# Uber and Its Shady Partners Are Pushing Drivers into Subprime Loans



## Sanjay (Oct 31, 2014)

*Uber and Its Shady Partners Are Pushing Drivers into Subprime Loans*
*Nitasha Tiku*
ProfileFollow

Nitasha Tiku


----------



## Sanjay (Oct 31, 2014)

Wow!
I just read the article!
It's mainly based on @uberpeople.net threads!


----------



## LAuberX (Jun 3, 2014)

If you buy a new car to do this gig you need your head examined. If you buy one from Uber that goes double, make that triple.

Bad credit means you have made bad decisions based on bad advice, no logic, impulses, poor planning, lazyness, the inability to read, believing politicians, thinking you were smarter than the giant banks who make casinos look tiny .. and keeping up with the Jones' (a.k.a. wanna be baller)


----------



## Worcester Sauce (Aug 20, 2014)

Sanjay said:


> *Uber and Its Shady Partners Are Pushing Drivers into Subprime Loans*
> *Nitasha Tiku*
> ProfileFollow
> 
> Nitasha Tiku


This is a fantastic post and should be required reading for ALL Uber drivers who are considering buying/leasing a vehicle for this "gig".


----------



## MiamiFlyer (Sep 22, 2014)

I believe this article comment sums it up perfectly!
l


----------



## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

@Randy Shear aka Uber Man, you getting a prominent mention in this article!


----------



## Randy Shear (Jul 25, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> @Randy Shear aka Uber Man, you getting a prominent mention in this article!


Uh oh... LOL.. Don't let Travis see this!


----------



## Randy Shear (Jul 25, 2014)

@Kim


----------



## hanging in there (Oct 1, 2014)

Randy Shear said:


> Uh oh... LOL.. Don't let Travis see this!


Randy, I watched your video and I have done what research I could on the Santander lease. In general I agree with you and my gut says run don't walk from this deal. But, one big question remains, which could be the turning point for me, regardless of how bad a deal it is on the surface. Is it in fact true that I could lease, for example, a 2015 Suburban LT for $1000 down through Uber's guaranteed lease program, drive it around Ubering etc for a year paying the weekly lease, then turn it in and only pay a $1000 early termination fee regardless of miles driven? (or $250 less per year after that, for example a $750 early termination fee after year 2). One of my ex-cabbie friends just did that deal a couple weeks ago and swears that this is the way it works, according to the fine print of the contract. If that is true, then it would be, to me, almost too good to be true regardless of the high effective interest rate because of the hours and miles I'm willing and accustomed to putting in, and the fact that I could be making the SUV rate as well as making my side deals outside of Uber.


----------



## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Uber's 'Thousands' of Car Loans Said to Include Risky Subprime Borrowers*
DOUGLAS MACMILLAN

http://m.wsj.com/articles/BL-DGB-38689


----------



## MiamiFlyer (Sep 22, 2014)

hanging in there said:


> Randy, I watched your video and I have done what research I could on the Santander lease. In general I agree with you and my gut says run don't walk from this deal. But, one big question remains, which could be the turning point for me, regardless of how bad a deal it is on the surface. Is it in fact true that I could lease, for example, a 2015 Suburban LT for $1000 down through Uber's guaranteed lease program, drive it around Ubering etc for a year paying the weekly lease, then turn it in and only pay a $1000 early termination fee regardless of miles driven? (or $250 less per year after that, for example a $750 early termination fee after year 2). One of my ex-cabbie friends just did that deal a couple weeks ago and swears that this is the way it works, according to the fine print of the contract. If that is true, then it would be, to me, almost too good to be true regardless of the high effective interest rate because of the hours and miles I'm willing and accustomed to putting in, and the fact that I could be making the SUV rate as well as making my side deals outside of Uber.


What would the payments on the Suburban Lease be for you?
I'm pretty sure there is a maximum on mileage to turn it early.
Given the leases are made to run to termination value of $1, the better move would be to buy a suburban that's a couple years old, and not have to pay all the depreciation.
When you want out, sell it!

Also keep in mind UberSUV/UberBlack is not adding new partners for Los Angeles.
You'll have to check status on Orange County.
I would research Ambudriver03's posts. He's offered a wealth of information on his Suburban driving in Orange County.


----------



## SCdave (Jun 27, 2014)

hanging in there said:


> Randy, I watched your video and I have done what research I could on the Santander lease. In general I agree with you and my gut says run don't walk from this deal. But, one big question remains, which could be the turning point for me, regardless of how bad a deal it is on the surface. Is it in fact true that I could lease, for example, a 2015 Suburban LT for $1000 down through Uber's guaranteed lease program, drive it around Ubering etc for a year paying the weekly lease, then turn it in and only pay a $1000 early termination fee regardless of miles driven? (or $250 less per year after that, for example a $750 early termination fee after year 2). One of my ex-cabbie friends just did that deal a couple weeks ago and swears that this is the way it works, according to the fine print of the contract. If that is true, then it would be, to me, almost too good to be true regardless of the high effective interest rate because of the hours and miles I'm willing and accustomed to putting in, and the fact that I could be making the SUV rate as well as making my side deals outside of Uber.


This is a huge commitment for you. Use this forum and Randy as a reference only. And DO NOT take what your friend told you as fact when you will be financially responsible. If you have a question, call Santander and ask this question yourself. Then ask for it in writing. Then get back to all of us and let us know the answer.

And of course, make sure you get some scenarios for different miles driven after 12 months or whatever term you're thinking of. Like say if I turn the vehicle back after 12 months with 60,ooo miles on it, what will the exact cost of termination be.


----------



## scrurbscrud (Sep 11, 2014)

Worcester Sauce said:


> This is a fantastic post and should be required reading for ALL Uber drivers who are considering buying/leasing a vehicle for this "gig".


We all already know that driving is a minimum wage yob when all is said and done and that's ONLY if you keep the overhead to a minimum. With the lease deals that is cut in HALF or more. And if biz is a little sketchy, which it certainly IS, it's a no win situation for those who take on the lease. I can only imagine the 'closing pressures' on the potential drivers who are considering leasing. Turning a bunch of new and used car salespeople loose on them.

Freakin' idiots if they do it! If you want to drive UberX buy a cheap qualified used car. That's the only way it will ever work and even then on UberX, it's IFFY at best.


----------



## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Uber did not respond to Nitasha Tiku, who wrote the Gawker article, but instead released a statement to WSJ. That led to the WSJ article.


----------



## Oc_DriverX (Apr 29, 2014)

The Tiku piece was well done.

Although she did mention it, I still think more could be written about the bloated income claims that Uber continues to use in their help wanted ads.


----------



## hanging in there (Oct 1, 2014)

SCdave said:


> This is a huge commitment for you. Use this forum and Randy as a reference only. And DO NOT take what your friend told you as fact when you will be financially responsible. If you have a question, call Santander and ask this question yourself. Then ask for it in writing. Then get back to all of us and let us know the answer.
> 
> And of course, make sure you get some scenarios for different miles driven after 12 months or whatever term you're thinking of. Like say if I turn the vehicle back after 12 months with 60,ooo miles on it, what will the exact cost of termination be.


They wouldn't give me payment info unless I went through the process of contacting Penske, getting the car picked out etc, but the lady I talked to at Santander said that in fact the 40k/yr estimated mileage figure does kick in the excess mileage charge on an early termination to the tune of 20 cents per mile. If I drive my typical 80k/yr then I'd be looking at 40k x .2 = $8000 excess mileage fee + $1000 early termination fee + $595 for some other fee involved that I didn't find out what it was, + the dealer can assess an extra fee if they deem the car to have excess "wear and tear". That is all in addition to the original $1000 down payment, the extra $1000 down payment that is taken out in excess payment amounts over the first year, plus of course the usual weekly 52 week lease fee which I believe I've heard from other threads runs around $375/wk or so? (For a 2015 Suburban LT)

So if that is a correct estimate, then to drive it a year and then turn it in might cost me:
$2000 down total
$375 x 52 wks = $19,500
$8000 for 40k excess miles
$1595 early termination fees
$2000 excess wear and tear? (pretty predictable estimate if the car is driven 80k/mi, I would assume, if not more)

total cost for the year $33,095, or roughly $636/wk

Ouch... but still cheaper than a typical taxi lease for something not nearly as nice and earning less per mile


----------



## SCdave (Jun 27, 2014)

hanging in there said:


> They wouldn't give me payment info unless I went through the process of contacting Penske, getting the car picked out etc, but the lady I talked to at Santander said that in fact the 40k/yr estimated mileage figure does kick in the excess mileage charge on an early termination to the tune of 20 cents per mile. If I drive my typical 80k/yr then I'd be looking at 40k x .2 = $8000 excess mileage fee + $1000 early termination fee + $595 for some other fee involved that I didn't find out what it was, + the dealer can assess an extra fee if they deem the car to have excess "wear and tear". That is all in addition to the original $1000 down payment, the extra $1000 down payment that is taken out in excess payment amounts over the first year, plus of course the usual weekly 52 week lease fee which I believe I've heard from other threads runs around $375/wk or so? (For a 2015 Suburban LT)
> 
> So if that is a correct estimate, then to drive it a year and then turn it in might cost me:
> $2000 down total
> ...


Anyway to purchase used? If you couldn't do this yourself, then with a partner? This at least leaves your options open in case Uber Deactivates you, drops rates to a level you just find unacceptable, g_d forbid you get sick and can't drive, or you decide you just don't want to drive anymore?

Santander just does not seem like a good option for you. Do what is best for you, but please reconsider this as an option. Put on that thinking cap and explore all other options.


----------



## Greg (Sep 30, 2014)

It's simple math, I count money and laugh!


----------



## scrurbscrud (Sep 11, 2014)

hanging in there said:


> They wouldn't give me payment info unless I went through the process of contacting Penske, getting the car picked out etc, but the lady I talked to at Santander said that in fact the 40k/yr estimated mileage figure does kick in the excess mileage charge on an early termination to the tune of 20 cents per mile. If I drive my typical 80k/yr then I'd be looking at 40k x .2 = $8000 excess mileage fee + $1000 early termination fee + $595 for some other fee involved that I didn't find out what it was, + the dealer can assess an extra fee if they deem the car to have excess "wear and tear". That is all in addition to the original $1000 down payment, the extra $1000 down payment that is taken out in excess payment amounts over the first year, plus of course the usual weekly 52 week lease fee which I believe I've heard from other threads runs around $375/wk or so? (For a 2015 Suburban LT)
> 
> So if that is a correct estimate, then to drive it a year and then turn it in might cost me:
> $2000 down total
> ...


Just WHY would you do that if you could buy a decent used one for less and have a payment of about *$335 a MONTH COMPARED TO $2734 A MONTH???*


----------



## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Uber program offers auto loans to subprime borrowers*
http://money.cnn.com/2014/11/05/technology/uber-subprime-loans/index.html


----------



## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Uber's program to help you buy a car sounds like a sweet deal. But it's actually really risky.*
*By Emily Badger*
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...e-a-sweet-deal-but-its-actually-really-risky/


----------



## dsimms (Nov 13, 2014)

scrurbscrud said:


> Just WHY would you do that if you could buy a decent used one for less and have a payment of about *$335 a MONTH COMPARED TO $2734 A MONTH???*


like the person says above, have a plan in case you get terminated...
You will still be responsible for whatever the car payment is....
any uber driver can wake up and find their account terminated....
There is nothing guaranteed about uber, lyft, etc...


----------



## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*New York City Agency Subpoenas (Uber Vehicle Financing Partner) Santander*

*http://mobile.nytimes.com/blogs/dea...ork-agency-investigates-auto-loans/?referrer=*


----------



## UL Driver SF (Aug 29, 2014)

Just out of curiosity....because I can't find it...not one person....who has uber forced into these loans that every dealership in America makes?

Has anyone gone on record saying über personally forced them to do this or else? Or are these just idiots with bad credit who are to stupid to figure out the proper way to buy a vehicle?


----------



## UL Driver SF (Aug 29, 2014)

So where is this list of drivers who were forced to take these loans? 

This would be a career making case for any DA. They want this information.


----------



## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

hanging in there said:


> Randy, I watched your video and I have done what research I could on the Santander lease. In general I agree with you and my gut says run don't walk from this deal. But, one big question remains, which could be the turning point for me, regardless of how bad a deal it is on the surface. Is it in fact true that I could lease, for example, a 2015 Suburban LT for $1000 down through Uber's guaranteed lease program, drive it around Ubering etc for a year paying the weekly lease, then turn it in and only pay a $1000 early termination fee regardless of miles driven? (or $250 less per year after that, for example a $750 early termination fee after year 2). One of my ex-cabbie friends just did that deal a couple weeks ago and swears that this is the way it works, according to the fine print of the contract. If that is true, then it would be, to me, almost too good to be true regardless of the high effective interest rate because of the hours and miles I'm willing and accustomed to putting in, and the fact that I could be making the SUV rate as well as making my side deals outside of Uber.


You'll only get the SUV rate if Uber accepts you into the SUV and Black categories. I'd get that in writing, before doing any deals for a towncar or SUV. Also, in some areas, they are making black car owners accept UberX trips. I wouldn't invest in a black car or SUV if Uber was even contemplating doing this ( not only is is bad for Black owners, it's bad for UberX drivers, as well. ).


----------



## UL Driver SF (Aug 29, 2014)

Oscar Levant said:


> You'll only get the SUV rate if Uber accepts you into the SUV and Black categories. I'd get that in writing, before doing any deals for a towncar or SUV. Also, in some areas, they are making black car owners accept UberX trips. I wouldn't invest in a black car or SUV if Uber was even contemplating doing this ( not only is is bad for Black owners, it's bad for UberX drivers, as well. ).


Anytime you have bad credit your options are limited. I have seen this first hand in the auto industry.

The question is how do you fix that to avoid this?


----------



## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

UL Driver SF said:


> Anytime you have bad credit your options are limited. I have seen this first hand in the auto industry.
> 
> The question is how do you fix that to avoid this?


I might consider doing an UberX new car deal in that situation ( you will make money if you are in a good cab town ) , but I'd make sure I was committed to driving long hours for a few years to make it worthwhile, which would be the only way it would be worthwhile. But, Uber black and SUV is too risky, given that Uber's policies are not that stable, or predictable, ie, they could change on a whim. In fact, in San Diego, I'm no longer seeing SUVs offered on my public app, so I guess they cancelled all the SUV contracts and now they are just in the black category ( ie., no more SUV rates ) ? That's what I'm talking about, Uber is unpredictable for that kind of towncar/SUV investment.


----------



## DriversOfTheWorldUnite (Nov 11, 2014)

Oscar Levant said:


> I might consider doing an UberX new car deal in that situation ( you will make money if you are in a good cab town ) , but I'd make sure I was committed to driving long hours for a few years to make it worthwhile, which would be the only way it would be worthwhile. But, Uber black and SUV is too risky, given that Uber's policies are not that stable, or predictable, ie, they could change on a whim. In fact, in San Diego, I'm no longer seeing SUVs offered on my public app, so I guess they cancelled all the SUV contracts and now they are just in the black category ( ie., no more SUV rates ) ? That's what I'm talking about, Uber is unpredictable for that kind of towncar/SUV investment.


It's that unpredictability that calls into question the ethics of even offering this long term debt. You are supposed to have some kind of stability if you take on long term debt.


----------



## UL Driver SF (Aug 29, 2014)

Oscar Levant said:


> I might consider doing an UberX new car deal in that situation ( you will make money if you are in a good cab town ) , but I'd make sure I was committed to driving long hours for a few years to make it worthwhile, which would be the only way it would be worthwhile. But, Uber black and SUV is too risky, given that Uber's policies are not that stable, or predictable, ie, they could change on a whim. In fact, in San Diego, I'm no longer seeing SUVs offered on my public app, so I guess they cancelled all the SUV contracts and now they are just in the black category ( ie., no more SUV rates ) ? That's what I'm talking about, Uber is unpredictable for that kind of towncar/SUV investment.


Ok...sometimes the only deal available is a bad deal. That sucks. I will assume that you know how to buy cars. But even you would consider that deal. For some that might be their only option.

So the question still remains....every car dealership and lending institution makes these loans. There are other options but if we cut off this one do we not make it even harder for those who want to drive?


----------

