# Uber proposes policy that would pay drivers a minimum wage of $21 per hour



## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/28/u...ld-pay-drivers-a-minimum-wage-of-21-per-hour/
On the heels of a driver-led protest outside Uber's San Francisco headquarters, where drivers showed their support for gig worker protections legislation (via Assembly Bill 5) and demanded a union, Uber  is circulating a petition urging people to "protect ridesharing in California." In the petition, Uber advocates for a policy that would offer drivers a minimum of $21 per hour, paid time off, sick leave and compensation if they are injured while driving, as well as a collective voice and "the ability to influence decisions about their work."

Uber has also created a new website called "Independent Driver" to showcase stories from drivers who want to remain independent contractors. Lyft, similarly, is circulating a petition urging people to demand legislators "fix AB 5."

"We agree with the bill's goal to protect workers, but we don't agree that this protection should come at the cost of the flexibility our community relies on to supplement their income, support their families, and set their own schedules," Lyft wrote in its petition. "After talking with thousands of California drivers and listening to experts in labor laws, we're proposing a revision that protects driver earnings and the flexibility to earn when and how you want. Our proposal includes additional workplace protections for drivers and a minimum earnings floor."

I've reached out to Gig Workers Rising, one of the organizations responsible for bringing drivers together to support AB-5 and demand the right to unionize. I'll update this story if I hear back. But, based on the organization's recent tweet, what Uber is offering isn't enough.

"$21 isn't a living wage for any category of worker in the San Francisco metro area except a single adult or two adults living together," Gig Workers Rising tweeted. "What they're offering is the floor, while hoping to kneecap any efforts to raise wages down the line & create a real union."

These petitions are clearly Hail Marys by Lyft and Uber to try to prevent the passage of AB-5, which seeks to codify the ruling established in Dynamex Operations West, Inc. v Superior Court of Los Angeles. In that case, the court applied the ABC test and decided Dynamex wrongfully classified its workers as independent contractors based on the presumption that "a worker who performs services for a hirer is an employee for purposes of claims for wages and benefits&#8230;"

According to the ABC test, in order for a hiring entity to legally classify a worker as an independent contractor, it must prove the worker is free from the control and direction of the hiring entity, performs work outside the scope of the entity's business and is regularly engaged in an "independently established trade, occupation, or business of the same nature as the work performed."

In short, AB-5, which has already passed in the California State Assembly, would ensure gig economy workers are entitled to minimum wage, workers' compensation and other benefits.


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## XPG (Oct 4, 2017)

"minimum of approximately $21 per hour while on a trip"--- art of scam!


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

XPG said:


> "minimum of approximately $21 per hour while on a trip"--- art of scam!


How many miles is that / hr


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## B - uberlyftdriver (Jun 6, 2017)

$21 or whatever an hour is not a business opportunity. 

bring back 80/20


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## Uber's Guber (Oct 22, 2017)

Uber/Lyft was never supposed to be a self-sustaining career. Read what Lyft said when they stated _"we don't agree that this protection should come at the cost of the flexibility our community relies on to *supplement *their income," _the key word being "supplement."
Friends, I'm sorry to demean some of you, but Uber/Lyft is a LOW-skilled job that any monkey (sorry Rakos) can do. You want real income with real benefits? Then get a REAL job. Do it sooner rather than later, because if AB5 is signed in it current form, Uber/Lyft will most likely exit the California market.


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## XPG (Oct 4, 2017)

Uber's Guber said:


> Uber/Lyft will most likely exit the California market.


 ???


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## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

Uber's Guber said:


> Uber/Lyft was never supposed to be a self-sustaining career. Read what Lyft said when they stated _"we don't agree that this protection should come at the cost of the flexibility our community relies on to *supplement *their income ," _the key word being "supplement."
> Friends, I'm sorry to demean some of you, but Uber/Lyft is a LOW-skilled job that any monkey (sorry Rakos) can do. You want real income with real benefits? Then get a REAL job. Do it sooner rather than later, because if AB5 is signed in it current form, Uber/Lyft will most likely exit the California market.


If AB5 is signed in current form, and both platforms will exit CA, do you think that vacuum would allow other company to come in and build a performant transportation business close to the model (not the compensation) Uber and Lyft currently have?


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## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

Uber's Guber said:


> Uber/Lyft was never supposed to be a self-sustaining career. Read what Lyft said when they stated _"we don't agree that this protection should come at the cost of the flexibility our community relies on to *supplement *their income ," _the key word being "supplement."


Not entirely true.

At one point Uber/Lyft were actively promoting themselves as a full-time occupation.

They got their wristslap for deceptive advertising, and probably knew something like AB5 was on the horizon so they changed from full-time to side hustle.


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## FLUBBER (Aug 14, 2018)

What a joke we're independent businesses how can any business be in business on $20 an hour in gross revenue. I'll start a company, pay myself $14 an hour as an employee and pay into my payroll processor $20 an hour to cover payroll, FICA, SS, Medicare etc. My business just went bankrupt in the first week no money left to pay gas, car, maintenance or cover shrinkage costs such as a $1,000 deductible for an occassional accident or deer hit the common hazards associated with putting 100k miles on a year. Forget providing healthcare or any benefits too obviously. Driving is great as a supplement just for extra money as long as you have a regular job to depend on. I wish I drove in the early days of UBER I heard rumors drivers used to make $50 an hour or more.


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## Uber_Yota_916 (May 1, 2017)

jocker12 said:


> If AB5 is signed in current form, and both platforms will exit CA, do you think that vacuum would allow other company to come in and build a performant transportation business close to the model (not the compensation) Uber and Lyft currently have?


Enter DiDi. Chinese overlords will be an upgrade.


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## Uber's Guber (Oct 22, 2017)

New2This said:


> At one point Uber/Lyft were actively promoting themselves as a full-time occupation.


Yep, and a bunch of ignorant ants bought into it. Some of them even rented cars. ?
To see your point though there was an entry interval in the timeline when rates were very lucrative and smart-phone savvy riders were eager to search out a rider. But once Uber perfected their marketing mastery to lure endless ants, that all changed.


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

Uber's Guber said:


> Uber/Lyft was never supposed to be a self-sustaining career. Read what Lyft said when they stated _"we don't agree that this protection should come at the cost of the flexibility our community relies on to *supplement *their income," _the key word being "supplement."
> Friends, I'm sorry to demean some of you, but Uber/Lyft is a LOW-skilled job that any monkey (sorry Rakos) can do. You want real income with real benefits? Then get a REAL job. Do it sooner rather than later, because if AB5 is signed in it current form, Uber/Lyft will most likely exit the California market.


There's no way Uber or Lyft will leave Cali even with AB5. Hopefully there will be some rational compromise.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> If AB5 is signed in current form, and both platforms will exit CA, do you think that vacuum would allow other company to come in and build a performant transportation business close to the model (not the compensation) Uber and Lyft currently have?


yes, because no other company is going to be stupid enough to blow billions of dollars on sdc's

as long as a new company doesnt try to do sdc's and reigns in their corporate level spending, there is really no way it cant be profitable going back to 80/20

no way in hell Lyft and Uber get their way...AB5 and a union is coming

there is no other way around it

also

https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/27/u...letting-up-on-the-fight-for-ab-5-and-a-union/


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

$21 per hour is getting close enough to what’s needed,

However Uber would pull shenanigans and only pay from acceptance to drop off thus making it as low as $4 an hour.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> $21 per hour is getting close enough to what's needed,
> 
> However Uber would pull shenanigans and only pay from acceptance to drop off thus making it as low as $4 an hour.


theres a million ways they can turn that $21 an hour into $10 an hour

meanwhile Lyft and Uber make $40 an hour on our backs

it needs to be a percentage again(80/20) or they can go to hell cause AB5 and a union is coming


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## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

B - uberlyftdriver said:


> $21 or whatever an hour is not a business opportunity.
> 
> bring back 80/20


Introduce 90/10


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## Who is John Galt? (Sep 28, 2016)

Uber_Yota_916 said:


> Enter DiDi. Chinese overlords will be an upgrade.


Going by current experience in the capital cities on the eastern seaboard of Oz, I wouldn't be so sure about that.

Read some of the threads in the Melbourne and Sydney forums in particular, and you will get an idea of how shifty both Didi and Ola are.

.


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## Lessthanminimum (Nov 5, 2017)

The reason Uber and Lyft can't make a profit is because they're drunk on other people's money and using it on a bunch of wasteful projects they should have never got involved in. They should have gotten things right with drivers and riders and made a profit before all this other garbage. 

A lot of drivers in investors are starting to lose confidence in these companies. Every time they come up with an "improvement" that is nothing more than a lie they lose more public trust.

I don't think either one of these companies survive in their current form. I do expect to see Lyft swirling the drain first. There are only so many morons you can find a drive for 30 cents a mile. They surely will not be the best and the brightest. Lyft will never live that one down. 

They're also failing when it comes to criminal background checks and safety requirements. I have proof of it. State laws where I live regarding safety inspections and course requirements are being ignored. Uber isn't ignoring them but Lyft sure is.


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## Hackenstein (Dec 16, 2014)

Uber's Guber said:


> Uber/Lyft was never supposed to be a self-sustaining career. Read what Lyft said when they stated _"we don't agree that this protection should come at the cost of the flexibility our community relies on to *supplement *their income," _the key word being "supplement."
> Friends, I'm sorry to demean some of you, but Uber/Lyft is a LOW-skilled job that any monkey (sorry Rakos) can do. You want real income with real benefits? Then get a REAL job. Do it sooner rather than later, because if AB5 is signed in it current form, Uber/Lyft will most likely exit the California market.


I remember when they claimed drivers made $90,000/yr.

They presented it as a career.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Who is John Galt? said:


> Going by current experience in the capital cities on the eastern seaboard of Oz, I wouldn't be so sure about that.
> 
> Read some of the threads in the Melbourne and Sydney forums in particular, and you will get an idea of how shifty both Didi and Ola are.
> 
> .


i think the idea was just that anyone, even overlords, would be an improvement, not necessarily that the overlords could actually getter done

it'll take probably a month before Lyft drivers in those markets finally start wising up and not driving for peanuts anymore

and this refers to all the drivers that don't come here which means they have no idea what really goes on in rideshare


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## Hideyokidshideyowifebcuz (Apr 30, 2019)

Uber's Guber said:


> Uber/Lyft was never supposed to be a self-sustaining career. Read what Lyft said when they stated _"we don't agree that this protection should come at the cost of the flexibility our community relies on to *supplement *their income," _the key word being "supplement."
> Friends, I'm sorry to demean some of you, but Uber/Lyft is a LOW-skilled job that any monkey (sorry Rakos) can do. You want real income with real benefits? Then get a REAL job. Do it sooner rather than later, because if AB5 is signed in it current form, Uber/Lyft will most likely exit the California market.


They will not exit the California market. If Uber didn't exit New York's market then they aren't going to exit California.

I agree that everyone should position themselves in another career or be ready to jump ship when this bill comes into law.

I hope AB 5 passes. Maybe Lyft will fold and it will allow other rideshare platforms to spring up.


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## nonononodrivethru (Mar 25, 2019)

If $1 a mile minimum base fare for drivers existed, this legislation would never come up.

Lyft and Uber have done this to themselves and deserve all of the consequences. Get greedy, get caught.


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Only if $21 per hour while logged on and accepting every ping. Then yes.


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## nonononodrivethru (Mar 25, 2019)

Lyft and Uber will not leave the California market. They'll make concessions. They'll increase driver's base rate and scale back the money they are spending on growth.

They are already making a fortune off tax loopholes. If they want to remain "technology companies", they have to play fair.


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## Hackenstein (Dec 16, 2014)

All of this is why Medallions exist. 

Unlimited supply to keep wait times down is not 'free market.' Their model is based on spending an incomprehensible amount of other people's money. 

Limited supply for a limited market. If you care about people actually making a living.


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## Lien Left (Aug 28, 2019)

Uber's Guber said:


> Uber/Lyft was never supposed to be a self-sustaining career. Read what Lyft said when they stated _"we don't agree that this protection should come at the cost of the flexibility our community relies on to *supplement *their income," _the key word being "supplement."
> Friends, I'm sorry to demean some of you, but Uber/Lyft is a LOW-skilled job that any monkey (sorry Rakos) can do. You want real income with real benefits? Then get a REAL job. Do it sooner rather than later, because if AB5 is signed in it current form, Uber/Lyft will most likely exit the California market.


They didn't exit the New York market after the minimum wage regulations were imposed there.
Doubt they'll leave their home market in California.


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## njn (Jan 23, 2016)

Uber's Guber said:


> if AB5 is signed in it current form, Uber/Lyft will most likely exit the California market.


I thought the same thing, but after reading the article, it sounds like they want to bend over to the california lawmakers.

$21 seems a bit high for the pay floor. It's currently $19 in NYC and drivers must buy their own commercial insurance.


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## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

Uber's Guber said:


> Uber/Lyft was never supposed to be a self-sustaining career. Read what Lyft said when they stated _"we don't agree that this protection should come at the cost of the flexibility our community relies on to *supplement *their income," _the key word being "supplement."
> Friends, I'm sorry to demean some of you, but Uber/Lyft is a LOW-skilled job that any monkey (sorry Rakos) can do. You want real income with real benefits? Then get a REAL job. Do it sooner rather than later, because if AB5 is signed in it current form, Uber/Lyft will most likely exit the California market.


I can't believe you said that. We as Uber drivers have to pass a grueling series of tests and background checks before we can work.

The prerequisite for Uber drivers is very high. You have to have a 4 year degree, CDL endorsements, pass a drug test and have your passenger drivers license for at least 5 years. You also have to know the language of the country you are working in.

So to telling that it's a low skilled job is ludicrous. That all we do is follow a blue line on a map.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

here's the email theyre sending out

yeah, sure, Uber, I'll get right on that


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## Single Malt (Nov 11, 2018)

Uber could pay 50 bucks an hour, it wouldn't matter. Yeah you'd make more on each drive but you'd only get one ride a day. It would simply allow Uber to saturate the market with drivers.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Yeah that’s exactly what it is. Says $21 an hour while driving to pickup a customer or with the in the car.

They can put rates to 35c a minute and eliminate per mile rates and be in compliance.

20 minute 20 mile fare would pay $7.00.


I’m pretty sure this scenario is a pay cut even in Orlando.


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## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> Yeah that's exactly what it is. Says $21 an hour while driving to pickup a customer or with the in the car.
> 
> They can put rates to 35c a minute and eliminate per mile rates and be in compliance.
> 
> ...


Yup, 21 an hour while driving.

Our country: We want wages equal to skilled labor wages even though we work at MCD's

Some law makers: OK we will force companies to pay you like your a skilled laborer. No need to better yourself to find a skilled labor job, MCD's will become a long career option now, 20 years as a cashier, retirement check for the rest of your life.

Uber isn't supposed to be a career move, it's to supplement your income.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Ssgcraig said:


> Yup, 21 an hour while driving.
> 
> Our country: We want wages equal to skilled labor wages even though we work at MCD's
> 
> ...


not skilled labor, just labor with a bunch of out of pocket expenses

last time I checked Mcdonalds workers had zero out of pocket expenses

you're right, 'though, what they really should be doing is passing laws that employees bear ALL corporate expenses on behalf of the corporations


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## kingcorey321 (May 20, 2018)

i used to earn an average of 25 to 35 an hour with lyft a year half ago . today i do less then 5 rides a week with them. its just not worth it .
they charge a pax 9 dollars i earn 3 . i get pissed off i turn the app off those bs 2 mile rides losing money. lyft makes 6 after gas lucky to make 2 screw lyft and uber .


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## GreatWhiteHope (Sep 18, 2018)

jocker12 said:


> https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/28/u...ld-pay-drivers-a-minimum-wage-of-21-per-hour/
> On the heels of a driver-led protest outside Uber's San Francisco headquarters, where drivers showed their support for gig worker protections legislation (via Assembly Bill 5) and demanded a union, Uber  is circulating a petition urging people to "protect ridesharing in California." In the petition, Uber advocates for a policy that would offer drivers a minimum of $21 per hour, paid time off, sick leave and compensation if they are injured while driving, as well as a collective voice and "the ability to influence decisions about their work."
> 
> Uber has also created a new website called "Independent Driver" to showcase stories from drivers who want to remain independent contractors. Lyft, similarly, is circulating a petition urging people to demand legislators "fix AB 5."
> ...


Why do these entilted scumbags think they're entilted to someone else giving them a good living ?


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## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> not skilled labor, just labor with a bunch of out of pocket expenses
> 
> last time I checked Mcdonalds workers had zero out of pocket expenses
> 
> you're right, 'though, what they really should be doing is passing laws that employees bear ALL corporate expenses on behalf of the corporations


Last time I checked, MCD's employees are not subsidized at $.58 a mile. MCD's employees actually pay taxes on their income unlike Uber drivers. Last time I checked, MCD's employees have out of pocket expenses, most of them have to pay for an Uber to and from work.


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## mch (Nov 22, 2018)

They wont exit California, they'll just make up for it by cutting rates in markets where they'll get no legislative resistance by doing so.


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## njn (Jan 23, 2016)

They will just pass the increase costs onto the pax. Don't worry, californians will welcome higher priced rides as they are the ones voting for it.


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## nouberipo (Jul 24, 2018)

XPG said:


> ???


Hence one of the reasons they just procured two huge properties....one in Dallas and one in Chicago. Do you think this is backup for the day they leave CA because they are told by the courts they must pay a living/fair wage to drivers?


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## amazinghl (Oct 31, 2018)

Don't believe it.
Don't trust it.
Don't depend on it.


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## SFOspeedracer (Jun 25, 2019)

Ssgcraig said:


> I can't believe you said that. We as Uber drivers have to pass a grueling series of tests and background checks before we can work.
> 
> The prerequisite for Uber drivers is very high. You have to have a 4 year degree, CDL endorsements, pass a drug test and have your passenger drivers license for at least 5 years. You also have to know the language of the country you are working in.
> 
> So to telling that it's a low skilled job is ludicrous. That all we do is follow a blue line on a map.


OMG I nearly pissed myself

???????


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## ducktaleswoohoo (Aug 28, 2019)

lol operating costs while moving is approx $10 an hour so $11 an hour no thanks least not for me maybe in highschool in the 90s but in 2020 haha

they act like this requires advanced trig

1st just show contractors the details of their contract if they're so scared if destination discrimination show approx fare +- a few bucks like riders see & approx miles direction destination is

or no penalties for acceptance and cancel rates, let drivers cancel all they want

then if idiots see its a $4-10gross ride & they still accept it they actually had a CHOICE theyll still eventually fail but now its truly on the driver

of course this means every intelligent driver will ignore all rides that show under $10 gross

this is where the states say you must pay this amount minimum per trip, per mile, per minute like cab rates have been regulated for over half a century, play whatever games you want but drivers must get 100% gross if the minimums.

all it takes is for the fbi labor department and puc to do their jobs

90+% of the app is just tricks & games to get idiots to drive for free...i would guess most drivers dont want to be employees they just dont want to be treated like one with no benefits while being called an independent contractor

uber lyft is a "tech" company they should charge a 10% finders or connection fee & GTFO the way they have no say in routes, per mile per minute because thats a transportation company if they want to get into all those details theyre nothing but a cab company & cab companies have regulated minimums










theyve lauudered billions on real estate from paying illegal wages & charging predatory pricing which no legit biz can compete with


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## VanGuy (Feb 15, 2019)

Ssgcraig said:


> I can't believe you said that. We as Uber drivers have to pass a grueling series of tests and background checks before we can work.
> 
> The prerequisite for Uber drivers is very high. You have to have a 4 year degree, CDL endorsements, pass a drug test and have your passenger drivers license for at least 5 years. You also have to know the language of the country you are working in.
> 
> So to telling that it's a low skilled job is ludicrous. That all we do is follow a blue line on a map.


It's going to be closer to that here than just about anyplace else. So far the law they're talking about includes a Taxi drivers license, which requires you to have a license for a while, I forget how long, and you're only supposed to be able to get your license if you can pass in English. I have no idea how those with no English pass but I assume someone's palms got greased. It also requires a Dr's exam which I'd be surprised if there was no drug screening in there. But, again I'm assuming with a little lube that can be accomplished as well.


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## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

VanGuy said:


> It's going to be closer to that here than just about anyplace else. So far the law they're talking about includes a Taxi drivers license, which requires you to have a license for a while, I forget how long, and you're only supposed to be able to get your license if you can pass in English. I have no idea how those with no English pass but I assume someone's palms got greased. It also requires a Dr's exam which I'd be surprised if there was no drug screening in there. But, again I'm assuming with a little lube that can be accomplished as well.


Could be time to get into the lube business?


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## VanGuy (Feb 15, 2019)

Haha, I'm a little long in the tooth to start becoming a Dr. 

A driving examiner maybe.


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## njn (Jan 23, 2016)

NYC has all the same license requirements, drug screening, fees just like taxis, along with the highest rates in the country to pay for their $19 min wage. Only recently they have been kicking drivers offline due to over saturation. Many drivers are prohibited to go online between normal work hours 9 to 5. There is also a 'hiring' freeze for new drivers. California should follow this progressive plan as it is working great in the big apple.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Ssgcraig said:


> Last time I checked, MCD's employees are not subsidized at $.58 a mile. MCD's employees actually pay taxes on their income unlike Uber drivers. Last time I checked, MCD's employees have out of pocket expenses, most of them have to pay for an Uber to and from work.


last time you checked mcdonalds employees still have no out of pocket expenses while working that reduces the amount they make per hour

all that other nonsense doesn't matter


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## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> last time you checked mcdonalds employees still have no out of pocket expenses while working that reduces the amount they make per hour
> 
> all that other nonsense doesn't matter


You must think Uber is the only job that has out of pocket expenses? My day job I have to use gasoline and a car to get to, that is an expense and I can't claim it on my taxes. Should you get a per diem for your fuel, lunches and car washes?


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Ssgcraig said:


> You must think Uber is the only job that has out of pocket expenses? My day job I have to use gasoline and a car to get to, that is an expense and I can't claim it on my taxes. Should you get a per diem for your fuel, lunches and car washes?


you tried comparing this job to other low skilled jobs as if the out of pocket costs meant nothing

it's the out of pockets costs and expenses that require a higher dollar per hour pay to offset the expenses and ensure drivers are making a decent wage


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## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> you tried comparing this job to other low skilled jobs as if the out of pocket costs meant nothing
> 
> it's the out of pockets costs and expenses that require a higher dollar per hour pay to offset the expenses and ensure drivers are making a decent wage


You brought up the out of pocket expenses. I simply stated that here in America, we want wages of skilled labor when we are working non-skilled jobs.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Ssgcraig said:


> Yup, 21 an hour while driving.
> 
> Our country: We want wages equal to skilled labor wages even though we work at MCD's
> 
> ...


The problem is...

Min wage would be a VAST IMPROVEMENT at this point for many many cities.


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## nash801 (Apr 17, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/28/u...ld-pay-drivers-a-minimum-wage-of-21-per-hour/
> On the heels of a driver-led protest outside Uber's San Francisco headquarters, where drivers showed their support for gig worker protections legislation (via Assembly Bill 5) and demanded a union, Uber  is circulating a petition urging people to "protect ridesharing in California." In the petition, Uber advocates for a policy that would offer drivers a minimum of $21 per hour, paid time off, sick leave and compensation if they are injured while driving, as well as a collective voice and "the ability to influence decisions about their work."
> 
> Uber has also created a new website called "Independent Driver" to showcase stories from drivers who want to remain independent contractors. Lyft, similarly, is circulating a petition urging people to demand legislators "fix AB 5."
> ...


$21 is not enough. after costs it is still below minimum wage. $60 per hour is a sustainable amount.


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## KK2929 (Feb 9, 2017)

jocker12 said:


> https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/28/u...ld-pay-drivers-a-minimum-wage-of-21-per-hour/
> On the heels of a driver-led protest outside Uber's San Francisco headquarters, where drivers showed their support for gig worker protections legislation (via Assembly Bill 5) and demanded a union, Uber  is circulating a petition urging people to "protect ridesharing in California." In the petition, Uber advocates for a policy that would offer drivers a minimum of $21 per hour, paid time off, sick leave and compensation if they are injured while driving, as well as a collective voice and "the ability to influence decisions about their work."
> 
> Uber has also created a new website called "Independent Driver" to showcase stories from drivers who want to remain independent contractors. Lyft, similarly, is circulating a petition urging people to demand legislators "fix AB 5."
> ...


------------------------------
The demand should be a cap on the total % U/L are allowed to take from earnings. That seems to be lost in all the excitement. Such as a total of 20% and both companies learn to operate the business within a budget. Just like every other business in the world. All these other side ventures they think are so important, they can finance some other way. 
Both companies are taking 40%+ from our earnings. If they pay $21.00 an hour guarantee, will they still take 40% of that ? I make more than $21 an hour gross. That will be a pay cut for me. 
Be careful what you ask for --



Hackenstein said:


> I remember when they claimed drivers made $90,000/yr.
> 
> They presented it as a career.


----------------------------
Five years ago, $90K was probably true.


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## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

I’m not sure Uber can take too many more blows. At its current rate Uber stock will close the year at $25/share.

With more laws, regulations, and lawsuits mounting against Uber, I believe the company will fold. Uber is really looking more fragile than ever this year.


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## nonononodrivethru (Mar 25, 2019)

nash801 said:


> $21 is not enough. after costs it is still below minimum wage. $60 per hour is a sustainable amount.


You're looking at it wrong.

If I drive 300 miles total one day (pickup and transport), I should expect to make $300.

$60 an hour would be driving nonstop at a $1 a mile.

Unrealistic.



KK2929 said:


> ------------------------------
> The demand should be a cap on the total % U/L are allowed to take from earnings. That seems to be lost in all the excitement. Such as a total of 20% and both companies learn to operate the business within a budget.  Just like every other business in the world. All these other side ventures they think are so important, they can finance some other way.
> Both companies are taking 40%+ from our earnings. If they pay $21.00 an hour guarantee, will they still take 40% of that ? I make more than $21 an hour gross. That will be a pay cut for me.
> Be careful what you ask for --
> ...


Plenty of XL drivers making $90k a year right now.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

nonononodrivethru said:


> You're looking at it wrong.
> 
> If I drive 300 miles total one day (pickup and transport), I should expect to make $300.
> 
> ...


Plenty of xl drivers living out their mini van too ?


----------



## nonononodrivethru (Mar 25, 2019)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Plenty of xl drivers living out their mini van too ?


They were likely bad at life before Uber.


----------



## ducktaleswoohoo (Aug 28, 2019)

xl only & my airport runs average $60+ an hour

rest of runs average $4 an hour

90+% airport runs everything else ignored or cancelled the lower tiers don't have that choice at less than $1 a mile cant win at that rate although many try

those shorties are not worth the time, risk, or effort if i got $10 gross minimum my ar would be 90+% instead of less than 10% & my cancel rate would be less than 10% instead of 40+%


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## SFOspeedracer (Jun 25, 2019)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> I'm not sure Uber can take too many more blows. At its current rate Uber stock will close the year at $25/share.
> 
> With more laws, regulations, and lawsuits mounting against Uber, I believe the company will fold. Uber is really looking more fragile than ever this year.


Idk, that AVs on the road tomorrow pipe dream still looks promising to the big guys

According to them they are still in "Investment Phase"


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

SFOspeedracer said:


> Idk, that AVs on the road tomorrow pipe dream still looks promising to the big guys
> 
> According to them they are still in "Investment Phase"












Uber investors are somewhere in the middle of anger and bargaining now.


----------



## UberProphet? (Dec 24, 2014)

jocker12 said:


> https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/28/u...ld-pay-drivers-a-minimum-wage-of-21-per-hour/
> On the heels of a driver-led protest outside Uber's San Francisco headquarters, where drivers showed their support for gig worker protections legislation (via Assembly Bill 5) and demanded a union, Uber  is circulating a petition urging people to "protect ridesharing in California." In the petition, Uber advocates for a policy that would offer drivers a minimum of $21 per hour, paid time off, sick leave and compensation if they are injured while driving, as well as a collective voice and "the ability to influence decisions about their work."
> 
> Uber has also created a new website called "Independent Driver" to showcase stories from drivers who want to remain independent contractors. Lyft, similarly, is circulating a petition urging people to demand legislators "fix AB 5."
> ...


Ignoring the loopholes that Uber can drive a convoy of trucks thru, Is Uber planning to roll this Nirvana out to all area's of the country?


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## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

Let's see....

$21 per hour (while on a ride), minus the 25% they claim to take, is ... $15.75 per hour. But only while a driver is on a ride! They aren't going to pay anything to drivers who are sitting around waiting for pings!

Isn't NY minimum over $24/hour? Comes out to $17.50, doesn't it? Plus additional compensation for rides that take them out of the territory?

Hmmmm.

Uber and Lyft both current claim that the "average" driver makes $30 per (booked) hour. Before their cut, of course. So for them to give up a guarantee of $21 per hour, using their math, is a bargain!

Seems to me they are trying to pull the wool over everyone's eyes - AGAIN - by offering a _pay cut_.

I hope AB5 passes, and is followed with additional laws designed to benefit the drivers. Just like NY did. And then I hope that other states follow!! These greedy companies have got to give in sometime. To hell with John, Logan and Dara.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Mista T said:


> Let's see....
> 
> $21 per hour (while on a ride), minus the 25% they claim to take, is ... $15.75 per hour. But only while a driver is on a ride! They aren't going to pay anything to drivers who are sitting around waiting for pings!
> 
> ...


Yup...

$21 an hour while a customer is in the car is a pay cut even in _*Orlando*_.

At $21 an hour garunteed a 20 mile 20 minute ride pays... $7.00ish

Frankly i'd love to see it happen.

I want to see them push the drivers around here past the point your not even paying for gas/tolls. That's the only line they haven't crossed, and once they do...

Whoah nelly, i can't wait for that point.

I've given up waiting for uber/lyft to offer fair pay, i'm currently waiting for them to finally push their drivers past the point the ants stick around.


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## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/28/u...ld-pay-drivers-a-minimum-wage-of-21-per-hour/
> On the heels of a driver-led protest outside Uber's San Francisco headquarters, where drivers showed their support for gig worker protections legislation (via Assembly Bill 5) and demanded a union, Uber  is circulating a petition urging people to "protect ridesharing in California." In the petition, Uber advocates for a policy that would offer drivers a minimum of $21 per hour, paid time off, sick leave and compensation if they are injured while driving, as well as a collective voice and "the ability to influence decisions about their work."
> 
> Uber has also created a new website called "Independent Driver" to showcase stories from drivers who want to remain independent contractors. Lyft, similarly, is circulating a petition urging people to demand legislators "fix AB 5."
> ...


Am a Free Market Capitalist all the way. Uber has ZERO obligation to pay drivers a "living wage". None.

Loooove my I/C status. Flexibility is the number one asset, for me, with this gig. Of course, do not have to live off the earnings or pay a car note.

It's literally one the best income streams I've ever had. It even pays, more than $1K/mo, if I don't work at all.

Thanks Uber.
? ?



Mista T said:


> Let's see....
> 
> $21 per hour (while on a ride), minus the 25% they claim to take, is ... $15.75 per hour. But only while a driver is on a ride! They aren't going to pay anything to drivers who are sitting around waiting for pings!
> 
> ...


Hope this stupid, anti business bill fails.

If it passes, hoping Uber pulls out of liberal, anti American, California.

MAGA
?


----------



## Asificarewhatyoudontthink (Jul 6, 2017)

jocker12 said:


> If AB5 is signed in current form, and both platforms will exit CA, do you think that vacuum would allow other company to come in and build a performant transportation business close to the model (not the compensation) Uber and Lyft currently have?


Since all that is needed is being able to design and implement an app that connects riders and drivers (team A), collects and disperses payments (team B), and provides optimized routing (team C and you get paid by the trip based on estimated route even if you find a shorter/quicker route so no more long haul)...
There never has been a valid business reason for the BS Uber and Lyft have been doing.
60 people in the core programming team doing the job correctly. 
A small BOD run properly with their pay packages tied directly to company profits. 
And a team of about 350 venue/municipality interface folks to coordinate profit sharing in markets (which, let's face it, is all the regulatory issues are about).

If these companies had done that from day one instead of pretending they were some super complicated 20,000 full time 150,000 to 350,000 a year employees, they would already have made the decisions needed to keep the company competitive while never having had the issues that lead to laws and regulations like CA and NYC have started.
Because they would have had happy drivers, low turn over while still maintaining adequate coverage that generates it's own demand.


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## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

Asificarewhatyoudontthink said:


> Since all that is needed is being able to design and implement an app that connects riders and drivers (team A), collects and disperses payments (team B), and provides optimized routing (team C and you get paid by the trip based on estimated route even if you find a shorter/quicker route so no more long haul)...
> There never has been a valid business reason for the BS Uber and Lyft have been doing.
> 60 people in the core programming team doing the job correctly.
> A small BOD run properly with their pay packages tied directly to company profits.
> ...


Am, both, a driver and rider. Totally satisfying on both platforms. Do not emphasize with the disgruntled crowd's complaints whatsoever.

If you're not satisfied move on. Quit driving, we really do not need you.

Sick of these uneducated, liberal whiners.

MAGA ?


----------



## kdyrpr (Apr 23, 2016)

Also.....the fact that there is rarely any surge to speak of in MOST markets has been the death knell for a lot of drivers. 2X 3X red spots on my phone always had a way of getting me off my but and driving.


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## Polomarko (Dec 20, 2016)

Uber's Guber said:


> Uber/Lyft was never supposed to be a self-sustaining career. Read what Lyft said when they stated _"we don't agree that this protection should come at the cost of the flexibility our community relies on to *supplement *their income," _the key word being "supplement."
> Friends, I'm sorry to demean some of you, but Uber/Lyft is a LOW-skilled job that any monkey (sorry Rakos) can do. You want real income with real benefits? Then get a REAL job. Do it sooner rather than later, because if AB5 is signed in it current form, Uber/Lyft will most likely exit the California market.


It doesn't matter full time or part time, nobody has right to unlawfully exploits people.



MiamiKid said:


> Am, both, a driver and rider. Totally satisfying on both platforms. Do not emphasize with the disgruntled crowd's complaints whatsoever.
> 
> If you're not satisfied move on. Quit driving, we really do not need you.
> 
> ...


When criminals move into your neighborhood, just move out!


----------



## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> The problem is...
> 
> Min wage would be a VAST IMPROVEMENT at this point for many many cities.


Federal government has a minimum wage.
Every state has a minimum wage.
Are you referring to the United States? If so, if you are an uber driver and after all expenses and subsidizations, you are not making minimum wage, why on this green earth are you an uber driver?

I don't think the problem is minimum wage, I think the problem is people just do not understand. If you are spending 12 hours, 48 trips to make $218 dollars, you are not a good Uber driver and/or your market sucks.

Seriously, 12 hours to make $218 dollars? Something isn't right.


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## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

Ssgcraig said:


> Federal government has a minimum wage.
> Every state has a minimum wage.
> Are you referring to the United States? If so, if you are an uber driver and after all expenses and subsidizations, you are not making minimum wage, why on this green earth are you an uber driver?
> 
> ...


Drivers should just appreciate the outstanding opportunity Uber's provided.

BTW: Overall Uber enjoys very high popularity amongst, both, drivers and riders. 
Unfortunately, a disproportionate share, of grunts, seem to find this forum to voice anti American views.

My two cents.
?


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## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

MiamiKid said:


> Drivers should just appreciate the outstanding opportunity Uber's provided.
> 
> BTW: Overall Uber enjoys very high popularity amongst, both, drivers and riders.
> Unfortunately, a disproportionate share, of grunts, seem to find this forum to voice anti American views.
> ...


What was anti American? I agree, a lot of Americans find anything to complain about. We have such 1st world problems.

I think the diversity of markets some do not understand too. Some you can make good money while others really are not good.


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## indydriver68 (Mar 13, 2018)

This offer is kinda like a settlement offer in a civil suit. Uber and Lyft only offer just enough they hope to satisfy the drivers and allows Uber and Lyft to save their asses. The drivers after being f***ed over time and time again don’t trust anything Uber or Lyft says or claims. Then the legislature is kinda like the jury. How much would it take for Uber and Lyft to be on the hook for that changes Uber and Lyft’s behavior and sends a clear message to treat and pay drivers fairly? 

So the offer by Uber and Lyft as usual make the offer sound when presented “Golden” when in reality it offers about as much useless items as Uber Pro. The offer doesn’t do enough or offer enough compensation. 

Current Drivers will never trust Uber or Lyft. Ever. Period. Uber and Lyft creates this and good luck with trying to change this. 

The legislature wants money from employee taxes in their coffers and I do believe for drivers to have rights and a livable wage. They need to do whatever is necessary to bring Uber and Lyft to heel. 

For the record I believe whole heartedly that Uber and Lyft have had every chance to do right by drivers and flat out refused to do so and now they are getting called to the carpet with AB5 and now claim they want to make it right. Uber and Lyft deserve everything AB5 costs them.


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## VanGuy (Feb 15, 2019)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> I'm not sure Uber can take too many more blows. At its current rate Uber stock will close the year at $25/share.
> 
> With more laws, regulations, and lawsuits mounting against Uber, I believe the company will fold. Uber is really looking more fragile than ever this year.


I sure hope so. My Put is at $32 for Dec 20.


----------



## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

jocker12 said:


> https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/28/u...ld-pay-drivers-a-minimum-wage-of-21-per-hour/
> On the heels of a driver-led protest outside Uber's San Francisco headquarters, where drivers showed their support for gig worker protections legislation (via Assembly Bill 5) and demanded a union, Uber  is circulating a petition urging people to "protect ridesharing in California." In the petition, Uber advocates for a policy that would offer drivers a minimum of $21 per hour, paid time off, sick leave and compensation if they are injured while driving, as well as a collective voice and "the ability to influence decisions about their work."
> 
> Uber has also created a new website called "Independent Driver" to showcase stories from drivers who want to remain independent contractors. Lyft, similarly, is circulating a petition urging people to demand legislators "fix AB 5."
> ...


I"ve had years of experience in the transportation industry. A wage will gaurantee massive layoffs, which will, in turn, result in poorer service. But, the drivers who are left on payroll will be fine. They will lose priviledges, be required to work shifts, and they may be required to work in less than desirable areas, etc.

However, in my view, if the gov forces a wage, uber will just bail in that area where it is forced because $21 an hour PLUS half of social security and worker's comp is a bridge to far for transport companies, these days ( except the bus charter companies),


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

XPG said:


> "minimum of approximately $21 per hour while on a trip"--- art of scam!


.....spin and lies, typical of F*ub*a*r*.....................



FLUBBER said:


> What a joke we're independent businesses how can any business be in business on $20 an hour in gross revenue.


Twenty dollars hourly is the _absolute *bare minimum *_gross revenue that keeps me out on the streets. If I do not have sixty dollars in gross revenue after three hours, it is obvious that I am wasting my time. I go home and mow the lawn or post on internet forums like this one.



Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> $21 per hour is getting close enough to what's needed,
> However Uber would pull shenanigans and only pay from acceptance to drop off thus making it as low as $4 an hour.


F*ub*a*r* and Gr*yft* always put their spin on something with the intent to deceive. If it takes me fifteen minutes from offer of ping to discharge of five dollar twenty five trip, yes, that averages out to twenty one the hour, but, if the next ping that shows up after five minutes is another fifteen to discharge for another five dollars twenty five, yes, that is still within the parameters of the spin, but, it disagrees with reality.



Hackenstein said:


> I remember when they claimed drivers made $90,000/yr.
> They presented it as a career.


Are you still around here? I have not seen one of your posts in some time.



Hideyokidshideyowifebcuz said:


> They will not exit the California market. If Uber didn't exit New York's market then they aren't going to exit California.


There are too many customers in California for Uber or Lyft to leave it.



TwoFiddyMile said:


> Only if $21 per hour while logged on and accepting every ping. Then yes.


.......and only if that is a minimum. If the driver averages better, he keeps it.



njn said:


> $21 seems a bit high for the pay floor. It's currently $19 in NYC and drivers must buy their own commercial insurance.


That might be high in Jersey, but in New York City it is likely too low. In the Capital of Your Nation, twenty one dollars is a shade over bare minimum for this business,



Ssgcraig said:


> So to telling that it's a low skilled job is ludicrous. That all we do is follow a blue line on a map.


There are those who believe that all that there is to this job is turning the ignition to ON, taking off the brake, putting the car into gear and following the Jippy Yess. Yes, you can DO this job by following that line, but, you will not make too much money consistently if that is all that you do.



Ssgcraig said:


> MCD's employees actually pay taxes on their income unlike Uber drivers.


If Uber/Lyft drivers do not pay taxes, the Internal Revenue will come after them, as Uber issues a 1099. Lyft does not always issue one (how it gets away with that, I do not know). Still, there is a record that you were paid something. The difference is that Icky-D's employees get it taken out of their paycheck, while it does not come out of your Uber/Lyft direct deposit. You must, however, still pay taxes. You do not have to
like it, Y-E-T, but, you must pay.



njn said:


> They will just pass the increase costs onto the pax.


One of the major failures of the TNCs is at Capitalism 101. Rather than making the consumer pay the costs of doing business, they take it out of the collective hide of their contractors in the form of pay cuts, be they outright pay cuts or pay cuts spun as something else,



VanGuy said:


> But, again I'm assuming with a little lube that can be accomplished as well.


Uber paid off in many cities to get into them. Whoever invented the word "kleptocracy" was being redundant.



TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> With more laws, regulations, and lawsuits mounting against Uber, Uber is really looking more fragile than ever this year.


If Uber had to follow the same rules as do the cab and limousine drivers and companies, it could not compete.

Travis Kalanick is on record before the D.C. City Council as admitting that Uber does the same thing that taxicab and limousine services do. He admitted this despite the company's official protestations that it is a "technology" company and not a "transportation" company. Even someone with a custodial level Intelligence Quotient could see through THAT spin. Someone had to pay the politicians to buy that one, officially, that is.



Mista T said:


> Let's see....
> 
> $21 per hour (while on a ride), minus the 25% they claim to take, is ... $15.75 per hour. But only while a driver is on a ride! They aren't going to pay anything to drivers who are sitting around waiting for pings!
> 
> ...


...........spin dissected...................I wonder how much it is going to cost Uber to get the California politicians to "buy" this

.


MiamiKid said:


> Uber enjoys very high popularity amongst, both, drivers and riders.


When you post things such as this, you give substance to the accusations from other posters that you are an Uber Shill or Uber Troll.


----------



## VanGuy (Feb 15, 2019)

Another Uber Driver said:


> Uber paid off in many cities to get into them. Whoever invented the word "kleptocracy" was being redundant.


I think they originally tried that here, and got stomped to the curb. That's why we still don't have it. Another favorite conspiracy theory of mine is this one I got from a friend,

"Every time Uber execs came to town to talk to the gov, the Hells Angels showed up and shook everyone's hands and then told them they weren't welcome. Rumour is the cabs run product for the Angels in return for protection from Ridesharing."


----------



## Antvirus (Jan 6, 2019)

I remember driving two passengers to an NBA game. I was playing Radio.com and during the commercial break an "Uber, what moves you" advert played. When I dropped them off there were Uber and Lyft signs everywhere. When I went home to watch the game, I noticed HUGE digital Uber signs all over the arena. Seems like $$ well spent because:

60% of the audience most likely got there via ride share

20% probably walk because they live close by

The other 20% don't drink, don't care, drive, park and know Uber exists


----------



## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

Another Uber Driver said:


> If Uber/Lyft drivers do not pay taxes, the Internal Revenue will come after them, as Uber issues a 1099. Lyft does not always issue one (how it gets away with that, I do not know). Still, there is a record that you were paid something. The difference is that Icky-D's employees get it taken out of their paycheck, while it does not come out of your Uber/Lyft direct deposit. You must, however, still pay taxes. You do not have to
> like it, Y-E-T, but, you must pay.


Someone missed the point. The difference is that as an Uber driver, I pay close to nothing in taxes on the income after the governments allowable write offs. Whereas a MDC's employee is paying the standard %.

I shouldn't have to explain the subsidy the government gives self employed Americans (Uber Drivers), I thought that was known.


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

Ssgcraig said:


> I shouldn't have to explain the subsidy the government gives self employed Americans (Uber Drivers), I thought that was known.


I actually make money at it, so I must pay. I drive my cab, in addition to Uber/Lyft. People in the Capital of Your Nation are still using cabs. Add the cab income to the TNC and I end up paying.


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## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

Another Uber Driver said:


> I actually make money at it, so I must pay. I drive my cab, in addition to Uber/Lyft. People in the Capital of Your Nation are still using cabs. Add the cab income to the TNC and I end up paying.


Two separate incomes? Just referring to TNC here.


----------



## Lee239 (Mar 24, 2017)

jocker12 said:


> https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/28/u...ld-pay-drivers-a-minimum-wage-of-21-per-hour/
> On the heels of a driver-led protest outside Uber's San Francisco headquarters, where drivers showed their support for gig worker protections legislation (via Assembly Bill 5) and demanded a union, Uber  is circulating a petition urging people to "protect ridesharing in California." In the petition, Uber advocates for a policy that would offer drivers a minimum of $21 per hour, paid time off, sick leave and compensation if they are injured while driving, as well as a collective voice and "the ability to influence decisions about their work."
> 
> Uber has also created a new website called "Independent Driver" to showcase stories from drivers who want to remain independent contractors. Lyft, similarly, is circulating a petition urging people to demand legislators "fix AB 5."
> ...


Just an Uber stunt, they would have to pay more than Taxi rates for the drivers to make $21 an hour plus other benefits. They are just using Trumps lie and distract method of stalling.


----------



## Amos69 (May 17, 2019)

If that were to happen here I would walk away immediately. I do not want to be an employee. If they provided a car and maintenance , fuel and insurance, I would still have to consider it. Health insurance and other benefits I would consider strongly


----------



## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> Drivers should just appreciate the outstanding opportunity Uber's provided.
> 
> BTW: Overall Uber enjoys very high popularity amongst, both, drivers and riders.
> Unfortunately, a disproportionate share, of grunts, seem to find this forum to voice anti American views.
> ...


I appreciate the opportunity. But when I am underpaid, I am not happy. Yesterday I went out for two hours and made $20 gross. So I'm complaining. When I make $27/hour average, I don't complain.

Anti-American? Seems to me that sticking up for oneself is VERY American! It all started with the Boston Tea Party - true Americans fought back against bullshit.

Maybe you could MAGA by leaving the country permanently.


----------



## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

Lee239 said:


> Just an Uber stunt, they would have to pay more than Taxi rates for the drivers to make $21 an hour plus other benefits. They are just using Trumps lie and distract method of stalling.


 They are just using politicians lie tactics and distract method of stalling.

Fixed it.

Think about it, they dangle the phrase "$21 an hour", but what that means is $21 an hour while on trip. Some of your eyes got big because the big picture eludes many. Do the math for what a 15 mile trip that takes 18 minutes will pay at $21 an hour. Yup, $6.30. This is what you want? Plus blocks that you have to get first come first serve, can only drive in a certain area.


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

Mista T said:


> I appreciate the opportunity. But when I am underpaid, I am not happy. Yesterday I went out for two hours and made $20 gross. So I'm complaining. When I make $27/hour average, I don't complain.
> 
> Anti-American? Seems to me that sticking up for oneself is VERY American! It all started with the Boston Tea Party - true Americans fought back against bullshit.
> 
> Maybe you could MAGA by leaving the country permanently.


Doing too well to leave the country. Multiple income streams.

Happen to love the awesome Capitalist machine. If Uber no longer works, for some people, they should quit. Instead of bashing the company.

So will continue calling those out who consistently complain, whine and name call. All they have to do is quit.

And never, ever hear it outside this forum. Talk to other drivers, everyday who love the opportunity Uber provides.

Try a more positive attitude.


----------



## ducktaleswoohoo (Aug 28, 2019)

Antvirus said:


> I remember driving two passengers to an NBA game. I was playing Radio.com and during the commercial break an "Uber, what moves you" advert played. When I dropped them off there were Uber and Lyft signs everywhere. When I went home to watch the game, I noticed HUGE digital Uber signs all over the arena. Seems like $$ well spent because:
> 
> 60% of the audience most likely got there via ride share
> 
> ...


so 60% or over 5000 people uber lyft to nba games? lmao & 20% live within a 10 minute walk to the arena so $2000+ for a 1 befroom and least 2,000 people? & only 2,000+ drive & park?

I want what youre smoking

the majority of the 4% who suceed at this ponzi avoid picking up & dropping off at events especially now that 90+% of surges goes to uber lyft

4% of people also use ride "share" regularly (weekly)



Ssgcraig said:


> They are just using politicians lie tactics and distract method of stalling.
> 
> Fixed it.
> 
> Think about it, they dangle the phrase "$21 an hour", but what that means is $21 an hour while on trip. Some of your eyes got big because the big picture eludes many. Do the math for what a 15 mile trip that takes 18 minutes will pay at $21 an hour. Yup, $6.30. This is what you want? Plus blocks that you have to get first come first serve, can only drive in a certain area.


driving 2mph so everyone sees you lol so take an hour to drive a minimum fare or shuffle baby shuffle go to an event & just take rides from the crowd or bar

they so clever at uber lyft hq since they just wamt to drivers to teleport home after drop off and to pick up like theres no costs and drivers must live right next to every ping & own homee right next to every drop off

anything but showing me the contract and legal minimums will result in me sitting in hotel lobbies outside of my car instead of in bed & ill make my $100+ a day on cancels & when they fire me collect 6 months of unemployment since you guess wed be employees


----------



## backstreets-trans (Aug 16, 2015)

TwoFiddyMile said:


> Only if $21 per hour while logged on and accepting every ping. Then yes.


I read in Jalopnik it was only guaranteed when on trip. Since you're only booked 40-60% of the time that works out to 
$11/hr, California minimum wage is $12/hr.

https://jalopnik.com/uber-and-lyft-dont-have-a-right-to-exist-1837680434


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

backstreets-trans said:


> I read in Jalopnik it was only guaranteed when on trip. Since you're only booked 40-60% of the time that works out to
> $11/hr, California minimum wage is $12/hr.
> 
> https://jalopnik.com/uber-and-lyft-dont-have-a-right-to-exist-1837680434


Who cares?


----------



## Antvirus (Jan 6, 2019)

ducktaleswoohoo said:


> the majority of the 4% who suceed at this ponzi avoid picking up & dropping off at events especially now that 90+% of surges goes to uber lyft


No kidding and that was in no way relevant to my comment.



ducktaleswoohoo said:


> so 60% or over 5000 people uber lyft to nba games? lmao & 20% live within a 10 minute walk to the arena so $2000+ for a 1 befroom and least 2,000 people? & only 2,000+ drive & park?


In my market we average well over 20k people per game. I don't know what rental price has to do with anything but ok. Here a one "befroom" doesn't reach 2k in that area but hey fine. Maybe high end apartments but sure, whatever you say.
A HUGE amount of people live within walking distance. Many choose to walk, bike, subway, etc...

I didn't say games, I said "an NBA Game" perhaps you should read a lil before you get all worked up champ.
My point was that IN MY MARKET they are pissing away advertising dollars for no reason. It was simply an observation.


----------



## CZ75 (Aug 10, 2018)

"While on a trip." Gotta love that one.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

backstreets-trans said:


> I read in Jalopnik it was only guaranteed when on trip. Since you're only booked 40-60% of the time that works out to
> $11/hr, California minimum wage is $12/hr.
> 
> https://jalopnik.com/uber-and-lyft-dont-have-a-right-to-exist-1837680434


NYC guarantees drivers $17 an hour after expenses. Law.


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

Mista T said:


> I appreciate the opportunity. But when I am underpaid, I am not happy. Yesterday I went out for two hours and made $20 gross. So I'm complaining. When I make $27/hour average, I don't complain.
> 
> Anti-American? Seems to me that sticking up for oneself is VERY American! It all started with the Boston Tea Party - true Americans fought back against bullshit.
> 
> Maybe you could MAGA by leaving the country permanently.


You're comparing the Boston Tea Party to AB5?

SERIOUSLY?

Boston Tea Party was about challenging big, overreaching government. You're about as WRONG, misdirected and just plain false as you could be.

Challenging the H#%$ out of the EVIL AB5 Bill is the fighting spirit of the Boston Tea Party, NOT supporting it!

AB5 will literally shutdown the rideshare gig, not improve it. I DESPISE the bill and ALL who support it. It is pure EVIL!!!! ???

The rideshare opportunity, for both drivers and riders, will disappear.

PLEASE JUST QUIT!!!!!!

Or better yet move to Venezuela!

MAGA
?


----------



## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> You're comparing the Boston Tea Party to AB5?
> 
> SERIOUSLY?
> 
> ...


Your lame attempt to convince everyone that Uber and Lyft are in the right is BS.

























If MAGA is about allowing capitalism to flow freely, then let U/L follow the laws and quit complaining yourself. If Uber dies because it has to play by the same rules as the rest of America, then MAGA on!


----------



## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Uber's Guber said:


> Uber/Lyft was never supposed to be a self-sustaining career. Read what Lyft said when they stated _"we don't agree that this protection should come at the cost of the flexibility our community relies on to *supplement *their income," _the key word being "supplement."
> Friends, I'm sorry to demean some of you, but Uber/Lyft is a LOW-skilled job that any monkey (sorry Rakos) can do. You want real income with real benefits? Then get a REAL job. Do it sooner rather than later, because if AB5 is signed in it current form, Uber/Lyft will most likely exit the California market.


The "supplement" part is a big fat lie.

Both companies would be out of business in less than 24 hours if they were to lose the hundreds of thousands of full time drivers.

Uber actively RECRUITED full time drivers using false advertising promises of $90,000 per year. The govt sued uber for false advertsing and they were forced to pay a $20 million dollar settlement.

Any monkey could do it? If that's the case, why are so few drivers making money doing it? 97% quit every year.

Try to do at least a little homework before posting a bunch of erroneous bullshit.



Hackenstein said:


> I remember when they claimed drivers made $90,000/yr.
> 
> They presented it as a career.


The shills don't believe in letting facts get in the way of their arguments.

Not only did Travis claim the $90,000, he promoted rideshare as a "sustainable business opportunity"



backstreets-trans said:


> I read in Jalopnik it was only guaranteed when on trip. Since you're only booked 40-60% of the time that works out to
> $11/hr, California minimum wage is $12/hr.
> 
> https://jalopnik.com/uber-and-lyft-dont-have-a-right-to-exist-1837680434


Yes, it's $21 per "booked" hour which is TERRIBLE pay.


----------



## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

Technically I'm sure some sharper early adopters of Uber made $100,000 gross the fist year or so.
Simple math.
$300x365 is $109,500.
But what if you burned down a brand new Chrysler 300 to do that?
So yeah, one could have grossed $90,000 without much imagination.
Net is an entirely different story.


----------



## Taxi2Uber (Jul 21, 2017)

TwoFiddyMile said:


> NYC guarantees drivers $17 an hour after expenses. Law.


Yeah, NYC min is roughly $27 gross, and roughly $17 after expenses.
But as I understand it, it's not a guarantee minimum hourly wage, but a minimum guarantee per trip or minimum pay rate, based on a formula that includes utilization rates, and some NYC drivers were earning less than min wage as a result. Time without a customer is not compensated, so you just can't sit at home with the app on and get paid a guaranteed min wage.



Hackenstein said:


> I remember when they claimed drivers made $90,000/yr.
> 
> They presented it as a career.


I remember as well.
It is amazing how many on here say that RS was never meant to be a full time job/career.
I had cab driver buddies that switched Day1 when Uber came into my market.
They were grossing $2000-$3000/week easily.
X 52 week = $100K-$150K/year.
They kept asking/encouraging me to make the switch, but I couldn't.
Of course it wasn't sustainable and I missed the boat of the early days, but those number were definitely attainable.


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

Mista T said:


> Your lame attempt to convince everyone that Uber and Lyft are in the right is BS.
> 
> View attachment 350611
> 
> ...


Dude, just QUIT if it's not working for you. That's the way any business works in this country.

Have ZERO sympathy for this lower, uneducated, type of driver, who can't figure this out.

They don't deserve minimum wage. Period.


----------



## Taxi2Uber (Jul 21, 2017)

Uber's $21 seems to make sense vs. NYC numbers.

NYC min wage is *$15* (11+employees)
CA State min wage is *$12*, (*$13* in 2020); LA min wage is $14.25 (26+employees)

The median rent in NYC is *$2,098*-1 bdrm; *$2,499*-2 bdrm
The median rent in CA is *$1,446*-1 bdrm; *$1,844*-2 bdrm

NYC min pay rate for Uber is *~$27*
CA min pay rate for Uber is *$21* (proposed)

But in places like San Francisco and Los Angeles, they would disagree, and consider $21 to be not enough and a pay cut.

In response to a couple of posters. Min wage doesn't equal Living wage.



Ssgcraig said:


> I don't think the problem is minimum wage, I think the problem is people just do not understand. If you are spending 12 hours, 48 trips to make $218 dollars, you are not a good Uber driver and/or your market sucks.
> 
> Seriously, 12 hours to make $218 dollars? Something isn't right.


That's ~$18/hr gross.
Factor in say $5/hr expenses, leaves you with $13/hr
Min wage for the location of that driver you referenced is $8.75/hr (soon to be $9.25).
So what's not right? Isn't $13 better than ~$9.
Would $20 net be better? Well, of course.
What people are you referring to, and what are they not understanding?


----------



## kevin92009 (Sep 11, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/28/u...ld-pay-drivers-a-minimum-wage-of-21-per-hour/
> On the heels of a driver-led protest outside Uber's San Francisco headquarters, where drivers showed their support for gig worker protections legislation (via Assembly Bill 5) and demanded a union, Uber  is circulating a petition urging people to "protect ridesharing in California." In the petition, Uber advocates for a policy that would offer drivers a minimum of $21 per hour, paid time off, sick leave and compensation if they are injured while driving, as well as a collective voice and "the ability to influence decisions about their work."
> 
> Uber has also created a new website called "Independent Driver" to showcase stories from drivers who want to remain independent contractors. Lyft, similarly, is circulating a petition urging people to demand legislators "fix AB 5."
> ...





Hackenstein said:


> I remember when they claimed drivers made $90,000/yr.
> 
> They presented it as a career.


?


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Ssgcraig said:


> You brought up the out of pocket expenses. I simply stated that here in America, we want wages of skilled labor when we are working non-skilled jobs.


yes I brought up the out of pocket expenses because you ignored them


----------



## ducktaleswoohoo (Aug 28, 2019)

Antvirus said:


> No kidding and that was in no way relevant to my comment.
> 
> In my market we average well over 20k people per game. I don't know what rental price has to do with anything but ok. Here a one "befroom" doesn't reach 2k in that area but hey fine. Maybe high end apartments but sure, whatever you say.
> A HUGE amount of people live within walking distance. Many choose to walk, bike, subway, etc...
> ...


you said least 60% of people took uber lyft to an nba game if 20k go to the game hence the more than, thats 12,000 people use uber lyft thats just ridiculous

you said 20% walk so 4000+ walk which means they live within a mile ir 2 have you ever lived downtown or near a stadium its usually minimum 2000 for a 1 bedroom in most cities unless in the projects thats ridiculous

i bet less than 10 people bike to a game and you didn't mention anything about bus & rail which i guarantee more people use to go to games than uber Lyft

the numbers are ridiculous hence i want what youre smoking

not worked up dont try to decipher tone from text its what children do hence the invention of emoticons & machete dont enoticon unless i want to stick something in a millinial

yes uber lyft burns 12+ million a day most of it to market everywhere so dummies sign up & for riders to use the service hence why no legit biz can compete


----------



## Antvirus (Jan 6, 2019)

ducktaleswoohoo said:


> i bet less than 10 people bike to a game and you didn't mention anything about bus & rail which i guarantee more people use to go to games than uber Lyft


Actually I did


Antvirus said:


> subway


Can you read or just get all excited?? Pay attention ant...

Since you're the authority on the subject why don't you do some "research" about my market and get back to me.

Here, I'l try to put it in language you can actually read and understand.
Don't fret, I won't trouble you with punctuation n shit.

Every market is different and for you to speak about a city you don't understand is laughable and when you get all excited and don't read every sentence it makes it more difficult for others to understand your point if you have one and not everyone lives in Utah and the country is big with lots of people and you should research the city you're speaking of before you make old man jokes about smoking drugs because they are pretty tired and boring and maybe if you lived here you would understand that the idea of 10 people biking to a game here is a lil on the low side and and and and and and

Is that better?


----------



## kevin92009 (Sep 11, 2016)

TwoFiddyMile said:


> Only if $21 per hour while logged on and accepting every ping. Then yes.


the fine print says otherwise , it's not a $21 min wage when the details are factored in.


----------



## Antvirus (Jan 6, 2019)

ducktaleswoohoo said:


> not worked up dont try to decipher tone from text its what children do hence the invention of emoticons & machete dont enoticon unless i want to stick something in a millinial


Oh you're worked up hahaha
WTF are you even talking about??? Stop mashing your phone with your hand and complete an actual thought.



ducktaleswoohoo said:


> its what children do


Ohhhhhhhh you mean like creating a profile named after a cartoon that a 5 year old would watch?
Perish the thought....



ducktaleswoohoo said:


> which means they live within a mile ir 2 have you ever lived downtown or near a stadium its usually minimum 2000 for a 1 bedroom in most cities unless in the projects thats ridiculous


Hahahaha
Thank you for the education. Perhaps I should ask my LL to raise my rent to your imagined price point since I live within a mile or two of, uhhhh, 3 stadiums?
In fact, let's triple it!
Your assumptions are adorable...


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

kevin92009 said:


> ?


Have been with Uber four years and never, even one single time, was it ever presented as fulltime $90K/yr. Never.

Man up guys and get over it. Stop bragging about your how uneducated and unskilled you are. Show some self respect.

Any educated, reasonable person should be able to figure out Uber is not meant to be fulltime, sole source of income. Nor is it meant to support paying for your car, appartment or living expenses.

Sorry, but any grunt who's been driving several years, struggling and doesn't get this? Deserves what they get for blatant STUPIDITY.

MAGA
??


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

When Uber and Lyft start talking percentages, and when I say percentage I mean 20%, we'll start listening. Til then, it's AB5 and a union.


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> When Uber and Lyft start talking percentages, and when I say percentage I mean 20%, we'll start listening. Til then, it's AB5 and a union.


They don't owe you a percentage and drivers do not deserve one. We agreed, in writing, to the current pay structure.

A scumbag union's not happening. Period. And if the EVIL AB5 passes? Your job is gone. So if that's what you want, suggest you spend 100% of your energy looking for another income stream. Because it's not happening.

MAGA
?⛳


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

MiamiKid said:


> They don't owe you a percentage and drivers do not deserve one. We agreed, in writing, to the current pay structure.
> 
> A scumbag union's not happening. Period. And if the EVIL AB5 passes? Your job is gone. So if that's what you want, suggest you spend 100% of your energy looking for another income stream. Because it's not happening.
> 
> ...


haven't you figured out you're in the minority yet ? nobody cares what you think...same with your sister usernames Seacraig and Fozzie


----------



## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> They don't owe you a percentage and drivers do not deserve one. We agreed, in writing, to the current pay structure.
> 
> A scumbag union's not happening. Period. And if the EVIL AB5 passes? Your job is gone. So if that's what you want, suggest you spend 100% of your energy looking for another income stream. Because it's not happening.
> 
> ...


Your lies and propaganda aren't fooling anyone. Go back to posting annoying rants on FB.


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> haven't you figured out you're in the minority yet ? nobody cares what you think...same with your sister usernames Seacraig and Fozzie


And haven't you figured out Uber is not going to work for "you people"?

Kinda of a no brainer. Or are the lower class grunts really that uneducated? They may be.

MAGA
?⛳


----------



## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Taxi2Uber said:


> Uber's $21 seems to make sense vs. NYC numbers.
> 
> NYC min wage is *$15* (11+employees)
> CA State min wage is *$12*, (*$13* in 2020); LA min wage is $14.25 (26+employees)
> ...


It's not $21 an hour, it's $21 an hour while there's a customer in the car.

60 mile 60 minute ride? = $21

20 mile 20 minute ride? =$7


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> It's not $21 an hour, it's $21 an hour while there's a customer in the car.
> 
> 60 mile 60 minute ride? = $21
> 
> 20 mile 20 minute ride? =$7


Sounds good to me.


----------



## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> Have been with Uber four years and never, even one single time, was it ever presented as fulltime $90K/yr. Never.


Do you think this Bussiness Insider report from May 27th, 2014 (before your four years with Uber) is accurate?
https://www.businessinsider.com/uber-drivers-salary-90000-2014-5
"*According to Uber, the median wage* for an *UberX driver working at least 40 hours a week in New York City is $90,766* a year and $74,191 a year in San Francisco,"


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> Do you think this Bussiness Insider report from May 27th, 2014 (before your four years with Uber) is accurate?
> https://www.businessinsider.com/uber-drivers-salary-90000-2014-5


Why would I care? And why would you?

Let's see four years and you can't figure it out? That's on you.

Tough luck pal. Enjoy your uneducated, working class life.


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> Do you think this Bussiness Insider report from May 27th, 2014 (before your four years with Uber) is accurate?
> https://www.businessinsider.com/uber-drivers-salary-90000-2014-5
> "*According to Uber, the median wage* for an *UberX driver working at least 40 hours a week in New York City is $90,766* a year and $74,191 a year in San Francisco,"


lol you cant talk to that Luber shill so don't even bother


----------



## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> Why would I care? And why would you?


First you criticized drivers for making false claims about the 90k/yr.

Then, when shown proof of its existence, you claim it doesn't matter.

Uber should have fired 401 marketing people, not just 400. You're nothing but a ......


----------



## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> Why would I care? And why would you?
> 
> Let's see four years and you can't figure it out? That's on you.
> 
> Tough luck pal. Enjoy your uneducated, working class life.


Do you think this report (see below) done by The Independent on Feb. 20th, 2017 (during your four years with Uber) is correct and
"*Uber has agreed to pay $20m to resolve charges that it duped drivers with exaggerated claims about how much they could earn* and underestimated how much it would cost to finance their cars.
The US Federal Trade Commission alleged that most Uber drivers were earning far less in 18 major cities than Uber said that they could earn on its website.
In a statement published on the Thursday, the FTC said Uber claimed drivers' annual median income was more than $90,000 (£73,355) in New York and over $74,000 in San Francisco. True earnings in those cities were $61,000 and $53,000 respectively, the FTC alleged. Less than 10 per cent of all drivers in those cities earned the yearly income Uber touted, the regulator said."?

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...lement-federal-trade-commission-a7537176.html


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Mista T said:


> Your lies and propaganda aren't fooling anyone. Go back to posting annoying rants on FB.


link please ?


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> lol you cant talk to that Luber shill so don't even bother


Hey, got land for sale, in Florida, worth $100K/acre. But will sell it to "you people" for just one dollar an acre! Friday night special.

Act now while it lasts.

Any takers? Let me know.
?



jocker12 said:


> Do you think this report (see below) done by The Independent on Feb. 20th, 2017 (during your four years with Uber) is correct and
> "*Uber has agreed to pay $20m to resolve charges that it duped drivers with exaggerated claims about how much they could earn* and underestimated how much it would cost to finance their cars.
> The US Federal Trade Commission alleged that most Uber drivers were earning far less in 18 major cities than Uber said that they could earn on its website.
> In a statement published on the Thursday, the FTC said Uber claimed drivers' annual median income was more than $90,000 (£73,355) in New York and over $74,000 in San Francisco. True earnings in those cities were $61,000 and $53,000 respectively, the FTC alleged. Less than 10 per cent of all drivers in those cities earned the yearly income Uber touted, the regulator said."?
> ...


My point is, only idiots fell for this. The advertising is just plain old "blue sky advertising". I've done it my entire life.

But "you people" actually bought this for four years. Don't you know any better?

Guess Governor George Wallace was right. 
?


----------



## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> Have been with Uber four years


Are you still with Uber?



MiamiKid said:


> "blue sky advertising"


Advertising to what? Uber paying $20 million because they got caught eating their own BS?


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> Are you still with Uber?


Yes, but only as fun money. ⛳?


----------



## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> never, even one single time, was it ever presented as fulltime $90K/yr. Never.


Do you still think you are correct and Uber never presented false information about possible driver earnings, in order to mislead the public?



MiamiKid said:


> Stop bragging about your how uneducated and unskilled you are.





MiamiKid said:


> Yes, but only as fun money.


If you think this is false, can you explain why do you think you are different?


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> Do you still think you are correct and Uber never presented false information about possible driver earnings, in order to mislead the public?


You're missing the entire point. I picked up on it immediately. Don't care about the commercials "you people" saw. It's "blue sky" advertising dude. You don't get it?

We do.

No, do NOT agree with you that Uber did anything wrong. What's with you?? Four years? You don't get it? You never will.



jocker12 said:


> Do you still think you are correct and Uber never presented false information about possible driver earnings, in order to mislead the public?
> 
> 
> Do you realize that, by *actively continue to be one of the Uber drivers*, you directly present yourself as "uneducated and unskilled"?
> ...


Slave on! LOL!


----------



## Mista T (Aug 16, 2017)

I'm done with this lying POS shill.

Ignored.


----------



## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> No, do NOT agree with you that Uber did anything wrong.


Then why do you think the US Federal Trade Commission pressed charges against Uber?
https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/pre...ay-20-million-settle-ftc-charges-it-recruited


MiamiKid said:


> blue sky" advertising


Again - Advertising to what? To Uber paying $20 million because they got caught eating their own BS?


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> Then why do you think the US Federal Trade Commission pressed charges against Uber?
> https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/pre...ay-20-million-settle-ftc-charges-it-recruited
> Again - Advertising to what? To Uber paying $20 million because they got caught eating their own BS?


Again, Uber did nothing wrong. This falls entirely on uneducated, naive and just plain stupid drivers.

What's wrong are "you people" NOT seeing through this. Four years and you believed this? ????

Actually, am getting a kick out of how STUPID some drivers are.


----------



## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> Uber did nothing wrong.


Then why do you think the US Federal Trade Commission pressed charges against Uber?


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> Then why do you think the US Federal Trade Commission pressed charges against Uber?


Just business as usual. Liberal, no good Judges.


----------



## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> no good Judges.


What Judges?
Uber Agrees to Pay $20 Million to *Settle* FTC Charges That It Recruited Prospective Drivers with Exaggerated Earnings Claims

So it was a liberal conspiracy against Uber?


----------



## Taxi2Uber (Jul 21, 2017)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> It's not $21 an hour, it's $21 an hour while there's a customer in the car.
> 
> 60 mile 60 minute ride? = $21
> 
> 20 mile 20 minute ride? =$7


Not sure why you think you're telling me something I already know and have stated.


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> What Judges?
> Uber Agrees to Pay $20 Million to *Settle* FTC Charges That It Recruited Prospective Drivers with Exaggerated Earnings Claims
> 
> So it was a liberal conspiracy against Uber?


Yes, it was a liberal conspiracy. I'm involved in advertising as well. It's called Capitalism.

But, that's not the point I'm making. Now that you know it doesn't work as a fulltime gig, why are you beating this "dead horse"?

I figured, all this, out the first couple hours driving. Yes, I look down on those who cannot understand this.

My two cents 
?⛳


----------



## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> it was a liberal conspiracy.


How about the US Law, more precisely Section 5(a) of the FTC Act? You say you did false advertising all your life?

Here is the FTC complaint in a PDF form - FTC's complaint, in its efforts to attract prospective drivers, Uber exaggerated the yearly and hourly income drivers could make

The document states - "The FTC brings this action under Section 13(b) of the Federal Trade Commission Act ("FTC Act"), 15 U.S.C. § 53(b), to obtain temporary, preliminary, and permanent injunctive. relief, rescission or reformation of contracts, restitution, the refund of monies paid, disgorgement of ill-gotten monies, and other equitable relief for Defendant's acts or practices in violation of Section 5(a) of the FTC Act, 15 U.S.C. § 45(a), in connection with its false, misleading, or unsubstantiated claims regarding driver earnings and its Vehicle Solutions Program."

If this was a liberal conspiracy, why do you think Uber didn't fight it, and agreed to settle for $20 million? Remember how settling is an admission of guilt that stops any further thorough investigation.


----------



## Uber's Guber (Oct 22, 2017)

Polomarko said:


> It doesn't matter full time or part time, nobody has right to unlawfully exploits people.


When exploiters move in, just move out!


Polomarko said:


> When criminals move into your neighborhood, just move out!


durrrr



Nats121 said:


> Any monkey could do it? If that's the case, why are so few drivers making money doing it?


Because monkey see, monkey do!


----------



## DoubleDee (Apr 22, 2019)

It's 21 dollars an hour "while on a trip". Look for Uber and Lyft to devise algorithms to screw with the drivers if this ever passes. It's so transparent.


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

DoubleDee said:


> It's 21 dollars an hour "while on a trip"


and before all expenses


----------



## Taxi2Uber (Jul 21, 2017)

And you were insisting for AB5 to pass.
Didn't heed the warnings.
You have tremendous faith that Uber would do right by you.
This time Uber is correct. This time drivers DID ask for it.


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Taxi2Uber said:


> And you were insisting for AB5 to pass.
> Didn't heed the warnings.
> You have tremendous faith that Uber would do right by you.
> This time Uber is correct. This time drivers DID ask for it.


Are you talking to me ? And if so, what exactly are you trying to say ?


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> How about the US Law, more precisely Section 5(a) of the FTC Act? You say you did false advertising all your life?
> 
> Here is the FTC complaint in a PDF form - FTC's complaint, in its efforts to attract prospective drivers, Uber exaggerated the yearly and hourly income drivers could make
> 
> ...


You really don't get it?

The legality is not my point. Not going to admit Uber did anything wrong, no matter what they did.

DON'T CARE!!!!

My point is how uneducated, and blatantly STUPID, drivers are to not be able to figure this out. We all advertise like this. Who cares? I don't.

YOU are the one in the wrong here. If it took you four years to figure out what, my kind of people, conclude in four hours; then, I'd say YOU have a major problem.

Adamantly oppose AB5 no matter what. Even if it passes, nothing will change for the "lower class grunt" drivers. If it doesn't work fulltime; then, government action is not going to make it work. The free market has deemed it inefficient as a sole source of income.

Doesn't really matter, to me, because I do not rely on Uber to pay any bills whatsoever. It makes me over $1,000/mo in residual income. That's right, if Uber goes under, tomorrow, my checks keep coming in. ⛳

The future is in "driverless" cars. Hoping this transition moves at a very fast pace. That way we can do away with the unnecessary expense of drivers.

My two cents.
?


----------



## GreatOrchid (Apr 9, 2019)

let them burn in hell uber deserves it 

release the robot cars let them loose car value and need fixing and cleaning they wont save any money and just wait till they kill more people 

robot cars will pass away and all that greed wont , uber wont be no more will be ne one with new regulation


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

GreatOrchid said:


> let them burn in hell uber deserves it
> 
> release the robot cars let them loose car value and need fixing and cleaning they wont save any money and just wait till they kill more people
> 
> robot cars will pass away and all that greed wont , uber wont be no more will be ne one with new regulation


Try a more positive attitude. Your thinking is hurting nobody except yourself.

Move on with your life and forget about Uber.

It shouldn't bother you that Uber works, very well, for some of us.


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## ducktaleswoohoo (Aug 28, 2019)

work smarter not harder is part of my code kid

& is why I average $40+ an hour while 96% fail & average $4


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## GreatOrchid (Apr 9, 2019)

40$ an hour doing what be specific

i dont think they like disney in miami unless your a girl haha maybe were on to somethin

you cant do x and average 40$ an hour most anywhere maybe nyc

guess where that 40 bucks is coming from bro?


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## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> never, even one single time, was it ever presented as fulltime $90K/yr. Never.





MiamiKid said:


> Not going to admit Uber did anything wrong, no matter what they did.


At least, you acknowledge now how Uber used false advertisement to mislead the public. From *never 90K promise *you now say* you refuse to admit they've done anything wrong *which is progress. Admitting how the promise was wrong or not has no relevance.

Misleading is not only about potential drivers, but is also about riders thinking the drivers were easily making (Uber reported the average UberX was making 90K) fortunes when that was not the case.

If Uber didn't fight "the conspiracy" then is clear there was no conspiracy. Uber was at fault and they knew it, paid $2 million settlement and got away with, again, eating their own BS.


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## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> At least, you acknowledge now how Uber used false advertisement to mislead the public. From *never 90K promise *you now say* you refuse to admit they've done anything wrong *which is progress. Admitting how the promise was wrong or not has no relevance.
> 
> Misleading is not only about potential drivers, but is also about riders thinking the drivers were easily making (Uber reported the average UberX was making 90K) fortunes when that was not the case.
> 
> If Uber didn't fight "the conspiracy" then is clear there was no conspiracy. Uber was at fault and they knew it, paid $2 million settlement and got away with, again, eating their own BS.


You don't how much I don't give a shit.


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## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

MiamiKid said:


> You don't how much I don't give a shit.


This is not about you.


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## GreatOrchid (Apr 9, 2019)

he thinks everything is about him he is from miami







its miamikid









cheap thrills in miami kiddo a wee bit whinny arent you did someone push an arempa in your face










here is miami kids uber eats to make them pesos









pictures are easier for him to understand


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## Cold Fusion (Aug 28, 2019)

Uber and Lyft are floating a $21 minimum wage. Critics say it's closer to $15.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/tech...imum-wage-critics-say-its-closer/?arc404=true
Drivers typically spend about 30 to 40 percent of their time without a passenger, and roughly 10 percent is spent driving to pick up a passenger, according to studies. The pick-up period would be compensated.

"If you're in a retail store and there's nobody in the store several hours a day, you still pay for that time,"


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## GreatOrchid (Apr 9, 2019)

yeah lyft new rates are 37 cents a mile for pre and post pickup

















there they are both of the boys:roflmao:


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## The Entomologist (Sep 23, 2018)

21 bucks in SF, I'm sure they want to set it to 10 bucks everywhere else.

What a joke, I ****ing make 30-40 an hour and still want more, give me more money to cover my car value you scammers.


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## GreatOrchid (Apr 9, 2019)

what car value none of these children understand they have no car value


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## kevin92009 (Sep 11, 2016)

Ssgcraig said:


> Could be time to get into the lube business?


want me to send you a bottle :


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Uber's Guber said:


> Yep, and a bunch of ignorant ants bought into it. Some of them even rented cars. ?
> To see your point though there was an entry interval in the timeline when rates were very lucrative and smart-phone savvy riders were eager to search out a rider. But once Uber perfected their marketing mastery to lure endless ants, that all changed.


Two things killed our pay rates... unethical companies and high rates of Third World immigration.

The overwhelming majority of drivers as well as ants are immigrants.



Hackenstein said:


> All of this is why Medallions exist.
> 
> Unlimited supply to keep wait times down is not 'free market.' Their model is based on spending an incomprehensible amount of other people's money.
> 
> Limited supply for a limited market. If you care about people actually making a living.


Medallions and other barriers to entry created the demand for rideshare in the first place.

Taxi monopolies provided poor service to pax and vitually guaranteed that the vast majority of taxi drivers would never own their own cabs.

If Uber and Lyft had been ethical, the rideshare business model would have remained well-paying like it was in the early days.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Nats121 said:


> Taxi monopolies provided poor service to pax and virtually guaranteed that the vast majority of taxi drivers would never own their own cabs.


umm,

There's an issue with that.

Alone a cab driver can't always do nearly as well as working for a large company, there's an economy of scale that kicks in.

One cab driver receiving calls has to driver significantly farther per pickup than one driver working in a company.

When i owned my own cab i had to limit myself to a *VERY* small area in terms of where I operated. 9/10 calls in for cab rides went un-serviced because it wasn't worth it for me to drive across the city for $4.80.

However take 700 cabs all answering the calls getting sent to the closest driver, the efficiency goes up by a very wide margin.

9/10 the fares i got were from scumming the street for flag downs, Skimming off the highest density areas.

{yeah i had a number, ignored most calls because they were too far away (i literally dumped them off on the cab company i currently driver for, karma?)

HOWEVER, It's so much more business per driver that it's enough to COMPLETELY counter the increased costs associated with being a company driver VS being an independent owner operator AND THEN SOME.

This week i had 5 fares that popped (from dispatch) at less than 1 mile away, from relatively low density areas.

$150-$200 per day as a solo driver
45c a mile in costs (on average over 3.5 years)
150-200 miles... $67-90

$200-300 a day as a company driver
($100ish in expenses) {hyrbrid sedan}

Being a company driver won't necessarily be vastly more expensive than being independent and may be more in revenue.

So it's a conundurm...

This is why there's people who drive for a comapny for 20+ years here when an annual taxi permit is all of $300.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> umm,
> 
> There's an issue with that.
> 
> ...


I don't know the area where you work, but in most places, cabs are leased by the drivers by the shift, the day, or the week.

Before rideshare, lease rates were high and often times there were more drivers than available cabs.

Dispatchers were often corrupt engaging in nepotism and collecting bribes from drivers, most of whom had virtually no hope of ever owing their own cabs.

All of this created fertile ground for rideshare to move in.


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## AvisDeene (Jun 7, 2019)

nonononodrivethru said:


> If $1 a mile minimum base fare for drivers existed, this legislation would never come up.
> 
> Lyft and Uber have done this to themselves and deserve all of the consequences. Get greedy, get caught.


No, the minimum base for a fare should be $1.45 per mile with a $3.50 pick up fee and a $0.40 per minute when the vehicle is moving slower than 15 miles per hour. Do put the bar so low.


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## Nerka (Jul 7, 2017)

Uber and Lyft won't leave the market. Instead they will service contract companies who will than hire drivers. Ulimately it will be the worst of all worlds.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Nats121 said:


> I don't know the area where you work, but in most places, cabs are leased by the drivers by the shift, the day, or the week.


Still how it works here for the company i drive for, all 3 are options.



Nats121 said:


> Before rideshare, lease rates were high


Lease rates are HIGHER actually... mine went up $3.00 over 3 years ago and The hybrids are $6.00 more than the crown victorias that are completely phased out.

All in all, i pay $9.00 more than when i started, but burn $10-12 less in gas per day than back then.



Nats121 said:


> often times there were more drivers than available cabs.


Yeah walking in on a Monday morning or Friday night without being assigned a cab left you with no guarantee of getting a car, the same is actually true now. Monday morning shifts are still really hard to get a car. (being assigned a car requires working 19 shifts a month)



Nats121 said:


> Dispatchers were often corrupt engaging in nepotism and collecting bribes from drivers


They still get fired for this kind of stuff, nothing has changed. But while the corruption exists, bribes aren't mandatory to make it work, and it's a very small number who engage in this crap.



Nats121 said:


> most of whom had virtually no hope of ever owing their own cabs.


didn't i say that driving for a company had ADVANTAGES to owning your own vehicle? Didn't i spell out a whole bunch of reasons why it was better even if expenses were higher?


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> Lease rates are HIGHER actually... mine went up $3.00 over 3 years ago and The hybrids are $6.00 more than the crown victorias that are completely phased out.
> 
> All in all, i pay $9.00 more than when i started, but burn $10-12 less in gas per day than back then.


Things must be very different in Orlando, because in the metro DC, uber really hurt the cab companies.

I drive by taxi companies and see plenty of cabs sitting idle with no drivers.

With a surplus of taxis, I'm assuming lease rates have fallen.



Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> didn't i say that driving for a company had ADVANTAGES to owning your own vehicle? Didn't i spell out a whole bunch of reasons why it was better even if expenses were higher?


Most large cities such as NYC, DC, Philly, Boston, Chicago, etc are dominated by street hails, thus owning a cab is far more profitable than leasing.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Nats121 said:


> With a surplus of taxis, I'm assuming lease rates have fallen.


They would be better off keeping the lease rates the same then cutting the lease to get more vehicles on the road.

Lower expenses for less revenue is better than the same expenses for less revenue.

10 cars X $100- $40 costs = $600
Vs
15 cars X $75- $40 in costs = $525

there's the math...

They are better off not lowering rates and running fewer cars.

Also since the competition for drivers is more intense now, they can have more part timers if they have spare cars around, also happier drivers because they end up going home with $0 less often because they couldn't get a car.

Also 99% of the time cars are kept based on how many shifts/miles they drive, not any sort of time based limit.

So is it good for the company to have cars sitting empty?

No

But it's better than lowering the price.


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## Lee239 (Mar 24, 2017)

Do all these per hour rates take into account the full cost to operate a vehicle including gas, maintenance and depreciation per hour?

and what do they consider per hour?

If I have to drive 6 miles in morning rush hour to do a pickup and that person only goes 1 mile and I'm paid $2.35 and now the pickup is in an area where that mile drive takes me a minute do they think I'm making 120 an hour? and then I get no more pings so I have to drive back home and wait and I wasted 45 minutes to make $2.35 gross to actually lose money deducting miles.

Per hour and minimum wage does not really work if you are just working a gig ride.

Even servers who made $2.13 are guaranteed a minimum wage if they can't make enough on tips to cover their hours in minimum wage. The don't even get that $2.13 it goes towards paying taxes.


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## SurgeMasterMN (Sep 10, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/28/u...ld-pay-drivers-a-minimum-wage-of-21-per-hour/
> On the heels of a driver-led protest outside Uber's San Francisco headquarters, where drivers showed their support for gig worker protections legislation (via Assembly Bill 5) and demanded a union, Uber  is circulating a petition urging people to "protect ridesharing in California." In the petition, Uber advocates for a policy that would offer drivers a minimum of $21 per hour, paid time off, sick leave and compensation if they are injured while driving, as well as a collective voice and "the ability to influence decisions about their work."
> 
> Uber has also created a new website called "Independent Driver" to showcase stories from drivers who want to remain independent contractors. Lyft, similarly, is circulating a petition urging people to demand legislators "fix AB 5."
> ...


If they can do $21.00 they can do $42.00 an hour.


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## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> yes I brought up the out of pocket expenses because you ignored them


OK, what ever floats your boat.


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## Uberdriver914 (Jun 15, 2019)

jocker12 said:


> https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/28/u...ld-pay-drivers-a-minimum-wage-of-21-per-hour/
> On the heels of a driver-led protest outside Uber's San Francisco headquarters, where drivers showed their support for gig worker protections legislation (via Assembly Bill 5) and demanded a union, Uber  is circulating a petition urging people to "protect ridesharing in California." In the petition, Uber advocates for a policy that would offer drivers a minimum of $21 per hour, paid time off, sick leave and compensation if they are injured while driving, as well as a collective voice and "the ability to influence decisions about their work."
> 
> Uber has also created a new website called "Independent Driver" to showcase stories from drivers who want to remain independent contractors. Lyft, similarly, is circulating a petition urging people to demand legislators "fix AB 5."
> ...


$21 ??? I make that now doing Uber !!!!


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Uberdriver914 said:


> $21 ??? I make that now doing Uber !!!!


no, your doing substantially better,

It's $21 an hour while you have a customer in the car.

A 20 mile 20 minute ride would pay out...

$7.00


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## Uberdriver914 (Jun 15, 2019)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> no, your doing substantially better,
> 
> It's $21 an hour while you have a customer in the car.
> 
> ...


Uber does pay low wages and I get the whole while you have someone in your car deal, but if I work less than 6 hours and make about $150 after gas that's pretty much a little over $20 an hour. It's not the worst like compared to this summer when Uber in my area was giving one ping an hour that was horrible. As an Uber driver you gotta figure out how many miles per gallon your car can get out of it and cross reference that with the calls you gets. I don't accept anything over 5 mins away and 1.5 miles away. You gotta find a way to beat the system at its own game. But anyways Uber should be paying at least $30 an hour at least.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

"While you have someone in your car"

Is the exact verbiage of what UBER is proposing.


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## Ssgcraig (Jul 8, 2015)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> no, your doing substantially better,
> 
> It's $21 an hour while you have a customer in the car.
> 
> ...


Yup, people are drooling over $21.


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