# rider caused the accident



## Umair alam

hi everyone.

I drive uber in toronto, canada. I was Driving uber rider to the destination.
after reaching to the destination. i parked the car. she open the door to get off the car. The car from the back smashed the whole door. 
i emailed uber help & support tell them about the accident. after a day they contact me only to get more information aand ask me to send the pics for the accident and all detials. ask me to complete incident service form. 

they told me an agent from insurance company will call me and will go through the stuff. he hasn't called me yet. 3 days are gone. and this waiting period is killing me. i domt have car to drive to.my other work. and my.new car is damaged.

i.want to ask u guys.

1) its the uber rider fault, do i have to.invovle my personl insurance.. i have never told them that im Driving uber
2) will uber cover my car damages

3) if they don't. what should i do.. becuase fixinf door.will csot me alot.. and its not.my faults..


please help me out. im so scared right now. don't know what will.happen


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## phillipzx3

It's the operator of the car who's at fault. First thing I tell my customer(s) is that *I* will open the door for them.

You're lucky you're not in Oregon. You'd get a ticket plus when your insurance company found out, they'd drop you like a hot potato.

Why do Uber drivers expose themselves to such risk for so little reward?

Rhetorical question....the answer is so they can claim how much cheaper they are than a cab. Let us know how being cheaper without carrying commercial insurance works out for you. ;-)


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## Umair alam

phillipzx3 said:


> It's the operator of the car who's at fault. First thing I tell my customer(s) is that *I* will open the door for them.
> 
> You're lucky you're not in Oregon. You'd get a ticket plus when your insurance company found out, they'd drop you like a hot potato.
> 
> Why do Uber drivers expose themselves to such risk for so little reward?


How come its my fault. she suppose to look back before opening the door. that's the normal procedure. I talk to the police . they told me the same thing


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## MrPincushion

Ignore members who insult you when you need a question answered. 

Do not contact your personal insurance. Only go through Uber's insurance. You will be liable for a $1000 deductible if they cover you, but it sounds as though your repair will be twice that at least. I hate to say it but you need to be patient, you will hear from them.


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## Umair alam

I really appreciate it you helping here.
Patience is the only thing its under my control.
I will go to the uber office today. Let see what they say.

Im curious about $1000 deductible, does this meant, I have to pay $1000 and whatever the rest amount is will be paid my uber ?

Second, If they say no, we don't cover you, What should I do then ?


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## MrPincushion

Yes you are liable for the 1st $1000 of repair cost. If the repair is $1000 or lower, you're on your own. It does sound as though your repair will be more than that. 

Given that you were still in period 3 with a rider in the car, they are likely to cover you. If not, then small claims court would be your next option. Do yourself a favor, focus on what you know, not what you don't know. Until told otherwise, you are in the process of submitting a claim. Work on that.


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## Umair alam

I cant thank enough for your support and info.

Yes I already submit everything, details, filled the IRF form.
I am waiting for call from the insurance agent. I am thinking of going to the Mississauga uber office today to get more information.

I think it will cost more than $1000, because the back door need to be replaced and the front door dent can be fix.
But again, it wasn't my fault, then how come I end up paying money?

Secondly, Should I call the passenger and ask that if she has been contacted by uber ?


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## HoldenDriver

Did you get the contact information of the passenger? Photo of their ID? I hope you did, good luck getting it from Uber.

Since you were the driver, you will file the claim. File it with Uber, since you were in Phase 3 driving at the time the incident occurred. Even if you had already hit end trip, you were still legally in Phase 3 driving, as the passenger had not fully exited the vehicle.

Uber will charge you the $1,000 deductible. You can then pursue recovering the $1,000 deductible from the passenger that caused the damage, likely in small claims court. In many jurisdictions, you could also pursue lost wages from the Uber car being out of service, plus any costs to arrange alternate transportation.

Realistically, there are low odds you will collect the deductible from the passenger. Most small claims judgements are never recovered. The time and effort to get a lien on their property - assuming they have any - will exceed $1,000 worth of your time, even at minimum wage.

You are correct, the passenger is liable here. But you are the insurance holder with Uber. You have to pay the deductible. The passenger owes you what you are out to be made whole (the deductible)... but good luck ever seeing any of that recovery.

And do not ask Uber to pay the $1,000 deductible on your behalf. All that will do is likely get you deactivated from Uber permanently. If you're ready to quit, you actually have an interesting case for a small claims action against Uber - but I suspect the court would rule that the passenger has to pay you back the deductible, and not Uber itself.

The good news is that Uber insurance should cover the costs above $1,000. So that's some relief.

I would not advise speaking with the passenger until Uber's insurance company has processed your claim. Doing so could interfere with the insurance investigator's process - which should finish first. Only contact the passenger once the insurance company has completed the initial claim process.

_In some states, lawsuits related to a car accident can result in the defendant's driver's license being suspended - should they not at least enter into a payment plan. But I don't think this qualifies as the passenger was not driving the car in question - it's not technically a car accident as a result, just property damage.

Note: This is how it works in my state. Laws are likely different elsewhere, so this is not legal advice.

Source: Me. I don't work in insurance today... but I do have a degree in the field._


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## SEAL Team 5

Umair alam said:


> How come its my fault. she suppose to look back before opening the door. that's the normal procedure. I talk to the police . they told me the same thing


Because you're in care, custody and control of the vehicle. Insurance companies view it the same exact way. You'll be told that you should of exited the roadway to a safe place. You're now a business owner operating a vehicle commercially. You're expected to know all laws, rules and regulations.


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## HoldenDriver

SEAL Team 5 said:


> Because you're in care, custody and control of the vehicle. Insurance companies view it the same exact way. You'll be told that you should of exited the roadway to a safe place. You're now a business owner operating a vehicle commercially. You're expected to know all laws, rules and regulations.


Well, not quite. The things you describe above make the driver the claimant. Not the person necessarily liable.

You can park in a safe place, and still have a passenger damage your vehicle, through no fault of your own. It sounds like that happened here. Regardless of if this is treated as comprehensive or collision, the driver has responsibility for the deductible because of the fact they own the vehicle (_or the fact that they're the Uber partner, depending on how you split hairs_) - not because of responsibility/fault.

I suspect the insurance will deem this as 0% at-fault for the driver. Just based on the information fed to me by the driver - YMMV in reality.

As I mentioned in my post though, for the purposes of paying the deductible, the driver is likely required to pay for it - and then seeking reimbursement from those liable (in this case, probably the passenger).


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## HoldenDriver

phillipzx3 said:


> Rhetorical question....the answer is so they can claim how much cheaper they are than a cab. Let us know how being cheaper without carrying commercial insurance works out for you. ;-)


Push for changes in the law, then. In California, it works out perfectly. When I'm online for Uber, Uber's insurance takes over. When I'm offline, my personal insurance takes over. It's illegal for an insurance company to drop me, just for driving for Uber. Would make for an easy $10,000 small claims suit if any insurance company here was dumb enough to do it.

You do have to be careful at times. For example. Uber's Phase 1 coverage is laughably poor. I never drive in Phase 1 if at all possible.

There are some new gray areas like Driver Destinations mode, but those are edge cases that will work themselves out eventually.


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## SEAL Team 5

HoldenDriver said:


> It's illegal for an insurance company to drop me, just for driving for Uber.


In most states you're most likely correct. But it's not illegal for an insurance company to deny a claim.


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## HoldenDriver

SEAL Team 5 said:


> In most states you're most likely correct. But it's not illegal for an insurance company to deny a claim.


Sure (with valid cause*), but I don't think that's the situation here. Uber Phase 2 & 3 coverage includes both comprehensive and collision. Regardless of how the claim is treated, Uber should pay out beyond the deductible. Driver is obligated to file with Uber's insurance, and Uber's insurance should cover the claim. Simple, easy.

I realize this sounds like complicated insurance to some, but this is really, really straightforward. Driver should sleep soundly know he/she is probably only out $1,000 - and since it's being run through Uber, likely without even an accident record strike.

_* Actually in most areas, it's illegal for an insurance claim to be denied without a clear mitigating reason - lack of coverage, fraud, etc. But I get the point, and it's a fair one._


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## SEAL Team 5

HoldenDriver said:


> Sure (with valid cause*), but I don't think that's the situation here. Uber Phase 2 & 3 coverage includes both comprehensive and collision.
> 
> _* Actually in most areas, it's illegal for an insurance claim to be denied without a clear mitigating reason - lack of coverage, fraud, etc. But I get the point, and it's a fair one._


I'm on the Black/SUV platform and carry my own commercial insurance, so I may not know Uber X insurance too well. I was told Uber's comp/coll only mimics the drivers insurance. Also heard in Phoenix that everyone had to accept a new agreement that Uber has zero liability to the driver or the driver's vehicle. Please correct me if I'm wrong. 
But I know one thing for sure. In most all personal auto policies there is an exclusion of coverage if the vehicle is used for commercial or agricultural use.


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## HoldenDriver

SEAL Team 5 said:


> I'm on the Black/SUV platform and carry my own commercial insurance, so I may not know Uber X insurance too well. I was told Uber's comp/coll only mimics the drivers insurance. Also heard in Phoenix that everyone had to accept a new agreement that Uber has zero liability to the driver or the driver's vehicle. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
> But I know one thing for sure. In most all personal auto policies there is an exclusion of coverage if the vehicle is used for commercial or agricultural use.


A long time ago, what you described is correct. Things changed after the first time an uberX driver hit, and killed, a young child.

Uber instituted much greater policies, and divided coverage based on Phase 1, 2, and 3 driving periods.

Here's an article that outlines their California policies - this is largely mirrored in other states now too when it comes to coverage amounts: https://newsroom.uber.com/insurance-update-for-california-driver-partners/

As you can see from graphic below, the only "hole" today, is if a driver gets into a comprehensive accident in Phase 1 - or if a pax gets into an accident that exceeds coverage amounts. Which, being realistic, any uberX driver that kills or seriously injures someone - may be best off declaring Chapter 7 anyways - unless the other party's insurance settles for the policy amount, knowing the driver has no other assets.

And if you are some rich person that enjoys driving for uberX "for fun" - *don't*. Your personal umbrella policies are useless when online for Uber. I have a friend or two in this boat, and I really have tried to get them to stop.

Edit: Should mention that some like Farmer's do offer rideshare-compatible insurance enhancements, for people that can afford to do uberX for fun: http://www.farmers.com/carideshare/


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## SEAL Team 5

HoldenDriver said:


> A long time ago, what you described is correct. Things changed after the first time an uberX driver hit, and killed, a young child.
> 
> Uber instituted much greater policies, and divided coverage based on Phase 1, 2, and 3 driving periods.
> 
> Here's an article that outlines their California policies - this is largely mirrored in other states now too when it comes to coverage amounts: https://newsroom.uber.com/insurance-update-for-california-driver-partners/
> 
> As you can see from graphic below, the only "hole" today, is if a driver gets into a comprehensive accident in Phase 1 - or if a pax gets into an accident that exceeds coverage amounts. Which, being realistic, any uberX driver that kills or seriously injures someone - may be best off declaring Chapter 7 anyways - unless the other party's insurance settles for the policy amount, knowing the driver has no other assets.
> 
> And if you are some rich person that enjoys driving for uberX "for fun" - *don't*. Your personal umbrella policies are useless when online for Uber. I have a friend or two in this boat, and I really have tried to get them to stop.
> 
> Edit: Should mention that some like Farmer's do offer rideshare-compatible insurance enhancements, for people that can afford to do uberX for fun: http://www.farmers.com/carideshare/


Thank you very much HoldenDriver. I appreciate your time on this. Now make money and be safe.


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## 55iz2Lo

This is why you should activate the kiddy locks on the rear doors, then get out and open them when there are no cabbies looking to take them out. Some of them will do this on purpose to get you off the road. Get a commercial policy too. Too many drunk airheads open them without giving a crap


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## dizie

Can the other car's TPL fix the OP's door?


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## njn

55iz2Lo said:


> This is why you should activate the kiddy locks on the rear doors, then get out and open them when there are no cabbies looking to take them out. Some of them will do this on purpose to get you off the road.


Never heard of such tactics, but I can believe it.


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## Phoenix123

So what was the end result of this, I would like to know


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## Destin

Umair alam said:


> hi everyone.
> 
> I drive uber in toronto, canada. I was Driving uber rider to the destination.
> after reaching to the destination. i parked the car. she open the door to get off the car. The car from the back smashed the whole door.
> i emailed uber help & support tell them about the accident. after a day they contact me only to get more information aand ask me to send the pics for the accident and all detials. ask me to complete incident service form.
> 
> they told me an agent from insurance company will call me and will go through the stuff. he hasn't called me yet. 3 days are gone. and this waiting period is killing me. i domt have car to drive to.my other work. and my.new car is damaged.
> 
> i.want to ask u guys.
> 
> 1) its the uber rider fault, do i have to.invovle my personl insurance.. i have never told them that im Driving uber
> 2) will uber cover my car damages
> 
> 3) if they don't. what should i do.. becuase fixinf door.will csot me alot.. and its not.my faults..
> 
> please help me out. im so scared right now. don't know what will.happen


Hi,
I want to know how your claim end up with Uber, i was involved in accident while driving uber and i filed the claim wiht uber they told me an adjuster gonna contact me in 2-3 business days and now one week past im still waiting. Im kind of worry because i want to know what is goin on are they gonna cover me and get my car fix.


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## Spatel

Hi Umair, I involved same kind of accident you had in toronto. Pls share your experience so that many can be benefited.


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## Johny Sam

Please update us about what happened, we need to know how much did they cover and how much you had to pay out of pocket? Next time Always look for the rider and don't assume they will know when is safe to get out, verbally tell them to wait there are cars coming and when you see it's clear tell them they can proceed. You are the commander in chief boss, don't forget that.


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## Mars Troll Number 4

55iz2Lo said:


> This is why you should activate the kiddy locks on the rear doors


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depending on the jurisdiction having doors that don't open can put you get you into serious trouble with the law,
False imprisonment is not something that is easy to get out of.

This is a serious and a very bad situation to be in. In some jurisdiction taxis can't even do what you are suggesting, as it falls under false imprisonment, or possibly even kidnapping..

Depending on the jurisdiction taxis may or may not be able to lock people in until they pay. (shopkeepers privilege) In Orlando for instance i can't do that... which is why i charge a LOT of customers partial payment up front.

What YOUR'E DOING, goes WAY beyond that because... your getting paid through the app, so it's more than likely less acceptable to do it in an uber than in a taxi.

What *Might* be more acceptable is to just child lock the driver side doors and put a notice on that door that it's locked for safety reasons and to use the other door, a nice sticker next to your camera in use sticker could maybe work.


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## Uber Dog

screw uber

hire a lawyer. Everyone involved is more responsible than you.

lyft pays more anyway


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## MHR

The 1st time I caught a “day drunk” messing with the automated doors on my ride while IN MOTION I set the locks to automatically engage once I shift into Drive.

If anybody ever questions my decision I ALWAYS tell them about the drunk dude and they have all laughed and said they get it. The same drunk dude is also the reason that the rear climate control is locked down as well.


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## Uber Dog

uber sucks bigly

another driver hit my new car while rider was exiting

fake uber insurance

$1000 deductible, no rental car, no lost wages, nada

i fired uber and will likely sue them


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