# Goodbye Ants! Seattle proposes Pay Per Mile tax on drivers.



## Lissetti (Dec 20, 2016)

*State Transportation Commission to recommend changing Washington to a 'Pay Per Mile' state*










*OLYMPIA, Wash. - *State transportation leaders voted Tuesday to recommend the state's hotly debated pay-per-mile tax, which could replace the gas tax and charge drivers based on their mileage.

The 16 recommendations approved by the Washington State Transportation Commission will be submitted to the governor, Legislature and Federal Highway Commission in January.

"It really comes down to making sure there's funding for the highways, and the bridges and the ferry system long-term," said Reema Griffith, Washington State Transportation Commission executive director.

Griffith said the commission has been studying the road-usage charge since 2012 and just wrapped up a yearlong pilot program with 2,000 drivers.

*She said more fuel efficient cars on the roads means less fuel is being sold, which is having a direct impact on funding Washington roads.*

Tuesday, commission members recommended the state gradually transition to a pay-per-mile tax, starting with hybrid and electric vehicles, which currently pay a flat rate.
Right now, Washington drivers pay 49.4 cents per gallon of gas. Under the recommendations, they'd pay 2.4 cents per mile.

"They're paying a lot today in gas taxes, they just don't feel it because it's kind of bundled on that receipt and we don't see it when we fill up," said Griffith.
Griffith said drivers would only pay one tax and that the pay-per-mile tax puts everyone on an even playing field.

Surveys the commission used show many people support the idea, but public testimony set a different tone.

"It is disrespectful, disfavored, and just plain wrong," said Tim Eyman.
"This charge is going to add more and more money that I don't have," said a citizen to the commission.

"You want to tax my driving and my family now on a daily basis to and from school, to and from football games, to and from soccer games," voiced another citizen.
According to Griffith, fully transitioning to a pay-per-mile tax could take the state at least 10 years.

https://www.kiro7.com/news/local/st...ay-per-mile-state/BRWLNSORWJC7TFU3LRCFPXEZPM/


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## 1.5xorbust (Nov 22, 2017)

Ouch.


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## Lissetti (Dec 20, 2016)

1.5xorbust said:


> Ouch.


Told you all Seattle hates Ants. One blow after another.:biggrin:


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## GreatWhiteHope (Sep 18, 2018)

Lissetti said:


> *State Transportation Commission to recommend changing Washington to a 'Pay Per Mile' state*
> 
> View attachment 390105
> 
> ...


**** these do good liberals


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## 1.5xorbust (Nov 22, 2017)

Lissetti said:


> Told you all Seattle hates Ants. One blow after another.:biggrin:


Got to keep the air clean there. California can't be far behind.


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## Wolfgang Faust (Aug 2, 2018)

Seattle was Californicated, real good.
The transition is complete.
Just like Portland.


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## Lissetti (Dec 20, 2016)

1.5xorbust said:


> Got to keep the air clean there. California can't be far behind.


Yep usually Seattle is the Guinea Pig. Then after that any state who gets a lot of revenue from fuel tax, and also has a large population of "green people"....or Ants, will be next. Most every Ant and environmentally conscious citizen here drives a hybrid.

Prius is king in Seattle!


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## Wolfgang Faust (Aug 2, 2018)

Next:
Mandatory real time GPS monitors to be installed in all vehicles.

GPS monitoring will enable automated prosecution of moving vehicle violations. Just think of the REVENUE generated for THE STATE there!

Dickie Peep Jayapals' Chinese company, Fuggem has been designated as sole distributor for all GPS tracking devices sold in the state.

Inspections start immediately.

The national language is now Swedish.
(Thunberg spoken here)

Underwear will be changed every 30 minutes. (And worn on the outside to check)


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## Invisible (Jun 15, 2018)

A few years ago, they added a wheel tax here, which is in addition to the yearly vehicle registration fee. They should do something like that.

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news.../county-board-approves-30-wheel-tax/93416022/


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## IthurstwhenIP (Jan 12, 2018)

The real driver is union jobs. 

Gas tax was too easy to collect....just well....add tax.

Per mile means tracking, teams to figure in state miles versus out of state....on and on.

I was living in WA and WAS on of the 2000 pilot cars. It is going to create A lot of jobs... And it will anally penetrate owners of fuel efficient cars.

PS if you own a big truck or SUV you will savea lot


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## Eddie Dingle (Sep 23, 2019)

Who is buying gas and not using it. I would have thought the simple thing to do would be raise the tax. Like others are saying this is a win for those with gas guzzlers.


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## IthurstwhenIP (Jan 12, 2018)

Eddie Dingle said:


> Who is buying gas and not using it. I would have thought the simple thing to do would be raise the tax. Like others are saying this is a win for those with gas guzzlers.


State of WA literally sent us reports on our milage tax and our fuel tax. They tracked everything thru that car port thing. If you had an electric, hybrid or small car the milage tax was higher than the gas. Visa versa for trucks and SUVs and sports cars


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

Lissetti said:


> Yep usually Seattle is the Guinea Pig. Then after that any state who gets a lot of revenue from fuel tax, and also has a large population of "green people"....or Ants, will be next. Most every Ant and environmentally conscious citizen here drives a hybrid.
> 
> Prius is king in Seattle!


But doesn't this hurt Prius owners?


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## Lissetti (Dec 20, 2016)

goneubering said:


> But doesn't this hurt Prius owners?


Exactly. It targets them too. Seattle wants to go back in time before tech was king here, where there was little to no traffic. Before 80K people a year moved here to work in tech. Before Ants clogged the streets daily. See...Seattle doesn't care if you drive a hybrid or a Hummer. They don't want cars clogging their streets. They only want transit and bicycles. As I've posted in another thread, Seattle has removed large sections of roads and turned them into bike lanes.










They tried giving us one of the highest fuel taxes in the nation once. Well that doesn't work too well in a city that is full of green people who buy electric cars and hybrids. Then they changed our registration to reflect the cost of the vehicle, except they didn't go by Kelly Blue Book. They went by the factory new value on cars. They valued my 2006 VW GTI at $10K, when Kelly Blue Book lists the exact same car at around 6K to 7K.

https://www.kbb.com/cars-for-sale/5...0&listingid=538555292&totalresults=10&index=3
As a result people's car tabs went from $80. to $300. and $1500. to renew.

https://patch.com/washington/seattle/1-500-car-tab-renewal-puget-sound-residents-shocked-fees
As a result, some Seattle rideshare drivers I know have to use their Ant car as their family car, even though they have a second car, just because they can't afford the registration on two cars. Perfectly good cars sit untouched in driveways just because the owners cant afford the registration.

Now....this Pay Per Mile tax is the latest on the Seattle War on Cars.


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## Wolfgang Faust (Aug 2, 2018)

Lissetti said:


> Exactly. It targets them too. Seattle wants to go back in time before tech was king here, where there was little to no traffic. Before 80K people a year moved here to work in tech. Before Ants clogged the streets daily. See...Seattle doesn't care if you drive a hybrid or a Hummer. They don't want cars clogging their streets. They only want transit and bicycles. As I've posted in another thread, Seattle has removed large sections of roads and turned them into bike lanes.
> 
> View attachment 390282
> 
> ...


Mark my words...if per mile passes, they will demand real time GPS monitoring.


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## Lissetti (Dec 20, 2016)

Wolfgang Faust said:


> Mark my words...if per mile passes, they will demand real time GPS monitoring.


Do you know its already being done?

State Farm, my insurance company has it and keeps trying to get me to opt in to save money.

My thoughts..."Hell No! Both my cars have a kick ass turbo. Especially the GTI."

https://www.statefarm.com/customer-care/download-mobile-apps/drive-safe-and-save-mobile
Also all of Uber (Fair) Xchange Lease cars are equipped with that device. I had an Uber Xchange Lease car for the first year I drove.


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## Wolfgang Faust (Aug 2, 2018)

Lissetti said:


> Do you know its already being done?
> 
> State Farm, my insurance company has it and keeps trying to get me to opt in to save money.
> 
> ...


I understand gps on rental vehicles, but anyone opting to voluntarily have one is a moron.

No reason to clip your GTIs wings!


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Lissetti said:


> *State Transportation Commission to recommend changing Washington to a 'Pay Per Mile' state*
> 
> View attachment 390105
> 
> ...


Coming soon : HOW TO CHANGE YOUR ODOMETER !


Lissetti said:


> Yep usually Seattle is the Guinea Pig. Then after that any state who gets a lot of revenue from fuel tax, and also has a large population of "green people"....or Ants, will be next. Most every Ant and environmentally conscious citizen here drives a hybrid.
> 
> Prius is king in Seattle!


They are preparing for Electric Cars.

Prepare for your home energy bills to skyrocket !


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## Cdub2k (Nov 22, 2017)

1.5xorbust said:


> Got to keep the air clean there. California can't be far behind.


I think you misunderstood the article

*"It really comes down to making sure there's funding for the highways, and the bridges and the ferry system long-term," said Reema Griffith, Washington State Transportation Commission executive director.

"She said more fuel efficient cars on the roads means less fuel is being sold, which is having a direct impact on funding Washington roads".*
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Air quality isn't the issue. It's actually a good thing for the environment that not enough fuel is being sold and that there are more fuel efficient vehicles on the road. The downside of being more efficient is that not enough money is being generated because of being more environmentally conscience. This is their way to generate more money from those of us with fuel efficient vehicles. If you play with the numbers you'd clearly see that it is strictly about the money.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

and how much will per gallon prices go down if they nix the gas tax?


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

SHalester said:


> and how much will per gallon prices go down if they nix the gas tax?


They won't nix the gas tax. Taxes go up, not down. That's basic political physics.


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## VanGuy (Feb 15, 2019)

You'd think in an environmentally conscious area they'd reward the fuel efficient drivers and not the SUVs though. Sure, they need to make up for the difference, but I'd leave the gas taxes alone and maybe add a tire tax or something to put a little incentive on the fuel efficient drivers to drive less if possible too.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Time to TAX BICYCLES !


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

ah, doesn't the article say 'replace'? That is different from tax hikes that sunset and suddely they decide to remove the sunset......


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

VanGuy said:


> You'd think in an environmentally conscious area they'd reward the fuel efficient drivers and not the SUVs though. Sure, they need to make up for the difference, but I'd leave the gas taxes alone and maybe add a tire tax or something to put a little incentive on the fuel efficient drivers to drive less if possible too.


AGNDA 21

CANADA HAS " CARBON TAX".


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## VanGuy (Feb 15, 2019)

tohunt4me said:


> AGNDA 21
> 
> CANADA HAS " CARBON TAX".


That too.


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## mch (Nov 22, 2018)

Hopefully it doesn't hit drivers out there too hard. That would suck:frowner:


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

SHalester said:


> and how much will per gallon prices go down if they nix the gas tax?


Probably $1.20 in California !


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## VanGuy (Feb 15, 2019)

SHalester said:


> and how much will per gallon prices go down if they nix the gas tax?


According to the article:



> Right now, Washington drivers pay 49.4 cents per gallon of gas. Under the recommendations, they'd pay 2.4 cents per mile.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

VanGuy said:


> According to the article:


Thats equivalent to 48 cents a gallon if you get 20 M.P.G . !!!

96 CENTS A GALLON IF YOU GET 40 M.P.G. !!!

EFFECTIVELY DOUBLING THE GASOLINE TAX !

ABSOLUTE ROBBERY !


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## ANT 7 (Oct 14, 2018)

Well, if this passes, deadheading will become a thing of the past, unless absolutely required.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

tohunt4me said:


> Probably $1.20 in California


gas in calif has other things going on. Like 'calif' only blend that is only made at a few refineries.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

SHalester said:


> gas in calif has other things going on. Like 'calif' only blend that is only made at a few refineries.


CALIFORNIA BLEND ????


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## Uberdriver2710 (Jul 15, 2015)

TAXATION IS THEFT


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

tohunt4me said:


> CALIFORNIA BLEND


http://www.fuelingcalifornia.org/resources/quick-facts/
Summer blend. winter blend. and on and on


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## Cdub2k (Nov 22, 2017)

SHalester said:


> and how much will per gallon prices go down if they nix the gas tax?


49.4 cents per gallon as per that article.
It sounds great but the tax is aimed at fuel efficient vehicles. Let me use this as an example

Larry drives 50,000 miles
The article says we'll have to pay 2.4 cents per mile
50,000 miles x 0.024 (2.4 cents) = $1200
Larry pays the State $1200 comes tax time

Larry saves 49.4 cents per gallon thanks to the cut in gas prices as per that article
Larry drove 50,000 miles
Larry drives a Hybrid and gets 50 mpg
50,000 / 50 mpg = 1,000 gallons purchased
1000 gallons purchased x 0.494 (49.4 cent per gallon savings) = *$494 saved but he pays $1200 flat cost come tax time. The State made $700 off of Larry*

The more miles to the gallon you get the harder you'll feel this new tax in Washington state and I'm sure it'll spread across the country eventually. You can play with the numbers. If Larry could only get 20 mpg he'd save a little over $1200 thanks to the 49.4 cents per gallon price. However, he'd be purchasing 1500 more gallons of gas at $3 a gallon to do it. In other words it's a win/win situation. That state is already making money on gas guzzlers. This tax is directly aimed at Hybrid owners. And 2.4 cents per mile is only the beginning. It'll probably go up in 10 years time.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Cdub2k said:


> 49.4 cents per gallon as per that article.
> It sounds great but the tax is aimed at fuel efficient vehicles. Let me use this as an example
> 
> Larry drives 50,000 miles
> ...


PROVING
GOVERNMENT IS FULL OF CRAP !


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## jlong105 (Sep 15, 2017)

SHalester said:


> and how much will per gallon prices go down if they nix the gas tax?


hahahahaha take away taxes!! that is funny


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

jlong105 said:


> hahahahaha take away taxes!! that is funny


To substitute with " PER MILE TAX" !

I GARUNTEE I WILL HAVE BACKUP ODOMETER FOR EACH OF MY VEHICLES !


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## BogusServiceAnimal (Oct 28, 2019)

Lissetti said:


> *State Transportation Commission to recommend changing Washington to a 'Pay Per Mile' state*
> 
> View attachment 390105
> 
> ...


Haha. They want fuel efficient cars and then get mad that it decreases their revenue. What a croc. The West Coast is slowly starting to become a communist state.



SHalester said:


> and how much will per gallon prices go down if they nix the gas tax?


They won't nix the gas tax. They want to have their cake and eat it too.

Run for the ****ing hills.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

stupidest thing I've ever heard

what kind of idiot would have to live in WA at ths point


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## BogusServiceAnimal (Oct 28, 2019)

Do you know how much you get taxed to drive through the area and live in another state?

Notta. The whole West Coast is a vacation place now. Two weeks. In and out.


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## Wolfgang Faust (Aug 2, 2018)

uberdriverfornow said:


> stupidest thing I've ever heard
> 
> what kind of idiot would have to live in WA at ths point


There are many good people there.
Unfortunately, inmates run the asylum, same as CA, MASS, OR and NY.


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## troothequalstroll (Oct 12, 2019)

Isn't that the same as a gas tax lol? Just raise that without having to track everyone's miles? How stupid & who's embezzling the gas tax they get .10-20 every gallon that's billions of profits every quarter the oil companies only make that much profit since the have r&d, exploration, land, drilling, refining, pipeline, transportation, storing, etc etc etc costs, the gubmint has none of these costs and make the same profit but have no money for roads? Need tolls? Someone stealing the ef out of the gas tax that's for sure


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## IGotDrive (Oct 8, 2018)

All I read was "State Transportation Commission joins rideshare companies to F drivers over some more."


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## REX HAVOC (Jul 4, 2016)

The tax will just be passed down to the riders. The drivers won't pay it out of their pockets.


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## nonononodrivethru (Mar 25, 2019)

REX HAVOC said:


> The tax will just be passed down to the riders. The drivers won't pay it out of their pockets.


I don't think you understand how drivers file their taxes.


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## Cdub2k (Nov 22, 2017)

REX HAVOC said:


> The tax will just be passed down to the riders. The drivers won't pay it out of their pockets.


Uber will probably increase their per mile rates by 2.4 cents in the state of Washington but everybody will still have to pony up the cash when you file your taxes.


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## MyJessicaLS430 (May 29, 2018)

Probably one of the most ridiculous policies in the history of mankind.... Drivers of fuel-efficient cars are punished??

This may sound like a conspiracy theory but it could be a possibility - As more people own fuel-efficient vehicles, the amount of gasoline sold per vehicle in a regular time interval decreases. This brings reduced revenue to the oil companies and certainly they are not happy with that! Then they may reach out to their "friends" in the government to ensure something has to be done....

Time for the government to reconsider whether it is worthwhile to invest in kids. Look at what kind of kids we are having these days? I am not saying all of them, but most of them do not show any respect at all. In Houston, if you own a home that worth > 500K (which is considered as $$$; since the average homes are about 300K), this translates to $10k+ school tax each year. Of course, the higher the value of your home, the more school tax you need to pay. In my opinion, the school tax could have better used in filling the potholes and improving the existing highway systems.... Think about the traffic load on 69 and 45 and the uncountable amount of potholes / uneven road surfaces in the city... Everybody is going to be happy without stop-and-go traffic and less bumps on their neighbourhoods which can extend the life of the suspension! 

Apologize if anyone finds my message off-track.


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## njn (Jan 23, 2016)

83% of the gas tax in nj goes towards public transport, trains and busses. the remaining 17% goes to road maintenance.


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## peteyvavs (Nov 18, 2015)

Lissetti said:


> *State Transportation Commission to recommend changing Washington to a 'Pay Per Mile' state*
> 
> View attachment 390105
> 
> ...


The State of Washington would be flush with revenue if it didn't hire so many useless administrators. Look at the payroll that fuel taxes pay for, their are at least 15k people earning 80k plus each doing do nothing jobs.


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## Lissetti (Dec 20, 2016)

peteyvavs said:


> The State of Washington would be flush with revenue if it didn't hire so many useless administrators. Look at the payroll that fuel taxes pay for, their are at least 15k people earning 80k plus each doing do nothing jobs.


No 80K is poverty here. Houses start at half a million. 120k and up is a standard livable wage.


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## OldBay (Apr 1, 2019)

BogusServiceAnimal said:


> Do you know how much you get taxed to drive through the area and live in another state?
> 
> *Notta.* The whole West Coast is a vacation place now. Two weeks. In and out.


Nada.


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## seymour (Apr 20, 2018)

Lissetti said:


> No 80K is poverty here. Houses start at half a million. 120k and up is a standard livable wage.


no it's not LOL

I have a friend making $45k a year and she's doing just fine. She owns her condo too - bought it in Ballard in 2009 for a measly $175k and now it's worth double. She still has a mortgage but she's able to make her payments with 8 weeks of paid vacation each year.


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## Lissetti (Dec 20, 2016)

seymour said:


> no it's not LOL
> 
> I have a friend making $45k a year and she's doing just fine. She owns her condo too - bought it in Ballard in 2009 for a measly $175k and now it's worth double. She still has a mortgage but she's able to make her payments with 8 weeks of paid vacation each year.


Again I live here. $45K is fine for Auburn, Burien and White Center, but any place close to Amazon HQ, which Ballard is, needs upwards of 90K. Having to walk to work, use public transit, and eating Top Ramen is not considered living comfortably to me.

I live 25 miles outside Seattle and 3 houses on my block just sold for half a mil each. Three 50 to 70 year old houses and one, with joist rot because it belonged to my hoarder neighbor who fell in the house, and the rats ate him before they found his body.....that house also sold for half a mil.....

Remember you also stated there are zero homeless in Seattle.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

When buying a house is not all about how much you make. It's more about how much savings you have......


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## seymour (Apr 20, 2018)

Lissetti said:


> Again I live here. $45K is fine for Auburn, Burien and White Center, but any place close to Amazon HQ, which Ballard is, needs upwards of 90K. Having to walk to work, use public transit, and eating Top Ramen is not considered living comfortably to me.
> 
> I live 25 miles outside Seattle and 3 houses on my block just sold for half a mil each. Three 50 to 70 year old houses and one, with joist rot because it belonged to my hoarder neighbor who fell in the house, and the rats ate him before they found his body.....that house also sold for half a mil.....
> 
> Remember you also stated there are zero homeless in Seattle.


c'mon girl, I said I saw no homeless 'camps' - lol..... and all my trucker buddies making $50-70k/year are doing just fine too. Your figures are off.
People are making $60k year here in the Bay(driving for Uber) and they too are doing just fine....


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

seymour said:


> People are making $60k year here in the Bay(driving for Uber) and they too are doing just fine


renters? If owners, somebody is making the bucks.


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## peteyvavs (Nov 18, 2015)

Lissetti said:


> No 80K is poverty here. Houses start at half a million. 120k and up is a standard livable wage.


Most people live for a salary, they'll always be middle class at best. I work for myself and invest what I earned. I can afford to live very comfortably in Seattle, but why would I when all I'll be doing is supporting some useless government employees with ever increasing taxes that never goes where it was intended.


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## gooddolphins (Apr 5, 2018)

Just tell grandma you need to borrow her car for a few months. Just post the pic of her face when she gets that 50000 dollar bill on up.net.


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## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Lissetti said:


> *State Transportation Commission to recommend changing Washington to a 'Pay Per Mile' state*
> 
> View attachment 390105
> 
> ...


The price of gas will stay the same or go up and the citizens will get this new per mile tax *guaranteed* if they let this proposal into law.



Invisible said:


> A few years ago, they added a wheel tax here, which is in addition to the yearly vehicle registration fee. They should do something like that.
> 
> https://www.jsonline.com/story/news.../county-board-approves-30-wheel-tax/93416022/


Cap elected officials salaries and benefits to the national average. Wow now we got enough money for roads, schools, pay off national debt, hell we might not run out of social security money &#128580;.


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## Lissetti (Dec 20, 2016)

I'm feeling like I'm ready to cuss out Seattle today after opening my mail.

To drive for rideshare in the King County area, of which Seattle is in, we are required to get a business license.

Then I read a letter today saying Seattle wants me to pay a tax on my business licence.

Apparently I don't own any tax if I don't make over 100K from my "business" it's just annoying to have to bother with that mess.

It just seems I'm always having to deal with the city of Seattle harassing me over my Ant status. Like my HOV lane "violations " with pax in my car.

I have tinted windows and large bucket seats in my car. If a small, female pax is in the back and she is bent over looking at her phone, other people can't see her and report me to the HOV violation hotline. Then I'm left pulling up my way bills and submitting them to DOT to prove I had a passenger in my car at the time of the "violation."



















Even though I don't get these emails anymore, I get messages left on my voicemail from Olympia or letters in the mail.

I need to move...:shifty:


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