# Calculating Cost to Drive/Expenses?



## prosidius (Dec 7, 2015)

I fell for the Uber kool aid and started driving with them part time. 3 days in I have $161 coming my way minus $12 in gas. Obviously there are other expenses such as oil changes, wear and tear, and time spent. How do you figure these expenses out?

Also, SherpaShare says so far I have a $125 deduction coming. I don't know much about taxes, but does that mean I need to knock $125 off the $161(essentially meaning I made only $36)?


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## MoneyUber4 (Dec 9, 2014)

Thank you for your post.

This is something that many delirious drivers would like to have and think positive about UBER.

The true is that there is a metric.

1) 8 to 12 Hours per day of work.

2) Many drivers are part time, they already have a full time (so they don't care how much they get as extra cash per week).

3) Full time drivers has 8 to 12 hours but master Uber has their minimum ride per mile/minutes already counted.

4) Average pick up to pax take 7 to 10 minutes. Total average ride is 7 to 12 minutes, which make an average net payment of $3 to 8 dollars per ride, Average waiting (dead time) is 15 to 20 minutes.

By adding Pick up time + dead time + ride time = It is averaging 2 rides per hour.

Drivers are making an average $8 to $16 dollars per hour. **Not enough to cover your expenses and wear and tear of the vehicle. 

Now drivers wish to be positive to think positive but the metric is there, not enough time/money to pay for everything that you need to pay.

The end; expenses will catch up to them and might leave them without a car.

Add, UBER is an illegal business. Cops are looking for drivers that are breaking the law.
I have nothing against drivers or techonology but UBER has to fix the problem.


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## UberEddie2015 (Nov 2, 2015)

Prosidius you are pretty smart for asking this question. Most new drivers think its gas and some will add tires, car washes. Most don't even know what there expense per mile is and actaully lose money but use thier vehicle as an ATM. 

How many miles do you do an oil change. Divide oil change cost by miles you drive before getting an oil change and thats your cost per mile. Remember ride share miles are harder on a vehicle than personal miles. Transmission flush/fill and filter change. Radiator flush.fill. Differential drain/refill. Timing belt/Water pump replacement. Belts replacement. Hoses replacement. Spark plug/ wires replacement. Tie rod inner and outer replacement. Struts replacement. Ball joints replacement. Wiper replacement. Exterior light (ex headlights, turn signal), tires, brakes and rotors, battery, starter, alternator. Take the average miles for replacement. Some will be sooner, some will be later. You should have a close figure. Some things like timing belt/water pump is easy to calculate as your car company gives you an idea when it should be changed. Some like brakes will vary a little but realize you will be doing stop and go alot. Depreciation of your vehicle due to all the miles you put on must be calculated for a per mile expense. Don't forget car washes. 

Some tell me thier expense per mile is under 10 cents a mile. They are crazy. most don't even know what thier true figure is. Everyone wants to believe they are making money and they don't want to admit to themselves they are making hardly anything. Some say this expense doesn't apply to me or that expense doesn't apply. Or depreciation doesn't matter. 

Figure out how many miles you drove, take how much you collected (thats not how much you made). Take miles driven and times by expense per mile and subtract from what you collected. Thats your profit.

My real cost to drive was 40 cents per mile. Thats why I don't drive anymore. No money to be made.

When you take miles driven, that is miles when you start driving for the day and subtract that from your mileage once you stopped driving for the day. That includes miles driving to pax, miles driving pax and miles driven to get back to an active area.

Good luck, Merry Christmas and stay safe.


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## Muki (Oct 15, 2015)

UberHammer dropped the best post on this topic: https://uberpeople.net/xfa-blog-entry/how-to-calculate-costs-as-an-uber-driver.23/


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## UberEddie2015 (Nov 2, 2015)

Muki thats a graet post Nicely written. Problem is most don't even know what maintenance is needed. Most don't even know what a strut or inner and outer tie rod is.


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## Muki (Oct 15, 2015)

UberEddie2015 said:


> Muki thats a graet post Nicely written. Problem is most don't even know what maintenance is needed. Most don't even know what a strut or inner and outer tie rod is.


Non-routine maintenance is really hard to account for because it's very random. Some people blow out their transmission in 50,000 miles, some drive 300,000 miles with no transmission issue. There's no way to really predict maintenance costs accurately with that kind of variability. I've owned by car since 2002 so I have an idea how much I spend on maintenance per year. If you haven't had your car that long, there's almost no way of knowing. It's like trying to predict your future health costs from disease.


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## Older Chauffeur (Oct 16, 2014)

I'm not familiar with Sherpa, but I'm guessing that you have entered the miles you drove for Uber and the result is a tax deduction of $125. (Approximately 217 miles) You will list your business use miles on Schedule C on your federal tax return, and deduct 57.5 cents each mile. You should keep a log of all miles you drive for Uber, including "dead" miles.
The deduction covers gas, maintenance, depreciation, etc. In the example you gave, you would pay tax only on the $36.
Disclosure: I am not a tax professional, and you should consult one.


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## prosidius (Dec 7, 2015)

Muki said:


> UberHammer dropped the best post on this topic: https://uberpeople.net/xfa-blog-entry/how-to-calculate-costs-as-an-uber-driver.23/


Thanks. My rough math comes out for driving costing 0.17c a mile but that excludes spark plugs and coolant changes (couldn't find info on that). Also excludes potential breakdowns (since who can predict those)? My 205 miles of driving for Uber thus cost me about $36. $161-36 = $125. According to SherpaShare I drove for 10.6 hours over three days...$125/10.6 = $11.79 /hour I'm making. Far cry from what Uber typically promotes but still higher than my terrible retail job and should still be able to help me pay the bills.

And Older Chauffeur, Sherpa automatically tracks trips/distance/time traveled and gives me the option to classify it as a personal or business trip. It then does the deduction stuff based on that.


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## UberEddie2015 (Nov 2, 2015)

.17 is terribly low. What year make and model auto do you own. If you like I will go thru all items and approx life. I don't iclude costs for a new transmission but I do include transmission fluid flush/fill and filter at 90k-100k miles. Radiator flush and fill at around 90k-100k. I tend to go to the low limit as ride share miles are tough miles. Tires are easy. Cost of tires and wheel alignment every 50k miles. Alignment may be needed sooner as my roads are pretty tough. Only you know that. Belts every 120k. Its not a must but I rather be cautious. If you throw a belt it costs you your days work. Battery every 4 to 5 years. Thats one item that is more time dependent. Timing belt and water pump every 90k miles. Inner and outer tie rods should be replaced every 150 to 200k miles. Struts 150-200k miles. Hoses when you do your belts at 120k. Ball joints 150-200k miles. Spark plugs 100k and spark plug wires every 200k. Starter and alternator should be around 200k. brakes every 50k and rotors can be 50 to 100k depending how you drive. Wheel bearings every 200k. axles cv joimts every 200k. most are probably putting on 50k a year driving so 200k is only 4 years of driving. Don't forget oil changes and gas. Windshield wipers every 6 months. Exterior lights (high intensity lights are expensive). I think I pretty much covered everything. Some expenses might happen sooner and some later. But I believe this to be pretty close. 

Don't forget depreciation. Every vehicle is different. Don't forget car washes. 

I can not tell you your costs. I have worked on cars for 30 years so I have a good idea of expenses. I have not included every item as some will last as long as the car.

Good luck. Merry Christmas. Be safe.


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## Hunt to Eat (Nov 19, 2015)

prosidius said:


> I fell for the Uber kool aid and started driving with them part time. 3 days in I have $161 coming my way minus $12 in gas. Obviously there are other expenses such as oil changes, wear and tear, and time spent. How do you figure these expenses out?
> 
> Also, SherpaShare says so far I have a $125 deduction coming. I don't know much about taxes, but does that mean I need to knock $125 off the $161(essentially meaning I made only $36)?


Average hourly profit driving for Uber is typically $7 to $9.The Uber ads suggesting you can make $25 to $35 per hour is pure, unadulterated equine feces.


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## Muki (Oct 15, 2015)

Hunt to Eat said:


> Average hourly profit driving for Uber is typically $7 to $9.The Uber ads suggesting you can make $25 to $35 per hour is pure, unadulterated equine feces.


The operative word is _can_. Not _will_.

Some drivers do make that much, but they are likely to be driving Black, Select or XL in higher paid markets.


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## MR5STAR (May 18, 2015)

Hunt to Eat Knows what he is talking about. A true Uber legend. A-B-C


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## prosidius (Dec 7, 2015)

UberEddie2015 said:


> .17 is terribly low. What year make and model auto do you own. If you like I will go thru all items and approx life. I don't iclude costs for a new transmission but I do include transmission fluid flush/fill and filter at 90k-100k miles. Radiator flush and fill at around 90k-100k. I tend to go to the low limit as ride share miles are tough miles. Tires are easy. Cost of tires and wheel alignment every 50k miles. Alignment may be needed sooner as my roads are pretty tough. Only you know that. Belts every 120k. Its not a must but I rather be cautious. If you throw a belt it costs you your days work. Battery every 4 to 5 years. Thats one item that is more time dependent. Timing belt and water pump every 90k miles. Inner and outer tie rods should be replaced every 150 to 200k miles. Struts 150-200k miles. Hoses when you do your belts at 120k. Ball joints 150-200k miles. Spark plugs 100k and spark plug wires every 200k. Starter and alternator should be around 200k. brakes every 50k and rotors can be 50 to 100k depending how you drive. Wheel bearings every 200k. axles cv joimts every 200k. most are probably putting on 50k a year driving so 200k is only 4 years of driving. Don't forget oil changes and gas. Windshield wipers every 6 months. Exterior lights (high intensity lights are expensive). I think I pretty much covered everything. Some expenses might happen sooner and some later. But I believe this to be pretty close.
> 
> Don't forget depreciation. Every vehicle is different. Don't forget car washes.
> 
> ...


2009 Civic. I included gas, oil, tires, air & cabin filters, transmission fluid change, cost of the car. Honda basically says "Do this and this, do that when the car tells you to." They don't give a mileage estimate, not even for an oil change. The Civic has a timing chain, so that wont need replacement. I did somehow forget about brakes. I didn't include radiator flush since I heard it's a big no no if it wasn't done routinely. I never thought about the suspension system or the starter & alternator. I kinda assumed you'd replace those when/if they break. I also did forget a battery. I know those are finite as well. I also forgot about tire rotations. Not sure about the cost on any of this stuff.


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## Hunt to Eat (Nov 19, 2015)

prosidius said:


> Thanks. My rough math comes out for driving costing 0.17c a mile but that excludes spark plugs and coolant changes (couldn't find info on that). Also excludes potential breakdowns (since who can predict those)? My 205 miles of driving for Uber thus cost me about $36. $161-36 = $125. According to SherpaShare I drove for 10.6 hours over three days...$125/10.6 = $11.79 /hour I'm making. Far cry from what Uber typically promotes but still higher than my terrible retail job and should still be able to help me pay the bills.
> 
> And Older Chauffeur, Sherpa automatically tracks trips/distance/time traveled and gives me the option to classify it as a personal or business trip. It then does the deduction stuff based on that.


Realistically speaking, $.17 is probably about one-quarter or one-third the actual - as an average for all cars. This is the very mistake nearly every new driver makes - grossly under-estimating actual ops costs.


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## Hunt to Eat (Nov 19, 2015)

prosidius said:


> 2009 Civic. I included gas, oil, tires, air & cabin filters, transmission fluid change, cost of the car. Honda basically says "Do this and this, do that when the car tells you to." They don't give a mileage estimate, not even for an oil change. The Civic has a timing chain, so that wont need replacement. I did somehow forget about brakes. I didn't include radiator flush since I heard it's a big no no if it wasn't done routinely. I never thought about the suspension system or the starter & alternator. I kinda assumed you'd replace those when/if they break. I also did forget a battery. I know those are finite as well. I also forgot about tire rotations. Not sure about the cost on any of this stuff.


I have a Honda Fit. Here's what I've replaced/repaired: A dozen windshields, gas, oil, batteries, tires, clutch, coolant, tie rods, control arms, ****** oil, brakes, body work & paint, window regulator, key fob batteries, windshield wiper motor, wiper blades, direct ignition coils, fuel filters, air filters, cabin filters, gear shift knob, interior detailing, exterior detailing. That's all I can come up off the top of my head.


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## RamzFanz (Jan 31, 2015)

MoneyUber4 said:


> Thank you for your post.
> 
> This is something that many delirious drivers would like to have and think positive about UBER.
> 
> ...


Advice that doesn't consider his actual situation is just not worth anything. None of what you said may be true for him just as it's not for me.

Also, Uber is legal in the vast majority of its markets. They are here where I am (maybe, it's in federal court) and cops don't look for Ubers here, they wave at us or ignore us. I do illegal stuff all the time in front of them, like u turns not at an intersection, and they don't say a word.


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## RamzFanz (Jan 31, 2015)

Hunt to Eat said:


> I have a Honda Fit. Here's what I've replaced/repaired: A dozen windshields, gas, oil, batteries, tires, clutch, coolant, tie rods, control arms, ****** oil, brakes, body work & paint, window regulator, key fob batteries, windshield wiper motor, wiper blades, direct ignition coils, fuel filters, air filters, cabin filters, gear shift knob, interior detailing, exterior detailing. That's all I can come up off the top of my head.


That sounds like one poorly built car. A dozen windshields? What the hell?


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## RamzFanz (Jan 31, 2015)

prosidius said:


> I fell for the Uber kool aid and started driving with them part time. 3 days in I have $161 coming my way minus $12 in gas. Obviously there are other expenses such as oil changes, wear and tear, and time spent. How do you figure these expenses out?
> 
> Also, SherpaShare says so far I have a $125 deduction coming. I don't know much about taxes, but does that mean I need to knock $125 off the $161(essentially meaning I made only $36)?


First, just as you are doing, use your own math. The Sad Sally's on here use false math not based on anything that has anything to do with you.

The answer about making money can't be answered by anyone but you. I could easily not make much at all if I didn't study my market and use sound strategies. Short rides will kill your profit. An expensive vehicle will kill your profit.


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## RamzFanz (Jan 31, 2015)

prosidius said:


> 2009 Civic. I included gas, oil, tires, air & cabin filters, transmission fluid change, cost of the car. Honda basically says "Do this and this, do that when the car tells you to." They don't give a mileage estimate, not even for an oil change. The Civic has a timing chain, so that wont need replacement. I did somehow forget about brakes. I didn't include radiator flush since I heard it's a big no no if it wasn't done routinely. I never thought about the suspension system or the starter & alternator. I kinda assumed you'd replace those when/if they break. I also did forget a battery. I know those are finite as well. I also forgot about tire rotations. Not sure about the cost on any of this stuff.


I don't consider rarely replaced items like starters, alternators, or batteries as line items. I calculate using a $2,000 annual slush fund for those items. It looks like I greatly overestimated those costs as of now.

My costs are at about $.17 a mile with the slush fund included. It's very doable.


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## RamzFanz (Jan 31, 2015)

Hunt to Eat said:


> Average hourly profit driving for Uber is typically $7 to $9.The Uber ads suggesting you can make $25 to $35 per hour is pure, unadulterated equine feces.


We're still waiting for your source. You keep making these claims to drivers as if all costs and payment schedules are the same. I just want to read your source please.


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## MoneyUber4 (Dec 9, 2014)

Moron, you can defend Uber all you want, if that is your dream go for it but drivers are loosing their shirt for this B.S.

Uber is keeping 43% for the fare on local rides.

ex. Hoboken, NJ local trips are charged $5.60
- $1.60 Illegal safe ride fee from Uber (aka Uber Insurance) - now you are left with $4.00
20% (Uber Referral fee) = $1.80

Left for driver to keep $3.20

Drivers are putting, their car, time and expenses.
Uber is putting $.0

And YES, UBER is Illegal in all New Jersey - Drivers have to hide from the police. It is ILLEGAL BUSINESS.


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## UberEddie2015 (Nov 2, 2015)

Moron how many miles do you put on Ubering every year. Or every month. From the mileage when you turn the app on and turn it off. I guess you don't believe in depreciation. A real expense I find the younger drivers do not believe in. If you driving for .75 or less a mile you aren't making min wage.


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## IckyDoody (Sep 18, 2015)

RamzFanz said:


> We're still waiting for your source. You keep making these claims to drivers as if all costs and payment schedules are the same. I just want to read your source please.


I asked him where he got these numbers. He said he helped about fifty uber drivers with their accounting.

Personally, I would think that extrapolating numbers from a such a small sample and then casually and consistently reffering to those numbers as though they are hard facts is dubious.

With that said, he is a good poster and it would be hard to disagree with that $7 to $9 per hour average for uberx. Alot of people are losing money or right around break even.


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## IckyDoody (Sep 18, 2015)

prosidius said:


> Thanks. My rough math comes out for driving costing 0.17c a mile but that excludes spark plugs and coolant changes (couldn't find info on that). Also excludes potential breakdowns (since who can predict those)? My 205 miles of driving for Uber thus cost me about $36. $161-36 = $125. According to SherpaShare I drove for 10.6 hours over three days...$125/10.6 = $11.79 /hour I'm making. Far cry from what Uber typically promotes but still higher than my terrible retail job and should still be able to help me pay the bills.
> 
> And Older Chauffeur, Sherpa automatically tracks trips/distance/time traveled and gives me the option to classify it as a personal or business trip. It then does the deduction stuff based on that.


How much are you charging yourself for depreciation-vehicle replacement cost? How much do think your car would be worth it you sold it today?


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## IckyDoody (Sep 18, 2015)

RamzFanz said:


> My costs are at about $.17 a mile with the slush fund included. It's very doable.


Would you care to offer a breakdown of your costs. If not, what is the year, model, make it your car?


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## IckyDoody (Sep 18, 2015)

Hunt to Eat said:


> Realistically speaking, $.17 is probably about one-quarter or one-third the actual. This is the very mistake nearly every new driver makes - grossly under-estimating actual ops costs.


This is where I think you are prone to exaggeration. If a 2009 civic costs 50 to 70 cents a mile to operate then the operator will lose money in most markets. Now, if the average driver, according to you, is making 7 to 9 bucks an hour then the average driver is operating at a substantially cheaper cost. Most likely at about $.25 to $.35 per mile. Now, I ask you; do you think that an 09 civic costs twice as much to drive as the average ubermobile?

What Is the cost per mile of your fit, if I may ask?


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## prosidius (Dec 7, 2015)

IckyDoody said:


> How much are you charging yourself for depreciation-vehicle replacement cost? How much do think your car would be worth it you sold it today?


The Civic is my second car (had an accident that totaled my first one). The total of the two cars add up to about $10,000 out of pocket costs. I hope to be driving the car for 185,000 miles (when the odometer hits 300K), so about a nickel a mile.

The car if sold today could probobly fetch $7-8K


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## SEAL Team 5 (Dec 19, 2015)

UberEddie2015 said:


> Prosidius you are pretty smart for asking this question. Most new drivers think its gas and some will add tires, car washes. Most don't even know what there expense per mile is and actaully lose money but use thier vehicle as an ATM.
> 
> How many miles do you do an oil change. Divide oil change cost by miles you drive before getting an oil change and thats your cost per mile. Remember ride share miles are harder on a vehicle than personal miles. Transmission flush/fill and filter change. Radiator flush.fill. Differential drain/refill. Timing belt/Water pump replacement. Belts replacement. Hoses replacement. Spark plug/ wires replacement. Tie rod inner and outer replacement. Struts replacement. Ball joints replacement. Wiper replacement. Exterior light (ex headlights, turn signal), tires, brakes and rotors, battery, starter, alternator. Take the average miles for replacement. Some will be sooner, some will be later. You should have a close figure. Some things like timing belt/water pump is easy to calculate as your car company gives you an idea when it should be changed. Some like brakes will vary a little but realize you will be doing stop and go alot. Depreciation of your vehicle due to all the miles you put on must be calculated for a per mile expense. Don't forget car washes.
> 
> ...


Uber Eddie, you are absolutely correct. Out of all the post I've seen, you are the only one to break operating cost down to dollars per mile. Almost everyone else is still dollars per hour. I've been a commercial livery driver in Phoenix for a little over 8 years. I have the proper credentials and insurance to legally operate in AZ. My operating cost run me right at $.62 per mile and that's based on gas at 2.25 per gallon. Gas is about the only expense that fluctuates. Ins, maint and registration are usually consistent. However, we get $2.50 per mile + tips. Our company has been in business for over 14 years. I must say it is nearly impossible to make above minimum wage driving for Uber. Don't forget that you as a driver is one wage and your vehicle is another wage. You should clear at least $1.00 per every mile driven. That includes when no one is in your vehicle on your way to pick up a fare. Good insight Eddie!!!


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## RamzFanz (Jan 31, 2015)

IckyDoody said:


> I asked him where he got these numbers. He said he helped about fifty uber drivers with their accounting.
> 
> Personally, I would think that extrapolating numbers from a such a small sample and then casually and consistently reffering to those numbers as though they are hard facts is dubious.
> 
> With that said, he is a good poster and it would be hard to disagree with that $7 to $9 per hour average for uberx. Alot of people are losing money or right around break even.


Yeah, but he also claims $.54 a mile as a cost which is absurd.

I don't disagree that UberX drivers often don't make what they think. It's a business, you have to drive smart, control your costs, and maximize your profit. Uber is paying too little in many areas, but it's not the same everywhere.


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## RamzFanz (Jan 31, 2015)

SEAL Team 5 said:


> Uber Eddie, you are absolutely correct. Out of all the post I've seen, you are the only one to break operating cost down to dollars per mile. Almost everyone else is still dollars per hour. I've been a commercial livery driver in Phoenix for a little over 8 years. I have the proper credentials and insurance to legally operate in AZ. My operating cost run me right at $.62 per mile and that's based on gas at 2.25 per gallon. Gas is about the only expense that fluctuates. Ins, maint and registration are usually consistent. However, we get $2.50 per mile + tips. Our company has been in business for over 14 years. I must say it is nearly impossible to make above minimum wage driving for Uber. Don't forget that you as a driver is one wage and your vehicle is another wage. You should clear at least $1.00 per every mile driven. That includes when no one is in your vehicle on your way to pick up a fare. Good insight Eddie!!!


Clearing $1 a mile, including dead miles, sounds about right for a full time career luxury vehicle driver. For an UberX driver, that's ridiculous. There would be no UberX if the driver's were clearing $300 a day for an 8 hour shift. This isn't rocket science, it's driving for extra dollars.


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## IckyDoody (Sep 18, 2015)

prosidius said:


> The Civic is my second car (had an accident that totaled my first one). The total of the two cars add up to about $10,000 out of pocket costs. I hope to be driving the car for 185,000 miles (when the odometer hits 300K), so about a nickel a mile.
> 
> The car if sold today could probobly fetch $7-8K


Yeah, 4.3 cents per mile is what I am getting from your numbers


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## Hunt to Eat (Nov 19, 2015)

IckyDoody said:


> This is where I think you are prone to exaggeration. If a 2009 civic costs 50 to 70 cents a mile to operate then the operator will lose money in most markets. Now, if the average driver, according to you, is making 7 to 9 bucks an hour then the average driver is operating at a substantially cheaper cost. Most likely at about $.25 to $.35 per mile. Now, I ask you; do you think that an 09 civic costs twice as much to drive as the average ubermobile?
> 
> What Is the cost per mile of your fit, if I may ask?


Last I checked, which was about a year ago, the Fit (nationally) was 26.8 cents per mile to operate. And, no, I don't exaggerate. As a pragmatist, that doesn't fit (no pun intended) with my personal constitution. A Civic (assuming not an Si model) likely costs considerably less to operate that the average Uber mobile. But keep in mind there are clowns out there driving UberX in Avalanches, four-door Tundras, Yukons, etc. The only way to clear any profit at all is to drive a reliable econobox, like a Fit or a Civic or a Prius.


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## Muki (Oct 15, 2015)

RamzFanz said:


> Clearing $1 a mile, including dead miles, sounds about right for a full time career luxury vehicle driver. For an UberX driver, that's ridiculous. There would be no UberX if the driver's were clearing $300 a day for an 8 hour shift. This isn't rocket science, it's driving for extra dollars.


When you say "clear" a dollar per mile, do you mean a dollar per mile in revenue or in pure profit(after all expenses).


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## UberEddie2015 (Nov 2, 2015)

Thanks Seal Team 5. Guys he is including insurance and reg in his figures. My CPM is right around .40. The problem with an older vehicle is that there is typical higher maint cost then a newer vehicle. But the depreciation is much higher for a new vehicle than an older one. 

Guys rideshare miles are tough miles on your vehicle. Much tougher than personal miles. I forgot some items for the list but they shouldn't add up more than a couple of cents. Run rideshare as a business not as a hobby. No SUCCESSFUL business runs without knowing thier expenses.


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## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

Hunt to Eat said:


> Realistically speaking, $.17 is probably about one-quarter or one-third the actual. This is the very mistake nearly every new driver makes - grossly under-estimating actual ops costs.


For every newbie here who grossly underestimates operating costs there's a poster who grossly overestimates operating costs and underestimates potential fares.


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## Hunt to Eat (Nov 19, 2015)

Coachman said:


> For every newbie here who grossly underestimates operating costs there's a poster who grossly overestimates operating costs and underestimates potential fares.


Exactly, which is why I stick to data, not guesses.


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## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

MoneyUber4 said:


> Drivers are putting, their car, time and expenses.
> Uber is putting $.0


That's funny coming from someone who just called another poster a moron.


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## SEAL Team 5 (Dec 19, 2015)

Muki said:


> When you say "clear" a dollar per mile, do you mean a dollar per mile in revenue or in pure profit(after all expenses).


That is pure profit. Revenue should be around $1.62 per every mile driven, with or without pax. If you use driving as a full time job, you should clear $60,000 per year. Otherwise it's not worth it. Don't forget, you have to upgrade you vehicle every 3 years also. Put $5,000 a year away for that.


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## Hunt to Eat (Nov 19, 2015)

SEAL Team 5 said:


> That is pure profit. Revenue should be around $1.62 per every mile driven, with or without pax. If you use driving as a full time job, you should clear $60,000 per year. Otherwise it's not worth it. Don't forget, you have to upgrade you vehicle every 3 years also. Put $5,000 a year away for that.


$60K driving for Uber?


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## SEAL Team 5 (Dec 19, 2015)

Hunt to Eat said:


> $60K driving for Uber?


No, $60k for driving. Uber is just one company, and from what I read on UberPeople.net, not a very employee friendly at all.


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## Hunt to Eat (Nov 19, 2015)

SEAL Team 5 said:


> No, $60k for driving. Uber is just one company, and from what I read on UberPeople.net, not a very employee friendly at all.


Tru dat! Unless a person is willing to put in 168 hours per week, no one is netting $60k driving for Uber.


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## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

Hunt to Eat said:


> Tru dat! Unless a person is willing to put in 168 hours per week, no one is netting $60k driving for Uber.


No. But you can make a nice little profit, especially driving surge. It beats making lattes at Starbucks.


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## Hunt to Eat (Nov 19, 2015)

Coachman said:


> No. But you can make a nice little profit, especially driving surge. It beats making lattes at Starbucks.


Starbucks provides a few bennies. Uber doesn't. Just sayin'. But I have no desire to sling five-dollar cups of coffee and subject my hands to dishwater all day, that's for sure. At least when I drive Uber I am honoring the memory of a loved one by classifying my labors as community service. I couldn't pull that off with a Starbuck's gig.


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## IckyDoody (Sep 18, 2015)

Hunt to Eat said:


> Exactly, which is why I stick to data, not guesses.


Stating that an 09 civic probably costs 50 to 70 cents a mile to drive is based on data? Ffs, just admit you exaggerated.


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## Hunt to Eat (Nov 19, 2015)

IckyDoody said:


> Stating that an 09 civic probably costs 50 to 70 cents a mile to drive is based on data? Ffs, just admit you exaggerated.


Ffs, when and where did I ever say that it costs 50 to 70 cents per mile to operate an econobox Civic? That's what it costs to run a large SUV, not a Civic. Your '09 Civic costs only slightly more per mile to operate than my '07 Fit, which is just over 26 cents per mile. The only Civic that'd run the kind of money you're talking about would be an Si that visits the track on weekends or the new Civic Type R that comes out in 2016. That's going to be an expensive car to operate, but what do you expect when a little four-popper churns out 310 horsepower? C'mon, IckyDoody, let's work with facts here. You're better than this. We know you are.


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## IckyDoody (Sep 18, 2015)

Hunt to Eat said:


> Ffs, when and where did I ever say that it costs 50 to 70 cents per mile to operate an econobox Civic? That's what it costs to run a large SUV, not a Civic. Your '09 Civic costs only slightly more per mile to operate than my '07 Fit, which is just over 26 cents per mile. The only Civic that'd run the kind of money you're talking about would be an Si that visits the track on weekends or the new Civic Type R that comes out in 2016. That's going to be an expensive car to operate, but what do you expect when a little four-popper churns out 310 horsepower? C'mon, IckyDoody, let's work with facts here. You're better than this. We know you are.


Funny how you edited your post that originally said that the op's cost to drive is probably 3 to 4 times his estimate of 17 cents a mile to add 'as an average of all cars'.

Looking back, I actually have your original statement quoted, pre-edit, on the second page of this thread.


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## UberEddie2015 (Nov 2, 2015)

An average car is not a civic. An average car is a mid size car. On average it should cost 39-41 cent a mile to drive. And this mid size car would be not even close to new. 2008-2009. When you add up driving to pax, driving pax to destination,driving to active area for every mile you drive the pax you have approx 1/2 mile dead head miles. Some people a little more, some people a little less. That takes your CPM that your paid to .58 to .61 for the example above. This is why you can't make money driving Uber, at least in my area.


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## Hunt to Eat (Nov 19, 2015)

UberEddie2015 said:


> An average car is not a civic. An average car is a mid size car. On average it should cost 39-41 cent a mile to drive. And this mid size car would be not even close to new. 2008-2009. When you add up driving to pax, driving pax to destination,driving to active area for every mile you drive the pax you have approx 1/2 mile dead head miles. Some people a little more, some people a little less. That takes your CPM that your paid to .58 to .61 for the example above. This is why you can't make money driving Uber, at least in my area.


Correct. The only way it works, or even comes close to working, is to drive a true econobox like a Fit or a Prius. Otherwise, what seems like profit is merely early cash-out of the vehicle's equity.


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## UberEddie2015 (Nov 2, 2015)

Yeah but who wants to drive a fit as your personal car. I am 6'3. I looked at Prius but the depreciation once your mileage hits 100k is extreme. Thats when the batteries are no longer covered. Gas wise create but you lose it back with depreciation. As the batteries wear down mileage suffers a little. Used civic is probably one of the best.


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## Hunt to Eat (Nov 19, 2015)

UberEddie2015 said:


> Yeah but who wants to drive a fit as your personal car. I am 6'3. I looked at Prius but the depreciation once your mileage hits 100k is extreme. Thats when the batteries are no longer covered. Gas wise create but you lose it back with depreciation. As the batteries wear down mileage suffers a little. Used civic is probably one of the best.


I'm 6'3" and the Fit is actually quite comfortable. The high roofline make it pretty decent - I can even wear my cowboy hat while driving it. I can't do that in my brother's 2014 Civic, and forget about anyone over 5'10" sitting in the backseat. Paxs are always amazed how roomy such a tiny car is. That's because it's just a shrunken minivan. A month ago I gave my Fit to my teenage son when my 2016 Accord Coupe arrived. He and I swap cars on nights I feel like driving. I drove the Fit as a daily driver for my other businesses for 165K miles and it's still running strong. He'll take it to college in two years. Then again, it's a Honda so what did we expect?


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## David Pickett (Nov 2, 2015)

Here's the spreadsheet I am using to track taxable dollars and make a contemporaneous record of miles driven. I use Google Maps to measure home or the last drop off to the pickup point, and the last drop off point to home. Criticisms, questions welcome!


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## DieselkW (Jul 21, 2015)

Break down all your costs, insurance and registration, loan + interest, fuel cost per mile, oil, tires, routine maintenance.... 

All of it can be broken down to cents per mile. 

My car costs about 27 cents per mile to operate. This is a known quantity, not pie in the sky. I've been driving small diesel engine powered VW's for more than 20 years, since it was demonstrated to me that durability and 40+ mpg are the hallmark of those engines. 

Rain-X is more cost effective than windshield wipers.
Driveway car washes are more cost effective than any mechanical washes.
Windex is worth it's weight in tips - clean windows are more important than you think.
Subtle scent of leather or "new car" smell is better than pine.

Maximize your profit - don't drive around without a passenger unless you're going home for the day. 

Don't forget, when you do your taxes, your 1099 includes the TNC commission - you have to deduct that 20% as a payment to the TNC.


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## David Pickett (Nov 2, 2015)

A 1099 that does not report your net with the issuing corporation?


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## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

David Pickett said:


> A 1099 that does not report your net with the issuing corporation?


I didn't believe it at first, either, until I did some google searching. Uber is not a transportation company or a technology company. For IRS purposes they are a "payment processor." According to how they tell it, the rider is paying you the entire fare for your services. Uber's role is simply to transfer you your payment while deducting a fee for their service.


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## ORT (Nov 14, 2015)

Muki said:


> The operative word is _can_. Not _will_.
> 
> Some drivers do make that much, but they are likely to be driving Black, Select or XL in higher paid markets.


No they don't, only in Uber fantasy land.


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## David Pickett (Nov 2, 2015)

But the 1099 should report both numbers, so they can land in the right places. Do I have to tally any numbers related to fares myself?

I just hope it does not trigger AMT.


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## DieselkW (Jul 21, 2015)

I haven't seen one yet, they should be able to download next week. 

If I understand it correctly, they're playing a tax hide and seek game, hoping that drivers will pay tax on the entire fare amount.

It's almost as if we should be issuing Uber/Lyft a 1099 for the commission WE pay THEM.


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