# Seattle Uber GM Confirms Pullout If Unionization Goes Forward



## circle1 (Sep 17, 2016)

http://www.geekwire.com/2017/uber-g...landmark-union-law-implemented/#disqus_thread


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## 7Miles (Dec 17, 2014)

By paying low wages (rates) Uber invited all kind of lawsuits and troubles . 
Just pay (have rates) at least 50% of what taxis charge and everybody will be happy. But no- they will go extra mile to screw drivers.
Well, deal with it now .


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## ABC123DEF (Jun 9, 2015)

Take your ball and go home, Foober. Don't let the door hit you in the donkey on the way out.


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## Ride-Share-Risk-Manager (Mar 16, 2017)

I see a tsunami of drivers starting union organizing across the USA. Uber and Lyft have nobody to blame but themselves. Their disdain for their drivers and their lack of support and communication combined with crappy money and allowing illegal immigrants to work for them has brought this result upon them. If Uber spent their money on retention bonuses for drivers rather than on millions for lobbyists they might buy some loyalty.


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## njn (Jan 23, 2016)

From the comments section from the article, it appears that it's the taxi union pushing the agenda. No smart rideshare driver would join a union of their competition, especially knowing corporations will leave the market if unionization is passed.


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## AnotherUberVictim (Nov 6, 2016)

njn said:


> From the comments section from the article, it appears that it's the taxi union pushing the agenda. No smart rideshare driver would join a union of their competition, especially knowing corporations will leave the market if unionization is passed.


Well, being that regardless of being rideshare, or a taxi, we are ride-for-hire drivers. Being that ride-sharing is pulling all wages down, my opinion is that it would be in in ALL our best interests to fight for better wages.


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## Ride-Share-Risk-Manager (Mar 16, 2017)

I think too many drivers get turned off by the word "union" and all of the negative connotations from the past that Uber and Lyft would like us to consider. In NYC there is a drivers guild, not a union. But at least there is someone standing up for drivers rights. Drivers need some level of representation so that they are not left out twisting in the wind on their own. Change will have to be forced upon Uber and Lyft, they will not do it on their own. It will require their investors, media, government and drivers. Uber is 25% owned by the sovereign wealth fund of Saudi Arabia, not exactly a country that respects human rights, women's rights, religious freedom or self expression, never mind allowing workers to organize or god forbid unionize. Keep that in mind, when you wonder why their business culture has so many problems.

Interesting article about what drivers are doing in India.

*Striking Uber And Ola Drivers Are Now Planning To Launch Their Own App*

Posted on March 6, 2017March 6, 2017 by OfficeChai Team

This is something Karl Marx would've been proud of.

Uber and Ola drivers had done everything in their power to get the cab-hailing companies to reinstate their bonuses. They'd been on strike in Delhi, Hyderabad and Bangalore; they'd approached the government and the courts; and some drivers had even taken the drastic step of taking their own lives. But now they're taking matters into their own hands.










Uber and Ola drivers are now looking to develop their own app that'll take on Uber and Ola. The heads of several drivers' unions have formed a core-committee that'll look into the development of the app. "The app will be ready in a month and we are working on other logistics like office space and also hiring people for customer service, among other things. As of now, 8,000 cab drivers are supporting this idea," said Tanveer Pasha, President of the Ola TaxiForSure and Uber Drivers' Association.

The app seems to have some backing from the corridors of power - former Karnataka HD Kumaraswamy is funding the app's development, say the drivers. He's also reportedly promised to help the drivers hire engineers. ""Kumaraswamy told us not to bow down to the rules laid across by foreign companies and be our own masters," the drivers association said.

This isn't the first time that taxi drivers have attempted to build their own app - last year, taxi drivers in Mumbai attempted to take on Uber and Ola with their own app which they called 9211. The app had generated a lot of buzz, but had ultimately failed to take off. Developing a ride-hailing app is not as difficult as it was a few years ago, but there are many more pieces to the puzzle to launch a successful business - there's the matter of quality control, customer service, and making sure the operation runs smoothly. The app will also need significant initial capital for its initial promotions.

But if the drivers can pull this off, it'll be an incredible achievement for Indian ingenuity. Cab aggregator drivers across the world are unhappy with the way big companies have been treating them - there have been strikes against Uber right from Qatar to Paris to New York. And India has shown the way in empowering workers in the past - Amul is a great example of how power was transferred to ultimate producers by cutting out the middleman. Cab drivers too form the fundamentals of the taxi business - it's about time they took control of their own destiny.

- See more at: https://officechai.com/news/striking-uber-ola-drivers-now-planning-launch-app/#sthash.2SvvxDKt.dpuf


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## charmer37 (Nov 18, 2016)

Union or not uber and lyft need to raise rates, Drivers would be happy and in my opinion the service would actually improve. Uber/lyft are shaking in their boots..lol, let's see ubers self driving cars come to the rescue this time, If they want to keep a Ridesharing service they are forced to pay us a lot more, It should be against the law giving rides in a nice new car for $3.20 per trip....Rip off.


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## Jesusdrivesuber (Jan 5, 2017)

So they will pull out and watch from afar as they did with Austin, they will then see how happy everyone is and decide to go bribe higher tiers of the gov to get them to come back.

Uber is like that ***** GF, she leaves you and then when your life is perfect, she tries to come back to ruin it again.

Make a law that anyone pulling out will not be able to operate there ever again to make it permanent.


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## Ride-Share-Risk-Manager (Mar 16, 2017)

Why doesn't the drivers association in Seattle follow the lead of their brothers in India and go form their own Ride Share company, there is an abundance of IT talent in Seattle. The ride share application is now becoming a more commoditized technology. Then they can control their own destiny and drivers can offer Uber and Lyft the opportunity to bid for their services based on the right combination of compensation, benefits, support and terms of engagement.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

They tried pulling this stunt in Austin and look what happened.

It would be interesting to hear Lyft"s reaction.


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## Ride-Share-Risk-Manager (Mar 16, 2017)

Uber and Lyft tried threatening New Jersey politicians that if they passed their recent ride share legislation that they would pull out of the state. It was a big ass bluff. I am glad that the Democrats in NJ actually had enough backbone to pass the laws and tell our Governor to put down the donuts and sign the bill or get overidden. Ultimately having comprehensive background checks on drivers and higher insurance coverage makes ride sharing better for everyone. The bill passed, the sky did not fall, the passengers don't care, and Uber and Lyft just had to lick their wounds and keep going.


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## Jagent (Jan 29, 2017)

Good. Let them leave. This will just spread all over the nation. I can't wait until it comes here. I would gladly be the spokesperson for how Uber abuses drivers. All they need to do is raise minimum fare and rates to a decent level and all these problems go away. These people are pure greed and nothing more.


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## circle1 (Sep 17, 2016)

7Miles said:


> By paying low wages (rates) Uber invited all kind of lawsuits and troubles .
> Just pay (have rates) at least 50% of what taxis charge and everybody will be happy. But no- they will go extra mile to screw drivers.
> Well, deal with it now .


. . . And not just what TNCs are doing, we're living in historic times.



Ride-Share-Risk-Manager said:


> I see a tsunami of drivers starting union organizing across the USA. Uber and Lyft have nobody to blame but themselves. Their disdain for their drivers and their lack of support and communication combined with crappy money and allowing illegal immigrants to work for them has brought this result upon them. If Uber spent their money on retention bonuses for drivers rather than on millions for lobbyists they might buy some loyalty.


. . . _*In fact*_ . . . if somebody with enough money to pay for office space and operating expenses for five years stepped forward, a proven and well-known TNC contractor I mean(!!), and started a state-sanctioned trade association, or guild, then could you imagine how many contractors would flood the place?!? 
It would blow up!



njn said:


> From the comments section from the article, it appears that it's the taxi union pushing the agenda. No smart rideshare driver would join a union of their competition, especially knowing corporations will leave the market if unionization is passed.


It's a conundrum. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.


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## circle1 (Sep 17, 2016)

Ride-Share-Risk-Manager said:


> Why doesn't the drivers association in Seattle follow the lead of their brothers in India and go form their own Ride Share company, there is an abundance of IT talent in Seattle. The ride share application is now becoming a more commoditized technology. Then they can control their own destiny and drivers can offer Uber and Lyft the opportunity to bid for their services based on the right combination of compensation, benefits, support and terms of engagement.


The App-Based Driver's Assoc. you're referring to (if I'm not mistaken) is operated by the Teamsters (most likely Local 117).

Seattle's city counsel has made laws concerning what has to happen for the future regarding Transportation Network Companies operating inside city limits.

Use this link as a jump-off point to do your own research
http://www.seattle.gov/Documents/De.../collective-bargaining-ordinance-timeline.pdf

We're facing much uncertainty here. On the ONE hand we've got the opportunistic and borderline predatory shenanigans of Lyft and Oops!ber. On the OTHER hand we've got a Teamsters local we know absoluteley nothing about and have yet to hear from. Making this more complicated are two more HANDS; the courts have never been (to anybody's knowledge) asked to decide if independent contractors can combine in any meaningful manner to set prices and/or working conditions (further muddying the waters concerning contractor-or-employee-status), and the now-confirmed fact that Oops!ber, if not Lyft also, will cease operations in Seattle if the Local 117 is voted in. [Whew! ]



uberdriverfornow said:


> They tried pulling this stunt in Austin and look what happened.
> 
> It would be interesting to hear Lyft"s reaction.


Seattle is a very large market, and there's TONS of investors and companies here going after tech. On the other hand, They both could stop operating (meaning drivers could drop off but not pick up) in Seattle, and just serve the rest of Washington state.


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## Ride-Share-Risk-Manager (Mar 16, 2017)

Why doesn't someone go visit Uncle Bill in Seattle and tell him to invest a few of his spare Microsoft dollars in a ride share start up.


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## UsedToBeAPartner (Sep 19, 2016)

Wouldn't that be cool! The drivers get organized in State after State and Uber pulls out of State after State only to be left with business outside the US. Uber will finally fire Travis and work to develop a new business plan that includes a living wage and a sense of trust among their drivers (the folks that used to be partners).


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## Red Leader (Sep 4, 2016)

Simple answer to a simple problem......

If you think a union could push Uber around, which it won't, then simply set your sights on the one place that has all the power in this situation......

City Hall.

All they need do is set a floor rate. That simple. They have the undisputed authority to do so. Yet, strangely, they sit silent.....hmmmm.


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## circle1 (Sep 17, 2016)

Ride-Share-Risk-Manager said:


> Why doesn't someone go visit Uncle Bill in Seattle and tell him to invest a few of his spare Microsoft dollars in a ride share start up.


Uncle Bill is too busy meddling in Third-World countries' affairs. That would be beneath him/them.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

circle1 said:


> http://www.geekwire.com/2017/uber-g...landmark-union-law-implemented/#disqus_thread


Uber's used to pulling out. They're commitment-wary


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## LA Cabbie (Nov 4, 2014)

Trump Economics said:


> Uber's used to pulling out. They're commitment-wary


That's how the drivers like it. KY jelly anyone?


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## phillipzx3 (May 26, 2015)

7Miles said:


> By paying low wages (rates) Uber invited all kind of lawsuits and troubles .
> Just pay (have rates) at least 50% of what taxis charge and everybody will be happy. But no- they will go extra mile to screw drivers.
> Well, deal with it now .


You're funny. If Uber charges 50% of what we charge, the drivers will be making less than they do now. So ya, charge 50% of our rates. Uber partners will love it. ;-)

You have half the expense of a cab. The rates Uber pays seemed to be OK when Uber drivers bragged of how cheap they are. Why change now?


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## BurgerTiime (Jun 22, 2015)

Anywhere Uber leaves they are easily replaced with an app company that follows the rules


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## phillipzx3 (May 26, 2015)

Ride-Share-Risk-Manager said:


> Why doesn't the drivers association in Seattle follow the lead of their brothers in India and go form their own Ride Share company, there is an abundance of IT talent in Seattle. The ride share application is now becoming a more commoditized technology. Then they can control their own destiny and drivers can offer Uber and Lyft the opportunity to bid for their services based on the right combination of compensation, benefits, support and terms of engagement.


Because they'd need a few million dollars to throw away subsidizing cheap rides in order to draw Uber passengers away from Uber. Without subsidized drivers and passengers, Uber or Lyft would never have been able to get off the ground. The same would be needed for a new company. They have to undercut Uber. Not just provide another platform.


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## dirtylee (Sep 2, 2015)

Happened in Austin, TX. After the new rideshare Cos with lower fees {example 2.9% & $ 0.30 a ride, yes that low}, drivers truly make more.

Drivers from Houston, which only has uber, have started commute to Austin for truly higher earnings.

I truly wish that Uber & lyft would pull out of Seattle.


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## circle1 (Sep 17, 2016)

BurgerTiime said:


> Anywhere Uber leaves they are easily replaced with an app company that follows the rules


Yes but "easily" in quotation marks, though . . .



phillipzx3 said:


> Because they'd need a few million dollars to throw away subsidizing cheap rides in order to draw Uber passengers away from Uber. Without subsidized drivers and passengers, Uber or Lyft would never have been able to get off the ground. The same would be needed for a new company. They have to undercut Uber. Not just provide another platform.


ANY business can "get off the ground" if they provide superior customer service, on a superior platform, with superior employees & contractors (admittedly that would take years to do). You are correct though, the two TNCs here are literally buying customers with investor monies hoping to corner the market.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

circle1 said:


> http://www.geekwire.com/2017/uber-g...landmark-union-law-implemented/#disqus_thread


BYE BYE !



BurgerTiime said:


> Anywhere Uber leaves they are easily replaced with an app company that follows the rules


And drivers are MUCH HAPPIER !


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## Adieu (Feb 21, 2016)

njn said:


> From the comments section from the article, it appears that it's the taxi union pushing the agenda. No smart rideshare driver would join a union of their competition, especially knowing corporations will leave the market if unionization is passed.


Lies and provocations

There is absolutely no reason NOT to join any limo/taxi organizations. Other fuber drivers are as much or more your competition than those

Also, no one will leave. Or if they do. Others will take their place. Like in Texas.

It's all scaremongering, Fuber trying to scare starving drivers into supporting it against Unionization.


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

phillipzx3 said:


> You're funny. If Uber charges 50% of what we charge, the drivers will be making less than they do now. So ya, charge 50% of our rates. Uber partners will love it. ;-)


If uber charged HALF of what the taxis in Orlando did they local drivers here would love it, it would be a huge price increase...

If uber pulls out of Seattle a local company will pop up to fill the gap like in Austin...

A drivers union would have the power to grab that new startup by the gonads and lay it out for them that they want X per mile or they will strike... then the startup uses that minimum as the basis for setting their rates and builds a profitable company around the cost of labor. As every startup will be in the same boat, none of them will be able to engage in a price war leading to 65c a mile.

At the end of the day the drivers will be better off and these startups that will replace them won't even have to advertise, they can provide commercial insurance, take 10% and be happy as a clam.

I hope to see more of these unions pop up all over the country.


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## circle1 (Sep 17, 2016)

Adieu said:


> Lies and provocations
> 
> There is absolutely no reason NOT to join any limo/taxi organizations. Other fuber drivers are as much or more your competition than those
> 
> ...


While being pro-union, I think there _could be_ reasons to reject Local 117.



Mears Troll Number 4 said:


> If uber charged HALF of what the taxis in Orlando did they local drivers here would love it, it would be a huge price increase...
> 
> If uber pulls out of Seattle a local company will pop up to fill the gap like in Austin...
> 
> ...


Unions _can be_ great and all, but I just can not understand why the TNCs don't communicate with their "partners?" A union wouldn't be necessary if the contractors had a guild that met with the TNCs quarterly to discuss business like adults and business people!


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## Rakos (Sep 2, 2014)

Trump Economics said:


> Uber's used to pulling out. They're commitment-wary


Kinda sounds like a comment one of those young "milliniels" would make...hehehe


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

Rakos said:


> Kinda sounds like a comment one of those young "milliniels" would make...hehehe


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## phillipzx3 (May 26, 2015)

Mears Troll Number 4 said:


> If uber charged HALF of what the taxis in Orlando did they local drivers here would love it, it would be a huge price increase.
> 
> I hope to see more of these unions pop up all over the country.


Move to Portland and join the 10,000 plus drivers who've come here from all over the country. UberX mileage rates are about half that of the cabs, but the minimum is twice that of a cab. Even with the better fees, the drivers don't do all too well (some do OK, for the people who'll claim they're do great! But most are making "spare change".) because they have so much competition from other Uber drivers.


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## Tom25 (Apr 5, 2015)

Unionizing is NOT the answer. Driver walk outs and protests are. My major complaints with them include lack of tipping capability within the app, some balance within the system that insures that a long deadhead will be rewarded with an equally long ride. Too often I have traveled 10 - 15 minutes for a pick up, to find the ride is less than that. Lastly, long waits at the airport. How about setting a maximum queue size at PDX of 50? Encouraging drivers to spread out throughout the city. All three of those issues could be easily dealt with, without costing UBER anything.

After that, then addressing income issues. But first thing first. Add tipping.... NOW!!


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## Jagent (Jan 29, 2017)

Tom25 said:


> Unionizing is NOT the answer. Driver walk outs and protests are. My major complaints with them include lack of tipping capability within the app, some balance within the system that insures that a long deadhead will be rewarded with an equally long ride. Too often I have traveled 10 - 15 minutes for a pick up, to find the ride is less than that. Lastly, long waits at the airport. How about setting a maximum queue size at PDX of 50? Encouraging drivers to spread out throughout the city. All three of those issues could be easily dealt with, without costing UBER anything.
> 
> After that, then addressing income issues. But first thing first. Add tipping.... NOW!!


Only way you'll get those things is if they're threatened by a union. Driver walkout will not happen. As soon as drivers turn off the app, it surges, and one by one, drivers will take rides.


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## Rakos (Sep 2, 2014)

I personnaly liked seeing the select driver...

Take down Travis...

Now THAT took GIANT monkey ball$...

THAT driver is my HERO....

Rakos


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## Jagent (Jan 29, 2017)

Rakos said:


> I personnaly liked seeing the select driver...
> 
> Take down Travis...
> 
> ...


I keep hoping that drivers near Travis will gather and protest at his house. Get the media involved. Things would quickly change.


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## Fuzzyelvis (Dec 7, 2014)

circle1 said:


> While being pro-union, I think there _could be_ reasons to reject Local 117.
> 
> Unions _can be_ great and all, but I just can not understand why the TNCs don't communicate with their "partners?" A union wouldn't be necessary if the contractors had a guild that met with the TNCs quarterly to discuss business like adults and business people!


Uber will "discuss" then change NOTHING. Even IF they met.


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## circle1 (Sep 17, 2016)

Trump Economics said:


> View attachment 108774


That triggered my seizure.



Tom25 said:


> Unionizing is NOT the answer. Driver walk outs and protests are.


That is virtually impossible without structured coordination. A guild or other state-sanctioned trade union would be the best answer, in my opinion.


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## circle1 (Sep 17, 2016)

Fuzzyelvis said:


> Uber will "discuss" then change NOTHING. Even IF they met.


Hence the need for a state-sanctioned guild. If enough people joined and paid dues regularly, the guild could possibly start their own ride-hail company. Owned and operated by the drivers!


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## Mars Troll Number 4 (Oct 30, 2015)

phillipzx3 said:


> Move to Portland and join the 10,000 plus drivers who've come here from all over the country. UberX mileage rates are about half that of the cabs, but the minimum is twice that of a cab. Even with the better fees, the drivers don't do all too well (some do OK, for the people who'll claim they're do great! But most are making "spare change".) because they have so much competition from other Uber drivers.


Well the minimum for an uber trip is a lot higher than a minimum for a taxi trip BUT....

Uber minimum
$6.20
$3.00 to the driver minus expenses

Taxi minimum $2.40 (minus expenses)

1/2 mile ride
$3.00 to the driver uber
$3.60 taxi

3 MILE trip
$3.00 to the uber driver
$10 taxi

4 MILES Into the trip the uber meter starts going up....

$3.70ish to the uber driver
$12.40 taxi fare

There arn't that many trips under half a mile... there's a lot under 5 miles...
And the cab company only gets about 1/4 of my meter..


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