# Can Uber legitimately deactivate you for having a tip cup?



## ten25 (Oct 4, 2015)

Wondering if they can really deactivate you for this since we are supposed to be independent contractors.


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## ABC123DEF (Jun 9, 2015)

They focus on the wrong crap.


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## Bob Reynolds (Dec 20, 2014)

That ain't a tip cup. That's my McDonalds drive through money and my toll booth money.


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## ten25 (Oct 4, 2015)

Bob Reynolds said:


> That ain't a tip cup. That's my McDonalds drive through money and my toll booth money.


That's funny because that's the approach I decided to take this morning - no tips though, but still wondering if it would be legal for Uber to deactivate someone for this reason.


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## ABC123DEF (Jun 9, 2015)

With the shady pax these lower fares are going to attract, you'd better not be putting ANY cash in plain view unless you want to run the risk of getting robbed!


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## ten25 (Oct 4, 2015)

This is interesting, excerpts from the IRS page (Google independent contractor defined)

*The general rule is that an individual is an independent contractor if the payer has the right to control or direct only the result of the work and not what will be done and how it will be done.*

*You are not an independent contractor if you perform services that can be controlled by an employer (what will be done and how it will be done). This applies even if you are given freedom of action. What matters is that the employer has the legal right to control the details of how the services are performed.*


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## CommanderXL (Jun 17, 2015)

ten25 said:


> Wondering if they can really deactivate you for this since we are supposed to be independent contractors.


According to the Partner Agreement, you can be deactivated by Uber for ANY reason at all, or no reason.


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## ABC123DEF (Jun 9, 2015)

Maybe Uber will be deactivated someday.


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## CommanderXL (Jun 17, 2015)

From Section 2.4:

"Company retains the right to, at any time at Company's sole discretion, deactivate or otherwise restrict you from accessing or using the Driver App or the Uber Services in the event of a violation of this Agreement, your disparagement of Company or any of its Affiliates, your act or omission that causes harm to Company's or its Affiliates' brand, reputation or business as determined by Company in its sole discretion, or for any other reason at the reasonable discretion of Company."​


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## ABC123DEF (Jun 9, 2015)

CommanderXL said:


> From Section 2.4:
> 
> "Company retains the right to, at any time at Company's sole discretion, deactivate or otherwise restrict you from accessing or using the Driver App or the Uber Services in the event of a violation of this Agreement, your disparagement of Company or any of its Affiliates, your act or omission that causes harm to Company's or its Affiliates' brand, reputation or business as determined by Company in its sole discretion, or for any other reason at the reasonable discretion of Company."​


*Gives Uber a round of applause*


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## Uberduberdoo (Oct 22, 2015)

ten25 said:


> This is interesting, excerpts from the IRS page (Google independent contractor defined)
> 
> *The general rule is that an individual is an independent contractor if the payer has the right to control or direct only the result of the work and not what will be done and how it will be done.*
> 
> *You are not an independent contractor if you perform services that can be controlled by an employer (what will be done and how it will be done). This applies even if you are given freedom of action. What matters is that the employer has the legal right to control the details of how the services are performed.*


Very interesting.


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## SD_Expedition (Dec 10, 2015)

ABC123DEF said:


> Maybe Uber will be deactivated someday.


You have got the best one liners here! LMBO


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## WHICHUBERUBE (Jan 10, 2016)

As a rider only I tip simply because UBER saves me a tremendous amount of hassle. Unfortunately it seems the company and some drivers are in bottom feeding mode. I would prefer happy drivers and clean cars. The prices are too low. I'm not saying some of you don't act like losers on here but fact remains a "tip" for a driver is a gap payment between what it costs to operate and what you actually get paid. It is not a tip in the traditional sense. To me the implication of a " tip " is candy money or extra money after a basic salary. With you guys it is survival money. I'm at a cafe now just drinking coffee after an UBER ride that's how cheap it is. Clearly a tip or substantial bonus structure has to be the only way it will work.


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## Santa (Jan 3, 2016)

WHICHUBERUBE said:


> As a rider only I tip simply because UBER saves me a tremendous amount of hassle. Unfortunately it seems the company and some drivers are in bottom feeding mode. I would prefer happy drivers and clean cars. The prices are too low. I'm not saying some of you don't act like losers on here but fact remains a "tip" for a driver is a gap payment between what it costs to operate and what you actually get paid. It is not a tip in the traditional sense. To me the implication of a " tip " is candy money or extra money after a basic salary. With you guys it is survival money. I'm at a cafe now just drinking coffee after an UBER ride that's how cheap it is. Clearly a tip or substantial bonus structure has to be the only way it will work.


Thanks for doing that.

We need more riders like you. I hope riders like you help us spread the word around other riders that how much tipping is important.


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## ABC123DEF (Jun 9, 2015)

WHICHUBERUBE said:


> As a rider only I tip simply because UBER saves me a tremendous amount of hassle. Unfortunately it seems the company and some drivers are in bottom feeding mode. I would prefer happy drivers and clean cars. The prices are too low. I'm not saying some of you don't act like losers on here but fact remains a "tip" for a driver is a gap payment between what it costs to operate and what you actually get paid. It is not a tip in the traditional sense. To me the implication of a " tip " is candy money or extra money after a basic salary. With you guys it is survival money. I'm at a cafe now just drinking coffee after an UBER ride that's how cheap it is. Clearly a tip or substantial bonus structure has to be the only way it will work.


You are in the minority of riders who actually understand our plight. Thank you for this.


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## Tenspeed (Jan 21, 2016)

Drivers are providing a service. As a driver, I feel like a waiter! A poorly paid one at that. I worked 9 hours yesterday. I made $85.00 and received a $2.00 tip. Oh boy!


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## ABC123DEF (Jun 9, 2015)

You'd almost think that Big Fuber had much bigger fish to fry right now than worry about whether or not drivers had tip cups in their cars.


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## There’s no need to tip (Dec 19, 2015)

WHICHUBERUBE said:


> As a rider only I tip simply because UBER saves me a tremendous amount of hassle. Unfortunately it seems the company and some drivers are in bottom feeding mode. I would prefer happy drivers and clean cars. The prices are too low. I'm not saying some of you don't act like losers on here but fact remains a "tip" for a driver is a gap payment between what it costs to operate and what you actually get paid. It is not a tip in the traditional sense. To me the implication of a " tip " is candy money or extra money after a basic salary. With you guys it is survival money. I'm at a cafe now just drinking coffee after an UBER ride that's how cheap it is. Clearly a tip or substantial bonus structure has to be the only way it will work.


I do agree that the current system is most likely unsustainable forever. However, I feel that there will still be plenty of drivers until such time as autonomous vehicles are ready to take the road. I believe they will start with companies like Uber and Lyft way before they are available or mainstream in the private sector. However, if Uber feels the need to raise the rates due to a decline in the amount of drivers or quality of service, so be it. I have no issue with that. Until such time, I will happily keep using the service as is. I don't feel the need to supplement anyone's income because they are unhappy with their current employment situation. I WILL however continue to provide a GRATUITY for service above and beyond such as candy, mint, water, charging cables, carrying heavy luggage to/from the door, etc...


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## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

ten25 said:


> Wondering if they can really deactivate you for this since we are supposed to be independent contractors.


You've kind of answered your question already. Since we're supposed to be independent contractors, Uber can deactivate us for any reason or no reason.


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## cferrel (Dec 14, 2015)

put the tip cup out. If they deactivate you then who cares? They dont pay enough anyway.


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## Fuzzyelvis (Dec 7, 2014)

WHICHUBERUBE said:


> As a rider only I tip simply because UBER saves me a tremendous amount of hassle. Unfortunately it seems the company and some drivers are in bottom feeding mode. I would prefer happy drivers and clean cars. The prices are too low. I'm not saying some of you don't act like losers on here but fact remains a "tip" for a driver is a gap payment between what it costs to operate and what you actually get paid. It is not a tip in the traditional sense. To me the implication of a " tip " is candy money or extra money after a basic salary. With you guys it is survival money. I'm at a cafe now just drinking coffee after an UBER ride that's how cheap it is. Clearly a tip or substantial bonus structure has to be the only way it will work.


Actually a tip "in the traditional sense" would be a bribe to get better service. But now, in practically every industry where it's an accepted (and expected) practice, it is making up a below minimum wage salary. Think waitresses making ~$2 per hour.

It's great that you realise we're in that same boat. Even if a driver IS making minimum wage after ALL expenses, it is a more dangerous job than a waitress AND we have no safety net of work men's comp or unemployment insurance. We also provide our own equipment and if it's damaged we can't work. So we need to make considerably more than minimum wage to make up for those unforeseen things that can immediately cut our income to zero.


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## I_Love_Uber_Not (Jan 28, 2016)

ten25 said:


> This is interesting, excerpts from the IRS page (Google independent contractor defined)
> 
> *The general rule is that an individual is an independent contractor if the payer has the right to control or direct only the result of the work and not what will be done and how it will be done.*
> 
> *You are not an independent contractor if you perform services that can be controlled by an employer (what will be done and how it will be done). This applies even if you are given freedom of action. What matters is that the employer has the legal right to control the details of how the services are performed.*


Did you read Uber's agreement that you signed/accepted to use the Uber drivers app, it's all in there.


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## UberBlackPr1nce (Dec 28, 2014)

ten25 said:


> Wondering if they can really deactivate you for this since we are supposed to be independent contractors.


They can deactivate you for not having a tip jar... whatever they want to do they can and will do.


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## Rich2nyce (Jan 25, 2016)

instead of a tip cup, ill be making a sign and hanging it on my headrest. it will read something like " tips are not required by Uber but happily accepted. Your driver is working hard to provide a 5 star experience"

those with a tip cup should empty it after every pax, that way they'll see it empty (no robbery) and hopefully decide to leave one, especially if its more than 1 pax.


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## ten25 (Oct 4, 2015)

I_Love_Uber_Not said:


> Did you read Uber's agreement that you signed/accepted to use the Uber drivers app, it's all in there.


Just because it's in their agreement and you agreed to it doesn't mean all provisions of the agreement are legal or can legally be enforced. I once was presented an agreement by a law firm which contained illegal provisions and the judge forced them to remove the illegal provisions.

The legal (IRS) definition of an independent contractor seems to conflict with Uber's business model and many provisions in the agreement.

Besides that while you may be 'legally' agreeing to something by signing it... you either sign it or quit. Just because I sign something doesn't mean I ACTUALLY agree with it - although legally the agreement would be enforceable whether I agree with it or not... (except any illegal provisions)


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## steel108 (Dec 19, 2015)

What do you mean "Is it legal for Uber to deactivate you?" You are an IC, they don't need a reason to deactivate you. You have no legal recourse. I don't like your name, DEACTIVATE. Let's pick a random person, DEACTIVATE. You are not employed by Uber; YOU HAVE ZERO RIGHTS. Are you getting the message?


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## Adieu (Feb 21, 2016)

Anybody ever try feeding them Lyft earnings & ratings, not for $10 or $100, but as grounds for classless or unconditional reactivation/ratings reset/extended trialperiod?


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

According to the terms of the California/Massachusetts settlement, you can have a sign and a tip jar. I would expect that Uber will allow that nationwide in order to avoid more lawsuits.


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## wk1102 (Dec 25, 2015)

Another Uber Driver said:


> According to the terms of the California/Massachusetts settlement, you can have a sign and a tip jar. I would expect that Uber will allow that nationwide in order to avoid more lawsuits.


Somewhere here in the forum someone posted the email exchange with Uber regarding a tip cup.

The driver was told it is allowed but was also warned that a tip cup/box may affect his raating. This was a few weeks- months ago I'm not really sure.

Was the rating system and deactivation because or ratings addressed at all in the lawsuit?


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

wk1102 said:


> Was the rating system and deactivation because or ratings addressed at all in the lawsuit?


It was discussed, but Uber still can de-activate due to poor ratings. What it appears has changed is that Uber will set up an appeals system and provide more opportunities for re-instatement or improvement.

Uber is not off the mark about the tip cup's affecting ratings. Hinting for a tip does make some people uncomfortable, even those skinflints who insist loudly that they never tip for anything. Make someone uncomfortable and start losing stars. One change for which I wish that the plaintiffs had pushed was requiring Uber to educate its users on how it applies its Star System. We have had inside information on this Forum that Uber does not want to do that. That is one thing that should change, but, for now, at least, will not.


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## wk1102 (Dec 25, 2015)

Another Uber Driver said:


> It was discussed, but Uber still can de-activate due to poor ratings. What it appears has changed is that Uber will set up an appeals system and provide more opportunities for re-instatement or improvement.
> 
> Uber is not off the mark about the tip cup's affecting ratings. Hinting for a tip does make some people uncomfortable, even those skinflints who insist loudly that they never tip for anything. Make someone uncomfortable and start losing stars. One change for which I wish that the plaintiffs had pushed was requiring Uber to educate its users on how it applies its Star System. We have had inside information on this Forum that Uber does not want to do that. That is one thing that should change, but, for now, at least, will not.


When I think of putting a tip box up I make me feel like the doorman or maitre d that clears his throat and holds his had out.

I took an Uber x ride yesterday, it was my first time. I was curious how it worked from the riders side.

Shortly after the ride ended I got a pop up on the riders app asking me to rate my ride or driver. I didn't think to screen shot things damn it all!

I messed around with it a little bit was afraid to accidentally rate poorly so I kept it brief.

5☆ said excellent on the top, and there was a way for me to leave a comment. 
4☆ good. For anything less than 5 
3☆ okay. It asked what went wrong
2☆bad. And had 4 or 5 choices. I 
1☆horrible. I don't remember all of them but one was navigation, there was an other choice, condition of car...

I don't know if this is a new feature or not but I've never heard of this before. Does anyone know?

I'm guessing it probably is new, I've seen a bunch of posts regarding negative feedback since they started putting our weekly summary in the app. At least well have some idea why we're getting dinged now. We'll just have to grow our skin a bit thicker if we going to see them all.

I just checked mine, my 2 reported issues are gone. I had one for cancelling and I had one for nav. They are gone. I'm sure people panicked when they saw a bunch of issues and everyone emailed support. A simple email from Uber explaining that this was happening may have prevented some of the emails. I'm just speculating of course but...


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## avguste (Apr 7, 2016)

now this is interesting. So Uber just started that weekly report?


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## wk1102 (Dec 25, 2015)

avguste said:


> now this is interesting. So Uber just started that weekly report?


As part of the app, yes. You should be getting one via email week as well, it's a little more detailed.


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## avguste (Apr 7, 2016)

Yea, I already got my 1st one...Pretty interesting. Kinda like it as well.


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## Bill Collector (Dec 17, 2015)

So, does this mean I can put the Tips note without worrying about Uber deactivating me?

As per the settlement, "Uber also will allow drivers to solicit tips from passengers, who often are unaware that tips aren't included in their fares. Drivers will be permitted to place signs in their cars stating, "tips are not included, they are not required, but they would be appreciated.""

I have Square reader and PayPal account. I intend to print/laminate the sign and put on the headrest facing the pax.


Another Uber Driver said:


> According to the terms of the California/Massachusetts settlement, you can have a sign and a tip jar. I would expect that Uber will allow that nationwide in order to avoid more lawsuits.


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## avguste (Apr 7, 2016)

What I am reading is that as of today, this is only valid to California and Mass. Once Uber sees how those 2 states do, they may expand nationwide. At least that is what I am understanding.


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## There’s no need to tip (Dec 19, 2015)

avguste said:


> What I am reading is that as of today, this is only valid to California and Mass. Once Uber sees how those 2 states do, they may expand nationwide. At least that is what I am understanding.


Correct understanding.


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## Red (Nov 8, 2014)

Yes they can and yes they will. Happened before. All it takes is one rider's tweet with a photo taken.


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## Bill Collector (Dec 17, 2015)

I'm gonna put this sign a week before quitting... It's all ready and laminated.
View attachment 36859


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

Bill Collector said:


> So, does this mean I can put the Tips note without worrying about Uber deactivating me?


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^\/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/



avguste said:


> What I am reading is that as of today, this is only valid to California and Mass. Once Uber sees how those 2 states do, they expand nationwide.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^\/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/\/



There's no need to tip said:


> Correct understanding.


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