# New Drivers Get More Pings?



## Maven (Feb 9, 2017)

I've seen this idea expressed several times on this forum, but does anybody have any real evidence that it's more than an "Urban Legend"? There are many theories why Uber does this. One variation goes 


Jagent said:


> ... For every new driver that logs in, Uber has invested money in a background check, plus several hundred in bonus and referral fees (if the new driver completes 20 rides). They're going to make that money back and it comes right out the pockets of established drivers.


I do believe that new drivers get more bonus/guarantees, but I'm more skeptical about more pings. What do you think?


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## Lyfty (Jul 26, 2014)

Yes, I can tell you from personal experience, once I signed up I was getting so many pings and I was making a lot of money without any effort or strategy, I was even getting pings from my home once I turn on the app. Few days later, all that sharply decreased. Same thing happened with my brother. And same thing happened with Lyft as well. I think they want to lure new drivers in so that they don't stop driving


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## touberornottouber (Aug 12, 2016)

To be honest I've seen no evidence of it. What I am more suspicious of is income leveling where you have a certain average and if you go over it they tend to give you less pings or less lucrative fares.


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## kc ub'ing! (May 27, 2016)

It sucks. It's unfair. It's fact. New drivers definitely get ping preference. I've witnessed it several times. I do mostly airport business. There is a "FIFO" staging area to await arrivals. I'll be number 1 in the queue and boom a car I've never seen and driver I don't recognize will leave for an airport pick up before me.

This is a fact and it makes perfect sense for Uber to do this. It's how they hook new drivers. I've been driving for 6 months, they know they have me. I've also been around to hear complaints from noobs, "ah gee I made so much my first month now I make less!" Welcome to veteran status noobie!


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## Lyfty (Jul 26, 2014)

kc ub'ing! said:


> It sucks. It's unfair. It's fact. New drivers definitely get ping preference. I've witnessed it several times. I do mostly airport business. There is a "FIFO" staging area to await arrivals. I'll be number 1 in the queue and boom a car I've never seen and driver I don't recognize will leave for an airport pick up before me.
> 
> This is a fact and it makes perfect sense for Uber to do this. It's how they hook new drivers. I've been driving for 6 months, they know they have me. I've also been around to hear complaints from noobs, "ah gee I made so much my first month now I make less!" Welcome to veteran status noobie!


My brother had the exact thing happen to him, he told me he was parking in the airport queue and had 10 cars in front of him, he got the ping as he was entering the parking lot! At first he thought there was so much demand and was excited about it, then he realized it was just a trick for new drivers


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## GrinsNgiggles (Oct 11, 2016)

Not sure about more pings but clearly new drivers create more forum threads


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## freddieman (Oct 24, 2016)

touberornottouber said:


> To be honest I've seen no evidence of it. What I am more suspicious of is income leveling where you have a certain average and if you go over it they tend to give you less pings or less lucrative fares.


i was thinking the same. there was this one week where i started off the bang. with the weekend still ahead i thought it was going to be my best week. the weekend came and it was a bust! ended the week right around my weekly avg.


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## Seahawk3 (Oct 5, 2016)

freddieman said:


> i was thinking the same. there was this one week where i started off the bang. with the weekend still ahead i thought it was going to be my best week. the weekend came and it was a bust! ended the week right around my weekly avg.


 I also notice this occasionally but i think it is more likely that uber tries to spread the fares around equally. In my area all drivers I know which is 15 avg 10hr. I have had weeks where I made 200 in 10 hrs then by end of week it's around 400 in 40 lmao. Happens to others in the area as well and has happened to me many of times


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## Fishchris (Aug 31, 2016)

I wouldn't say more pings as I can still go to the right time and place and get one ping after another.

But as far as longer distance rides during higher surge periods, it seems that those kind of rides have really fallen off for me in the last few months.

I used to be able to get two or three 15 to 25 mile rides on any busy Friday or Saturday night from downtown Sacramento. Now I don't even know how many weeks it's been since I even had one ride like that ?
Again though on a busy Friday or Saturday night I can get 12 or 15 pings without ever waiting longer than 30 seconds, it's just that they average about two miles each


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## SuzeCB (Oct 30, 2016)

kc ub'ing! said:


> It sucks. It's unfair. It's fact. New drivers definitely get ping preference. I've witnessed it several times. I do mostly airport business. There is a "FIFO" staging area to await arrivals. I'll be number 1 in the queue and boom a car I've never seen and driver I don't recognize will leave for an airport pick up before me.
> 
> This is a fact and it makes perfect sense for Uber to do this. It's how they hook new drivers. I've been driving for 6 months, they know they have me. I've also been around to hear complaints from noobs, "ah gee I made so much my first month now I make less!" Welcome to veteran status noobie!


It also saves them money. Uber has a promotion for new drivers where they guarantee that if they do x amount of rides in a week they will guarantee that they will make y amount of money. If they are not money, through the rides that they get it, then Uber doesn't have to pay them so much out of its pocket. If they let the older drivers, who are no longer eligible for that promotion, get the rides then they will have to pay us are going rates and pay out the promotion guarantee to the new drivers that didn't get the rides.


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## Lyfty (Jul 26, 2014)

Fishchris said:


> I wouldn't say more pings as I can still go to the right time and place and get one ping after another.
> 
> But as far as longer distance rides during higher surge periods, it seems that those kind of rides have really fallen off for me in the last few months.
> 
> ...


I SECOND this, when i first signed up most of my pings were moderately long, it was worth it. after my first week i started getting all min fare trips, it is crazy. about %85 of my rides are min fare. regardless of where i drive. i only drive on weekends but it has been really bad for me lately


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## DollarStoreChauffeur (Sep 12, 2016)

On my first or second day driving I pulled into the airport lot with at least 12 cars already waiting in the FIFO system. Within a minute or two of parking, I got a ping and went on my way. There's no way those others all had their apps off. There's no incentive to do so because our airport can't surge.


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## Tripwire (Oct 28, 2015)

kc ub'ing! said:


> It sucks. It's unfair. It's fact. New drivers definitely get ping preference. I've witnessed it several times. I do mostly airport business. There is a "FIFO" staging area to await arrivals. I'll be number 1 in the queue and boom a car I've never seen and driver I don't recognize will leave for an airport pick up before me.


Lots of reasons for that: different platform (Lyft), different service XL or Select etc...

Or depending on your city queue jumpers.

Just because another driver leaves the queue before you doesn't mean anything.

It's simple, really, request a ride.

If you don't get the ping, queue jumpers are around. (Most common on Select and Black)

On Lyft I have received a ping while on number 20+ several times due to my rating and the PAX being a new rider.


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## DRider85 (Nov 19, 2016)

No not for me but for some reason when I'm 1-2 rides away from a bonus it always gets slow. It's as if they know I'm gonna stay out and so they help out others.


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## kc ub'ing! (May 27, 2016)

Tripwire said:


> Lots of reasons for that: different platform (Lyft), different service XL or Select etc...
> 
> Or depending on your city queue jumpers.
> 
> ...


Wrong my friend. My market has just 2 services, X or XL. It's very easy to discern between the 2. New drivers do get preference. Just another means Uber uses to shaft existing drivers.


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## Maven (Feb 9, 2017)

Let's assume, based on this thread, that "New drivers" do in fact get more pings. What do you think is Uber's definition of "New"? Hours online, days, weeks, more? It appears to be_ just enough_ to get a new PAX "hooked" on the idea of all the easy money coming their way. Thereafter, they become "old" drivers and treated like the rest of us.


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## SuzeCB (Oct 30, 2016)

Maven said:


> Let's assume, based on this thread, that "New drivers" do in fact get more pings. What do you think is Uber's definition of "New"? Hours online, days, weeks, more? It appears to be_ just enough_ to get a new PAX "hooked" on the idea of all the easy money coming their way. Thereafter, they become "old" drivers and treated like the rest of us.


I think it's as long as the new driver incentive lasts.

It guarantees the driver will make a certain amount if they drive a certain number of hours. The more that the driver is able to earn in actual rides during those hours, the less that Uber has to shell out of their own pockets.

It's a business issue, not anything personal.


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## Jagent (Jan 29, 2017)

Maven said:


> Let's assume, based on this thread, that "New drivers" do in fact get more pings. What do you think is Uber's definition of "New"? Hours online, days, weeks, more? It appears to be_ just enough_ to get a new PAX "hooked" on the idea of all the easy money coming their way. Thereafter, they become "old" drivers and treated like the rest of us.


I don't think Uber cares about the psychological aspect of it all. All they care about is getting their money back. They've spent a certain number of dollars on a background check and promotion, once they recoup that the new driver is thrown to the wolves.


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## kc ub'ing! (May 27, 2016)

SuzeCB said:


> It's a business issue, not anything personal.


An unethical practice that takes money out of my pocket is deeply personal.


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## BiggestScamInHistory (Jan 19, 2016)

The new driver incentives & bonuses theory makes the most sense. Different class queue jumpers not so much. 

It's also the most innovative way any company has had to induce employee turnover & keep control over their business than any other has come up with. 

Usually companies would just decrease hours until the employee quits on their own therefore not having to pay out anything in higher employment tax premiums in the future. 

Uber & Lyft have 2 financial incentives in not having to subsidize new drivers bonuses for nothing, and giving out more rides where their take is 25-30% than only 20%. New drivers are also much, much more likely to take Pool & Line requests & accept any kind of request they get whether they be near or far, from low-rated riders, or anything else veterans would turn away from.

They gain nothing from keeping it an exclusive club for veteran drivers who make the most money from the platform.


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## Shakur (Jan 8, 2017)

They definitely have an average hourly you WILL not go over for duration of shift. Youll have a couple spikes but trust it will even out unless running both apps simultaneously.


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## Maven (Feb 9, 2017)

Jagent said:


> I don't think Uber cares about the psychological aspect of it all. All they care about is getting their money back. They've spent a certain number of dollars on a background check and promotion, once they recoup that the new driver is thrown to the wolves.


Still not sure that new drivers get more pings, although there is a lot of anecdotal evidence. However, I'm reasonably sure that Uber cares *a lot* about the psychological aspect.

Uber has collected reams of data, via the Apps, for years on both driver and passenger habits under various stimuli (surge, boosts, and promotions). This data is extremely valuable, but drivers receive nothing for their individual or collective contributions.  It is used to create new stimuli (surge, boosts, and promotions) that maximize Uber profits.

Passengers are not treated better, just differently. Will they accept paying more for Up-Front Pricing? If so, how much more?

Drivers are rats in a maze, rewarded by bits of cheese (money) to perform as needed.


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## ShinyAndChrome (Aug 18, 2017)

Maven said:


> Still not sure that new drivers get more pings, although there is a lot of anecdotal evidence. However, I'm reasonably sure that Uber cares *a lot* about the psychological aspect.
> 
> Uber has collected reams of data, via the Apps, for years on both driver and passenger habits under various stimuli (surge, boosts, and promotions). This data is extremely valuable, but drivers receive nothing for their individual or collective contributions.  It is used to create new stimuli (surge, boosts, and promotions) that maximize Uber profits.
> 
> ...


Rats in a maze for sure. it wouldn't surprise me at all if the system automatically pegs the spineless drivers, too; the kind who will happily do a 15-20 minute ping. So if I am 14 minutes away but the system knows I never accept those and then another driver is 18 minutes away but he's happy to drive across the country for a pickup, I wonder if it pings him first. I know I have gotten pings when the rider app shows other drivers closer. it's possible they all ignored the request, too, but sometimes it seems very hard to believe on account of density of other cars.

On the other hand, sometimes uber acts so stupidly I wonder if they are as smart as we think after all. Their rating system is a mess, they give us something with 180 days then retract it, etc. They don't seem nearly as competent as we suspect they may be.


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## Maven (Feb 9, 2017)

ShinyAndChrome said:


> ... they give us something with 180 days then retract it, etc. They don't seem nearly as competent as we suspect they may be.


That's because the smart guys doing the analysis and making the recommendations are not the money guys making the decisions, who were promised a 0.2% (made up number) increase in profits. Two weeks later, when the status report revealed a 0.3% loss, they panicked, going from 6 DFs, not to 4 or 3, but back to the original 2 DFs.


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## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

I've been driving for two years. I drove for an hour and a half this afternoon. I turned on the app and got a ping within 10 seconds. A trip to the airport, dropped off, and got another ping within 10 seconds. A trip back to my town in the 'burbs, dropped off, and got another ping within one minute. I dropped off within a mile of home, so I figured I'd stop for a while.


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## Tnasty (Mar 23, 2016)

After doing close to 17k rides and seeing my income decline year after year, I believe it! 

Uber is technology company when it comes to stacking the deck.Imagine if fuber made slot machines or delt cards.


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## hulksmash (Apr 26, 2016)

I was getting better rides when I got reactivated from Lyft when my overall acceptance was still high. I believe the algorithm treated me like a new driver. Even though my past ride history was still there, I didn't get the messsage that my acceptance is low like I get now on every ping. Now at surge events it takes longer to get a ping and they're not as long as before.


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## I_Like_Spam (May 10, 2015)

I don't think it would be that technically challenging for Uber to give preference to rookie drivers- and they have a lot of motivation to do so.

Uber gets a bigger taste, new drivers are more likely to get frustrated and quit if they aren't make money, they'd be crazy not to, especially in large markets with hundreds of drivers out there, no way to really get "caught" on it.


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## Grahamcracker (Nov 2, 2016)

Maven said:


> I've seen this idea expressed several times on this forum, but does anybody have any real evidence that it's more than an "Urban Legend"? There are many theories why Uber does this. One variation goes
> 
> I do believe that new drivers get more bonus/guarantees, but I'm more skeptical about more pings. What do you think?


I was told new driver's get more pings/better rides by the district manager from our green light location at a driver's meeting about 180 days of change back in May. He said and I quote " new driver's do get more and better pings to get them hooked".

Now, why would he say this to a room of 60+ driver's if it wasn't true?


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## Maven (Feb 9, 2017)

Grahamcracker said:


> I was told new driver's get more pings/better rides by the district manager from our green light location at a driver's meeting about 180 days of change back in May. He said and I quote " new driver's do get more and better pings to get them hooked". Now, why would he say this to a room of 60+ driver's if it wasn't true?


I think that it's irrelevant if new drivers get more pings or not. The obvious goal is for them to get "hooked". Very soon they become old drivers like the rest of us. When, not if, 95% of them stop driving for Uber in 6 months or less then Uber still wins.

In my experience, most salesmen lie, either by omission, misleading, exaggeration, or complete falsehoods. Uber does all of these, systematically and consistently, staying just barely legal. Uber omits the insurance gap information, danger of being dropped by your current insurer, and health risks. Uber inflates the income numbers that may have been partially true years ago, painting a rosy, unrealistic fantasy.

The district manager might have even believed part what he was saying. That does not necessarily make it true. All done to get new drivers "hooked". That's part of his job. It worked in the past, is working today, and will probably continue to work in the future.


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## Zhenbuxianghua (Feb 17, 2017)

I would say definitely true. I remember when I started driving I thought it's a good business. Brought in $200+ a day in my first week. Then it has gone downhill straight. Now I work longer hours but never was able to bring more than $150 a day home(after expenses). Uber sucks, and so does lyft.



Zhenbuxianghua said:


> I would say definitely true. I remember when I started driving I thought it's a good business. Brought in $200+ a day in my first week. Then it has gone downhill straight. Now I work longer hours but never was able to bring more than $150 a day home(after expenses). Uber sucks, and so does lyft.


The problem is, not only are you given fewer pings, but also fewer money making pings too. They know you can't quit uber so they don't care about you anymore.


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## Grahamcracker (Nov 2, 2016)

Zhenbuxianghua said:


> They know you can't quit uber


Why?


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## hulksmash (Apr 26, 2016)

I think it's a function of an increase in the driver pool within the timewhen you first started until X amount of time in the future. It seems that every year there are way more drivers than the year before, so from your own point of view your earnings will always decrease 

I also do think it is Uber's way of forcing attrition of veteran drivers who don't accept everything thrown their way. The ones who can't adapt fall to the wayside, and the ones who can and the ones who have the luxury of only driving surge survive.


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## Zhenbuxianghua (Feb 17, 2017)

Grahamcracker said:


> Why?


because I need money.


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## Grahamcracker (Nov 2, 2016)

Zhenbuxianghua said:


> because I need money.


Money can be made many other ways. Uber isn't the only option anyone has.


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## Zhenbuxianghua (Feb 17, 2017)

Grahamcracker said:


> Money can be made many other ways. Uber isn't the only option anyone has.


If someone can make an app that calls all nearby bank robbers to rob a particular bank at the same time to overwhelm the police. LOL


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## Zhenbuxianghua (Feb 17, 2017)

Zhenbuxianghua said:


> If someone can make an app that calls all nearby bank robbers to rob a particular bank at the same time to overwhelm the police. LOL


I even came up with a name for this app. It's called Ubanker


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## PrestonT (Feb 15, 2017)

Tnasty said:


> After doing close to 17k rides and seeing my income decline year after year, I believe it!
> 
> Uber is technology company when it comes to stacking the deck.Imagine if fuber made slot machines or delt cards.


Your income has declined year after year, but has your ride count per hour declined year after year? Whether it's via rate change or surge suppression, they've been dropping pay regularly.


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## Zhenbuxianghua (Feb 17, 2017)

PrestonT said:


> Your income has declined year after year, but has your ride count per hour declined year after year? Whether it's via rate change or surge suppression, they've been dropping pay regularly.


The majority of earning decline is due to rate cuts. Uber said when they cut the rates that you would get more pings. But then the market was flooded by new drivers so any ping increase has been diluted out. In fact, there's less pings now than ever.


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## IMMA DRIVER (Jul 6, 2017)

Why is anyone surprised? Casino's do this all the time. Let you win early then take it away once you begin to get comfy.


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## PrestonT (Feb 15, 2017)

IMMA DRIVER said:


> Why is anyone surprised? Casino's do this all the time. Let you win early then take it away once you begin to get comfy.


Hahaha. Casinos don't "let" you win, or "take" your money away from you. It's built into the mathematics of the games. In the case of Uber, this is a strategy they outlined. Lure em in, drop the rates as supply increases.


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## andrew1982 (Oct 19, 2017)

Ye it would make sense as most drivers that download uber don't stay around for too long but who knows?


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## santhony109 (Jun 16, 2017)

Has anyone thought about the size of our data samples? None of us are capable of generating large enough data samples to be statisticly relevant. Theres no way you can develop a trend based on 8,10 or 12 rides per night.


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## sbstar07 (Aug 31, 2017)

You get your pings by hustle. If you are close to the rider you will get it. If you and another rider are close to the rider who ever has the better rating will get the ping. Keep it up!


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## dirtylee (Sep 2, 2015)

sbstar07 said:


> You get your pings by hustle. If you are close to the rider you will get it. If you and another rider are close to the rider who ever has the better rating will get the ping. Keep it up!


Straight up bullshit. 
Try have a pax in your car ping you.


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## Bro Olomide (Sep 1, 2017)

dirtylee said:


> Straight up bullshit.
> Try have a pax in your car ping you.


I have a handful of times.... It came right to me. My rating has fluctuated between 4.75 --> 4.78.


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## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

kc ub'ing! said:


> It sucks. It's unfair. It's fact. New drivers definitely get ping preference. I've witnessed it several times. I do mostly airport business. There is a "FIFO" staging area to await arrivals. I'll be number 1 in the queue and boom a car I've never seen and driver I don't recognize will leave for an airport pick up before me.
> 
> This is a fact and it makes perfect sense for Uber to do this. It's how they hook new drivers. I've been driving for 6 months, they know they have me. I've also been around to hear complaints from noobs, "ah gee I made so much my first month now I make less!" Welcome to veteran status noobie!


I've gotten trips when the staging area had a lot of cars in it, and I just entered the zone. Not sure why that happened. 
Also, if there are only a few cars in the queue, ad i see thrice that many in the staging area, that's when drivers start holding out for a surge.

If you are number one in the Queue, and you reject a trip, you'll stay #1 (you're allowed one reject), but it will dispatch several trips behind you (if several were going off pretty much in the same time frame ) before system catches up to itself and make you available as number one. I've seen this happen, but not without my turning down a trip, first. Are you sure this isnt what happened? Also, this won't happen if it's slow, only if a plane lands and a bunch of trips are being dispatched as many on the plane start requesting cars.


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