# Use of robots in healthcare



## Drizzle (Jan 1, 2018)

You hear a lot about SDC but why dont AI people focus on things like healthcare. You could easily program ai to do a doctors job. Wow a machine to take a patients temp, weight, height and ask whats wrong. A machine that can read test results and make a by the book diagnoses where as a human doctor is mostly guessing. SDC would be cool but I hate my doctor and would much prefer a machine. Also teachers, court recorders, judges, so many professions should be done by machines to ensure theres no human bias. 

But its too corrupt. Yay America what freedom!!!


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6028471/

They are working on that as we speak as well!


----------



## Irishjohn831 (Aug 11, 2017)

The problem is, all the robots want to be Uber drivers


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Drizzle said:


> You hear a lot about SDC but why dont AI people focus on things like healthcare. You could easily program ai to do a doctors job. Wow a machine to take a patients temp, weight, height and ask whats wrong. A machine that can read test results and make a by the book diagnoses where as a human doctor is mostly guessing. SDC would be cool but I hate my doctor and would much prefer a machine. Also teachers, court recorders, judges, so many professions should be done by machines to ensure theres no human bias.
> 
> But its too corrupt. Yay America what freedom!!!


You know how using gps sometimes and you wonder "why in the hell would it do that, it makes no sense." Well that's because it's simply an algorithm. AI is nice but it is a long way from what a reasoning mind.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> You know how using gps sometimes and you wonder "why in the hell would it do that, it makes no sense." Well that's because it's simply an algorithm. AI is nice but it is a long way from what a reasoning mind.


Have you ever seen a driver do something and it make no sense...... Human reasoning is not all that good either.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Uberfunitis said:


> Have you ever seen a driver do something and it make no sense...... Human reasoning is not all that good either.


Machines have no reasoning but programming design to make a poor imagination of human reasoning.

Human reasoning can be faulty mostly due to our emotions which also is our greatest strength.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Machines have no reasoning but programming design to make a poor imagination of human reasoning.
> 
> Human reasoning can be faulty mostly due to our emotions which also is our greatest strength.


I will take a predictable machine over an emotional human any day but that is just me.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Uberfunitis said:


> I will take a predictable machine over an emotional human any day but that is just me.


Emotion= energy in motion.

Emotion is what drives all humans and drives our intelligence. Without it we wouldn't have created none of this stuff. It's crazy to me how people think humans are inferior to machines. The human mind still has more processing power than any super computer in existence.

(Read the provided chart carefully to see the full extent of the processing gap between us and super computers that take up a whole room. It's not remotely close it's like comparing a hot wheel to the speed of light.)


----------



## Drizzle (Jan 1, 2018)

Im just saying it would be much easier to program a doctor machine using text books and blood tests and a questionnaire.

Why are we waisting our time dev driving sensors? Create a laptop doctor save the freaking world. Make billions.

I mean doctors are smart but they are not as smart as data bases.

Long story short dont be too scared the machines are gonna take your job. The doctors should be first to go.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Emotion= energy in motion.
> 
> Emotion is what drives all humans and drives our intelligence. Without it we wouldn't have created none of this stuff. It's crazy to me how people think humans are inferior to machines. The human mind still has more processing power than any super computer in existence.
> 
> ...


I do not doubt that the human brain has more processing power. I just doubt the individual human that is in control of that processing power. Humans for the most part have shown that they are not all that rational nor take the best action a good portion of the time. Emotion in my opinion gets in the way of rational thought.


----------



## Mr. Sensitive (Jan 7, 2018)

Irishjohn831 said:


> The problem is, all the robots want to be Uber drivers


This is the truth!


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Uberfunitis said:


> I do not doubt that the human brain has more processing power. I just doubt the individual human that is in control of that processing power. Humans for the most part have shown that they are not all that rational nor take the best action a good portion of the time. Emotion in my opinion gets in the way of rational thought.


Where do think imagination and Ingenuity come from? We can all come up with completely different rational conclusions on a problem. A roach's instinct to run when the lights come on is rational. A man that defends a woman from an assault is irrational. Emotion was the difference.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Where do think imagination and Ingenuity come from? We can all come up with completely different rational conclusions on a problem. A roach's instinct to run when the lights come on is rational. A man that defends a woman from an assault is irrational. Emotion was the difference.
> View attachment 301010


Nope sorry on this we will not agree. A minority of people may be able to use their emotion in a good productive way but the vast majority do not I believe.


----------



## Irishjohn831 (Aug 11, 2017)

Uberfunitis said:


> Have you ever seen a driver do something and it make no sense...... Human reasoning is not all that good either.


Human instinct and reaction is the key, it will never be matched by an autonomous car. It is the unconscious reaction like a car, a person, etc running or turning in front of your car. We delve deep into primal instinct and act on fight or flight. Nothing can compare to that, this is why you don't see planes take off without pilots, planes have been flying themselves for years. The pilot(s) instinct and experience is the key and of most value.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

Irishjohn831 said:


> Human instinct and reaction is the key, it will never be matched by an autonomous car. It is the unconscious reaction like a car, a person, etc running or turning in front of your car. We delve deep into primal instinct and act on fight or flight. Nothing can compare to that, this is why you don't see planes take off without pilots, planes have been flying themselves for years. The pilot(s) instinct and experience is the key and of most value.


Sure it can and will be. The computer can crunch data and make connections that the human mind can not. This is key in fields like bioinformatics where big data is analyzed in a way a human just can not do. Sure the tech has much room for improvement but it will be there I have no doubt about that.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Mr. Sensitive said:


> This is the truth!





Uberfunitis said:


> Nope sorry on this we will not agree. A minority of people may be able to use their emotion in a good productive way but the vast majority do not I believe.


If the vast majority didn't the world wouldn't function.

Emotion is what gets us up to go to work everyday.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> If the vast majority didn't the world wouldn't function.


It would and it does, it just does not function well just look at the crashes that happen every day by these humans with their instinct and emotion.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

If nobody went to work the world wouldn’t function. Put car crashes in statistical format and we’re talking a less than 1% failure rate.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> If nobody went to work the world wouldn't function. Put car crashes in statistical format and we're talking a less than 1% failure rate.


And we can reduce that even further using AI.


----------



## Irishjohn831 (Aug 11, 2017)

Uberfunitis said:


> Sure it can and will be. The computer can crunch data and make connections that the human mind can not. This is key in fields like bioinformatics where big data is analyzed in a way a human just can not do. Sure the tech has much room for improvement but it will be there I have no doubt about that.


Best comparison is a line from Good Will Hunting when Robin Williams says to Matt Damon you can probably tell me all about paintings, tell me every color used in the Cistene Chapel, but you can't tell me what it smells like on the inside.

You can fill a computer with all the knowledhe in the world, but primal instinct will always rule in life or death.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

Irishjohn831 said:


> but primal instinct will always rule in life or death.


Not for that much longer.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Uberfunitis said:


> And we can reduce that even further using AI.


AI has a much worst failure rate. Software in general has a much worst failure rate than that.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> AI has a much worst failure rate. Software in general has a much worst failure rate than that.


For now perhaps, and that is only because they don't have as much usage to buffer the accidents yet. but that will not always be the case.

Leading causes of auto accidents today. That emotion seems to be doing well for us.
*1. Distracted Driving*
The number one cause of car accidents is not a criminal that drove drunk, sped or ran a red light. Distracted drivers are the top cause of car accidents in the U.S. today. A distracted driver is a motorist that diverts his or her attention from the road, usually to talk on a cell phone, send a text message or eat food.
More on how distracted driving causes accidents
*2. Speeding*
You've seen them on the highway. Many drivers ignore the speed limit and drive 10, 20 and sometimes 30 mph over the limit. Speed kills, and traveling above the speed limit is an easy way to cause a car accident. The faster you drive, the slower your reaction time will be if you need to prevent an auto accident.
More on how speeding causes accidents
*3. Drunk Driving*
When you drink, you lose the ability to focus and function properly and its very dangerous when operating a vehicle. Driving under the influence of alcohol causes car accidents every day, even when they are one the top causes that can be avoided. Always use a designated driver if you go out and drink.
More on how drunk-driving causes accidents
*4. Reckless Driving*
If you don't drive carefully, and you may end up in a needless car accident. That's what often happens to reckless drivers who speed, change lanes too quickly or tailgate before causing a car accident. Reckless drivers are often impatient in traffic so be sure to take extra care around aggressive drivers.


----------



## Irishjohn831 (Aug 11, 2017)

Uberfunitis said:


> For now perhaps, and that is only because they don't have as much usage to buffer the accidents yet. but that will not always be the case.
> 
> Leading causes of auto accidents today. That emotion seems to be doing well for us.
> *1. Distracted Driving*
> ...


What are you comparing this to ? I could easily say an autonomous car killed a woman in the early stages of testing.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

Irishjohn831 said:


> What are you comparing this to ? I could easily say an autonomous car killed a woman in the early stages of testing.


That is true.... note the early stages of testing.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Uberfunitis said:


> For now perhaps, and that is only because they don't have as much usage to buffer the accidents yet. but that will not always be the case.
> 
> Leading causes of auto accidents today. That emotion seems to be doing well for us.
> *1. Distracted Driving*
> ...


Reason why cars exist in first place = imagination, passion, greed, desire, power, pride.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Reason why cars exist in first place = imagination, passion, greed, desire, power, pride.


The robots are coming you can embrace them or fight them kicking and screaming but make no mistake about it they are coming.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Uberfunitis said:


> That is true.... note the early stages of testing.


We are 10 years in... early stages my ass. They priviously was talking a 2017 debut


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> We are 10 years in... early stages my ass. They priviously was talking a 2017 debut


People will get hurt by them that is without question but that amount in the end once fully deployed will be less than the human counterparts inflict upon each other.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> We are 10 years in... early stages my ass. They priviously was talking a 2017 debut


I want SDCs to come. It just erks me when people confuse sci-fi and science.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> I want SDCs to come. It just erks me when people confuse sci-fi and science.


Lol deadlines are hardly ever made in new projects.

I thought everyone loved that emotion.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Uberfunitis said:


> People will get hurt by them that is without question but that amount in the end once fully deployed will be less than the human counterparts inflict upon each other.





Uberfunitis said:


> Lol deadlines are hardly ever made in new projects.


Its more than that. Marketing people are distorting when SDCs will be ready and they're capabilities in first generation. Marketing and investors are saying one thing, scientists and engineers another.


----------



## Drizzle (Jan 1, 2018)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> AI has a much worst failure rate. Software in general has a much worst failure rate than that.


I disagree, you could give an 18 year old a laptop and webmd and that person could be a better informed doctor than all doctors 120 years ago. It depends software excels in storing vast amounts of knowledge and returing information instantly. Computers do things that humans cant and humans do things that computers cant. So if automation was a serious revolution in labor like industrilization, drivers would not be the first to go, way too many sensors involved. It would be like courtroom recorders first bc alexa can literally do that right now. Its not necessarily technology holding us back.

Someone gets paid 50k a year to type in a courtroom. We could literally replace that person w alexa for $200. But we dont do that.


----------



## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

Drizzle said:


> You hear a lot about SDC but why dont AI people focus on things like healthcare. You could easily program ai to do a doctors job. Wow a machine to take a patients temp, weight, height and ask whats wrong. A machine that can read test results and make a by the book diagnoses where as a human doctor is mostly guessing. SDC would be cool but I hate my doctor and would much prefer a machine. Also teachers, court recorders, judges, so many professions should be done by machines to ensure theres no human bias.
> 
> But its too corrupt. Yay America what freedom!!!


They already do that in China


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Drizzle said:


> I disagree, you could give an 18 year old a laptop and webmd and that person could be a better informed doctor than all doctors 120 years ago. It depends software excels in storing vast amounts of knowledge and returing information instantly. Computers do things that humans cant and humans do things that computers cant. So if automation was a serious revolution in labor like industrilization, drivers would not be the first to go, way too many sensors involved. It would be like courtroom recorders first bc alexa can literally do that right now. Its not necessarily technology holding us back.
> 
> Someone gets paid 50k a year to type in a courtroom. We could literally replace that person w alexa for $200. But we dont do that.


You misunderstand my meaning of failure rate. I was talking literally in response to a remark. Software does as a fact have a worst failure rate than humans, it's not a matter of an opinion. Your phone will freeze at a higher rate than a drunk human dumb enough to get behind a wheel.

Now technology in general is better at some things than humans but higher thought isn't one of them. Medical diagnosis is one of those higher thought things. When medical personnel see you they are watching you more than they are listening to what you say. For example, "how aware is patient?, how quick do they respond?, skin coloration and feel?, how often are they using the restroom? Are they words coherent etc", and those are just observations of a CNA.

Finally, no Alexia can't replace a court room reporter. People talk too fast and speakers swap to quickly for Alexia to record at $200. A better machine worth thousands would do better but ultimately fail in its accuracy. Court room reporters must type in excess 225wpm at high accuracy. In law changing a single word changes could change the whole meaning of a law.

Stop assuming what machines can do and humans can't and actually read. You can even speak your questions into your phone. Slow, loud and clear, ok google.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> You misunderstand my meaning of failure rate. I was talking literally in response to a remark. Software does as a fact have a worst failure rate than humans, it's not a matter of an opinion. Your phone will freeze at a higher rate than a drunk human dumb enough to get behind a wheel.
> 
> Now technology in general is better at some things than humans but higher thought isn't one of them. Medical diagnosis is one of those higher thought things. When medical personnel see you they are watching you more than they are listening to what you say. For example, "how aware is patient?, how quick do they respond?, skin coloration and feel?, how often are they using the restroom? Are they words coherent etc", and those are just observations of a CNA.
> 
> ...


Medicine for the most part is just an algorithm that the doctors use. There are flow charts out there that people use to arrive at diagnosis. In some areas the computer has even shown that it is better at picking up on those subtle clues and identifying things like cancer in a mammogram for example.

The Human brain has an actually pretty high failure rate. How many times are you going thru your day and you forget where you put your keys, you want to say something and it is just at the tip of your tongue but you can't remember it. You miss your anniversary, someones birthday etc the human brain actually has a pretty high failure rate.


----------



## Drizzle (Jan 1, 2018)

Medical dianoses doesnt require thought. It doesnt need to be full AI. It just has to intrepret test results thats all. Humans cant do blood tests machines do. Its actually really easy and an old computer could do it. Dont they still use paper medical records? Medicine is so far behind in technology. When you walk into a hospital its like walking back in time! Your little app on your phone that stores and can retrieve maps from the entire world is more advanced then almost all the tech used in medicine. 

When you go to the doctor and have a problem the doctor just guesses, they may consult a text book but misdiagnoses is common in medicine. Also crazy things in medicine with the human brain like placebo effects. Doctors do this too, new trends in allergies that do not exist. 86% of people diagnosed with gluten allergies do not have gluten allergies. The machines think our little brains are stupid.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Uberfunitis said:


> Medicine for the most part is just an algorithm that the doctors use. There are flow charts out there that people use to arrive at diagnosis. In some areas the computer has even shown that it is better at picking up on those subtle clues and identifying things like cancer in a mammogram for example.
> 
> The Human brain has an actually pretty high failure rate. How many times are you going thru your day and you forget where you put your keys, you want to say something and it is just at the tip of your tongue but you can't remember it. You miss your anniversary, someones birthday etc the human brain actually has a pretty high failure rate.


You don't walk nor drive with the conscious brain but the unconscious brain, just like you do not think of breathing. Your unconscious mind forgets nothing, has unlimited storage space, and calculates as fast as light. As far as failure rate the day your brain fails to coordinate your hearth or something else important, you usually die. There is no pooping the battery nor alt,clt,delete.

The AI both of you speak of already existed before machine learning. You both forget MIS. When it came out nearly 2 decades ago people thought it would replace middle management in the corporate world because of it "decision" making capabilities. In truth it was merely just another tool to be used by humans. Machine learning and AI is no different. There is a difference between sci-fi and science.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> There is a difference between sci-fi and science.


Yes the difference is the timing.

Look you don't believe AI is here or likely to be here any time soon in a meaningful way, that is cool, you are entitled to your opinion and time will tell.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

When I here scientists talk about robots or human reducing software I think of image one(science). It's very apparent half of society mostly due to marketing think of image two(sci-fi).

Which do you think is more likely a machine to help a doctor be more efficient or a machine that is entrusted with people lives at stake?


















Uberfunitis said:


> Yes the difference is the timing.
> 
> Look you don't believe AI is here or likely to be here any time soon in a meaningful way, that is cool, you are entitled to your opinion and time will tell.


It's not AI that I question, it is here and has been here. It's people interpretation of what AI is and it's capabilities that is the problem.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> It's not AI that I question, it is here and has been here. It's people interpretation of what AI is and it's capabilities that is the problem.


The only limit on the future of AI capability is our imagination and desire.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Uberfunitis said:


> The only limit on the future of AI capability is our imagination and desire.


For once we argree on something. Btw what is imagination and desire again?


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> For once we argree on something. Btw what is imagination and desire again?


The intersection of hard work and planning.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Uberfunitis said:


> The intersection of hard work and planning.


Nice try, but they are emotions. AI just as all scientific breakthroughs are driven by energy in motion going back to the beginning of our conversation.


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Nice try, but they are emotions. AI just as all scientific breakthroughs are driven by energy in motion going back to the beginning of our conversation.


Humans will always lead the way with AI. But I see no reason why AI can not be entrusted in the near future with routine medical care for example kicking back patients that fall outside of its programed capability to handle.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Uberfunitis said:


> Humans will always lead the way with AI. But I see no reason why AI can not be entrusted in the near future with routine medical care for example kicking back patients that fall outside of its programed capability to handle.





Uberfunitis said:


> Humans will always lead the way with AI. But I see no reason why AI can not be entrusted in the near future with routine medical care for example kicking back patients that fall outside of its programed capability to handle.


Do you mean a much more robust and complex version of this


----------



## Uberfunitis (Oct 21, 2016)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Do you mean a much more robust and complex version of this
> View attachment 301161


Pretty much! No reason part of that complexity could not include movement and a nice face for you to look at that swaps out to an actual doctors face when needed.


----------



## Drizzle (Jan 1, 2018)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Do you mean a much more robust and complex version of this
> View attachment 301161


Boom its already better than going to the doctor, now add blood tests, v02 lung tests and a questionaire an entire industry taken down by the superior machines! Bwa ha ha ha ha!!!!

Too freaking easy.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Uberfunitis said:


> Pretty much! No reason part of that complexity could not include movement and a nice face for you to look at that swaps out to an actual doctors face when needed.


I could see that being used to curb ER pat


Drizzle said:


> Boom its already better than going to the doctor, now add blood tests, v02 lung tests and a questionaire an entire industry taken down by the superior machines! Bwa ha ha ha ha!!!!
> 
> Too freaking easy.


Sighs... this wouldn't replace a doctor. It would curb how many people see the doctor. It will tell people with a cold to eat soup, anything serious get in line to see the doctor.

You really gotta be special to think if you got lung cancer, you just need to follow the prompts on the machine.


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Drizzle said:


> You hear a lot about SDC but why dont AI people focus on things like healthcare. You could easily program ai to do a doctors job. Wow a machine to take a patients temp, weight, height and ask whats wrong. A machine that can read test results and make a by the book diagnoses where as a human doctor is mostly guessing. SDC would be cool but I hate my doctor and would much prefer a machine. Also teachers, court recorders, judges, so many professions should be done by machines to ensure theres no human bias.
> 
> But its too corrupt. Yay America what freedom!!!


Many surgeries are ALREADY done by Robots.
" Dr. assisted".

Look it up.

Been going on over 10 years.


----------



## Drizzle (Jan 1, 2018)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> I could see that being used to curb ER pat
> 
> Sighs... this wouldn't replace a doctor. It would curb how many people see the doctor. It will tell people with a cold to eat soup, anything serious get in line to see the doctor.
> 
> You really gotta be special to think if you got lung cancer, you just need to follow the prompts on the machine.


V02 tests are not for lung cancer its for asthma, emphysema, athletes. Basically to test lung function then if they find cancer see a specialist. If you go see a doctor and they suspect cancer you go see a specialist.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Drizzle said:


> V02 tests are not for lung cancer its for asthma, emphysema, athletes. Basically to test lung function then if they find cancer see a specialist. If you go see a doctor and they suspect cancer you go see a specialist.


I didn't say it was.


----------



## Irishjohn831 (Aug 11, 2017)

Robot perform unlicensed procedures, robot put concrete in bootys to make women happy. Beep beep beep


----------



## Diamondraider (Mar 13, 2017)

Uberfunitis said:


> I do not doubt that the human brain has more processing power. I just doubt the individual human that is in control of that processing power. Humans for the most part have shown that they are not all that rational nor take the best action a good portion of the time. Emotion in my opinion gets in the way of rational thought.


I bet you are great at parties...sheesh


----------



## Drizzle (Jan 1, 2018)

Diamondraider said:


> I bet you are great at parties...sheesh


I actually agree with him, have you ever seen an emotional woman. Completly devoid of rational thought. Everyone has seen it, emotional people will argue 2+2=14 with no shame.


----------



## bonum exactoris (Mar 2, 2019)

Drizzle said:


> I actually agree with him, have you ever seen an emotional woman. Completly devoid of rational thought. Everyone has seen it, emotional people will argue 2+2=14 with no shame.


cir 1970_: " have you ever seen an emotional woman "_
cir 2019: Have U ever seen an emotional person


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

It's so funny to see tomato and his SDC public relations firm coworkers having a conversation in this thread with themselves while sitting next to each other in their cubicles.


----------

