# #BoycottUber2016 | 87¢/mi = 5.44¢/mi after expenses (MUST READ)



## Texstar12 (Sep 5, 2015)

*EDIT: My initial math was wrong. In this original post, I took taxes out before expenses. See page 2 of this thread for the correct math.*

*Part 1/2»*

Yes, I was one of the idiots that put ALL my eggs in the Uber basket here in Houston, Texas for $1.10/mi. I went out and bought me a 2014 Chevy Impala LTZ with the intent of making this a full-time job. It had 12,202 original miles when I bought it on August, 20, 2015, and as of midnight 2016, had 26,062 miles. That's 13,860 miles in 134 days.

13,860 mi ÷ 134 days = 103.43 miles per day, or 517.15 mi in a 5-day work week.

Now let's analyze the impact of what 87¢/mi will cost me based on my REAL history, and I guarantee, I kept an active detailed mileage log and a very organized financial record.

*GROSS PAY»*
87¢ gross pay per mile minus 20% commission (20% commission for me because I started on 8/28 (*whew!*)) = 69.6¢

Recap:
87¢/mi - 20% = 69.6¢/mi ← This is my _net_ pay.

Minus 30% for taxes (playing it safe):
69.6¢ - 30% = 48.72¢/mi ← This is my _net pay after taxes_. Now, let's do _Operating Costs _(oil changes and fuel).

*OPERATING COSTS»*
_Oil_ | I do my own oil changes because I do not trust lube shops; plus it's easy to do. However, it is NOT cheaper! You'll get a better deal going into a lube shop and having a mechanic do it for you for about $10 less, but after some bum high school teen put washer fluid in the engine of my '90 Cadillac back in 2009, I will NEVER let anyone change my oil ever again.

But I digress, 5qts. of oil from AutoZone plus air filter and oil filter is $32.85 every 3 months when driving 517.15 miles a week. There are 13 weeks in 3 months. 517.15 mi/wk = 6,722.95 mi/3-month period. My impala has one of those oil life meters on there and I go by that. It allows me to put about 6,722.95 miles on one oil change instead of going by the old 3-month/3,000 mile rule; oil lasts longer than that.

Recap:
• 6,722.95 miles in a 3-month period = 517.15 mi/wk x 13 weeks
• 6,722.95 mi. ÷ 3 mo. = 2,240.98 mi./mo.

• So, $32.85 ÷ 3 mo. = $10.95/mo.

What's the cost of this per mile?
[EXPENSE IN CENTS PER MONTH] ÷ [MILES PER MONTH] = [COST PER MILE IN CENTS]
Convert to cents: $10.95/mo → 1,095¢/mo
1,095¢/mo ÷ 2,240.98 mi/mo = 0.48862¢/mi = <0.49¢ = $0.0049/mi = <½¢/mi. (less than a half a cent per mile).

_Fuel_ | Gas for my 2014 Chevy Impala LTZ with a 3.6L V6 engine at 19mpg city/30 mpg hwy (roughly 21mpg combined) is costing me anywhere between 8.9¢ to 12¢/mi depending on how much I drive and where I fill up with gas prices varying from $1.599 to $1.859 per gallon. So let's call it a cost of an even 10¢/mi.

Recap:
• 87¢/mi - 20% = 69.6¢/mi ← This is my _net_ pay.
• 69.6¢ - 30% = 48.72¢/mi ← This is my _net pay after taxes_.

• Oil operating costs per mile = 0.49¢/mi
• Fuel operating costs per mile = 10¢/mi
• TOTAL OPERATING COSTS per mile = 10.49¢/mi

• 48.72¢ - 10.49¢ = 38.23¢/mi after gas expenses.

Now let's do expenses!

*EXPENSES»*
_GEICO Rideshare Insurance_ | To cover my (ass)et, I purchased GEICO Rideshare insurance in full coverage. This protects me in the event I get into an accident that Uber will not cover because their insurance policy is sketchy to say the least. Plus, I don't have to walk on eggshells around my insurance company. It is _geared_ towards Uber drivers. However, it costs a HEFTY $181.28 per month. Let's factor THAT in! Yaaaaay!

[EXPENSE IN CENTS PER MONTH] ÷ [MILES PER MONTH] = [COST PER MILE IN CENTS]
Convert to cents: $181.28/mo → 18,128¢/mo
18,128¢/mo ÷ 2,240.98 mi/mo = 8.0893¢/mi → <8.09¢/mi

Recap:
• 87¢/mi - 20% = 69.6¢/mi ← This is my _net_ pay.
• 69.6¢ - 30% = 48.72¢/mi ← This is my _net pay after taxes_.
• 48.72¢ - 10.49¢ = 38.23¢/mi ← This is what I keep after _operating costs_.

After _Operating Costs_, my profit went down to 38.23¢/mi. Let's take away 8.09¢ from that for insurance costs...

38.23¢/mi - 8.09¢/mi = 30.14¢/mi. ← This is what I keep after _Rideshare Insurance_

...BUT WAIT! THERE'S MORE!

_Car Note |_ The car note is $354.27/mo. Let's factor this in:

RECALL: 
• I drive 103.43 miles per day, or 517.15 mi in a 5-day work week.
• There are a little over 4 weeks in a 3-month period, so to counter for that, you can calculate 13 even weeks in a 3-month period.
• 3 months x 4 months = 12 months → 1 year
• 13 weeks x 4 months = 52 weeks in 1 year.
• So, 517.15 x 13 = 6,722.95 mi/3-mo period.
• 6,722.95 mi/3-mo period ÷ 3 mo = 2,240.98 mi/mo
• 517.15 mi/wk → 2,240.98 mi/mo

[EXPENSE IN CENTS PER MONTH] ÷ [MILES PER MONTH] = [COST PER MILE IN CENTS]
Convert to cents: $354.27/mo → 35,427¢/mo
35,457¢/mo ÷ 2,240.98 mi/mo = 15.8221¢/mi → >15.82¢/mo

Recap:
• 87¢/mi - 20% = 69.6¢/mi ← This is my _net_ pay.
• 69.6¢ - 30% = 48.72¢/mi ← This is my _net pay after taxes_.
• 48.72¢ - 10.49¢ = 38.23¢/mi ← This is what I keep after _operating costs_.
• 38.23¢/mi - 8.09¢/mi = 30.14¢/mi ← This is what I keep after _Rideshare Insurance._
• 30.14¢/mi - 15.82¢/mi = 14.32¢/mi ← This is what I keep after the _Car Note_.

Not done!

_Mobile Phone _| Before Uber, I went 16 months without cell service. I didn't need it. I had a phone, but I used a Google Voice number and connected via Wi-Fi only. However, I had to get service for Uber. This is a business expense, so I count it. I'm on the 6GB monthly plan, and use Wi-Fi most of the time. Uber is the primary use of this phone while off the Wi-Fi, and it always comes close to maxing out my data cap at over 95% each month. In 2015, my monthly bill ranged from $109.58/mo to $114.73/mo, so I'll be generous and call it at $110/mo.

[EXPENSE IN CENTS PER MONTH] ÷ [MILES PER MONTH] = [COST PER MILE IN CENTS]
Convert to cents: $110.00/mo → 11,000¢/mo
11,000¢/mo ÷ 2,240.98 mi/mo = 4.9086¢/mi → <4.91¢/mi

Recap:
• 87¢/mi - 20% = 69.6¢/mi ← This is my _net_ pay.
• 69.6¢ - 30% = 48.72¢/mi ← This is my _net pay after taxes_.
• 48.72¢ - 10.49¢ = 38.23¢/mi ← This is what I keep after _operating costs_.
• 38.23¢/mi - 8.09¢/mi = 30.14¢/mi ← This is what I keep after _Rideshare Insurance._
• 30.14¢/mi - 15.82¢/mi = 14.32¢/mi ← This is what I keep after the _Car Note_.
• 14.32¢/mi - 4.91¢/mi = 9.41¢/mi ← This is what I keep after the _Mobile Phone_ bill.

One last thing...

_Car Washes_ | In order to maintain a good rating on Uber's strict 5-star rating system, you gotta keep your car clean. That is a basic essential business expense critical to keeping an above 4.7 rating. I went for a daily wash and vacuum. I paid $89.00 a month for a special package at Regency Car Wash on Hwy. 6 between I-10 and Memorial Dr. I didn't go every day though. I probably went about 12 times a month. So, $89/mo ÷ 12 visits = <$7.42/day + $2.00 tip for the employees wiping down your car = $9.42/day. As infrequently as we got tipped, ALL my tip money went to these people, so it's like I never got tips at all, so let's call it $7.42/day x 3 visits per week = $22.26/week. Long rain spells made this more expensive as I didn't need washes then, but I'd still go for a vacuum down. It's part of the package.

[EXPENSE IN CENTS PER MONTH] ÷ [MILES PER MONTH] = [COST PER MILE IN CENTS]
Convert to cents: $89.00/mo → 8,900¢/mo
8,900¢/mo ÷ 2,240.98 mi/mo = 3.9715¢/mi → >3.97¢/mi

*FINAL RECAP»*
• 87¢/mi - 20% = 69.6¢/mi ← This is my _net_ pay.
• 69.6¢ - 30% = 48.72¢/mi ← This is my _net pay after taxes_.
• 48.72¢ - 10.49¢ = 38.23¢/mi ← This is what I keep after _operating costs_.
• 38.23¢/mi - 8.09¢/mi = 30.14¢/mi ← This is what I keep after _Rideshare Insurance._
• 30.14¢/mi - 15.82¢/mi = 14.32¢/mi ← This is what I keep after the _Car Note_.
• 14.32¢/mi - 4.91¢/mi = 9.41¢/mi ← This is what I keep after the _Mobile Phone_ bill.
• 9.41¢/mi - 3.97¢/mi = *5.44¢/mi* ← This is what I keep after _Car Washes_ and everything else

*FINAL ANALYSIS»*
♦ Income ← +48.72¢/mi
• 87¢/mi ← Gross Pay
• - 20% ← Commission
• 69.6¢/mi ← Net Pay
• -30% ← Tax Savings from Net Pay
• 48.72¢/mi ← Net After Taxes

♦ -10.49¢/mi ← Operating Costs:
• -0.49¢/mi ← Oil Changes
• -10¢/mi ← Fuel

♦ -32.79¢/mi ← Business Expenses: 
• -8.09¢/mi ← Rideshare Insurance
• -15.82¢/mi ← Car Note
• -4.91¢/mi ← Mobile Phone Bill
• -3.97¢/mi ← Car Washes

*SUMMARY» *
If you're at 20% commission getting paid 87¢/mi, after all basic expenses and setting aside for taxes, you're left with 5.44¢/mi profit. I'D BE DRIVING FOR 5.44¢ PER MILE. A 28-mile airport run from outside the loop at 5.44¢/mi is worth $1.52 in profit. Let that sink in. Also, I haven't even bothered to factor in imminent repairs and long-term maintenance costs on the car such as new tires, which may cost upwards of $500+, alignments, brakes, tune-ups, etc. All those would push it into the red. And if that doesn't, your personal living expenses will such as groceries, rent, utilities, pets, etc. _*87¢/mi IS NOT A LIVABLE WAGE!!!!!*_


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## Texstar12 (Sep 5, 2015)

*Part 2/2»*

*Final Thoughts»*
In the beginning, Uber was my dream job. I could start and stop whenever I wanted, be my own boss, and let my irregular circadian clock run amok and work all hours of the day--whenever I was most alert. The passengers loved me and I made them happy. I ended Uber with a 4.89 average and have wonderful reviews to show for my hard work. I'm 31 years old and I moved back in with my parents about 7½ years ago after my first failed attempt of making it on my own when I was 23 and have been plotting my escape ever since. Uber gave me that ray of hope that I could do something I love AND earn enough to save up and move out of here with their original advertising slogans of "life-changing money." However, corporate greed took over and the big guy tried to screw over the little guy. Note: I said "tried".

Yes, if I remained working for Uber, they'd be screwing me over, but I'm not going to let that happen. I was a very passionate Uber guru, but now, they've turned me, one of MANY drivers out there, against them, and I will convert this passion into their eminent demise. They've angered the wrong driver. I will spread word of boycotts for miles. I will be loud. I will be obnoxious. I will be heard. But don't let my voice convince you; do the math yourself. YOU WILL BE LOSING MONEY IF YOU CONTINUE TO DRIVE FOR UBER!!!

These calculations I've made are based on my real miles. The more you drive, the more you distance yourself from expenses. Uber has lowered our pay SO devastatingly low that there's absolutely NO WAY to make this your full-time job because you'll be spending ALL your time working, fully awake until you're fatigued and losing sleep. And you have to lose sleep to make a profit now because the less you work, it's completely unprofitable. I worked 32-38 hours a week, and if I was to keep up that pattern, I'd be losing money doing this as a part time gig. Let me repeat that: *YOU WILL DEFINITELY BE LOSING MONEY DOING THIS AS A PART-TIME GIG!!!*

_*To all the newbies out there reading this*_, let this be a "fare" warning. HEED THIS: You will LOSE money driving for Uber. All these calculations are based on 87¢/mi @ 20% commission here in Houston, TX. Other places are far less off than us here. Detroit, for example, is at 30¢ per mile! THAT'S CRIMINAL!!! What's more, Uber plans to replace ALL drivers in the not-so-distant future with self-driving cars and we have ALL been used as pawns in order to plot their cars' programming. It's not a conspiracy theory, it's a fact. Google it. It's disgusting and despicable! You will NOT make money doing this, let alone covering costs to live, and you will be DONATING your money to a $60 BILLION CORPORATION THAT TELLS CLIENTS THAT TIPPING ISN'T NECESSARY!!!!!!

One last closing thought: everything we do in life from the clothing we wear to the merchandise we buy to the cars we drive is a vote for what we stand for. By choosing to continue to drive for Uber, you are voting FOR the tyranny that is corporate greed run amok. Take a stand and BOYCOTT these thugs! I know what it's like to get in the mindset of a stable job for a long time. *SNAP OUT OF IT! WAKE UP! THIS IS REALITY!* And for those of you who say you're going to quit working for Uber, sell your car, and take Uber from now on, *YOU ARE SICK!* Do you not have any concept of what you are backing?! Money talks. Shut Uber up for good. Take a stand and *#BoycottUber2016* !


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## SD_Expedition (Dec 10, 2015)

You are exactly right.


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## Imanuel (Dec 7, 2015)

damn you really took time to do all that math? you could have gone out and got the winter guarantees! (obviously trolling)


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## JimS (Aug 18, 2015)

Let's be a little more honest here. You take taxes out of your NET income after expenses, you don't take the taxes out BEFORE the deductions.


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## uber strike (Jan 10, 2016)

too many drivers don't factor expenses


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## uber strike (Jan 10, 2016)

too many drivers don't factor in expenses. So they think that there is a profit. But after this last rate cut and reading through forum it seems to me that drivers are getting smarter. we are already on boycott. I haven't taken 1 trip since the rate cut. I will only drive on Surge. on Saturday night I didn't take a 1.2 surge because even that's too low now.


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## Matt Uterak (Jul 28, 2015)

I haven't washed my car in 4 weeks.


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## SoBeUBER (Aug 27, 2014)

You don't take out taxes before expenses...lol...also, an UBER driver in a 30% tax bracket??? lol...more like 0-5% if using the standard .565 deduction and logging all miles...


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## Texstar12 (Sep 5, 2015)

SoBeUBER said:


> You don't take out taxes before expenses...lol...also, an UBER driver in a 30% tax bracket??? lol...more like 0-5% if using the standard .565 deduction and logging all miles...


REALLY?! Good! I've got a ton saved up then come tax season!  I'm gonna go back and recalculate this then. Can anyone else verify this?


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## uberboise (Oct 20, 2015)

Yeah taxes, you have deductions. So you are lopping of way too much with 30%, if your expenses are that much you probably have next to zero tax liability And you should set up an S corp so that you have no ss or medicade taxes:

https://turbotax.intuit.com/tax-too...duce-Your-Self-Employment-Taxes/INF22938.html


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## Texstar12 (Sep 5, 2015)

uberboise said:


> Yeah taxes, you have deductions. So you are lopping of way too much with 30%, if your expenses are that much you probably have next to zero tax liability And you should set up an S corp so that you have no ss or medicade taxes:
> 
> https://turbotax.intuit.com/tax-too...duce-Your-Self-Employment-Taxes/INF22938.html


But is it too late to set up an S corp come 2015 taxes due now that we're in 2016?


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## Matt Uterak (Jul 28, 2015)

uberboise said:


> Yeah taxes, you have deductions. So you are lopping of way too much with 30%, if your expenses are that much you probably have next to zero tax liability And you should set up an S corp so that you have no ss or medicade taxes:
> 
> https://turbotax.intuit.com/tax-too...duce-Your-Self-Employment-Taxes/INF22938.html


FICA is about the cheapest insurance policy one will every buy.

I could go into a long diatribe, but if one doesn't have Social Security taxable income they will, eventually, lose their insured status for disability. If one didn't have enough Social Security taxable income before following the S corp strategy they will not draw any benefits at retirement age nor will their spouse or kids get survivor benefits if they die.


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## uberboise (Oct 20, 2015)

Actually from my experience, no, it is not too late. I am already and independent contractor. For a long time I operated as an LLC. My new and current accountant was able to go back a year as a S Corp. Somehow, I didn't ask questions. It pays to have a good accountant. And before you ask or comment, this guy is very reputable, it's not my cousin Vinny. I pay about $700 bucks for my SCorp returns, but it's worth it.


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## uberboise (Oct 20, 2015)

Matt Uterak said:


> FICA is about the cheapest insurance policy one will every buy.
> 
> I could go into a long diatribe, but if one doesn't have Social Security taxable income they will, eventually, lose their insured status for disability. If one didn't have enough Social Security taxable income before following the S corp strategy they will not draw any benefits at retirement age nor will their spouse or kids get survivor benefits if they die.


That's assuming you have never paid in to SS in your lifetime. I would say 99% of the people driving Uber have had a W-2 job most of their lives. You have already paid into the system. I get a SS statement every year, and guess what, my contributions are still there.


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## Matt Uterak (Jul 28, 2015)

uberboise said:


> That's assuming you have never paid in to SS in your lifetime. I would say ((% of the people driving Uber have had a W-2 job most of their lives. You have already paid into the system. I get a SS staement every year, and gusee what, my contributions are still there.


Again, if you don't pay in 5 of the last 10 years you cannot draw disability if you get messed up or develop a chronic illness.

I specifically noted that retirement and survivors is different.

I hope you and any others that go the S Corp route are saving for retirement because the limited amount of Retirement benefits will replace a much lower % of your income vs a person working on a W2

Like you, I am simply providing some information to help others make good decisions. I would hazard a guess that most full time uber drivers are on the lower socio-economic scale and don't have a lot of resources to fall back on.


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## Texstar12 (Sep 5, 2015)

Matt Uterak said:


> Again, if you don't pay in 5 of the last 10 years you cannot draw disability if you get messed up or develop a chronic illness.
> 
> I specifically noted that retirement and survivors is different.
> 
> ...


Yeah, I don't think I feel so comfortable about the S corp thing. And yes, I've done nothing but regular jobs that have provided W-2s before Uber. But I don't want to take out too little amount of taxes, so how much should I take out? After expenses, this 87¢/mi comes down to 30.29¢/mi when not taking out any taxes whatsoever before expenses. How much to take out of that is what I wonder.


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## uberboise (Oct 20, 2015)

Matt Uterak said:


> Again, if you don't pay in 5 of the last 10 years you cannot draw disability if you get messed up or develop a chronic illness.
> 
> I specifically noted that retirement and survivors is different.
> 
> ...


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## UberPasco (Oct 18, 2015)

You also forgot to add in your per minute rate. And your car note is only valid if you solely use your vehicle for business and/or you wouldn't have a vehicle otherwise. A better method would be to figure what you paid minus the current value and divide by your business miles. Other than that, nice analysis.


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## Matt Uterak (Jul 28, 2015)

Texstar12 said:


> Yeah, I don't think I feel so comfortable about the S corp thing. And yes, I've done nothing but regular jobs that have provided W-2s before Uber. But I don't want to take out too little amount of taxes, so how much should I take out? After expenses, this 87¢/mi comes down to 30.29¢/mi when not taking out any taxes whatsoever before expenses. How much to take out of that is what I wonder.


Uberboise is probably a better one to ask the tax question.

I am unsure, as it has been a number of years since I've seen and Scorp return, but you do have the option of taking the K-1 income and/or issuing a W-2 to yourself but I am not a tax expert in terms of small details.

Remember if you want to keep insured for SSDI you need to hit an Fica taxable amount to obtain 4 Quarters.


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## UberPasco (Oct 18, 2015)

Texstar12 said:


> Yeah, I don't think I feel so comfortable about the S corp thing. And yes, I've done nothing but regular jobs that have provided W-2s before Uber. But I don't want to take out too little amount of taxes, so how much should I take out? After expenses, this 87¢/mi comes down to 30.29¢/mi when not taking out any taxes whatsoever before expenses. How much to take out of that is what I wonder.


15% is generous after your deductions. You may be better off doing actual vs standard if your vehicle is truly business only. Otherwise take everything you made, subtract (business miles*.575) and take 15% of that.


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## Texstar12 (Sep 5, 2015)

Okay, so after others posted that I should take out taxes after expenses, I went back and revisited the math. I'm not trying to provide false information here, so here's the re-work:

• 87¢/mi - 20% = 69.6¢/mi ← This is my _net_ _pay_ after commission.
• 69.6¢ - 10.49¢% = 59.11¢/mi ← This is what I keep after _operating costs_.
• 59.11¢/mi - 8.09¢/mi = 51.02¢/mi ← This is what I keep after _Rideshare Insurance._
• 51.02¢/mi - 15.82¢/mi = 35.20¢/mi ← This is what I keep after the _Car Note_.
• 35.20¢/mi - 4.91¢/mi = 30.29¢/mi ← This is what I keep after the _Mobile Phone_ bill.

♦ 30.29¢/mi Net Pay less Expenses (not including long-term maintenance charges)

Now let's play what-if's on taxes because I have never had any idea as to how much to set aside. People have said anywhere from 5-25%, and all of last year, I set aside 25% to be safe, but just raised it to 30% this year. Besides, by setting aside more, come tax season, I get to keep more and boost savings.

• 30.29¢/mi - 30% = 21.20¢/mi
• 30.29¢/mi - 25% = 22.72¢/mi
• 30.29¢/mi - 20% = 24.23¢/mi
• 30.29¢/mi - 15% = 25.75¢/mi
• 30.29¢/mi - 10% = 27.26¢/mi
• 30.29¢/mi -05% = 28.78¢/mi

Okay so I stand corrected. 87¢/mi → 30.29¢/mi after expenses for me, and yes, I use this car solely for Uber and don't have any other job to commute to at the moment. I track the "online" miles and "offline" miles in my log. But still, 30 cents per mile is not a livable wage. Once you factor in groceries, utilities, rent, you're in the red! And you can't do this as a side gig because you have to work a TON of hours and drive a bunch of miles to further distance yourself from your expenses. Overall, Uber is a SCAM and you are losing out in the end.

I'm never going back to Uber, and I'm going to get my Taxi license on Wednesday because I love driving.


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