# Rate the Fare not the PAX. $4.00 fare, no tip = automatic 1 Star



## DukeOfDallas

Seriously, I have started to rate my passengers on fares. Pax can be nicest person in the world, but if I drove 15 minutes out of my way for a $4.00 fare with no tip, automatic rating is a 1 star. 

Anyone else agree or use similar system?


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## DukeOfDallas

driving 15 minutes to make $4.00 before deductions IS a bad apple. Other drivers need to know this is a bad apple fare.


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## DukeOfDallas

I will continue to rate this way, and hopefully others will as well. Then, YOU can go and scoop up all the 15 minute trips for $4 you want. Have at it.


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## BayArea Lyft Driver

It's not the pax's fault there are no closer drivers. How do we tell who's cool or who's not? Those rating are for us to tell if the pax is going to be a ******bag or not


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## DukeOfDallas

The rating is now for us to tell is the PAX is a $4 ******bag / no tipper. New World Order. uber on!


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## BayArea Lyft Driver

Ok so out of curiosity, lets say this $4 ******bag wants a 50 mile run, he pings, you get it. You see the low rating. and you don't take it. 

How does that make any sense?


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## DukeOfDallas

someone will pick him up for the 50 mile run (not me) and rate him a five star. As for me I will continue to rate $4 ******bags as 1 star


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## DukeOfDallas

Rate the Fare not the customer. This is the only way Uber will take notice of negative earnings on short trips.


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## BayArea Lyft Driver

So how do we tell from who's actually a ******bag to someone who is going down the block?


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## DukeOfDallas

After other drivers switch to rating fares instead of passengers, you will know that 1 star = high probability of a shitty trip with no tip.


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## BayArea Lyft Driver

so lets say everyone in Dallas does it. Riders take short rides, and take long rides. They all become 1 star riders, now what?


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## Sly

One day the pax needs a ride to local bar. Next day he needs a ride to the airport. Same pax. We provide the short trips to get pax in the habit of using us so then we get the long trips too. We don't do the short trips then someone else gets them and they also get the long trips too. Nobody does long trips only.


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## DukeOfDallas

Longer riders = better fare for driver. They do not get 1 star. If you use me everyday for $4 fares with no tip, you will deviate down towards a PAX rating of 1 star which tells other drivers possible negative earnings alert.

Remember, these PAX taking $4 rides know you are driving 15 minutes to get them and know they should tip cash. They are part of the problem.


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## DukeOfDallas

Three stars = mixed length trips and Five stars - longer trips. Lower star rating - lower fare averages on that pax. Very simple.


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## BayArea Lyft Driver

Duke, you're making no sense. I repeat this again, if everyone in Dallas starts doing this, every uber rider will have a bad rating. What happens next?


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## UberHammer

Rating systems are inherently flawed, as a person can rate for whatever reason they want. 

To really know what the rating even means it would have to be done as a survey, and a well defined one at that. For example:

How would you rate the customers attitude? 1, 2, 3, 4, or 5?
How would you rate the profit you made on the trip? 1, 2, 3, 4, or 5?
Etc, etc....

When there is nothing but one rating being asked, it becomes nothing but a mass collection of all the different things that could be rated. Everybody isn't rating on the same question.


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## DukeOfDallas

Who does this for anything other than $ ... not me. New rating system is now pax with lower rating is lower fares with no tip. PERIOD. End of story. Rate the fare, not the passenger. DONE. I'll pass on all 1 stars because I am sick of driving 15 minutes to make $4 before deductions.


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## UberHammer

DukeOfDallas said:


> Who does this for anything other than $ ... not me. New rating system is now pax with lower rating is lower fares with no tip. PERIOD. End of story. Rate the fare, not the passenger. DONE. I'll pass on all 1 stars because I am sick of driving 15 minutes to make $4 before deductions.


I rate $4 fares in suburbs low. Have been for quite sometime now. I however don't rate $4 fares low in the hot spots. Sometimes I'll deadhead to hotspots for $0. So I don't ever mind being pulled to one, even for a minimum fare.

The suburb ones however typically require deadheading out of there to find more work. It is a huge flaw in Uber's system to pull drivers 15 minutes away into dead zones.


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## DukeOfDallas

That's the way it is now doggie. Low paycheck = low rating. The pax is part of the problem. Why don't you just drive folks around for free and quit moping?


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## Sly

DukeOfDallas said:


> That's the way it is now doggie. Low paycheck = low rating. The pax is part of the problem. Why don't you just drive folks around for free and quit moping?


So what happens if a Pax only needs to go 3 or 4 miles down the road you want them to walk? That isn't very entrepreneurial of you. You sound like a socialist.


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## DukeOfDallas

they wanna go 3-4 miles, they call Uber and then they tip their driver for the operating expense OR the get a 1 star rating and i refuse next pick-up. 

Rate The Fare Not The Pax!


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## UberHammer

Sly said:


> So what happens if a Pax only needs to go 3 or 4 miles down the road you want them to walk? That isn't very entrepreneurial of you. You sound like a socialist.


If I have to drive 6 to 8 miles to pick them up, at $0.90/mile and a$0 base fare, it's not entrepreneurial to drive them 3 to 4 miles. That's charitable.

Even with the $0.15 per minute, and 6 to 8 minutes for the passengers ride, it's a net of $0.32 to the driver per mile for the total miles (billed plus deadhead), which is right around what the car costs to operate. The driver gets NOTHING for their time.


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## getFubered

I'm with Dallas. In fact I only give 5 star and 1 star ratings. No one is evaluating or managing the pax like they do us. The sole purpose of the pax rating is for the driver to decide if they want the ride or not. 4 and 3 stars are pointless. You don't give mediocre rides for mediocre pax. 5 star means I, or other drivers, would want to give this person a ride again-LOOKING AT THE WHOLE PICTURE. Would you recommend or want to pick up non tipping colleges kids only to take them from one frat house to another 5 blocks away for no tip? **** no. Would you deal with a semiannoying pax if they wanted nothing but 20 mile rides to work? At these rates yes. 1 star means, I wouldn't want to do this again, who cares if they're nice or not.

Especially now with the no show fee, if pax make me wait 4 minutes, they're getting 1 starred. Pax aren't disciplined per se for low ratings-who ****ing cares. The point is for us to decide who we want to pick up, the whole picture needs weighed in on.


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## Kalee

DukeOfDallas said:


> Seriously, I have started to rate my passengers on fares. Pax can be nicest person in the world, but if I drove 15 minutes out of my way for a $4.00 fare with no tip, automatic rating is a 1 star.
> 
> Anyone else agree or use similar system?


Good luck with that. You're likely setting yourself up for deactivation.


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## Ripd

DukeofDallas should simply have the option to never be paired with a certain rider ever again... at his discretion. Riders should have the same option. Problem solved.


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## getFubered

Ripd said:


> DukeofDallas should simply have the option to never be paired with a certain rider ever again... at his discretion. Riders should have the same option. Problem solved.


It doesn't solve the problem because that same shitty rider or driver burdens everyone else.


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## Kalee

Ripd said:


> DukeofDallas should simply have the option to never be paired with a certain rider ever again... at his discretion. Riders should have the same option. Problem solved.


It is less costly to Uber to just deactivate the driver.


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## remy

I'm glad there are couple of people here who still provide with "hands and knees" service. Uber loves you! Riders thinks you are a joke! Drivers think you are a joke and as a whole we will bring this service down good or bad.


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## Ripd

getFubered said:


> It doesn't solve the problem because that same shitty rider or driver burdens everyone else.


Why do you care? Everyone trying to be Paul Revere is the problem here. Let them eliminate the problematic rider based on their own experiences... not your he said/she said bullshit. Ever heard of YMMV?


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## remy

upnetuser said:


> All these issues are driven by bad Uber policies and their anti-driver stances.
> 
> They don't let drivers limit their pickup radius. That causes silly games like rating passengers bad for having to drive far, sitting in a spot and not moving until they cancel, driver cancels, etc. Uber doesn't care if you drive 15 minutes for a $4 fare, they make their $1 and 20% regardless.
> 
> Seeing a trend here?


That is exactly right! It's all about commissions in seconds. Uber has time to time turned on that heat map to bring drivers out and no request. Drivers gets frustrated. As whole Uber community is so jacked up like cannibalizm.


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## scrurbscrud

UberHammer said:


> I rate $4 fares in suburbs low. Have been for quite sometime now. I however don't rate $4 fares low in the hot spots. Sometimes I'll deadhead to hotspots for $0. So I don't ever mind being pulled to one, even for a minimum fare.
> 
> The suburb ones however typically require deadheading out of there to find more work. *It is a huge flaw in Uber's system to pull drivers 15 minutes away into dead zones.*


Lyft has the same issue. After being pulled long distance out of prime time areas several times last nite, that I work hard to STAY IN, I said screw this and just knocked off early.

It's the only logical reaction to driver abuses. Rating the pax down doesn't do anything.

When are both of these companies going to get their heads out of their asses and put in a radius filter with price adjustments? Probably won't as long as fool drivers keep doing it. Most burb areas don't surge with hot spots on late nites either, which is another big HOLE in both of these companies systems. No reason on earth that burb drunks should get off the hook for cheap fares while hot spot pax pay what they should. Same with bad weather condition surge/prime time. Cover the whole city please!!!


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## getFubered

Ripd said:


> Why do you care? Everyone trying to be Paul Revere is the problem here. Let them eliminate the problematic rider based on their own experiences... not your he said/she said bullshit. Ever heard of YMMV?


Why do I care? Because I'm the one ****in picking them up! I know, I'm one of those cheapskates who doesn't want to risk my car and give my time for $1.50 net rides...It doesn't do anyone any good to give every pax 4 or 5 stars unless they puke.

If you turned the app on in a decent area and didn't accept a ride for an entire hour you may get 10-15 or more requests. Given that you can, at best, average only 3 rides per hour, wtf would I want to waste it on tipless min fares? I realize you have to balance the acceptance rate, but there's plenty of wiggle room. If everyone did this, and then educated pax on why their rating is low, rider quality and tips would improve.


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## DukeOfDallas

*Rating the fare and not the passenger* will call awareness to driver exploitation that Uber ignores


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## scrurbscrud

getFubered said:


> tips would improve.


Uber drivers ain't gonna git tip shit unless and until the app allows it.

You're of course spot on with the min. fare examples. NO, a driver can't make SQUAT doing endless min. fares cause you can only turn 3 an hour. Sometimes 4. 5 if it's a miracle setup. I've never exceeded 4 and that only once or twice in several months.


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## scrurbscrud

DukeOfDallas said:


> *Rating the fare and not the passenger* will call awareness to driver exploitation that Uber ignores


Hell, if drivers are stupid enough to drive for Uber's shitty X std. rates they really don't have anything to ***** about except their own ignorance for doing so. They should take the fast track and rate themselves out of business early. Save themselves a headache later.


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## DukeOfDallas

getFubered said:


> Why do I care? Because I'm the one ****in picking them up! I know, I'm one of those cheapskates who doesn't want to risk my car and give my time for $1.50 net rides...It doesn't do anyone any good to give every pax 4 or 5 stars unless they puke.
> 
> If you turned the app on in a decent area and didn't accept a ride for an entire hour you may get 10-15 or more requests. Given that you can, at best, average only 3 rides per hour, wtf would I want to waste it on tipless min fares? I realize you have to balance the acceptance rate, but there's plenty of wiggle room.* If everyone did this, and then educated pax on why their rating is low, rider quality and tips would improve.*


*EXACTLY!*


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## DukeOfDallas

UBER is a BILLION DOLLAR company and the socially responsible thing to do is for them to acknowledge negative net operating costs on $4 fares and subsidize the driver so Driver is keeping more of the fare and losing less to Uber for deductions.


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## Ripd

getFubered said:


> Why do I care? Because I'm the one ****in picking them up


No. The issue was why do you care about being some sort of Paul Revere and warning every other driver about what amounts to your own he said/she said bullshit about a rider? Personally I dont care what other drivers think because of YMMV. I shouldnt care of what DukeofDallas thinks about a pax and he shouldnt care what I think. As a driver, you should be able to eliminate anyone you feel has crossed the line based on YOUR OWN CRITERIA. Unfortunately, Uber makes the rules in this case, and shit rolls downhill.....


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## Ripd

DukeOfDallas said:


> UBER is a BILLION DOLLAR company and the socially responsible thing to do is for them to acknowledge negative net operating costs on $4 fares and subsidize the driver so Driver is keeping more of the fare and losing less to Uber for deductions.


<stating the obvious/> this is exactly why unions exist


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## scrurbscrud

Ripd said:


> <stating the obvious/> this is exactly why unions exist


That's also why individual drivers have the ability, will and right to say UBER OFF when the pay is inadequate. Which is the only 'real' solution.

If you don't like hitting yourself in the face, just stop it.


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## flyingdingo

DukeOfDallas said:


> Seriously, I have started to rate my passengers on fares. Pax can be nicest person in the world, but if I drove 15 minutes out of my way for a $4.00 fare with no tip, automatic rating is a 1 star.
> 
> Anyone else agree or use similar system?


Why did you drive 15 minutes out of your way? Stop doing that.


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## BlkGeep

I'm in agreement, been doing the same thing for a while, it's the customers fault for not waiting till a car pops up closer before requesting, I'm also getting in the habit of canceling if I see a driver come on line closer on those longer pings while I'm en route. Luckily Phoenix is busy enough you can cancel and get other pings closer.


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## Ripd

getFubered said:


> If everyone did this, and then educated pax on why their rating is low, rider quality and tips would improve.


Utopian statement. Riders have been conditioned by the Uber Kool-Aid that their driver is going to be wearing a tux, passing out candy and telling jokes. Once you hit them with a bunch of lecturing, they will write you off as a non-entertaining disgruntled driver and hit you with a low rating. Your going to educate someone in 2 blocks?? haha funny shit......


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## UberXTampa

DukeOfDallas said:


> Seriously, I have started to rate my passengers on fares. Pax can be nicest person in the world, but if I drove 15 minutes out of my way for a $4.00 fare with no tip, automatic rating is a 1 star.
> 
> Anyone else agree or use similar system?


This will automatically disenfranchise 60% of people that ride with me.


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## DukeOfDallas

These crap charity fare runs disenfranchise 90% of Uber drivers. Therefore, rate the fare not the passenger until Uber corrects.


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## Sydney Uber

flyingdingo said:


> Why did you drive 15 minutes out of your way? Stop doing that.


For the opportunity to 1 star the rider !


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## flyingdingo

Sydney Uber said:


> For the opportunity to 1 star the rider !


What an expensive 1-star.


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## Txchick

flyingdingo said:


> Why did you drive 15 minutes out of your way? Stop doing that.


Probably doing guarantees in the recent past. Dallas market currently not doing continual 24 hour 7 day a week guarantees. Uber only offers guarantees during weekends & bad weather days.


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## Txchick

UberXTampa said:


> This will automatically disenfranchise 60% of people that ride with me.


You need to disfranchise for .75 cents per mile.


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## Sydney Uber

UberXTampa said:


> This will automatically disenfranchise 60% of people that ride with me.


Have some riders misused the rating system? I have been down rated for not running a red light and not pulling stupid stunts in traffic just to get some stupid disorganised shit somewhere 30 seconds quicker. i've been down rated because I don't have Spotify. I've been down rated because I've had no full bottles of water (start every shift with 8)

Any pax or group with one iota of attitude, ungraciousness, for a trip I'm doing at about a 50% discount on established Black rates gets down rated. No tip - 1 star. 
Wrong pin location - 1 star
Attitude - 1 star
Loud music - star
Back Rub + 2 Stars
Respectful requests + 1 star

You get the picture! The rating system rips into the souls of drivers, use it to counter-attack.


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## UberHammer

I may start taking some of these sub-4 riders, for no other purpose than the joy of asking "Hey, want to see what Uber thinks of you as a passenger?"

Even if they say no, I'll show 'em anyway.


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## Txchick

UberHammer said:


> I may start taking some of these sub-4 riders, for no other purpose than the joy of asking "Hey, want to see what Uber thinks of you as a passenger?"
> 
> Even if they say no, I'll show 'em anyway.


Go @UberHammer!!!


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## troubleinrivercity

Riders who do minimum fare rides, without apology and without tip deserve whatever rating you feel like giving them. I can only assume they do min-fare rides all the time, and future drivers shouldn't have to work hard to make possible their "too good for the bus" lifestyle. Let the newbies and shitheads do these fares by rating low.

A lot of you posters here are really dumb and can't look after yourselves though. You should listen to sense and be less desperate. If I were uber I would surely take advantage of you. Rating system already not useful because so many of you are even afraid of rating passengers low.

Hilariously, when a customer tells you that they're only going a _very_ short distance, they'll usually play dumb and try to spin it like it's a great, easy run for you (Rather than suffer the indignity and horror of explaining themselves or apologizing to a driving robot). Believe me, they know better and are playing you like a child.


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## troubleinrivercity

Libertarian managers don’t care about anything but profitability and growth. If you wanted service, you’d pay for it. If you cared about social responsibility and the next generation, you’d pay for it. They believe in perfectly liquid markets with immediate response times and no strange feedback loops, or anything weird at all. Mix this sort of reductivist nonsense with computer-scientist determinism and this is the sort of company you can expect to see out of SF from now until forever. Autistic levels of willful denseness.
****. These. Assholes.


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## Casuale Haberdasher

LAndreas said:


> I'm glad you're in the Dallas market, and I am not. Condolences to the hard working independent Uber drivers in TX for having Duke make this work tool of yours worthless.
> 
> The quality of the most recent Uber recruits has really gotten scary.


POST # 22 / @LAndreas : Hi Ho!

Yours is not the only Post referring
to Decreasing Quality of #[F]Uberfolk
recently. "Ex-Uber CSR..." @john djjjoe
claimed that the Office in LIC was at a
5 to 7 Ratio for Most Recent Deactiva-
tees/OnBoardees.

I Homorously Coined #[F]UberHooptie
to draw the Drivership's Attention to
this Latest AntiPersonnel LLC's stunt
to Sink Lyft and become even more
Orwellian in their Perfidy. Pray that
the Current Lawsuits provide a Wake
UpCall/ DopeSlap to Emperor A••hat.


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## CityGirl

Casuale Haberdasher said:


> POST # 22 / @LAndreas : Hi Ho!
> 
> Yours is not the only Post referring
> to Decreasing Quality of #[F]Uberfolk
> recently. "Ex-Uber CSR..." @john djjjoe
> claimed that the Office in LIC was at a
> 5 to 7 Ratio for Most Recent Deactiva-
> tees/OnBoardees.
> 
> I Homorously Coined #[F]UberHooptie
> to draw the Drivership's Attention to
> this Latest AntiPersonnel LLC's stunt
> to Sink Lyft and become even more
> Orwellian in their Perfidy. Pray that
> the Current Lawsuits provide a Wake
> UpCall/ DopeSlap to Emperor A••hat.


Dude, you're like our wise UberYoda. Sometimes I totally get what you are saying. Here, not so much.


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## scrurbscrud

I've never seen any company run a burn and churn system be successful in the long term. Eventually you run out of bodies to burn.


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## UberHammer

scrurbscrud said:


> I've never seen any company run a burn and churn system be successful in the long term. Eventually you run out of bodies to burn.


HR manager: Travis, the unboarding is slowing down...
Travis: Drop the age requirement to 16 years old.
HR manger: It already is.
Travis: Drop it to 14 then.
HR manager: But it's illegal for 14 year olds to drive.
Travis: When have laws ever stopped us before?
HR manager: Good point. 14 it is!


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## scrurbscrud

UberHammer said:


> HR manager: Travis, the unboarding is slowing down...
> Travis: Drop the age requirement to 16 years old.
> HR manger: It already is.
> Travis: Drop it to 14 then.
> HR manager: But it's illegal for 14 year olds to drive.
> Travis: When have laws ever stopped us before?
> HR manager: Good point. 14 it is!


Yeah, same methods losing armies are forced to use.


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## Backdash

Wondering if the OP really believes that rating the fare and not the pax is some kind of solution...


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## scrurbscrud

Backdash said:


> Wondering if the OP really believes that rating the fare and not the pax is some kind of solution...


Good solution to have Uber punt a driver. Then the driver doesn't have to worry about low fares anymore.


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## Dakijan

DukeOfDallas said:


> UBER is a BILLION DOLLAR company and the socially responsible thing to do...


A democrat in Texas? Somebody buy a lottery ticket with his birthday.

But on a serious note, Uber is to blame on this. Not because of what you said, but because they dont interview their prospective drivers and dont call their existing drivers to see how they're doing. Uber is a special company, it allows dysfunctional and toxic employees to fall through the cracks. Thank you Duke, for keeping this company so special.


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## UberHammer

Danikjan said:


> Uber is a special company, it allows dysfunctional and toxic employees to fall through the cracks.


Uber only has 2,000 employees.


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## scrurbscrud

UberHammer said:


> Uber only has 2,000 employees.


and 160,000 special needs sub contractors


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## Casuale Haberdasher

CityGirl said:


> Dude, you're like our wise UberYoda. Sometimes I totally get what you are saying. Here, not so much.


POST # 64 / @CityGirl : May the Sun
still be shining for You Golden State
Girl. As honored as I am by your
Humorous Honorific Bisonic Yoda
seeks to Crystal Clear Clarify my
earlier Post.

The now 2-weeks-gone @john djjjoe said
that at the LongIslandCity (NY.) Offices
where he and other East Coast CSRs and
Operations Management worked the
ratio of DischargedDrivers to New"Hires"
was 5 to 7: a 140% turnover rate!

#[F]UberHooptie is MY reference to the
"Hiring"Initiative that provides a $200
Spiff to a Current Driver referring a Y2K Car(or newer) Owner who subsequently
applies/submits docs/gets approved/down-
loads TheApp and Completes 20 Rides.

My apologies for earlier Obfususcatory
Utterings. #[F]Uber Yoda, out.


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## arto71

scrurbscrud said:


> and 160,000 special needs sub contractors


That was December 2014.


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## Praxeology

Apologies if this has already been brought up, but as much as I really like this idea for spoiled entitled urban hipsters who probably think they are getting soaked at $4, is there any indication punitive ratings against low fares come with consequences from the company itself? Knowing how Uber is, I cannot imagine they would be very amused to learn there is essentially a sort of union action being taken against the passengers in protest of the fares. Still, I really like the idea, although I'm not sure I will adopt it for myself.


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## arto71

scrurbscrud said:


> and 160,000 special needs sub contractors


If they had that many drivers now we wouldn't be having this conversation now because ETA would have been 2 to 3
min. as it was in December and OP would not drive 15 min .


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## DukeOfDallas

Praxeology said:


> Apologies if this has already been brought up, but as much as I really like this idea for spoiled entitled urban hipsters who probably think they are getting soaked at $4, is there any indication punitive ratings against low fares come with consequences from the company itself? Knowing how Uber is, I cannot imagine they would be very amused to learn there is essentially a sort of union action being taken against the passengers in protest of the fares. Still, I really like the idea, although I'm not sure I will adopt it for myself.


Do us all a favor and adopt it. Rate the Fare not the Pax.


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## Sly

You people are why we'll lose our jobs to self driving cars. Asshole drivers who don't know the meaning of the words customer service.


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## scrurbscrud

arto71 said:


> If they had that many drivers now we wouldn't be having this conversation now because ETA would have been 2 to 3
> min. as it was in December and OP would not drive 15 min .


Long distance pings have been a perpetual reality in ride share. Most drivers are not stupid enough to sit in the burbs with no business and the apps don't have sense enough to accommodate and incentivize drivers to drive for nothing to do them.


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## DukeOfDallas

Sly said:


> You people are why we'll lose our jobs to self driving cars. Asshole drivers who don't know the meaning of the words customer service.


Come pick me up in Dallas. I need to run to the store for a pack of cigs.


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## arto71

scrurbscrud said:


> o sit in the burbs


I'm not talking about burbs ,right in the heart of DT LA on Friday at 4:00 pm prime time with ETA 12 min .


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## scrurbscrud

arto71 said:


> I'm not talking about burbs ,right in the heart of DT LA on Friday at 4:00 pm prime time with ETA 12 min .


That would be more of a driver shortage issue than a long distance ping issue wouldn't it?


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## Sly

DukeOfDallas said:


> Come pick me up in Dallas. I need to run to the store for a pack of cigs.


Dude that's what we are here for.


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## UberHammer

Sly said:


> You people are why we'll lose our jobs to self driving cars. Asshole drivers who don't know the meaning of the words customer service.


The rider rating has nothing to do with customer service...

...except in my soon to be endeavors where I intend to share with sub-4 riders the truth about themselves.


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## Praxeology

UberHammer said:


> ...except in my soon to be endeavors where I intend to share with sub-4 riders the truth about themselves.


Well, I definitely want to hear how that story ends up.

It might get a little uneasy, though, considering you aren't exactly separated by a lot of space in the Isetta.


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## arto71

scrurbscrud said:


> That would be more of a driver shortage issue than a long distance ping issue wouldn't it?


Thats what I'm saying shortage of drivers ,they're not that many drivers out there as it was month of December which is the one of the reason for longer ETAs.


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## arto71

Sly said:


> You people are why we'll lose our jobs to self driving cars. Asshole drivers who don't know the meaning of the words customer service.


Could you please tell us what's the uber rate in your market.


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## Sly

arto71 said:


> Could you please tell us what's the uber rate in your market.


What difference does that make? You give good customer service or if you think you're not getting paid enough you don't do the job at all. YOU DON'T GIVE CRAPPY SERVICE PERIOD.


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## UberHammer

Sly said:


> Dude that's what we are here for.


No UberX available here in Ohio..... I'm waiting.... Are you coming?


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## arto71

Sly said:


> What difference does that make? You give good customer service or if you think you're not getting paid enough you don't do the job at all. YOU DON'T GIVE CRAPPY SERVICE PERIOD.


Really I'm speechless. Correct me if I,m wrong $1.80 mile $ 0.20 minute $2.00 base?


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## Zoots Alures

DukeOfDallas said:


> Seriously, I have started to rate my passengers on fares. Pax can be nicest person in the world, but if I drove 15 minutes out of my way for a $4.00 fare with no tip, automatic rating is a 1 star.
> 
> Anyone else agree or use similar system?


Dude, your beef is with Uber Leadership, NOT THE RIDER, CLIENT, OR PAX! Unfortunately I too have had BS calls where a 25 min. drive to the pick up location; then a short ride for the Pax by comparison; then the ($0-$infinity) return trip if you don't want to risk being sent even further away from your home base.

If you want to see change in the mathematical code then I strongly encourage you to compose a message to Uber Leadership and state not only your practical observations from the field but provide feedback on how YOU would like to see these improvements.

I sincerely look forward to seeing Uber 4.01 (I really don't know) upgrade that contain your suggestion(s). No, really!


----------



## BayArea Lyft Driver

If the service is cheap enough, people don't care of about it. Look at Spirit airlines. People are pissed off, but they still spend money with them.


----------



## OCBob

The issue isn't just with Uber policy but stupid riders that actually think a $4 ride is worth it even if we got the whole $4! If I take you 2 miles after driving 5 miles and 12 minutes to get to your pick up area (on time) and the fare is $4, how moronic is that rider to think that 1) we were getting the whole fare of $4 and 2) what part of $4 is a tip? They feel so good about saving money and not even looking at the idea that they actually cost the driver money/profit and could have possibly taken someone else with a doable fare.

I think the OP is wrong for giving out a dreaded 1 star but for me, if you don't tip and it is under $6, you get a 4 star. This is plenty fair and once that rating goes under 4.5 (which is pretty damn low) and I have options to cancel, they won't be getting picked up by me. Enough drivers ding them to a 4 star and they will be getting closer to under 4.4 then 5.0 stars.


----------



## OCBob

Sly said:


> Dude that's what we are here for.


At $2.40? **** that but unfortunately, we do not have a ****ing clue where they are going unless we contact them ahead of time. You seem like you are having a great time driving all over the place even at the chance of losing money.


----------



## UberHammer

OCBob said:


> The issue isn't just with Uber policy but stupid riders that actually think a $4 ride is worth it even if we got the whole $4!


I had a woman once who was just going a few blocks and knew it was a $4 fare ask me how much of that I keep. I told her Uber takes 40% of that so I get $2.40... and she looked like I shot her puppy.

She tipped me $5.


----------



## Ripd

I feel the same way as DukeofDallas most of the time. The flaw in his logic is that eventually, an Uber rating algorithm will notify a CSR that you are a potential bad Uber apple due to all the low ratings you give out. And if that's the case... all you've accomplished is drawing negative attention to yourself. Which is the opposite of what you set out to do.... and the game ends up playing you.


----------



## hoogle

DukeOfDallas said:


> Seriously, I have started to rate my passengers on fares. Pax can be nicest person in the world, but if I drove 15 minutes out of my way for a $4.00 fare with no tip, automatic rating is a 1 star.
> 
> Anyone else agree or use similar system?


The concept makes a lot of sense. The passenger should be trained to cancel you or tip (= compensate) you for the drive from such a long distance.

Allowing for the passenger's ignorance or not thinking, I think a two or three star rating is warranted, not a one.

I disagree that this is rating the fare, not the passenger. You are rating the passenger for courtesy, not rating the fare. The prospective fare and distance-to-rider merely dictates whether the passenger should cancel or be prepared to tip generously. Failing to do either warrants a two or three star rating if the passenger is otherwise well-behaved.


----------



## john djjjoe

DukeOfDallas said:


> Seriously, I have started to rate my passengers on fares. Pax can be nicest person in the world, but if I drove 15 minutes out of my way for a $4.00 fare with no tip, automatic rating is a 1 star.
> 
> Anyone else agree or use similar system?


Can't wait for you to be deactivated. Data team will pick up on the difference between your and other drivers' ratings patterns. Let us know when you are weeded out.


----------



## scrurbscrud

john djjjoe said:


> Can't wait for you to be deactivated. Data team will pick up on the difference between your and other drivers' ratings patterns. Let us know when you are weeded out.


Yes, we are so ignorantly predictable.

When drivers hit that ping, they agree to provide a service for a price, ****ed up algo's and unfair pricing notwithstanding.

The fare should have nothing to do with a pax rating, nor should lack of a tip.

It's a ride from A to B for $X and nothing more, social considerations of stars notwithstanding. Stars to me in this equation are just as much a part of the driver engagements with the pax as the pax responses to services rendered in this exchange of services with the driver.

The rate you give a pax is in many ways a reflection of yourself as a driver.


----------



## UberHammer

My neighbor is a school teacher who got fired for being stingy with stars.

True story.


----------



## scrurbscrud

UberHammer said:


> My neighbor is a school teacher who got fired for being stingy with stars.
> 
> True story.


go figure


----------



## UberHammer

scrurbscrud said:


> go figure


Don't keep a child from getting their stars if you want to keep your job.

That's the moral of the story.

[puts down UberThinking cap and heads back to the real world]


----------



## Dcspride

I only read the first page of this thread and it seems like op is more upset at the fact that passenger didn't tip him... Uber is not for you man... Go drive for lyft and you may get some tips.


----------



## Ez-Russ

DukeOfDallas said:


> driving 15 minutes to make $4.00 before deductions IS a bad apple. Other drivers need to know this is a bad apple fare.


I agree no tip = 1 star.


----------



## Backdash

Maybe the pax should rate the driver for the time it takes him to arrive
Driver gets 1 star if arrival time is more than 10 min. 
That way Uber will be forced to only match drivers to requests that are no more than 10 min away.
DOH!


----------



## Big Machine

This exactly why I rate all drivers 3 stars and lower. These neanderthal drivers who scream about tips need to understand tips are never mandatory and I am not going to carry cash to satisfy the uneducated. Some of you just need to move on and find a job since it seems like business ownership is not for you.


----------



## newsboy559

LAndreas said:


> You're doing other drivers a disservice. A bad pax rating should be reserved for the real trouble cases that no one wants in their car. By you wrecking everyone's rating, I am no longer able to tell who those truly bad apples are that should stay at the side of the road.


YOU are doing everyone a disservice. Non-tippers ARE bad passengers. Yes, tips are never expected... blah blah blah. But the fact is, Uber seems to have manipulated a way to make Uber drivers the ONLY workers in the entire service industry who it's understood that a gratuity is not necessary, expected or that offering a gratuity is even frowned upon. The only way drivers can win this battle is to include a non-tip in the rating.

For example, Uber is a luxury. Yes, even UberX is a luxury. Anything that the customer could do themselves, but chooses to have someone serve them in order to do it - is a luxury. By definition by the vast majority of people who use a 5-star rating system for anything, the top rating is reserved for exceptional, above and beyond service. By YOUR own definition, a tip is not expected. Therefore, when a tip IS given, the customer has gone above and beyond what was expected. No tip = no 4 stars. Period! No tip and you made me wait for more than one minute after I arrived = 3 stars. It goes downhill from there.


----------



## newsboy559

Sly said:


> One day the pax needs a ride to local bar. Next day he needs a ride to the airport. Same pax. We provide the short trips to get pax in the habit of using us so then we get the long trips too. We don't do the short trips then someone else gets them and they also get the long trips too. Nobody does long trips only.





DukeOfDallas said:


> Longer riders = better fare for driver. They do not get 1 star. If you use me everyday for $4 fares with no tip, you will deviate down towards a PAX rating of 1 star which tells other drivers possible negative earnings alert.
> 
> Remember, these PAX taking $4 rides know you are driving 15 minutes to get them and know they should tip cash. They are part of the problem.


Not to mention, if you're forced to drive 15 minutes for a minimum fare, this passenger is causing you to lose money with his non-tipping practices. THAT'S the part that's not your fault. THAT'S the part that is Uber's fault because they frown upon cancellations and low acceptance rates.


----------



## newsboy559

Big Machine said:


> This exactly why I rate all drivers 3 stars and lower. These neanderthal drivers who scream about tips need to understand tips are never mandatory and I am not going to carry cash to satisfy the uneducated. Some of you just need to move on and find a job since it seems like business ownership is not for you.


Good. We're all proud of you for not carrying cash. Now, please ask each and every Uber driver you use if he/she can accept a credit or debit card via Square. Most of us do these days.

Neanderthal...

You clearly know the deal. And you clearly get a stiffy knowing that you are screwing your drivers who provide you with excellent service out of a gratuity that they deserved. Try not tipping your wait staff at a nice sit-down restaurant and see how they respond.


----------



## Backdash

Of course tips aren't mandatory. They aren't mandatory anywhere. Customers tip if and how much they choose too. 

Not being mandatory does not equal "should not" tip. 

It sounds like since you don't carry cash you're trying to justify not tipping.


----------



## newsboy559

DukeOfDallas said:


> they wanna go 3-4 miles, they call Uber and then they tip their driver for the operating expense OR the get a 1 star rating and i refuse next pick-up.
> 
> Rate The Fare Not The Pax!


That's just it. There are a good many Uber drivers who have zero ability to run a profitable business. You're talking to a few of them right now. Then there are real entrepreneurs who know the deal, maybe have gotten burned before, or have just plain learned their lesson. The fact is, these passengers KNOW they should tip. Has Uber muddied the water due to their deceptive marketing? Absolutely. But the passenger should know that tipping is not necessary with ANY service. But it is for darn sure strongly suggested if you want to continue to receive superior service.

Lastly, it's Uber's fault that drivers are subjected to long dead rides. This is a flaw in the system that needs serious attention. I'm not leaving a surge zone in the middle of my downtown to go pick up someone at a titty bar out in the suburbs 20 miles away. And I shouldn't be asked to do so based on the way Uber purports to operate in the first place.


----------



## CityGirl

Casuale Haberdasher said:


> POST # 64 / @CityGirl : May the Sun
> still be shining for You Golden State
> Girl. As honored as I am by your
> Humorous Honorific Bisonic Yoda
> seeks to Crystal Clear Clarify my
> earlier Post.
> 
> The now 2-weeks-gone @john djjjoe said
> that at the LongIslandCity (NY.) Offices
> where he and other East Coast CSRs and
> Operations Management worked the
> ratio of DischargedDrivers to New"Hires"
> was 5 to 7: a 140% turnover rate!
> 
> #[F]UberHooptie is MY reference to the
> "Hiring"Initiative that provides a $200
> Spiff to a Current Driver referring a Y2K Car(or newer) Owner who subsequently
> applies/submits docs/gets approved/down-
> loads TheApp and Completes 20 Rides.
> 
> My apologies for earlier Obfususcatory
> Utterings. #[F]Uber Yoda, out.


----------



## getFubered

john djjjoe said:


> Can't wait for you to be deactivated. Data team will pick up on the difference between your and other drivers' ratings patterns. Let us know when you are weeded out.


Hey Johnny, I know you have a marketing degree from a small school that makes you smarter than the rest of us and has allowed you to move from one entry level position to the next in liberally focused startups, but wtf would you think uber would deactivate someone for giving out statistically lower ratings than other drivers? Drivers were gaming guarantees costing them hundreds of thousands and you think they care about low pax ratings? Your skinny jeans are limiting blood circulation to that overvalued brain of yours.


----------



## UberHammer

getFubered said:


> Hey Johnny, I know you have a marketing degree from a small school that makes you smarter than the rest of us and has allowed you to move from one entry level position to the next in liberally focused startups, but wtf would you think uber would deactivate someone for giving out statistically lower ratings than other drivers? Drivers were gaming guarantees costing them hundreds of thousands and you think they care about low pax ratings? Your skinny jeans are limiting blood circulation to that overvalued brain of yours.


It's all about the stars, man. Don't mess with rider's stars. They might cry.


----------



## Markopolo

Uber tells the Pax "tip is included" " There is apparently also a splash on their app to remind them at the end of the ride. This sucks but Don't blame the Pax.


----------



## scrurbscrud

All things being said about pax star ratings, I've never seen any written guidelines presented by Uber on how to handle them. It would appear to be entirely subjective on the part of the party providing same.


----------



## Lidman

DukeOfDallas said:


> Longer riders = better fare for driver. They do not get 1 star. If you use me everyday for $4 fares with no tip, you will deviate down towards a PAX rating of 1 star which tells other drivers possible negative earnings alert.
> 
> Remember, these PAX taking $4 rides know you are driving 15 minutes to get them and know they should tip cash. They are part of the problem.


 I agree. Having to drive a lot of "dead miles" for a measly fare with no tip almost costs you money rather then earning it. In our company we can charge a much higher "minimum fare" if we have to go to another town to pick up the pax.

Screw those cheap pax. Hopefully uber will raise it's rates soon and charge more for having to drive far to get your pax.


----------



## Lidman

DukeOfDallas said:


> Who does this for anything other than $ ... not me. New rating system is now pax with lower rating is lower fares with no tip. PERIOD. End of story. Rate the fare, not the passenger. DONE. I'll pass on all 1 stars because I am sick of driving 15 minutes to make $4 before deductions.


 It has everything to do with it. It's not the drivers fault they trying to make a living and by picking them up with no tips at these "sweat shop" rate, they're working for free.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher

getFubered said:


> Hey Johnny, I know you have a marketing degree from a small school that makes you smarter than the rest of us and has allowed you to move from one entry level position to the next in liberally focused startups, but wtf would you think uber would deactivate someone for giving out statistically lower ratings than other drivers? Drivers were gaming guarantees costing them hundreds of thousands and you think they care about low pax ratings? Your skinny jeans are limiting blood circulation to that overvalued brain of yours.


POST #114 /@getFubered: Just so you
know... @john djjjoe last participated
on Sun. 2/22 PM. He's on his 3rd week
of his New Job at Condescension Corp.
a Division of ******baggery UnLtd.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Casuale Haberdasher said:


> POST #114 /@getFubered: Just so you
> know... @john djjjoe last participated
> on Sun. 2/22 PM. He's on his 3rd week
> of his New Job at Condescension Corp.
> a Division of ******baggery UnLtd.


I'll give him big credits for telling the inside story like it is. You heard it. Drivers who rate pax lower than other drivers may very well face the TNC extinction axe.

Not that drivers care, but that's how the insiders see it. So hat's off for actually hearing that fact from the inside. It was only driver speculation prior.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Sly said:


> So what happens if a Pax only needs to go 3 or 4 miles down the road you want them to walk? That isn't very entrepreneurial of you. You sound like a socialist.


^^^
Walking 3 or 4 miles? 
Sounds less like a Socialist and more like an athleticicist. 
A Socialist would be somebody who drove the passenger a few miles but then passed on his loss to all of the rest of the drivers, or passed on his actual profit of .25¢ to the rest of the drivers on duty at the time. 
Let's say that you own a pizza joint and you have a medium, one topping pizza on special for $5.00 and you have a delivery guy working for you that makes minimum wage plus his tips. 
I call you up and order _ONE _pizza and I live ten miles away. 
You actually make a max of $2.50 on the material end of the pizza, then there is the gas for the oven, the lights, the rent, the insurance, the wage for the person who serves in the restaurant and takes the phone orders. 
You get a call from Jimbo (me) and I order a pizza and you send your guy out there to deliver it. 
Where's your profit? 
What's even better is that I tell my neighbors that your pizza is the best one that I ever had and tell them to all order a pizza over the next week. 
Now you start tearing your hair out.

That's why pizza joints have a minimum amount in order to deliver, like $30.00 PLUS a minimum delivery charge of $2.50 which doesn't go to the driver. 
Not only that, but the Socialism part comes in when the pizza joint owner's taxes have to pick up the cost of the Uber driver who has to go into the ER and can't afford the $10,000.00 bill for his fractured skull and resultant treatment because he can't afford $700.00 a month for medical coverage.

The upshot? 
Pizza guy closes his doors, signs on with Uber with a Santander lease and starts making $4.00 rides with no tip. 
How's that for coming full circle?


----------



## Uber-Doober

By the way..... just one short little question. 
In all of Uber's superior wisdom and technology, how does not rating a pax affect the pax rating? 
I know it's probably a dumb question because it probably has no effect whatsoever, but I just thought I'd ask.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Sydney Uber said:


> Have some riders misused the rating system? I have been down rated for not running a red light and not pulling stupid stunts in traffic just to get some stupid disorganised shit somewhere 30 seconds quicker. i've been down rated because I don't have Spotify. I've been down rated because I've had no full bottles of water (start every shift with 8)
> 
> Any pax or group with one iota of attitude, ungraciousness, for a trip I'm doing at about a 50% discount on established Black rates gets down rated. No tip - 1 star.
> Wrong pin location - 1 star
> Attitude - 1 star
> Loud music - star
> Back Rub + 2 Stars
> Respectful requests + 1 star
> 
> You get the picture! The rating system rips into the souls of drivers, use it to counter-attack.


^^^
Does that back rub come with a happy ending? 
Ooooop's, I forgot.... the pax then gives you a 1 star for not providing the impotence pill (had to say that because the V word is a banned one. LOL!)


----------



## UberHammer

scrurbscrud said:


> All things being said about pax star ratings, I've never seen any written guidelines presented by Uber on how to handle them. It would appear to be entirely subjective on the part of the party providing same.


I agree... which is why it's entirely consistent for Uber to fire a driver over their subjective use of the rider rating system. Drivers should be scared about the possibility of being fired over anything and everything. It's part of Uber's business model. Without such fear, Uber couldn't get drivers to surrender their rights as Independent Contractors. It's a business model that gives Uber the benefit of having employees without being subject to the government regulations of having employees.


----------



## Uber-Doober

UberHammer said:


> My neighbor is a school teacher who got fired for being stingy with stars.
> 
> True story.


^^^
WHAT!!!
Hey, we're in a society where now all kids get a trophy, or in this case a star just for participating.
They could be the biggest Clod in the class, but in order for them to "feel good" and not have their little infantile sensibilities dashed on the rocks, we now have to give them "Participation trophys" which is sure not like what they're gonna have to face once they get out there in the big, bad "real" world. 
I wonder if any of those companies that make the stars make black stars for the real ConeHeads in the class?

Mother: Oh, look Daddy, Billy came home with a trophy. 
Daddy: That's my little Genius. 
Billy: Daddy, could you please untie my shoelaces?


----------



## scrurbscrud

UberHammer said:


> I agree... which is why it's entirely consistent for Uber to fire a driver over their subjective use of the rider rating system. Drivers should be scared about the possibility of being fired over anything and everything. It's part of Uber's business model. Without such fear, Uber couldn't get drivers to surrender their rights as Independent Contractors. It's a business model that gives Uber the benefit of having employees without being subject to the government regulations of having employees.


And being 'deactivated' isn't be fired either. Such are no longer being used as sub-independent contractors. Firing without firing.


----------



## UberHammer

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> WHAT!!!
> Hey, we're in a society where now all kids get a trophy, or in this case a star just for participating.
> They could be the biggest Clod in the class, but in order for them to "feel good" and not have their little infantile sensibilities dashed on the rocks, we now have to give them "Participation trophys" which is sure not like what they're gonna have to face once they get out there in the big, bad "real" world.
> I wonder if any of those companies that make the stars make black stars for the real ConeHeads in the class?
> 
> Mother: Oh, look Daddy, Billy came home with a trophy.
> Daddy: That's my little Genius.
> Billy: Daddy, could you please untie my shoelaces?


It was a joke... to illustrate how ridiculous John djjjoe sounds suggesting Uber fires drivers for their stinginess in giving stars to passengers. The sad thing is, he's probably right. Uber would fire a driver for something as stupid as that. It's because Uber is a ridiculously ****ed up company. It's a culture that flows directly from Travis Kalanick's autistic brain. Absolutely a genius engineer, but a horrible people person.


----------



## UberHammer

scrurbscrud said:


> And being 'deactivated' isn't be fired either. Such are no longer being used as sub-independent contractors. Firing without firing.


As long as Uber continues to treat drivers like employess, I will continue to use employment terms in describing the relationship.


----------



## scrurbscrud

UberHammer said:


> As long as Uber continues to treat drivers like employess, I will continue to use employment terms in describing the relationship.


There are similarities, but Uber can obviously abuse independent contractors more than employees on many counts. Voluntarily on the drivers parts in some cases.


----------



## UberHammer

scrurbscrud said:


> There are similarities, but Uber can obviously abuse independent contractors more than employees on many counts. Voluntarily on the drivers parts in some cases.


It's called coercion. The threat of being deactivated persuades drivers to do things they as independent contractors have no contractual requirement to do.

co·er·cion
kōˈərZHən,kōˈərSHən/
_noun_

the practice of *persuading someone to do something by using* force or *threats*.
"it wasn't slavery because no coercion was used"
synonyms: force, compulsion, constraint, duress, oppression, enforcement,harassment, intimidation, threats, arm-twisting, pressure
"Johnson claims the police used coercion to extract a confession"


----------



## scrurbscrud

UberHammer said:


> It's called coercion. The threat of being deactivated persuades drivers to do things they as independent contractors have no contractual requirement to do.
> 
> co·er·cion
> kōˈərZHən,kōˈərSHən/
> _noun_
> 
> the practice of *persuading someone to do something by using* force or *threats*.
> "it wasn't slavery because no coercion was used"
> synonyms: force, compulsion, constraint, duress, oppression, enforcement,harassment, intimidation, threats, arm-twisting, pressure
> "Johnson claims the police used coercion to extract a confession"


Get to work slaves! Or not? It's still voluntary coercion.


----------



## Uber-Doober

newsboy559 said:


> YOU are doing everyone a disservice. Non-tippers ARE bad passengers. Yes, tips are never expected... blah blah blah. But the fact is, Uber seems to have manipulated a way to make Uber drivers the ONLY workers in the entire service industry who it's understood that a gratuity is not necessary, expected or that offering a gratuity is even frowned upon. The only way drivers can win this battle is to include a non-tip in the rating.
> 
> For example, Uber is a luxury. Yes, even UberX is a luxury. Anything that the customer could do themselves, but chooses to have someone serve them in order to do it - is a luxury. By definition by the vast majority of people who use a 5-star rating system for anything, the top rating is reserved for exceptional, above and beyond service. By YOUR own definition, a tip is not expected. Therefore, when a tip IS given, the customer has gone above and beyond what was expected. No tip = no 4 stars. Period! No tip and you made me wait for more than one minute after I arrived = 3 stars. It goes downhill from there.


^^^
Jeez, I really hate to monopolize this thread, but I really have to say this about making the driver wait. 
The other day I had a pickup over at the Trump, and when I pull in there I see four people standing out in front talking to the door man and it turns out that they are my passengers.... mom, dad and two kids. 
I really have to laugh because they looked like the Clampetts out there with all that luggage. LOL!
Turns out that they just moved out here from Des Moines and live in one of the penthouse condos. 
Now, if ANYbody should have had the temerity to keep me waiting, it should have been them. 
They're going home for a funeral. 
Had to use the strap to hold down the trunk from all the luggage and one of the kids wanted to sit in front which automatically made the blood drain from my face, but he was a very cool 12 year old. 
They took my card to call me when they get back in five days. 
Tip for a few miles to McCarran? $50. bux. 
They could call me up at 3:am and I'd be there. Haha.


----------



## Uber-Doober

scrurbscrud said:


> That would be more of a driver shortage issue than a long distance ping issue wouldn't it?


^^^
Yes, BUT....
In Downtown L.A. at 4:30 a 15 minute ETA could mean that the pax is at the other end of the block.
Believe me, been there done that. 
Just try to get from the Otani to the Hilton at 5:00 on a Friday and not get your Livery dented. Hah!


----------



## scrurbscrud

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Jeez, I really hate to monopolize this thread, but I really have to say this about making the driver wait.
> The other day I had a pickup over at the Trump, and when I pull in there I see four people standing out in front talking to the door man and it turns out that they are my passengers.... mom, dad and two kids.
> I really have to laugh because they looked like the Clampetts out there with all that luggage. LOL!
> Turns out that they just moved out here from Des Moines and live in one of the penthouse condos.
> Now, if ANYbody should have had the temerity to keep me waiting, it should have been them.
> They're going home for a funeral.
> Had to use the strap to hold down the trunk from all the luggage and one of the kids wanted to sit in front which automatically made the blood drain from my face, but he was a very cool 12 year old.
> They took my card to call me when they get back in five days.
> Tip for a few miles to McCarran? $50. bux.
> They could call me up at 3:am and I'd be there. Haha.


I thought they banned TNC's there?


----------



## UberHammer

scrurbscrud said:


> Get to work slaves! Or not? It's still voluntary coercion.


It's Uber that is committing the act of coercion. The drivers aren't volunteering to be coerced by Uber. Uber does it to them all indiscriminately.

You're right though that drivers after receiving Uber's coercion can choose to respond by telling Uber to get bent and quitting... or they can choose to tuck their tale between their legs and give Uber the behavior that Uber is pursuing coercively.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Sly said:


> Dude that's what we are here for.


^^^
If they can afford to smoke at the price of a pack these days, then they can afford to tip.


----------



## UberGirlPBC

DukeOfDallas said:


> After other drivers switch to rating fares instead of passengers, you will know that 1 star = high probability of a shitty trip with no tip.


We all SHOULD NOT DRIVE UBERX ANYMORE PERIOD! We are creating a nation of cheap people. I have had people who enjoyed the drive they received from me but still questions why UberSelect is more expensive. I tell them the car and no one can survive off of $0.75- 0.90 per mile. If you want a change, then everyone should go get an UberSelect, XL, or Black. I drove UberX for 5 weeks in the beginning. I decided I liked, ***ahem*** needed this extra income. In Jan they dropped the X rate to around $0.90 so I decided it was time to up my game. I am now at about 400 trips. I am trying to get my Vehicle for Hire license as well. We need to keep this business legitimate so Uber can stay in our markets. In Japan, they eliminated UberX. UberX is too cheap. Trust me, you really don't want to do this to yourself or your car.


----------



## Uber-Doober

scrurbscrud said:


> I thought they banned TNC's there?


^^^
Oh, did they? 
I had no idea... I'm in Vegas but drove Livery in L.A. for a few years. 
I thought that Uber Black in L.A. was still functioning because it was my understanding that Black had to have their TCP numbers on the bumper which would automatically give them entrance into the airport for p/u and delivery.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Oh, did they?
> I had no idea... I'm in Vegas but drove Livery in L.A. for a few years.
> I thought that Uber Black in L.A. was still functioning because it was my understanding that Black had to have their TCP numbers on the bumper which would automatically give them entrance into the airport for p/u and delivery.


You mentioned dropping at McCarron. Pre ban?


----------



## UberGirlPBC

DukeOfDallas said:


> they wanna go 3-4 miles, they call Uber and then they tip their driver for the operating expense OR the get a 1 star rating and i refuse next pick-up.
> 
> Rate The Fare Not The Pax!


Karma does Bless. If they think they are getting Mc Donalds while at Mc Donalds, wait who tips at Mc Donalds? 
Just upgrade your car to a 2010+ whatever Uber market nice service you have in Dallas. It is a gamechanger and less work, better clientele also. And they tip more often IJS


----------



## Uber-Doober

UberGirlPBC said:


> Karma does Bless. If they think they are getting Mc Donalds while at Mc Donalds, wait who tips at Mc Donalds?
> Just upgrade your car to a 2010+ whatever Uber market nice service you have in Dallas. It is a gamechanger and less work, better clientele also. And they tip more often IJS


^^^
How the heck do they know what kind of car they're pinging? 
Karma? Maybe you're talking about a Fisker Karma... on a Santander lease.

http://thenewfisker.com


----------



## Uber-Doober

scrurbscrud said:


> You mentioned dropping at McCarron. Pre ban?


^^^
I'm driving livery here in Vegas. 
Never drove for Uber here in Vegas... they were kicked two days before I was gonna start. LOL. 
And another poster mentioned Karma. 
Well, I must have good Karma because I'd be running the wheels off of my little entry level Benz CLA250 which only qualifies for UberX


----------



## UberGirlPBC

upnetuser said:


> All these issues are driven by bad Uber policies and their anti-driver stances.
> 
> They don't let drivers limit their pickup radius. That causes silly games like rating passengers bad for having to drive far, sitting in a spot and not moving until they cancel, driver cancels, etc. Uber doesn't care if you drive 15 minutes for a $4 fare, they make their $1 and 20% regardless.
> 
> Seeing a trend here?


I drive UberSelect. I let the pax know if I am halfway to them Uber will charge them $10. I do not have to wait for them to realize I am not coming. I drive to them and if they cancel midway, you just paid for my time and gas. I send them a Blessing in the air and thank them for the $10 and pull over and wait for the next request (saves gas).

The other day a pax pinged me; I accepted. I sent my usual text (eta and he pinged from the airport so I asked what airline). He replied he was not even in FL yet. He was just (playing around) learning the app. I texted can you please cancel. No response, no worries I got you buddy I am still driving to your destination. I ask him to cancel again. Crickets! I told him if he does not cancel soon Uber will charge him $10.00 and the cancel button is in the top right corner (but sometimes bottom depending on phone but didn't text all that). Couple mins later no response but his arse sure enough canceled as he would have never canceled at all had I not said $10.

I would have driven all the way there and waited for a bit and hit no show. I am not messing with my acceptance rates. Uber notices all of these things and probably does not factor in the customer asked me to cancel. Unfortunately since the pax did not care he was requesting a live driver and did not cancel immediately, by the time he did cancel I had driven halfway. He was charged $10 and that's a small fee for the price of education. If you can, get off of UberX. It is worth to Uber in a different Uber Class in so many ways. You can hand out business cards and keep your own customers. Then if Uber leaves your area and the apps no longer work you are not dead in the water. Think Smart(er), work easier, make more money everyone Hugs!


----------



## scrurbscrud

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> I'm driving livery here in Vegas.
> Never drove for Uber here in Vegas... they were kicked two days before I was gonna start. LOL.
> And another poster mentioned Karma.
> Well, I must have good Karma because I'd be running the wheels off of my little entry level Benz CLA250 which only qualifies for UberX


Good on you. Probably beats the heck outta being swatted by the local army thugs.


----------



## Sydney Uber

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Walking 3 or 4 miles?
> Sounds less like a Socialist and more like an athleticicist.
> A Socialist would be somebody who drove the passenger a few miles but then passed on his loss to all of the rest of the drivers, or passed on his actual profit of .25¢ to the rest of the drivers on duty at the time.
> Let's say that you own a pizza joint and you have a medium, one topping pizza on special for $5.00 and you have a delivery guy working for you that makes minimum wage plus his tips.
> I call you up and order _ONE _pizza and I live ten miles away.
> You actually make a max of $2.50 on the material end of the pizza, then there is the gas for the oven, the lights, the rent, the insurance, the wage for the person who serves in the restaurant and takes the phone orders.
> You get a call from Jimbo (me) and I order a pizza and you send your guy out there to deliver it.
> Where's your profit?
> What's even better is that I tell my neighbors that your pizza is the best one that I ever had and tell them to all order a pizza over the next week.
> Now you start tearing your hair out.
> 
> That's why pizza joints have a minimum amount in order to deliver, like $30.00 PLUS a minimum delivery charge of $2.50 which doesn't go to the driver.
> Not only that, but the Socialism part comes in when the pizza joint owner's taxes have to pick up the cost of the Uber driver who has to go into the ER and can't afford the $10,000.00 bill for his fractured skull and resultant treatment because he can't afford $700.00 a month for medical coverage.
> 
> The upshot?
> Pizza guy closes his doors, signs on with Uber with a Santander lease and starts making $4.00 rides with no tip.
> How's that for coming full circle?


That scenario is playing out in Black /PH industry as we speak. Scary
Stuff.


----------



## scrurbscrud

UberGirlPBC said:


> I drive UberSelect. I let the pax know if I am halfway to them Uber will charge them $10. I do not have to wait for them to realize I am not coming. I drive to them and if they cancel midway, you just paid for my time and gas. I send them a Blessing in the air and thank them for the $10 and pull over and wait for the next request (saves gas).
> 
> The other day a pax pinged me; I accepted. I sent my usual text (eta and he pinged from the airport so I asked what airline). He replied he was not even in FL yet. He was just (playing around) learning the app. I texted can you please cancel. No response, no worries I got you buddy I am still driving to your destination. I ask him to cancel again. Crickets! I told him if he does not cancel soon Uber will charge him $10.00 and the cancel button is in the top right corner (but sometimes bottom depending on phone but didn't text all that). Couple mins later no response but his arse sure enough canceled as he would have never canceled at all had I not said $10.
> 
> I would have driven all the way there and waited for a bit and hit no show. I am not messing with my acceptance rates. Uber notices all of these things and probably does not factor in the customer asked me to cancel. Unfortunately since the pax did not care he was requesting a live driver and did not cancel immediately, by the time he did cancel I had driven halfway. He was charged $10 and that's a small fee for the price of education. If you can, get off of UberX. It is worth to Uber in a different Uber Class in so many ways. You can hand out business cards and keep your own customers. Then if Uber leaves your area and the apps no longer work you are not dead in the water. Think Smart(er), work easier, make more money everyone Hugs!


Gave an Uber black driver a fare awhile back. Nice op to quiz him on profitability, other interesting details.

Summary of analysis. UberX cut his previous biz in half and it's less than marginal currently. Why, just like UberX!


----------



## UberGirlPBC

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> How the heck do they know what kind of car they're pinging?
> Karma? Maybe you're talking about a Fisker Karma... on a Santander lease.
> 
> http://thenewfisker.com


They see UberXL, UberX, UberSelect...sometimes the cheap UberX people want an UberX but there are none available in the area. They see the UberSelect, me, and want to really get to their destination and have no choice but to pay $2.35 per miles plus $0.40 per minute minimum fare is $10. I hear their complaints about why is my fare more expensive. I tell them they are killing the people who UberX. I had a few laugh and say they don't care (not effing funny). I care about you all! I don't know how to raise your fares, except if no one UberX's which will never happen if the option is available. It will have to be a personal choice. Xoxo


----------



## Uber-Doober

UberGirlPBC said:


> They see UberXL, UberX, UberSelect...sometimes the cheap UberX people want an UberX but there are none available in the area. They see the UberSelect, me, and want to really get to their destination and have no choice but to pay $2.35 per miles plus $0.40 per minute minimum fare is $10. I hear their complaints about why is my fare more expensive. I tell them they are killing the people who UberX. I had a few laugh and say they don't care (not effing funny). I care about you all! I don't know how to raise your fares, except if no one UberX's which will never happen if the option is available. It will have to be a personal choice. Xoxo


^^^
Ok, I just sorta / kinda misunderstood you a bit. 
I thought you were advocating getting a better car for UberX because there's a lot of 40K+ machinery out there that only qualifies for X and the karma alone isn't gonna pay the bills. 
But upgrading to something really good looking that's used and lo miles in order to upgrade your category to Select or something like that, I can see the benefit.... but the X drivers are really getting killed in most of their respective markets. 
Best of luck to you, UberGirl!


----------



## UberGirlPBC

Oops, I meant I let the pax know if they text me or call me they no longer want me. I will no longer cancel for them. They will be charged $10 unless they are less rude and cancel immediately. My ratings were not as great as my acceptance rate was 100% last week. Some
due to the fact they wanted to pay UberX and a few guys offered me to come in for a drink. I don't worry about the cards I am dealt and what I cannot change. I only work on what I can do to make more money and less headache. I will keep trying to work more earlier hours on my days off from my W2 job. I know hours after midnight may result in low ratings from drunk dudes or it may result in $5-$20 tips. I noticed it is all the power of positive thinking and Blessing the negative to receive more positive. If Uber does not workout for me I will have another 2nd job until I self employed like I was in LA. I am passing out business cards and I just need to file my application for the vehicle for hire license after I receive my driving record from CA. I am not here to annoy only help you make more $$$$$$$$$$$$$$



UberGirlPBC said:


> I drive UberSelect. I let the pax know if I am halfway to them Uber will charge them $10. I do not have to wait for them to realize I am not coming. I drive to them and if they cancel midway, you just paid for my time and gas. I send them a Blessing in the air and thank them for the $10 and pull over and wait for the next request (saves gas).
> 
> The other day a pax pinged me; I accepted. I sent my usual text (eta and he pinged from the airport so I asked what airline). He replied he was not even in FL yet. He was just (playing around) learning the app. I texted can you please cancel. No response, no worries I got you buddy I am still driving to your destination. I ask him to cancel again. Crickets! I told him if he does not cancel soon Uber will charge him $10.00 and the cancel button is in the top right corner (but sometimes bottom depending on phone but didn't text all that). Couple mins later no response but his arse sure enough canceled as he would have never canceled at all had I not said $10.
> 
> I would have driven all the way there and waited for a bit and hit no show. I am not messing with my acceptance rates. Uber notices all of these things and probably does not factor in the customer asked me to cancel. Unfortunately since the pax did not care he was requesting a live driver and did not cancel immediately, by the time he did cancel I had driven halfway. He was charged $10 and that's a small fee for the price of education. If you can, get off of UberX. It is worth to Uber in a different Uber Class in so many ways. You can hand out business cards and keep your own customers. Then if Uber leaves your area and the apps no longer work you are not dead in the water. Think Smart(er), work easier, make more money everyone Hugs!


----------



## Actionjax

Just curious, if say a disgruntled Taxi driver decided to order a bunch of rides and take them but rate every ride 1* just to screw with your ratings and get you fired because in their mind you are all a bunch of pricks, would you want Uber to do something looking at the history of this rider? Or just let it go because it's not a big deal.

What if an army of them decided to do this over a 2 week period.

I find it funny how we believe that giving 1* ratings for what is considered stupid things that the PAX is not either informed or things that are really not their problem. (Like short rides).

Lots feel it's unjustified that Uber would deactivate you for doing this, yet if a PAX was doing this you would be screaming for them to be deactivated.

Ratings are a 2 way street, difference is a PAX rating will have little impact on them. Think about that next time you give a 1* out. Someone else may be getting them in return when they find out.

But I forgot as independent contractors it's all about the short game.


----------



## UberGirlPBC

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Ok, I just sorta / kinda misunderstood you a bit.
> I thought you were advocating getting a better car for UberX because there's a lot of 40K+ machinery out there that only qualifies for X and the karma alone isn't gonna pay the bills.
> But upgrading to something really good looking that's used and lo miles in order to upgrade your category to Select or something like that, I can see the benefit.... but the X drivers are really getting killed in most of their respective markets.
> Best of luck to you, UberGirl!


Thank you Uber Doober! This whole thread and many like them can go away if the person is able to change cars. Let's say a person is driving a newer Camry and paying $250-$350 per month for a carnote. They could look in their area and find a 2010+ Audi, BMW, Cadillac, Jaguar, Mercedes etc for around $20k used with low miles and their carnote will be around $400 or so. Now they have a car they like and the pax like. They build their batch of customers who pay them cash to drive them around and Uber too. They are getting a better fare, but the their monthly expense went up because of the carnote, but they are making more money. If you like driving ( I pick non traffic hours, so I like driving), then you can make a good business around this. If no one can get under $1 per mile fares, then everyone will pay gladly to not walk or take a bus, no? The wheel model has already been made. The under $1 fares is not helping the wheel model. Cabs charge almost $3 per mile. We are better than under $1


----------



## Uber-Doober

scrurbscrud said:


> Good on you. Probably beats the heck outta being swatted by the local army thugs.


^^^
LOL!
You know, I actually qualified for a pass into Nellis AFB to pick up some officers and/or their families. 
Some of the nicest peeps you ever met, and really undemanding. 
Some of the other drivers ask me 'how the (blank) did you ever get that? (They can only get as far as the bullet proof gates)
It took me six months AND I had to pay personally for all their research done on me, AND another Federal fingerprinting session, but for me it's more of a status symbol. 
I average only about ten rides a year out of or to Nellis AFB, but dispatch always only calls me because they know that currently I'm the only one that can get in there. Hah! I love it! 
And if my Cadillac assigned car isn't big enough for the party, they tell me to come in and pick up a stretch that isn't being used. 
BTW, the total permit process to get on the base was like $250.00 which companies like FedX, UPS and the Post Office pay but I had to fork over my own dinero.


----------



## getFubered

Actionjax said:


> Just curious, if say a disgruntled Taxi driver decided to order a bunch of rides and take them but rate every ride 1* just to screw with your ratings and get you fired because in their mind you are all a bunch of pricks, would you want Uber to do something looking at the history of this rider? Or just let it go because it's not a big deal.
> 
> What if an army of them decided to do this over a 2 week period.
> 
> I find it funny how we believe that giving 1* ratings for what is considered stupid things that the PAX is not either informed or things that are really not their problem. (Like short rides).
> 
> Lots feel it's unjustified that Uber would deactivate you for doing this, yet if a PAX was doing this you would be screaming for them to be deactivated.
> 
> Ratings are a 2 way street, difference is a PAX rating will have little impact on them. Think about that next time you give a 1* out. Someone else may be getting them in return when they find out.
> 
> But I forgot as independent contractors it's all about the short game.


You're kidding right? How could you possibly compare pax ratings to driver ratings? Your logic is so faulty sometimes.


----------



## UberGirlPBC

Awww Hun I love Benz's don't do that to your nice car!!! Maybe AZ has those Benz in their Higher Uber Classes? I'm kind of lost where you live? In FL I think the CLA is Select. Upgrade ya! The pax must be excited and must usually tip you when they get to ride in the CLA vs another X group no? I have switched on to UberX during surges to keep it economical only to sometimes not get the surge and the UberX people feel the need to tip, sometimes. I mostly just UberSelect now. I might do some UberX for ratings, but that's a little bit of a secret or story. _I have to get my ratings back up to 4.8 the lonely hearts club were unforgiving last week, oh well_


----------



## Uber-Doober

UberGirlPBC said:


> Thank you Uber Doober! This whole thread and many like them can go away if the person is able to change cars. Let's say a person is driving a newer Camry and paying $250-$350 per month for a carnote. They could look in their area and find a 2010+ Audi, BMW, Cadillac, Jaguar, Mercedes etc for around $20k used with low miles and their carnote will be around $400 or so. Now they have a car they like and the pax like. They build their batch of customers who pay them cash to drive them around and Uber too. They are getting a better fare, but the their monthly expense went up because of the carnote, but they are making more money. If you like driving ( I pick non traffic hours, so I like driving), then you can make a good business around this. If no one can get under $1 per mile fares, then everyone will pay gladly to not walk or take a bus, no? The wheel model has already been made. The under $1 fares is not helping the wheel model. Cabs charge almost $3 per mile. We are better than under $1


^^^
You know what? 
I really like bumper to bumper traffic because occasionally (VERY occasionally) I get somebody on the freeway when it's stopped who toots the horn next to me and wants my card. 
It shows a sharp person because the only way that they know that I'm livery is by the numbers on the bumper, and then the luck of being able to get up next to me when the traffic stops for another 30 secs.


----------



## UberGirlPBC

Go to vistaprint.com and get door magnets with your number on them. Just have the word transportation on them or something like that if that is legal? I will when I get the license


----------



## UberHammer

getFubered said:


> You're kidding right? How could you possibly compare pax ratings to driver ratings? Your logic is so faulty sometimes.


Very faulty. Uber would have to be deactivating riders with ratings below 4.6... AND this would have to be many riders source of income for the two to be anywhere comparable.


----------



## Uber-Doober

UberGirlPBC said:


> Awww Hun I love Benz's don't do that to your nice car!!! Maybe AZ has those Benz in their Higher Uber Classes? I'm kind of lost where you live? In FL I think the CLA is Select. Upgrade ya! The pax must be excited and must usually tip you when they get to ride in the CLA vs another X group no? I have switched on to UberX during surges to keep it economical only to sometimes not get the surge and the UberX people feel the need to tip, sometimes. I mostly just UberSelect now. I might do some UberX for ratings, but that's a little bit of a secret or story. _I have to get my ratings back up to 4.8 the lonely hearts club were unforgiving last week, oh well_


^^^
Yeh, when I "almost" started Ubering and found out that here in Vega$ my MBZ would only be X, even though I only had it for a month, I seriously considered trading it for a new optioned out Prius... maybe the Prius V. 
Kinda glad that it didn't work out here because I was taken back by a company that I used to drive for (And this company NEVER takes former drivers back) and they gave me a fantastic assigned car that is only one of about ten that isn't black. 
Can't remember what Cadillac calls that color, but it's a very deep red pearl and on the CTS it's spectacular and the pax love it.


----------



## UberGirlPBC

upnetuser said:


> the sad part is the per mile rate you listed for uber select is what the rate should be for uber X in LA/OC.
> 
> while it would be nice getting paid more to drive select, I have no long term interest in driving people around, so I wouldn't bother getting a car that qualifies for select. it would also still be working for these assholes, which is another thing I have zero interest in.


I wish you well in your endeavors! I am considering studying real estate also. I took the the insurance exam and passed the first time it was hard though. I have many agendas. I will have to wait until next week to sign up for online real estate exam studies. I do like driving, because I have found a way to make it on my terms. Half of the reason it works for me is because all these beautiful souls who contribute to this form. Even the mean ones I learn something from them or not what to do XOxo


----------



## UberGirlPBC

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Yeh, when I "almost" started Ubering and found out that here in Vega$ my MBZ would only be X, even though I only had it for a month, I seriously considered trading it for a new optioned out Prius... maybe the Prius V.
> Kinda glad that it didn't work out here because I was taken back by a company that I used to drive for (And this company NEVER takes former drivers back) and they gave me a fantastic assigned car that is only one of about ten that isn't black.
> Can't remember what Cadillac calls that color, but it's a very deep red pearl and on the CTS it's spectacular and the pax love it.


That's awesome! I so wish I could drive in Vegas!!!! I would come UUUUPPP!!! Although convention season is winding down, March Madness is popping. Hmmm, I am such a Cali person, now I am thinking about heading back west and driving in LV... That would be so much fun (and the horny drunk dudes sometimes a nightmare, but sometimes awesome $100 tips) HMmmm...

Well, Uber Doober, stay in touch! I have you on follow and may inbox you my email.


----------



## Actionjax

UberHammer said:


> Very faulty. Uber would have to be deactivating riders with ratings below 4.6... AND this would have to be many riders source of income for the two to be anywhere comparable.


Just because the outcome is different doesn't change the way it is being used. Riders care as much about your job as you care about them.

This thread is looking for justification on low ratings on riders. You don't think that Uber will trend that stuff? Take action where required?

Fact is they believe their rating system is a valid one. You want to screw with it be my guest. But when drivers start to cry that they were deactivated for some of the littlest things, you may want to evaluate how you felt going postal on the system contributed to that.

And I think I clearly stated a PAX rating will have little impact on them. If people want to start to screw with riders I can see them screwing us back. And it will sting twice as hard.

More and more PAX I noticed ask me for their ratings. And some are leaving down right aggravated when I tell them they are a sitting in the high 3's. Who knows how that effected me in the end. But to start out with that is not a positive and I end up playing damage control because some disgruntled driver took it upon themselves to be a rebel against the system.

But hey let me know how drivers will do in the long run with that kind of rebellion.


----------



## UberHammer

Actionjax said:


> This thread is looking for justification on low ratings on riders. You don't think that Uber will trend that stuff? Take action where required?


Nothing I've ever seen from Uber makes me think they give a shit what drivers rate the riders. If I had to make a prediction, I'd say it's eventually going away.


----------



## newsboy559

UberGirlPBC said:


> Karma does Bless. If they think they are getting Mc Donalds while at Mc Donalds, wait who tips at Mc Donalds?
> Just upgrade your car to a 2010+ whatever Uber market nice service you have in Dallas. It is a gamechanger and less work, better clientele also. And they tip more often IJS


That would be nice, but Uber only has X in my market. Nothing else.


----------



## Actionjax

UberHammer said:


> Nothing I've ever seen from Uber makes me think they give a shit what drivers rate the riders. If I had to make a prediction, I'd say it's eventually going away.


Funny I have heard otherwise. And I think I come from a better place of knowing. Maybe you should take the advice of some of the CSR's on here when they say something about that.

And if Drivers abuse the system there is chance it will go away. Then what. You got nothing to go by. Good luck figuring stuff out now. They already stripped the pictures of the riders off the app. Then the names. Soon they will kill the addresses and the ratings. All because people get choosy.

So they got you by the balls. Get over it or move on.


----------



## newsboy559

UberGirlPBC said:


> I would have driven all the way there and waited for a bit and hit no show. I am not messing with my acceptance rates. Uber notices all of these things and probably does not factor in the customer asked me to cancel.


I'm also fairly certain the "Customer requested cancel" option is worthless. It still shows up as "driver_canceled" on your Uber partner statement. And it also still goes against your cancellation rate.


----------



## Truth & Facts

I will quit driving soon. If you are in my car, you will get a 1-star, no questions asked.

Let's destroy current imperfect rating system so that a better one will evolve, just like from Windows 8.1 jump to Windows 10.


----------



## Orlando_Driver

My rating system:
If she is super hot 5 stars
Hottie 4 stars
Short skirt showing some leg 5 stars
Cleavage shot 5 stars
*****y Business woman 3 stars ( but can be upgraded based on above )


----------



## geeman

DukeOfDallas said:


> Seriously, I have started to rate my passengers on fares. Pax can be nicest person in the world, but if I drove 15 minutes out of my way for a $4.00 fare with no tip, automatic rating is a 1 star.
> 
> Anyone else agree or use similar system?


Well you were the dumb ass for driving 15 minutes. I wouldn't drive more then 5 minutes to pick up a PAX that is if I were driving. I quit once the fares dropped to 75 cents a mile. You're losing money and mortgaging your car.


----------



## Uber-Doober

newsboy559 said:


> That would be nice, but Uber only has X in my market. Nothing else.


^^^
Wow, that's strange because there's a lot of money in Wichita and you'd think that there would be enough business to run the wheels off of a Black just on airport runs. 
Sorry, but I don't know if Uber is allowed in the airports in Wichita, but if they are.... you never can tell about being the first Black or SUV in a market like that. 
Wouldn't hurt to ask Uber Wichita. 
From what I've gathered about Uber is that they would just dismiss you and say that they only have X which is the Borg Drone mentality of Uber.... without wanting to think out of the box and activate a couple of Black or SUV's to see what the market will bear. 
Anyway, if you have the wherewithal to do it, I'd put it too them.... but be advised because I know people in Wichita, they like Amurrrican prestige vehicles. 
Over there, they might drive Lexuses, but they like Cadillacs, Lincolns, and big Chevy Suburbans to get driven around in.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Actionjax said:


> Funny I have heard otherwise. And I think I come from a better place of knowing. Maybe you should take the advice of some of the CSR's on here when they say something about that.
> 
> And if Drivers abuse the system there is chance it will go away. Then what. You got nothing to go by. Good luck figuring stuff out now. They already stripped the pictures of the riders off the app. Then the names. Soon they will kill the addresses and the ratings. All because people get choosy.
> 
> So they got you by the balls. Get over it or move on.


^^^
You could put the pax in a REAL quandary and tell them to rate on a scale of one to 100. 
Lotta head scratching in the back seat, especially if they're drunk, throwing up, or have diarreahaha.


----------



## Actionjax

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> You could put the pax in a REAL quandary and tell them to rate on a scale of one to 100.
> Lotta head scratching in the back seat, especially if they're drunk, throwing up, or have diarreahaha.


You really want to mess with them give them colors to choose. But be sure to throw in colors like purple or blue just to mess with them.


----------



## UberGirlPBC

newsboy559 said:


> I'm also fairly certain the "Customer requested cancel" option is worthless. It still shows up as "driver_canceled" on your Uber partner statement. And it also still goes against your cancellation rate.


 You will be happy to know the last pay period I did not receive all my cancellations, but this is what it looks like :
43.62 1.00 (1.00)( 12.21) 31.41 So I got paid $31 for this fare
11:01PM uberSELECT 10.00 (2.80) 7.20 I got paid $7.20 for no show or cancellation (and no minus $1 safe rider fee) No I am not interested in $7, but it is better than nothing for a no show or cancellation I drove to.


----------



## newsboy559

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Wow, that's strange because there's a lot of money in Wichita and you'd think that there would be enough business to run the wheels off of a Black just on airport runs.
> Sorry, but I don't know if Uber is allowed in the airports in Wichita, but if they are.... you never can tell about being the first Black or SUV in a market like that.
> Wouldn't hurt to ask Uber Wichita.
> From what I've gathered about Uber is that they would just dismiss you and say that they only have X which is the Borg Drone mentality of Uber.... without wanting to think out of the box and activate a couple of Black or SUV's to see what the market will bear.
> Anyway, if you have the wherewithal to do it, I'd put it too them.... but be advised because I know people in Wichita, they like Amurrrican prestige vehicles.
> Over there, they might drive Lexuses, but they like Cadillacs, Lincolns, and big Chevy Suburbans to get driven around in.


That's exactly the way Uber thinks. I've enquired. They refuse to tell me anything about plans to introduce Black or Select in the market.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Aeschylus stated: "Moderation in all things". 
I would be willing to put that to use in the ratings too.


----------



## UberHammer

Actionjax said:


> Funny I have heard otherwise. And I think I come from a better place of knowing. Maybe you should take the advice of some of the CSR's on here when they say something about that.
> 
> And if Drivers abuse the system there is chance it will go away. Then what. You got nothing to go by. Good luck figuring stuff out now. They already stripped the pictures of the riders off the app. Then the names. Soon they will kill the addresses and the ratings. All because people get choosy.
> 
> So they got you by the balls. Get over it or move on.


So they've stripped all those things away from the driver... but they won't ever strip the rider rating away from the driver?

Of course they will. What you just said supports my argument more than yours. There will come a time when drivers won't even see it anymore.


----------



## Uber-Doober

newsboy559 said:


> That's exactly the way Uber thinks. I've enquired. They refuse to tell me anything about plans to introduce Black or Select in the market.


^^^
Yup, I thought so. 
Just a buncha Drones that think that even some little inconsequential piece of info is gonna bring the company down. 
WTF! 
That's the kind of thinking that Asians are famous for, and is what is going to make Samsung the next Nokia. 
Underlings report to managers who report to supervisors who report to supervisors who report to supervisors.... well, you get the picture, and God forbid they take any advice from a guy who is willing to put his own money down for the implementation of an out of the box idea.


----------



## Actionjax

UberHammer said:


> So they've stripped all those things away from the driver... but they won't ever strip the rider rating away from the driver?
> 
> Of course they will. What you just said supports my argument more than yours. There will come a time when drivers won't even see it anymore.


I don't think I supported what you said. Drivers will be booted long before any mass change happens. But lets say they did to what you are saying how is that helping things in the long run? What's your point?

I stated that trending at Uber will work against a driver who engages in this kind of behavior. You disagree with that. By all means please do, it's your right because that's what you have experienced. But my experience tells me something else. And I would think if someone thought about it long an hard they would figure it out for themselves on what is a valid response when a dozen riders out of hundreds shows a history of giving 1 star to a pax when 20 other drivers gave a 5 star. Then look at that driver and behold that's a trend.

Sounds to me like a driver attitude problem or a training issue. Either way, it wont work out well for the driver.

Come on UberHammer your a smart guy, you know how this will play out. You think Uber just sits on top of it's money waiting for an IPO to come out? Or do you think they are always shaving drivers off that don't follow the game they want played.


----------



## Txchick

Actionjax said:


> I don't think I supported what you said. Drivers will be booted long before any mass change happens. But lets say they did to what you are saying how is that helping things in the long run? What's your point?
> 
> I stated that trending at Uber will work against a driver who engages in this kind of behavior. You disagree with that. By all means please do, it's your right because that's what you have experienced. But my experience tells me something else. And I would think if someone thought about it long an hard they would figure it out for themselves on what is a valid response when a dozen riders out of hundreds shows a history of giving 1 star to a pax when 20 other drivers gave a 5 star. Then look at that driver and behold that's a trend.
> 
> Sounds to me like a driver attitude problem or a training issue. Either way, it wont work out well for the driver.
> 
> Come on UberHammer your a smart guy, you know how this will play out. You think Uber just sits on top of it's money waiting for an IPO to come out? Or do you think they are always shaving drivers off that don't follow the game they want played.


I will say both & I still think you need to take a 12 step Uber program. Uber is the worst company I have seen come up the ranks along with Amazon in a long time. If my full time employer ran a company like Uber we would have been gone a long time ago.


----------



## Uber-Doober

newsboy559 said:


> That's exactly the way Uber thinks. I've enquired. They refuse to tell me anything about plans to introduce Black or Select in the market.


^^^
Just one more thing. 
A couple of years ago I told the GM of the company that I'm with that we should have at least one Rolls. 
So they went out and bought either a Ghost or Wraith.... whichever one is built on the 7 series BMW chassis and guess what? 
That damned thing has already almost 200K on the clock and the GM said that there probably wouldn't be a market for in here in Vegas. 
They're literally running the wheels off of that thing. 
And, no.... I haven't driven it. Hah! 
I never got compensated for it in any way, but they DO let me work my own hours (within reason) which has all the other drivers wondering what my connection is.


----------



## ChevyChick

LAndreas said:


> I'm glad you're in the Dallas market, and I am not. Condolences to the hard working independent Uber drivers in TX for having Duke make this work tool of yours worthless.
> 
> The quality of the most recent Uber recruits has really gotten scary.


 I was going to say the same thing!!


----------



## Actionjax

Txchick said:


> I will say both & I still think you need to take a 12 step Uber program. Uber is the worst company I have seen come up the ranks along with Amazon in a long time. If my full time employer ran a company like Uber we would have been gone a long time ago.


If my full time employer ran like Uber I wouldn't be anywhere near them either. But that won't change how it will play out for drivers. If people want justice doing a 1 star on a pax is just singling you out to be cut from the fold. And last I checked the Uber rebellion needs all the driver it can get. Because based on what I see here more are leaving every day.


----------



## johnywinslow

if im working for guarantee I LOVE the 20 min 4$ ride. eats up my hr. makes the minimum 1 trip per hr. if I only get 4.00 that means uber has to add $14.00 to my fare! I simply stop caring or looking at fares and watch the clock, turn my ap on for say 3 hrs, start at the top of the hour of course. then the way I see it I just made $18.00 an hr. x 3 hrs. if I made more then that that's awesome, if not who cares, im working by the hour not the trip! I make guarantee money every single week, I know it cant last its too good to be true.


----------



## UberHammer

Actionjax said:


> I don't think I supported what you said. Drivers will be booted long before any mass change happens. But lets say they did to what you are saying how is that helping things in the long run? What's your point?
> 
> I stated that trending at Uber will work against a driver who engages in this kind of behavior.* You disagree with that. *By all means please do, it's your right because that's what you have experienced. But my experience tells me something else. And I would think if someone thought about it long an hard they would figure it out for themselves on what is a valid response when a dozen riders out of hundreds shows a history of giving 1 star to a pax when 20 other drivers gave a 5 star. Then look at that driver and behold that's a trend.
> 
> Sounds to me like a driver attitude problem or a training issue. Either way, it wont work out well for the driver.
> 
> Come on UberHammer your a smart guy, you know how this will play out. You think Uber just sits on top of it's money waiting for an IPO to come out? Or do you think they are always shaving drivers off that don't follow the game they want played.


I have never disagreed with that. I even agreed with it. Here's a link to my post in this thread agreeing to it, and why I agree Uber will do that:

https://uberpeople.net/threads/rate...tip-automatic-1-star.15360/page-7#post-206410


----------



## Uber-Doober

Actionjax said:


> Funny I have heard otherwise. And I think I come from a better place of knowing. Maybe you should take the advice of some of the CSR's on here when they say something about that.
> 
> And if Drivers abuse the system there is chance it will go away. Then what. You got nothing to go by. Good luck figuring stuff out now. They already stripped the pictures of the riders off the app. Then the names. Soon they will kill the addresses and the ratings. All because people get choosy.
> 
> So they got you by the balls. Get over it or move on.


^^^
Take the advice of a CSR? 
WHAT!!!!
Look... I know that your opinions are skewed in one direction from maybe being a little too close to the source. 
You mentioned once in another thread that Uber (office type) employees are forbidden to drive. 
Well, I wonder what the reason for that is? 
Could it be because they might actually find out how the other half lives? 
EVERYbody on the executive level at my company has driven. Everybody from the lady in HR and on up. 
You can't know a lot about one level of the company and be ignorant of everything else. 
It's like me saying that I'm gonna open a technology company selling hamburgers, but I'm a computer and programming genius but I don't know how to turn on a stove. 
OMG... how the *** do you make a patty?
How much is too much secret sauce? 
Oh, crap... my buns are all burned.

OK, so Uber is a "technology" company and everybody up top, the "string pullers" if you will has an expertise in that area. 
That, I'm willing to admit. 
But they have absolutely no experience of what it's like to try to make a living driving.... not one scintilla of what it's like to have to do dead miles (as you admitted) which came as a revelation to the guy that you spoke to over at your little propaganda soirée where they only invited five drivers(!), a truly representative number if I might say. That's tongue in cheek, by the way just in case you didn't grasp it.

So, don't just sit there and tell drivers to like it or lump it, because that's exactly what has filtered down to the CSR's from the top.


----------



## DrJeecheroo

Lidman said:


> It has everything to do with it. It's not the drivers fault they trying to make a living and by picking them up with no tips at these "sweat shop" rate, they're working for free.


Because Sly feels it's in the UBER Warrior Code. Meanwhile UBER still makes a couple of bucks on each of these miserable fares. I had one of these last week, where it took me 15 minutes to get to the pax and it was ***** ***** ***** about how long it took for such a short fare.


----------



## DrJeecheroo

Sly said:


> Dude that's what we are here for.


Good now do your UBER duty and go pick him up at those .90 cent rate/mile. Remember like you said that's what were here for. Regardless of how far we have to drive to get the passenger.


----------



## getFubered

Haha yea they're going to deactivate a nice, white, experienced driver from the burbs with a 4.9 rating for rating SOME pax low and replace him with alibaba and the 40 thieves. Everyone has been complaining about smelly uber cars, wait til August hits and the smell becomes unbearable. They're not going to get rid of someone for rider ratings because no one gives a shit. You think drivers in Nashville giving 80 cent min fares are getting requests thinking "hmm that rider is not acceptable enough my services". Uber is shady no doubt. But they do what they do because they think its in their own best interests (even though they're often blinded by their own arrogance). In this case, there getting nothing by deactivating a good driver for low pax ratings because once again no one gives a shit.

Except you because you use Uber as a rider, you have another full time job, and your city hasn't seen rate cuts.


----------



## Uber-Doober

DrJeecheroo said:


> Because Sly feels it's in the UBER Warrior Code. Meanwhile UBER still makes a couple of bucks on each of these miserable fares. I had one of these last week, where it took me 15 minutes to get to the pax and it was ***** ***** ***** about how long it took for such a short fare.


^^^
Haha @ that passenger. 
Order a cab here in Vegas and you wait anywhere between 45 minutes to an hour and a half. 
And then the cab driver can't find my street which is only one block long in the whole of Las Vegas.


----------



## Uber-Doober

getFubered said:


> Haha yea they're going to deactivate a nice, white, experienced driver from the burbs with a 4.9 rating for rating SOME pax low and replace him with alibaba and the 40 thieves. Everyone has been complaining about smelly uber cars, wait til August hits and the smell becomes unbearable.


^^^
Smell like one of Ali Bababa's camels?


----------



## DrJeecheroo

Txchick said:


> I will say both & I still think you need to take a 12 step Uber program. Uber is the worst company I have seen come up the ranks along with Amazon in a long time. If my full time employer ran a company like Uber we would have been gone a long time ago.


I agree. 1. We admitted we were powerless over UBER that the lowered fare rate became unmanageable 2. Came to believe that a company more ethnical then uber could restore us to monetary sanity. 3 Made a decision (or indecision if deactivated by uber) to turn our will and lives over to the care of anything uberless as we understand whatever that would be. 
4. Taking a fearless and moral inventory of how we became uberites in the first place.
5. Admitted the exact nature of how uber wronged us.
Steps 6-12 There's life after uber.

STEP 13....To work this step you are required to have served at least two years in this non-ubership, and start dating someone with less then one year of (uber-freeiaty).


----------



## Uber-Doober

DrJeecheroo said:


> I agree. 1. We admitted we were powerless over UBER that the lowered fare rate became unmanageable 2. Came to believe that a company more ethnical then uber could restore us to monetary sanity. 3 Made a decision (or indecision if deactivated by uber) to turn our will and lives over to the care of anything uberless as we understand whatever that would be.
> 4. Taking a fearless and moral inventory of how we became uberites in the first place.
> 5. Admitted the exact nature of how uber wronged us.
> Steps 6-12 There's life after uber.
> 
> STEP 13....To work this step you are required to have served at least two years in this non-ubership, and start dating someone with less then one year of (uber-freeiaty).


^^^
The only problem is that the Uber Big Book was written by Travis. 
Uber doesn't give chips... not even tips, and no 7th Tradition but the drivers give royally, and not even pass the coffee can.


----------



## DrJeecheroo

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> The only problem is that the Uber Big Book was written by Travis.
> Uber doesn't give chips... not even tips, and no 7th Tradition but the drivers give royally, and not even pass the coffee can.


Yes but this is the 12 steps to ones that want to go uberless. Trying to put the disease of uberism into remission.


----------



## Actionjax

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Take the advice of a CSR?
> WHAT!!!!
> Look... I know that your opinions are skewed in one direction from maybe being a little too close to the source.
> You mentioned once in another thread that Uber (office type) employees are forbidden to drive.
> Well, I wonder what the reason for that is?
> Could it be because they might actually find out how the other half lives?
> EVERYbody on the executive level at my company has driven. Everybody from the lady in HR and on up.
> You can't know a lot about one level of the company and be ignorant of everything else.
> It's like me saying that I'm gonna open a technology company selling hamburgers, but I'm a computer and programming genius but I don't know how to turn on a stove.
> OMG... how the *** do you make a patty?
> How much is too much secret sauce?
> Oh, crap... my buns are all burned.
> 
> OK, so Uber is a "technology" company and everybody up top, the "string pullers" if you will has an expertise in that area.
> That, I'm willing to admit.
> But they have absolutely no experience of what it's like to try to make a living driving.... not one scintilla of what it's like to have to do dead miles (as you admitted) which came as a revelation to the guy that you spoke to over at your little propaganda soirée where they only invited five drivers(!), a truly representative number if I might say. That's tongue in cheek, by the way just in case you didn't grasp it.
> 
> So, don't just sit there and tell drivers to like it or lump it, because that's exactly what has filtered down to the CSR's from the top.


I'm not sure why you think Uber not letting people drive has anything to do with them finding out anything. How do you think Uber legal standing would be if they had employees drive. That would skew the relationship they present to both governments and the world as "We are only a tech company"

As for being close to the source it grants me a bit more insight that can be to my advantage. As the saying goes keep your friends close and your enemy closer. Not making Uber the enemy yet but they are not my friends either. We have a mutual benefit for the city of Toronto. And being aware of everything on all sides is a smart play in my book.

So if you think playing Uber is a good strategy then good on you. But countless stories say otherwise.


----------



## UberHammer

@Actionjax ... question.

Do you believe Uber coerces drivers, using threats of possible deactivation, into doing things that they are not contractually obligated to do?


----------



## Actionjax

UberHammer said:


> @Actionjax ... question.
> 
> Do you believe Uber coerces drivers, using threats of possible deactivation, into doing things that they are not contractually obligated to do?


I think Uber's contract is written in such a way that drivers will fall into some area of the contract if Uber wants them gone. So your question has 2 parts.

Do they coerce drivers or threaten them unnecessarily. Yes some markets they do.
Do the go against the contract. I don't think so. They can let anyone go without cause. That alone is in the contract.

That said there are many drivers who are trying to screw Uber. So I think its a 2 way street sometimes. Its just sad good drivers get lumped in with the bad without even being heard.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Actionjax said:


> I'm not sure why you think Uber not letting people drive has anything to do with them finding out anything. How do you think Uber legal standing would be if they had employees drive. That would skew the relationship they present to both governments and the world as "We are only a tech company"
> 
> As for being close to the source it grants me a bit more insight that can be to my advantage. As the saying goes keep your friends close and your enemy closer. Not making Uber the enemy yet but they are not my friends either. We have a mutual benefit for the city of Toronto. And being aware of everything on all sides is a smart play in my book.
> 
> So if you think playing Uber is a good strategy then good on you. But countless stories say otherwise.


^^^
Paragraph 1:Total frabrication. Governments only care about one thing, and that's, A) How they can regulate and what employees do to presumably make the business better has absolutely no standing in what any governmental official does, thinks, or says. 
B) Oh, you're such an Uber egalitarian in thinking that Uber is such an above board company that they have to travel on the "straight and narrow" to preserve what the "world" thinks of them.

Paragraph 2: Stop with the quotes from the famous to bolster your own standing. I'm sure that Travis never read The Art Of War, but I'm sure that he read Mein Kampf.

Last line: "Playing" Uber can be taken two ways, but the way that I interpret it is that when a "partner" plays by the rules and the Company thinks that he's getting the upper hand, they don't like it. 
Uber wants the non-thinkers to be milked dry by their "business mode" as it has been referred to, and the slack-jawed, mouth-breathers to just fall into lock-step and generate those safety fees and the 20%. 
You can't deny that Uber, in lowering their rates has only one thing in mind, and that is to break the backs of any competition without regard to the welfare if its "partners" because they are using the partners personal resources to do this... and that is undeniable, and once that (might) happen, the rates won't change at all because there won't be any motivation to do so. 
In other words, just to paraphrase you, Like it or lump it.

If, as you stated in another thread that you might have to give up driving for whatever reason, or an enhanced relationship with Uber, I doubt very much that you will attempt any change withing your capacity, and just ultimately drink the Company Kool-Aid, maybe get in on the IPO, enhance your resume' as well as your retirement plan. 
Uber is a kind of juggernaut with a pre-entrenched mentality that doesn't like boat rockers that come to the aid of drivers because Uber isn't a transportation company, but an elitist "technology" company that really doesn't know anything about how to treat people and doesn't have anybody on board who knows or even cares how to treat or deal with drivers. The drivers are just a means to an end.

Now, where's my cook book.... I have to learn how to make a hamburger patty. 
Or better yet, I'll hire a master chef and then tell him that he's doing it the wrong way. 
Or give him a bonus if he can make 2,000 patties in one hour and then take the bonus away or "inactivate" him if he uses one of those forms that make like, 50 patties in two minutes.... but I won't put that in the contract... I'll just say that he shows evidence of fraudulent activity because he's not using his hands. 
That sounds better.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Actionjax said:


> I think Uber's contract is written in such a way that drivers will fall into some area of the contract if Uber wants them gone. So your question has 2 parts.
> 
> Do they coerce drivers or threaten them unnecessarily. Yes some markets they do.
> Do the go against the contract. I don't think so. They can let anyone go without cause. That alone is in the contract.
> 
> That said there are many drivers who are trying to screw Uber. So I think its a 2 way street sometimes. Its just sad good drivers get lumped in with the bad without even being heard.


^^^
Oh, yeah... "sad". 
That's about as far as it goes. 
It has been proven time and time again that coercion does absolutely nothing for the morale or productivity of a corporation, and just remember, that YOUR contract just might have all of those clauses. 
Rewards are what do it for the company, and taking them away for one reason or another is not coercion but designed to reinstate that productivity mode. 
Take for instance, Apple and Google.... two companies that I just know that Travis is salivating to emulate. 
Both give bonuses and perks up the kazoo, like open 24/7 kitchens with dining rooms and untimed breaks which are rarely abused because of the perks that might go away. 
Both of these companies have been doing this from the very get-go, even before they became monolithic monsters on the world's business scene. 
Why, you might ask? 
Because the founders 1) Weren't arrogant to the Human condition, and 2) Somewhere along the line they learned how to deal with people effectively and not become entitled narcissists to the detriment of others and knew that they had to give in order to get.

The founder of Uber had an idea that he sold to others that gave him a shitload of money, made up a bunch of rules that sounded good to him and was a one way street to benefit the company, which you just admitted due to the contract having clauses in it that could be used against anybody if necessity and whim struck, while the executives are so detached from what some guy who is driving 18 hours a day (illegal in every State / Commonwealth in this country.) in order to make a living come around to the belief that he's doing something "fraudulent", or "gaming" the system.


----------



## Actionjax

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Oh, yeah... "sad".
> That's about as far as it goes.
> It has been proven time and time again that coercion does absolutely nothing for the morale or productivity of a corporation, and just remember, that YOUR contract just might have all of those clauses.
> Rewards are what do it for the company, and taking them away for one reason or another is not coercion but designed to reinstate that productivity mode.
> Take for instance, Apple and Google.... two companies that I just know that Travis is salivating to emulate.
> Both give bonuses and perks up the kazoo, like open 24/7 kitchens with dining rooms and untimed breaks which are rarely abused because of the perks that might go away.
> Both of these companies have been doing this from the very get-go, even before they became monolithic monsters on the world's business scene.
> Why, you might ask?
> Because the founders 1) Weren't arrogant to the Human condition, and 2) Somewhere along the line they learned how to deal with people effectively and not become entitled narcissists to the detriment of others and knew that they had to give in order to get.
> 
> The founder of Uber had an idea that he sold to others that gave him a shitload of money, made up a bunch of rules that sounded good to him and was a one way street to benefit the company, which you just admitted due to the contract having clauses in it that could be used against anybody if necessity and whim struck, while the executives are so detached from what some guy who is driving 18 hours a day (illegal in every State / Commonwealth in this country.) in order to make a living come around to the belief that he's doing something "fraudulent", or "gaming" the system.


You have no idea what you are talking about. That's obvious. Just because you don't see the abuses that other companies commit doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Both Google and Apple have been manipulating workers in other countries for years. But that's ok because they aren't Americans right.

Get off your high horse thinking Uber is the only evil of this world. Companies of all shapes and sizes commit injustices for the all mighty $. How they take care of their employees can vary from one to another.

You are not an Uber employee. And I'm sure they treat their employees well enough. You are the slave 3rd party contractor no different than the slaves building iPhones in crap working conditions.

You don't like it we get it. But guess what that's life in the corporate world. Big guys step on little guys.

You want fair. Go get a job at a company that gives a dam. Gives you fair working conditions. Don't buy into the get rich quick scheme driving for Uber.

You seem to think you have all the answers and assume I don't. Fact is I can just look at the situation with a more logical sense than you are. I have removed emotion out of this game.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Actionjax said:


> You have no idea what you are talking about. That's obvious. Just because you don't see the abuses that other companies commit doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Both Google and Apple have been manipulating workers in other countries for years. But that's ok because they aren't Americans right.
> 
> Get off your high horse thinking Uber is the only evil of this world. Companies of all shapes and sizes commit injustices for the all mighty $. How they take care of their employees can vary from one to another.
> 
> You are not an Uber employee. And I'm sure they treat their employees well enough. You are the slave 3rd party contractor no different than the slaves building iPhones in crap working conditions.
> 
> You don't like it we get it. But guess what that's life in the corporate world. Big guys step on little guys.
> 
> You want fair. Go get a job at a company that gives a dam. Gives you fair working conditions. Don't buy into the get rich quick scheme driving for Uber.
> 
> You seem to think you have all the answers and assume I don't. Fact is I can just look at the situation with a more logical sense than you are. I have removed emotion out of this game.


^^^
Oh, ok, so now you're falling back on moral equivalence so that it's alright for uber to be run by a sociopath and treat the drivers like dirt under his feet because "other companies do it". 
Uber treats its drivers like crap but other companies do it. 
That's so typical.... not only of an Uberdrone, but of this administration too. 
Just a bunch of sociopaths.

And, MY company does give a damn and my plan is with the same PPO as the police and fire here in Clark. 
And guess what? 
I pay 5 bux a month and keep it by working 32 hours a week minimum.

No, I don't have all the answers, and I only know what I know and don't try to proselytize for an outlaw bandit who cares nothing about my health and well being..... just milk the people who are working like dogs for the Company. 
And "that" is Uber's philosophy. 
Tell me something, since you seem to have more answers than I do. 
What has Uber actually done for its drivers since its inception? 
Name one thing that in the last six months Uber has done for its employees that makes them prosper and/or enhances their lives. 
Name it, and if its valid and able to be verified, I promise that I'll never question you in an adversarial tone again. 
Heck, I've even given you some 'likes' on some of your posts.... but I've received over 500 in two in a half months here.


----------



## Lidman

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Oh, ok, so now you're falling back on moral equivalence so that it's alright for uber to be run by a sociopath and treat the drivers like dirt under his feet because "other companies do it".
> Uber treats its drivers like crap but other companies do it.
> That's so typical.... not only of an Uberdrone, but of this administration too.
> Just a bunch of sociopaths.
> 
> And, MY company does give a damn and my plan is with the same PPO as the police and fire here in Clark.
> And guess what?
> I pay 5 bux a month and keep it by working 32 hours a week minimum.
> 
> No, I don't have all the answers, and I only know what I know and don't try to proselytize for an outlaw bandit who cares nothing about my health and well being..... just milk the people who are working like dogs for the Company.
> And "that" is Uber's philosophy.
> Tell me something, since you seem to have more answers than I do.
> What has Uber actually done for its drivers since its inception?
> 
> Name one thing that in the last six months Uber has done for its employees that makes them prosper and/or enhances their lives.
> Name it, and if its valid and able to be verified, I promise that I'll never question you in an adversarial tone again.
> Heck, I've even given you some 'likes' on some of your posts.... but I've received over 500 in two in a half months here.


Doober: It's almost pointless to argue with members whose cities uber pays around 1.60/mile. He's going to rigorously defend UBER's tactics until they eventually drop the price in Toronto.


----------



## Uberamstel

There are Whales and there is Plankton


----------



## Guest

I do not agree with your rating system.

The rider should be rated 3 or below only if they were rude, made a mess in your car etc.

As for low fares (its not the riders fault so dont rate them low for that).

As for tips, if the rider does not tip it is an automatic 4.


----------



## UberGirlPBC

Uber Doober don't worry about proving your point. I think most of us are able to learn from this form. Unfortunately, people become very passionate about what they know. Sometimes both arguments have truth. Uber mindset or goal is unclear for me as I am in FL now one of the area Uber should do more to make it legitmate since it is a destination which attracts international travelers who use Uber where they are from. If I move back to Cali same thing.

I will say Uber has provided the additional income I need to live comfortably. Uber must complete their negotiations and help us Uber on safely without consequences. This is what I expect at this time from the company and raise UberX rates to at least $2 per mile. Anything lower than that shows disregard for their partner's well being


----------



## J.J. Smith

I don't pay much attention to the rating when I pick up a passenger, but I do start all at 3. Three stars is average. The average rider is, well, average. He/she can improve rating by being friendly, interesting, polite, etc. to a 4, but no higher unless a tip is given. A tip generates 5 stars and I tell them when they do tip, "This is how you get a 5 star rating!"

Jerks with no tip can get a 2 star.

Example: picked up a five star. Four people with luggage that could barely fit to the Baltimore airport from Northern VA - maybe 60 miles - in a snow storm. No tip. Ruined their 5 stars with a 2.


----------



## Goober

I take off a star or three if I drive over 3 miles for a minimum fare.


----------



## Uberamstel

OK, now I happen to be an Uber rider requesting a short ride. 

I notice the arrival time of Uber is 10+ minutes.

I cancel and re-request, new driver eta = 15 minutes and I do not cancel.

I know the driver is not happy and will 1* me, because I read that here so what do you think I do when the *'s pop up?

Bad idea, imo


----------



## Sly

Uberamstel said:


> OK, now I happen to be an Uber rider requesting a short ride.
> 
> I notice the arrival time of Uber is 10+ minutes.
> 
> I cancel and re-request, new driver eta = 15 minutes and I do not cancel.
> 
> I know the driver is not happy and will 1* me, because I read that here so what do you think I do when the *'s pop up?
> 
> Bad idea, imo


I wont one star you it isnt your fault how long or short the drive to you is.


----------



## UberHammer

Actionjax said:


> I think Uber's contract is written in such a way that drivers will fall into some area of the contract if Uber wants them gone. So your question has 2 parts.
> 
> Do they coerce drivers or threaten them unnecessarily. Yes some markets they do.
> Do the go against the contract. I don't think so. They can let anyone go without cause. That alone is in the contract.
> 
> That said there are many drivers who are trying to screw Uber. So I think its a 2 way street sometimes. Its just sad good drivers get lumped in with the bad without even being heard.


I will take that as a "yes" answer to my question.

Next question.... who do you think knows more about how to make profit as an Uber driver in each city? Uber or drivers?


----------



## UberHammer

Sly said:


> I wont one star you it isnt your fault how long or short the drive to you is.


It's Uber's fault.

Uber should not send un-profitable requests to drivers and coerce them into accepting them with threats of deactivating them if they don't.

If Uber wants a system where riders can get picked up 10+ minutes away from drivers and drivers can make a profit on those requests, then Uber needs to set rates high enough so that their system produces that result.

Taxis are required by most city's regulations to accept those requests out in the boonies. It's one of the reasons why taxis charge the rates they do. If they didn't charge enough, those unprofitable boonie trips would eat into the profitable trips, exactly like what happens with Uber drivers... and Travis doesn't give a shit.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Goober said:


> I take off a star or three if I drive over 3 miles for a minimum fare.


Pax have absolutely no conception of driver profitability over distance to pax/min. fare issues. It's unreasonable to expect them to know that drivers don't make shit on long distance min. fare pings.

Half the drivers out there are clueless on this subject. 100% of the pax are clueless on this subject.


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

Uberamstel said:


> OK, now I happen to be an Uber rider requesting a short ride.
> 
> I notice the arrival time of Uber is 10+ minutes.
> 
> I cancel and re-request, new driver eta = 15 minutes and I do not cancel.
> 
> I know the driver is not happy and will 1* me, because I read that here so what do you think I do when the *'s pop up?
> 
> Bad idea, imo


Easy to make sure he or she doesn't 1* you. Give him a good tip (enough to make the ride $2 per mile and a couple bucks more would be what I'd do) and say you're sorry uber sent him from so far away but you really needed the ride and you hope the tip can make up for it since you know the rates are too low. And tell him you will 5 * him for being willing to make that trip. Assuming you didn't leave trash in his car or act otherwise jerky you will get 5 * from me in that case.


----------



## UberHammer

scrurbscrud said:


> Pax have absolutely no conception of driver profitability over distance to pax/min. fare issues. It's unreasonable to expect them to know that drivers don't make shit on long distance min. fare pings.
> 
> Half the drivers out there are clueless on this subject. 100% of the pax are clueless on this subject.


It's way more than half the drivers. Hell, even some of the drivers here that have proven that they can do math are clueless on this subject.


----------



## scrurbscrud

UberHammer said:


> It's Uber's fault.
> Uber should not send un-profitable requests to drivers and coerce them into accepting them with threats of deactivating them if they don't.
> and *Travis doesn't give a shit*.


Uh, yeah. I think you hit the nail on the head. I'd suspect this is probably the #1 complaint of all drivers and it goes without any notice on the part of any of these ride share companies. It would be very easy for them to come up with a surcharge distance to pickup add on to offset this problem AND to serve the burbs.

They could also do a much better job of surging/prime timing outlying areas as well, to get them served and spread out the driver hordes better.

Long ways to go on these issues yet.


----------



## scrurbscrud

UberHammer said:


> It's way more than half the drivers. Hell, even some of the drivers here that have proven that they can do math are clueless on this subject.


The sad part IS that most of us KNOW that the pax will PAY MORE to settle these issues because they can't get service any other way for a reasonable price/timeframe.

That's how ****ing blind these two major ride share companies are. They are still sitting on a gold mine for everyone and are too busy cutting the drivers financial throats with low fares to see it. It's also why they lose scores of drivers. Their biz models are just severely ****ed up.


----------



## UberHammer

scrurbscrud said:


> The sad part IS that most of us KNOW that the pax will PAY MORE to settle these issues because they can't get service any other way for a reasonable price/timeframe.
> 
> That's how ****ing blind these two major ride share companies are. They are still sitting on a gold mine for everyone and are too busy cutting the drivers financial throats with low fares to see it. It's also why they lose scores of drivers. Their biz models are just severely ****ed up.


I agree with this post 1000%


----------



## Uberamstel

pax ratings means nothing at all to most pax.

And doesn't really to me either.

Don't even check their rating anymore after I picked up a perfectly wonderful young lady @2.5*s and who was blown away when I told her she was 2.5.

She didn't have a clue where that came from.

So pax ratings are basically and mainly for satisfying the passive-agressive side of drivers, giving us some illusion of control within the Uber Matrix.

I am aware of the level of people-influence science on the Uber payroll: neuroscientists, behavioural psychologists etc.

To us it Should mean:
Vomit Alert
Dropdead Drunk Alert
Stinky Breath Alert

But it just doesn't

I actually drive to a 5* pickup with some trepidation and my doors locked.

Could be first-time rider and therefore a Sting going on, waiting for me to end the ride and prove that a financial transaction has taken place leaving me with a €4200 fine.

Or 5* could be an angry Amsterdam cab-driver waiting with his friends to deal with the UberX situation in the same way they have dealt with competion in the past.

I would rather deal with a 2* any day of the week.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Uberamstel said:


> Could be first-time rider and therefore a Sting going on, waiting for me to end the ride and prove that a financial transaction has taken place leaving me with *a €4200 fine.*


If you're Ubering with that hovering over your head yer nutz. I sure as hell wouldn't worry much about starz either if I had to look over my shoulder for cops.


----------



## Uberamstel

scrurbscrud said:


> If you're Ubering with that hovering over your head yer nutz. I sure as hell wouldn't worry much about starz either if I had to look over my shoulder for cops.


Yepp. Part of me just likes the adrenalin I guess, but for sure it is nutz plus I gross $25 an hour non-surge because the non-nutz stay on the couch

And Uber does pay the first fine.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Uberamstel said:


> Yepp. Part of me just likes the adrenalin I guess, but for sure it is nutz plus I make $25 an hour non-surge because the non-nutz stay on the couch
> 
> And Uber does pay the first fine.


Yeah, the early Uber initiates always seem to like their chances of not getting caught for breaking the laws.

If you get caught though, make sure you don't get stuck with a mark on your permanent record in a plea deal...

Uber (illegally) on! At least it payz better.


----------



## DukeOfDallas

Drivers need to RATE THE FARE until Uber addresses driver manipulation on minimum fare trips. Minimum trip (with safe trip fee and Uber deductions) and no tip = 1 STAR. Low pax ratings alert drivers that this is high probability of minimal trip fare. This is UBER Mgmt responsibility to correct. Non-tipping pax contribute tacit consent to driver manipulation.

Anyone on here defending Uber is not a driver. This tips off driver that if they accept low star ping, minimal fare is likely.


----------



## UberHammer

DukeOfDallas said:


> Anyone on here defending Uber is not a driver.


This is not true. Some are.

I equate them to women who defend their wife beating husband.


----------



## scrurbscrud

DukeOfDallas said:


> Drivers need to RATE THE FARE until Uber addresses driver manipulation on minimum fare trips. *Minimum trip (with safe trip fee and Uber deductions) and no tip = 1 STAR. * Low pax ratings alert drivers that this is high probability of minimal trip fare. This is UBER Mgmt responsibility to correct. Non-tipping pax contribute tacit consent to driver manipulation.
> 
> Anyone on here defending Uber is not a driver. This tips off driver that if they accept low star ping, minimal fare is likely.


You understand though that for most of us that would be at least 50% or more of the fares? Hell, with the suck ass rates even a more than minimum fare still sucks major ass.

It's not the min. fares only that are killing us off. It's the entire pay scheme.


----------



## DukeOfDallas

Yes, but most egregious is the minimal fare trips that Uber takes their same deductions on. This needs to stop now. Uber needs to share the pain rather than pass it along to driver because they decided to cut rates.


----------



## scrurbscrud

DukeOfDallas said:


> Yes, but most egregious is the minimal fare trips that Uber takes their same deductions on. This needs to stop now. Uber needs to share the pain rather than pass it along to driver because they decided to cut rates.


The min. fare was a problem before the last pay cut, but I could live with it when the overall pay was acceptable.

*On a miles basis the min. fare is NOT the worst pay per mile by a long shot.* If you're sitting in a hot zone and only have to drive a quarter mile to the pax and 3/4 mile fare, the pay is $2.40 a MILE. $2.40 a mile is NOT an issue, other than trying to 'turn' enough of them in an hour to make anything. Best you can do is 3-4 fares an hour. Drivers might not make much in this setup but at least they keep the dead miles down, so they are not losing money. So you do 4 @ $9.60 an hour? IF you only drove 4 miles total to do it that's probably all you deserve. It's still $2.40 a mile.

It's the damn long distance pings with min. fare that causes a driver to bleed money. We literally PAY to drive in those ****ed up setups.

And the long distance fares are the real bad bad bad. It drops the $ per mile figure well under $1 gross. Many times less than 70 cents a mile overall in gross fare with dead miles. It's just impossible to make that kind of number work. In the areas with the 65-75 cent per paid mile they are just BLEEDING money across the board, paying out of pocket to drive. ****in nutz man.

At a 70 cent a mile overall gross, which is about where I land on std X, it works out to less than the IRS cost deduction for miles, net to me.

***** that. Uber can kiss my ass for that kind of number. If they can't run simple math why in the **** does anyone think STARZ are going to get their attentions?*

IF drivers are stupid enough to drive for that...

LET DRIVERS STARVE. No one is making any of us drive at the point of a gun.


----------



## Actionjax

UberHammer said:


> I will take that as a "yes" answer to my question.
> 
> Next question.... who do you think knows more about how to make profit as an Uber driver in each city? Uber or drivers?


That's easy. It would be the drivers. Although some are a little dense on that subject as well.

Uber does not count expenses in their calculations. Everything they deal with is gross.

So question to you is this. Do you think some drivers make up things to cry poverty? Play Uber as the bad guy because of the rate cuts? They have had a cut in profits but still make money?


----------



## scrurbscrud

Actionjax said:


> That's easy. It would be the drivers. Although some are a little dense on that subject as well.
> 
> Uber does not count expenses in their calculations. Everything they deal with is gross.
> 
> So question to you is this. Do you think some drivers make up things to cry poverty? Play Uber as the bad guy because of the rate cuts? They have had a cut in profits but still make money?


Oh **** no. The cab business is no mystery. The metrics have been well known and well established for decades now.

The fact is you CAN NOT MAKE ANY MONEY at less than X figure and that's all there is to this subject.

Uber is just seeing how many stupid ****s there are available in the driver world and milking the shit out of every last one of them.

I will not be counted among the ignorant contributors to their SCHEME. It's that simple.

Your rate is IFFY in Toronto. I would not drive for what you drive for, primarily because I'm XL. If you think taking on the risk is worth $12 an hour running midnight shifts, that's your business. Add commercial insurance to the calcs and you'd say PISS OFF to Uber in a heartbeat.

You part timers who pick off numbers from weekend driving aren't a good metric to use either. Run 6 days a week, 12 hours a day to see what this gig REALLY pays. There's your reality pill waiting to happen.

Part time drivers are the bigger fools because they BET THEIR LIVES running bareback on insurance for SHIT for pay.

Damn fools.


----------



## DukeOfDallas

Yesterday a pax was asking about driver and pax ratings. They asked what kinds of things get a pax rated low. I said, rudeness, behavior, drunk usually but also drivers have started to automatically assign lower pax ratings to lower fares. The pax thought about this and said, "I guess that makes sense." It does make sense. Rate the Fare.


----------



## Actionjax

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Oh, ok, so now you're falling back on moral equivalence so that it's alright for uber to be run by a sociopath and treat the drivers like dirt under his feet because "other companies do it".
> Uber treats its drivers like crap but other companies do it.
> That's so typical.... not only of an Uberdrone, but of this administration too.
> Just a bunch of sociopaths.
> 
> And, MY company does give a damn and my plan is with the same PPO as the police and fire here in Clark.
> And guess what?
> I pay 5 bux a month and keep it by working 32 hours a week minimum.
> 
> No, I don't have all the answers, and I only know what I know and don't try to proselytize for an outlaw bandit who cares nothing about my health and well being..... just milk the people who are working like dogs for the Company.
> And "that" is Uber's philosophy.
> Tell me something, since you seem to have more answers than I do.
> What has Uber actually done for its drivers since its inception?
> Name one thing that in the last six months Uber has done for its employees that makes them prosper and/or enhances their lives.
> Name it, and if its valid and able to be verified, I promise that I'll never question you in an adversarial tone again.
> Heck, I've even given you some 'likes' on some of your posts.... but I've received over 500 in two in a half months here.


So as far as what Uber has done in a positive light I can only speak on my city on this matter. I won't begin to answer what they have done for their employees since I am not in tune with their corporate policy. But they seem happy with their employer and excited to be there.

As far as positive changes I see a few.

1) Taxi companies around here are scared. They have something disrupting them. And there is actually visible changes going on. For the first time I seen people getting into taxi's New Years without an issue. Taxi companies are now all hands on deck. People do not struggle to get cabs here anymore.
2) Taxi companies are now engaged with the communities. They are offering gift cards, making donations to worthy causes, and engaging with the city. This is something new that has started.
3) Taxi drivers are being told to shape up or there is no room for them here in the city. Dispatch companies are taking serious action against dangerous and fraudulent behavior.

This did not start to happen till Uber showed up.

As for what Uber has done is give thousands a means to make extra money. And in my market it's still a good way to make money.

Uber has some flaws. But I'm not going to paint them as the evil of society. I work at a major bank, lets get one thing straight, we are the evil. We are just better at hiding it as we have many products but no goods we actually sell.

Let me know when you want to finance your next Uber vehicle....I'm sure we can help with that.


----------



## scrurbscrud

DukeOfDallas said:


> Yesterday a pax was asking about driver and pax ratings. They asked what kinds of things get a pax rated low. I said, rudeness, behavior, drunk usually but also drivers have started to automatically assign lower pax ratings to lower fares. The pax thought about this and said, "I guess that makes sense." It does make sense. Rate the Fare.


IF you were rating the fare, then every pax and every fare other than surge would be a one.

Uber can't do driver math, that much is certain. They could give a **** how many stars you dish out.


----------



## UberHammer

Actionjax said:


> That's easy. It would be the drivers. Although some are a little dense on that subject as well.
> 
> Uber does not count expenses in their calculations. Everything they deal with is gross.
> 
> So question to you is this. Do you think some drivers make up things to cry poverty? Play Uber as the bad guy because of the rate cuts? They have had a cut in profits but still make money?


The one's that are making a few bucks an hour in profit, but are claiming they are losing money, are absolutely making things up to cry poverty. Lying about the numbers only makes things worse because the other side now has you caught in a lie. The truth is bad enough, so why resort to lying? The truth is a lot of drivers are making less than minimum wage in profit in their business after their costs. Let that fact speak for itself. Uber can't defend itself from that.

Now, given you agree that Uber coerces drivers into doing things they are not contractually obligated to do, and that drivers know more than Uber about the driver's profitability, do you believe Uber coerces drivers into doing things the driver knows are not profitable AND the driver knows they are not contractually obligated to do?

If yes, do you think it's possible that some drivers makes less than minimum wage in profit in their business after their costs because they're doing non-contractually obligated things Uber coerces them into doing?


----------



## scrurbscrud

Actionjax said:


> So as far as what Uber has done in a positive light I can only speak on my city on this matter. I won't begin to answer what they have done for their employees since I am not in tune with their corporate policy. But they seem happy with their employer and excited to be there.
> 
> As far as positive changes I see a few.
> 
> 1) Taxi companies around here are scared. They have something disrupting them. And there is actually visible changes going on. For the first time I seen people getting into taxi's New Years without an issue. Taxi companies are now all hands on deck. People do not struggle to get cabs here anymore.
> 2) Taxi companies are now engaged with the communities. They are offering gift cards, making donations to worthy causes, and engaging with the city. This is something new that has started.
> 3) Taxi drivers are being told to shape up or there is no room for them here in the city. Dispatch companies are taking serious action against dangerous and fraudulent behavior.
> 
> This did not start to happen till Uber showed up.
> 
> As for what Uber has done is give thousands a means to make extra money. And in my market it's still a good way to make money.
> 
> Uber has some flaws. But I'm not going to paint them as the evil of society. I work at a major bank, lets get one thing straight, we are the evil. We are just better at hiding it as we have many products but no goods we actually sell.
> 
> Let me know when you want to finance your next Uber vehicle....I'm sure we can help with that.


Go back and figure out your great pay dayz with real insurance to cover this gig because THAT is what cab drivers have to do.

You minus out $300-400 a month out of your weekend numbers to 'be legal' instead of betting your financial life to run an iffy cab service with iffy insurance and see how great those figures work out.

Equal footing would put most part timers out of the business, rightfully so.

One accident with any part timer and they'll figure out in a real hurry how much Uber running paid them.


----------



## Actionjax

UberHammer said:


> The one's that are making a few bucks an hour in profit, but are claiming they are losing money, are absolutely making things up to cry poverty. Lying about the numbers only makes things worse because the other side now has you caught in a lie. The truth is bad enough, so why resort to lying? The truth is a lot of drivers are making less than minimum wage in profit in their business after their costs. Let that fact speak for itself. Uber can't defend itself from that.
> 
> Now, given you agree that Uber coerces drivers into doing things they are not contractually obligated to do, and that drivers know more than Uber about the driver's profitability, do you believe Uber coerces drivers into doing things the driver knows are not profitable AND the driver knows they are not contractually obligated to do?
> 
> If yes, do you think it's possible that some drivers makes less than minimum wage in profit in their business after their costs because they're doing non-contractually obligated things Uber coerces them into doing?


I do believe there are drivers making minimum wage or less. We have both shown the math. But Uber does not guarantee a profit or living wage in their contract. So to say Uber forces people to do something unprofitable is a false statement. Profit is not part of their contract. Accepting pings and not inconveniencing the customer is. You are contractually obligated to accept pings and there is an SLA metric around that. There is also a level of service that is expected based on customer ratings.

Profit is not part of the equitation in the contract. They are not contractually obligated to your profitability.

Right or wrong that's the way it is. And for many it's not a fair deal. (No different than anyone getting in over their heads in debt load while a bank loads them up on more)

Now if you have a particular item in question where Uber is coercing drivers to do something I'm all ears.

Would I say Uber is deceptive in it's marketing. Absolutely. Surprised no one has gone after them for the lofty claims they are telling people. There is recourse for that. Problem is they only have to show one success story for it to be valid. Weight loss and gym memberships have been based on that model for years.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Actionjax said:


> But Uber does not guarantee a profit or living wage in their contract. So to say Uber forces people to do something unprofitable is a false statement. Profit is not part of their contract.
> Profit is not part of the equitation in the contract. They are not contractually obligated to your profitability.
> Right or wrong that's the way it is.
> Would I say Uber is deceptive in it's marketing. Absolutely.


That's why Uber is nothing more than a 40 billion dollar valuation company* that exists by running a cab scam on unsuspecting and ignorant drivers.*

Welcome to the one world economy.

One big happy SCAM brought to you by some ass hat techie in Cali.


----------



## UberXtraordinary

DukeOfDallas said:


> I will continue to rate this way, and hopefully others will as well. Then, YOU can go and scoop up all the 15 minute trips for $4 you want. Have at it.


(Duke of Dallas' next post) "Fuber effin deactivated me and I have no idea why?!" Seriously bro.


----------



## UberHammer

Actionjax said:


> I do believe there are drivers making minimum wage or less. We have both shown the math. But Uber does not guarantee a profit or living wage in their contract. So to say Uber forces people to do something unprofitable is a false statement.


I did not say "forces". I said "coerces". Please do not change my words so that you can then claim "false statement". People who do that are assholes.



> Profit is not part of their contract. Accepting pings and not inconveniencing the customer is. You are contractually obligated to accept pings and there is an SLA metric around that.


From section 2.4 of the contract:
_
"You retain the option, via the Driver App, to attempt to accept or to decline or ignore a User's request for Transportation Services via the Uber Services"_

Drivers retain THE OPTION of accepting pings.



> There is also a level of service that is expected based on customer ratings.


Correct. They can be contractually deactivated for their driver rating. However, nothing in the contract states they can be deactivated for acceptance rating (except for the provision that deactivation can occur for anything, which is the "coercion" provision). Section 2.5.2 establishes that driver rating may result in deactivation, but acceptance rating results in nothing more than poor user experience.

_"In order to continue to receive access to the Driver App and the Uber Services, you must maintain an average rating by Users that exceeds the minimum average acceptable rating established by Company for your Territory, as may be updated from time to time by Company in its sole discretion ("Minimum Average Rating"). In the event your average rating falls below the Minimum Average Rating, Company will notify you and may provide you, in Company's discretion, a limited period of time to raise your average rating above the Minimum Average Rating. If you do not increase your average rating above the Minimum Average Rating within the time period allowed (if any), Company reserves the right to deactivate your access to the Driver App and the Uber Services. Additionally, you acknowledge that your repeated failure to accept User requests for Transportation Services while you are logged in to the Driver App creates a negative experience for Users of Uber's mobile application. If you do not wish to accept User requests for Transportation Services for a period of time, you will log off of the Driver App." _

There is nothing in the contract that states Uber reserves the right to deactivate driver access based on acceptance rate. The only thing drivers agree to in the contract is that 1) repeated failure to accept User requests creates a negative user experience; and 2) if the driver does not wish to accept User requests for a period of time, they will log off. The driver still retains THE OPTION of accepting pings, and there's no level of acceptance needed to avoid deactivation. Uber's 80% acceptance requirement is nothing but coercion, and comes from the "we can deactivate you for anything".



> Profit is not part of the equitation in the contract. They are not contractually obligated to your profitability.


That's not what I asked. I'm asking you if you believe Uber coerces drivers into accepting non-profitable jobs, when drivers retain the contractual right of THE OPTION of accepting those jobs, even when the driver accepts only 40% because only 40% of the requests Uber sends them are profitable in their specific part of the market?



> Right or wrong that's the way it is. And for many it's not a fair deal. (No different than anyone getting in over their heads in debt load while a bank loads them up on more)
> 
> Now if you have a particular item in question where Uber is coercing drivers to do something I'm all ears.


Then open your ears, because that's what I'm sharing with you. Please stop being intentionally deaf on this. I know you're smart enough to understand this, even though you wish it weren't true.



> Would I say Uber is deceptive in it's marketing. Absolutely. Surprised no one has gone after them for the lofty claims they are telling people. There is recourse for that. Problem is they only have to show one success story for it to be valid. Weight loss and gym memberships have been based on that model for years.


The marketing is a whole other shitstorm that has nothing to do with what I'm showing here.

Driver's are coerced by Uber into surrendering a right they specifically retain in the contract.


----------



## UberXtraordinary

Sly said:


> One day the pax needs a ride to local bar. Next day he needs a ride to the airport. Same pax. We provide the short trips to get pax in the habit of using us so then we get the long trips too. We don't do the short trips then someone else gets them and they also get the long trips too. Nobody does long trips only.


Here's an unrelated story. I drive for plus, but last week added the ability to dip down into X, in order to do short runs for the guarantee.

Two weeks ago, I was about six runs short of hitting my guarantee on a Sunday. So I logged in as X, hopefully to do a bunch of quick short runs, the type this guy is complaining about. I needed to do about seven runs in one hour or eight runs in two hours or nine runs in three hours you get the picture. That's an impossible task for plus, but I've read that this is totally possible with the X. My first ping came from Bob Hope Airport. Two passengers, both still waiting for bags. 10 to 15 minutes later we begin the trip. The guy informs me, "you'll be taking us too different locations." As it turned out this two-for-one ride took the entire hour. Decent fare for X I suppose, Nearly $40. With plus that would've been more like $70. That is the last time I drove X. Suffice it to say no guarantee that week&#8230; I have not collected significant guarantee for the past four weeks. I'm sticking with plus for the most part.


----------



## Sly

DukeOfDallas said:


> Drivers need to RATE THE FARE until Uber addresses driver manipulation on minimum fare trips. Minimum trip (with safe trip fee and Uber deductions) and no tip = 1 STAR. Low pax ratings alert drivers that this is high probability of minimal trip fare. This is UBER Mgmt responsibility to correct. Non-tipping pax contribute tacit consent to driver manipulation.
> 
> Anyone on here defending Uber is not a driver. This tips off driver that if they accept low star ping, minimal fare is likely.


Just because previous fares were minimum doesn't mean future ones will be. Your system is flawed.


----------



## Orlando_Driver

Sly said:


> Just because previous fares were minimum doesn't mean future ones will be. Your system is flawed.


Uber shill !!


----------



## getFubered

Sly said:


> Just because previous fares were minimum doesn't mean future ones will be. Your system is flawed.


It will reflect the ratio (I know this is already too complex for you but try to hang with me). If a rider does 9 min fares and 1 airport run. His/her low rating will reflect that. I say to you then "there's a 1/10 chance this person will want to go to the airport, and 9/10 they want a ride a few blocks away". Do you take the chance? Knowing you yes, anyone who didn't struggle to get past 8th grade algebra, no.

Making the rating depend 100% on the fare isn't perfect, but it should be at least 80% how you rate pax if you guys know what's good for you. Which you don't. Which is why Uber doesn't care.


----------



## Actionjax

UberHammer said:


> I did not say "forces". I said "coerces". Please do not change my words so that you can then claim "false statement". People who do that are assholes.
> 
> From section 2.4 of the contract:
> _
> "You retain the option, via the Driver App, to attempt to accept or to decline or ignore a User's request for Transportation Services via the Uber Services"_
> 
> Drivers retain THE OPTION of accepting pings.
> 
> Correct. They can be contractually deactivated for their driver rating. However, nothing in the contract states they can be deactivated for acceptance rating (except for the provision that deactivation can occur for anything, which is the "coercion" provision). Section 2.5.2 establishes that driver rating may result in deactivation, but acceptance rating results in nothing more than poor user experience.
> 
> _"In order to continue to receive access to the Driver App and the Uber Services, you must maintain an average rating by Users that exceeds the minimum average acceptable rating established by Company for your Territory, as may be updated from time to time by Company in its sole discretion ("Minimum Average Rating"). In the event your average rating falls below the Minimum Average Rating, Company will notify you and may provide you, in Company's discretion, a limited period of time to raise your average rating above the Minimum Average Rating. If you do not increase your average rating above the Minimum Average Rating within the time period allowed (if any), Company reserves the right to deactivate your access to the Driver App and the Uber Services. Additionally, you acknowledge that your repeated failure to accept User requests for Transportation Services while you are logged in to the Driver App creates a negative experience for Users of Uber's mobile application. If you do not wish to accept User requests for Transportation Services for a period of time, you will log off of the Driver App." _
> 
> There is nothing in the contract that states Uber reserves the right to deactivate driver access based on acceptance rate. The only thing drivers agree to in the contract is that 1) repeated failure to accept User requests creates a negative user experience; and 2) if the driver does not wish to accept User requests for a period of time, they will log off. The driver still retains THE OPTION of accepting pings, and there's no level of acceptance needed to avoid deactivation. Uber's 80% acceptance requirement is nothing but coercion, and comes from the "we can deactivate you for anything".
> 
> That's not what I asked. I'm asking you if you believe Uber coerces drivers into accepting non-profitable jobs, when drivers retain the contractual right of THE OPTION of accepting those jobs, even when the driver accepts only 40% because only 40% of the requests Uber sends them are profitable in their specific part of the market?
> 
> Then open your ears, because that's what I'm sharing with you. Please stop being intentionally deaf on this. I know you're smart enough to understand this, even though you wish it weren't true.
> 
> The marketing is a whole other shitstorm that has nothing to do with what I'm showing here.
> 
> Driver's are coerced by Uber into surrendering a right they specifically retain in the contract.


Without picking apart every sentence you say I will just make a blunt statement. Uber coerces drivers the same way McDonalds coerces fat people. It is all about the marketing.

Lets start with the definition.

*Coerce*

persuade (an unwilling person) to do something by using force or threats.
"they were *coerced into* silence"

That would define every employer in the country. Just because you don't want to do something. Fact is you are obligated to perform your job. Uber has clearly defined this.

1) Accept 80% of all request
2)Keep your driver star rating up to the standard for your area
3) Don't do anything unsafe
4) Follow the rules they set out.

Uber's responsibility? To pay you on time whatever they have set out. Regardless if it is $1 a mile or $0.05 a mile. they set the price and everyone has agreed to every rate cut. If you didn't you quit.

If your employer dropped you for breaking the rules will you say they coerced you? Please.

If you were under an employment contract and the contract ended and they wanted to negotiate a new one at half the money are they now coercing you to do something you don't want to do.

Your personal life has no bearing on what Uber or any other employer does. You get paid for doing a job, that's it. They define the job and pay. You say yes or no. Uber is not social assistance for the desperate.

No one is coercing anyone. If anything there are a few drivers on here who are trying to coerce Uber as by definition "to do something by using force or threats"

Follow the rules, don't **** around, get paid. It's not that hard. I don't set the prices in your territory nor do I support them being that low.

In the end it's all about how Uber markets. They tell people what they want to hear. How much money they can make. How independent they can be. All packaged up with a Car loan, a dream and no reality. I know many business who use the same model and burden society with the fallout.

It's not new, Uber didn't invent it. And no one is being forced into Uber labor camps in Siberia. If someone wants out they will find a way. But people sometimes just don't know how. That's the help they need.


----------



## scrurbscrud

$1 a bile. Gotta lub it, along with a car loan, a dream and no reality. About sums it up.


----------



## Actionjax

scrurbscrud said:


> $1 a bile. Gotta lub it, along with a car loan, a dream and no reality. About sums it up.


Fixed thanks.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Actionjax said:


> Fixed thanks.


It is a forever fixed term in my mind now...very succinct description.


----------



## UberHammer

Actionjax said:


> Without picking apart every sentence you say I will just make a blunt statement. Uber coerces drivers the same way McDonalds coerces fat people. It is all about the marketing.
> 
> Lets start with the definition.
> 
> *Coerce*
> 
> persuade (an unwilling person) to do something by using force or threats.
> "they were *coerced into* silence"


Please show where McDonald's forces or threatens of fat people. If you can't (and I suspect you can't), then McDonalds does not coerce fat people.



> That would define every employer in the country. Just because you don't want to do something. Fact is you are obligated to perform your job. Uber has clearly defined this.


Employees have rights established by law. An employer cannot coerce an employee to surrender their rights established by law. The employer breaks the law when they do so. For example, an employer cannot coerce an employee to surrender their right to minimum wage by threatening to fire them if they won't work for $4 an hour.



> 1) Accept 80% of all request


Contractors have rights established by the contract. A company cannot coerce a contractor to surrender their rights established by the contract. The company breaks the contract when they do so. For example, Uber cannot coerce a contractor to surrender their right to ignore pings by threatening to deactivate them if they won't accept 80% of the pings they are sent.

There is nothing in the Uber/driver contract establishing an acceptance rating, and Uber's right to deactivate drivers if it is too low. By doing so, they are coercing drivers out of the right they retain in the contract to ignore pings at any percentage, high or low.



> 2)Keep your driver star rating up to the standard for your area


This is specifically stated in the contract, as well as Uber's right to deactivate drivers for it.



> 3) Don't do anything unsafe
> 4) Follow the rules they set out.


These sentences are very general. So their applicability to the discussion requires more detail.



> Uber's responsibility? To pay you on time whatever they have set out. Regardless if it is $1 a bile or $0.05 a mile. they set the price and everyone has agreed to every rate cut. If you didn't you quit.


Price of the fare is ANOTHER right the driver retains in the contract, yet drivers are coerced by Uber into surrendering.

But before we go there, let's see if you can wrap your head around Uber coercing drivers into surrendering their right to ignore requests at ANY percentage.



> If your employer dropped you for breaking the rules will you say they coerced you? Please.


No driver is breaking the contract by ignoring pings at ANY percentage of acceptance. Uber is coercing them into doing so by pulling non-contract "rules" out of thin air.



> If you were under an employment contract and the contract ended and they wanted to negotiate a new one at half the money are they now coercing you to do something you don't want to do.


No. That's the point. They are coercing drivers to give up their rights that exist in the existing contract. If the contract ends, so do the rights the contract establishes.



> Your personal life has no bearing on what Uber or any other employer does.


Wow! You are really going far out of your way to come up with things to retort this issue. Nothing I've said is in the context of personal issues. This is entirely about the rights driver retain in the contract that Uber coerces drivers into surrendering.



> You get paid for doing a job, that's it. They define the job and pay. You say yes or no. Uber is not social assistance for the desperate.


THE CONTRACT DEFINES THE JOB AND PAY!!!!

And as I said before, the rate of the fare is retained by the driver in the contract. Uber only has the right to set the amount for the services they are selling to the driver. All they can contractually do with the fare is make a recommended amount. We will get into that later.



> No one is coercing anyone. If anything there are a few drivers on here who are trying to coerce Uber as by definition "to do something by using force or threats"
> 
> Follow the rules, don't **** around, get paid. It's not that hard. I don't set the prices in your territory nor do I support them being that low.
> 
> In the end it's all about how Uber markets. They tell people what they want to hear. How much money they can make. How independent they can be. All packaged up with a Car loan, a dream and no reality. I know many business who use the same model and burden society with the fallout.
> 
> It's not new, Uber didn't invent it. And no one is being forced into Uber labor camps in Siberia. If someone wants out they will find a way. But people sometimes just don't know how. That's the help they need.


I'd responded point to point with the rest, but it's obvious you got into blathering rhetoric mode. Let the contract do the speaking if you don't like me, the messenger. I'm not telling you anything the contract doesn't say.


----------



## Actionjax

UberHammer said:


> Please show where McDonald's forces or threatens of fat people. If you can't (and I suspect you can't), then McDonalds does not coerce fat people.


That was the point, McDonalds is using coercion as much as Uber is. They are not employing what you are saying.


UberHammer said:


> Contractors have rights established by the contract. A company cannot coerce a contractor to surrender their rights established by the contract. The company breaks the contract when they do so. For example, Uber cannot coerce a contractor to surrender their right to ignore pings by threatening to deactivate them if they won't accept 80% of the pings they are sent.
> 
> There is nothing in the Uber/driver contract establishing an acceptance rating, and Uber's right to deactivate drivers if it is too low. By doing so, they are coercing drivers out of the right they retain in the contract to ignore pings at any percentage, high or low.


It's in black and white on the Uber partner site. It's not an unreasonable request and they have stated what will happen if you don't meet that request. Employers can request anything reasonable to an employee that may not be written in an employment contract. Same with 3rd party agreements. I can reasonably ask them for something and if denied I can terminate said contract for reasonable grounds.

Either way there is no penalty clause in the driver ending the contract as there is no penalty for Uber to do the same. Again no show of force there. Contract is open ended for both parties.



UberHammer said:


> No. That's the point. They are coercing drivers to give up their rights that exist in the existing contract. If the contract ends, so do the rights the contract establishes.


When you have agreed in the app to your price change you are agreeing to an amended contract. There is no fixed terms in the contract and it can be amended at any time by Uber. If you don't like it write your own contract and get Uber to sign it. That's perfectly acceptable. But we all know they don't need to sign something that won't benefit them.

Your rights are as good as what you signed and if you keep signing your rights away who's fault is that.



UberHammer said:


> THE CONTRACT DEFINES THE JOB AND PAY!!!!
> 
> And as I said before, the rate of the fare is retained by the driver in the contract. Uber only has the right to set the amount for the services they are selling to the driver. All they can contractually do with the fare is make a recommended amount. We will get into that later.


When you become a licensed Taxi with a meter you can set whatever fare you want. Or when you become a registered limo company you can do the same. But most Uber drivers don't choose to go the full route. So they can't legally set a fare or they are going against all those loopholes they love. So all you are getting is what you like to say is a generated lead with a $ attached to it.

Your contract prices can change at any time they call that an addendum. And the App clearly asked everyone to accept the addendum or log off.

As far as the so called rhetoric goes you let me know when you come across the Uber forced labor camps in passing. Or are you going to now state the contract is in spirit forced labor. The word here that does not fit in what your are saying is "Coerce" because that includes the word "FORCE" by definition. So show me how people are forced to do Uber.


----------



## UberHammer

Actionjax said:


> That was the point, McDonalds is using coercion as much as Uber is. They are not employing what you are saying.


As soon as I read this, I yelled "**** YOU" out loud!

How can you read that and come to the complete opposite understanding of what I said?

I'm done with you. You're on ignore now. I cannot stand people who have the intelligence to understand concepts, but willingly refuse to accept simple concepts. They suck the time and effort out of people willingly trying to help them. I'm done wasting my time and effort on you. BYE!


----------



## Actionjax

UberHammer said:


> As soon as I read this, I yelled "**** YOU" out loud!
> 
> How can you read that and come to the complete opposite understanding of what I said?
> 
> I'm done with you. You're on ignore now. I cannot stand people who have the intelligence to understand concepts, but willingly refuse to accept simple concepts. They suck the time and effort out of people willingly trying to help them. I'm done wasting my time and effort on you. BYE!


Well that was easy...lol. Guess he is going to take his ball and go home.


----------



## ntsnipe

DukeOfDallas said:


> Yes, but most egregious is the minimal fare trips that Uber takes their same deductions on. This needs to stop now. Uber needs to share the pain rather than pass it along to driver because they decided to cut rates.


So as a passenger, I ended up on this site because I was trying to find how to avoid rating drivers, I wonder why you drive for uber. I was wholly aware that uber had the policies that it has. While you do rail a bit against Uber you cast most of your comments in an us v them light for drivers and passengers, something I find odd for a driver. Because as a passenger I have no idea how much you make or whether I am a profitable ride or not. Just like when I get in a cab I assume the driver is making a living and is happy with his job or he wouldn't be doing it.

That said, yes I would like to tips every ride yet I can't. Why? Because uber doesn't let me. Yes that's right uber doesn't let me. Lift lets me. Uber does not. Why do I take uber because I don't have to carry cash. That is the single largest benefit of using uber. I could give a shit if the cars are cleaner, nicer, cheaper than taxis. I could care less if the drivers are nicer. End of the day, I care about convenience. I can more easily acquire an uber than a cab and I don't have to worry about carrying cash. Which by the way, who carries cash these days? So when I book a short trip or a long trip, I would like to tip with my app but I can't, so regardless of the fare I rarely tip on Uber. why? Because who carries cash these days. Before seeing this board I assumed drivers made enough money that the tip wasn't important now I see it's not. This leaves me with a problem. I am not likely to start carrying cash, so I guess I'll be a 1 rating until uber let's me tip their drivers.

I guess in closing I'd say you should be railing against Uber not Pax. This is the only way you will fix this problem. Because why? Who carries cash these days, that's why?

With all that said, anyone know how I can skip the rating of driver? I hate it, but once you ride as a pax you are forced by the app to rate the driver. Seems stupid to me. Rating systems are useless and I have never once checked a driver's rating before boarding. It's a cab ride, not an employment contract for Christ's sake.


----------



## Txchick

ntsnipe said:


> So as a passenger, I ended up on this site because I was trying to find how to avoid rating drivers, I wonder why you drive for uber. I was wholly aware that uber had the policies that it has. While you do rail a bit against Uber you cast most of your comments in an us v them light for drivers and passengers, something I find odd for a driver. Because as a passenger I have no idea how much you make or whether I am a profitable ride or not. Just like when I get in a cab I assume the driver is making a living and is happy with his job or he wouldn't be doing it.
> 
> That said, yes I would like to tips every ride yet I can't. Why? Because uber doesn't let me. Yes that's right uber doesn't let me. Lift lets me. Uber does not. Why do I take uber because I don't have to carry cash. That is the single largest benefit of using uber. I could give a shit if the cars are cleaner, nicer, cheaper than taxis. I could care less if the drivers are nicer. End of the day, I care about convenience. I can more easily acquire an uber than a cab and I don't have to worry about carrying cash. Which by the way, who carries cash these days? So when I book a short trip or a long trip, I would like to tip with my app but I can't, so regardless of the fare I rarely tip on Uber. why? Because who carries cash these days. Before seeing this board I assumed drivers made enough money that the tip wasn't important now I see it's not. This leaves me with a problem. I am not likely to start carrying cash, so I guess I'll be a 1 rating until uber let's me tip their drivers.
> 
> I guess in closing I'd say you should be railing against Uber not Pax. This is the only way you will fix this problem. Because why? Who carries cash these days, that's why?
> 
> With all that said, anyone know how I can skip the rating of driver? I hate it, but once you ride as a pax you are forced by the app to rate the driver. Seems stupid to me. Rating systems are useless and I have never once checked a driver's rating before boarding. It's a cab ride, not an employment contract for Christ's sake.


Thanks for your input. If you don't mind please send Uber a email about adding the tip app. Drivers have addressed this with Uber countless times to no avail. Drivers have to rate pax immediately after ending ride. Don't think on pax app it's unavoidable if you want to use Uber again..have to rate.


----------



## ntsnipe

Txchick said:


> Thanks for your input. If you don't mind please send Uber a email about adding the tip app. Drivers have addressed this with Uber countless times to no avail. Drivers have to rate pax immediately after ending ride. Don't think on pax app it's unavoidable if you want to use Uber again..have to rate.


Will do. And thanks for the reply on the rating thing.


----------



## getFubered

ntsnipe said:


> So as a passenger, I ended up on this site because I was trying to find how to avoid rating drivers, I wonder why you drive for uber. I was wholly aware that uber had the policies that it has. While you do rail a bit against Uber you cast most of your comments in an us v them light for drivers and passengers, something I find odd for a driver. Because as a passenger I have no idea how much you make or whether I am a profitable ride or not. Just like when I get in a cab I assume the driver is making a living and is happy with his job or he wouldn't be doing it.
> 
> That said, yes I would like to tips every ride yet I can't. Why? Because uber doesn't let me. Yes that's right uber doesn't let me. Lift lets me. Uber does not. Why do I take uber because I don't have to carry cash. That is the single largest benefit of using uber. I could give a shit if the cars are cleaner, nicer, cheaper than taxis. I could care less if the drivers are nicer. End of the day, I care about convenience. I can more easily acquire an uber than a cab and I don't have to worry about carrying cash. Which by the way, who carries cash these days? So when I book a short trip or a long trip, I would like to tip with my app but I can't, so regardless of the fare I rarely tip on Uber. why? Because who carries cash these days. Before seeing this board I assumed drivers made enough money that the tip wasn't important now I see it's not. This leaves me with a problem. I am not likely to start carrying cash, so I guess I'll be a 1 rating until uber let's me tip their drivers.
> 
> I guess in closing I'd say you should be railing against Uber not Pax. This is the only way you will fix this problem. Because why? Who carries cash these days, that's why?
> 
> With all that said, anyone know how I can skip the rating of driver? I hate it, but once you ride as a pax you are forced by the app to rate the driver. Seems stupid to me. Rating systems are useless and I have never once checked a driver's rating before boarding. It's a cab ride, not an employment contract for Christ's sake.


Are you ****in stupid? you really think after you just paid $4 for a ride in a $10k+ vehicle that's enough for Uber to make money, the driver to make money, and include a tip? Have you been to a gas station since 2004? I get it, it's 2015 and your entitled to a ride at the push of a button for nothing and your cheap and don't carry an extra couple of 1's on you, really I get it. But don't come on this forum and tell us "uh well, uh I didn't know how much you make". A $4 or $7 ride how much do you think we made? 10? 15?


----------



## Actionjax

getFubered said:


> Are you ****in stupid? you really think after you just paid $4 for a ride in a $10k+ vehicle that's enough for Uber to make money, the driver to make money, and include a tip? Have you been to a gas station since 2004? I get it, it's 2015 and your entitled to a ride at the push of a button for nothing and your cheap and don't carry an extra couple of 1's on you, really I get it. But don't come on this forum and tell us "uh well, uh I didn't know how much you make". A $4 or $7 ride how much do you think we made? 10? 15?


And here we go


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

ntsnipe said:


> So as a passenger, I ended up on this site because I was trying to find how to avoid rating drivers, I wonder why you drive for uber. I was wholly aware that uber had the policies that it has. While you do rail a bit against Uber you cast most of your comments in an us v them light for drivers and passengers, something I find odd for a driver. Because as a passenger I have no idea how much you make or whether I am a profitable ride or not. Just like when I get in a cab I assume the driver is making a living and is happy with his job or he wouldn't be doing it.
> 
> That said, yes I would like to tips every ride yet I can't. Why? Because uber doesn't let me. Yes that's right uber doesn't let me. Lift lets me. Uber does not. Why do I take uber because I don't have to carry cash. That is the single largest benefit of using uber. I could give a shit if the cars are cleaner, nicer, cheaper than taxis. I could care less if the drivers are nicer. End of the day, I care about convenience. I can more easily acquire an uber than a cab and I don't have to worry about carrying cash. Which by the way, who carries cash these days? So when I book a short trip or a long trip, I would like to tip with my app but I can't, so regardless of the fare I rarely tip on Uber. why? Because who carries cash these days. Before seeing this board I assumed drivers made enough money that the tip wasn't important now I see it's not. This leaves me with a problem. I am not likely to start carrying cash, so I guess I'll be a 1 rating until uber let's me tip their drivers.
> 
> I guess in closing I'd say you should be railing against Uber not Pax. This is the only way you will fix this problem. Because why? Who carries cash these days, that's why?
> 
> With all that said, anyone know how I can skip the rating of driver? I hate it, but once you ride as a pax you are forced by the app to rate the driver. Seems stupid to me. Rating systems are useless and I have never once checked a driver's rating before boarding. It's a cab ride, not an employment contract for Christ's sake.


Ask every driver if he has a square reader to take a credit card tip. Many do and if pax ask will then get one. Takes 30 seconds to use. But Funnily enough when someone tells me they'd tip but don't carry cash and I tell them I can take their card only 1 in 5 actually takes me up on it.


----------



## Txchick

getFubered said:


> Are you ****in stupid? you really think after you just paid $4 for a ride in a $10k+ vehicle that's enough for Uber to make money, the driver to make money, and include a tip? Have you been to a gas station since 2004? I get it, it's 2015 and your entitled to a ride at the push of a button for nothing and your cheap and don't carry an extra couple of 1's on you, really I get it. But don't come on this forum and tell us "uh well, uh I didn't know how much you make". A $4 or $7 ride how much do you think we made? 10? 15?


Why I understand your frustration about Uber's recent rate cuts, this pax does not deserve to be called names. When I quit in Jan of 2015 after rate cuts many passengers did not even know rate cuts had happened. Just my thoughts & input.


----------



## DukeOfDallas

Any drivers on here who are afraid to rate a minimum fare as low because they fear deactivation are really, really huge suckers. RATE THE FARE until Uber corrects the situation.


----------



## DukeOfDallas

Stop playing into to the coercion and rate low fares as low. It's called FEEDBACK people. No one is going to deactivate you. It is well within your right as a driver to do this.


----------



## Backdash

DOD,
Your plan is awesome!

Except for the fact that your kidding yourself about it changing anything.. pure waste of time and hostility.
Ill continue to rate the passengers not Ubers fares
and thats Mr. Sucker to you, dumbass


----------



## NewGirlinTown

Uber in no way disallows tips. You are free to tip any time you want.


----------



## Txchick

NewGirlinTown said:


> Uber in no way disallows tips. You are free to tip any time you want.


No but they don't advocate it either. For a long time their website promoted no need to tip cashless system.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Orlando_Driver said:


> Uber shill !!


I think Sly is saying he makes more money driving for 75 cents a mile longer fares than he does for $2.40 per mile on a 1 mile short fare...


----------



## hpdriver

The tips depend on your attitude and how much you educate the riders about tips. If it doesn't help you, it will help the next driver. I always tell any first time riders about how cash tips are a big boost for our morale. Just mention the word tips somewhere and hope it works.

I do not expect tips from any college students. But I do tell them to tip once they get a job. Ride with a smile and throw this negativity away. I got tips for 52$ this week with UberX and I only drove 34 trips for 21 hours. Again, I may be below average in terms of tip. Bought bottled water for the first time this week, got lucky with a couple of airport trips at 6.5x and 5.2x. Some karma here!

Depending full time on UberX is another mistake that people make, you seem to be stuck in this maze. Move on and find another job, and keep this as a second job. It's not that hard to find a real job! Takes the same amount of time to fill out an application these days as much time you spend ranting and replying to comments.


----------



## NewGirlinTown

Txchick said:


> No but they don't advocate it either. For a long time their website promoted no need to tip cashless system.


Yes, they did, but I've been told that now they are quietly saying "drivers would appreciate tips". And seriously, anyone who takes a $4 trip (for which we get $2.40) and doesn't tip is just a schmuck, and doubly so when we have to drive 10 minutes to reach them; they can't be that dense that they are unaware of their predatory behavior.


----------



## NewGirlinTown

A surprising number of people think the tip is rolled into the fee.


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

NewGirlinTown said:


> A surprising number of people think the tip is rolled into the fee.


I think most have now been educated that its not but they prefer to pretend that they still think that because when they tell me they don't carry cash or they would tip (so its ubers fault its not in the app) and I say a lot of drivers including myself have a square reader they still don't tip. They carry on chit chatting but leap out at the end afap. (As fast as possible)


----------



## Txchick

NewGirlinTown said:


> A surprising number of people think the tip is rolled into the fee.


Yes they do!! Who promoted that idea???Uber!!


----------



## johnywinslow

I don't defend uber. I just don't hate them. I feel like in this screwed up world its everyman for himself. I don't hate uber because it would require me to like another big corporation, they are like politicians no such thing as a "GOOD" one. no lesser evil. they are all exactly the same except for the propaganda that comes out of every possible hole. I simple don't care, I use them they use me... its the cycle of life... but if it makes you feel better the last two weeks ive taken home more money then I have made in fares. so uber paid me 100% of my fares plus some because of guarantee and new riders. not much mind you, but uber paid me more then I gave them...so I feel kinda like im screwing them, but hey its their rules!


----------



## OCBob

Fuzzyelvis said:


> I think most have now been educated that its not but they prefer to pretend that they still think that because when they tell me they don't carry cash or they would tip (so its ubers fault its not in the app) and I say a lot of drivers including myself have a square reader they still don't tip. They carry on chit chatting but leap out at the end afap. (As fast as possible)


Lying to driver and getting him excited for a tip but bail out when he is caught lying? 2 star automatically


----------



## Yamariz

DukeOfDallas said:


> Seriously, I have started to rate my passengers on fares. Pax can be nicest person in the world, but if I drove 15 minutes out of my way for a $4.00 fare with no tip, automatic rating is a 1 star.
> 
> Anyone else agree or use similar system?


Thanks for the heads up! Nothing pisses me off more than going out of my way 5.00 trip and no tip even though we cant take tips at least offer!


----------



## Guest

ntsnipe said:


> So as a passenger, I ended up on this site because I was trying to find how to avoid rating drivers, I wonder why you drive for uber. I was wholly aware that uber had the policies that it has. While you do rail a bit against Uber you cast most of your comments in an us v them light for drivers and passengers, something I find odd for a driver. Because as a passenger I have no idea how much you make or whether I am a profitable ride or not. Just like when I get in a cab I assume the driver is making a living and is happy with his job or he wouldn't be doing it.
> 
> That said, yes I would like to tips every ride yet I can't. Why? Because uber doesn't let me. Yes that's right uber doesn't let me. Lift lets me. Uber does not. Why do I take uber because I don't have to carry cash. That is the single largest benefit of using uber. I could give a shit if the cars are cleaner, nicer, cheaper than taxis. I could care less if the drivers are nicer. End of the day, I care about convenience. I can more easily acquire an uber than a cab and I don't have to worry about carrying cash. Which by the way, who carries cash these days? So when I book a short trip or a long trip, I would like to tip with my app but I can't, so regardless of the fare I rarely tip on Uber. why? Because who carries cash these days. Before seeing this board I assumed drivers made enough money that the tip wasn't important now I see it's not. This leaves me with a problem. I am not likely to start carrying cash, so I guess I'll be a 1 rating until uber let's me tip their drivers.
> 
> I guess in closing I'd say you should be railing against Uber not Pax. This is the only way you will fix this problem. Because why? Who carries cash these days, that's why?
> 
> With all that said, anyone know how I can skip the rating of driver? I hate it, but once you ride as a pax you are forced by the app to rate the driver. Seems stupid to me. Rating systems are useless and I have never once checked a driver's rating before boarding. It's a cab ride, not an employment contract for Christ's sake.


Drivers are aware that it is mostly Uber's fault that they do not have a tip option built in their app and Uber knows that. Why doesn't Uber have a tip option? It uses that as advertising its service. Uber says taking Uber means you don't have to pay extra.

As for passengers not knowing what drivers make, do you not have common sense? Rides that take place out of downtown have long eta's which means the driver drove 2-3 miles to get to you then dropped you off 2 miles and your fare turned out $5 so how is $5 worth the 5 miles drive? I didn't take out Uber's fee because I understand the pax wouldn't know how much the driver keeps.

It is true most people don't carry cash but what if you go to a place where you can only tip cash? Like some restaurants don't have an option to tip on the card so then you don't tip that waiter/waitress?

Now that you know Uber drivers make below minimum wage and if you have any courtesy you should probably start carrying some cash.


----------



## Guest

Yamariz said:


> Thanks for the heads up! Nothing pisses me off more than going out of my way 5.00 trip and no tip even though we cant take tips at least offer!


We can take tips. Just say "oh, it wasn't necessary but thank you so much"


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## scrurbscrud

It's only fair to point out the obvious, that when the driver hits an Uber ping *they have already rated the fare as sufficient to do the deal.*


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## Fuzzyelvis

OCBob said:


> Lying to driver and getting him excited for a tip but bail out when he is caught lying? 2 star automatically


Yes. If you tell me you would tip if you could and then I give you a option to tip and you don't take it I ding you for lying.


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## Fuzzyelvis

scrurbscrud said:


> It's only fair to point out the obvious, that when the driver hits an Uber ping *they have already rated the fare as sufficient to do the deal.*


15 seconds as you're driving down the road is not sufficient time for many drivers to know if it's worth it and the only way to get more time is to accept. And with most drivers "amateurs" Uber should know that. I know houston very well but if I get a ping from a subdivision I don't always know exactly how far it really is that quickly.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Fuzzyelvis said:


> 15 seconds as you're driving down the road is not sufficient time for many drivers to know if it's worth it and the only way to get more time is to accept. And with most drivers "amateurs" Uber should know that. I know houston very well but if I get a ping from a subdivision I don't always know exactly how far it really is that quickly.


No matter. The moment a driver takes a ping, they have rated the fare as acceptable. Taking it out on the pax by a low star is just hypocrisy. If drivers want to rate the fare as unacceptable, you know the answer. Don't take the ping.


----------



## Actionjax

Anti-Uber said:


> Drivers are aware that it is mostly Uber's fault that they do not have a tip option built in their app and Uber knows that. Why doesn't Uber have a tip option? It uses that as advertising its service. Uber says taking Uber means you don't have to pay extra.
> 
> As for passengers not knowing what drivers make, do you not have common sense? Rides that take place out of downtown have long eta's which means the driver drove 2-3 miles to get to you then dropped you off 2 miles and your fare turned out $5 so how is $5 worth the 5 miles drive? I didn't take out Uber's fee because I understand the pax wouldn't know how much the driver keeps.
> 
> It is true most people don't carry cash but what if you go to a place where you can only tip cash? Like some restaurants don't have an option to tip on the card so then you don't tip that waiter/waitress?
> 
> Now that you know Uber drivers make below minimum wage and if you have any courtesy you should probably start carrying some cash.


Restaurants who don't allow a tip on your card are called fast food. And they don't get tipped very often. If it's a sit down with full service they risk the same issue we do. In the end that's not a customer issue. That's ours.


----------



## Fuzzyelvis

scrurbscrud said:


> No matter. The moment a driver takes a ping, they have rated the fare as acceptable. Taking it out on the pax by a low star is just hypocrisy. If drivers want to rate the fare as unacceptable, you know the answer. Don't take the ping.


It's acceptable with a tip to make it a realistically money making trip. So the pax has control there. Half the pax don't even look to see how much the trip was. They know it's too cheap and don't care.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Fuzzyelvis said:


> It's acceptable with a tip to make it a realistically money making trip. So the pax has control there. Half the pax don't even look to see how much the trip was. They know it's too cheap and don't care.


We all know that tipping with Uber pax is a rare occurrence and would not be expected. NOR does the pax have ANY awareness of the shit for driver pay.

Low fare pay is not a pax issue or a tip issue. It's really not even an UBER issue because obviously there are sufficient dumb asses to fill the donkey driving herd.

It's only an issue for those drivers dumb enough to take low pay and then ***** about taking what they agreed to take and then blame it on the pax by rating what they agreed to already.

In short, a very stupid reaction.


----------



## Big Machine

LAndreas said:


> Hpdriver, the more I read these threads in this forum (and I'll stop now), the more I think many of the commenters here are in fact unemployable. In fact, I am starting to have reservations using Uber again for myself, given that I may encounter some of us here on the forums in the driver seat of a car I'd be in. Some of these posts are starting to really scare me..


This is so true. I am not joking when i say the majority of these people sound like neanderthals screaming "WUUUURS MUUUUUUH TIIIIIIIP". I am also not kidding when I say the majority of drivers posting here have reached the peak of their careers and dont seem to be able to hold any other employment. Keep rating riders low though and make it so they stop using Uber, I will keep rating drivers based on the info I read here. Just dont complain when you get deactivated or have no riders because you have scared away all of the business. I am sure that will be blamed on someone else other than yourselves for doing that though.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Big Machine said:


> This is so true. I am not joking when i say the majority of these people sound like neanderthals screaming "WUUUURS MUUUUUUH TIIIIIIIP". I am also not kidding when I say the majority of drivers posting here have reached the peak of their careers and dont seem to be able to hold any other employment. Keep rating riders low though and make it so they stop using Uber, I will keep rating drivers based on the info I read here. Just dont complain when you get deactivated or have no riders because you have scared away all of the business. I am sure that will be blamed on someone else other than yourselves for doing that though.


Better yet. The pax can go **** themselves if they think the stupid driving herd will continue on. They won't cause they'll be broke.


----------



## DrJeecheroo

Sly said:


> So what happens if a Pax only needs to go 3 or 4 miles down the road you want them to walk? That isn't very entrepreneurial of you. You sound like a socialist.


Well some of the ones I've seen could use the exercise.


----------



## DrJeecheroo

Big Machine said:


> This is so true. I am not joking when i say the majority of these people sound like neanderthals screaming "WUUUURS MUUUUUUH TIIIIIIIP". I am also not kidding when I say the majority of drivers posting here have reached the peak of their careers and dont seem to be able to hold any other employment. Keep rating riders low though and make it so they stop using Uber, I will keep rating drivers based on the info I read here. Just dont complain when you get deactivated or have no riders because you have scared away all of the business. I am sure that will be blamed on someone else other than yourselves for doing that though.


' "WUUUURS MUUUUUUH TIIIIIIIP".".... Are you having a spaz attack?


----------



## DrJeecheroo

Ripd said:


> Why do you care? Everyone trying to be Paul Revere is the problem here. Let them eliminate the problematic rider based on their own experiences... not your he said/she said bullshit. Ever heard of YMMV?


What does YMMV stand for. (You make me vomit?)


----------



## Guest

Actionjax said:


> Restaurants who don't allow a tip on your card are called fast food. And they don't get tipped very often. If it's a sit down with full service they risk the same issue we do. In the end that's not a customer issue. That's ours.


I am very well aware what fast food restaurants are.

I have been to many restaurants where there is no option to tip and it is a restaurant. The waiters/waitresses serve.

I am not disagreeing that its not a customers issue but if you know that you are using a service where you should tip and tips are only cash then you should carry cash.

People should tip Uber drivers because most go out of their way for pick ups and offer treats.

I offer water and chocolates because I do lyft 90% of the time and get tips but I do offer the same treatment to my Uber riders.

After the rate cuts I have to drive 8-10 miles to pick a rider for a $3-4 after uber cut and the rider knows that I drove from so far yet no tip. These riders are regular riders and if they have any level of sense they should know Im not making anything if I come from so far.


----------



## Guest

scrurbscrud said:


> We all know that tipping with Uber pax is a rare occurrence and would not be expected. NOR does the pax have ANY awareness of the shit for driver pay.
> 
> Low fare pay is not a pax issue or a tip issue. It's really not even an UBER issue because obviously there are sufficient dumb asses to fill the donkey driving herd.
> 
> It's only an issue for those drivers dumb enough to take low pay and then ***** about taking what they agreed to take and then blame it on the pax by rating what they agreed to already.
> 
> In short, a very stupid reaction.


Not have any awareness of the drivers pay?

Lets say, I ordered an Uber to go down 2 miles and I know it will cost me about $5.6 and as a customer Ill assume the driver gets to keep all of it. But I do know he drove 4-5 miles to pick me up so after drive 6-7miles spending 15-20 mins of his time he made $5.6. That is before paying for gas. So as a rider it is obvious to me they are not making good money.

I was a rider before a driver and knew they werent making a lot.


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## scrurbscrud

Anti-Uber said:


> Not have any awareness of the drivers pay?
> Lets say, I ordered an Uber to go down 2 miles and I know it will cost me about $5.6 and as a customer Ill assume the driver gets to keep all of it. But I do know he drove 4-5 miles to pick me up so after drive 6-7miles spending 15-20 mins of his time he made $5.6. That is before paying for gas. So as a rider it is obvious to me they are not making good money. I was a rider before a driver and *knew they werent making a lot.*


*Ain't their problem is it?*


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## Guest

scrurbscrud said:


> *Ain't their problem is it?*


I never said its the riders problem but they should tip. Like people should tip any worker who makes below minimum wage and relies on tips.


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## scrurbscrud

Anti-Uber said:


> I never said its the riders problem but they should tip. Like people should tip any worker who makes below minimum wage and relies on tips.


Don't disagree but tips have always been optional. They are seldom if ever, a requirement. I think 7 pax should have a mandatory tip just like 6 or more at a restaurant table. But what I think really doesn't matter if it isn't.

I agreed to the fare regardless of the tip. Rating the pax based on not tipping is legit. But not the fare.

And when Uber constantly bombards the pax with 'tipping is not required' you can hardly blame the pax.


----------



## Guest

scrurbscrud said:


> Don't disagree but tips have always been optional. They are seldom if ever, a requirement. I think 7 pax should have a mandatory tip just like 6 or more at a restaurant table. But what I think really doesn't matter if it isn't.
> 
> I agreed to the fare regardless of the tip. Rating the pax based on not tipping is legit. But not the fare.
> 
> And when Uber constantly bombards the pax with 'tipping is not required' you can hardly blame the pax.


I never rate passengers based on fare but definitely based on tip. Tip is not requirement but the question is whether one should tip or not? And I believe they should if they dont rate them low because drivers are trying to earn and bring food to the table not do charity work.

I feel pax are also at fault especially when they say tip is included etc. I've had passengers wow you get to keep $5 for this ride. Yeah I spent 8 miles driving for $5.


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## Oscar Levant

DukeOfDallas said:


> Seriously, I have started to rate my passengers on fares. Pax can be nicest person in the world, but if I drove 15 minutes out of my way for a $4.00 fare with no tip, automatic rating is a 1 star.
> 
> Anyone else agree or use similar system?


I am adamantly against this. Look, uber tells people no tipping necessary, they told you that when you started, they told you to tell that to people, and you accepted those terms.

If you start rating people low for low tipping, when many, or most, do not tip because of this no-tipping policy, Uber is going to find out real quick what you are doing. Wholesale unjust low ratings are not good for business. It's widely known that Uber doesn't require tipping. 
If it's not good for business, Uber will probably deactivate you. That's my guess.


----------



## Driver8

Sly said:


> One day the pax needs a ride to local bar. Next day he needs a ride to the airport. Same pax. We provide the short trips to get pax in the habit of using us so then we get the long trips too. We don't do the short trips then someone else gets them and they also get the long trips too. Nobody does long trips only.


Who is "we"? YOU, the drivers, pay for negative-earning trips, Uber doesn't. YOU aren't training the pax to do anything - you're the one being trained.


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## Driver8

Markopolo said:


> Uber tells the Pax "tip is included" " There is apparently also a splash on their app to remind them at the end of the ride. This sucks but Don't blame the Pax.


There are dozens of articles and vids that have gone viral, explaining to pax what bullshit that is. Whether or not to tip is pax choice and they know it. Especially among users of the upper tier of Uber services - Black, XL, SUV, Select. 90% of my pax were business travelers who were well aware of what kind of deal they were getting.


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## Oscar Levant

DukeOfDallas said:


> Rate the Fare not the customer. This is the only way Uber will take notice of negative earnings on short trips.


Cherry picking not only is not good for business, it's unfair to other drivers and unjust rating is not good for business, either.

They'll just deactivate you. I can almost gaurantee it.


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## scrurbscrud

Driver8 said:


> There are dozens of articles and vids that have gone viral, explaining to pax what bullshit that is. Whether or not to tip is pax choice and they know it. Especially among users of the upper tier of Uber services - Black, XL, SUV, Select. 90% of my pax were business travelers who were well aware of what kind of deal they were getting.


The driver agreement with Uber says that we know and accept that they publicly use the 'no tipping is required' as a marketing effort.

It sure ain't the pax fault. And even making derogatory statements about it should be engaged with caution since we as drivers AGREED to that proposition to begin with.


----------



## ntsnipe

getFubered said:


> Are you ****in stupid? you really think after you just paid $4 for a ride in a $10k+ vehicle that's enough for Uber to make money, the driver to make money, and include a tip? Have you been to a gas station since 2004? I get it, it's 2015 and your entitled to a ride at the push of a button for nothing and your cheap and don't carry an extra couple of 1's on you, really I get it. But don't come on this forum and tell us "uh well, uh I didn't know how much you make". A $4 or $7 ride how much do you think we made? 10? 15?


Yes I must be stupid because I really didn't know. I suppose the a more appropriate way to phrase it is that I didn't know if your day is profitable. Whether it is critical for every ride to be profitable or whether you just count on the day being profitable. I also heard from a driver that uber guaranteed a minimum hourly wage. . . So in that case I assumed that the hourly wage makes up for the shitty fares. After reading this site it looks like they don't do that always and in all markets, but I again, I don't know. So yes, without being an entitled idiot I can say I didnt know whether your job was profitable for you or not. Lemme ask you, do you think every cab ride is profitable? My guess is no! My guess is that they too have fares that don't make them a lot of money which get offset by others where more money is made. But then again, I am ****ing stupid so I could be wrong.

Also, make no mistake, I am not cheap. I tip rather well and I would tip uber drivers if given the option. I tip lyft every time I use them. This was the point of my post. Just because uber is ****ing you, doesn't mean I want to **** you. You want me to keep with me a crisp little stack of bills that I can use just for when I use Uber? You want me to add an step to my day to make sure I have cash in case I take an uber? Does that make sense? Does that make more sense then having the app that I am using to pay you allow me to add a tip? Really, which is the better focal point? Going after all the customers that use Uber to get them to carry cash or simply going after uber to add a feature to their app. Perhaps I am the wrong person to ask because I'm ****ing stupid but I'd spend my time trying to get uber to change their stupid policy, because it is stupid.

BTW, yesterday I sent an email to uber asking them to add the feature. I find it hilarious that I am actually trying to help you and youre calling me ****ing stupid. It's poetic really. And on a final note, if you don't want to have any unprofitable rides dont take them. Have a good life getFubered.


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## ntsnipe

Fuzzyelvis said:


> Ask every driver if he has a square reader to take a credit card tip. Many do and if pax ask will then get one. Takes 30 seconds to use. But Funnily enough when someone tells me they'd tip but don't carry cash and I tell them I can take their card only 1 in 5 actually takes me up on it.


Thanks for the tip, ha, no pun intended. That's something else I did not know. I will start asking drivers about that.


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## Goober

scrurbscrud said:


> Pax have absolutely no conception of driver profitability over distance to pax/min. fare issues. It's unreasonable to expect them to know that drivers don't make shit on long distance min. fare pings.
> 
> Half the drivers out there are clueless on this subject. 100% of the pax are clueless on this subject.


still feels good to f^%* up their driver rating. Not proposing that people do it across the board....just one of those things that will make me give a rider a shitty rating.


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## Guest

We a


ntsnipe said:


> Yes I must be stupid because I really didn't know. I suppose the a more appropriate way to phrase it is that I didn't know if your day is profitable. Whether it is critical for every ride to be profitable or whether you just count on the day being profitable. I also heard from a driver that uber guaranteed a minimum hourly wage. . . So in that case I assumed that the hourly wage makes up for the shitty fares. After reading this site it looks like they don't do that always and in all markets, but I again, I don't know. So yes, without being an entitled idiot I can say I didnt know whether your job was profitable for you or not. Lemme ask you, do you think every cab ride is profitable? My guess is no! My guess is that they too have fares that don't make them a lot of money which get offset by others where more money is made. But then again, I am ****ing stupid so I could be wrong.
> 
> Also, make no mistake, I am not cheap. I tip rather well and I would tip uber drivers if given the option. I tip lyft every time I use them. This was the point of my post. Just because uber is ****ing you, doesn't mean I want to **** you. You want me to keep with me a crisp little stack of bills that I can use just for when I use Uber? You want me to add an step to my day to make sure I have cash in case I take an uber? Does that make sense? Does that make more sense then having the app that I am using to pay you allow me to add a tip? Really, which is the better focal point? Going after all the customers that use Uber to get them to carry cash or simply going after uber to add a feature to their app. Perhaps I am the wrong person to ask because I'm ****ing stupid but I'd spend my time trying to get uber to change their stupid policy, because it is stupid.
> 
> BTW, yesterday I sent an email to uber asking them to add the feature. I find it hilarious that I am actually trying to help you and youre calling me ****ing stupid. It's poetic really. And on a final note, if you don't want to have any unprofitable rides dont take them. Have a good life getFubered.


Most drivers have asked uber to add the option but uber doesn't care and now the only ones that are driving for uber are who have no choice or are too stupid to realize they are not making money.

You're saying why should you add an extra step because if you dont most drivers wont pick you due to low rating. When I didnt notice riders ratings I picked up low rated riders and they complained they had to wait longer. My guess? Drivers weren't accepting their request.

Riders rate drivers low based on fares and things that aren't in drivers control so we as drivers will rate riders based on whatever we want.


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## getFubered

ntsnipe said:


> Yes I must be stupid because I really didn't know. I suppose the a more appropriate way to phrase it is that I didn't know if your day is profitable. Whether it is critical for every ride to be profitable or whether you just count on the day being profitable.


Really? Whether it is critical for every ride to be profitable? WTF would anyone want to take an unprofitable trip? Jesus.



ntsnipe said:


> Lemme ask you, do you think every cab ride is profitable? My guess is no!


Why do you think Uber is half the price of a Cab? Do you think they magically figured out a way to transport people at half the price while still being able pay for software development? Oh wait they did, so long as they don't have to pay for the cost of operating the vehicle (drivers have their own vehicles) they can charge half as much while exploiting people-relying on their inability to be honest about expenses and perform simple arithmetic.



ntsnipe said:


> You want me to add an step to my day to make sure I have cash in case I take an uber? Does that make sense?


No no, that would be asking way too much given that you're only getting a ride at the push of a button, in less than 5 minutes for dirt cheap.

In all fairness, you're right it is pretty absurd of me to think that you would consider how much people make whose services you use. But someone is showing up in their own vehicle to chauffeur you around, and given that you have probably taken a cab before, it never crossed your mind to tip them? I get it, there is no in app option to tip, but would it kill you to tip your driver in cash? That isn't a machine driving you around, its a human being. See I'm one of those weird people that think of workers as human beings, not contractually agreed upon slaves. I'm one of those crazy people that tips the guy at autozone for coming outside and installing a newly purchased battery in my car with 12 inches of snow on the ground when its 15 degrees out. "Oh but they never said you have to tip". No, but thats a human who is working at half the wage of the alternative and I just got the service for free.

I get it though, truly, I'm not like a lot of people. But YOU came on this forum telling us how you ARE NOT ABLE TO tip. I can assure you that if you were not happy at whatever meaningless job you have, I would not come on a forum created for you and your colleagues and complain about what you were doing. That is like suggesting walmart customers should complain to walmart employees when they are on strike because the shelves arent stocked, they cant get rang out etc.

I agree 100%, the blame is on Uber. However they don't give a **** about drivers. So, as a driver, I look out for myself and try to make the experience as awful as I can for riders without being deactivated because that is the only way they will begin to take notice.

But hey, this new Uber thing is great.


----------



## ntsnipe

Dude. I am sorry you don't like your job. I did not mean to come here and complain that I can't tip. I meant to say it seemed like the plan to punish pax for not tipping would not help. Another driver suggested that getting square would solve the tip issue. I liked that idea though perhaps it's still just a bandaid on the problem.


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## Lidman

In my cab job I've gotten a few of those $3/4 fares with no tips and also ones that tip $2 or more those short run. Fortunately, I get lots of pax who are bartenders/waitress'ers/ etc, who tip awesome. Whenever I get stuck with those grocery runs that got two blocks, I try to remember this too will pass. I'm especially grateful that lyft is more driver friendly and has a tip option on it' app. Thankgod I don't drive for uber.


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## DC Short Trip

LOL
You are all going to rate yourself out of a job. _You chose_ to sign a contract with Uber to provide a service; no one held a gun to your head. Some of you _choose_ to drive over 10 minutes for a $4 fare. It's all about choices. And you complain when someone uses your service? I take mainly $6, (give or take), trips because I live in the city. I've only tipped once, (holiday time, raining, so I had wet packages). That was completely my discretion. When I signed up as an Uber user, I signed a contract that dictates that I will pay for using a service, which I do. So I pay for the service you provide, and you provide the service that I pay for. Where does a tip fit in? Are you getting out of the car and opening the door for me? Are you pressing my clothes while I'm riding with you? No. You are doing exactly what you are paid to do. You are doing what the contract _you signed_ with Uber stipulates. If you don't like the terms of the contract, get a different job. It's that simple. A pax doesn't owe you anything extra. Most of you sound like a bunch of whiny progressive socialists who want something for nothing.


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## Txchick

DC Short Trip said:


> LOL
> You are all going to rate yourself out of a job. _You chose_ to sign a contract with Uber to provide a service; no one held a gun to your head. Some of you _choose_ to drive over 10 minutes for a $4 fare. It's all about choices. And you complain when someone uses your service? I take mainly $6, (give or take), trips because I live in the city. I've only tipped once, (holiday time, raining, so I had wet packages). That was completely my discretion. When I signed up as an Uber user, I signed a contract that dictates that I will pay for using a service, which I do. So I pay for the service you provide, and you provide the service that I pay for. Where does a tip fit in? Are you getting out of the car and opening the door for me? Are you pressing my clothes while I'm riding with you? No. You are doing exactly what you are paid to do. You are doing what the contract _you signed_ with Uber stipulates. If you don't like the terms of the contract, get a different job. It's that simple. A pax doesn't owe you anything extra. Most of you sound like a bunch of whiny progressive socialists who want something for nothing.


Diagree with you with recent rate cuts in Jan 2015 LA market, Chicago, Dallas markets to .90 cents per mile $4.00 minimum. Dallas market is not 24 hour surge so not a lot of opportunities to make the difference up in rate cuts. The Dallas market unlike Washington DC does not have guarantees any longer. Drivers who built Uber markets just want to make more than minimum wage after costs. Thanks for stopping by Rush Limbaugh!


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## scrurbscrud

Goober said:


> still feels good to f^%* up their driver rating. Not proposing that people do it across the board....just one of those things that will make me give a rider a shitty rating.


I know. It feels just as good to cancel and get a fee. I resist the urge to down rate pax over a non tip out of personal self interests cause I know how Uber is.

I also know what I agree to do when I hit 'accept.' It's also why I don't drive much anymore, because of the fare. It's better for me to not drive than to ***** about the pax. I generally like people anyway, and try to keep it that way. A bad attitude will take a driver out as fast as anything else. I won't give Uber the pleasure of scratching me over giving pax low star ratings. That's part of the motive.


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## Lidman

DC Short Trip said:


> LOL
> You are all going to rate yourself out of a job. _You chose_ to sign a contract with Uber to provide a service; no one held a gun to your head. Some of you _choose_ to drive over 10 minutes for a $4 fare. It's all about choices. And you complain when someone uses your service? I take mainly $6, (give or take), trips because I live in the city. I've only tipped once, (holiday time, raining, so I had wet packages). That was completely my discretion. When I signed up as an Uber user, I signed a contract that dictates that I will pay for using a service, which I do. So I pay for the service you provide, and you provide the service that I pay for. Where does a tip fit in? Are you getting out of the car and opening the door for me? Are you pressing my clothes while I'm riding with you? No. You are doing exactly what you are paid to do. You are doing what the contract _you signed_ with Uber stipulates. If you don't like the terms of the contract, get a different job. It's that simple. A pax doesn't owe you anything extra. Most of you sound like a bunch of whiny progressive socialists who want something for nothing.


This post is a comedy. The ole "uber didn't hold a gun to your head" is a bit redundant. I just feel bad for those poor drivers who have to put up with likes of you. lolol. But feel free to rant and rave. It's very entertaining.

"Are you pressing my clothes while I'm riding with you?" Who knows, maybe uber will jump into the dry cleaning on wheels business.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Lidman said:


> This post is a comedy. The ole "uber didn't hold a gun to your head" is a bit redundant. I just feel bad for those poor drivers who have to put up with likes of you. lolol. But feel free to rant and rave. It's very entertaining.


It's equally ironic to have non drivers/pax come in here and post on this subject...wink wink.


----------



## DC Short Trip

Txchick said:


> Diagree with you with recent rate cuts in Jan 2015 LA market, Chicago, Dallas markets


Your disagreement isn't specific: are you saying that since the rates were cut that it is now up to the pax to make up the difference?


----------



## Txchick

Lidman said:


> This post is a comedy. The ole "uber didn't hold a gun to your head" is a bit redundant. I just feel bad for those poor drivers who have to put up with likes of you. lolol. But feel free to rant and rave. It's very entertaining.


Mr Washington DC Rush Lumbaugh doing short fates..ha ha ha!


----------



## Txchick

DC Short Trip said:


> Your disagreement isn't specific: are you saying that since the rates were cut that it is now up to the pax to make up the difference?


Reread the post I edited it. Ubers main competitor offers tip option. What I am saying is Drivers would not be complaining if rates were at a level were driving was profitable. I went thru 2 rate cuts wit Fuber in a 8 month span. Uber has discouraged tipping since its inception. Get with it Rush!!


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## Lidman

God forbid if you canceled on somewhat like that.


----------



## Lidman

scrurbscrud said:


> It's equally ironic to have non drivers/pax come in here and post on this subject...wink wink.


 I'd love to see hows dc pax would post on here, if he/she got hit with a rate surge.. I'd love to see dc with a 10x surge.


----------



## Lidman

DC Short Trip said:


> Your disagreement isn't specific: are you saying that since the rates were cut that it is now up to the pax to make up the difference?


well some of pax will make up for it if there's a price surge... which im sure you the pax agreed on the uber tos.


----------



## DC Short Trip

Txchick said:


> Te
> 
> Reread the post I edited it. Ubers main competitor offers tip option. What I am saying is Drivers would not be complaining if rates were at a level were driving was profitable. I went thru 2 rate cuts wit Fuber in a 8 month span. Uber has discouraged tipping since its inception. Get with it Rush!!


There was no need to edit your original post, my guess was right. You're upset that Uber cut fares and believe that the pax should pick up the tab. So you accepted a job and the terms changed. Get a different job. Problem solved.


----------



## DC Short Trip

Lidman said:


> This post is a comedy. The ole "uber didn't hold a gun to your head" is a bit redundant. I just feel bad for those poor drivers who have to put up with likes of you. lolol. But feel free to rant and rave. It's very entertaining.
> 
> "Are you pressing my clothes while I'm riding with you?" Who knows, maybe uber will jump into the dry cleaning on wheels business.


What's redundant is the "the company I chose to work for doesn't pay me enough; the passengers don't tip; MAAAAAWM, Uber is looking at me, make it stop!!" mentality of those of you that want charity.


----------



## Lidman

DC Short Trip said:


> There was no need to edit your original post, my guess was right. You're upset that Uber cut fares and believe that the pax should pick up the tab. So you accepted a job and the terms changed. Get a different job. Problem solved.


 I wouldn't get to used to ubers bargain rates, as they will crash with in a couple of years. So your right, uber drivers would be better off driving for lyft and even cab companies. I hope everyone else takes your advice about quitting uber. Then you'll have to pay more than2x taking a cab. ahahahaah NO more uber and to coin your phrase "problem solved".


----------



## Lidman

DC Short Trip said:


> What's redundant is the "the company I chose to work for doesn't pay me enough; the passengers don't tip; MAAAAAWM, Uber is looking at me, make it stop!!" mentality of those of you that want charity.


I don't driver for uber. I'm content driving the the cab on weekends. Most non tippers end up paying more on the long run, because I charge them for eyery little thing I can. hahahaha.


----------



## Txchick

DC Short Trip said:


> There was no need to edit your original post, my guess was right. You're upset that Uber cut fares and believe that the pax should pick up the tab. So you accepted a job and the terms changed. Get a different job. Problem solved.


I already have a full time job Mr Limbaugh & quit driving Uber in Jan 2015. What I did not sign up for was a supposed partner dropping rates at a whim to oust their competitor Lyft. What drivers do we have now in Dallas?? Non English speaking don't know Dallas drivers. Heard it all the time my last week at Uber where are all the good drivers?? It's Ubers brand at stake..ya get what you pay for!


----------



## Txchick

DC Short Trip said:


> What's redundant is the "the company I chose to work for doesn't pay me enough; the passengers don't tip; MAAAAAWM, Uber is looking at me, make it stop!!" mentality of those of you that want charity.


Drivers who built markets for Uber did not expect their partner-Uber's phrase not mine to drop rates at bottom feeder pricing to a minimum wage fiasco. Keep doing short fares Rush making much at $1.02 cents per mile after expenses?? Nope!


----------



## DC Short Trip

Uber is only about $2 cheaper than a cab, sorry to burst your bubble. I have no problem going back to cabs - won't affect me at all. How do you figure Uber "will crash with in (sic) a couple of years."? Clearly, Uber will still have drivers if they drop rates further as this thread proves. Even so, all it takes is another competing company to come in and pay their drivers more than Uber pays. If Uber wants to remain viable, they will also increase their pay (or offer drivers some other incentive). Econ 101.
How do you charge non-tippers "for eyery little thing" in a cab, when the tip would come after the customer is given the total amount for the ride? Do you drive a magic, time-travelling cab where you can see the end of the trip before the trip starts?


----------



## scrurbscrud

DC Short Trip said:


> Uber is only about $2 cheaper than a cab, sorry to burst your bubble. *I have no problem going back to cabs - won't affect me at all. *


All in favor say AYE!

Aye!


----------



## Lidman

AYE! AYE!


----------



## Lidman

"How do you charge non-tippers "for eyery little thing" in a cab, when the tip would come after the customer is given the total amount for the ride? Do you drive a magic, time-travelling cab where you can see the end of the trip before the trip starts?"

Why yes I do. Thanks for asking.


----------



## DC Short Trip

Txchick said:


> I already have a full time job Mr Limbaugh & quit driving Uber in Jan 2015. What I did not sign up for was a supposed partner dropping rates at a whim to oust their competitor Lyft. What drivers do we have now in Dallas?? Non English speaking don't know Dallas drivers. Heard it all the time my last week at Uber where are all the good drivers?? It's Ubers brand at stake..ya get what you pay for!


I bet you did sign up for a partner "dropping rates at a whim to oust their competitor". My guess is that the contract you signed stipulated that Uber had the right to change the terms, possibly without notice.
If you already have a full-time job, what are you complaining about? Oh, now I see Governor Perry. You have a problem with "non English speaking" drivers. GPS is available so knowing Dallas isn't really your issue. You want only white 'muricans to drive for Uber. How dare an immigrant get into this country and get a job!! So your complaint is really that Uber isn't racist enough for you. Nice.


----------



## Txchick

DC Short Trip said:


> I bet you did sign up for a partner "dropping rates at a whim to oust their competitor". My guess is that the contract you signed stipulated that Uber had the right to change the terms, possibly without notice.
> If you already have a full-time job, what are you complaining about? Oh, now I see Governor Perry. You have a problem with "non English speaking" drivers. GPS is available so knowing Dallas isn't really your issue. You want only white 'muricans to drive for Uber. How dare an immigrant get into this country and get a job!! So your complaint is really that Uber isn't racist enough for you. Nice.


Geez kinda went off the road their Rush! Governor Perry not in office any longer. Secondly, Mr I call people Socialist not a matter of what nationality a Uber driver is can they speak to relate to a pax? Doesn't matter if they have a GPS unit cause one is in the app. Drivers Uber has hired since I left struggling to make that happen. I do care about the drivers who invested their time, their vehicles, their hard work in developing markets to get screwed by their partner..Uber! Do drivers deserve this: http://www.10news.com/news/dashcam-shows-uber-drivers-ugly-encounter-03112015


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## DC Short Trip

Nice try with your backpedalling, Mr. Perry. Sounds like the nationality of Uber drivers means a lot to you as your complaint was specifically about "non-english speaking" drivers. I guess you feel hurt since you were called out for being a racist. Here's an exercise for you: research how many cab drivers in this country are what you would call "non-english speaking". You will find that it is a very high number. They can "speak to relate" to their passengers quite well as they make a living doing it every day. It's funny how you bring up "non English speaking" drivers as being a negative, when you can't communicate in English yourself. "Drivers Uber has hired since I left struggling to make that happen" is not a sentence. What exactly are they struggling to make happen? Learn to punctuate and try to complete your thoughts, (and sentences), before writing.
Are you butt-hurt for being called a socialist? Well, I call them as I see them. I believe whiny progressive socialist was my phrasing, but I digress. That's exactly what you are. Please explain to me how you developed markets? I don't know your background, but in your posts to me you have only stated that you were an Uber driver. Did you also do marketing and research for Uber before they set up shop in Dallas? 
How did the, "drivers who invested their time, their vehicles, their hard work... get screwed"? Were they fired? Were they guaranteed certain items that were reneged? I doubt it. It sounds like the typical whiny progressive socialist mantra of you feeling like you are owed something when you are not. As for your link, how exactly is that Uber's fault? Are you seriously suggesting that this specifically happened because of the rate drop? That is laughable. You don't have to answer: I know it is exactly what you think. You have proven post after post that you don't have a valid complaint, and can't communicate or organize your thoughts. Once you are called out on one topic, you deflect. The more you do that, the less sense you make.
The most important sentence in the article you linked to: "The company paid for the repairs to Patrick's Ford Escape". Of course, you probably did not scroll down far enough to read that because you were blinded by your progressive outrage fuelled by your lack of comprehension skills. You can wish all you want that the rate drop causes violence; wishing won't make it so. Sorry Perry, you lose.


----------



## Lidman

DC Short Trip said:


> Nice try with your backpedalling, Mr. Perry. Sounds like the nationality of Uber drivers means a lot to you as your complaint was specifically about "non-english speaking" drivers. I guess you feel hurt since you were called out for being a racist. Here's an exercise for you: research how many cab drivers in this country are what you would call "non-english speaking". You will find that it is a very high number. They can "speak to relate" to their passengers quite well as they make a living doing it every day. It's funny how you bring up "non English speaking" drivers as being a negative, when you can't communicate in English yourself. "Drivers Uber has hired since I left struggling to make that happen" is not a sentence. What exactly are they struggling to make happen? Learn to punctuate and try to complete your thoughts, (and sentences), before writing.
> Are you butt-hurt for being called a socialist? Well, I call them as I see them. I believe whiny progressive socialist was my phrasing, but I digress. That's exactly what you are. Please explain to me how you developed markets? I don't know your background, but in your posts to me you have only stated that you were an Uber driver. Did you also do marketing and research for Uber before they set up shop in Dallas?
> How did the, "drivers who invested their time, their vehicles, their hard work... get screwed"? Were they fired? Were they guaranteed certain items that were reneged? I doubt it. It sounds like the typical whiny progressive socialist mantra of you feeling like you are owed something when you are not. As for your link, how exactly is that Uber's fault? Are you seriously suggesting that this specifically happened because of the rate drop? That is laughable. You don't have to answer: I know it is exactly what you think. You have proven post after post that you don't have a valid complaint, and can't communicate or organize your thoughts. Once you are called out on one topic, you deflect. The more you do that, the less sense you make.
> The most important sentence in the article you linked to: "The company paid for the repairs to Patrick's Ford Escape". Of course, you probably did not scroll down far enough to read that because you were blinded by your progressive outrage fuelled by your lack of comprehension skills. You can wish all you want that the rate drop causes violence; wishing won't make it so. Sorry Perry, you lose.


 Now this is a classic example of an uberite with a loose cannon.


----------



## Pascal O.

@DukeOfDallas

All you "where is my tip" ppl make me laugh. Don't get me wrong, when I get a tip from a pax -- like the *$20* bill handed to me yesterday -- I always appreciate it as the rates sucks (*0.95* cents in Atlanta). But rating any pax based on your fare is childish & ignorant. As SEVERAL drivers have stated, ratings should warn us of pax who are difficult to deal w/ and so forth. Moreover, if you drop off a pax who had a min fare & rated them a 1 star, how does that inform the pax that they should tip next time? See the communication issue here?

Analogy --> a child does sth I deem wrong & I scold them but DON'T say what they did that earned the punishment. How do they learn?

Also, if the Uber rates were appropriate, lets say a standard *$2*/mile & *0.20-40* cents per min, would you be nagging that pax don't tip? The issue is w/ Uber not the pax. Plain & simple.

I for one don't drive anymore unless there is at least a *1.5x* surge & I drive much less & yet earn more as conveyed in my weekly summaries. Quit your child-like whining as am confident your @ least 30 years of age & adapt to the new Uber norm or quit. Rating pax ignorantly affects the rest of us. I only pick up pax w/ 4.6 or higher ratings as I do not wish to risk picking idiots in my new 2014 Honda accord. Ppl like you mess up my rating system


----------



## Txchick

DC Short Trip said:


> Nice try with your backpedalling, Mr. Perry. Sounds like the nationality of Uber drivers means a lot to you as your complaint was specifically about "non-english speaking" drivers. I guess you feel hurt since you were called out for being a racist. Here's an exercise for you: research how many cab drivers in this country are what you would call "non-english speaking". You will find that it is a very high number. They can "speak to relate" to their passengers quite well as they make a living doing it every day. It's funny how you bring up "non English speaking" drivers as being a negative, when you can't communicate in English yourself. "Drivers Uber has hired since I left struggling to make that happen" is not a sentence. What exactly are they struggling to make happen? Learn to punctuate and try to complete your thoughts, (and sentences), before writing.
> Are you butt-hurt for being called a socialist? Well, I call them as I see them. I believe whiny progressive socialist was my phrasing, but I digress. That's exactly what you are. Please explain to me how you developed markets? I don't know your background, but in your posts to me you have only stated that you were an Uber driver. Did you also do marketing and research for Uber before they set up shop in Dallas?
> How did the, "drivers who invested their time, their vehicles, their hard work... get screwed"? Were they fired? Were they guaranteed certain items that were reneged? I doubt it. It sounds like the typical whiny progressive socialist mantra of you feeling like you are owed something when you are not. As for your link, how exactly is that Uber's fault? Are you seriously suggesting that this specifically happened because of the rate drop? That is laughable. You don't have to answer: I know it is exactly what you think. You have proven post after post that you don't have a valid complaint, and can't communicate or organize your thoughts. Once you are called out on one topic, you deflect. The more you do that, the less sense you make.
> The most important sentence in the article you linked to: "The company paid for the repairs to Patrick's Ford Escape". Of course, you probably did not scroll down far enough to read that because you were blinded by your progressive outrage fuelled by your lack of comprehension skills. You can wish all you want that the rate drop causes violence; wishing won't make it so. Sorry Perry, you lose.


What a tool!!


----------



## Txchick

Lidman said:


> Now this is a classic example of an uberite with a loose cannon.


Cannon without a cause!


----------



## OCBob

Yamariz said:


> Thanks for the heads up! Nothing pisses me off more than going out of my way 5.00 trip and no tip even though we cant take tips at least offer!


Oh please, please tell me you are messing with us! This is the problem when drivers think we cannot except tips and fall in line with Uber rumors. What happens is you reject a well earned tip and one of the few Uber riders that would normally tip now never does as they think we cannot except them. I never reject a tip! Infact, I expect a tip on any fare under $6 or the rider loses a star. Simple math for me. If they are dumb enough to think there is any money in a $6 or less fare (especially when I traveled over 3 miles and 10 minutes to get to you!) then their stupidity is going to get them to a 4 star.


----------



## OCBob

Big Machine said:


> This is so true. I am not joking when i say the majority of these people sound like neanderthals screaming "WUUUURS MUUUUUUH TIIIIIIIP". I am also not kidding when I say the majority of drivers posting here have reached the peak of their careers and dont seem to be able to hold any other employment. Keep rating riders low though and make it so they stop using Uber, I will keep rating drivers based on the info I read here. Just dont complain when you get deactivated or have no riders because you have scared away all of the business. I am sure that will be blamed on someone else other than yourselves for doing that though.


We judge based on actual actions. Also, don't stereotype those here as many, like myself, are self employed outside of UBusER. A bump in the road because of the career I have been in for a number of years is the reason I am driving part time. We ***** about lack of tip because it is the only way to get a decent pay out of the fares that we lose at in Uber land.
Keep rating the drivers, who you have no idea of their mindset and how they truthfully feel, so they become deactivated. You know what the effect will be? Less drivers and more surge! Enjoy your ride chump! A


----------



## OCBob

DC Short Trip said:


> I bet you did sign up for a partner "dropping rates at a whim to oust their competitor". My guess is that the contract you signed stipulated that Uber had the right to change the terms, possibly without notice.
> If you already have a full-time job, what are you complaining about? Oh, now I see Governor Perry. You have a problem with "non English speaking" drivers. GPS is available so knowing Dallas isn't really your issue. You want only white 'muricans to drive for Uber. How dare an immigrant get into this country and get a job!! So your complaint is really that Uber isn't racist enough for you. Nice.


The problem is riders have issues with non English speaking drivers! We don't talk to other riders so their communication doesn't affect us on our current ride. How do they affect us? It brings Uber down to a cheap Taxi ride. They do not know what the riders is saying if they want to make a stop before final destination so the riders get frustrated. They can't keep up with a simple conversation either. Uber was very hip but riders are now getting what they pay for as English speaking and educated drivers quit or are only on the road with Surges and trying to do as little as possible to get the guarantees. I know you don't qualify as a driver when you stated anyone with a GPS can be a good driver in any city. Really? Come out to SoCal and I can't wait when you take a rider on a toll raod because the GPS told you to do so. Add in you going 7 minutes to pick up a rider but that is based on you jumping on the toll road and not be compensated for it. Those that drive here know that 7 minute ride is really 15 minutes and a few more miles because we don't take toll roads to pick up a rider. Keep taking the cheap rides and enjoy trying to communicate with the guy that has been in this country for 9 months. Just don't ask for a cord, a stop in between your final destination, etc because he won't know what the **** you are talking about!


----------



## DrJeecheroo

DC Short Trip said:


> Nice try with your backpedalling, Mr. Perry. Sounds like the nationality of Uber drivers means a lot to you as your complaint was specifically about "non-english speaking" drivers. I guess you feel hurt since you were called out for being a racist. Here's an exercise for you: research how many cab drivers in this country are what you would call "non-english speaking". You will find that it is a very high number. They can "speak to relate" to their passengers quite well as they make a living doing it every day. It's funny how you bring up "non English speaking" drivers as being a negative, when you can't communicate in English yourself. "Drivers Uber has hired since I left struggling to make that happen" is not a sentence. What exactly are they struggling to make happen? Learn to punctuate and try to complete your thoughts, (and sentences), before writing.
> Are you butt-hurt for being called a socialist? Well, I call them as I see them. I believe whiny progressive socialist was my phrasing, but I digress. That's exactly what you are. Please explain to me how you developed markets? I don't know your background, but in your posts to me you have only stated that you were an Uber driver. Did you also do marketing and research for Uber before they set up shop in Dallas?
> How did the, "drivers who invested their time, their vehicles, their hard work... get screwed"? Were they fired? Were they guaranteed certain items that were reneged? I doubt it. It sounds like the typical whiny progressive socialist mantra of you feeling like you are owed something when you are not. As for your link, how exactly is that Uber's fault? Are you seriously suggesting that this specifically happened because of the rate drop? That is laughable. You don't have to answer: I know it is exactly what you think. You have proven post after post that you don't have a valid complaint, and can't communicate or organize your thoughts. Once you are called out on one topic, you deflect. The more you do that, the less sense you make.
> The most important sentence in the article you linked to: "The company paid for the repairs to Patrick's Ford Escape". Of course, you probably did not scroll down far enough to read that because you were blinded by your progressive outrage fuelled by your lack of comprehension skills. You can wish all you want that the rate drop causes violence; wishing won't make it so. Sorry Perry, you lose.


Have you ever considered anger management?


----------



## DrJeecheroo

DC Short Trip said:


> What's redundant is the "the company I chose to work for doesn't pay me enough; the passengers don't tip; MAAAAAWM, Uber is looking at me, make it stop!!" mentality of those of you that want charity.


I could use some charity.. Could you take up a collection for "The Jeecheroo Fund". Thank you.


----------



## Txchick

OCBob said:


> The problem is riders have issues with non English speaking drivers! We don't talk to other riders so their communication doesn't affect us on our current ride. How do they affect us? It brings Uber down to a cheap Taxi ride. They do not know what the riders is saying if they want to make a stop before final destination so the riders get frustrated. They can't keep up with a simple conversation either. Uber was very hip but riders are now getting what they pay for as English speaking and educated drivers quit or are only on the road with Surges and trying to do as little as possible to get the guarantees. I know you don't qualify as a driver when you stated anyone with a GPS can be a good driver in any city. Really? Come out to SoCal and I can't wait when you take a rider on a toll raod because the GPS told you to do so. Add in you going 7 minutes to pick up a rider but that is based on you jumping on the toll road and not be compensated for it. Those that drive here know that 7 minute ride is really 15 minutes and a few more miles because we don't take toll roads to pick up a rider. Keep taking the cheap rides and enjoy trying to communicate with the guy that has been in this country for 9 months. Just don't ask for a cord, a stop in between your final destination, etc because he won't know what the **** you are talking about!


Yes! Same way in NYC with the stand alone GPS unit. When I have been out to LA for work or visiting friends I know my personal GPS takes me on toll roads if I don't opt out. I always asked my pax in Dallas toll way or not??


----------



## Txchick

DrJeecheroo said:


> Have you ever considered anger management?


Ha ha!!


----------



## Lidman

DrJeecheroo said:


> Have you ever considered anger management?


I would need it after one week of Ubers 'self entitled" $4 no tip paxs. and .65/mile


----------



## AJOMAA11

DukeOfDallas said:


> Who does this for anything other than $ ... not me. New rating system is now pax with lower rating is lower fares with no tip. PERIOD. End of story. Rate the fare, not the passenger. DONE. I'll pass on all 1 stars because I am sick of driving 15 minutes to make $4 before deductions.


Why would you buther yourself by Ubering ? There are plenty of jubs out in the street where you can make more money than the $4 trip


----------



## Txchick

AJOMAA11 said:


> Why would you buther yourself by Ubering ? There are plenty of jubs out in the street where you can make more money than the $4 trip


I guess he feels Dallas market is a $4.00 market, which it is to some extent. It's not like there is 24 hour long period of surges to make up difference. @.90 cents per mile $4.00 minimum not feasible to drive distances for longer fares anymore.


----------



## Uber-Doober

UberGirlPBC said:


> Go to vistaprint.com and get door magnets with your number on them. Just have the word transportation on them or something like that if that is legal? I will when I get the license


^^^
Good idea, but you know what? 
The manager over at Aladdin, now Planet Hollywood once told me that once you give out 1,000 cards (And I don't mean ten to every passenger), you'll never have to work the airport again, OR have to deal with dispatch again.... which is basically true. 
His office was right inside the VIP entrance over at Aladdin/Hollywood and he really knew the business. 
I took everything that he told me as gospel, and his advice hasnn't steered me wrong. 
I get calls from people who haven't been to Vegas in like... five years, and I still remember them (Mostly) and glad that I took the advice.

UNfortunately, Uber is not structured to build a recurring customer base like even a cab service is able to do. 
I know cab drivers who have cards that they give out to passengers and a lot of times they give out cards only to pax who tip.

I give my cards out to all of my pax, because if they throw them away on the floor of the airport, then I have actually known people who picked them off the floor near the slots or even in the men's room and gave me a call.

Did I actually say that???


----------



## Uber-Doober

Actionjax said:


> I don't think I supported what you said. Drivers will be booted long before any mass change happens. But lets say they did to what you are saying how is that helping things in the long run? What's your point?
> 
> I stated that trending at Uber will work against a driver who engages in this kind of behavior. You disagree with that. By all means please do, it's your right because that's what you have experienced. But my experience tells me something else. And I would think if someone thought about it long an hard they would figure it out for themselves on what is a valid response when a dozen riders out of hundreds shows a history of giving 1 star to a pax when 20 other drivers gave a 5 star. Then look at that driver and behold that's a trend.
> 
> Sounds to me like a driver attitude problem or a training issue. Either way, it wont work out well for the driver.
> 
> Come on UberHammer your a smart guy, you know how this will play out. You think Uber just sits on top of it's money waiting for an IPO to come out? Or do you think they are always shaving drivers off that don't follow the game they want played.


^^^
"Trending"? 
Oh, Please! 
All you trendy people use words like "trending" to seem "trendy". 
"Trending" people have no actual knowledge of what is actually trending. 
You're so hip and cool..... so much so as to be "trending". 
You're waaaaaay to close to the source to be trendy. 
Travis is about the least trendy dresser that I've ever seen... as also his comments about "Dudes" riding Uber.

OK, so put Uber on your resume' and let it go at that... and let all the rest of us give you a big Laff.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Actionjax said:


> So as far as what Uber has done in a positive light I can only speak on my city on this matter. I won't begin to answer what they have done for their employees since I am not in tune with their corporate policy. But they seem happy with their employer and excited to be there.
> 
> As far as positive changes I see a few.
> 
> 1) Taxi companies around here are scared. They have something disrupting them. And there is actually visible changes going on. For the first time I seen people getting into taxi's New Years without an issue. Taxi companies are now all hands on deck. People do not struggle to get cabs here anymore.
> 2) Taxi companies are now engaged with the communities. They are offering gift cards, making donations to worthy causes, and engaging with the city. This is something new that has started.
> 3) Taxi drivers are being told to shape up or there is no room for them here in the city. Dispatch companies are taking serious action against dangerous and fraudulent behavior.
> 
> This did not start to happen till Uber showed up.
> 
> As for what Uber has done is give thousands a means to make extra money. And in my market it's still a good way to make money.
> 
> Uber has some flaws. But I'm not going to paint them as the evil of society. I work at a major bank, lets get one thing straight, we are the evil. We are just better at hiding it as we have many products but no goods we actually sell.
> 
> Let me know when you want to finance your next Uber vehicle....I'm sure we can help with that.


^^^
Sorry, but you missed the boat. 
Those aren't anything that has actually BENEFITED Uber drivers. 
Absolutely NOthing that you mentioned is an actual benefit to the drivers, and those who are driving X and seeing diminishing returns. 
You drank too much of the Kool-Aid over there at the "posh" little get-together where only five drivers were invited.


----------



## Uber-Doober

UberHammer said:


> As soon as I read this, I yelled "**** YOU" out loud!
> 
> How can you read that and come to the complete opposite understanding of what I said?
> 
> I'm done with you. You're on ignore now. I cannot stand people who have the intelligence to understand concepts, but willingly refuse to accept simple concepts. They suck the time and effort out of people willingly trying to help them. I'm done wasting my time and effort on you. BYE!


^^^
I yelled it too.


----------



## Actionjax

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> "Trending"?
> Oh, Please!
> All you trendy people use words like "trending" to seem "trendy".
> "Trending" people have no actual knowledge of what is actually trending.
> You're so hip and cool..... so much so as to be "trending".
> You're waaaaaay to close to the source to be trendy.
> Travis is about the least trendy dresser that I've ever seen... as also his comments about "Dudes" riding Uber.
> 
> OK, so put Uber on your resume' and let it go at that... and let all the rest of us give you a big Laff.


What does your comment have anything to do with what I said. Oh that must be sarcasm. Not an intelligent rebuttal. Trends or things that trend is trending. Just because it's used in the twitter space doesn't make it any less of a business word.

Still doesn't change the fact that if Uber discovers a trend in it's data that is negative to their business model. They will cut the cord.

Are you not agreeing with that? This is not me taking a side like you are...this is just the facts of doing business in a corporate space.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Actionjax said:


> What does your comment have anything to do with what I said. Oh that must be sarcasm. Not an intelligent rebuttal. Trends or things that trend is trending. Just because it's used in the twitter space doesn't make it any less of a business word.
> 
> Still doesn't change the fact that if Uber discovers a trend in it's data that is negative to their business model. They will cut the cord.
> 
> Are you not agreeing with that? This is not me taking a side like you are...this is just the facts of doing business in a corporate space.


^^^
"Space"? 
Just more new speak.


----------



## Actionjax

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Sorry, but you missed the boat.
> Those aren't anything that has actually BENEFITED Uber drivers.
> Absolutely NOthing that you mentioned is an actual benefit to the drivers, and those who are driving X and seeing diminishing returns.
> You drank too much of the Kool-Aid over there at the "posh" little get-together where only five drivers were invited.


I have stated many times. I don't care about the benefit of drivers as my #1 priority. I care about the consumer. The people who ride the service. Taxi companies have modeled their entire business strategy around the driver. And it's a loosing strategy long term.

No different than the music industry who built their model around what was best for them. We all seen where that got them long term.

I don't think the boat has been missed around here. I think your optics are flawed because you don't want to se change. But I think that's because your industry is under attack, and you have no concept of what it will take to fix it.


----------



## Actionjax

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> I yelled it too.


I'm not here to make friends. If you are here for a popularity contest be my guest. At least I have posted something other than a series of complaints and "oh poor me Uber is evil"

People who complain about the same crap over and over but still run back for the abuse I have no respect for. You are the same people who think your time is worth more than it is yet can't prove why.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Actionjax said:


> I'm not here to make friends. If you are here for a popularity contest be my guest. At least I have posted something other than a series of complaints and "oh poor me Uber is evil"
> 
> People who complain about the same crap over and over but still run back for the abuse I have no respect for. You are the same people who think your time is worth more than it is yet can't prove why.


^^^
Typical corporate-speak. 
Or maybe I should say 'TravisSpeak". 
Remember? 
Travis is the "dude" that said that you were worth 'such and such' when you signed up, and then down the road a few months said that you were worth less, and couldn't sign in for the day unless you accepted the new rates that automatically reduced your worth. 
Or should I say "worthless"? 
Actually, you really like using people and putting them in a panic so that instead of working maybe, let's say 8 hours a day, have them work 10, 12, or maybe 18 hours a day in order to make the same amount.... all the time while running the tires off their cars. 
You really like that, don't you? 
Yeah, I thought you did, you muthafkkah.

Hey, I have it cushy. 
I drive the company's car, they pay for all the gas, and when the alternator started throwing solder the other day, I pulled into our service department and they changed it.

You're one of those dudes that really wants to bleed the owner/operator till he's completely down and out, aren't you? 
Yeah, I know your type..... the little fat-palmed guy who wasn't wiped properly when he was toilet trained and it carried over into adulthood.


----------



## Actionjax

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Typical corporate-speak.
> Or maybe I should say 'TravisSpeak".
> Remember?
> Travis is the "dude" that said that you were worth 'such and such' when you signed up, and then down the road a few months said that you were worth less, and couldn't sign in for the day unless you accepted the new rates that automatically reduced your worth.
> Or should I say "worthless"?
> Actually, you really like using people and putting them in a panic so that instead of working maybe, let's say 8 hours a day, have them work 10, 12, or maybe 18 hours a day in order to make the same amount.... all the time while running the tires off their cars.
> You really like that, don't you?
> Yeah, I thought you did, you muthafkkah.
> 
> Hey, I have it cushy.
> I drive the company's car, they pay for all the gas, and when the alternator started throwing solder the other day, I pulled into our service department and they changed it.
> 
> You're one of those dudes that really wants to bleed the owner/operator till he's completely down and out, aren't you?
> Yeah, I know your type..... the little fat-palmed guy who wasn't wiped properly when he was toilet trained and it carried over into adulthood.


Glad you have it cushy. I work for a living and it's far from cushy. Most weeks for a corporate **** like me is 60 hours. But I am also paid well for the work that I do and I like what I do.

And fair treatment of employees is always paramount when they are employees. When they are contractors they get a fair assessment of the work done and if they don't like it then they can go see what the market will dictate for their services.

Remember you are not an employee with Uber. You are just a contractor.

You are right I use corporate speak. being 16 years with my company working my ass off, going to school part time to get a degree, climb the corporate ladder, all has paid off. But I had to work at it. I could have chased the money early on in my career and moved to another company like all my friends did, making 50% more per year. Only for that company to go bankrupt. I stuck it out because I knew what my market is worth and what the future held.

I suggest you ask yourself the question on what the future holds for the average driver. The writing is on the wall, you need to evolve and adapt.

Uber has relegated driving to an anyone with a pulse can do it and you don't need to be paid well to do it either. And guess what it is working. So your market worth is being eroded, you don't like it, but you can fight it like many other industries tried to buck change or you can try and evolve. Be better than Uber.

You say you know my type. Fact is I know your type as well. And I feel sorry for you I really do.


----------



## DukeOfDallas

ActionJackAss and some other posters on here are really quite puzzling. Anyone that adamant against a driver making a fair and equitable wage has another agenda.

ANYHOW, I was contacted by someone from the media who writes online and is researching a story on Uber drivers. In short, I voiced two concerns:
1) Uber needs to recognize that many minimal fares are unprofitabale (even costly) for drivers - and 
2) Uber needs to implement an Active / Idle driver button for when passengers request stops at pharmacy, dry cleaners and other errands where the driver is asked to wait on them.


----------



## Sly

DukeOfDallas said:


> ActionJackAss and some other posters on here are really quite puzzling. Anyone that adamant against a driver making a fair and equitable wage has another agenda.
> 
> ANYHOW, I was contacted by someone from the media who writes online and is researching a story on Uber drivers. In short, I voiced two concerns:
> 1) Uber needs to recognize that many minimal fares are unprofitabale (even costly) for drivers - and
> 2) Uber needs to implement an Active / Idle driver button for when passengers request stops at pharmacy, dry cleaners and other errands where the driver is asked to wait on them.


2. you already get paid per minute when you are driving less than 14 mph.


----------



## Actionjax

DukeOfDallas said:


> ActionJackAss and some other posters on here are really quite puzzling. Anyone that adamant against a driver making a fair and equitable wage has another agenda.
> 
> ANYHOW, I was contacted by someone from the media who writes online and is researching a story on Uber drivers. In short, I voiced two concerns:
> 1) Uber needs to recognize that many minimal fares are unprofitabale (even costly) for drivers - and
> 2) Uber needs to implement an Active / Idle driver button for when passengers request stops at pharmacy, dry cleaners and other errands where the driver is asked to wait on them.


I will agree with point #1 but no idea why #2 is required. Why not just run the meter. If it's a fair value on time why do you need this?

Also just because there are people on here who believe in good customer service and that Uber treats you poorly that it should be taken out on the customer is not an agenda. It's called doing a job well done. Nothing puzzling about that.

No one said you shouldn't make a fair wage. But Uber is not your employer. You want a wage go get a full time job. You want to be paid for your marketable services with no protection. Do Uber. You can't have it both ways.


----------



## Actionjax

Sly said:


> 2. you already get paid per minute when you are driving less than 14 mph.


Here you get paid per min regardless. I think the speed thing is a Taxi thing.


----------



## DukeOfDallas

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox...uld_decide_the_legal_fate_of_the_sharing.html

There are facets of the Uber biz model that suggest drivers are, in fact, employees. Above article is about Uber in court over driver status.


----------



## scrurbscrud

DukeOfDallas said:


> ActionJackAss and some other posters on here are really quite puzzling. Anyone that adamant against a driver making a fair and equitable wage has another agenda.
> 
> ANYHOW, I was contacted by someone from the media who writes online and is researching a story on Uber drivers. In short, I voiced two concerns:
> 1) Uber needs to recognize that many minimal fares are unprofitabale (even costly) for drivers - and
> 2) Uber needs to implement an Active / Idle driver button for when passengers request stops at pharmacy, dry cleaners and other errands where the driver is asked to wait on them.


Rating the fare as insufficient from a drivers perspective is to not turn on the app or take pings. But the moment you take that ping, already knowing what may be on the other end, you have RATED THE FARE to be sufficient.

Rating pax on no tipping is another question. That's legit. But you also understand and AGREE to Uber's no tip required advertising pumping and recognize *supposedly* that it's good for obtaining pax, which is supposedly in our best interests.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Actionjax said:


> Glad you have it cushy. I work for a living and it's far from cushy. Most weeks for a corporate **** like me is 60 hours. But I am also paid well for the work that I do and I like what I do.
> 
> And fair treatment of employees is always paramount when they are employees. When they are contractors they get a fair assessment of the work done and if they don't like it then they can go see what the market will dictate for their services.
> 
> Remember you are not an employee with Uber. You are just a contractor.
> 
> You are right I use corporate speak. being 16 years with my company working my ass off, going to school part time to get a degree, climb the corporate ladder, all has paid off. But I had to work at it. I could have chased the money early on in my career and moved to another company like all my friends did, making 50% more per year. Only for that company to go bankrupt. I stuck it out because I knew what my market is worth and what the future held.
> 
> I suggest you ask yourself the question on what the future holds for the average driver. The writing is on the wall, you need to evolve and adapt.
> 
> Uber has relegated driving to an anyone with a pulse can do it and you don't need to be paid well to do it either. And guess what it is working. So your market worth is being eroded, you don't like it, but you can fight it like many other industries tried to buck change or you can try and evolve. Be better than Uber.
> 
> You say you know my type. Fact is I know your type as well. And I feel sorry for you I really do.


^^^
1) Cushy for my line of work.

2) So how can you have some thin lipped little chippy deal with an owner/operator and tell him that he's finished? 
Contractors are contractors but have no way of dealing in real time with the contractOR?

3) You keep referring to "employees". Hmmmm.... seems to me you have a dichotomy of terms in your lexicon.

4) "Just" a contractor? What!!! Contractors have their life's blood invested.

5) You "like what you do? You mean ruining people and telling them that they are "worthless"?

6) Oh, poor baby.... I used to work 80 hours per week when I was in the restaurant business for ten years keeping my place working so that my employees had a place to go to day in and out.

7) You "stuck it out"? You can get arrested for that..... even in Canada.

8) "Evolve and adapt"? Yeah, get used to standing in line at a food bank.

9) "Everybody with a pulse". Hmmmm, yeah, that's what Uber wants.... and hopefully that person with a pulse has money in the bank that has it to waste and put into your and Travis' coffers.

10) "Chased the money"? Oh, poor baby... now you're just chasing everybody else's money.... just like Travis. Something tells me that you actually ARE Travis.

11) Don't feel sorry for me or my "type". I have family money that I've been living on for the last 20 years. My parents left me a shit load of money but at my age, it's running a bit thin and god forbid I should outlive my money. LOL.

12) You 're an asshole. You can quote me on that.


----------



## DukeOfDallas

Actionjax said:


> Here you get paid per min regardless. I think the speed thing is a Taxi thing.


per minute pay to sit and wait on a passenger running errands is taking advantage of driver due to extremely low per minute earnings


----------



## Sly

DukeOfDallas said:


> per minute pay to sit and wait on a passenger running errands is taking advantage of driver due to extremely low per minute earnings


You want a fair wage go to work for Mears and then join a union. Contractual work doesn't suit you.


----------



## Uber-Doober

DukeOfDallas said:


> http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox...uld_decide_the_legal_fate_of_the_sharing.html
> 
> There are facets of the Uber biz model that suggest drivers are, in fact, employees. Above article is about Uber in court over driver status.


^^^
All they have to do in court as far as precedent is concerned is to refer to the case of Prime Time Shuttle who (When I was an owner/operator) was treating us as employees. 
The Class Action won, but we only got a max of something like $300.00 per settlement. 
Wasn't even worth my time to make the phone calls back to the law firm over the ten years that it took. 
Class Actions are complete bullshit.


----------



## DukeOfDallas

Sly said:


> You want a fair wage go to work for Mears and then join a union. Contractual work doesn't suit you.


*Are you suffering from trust fund syphilis?*


----------



## Actionjax

DukeOfDallas said:


> http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox...uld_decide_the_legal_fate_of_the_sharing.html
> 
> There are facets of the Uber biz model that suggest drivers are, in fact, employees. Above article is about Uber in court over driver status.


That has yet to be proven in a court of law. So until it happens and good luck with that, you are still a contractor.

It just makes great headlines.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Sly said:


> 2. you already get paid per minute when you are driving less than 14 mph.


^^^
Are you living in Lala land? 
Waiting is not the same as driving less than 14 mph.


----------



## DukeOfDallas

And most drivers would prefer to remain contractors if the position were profitable. All Uber has to do is acknowledge negative profit trips for drivers and make it right. Most of the driving pool is not out to "get" Uber, just want a fair shake. Rate cuts benefit Uber and Pax but are very costly to driver.

System is a balancing act, and right now things are off kilter. Need to adjust to ensure fair and equitable pay for drivers. Not that hard or that expensive to do.


----------



## Uber-Doober

Actionjax said:


> That has yet to be proven in a court of law. So until it happens and good luck with that, you are still a contractor.
> 
> It just makes great headlines.


^^^
Oh, yes it has been proven, but precedent has to be proven and referred to over and over again, unfortunately.
Uber will meet it's maker regarding the corporate/owner/operator relationship as it has been established in precedent in the nations' courts.

In Nevada, contractors are treated completely differently than Uber treats it's "Partners". 
Transport "Contractors" in Nevada are bound by the same laws as over the road contractors/contractees have to abide by, like documentation of hours driven, down time, off time, sleep time, you name it. 
No 16 hour days for Uber drivers. 
In fact, nothing over 10 hours on the clock according to State law.


----------



## DukeOfDallas

DukeOfDallas said:


> And most drivers would prefer to remain contractors if the position were profitable. All Uber has to do is acknowledge negative profit trips for drivers and make it right. Most of the driving pool is not out to "get" Uber, just want a fair shake. Rate cuts benefit Uber and Pax but are very costly to driver.
> 
> System is a balancing act, and right now things are off kilter. Need to adjust to ensure fair and equitable pay for drivers. Not that hard or that expensive to do.


If UBER proves inflexible it will go the way of Time Warner AOL. 
No one is immune.


----------



## scrurbscrud

DukeOfDallas said:


> http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox...uld_decide_the_legal_fate_of_the_sharing.html
> 
> There are facets of the Uber biz model that suggest drivers are, in fact, employees. Above article is about Uber in court over driver status.


Piss in the wind. Even if the drivers were determined to be employees they are NOT going to get any money. Travis will just bankrupt the company like he's had to do before.

Anyone who thinks they are going to get any significant retroactive monetary gain from class action lawsuits is a dolt, generally speaking.


----------



## scrurbscrud

DukeOfDallas said:


> *Are you suffering from trust fund syphilis?*


He's driving for 75 cents a mile and killing it. That ought to tell you all you need to know about his math skills. Will leave it at that.


----------



## scrurbscrud

DukeOfDallas said:


> per minute pay to sit and wait on a passenger running errands is taking advantage of driver due to extremely low per minute earnings


It's better than actually driving and losing money. Per minute pay sitting is the least of driver concerns. Drivers make much less by turning the wheels. The per minute pay just hammers home how shitty the whole pay scheme really is because IT'S EASY TO CALCULATE the shit for pay on a per minute basis.

Where drivers get into trouble is not being able to calculate that at any rate less than $1.40 a mile they make exactly ZERO.


----------



## Actionjax

Uber-Doober said:


> Cushy for my line of work.


Well good for you. Long as you enjoy it.


Uber-Doober said:


> So how can you have some thin lipped little chippy deal with an owner/operator and tell him that he's finished?
> Contractors are contractors but have no way of dealing in real time with the contractOR?


Is that a statement or a question. What are you trying to say? It's kind of jiberish



Uber-Doober said:


> You keep referring to "employees". Hmmmm.... seems to me you have a dichotomy of terms in your lexicon.


Again do you have a point here or just a rant?



Uber-Doober said:


> "Just" a contractor? What!!! Contractors have their life's blood invested.


Again so what if they have their life blood invested. They do that by choice. There is no security in that and it can be full of rewards in the right market.



Uber-Doober said:


> You "like what you do? You mean ruining people and telling them that they are "worthless"?


I don't recall telling people they are worthless. I said that the market will dictate their worth. No different than any industry. I don't think I am ruining anyone, you are giving me way more credit than I think I deserve. I just don't have that type of influence. (But I am sure I can find some classes on that, will look into it)



Uber-Doober said:


> Oh, poor baby.... I used to work 80 hours per week when I was in the restaurant business for ten years keeping my place working so that my employees had a place to go to day in and out.
> 
> 7) You "stuck it out"? You can get arrested for that..... even in Canada.
> 
> 8) "Evolve and adapt"? Yeah, get used to standing in line at a food bank.
> 
> 9) "Everybody with a pulse". Hmmmm, yeah, that's what Uber wants.... and hopefully that person with a pulse has money in the bank that has it to waste and put into your and Travis' coffers.
> 
> 10) "Chased the money"? Oh, poor baby... now you're just chasing everybody else's money.... just like Travis. Something tells me that you actually ARE Travis.


No need to go through these individually, they are just rants. You know my position. I know yours.



Uber-Doober said:


> Don't feel sorry for me or my "type". I have family money that I've been living on for the last 20 years. My parents left me a shit load of money but at my age, it's running a bit thin and god forbid I should outlive my money. LOL.


You must have made your parents very proud burning through their money. Some of us work for a living and work so our parents can spend every penny enjoying themselves. I told my parents long ago if they leave anything for me I will burn it. So they better spend it all for themselves and enjoy their life. I'm financially sound so I don't need to wait for others to support me.



Uber-Doober said:


> 12) You 're an asshole. You can quote me on that.


I'm ok with that assessment. Coming from the source of the comment it holds little to no weight on what I do or how I operate.


----------



## getFubered

Actionjax said:


> Glad you have it cushy. I work for a living and it's far from cushy. Most weeks for a corporate **** like me is 60 hours. But I am also paid well for the work that I do and I like what I do.
> 
> And fair treatment of employees is always paramount when they are employees. When they are contractors they get a fair assessment of the work done and if they don't like it then they can go see what the market will dictate for their services.
> 
> Remember you are not an employee with Uber. You are just a contractor.
> 
> You are right I use corporate speak. being 16 years with my company working my ass off, going to school part time to get a degree, climb the corporate ladder, all has paid off. But I had to work at it. I could have chased the money early on in my career and moved to another company like all my friends did, making 50% more per year. Only for that company to go bankrupt. I stuck it out because I knew what my market is worth and what the future held.
> 
> I suggest you ask yourself the question on what the future holds for the average driver. The writing is on the wall, you need to evolve and adapt.
> 
> Uber has relegated driving to an anyone with a pulse can do it and you don't need to be paid well to do it either. And guess what it is working. So your market worth is being eroded, you don't like it, but you can fight it like many other industries tried to buck change or you can try and evolve. Be better than Uber.
> 
> You say you know my type. Fact is I know your type as well. And I feel sorry for you I really do.


How do you always find a way to pat yourself on the back every post? This is uberpeople.net, nobody gives a **** what you do outside of Uber, especially your shitty bank job.


----------



## UberHammer

DukeOfDallas said:


> *ActionJackAss* and some other posters on here are really quite puzzling.


Ah... I see he must still spewing more of the same since I put him on ignore. Thanks for reminding me to keep him there!


----------



## Actionjax

getFubered said:


> How do you always find a way to pat yourself on the back every post? This is uberpeople.net, nobody gives a **** what you do outside of Uber, especially your shitty bank job.


Because I'm not a whinny little ***** who blames the rest of the world for my issues. I act on things. And I think you mean to say you don't give a ****. Fact is there are many more who do.


----------



## Actionjax

UberHammer said:


> Ah... I see he must still spewing more of the same since I put him on ignore. Thanks for reminding me to keep him there!


Ignorance is bliss after all


----------



## scrurbscrud

Actionjax said:


> Ignorance is bliss after all


If you followed the conversation Uberhammer and Michael are under the very mistaken premise that they can set their own fares higher with pax. Suuure you can. Good grief how stupid can drivers really be.

Poor reading skills on their part translates to 'I don't want to hear reality' so turn me off.

Nutz to both of 'em. On this count.


----------



## Sly

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Are you living in Lala land?
> Waiting is not the same as driving less than 14 mph.


Yes it is, it's driving 0 mph. You flunked the iq test.


----------



## Sly

DukeOfDallas said:


> And most drivers would prefer to remain contractors if the position were profitable. All Uber has to do is acknowledge negative profit trips for drivers and make it right. Most of the driving pool is not out to "get" Uber, just want a fair shake. Rate cuts benefit Uber and Pax but are very costly to driver.
> 
> System is a balancing act, and right now things are off kilter. Need to adjust to ensure fair and equitable pay for drivers. Not that hard or that expensive to do.


And most people would prefer to be millionaires, so ****ing what.
We do not live in a communist country where the people get to dictate what wages the company will pay.


----------



## Sly

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> Oh, yes it has been proven, but precedent has to be proven and referred to over and over again, unfortunately.
> Uber will meet it's maker regarding the corporate/owner/operator relationship as it has been established in precedent in the nations' courts.
> 
> In Nevada, contractors are treated completely differently than Uber treats it's "Partners".
> Transport "Contractors" in Nevada are bound by the same laws as over the road contractors/contractees have to abide by, like documentation of hours driven, down time, off time, sleep time, you name it.
> No 16 hour days for Uber drivers.
> In fact, nothing over 10 hours on the clock according to State law.


Glad I don't live in Nevada.
What the **** happened to living in the land of the free?


----------



## scrurbscrud

Sly said:


> And most people would prefer to be millionaires, so ****ing what.
> We do not live in a communist country where the people get to dictate what wages the company will pay.


YES! We as Americans have the right to drive for a loss damnit! And nobody has the right to tell me otherwise.

We also have the right to delude ourselves that we are actually making a profit when it's non-existent, damnit.


----------



## Sly

scrurbscrud said:


> YES! We as Americans have the right to drive for a loss damnit! And nobody has the right to tell me otherwise.
> 
> We also have the right to delude ourselves that we are actually making a profit when it's non-existent, damnit.


You have a right to not work for Uber if you think they aren't paying enough.
You do not have the right to force them to pay more.


----------



## scrurbscrud

Sly said:


> You have a right to not work for Uber if you think they aren't paying enough.
> You do not have the right to force them to pay more.


See previous. I would never claim anyone can't work for free or even at a loss. Testimony on why they're unemployed to start with maybe?


----------



## UberGirlPBC

Ahaha, awesome! I'm getting tired of trying with Uber in SoFlo. I had real good ratiings with UberX. Mostly women requested me. Once I started Select, mostly guys request me. Men don't rate often and more than half rate me low.

It is season here now and Palm Beach has few genuinely nice people. If I were out west I'd worry the women's ratings not the men. It is so bassackwards here. I think I am done trying and will try Lyft


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## DukeOfDallas

@ Sly I'm trying to understand ... what is your issue with driver complaint over negative net earnings on min trip fares? I'm not being sarcastic. Why are you so opposed to this adjustment? Thanks for your response.


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## SpringsUBER

If you drive 15 min to pick up thats on you bro... Count on the short trips for a good chance at 5* increases. 

Then you will make up for the longer surge fare ratings. 

Poor plan, screws with other drivers judgements. you need more drivers in that area if this is such a problem out there.


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## Yamariz

Anti-Uber said:


> We can take tips. Just say "oh, it wasn't necessary but thank you so much"


Oh I was told absolutely no tipping and they have threatened to shut me down.


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## elelegido

Sly said:


> We do not live in a communist country where the people get to dictate what wages the company will pay.


C'mon, Uber, start operations in Cuba. Glorious sunshine, beautiful women and... because it's a communist country, as a worker I get to tell you how much to pay me.

LOL


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## Guest

Yamariz said:


> Oh I was told absolutely no tipping and they have threatened to shut me down.


On Uber?


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