# Does Uber really have a new, deep-pocketed, equally aggressive competitor waiting in the wings?



## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

*Does Uber really have a new, deep-pocketed, equally aggressive competitor waiting in the wings?*
https://pando.com/2016/02/16/what-j...des/550a34d4b70f03fdae5d90d767cbbd0c38efac51/

[...clip...]

The irony of all of this-- of course-- is that Uber's Achilles Heel is the thing it high-fived itself so much about in the early days. It's greatest "disruption": A reliance on independent contractors it doesn't have to pay or offer benefits to. This strategy always had risks, like the drivers also drive for Lyft. Big deal, Uber could outspend and out execute them. Even when they've infuriated them _en masse_, they may have figured the worst they'd have to contend with is a unionization drive. Uber is increasingly worried about that, sure. But they've hired the best people to fight it. They fought back threats like this before, even buying whole state legislatures when they had to.

But even Uber likely didn't assume in a down funding market a company would come out of left field to challenge the most highly valued company in Silicon Valley history and take one-third the cut Uber is taking now. Nor did it likely assume it's utter antipathy for drivers and it's "hey you work for yourselves! not for us!" attitude would lead to drivers willingly giving away route data that could be a competitive leg up to a new entrant. And their "partners" rooting for that entrant all the while because as the forum reads, Uber has left them with "nothing to lose." There's not even a "devil we know" comfort to Uber-- that's how much recent rate cuts have devastated its drivers.
[...clip...]


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## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

Not exactly a Pulitzer winning article 
A better piece: http://www.forbes.com/sites/briansolomon/2016/02/16/stealth-startup-juno-will-take-on-uber-by-treating-drivers-better/


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

John Deer said:


> Not exactly a Pulitzer winning article
> A better piece: http://www.forbes.com/sites/briansolomon/2016/02/16/stealth-startup-juno-will-take-on-uber-by-treating-drivers-better/


The Forbes piece (nice - and thanks for posting) is fluff. It only recaps the CBInsights article.
The Pando piece ties all of the connections together while also raising some bizarre - and some legit -privacy concerns.


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## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> The Forbes piece (nice - and thanks for posting) is fluff. It only recaps the CBInsights article.
> The Pando piece ties all of the connections together while also raising some bizarre - and some legit -privacy concerns.


Was referring to those bizarre privacy concerns as well as getting to conspiracy-theory-land in places...
I can totally understand a company wanting to get enough drivers before it starts accepting rides - it may have worked in 2012 - but anyone entering the market now must be able to provide good service _at day one_. You need enough cars to cover the city so you when a passenger opens the app, she can get a car in 3 minutes. You'd want to track cars so you'd know how much cars you need for example.

BTW, about passenger privacy: you're credit card transactions tell all there's need to know. Check: http://blog.futureadvisor.com/study...t-in-riders-and-revenue-with-12x-lead-in-u-s/ (assuming there's anything Facebook or Google don't know about you already)


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> *Does Uber really have a new, deep-pocketed, equally aggressive competitor waiting in the wings?*
> https://pando.com/2016/02/16/what-j...des/550a34d4b70f03fdae5d90d767cbbd0c38efac51/
> 
> [...clip...]
> ...


It is no longer Uber vs. Lyft.
It is now G.M. defense contractor vs. GOOGLE D. A. R. P. A. defense contractor. 
Welcome to the War of Big Brothers. 
May the Force be with you.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

John Deer said:


> BTW, about passenger privacy: you're credit card transactions tell all there's need to know. Check: http://blog.futureadvisor.com/study...t-in-riders-and-revenue-with-12x-lead-in-u-s/ (assuming there's anything Facebook or Google don't know about you already)


That link (which has some 'yeah, ok' points) is two years outdated - and only mentions credit card data for tracking dollars spent per ride, per service. That data has nothing to do with travel routes and patterns within a market, nor any trip specific information other than possibly the timestamp of the transactionand the city.

Yeah - the privacy issues raised do seem bizarre... but stanger things have happened - and certaibnly Uber has proven that these millenial geeks no nothing about business ethics or moral conduct.


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## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> That link (which has some 'yeah, ok' points) is two years outdated - and only mentions credit card data for tracking dollars spent per ride, per service. That data has nothing to do with travel routes and patterns within a market, nor any trip specific information other than possibly the timestamp of the transactionand the city.


True.
http://toddwschneider.com/posts/analyzing-1-1-billion-nyc-taxi-and-uber-trips-with-a-vengeance/

Note that this data is anonymized - there's no data on specific passengers (which Uber does have - and has used in the past against the very same Pando in the past).

What information _can_ Juno collect from a device in the car? Well, it can certainly tell it where its drivers are, when they are working etc. (obviously Uber will have this data and more, and so would Google - unless you use Apple Maps of course). The screen shot is fuzzy but it seems drivers can change state between "online" and some other state (can't read it). Juno can't really know anything about specific passengers. At best, they can ask the driver to indicate a passenger was picked up or dropped. That's more than one can get from the Uber & taxi trips above or credit card information - which is presumably why Juno is interested in getting it (even if it's cost it a dime)


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

John Deer said:


> What information _can_ Juno collect from a device in the car?


It can buy/ease the learning curve that Uber and Lyft had to develop from the ground up. That's a huge adanatage over starting from scratch. Times of heaviest demand, most frequented routes, avg length of trips, etc.


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## Thatendedbadly (Feb 8, 2016)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> It can the learning curve that Uber and Lyft had to develop from the ground up. That's a huge adanatage over starting from scratch. Times of heaviest demand, most frequented routes, avg length of trips, etc.


Problem being that Uber never developed much of a 'learning curve', they simply focused on getting the car to the pax, consequences for the drivers be damned, if only for the reason that the drivers aren't costing Uber much in overhead. In all probability very little in overhead. Uber focuses on the pax and themselves, like all three legged stools you actually need all three legs for the damn thing to be usable.


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## Ziggy (Feb 27, 2015)

Juno should be prime to scoop up all the drivers they want from Uber ... as only Uber trolls will suckle on the Uber teat after Juno launches a platform that enables drivers to make a living wage


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## DaveCraige (Feb 11, 2016)

fascinating stuff. Thanks for all the up to the minute news about Juno.


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## Backdash (Jan 28, 2015)

Have a look...


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## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

Ziggy said:


> Juno should be prime to scoop up all the drivers they want from Uber ... as only Uber trolls will suckle on the Uber teat after Juno launches a platform that enables drivers to make a living wage


Although Juno's commission is 10% vs. Uber's 25% (which means you keep 20% more of the dough), do you think they'd have a chance if they are priced higher than Uber? Like it or not, any new entrant, unless providing a very different experience (which I think Juno does not - same drivers, same cars) - would have to keep prices in-line with Uber - at least initially.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

John Deer said:


> Although Juno's commission is 10% vs. Uber's 25% (which means you keep 20% more of the dough), do you think they'd have a chance if they are priced higher than Uber? Like it or not, any new entrant, unless providing a very different experience (which I think Juno does not - same drivers, same cars) - would have to keep prices in-line with Uber - at least initially.


So what you're saying is that, all things being equal, but with a lower fee,
for each dollar in gross fare, drivers would earn
$0.90 with Juno vs $0.75-$0.80 earned with Uber.
I'd take that ANY day. I'd run both apps and favor Juno requests
(the way a lot of drivers do now with Lyft and Uber)


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> The Pando piece ties all of the connections together while also raising some bizarre - and some legit -privacy concerns.


Sarah Lacy focussing & speculating on hypothetical privacy concerns was bizarre indeed. 
Talmon Marco is the founder of Juno. He will be doing a Q & A.









Talmon Marco was the founder of Viber App which was acquired by Japan's Rakuten for $900 million.

I met Talmon last June in NYC. He has my support.


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## Ziggy (Feb 27, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> Sarah Lacy focussing & speculating on hypothetical privacy concerns was bizarre indeed.
> Talmon Marco is the founder of Juno. He will be doing a Q & A.
> View attachment 28207
> 
> ...


Hahaha ... she's featuring an image from the wrong Juno

Here's the correct Juno - https://www.gojuno.com/meet/


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## andaas (May 19, 2015)

Ziggy said:


> Hahaha ... she's featuring an image from the wrong Juno
> 
> Here's the correct Juno - https://www.gojuno.com/meet/


She's intentionally using the movie poster, lol.


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## Ziggy (Feb 27, 2015)

John Deer said:


> Although Juno's commission is 10% vs. Uber's 25% (which means you keep 20% more of the dough), do you think they'd have a chance if they are priced higher than Uber? Like it or not, any new entrant, unless providing a very different experience (which I think Juno does not - same drivers, same cars) - would have to keep prices in-line with Uber - at least initially.


It appears from the onboarding process that Juno will weed out the lower rated drivers ... though what's missing from the intake form is how many Uber trips you've taken and how long you've been driving Uber ... as a driver with 4.98 only 50 trips is not necessarily a good driver ratings wise; but a driver with 4.88 and 3,000 trips is probably a better driver overall.

Though, it will be interesting to see what shakes up overall; I do not and never have driven X* ... >90% of my pax that I've asked are willing to pay more than the current Lux rate for a reliable service. In either case, Juno has deep pockets and if they can make the slightest dent in NYC; it might rattle the cages at Uber and force them to clean up their act and be fairer with their drivers. The fact that there were at least a dozen driver #SlowDown events nationwide during Valentine's Day weekend ... should be a clear indicator to Uber that the market is ripe for someone to swoop in and unseat them. Uber was confident that no one would dare enter the market against them, so they could continue abusing their drivers worldwide.


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## Manotas (Dec 2, 2015)

Come to Miami... I'll sign up and find out for myself


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## andaas (May 19, 2015)

Juno will most likely be in NYC area only for awhile. Reading the driver agreement, it is worded similarly for the specific driver requirements in New York, specifically with regards to drivers being required to provide their own commercial insurance, etc. Who knows how long it will take for them to venture beyond city #1.


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## ten25 (Oct 4, 2015)

John Deer said:


> Although Juno's commission is 10% vs. Uber's 25% (which means you keep 20% more of the dough), do you think they'd have a chance if they are priced higher than Uber? Like it or not, any new entrant, unless providing a very different experience (which I think Juno does not - same drivers, same cars) - would have to keep prices in-line with Uber - at least initially.


I quit Uber and started driving a cab in the suburbs of Kansas City... You would be surprised how many people are willing to pay $2 a mile. I do more business driving a cab than I did driving Uber and this is not a particularly great city to be a cab driver.


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## naplestom75 (May 3, 2015)

I think it has alot of new, shallow pocket aggressive competitors waiting in the wings that will all enter the market one by one


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## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

andaas said:


> Juno will most likely be in NYC area only for awhile. Reading the driver agreement, it is worded similarly for the specific driver requirements in New York, specifically with regards to drivers being required to provide their own commercial insurance, etc. Who knows how long it will take for them to venture beyond city #1.


New York is on a different planet when it comes to For-Hire regulations...


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## Tequila Jake (Jan 28, 2016)

I'm not sure how Juno can make it on 10%. The only real marginal cost per ride is insurance (covered by the Rider Fee) and the credit card processing fee. The credit card processing is likely 1.5 to 3% and has to be paid on any tip amount and the rider fee. That's huge if more than 30% of their revenue is going to card processing.


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## naplestom75 (May 3, 2015)

You really think these companies are paying an insurance premium based on number of rides?

that's the racket of the SR fee. Their insurance rates are set and probably audited from period to period for flat amounts.


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## stuber (Jun 30, 2014)

John Deer said:


> Although Juno's commission is 10% vs. Uber's 25% (which means you keep 20% more of the dough), do you think they'd have a chance if they are priced higher than Uber? Like it or not, any new entrant, unless providing a very different experience (which I think Juno does not - same drivers, same cars) - would have to keep prices in-line with Uber - at least initially.


But not necessarily. Juno could be priced significantly higher and still work.
Since Uber and Lyft have already created driver density, Juno could leverage that.
Uber and Lyft can put the drivers out in field and keep them busy, but drivers would run Juno as well, and grab those calls whenever they come.

I contend that many passengers were never particularly concerned with Uber's original higher prices. Eventually, passengers would gravitate towards the better service. Then we could see a race to the top.

They could carve out the high standards, luxury niche that Uber has basically abandoned.

It would make sense with their lower commission rate.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Tequila Jake said:


> I'm not sure how Juno can make it on 10%. The only real marginal cost per ride is insurance


Juno will initially roll out in NYC where Drivers already have their own commercial livery insurance.

Roll out in other markets could be accompanied by a $1/Ride Fee to cover for insurance. This $1/Ride Fee would be less than Uber's ~$1.75/Ride Booking Fee (previously called SRF) or Lyft's $1.50/Ride Trust & Safety Fee.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

andaas said:


> Juno will most likely be in NYC area only for awhile. Reading the driver agreement, it is worded similarly for the specific driver requirements in New York, specifically with regards to drivers being required to provide their own commercial insurance, etc. Who knows how long it will take for them to venture beyond city #1.


Feb 17, 17:40

Hello ________,

Thank you for your interest in Juno.
Currently we are focusing on New York City but we will be expanding in the upcoming months.
We have your details on file for when we do reach out for expansion.

We hope to see you soon.

At Your Service -

Lianne. S
Juno Specialist

1-855-JUNO-USA ( 855-586-6872 )
[email protected]| www.gojuno.com​


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## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

https://t.co/GqKQIOm9rq


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

stuber said:


> They could carve out the high standards, luxury niche that Uber has basically abandoned.


I would hope so - but the low utilization of UberSELECT/LUX (where its available) doesn't paint an optomistic picture.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

John Deer said:


> https://t.co/GqKQIOm9rq


_"[They're] setting aside half of the founder's stock to give to drivers.
"But while the equity part sounds nice, let's be real. Drivers aren't going to switch from Uber just for the chance of a potential payday. They've been burned by the promises of a startup before. And that's why Juno says it's taking only a 10% commission of each ride, enables tipping, and is open to drivers being contractors or being employees if they want to be exclusive to Juno."_​


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## Ziggy (Feb 27, 2015)

stuber said:


> I contend that many passengers were never particularly concerned with Uber's original higher prices. Eventually, passengers would gravitate towards the better service. Then we could see a race to the top.
> They could carve out the high standards, luxury niche that Uber has basically abandoned.
> It would make sense with their lower commission rate.


Agreed. As I drive Lux & Select ... many of my pax are willing to pay $5-8/mi (which is considerably lower than Black). Many of my pax rationalize it that a DUI is >$15K ... their average UberLux trip is $150 ... therefore they can take 100 UberLux trips instead of paying for 1 DUI.

Nothing against X ... but I think the sweet spot is somewhere in the middle ... Select & above.


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## BurgerTiime (Jun 22, 2015)

Whatever competitor comes into the market they only have to beat Uber in that market. Win over good driver and users is all they have to do. Treat drivers with respect and allow tipping and Uber will fall. It will only take one in each market to win em over. At this point everyone is looking for something better.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Juno founder: "Everybody we talked to, they hated Uber with a passion."*

New ridesharing service Juno wasn't planning to do any press for a few months. But when you put an app in two thousand cars in the media capital of the word and threaten to target the glaring weak spot of the highest valued company in Silicon Valley history&#8230; well, word tends to spread.

Yesterday we speculated about the prospects and pluses and minuses of what we knew of the app. Soon afterwards, Juno's founder and CEO Talmon Marco emailed me, arguing that my speculation-- particularly that the company's data collection on active Uber drivers was "creepy"-- was wildly unfair.

Despite his intention not to do press this early, Marco and I spent an hour on the phone yesterday afternoon as he explained details of Juno's plans. The call was followed by a lengthy email exchange. At the very least Juno seems determined to have a different relationship with journalists than Uber.

To be clear: Marco's effort is still in the very early stages. Juno hasn't yet picked up a single passenger. He's raised money from just the cofounders of his previous company, himself, and friends and family, and is staying silent on the funding details. It's "in the eight figures" he told me before apologizing for the broad range in what that could be. Let's assume the $10 million-ish low-end. That's still a hefty amount for an unlaunched business funded by founders and friends and family.

Marco's last company-- Viber-- didn't raise outside capital and was sold to Rakuten for some $900 million. So he can certainly afford to bootstrap for a while. And that's another part of his differentiation: Unlike Uber's would-be "baller" culture, which has maximized valuations damn the consequences, Juno's founders say they aren't motivated by personal enrichment, because they've already made plenty. Proof? They setting aside half of the founder's stock to give to drivers.

But while the equity part sounds nice, let's be real. Drivers aren't going to switch from Uber just for the chance of a _potential_ payday. They've been burned by the promises of a startup before. And that's why Juno says it's taking only a 10% commission of each ride, enables tipping, and is open to drivers being contractors or being employees if they want to be exclusive to Juno.

How can they afford this? Marco wouldn't detail a lot of the economics on the record, but a clear cost savings is in marketing. Uber and Lyft spend billions per year on incentives, signing bonuses, referral fees, passenger giveaways, artificially low subsidies to encourage growth, billboard campaigns, and many other ways to drive growth. Juno believes by launching in just one market at first, growing slowly, and building the service drivers want to succeed, they won't need to spend anywhere close to the same marketing dollars. So far, they haven't spent any.

Put another way: Juno will put all its money into keeping existing drivers happy, not continually bringing new ones into the funnel. And because the cut is so much lower, theoretically drivers will evangelize the service to passengers. Drivers won't only be a "partner" in the sense of getting equity, Marco helps they'll offset the marketing waste of other services by helping market the service themselves.

This is a bold experiment, and includes details that many people (including us!) have said the more friendly Lyft should have done as a differentiation, rather than being forced into playing Uber's game with shallower pockets. Juno has the distinct disadvantage of launching seven years into this game, but the advantage of starting from a clean slate, witnessing what clearly _hasn't _worked about the current approach.

The excitement around it has created a crazy game of telephone in the driver community. We've gotten tips for 24 hours that wildly conflict, inflate numbers of drivers and equity, and all sorts of other details. One thing is for sure: The entire New York driver community is talking about Juno and that excitement is spreading. This may not have been the launch Marco planned, but you can argue it's been effective.

There's another reason the economics may work: Marco says clearly that Juno will not engage in price wars. That means it won't be the cheapest option. He says the experience will be better for passengers, but wouldn't give details. Drivers have told us that includes things like alerts that a passenger's battery may be low, they may have luggage or may have special requests and needs.

Still, not caving to the price wars is clearly the biggest gamble the new service is taking. Drivers will absolutely opt for a service that pays them more. But consumers also tend to vote with their wallets when it comes to any mode of transportation.

It was Uber who defined this battle in terms of politics. Uber would be the candidate going up against "an asshole called Taxi." Only now, it's clear the world considers candidate Uber the asshole in the race, especially the driver community.

If you're looking for an electoral analogy, Uber is the rich, brash, never apologizing Donald Trump of the ridesharing world, Lyft is the sometimes bumbling, ultimately lovable Bernie Sanders who seems pathologically incapable of throwing a hard jab. Juno could be something like a Hillary Clinton. Someone who knows how to play the game, but also says the right things when it comes to controversial issues.

Only that analogy isn't completely fair, because Juno is also the ultimate outsider as a "candidate" to compete with Valley ridesharing giants. It's founded by Israelis, backed by non-Silicon Valley VC money, based in New York, and enriched by Japanese cash from a previous sale.

*Continued next post...*


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## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

BurgerTiime said:


> Win over good driver and users is all they have to do.


Sounds so easy...


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*...Continued from post above.*

Rather than reading more of my own analogies and speculation, here's Marco's own words in an excerpt of our conversation:

*Sarah Lacy: *Why are you going after the highest valued, most capital intensive business in the Valley just as we've entered a funding correction? Why now?

*Talmon Marco: *We are still trying to figure that out. (Laughs) We sold Viber in early 2014, and we were not obligated to stay there. Entrepreneurs are entrepreneurs and as fun as Rakuten was, it's not the place for people like us. We like to start stuff. So we started to look at different things. Peer-to-peer lending, a lot of different things. And we started looking at this space.

We started to feel like there was a lot of dissent on the driver side towards Uber, but it wasn't clear how bad it was. It's difficult to gauge whether it was a few people who hate Uber or whether it was something big. We put together a focus group December 29 and 30 of 2014. We talked to over thirty drivers over a few sessions over a couple of days. We wanted to see how they feel about the space.

We realized this is not one crazy guy sending messages. Everybody we talked to, they hated Uber with a passion. We talked about our model, and the plan was not even half-baked. But we wanted to give drivers equity and make them true partners. We set up a Google Voice number and started getting calls from drivers about joining our new company. We didn't even have a company, it was just a focus group. That's when we thought, "We just have to build it." There is an opening here. There is something that can be done. And it could be worthy.

There was this moment when I talked to one driver, and I asked how many hours he drove a day. He said "I drive until I make $350. There is no time limit." That's horrible. That's not the way you or I conduct our lives. We might work more hours, we might work less, but we don't have to work until we make a certain amount.

We went on to talk to passengers, and you could see the loyalty to any brand is not that high. We saw there was a sufficient opening.

We did a round of financing-- mostly us-- and late April of last year, we started developing code and started bringing drivers on board in December. We started out going into Uber cars and talking to them, but after a very short while we stopped. It was completely organic. Thousands of drivers are now in New York driving with our software. 1,000 more are registered and waiting.

When we're technically ready, we'll launch. From a driver population point of view, we are almost ready. We will start slow and get things right. There is nothing sinister or crazy about our service.

*SL*: So let's talk about the quiet tracking of data then. Can you understand why some people would have found that creepy?

*TM: *I don't know how else we would have done this. We can't do what Uber did. We can't launch with two and a half cars on the street and say "We're doing this!" We need to be a fully baked company that can compete with 1,200 engineers and 10,000 servers and $10 billion in financing. We need to say we are better than they are.

[Marco explained over email that there are three modes for the app: Offline, online, and busy. Right now every driver has it in "busy" mode, where it is collecting basic location information, but drivers aren't available for pickups.]

The "busy" mode was not originally built for any data gathering, it was part of the way our stock compensation was going to work. Drivers earn equity depending on how much they drive and they need to be active a certain number of hours per month. If we don't have enough work to send them, and they need to drive for Uber, we wanted a way to still count them as "active."

We count "busy" mode as active time for the drivers, even though we make nothing out of it. To be honest, shame on me, I never thought this would be a passenger concern. I don't know the pick up location or the passenger data. This kind of data we get TLC releases on every single taxi ride in New York City.

*SL:* It occurs to me the one thing you can use to your advantage is time and patience-- especially in a down funding environment. Uber has expanded so quickly, and its valuation is so high that it has to win all over the world at once. That's hurting its economics and is causing part of this problem. Are you going to have a more deliberate strategy?

*TM:* It's too early to discuss our expansion strategy. We need to be a bit more humble and walk before we run. Let's see how things go in New York. We are going to write our playbook in New York and are going to make a lot of mistakes and learn things and then apply them to other markets.

It's too early to predict anything else.

*SL: *How big is your team?

*TM:* One hundred people spread between New York, Minsk, Belarus, and Tel Aviv where we do architecture, product and support. We have 24/7 phone support for both riders and drivers. That's another difference.

*SL:* What about price? Consumers have been taught to believe these are commodity products, getting you from point A to point B with similar apps, driven by the same drivers oftentimes.

*TM:* We are not looking at competing with Uber and Lyft on price. We are looking to compete on quality. We want to offer a differentiated experience to drivers, but also to riders. There is a lot to improve in this space.

*SL:* Is the future of this company human drivers?

*TM:* We believe like everyone else in this space that we're going to have self-driving cars. Where we differ from Uber and Lyft is what happens to our drivers on that day. The answer with Uber and Lyft is they get deactivated. "Deactivated." It's interesting that they use the same term that's used by the Borg in Star Trek. What we see happening on that day, is because they'll be shareholders in our company, they'll continue to enjoy the benefits of their work. I don't know of any other revolution where people are replaced with machines and the people can still continue to enjoy the benefits of their earlier work.

Every single one of our drivers is eligible to become a shareholder. It's based on how much they drive. We are in the process of filing the documentation. There are definitely SEC considerations when it comes to doing something like this.

You need to be an active driver for 24 months out of 30. This is like vesting.

*SL: *People are saying it's 50% of the company? Is that right?

*TM: *It's 50% of the founding shares. They'll be the same as the founders. The drivers will get diluted as we get diluted.

*SL:* And, sorry, I have to ask about this strange coincidence where Uber drivers are organizing protests on Viber&#8230; coincidence?

*TM:* We have better things to do than organize Uber campaigns on a platform we used to own.

*SL:* Your rhetoric isn't just about being fair to drivers. It's about ethics and fairness. Uber has had many scandals beyond just cutting driver pay, is that also something you're trying to poke at?

*TM:* We want to do the right thing. Every single one of us could retire if we wanted to and never work again. This is not just about making a few extra dollars. It is about doing something meaningful.

Maybe I'm getting older. I think you can be nice to everyone. Being nice doesn't cost you anything.

*SL:* So this launches to passengers this spring?

*TM*: We sure hope so.

*Continued post below...*


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*...Continued from post above.*

When you see someone coming out of our office with this nice Juno bag, you see this happiness in their eyes and we haven't given them anything yet. It's only a promise right now. A hope that maybe things can be better. In many ways it's invigorating, but it puts a lot of pressure on us to succeed. We'd be disappointing a lot of people.

* * * *

There's an interesting coda to all of this. Late last night, I got an email from Marco telling me they were going to drop the location reporting during the app's busy mode. I asked if this was because of the perceived creepiness factor, which frankly, I thought he rebutted pretty well already by saying it didn't have any passenger specifics.

He answered, "I'm afraid so." He continued:

There are lots and lots of reasons to do this. For example (and in no particular order)

- did a driver leave the device busy by mistake? If they are stationary for a long period, you'd like to ask the driver if he or she is still around. If no response - go offline.

- analyze pricing - does the pricing model make sense? Perhaps you should charge more per minute and less per mile? For example, under Uber's current pricing, a driver "waiting for an hour" In NYC will make $21. That's $13.65 after Uber's cut and taxes. From this you need to deduct operating expenses. Even without mileage that's about $6 per hour. So now that's $7.65. That's less than NY minimum wage. Maybe there is a better pricing model.

- fleet management. By better analyzing traffic patterns you can typically predict demand. If you can predict demand, you can send cars to where you expect demand will happen, reducing the need for surge and reducing driver downtime - so drivers make more and passengers pay less.

There are plenty of good things that you can do with this data. But for now, we'll skip some of it.

Of the many ways Marco said how Juno will be different from Uber, this reaction demonstrated it clearly. When drivers, regulators, the press or anyone else has raised a concern about Uber's actions, the company not only doesn't make changes, but executives who have made threats to journalists or abused user data are not even fired. Uber is a company that will never alter its path-- even when the wider world has condemned its actions. Even if it should. Juno in contrast dropped a pretty innocuous feature because it "felt" creepy to some people.

It's hard not to think again of politicians. Juno is the "candidate" seeking compromise and consensus. Uber wants only to push its agenda through at any costs.

Juno is certainly a company that listens. It's an appealing "candidate" promising hope and change. The question is whether it'll be a company that can execute. We'll see this spring. There's a reason things never really change in Washington. We'll see if ridesharing is any different.


----------



## stuber (Jun 30, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> *...Continued from post above.*
> 
> When you see someone coming out of our office with this nice Juno bag, you see this happiness in their eyes and we haven't given them anything yet. It's only a promise right now. A hope that maybe things can be better. In many ways it's invigorating, but it puts a lot of pressure on us to succeed. We'd be disappointing a lot of people.
> 
> ...


Good stuff. I'll watch this.


----------



## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Follow Juno:


 https://twitter.com/i/web/status/700016721659359233*


----------



## TheHairyFiddler (Jan 12, 2016)

Don't know if it's Juno or whoever...but some shrewd business entity run by sharp people would destroy Travis. If Mr. Billionaire doesn't understand that there will be serious consequences for his brutal business tactics towards the very people that made him filthy rich, then he is sadly mistaken.

It's just a matter of time. Remember Travis...what goes around comes around. Someday, you will pay for ruining the lives of tens of thousands of people...who bought in to your BS.


----------



## stuber (Jun 30, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> Juno will initially roll out in NYC where Drivers already have their own commercial livery insurance.
> 
> Roll out in other markets could be accompanied by a $1/Ride Fee to cover for insurance. This $1/Ride Fee would be less than Uber's ~$1.75/Ride Booking Fee (previously called SRF) or Lyft's $1.50/Ride Trust & Safety Fee.


Commercial ONLY, would be a good idea IMO. That way there's no licence hassles to go through as they expand. Just take the high road. And own it. The large limousine companies are no where near making this happen, yet there's ample demand.


----------



## stuber (Jun 30, 2014)

TheHairyFiddler said:


> Don't know if it's Juno or whoever...but some shrewd business entity run by sharp people would destroy Travis. If Mr. Billionaire doesn't understand that there will be serious consequences for his brutal business tactics towards the very people that made him filthy rich, then he is sadly mistaken.
> 
> It's just a matter of time. Remember Travis...what goes around comes around. Someday, you will pay for ruining the lives of tens of thousands of people...who bought in to your BS.


But it's not just about revenge. The commercial part of the market (professionals with permits and insurance) is begging for a solution. TK is not even looking to serve that market. Someone else should.


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

andaas said:


> Juno will most likely be in NYC area only for awhile. Reading the driver agreement, it is worded similarly for the specific driver requirements in New York, specifically with regards to drivers being required to provide their own commercial insurance, etc. Who knows how long it will take for them to venture beyond city #1.


New York streets will be an immobile junkyard of ridesharing cars and taxis.

Where is "PIZZA RAT" when you need him ?


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

When will a driver group start their own company ?


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

With emphasis on "PERSONAL HUMAN SERVICE"

NOT DRIVERLESS CARS TOSSING PAX ON A SUPERMARKET SCALE IN THE SELF CHECKOUT LANE.

there is a sales spproach in the human aspect from management down to customer service.

We have seen what "Technology"
Has to offer !
Who will head in a Humanist direction ?


----------



## andaas (May 19, 2015)

tohunt4me said:


> When will a driver group start their own company ?


Many have. Arcade City, Fare, to name a couple.


----------



## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

I would give any driver-focussed company my full support and try to help it grow large enough so I could dump these much hated UberLyft clowns at the earliest opportunity.

But the proof is in the pudding. It's all very well and good for a company to say that it's driver-centric, but when the hard reality sets in and it has to pull out all the stops to compete with Uber, things are likely to change. Lyft, for example, originally pushed the idea that drivers were part of some kind of "rideshare community". It claimed to treat drivers better. But no, every day it became more like Uber and now Lyft is just a carbon copy of its master in every material aspect.

Time will tell.


----------



## Lack9133 (Mar 26, 2015)

ten25 said:


> I quit Uber and started driving a cab in the suburbs of Kansas City... You would be surprised how many people are willing to pay $2 a mile. I do more business driving a cab than I did driving Uber and this is not a particularly great city to be a cab driver.


Completely agree. I did the same thing in my city and I make more money in my taxi. I still hold onto the Uber app for those crazy surcharge nights but as I have said all along, customers care more about response time than price in this market. That $1.00 difference between Uber and Taxi per mile cost really doesn't matter much to customers only going a couple miles. Most would rather pay the extra $3.00 to jump in a taxi who is in front of them as compared on waiting 10 minutes for the Uber to show.


----------



## andaas (May 19, 2015)

I think Lyft has been trying to compete with Uber as best as they have been able to. At this point, I don't think Lyft could have competed without following suit in the race to the bottom.

However, as Juno has realized, the race has left drivers pissed off at both of the current players in the scene... cutting rates, bringing in more and more drivers... the quality of both Uber and Lyft has fallen just like the rates.

If Juno can properly capitalize on the situation, they could leave Uber+Lyft handling the bargain transportation markets they have created (Pool/Line, etc.), and Juno can create an affordable alternative to the taxi which is what started all of this furor 5 years ago (yes, I know Uber is older than 5 years, but they were a black car company the first 2 years before Lyft came along).


----------



## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

stuber said:


> But it's not just about revenge. The commercial part of the market (professionals with permits and insurance) is begging for a solution. TK is not even looking to serve that market. Someone else should.


That's practically _all_ of the market in NYC...


----------



## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

tohunt4me said:


> When will a driver group start their own company ?


When drivers have the resources and know-how.
Until that happens, seems Juno is the closest thing you have to owing a part of the business


----------



## SCdave (Jun 27, 2014)

Very interesting stuff on Juno. So what is his uberpeople.net "user name"? Guessing he's been lurking around here for awhile.

He is looking at a niche to jump in. The transportation industry is huge. And the TNC industry is so new that what it looks like in 6 months, 1 year or 3 years, who knows?

I would be happy to drive Juno for an equity share (hmmm might have mentioned this once or twice). Also it looks like Juno will stay clear of the Employee vs Independent Contractor lawsuits with their Company. Following the Uber TNC model is a huge risk. Juno has greatly lowered their risk re the funds they would need to allocate to potential lawsuits and payouts to grease local/state, and federal legislation. I would think 5% commission would even be viable. 10% commission for a smart TNC company should be profitable.

I could also see Juno "partnering" with city governments with their model. I would think city governments and local city unions would be more open to the Juno model than the Uber model. Yes, go after small/medium sized cities in the USA. Offer them a great transportation model from a company that supports money in the pockets of the people who live and work in their cities and not Uber Investors and their offshore accounts somewhere else in the world.

And all of those European Countries that currently hate the Uber model. Do you think the Juno model would be more likely to get the "okay" to start up business?

Juno model actually seems like an App Technology Company that does Merchant Card Processing and works "with" Driver Partners. Hmmmm


----------



## UberBlackPr1nce (Dec 28, 2014)

ten25 said:


> I quit Uber and started driving a cab in the suburbs of Kansas City... You would be surprised how many people are willing to pay $2 a mile. I do more business driving a cab than I did driving Uber and this is not a particularly great city to be a cab driver.


If you add up the 25% uber takes monthly it can add up about the same to rent a cab.


----------



## sunshine1983 (Sep 27, 2015)

TheHairyFiddler said:


> Don't know if it's Juno or whoever...but some shrewd business entity run by sharp people would destroy Travis. If Mr. Billionaire doesn't understand that there will be serious consequences for his brutal business tactics towards the very people that made him filthy rich, then he is sadly mistaken.
> 
> It's just a matter of time. Remember Travis...what goes around comes around. Someday, you will pay for ruining the lives of tens of thousands of people...who bought in to your BS.


Hardly doubt it. He has too much money now. As long as he's sober and stay away from trouble, he will live a happy and filthy rich life ever after.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

Tequila Jake said:


> I'm not sure how Juno can make it on 10%. The only real marginal cost per ride is insurance (covered by the Rider Fee) and the credit card processing fee. The credit card processing is likely 1.5 to 3% and has to be paid on any tip amount and the rider fee. That's huge if more than 30% of their revenue is going to card processing.


POST # 24/Tequila Jake: If you find it
hard to Wrap
your Head Around 10%...then check
out the Boston-only Russian Expats
running "FASTEN" at only $1/Ride as
Software Licensing Fee!

Mentoring Bison: Here since 07DEC2014.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

sunshine1983 said:


> Hardly doubt it. He has too much money now. As long as he's sober and stay away from trouble, he will live a happy and filthy rich life ever after.


POST # 54/sunshine1983: You MUST
have been Otherwise
Engrossed Last Summer when Daish/ISIS
declared that "a Contract was Out" [What! No more Fatwas ?] on the Former Crown Prince of Kalanickistan [May $Billions be Upon him] his August Exigency, Emperor 
@$$hat the Fi$t.

He's got a 7.62x54 Cartridge-Propelled Projectile coming soon to the ManCave-
in-the-Sky @1455 Market Street before
HQ is completely moved across-to-EastBay
in Herbally Hip "Oaksterdam".

Travis : Interviewing "Body Doubles".
☆ ☆ ☆ "Hello, Eddie Munster ?


----------



## stuber (Jun 30, 2014)

John Deer said:


> That's practically _all_ of the market in NYC...


Yes. NYC. But presumably they aren't going to launch in ONLY NYC. What I'm saying is that they should keep it restricted to the licensed professional drivers who have all their local permits and commercial insurance. In all markets. That way they can avoid all the litigation, have reduced overhead (no insurance expenses) and steal away all the UberBlack drivers and all others who run with permits and commercial insurance.

The full time pros have been looking for this since Uber abandoned them for X.


----------



## naplestom75 (May 3, 2015)

Tequila Jake said:


> I'm not sure how Juno can make it on 10%. The only real marginal cost per ride is insurance (covered by the Rider Fee) and the credit card processing fee. The credit card processing is likely 1.5 to 3% and has to be paid on any tip amount and the rider fee. That's huge if more than 30% of their revenue is going to card processing.


Crédit card processing is way lower for someone with that buying power too. Probably averages less than 1%


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

The good thing about Juno is that it has put Uber on notice that it is not playing the lower fares game.


----------



## itsablackmarket (May 12, 2015)

andaas said:


> Juno will most likely be in NYC area only for awhile. Reading the driver agreement, it is worded similarly for the specific driver requirements in New York, specifically with regards to drivers being required to provide their own commercial insurance, etc. Who knows how long it will take for them to venture beyond city #1.


Hopefully not long at all. Slothery is unacceptable. I hope they understand that we are desperate out here, and to move quick and capitalize on the excitement ASAP! I'm so desperate  ..

Uber is like a dry forest, ripe for a wild fire. Let Juno be like a fire that feeds on the failures of Uber as its fuel, spreading everywhere and consuming the whole Uber company in every location they exist. Yay! Uber must be so angry now that they haven't IPO'd yet. Bahahaha.


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> Sarah Lacy focussing & speculating on hypothetical privacy concerns was bizarre indeed.
> Talmon Marco is the founder of Juno. He will be doing a Q & A.
> View attachment 28207
> 
> ...


I agree there's no privacy issue. Every time I run uber I run Juno. I pick up on a street I click busy. I unload and then click available.. There's no creepy spying going on.. Juno app has no idea who's in my car.

Juno's people are good and I'm glad they're not gonna follow uber off a cliff. The focus with Juno is quality and will only take drivers from Uber with a 4.7 or higher rating.


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## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

Lack9133 said:


> Completely agree. I did the same thing in my city and I make more money in my taxi. I still hold onto the Uber app for those crazy surcharge nights but as I have said all along, customers care more about response time than price in this market. That $1.00 difference between Uber and Taxi per mile cost really doesn't matter much to customers only going a couple miles. Most would rather pay the extra $3.00 to jump in a taxi who is in front of them as compared on waiting 10 minutes for the Uber to show.


A ride share app will always play second fiddle to a taxi.


----------



## rocksteady (Mar 19, 2015)

Shit at 10% commission they could win over drivers and be priced competitively.


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

rocksteady said:


> Shit at 10% commission they could win over drivers and be priced competitively.


Of course it can. Uber proved that already. Juno could do a huge volume in New York! The bottom line is we all need to abandon Uber!! Like George said. "Fool me once shame on you......Fool me...and you can't get fooled again"


----------



## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

bezi_NY said:


> Of course it can. Uber proved that already. Juno could do a huge volume in New York! The bottom line is we all need to abandon Uber!! Like George said. "Fool me once shame on you......Fool me...and you can't get fooled again"


Remember it still has to win _passengers_.
Although Uber is nasty to its "partners", overall passengers like its service. This may change if the top drivers (I understand Juno has a 4.7 threshold) decide to deactivate Uber and drive only for Juno. If Uber looses its best drivers, its service would be hurt (actually, has this happened already? with the constant race to the bottom, I'd expect that drivers that have other options - i.e. mostly the best drivers - would leave).
Of course, until Juno has enough customers, drivers will have both Uber and Juno open - and take rides as they come.

How can Juno get traction with passengers (they could throw money at the problem - e.g. discounts, advertising etc. - but this seems a bad move - Uber can outspend them ten-to-one)?


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

This is the App to address those bogus privacy concerns! Online or busy. That's it. On Or off


----------



## andaas (May 19, 2015)

That will be the biggest hurdle they (or any new service starting up) will need to tackle. Great service is one thing, but there are many people (probably, unfortunately, the majority) who will choose price+convenience over service.

As a consumer, which is more appealing to you?

1. Car arrives in 3-5 minutes, driver picks you up, you notice he's wearing sweatpants and a t-shirt, he barely speaks a word and is not sociable, ride costs $15. You don't tip because, well, you were told you didn't have to. Total time from request to drop off, 25 minutes.

2. Car arrives in 15-20 minutes, driver arrives, is nicely dressed, greets you with a smile and opens your door for you, the ride costs $25-30. There is an option to tip, so you tip another $5. Total cost, $35. Total time from request to drop off, 45 minutes.


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

John Deer said:


> Remember it still has to win _passengers_.
> Although Uber is nasty to its "partners", overall passengers like its service. This may change if the top drivers (I understand Juno has a 4.7 threshold) decide to deactivate Uber and drive only for Juno. If Uber looses its best drivers, its service would be hurt (actually, has this happened already? with the constant race to the bottom, I'd expect that drivers that have other options - i.e. mostly the best drivers - would leave).
> Of course, until Juno has enough customers, drivers will have both Uber and Juno open - and take rides as they come.
> 
> How can Juno get traction with passengers (they could throw money at the problem - e.g. discounts, advertising etc. - but this seems a bad move - Uber can outspend them ten-to-one)?


I think we can do just fine with Juno in New York. I think it would be all the wiser to kick off rapidly in other markets as well. Because someone in another city comes to New York it would be nice if they loaded the Juno app before leaving home.

-To me if drivers continue to drive for Uber after Juno is up and running they're not gonna get any sympathy from me! I will not participate in any protest for you or any post on this board to help you! There is no help for that person and they will get what they deserve!

-We need a massive existing driver campaign against Uber for guys to stop driving for them. If a pax opens the uber app and sees 4 or 5x they're gonna look for an alternative! Again, drivers need to abandon ship on Uber and not look back! Guys are already not doing Uber X or Uber for that mater! I mean experienced guys with many years experience in this industry from the area! The ones (drivers) I know are already with Juno and will not do Uber Juno. Some are doing Gett at the moment and black car base work and

-Uber has angered so many drivers in the area... Drivers in my area are already doing things to disrupt service ....( I'll just leave it at that.. )

Bottom line is once Juno launches I'm not participating in any Uber protest for drivers ever again. If you've not learned your lesson you never will. 
-I didn't take any black car requests from LGA during the protest, even though black car rates weren't lowered. I refused because the Uber X guys in the lot were protesting. 
- SUV guys were also taking X protesters to the Uber office in Long Island city at their own expense. I had already commutes to a private from the previous evening and couldn't participate in that but did come back to lot 7 in support.

I wish all the best!!


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

andaas said:


> That will be the biggest hurdle they (or any new service starting up) will need to tackle. Great service is one thing, but there are many people (probably, unfortunately, the majority) who will choose price+convenience over service.
> 
> As a consumer, which is more appealing to you?
> 
> ...


3. MTA lol

4. Train to the plain.

One question,
How is uber gonna be cheaper with no cars available and surge kicking in?

Regarding:
1)Taxi is the alternative to the guy in the suit in New York and always has been. 
2) I have met almost all my private clients through Uber. And most I charge more than Uber. (I can prove it with square statements over the past year.) some are paying me double what Uber charges. $90. LGA from park and 79th. At 5am. In under .30min. I make my own Surge.

Andaas, 
guys need to stop working for Uber for free!


----------



## andaas (May 19, 2015)

bezi_NY said:


> 3. MTA lol
> 
> 4. Train to the plain.
> 
> ...


I'm not a fan of Uber. I'm a realist.

The problem is there are too many people willing to drive for Uber for pennies. If those drivers don't learn about Juno, or aren't QUALIFIED to drive for Juno, then Uber has the advantage.

How is that Uber competitor in Boston doing? You know, the one that started back in September/October? Never heard of them? I'm not surprised.

Granted, that company wasn't as well funded, but you have to understand there are DOZENS of companies trying to take a piece of the pie, and there is only so much pie to go around.

Believe me, I *WANT* this company to succeed. And NOW is the right time for it. However, it's going to take a lot of pieces to fall in just the right place for someone to really make a dent in Uber. Luckily, Uber is doing an amazing job of cracking their armor and showing signs of weakness.


----------



## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

andaas said:


> That will be the biggest hurdle they (or any new service starting up) will need to tackle. Great service is one thing, but there are many people (probably, unfortunately, the majority) who will choose price+convenience over service.
> 
> As a consumer, which is more appealing to you?
> 
> ...


The wait time is part of the quality/service - so right now this is not a clear cut service vs. price.
_If_ the second example had a 3-5 minute wait time like the first, and the rest stays the same the question is valid - do you pay for the nicer car/driver?
In principle that's Black vs. X - wait time is roughly the same - but you get a nicer car.


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

andaas said:


> I'm not a fan of Uber. I'm a realist.
> 
> The problem is there are too many people willing to drive for Uber for pennies. If those drivers don't learn about Juno, or aren't QUALIFIED to drive for Juno, then Uber has the advantage.
> 
> ...


Guys here in New York are in the brink!!! I agree the window is open wider than ever for an alternative. Uber can now be associated with ZIKA drivers here hate it so bad! It's boiling over! Juno needs use this momentum created by Uber.

I got a text a few minutes ago from Juno, and I think theyre stepping it up..


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

John Deer said:


> The wait time is part of the quality/service - so right now this is not a clear cut service vs. price.
> _If_ the second example had a 3-5 minute wait time like the first, and the rest stays the same the question is valid - do you pay for the nicer car/driver?
> In principle that's Black vs. X - wait time is roughly the same - but you get a nicer car.


On the other hand X vs yellow can mean zero wait time. And the result is an X driver racing to an empty corner.
The reality is That it's a fact the last round of 30000 cars in New York City hasn't even put a dent in yellow cab earnings and in desperation Uber cut rates and raise commissions. 
DesperAtion is the word


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> It can buy/ease the learning curve that Uber and Lyft had to develop from the ground up. That's a huge adanatage over starting from scratch. Times of heaviest demand, most frequented routes, avg length of trips, etc.


Drivers need to wield their power and delete that Uber and Lyft garbage! As drivers we need to do what's right and run from those dirt bags.


----------



## SCdave (Jun 27, 2014)

Giving an Equity Interest to the Drivers is the kicker. Drivers are now "Partners" not in BS Uber Speak but in $$ terms.

I can see new Juno drivers driving for Uber "because they have to" but driving for Juno "because they want to". This will be in the startup phase. Driver looks at weeks income and drives Uber to meet the bills. Then Driver switches to Juno to make money AND Grow their Part of the Business (Equity Interest).

Drivers really have no future in Uber. Once you stop driving for Uber, what do Drivers have? Nada, nyet, nothing.

Juno, at least, offers a possible future income stream. Drivers are earning Equity interest that grows with the amount of time Drivers in vest in the business. Wow, kind of like an actual "Partner".

Yes, Juno has to be viable and not be a flash in the pan startup for the Equity interest to have meaning. But that is like any business.

Remember, Juno can grow and the driver's equity interest will grow in value. Or Juno can be bought out by some corporation...and your equity interest has value. You can quite driving or retire, and your equity interest has value (yes, potential to have lower value or no value but like any investment).

Always a risk to trade $$ now for equity and future income. At least I appreciate that I'm putting up capital (my vehicle) and getting an equity interest for my "investment". With Uber, I'm putting up capital (my vehicle) and getting a fist bump and a 5 stars.

For most Drivers, Uber is only the ability to watch your house catch fire and hopefully be able put out that fire and still be able to live in the house minus a room or two. With Juno, at least there is the possibility to rebuild your house. Or in the best case, add on a room and deck.

But we will just have to wait and see if Juno is a nice 4-letter trendy name or a viable company.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

bezi_NY said:


> Drivers need to wield their power and delete that Uber and Lyft garbage! As drivers we need to do what's right and run from those dirt bags.


but, but, but... then we wouldn't be DRIVER'S anymore!


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

SCdave said:


> Giving an Equity Interest to the Drivers is the kicker. Drivers are now "Partners" not in BS Uber Speak but in $$ terms.
> 
> I can see new Juno drivers driving for Uber "because they have to" but driving for Juno "because they want to". This will be in the startup phase. Driver looks at weeks income and drives Uber to meet the bills. Then Driver switches to Juno to make money AND Grow their Part of the Business (Equity Interest).
> 
> ...


Again, I just joined Juno and I like what I hear. I hope they hit some of the big cities soon like LA, Chicago, Sanfran, Miami, etc.. Again, not as the cheapest service in town but a very good service. I do some Uber, and I have a 4.9 rating, I only take black car requests and my rates were not affected by uber's rate cuts in New York. I just don't like how they operate and for that reason I can not trust them nor can I condone their treatment and abuse of drivers and their capital. I'm not gonna wait for the cows to come before I decide to part ways with uber.

There's a lot more to Juno that has not been discussed. I think I shared more than enough for now. I'm just a driver...


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> but, but, but... then we wouldn't be DRIVER'S anymore!


Join Juno.


----------



## rocksteady (Mar 19, 2015)

bezi_NY said:


> Of course it can. Uber proved that already. Juno could do a huge volume in New York! The bottom line is we all need to abandon Uber!! Like George said. "Fool me once shame on you......Fool me...and you can't get fooled again"


Uber proved what already? Was their commission 10% at some point?


----------



## andaas (May 19, 2015)

rocksteady said:


> Uber proved what already? Was their commission 10% at some point?


Yes, if I'm not mistaken, Uber's original commission on launch was 10%. Maybe some old timer can verify.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

andaas said:


> Yes, if I'm not mistaken, Uber's original commission on launch was 10%. Maybe some old timer can verify.


5 years is an old timer.
I'm so screwed in this world.


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

rocksteady said:


> Uber proved what already? Was their commission 10% at some point?


Uber proved you can charge more and be successful. It doesn't have to be the cheapest.

Baller mentality for the masses..lol


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

Why would you want to do anything with people like this?

When Novogratz asked Callinicos why Uber would risk upsetting drivers by raising rates 5%, he said Callinicos didn't hesitate and said, "Because we can."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/ellenhu...rx-tiered-commission-30-percent/#7fb1378e75cc


----------



## SCdave (Jun 27, 2014)

bezi_NY said:


> Why would you want to do anything with people like this?
> 
> When Novogratz asked Callinicos why Uber would risk upsetting drivers by raising rates 5%, he said Callinicos didn't hesitate and said, "Because we can."
> 
> http://www.forbes.com/sites/ellenhu...rx-tiered-commission-30-percent/#7fb1378e75cc


Hopefully in a few years they interview Callinicos again and ask the same question and the response might be, " Because we thought we could".


----------



## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

I


SCdave said:


> Hopefully in a few years they interview Callinicos again and ask the same question and the response might be, " Because we thought we could".


 Can't wait!!

Uber is a dead man walking in my eyes!


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## DaveCraige (Feb 11, 2016)

Thanks for all the updates guys! This is a great thread.

I am compiling as much info as possible here in this running document to share with the many drivers in the Facebook driving groups:

https://medium.com/p/6528b341359b


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## rocksteady (Mar 19, 2015)

bezi_NY said:


> Uber proved you can charge more and be successful. It doesn't have to be the cheapest.
> 
> Baller mentality for the masses..lol


okay, but I don't know of what you're referring to, and that's not what I was talking about. I was referring to the questions raised in the article about Juno's market potential. They want to treat the the drivers better which means more cost upfront as they try to break in to an Uber dominated market. Most ride-share users will ultimately will pick cheap rides over an ethical company with much higher prices. It's similar to organic foods' small market share. My point was they actually could price themselves competitively with Uber if they were able to only take ten percent commission and stay above water. Say the rates were the exact same--hell yeah I'm going to choose to drive with the company that'll let me take home ten percent more of those fares, and driver retention saves money--something that seems to escape the simpletons at Uber. Driver competition will be high which will raise the bar along with customer satisfaction--a money maker.

Especially at first, Juno won't have near as much business and with the higher share of earnings for drivers, supply will outpace demand as Uber drivers jump on board en masse. If they can get a foot hold and demand goes up quickly, they have a chance. But Uber will be in a lot of the markets already and they will change to keep drivers and customers if they have to (if I'm wrong and they're more shrewd capitalists than selfish morons).

Juno says they're going to take their time to do things right. I understand and respect that. But don't take too long to come to NC!


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## SCdave (Jun 27, 2014)

Juno PR putting out interviews from Uber Drivers who switched platforms - just examples guys/gals

Juno Driver #1: " I used to drive Uber but they lowered fares so much that I saw so many Drivers with cars that weren't maintained properly.

Juno Driver #2: "I used to drive Uber but uberPOOL was so distracting that I refused to take those requests. I just didn't feel I could provide the level of safe driving that I can on Juno".

Juno Driver #3: " Juno takes out a reasonable commission on fares that are a bit higher than Uber. But I also get equity in Juno as a driver. I'm now able to budget more towards maintaining and repairing my car instead of cutting corners like I had to when I drove uber".

All of the above are hypothetical. I have not driven for Juno. I have not interviewed any drivers. But I could see these hypothetical interviews of past Uber drivers now driving for Juno and hitting on the areas of the Uber platform that do relate to unsafe driving, again, hypothetically.


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## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

DaveCraige said:


> Thanks for all the updates guys! This is a great thread.
> 
> I am compiling as much info as possible here in this running document to share with the many drivers in the Facebook driving groups:
> 
> https://medium.com/p/6528b341359b


I like this one! I wonder what Richard thinks of Ubers buisness model?


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## backstreets-trans (Aug 16, 2015)

bezi_NY said:


> Why would you want to do anything with people like this?
> 
> When Novogratz asked Callinicos why Uber would risk upsetting drivers by raising rates 5%, he said Callinicos didn't hesitate and said, "Because we can."
> 
> http://www.forbes.com/sites/ellenhu...rx-tiered-commission-30-percent/#7fb1378e75cc


I think that was very telling on how evil this company is. The guy telling the story was in disbelief along with us drivers. He knew this would be their downfall. Anyone withwith any business sense now knows not to invest any more money with them. They thought driverless cars were around the corner but that ain't happening any time soon.


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

bezi_NY said:


> View attachment 28425
> 
> 
> I like this one! I wonder what Richard thinks of Ubers buisness model?


This is what he thinks,

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technolo...ard-Branson-could-launch-a-rival-to-Uber.html


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## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

backstreets-trans said:


> I think that was very telling on how evil this company is. The guy telling the story was in disbelief along with us drivers. He knew this would be their downfall. Anyone withwith any business sense now knows not to invest any more money with them. They thought driverless cars were around the corner but that ain't happening any time soon.


I'm stunned at how stupid these guys running Uber are. I have years of Automotive experience and a few years of orrery large fleet experience... Clearly not everyone at Uber is on the same page when it comes to the fleet/car ownership business. They have no Idea what an inspection is some of these Western European countries. lol they will fail a chipped windshield Germany forget about a crack.. lol they think that a lens won't crack and a car won't ever need to be cleaned their driverless cars won't ever hit a pothole and have a blow out or a crack rim... No Vandelism will strike an Uber.. lol I swear I almost feel sorry for their (Ubers) Investors. I mean the Institionals are using pension money and are screwing other working families over with this scam.lol
They're actually reaching out to Individuals through brokers or financial planners.. I swear I heard an Athlete that's my regular on the phone talking about Chinese shares lol. Probably the worst of any shares to buy! I wish he would have asked me what I thought.. Not that he would have believed me... Others are high on the fool-aide on the investors side of this scam.. I must admit a light went off when Inheard this kid talking about Uber shares with this dude, like so this is how American Athletes end up broke... How lovely these preditors are.. Real nice people looking out for you Hmmmmm


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## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

observer said:


> This is what he thinks,
> 
> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technolo...ard-Branson-could-launch-a-rival-to-Uber.html


Sounds pretty proud of himself


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## uber strike (Jan 10, 2016)

uber has to pay for drivers to sign up. the advantage here is that juno and "a-ride" will have drivers signing up willingly. that allows for a concentrated grab of the market share. i'm in la and ready to sign up.


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## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

http://money.cnn.com/2016/02/19/technology/meet-uber-competitor-juno/index.html


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## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

http://www.bizjournals.com/newyork/...haring-app-juno-brings-fight-to-uber-one.html


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## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

John Deer said:


> http://money.cnn.com/2016/02/19/technology/meet-uber-competitor-juno/index.html


"Juno is slated to launch in its first market, New York City, this spring. It already has "thousands" of drivers signed up to work with the company."

Uber flooded the market here in New York with so many drivers that it opened the door wide open for a competitor to come in and swoop up enough of them to compete against it..

I know Uber can counter with a lot of cash.... Or sandwiches at the airport parking lot..lol
Photo was taken by a friend.


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## Zaki athar (Jan 29, 2016)

Believe me customers living in manhattan don't care about $.25 to $.45 price difference. someone living in manhattan dont mind paying $3000.00 for a 1bed apat. Do you think he has problem paying couple extra dollar for a cab. If some one can't afford a cab, nyc has best transit system in the world. He will take subway. If he want to go door to door, I bet he won't mind paying few cents extra for a good service. It's only the uber who is doing all this propaganda, and false advertisement. Uber want drivers to offer bottle of water to their paxs. I'm sorry to say but if you walk to a grocery store in manhattan it will cost you $1.99. 2 pax 2 bottle of water $3.99. If it's a minimum fare uber will pay you I think $4.70 may be. Actually what you earn from that trip is $.70. Now you can argue that the cost of bottle of water that driver has paid is may be $.20. I bet cost for the same bottle of water grocery store has paid is less then $.20.
Imagin if you are going for vacation, will you not take a taxi from airport to hotel if it's more then $.85/ mile. 
Problem is that there are more then enough stupid people who are willing to spend their time and wreck their cars for uber slavery wages.
In Detroit uber rates are $.30/mile and their are people still driving.
Can't believe it.....


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## Jack Pavlov (Nov 7, 2015)

Uber isn't even on the radar in terms of being the most highly valued company in Silicon Valley. I can name 10 companies off the top that have a valuation that is probably 10 times that of Uber who haven't even been able to post a successful quarter of revenue.


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## LA Cabbie (Nov 4, 2014)

Jack Pavlov said:


> Uber isn't even on the radar in terms of being the most highly valued company in Silicon Valley. I can name 10 companies off the top that have a valuation that is probably 10 times that of Uber who haven't even been able to post a successful quarter of revenue.


Private company it is. Not public which is what you are thinking.


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## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

Jack Pavlov said:


> Uber isn't even on the radar in terms of being the most highly valued company in Silicon Valley. I can name 10 companies off the top that have a valuation that is probably 10 times that of Uber who haven't even been able to post a successful quarter of revenue.


How many of them own Almost no product?(cars)


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## USArmy31B30 (Oct 30, 2015)

It's who takes care of the drivers wins this "game". The same concept as with the married couple, "happy wife, happy life" and it's "happy driver, happy passenger" for the TNC...

I am now a seasoned driver driving for Uber and Lyft and with Juno, I am ready to move on... With Uber/Lyft's continued rate cuts, I am one of those hungry drivers ready for the right leadership and Juno will have a massive fearless army ready to take down Goliath...


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## John Deer (Feb 12, 2015)

USArmy31B30 said:


> It's who takes care of the drivers wins this "game". The same concept as with the married couple, "happy wife, happy life" and it's "happy driver, happy passenger" for the TNC...
> 
> I am now a seasoned driver driving for Uber and Lyft and with Juno, I am ready to move on... With Uber/Lyft's continued rate cuts, I am one of those hungry drivers ready for the right leadership and Juno will have a massive fearless army ready to take down Goliath...


It's more complicated than that - in a "normal" industry, there's the company (or "management"), the employees of that company and the customers (in ridesharing it's the same - but it's "partners" instead of employees).
For the company to succeed, it has to make the customers happy. To do _that_, the company needs to make its employees happy. Happy employees is not a goal in itself - and as Uber shown so far - you can build a company even with an unhappy workforce.


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## USArmy31B30 (Oct 30, 2015)

John Deer said:


> It's more complicated than that - in a "normal" industry, there's the company (or "management"), the employees of that company and the customers (in ridesharing it's the same - but it's "partners" instead of employees).
> For the company to succeed, it has to make the customers happy. To do _that_, the company needs to make its employees happy. Happy employees is not a goal in itself - and as Uber shown so far - you can build a company even with an unhappy workforce.


Ya sure but loyalty will soon disappear... If they want to keep the company running for a long time with higher growth, I believe they need to build a company that will have customers coming back... Bad experiences will force pax for other options, if a company that doesn't treat it's employees well, they'll get/hire sub-par employees with no care for the business, then TNC will just be just another bad transportation experience on a cheaper side...

Same with the TNC drivers, we are all looking for a way out, if there is, then we will not hesitae to move on. Drivers are learning to turn off the app when there's no surge and pax hates surges, and that's just another reason pax would also look for a way out if they could... And I do see an influx of Uber cheapskates flocking the Lyft platform because it rarely surges and it's surge on a MINIMAL level. I hated giving them high ratings when they deliberately press F$&@"! ZERO for the tip!!! SMFH...

A lot more people would want to be treated well, and pax will not hesitate to pay for it... Just like any other product out there, YOU GET WHAT YOU PAID FOR...


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## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

Gaining some traction...

http://fox61.com/2016/02/21/uber-competitor-says-its-drivers-will-own-the-company/


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## USArmy31B30 (Oct 30, 2015)

bezi_NY said:


> Gaining some traction...
> 
> http://fox61.com/2016/02/21/uber-competitor-says-its-drivers-will-own-the-company/


Then all of a sudden all high rated Uber drivers dropped to 4.69 for no apparent reason...

Then Uber will automatically add 20% TIPS with the fare, but they will drop the current rate per mile DOWN 20% LMFAO


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## bezi_NY (Feb 28, 2015)

USArmy31B30 said:


> Then all of a sudden all high rated Uber drivers dropped to 4.69 for no apparent reason...
> 
> Then Uber will automatically add 20% TIPS with the fare, but they will drop the current rate per mile DOWN 20% LMFAO


My weekly dropped to 4.5 30 fares with one negative.. Is that even possible?


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## USArmy31B30 (Oct 30, 2015)

bezi_NY said:


> My weekly dropped to 4.5 30 fares with one negative.. Is that even possible?


Yup! The way Uber screw us is, ONE 4/5* dings us 19x higher vs you improving your ratings... Someone posted his calculations about ratings and he is right...


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## boxdin (Jan 15, 2015)

John Deer said:


> Not exactly a Pulitzer winning article
> A better piece: http://www.forbes.com/sites/briansolomon/2016/02/16/stealth-startup-juno-will-take-on-uber-by-treating-drivers-better/


Forbes won't accept my pop blocker, so forget them.


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## 45821 (Feb 15, 2016)

bezi_NY said:


> I'm stunned at how stupid these guys running Uber are. I have years of Automotive experience and a few years of orrery large fleet experience... Clearly not everyone at Uber is on the same page when it comes to the fleet/car ownership business. They have no Idea what an inspection is some of these Western European countries. lol they will fail a chipped windshield Germany forget about a crack.. lol they think that a lens won't crack and a car won't ever need to be cleaned their driverless cars won't ever hit a pothole and have a blow out or a crack rim... No Vandelism will strike an Uber.. lol I swear I almost feel sorry for their (Ubers) Investors. I mean the Institionals are using pension money and are screwing other working families over with this scam.lol
> They're actually reaching out to Individuals through brokers or financial planners.. I swear I heard an Athlete that's my regular on the phone talking about Chinese shares lol. Probably the worst of any shares to buy! I wish he would have asked me what I thought.. Not that he would have believed me... Others are high on the fool-aide on the investors side of this scam.. I must admit a light went off when Inheard this kid talking about Uber shares with this dude, like so this is how American Athletes end up broke... How lovely these preditors are.. Real nice people looking out for you Hmmmmm


Driverless cars are great idea given all cars on the road are driverless, this of course will not happen in my lifetime.


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## Uberme4450 (Feb 13, 2016)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> *Does Uber really have a new, deep-pocketed, equally aggressive competitor waiting in the wings?*
> https://pando.com/2016/02/16/what-j...des/550a34d4b70f03fdae5d90d767cbbd0c38efac51/
> 
> [...clip...]
> ...


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## Uberme4450 (Feb 13, 2016)

Yes,
Its us the drivers are, Uber is a app, we are a disorganized bunch of drivers, most of us love the job outside of the entity we no longer need. We have no time to waist and to show the American free market without threats of deactivation Via a rating system That is unconstitutional and UN AMERICAN.
You are correct my friend I have done the math every which way and you cannot make a living and Uber is racking in billions as we go out make between 4 and 14 dollars an hour and I am being on the high end. We cannot strike because we would be striking against who "Uber" Uber has so disassociated itself from the drivers its become cattle herding as the rating system gets everyone eventually and they got me after 1200 rides a 4.78 rating and I had several altercations with drunks but they got me for a 85/ in posted 70 deactivated the day of conviction. FYI As a professional driver you are 10 times more likely to get minor traffic citations. Bottom line on March 17. at 12 AM its our turn to rate our partner and if 5 stars go to work and if its 4 go to work but if it is a 3 or below shut the app off and go get your car maintenance, take care of paperwork ( you are required to complete 1 ride a month) no retaliation its your business. No need to walk around with a sign we simply log off the app and by that act we vanish and Uber the app becomes a useless technology because I rate Uber as a partner with 1 star I love the job thanks for the idea / the control and not giving any help <20%> drooped fairs and contestant threat of 1 or 2 riders that sat "unsafe" your done, accident deactivated and the absolute joke that you could ever make a living and I can tell you most drivers make less then minimum wage. The next step is coming anyway that is why we act now and become each others partners by ride share Presences much like a Police department. The drivers with the best ratings and most completed trips with Great MVR,S will be identified and by precedent be voted in as Follows Los Angeles will be represented by 6 board members (Valley) (Down Town) (East LA) (South LA) (West Side) (Harbor Division) we transform in to a ride share enterprise, we get investors like Donald Trump and thousands will want stock in this its proven. The board of directors can and will drive if they so desire but we the drivers will have voted them in and we will be at peace with not guilty until proven, yes a rating system will be in effect but the driver will be awarded due process, if the driver drops below 4.6 he or she will be issued a 30 day warning and suspended for a period of time 3 strikes and termination but the board of directors will listen to a final appeal if they deem multiple infractions.

Terminations would be disrespect of clients, reckless driving, sexual misconduct, Theft, Driving record with 3 points in 1 year ( background checks would eliminate any candidate with a DUI in the past ten years, any criminal conviction above a Misdemeanor life time, Driving record of unacceptable data.

The board of directors would represent the entire state of California as each state has different laws as an example The IBEW is the international brotherhood of electrical workers, however as there are many different companies they must all comply with the IBEW by Local we would be called RSSA Ride Share Services of America, Unlike the IBEW RSSA would be a publicaly and employee owned company kind of like a large chain Cosco for example. Employee owned and publicly shared the great board of directors we voted in would approve of appointing a CEO of LA or OC.

The nature of ride share is to confusing to have 5000 companies and 500 different applications, prices would be set by demand / cost of living / Locals / like south LA would have rates lower then the west, drivers however would be awarded the opertunity to serve the community rhey live in and Lotteries every 1/4 for parts of the city that are much more lucritive (There would also be a local we would call travelers that would be willing to travel for big events or needs in a certain part of california due new cooperations opening , diasters and these drivers would get stipends.

Drivers: I love you guys and I love to drive and I look at the year and a half with Uber as a wonderful adventure at a loosing cause burned 65t housand mile on my first Uber car and 27K on second I do not wnat to get in to the details of how much i lost but listen there is light at the end of the tunnel Uber ? Razor have Billions of dollars and a thousands of drivers that want a reality to the dream and that dream is a proven success we just have to put it in to action (Remember the Teamters) Uber drivers are not pushovers, cowards, or can be controlled anymore, us men women of all races creeds need to come together, we need to ID the legends of ride share (The best Women and Men of this revolution in transportation) We unite as partners and vote for what is rite and what is wrong and we never deactivate a customer they will deactivate themselves in jail and drivers will afforded investigations and cars will be equipped with at the drivers discreteness and a warning to the rider a tape recorder no camera. 98% of society are decent wonderful people that just need a ride and guess what millions of them.

If you want or think this is a viable idea and want to help me before I get killed because my life has been threatened Join me and be not afraid as ride share is here to stay and so are you and me.

In a sign of unity start a string of supporters by just saying I am In. I am alone we need investors we need the news media and most of all we need our leeders.

Uberme4450 lets make history together not deactivated and replaced as we drop out by financial circumstances or you get it by who/ Who cares.

lets get a forum of ideas Uber and Lyft are a app we are the drivers 2 appps verses 100,000 drivers we win can we gather the tribes.

LETS DO THIS NOW
JOIN ME Before its to late and Uber knows the feds are coming, we have the drivers we just need organization, leaders and Donald Trump anybody no anybody that knows him so I can meet with him if you approve of me doing so.

just say I am in


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## Uberme4450 (Feb 13, 2016)

Im in My rating of Uber -1 Lyft 1 i made money at times with lyft I am in!!!!!!


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## UofMDriver (Dec 29, 2015)

Ziggy said:


> Juno should be prime to scoop up all the drivers they want from Uber ... as only Uber trolls will suckle on the Uber teat after Juno launches a platform that enables drivers to make a living wage


Looking forward to Juno. Uber put has a guarantee in the daytime in Detroit of 10.00 hr. Before Uber fees. Now Uber takes 28% from new drivers, after gas your working in the 6 dollar an hour range. My guess is Uber game plan is just to flood the market with new drivers constantly. Get what they can out of them, and just keep bring more on. I heard Uber commercials on two different radio stations today to become drivers. Uber was decent to drive for at one time, now it is a joke, and they brought Lyft right down with them.


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## Ziggy (Feb 27, 2015)

UofMDriver said:


> Looking forward to Juno. Uber put has a guarantee in the daytime in Detroit of 10.00 hr. Before Uber fees. Now Uber takes 28% from new drivers, after gas your working in the 6 dollar an hour range. My guess is Uber game plan is just to flood the market with new drivers constantly. Get what they can out of them, and just keep bring more on. I heard Uber commercials on two different radio stations today to become drivers. Uber was decent to drive for at one time, now it is a joke, and they brought Lyft right down with them.


Yep ... total race to the bottom. 

2014 income was great: Uber only taking 10% ... good fares slightly lower than taxis. 
Jan 2015 - Uber took 20% ... X dropped to $2.50
May 2015 - Uber 20% ... X dropped to $1.90
Oct 2015 - Uber 20% ... X dropped to $1.30
Feb 2016 - Uber 20% (old drivers) / 25% (new drivers) ... X dropped to $1.00 ... Pool 24/7
*actual dates may be slightly off ... because I stopped driving X. But Uber has never raised rates ... and has always increased their commission


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## Curmudg (Nov 25, 2015)

John Deer said:


> Although Juno's commission is 10% vs. Uber's 25% (which means you keep 20% more of the dough), do you think they'd have a chance if they are priced higher than Uber? Like it or not, any new entrant, unless providing a very different experience (which I think Juno does not - same drivers, same cars) - would have to keep prices in-line with Uber - at least initially.


No one knows what Ubers price is - it changes all the time- I was out in the burbs of St Paul today, needed a ride home from a car repair place, and couldn't call one - first ring suburb too - for a while I coulda done a Uber XL. With the constant surging in the city, there is no service in the burbs and the price in the city is all over the map - People don't understand why there was a price cut - it was very fair before, now they dropped it, and service stinks, and drivers are angry, and not driving, and... If a company (like Lyft or a new entrant) would raise prices back - still be fair, but consistent, I think people would quickly abandon the games played by Uber with pricing.


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## Uberme4450 (Feb 13, 2016)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> *Does Uber really have a new, deep-pocketed, equally aggressive competitor waiting in the wings?*
> https://pando.com/2016/02/16/what-j...des/550a34d4b70f03fdae5d90d767cbbd0c38efac51/
> 
> [...clip...]
> ...


Uber is not a company YOU ARE


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*

 https://twitter.com/i/web/status/703610708349624320**







*


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## Dierwolf (Oct 31, 2014)

Well the thing is, when Juno go's live Uber will lose 90% of their drivers. In my town when Juno fire's up every driver will turn off the Uber app and run Juno, which is going to be funny as hell, I can just see the emails.


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## USArmy31B30 (Oct 30, 2015)

Dierwolf said:


> Well the thing is, when Juno go's live Uber will lose 90% of their drivers. In my town when Juno fire's up every driver will turn off the Uber app and run Juno, which is going to be funny as hell, I can just see the emails.


Let those cheapskate Uber pax pay 8x surges on Uber! LOL then the Uber pax will look for a way out, JUNO is the answer. She's a protector after all. I hope Juno won't give any chance for their pax to be SUPER CHEAPSKATES but to be fair with pax and drivers a like. Cheaper fare than a cab ride, better car than a cab and better customer service than a cab. It will be done!!!


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## Dierwolf (Oct 31, 2014)

USArmy31B30 said:


> Let those cheapskate Uber pax pay 8x surges on Uber! LOL then the Uber pax will look for a way out, JUNO is the answer. She's a protector after all. I hope Juno won't give any chance for their pax to be SUPER CHEAPSKATES but to be fair with pax and drivers a like. Cheaper fare than a cab ride, better car than a cab and better customer service than a cab. It will be done!!!


I have found that the riders don't mind if its a little more than a taxi, they understand that we are NOT a taxi and are willing to pay more.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Inside Juno, The Company That Wants To Beat Uber By Wooing Its Drivers*
*http://www.fastcompany.com/3057182/...al&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer*


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## ubersuxx (Mar 2, 2016)

John Deer said:


> Although Juno's commission is 10% vs. Uber's 25% (which means you keep 20% more of the dough), do you think they'd have a chance if they are priced higher than Uber? Like it or not, any new entrant, unless providing a very different experience (which I think Juno does not - same drivers, same cars) - would have to keep prices in-line with Uber - at least initially.


Sure can, the only thing Uber can do is treat drivers better which may cause Juno a problem because Uber drivers will be happy and might stay. Does not matter how low Uber prices go if they dont have drivers... Juno is after the drivers not the passengers.. No drivers, no rideshare business.

Will driver leave Uber: I will as soon as Juno hits my area, however lets see what happens in NYC.. that will be a great indicator of drivers hatred for Uber. I have not once talked to a fellow uber driver who has anything good to say about Uber, the convo is more like Uber doesnt a give crap about the drivers, Uber are greedy bastards, they suck, on and on... not sometimes but always that is what I am hearing... oh and meant to add Uber's turnover rate is high and today has a problem of retaining drivers once they find out the $25 hour radio commercials really translate to $10 after expenses, oh wait here comes another rate decrease...lol
the referral fee in my area just went up, they need more drivers.
Also Juno wants drivers to stay on Uber/Lyft whatever as the Uber mass exodus takes place... smart!

UBERSUXX!


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## Teksaz (Mar 16, 2015)

Travis, the Uber Honeymoon is over. LOL

Uber drivers will flock to Juno, _*BECAUSE WE CAN!!*_

Isn't Karma a biatch lol


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## everythingsuber (Sep 29, 2015)

Drivers hating Uber won't sent them broke. Pax hating Über sends them broke. Pax still want to believe Uber drivers are happy to work for nothing. Actually they don't care if drivers are happy pax still get picked up. The cars and the service need to be beyond bad to stop the uber demographic choosing über.


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## Teksaz (Mar 16, 2015)

As mentioned before, there will be so few Uber drivers, pax will be paying surge constantly to get a ride which in turn will piss them off and look for an alternative. This will decimate Uber in record time.

Word will spread quickly about Juno. I've already had pax that have heard about Juno. Bottom line, Uber screwed the pooch and now it's to late. Travis F-ed up again. Dood can't get it right. History repeats it's self once again. lol


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## USArmy31B30 (Oct 30, 2015)

It all comes down to the individuals... If somebody mistreated you over and over again and YOU as individual continued to be mistreated, it only means YOU as individual liked to be treated in that manner...

Question now is, if Uber says I'm sorry, we will raise the rates back to the COMPETITIVE rates and will treat drivers fairly. For instance JUNO set the per mile at $2.00/.30 per min. Will you or will you not stay with uber? Sorry, sorry, hahahahahaha Uber raising rates, treating their drivers like human being and apologizing?!!! WTF Am I smoking right?!!!  

I regarded LYFT as a less worse option than Uber as there is no better alternatives and if Juno does what they say they would do, then I would treat the way the TNC companies had treated me in the past, JUNO first, LYFT seconds... Uber App goes in the trash can as it treated me as garbage...


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Welcome to Juno*


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