# 99% of Those Who Died From Virus Had Other Illness, Italy Says



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says
Plain and simple.

This goes along with what I posted about Italy's recent flu seasons killing 1,833 people each month on average.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1201971219303285


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## Imonous (Jun 18, 2017)

Yeah, it's overblown. But everyone wants something to panic about so whatever.


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

96% in NY.
But, US has a high number of other illness crowd, and most of them are under 60.
BP, Diabetic, Obesity and others. 
39 year old lady from New Orleans died due to other reasons.


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## Invisible (Jun 15, 2018)

Not many people may even know they have an illness though. And I’ve read plenty of stories where healthy people died who weren’t elderly.


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## Imonous (Jun 18, 2017)

Invisible said:


> Not many people may even know they have an illness though. And I've read plenty of stories where healthy people died who weren't elderly.


I know im going to catch some flak for this, but sometimes healthy people also die from the flu. That's never been a reason to destroy the livelihoods of millions of people by plunging ourselves into another Great Depression.


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## 197438 (Mar 7, 2020)

uberdriverfornow said:


> https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says
> Plain and simple.
> 
> This goes along with what I posted about Italy's recent flu seasons killing 1,833 people each month on average.
> ...


Now you finally have a chance to be part of the 1%.


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## x100 (Dec 7, 2015)

I still think there's a lot of unknown as ppl in their 20s and 30s have easily died.

Takes me personally 4-5 days getting over a flu. And normally wait another 5 days before starting exercising. Not looking forward to it.

In other news 101 years old man survives the Corona
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-spanish-flu-survives-coronavirus/2926073001/


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## dauction (Sep 26, 2017)

uberdriverfornow said:


> https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says
> Plain and simple.
> 
> This goes along with what I posted about Italy's recent flu seasons killing 1,833 people each month on average.
> ...


So what..MOST People have at least 1 other aliment .. Less than 5% of the poulation is healthy with no health issues

I*f you're in perfect health, you're in the minority: Less than 5 percent of people worldwide had no health problems in 2013, a new study finds.*

Researchers analyzed information on about 300 diseases and conditions - everything from acne and PMS to chronic conditions such as heart disease and diabetes - and more than 2,300 disease-related consequences, in people in 188 countries.

Overall, just 4.3 percent of people had no health problems, the researchers found. The likelihood of having any disease or condition increased with age: In developed countries, about 64 percent of kids under age 5 had a health problem in 2013, compared with 99.97 percent of adults ages 80 and older.

Often, people had more than one health condition, and about 2.3 billion people worldwide had more than five health ailments. Among people ages 80 and over in developed countries, about 65 percent had five to nine health ailments, and a quarter had 10 or more
https://www.livescience.com/51122-world-health-problems.html


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## waldowainthrop (Oct 25, 2019)

Speculation and open-mindedness is one thing. Confirmation bias is another altogether.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

dauction said:


> So what..MOST People have at least 1 other aliment .. Less than 5% of the poulation is healthy with no health issues
> 
> I*f you're in perfect health, you're in the minority: Less than 5 percent of people worldwide had no health problems in 2013, a new study finds.*
> 
> ...


You're confusing "health problem" with "illness".

Acne is a "health problem" but it's far from an "illness".

Nice try, 'though.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says
> Plain and simple.
> 
> This goes along with what I posted about Italy's recent flu seasons killing 1,833 people each month on average.
> ...


Diabetes seems to be a Major Player.
From info. Being released now.


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

NY- Elmhurst hospital - most of the deaths happening here
2/3 of the people born out of the US
Poor neighborhood.
Most people standing in line next to each other, maybe 1ft distance.
Weather in the 40’s


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## tmart (Oct 30, 2016)

I heard the numbers got fudged in 2009 also. For example people were included in the numbers that just had similar symptoms if I recall correctly


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## dauction (Sep 26, 2017)

uberdriverfornow said:


> You're confusing "health problem" with "illness".
> 
> Acne is a "health problem" but it's far from an "illness".
> 
> Nice try, 'though.


OK lets get specific then...

75 Million Americans have Hypertension









And Then we find early Research that shows that 50% of 170 patients tested that died had hypertension










Hypertension thats just one ailment that is very common ...

*My overall Point is that we are biological beings and very few are actually "Healthy"

Hypertension ,Diabetes , respiratory health issues and heart diseases all very common hundreds of millions with these issues

Yes acne is not one to be concerned about ..congratulations for pointing that out*


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

dauction said:


> OK lets get specific then...
> 
> 75 Million Americans have Hypertension
> View attachment 438680
> ...


many people have high blood pressure nowadays

just because you have high blood pressure doesn't mean you're about to die

and you certainly aren't going to die from a flu virus just because you have high blood pressure

people most likely to die from flu viruses and pnuemonia have respiratory illnesses

https://www.nhsinform.scot/illnesse...s/conditions/high-blood-pressure-hypertension
*"How common is high blood pressure?*
High blood pressure is a common condition, it is estimated that 18% of adult men and 13% of adult women have high blood pressure but are not getting treatment for it."

try harder


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## dauction (Sep 26, 2017)

uberdriverfornow said:


> most people have high blood pressure nowadays
> 
> just because you have high blood pressure doesn't mean you're about to die


Ummmm..CLEARLY 75 Million Americans with High Blood Pressure have a substantially higher risk of Dying if they catch Corona Virus which is NOT the flu and you know it isn't the flu ...you sound like an idiot claiming it is
..


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

dauction said:


> Ummmm..CLEARLY 75 Million Americans with High Blood Pressure have a substantially higher risk of Dying if they catch Corona Virus which is NOT the flu and you know it isn't the flu ...you sound like an idiot claiming it is
> ..
> View attachment 438694


then why aren't more people dying from it ?

75 million americans with high blood pressure and only 1,700 deaths ?

the common flu is laughing at Covid19 as the common flu kills 153 each day

Covid19 aint shit

thanks for playing


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## dauction (Sep 26, 2017)

uberdriverfornow said:


> then why aren't more people dying from it ?
> 
> 75 million people with high blood pressure and only 1,700 deaths ?
> 
> the common flu is laughing at Covid19 as the common flu kills 153 each day


Because people are self quarantining.. as long as they stay away from others they are ok &#8230; IF IF we did not have this quarantine then the death rates would be MUCH MUCH higher...The Virus is looking for Hosts but if the host are staying in their homes the virus will die off

And CLEARLY with a little common sense of the 75 million with hypertension some are strong than others

I wil give oyu thmbs up on the "regular" flu I have for years complained that people don't take it serious enough ..but the reality is it has a death rate of .01% Covid is AT LEAST 10 times deadlier at just the minimum 1%

That is why it has been taken so serious and Shut downs , quarantines have been instituted across the Globe (assure me you believe the earth is round lol ) * It is those measures that are keeping the COVID rates down ..infections and thus deaths.*..


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

dauction said:


> Because people are self quarantining.. as long as they stay away from others they are ok &#8230; IF IF we did not have this quarantine then the death rates would be MUCH MUCH higher...The Virus is looking for Hosts but if the host are staying in their homes the virus will die off
> 
> And CLEARLY with a little common sense of the 75 million with hypertension some are strong than others
> 
> ...


lol you keep moving the goalposts to fit your agenda

find me one article that links covid19 deaths with existing high blood pressure and not existing respiratory issues

the facts are that most people supposedly dying from Covid19 had existing serious respiratory issues as is the case with the common flu, almost always the elderly


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## dauction (Sep 26, 2017)

uberdriverfornow said:


> lol you keep moving the goalposts to fit your agenda
> 
> find me one article that links covid19 deaths with existing high blood pressure and not existing respiratory issues
> 
> the facts are that most people supposedly dying from Covid19 had existing serious respiratory issues as is the case with the common flu, almost always the elderly


Your a troll nothing more..you keep saying the Flu because you think if you keep saying it people will believe it ... You're dangerous and an idiot


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

dauction said:


> Your a troll nothing more..you keep saying the Flu because you think if you keep saying it people will believe it ... You're dangerous and an idiot


thanks for playing

you can fool most of the people most of the time, but you can't fool all of the people all of the time


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

Doctors and Nurses age 60 and higher should not be dealing with CV patients.
Let younger Doctors/ Nurses deal with the patients.


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## dauction (Sep 26, 2017)

Spain has 72,248 cases and 5,690 Deaths 
Germany has 53,340 and just 399 Deaths !

*A sturdy healthcare system*

Germany is in good shape to fight its outbreak because it has a well-developed and comprehensive healthcare system, with both public and private options.

Germany spends $4,714.26 per person each year on healthcare,  according to World Bank data from 2016. The figure is higher than most other nations.

Germany has the second-most critical care beds per capita in Europe, according to data from European Health for All. The beds are essential  when trying to battle severe cases of the coronavirus.

Germany has 621 beds per 100,000 people. Italy has 275, and Spain 293.

"In general, we have a rather good intensive care situation in Germany," German virologist Martin Stürmer  told Vox.

"We have highly specialized doctors and facilities, and maybe that's part of the reason why our severely ill patients survive compared to those in other countries.
*Old people have by and large avoided infection.

The average age of a German infected with coronavirus is 46, whereas in Italy it is 63, according to Wired. *

Older people  are far more likely to die from the coronavirus, and most deaths occur in  those with preexisting health conditions, which are  more common in older people.

80% of all people infected in Germany are younger than 60,  the Robert Koch Institute said on Monday, indicating that the outbreak hasn't yet taken hold in older people, where the risk of death is much higher.

In Spain the number of affected over-60s is around 50%.

In the Uniteds States the Average age is 38 ..so we should have an even lower rate...around 1% death rate ..still 10 times larger than the flu but far better than Spains 8% and Italys 11% death rate


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

Dogs and cats spreading CV. You take your dog to the dog park, dogs gets it or your dog passes on to the next dog.:thumbdown:


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1243650632692662272


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

uberdriverfornow said:


> then why aren't more people dying from it ?
> 
> 75 million americans with high blood pressure and only 1,700 deaths ?
> the common flu is laughing at Covid19 as the common flu kills 153 each day
> ...


COVID-19 is now at 71 Americans dead per day average.

When COVID-19 crosses 153 deaths per day would you reconsider your position?


Italy just crossed 10,000 deaths today.
10,000 deaths in just a little over a month.
They had their first death on February 22.
10,000 dead in a little over a month with the entire country under extreme quarantine conditions.

Most reasonable people can see this is not influenza.


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## Major League (Oct 16, 2014)

36,000 people died in the US from the flu in the 2017/18 season. After three months worldwide we are only at 30,000 dead from corona. 

But 500,000 people on average die per year from the flu. That's about 40,000 per month or 120,000 deaths over 3 months. 

So far and worldwide the flu is 3X deadlier than the Corona Virus. Hm.


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## 2win (Jun 29, 2019)

uberdriverfornow said:


> https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says
> Plain and simple.
> 
> This goes along with what I posted about Italy's recent flu seasons killing 1,833 people each month on average.
> ...


There's a difference between 1800 a month and 1000 a day. The difference is the flu vs covid-19.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.dw...arly-1000-new-deaths-in-single-day/a-52934034


Jon77 said:


> COVID-19 is now at 71 Americans dead per day average.
> 
> When COVID-19 crosses 153 deaths per day would you reconsider your position?
> 
> ...


Actually over 400 American's died yesterday alone.


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

2win said:


> There's a difference between 1800 a month and 1000 a day. The difference is the flu vs covid-19.
> 
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.dw...arly-1000-new-deaths-in-single-day/a-52934034
> 
> Actually over 400 American's died yesterday alone.


 I'm averaging out to get an average daily death rate since the first US casualty on February 29.
This is just beginning to ramp up, these numbers are going to be staggering pretty soon.

And what the deniers are not realizing is that this is the very end of the flu season.
In a few days flu season is done.
From the CDC website.


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## 2win (Jun 29, 2019)

Jon77 said:


> I'm averaging out to get an average daily death rate since the first US casualty on February 29.
> This is just beginning to ramp up, these numbers are going to be staggering pretty soon.
> 
> And what the deniers are not realizing is that this is the very end of the flu season.
> ...


That graph shows the times that month was the peak. Meaning March could be the peak of flu season. Or December or most often February. Peak is not the end of the season, it's when it's worst. Either way we agree deniers need to wakeup. Or compare covid19 to a bigger pandemic like tuberculosis.


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

Major League said:


> 36,000 people died in the US from the flu in the 2017/18 season. After three months worldwide we are only at 30,000 dead from corona.
> 
> But 500,000 people on average die per year from the flu. That's about 40,000 per month or 120,000 deaths over 3 months.
> 
> So far and worldwide the flu is 3X deadlier than the Corona Virus. Hm.


Exponential growth, read about it.



2win said:


> That graph shows the times that month was the peak. Meaning March could be the peak of flu season. Or December or most often February. Peak is not the end of the season, it's when it's worst. Either way we agree deniers need to wakeup. Or compare covid19 to a bigger pandemic like tuberculosis.


In other words we peaked already on the Covid crisis, it's all done.
We're on the down slope now, next month will be less than this month ?


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## 2win (Jun 29, 2019)

Jon77 said:


> In other words we peaked already on the Covid crisis, it's all done.
> We're on the down slope now, next month will be less than this month ?


No clue how you came to that conclusion. We are entering the eye of the storm. It's unfortunately just beginning. Maybe peaking in May. We can hope for some seasonality but lack of immunity is fighting against us in contagion.


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

Here's the big bad tuberculosis pandemic in the United States.
Per the CDC website.










TB killed 515 Americans in ALL of 2017.
TB is a Third World problem, it's not an issue in developed countries.

More than 400 Americans died in the last 24 hours, so what do you think exponential growth has in store for us over the next 24 ?



2win said:


> That graph shows the times that month was the peak. Meaning March could be the peak of flu season. Or December or most often February. Peak is not the end of the season, it's when it's worst. Either way we agree deniers need to wakeup. Or compare covid19 to a bigger pandemic like tuberculosis.


I misunderstood you, sorry.
It just blows me away that people still denying this is even happening.
Mr. Major league obviously has some cognitive issues.


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## 2win (Jun 29, 2019)

Jon77 said:


> Here's the big bad tuberculosis pandemic in the United States.
> Per the CDC website.
> 
> View attachment 438995
> ...


Tuberculosis kills 1.5 million a year worldwide. Including over 200k kids. Its been a problem for 150 years. I don't value American's lives over others. Life is a life.



Jon77 said:


> More than 400 Americans died in the last 24 hours, so what do you think exponential growth has in store for us over the next 24 ?


Likely more than 1k per day by end of the week unfortunately.


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

2win said:


> Tuberculosis kills 1.5 million a year worldwide. Including over 200k kids. Its been a problem for 150 years. I don't value American's lives over others. Life is a life.
> 
> 
> Likely more than 1k per day by end of the week unfortunately.


 Yeah I think you're right, probably Friday or Saturday we're going to have around 1000 deaths a day in the United States from this COVID-19.

But there's still gonna be people that will refuse to even acknowledge the huge elephant in the room.


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## Major League (Oct 16, 2014)

Jon77 said:


> I'm averaging out to get an average daily death rate since the first US casualty on February 29.
> This is just beginning to ramp up, these numbers are going to be staggering pretty soon.
> 
> And what the deniers are not realizing is that this is the very end of the flu season.
> ...


Actually, the first reported case of Corona was on January 20th and many suggest it was here earlier than that. You do realize that both the Corona and the flu are viruses and reported to be negatively impacted by warmer weather? So your graphical argument actually works against you as much as for you.



Jon77 said:


> Here's the big bad tuberculosis pandemic in the United States.
> Per the CDC website.
> 
> View attachment 438995
> ...


Now I know why you wear the helmet in your picture. You do realize that TB is a bacterial infection and Corona is a viral. In some ways they mimic each other but the main difference is that most who have TB need anti bodies. The closest related illness to Corona right now is the flu which is why you will see many comparison pages.

RE: exponential growth
Maybe this will help you. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

We actually had 525 new deaths yesterday but if you scroll to the bottom of the page, you will see that new cases is reported less as compared to the prior day for the last 5 days which indicates nearing the peak of the bell. The numerical gap is lessening, in case you didn't understand.

And if you navigate to Italy's page you will see that they are or at least appear to be at the other side of the bell in new cases reported.

And here is a quote from Dr. Fauci who is part of the President current task force. 
Taken from this article. https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2020/03/03/flu-update

"According to an editorial published in _NEJM_ by Anthony Fauci and Clifford Lane from the *National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases*, and CDC director Robert Redfield, the true death rate for the coronavirus could end up being below 1%, which would make it similar to the death rate seen in a severe flu season."


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

Major League said:


> Actually, the first reported case of Corona was on January 20th and many suggest it was here earlier than that. You do realize that both the Corona and the flu are viruses and reported to be negatively impacted by warmer weather? So your graphical argument actually works against you as much as for you.
> 
> 
> Now I know why you wear the helmet in your picture. You do realize that TB is a bacterial infection and Corona is a viral. In some ways they mimic each other but the main difference is that most who have TB need anti bodies. The closest related illness to Corona right now is the flu which is why you will see many comparison pages.
> ...


 The reported cases are starting to flatten because the whole country is shut down.

No work, no schools, no bars, no restaurants, no concerts, no going out to the beach, no going out to the park.
Maximum and unprecedented shut down of the entire country.

We are not in the flu season now, we should not be experiencing this problem at this time.
Flu season peaks in February, we are going into April now.
Look at the CDC chart for April there's nothing of any importance during normal times, using no containment efforts at all.

Repeat, with - ZERO- efforts to control influenza, April is not normally an influenza month.

During a normal April schools are open, concerts are going on, people are at work, and still influenza is not a major problem.

But this April cases will be going up and deaths will be going up.
We will not see the crest till maybe late spring or early summer.
Social distancing plus warm weather as an ally will hopefully help us get this under control.
God willing.

We are flattening the curve because we are doing something we've never done in our history.


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## Major League (Oct 16, 2014)

Jon77 said:


> The reported cases are starting to flatten because the whole country is shut down.
> 
> No work, no schools, no bars, no restaurants, no concerts, no going out to the beach, no going out to the park.
> Maximum and unprecedented shut down of the entire country.
> ...


Do you just make stuff up as you go along. Flu season goes till the end of April and sometimes longer.

CORONA and FLU are both viruses and historically lose effectiveness as the weather warms.

Corona is still significantly smaller than this years flu in terms of all the statistics.

The flu has caused hundreds of thousands of hospital visits - 500,000 and tens of thousands more deaths.

The flu has caused the death of dozens of children, app. 140 while there are zero from corona.


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

Major League said:


> Do you just make stuff up as you go along. Flu season goes till the end of April and sometimes longer.
> 
> CORONA and FLU are both viruses and historically lose effectiveness as the weather warms.
> 
> ...


CDC making things up.


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## 2win (Jun 29, 2019)

Again buddy, you keep posting this chart but seems you aren't reading it right. The chart says PEAK. @Major League is right, flu season generally ain't over yet. Though it likely already peaked. It's also likely the social distancing measures have had some impact.

The worst would be having the flu, going to get tested or to the doctor and catching covid19.


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

2win said:


> Again buddy, you keep posting this chart but seems you aren't reading it right. The chart says PEAK. @Major League is right, flu season generally ain't over yet. Though it likely already peaked. It's also likely the social distancing measures have had some impact.
> 
> The worst would be having the flu, going to get tested or to the doctor and catching covid19.


 The CDC chart shows that during normal times with a normal influenza, the peak is in February.
Flu season can actually go into beginning of May, that is when the warm weather cuts down on transmission.

The point of this chart is we should have been already on a downward slope trajectory but we clearly are not.

We are not in the heart of flu season now.
And yet COVID-19 is just getting started.

Warm weather and social distancing are our allies, and yet so far it looks like we're still losing this battle.

If this was a normal influenza we would be on a downward trajectory right now, even without having to shut down the whole country.


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## 2win (Jun 29, 2019)

At this point it’s practically hopeless to argue with someone who thinks this is comparable to the flu. Even trump realized he was wrong on that weeks ago.


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

2win said:


> Again buddy, you keep posting this chart but seems you aren't reading it right. The chart says PEAK. @Major League is right, flu season generally ain't over yet. Though it likely already peaked. It's also likely the social distancing measures have had some impact.
> 
> The worst would be having the flu, going to get tested or to the doctor and catching covid19.


 Yeah if I broke my leg I still wouldn't go to the hospital I just get some two by fours and duct tape, fix it myself.

One of my mechanics got tested couple days ago, he was negative.
Of course he came to work the next day so I just hope he didn't catch anything while he was there.


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## Major League (Oct 16, 2014)

Jon77 said:


> The reported cases are starting to flatten because the whole country is shut down.
> 
> No work, no schools, no bars, no restaurants, no concerts, no going out to the beach, no going out to the park.
> Maximum and unprecedented shut down of the entire country.
> ...


I've attached two images. One is from Italy. See how the new cases formed at the top of the bell and is faltering and then dropping. We have the same, actually almost exactly, lead up and see how its wanting to level out?

If you look at the timeline you'll see it lasted about a little more than a month in Italy so we are about a week away from Italy's turn on the curve.


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

Major League said:


> I've attached two images. One is from Italy. See how the new cases formed at the top of the bell and is faltering and then dropping. We have the same, actually almost exactly, lead up and see how its wanting to level out?
> 
> If you look at the timeline you'll see it lasted about a little more than a month in Italy so we are about a week away from Italy's turn on the curve.


 Human intervention plus warm weather is making it harder for this virus to spread.

Both of our countries have completely shut down.
Our factories are idle, our shopping malls are empty, the doors on all the schools are locked, in Italy the military is on the streets.

This virus cannot survive in these conditions.

If we had continued with business as usual there was no way we could flatten the curve.

Unprecedented action by the human species is what's going to defeat this, or at least buy us time till a vaccine is found.


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bl...-says-high-blood-pressure-is-major-death-riskBlood Pressure


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

2win said:


> There's a difference between 1800 a month and 1000 a day. The difference is the flu vs covid-19.
> 
> https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.dw...arly-1000-new-deaths-in-single-day/a-52934034
> 
> Actually over 400 American's died yesterday alone.


still a long way to go before Covid19 gets to 25,000 annual average deaths that the common flu has each year but it sounds like you and the other clown are going to will it all the way there as you pray for more deaths to make yourself look good



Jon77 said:


> The CDC chart shows that during normal times with a normal influenza, the peak is in February.
> Flu season can actually go into beginning of May, that is when the warm weather cuts down on transmission.
> 
> The point of this chart is we should have been already on a downward slope trajectory but we clearly are not.
> ...


the important thing is you are noting that Covid19 is similar to the flu....most flu denyers have a problem admitting that


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

uberdriverfornow said:


> https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says
> Plain and simple.
> 
> This goes along with what I posted about Italy's recent flu seasons killing 1,833 people each month on average.
> ...


Situation A
1833 Italians dying from influenza in one month - with no containment efforts whatsoever

Situation B
1,645 Italian dying just within the past 48 hours from COVID-19 - with the whole country on lockdown.

A denier would say these situations are identical


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Jon77 said:


> Situation A
> 1833 Italians dying from influenza in one month - with no containment efforts whatsoever
> 
> Situation B
> ...


a denier would say you still got 15,000 deaths to hope and pray for before you have the same amount of deaths from the common flu

unlike you, I don't pray people die so that I can look correct

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1201971219303285
"We estimated excess deaths of 7,027, 20,259, 15,801 and 24,981 attributable to influenza epidemics in the 2013/14, 2014/15, 2015/16 and 2016/17,"

furthermore, this assumes more people hopefully weren't passing away in recent years since it only goes as far as 2016-2017


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## 2win (Jun 29, 2019)

Maybe get a source that is more recent 😂 

Praying for u pal and hoping deniers like yourself don’t add to the death total. If we can convince your types to take it serious maybe some lives will be spared.


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

I don’t pray for anybody to die, I want this to be over, I want to go back to work without having to look at every customer as a potential cause of my death.
I don’t want to have experience the Great Depression first hand, I’m OK about reading about it in a book.

But people in power did not take this seriously and now we’re all going to have to pay for this effin ignorance.

Joe Diffie just passed away from Covid a few hours ago.
I don’t want my heroes to start dropping left and right.
I don’t want my friends, family, my wife to drop dead from the shit.

But this could’ve been prevented if people woke the hell up.
This is not your run-of-the-mill influenza.

The damage will be so great to our country this will NEVER be allowed to happen again.

This virus had collaborators, deniers that said there’s nothing to worry about, it’s just a flu.
The Nazi’s had collaborators and this virus had its own collaborators.

Scientist and a medical professionals from around this world were fighting with their hands being restrained by ignoramuses.
They never had a chance.

I want desperately to be wrong, but this trajectory is becoming self evident.

I’m drinking a beer and listening to “prop me up against the jukebox if I die”.

RIP Joe..


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

2win said:


> Maybe get a source that is more recent &#128514;
> 
> Praying for u pal and hoping deniers like yourself don't add to the death total. If we can convince your types to take it serious maybe some lives will be spared.


praying for you and anyone else talking as if more people dying is a good thing



Jon77 said:


> I don't pray for anybody to die, I want this to be over, I want to go back to work without having to look at every customer as a potential cause of my death.
> I don't want to have experience the Great Depression first hand, I'm OK about reading about it in a book.
> 
> But people in power did not take this seriously and now we're all going to have to pay for this effin ignorance.
> ...


the damage to this country is SOLELY coming from the fact that they declared a partial martial law by completely locking it down and telling people they will be charged with a criminal offense if they leave their house and don't treat their neighbors like they have the bubonic plague and try to get people to rat on their neighbor, causing much hate all around for literally NO REASON


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## 2win (Jun 29, 2019)

uberdriverfornow said:


> praying for you and anyone else talking as if more people dying is a good thing
> 
> 
> the damage to this country is SOLELY coming from the fact that they declared a partial martial law by completely locking it down and telling people they will be charged with a criminal offense if they leave their house and don't treat their neighbors like they have the bubonic plague and try to get people to rat on their neighbor, causing much hate all around for literally NO REASON


I'm far from thinking it's a good thing. If I did I wouldn't be at home for weeks already.

The other people fearful of unnecessary death and hospitals being overwhelmed are the vast majority of the world medical and scientific community. It's a shame your church subscribes to some other defiant ideology. Must be tough to live in such an altered reality.


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## 197438 (Mar 7, 2020)

Hospitals/911 should check a patient's social media commentary before sending an ambulance or deciding who gets a ventilator. Anyone dismissing the gravity of the situation at this point should be given a bedroll in a crowded tent outside, a manual ventilator, and hopes and prayers. Pump it yourself if you have the energy, or ask your family to pump it for you without PPE.

Be safe, and call your mom every day.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

EastBayRides said:


> Hospitals/911 should check a patient's social media commentary before sending an ambulance or deciding who gets a ventilator. Anyone dismissing the gravity of the situation at this point should be given a bedroll in a crowded tent outside, a manual ventilator, and hopes and prayers. Pump it yourself if you have the energy, or ask your family to pump it for you without PPE.
> 
> Be safe, and call your mom every day.


When the first amendment is destroyed, we see the real damage this virus has caused.


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

EastBayRides said:


> Hospitals/911 should check a patient's social media commentary before sending an ambulance or deciding who gets a ventilator. Anyone dismissing the gravity of the situation at this point should be given a bedroll in a crowded tent outside, a manual ventilator, and hopes and prayers. Pump it yourself if you have the energy, or ask your family to pump it for you without PPE.
> 
> Be safe, and call your mom every day.


 When the Germans got kicked out of France after World War II, the French people rooted out and shamed the collaborators that had worked with the Nazis.

This virus faced a small but determined resistance organization called science.
Unfortunately too many people decided to become collaborators and actively fight against science, enabling this virus to spread.

Some people say that medical care should be blind, doctors should never differentiate between the suspect who is bleeding out and the police officer who is also in critical condition because he was shot by the aforementioned suspect.

Given limited medical resources it looks like within the next two weeks doctors will have to decide who lives or dies, an 80-year-old with corona will not have the same priority as a 35-year-old with the same disease.

There are people on this website who claimed, and some still claim it's all a hoax, fake news.
There's even some drivers who claim they will spread it to as many people as they can if they get sick, so they can help build up a herd immunity.

If we get to a point where resources run out, doctors, nurses, hospital beds, medicine, ventilators, where do these virus collaborators belong on the priority scale?

I think stupid people should have the freedom to do stupid things, I don't believe in the nanny state protecting the Darwin award winners.
But stupid people should not expect society to bail them out because of their self inflicted stupidity.
Shockingly, sometimes stupidity actually has repercussions.

If you want to go to the beach for spring break with thousands of other idiots, you're free to do so.
If you think this is just a run-of-the-mill influenza, no big deal, you're certainly free to your belief system.
But don't feel now that you're entitled to have the same medical priority as people who genuinely tried to avoid this disease but unfortunately could not.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

Jon77 said:


> When the Germans got kicked out of France after World War II, the French people rooted out and shamed the collaborators that had worked with the Nazis.
> 
> This virus faced a small but determined resistance organization called science.
> Unfortunately too many people decided to become collaborators and actively fight against science, enabling this virus to spread.
> ...


See what panic does. Turns people, who are normally good and decent people who turn into Nazi wannabees.

I'll take the rational view that allowing people to have civil debate outweighs the fear that rages through the masses.


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

BigRedDriver said:


> See what panic does. Turns people, who are normally good and decent people who turn into Nazi wannabees.
> 
> I'll take the rational view that allowing people to have civil debate outweighs the fear that rages through the masses.


 Look I do not want to be disrespectful, that is not my style, I know you are a smart person, but I think you're missing my point.
Also I like the cat in your avatar, I got three of them at home, an animal lover cannot be a bad person in my viewpoint.
I absolutely believe in freedom of speech, without it we will descend into a totalitarian system, our founding fathers made it the first amendment for a reason.
And there was also reason why the second amendment followed the first, without it you could not maintain amendment number one.

I also believe people should be free to do stupid things, if you want to drive without seatbelts do it, if you want to ride a motorcycle without a helmet go ahead, if you want to smoke cigarettes, well knock yourself out.

I don't believe the nanny state should be able to or be required to, protect people from themselves.

We all know hospitals are not going to check peoples comments on social sites.
This is tongue-in-cheek and it comes from a deep seated frustration over what we are all now being needlessly subjected to.
The fact remains it didn't have to go this way if people had listened to the warnings from the scientific community.
It was science versus politics and stupidity, and unbelievably in this country science is the underdog.

And the stupidity was not relegated to one political party, just listen to what the mayor of New York City, De Blasio was staying up till just recently.
When the reporters called him out on his prior BS he tried the classic Trump maneuver.
It never happened, or if it did happen let's not talk about it, let's look forward only.

Still, even now with all the information we now have, and witnessing the stuff we're seeing with out own eyes, the doctors begging for help, the nurses and police officers that are dropping dead from this coronavirus, the US Army actually calling up the ready reseves, the massive and expensive medical ships being positioned in place and getting ready, some people still think this is no big deal, it's all a hoax.
Just a run-of-the-mill influenza.

The warmer weather is going to be our ally, social distancing is going to be our ally, the medical professionals, both military and civilians, fighting on the front lines are our allies, scientists racing to find a vaccine are our allies.

People who ignore the scientists, the doctors and now our belatedly late "leaders', are not doing the human race any favors.

This was not pre-ordained, this situation did not have to happen.


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## 197438 (Mar 7, 2020)

Jon77 said:


> Look I do not want to be disrespectful, that is not my style, I know you are a smart person, but I think you're missing my point.
> Also I like the cat in your avatar, I got three of them at home, an animal lover cannot be a bad person in my viewpoint.
> I absolutely believe in freedom of speech, without it we will descend into a totalitarian system, our founding fathers made it the first amendment for a reason.
> And there was also reason why the second amendment followed the first, without it you could not maintain amendment number one.
> ...


BigRed didn't actually read your post and has an obsessive need to be contrarian. No point in responding.


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## UberLaLa (Sep 6, 2015)




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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

UberLaLa said:


> View attachment 440059


 Thanks for the chart.
I think it's something every driver should look at to kind of gauge your individual risks.
I'm not sure where I fall on that scale I'm in very good health but I had a damage to my left lung back in 91 and had a severe case of pneumonia in 2003.
I'm hoping I still fall into the 1% risk of death category.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

EastBayRides said:


> BigRed didn't actually read your post and has an obsessive need to be contrarian. No point in responding.


You should grow up.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

2win said:


> I'm far from thinking it's a good thing. If I did I wouldn't be at home for weeks already.
> 
> The other people fearful of unnecessary death and hospitals being overwhelmed are the vast majority of the world medical and scientific community. It's a shame your church subscribes to some other defiant ideology. Must be tough to live in such an altered reality.


hospitals aren't being overwhelmed at all

have you noticed the news has made 0 reports from hospitals regarding being "overwhelmed" ?

ive given numerous rides to nurses to and from hospitals and they ALL report nothing out of the ordinary

this is nothing but a normal flu season and a flu virus and everyone is fallin for it


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

Jon77 said:


> Look I do not want to be disrespectful, that is not my style, I know you are a smart person, but I think you're missing my point.
> Also I like the cat in your avatar, I got three of them at home, an animal lover cannot be a bad person in my viewpoint.
> I absolutely believe in freedom of speech, without it we will descend into a totalitarian system, our founding fathers made it the first amendment for a reason.
> And there was also reason why the second amendment followed the first, without it you could not maintain amendment number one.
> ...


That wasn't intended for you. But let's just not allow medical care for anyone who does foolish things like:

No care if you have a speeding ticket

if you ski

Ride a motorcycle? Nope.

drive a car? 10s of thousands die in car accidents each year! No car for you!

It can go on and on and on and on.


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## UberLaLa (Sep 6, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> hospitals aren't being overwhelmed at all
> 
> have you noticed the news has made 0 reports from hospitals regarding being "overwhelmed" ?
> 
> ...


This video is just for you : )






Overcrowding of hospitals will be a bigger issue than it is now, the Isolation measures are helping somewhat, but the main issue is a shortage of Ventilators.


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## TemptingFate (May 2, 2019)

uberdriverfornow said:


> hospitals aren't being overwhelmed at all
> 
> have you noticed the news has made 0 reports from hospitals regarding being "overwhelmed" ?
> 
> ...


https://thebulwark.com/covid-19-is-bigger-than-9-11/


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## 197438 (Mar 7, 2020)

TemptingFate said:


> https://thebulwark.com/covid-19-is-bigger-than-9-11/


Not if you count the dead soldiers in the 18 years since. On a global scale, >200,000 dead for the cost of $6T in response. Not a good comparison, unless you are interested in understanding how the Right can be unconcerned about how many die from COVID-19 in order to save economies.


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## BigRedDriver (Nov 28, 2018)

EastBayRides said:


> Not if you count the dead soldiers in the 18 years since. On a global scale, >200,000 dead for the cost of $6T in response. Not a good comparison, unless you are interested in understanding how the Right can be unconcerned about how many die from COVID-19 in order to save economies.


I have a feeling you would fair poorly in a depressed economy.

Just sayin


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## WAHN (May 6, 2019)

Jon77 said:


> Joe Diffie just passed away from Covid a few hours ago.


Damn. I just hope they honor his wishes.


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## Jon77 (Dec 6, 2018)

WAHN said:


> Damn. I just hope they honor his wishes.


It was a sad Sunday, I was listening to that song and drinking tons of beer.


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