# HOW LYFT USES YOUR TIPS AGAINST YOU



## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

* Are you aware that your tips on Lyft are being used against you in order to reduce your pay?









*

*For Example:*

If the Lyft algorithm evenly distributes the total amount of calls coming in by the total amount of available drivers and determines that an $18/hour rate (before taxes and expenses) is applicable, then drivers - by a wide majority - must not exceed that threshold.

This means that if Chris grossed $18.32 over the course of 60 minutes by doing 2 calls, Sarah should earn a similar amount for the 3 calls that she completed. But since Sarah was in a better mood this hour and got tipped $5 from each passenger, she actually made $33 (gross), whereas Chris is left with nothing but his fares.

This, then, means that Sarah will get considerably fewer calls (or calls that pay less) for the duration of the evening (or week), which allows the system to bring her pay back down to an $18/hour rate. So, who gets the calls that Sarah wasn't able to collect (or calls that pay more) because Lyft is determining her pay? *Other drivers.* Wait, what? That doesn't make any sense. After all, commission equals commission, so why not just leave Sarah alone and give her every call she's entitled to?

*Algorithm Secrets:*

Any call that Sarah is not being given is routed to another driver, which gives them the appearance of normal activity (similar to _guarantees_), and any higher paying call that Sarah is not being allowed to collect is going towards the other driver's $18/hour rate. This is similar to a pyramid scheme, where someone always gets the short end of a stick. (Sarah might also be having her higher paying calls siphoned away because she has a history of collecting the Power Driver Bonus, which means Lyft really wants to give her as many lower paying calls as they can, that way their commission losses are marginalized.)

Other drivers (including new drivers) are needed because Sarah could quit any time, but they're also needed because Lyft is trying to collect every call that comes into their platform before the user defects to Uber, which is usually the case when the customer wants a rate that isn't Primetime, or because they'd like to get a faster eta. In other words, Sarah can't collect all of these calls on her own, and Lyft is actively working to increase their own commission by having as many money-making machines on their platform as they can.

Many people think Lyft should have less drivers and higher rates (Primetime or otherwise), that way everyone involved can make more money, but you're not thinking like a business owner. If your rates were consistently high, why would anyone choose you over the competition? Yes, Lyft clearly wants normal rates, customers that return, and lots of drivers (employees) so they can collect every revenue opportunity that comes along, *but how do they go about doing this? *Perhaps you've noticed the little *pink squares* on your map no longer guarantee a Primetime rate, but Lyft never made this announcement publicly. In fact, they intentionally let the opposite occur for an extended period of time in order to condition your behavior, which is why you still feel euphoric whenever you see pink squares on your screen. But what if I told you those pink squares were fictional? And what if I told you you were being manipulated into driving solely for the purpose of providing continual coverage in the following order:

the ability to collect every call...
which equals normal rates...
which equals customers that return.
And what if I told you this was their intention all along?

"Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves." *Translation:* The only thing worse than Uber is a company that does the exact same thing, but claims to be different, and uses your tips against you. *Lyft* is the one you should really be keeping an eye out for.

*Want more dirty deets on Lyft? Click on my Trump Economics Avatar and scroll to the Information/About me section of my uberpeople.net page.*


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## macchiato (Sep 29, 2015)

The way they operate is such a socialist mindset. We don't get paired on who is closer but who has been online the longest without a ping. This is why we get far distance pings.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

Yea, you're an employee in every way, but you decide when to show up for work. Well, unless you take the Power Driver Bonus into account, which was done as a way of _scheduling drivers_. You must work for us 4-5 days a week during these busy periods in order to qualify - this is your schedule.

I still remember the days when Lyft used to make you opt-in and tell them when you'd be available to drive. Was this not _scheduling_? And did this practice not end when they started getting sued for misclassifying their drivers? I don't understand why the courts decided to look the other way and let them settle their lawsuit when the proof was there?

Oh, yea, our government is bought and paid for by the rich.


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## circle1 (Sep 17, 2016)

Trump Economics said:


> *Are you aware that your tips are being used against you in order to reduce your pay?*
> 
> *For Example:*
> 
> ...


. . . Interesting . . . so, are you saying we should be more discretionary in accepting pings? Because what you described, while interesting, doesn't hint at a solution.


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## Jagent (Jan 29, 2017)

The solution is to stop playing their stupid game. Stop accepting pings over 10 minutes away. If eveeyone does this, it throws a wrench in their plans. 

This totally explains why I get tons of stupid pings from Lyft. I only run Lyft when Uber is dead, but I get tons more Lyft pings. The problem is, they are all super far away from me. ...which is why I never run the app. Which is why I get the marathon pings. It's like being on a hamster wheel.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Trump Economics said:


> *Are you aware that your tips on Lyft are being used against you in order to reduce your pay?*
> 
> *For Example:*
> 
> ...


How the hell is this being an INDEPENDENT CONTRACTOR !!!!
ALGORITHMS ?


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

*You want the truth?










The only method of recourse is to rate every passenger 1-star.* When you do this, the algorithm thinks something went wrong during the ride, so it throws you another call again fairly quickly in order to make up for the bad experience (fictional or not). "Oh, calm down, here's more money to make you feel better," it says.

Honestly, a lot of drivers are dumb - they get angry and refuse to take Lyft Line calls, etc. Awesome - there's another reason for Lyft to off-board you. You need to be *SMART* and hit them where it hurts. *TAKE EVERY CALL THEY GIVE YOU AND RATE THE PASSENGER 1-STAR.* As I said before, you'll be bumped to the front of the line for new calls, and you'll also be putting new drivers at a disadvantage, as they're actively trying to avoid people with a low rating. Cha-ching - more calls for you!

The downside? You're going to second guess whether or not you should pick up the next passenger you come across that has a 4.1 rating. "Is it legit, or are more people doing what I'm doing," you'll ask yourself.

The upside? You can use all that extra money you're making to buy yourself a nifty little dash cam that faces the interior of your car. And besides, everyone reading this knows ratings are a false sense of security. How many 5-star passengers have you had that treated you and your car like garbage?

Wait, what? *All of this is so mean! *Yea, whatever. "These morons don't seriously think it costs $4.00 to drive them around for 20 minutes in traffic, right? If they're going to abuse the system and take advantage of subsidized rides/venture capital, then so should you."

I don't know - after 7,000 rides, I just broke. I started to put my rent first because I knew there wasn't a passenger in sight who was going to let me live with them.

"How do you like driving for Lyft," they'd ask.

"The money is pretty bad, and it is what it is," I'd tell them.

"Oh, yea, I've heard that," they'd reply.

"But you're still using Lyft anyway," I'd think to myself; and that was that.


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## charmer37 (Nov 18, 2016)

I treat lyft like a a long distance relative, I rarely drive for lyft and I keep it 100% real with all my uber and lyft pax...Like they say, 2 can play at that game.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

charmer37 said:


> I treat lyft like a a long distance relative, I rarely drive for lyft and I keep it 100% real with all my uber and lyft pax...Like they say, 2 can play at that game.


Preach! And I still average a 4.95 rating or higher, even though it means didly at the end of the day. (Uber and Lyft are a s*** stain on the underwear of life)

As I've said before, ratings are meant to mentally condition a driver and keep them in fear (on their best behavior). They want the driver to get frustrated so they'll try even harder to provide better service. Really? A driver has one job: get the passenger from A to B safely and efficiently. Period. This isn't about water, music or small talk. This is about making less than minimum wage when it comes to doing your taxes.

"Oh, it looks like you didn't make very much last year, and you may have even lost money by driving," your tax guy will tell you. Really?

*How many of you work to make nothing?
*
By driving for Uber or Lyft, all you're really doing is exchanging the equity in your vehicle for cash up front - you're giving yourself a payday loan every week. Period.

Alas, I digress. There will always be people who rate you poorly, and ratings do not determine your pay - the algorithm does.

And since ratings are quantified in an autonomous fashion, the only people who could be off-boarded are the ones who repeatedly get 1-star review after 1-star review (figuratively speaking).

Also, watch Season 3, episode 1 of Black Mirror on Netflix if you need additional reflection.


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## Stan07 (Oct 10, 2016)

Did you guys know that Lyft cancel your rides as soon as they find the closer driver? And they send you the text, as if pax canceled it!
LYFT CANCELED: X has canceled the Lyft request.


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## circle1 (Sep 17, 2016)

tohunt4me said:


> How the hell is this being an INDEPENDENT CONTRACTOR !!!!
> ALGORITHMS ?


"He Who Has The Gold . . . "


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

Stan07 said:


> Did you guys know that Lyft cancel your rides as soon as they find the closer driver? And they send you the text, as if pax canceled it!
> LYFT CANCELED: X has canceled the Lyft request.


I figured that was happening! If a driver finishes a call and is a few minutes closer to the passenger, it would make sense for the system to cancel on you and throw it to them. In Los Angeles, this area is known as Thousand Oaks, or any area up in the hills. Just pray the call cancels before your reception drops.


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## cenTiPede (Dec 5, 2016)

Do you know which one is the incriminating file?


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

cenTiPede said:


> Do you which one is the incriminating file?


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## cenTiPede (Dec 5, 2016)

Sorry, I forgot the word "know" on my question above.

In case you noticed the missing word, the question is because you made a claim and posted a link to a file repository on github. My assumption was that inside that repository is the proof to your claim.

Or are you so enamored with the president that you're taking his personality of baseless-statements-in-chief?


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

cenTiPede said:


> Sorry, I forgot the word "know" on my question above.
> 
> In case you noticed the missing word, the question is because you made a claim and posted a link to a file repository on github. My assumption was that inside that repository is the proof to your claim.
> Hmm. Even if the word "know" was omitted, I'm still not sure I would
> Or are you so enamored with the president that you're taking his personality of baseless-statements-in-chief?


The reference to GitHub goes to Lyft's state of mind. Cheers


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## macchiato (Sep 29, 2015)

Stan07 said:


> Did you guys know that Lyft cancel your rides as soon as they find the closer driver? And they send you the text, as if pax canceled it!
> LYFT CANCELED: X has canceled the Lyft request.


I've seen this happen (from driver side) and also been told by pax. They claim that they got matched with another driver without them canceling nor driver canceling. They said it just switched to my car while the first driver was en route. Highly shady stuff if true.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

macchiato said:


> I've seen this happen (from driver side) and also been told by pax. They claim that they got matched with another driver without them canceling nor driver canceling. They said it just switched to my car while the first driver was en route. Highly shady stuff if true.


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## Adieu (Feb 21, 2016)

More maddening how it gives you stealth timeouts if youre a couple rides from a PDB bonus


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

Adieu said:


> More maddening how it gives you stealth timeouts if youre a couple rides from a PDB bonus


Oh, that's my Sunday! A 9-hour day that should be 4.


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## Stan07 (Oct 10, 2016)

Trump Economics said:


> I figured that was happening! If a driver finishes a call and is a few minutes closer to the passenger, it would make sense for the system to cancel on you and throw it to them. In Los Angeles, this area is known as Thousand Oaks, or any area up in the hills. Just pray the call cancels before your reception drops.


I accepted a ride request, eta was 5 mins, rider canceled (received the text) 2 mins after. I kept driving, found the rider. He said I didn't cancel, showed me his phone. Text from Lyft: we found you a closer driver. We waited together for the closer driver. That's lyft.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

Stan07 said:


> I accepted a ride request, eta was 5 mins, rider canceled (received the text) 2 mins after. I kept driving, found the rider. He said I didn't cancel, showed me his phone. Text from Lyft: we found you a closer driver. We waited together for the closer driver. That's lyft.


*shakes head*

This practice should be made into a lawsuit. No, seriously -- I'm not litigious, but it's happened to you, it's happened to me, and that means it's happened to a million other people.

If Lyft decides they want to find a closer driver, fine, but you need to be compensated for your time.

If the customer didn't cancel, you didn't get a cancellation fee.


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## 2CV750CC (Nov 18, 2015)

happened to me one time, I got a pickup in Sherman Oaks, lady calls, asks if it is ok to go to Palmdale, 70 mile drive - no problem, we will be a carpool, fine, lets go, I am almost at her place and they switched me to another pickup high up in the hills of Encine, annoying to get to and a $5 ride instead of a $80 ride


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

On the bright side, you would have been stuck in Palmdale and you would've had to turn your app off for an hou


2CV750CC said:


> happened to me one time, I got a pickup in Sherman Oaks, lady calls, asks if it is ok to go to Palmdale, 70 mile drive - no problem, we will be a carpool, fine, lets go, I am almost at her place and they switched me to another pickup high up in the hills of Encine, annoying to get to and a $5 ride instead of a $80 ride


On the bright side, at least you weren't stuck in Palmdale. Rides like that only work when you can get someone who takes you back to where you came from. I'm sorry that happened. For me, the best rides are the ones that take 20 minutes to get to and they only end up going 2 miles. Like, I'm conditioned to believe if I have to travel a great distance to get to you, it will be worth it, but those days are long gone.


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## 2CV750CC (Nov 18, 2015)

Trump Economics said:


> On the bright side, you would have been stuck in Palmdale and you would've had to turn your app off for an hou
> 
> On the bright side, at least you weren't stuck in Palmdale. Rides like that only work when you can get someone who takes you back to where you came from. I'm sorry that happened. For me, the best rides are the ones that take 20 minutes to get to and they only end up going 2 miles. Like, I'm conditioned to believe if I have to travel a great distance to get to you, it will be worth it, but those days are long gone.


I had the same thought

if I get calls for over 10 mins away I don't take them

if they are close to 10 mins and I am in a weird area I call first to get a feel
did that the other night and got a great one from Tujunga to Glendale for $55
I told the guy it will take me 10 mins, he said ok, I will wait....


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## RaleighUber (Dec 4, 2016)

cenTiPede said:


> In case you noticed the missing word, the question is because you made a claim and posted a link to a file repository on github. My assumption was that inside that repository is the proof to your claim.


The connection is that the folks who programmed Lyft also programmed "secret files."


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

Trump Economics said:


> * Are you aware that your tips on Lyft are being used against you in order to reduce your pay?
> 
> 
> View attachment 97135
> ...


If Sarah noticed that Chris is getting her calls, she'd probably decide to ping Chris, jack his car when he arrives and stuff him in the trunk. Taking his rides, she could then restore her hourly rate. F Chris.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

RaleighUber said:


> The connection is that the folks who programmed Lyft also programmed "secret files."


Exactly


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

elelegido said:


> If Sarah noticed that Chris is getting her calls, she'd probably decide to ping Chris, jack his car when he arrives and stuff him in the trunk. Taking his rides, she could then restore her hourly rate. F Chris.


I think we have some footage of Sarah -- I would proceed with caution.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

2CV750CC said:


> I had the same thought
> 
> if I get calls for over 10 mins away I don't take them
> 
> ...


I hate calling passengers in advance. I prefer the disappointment in person. Plus, I don't want to take on the role of _other drivers_. Chances are, a driver has called them before, asked where they're going, and cancelled on them. If I call the passenger, what if they think I'm one of those drivers and cancels on me first?


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

Trump Economics said:


> I think we have some footage of Sarah -- I would proceed with caution.
> View attachment 97329


That's one of those SeeJaneGo maniacs, surely.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

elelegido said:


> That's one of those SeeJaneGo maniacs, surely.


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## MyPerspective (Feb 14, 2017)

Amazing thread.

Just found out today that lyft keeps the fares and doesn't pay commision on any additional passengers you pick up on lyft line. 

Drivers get paid on time and milage.

I thought at least the passengers split the total fare - not get charged separately.


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## Adieu (Feb 21, 2016)

Trump Economics said:


> Oh, that's my Sunday! A 9-hour day that should be 4.


I've had waaaaaaaaay too many one-weekend PDB attempts end 1 ride short of PDB 20% (or 2, if I didn't accept or cancelled pings that would screw me)

And waaaaaaaaaaaay too many NoHo / Pasadena / Rolling Hills destinations when getting close

And waaaay too many unmatched lyft lines

PLUS!! I've literally observed my car disappearing from the radar in some cases...not juse being rationed to Plus only or something, but disappearing entirely

Sit in a massive surge zone that you KNOW pings nonstop and pointblank if you've cleared PDB quotas --- and no pings or only 15-20 minute ones....and that's with a vehicle that gets EVERY vehicle option lyft offers in LA


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

Adieu said:


> I've had waaaaaaaaay too many one-weekend PDB attempts end 1 ride short of PDB 20% (or 2, if I didn't accept or cancelled pings that would screw me)
> 
> And waaaaaaaaaaaay too many NoHo / Pasadena / Rolling Hills destinations when getting close
> 
> ...


Which is why Lyft does everything they can to keep their algorithm a secret. Yes, we might be logging in when we want to, but they're explicitly withholding rides from us. An independent contractor knows the terms before they accept the job. I don't recall agreeing to any of this. We should be matched with the closest person to us -- that's how a dispatch works.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

MyPerspective said:


> Amazing thread.
> 
> Just found out today that lyft keeps the fares and doesn't pay commision on any additional passengers you pick up on lyft line.
> 
> ...


Sounds about right. Give it a few months -- eventually you'll be paying them to drive.


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## Nuke (Dec 18, 2014)

Trump Economics What is the source of your information? I had suspicions about it but never sure if it was true.

And also your solution to this algorithm is to rate every rider 1-star. Won't this trigger a red flag on your account and lead to deactivation? Plus rating someone 1 star will prevent you from future matches with the same person which will hurt you in the long term


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

Nuke said:


> Trump Economics What is the source of your information? I had suspicions about it but never sure if it was true.
> 
> And also your solution to this fukd up algorithm is to rate every rider 1-star. Won't this trigger a red flag on your account and lead to deactivation? Plus rating someone 1 star will prevent you from future matches with the same person which will hurt you in the long term


Nuke I'm not sure it would be appropriate for Lyft to flag your account, as there aren't any parameters for rating someone poorly. Plus, it's not Lyft's job to determine what's unsatisfactory in your mind and what's not. If you say it's a 1-star ride, it's a 1-star ride, and the same thing goes for a passenger. If you're ever questioned, tell the truth. "Hey, your service has been horrible to me for x, y and z. You cause me mental anguish on a daily basis and this translates into how I view your passenger, so they're rated accordingly." *Fact: *Lyft asks you to rate your passenger based on your experience. "I'm sorry, but my experience is horrible because I'm making less than minimum wage, and your customer is responsible for this because they booked the ride," I'd say. Also, a 1-star rating will ensure you are not matched with the same person again, but if you live in a big city, who cares? The odds of being in the right place at the right time (for a repeat call) are few and far between. Plus, the system would likely say, "Oh, I can't match this passenger and this driver together, but here's another person 2 feet away that they can have." In fact, the system is already doing that by segregating your calls.

P.S. My knowledge is my source


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## SmokestaXX (Dec 17, 2016)

Similar situation happened to me with Uber. I got into a steady groove of pickup/dropoff with decent fares. I returned 2 the hotpot and noticed others were getting requests b4 me even though I had been sitting there. At 1st I took it as a welcomed break but after 30mins it became obvious. I was finally able to rule out paranoia when another driver noticed what was happening and walked over & started talking with me about it. Then he got a request. During this sequence of events, I had been sending messages to Uber about this situation & got the BS run around reply. Finally got somewhat of an apology reply, started to drive off, and suddenly I got a request.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

SmokestaXX said:


> Similar situation happened to me with Uber. I got into a steady groove of pickup/dropoff with decent fares. I returned 2 the hotpot and noticed others were getting requests b4 me even though I had been sitting there. At 1st I took it as a welcomed break but after 30mins it became obvious. I was finally able to rule out paranoia when another driver noticed what was happening and walked over & started talking with me about it. Then he got a request. During this sequence of events, I had been sending messages to Uber about this situation & got the BS run around reply. Finally got somewhat of an apology reply, started to drive off, and suddenly I got a request.


So the question remains, "Why is this not being reported on in the press? Why is this not proof of an employer-employee relationship?" There's nothing independent about being sidelined when there's work to your right and left. By choosing one driver over the other, is this not discriminatory?


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## Charlie Schwartz (Aug 17, 2016)

Trump Economics said:


> I figured that was happening! If a driver finishes a call and is a few minutes closer to the passenger, it would make sense for the system to cancel on you and throw it to them. In Los Angeles, this area is known as Thousand Oaks, or any area up in the hills. Just pray the call cancels before your reception drops.


They dont have the thingie that Uber has which routes calls to drivers before they drop off their previous pax?


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

Charlie Schwartz said:


> They dont have the thingie that Uber has which routes calls to drivers before they drop off their previous pax?


They do, but the rules still apply.


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## twerkyo.....UBERRRRR (Oct 13, 2015)

I love conspiracy theories. I tell you what. Lyft is the dumber of the 2 companies. I have exploited every loophole in their system and after being deactivated, they welcomed me back with open arms. Trust me, these companies are far from smart with their ping algorithm. 

If you can imagine 3 drunk bros throwing darts at a wall, that's how they choose random surges etc... The only thing they have is the data they mine from drivers and pax. That is it. 

It took uber 4 years to figure out if location services was off on an iPhone. 

State of the art.... My ass


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## REX HAVOC (Jul 4, 2016)

Trump Economics said:


> *You want the truth? *
> I don't see the logic in this. If you rate every pax a 1 star you'll never get tips and the pax will rate you low in retaliation and pretty soon you'll be dropped due to poor ratings. Btw, if you don't want to take Lyft Line, send support a note and they'll remove you from getting anymore line rides.
> *
> 
> ...


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

twerkyo.....UBERRRRR said:


> I love conspiracy theories. I tell you what. Lyft is the dumber of the 2 companies. I have exploited every loophole in their system and after being deactivated, they welcomed me back with open arms. Trust me, these companies are far from smart with their ping algorithm.
> 
> If you can imagine 3 drunk bros throwing darts at a wall, that's how they choose random surges etc... The only thing they have is the data they mine from drivers and pax. That is it.
> 
> ...


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## macchiato (Sep 29, 2015)

MyPerspective said:


> Amazing thread.
> 
> Just found out today that lyft keeps the fares and doesn't pay commision on any additional passengers you pick up on lyft line.
> 
> ...


That's why we want Lyft to itemize each pax pickup and drop in the ride history. They hide the info because they know they're cheating.


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## kcdrvr15 (Jan 10, 2017)

If enough drivers filed complaints with their states attorney generals office, and follow up with their local congressman, this may get changed. The problem is this behavior by Lyft and fuber may not be illegal or very difficult to prove. Both of these companies have good legal teams and have probably already planned for any legal challenge. The TOS and "contract" we agreed to will protect them from lawsuits.

I understand the companies doing the redirected requests, this makes the wait time for the rider shorter, but to lie to the driver and say the pax cancelled and not pay a cancellation fee is just another example of how fuber and lyft exploit drivers.


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## Bandy (Jul 26, 2016)

Trump Economics said:


> * Are you aware that your tips on Lyft are being used against you in order to reduce your pay?
> 
> 
> View attachment 97135
> ...


Does anyone know if Uber is the same?


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## Drivingforprofit (Jan 14, 2017)

Jagent said:


> The solution is to stop playing their stupid game. Stop accepting pings over 10 minutes away. If eveeyone does this, it throws a wrench in their plans.
> 
> This totally explains why I get tons of stupid pings from Lyft. I only run Lyft when Uber is dead, but I get tons more Lyft pings. The problem is, they are all super far away from me. ...which is why I never run the app. Which is why I get the marathon pings. It's like being on a hamster wheel.


I respect what you are saying here; but did you operate the Lyft platform on VD? It was a seamless stream of primetime rides that were hitting them for $12 to $14 dollars for 6 to 7 blocks. I am not diminishing what you are saying; but VD was legitimate.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

Bandy said:


> Does anyone know if Uber is the same?


I'll give you 3 guesses.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

Drivingforprofit said:


> I respect what you are saying here; but did you operate the Lyft platform on VD? It was a seamless stream of primetime rides that were hitting them for $12 to $14 dollars for 6 to 7 blocks. I am not diminishing what you are saying; but VD was legitimate.





Drivingforprofit said:


> I respect what you are saying here; but did you operate the Lyft platform on VD? It was a seamless stream of primetime rides that were hitting them for $12 to $14 dollars for 6 to 7 blocks. I am not diminishing what you are saying; but VD was legitimate.


Glad you had a good night


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## Bandy (Jul 26, 2016)

Trump Economics said:


> I'll give you 3 guesses.


So that would be no, maybe and yes? lol...


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## 2CV750CC (Nov 18, 2015)

Trump Economics said:


> I hate calling passengers in advance. I prefer the disappointment in person. Plus, I don't want to take on the role of _other drivers_. Chances are, a driver has called them before, asked where they're going, and cancelled on them. If I call the passenger, what if they think I'm one of those drivers and cancels on me first?


I call and don't ask where they are going, just tell them it is a 10 min drive to get to them - that way they can choose to cancel or wait, usually works out really well


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## CTridz (Feb 20, 2017)

macchiato said:


> The way they operate is such a socialist mindset. We don't get paired on who is closer but who has been online the longest without a ping. This is why we get far distance pings.


I've only been driving with Lyft for a short time but I think I'm starting to see the pattern. On another forum someone posted that Lyft gives you calls within a certain radius of your current location. The radius expands proportional to how long you have been logged in to driver mode without a call. If you've only been online for 30 seconds you will probably get the call if someone standing next to your car requests a Lyft. However, a driver that hasn't gotten a ping in the last hour may have priority over you for a ride in a neighboring town. That seems to be mostly consistent with my experiences so far.


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## eboe (Jun 29, 2016)

The Prime Time thing is also BS. It's happening all over the place to drivers here, and a couple have said they have seen, after asking, on the Pax phone at the end of the trip, where the Pax actually paid for the Prime Time that we did not receive. Which completely explains why Lyft isn't more concerned as to why it could be, for example, 300-700% for 5 full minutes, and I got 2 pings during that time period, the first one started and finished on a short ride, with no PT, then the next one started with the map still nutso, and was a base fare $18 ride, boom, no PT. You would think that they would want their 25% to be tripled or more. But, if they are instead reaping the full tripling and not just the tripling of the 25%, why not just tell us that the pax didn't see PT? After all, we aren't going to see the pax apps usually. 

So, I implore you, if this happens to you, please ask the pax to see their app. I discussed this with a couple of random pax and they both stated that while they hate paying surge etc, if they have to, they sure as hell want the driver to get their part of it.


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## eboe (Jun 29, 2016)

Trump Economics said:


> I'll give you 3 guesses.


Uber is supposedly set up as proximity only.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

CTridz said:


> I've only been driving with Lyft for a short time but I think I'm starting to see the pattern. On another forum someone posted that Lyft gives you calls within a certain radius of your current location. The radius expands proportional to how long you have been logged in to driver mode without a call. If you've only been online for 30 seconds you will probably get the call if someone standing next to your car requests a Lyft. However, a driver that hasn't gotten a ping in the last hour may have priority over you for a ride in a neighboring town. That seems to be mostly consistent with my experiences so far.


Oh, the "independence" of it all.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

eboe said:


> The Prime Time thing is also BS. It's happening all over the place to drivers here, and a couple have said they have seen, after asking, on the Pax phone at the end of the trip, where the Pax actually paid for the Prime Time that we did not receive. Which completely explains why Lyft isn't more concerned as to why it could be, for example, 300-700% for 5 full minutes, and I got 2 pings during that time period, the first one started and finished on a short ride, with no PT, then the next one started with the map still nutso, and was a base fare $18 ride, boom, no PT. You would think that they would want their 25% to be tripled or more. But, if they are instead reaping the full tripling and not just the tripling of the 25%, why not just tell us that the pax didn't see PT? After all, we aren't going to see the pax apps usually.
> 
> So, I implore you, if this happens to you, please ask the pax to see their app. I discussed this with a couple of random pax and they both stated that while they hate paying surge etc, if they have to, they sure as hell want the driver to get their part of it.


Thanks for this -- super helpful!! Didn't realize they were doing this to other people, too.


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## Adieu (Feb 21, 2016)

Keep going on and offline 


macchiato said:


> The way they operate is such a socialist mindset. We don't get paired on who is closer but who has been online the longest without a ping. This is why we get far distance pings.


I get repeat clients all the time on Lyft.

In multiple cities, both urban and suburban.



Trump Economics said:


> Nuke I'm not sure it would be appropriate for Lyft to flag your account, as there aren't any parameters for rating someone poorly. Plus, it's not Lyft's job to determine what's unsatisfactory in your mind and what's not. If you say it's a 1-star ride, it's a 1-star ride, and the same thing goes for a passenger. If you're ever questioned, tell the truth. "Hey, your service has been horrible to me for x, y and z. You cause me mental anguish on a daily basis and this translates into how I view your passenger, so they're rated accordingly." *Fact: *Lyft asks you to rate your passenger based on your experience. "I'm sorry, but my experience is horrible because I'm making less than minimum wage, and your customer is responsible for this because they booked the ride," I'd say. Also, a 1-star rating will ensure you are not matched with the same person again, but if you live in a big city, who cares? The odds of being in the right place at the right time (for a repeat call) are few and far between. Plus, the system would likely say, "Oh, I can't match this passenger and this driver together, but here's another person 2 feet away that they can have." In fact, the system is already doing that by segregating your calls.
> 
> P.S. My knowledge is my source


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## Jurisinceptor (Dec 27, 2016)

Trump Economics said:


> * Are you aware that your tips on Lyft are being used against you in order to reduce your pay?
> 
> 
> View attachment 97135
> ...


Lyft sucks!


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## baylyft (Mar 4, 2017)

Trump Economics said:


> * Are you aware that your tips on Lyft are being used against you in order to reduce your pay?
> 
> 
> View attachment 97135
> ...


I would concur on the $18/hr rate as that is what I have been tracking for the past 6 weeks based on trip revenue only, no tips and tolls... Seems to be very consistent... z


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

baylyft said:


> I would concur on the $18/hr rate as that is what I have been tracking for the past 6 weeks based on trip revenue only, no tips and tolls... Seems to be very consistent... z


What's your hourly rate now? Do you miss 2016 yet?


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

Also, drivers (in most areas) need to maintain a 4.6, not a 4.8. Also, it's very rare for a driver to be terminated for low ratings. It's flags and repeated incidents, which they have documented, that will get you kicked off of the platform.

And I keep telling people, "Demand proof if you're deactivated. Take them to small claims court and you'll win. A passenger's word is HERESAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They have to show evidence that you were drunk, high, rude, etc. Where's the drug test? Where's the cell phone footage? Sue for backwages!!!!" Most passengers just make up lies and rate drivers poorly SO THEY CAN GET A FREE RIDE CREDIT. Lyft has a history of well-documented discrimination; against drivers, minorities, the disabled, etc. Your case would be a SLAM DUNK.

*Mic drop*


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## kk21912003 (May 5, 2017)

Trump Economics said:


> * Are you aware that your tips on Lyft are being used against you in order to reduce your pay?
> 
> 
> View attachment 97135
> ...


I pretty much believe what you said above. I am just an ordinary driver and know very little about *Algorith system. *Uber and Lyft have so many high-educated computer or software engineers working for them and there must be something, good or dirty, for them to be busy at everyday. After doing UBER and LYFT for quite a while, I will say Lyft currently is no better than Uber at all, if not worse given what you said is true. I have a feeling that most Lyft riders hate Uber and have unrealistic expectation on Lyft and Lyft wants its drivers to sacrifice themselves to meet those riders' expectation with no better payment and treatment but the suspicious tip system and a hint based on this tip system " we are better than Uber". Uber and Lyft are same at present, work only in your best interest instead of either of them. Stop praising either of them just because of the hatred on the other one or unknown purposes.


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## Jenny01 (Apr 12, 2015)

Trump Economics said:


> * Are you aware that your tips on Lyft are being used against you in order to reduce your pay?
> 
> 
> View attachment 97135
> ...


What tips?


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

That being said ate there any cases where drivers have won v Lyft in small clainm?


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## MrMikeNC (Feb 16, 2017)

Might be something to this. Lately I've been sitting in pink sections on Saturday nights, where its 300% or higher, and I'll either get no pings or a ping then a cancellation.



Stan07 said:


> Did you guys know that Lyft cancel your rides as soon as they find the closer driver? And they send you the text, as if pax canceled it!
> LYFT CANCELED: X has canceled the Lyft request.


Yeah sitting in "hot" pink zones/prime time (300% or better) with no pings or cancellations led me to this conclusion, I just have no way to prove it.


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

No pings: Lyft system sucksred you into believing there was truly a demand for that area

Ping then cancellation: thought this was due to pax losing their fecal matter when they realize how much they are about to be raped by Lyft PT. >,<


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## Certain Judgment (Dec 2, 2016)

Trump Economics, I am curious. How do you have this much information on the inner workings of Lyft's algorithms?


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## circle1 (Sep 17, 2016)

Trump Economics said:


> Also, drivers (in most areas) need to maintain a 4.6, not a 4.8. Also, it's very rare for a driver to be terminated for low ratings. It's flags and repeated incidents, which they have documented, that will get you kicked off of the platform.
> 
> And I keep telling people, "Demand proof if you're deactivated. Take them to small claims court and you'll win. A passenger's word is HERESAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They have to show evidence that you were drunk, high, rude, etc. Where's the drug test? Where's the cell phone footage? Sue for backwages!!!!" Most passengers just make up lies and rate drivers poorly SO THEY CAN GET A FREE RIDE CREDIT. Lyft has a history of well-documented discrimination; against drivers, minorities, the disabled, etc. Your case would be a SLAM DUNK.
> 
> *Mic drop*


You're making me hyperventilate here!!!! This is S-O-O freakin' obvious! I feel like punchin' somebody in the face!


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## senorCRV (Jan 3, 2017)

I think $18 an hour is Lyft's total market share in OH


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## circle1 (Sep 17, 2016)

Certain Judgment said:


> Trump Economics, I am curious. How do you have this much information on the inner workings of Lyft's algorithms?


He's living it. Other drivers are beginning to report the same experiences.


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## Trump Economics (Jul 29, 2015)

Cynergie said:


> That being said ate there any cases where drivers have won v Lyft in small clainm?


I haven't found anything publicly -- most drivers don't know you can sue Lyft in small claims court. I'm guessing most go right to an attorney who inevitably says, "Arbitration agreement, minimal return, so 'no.'"


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## NYCTLC (Mar 23, 2017)

This is why they advertise the phrase, *"Guaranteed pay 1200/per week"*. They just left out the rest of the sentence *"...Across the board"*.


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## DavidHill76 (Apr 20, 2017)

Trump Economics said:


> * Are you aware that your tips on Lyft are being used against you in order to reduce your pay?
> 
> 
> View attachment 97135
> ...


I'm Sarah in this situation. I qualify for the power driver bonus every weekend for the most part. They're even letting Lyft Riders go in front of me at the airport queue who showed up after me. This is getting ridiculous. Coming up on 2 months of driving solely for the lift, and this is how I'm treated?



Trump Economics said:


> *shakes head*
> 
> This practice should be made into a lawsuit. No, seriously -- I'm not litigious, but it's happened to you, it's happened to me, and that means it's happened to a million other people.
> 
> ...


It's definitely happened to me a couple of times



Adieu said:


> I've had waaaaaaaaay too many one-weekend PDB attempts end 1 ride short of PDB 20% (or 2, if I didn't accept or cancelled pings that would screw me)
> 
> And waaaaaaaaaaaay too many NoHo / Pasadena / Rolling Hills destinations when getting close
> 
> ...


What do you use to see your car while in driver mode?


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## Cynergie (Apr 10, 2017)

DavidHill76 so far the only way I know of to beat the system of airport queue purgatory, is to NOT put yourself into said queue in the first place. This personal discovery was by pure accident. It seems that if a new pax is within the vicknity of the pax youre dropping off at SFO, the likelyhood of the system pairing you with that new pax is VERY high. 

I've acquired return pax back to SF this way within seconds of dropping off the original pax. First time this happened, new pax had literally just walked out of the departure terminal and requested a Lyft ride. Immediately got me some 10ft away at the curb. Last week did a line drop of several pax. Was entering the on ramp back to SFO when I got a 10 min count down timer msg that said I needed to get back to the queue zone or risk "losing my place in line". 

Opted for the risk. lol


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