# No Cleaning Fee for a Little Puke



## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

Drove these folks home after the bars let out. Broke my rule and went to McDonald's. While in line, they started yelling out the window at the people ordering in front of us. One of the girls in the back leans out the window and screams, "The South will rise again!" to a car full of black people with New York tags. I told her, "Don't do that!"

Then, a while later, I hear what no driver wants to hear, "Open the door!" She pukes out the car door. Gets a few chunks on the lip of the door, and on the seat and the door handle. Not really that big of a deal, but I did log off and go straight home and clean it up. I think I deserve a little compensation for cleaning up bodily fluids (and throwing my towels away afterward.)

You would think the bastards would have offered a tip because they were so worried about a cleaning fee. They didn't. So I submitted it to uber, and they're rejecting it, calling it just "a little clean up" and "normal wear and tear."

All I got off that ride was 17 ****ing dollars. (And maybe a hit put on my car.)

It's difficult to photograph in the dark, but I'll include the pics. Here's the email:
*

me*

Sep 26, 23:43

While in line at McDonald's, one of the passengers puked outside the car. Some got on the floor, door, and seat. I logged off to clean and deodorize.

TRIP #####

Attachment(s)

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On Sep 27, 2015, at 9:30 AM, S (Uber Partner Support) <[email protected]> wrote:










##- Please type your reply above this line -##
Your request has been updated. To add additional comments, reply to this email.

*S* (Uber)

Sep 27, 06:30

Hi,

Thanks for writing in and bringing this to our attention. I am so sorry to see that your rider was not respectful of you or your vehicle on this trip.

Facilitating a comfortable and respectful environment for both riders and drivers is a top priority for us and I will follow up appropriately with your rider here.

Sometimes, the unfortunate nature of this industry is that riders sometimes leave behind a little wear and tear or mess to clean up. That said, I'm afraid the cleaning and damage fees we facilitate are reserved for significant messes directly attributable to the rider on a given trip.

Again, I understand the frustration here. I'm more than happy to address any other questions or concerns you have.

Best Regards,

*S*
help.uber.com

--------------------------------

*ME*

S,

"A little wear and tear or mess to clean up" is fine. I expect that. I vacuum up sand. I pick up garbage. No problem. However, I did NOT sign up to handle BODILY FLUIDS! Can you see where there are chunks on the lip of the door? Can you see the wet vomit around the door handle and on the seat? I'm not asking for $250, but I do believe this is above and beyond what is normally expected, as I did have to log off to properly clean bodily fluids and deodorize my car. I also asked them directly before they got in if anyone was going to puke. They all said no, and they were well aware of the fees if they did.

Please escalate.

Thank you,

Sent from my iPhone









Chunks where the flash hit^









See the fluid around the door handle and arm rest^


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

JaxBeachDriver said:


> Drove these folks home after the bars let out. Broke my rule and went to McDonald's. While in line, they started yelling out the window at the people ordering in front of us. One of the girls in the back leans out the window and screams, "The South will rise again!" to a car full of black people with New York tags. I told her, "Don't do that!"
> 
> Then, a while later, I hear what no driver wants to hear, "Open the door!" She pukes out the car door. Gets a few chunks on the lip of the door, and on the seat and the door handle. Not really that big of a deal, but I did log off and go straight home and clean it up. I think I deserve a little compensation for cleaning up bodily fluids (and throwing my towels away afterward.)
> 
> ...


Bullshit! Remind Uber you are an IC. Uber is not your employer. As an IC, you are charging the pax a cleaning fee. Ask Uber CSR if they want to speak to your attorney or charge the pax the cleaning fee!


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## Jedi Driver (Aug 23, 2015)

I'll have to remember that line--"please escalate" in my emails to Guber. Hope you get some compensation for this...


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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

I will email the Uber Lawsuit attorneys too. This is one more piece of evidence jurors should hear in the Employee v IC lawsuit. Dear jury, if drivers were really independent contractors, do you agree that drivers should be able to determine when & what to charge pax for damage to their vehicles?


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

Uber is the e-Bay of the transportation business.

FeePay has made it brutal on the sellers, because it can. If you try to sell on any other auction site, you have far fewer customers. FeePay has the customers, so they can shaft the sellers and not use any Vaseline, even.

SCREWber is the same. SCREWber has the customers, so if you go anywhere else, you do not have as many passengers. SCREWBer can shaft you any way that it likes and not use any Vaseline, even.

Now, even if you send in the photographs, if the user denies that he dun did the deed, you get SCREWbered: NO COMPENSATION FOR YOU.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

Got an email back:

*Shay* (Uber)

Sep 27, 08:12

Hi,

This was already passed along to me for further help. I want to commend you on the professionalism you've displayed in handling this incident. I hate to be the bearer of bad news but unfortunately, pictures are a main requirement in the processing of cleaning fees. We trust our partners, but protocol states that we MUST have evidence of the issue. The photos provided does not capture the incident described as vomit. The photo captures a few drops of liquid.

If all the vital information we have is accurate, we do reimburse you for your loss. However, we cannot go and charge the rider if there is no physical basis for our charges. I hope you understand, and I hope this gives you a better knowledge of the process for cleaning fees should this issue arise again in the future.

If there is any related issue I can help with, please let me know. We truly appreciate your patience and hard work and we look forward to continuing a successful partnership with you.

Best,


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

UberRidiculous said:


> I will email the Uber Lawsuit attorneys too. This is one more piece of evidence jurors should hear in the Employee v IC lawsuit. Dear jury, if drivers were really independent contractors, do you agree that drivers should be able to determine when & what to charge pax for damage to their vehicles?


Good point. I added that to my rant.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

**** 'em. I'm a black car driver. I'm fully legal without them. I will just have to work 2x as hard to promote my own business. Ppl ****ing love shitty ass ****ing uber. But I worked 8 hours last night at the beaches and made about $40 after uber fees, before expenses. Not even worth my ****ing time at this point. Complete over saturation. I won't keep *****ing Going around in circles, I'm just going to move on. Even at 4am, there are 3 black cars at beach, where there used to be none.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

UberRidiculous said:


> Bullshit! Remind Uber you are an IC. Uber is not your employer. As an IC, you are charging the pax a cleaning fee. Ask Uber CSR if they want to speak to your attorney or charge the pax the cleaning fee!


I added that to my rant.


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## phillipzx3 (May 26, 2015)

UberRidiculous said:


> Bullshit! Remind Uber you are an IC. Uber is not your employer. As an IC, you are charging the pax a cleaning fee. Ask Uber CSR if they want to speak to your attorney or charge the pax the cleaning fee!


As an "Independent Contractor," try turning your Uber/Lyft app off and see how well your "rideshare" business does.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

phillipzx3 said:


> As an "Independent Contractor," try turning your Uber/Lyft app off and see how well your "rideshare" business does.


I'm not rideshare. Uber is not rideshare. Uber is a ********* company, masquerading as new technology. I am a fully licensed driver. So **** uber. I'll make it on my own, or I'll sell the car and move on to other ventures. At this point, I'd make more at McDonald's.

But I think that your post further proves the point that we are not truly independent contractors.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)




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## UberRidiculous (May 19, 2015)

phillipzx3 said:


> As an "Independent Contractor," try turning your Uber/Lyft app off and see how well your "rideshare" business does.


phillipzx3 you're a funny guy. I turned Uber Off 6 wks after starting. HELLOOOO because F- Uber was NOT profitable. Not in my market at .75 cents/mile.



JaxBeachDriver said:


> I'm not rideshare. Uber is not rideshare. Uber is a ********* company, masquerading as new technology. I am a fully licensed driver. So **** uber. I'll make it on my own, or I'll sell the car and move on to other ventures. At this point, I'd make more at McDonald's.
> 
> But I think that your post further proves the point that we are not truly independent contractors.


Amen!


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## Jim Ng (Aug 16, 2015)

Go to a gag shop & buy some fake vomit. Keep it handy for the next time.


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## elelegido (Sep 24, 2014)

A good reason to get an in-car video camera.

If puke denial is going to be a regular thing with Uber, it may be worth preserving the stomach contents and sending them in to Uber's HQ - they can conduct their own analysis as to whether it is harmless liquid or not.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

elelegido said:


> A good reason to get an in-car video camera.
> 
> If puke denial is going to be a regular thing with Uber, it may be worth preserving the stomach contents and sending them in to Uber's HQ - they can conduct their own analysis as to whether it is harmless liquid or not.


Exactly! I'm sorry that I don't have a bodily fluid test kit in which to demonstrate that the liquid shown in the photos are, in fact, bodily fluid.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

I'm now on UberIgnore.


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## GrandpaD (Jul 29, 2015)

A portion of a can of vegetable soup does a great job of photo enhancement.


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## Saleem hatoum (Jun 1, 2015)

If there is puke on the side of the car Uber will pay. Few weeks ago this guy had tobacco and he lower the window and spit few particles touched my car. I took the photos sent to Uber and they verified witht eh Rider that if he threw and charged him $100.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

Saleem hatoum said:


> If there is puke on the side of the car Uber will pay. Few weeks ago this guy had tobacco and he lower the window and spit few particles touched my car. I took the photos sent to Uber and they verified witht eh Rider that if he threw and charged him $100.


They would NOT grant me a fee, so **** them. I quit today. I had them delete my account completely. No temptation to go back.


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## Drivingubernlyft (Jun 5, 2015)

Honestly that's not enough to warrant a reimbursement. You could clean that with a wet wipe. I have had puke all over the interior of my car where I the detailer had to use a steamer and wet/dry vac!


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## Major League (Oct 16, 2014)

Drivingubernlyft said:


> Honestly that's not enough to warrant a reimbursement. You could clean that with a wet wipe. I have had puke all over the interior of my car where I the detailer had to use a steamer and wet/dry vac!


Have to disagree. Puke is considered bio hazard. Needs to be cleaned professionally.


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## thehappytypist (Oct 9, 2014)

The major issue is that it doesn't definitively look like vomit. One thing we have to keep in mind with cleaning fees is justifying the charge to the rider and if the pics can't do that, we can't pay out. Something like that is difficult because I know that some vom isn't chunky (lol we call it chunky goodness) and some is clear, depending on the stomach contents or lack thereof. I tend to be a little...soft on cleaning fees.


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## Drivingubernlyft (Jun 5, 2015)

Major League said:


> Have to disagree. Puke is considered bio hazard. Needs to be cleaned professionally.


Actually for puke to be biohazard there would have to be visible amounts of blood. Otherwise it's not considered biohazard and you don't need a professional cleaning or epa license. A wet wipe will suffice.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

Drivingubernlyft said:


> Honestly that's not enough to warrant a reimbursement. You could clean that with a wet wipe. I have had puke all over the interior of my car where I the detailer had to use a steamer and wet/dry vac!


Right. That would warrant a full cleaning fee. I wasn't asking for a $250 fee. But cleaning bodily fluids isn't my job.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

Doesn't matter. Pax complain about the stupidest ****ing thing, and uber pays out. Reimburses them for the ride. Gives them ride credit. I'm talking for the stupidest thing. But as much as I have driven, you'd think someone along the way could have done something. Uber could have eaten their fee for that one ride or whatever.

I have only ever asked for 1 other cleaning fee, and it was just a $50 fee. This, I would've been happy with $20 or whatever, just for the hassle.

Just goes to show that they do not care about drivers. Every one of you is a dime a dozen. Pax is who they want to please.


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## Drivingubernlyft (Jun 5, 2015)

JaxBeachDriver said:


> Doesn't matter. Pax complain about the stupidest ****ing thing, and uber pays out. Reimburses them for the ride. Gives them ride credit. I'm talking for the stupidest thing. But as much as I have driven, you'd think someone along the way could have done something. Uber could have eaten their fee for that one ride or whatever.
> 
> I have only ever asked for 1 other cleaning fee, and it was just a $50 fee. This, I would've been happy with $20 or whatever, just for the hassle.
> 
> Just goes to show that they do not care about drivers. Every one of you is a dime a dozen. Pax is who they want to please.


I can understand that.


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## thehappytypist (Oct 9, 2014)

JaxBeachDriver said:


> Doesn't matter. Pax complain about the stupidest ****ing thing, and uber pays out. Reimburses them for the ride. Gives them ride credit. I'm talking for the stupidest thing. But as much as I have driven, you'd think someone along the way could have done something. Uber could have eaten their fee for that one ride or whatever.
> 
> I have only ever asked for 1 other cleaning fee, and it was just a $50 fee. This, I would've been happy with $20 or whatever, just for the hassle.
> 
> Just goes to show that they do not care about drivers. Every one of you is a dime a dozen. Pax is who they want to please.


Although a majority of people on the advanced team are on our way out, we don't want to have a bad record here or to get fired for misconduct of some kind, which would put our unemployment benefits at risk. You may not care about that but it does mean we won't be going rogue just because we're pissed about being yanked around, and giving out cleaning fees that would be considered unwarranted is a huge no-no. The rider disputes it, it gets refunded for the rider but not the driver, Uber eats the fee and that CSR gets reported.

Uber doesn't care about riders or drivers, they care about money.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

thehappytypist said:


> Although a majority of people on the advanced team are on our way out, we don't want to have a bad record here or to get fired for misconduct of some kind, which would put our unemployment benefits at risk. You may not care about that but it does mean we won't be going rogue just because we're pissed about being yanked around, and giving out cleaning fees that would be considered unwarranted is a huge no-no. The rider disputes it, it gets refunded for the rider but not the driver, Uber eats the fee and that CSR gets reported.
> 
> Uber doesn't care about riders or drivers, they care about money.


It's bullshit policy, is what I'm saying. There's no driver retention, but plenty of passenger retention measures.

When did I suggest that CSRs go rogue? When I asked that they delete all of my accounts, it went all the way to the d-bag (having had encounters with him before) in charge of Florida. If anybody along the way cared about driver retention, they could have done something.

Unbelievable to me how many people are willing to accept and defend just about anything in the name of business. As if money is the only thing that matters in our lives. Yes, businesses are there to make money, but businesses are run by people, and ethics and morals still exist. It's a sad state of humanity that we accept almost anything because "it's business."

This company does nothing to restrict dangerous practices. It's illegal here to work more than 12 hours without a 6 hour break in between shifts. Uber doesn't even encourage drivers to log off. Instead, a notice pops up encouraging you to stay logged in, no matter how many hours you've worked. You can stay logged in for 24 hours -- I'm not the only one to have tried it. Uber Jax logged over 100 hours in a week, and Uber's weekly email still said "if you worked 3 more hours, you would have made..."

They keep cutting rates because they know they can find drivers stupid or desperate enough to work for nothing. These people assume great risk, and uber assures them that "we've got your back 100%," but when a driver is assaulted or harmed while on the platform, what does uber do for that driver? When a driver's insurance drops him/her, what does uber do for that driver?


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## thehappytypist (Oct 9, 2014)

JaxBeachDriver said:


> It's bullshit policy, is what I'm saying. There's no driver retention, but plenty of passenger retention measures.
> 
> When did I suggest that CSRs go rogue? When I asked that they delete all of my accounts, it went all the way to the d-bag (having had encounters with him before) in charge of Florida. If anybody along the way cared about driver retention, they could have done something.
> 
> ...


By go rogue I meant giving out money for a cleaning fee that wouldn't stand up to a rider dispute. When we refund a cleaning fee to a rider, we don't take back the driver's payment so Uber eats the cost. They don't like that. Mainly I'm saying I can see why they declined the cleaning fee but I don't think it's far fetched to pay it out at $50 or so. That's going to depend on the CSR you get, some are more strict than others. They trust our judgment enough to hand out hundreds of dollars yet they get rid of us. Silly Uber. I'm going to have a cleaning fee guide up on the blog soon-ish that will have comprehensive info instead of the bits and pieces support gives out. I was hoping to have it yesterday but that didn't quite happen.

They claim that you're independent contractors so that employment laws don't apply. Those types of limitations tend to be for employees only, ime, but I could be wrong. I'm not up on labor laws everywhere. They just cover their ears and go LA LA LA INDEPENDENT CONTRACTORRRRRS when any of those little details come up.


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## HOUTXRon (Aug 23, 2015)

JaxBeachDriver said:


> Drove these folks home after the bars let out. Broke my rule and went to McDonald's. While in line, they started yelling out the window at the people ordering in front of us. One of the girls in the back leans out the window and screams, "The South will rise again!" to a car full of black people with New York tags. I told her, "Don't do that!"
> 
> Then, a while later, I hear what no driver wants to hear, "Open the door!" She pukes out the car door. Gets a few chunks on the lip of the door, and on the seat and the door handle. Not really that big of a deal, but I did log off and go straight home and clean it up. I think I deserve a little compensation for cleaning up bodily fluids (and throwing my towels away afterward.)
> 
> ...


Thanks for sharing the detailed pictures with us.

Do not clean anything before taking the pictures. Once you have taken the pics, submit right away then start cleaning like crazy.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

HOUTXRon said:


> Thanks for sharing the detailed pictures with us.
> 
> Do not clean anything before taking the pictures. Once you have taken the pics, submit right away then start cleaning like crazy.


Doesn't matter


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## Dan Dixon (Jul 10, 2015)

thehappytypist said:


> By go rogue I meant giving out money for a cleaning fee that wouldn't stand up to a rider dispute. When we refund a cleaning fee to a rider, we don't take back the driver's payment so Uber eats the cost. They don't like that. Mainly I'm saying I can see why they declined the cleaning fee but I don't think it's far fetched to pay it out at $50 or so. That's going to depend on the CSR you get, some are more strict than others. They trust our judgment enough to hand out hundreds of dollars yet they get rid of us. Silly Uber. I'm going to have a cleaning fee guide up on the blog soon-ish that will have comprehensive info instead of the bits and pieces support gives out. I was hoping to have it yesterday but that didn't quite happen.
> 
> They claim that you're independent contractors so that employment laws don't apply. Those types of limitations tend to be for employees only, ime, but I could be wrong. I'm not up on labor laws everywhere. They just cover their ears and go LA LA LA INDEPENDENT CONTRACTORRRRRS when any of those little details come up.


Just for your information, Lyft will log out a driver that has been on the app for 10 hours straight, and will not allow them to log on for 6 hours after that. 
You are correct that the labor laws don't apply, but DOT regulations do.


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## thehappytypist (Oct 9, 2014)

Dan Dixon said:


> Just for your information, Lyft will log out a driver that has been on the app for 10 hours straight, and will not allow them to log on for 6 hours after that.
> You are correct that the labor laws don't apply, but DOT regulations do.


Quite true. I try not to spout off about any laws except for NYC stuff because I have no clue. lol


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## Muki (Oct 15, 2015)

I can see where both driver and Uber are coming from here. If someone pukes in your car, cleaning even a small amount is disgusting and feels worthy of compensation. But the Uber CSR can't really see much in the photo and doesn't know if the rider is exaggerating or lying and has to make a hard call on what to do. If he now charges the pax's credit card, what if the pax denies it and says the driver is lying. Then it's a huge mess to have to mediate.

What really pisses me off though is that someone can puke in your car and not even hand you an extra tip just to say sorry. While I've met some really nice people Ubering, hearing stories like this makes me start to hate people. If I did that in someone's car, I'd tell him to stop at a store and I'd buy cleaning agent and rags and clean the mess spotless. I'd then give him $50 at least for the trouble and hope that he will not report it to Uber.


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## ColdRider (Oct 19, 2015)

Lol. Looks like drops of water.


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## Dan Dixon (Jul 10, 2015)

thehappytypist said:


> Quite true. I try not to spout off about any laws except for NYC stuff because I have no clue. lol


If you can keep up with the NYC stuff, I applaud you. I have been in logistics for over 20 years, and I can barely keep up with the federal, and NC stuff. 
I appreciate you taking your time to help drivers on this board, you always try to be helpful,and nice, even when you have to tell someone something they don't want to hear.


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## thehappytypist (Oct 9, 2014)

Dan Dixon said:


> If you can keep up with the NYC stuff, I applaud you. I have been in logistics for over 20 years, and I can barely keep up with the federal, and NC stuff.
> I appreciate you taking your time to help drivers on this board, you always try to be helpful,and nice, even when you have to tell someone something they don't want to hear.


I appreciate the kind words  It's actually nice to tell it like it is instead of having to use Uberspeak.


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## Major League (Oct 16, 2014)

Drivingubernlyft said:


> Actually for puke to be biohazard there would have to be visible amounts of blood. Otherwise it's not considered biohazard and you don't need a professional cleaning or epa license. A wet wipe will suffice.


Yea but you know something. Who knows what was coming out of this person mouth and maybe there was blood but it's not on the door where the picture was taken but there's remnants of blood. And there's still the protocol of wearing gloves. If a cop had their arm thrown-up on by a suspect, you know damn well they would be running to the disinfectant. Just saying.

The rider should be billed.


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## Drivingubernlyft (Jun 5, 2015)

Major League said:


> Yea but you know something. Who knows what was coming out of this person mouth and maybe there was blood but it's not on the door where the picture was taken but there's remnants of blood. And there's still the protocol of wearing gloves. If a cop had their arm thrown-up on by a suspect, you know damn well they would be running to the disinfectant. Just saying.
> 
> The rider should be billed.


That's true. I agree with you there


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

Muki said:


> I can see where both driver and Uber are coming from here. If someone pukes in your car, cleaning even a small amount is disgusting and feels worthy of compensation. But the Uber CSR can't really see much in the photo and doesn't know if the rider is exaggerating or lying and has to make a hard call on what to do. If he now charges the pax's credit card, what if the pax denies it and says the driver is lying. Then it's a huge mess to have to mediate.
> 
> What really pisses me off though is that someone can puke in your car and not even hand you an extra tip just to say sorry. While I've met some really nice people Ubering, hearing stories like this makes me start to hate people. If I did that in someone's car, I'd tell him to stop at a store and I'd buy cleaning agent and rags and clean the mess spotless. I'd then give him $50 at least for the trouble and hope that he will not report it to Uber.





ColdRider said:


> Lol. Looks like drops of water.





Major League said:


> Yea but you know something. Who knows what was coming out of this person mouth and maybe there was blood but it's not on the door where the picture was taken but there's remnants of blood. And there's still the protocol of wearing gloves. If a cop had their arm thrown-up on by a suspect, you know damn well they would be running to the disinfectant. Just saying.
> 
> The rider should be billed.


What also pisses me off is that by them saying they can't tell what it is, they're essentially calling me a liar and accusing me of fraud. Also, you can consider the driver's history: In over a year of driving, I've only asked for one other cleaning fee.

If I am the independent contractor and uber is merely handling the billing and is just a lead generator, where would they get off telling me what I can and can't bill for? Imagine the Square folks telling me I can't charge a passenger a cleaning fee! Imagine an advertising company telling me how to run my business. This is yet another example of how uber is absolutely a transportation company, treating us like employees.


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## Drivingubernlyft (Jun 5, 2015)

I agree


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## uberman168 (Nov 9, 2015)

Major League said:


> Have to disagree. Puke is considered bio hazard. Needs to be cleaned professionally.


I think your going a bit too far. I don't see any blood. I would be pissed. but bio hazard it is not


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## FlDriver (Oct 16, 2015)

Puke is NOT normal wear and tear!

When a friend threw up in my car years ago, I had to call several detailers to find someone who would take the job. Most of them did not want anything to do with cleaning up vomit, and these are people who clean cars for a living.


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## FlDriver (Oct 16, 2015)

uberman168 said:


> I think your going a bit too far. I don't see any blood. I would be pissed. but bio hazard it is not


Bio hazard it IS! Anything that involves bodily fluids is. "Biohazard" is exactly the term detailers used when I called to find someone to clean up a mess like this. Anyone in the medical field would agree with that definition.

You don't know what you're talking about.


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## uberman168 (Nov 9, 2015)

FlDriver said:


> Bio hazard it IS! Anything that involves bodily fluids is. "Biohazard" is exactly the term detailers used when I called to find someone to clean up a mess like this. Anyone in the medical field would agree with that definition.
> 
> You don't know what you're talking about.


this is from the university of new England's website. and I guess neither does the university


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