# Bulletproof hat.



## 58756 (May 30, 2016)

Some fellow East African drivers in Minneapolis got shot to death in head from behind the seat in Cabs, so I am gonna order this soon and expense it for life.

https://bulletsafe.com/products/bul...9ODKJ0TrSbAfLLauyqSplj16m6F-kc1hoCTD8QAvD_BwE
https://www.google.com/search?q=cab...print-us-revc&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8


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## Fusion_LUser (Jan 3, 2020)

It's only "bullet" proof in the front though. The driver was shot from the rear.


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

Ozzyoz said:


> Some fellow East African drivers in Minneapolis got shot to death in head from behind the seat in Cabs, so I am gonna order this soon and expense it for life.
> 
> https://bulletsafe.com/products/bul...9ODKJ0TrSbAfLLauyqSplj16m6F-kc1hoCTD8QAvD_BwE
> https://www.google.com/search?q=cab...print-us-revc&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8


Tell him " welcome to Minneapolis "and don't call the cops.:smiles:



Ozzyoz said:


> Some fellow East African drivers in Minneapolis got shot to death in head from behind the seat in Cabs, so I am gonna order this soon and expense it for life.
> 
> https://bulletsafe.com/products/bul...9ODKJ0TrSbAfLLauyqSplj16m6F-kc1hoCTD8QAvD_BwE
> https://www.google.com/search?q=cab...print-us-revc&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8


Are you still doing your thermometer experiment on pax's:smiles:


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## bethswannns (Mar 22, 2020)

It looked like they put a bent Iphone inside the cap.. So ingenious..


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## 58756 (May 30, 2016)

mbd said:


> Tell him " welcome to Minneapolis "and don't call the cops.:smiles:
> 
> 
> Are you still doing your thermometer experiment on pax's:smiles:


No I returned it



Fusion_LUser said:


> It's only "bullet" proof in the front though. The driver was shot from the rear.


I'll have to look for a new solution. Just last week q guy walking in Minneapolis park had his hat fly away then he saw some blood when he felt his head, turns out he was grazed by a bullet.


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## ariel5466 (May 16, 2019)

If things were bad enough in my city where I felt the need to wear bulletproof anything I would stop driving.


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## ColdRider (Oct 19, 2015)

As others mentioned, front part bullet proof. Even if you wore it backwards, what if they shoot under the brim?

I guess protection is better than nothing, I agree. I just think you can easily end up as a potato brainlet if the shooter decides to aim under the hat.



















Ever watched goodfellas? A killer doesn't need a gun to take you out if they really wanted to.


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## Johnny Mnemonic (Sep 24, 2019)

Ozzyoz said:


> I still drive downtown and everywhere but nights I'm careful, but in Islam we believe we die when it's written for us and our time to go according to predecree. So if i stop posting on this forum for a long time, I most likely was killed or got nabbed by the federal cops in unmarked cars.


I would like to again suggest you avoid downtown and driving after midnight.

https://sufiway.eu/trust-in-allah-but-tether-your-camel/


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## 58756 (May 30, 2016)

Johnny Mnemonic said:


> I would like to again suggest you avoid downtown and driving after midnight.
> 
> https://sufiway.eu/trust-in-allah-but-tether-your-camel/


Got it


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

Ozzyoz said:


> Got it


Put a fake sign that says video recorded remotely.


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## 58756 (May 30, 2016)

mbd said:


> Put a fake sign that says video recorded remotely.


That won't prevent a hardened criminal who looks forward to Prison. To some Prison is a culture and they get to meet other prisoners and be real men and lift weights there. One MN prisoner even convinced a correctional officer to go kill a man for him years ago around 2007.


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## Invisible (Jun 15, 2018)

Ozzyoz said:


> That won't prevent a hardened criminal who looks forward to Prison. To some Prison is a culture and they get to meet other prisoners and be real men and lift weights there. One MN prisoner even convinced a correctional officer to go kill a man for him years ago around 2007.


And it won't help the severely mentally ill pax. Remember the Walmart pax, who was a teen, who killed the driver in Chicago with a machete she stole from Walmart?


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## maxroyalty1 (Mar 8, 2017)

Ozzyoz said:


> Got it


Bro just stick to the suburbs and be home by midnight it's a simple formula


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## 58756 (May 30, 2016)

maxroyalty1 said:


> Bro just stick to the suburbs and be home by midnight it's a simple formula


Suburbs can get you killed too lol. I was once chocked from behind by young college girl but she was drunk and meant it as hug type thing but she put her cheek on my cheek very hard and got her makeup on me as she cut off my air throat. I had to forcibly remove her giant Germanic arm off of me, never knew women can be that strong until I force removed her from me.



Invisible said:


> And it won't help the severely mentally ill pax. Remember the Walmart pax, who was a teen, who killed the driver in Chicago with a machete she stole from Walmart?


Yes I remember that one, tohunt4me posted bloody car images of that, driver was yelling "she really is killing me" to the dispatch.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Bulletrproof hat?

Sitting behind the driver they arn't going to shoot you in the part of the head that the hat coveres, more than likely it's going to be a bullet coming at an upward angle, IE nowhere the would cover.

Want to invest in protection?

https://bulletproofeveryone.com/the-sherpa-mens-bulletproof-hoodie/









I've seen a heck of a lot of bullet holes, contrary to every video game ever, no one aims for a head shot in real life, they aim for center mass.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> Bulletrproof hat?
> 
> Sitting behind the driver they arn't going to shoot you in the part of the head that the hat coveres, more than likely it's going to be a bullet coming at an upward angle, IE nowhere the would cover.
> 
> ...


SO THE IMPACT OF THE BULLET PUTS YOU IN A COMA FOR 20 YEARS . . .

INSTEAD OF PENETRATING AND KILLING YOU . . .

3 more Years of muscle rehabilitation & tendon transplants
And we can begin teaching you to walk mr. Smith . . .



Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> Bulletrproof hat?
> 
> Sitting behind the driver they arn't going to shoot you in the part of the head that the hat coveres, more than likely it's going to be a bullet coming at an upward angle, IE nowhere the would cover.
> 
> ...


Needs to be Covid Proof also . . .


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## 25rides7daysaweek (Nov 20, 2017)

Ozzyoz said:


> That won't prevent a hardened criminal who looks forward to Prison. To some Prison is a culture and they get to meet other prisoners and be real men and lift weights there. One MN prisoner even convinced a correctional officer to go kill a man for him years ago around 2007.


Not even to mention the sex !
Ive heard its a distant second
to mental institution sex though
People are just lined up to 
get into both of those places !
Kinda like a super long term
sex tourism mentality....


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## 58756 (May 30, 2016)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> Bulletrproof hat?
> 
> Sitting behind the driver they arn't going to shoot you in the part of the head that the hat coveres, more than likely it's going to be a bullet coming at an upward angle, IE nowhere the would cover.
> 
> ...


I want that but is the hoodie good and protect well? What about summer heat?


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## Iann (Oct 17, 2017)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> Bulletrproof hat?
> 
> Sitting behind the driver they arn't going to shoot you in the part of the head that the hat coveres, more than likely it's going to be a bullet coming at an upward angle, IE nowhere the would cover.
> 
> ...


The man bun alone will probably get this guy's ass kicked.


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## SleelWheels (Jun 25, 2019)

If my time is up it’s up, that could happen any number of ways including some freak with a gun in the back seat.


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## TBone (Jan 19, 2015)

I have thought about ways to disable people in the back seat. I think my best idea would be to place strobes inside the car and use a pattern that disorients a person. Would work great on drunks.
My not so good and probably not legal idea...put a row of spikes under the seats that shoot up to impale someone. Definitely want it to work right and put the button somewhere it can't be triggered accidentally lol
Maybe add in a steel plate in the drivers seat to stop bullets.


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## SleelWheels (Jun 25, 2019)

Did I hear 'passenger ejector seat' at the end of this vid?


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## ariel5466 (May 16, 2019)

TBone said:


> put a row of spikes under the seats that shoot up to impale someone





SleelWheels said:


> Did I hear 'passenger ejector seat' at the end of this vid?


I was about to say, that sounds like some James Bond shit &#128514;


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## Who is John Galt? (Sep 28, 2016)

SleelWheels said:


> Did I hear 'passenger ejector seat' at the end of this vid?


I'm glad Bond was a little more focused when he had a roll in the hay with Miss Püssy Galore later in the same movie.


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## S0cialm3nace (Aug 2, 2020)




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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Ozzyoz said:


> I want that but is the hoodie good and protect well? What about summer heat?


It comes in up to IIIA rating,

Basically it will stop anything common in hand gun ammo, your typical street rat with an illegal firearm will be using a 9mm or a 44, 45 ect.

It will feel like you got smashed with a fastball in the gut/back. Best bet is to double over and play dead while they are looting you and your car then run them over once they are out. If they have GSR on them and you have armor with bullets stuck in it, and the bruises to match in it there's no court in this country that won't take a self defense for that.

It won't make you immortal but it should provide some heavy bullet resistance. As far as summer heat goes, heat sucks, armor gets sweaty in the heat. No real solutions except a magical barrier.










This particular company makes some low-key body armor that doesn't scream body armor.

This bullet proof Vest looks like something else i'd wear most of the year,









This company also has some woman's wear as well,










I mean this stuff isn't cheap but it's not completely un-affordable either.

I'm going to throw this out as an option for you folks,

The problem with traditional vests is that you need three layers of clothing, and it gets hot and uncomfortable. Bare minimum with a traditional vest you need an undershirt, body armor, top layer. Law enforcement typically only wears a shirt with armor over top, so this is more layers than most law enforcement use.

An armored Jacket like these reduces this down to just 2 layers. T-shirt and Body armor. Then you can unzip it and take it off between fares, even just unzipping really helps. If you hang it over the back of your seat it still offers protection from getting shot in the back.

Regular not sketchy customer, 2 seconds and you can peel it off. Get a ping in the hood? Get that thing back on in a jiff.


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## S0cialm3nace (Aug 2, 2020)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> It comes in up to IIIA rating,
> 
> Basically it will stop anything common in hand gun ammo, your typical street rat with an illegal firearm will be using a 9mm or a 44, 45 ect.
> 
> ...


In my opinion body armor is only half the equation. Running the person over after will get you in jail. If you are going far enough to get armor, you should also be carrying a gun. You might survive getting shot so now it's time to return the favor.


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## ANT 7 (Oct 14, 2018)

The hat won't work.

The kinetic energy from the round will still crack your skull and cause hemoragic trauma, etc.

I used to play goalie in hockey. Got hit in the nuts with a snapshot. Sure, the cup took the hit, but I passed out anyways.


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## Kings-Full (Mar 7, 2020)

ANT 7 said:


> The hat won't work.
> 
> The kinetic energy from the round will still crack your skull and cause hemoragic trauma, etc.


Exactly!

Anyone that doubts that can get one, put it on, and then have your buddy hit the hat with a baseball bat. Hopefully it won't kill you.

Stupidest idea ever!


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

Kings-Full said:


> Exactly!
> 
> Anyone that doubts that can get one, put it on, and then have your buddy hit the hat with a baseball bat. Hopefully it won't kill you.
> 
> Stupidest idea ever!


Depending on the caliber of the firearm, being shot wearing that hat might cause a concussion, could crack your skull, etc., and it could have very bad results. But, probably it is still a lot more survivable than having a bullet enter your skull.

It will be more effective with some calibers than others. A IIIA hat might crack your skull if hit with a .44, but might not leave much damage to the wearer at all if hit by a .22. The .22, without the hat, would penetrate to the back of the skull and then bounce off the back of the skull to make a second path through the brain.


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## ariel5466 (May 16, 2019)

Trafficat said:


> Depending on the caliber of the firearm, being shot wearing that hat might cause a concussion, could crack your skull, etc., and it could have very bad results. But, probably it is still a lot more survivable than having a bullet enter your skull.


Personally, I would much rather die instantly than be a vegetable on life support.


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

ariel5466 said:


> Personally, I would much rather die instantly than be a vegetable on life support.


A bullet through your brain won't necessarily kill you instantly unless it hits the brain stem. Anywhere else, while it will probably result in death eventually (and probably quite rapidly), there are no guarantees that you might not survive as a vegetable or with serious brain injury.

Phineas Gage survived a rod passing through his brain much larger than most bullets. Apparently it changed his behavior to have an ill temperament however, making him nearly unemployable. He had to become an Uber driver (or the equivalent of his era), but he did survive it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phineas_Gage


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## Kings-Full (Mar 7, 2020)

Trafficat said:


> Depending on the caliber of the firearm, being shot wearing that hat might cause a concussion, could crack your skull, etc., and it could have very bad results. But, probably it is still a lot more survivable than having a bullet enter your skull.
> 
> It will be more effective with some calibers than others. A IIIA hat might crack your skull if hit with a .44, but might not leave much damage to the wearer at all if hit by a .22. The .22, without the hat, would penetrate to the back of the skull and then bounce off the back of the skull to make a second path through the brain.


I don't think so.

Physics tells us, via F=MA, that there's a tremendous force applied when a bullet strikes. The skull is not designed to handle large forces, and neither is the brain. Ask NFL players about that.

People wearing vests have had bones broken and extensive soft tissue damage.

The likely hood of survival is slim imo, and would result in some very debilitating side effects regarding cognitive abilities. IOW, you'd be a vegetable.

There's only one way to protect your head from a bullet. Don't let the bullet hit you in the head.


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

Kings-Full said:


> I don't think so.
> 
> Physics tells us, via F=MA, that there's a tremendous force applied when a bullet strikes.


Bullets don't really have tremendous force. Every action has an opposite and equal reaction. The momentum of the gun imparted to the shooters hand is the same as the momentum of the bullet. When you shoot a gun, the gun does not break your hand because the grip is much larger than the diameter of the bullet and the gun will also spread the force over a slightly longer period of time. The gun will have higher mass and lower velocity which means less kinetic energy since energy is proportional to the square of the velocity.

Bullets fundamentally work by concentrating that force over a very small area. Pressure = Force / Area. This high pressure drills a small hole through something. This small hole damages the body. It doesn't take a large hole to cause severe damage.

Body armor causes the bullets force to be spread out over a larger area, thus preventing penetration of the projectile.

Many bullets have less energy than a baseball, yet not everyone who is hit in the head by a baseball will die.



> People wearing vests have had bones broken and extensive soft tissue damage.


Depends on the vest. Depends on the caliber of the round.



> The likely hood of survival is slim imo, and would result in some very debilitating side effects regarding cognitive abilities. IOW, you'd be a vegetable.
> 
> There's only one way to protect your head from a bullet. Don't let the bullet hit you in the head.


My guess, if you are hit in the head with a .22 that first strikes this cap, your odds of survival are 99%+, and the odds of traumatic brain injury will be very low as well. It might raise a bump on your head but probably won't break anything.

With a .40 S&W, I'd say your odds of survival are probably 50% and if you do survive, there is a fair enough chance that brain damage will be mostly temporary or minor, although there is also a fair chance that it could be substantial.

Without the cap, I'd say if you are shot in the head with a .22, your odds of survival are around 5% or less, and if you survive, you will most likely have at least as significant brain injury as if you got hit with the .40 while wearing the cap.

A .22 LR bullet is 3 grams and travels about 600 mph out of a handgun. A baseball weighs 150 grams and travels maybe 60 mph.

So the momentum of the baseball is 9000 gram miles per hour, whereas the .22LR bullet is only 1800 gram miles per hour. The baseball has nearly 5 times the momentum of the .22.

The energy of the .22 LR is 135,000 gram miles squared per hours squared.

The energy of the baseball is 270,000 gram miles squared per hours squared. So the baseball also has twice the energy as the .22.

The .22 is far more deadly compared to a baseball because it's diameter is small and it is hard and not easily deformed. The body armor negates that advantage of the .22.

I would say that you are less than half as likely to suffer brain injury if hit in the bulletproof hat by a .22 as if you were hit by a baseball in the forehead.


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## Kings-Full (Mar 7, 2020)

Trafficat said:


> My guess, if you are hit in the head with a .22 wearing this cap, your odds of survival are 99%+, and the odds of traumatic brain injury will be very low as well.
> 
> With a .44 magnum, I'd say your odds of survival are probably 50% and if you do survive, there is a fair enough chance that brain damage will be mostly temporary or minor, although there is also a fair chance that it could be substantial.
> 
> Without the cap, I'd say if you are shot in the head with a .22, your odds of survival are around 5% or less, and if you survive, you will most likely have at least as significant brain injury as if you got hit with the .44 while wearing the cap.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physics_of_firearms
"
*Transfer of energy[edit]*
When the bullet strikes, its high velocity and small frontal cross-section means that it will exert large stresses in any object it hits. This usually results in it penetrating any soft object, such as flesh. The energy is then dissipated in the wound track formed by the passage of the bullet. See terminal ballistics for a fuller discussion of these effects.

Bulletproof vests work by dissipating the bullet's energy in another way; the vest's material, usually Aramid (Kevlar or Twaron), works by presenting a series of material layers which catch the bullet and spread its imparted force over a larger area, hopefully bringing the round to a stop before it can penetrate into the body. *While the vest can prevent a bullet from penetrating, the wearer will still be affected by the kinetic energy of the bullet, which can produce serious internal injuries."*

Emphasis mine.

I'm not sure you fully understand, no disrespect.

Calibre isn't as important as you think. It does play a role, but not nearly to the degree you seem to think.

Let me ask you this, are you willing to take my 'baseball bat' challenge?


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## ariel5466 (May 16, 2019)

Okay, we need to test this. If only Mythbusters was still on the air!


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

Kings-Full said:


> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physics_of_firearms
> "
> *Transfer of energy[edit]*
> When the bullet strikes, its high velocity and small frontal cross-section means that it will exert large stresses in any object it hits. This usually results in it penetrating any soft object, such as flesh. The energy is then dissipated in the wound track formed by the passage of the bullet. See terminal ballistics for a fuller discussion of these effects.
> ...


I'm not sure you fully understand. I own body armor and guns. I shoot body armor with guns. I'm quite familiar with the actual capabilities of bullets on armor from direct experience. Have you ever fired a bullet at body armor before? The quote you have that injury CAN be produced with armor is true, but it is a generalization that does not apply for any bullet that hits any armor. It depends on the rating and type of armor as well as the type of bullet that hits it.

.22LR out of a handgun.... 40 grains, 900 feet per second.
.40 S&W out of a handgun.... 165 grains, 1100 feet per second.

0.5*40*(900^2)/(0.5*165*(1100^2)) = 0.16

There is a reason that body armor has different ratings. You don't need IIA armor to defeat a .22 pistol, because it only has 16% as much energy as the rounds it is designed to defeat.

And neither will a bullet that has only 16% as much energy cause as much harm to the wearer of armor designed to stop a bullet that has six times the energy.

Just because I'm not willing to be hit in the head with a baseball doesn't mean I can't recognize that being hit with a bullet having half the energy as a baseball with armor on is less likely to be fatal than not wearing armor.


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## Kings-Full (Mar 7, 2020)

Trafficat said:


> I'm not sure you fully understand. I own body armor and guns. I shoot body armor with guns. Have you ever fired a bullet at body armor before?
> 
> .22LR out of a handgun.... 40 grains, 900 feet per second.
> .40 S&W out of a handgun.... 165 grains, 1100 feet per second.
> ...


I'm from Texas, I own guns. Lots of em.... Have had a LTC for 2 decades now. Spend lots of time at the range. I don't know a soul that would spend .05 cents on a bulletproof hat.

Go and get you a bulletproof hat if you're so inclined.

BTW, there's a reason you're not willing to take the 'baseball bat' challenge and we both know it.

ETA: You did a ninja edit on me regarding the challenge but I quoted you before you did.


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

Kings-Full said:


> BTW, there's a reason you're not willing to take the 'baseball bat' challenge and we both know it.


Hmm, maybe because I don't want to suffer traumatic injury and possibly death?

What would you rather be hit by, a baseball at half speed, or a .22 caliber bullet directly in the skull?

You will PROBABLY survive the baseball. You will PROBABLY die from the .22

Just because I would PROBABLY live being hit by a half speed baseball and am cognizant of that fact doesn't mean I would volunteer to be hit by one.


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## Kings-Full (Mar 7, 2020)

Trafficat said:


> Hmm, maybe because I don't want to suffer traumatic injury and possibly death?
> 
> What would you rather be hit by, a baseball at half speed, or a .22 caliber bullet directly in the skull?
> 
> ...


Or.... The force imparted by both is very likely to kill you.


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

Kings-Full said:


> Or.... The force imparted by both is very likely to kill you.


Both involve a possibility of death. One is much greater than the other.

Would you volunteer to have your legs broken even if it wouldn't kill you? Of course not. Even with no chance of death no one volunteers for injury.

Enough with this non-sense about this idiotic "challenge".


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## Kings-Full (Mar 7, 2020)

Trafficat said:


> Both involve a possibility of death. One involves a large possibility of death and one involves a small possibility of death.
> 
> Would you volunteer for someone to hit you in the leg with a baseball bat just because it wouldn't kill you? Of course not. You don't want to be injured even if there was NO chance of death.
> 
> Enough with this non-sense about this idiotic "challenge".


There's just one problem with this. You discount the impact of one while acknowledging the impact of the other.

You've made several "my guess" statements here without providing a single source that supports your 'guesses'.

Again, if you're a believer in bulletproof hats then get one. Don't worry about how I feel about them.

You'll simply never be able to come up with an argument that will change my mind because my opinion is formed by science and facts.


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## ariel5466 (May 16, 2019)

What we need to do is get this hat, an assortment of firearms and other weaponry, and those ballistic gel heads that measure the force exerted. That would be such a fun experiment!


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

Kings-Full said:


> There's just one problem with this. You discount the impact of one while acknowledging the impact of the other.
> 
> You've made several "my guess" statements here without providing a single source that supports your 'guesses'.
> 
> ...


The physics says a bullet proof hat will most likely save your life from a .22.

Was my math wrong when I showed that a .22 out of a handgun has half the energy of a baseball and 1/5 of the momentum? If not, then why do you assert that being shot by a .22 while wearing this hat is the same as being hit by a full force baseball bat swing?

Note that a baseball hit by an actual bat is going to be going possibly TWICE as fast as the baseball speed I used in my calculation which was 60 mph, which is more of a pitched baseball speed.

BTW, here's an actual video of this hat with ballistics gel heads and skulls being shot at by a .45 which has 7 times as much energy as a .22 :


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## Kings-Full (Mar 7, 2020)

Trafficat said:


> The physics says a bullet proof hat will most likely save your life from a .22.
> 
> Was my math wrong when I showed that a .22 out of a handgun has half the energy of a baseball and 1/5 of the momentum? If not, then why do you assert that being shot by a .22 while wearing this hat is the same as being hit by a full force baseball bat swing?
> 
> ...


I didn't check your math, it's your guesses that concern me.

You're pulling statistics out of your backside and trying to pass it off as 'fact' or 'reasonable'.

If these bullets are so low impact, according to you, then why do people suffer serious injuries when wearing a vest?

Do you think the skull/brain is designed to handle these impacts?

Would you recommend a bulletproof hat to your mother?

What you're really arguing here is that you might surviving a fall from an airplane if you land on a mattress factory.


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

Kings-Full said:


> I didn't check your math, it's your guesses that concern me.
> 
> You're pulling statistics out of your backside and trying to pass it off as 'fact' or 'reasonable'.
> 
> If these bullets are so low impact, according to you, then why do people suffer serious injuries when wearing a vest?


The vest purpose is to save your life, not to prevent all injury. People don't always suffer serious injuries when wearing a vest, either. Many times they will only have a bruise. It depends on the caliber of the round, exactly where it hits, and the specific vest. A .22 hitting a IIIA vest over someone's belly will probably leave a bruise, but a .357 magnum right over a rib might crack that rib and cause more severe internal bleeding.



> Do you think the skull/brain is designed to handle these impacts?


Considering that a large number of people survive being hit in the head by a baseball, it would seem to me that being hit by something with half the energy should provide promising odds.

The skull evolved to protect the brain from common injuries our ancestors encountered, such as tripping and hitting your head on something. If you trip and fall on a rock, the impact could still kill you. People die from tripping all the time. But sometimes (usually), the skull prevents your brain from being damaged by such impacts, which are actually in a similar magnitude to being hit by a low powered round that hits a soft body armor panel, or to being hit by a baseball.

From this article:
https://www.sportsrec.com/10181195/5-things-you-need-to-know-about-getting-hit-with-a-baseball


> *I Got a Hit on the Head*
> A concussion is one of the most common injuries when you get hit in the head with a baseball. Concussions, also known as traumatic brain injuries, can be tricky to diagnose. Know that a person doesn't need to lose consciousness to have a concussion. Occasionally, concussions also occur from a hit on another part of the body that sends an "impulsive force" message to the head. Concussion symptoms may show up immediately or days later, from nausea to fuzzy vision to problems with thinking. See a doctor if you think a concussion has occurred, and understand that multiple concussions over a lifetime can lead to permanent changes in the brain. Make sure qualified healthcare personnel are available at baseball games to assess injuries and provide first aid.


A concussion is a common result of being hit in the head with a baseball... not death, but mere concussion. The article warns about the danger of multiple concussions. A single concussion from being hit by a baseball is not likely to make you into a vegetable.

The article says 95,000 hit by a baseball go to the ER every year. About half are injuries to the head, and only 4 die annually from baseball injuries. That is much less than 1%, so my statistic "guess" of survivability being 99% for a half-energy projectile seems pretty "reasonable" to me. It may be a "guess" but it is hardly "pulled out of my ass". It is directly compared to well known similar injuries.

A 22 that hits armor with half the energy of a baseball is not more likely to kill you.



> Would you recommend a bulletproof hat to your mother?


If my mother was going to go into combat against people armed with handguns, and her choice was to have a bare head or a bulletproof hat, then yes, I would.

SWAT/Interceptor armor and a bulletproof helmet would obviously be better.



> What you're really arguing here is that you might surviving a fall from an airplane if you land on a mattress factory.


People survive concussions of this magnitude quite often, whereas people almost never survive falling out of a plane without a parachute.

So I would say, no, that's not the same argument.


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## Kings-Full (Mar 7, 2020)

Trafficat said:


> A 22 that hits armor with half the energy of a baseball is not more likely to kill you.


This is just another example of you pulling 'facts' out of your backside. And frankly, it's the last straw. You refuse to post a single thing that remotely supports your conclusions. You're making it up as you go, while refusing to acknowledge any of my points.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/the-baseball-the-bullet-and-what-it-all-means
"
For a baseball or a bullet, the formula for the kinetic energy is the same.

K.E. = 1/2MV²

Meaning that kinetic energy equals one half the mass of an object times the square of the velocity.

Meaning that kinetic energy-which is measured in joules-increases exponentially with velocity.

The baseball lobbed in by wounded Capitol Police Officer David Bailey as the first pitch of Thursday night's Congressional baseball game carried hardly any kinetic energy at all, maybe 20 joules.

Then Rep. Cedric Richmond took the mound as the best player on either team, with the ability to pitch as fast as 80 mph, which carries 91 joules.

That is proportionately the approximate difference between the capabilities of the two weapons the maniac was carrying when he appeared at a pre-game practice for the Republican team on Wednesday.

If the maniac had opened fire with his 9 mm pistol, the bullet would have left the muzzle at around 800 miles per hour with 467 joules.

He instead used his SKS 7.62 assault-style rifle. The bullets left the muzzle at some 1,600 miles per hour with 2,045 joules.

That means the bullet that struck Majority Whip Steve Scalise had roughly four times the kinetic energy than if he had been shot with the handgun.

And, as any trauma surgeon will tell you, bullets kill primarily by transferring kinetic energy to tissue and bone."

Do I need to highlite the relevant sections here. Primarily the kinetic energy transfer by a baseball and a bullet?

Now, you show me something to backup your claim that a .22 impacts with half the energy of a baseball. That's pure BS!

You don't understand the physics involved.

I'm out, you can have the last word.


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

Kings-Full said:


> K.E. = 1/2MV²


I used that exact equation in a previous post to demonstrate that a 22 had half the energy of a baseball in a previous post and you didn't disagree with my math.



> If the maniac had opened fire with his 9 mm pistol, the bullet would have left the muzzle at around 800 miles per hour with 467 joules.
> 
> Now, you show me something to backup your claim that a .22 impacts with half the energy of a baseball. That's pure BS!


A .22 has less joules than a 9mm.

Let's take a .22 fired from a short barreled revolver, traveling 700 feet per second due to the much shorter barrel from rifle. They are advertised at 1600 fps from a 16" barrel, I have gotten about 900 ft/s out of a 4" barrel, and I've gotten around 700 ft/s with some of my snubnosed revolvers. For instance, date from a 1 5/8" barrel: https://northamericanarms.com/ballistics/ball-22llr/

I did not use joules in my last post but rather a unit of measurement which was non-standard to avoid unit conversion. So let me do the same calculation in SI units.

And lets take your 80 mph baseball.

A 22 out of a short barreled revolver:
1/2*(0.0026 kg)*(213 m/s)^2 = 59 Joules

A baseball at 80 mph:
1/2*(0.150 kg)*(36 m/s)^2 = 97 Joules

It seems in my last post, reviewing my math which you did not contest but merely ignored, I did make an error and overestimated the baseball energy. But I also used a rather generous overestimate for .22 velocity since some mugger is probably using a snubnosed gun rather than a .22 LR target pistol with a long barrel. Even with the longer barrel, the energy is the SAME as the baseball, and with the shorter barrel about 60% as much. And still, a 100% powered baseball doesn't kill most people when they get hit in the head.


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## Kings-Full (Mar 7, 2020)

Trafficat said:


> I used that exact equation in a previous post to demonstrate that a 22 had half the energy of a baseball in a previous post and you didn't disagree with my math.


:sigh: Just when you think you're out they drag you back in...

I didn't disagree with your math because it's based on assumption and half truths.

Here's a chart - prove it wrong. Notice what's at the very bottom??

http://wredlich.com/ny/2013/01/proj...r/#:~:text=The .,have a very different effect.

"Here's a chart with some common sports projectiles and bullets, and please note that these are rough numbers. For firearms there's a great ballistics calculator from Winchester.

"

You're 'math' isn't even close. But I think you knew that....


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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

I like how that table you posted shows the baseball at 140 Joules!



> I didn't disagree with your math because it's based on assumption and half truths.


Sorry, but out of a snub-nosed revolver, the energy of the .22 is 60 joules, not 168 joules.

Barrel length affects velocity. A rifle has a barrel 8 times as long as a snubby.

https://northamericanarms.com/ballistics/ball-22llr/
*CCI Standard Velocity*
*22 LONG RIFLE - 1 & 5/8″ BARREL
(Velocities in feet per second)*
​
*40 Gr. Solid*​*1st Group*​*2nd Group*​*Avg.*​*1st Group*​*2nd Group*​*Avg.*​*2 Gun Avg.*​High​715​658​687​640​652​646​*666*​Low​649​638​644​610​600​605​*624*​*Mean*​668​645​657​624​624​624​*640*​SD​31​7​19​15​20​18​*18*​

Wanna do the math and tell me how many joules that revolver is generating based on the average velocities from that table?

But let's just go with your table. Even if criminals used a 22 RIFLE instead of a snubnosed revolver, the energy on YOUR table you just quoted shows that the energy is NEARLY THE SAME as for the baseball. And since most baseballs concussions don't kill people...


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## Kings-Full (Mar 7, 2020)

Here's the thing, and it's the point, among others, you've missed this entire discussion.

There's a reason I can catch a baseball thrown at 100 mph with a glove and I can't catch a .22, even from a snub nosed revolver, with the same glove without serious injury. By that I mean I hold up my gloved hand and the shooter aims at it and fires. 

Know what that is?


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## June132017 (Jun 13, 2017)




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## Trafficat (Dec 19, 2016)

Kings-Full said:


> .There's a reason I can catch a baseball thrown at 100 mph with a glove and I can't catch a .22, even from a snub nosed revolver, with the same glove without serious injury. By that I mean I hold up my gloved hand and the shooter aims at it and fires.
> 
> Know what that is?


Yes.... your glove is not a IIA rated kevlar glove.

Normally when the catcher uses a glove, the web of the glove is supposed to take the impact first, and deform a lot, causing the force to be slowly distributed to the hand beneath the glove. So if the glove was used with a bullet, the bullet would actually pass through the web without striking the hand. If the web was made out of Kevlar, it would catch the bullet in the web, and it probably wouldn't injure the hand.

If you instead had a kevlar panel over your palm, and shot your palm, that might hurt your hand.... but if you caught a 100 mph ball without a glove, I would imagine that would hurt the hand quite a lot, probably as much as being shot in the hand while wearing a IIA panel over the hand.

The bullet has higher pressure because it is much smaller than a baseball. And it has less deformation because it is less elastic than the baseball. That's why the Kevlar is designed to distribute the impact over a much wider area. Since the bullet does not penetrate, the kevlar itself impacts the body. The part of the kevlar that touches the body will be wider than the bullet by a substantial margin and it will have to accelerate when the bullet hits it, and when the kevlar impacts the body it is less rigid than the bullet and will decelerate over a longer period of time.

The bullet does not provide more blunt force trauma than the baseball. It drills a hole because the force is focused over a small area. Except when you use armor that prevents that hole from being drilled.


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## S0cialm3nace (Aug 2, 2020)

I’ve taken the baseball bat challenge... it wasn’t pleasant but I survived. 
Is it worth mentioning that 22 and 45 are also a different bullet. Sometimes that means more than you would think. For instance the force oh a high heel vs the force of a flat shoe and the idea that it’s smaller and won’t likely expand... on the other hand the hat can spread the force across the head which will help somewhat. Probably just break your neck. anyway if you use underwood XTreme Penetrators It won’t matter anyway.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

S0cialm3nace said:


> In my opinion body armor is only half the equation. Running the person over after will get you in jail.


This really depends. Let's say for instance you pull into a driveway to get off a busy road (don't you just hate busy roads with driveways) and 3 guys pop out of the bushes with guns to carjack you.

Now your in a car with armed carjackers behind you coming towards you and a building in front of you.

This is a two parter, but a perfect example of when/how to use a vehicle as a weapon.











Escape and running someone over aren't mutually exclusive.

Had they not been trying to carjack her this would have been uncalled for, however her actions as ballsy as they were, they were the ideal solution for the problem and far less risky than leaving the car (and possibly being murdered on the spot).

Carjacking often involves the use of another vehicle for "blocking" and simply ramming through like this woman did will get the job done.

38-40 seconds

The driver he's trying to carjack hits him solid dead center.


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## S0cialm3nace (Aug 2, 2020)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> This really depends. Let's say for instance you pull into a driveway to get off a busy road (don't you just hate busy roads with driveways) and 3 guys pop out of the bushes with guns to carjack you.
> 
> Now your in a car with armed carjackers behind you coming towards you and a building in front of you.
> 
> ...


He said pretend your dead and after they are running away run them over... in that case it's no longer self defense.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

S0cialm3nace said:


> He said pretend your dead and after they are running away run them over... in that case it's no longer self defense.


depends on the camera angles now doesn't it?


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## Amos69 (May 17, 2019)

Who is John Galt? said:


> I'm glad Bond was a little more focused when he had a roll in the hay with Miss Püssy Galore later in the same movie.
> 
> View attachment 497916


P ussy died earlier this year.

Bad year for P ussy


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## ColdRider (Oct 19, 2015)

Will the hat protect you from this mammoth?


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## gajala (Sep 1, 2020)

Rural areas can get you slaughtered too lol. I was once chocked from behind by a youthful school young lady however she was tanked and implied it as an embrace type thing yet she put her cheek on my cheek extremely hard and got her cosmetics on me as she removes my air throat. I needed to coercively eliminate her goliath Germanic arm off of me, never realized ladies can be that solid until I persuasively eliminated her from me.


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