't die.


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## Adieu (Feb 21, 2016)

I know a couple XL guys who had hybrids, their 20-26 MPG everywhere were kinda enviable....then again, their trucks cost a helluva lot more $$$ to buy.


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## Kodyhead (May 26, 2015)

Adieu said:


> I know a couple XL guys who had hybrids, their 20-26 MPG everywhere were kinda enviable....then again, their trucks cost a helluva lot more $$$ to buy.


I got the QX60 Hybrid and averaging between 21-23 mpg, but it is a terrible car in warm weather climates as when the AC is on, the engine basically never shuts off. From my limited experience Toyota or Lexus are the best, have not tried getting a ford, I tried the Lincoln, but I would consider a lease but would never buy a lincoln used.


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Kodyhead said:


> I got the QX60 Hybrid and averaging between 21-23 mpg, .


My 03 Toyota Avalon gets 22 mpg and cost me $8k used with 100k mi on it. 
How's that better than a hybrid?


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## Adieu (Feb 21, 2016)

UberBastid said:


> My 03 Toyota Avalon gets 22 mpg and cost me $8k used with 100k mi on it.
> How's that better than a hybrid?


QX60 is a humongous largeish-midsize-SUV brick with three rows of seating


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## Kodyhead (May 26, 2015)

UberBastid said:


> My 03 Toyota Avalon gets 22 mpg and cost me $8k used with 100k mi on it.
> How's that better than a hybrid?


I also do Luxsuv, lux and xl only no pool or x, maybe x if it surges over 2.5

And equal comparison to your car would be the Toyota Avalon hybrid or Lexus es300h hybrid which should get you 35-43 mpg, I know from experience because I traded an es300h a few months back for this one


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## azndriver87 (Mar 23, 2015)

2009 toyota prius.


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## Hugo (Oct 13, 2015)

For 2017, the Toyota Highlander Hybrid was updated for more efficiency and power. Also pricing was reduced -- it used to be found only in the top trim, but now you can also get it in lower trims. I'm averaging 27+ mpg.


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## Darrell Green Fan (Feb 9, 2016)

I wanted to bump this thread to rekindle the discussion. Here are my thoughts. The best way to make ride share profitable is to get a car that will last, Honda and Toyota for obvious reasons, and drive it to 250,000-300,000 miles. Unless you are mostly city this that mileage total is very realistic. How here's the rub, the batteries are not expected to last that long, particularly if you are driving in town which we all end up doing. Now you could buy a junk yard battery, which could last 5 years or 5 months. So the other option is investing thousands into a new bettery for an older car with 200,000 miles on it which is kind of hard to justify. Should you do that, and factoring in the higher purchase price, aren't you offsetting most or all of the gas savings?


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## peteyvavs (Nov 18, 2015)

I’m getting 56.2 mpg on my Prius Two, it’s very comfortable, smooth ride, very low maintenance, and has more then enough ample cargo space.


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## SamuelB (Aug 29, 2018)

UberBastid said:


> My 03 Toyota Avalon gets 22 mpg and cost me $8k used with 100k mi on it.
> How's that better than a hybrid?


I have a 2003 Toyota Avalon as well. Has 120,000 miles. Get many compliments on it...what good condition it is in...roominess. Was getting 16-18mpg. Did a can of gumout and now getting 19-21mpg. Going in the shop next week....I hit a pole backing out and dented right front and tore bumper partially off. 15 years is limit for cars in my market so it will time out shortly. Guy at hub told me to give it until Feb. I guess will just wait to hear from them. Haven't been able to use it for Uber for a couple weeks because of damage. Will have $12-13,000 by the end of the month and will be Prius shopping. I wish I could just continue with the Avalon - no depreciation worries and it runs great. Although, I feel like it is a time bomb with something major brewing.

When did you get yours? 8K? Blue Book is ~$4,000 on mine in good condition.


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

It only costs $500 or less to rebuild or repair or refurbish a battery. 
Why would you not buy a car for a future (200,000 mile) repair for only $500.
Why are people so afraid of the battery in a Prius? I dunno.



SamuelB said:


> When did you get yours? 8K? Blue Book is ~$4,000 on mine in good condition.


I got mine in 2012 or so. 
GREAT car. Love it.
Yea, I will time out soon too -- but, I already timed myself out (I don't drive any more).
I drive a car till the wheels fall off - then I buy used wheels and drive it some more.


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## Darrell Green Fan (Feb 9, 2016)

UberBastid said:


> It only costs $500 or less to rebuild or repair or refurbish a battery.
> Why would you not buy a car for a future (200,000 mile) repair for only $500.
> Why are people so afraid of the battery in a Prius? I dunno.
> 
> ...


Not sure where you got a $500 cost, everything I have seen is much higher. Even rebuilt or junk yard batteries installed are much more than $500 from everything I've seen.


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Well, maybe things cost more there ...
But you can have the battery tested to find out which cells are bad, and they can be bought for about $100 each. My mechanic will replace for $375 labor - no matter how many.
Then you got a car that's good for _another _200k.
You're not one of those guys that goes to the dealer for repairs are you?
They'll replace the whole battery, with a new one, and ... yea, that gets spendy.


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## Darrell Green Fan (Feb 9, 2016)

UberBastid said:


> Well, maybe things cost more there ...
> But you can have the battery tested to find out which cells are bad, and they can be bought for about $100 each. My mechanic will replace for $375 labor - no matter how many.
> Then you got a car that's good for _another _200k.
> You're not one of those guys that goes to the dealer for repairs are you?
> They'll replace the whole battery, with a new one, and ... yea, that gets spendy.


No no I don't go to a dealer. LOL at those guys. Thanks for this tip, I'm new to hybrids and always thought you replaced the entire battery not each bad cell.


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Darrell Green Fan said:


> No no I don't go to a dealer. LOL at those guys. Thanks for this tip, I'm new to hybrids and always thought you replaced the entire battery not each bad cell.


In my town (and it's not a big town) we have two mechanics (not dealers) who specialize in hybrid cars. I know one of the guys and he told me that if I was considering purchasing a used one to look at Prius only, second gen or newer (*not *a '09 or '10), and 'bring it to me so I can test the cells'. But that 'if there is a bad cell, its a good negotiating point.' I should be able to get more off than what it costs to replace them. 
A new one has a (I think) 100k mile battery warranty -- but, he told me not to be afraid of a Prius with 150k on it. He sees them all day long with more than 300k on them. He doesn't know how long they'll last -- because he's never found one that _needed _to be replaced. They just don't wear out, mechanically. Most of them die in car accidents (which is a source for battery parts).
He said he has one customer who has 310k on the car. It ran so good that he invested in getting the seats reupholstered and put in new carpets ... they were completely worn out and very shabby. He says that car looks and runs great.
He claims that "these cars are freakin bullet proof."


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## Darrell Green Fan (Feb 9, 2016)

UberBastid said:


> In my town (and it's not a big town) we have two mechanics (not dealers) who specialize in hybrid cars. I know one of the guys and he told me that if I was considering purchasing a used one to look at Prius only, second gen or newer (*not *a '09 or '10), and 'bring it to me so I can test the cells'. But that 'if there is a bad cell, its a good negotiating point.' I should be able to get more off than what it costs to replace them.
> A new one has a (I think) 100k mile battery warranty -- but, he told me not to be afraid of a Prius with 150k on it. He sees them all day long with more than 300k on them. He doesn't know how long they'll last -- because he's never found one that _needed _to be replaced. They just don't wear out, mechanically. Most of them die in car accidents (which is a source for battery parts).
> He said he has one customer who has 310k on the car. It ran so good that he invested in getting the seats reupholstered and put in new carpets ... they were completely worn out and very shabby. He says that car looks and runs great.
> He claims that "these cars are freakin bullet proof."


Really appreciate the feedback. But I'm wondering if this applies to Honda or a Camry as well. I hate the look of the Prius, no way I'm driving one of those. As I'm tall I want something bigger anyway.


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## Hybrid_Rolla (Dec 12, 2018)

Hybrid drivetrains are very simplistic. At least in the Toyota/Lexus platform for which I’m familiar. There’s comparatively little moving parts to “wear out” compared with a regular gasoline engine and transmission. No alternators, no starter motors, and anything made in the last decade has no drive belt pulleys hanging off the engine drawing power for ancillary accessories. 2 brushless electromagnet motors that will last beyond the useable life of the car, a planetary gear system to mimic a CVT transmission and a traction battery - arguably the weak point. Which means with regular maintenance they tend to live up to their reputations for being bulletproof.

Cost of insurance is similar to a regular car, and my local state government offers incentives for hybrids so it’s ever so slightly cheaper for cost of annual registration. But I don’t know if this is widespread so I don’t know if it would be similar costs for people in other locations or cheaper.

My position on fuel and servicing is an outlier as my vehicle prior to getting a hybrid was a modified high performance car, so my fuel cost is 1/3 of what I’m used to (55mpg vs 17mpg), and services so far costing me 15% of what I’m normally used to paying, but there are savings compared to a ‘regular’ vehicle too I’m sure.


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## B - uberlyftdriver (Jun 6, 2017)

if you look at how much you spend in gas, the prius will pay you back every month

i save more in gas money than my payment every month compared to my regular car


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Darrell Green Fan said:


> Really appreciate the feedback. But I'm wondering if this applies to Honda or a Camry as well. I hate the look of the Prius, no way I'm driving one of those. As I'm tall I want something bigger anyway.


Do your homework.
Google is your friend.
Talk to a couple of hybrid mechanics ... even one or two at a dealership.


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

My hybrid experience to date:
07 Prius purchased new in May 2007. Battery warranty in Texas is 8 years or 100K miles. Battery went out at 7 years 10 months and 120K miles. Basically was SOL on the warranty and Toyota Corporate was no help at all.

Researched on how to determine which module was out, what to look for when purchasing a module, and how to actually change it out. Ordered a compatible module from EBay. Installed and all was good. For a few weeks. Another module went bad.

Researched companies that sell refurb batteries. Went with one that offered a pack with all new modules, $2500 and 4 year warranty. Got it home and opened it up. All modules were used/refurb. Took it back (175 miles away from me in Dallas).

Went to the local Toyota dealership and discussed with the director of service, who happened to be a big fan of the Prius, what I had been through. Let me say 2 things at this point. One is that we (consumers) cannot buy new modules. The other is we're talking batteries here. No battery has infinite life no matter what you do to it. This guy offered a new battery pack, from Toyota, for $2100 including tax. Bought it, installed it, and all is good so far at 173K miles.

Otherwise the only thing I've had to replace besides tires and 12 volt battery was an inverter electric cooling pump. Under $30.

They're a good car and I'll buy another when needed.


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## Darrell Green Fan (Feb 9, 2016)

UberBastid said:


> Do your homework.
> Google is your friend.
> Talk to a couple of hybrid mechanics ... even one or two at a dealership.


I am doing my homework, found this thread in a Google search and who better to ask than other drivers?



BCS DRIVER said:


> My hybrid experience to date:
> 07 Prius purchased new in May 2007. Battery warranty in Texas is 8 years or 100K miles. Battery went out at 7 years 10 months and 120K miles. Basically was SOL on the warranty and Toyota Corporate was no help at all.
> 
> Researched on how to determine which module was out, what to look for when purchasing a module, and how to actually change it out. Ordered a compatible module from EBay. Installed and all was good. For a few weeks. Another module went bad.
> ...


This is exactly what I was afraid of. Sounds like it was big hassle for you and you ended up sinking 2 grand plus the cost/trouble of replacing the first bad module into a car with only 120,000 miles on it.


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

Darrell Green Fan said:


> This is exactly what I was afraid of. Sounds like it was big hassle for you and you ended up sinking 2 grand plus the cost/trouble of replacing the first bad module into a car with only 120,000 miles on it.


All true. I really think my experience was a fluke for having one go at 120K. Some states the warranty is 150K or 10 years.


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## Darrell Green Fan (Feb 9, 2016)

BCS DRIVER said:


> All true. I really think my experience was a fluke for having one go at 120K. Some states the warranty is 150K or 10 years.


Yeah may be the case, but again 150,000 miles for a car built for twice that is not acceptable either.


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## peteyvavs (Nov 18, 2015)

I don’t know why everyone is so concerned about the battery it has a 10 year warranty.


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## BCS DRIVER (Oct 25, 2018)

Darrell Green Fan said:


> Yeah may be the case, but again 150,000 miles for a car built for twice that is not acceptable either.


Yes I see and acknowledge your concern and by no means are trying to down play them. I put the hybrid battery in the same class as tire and 12 volt battery warranties. They are all items that will eventually need replacement. It's not a matter of if but rather when. Meaning when trying to decide whether to purchase a hybrid versus a conventional the two things to consider are the extra upfront cost of a hybrid plus the eventual battery replacement versus the gas cost savings over a conventional vehicle. Not sure if the fed still offers the tax credit for hybrid purchase but recall I was able to get a credit of several thousand $$ when I bought. That's credit, not deduction. Meaning if my tax amount for that year was $20K I lopped off say $4K and paid $16K in FICA.

I suggest you check out the Prius Chat forum. Lots of good info there.



peteyvavs said:


> I don't know why everyone is so concerned about the battery it has a 10 year warranty.


It's 8 year or 10 year and 100K miles or 150K miles, depending on what state you purchase in. Anytime you purchase anything that has a limited lifetime such as a battery in it and that battery replacement is several thousand $$ there is a need to be, not concerned, but at least given careful thought.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Ubergoober6 said:


> I still have 1.5 years left on my lease but I was wondering if investing in a hybrid next is a good idea. Are the gas savings actually worthwhile?


How many MILES are left on your lease?

That's a far more important topic.

I can blow all the miles for a 3 year lease in less than a year.


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