# Unraveling Uber’s Untruths



## KevinH (Jul 13, 2014)

https://onezero.medium.com/unraveling-ubers-untruths-ef5d203de11f
*Uber has written millions of lines of code, but none of it changes the reality that drivers need to feed their family and pay their rent*

*Dan Teran*
*23 hours ago·8 min read*









Photo: Robyn Beck/Getty Images

In 1938 Franklin Delano Roosevelt warned America, "do not let any calamity-howling executive with an income of $1,000 a day,&#8230; tell you&#8230; that a wage of $11 a week is going to have a disastrous effect on all American industry._"_ The following day he signed the Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA), for the first time establishing a federal minimum wage of $.25 an hour, a 40-hour workweek, and a ban on child labor in mining and manufacturing. New Deal initiatives, combined with the industrial boom of World War II, would not only usher in an unprecedented era of American economic growth but ensure that the wealth created was shared broadly with the burgeoning American middle class.

The United States in 2020 might look sadly familiar to FDR. In the past decade, we have returned to levels of income inequality and unemployment not seen since FDR sat in the Oval Office. In California, a new generation of what FDR called "economic royalists and sweaters of labor," are howling calamity again, as they ask voters to support them in depriving gig workers of the basic protections of the Fair Labor Standards Act. They may have traded in the top hat and monocle for Allbirds and a Patagonia vest and the factory floor for the mobile app, but the story remains the same.

Last year, the California State Legislature passed AB-5, which establishes an "ABC test" for determining the degree of control a company has over its workforce, and therefore what the proper classification should be. Based on the test, California has ruled that many gig workers, including Uber drivers, should qualify for the protections of employment under the FLSA and subsequent legislation.



> _*I think that Uber's employees, riders, and drivers deserve better information than they are getting.*_​


The FLSA and subsequent worker protections afforded to employees include a minimum wage, unemployment insurance, disability insurance, and, in California, paid family leave, paid sick leave, and vacation. They provide a foundation of security for tens of millions of American families and are especially critical today as we face a global pandemic.

Last month, Dara Khosrowshahi, the chief executive of Uber, published an op-ed in the _New York Times_ arguing against giving Uber drivers these basic protections. Uber has continued to make the same case elsewhere as it champions an upcoming ballot initiative that would allow it to continue denying workers the rights of being employees. The company, along with other gig economy employers, is committed to spending over $100 million to make sure it's drivers never see the benefits of employment.

While most working Americans can take a sick day, Uber drivers have been pushed to drive sick to put food on the table. Because they are deemed independent contractors, drivers lack proper training and are not empowered to speak up about unsafe working conditions, potentially contributing to the uncontrolled spread of Covid-19 in the United States relative to Europe.

What troubles me about Uber's argument against reclassifying its drivers as employees is not that it advocates for a policy designed to enrich executives and shareholders at the cost of workers. By now we should expect no less. What troubles me most is the lack of integrity with which the key arguments are made. I think that Uber's employees, riders, and drivers deserve better information than they are getting.

Through his writing and numerous recent interviews, Khosrowshahi has emerged as the face of the modern-day opponent of labor, the calamity-howling executive that FDR warned us about. In order to unravel some of the fundamental untruths of Uber's case, I'd like to address some of his own words directly.



> Why not just treat drivers as employees? [&#8230;] Uber would only have full-time jobs for a small fraction of our current drivers and only be able to operate in many fewer cities than today.


The letter begins by introducing a false constraint that drivers would be required to work full-time jobs or that Uber would be obligated to provide full-time jobs. Surely Khosrowshahi and his colleagues are familiar with the part-time job. There is no state or federal law that determines a minimum number of hours an employee must work in any given day, week, month, or even year. About 23 million Americans hold part-time jobs today, and 8 million Americans hold more than one.



> _*Did eliminating child labor increase the price of ladies' hosiery?
> Probably. Was it the right thing to do? Absolutely.*_​


To support this dubious claim, Khosrowshahi links to an opaque blog post written by an Uber employee. She says that _"_shifting to an employment model would put pressure on Uber to consolidate working hours across fewer workers in order to manage costs that are fixed per employee_._"

There is no mention of how giving a better deal to drivers might impact the hundreds of millions of dollars the company is currently spending to recruit and onboard new drivers.



> Rides would be more expensive, which would significantly reduce the number of rides people could take and, in turn, the number of drivers needed to provide those trips.


Uber has written millions of lines of code of software, but none of it changes the reality that someone has to drive you from A to B, and that that person needs to feed their family and pay their rent. The last time I rode in an Uber the driver told me he drove 19 minutes to pick me up. He then drove me for about 20 minutes, and I paid $19.70. Determining how much the average Uber driver makes per hour is a notoriously difficult task, but I would be surprised if after the cost of fueling and maintaining his vehicle he was making the New York City-mandated $15 minimum wage.

It is probably true that in order to provide the full benefits of employment to drivers, riders would be asked to pay a higher cost. However, is this a bad outcome? Did eliminating child labor increase the price of ladies' hosiery? Probably. Was it the right thing to do? Absolutely.



> _*It is okay to celebrate innovators without accepting their violations of labor laws as innovation.*_​


If lower prices mean depriving drivers of the basic benefits of employment and other protections designed to shield our most vulnerable workers, then perhaps Uber should reconsider certain aspects of the operation that cannot operate profitably. It is okay to celebrate innovators without accepting their violations of labor laws as innovation.



> More important than what I think is what drivers think: In public surveys over the last decade, the vast majority of drivers have said they don't want to be employees because of how much they value flexibility.


Central to Khosrowshahi's argument is that drivers do not want to be employees. He makes his argument by referencing another op-ed in the _New York Times_ that is written by Harry Campbell, a former part-time Uber and Lyft driver and the founder of _The Rideshare Guy_, a blog and podcast for ride-share drivers_._

Harry Campbell's voice is far from independent. He is a paid consultant for Uber, Lyft, and other ride-sharing companies. This is no secret. Five years ago he stated publicly that he was making more than $20,000 a month on this enterprise. His entrepreneurship is commendable, but Khosrowshahi's misrepresentation of the voice of the driver is not, nor is the _New York Times_' failure to note this conflict.

Campbell's article is titled "Uber Drivers Just Want to Be Free," but in the article, he says "they're essentially working an employee-like schedule but without any of the protections. That means no minimum wage, no unemployment insurance, no benefits, and no workers' compensation. I can't fault these drivers for pushing to improve their lives." What, exactly, do drivers want to be free from?

In Campbell's own words it sounds like the benefits of employment are exactly what drivers want&#8230; unless of course they were convinced that they could never have them and that the alternative to their current arrangement was no work at all. This is consistent with both Uber and Lyft threatening to shut down service in California before classifying workers properly, in a capital strike that would make even Ayn Rand blush.



> A recent survey commissioned by Uber and other companies found that two out of three app drivers would stop driving if their flexibility was compromised.


The greatest myth perpetuated by all gig economy companies is that workers have to choose between flexibility and the benefits of employment. The flexibility farce is the cornerstone untruth upon which Uber and its peers have built their business. Providing employees with scheduling flexibility is a choice that is made by the employer, and at many companies is perceived as a benefit. Uber conveniently ignores this fact and instead chooses to intimidate their drivers into accepting the status quo.

If Uber fears the increased cost and responsibility of being an employer and taking responsibility for millions of people, I don't blame them. It is hard. I have faced all of these decisions, and their consequences, as co-founder and CEO of Managed by Q. Managed by Q was the target of frivolous lawsuits, outside union agitation, and was held responsible when our employees screwed up on the job. We screwed up too. It is not easy to be a large employer, especially of a financially and economically vulnerable employee population. But shouldn't we expect our highest-paid executives to solve our hardest problems? FDR warned of executives making $1,000 a day, what would he think of Khosrowshahi's compensation package of over $40 million?

When Khosrowshahi joined Uber as CEO, he introduced a new company value: "We do the right thing, period."

In 1938 unemployment was at 19%, nearly double what it is today. The opponents of the FLSA cried job destruction, called the bill unconstitutional, and were successful in killing the bill on the floor of the House the first time around. Roosevelt persisted and prevailed. In the depths of the Great Depression, millions of Americans got a raise. With 80 years of hindsight, it is clear that FDR did the right thing.

Today, Uber has the opportunity to be a leader and once again expand the protections of the FLSA to nearly 1 million workers at a time when they need it most. Instead, Uber is investing hundreds of millions of dollars to deprive their drivers, in many ways the same immigrant and minority workforce FDR sought to protect, of the very protections of the FLSA.

It took decades to know that the New Dealers were right and that a minimum wage could build the middle class, expand purchasing power, and grow the pie for everyone. We don't need 80 years to pass to know what is the right thing to do here. I am not asking anyone to delete Uber, I am asking for Uber's employees, drivers, and customers to rise to the moment and challenge Khosrowshahi to live by his own stated value, and do the right thing for the company and for our country.


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## dmoney155 (Jun 12, 2017)

OOOORrrrr... you could just use bubber to supplement your income and drive to fill in the gaps between actual job. Bubbering is not a job to provide food on table or pay rent. Stop treating it like one, and will have no quarrels with uber or lyft and actually would be thankful for what you have instead of trying to destroy it.

Drivers did it to themselves, trying to make it something that it is not.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

dmoney155 said:


> OOOORrrrr... you could just use bubber to supplement your income and drive to fill in the gaps between actual job. Bubbering is not a job to provide food on table or pay rent. Stop treating it like one, and will have no quarrels with uber or lyft and actually would be thankful for what you have instead of trying to destroy it.
> 
> Drivers did it to themselves, trying to make it something that it is not.


Did what to ourselves?

The first year i drove for uber i cleared $1000-2000 a WEEK.


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## W00dbutcher (Jan 14, 2019)

So "filling in the gaps" is sufficient for you maybe. However some people would actually like to make minimum wage and compensation for the vehicle that they are using to make this company millions of dollars.

They spend millions of dollars to make sure and you can never progressed further in life at this job.

While it fills the gaps for you it makes a lot of employees at his company very rich at your expense.



Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> Did what to ourselves?
> 
> The first year i drove for uber i cleared $1000-2000 a WEEK.


Yes this is true I'm in the same category as you. However there are many who aren't and never will be cause they don't know how to use the system against itself.

This is where a min wage and car reimbursement should come into play.

If you can make $22 or more an hour, that is sufficient for more people to cover the minimum wage in maintenance. If you can clear $12 an hour you're losing money all the way around.


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## Clothahump (Mar 31, 2018)

KevinH said:


> * income inequality*


I love that *term.* Can anyone explain what it means? Should the janitor be paid the same rate as the CEO? Should a database administrator be paid the same as a data entry clerk?


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## W00dbutcher (Jan 14, 2019)

No they should not... But they also make a minimum wage that's guaranteed.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

dmoney155 said:


> Drivers did it to themselves, trying to make it something that it is not.


That's plain and simple BS.

Uber heavily recruited FULL TIME drivers in the early days and got into trouble with the govt for inflating the average yearly earnings of full drivers in their ads.



Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> Did what to ourselves?
> 
> The first year i drove for uber i cleared $1000-2000 a WEEK.


Gotta love that "it's the drivers' fault" BS.

Yeah, it's the drivers' fault that Uber heavily recruited drivers with decent pay rates (more than triple the current per mile rate in most markets) and then pulled the rug out from under them with massive rate cuts.

In the early days there were some drivers pulling in more than 100k per year, and some of those drivers had quit good-paying jobs for what appeared to be the ideal job, only to be betrayed by Travis and Zimmer.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

W00dbutcher said:


> So "filling in the gaps" is sufficient for you maybe. However some people would actually like to make minimum wage and compensation for the vehicle that they are using to make this company millions of dollars.
> 
> They spend millions of dollars to make sure and you can never progressed further in life at this job.
> 
> ...


back then it was easy... go downtown at 1:45 log in at 2:05 am and get a surge fare. 3-4x and your looking at $30-100 easy. Get 2-3 surges and that's easily $150.

then you clean up the vomit or whatever... and at 4:00 go back out for early morning airport runs.

by 8:00 am I was at $200+

And the not such as good times... 5:00 pm to midnight was easily another $100

then during the day 8:00 am to 3:00 pm?

that was good for racking up short trips for incentives.

30 fares for $200-300 bonus... 2 days I could knock that out and that's another $400-700. Just had to make sure that I was only online in high demand areas. I worked out by the university during the day to get that... piles of short trips were great for knocking out the weekly incentive.

it was so stupid easy back then.


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> back then it was easy... go downtown at 1:45 log in at 2:05 am and get a surge fare. 3-4x and your looking at $30-100 easy. Get 2-3 surges and that's easily $150.
> 
> then you clean up the vomit or whatever... and at 4:00 go back out for early morning airport runs.
> 
> ...


It was a great ride!! Then reality set in and The Algorithm discovered most drivers don't know their cost of doing business.


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## W00dbutcher (Jan 14, 2019)

goneubering said:


> It was a great ride!! Then reality set in and The Algorithm discovered most drivers don't know their cost of doing business.


Wrong... Reality set in when Uber executives realized they can rob all the new drivers till there's was just a bone to give them.....and no one complained.

Or had the means or outlet to do so.


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

W00dbutcher said:


> Wrong... Reality set in when Uber executives realized they can rob all the new drivers till there's was just a bone to give them.....and no one complained.
> 
> Or had the means or outlet to do so.


Some drivers here complain because they know their cost of participating in the rideshare business. Unfortunately most drivers don't know.

The pay rate when Uber started was unsustainable but they did it initially to create a new business model.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

so reading all the replies: AB5 is the solution? As I always ask, what happens to all those who want AB5, what happens if you are not selected to be 'hired'?

Happy those hired have some version 'minimum wage'? Even if you weren't hired and now find yourself with no 'gig' at all? Hum.


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## ANT 7 (Oct 14, 2018)

dmoney155 said:


> Drivers did it to themselves, trying to make it something that it is not.


Bingo......

People who are unemployable in real jobs of any kind are just "some" of the ones doing rideshare, and they want rideshare to be the same as the real job they could never get, because their inherent personal character flaws prevent them from doing so.

****ed up people want free shit. The problem is not Uber, it is the ****ed up people driving for Uber.

Being a contractor works just fine for me. I do this full time 60 hours a week Monday to Friday. If the math didn't make sense, and as I am a personally responsible individual, then, I would simply not drive Uber. I could go and get a different jobby job because I am employable.

This is now about the state wanting tax money from employees, and since some of these contractor's screwed it for EVERYONE by making a lot of noise about not being treated like employees, they are about to make half as much money now, and have to do pickups at WalMart to make minimum wage if AB5 passes.

Idiots always reap what they sow.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

OK, how many believe RS is a legit career choice? Oh, where is the master of polls, sounds like a good one: Is RS a career?


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## W00dbutcher (Jan 14, 2019)

SHalester said:


> OK, how many believe RS is a legit career choice? Oh, where is the master of polls, sounds like a good one: Is RS a career?


It's a career if you can make it work for yourself. Then again making cotten candy at gatherings is a carrier of you can make it work for yourself...


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

W00dbutcher said:


> It's a career if you can make it work for yourself.


Yeah, I think not. Where is the advancement? Where are the raises?

It's a JOB if you can make it work for yourself. A dead end job. You do RS for 10 years at the end you are exactly where you started. Yikes?


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## I will crack Lyft hacks (Aug 5, 2019)

dmoney155 said:


> OOOORrrrr... you could just use bubber to supplement your income and drive to fill in the gaps between actual job. Bubbering is not a job to provide food on table or pay rent. Stop treating it like one, and will have no quarrels with uber or lyft and actually would be thankful for what you have instead of trying to destroy it.
> 
> Drivers did it to themselves, trying to make it something that it is not.


I got into this specifically because of the promises to be my own CEO.

In no way did I assume Being my own CEO was to be after my "OTHER" job.

The labor force for Uber started as full time professionals that switched over from Taxi, limo business with the idea of being their own CEO full time, not a kid game playing CEO after a actual job.


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## I will crack Lyft hacks (Aug 5, 2019)




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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

I will crack Lyft hacks said:


> I got into this specifically because of the promises to be my own CEO.
> 
> In no way did I assume Being my own CEO was to be after my "OTHER" job.
> 
> The labor force for Uber started as full time professionals that switched over from Taxi, limo business with the idea of being their own CEO full time, not a kid game playing CEO after a actual job.


You can't be your own CEO when all the rules are made by the other party.


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## IRME4EVER (Feb 17, 2020)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> Did what to ourselves?
> 
> The first year i drove for uber i cleared $1000-2000 a WEEK.


That is history :laugh:


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## NauticalWheeler (Jun 15, 2019)

say what you will. I made $100,000 driving for Uber last year. A long article was written about it, which @MHR Shared in another thread.


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## Nats121 (Jul 19, 2017)

goneubering said:


> The pay rate when Uber started was unsustainable but they did it initially to create a new business model.


How much were those "unsustainable" rates? Uber's growth was massive even in the earliest days of Uber X when the rates for X were quite a bit higher than taxi rates.

I have no doubt whatsoever that Uber could have succeeded excellently with Uber X priced a little below taxi rates. Drivers would have made good money and the pax would be enjoying the convenience of readily available rides at prices lower than taxis.

But that wasn't good enough for Travis and his greedy investors. They wanted to rule the transportation world at virtually any cost.



NauticalWheeler said:


> say what you will. I made $100,000 driving for Uber last year. A long article was written about it, which @MHR Shared in another thread.


What service type (X, XL, etc)?

I don't believe it, but even if you did, so what? You're an extreme outlier, a freak.

The fact that so few drivers make decent money at this is an indictment against these companies.

A 97% turnover rate for a job that offers flexible hours is shameful.


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## I will crack Lyft hacks (Aug 5, 2019)

IRME4EVER said:


> That is history :laugh:


You sound like Travis talking after he ordered a rate cut.

History repeats itself.








NauticalWheeler said:


> say what you will. I made $100,000 driving for Uber last year. A long article was written about it, which @MHR Shared in another thread.


If you made 100k with Uber 5-8 years ago it's no big deal.

They reduced rates to the degree that drivers making 100k early on are at 50% of that at best now.

We would like details

If someone leaves their normal job and starts ride-share full time, is 100k income a reasonable goal.
What areas have rates and have not been saturated markets to allow a person to start rideshare and make 100k.
Is it simply a smart driver vs dumb driver issue, or a issue of rate cuts and saturation that doesn't allow others to have your experience.


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## Soldiering (Jan 21, 2019)

dmoney155 said:


> OOOORrrrr... you could just use bubber to supplement your income and drive to fill in the gaps between actual job. Bubbering is not a job to provide food on table or pay rent. Stop treating it like one, and will have no quarrels with uber or lyft and actually would be thankful for what you have instead of trying to destroy it.
> 
> Drivers did it to themselves, trying to make it something that it is not.


I agree with you partially.

I've been boobering FULL time 5 years. I've averaged 55k a year.



SHalester said:


> Yeah, I think not. Where is the advancement? Where are the raises?
> 
> It's a JOB if you can make it work for yourself. A dead end job. You do RS for 10 years at the end you are exactly where you started. Yikes?


I've done RS for 4.5 years. I've accumalated an 80k savings in that time.


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## I will crack Lyft hacks (Aug 5, 2019)

*FTC Says Uber Misled Drivers, Company To Pay $20M Settlement*









The Federal Trade Commission announced that high-flying gig economy company Uber will pay $20 million to settle charges that "it misled prospective drivers with exaggerated earning claims and claims about [vehicle] financing," according to a press release.

According to the FTC, Uber overstated how much drivers could expect to make in a number of cities.


> The FTC alleges that Uber claimed on its website that uberX drivers' annual median income was more than $90,000 in New York and over $74,000 in San Francisco. The FTC alleges, however, that drivers' annual median income was actually $61,000 in New York and $53,000 in San Francisco. In all, less than 10 percent of all drivers in those cities earned the yearly income Uber touted. The FTC also alleges that Uber made high hourly earnings claims in job listings, including on Craigslist, but that the typical Uber driver failed to earn those advertised hourly amounts in various cities


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## NauticalWheeler (Jun 15, 2019)

I will crack Lyft hacks said:


> You sound like Travis talking after he ordered a rate cut.
> 
> History repeats itself.
> 
> ...


@MHR , look what I've done &#128556;


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## Big Lou (Dec 11, 2019)

KevinH said:


> https://onezero.medium.com/unraveling-ubers-untruths-ef5d203de11f
> *Uber has written millions of lines of code, but none of it changes the reality that drivers need to feed their family and pay their rent*
> 
> *Dan Teran*
> ...


By the Uber/Lyft admissions, the drivers are not in the profitability equation.
Remember......Those two companies are in the technology business which involves matching drivers with passengers. Their hands are clean. 
Sadly.....Prop 22 will win the day and we'll have to deal with it. It all barrels down to a poorly and hastily written bill AB5. It had all the good intentions but did not take into account the rest of the gig workers in California or for that matter, the country.
There comes a time to swallow this nasty pill and deal with it!


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

Soldiering said:


> I agree with you partially.
> 
> I've been boobering FULL time 5 years. I've averaged 55k a year.
> 
> ...


In Peoria??!!


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## Soldiering (Jan 21, 2019)

goneubering said:


> In Peoria??!!


The whole Valley


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

I will crack Lyft hacks said:


> *FTC Says Uber Misled Drivers, Company To Pay $20M Settlement*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I got zilch from this. When I contacted the FTC to find out where my share was they said I was not eligible. &#128545;


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

The Gift of Fish said:


> I got zilch from this. When I contacted the FTC to find out where my share was they said I was not eligible. &#128545;


Who's eligible?


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Unravel Uber Untruths

And you Unravel the FABRIC OF UBER !!!


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

tohunt4me said:


> Unravel Uber Untruths
> 
> And you Unravel the FABRIC OF UBER !!!


Or the fabric of the space/time continuum!!


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

goneubering said:


> Who's eligible?


Drivers who started in 2014 and 2015 when Uber posted the ads lying about average earnings. However, the FTC's fickle finger of random has selected the drivers to be paid out and the money's all gone now.


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