# Uber Suspends UberPOP In France Following Turmoils And Arrests



## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

http://techcrunch.com/2015/07/03/uber-stops-uberpop-in-france-following-turmoils-and-arrests/


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Often lost in the #UberHYPE is the Fact that Driving for UberPOP/UberX is Not a viable F/T job!


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## Sydney Uber (Apr 15, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> Often lost in the #UberHYPE is the Fact that Driving for UberPOP/UberX is Not a viable F/T job!
> 
> View attachment 9271


This is something I've thought about Chi1.

What good is a "new" industry whose workforce only barely makes a living, so much so, that rarely do they earn enough to be in a taxable earnings bracket.

Then tricky company setups allow profits to be siphoned offshore to tax havens.

And on top of that, the added competition sees established Taxi earnings fall below taxable thresholds with Government license fees, transaction taxes dropping because of the loss of Market share to UBER means fewer license sales at lower rates.

There is a lot UBER can PROMISE Governments with the eventual use of Robot cars, and accurate driver earnings data, but if UBER's business model simply sends drivers on downward earnings spiral - what good are they to a Taxation Department?


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Translated from French:*

*Uber announced the suspension of UberPop in France*
*http://mobile.lemonde.fr/economie/a...edium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#meter_toaster*

After a crazy week started Thursday, June 25 by a taxi strike punctuated by violence and marked by reference correctional two bosses Uber for Europe and France, the US giant throws in the towel in France. In an interview with _the World_ , Simphal Thibaud, CEO of Uber France, announced the _"suspension"_ of UberPop, this service that allows individuals to improvise taxi drivers with their cars every day. An about-face.Ignoring the many proclamations of illegality, the California company continued to deploy its service until justice bracket definitively. Uber, whose main activity is the transport car with driver (VTC), wants to blow the locks that hinder this emerging market.

*Why continue to offer the service in France UberPop while all the country's authorities ask you to stop this activity?*

"Basically, we defer to the Constitutional Council decision expected in September on the article of the law Thévenoud"
We have decided to suspend UberPop in France, from 20 o'clock that Friday night [July 3]. First to preserve the safety of drivers Uber, which has always been our priority. They were victims of violence in recent days. The second reason is that we want to position ourselves in a spirit of appeasement, dialogue with the authorities and show that we take our responsibilities. On the substance, we defer to the Constitutional Council decision expected in September on the article of the law Thévenoud [which organizes the competition taxis] for UberPop.

*This is the first time qu'Uber renounces the world to a service without being forced by the courts. Is this the sign of a shift in your strategy?*

No, we have already removed the UberX service Portland [United States]. The main factor here is not coercion but violence.

*The police action in recent days had she not already wiped activity UberPop?*

Not at all. Nearly 10,000 occasional drivers in France are on the UberPop platform, which 4000 were active last week. All this noise rather is advertising for the platform.

*What will happen to UberPop drivers?*

87% of drivers have UberPop another activity next. Their annual average income is 8,200 euros, which corresponds approximately to the annual costs of their vehicle. I want to thank them for their calm and their exemplary attitude despite the difficulties and violence. UberPop offered them a real opportunity to supplement their income, while the country is sorely lacking.We will help.

*Was it responsible for encouraging there another week to join UberPop affirming them that it was legally certain?*

It has always been responsible, unlike some actors who do not have clearly condemned the violence. Our priority now is to find a way to put these thousands of drivers on the road. It is vital for them and their families. Obstacle We will help them in the race to become VTC [transport vehicle with driver]. Because the facts show that the regulation is absolutely not.

*The Thévenoud law allows it not the development of the VTC market, the differentiating both taxis and illegal services such UberPop?*

It's the opposite. This law marked a halt to the development of this new economic sector. Since 1 st January, only 215 new cards VTC were granted in France while at the same time, 25,000 people contacted Uber to become VTC driver.Thousands have their complete file, are training and waiting in vain for their card. We will make proposals to the drivers and the government to get out of this situation. Over 400,000 passengers use UberPop because it brings a new service, reliable and safe. In the growing sector of urban mobility, where more and more people give up their car, there is a complementarity rather than competition between the different modes of transport.

*What measures do you propose to the government?*

Simple adjustments that would bring, for example, the French system to that of London where there are 80 000 and 30 000 taxis VTC [in Paris, there are 17,700 taxis and estimates the number of VTC 10 000]. It would be enough to no longer require training in hours, but skills validated by an exam. Currently, the process to become VTC takes six months and requires 250 hours of training when we have the right to be light aircraft pilot in 20 hours! This training costs up to 6,000 euros. No one in the population we are talking about has such a sum. The law also imposes a financial capacity of 1 500 euros, while speaking of young suburbs, far from employment ... Third degree VTC allow for less expensive cars, lighter, cleaner. For nearly two years we make these proposals. We also have proposals that taxis are more in line with their time.

*After you have behaved as a cowboy, how do you be credible to propose measures to taxis?*

The cowboys, these are people who lynch people on public roads. Fortunately companies to innovate! We believe that there should be maximum freedom for taxi drivers so they can choose the platform they want to work with. The law prohibits them to be as VTC. However, the offer is more open and allows competition between platforms, drivers will gain more. This happens like that in all the markets where we are, but not in France.

*You risk a prison sentence. Have you considered leaving Uber?*

I'm not about to leave Uber! It is probably the company that has grown the fastest in the history of mankind. There are still great things to do. This business is being debated everywhere, it comes from the success and power of an idea.


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> *Translated from French:*
> 
> *Uber announced the suspension of UberPop in France*
> *http://mobile.lemonde.fr/economie/a...edium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#meter_toaster*
> ...


This guy fits the UberMold for sure. Yes, I do hope Uber considers driver safety; however chi1cabby do you think UberPop was suspended as a driver safety priority OR as a Keep-My-CEO-Butt-Outta-Jail-in-September priority? My money is on the later. If UberPop would have continued its defiance after CEOs were taken into custody, THAT would have been a direct challenge to government and more likely to produce an outcome of jail sentences!


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

UberRidiculous said:


> chi1cabby do you think UberPop was suspended as a driver safety priority OR as a *Keep-My-CEO-Butt-Outta-Jail-in-September priority*?


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

Sydney Uber said:


> This is something I've thought about Chi1.
> 
> What good is a "new" industry whose workforce only barely makes a living, so much so, that rarely do they earn enough to be in a taxable earnings bracket.
> 
> ...


Sydney Uber it's worse than that almost everywhere in the USA for UberX now. I hear fares were reasonable once but now I believe without surge pricing, UberX drivers here are just borrowing money from their vehicle equity. The CEO in this article admits exactly this and that the same was true for UberPop in France. Uber did a lot of misleading advertising about what drivers can make. Then Uber never discloses to drivers possible industry pitfalls or government expectations. Uber is a bully, a con, and a thief. NOW in my area advertising has changed. I think in response to a lot of government reviews right now. First Uber advertised high $earnings $1300/week. THEN recently changed to $600/week. NOW NO $Amount advertised but instead radio ad says MAKE LIFE CHANGING MONEY! YES YOUR LIFE CHANGES WHEN YOU DRIVE YOUR ONLY CAR INTO THE CRAPPER FOR UBER POCKET CHANGE!!!!!!!
This is the perverbial middle finger Uber continues to give its drivers here. When challenged in courts for falsely advertising 'tips were included' and losing said court case, what does Uber do? Uber changes wording to 'no need to tip'. Uber could have added an optional tip function but nooooooo, instead per UberUsual, Uber said.... LET THE DRIVERS EAT CAKE! And you know what happened to someone who said that! They got her. And they're gonna get Uber!


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## Sydney Uber (Apr 15, 2014)

That's what I've always been saying - UBERX and its Investors will go to water if UBER managers started getting their arses dragged off to jail. 

Drivers have always been canon fodder to both the Cab & Rideshare industry. Whilst they risked enforcement action, falling takings and insurance fraud, this was totally acceptable. It's despicable!


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

AND I hear Uber is having a difficult time finding a new Financial officer. The USA LOVES putting white collar financial guys who 'COOK-THE-BOOKS' in jail for LONG LONG periods of time. 
SO do you think that CFO position isn't filled yet because Uber is picky? OR because Uber can't find someone qualified to play their UberGames in that position?


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## Sydney Uber (Apr 15, 2014)

UberRidiculous said:


> Sydney Uber it's worse than that almost everywhere in the USA for UberX now. I hear fares were reasonable once but now I believe without surge pricing, UberX drivers here are just borrowing money from their vehicle equity. The CEO in this article admits exactly this and that the same was true for UberPop in France. Uber did a lot of misleading advertising about what drivers can make. Then Uber never discloses to drivers possible industry pitfalls or government expectations. Uber is a bully, a con, and a thief. NOW in my area advertising has changed. I think in response to a lot of government reviews right now. First Uber advertised high $earnings $1300/week. THEN recently changed to $600/week. NOW NO $Amount advertised but instead radio ad says MAKE LIFE CHANGING MONEY! YES YOUR LIFE CHANGES WHEN YOU DRIVE YOUR ONLY CAR INTO THE CRAPPER FOR UBER POCKET CHANGE!!!!!!!
> This is the perverbial middle finger Uber continues to give its drivers here. When challenged in courts for falsely advertising 'tips were included' and losing said court case, what does Uber do? Uber changes wording to 'no need to tip'. Uber could have added an optional tip function but nooooooo, instead per UberUsual, Uber said.... LET THE DRIVERS EAT CAKE! And you know what happened to someone who said that! They got her. And they're gonna get Uber!


What really saddens me, is how prepared this generation of clever young business graduates have grasped the UBER business model of deceit, deception and lawless promotion "because they can".

In the vast majority of cases, the UBER spin and lies net people down on their luck, or with few other earning opportunities. But these fresh-faced graduates continue the on-boarding lies that is part of the promise.

I couldn't do to my enemies, yet these young folk have been recruited to do the devil's work, and do it wonderfully at great cost to the concept of truth and fairness in business.

How do they sleep at night?


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

Sydney Uber said:


> What really saddens me, is how prepared this generation of clever young business graduates have grasped the UBER business model of deceit, deception and lawless promotion "because they can".
> 
> In the vast majority of cases, the UBER spin and lies net people down on their luck, or with few other earning opportunities. But these fresh-faced graduates continue the on-boarding lies that is part of the promise.
> 
> ...


They sleep at night very well on pillows full of cash.

I read a few years ago, on another forum completely unrelated, someone in another country commented that Americans worship a God of Mammon. I had to look that up. They were. .. and they ARE right! The almighty dollar rules in America. America needs to wake up. Our middle class is being disintegrated. There's no magic wand making our middle class disappear. It's more of a slow death. Meanwhile our children are being sold this bill of American Exceptionalism that THEY TOO can be the next OPRAH or Michael Jordan if only they work hard enough. AND if they aren't, then shame on them, for not working hard enough. It's really disgusting.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Uber blames French woes on poor communication, but it has nothing to do with poor communication*
*http://venturebeat.com/2015/07/03/u...it-has-nothing-to-do-with-poor-communication/*


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## arto71 (Sep 20, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> *Uber blames French woes on poor communication, but it has nothing to do with poor communication*
> *http://venturebeat.com/2015/07/03/u...it-has-nothing-to-do-with-poor-communication/*


"As well as the income it has generated for 10,000 drivers."
And how many of these 10,000 drivers went out and bought a cars for ubering only?


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

UberRidiculous said:


> They sleep at night very well on pillows full of cash.
> 
> I read a few years ago, on another forum completely unrelated, someone in another country commented that Americans worship a God of Mammon. I had to look that up. They were. .. and they ARE right! The almighty dollar rules in America. America needs to wake up. Our middle class is being disintegrated. There's no magic wand making our middle class disappear. It's more of a slow death. Meanwhile our children are being sold this bill of American Exceptionalism that THEY TOO can be the next OPRAH or Michael Jordan if only they work hard enough. AND if they aren't, then shame on them, for not working hard enough. It's really disgusting.


Too bad I can only give one like, this post deserves thousands of "likes".


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> *Uber blames French woes on poor communication, but it has nothing to do with poor communication*
> *http://venturebeat.com/2015/07/03/u...it-has-nothing-to-do-with-poor-communication/*


KInd of funny to read that title concerning poor communication. The French are rather precise with their language, quite skilled at expressing themselves with a high degree of accuracy. That idea is a bit of a joke.


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## Hackenstein (Dec 16, 2014)

[email protected] 'poor communication.'

France: Stop operating, you're breaking the law

Uber: No. Make us.

France. Ok, done.


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

Hackenstein said:


> [email protected] 'poor communication.'
> 
> France: Stop operating, you're breaking the law
> 
> ...


Part of communicating effectively is being a good listener. Somebody wasn't listening. Pay heed. 
Ça suffit eh?


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## Huberis (Mar 15, 2015)

I have heard mention on here of the power of the French taxi lobby. I wouldn't know the truth behind that one way or another specifically. More important in my mind is that in France, Labor has a voice, is organized and can force an issue to direct attention in their direction. People in general have a far more developed vocabulary for discussing labor issues. I promise you that. It is a much bigger issue topic in Europe than here in the States. 

In this country, there is little interest in the world and work of a laborer. Not in a real sense. In the opinion of the public here, that the industry is being turned into a part time affair - so be it. Uber found a bit of resistance. Good for them.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Germany faces probe over Uber ban*
*https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...xOpSg9_3LPaff24MA&sig2=AlPCl46LZ8XGbbjqRDPcQg*
_Germany's ban on some Uber services faces a probe by the European Commission, as the US ride-hailing company called on Brussels to help in its fight with national regulators on the continent._

_Uber had complained that Germany's laws on taxis and rules on competition violated EU law. The commission last week took the company's complaint to the next stage by demanding that Germany explain its rules, according to a letter seen by the Financial Times._

_Many of Uber's services have been outlawed in Germany, where rules such as a ban on car-hire services accepting a new order while a passenger is in the vehicle, severely hamper Uber's ability to match drivers with customers._

_German courts have alsodemanded the company must hold a taxi operator's licence, despite Uber arguing that itdoes not itself providetransportation. The company also believes these rules and others violate EU law._

*The group has launched a similar complaint in France*_, where it has faced violent protests from local taxi drivers who have called on the app to be made illegal. Two of its executives were arrested last month and ordered to stand trial in September, and thecompany temporarily suspended its UberPop ride-sharing service in the country._

_Uber's expansion into Europe has been marked by struggles with regulators, with its services limited or banned in a number of European markets. Drivers in these countries often face fines or see their carsimpounded._

_Increasingly, the company has pinned its hopes on regulation from Brussels, rather than engaging in a protracted struggle with individualregulators across the EU's 28 countries._

_A judge in Spain - which has an outright ban on Uber - is in the process of referring to the European Court of Justice, the EU's highest court, the question of whether Uber is a transportation company or a digital service. If the court finds that it is a digital serviceprovider it will be much harder for national regulators to curb its activities._

_Germany has 10 weeks to respond to the letter from the commission. *A deadline for France to respond to its probe expired earlier this week.*_

_Uber said: "We're a digital intermediary yet transportation laws dating back to the '50s are being applied in Germany. Such outdated regulations are being used to protect established players from competition,rather than benefit many more people."_

_Despite Uber's protracted legal problems in Europe, the ride-sharing company has become one of the most valuable privately owned companies in the world, with a recent fundraising round giving it a reported valuation of $50bn._

_The commission did not respond to a request for comment._


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## Berliner (Oct 29, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> _German courts have alsodemanded the company must hold a taxi operator's licence, despite Uber arguing that itdoes not itself providetransportation. The company also believes these rules and others violate EU law._


Sorry, but this is wrong.

They must hold a *Limo* operator´s licence for UberBlack and have to own at minimum one car, local law.

For dispatching UberX or UberPop they have to guarantee that the drivers have cdl, the cars are licensed, properly insured and to make sure that the car is going back to the base after operating.

To dispatch cabs, like UberTaxi, they only need a businesslicence, cost maybe € 60,00.

To operate a own cab you need a licence. The costs in the majorcities like Berlin or Hamburg are less than an fuel, because there is no cap of taxis and no "Medallion-System".

Hope it helps.

Kind regards from the other side of the pool.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*#UberPOP | French court upholds ban on Uber's service using non-professional drivers*
*http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSL5N11S3S220150922*


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## UberNorthStar (Jul 7, 2015)

*Good for the French for not caving in!*

*Viva LA France!!*


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## Berliner (Oct 29, 2014)

Good timing from my neighbours.

In eight days, 09/30/15, Uber will face trial in France.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/06/30/us-france-uber-idUSKCN0PA18Y20150630

There is a good chance that Thibaud Simphal, manager of Uber France, and Pierre-Dimitri Gore-Coty, general manager of Uber Western Europe, will visit a jail from the inside.

The French don´t gamble with their labor laws. Their worker strikes are legendary.


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## Ca$h4 (Aug 12, 2015)

The game isn't over yet. Uber is trying to pre-empt all European National Laws (France, Italy, Germany, etc.) by using the European Court of Justice (ECJ).

*https://www.theparliamentmagazine.eu/articles/news/eu-commission-launches-study-uber*


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## Berliner (Oct 29, 2014)

Ca$h4 said:


> The game isn't over yet. Uber is trying to pre-empt all European National Laws (France, Italy, Germany, etc.) by using the European Court of Justice (ECJ).
> 
> *https://www.theparliamentmagazine.eu/articles/news/eu-commission-launches-study-uber*


They can try what ever they want. But there are three elephants in the room: CDL, insurance and license. Period. We are not in Somalia or Papua-Neuguinea. We have a liability of 7.500.000,00 €, EU-wide. It´s up to you to convert this in US$. and check your premium


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## Ca$h4 (Aug 12, 2015)

Berliner said:


> They can try what ever they want. But there are three elephants in the room: CDL, insurance and license. Period. We are not in Somalia or Papua-Neuguinea. We have a liability of 7.500.000,00 €, EU-wide. It´s up to you to convert this in US$. and check your premium


You multiply Euros by 1.1 (today's exchange rate) to get USA dollar equivalent. So, 7.5 million euros is 7.5 times 1.1 equals $8.25 million USA dollars. With today exchange rate 7.5 million Euros is $8.25 million USA dollars.


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## My Cabby (Dec 2, 2014)

*After you have behaved as a cowboy, how do you be credible to propose measures to taxis?*

The cowboys, these are people who lynch people on public roads. Fortunately companies to innovate! _*We believe that there should be maximum freedom for taxi drivers so they can choose the platform they want to work with*_. The law prohibits them to be as VTC. However, the offer is more open and allows competition between platforms, drivers will gain more. This happens like that in all the markets where we are, but not in France.

Uber Taxi service in France but not Taxi service in US? lol


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## Berliner (Oct 29, 2014)

Update: Uber France chief Thibaud Simphal and Pierre-Dimitri Gore-Coty, general manager for Western Europe, *could be sent to prison for up to five years* and fined as much as 300,000 euros if found guilty of deceptive commercial practices and other charges.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/uber-execs-on-trial-in-france-face-two-years-jail-time-125432364.html


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## Berliner (Oct 29, 2014)

The next:

*Uber to suspend unlicensed UberPOP service in Brussels*

http://ca.reuters.com/article/idCAKCN0S71VQ20151013

I guess Europe isn`t a good place for cowboys.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

*Uber drops Uberpop taxi service in the Netherlands*
*http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2015/11/uber-drops-uberpop-taxi-service-in-the-netherlands/*


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