# Uber Drivers Seek to Team Up with Teamsters



## MikesUber (Oct 23, 2015)

Labor union says it has received "overwhelming outreach" from Uber drivers seeking benefits and a stronger voice on the job.

Source: http://www.cnet.com/news/uber-drivers-seek-to-team-up-with-teamsters/

April 22, 20163:19 PM PDT

A day after Uber settled a pair of class action lawsuits over how it classifies drivers, the Teamsters said it plans to form an association for ride-share drivers in California.

The labor union said Friday it has received "overwhelming outreach" from Uber drivers seeking benefits, dispute resolution and a stronger voice on the job.

"We welcome any Uber drivers seeking to improve their working conditions," said Rome Aloise, president of Teamsters Joint Council 7, in a statement. "By coming together, the Teamsters will help these drivers have a stronger voice and improve standards for rideshare drivers in California."

Under the recent settlement with drivers in California and Massachusetts, which still needs to be approved by a judge, Uber drivers will remain independent contractors. This means the company is not responsible for all sorts of costs, including Social Security, health insurance and overtime. However, among the changes in the settlement is a requirement that Uber recognize a drivers association in both states.

The Teamsters already formed an association for Uber drivers in Seattle under the App-Based Drivers Association, and has organized drivers at tech companies throughout Silicon Valley, including Facebook, Apple, Google and Yahoo.

Uber said this does not affect the settlement.


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## Squirming Like A Toad (Apr 7, 2016)

Doesn't make much sense. So we send money to the Teamsters, and we get...? 

When you work for a union they control everything about your job, and they obviously can't do that when we are responsible for our own cars and our own working times and places. Nobody forces us to take a fare and if a union driver doesn't some other driver will.

All this will end up doing is making the Teamsters a de facto regulatory authority over rideshare and independent drivers won't be allowed, you'll end up having to drive for a company they control that will be no different than a taxi company.


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## AllenChicago (Nov 19, 2015)

Can the Teamsters force all drivers who pay their monthly dues to display a sticker on their window under the Uber sticker? In effect, strong-arming all drivers to join the union, because the drivers who don't have this sticker are subjecting their cars to mysteriously being vandalized with spray paint, or something.


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## Squirming Like A Toad (Apr 7, 2016)

AllenChicago said:


> Can the Teamsters force all drivers who pay their monthly dues to display a sticker on their window under the Uber sticker? In effect, strong-arming all drivers to join the union, because the drivers who don't have this sticker are subjecting their cars to mysteriously being vandalized with spray paint, or something.


That's what concerns me too, what's going to happen to the drivers who choose not to be in the union? I don't know if they would resort to the violent tactics because that would be hard to pull off and squaring off with drivers on the road would be risky, but they do do the same thing with regulation, just get the state to impose regulation so you can't practically be a union driver without driving for one of their outfits.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

How about Teamsters steps in and sends a "friend of the court" brief regarding this ridiculous settlement to the court exposing it for the joke it is ? Then after helping us to force the lawyer to litigate this and get us employee status we will agree to make Teamsters our union ?


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## Squirming Like A Toad (Apr 7, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> How about Teamsters steps in and sends a "friend of the court" brief regarding this ridiculous settlement to the court exposing it for the joke it is ? Then after helping us to force the lawyer to litigate this and get us employee status we will agree to make Teamsters our union ?


Why would you want to be an employee of Uber? When you're an employee they tell you what to do, how to do it, when to do it, and where to do it. Might as well apply to a cab or limo company then, they'll even provide the car. The benefit of being an IC is you drive in the times and places that work best for you, and by being smarter than a big company about controlling expenses you can be more profitable.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Squirming Like A Toad said:


> Why would you want to be an employee of Uber? When you're an employee they tell you what to do, how to do it, when to do it, and where to do it. Might as well apply to a cab or limo company then, they'll even provide the car. The benefit of being an IC is you drive in the times and places that work best for you, and by being smarter than a big company about controlling expenses you can be more profitable.


Are you being serious?

Why do I want to be an employee?

Probably because I want better pay. Probably because I want to be reimbursed for my vehicle expenses which will ONLY happen if I'm an employee. I have done about 1200 trips since I started in November. As an employee doing pizza delivery any employee gets, on average. atleast $1.50 a delivery. That means I would have already have been paid $1800. Maybe you're happy not getting anything, but I am not.

Then there's working conditions. As it stands now, Uber can do what it wants when it wants. We get no say. Without being an employee, we get no protections to becoming a union member. The only way we get a say is if we become an employee and form a union. We can't count on Uber doing anything good for us until we become an employee.

Having the "flexibility" of turning the app on when I want ? Who the hell gives a shit if you're making peanuts? Who the hell gives a shit if you can't earn a living? Furthermore, there is nothing that says that we can't still have that option even if we are employees. Uber is brainwashing you into thinking that they simply can't keep that option while we are employees. They are brainwashing you into giving up everything in order to be able to turn the app on and off when you want.

I could go on and on about the virtues of being an employee. This joke of a settlement specifically states that these stupid drivers associations are not unions and can't collectively bargain. That means they mean nothing and have NO TEETH WHATSOEVER. That's exactly what Uber wants.

So yeah if you want Uber to keep cutting rates and not paying you reimbursements then yeah of course you want to be an independent contractor with no employee benefits and protections.

This is all common sense and only a moron or an Uber shill or a taxi cab driver wants us to be an independent contractor.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Furthermore, maybe you like how Uber keeps raising the booking fee and lowering the rates ? I don't. That will never change until we are a union. It will continue to change in Uber's favor until we stop it with a union contract.


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Are you being serious?
> 
> Why do I want to be an employee?
> 
> ...


People with different opinions than you are not morons or shills.

Not sure if the above article has this quote, but check the USA Today article.

http://usat.ly/1SzN3bg



> Though, according to the Teamsters, not all drivers actually want to be employees.
> 
> "We've talked to drivers that are trying to make it a full time job and would probably love to be employee but we've also talked to people -frankly the majority of them - who don't want to work full time and don't want to be employees. There's no unanimity of opinion on this issue," said Aloise.


So there you have it. The union that you want to head the drivers association has already looked into it and found it the majority of drivers don't want to be employees.


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## Chicago88 (Feb 7, 2016)

Getting public awareness around how deceitful Uber is would be much more effective than a union. Higher pay isn't going to be a part of the rideshare world. Lower pay and lower quality of drivers/cars is what pax want - yes, lower quality car is what pax want because that comes automatically with lower quality driver... Select and black car will always have a market but Uber X is going to be beat up cars with sketchy drivers, you can see that already starting.


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

Chicago88 said:


> Getting public awareness around how deceitful Uber is would be much more effective than a union. Higher pay isn't going to be a part of the rideshare world. Lower pay and lower quality of drivers/cars is what pax want - yes, lower quality car is what pax want because that comes automatically with lower quality driver... Select and black car will always have a market but Uber X is going to be best up cars with sketchy drivers, you can see that already starting.


Let's see. If drivers, collectivity, wanted to increase awareness about Uber's practices... Or if they even wanted the ability to know that they collectively decided to do something at all... Would need two things: 1) an ability to collect money and 2) an organization of some sort...

If only there was an organization that did those sorts of things...

Disclosure: I'm not currently for or against a union or association. I'm leaning in the direction of being for it but I'd want to see what it turns out to be before deciding. Teamsters would definitely get press for drivers. It's what they do. They would also take money to do that and I would want to know how much before I decided if it was worth it.


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

Squirming Like A Toad said:


> Might as well apply to a cab or limo company then, they'll even provide the car.


Here, the cab drivers are not employees of the cab companies. They affiliate with a company by contract. Either they own or rent their cabs. While many of the limousine drivers here are employees, not all are. Some have their own limousines and do work for this or that limousine company under contract.



uberdriverfornow said:


> only a or a taxi cab driver wants us to be an independent contractor.


I drive a taxicab and I do not care whether or not you are an employee of Uber, Lyft, Split or Honest Alfie's TNC service. For my purposes, I would prefer to remain an independent contractor, because it allows me to drive the UberX car (with its concommitant substandard rates)only when the cab is out of service or I think that it will be an excessively slow cab day and I drive the UberX car as substandard pay is better than no pay. I do not want Uber's telling me to leave the cab and its acceptable rates parked while I drive the UberX car for its substandard rates.


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## Chicago88 (Feb 7, 2016)

Undermensch said:


> Let's see. If drivers, collectivity, wanted to increase awareness about Uber's practices... Or if they even wanted the ability to know that they collectively decided to do something at all... Would need two things: 1) an ability to collect money and 2) an organization of some sort...
> 
> If only there was an organization that did those sorts of things...


I appreciate the humor - point taken. But we don't really need a union...there's not enough money to steal from Uber drivers for any union to care. But I do believe the small protests I've seen if continued could bring some change.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

MikesUber said:


> Labor union says it has received "overwhelming outreach" from Uber drivers seeking benefits and a stronger voice on the job.
> 
> Source: http://www.cnet.com/news/uber-drivers-seek-to-team-up-with-teamsters/
> 
> ...


Coming soon :a ride you won't forget !


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Undermensch said:


> People with different opinions than you are not morons or shills.
> 
> Not sure if the above article has this quote, but check the USA Today article.
> 
> ...


That's called being uninformed. Those drivers that don't want to be employees better be careful what they wish for.

My job is to inform all drivers what the full ramifications are for not being employees. It is only going to get worse if we don't wind up winning this lawsuit.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Another Uber Driver said:


> Here, the cab drivers are not employees of the cab companies. They affiliate with a company by contract. Either they own or rent their cabs. While many of the limousine drivers here are employees, not all are. Some have their own limousines and do work for this or that limousine company under contract.
> 
> I drive a taxicab and I do not care whether or not you are an employee of Uber, Lyft, Split or Honest Alfie's TNC service. For my purposes, I would prefer to remain an independent contractor, because it allows me to drive the UberX car (with its concommitant substandard rates)only when the cab is out of service or I think that it will be an excessively slow cab day and I drive the UberX car as substandard pay is better than no pay. I do not want Uber's telling me to leave the cab and its acceptable rates parked while I drive the UberX car for its substandard rates.


You won't have to leave your cab. Don't let Uber trick you into thinking that you will have to leave with that blackmail argument. It's a total spin job much like their spin job on telling people you can't be an employee AND still be able to turn the app on and off when you want.


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## ubershiza (Jan 19, 2015)

Hoffa wouldn't be caught dead in an uber!


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Chicago88 said:


> I appreciate the humor - point taken. But we don't really need a union...there's not enough money to steal from Uber drivers for any union to care. But I do believe the small protests I've seen if continued could bring some change.


Yes we do. Only a union contract prevents Uber from doing what they want, when they want, how they want. Period. End of story.

Or do you plan on using some Jedi mind tricks on them ?


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Undermensch said:


> People with different opinions than you are not morons or shills.
> 
> Not sure if the above article has this quote, but check the USA Today article.
> 
> ...


Furthermore, that article specifically states that NOT ALL drivers want to be employees, not that THE MAJORITY OF THE DRIVERS as you claim.

Don't lie just to spin your point.

Some people have been brainwashed into hating unions by Republicans.

Paying union dues is a small price to pay to have great benefits and pay through a contract that Uber can't just change at will.


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## Squirming Like A Toad (Apr 7, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Are you being serious?
> 
> Why do I want to be an employee?
> 
> ...


You can do whatever you want. I have no desire to be an employee of Uber, nor to join the Teamsters. This is a part-time gig for me and I drive when, what, and where it is profitable for _me. _Companies do not hire employees for the benefit of the employee and if I worked for Uber the conditions would be the ones most profitable for Uber, not me. If I had to pay a cut to the union thugs as well it would be unlikely to be as good a deal as I have now.

Remember there is no free lunch, anytime or anywhere. Driving expenses are real and will never go away, and we will not be "reimbursed" for expenses, it will just come out of our pay some other way. At least as IC's we are able to use our brains to reduce our expenses, and a big company has expenses that we don't.

How are you making $1800 in 1200 trips? At my rate 1200 trips is over $8K, net. Obviously you're not doing it right.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Did you even bother to actually read that first paragraph ? I'm talking about reimbursements. 1200 x $1.50 per delivery = $1800.

It's a rough estimate to how much we should be receiving if we were employees and got some sort of reimbursement.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

I challenge each and every one of you to go out and find someone in a union job and ask them about their benefits and pay. I can almost guarantee they they have great pay and great medical benefits, probably 401k with possible match, etc etc.

Yes, we'd love to not have to pay for the benefits of a union contract but unfortunately we live in a real world, not a utopia. 

If you think Uber is going to give you the same benefits that a union contract would, you really are living in a utopia.

Go ask Walmart workers what kind of benefits they have.


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## Squirming Like A Toad (Apr 7, 2016)

The union workers I know are government workers and they all think their job sucks. Unions have their priorities too, and it's not us. What do you think they are, a bunch of philanthropists? A little envelope to the union official and management can still do whatever they want, and you have even less recourse.

The Uber system as we know it cannot exist as a service relying on union employees. They can take their ball and go home in any market that tries imposing that. If you are looking for full-time, career employment maybe this isn't for you, I'm just filling up my retirement fund with it.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Squirming Like A Toad said:


> The union workers I know are government workers and they all think their job sucks. Unions have their priorities too, and it's not us. What do you think they are, a bunch of philanthropists? A little envelope to the union official and management can still do whatever they want, and you have even less recourse.
> 
> The Uber system as we know it cannot exist as a service relying on union employees. They can take their ball and go home in any market that tries imposing that. If you are looking for full-time, career employment maybe this isn't for you, I'm just filling up my retirement fund with it.


Hey, if you're cool with no benefits and low pay and stressful working conditions that's your choice. Nobody said you have to want things most drivers want.


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## Squirming Like A Toad (Apr 7, 2016)

Side job. None of these things are free, and if somebody wanted to offer me benefits I'd rather make a deal with him and just take the cash.


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> That's called being uninformed. Those drivers that don't want to be employees better be careful what they wish for.
> 
> My job is to inform all drivers what the full ramifications are for not being employees. It is only going to get worse if we don't wind up winning this lawsuit.


Nothing to do with being uninformed. You might be a little pompous if you truly think that.


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

Chicago88 said:


> I appreciate the humor - point taken. But we don't really need a union...there's not enough money to steal from Uber drivers for any union to care. But I do believe the small protests I've seen if continued could bring some change.


Fair enough and glad you got that I was messing with you 

I'm with you. I could see that a union could help and I could see that it could suck. I'm indecided at the moment. I'm still making plenty of money so I'm not really sweating it.


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## 5StarPartner (Apr 4, 2015)

Am I the only one here thinking if drivers are stupid enough to drive for $5 an hour and destroying their cars.... They'd be pretty bad at forming a union.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Undermensch said:


> Nothing to do with being uninformed. You might be a little pompous if you truly think that.


Not pompous at all. It's called tough love.

I can easily sit here making $1000 a week and not care about a single driver in Detroit or Tampa making 24 cents a mile, but I can't do that. Just because I make 85 cents a mile doesn't mean I'm not going to try to help all the drivers, especially the ones being especially screwed over by Uber.

You may not care at all what happens to anyone but yourself. I am not the same way.

It's called a taste of reality. Someone needs to be the real voice of the drivers.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

5StarPartner said:


> Am I the only one here thinking if drivers are stupid enough to drive for $5 an hour and destroying their cars.... They'd be pretty bad at forming a union.


We can sit here and do nothing or we can have a voice. We can bury our heads in the sand and take all of Uber's shenanigan's or we can voice our opinion and try to change it for the better.

You don't form a union, there are many unions out there that will happily represent us.


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Not pompous at all. It's called tough love.
> 
> I can easily sit here making $1000 a week and not care about a single driver in Detroit or Tampa making 24 cents a mile, but I can't do that. Just because I make 85 cents a mile doesn't mean I'm not going to try to help all the drivers, especially the ones being especially screwed over by Uber.
> 
> ...


Your answer has nothing to do with employee vs contractor status.

What you aren't realizing is that being a contractor has huge tax benefits for many of us. If I was an employee I would lose 30% of what I'm making now.

I'm also making $18/hour after all expenses. I am certainly not interested in making minimum wage + mileage reimbursement. No thanks.

If you want to be the real voice of drivers you can't just pick the smaller group of drivers that want to be employees, support their cause, and claim that the majority of drivers are therefore idiots. I mean, you can, but you'll not be the voice of drivers at that point.


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> We can sit here and do nothing or we can have a voice. We can bury our heads in the sand and take all of Uber's shenanigan's or we can voice our opinion and try to change it for the better.
> 
> You don't form a union, there are many unions out there that will happily represent us.


They actually can't right now, not as a union at least. Unions aren't allowed for independent contractors because the government sees price negotiations in that case as price fixing.

That's why the unions are only able to form associations of drivers. It's not quite clear if they could get automatic signups and dues or whether they could call strikes, etc. Could take years to sort out how they will work.


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## JaniceCT (Aug 20, 2015)

unions and teamsters are scum. only interested in collecting more union dues. stay away!


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## I_Like_Spam (May 10, 2015)

I don't see how this is really going to be a benefit for Uber drivers, but I still can see it coming down due to Uber's progressive reputation.


Basically, Uber would deduct 5% of the fares and send the money to the Teamsters union. The Teamsters would lobby with the state legislatures and Uber executives to try and get the drivers a better deal. The downside is that if a driver complained to Uber, they'd tell you that the Teamsters are your exclusive representative so they wouldn't be allowed to talk to you.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

ubershiza said:


> Hoffa would be caught dead in an uber!


Hoffa, hasn't been caught dead anywhere . . .
He may be in Cuba sipping Pina Colodas . . .


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

I_Like_Spam said:


> I don't see how this is really going to be a benefit for Uber drivers, but I still can see it coming down due to Uber's progressive reputation.
> 
> Basically, Uber would deduct 5% of the fares and send the money to the Teamsters union. The Teamsters would lobby with the state legislatures and Uber executives to try and get the drivers a better deal. The downside is that if a driver complained to Uber, they'd tell you that the Teamsters are your exclusive representative so they wouldn't be allowed to talk to you.


And then . . . they have "Right to Work" States . . .How many here have been in a Union before ?


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

AllenChicago said:


> Can the Teamsters force all drivers who pay their monthly dues to display a sticker on their window under the Uber sticker? In effect, strong-arming all drivers to join the union, because the drivers who don't have this sticker are subjecting their cars to mysteriously being vandalized with spray paint, or something.


Unions don't do that sort of thing.

Union members perhaps , but not Unions.


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## I_Like_Spam (May 10, 2015)

AllenChicago said:


> Can the Teamsters force all drivers who pay their monthly dues to display a sticker on their window under the Uber sticker? In effect, strong-arming all drivers to join the union, because the drivers who don't have this sticker are subjecting their cars to mysteriously being vandalized with spray paint, or something.


I don't see that kind of thing coming down in 2016, maybe in the 1950's or 60's, but not today. Union members aren't that aggressive nowadays, or maybe there just aren't that many true believers.

Besides, the union would be collecting their agency fee upfront, and straight from the Uber treasury, it wouldn't be their top priority to get your heart and soul into the effort, since they will already have the cash.


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## Trebor (Apr 22, 2015)

AllenChicago said:


> Can the Teamsters force all drivers who pay their monthly dues to display a sticker on their window under the Uber sticker? In effect, strong-arming all drivers to join the union, because the drivers who don't have this sticker are subjecting their cars to mysteriously being vandalized with spray paint, or something.


I would be willing to have 50 cents deducted from each ride to be paid to the teamsters in exchange for their services. Sure my pay would go down 50 cents but the teamsters need to have a a pretty sizable war chest to go fight Uber for drivers. Those min. rides will suck even more, but having a organization like teamsters, there is a real possibility that they can strong arm Uber to raising the min ride price.


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## Tequila Jake (Jan 28, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> That's called being uninformed. Those drivers that don't want to be employees better be careful what they wish for.
> 
> My job is to inform all drivers what the full ramifications are for not being employees. It is only going to get worse if we don't wind up winning this lawsuit.


Have you been informed of the ramifications of being an employee? It is common practice for employers to forbid employees to work for a direct competitor. Uber can define Lyft, any taxi company, any delivery service as a competitor even if Uber's service is not in your market.

They definitely won't permit you to simultaneously work multiple companies at the same time.

They can regulate your hours. They say you can only work 29 hours and get no benefits. 29 hours they control at minimum wage but golly gee, you get gas money.

Is that really what you want?


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## Tequila Jake (Jan 28, 2016)

Trebor said:


> I would be willing to have 50 cents deducted from each ride to be paid to the teamsters in exchange for their services. Sure my pay would go down 50 cents but the teamsters need to have a a pretty sizable war chest to go fight Uber for drivers. Those min. rides will suck even more, but having a organization like teamsters, there is a real possibility that they can strong arm Uber to raising the min ride price.


50 cents per ride is an insane amount of money, especially since it will come out after Uber's cut. My cut of a minimum fare ride would go from $2.85 to $2.35, an 18% pay cut with no guarantee of any increase.

I drive part time, about 100-150 rides per month, and would not be willing to pay $600-$900 per year.


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## I_Like_Spam (May 10, 2015)

Tequila Jake said:


> 50 cents per ride is an insane amount of money, especially since it will come out after Uber's cut. My cut of a minimum fare ride would go from $2.85 to $2.35, an 18% pay cut with no guarantee of any increase.
> 
> I drive part time, about 100-150 rides per month, and would not be willing to pay $600-$900 per year.


Whether or not you think its a good deal or not, $600-$900 a year is about average for union dues in this country in 2016. Its not an "insane" amount of money, but instead a rather ordinary amount. Last year I paid $800 in dues at my regular job.


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## Archie8616 (Oct 13, 2015)

Another Uber Driver said:


> Here, the cab drivers are not employees of the cab companies. They affiliate with a company by contract. Either they own or rent their cabs. While many of the limousine drivers here are employees, not all are. Some have their own limousines and do work for this or that limousine company under contract.
> 
> I drive a taxicab and I do not care whether or not you are an employee of Uber, Lyft, Split or Honest Alfie's TNC service. For my purposes, I would prefer to remain an independent contractor, because it allows me to drive the UberX car (with its concommitant substandard rates)only when the cab is out of service or I think that it will be an excessively slow cab day and I drive the UberX car as substandard pay is better than no pay. I do not want Uber's telling me to leave the cab and its acceptable rates parked while I drive the UberX car for its substandard rates.


...Question, are you able to drive your taxi and just log in and start taking Uberx requests? I remember someone saying they requested an Uber, but the taxi showed up.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Undermensch said:


> Your answer has nothing to do with employee vs contractor status.
> 
> What you aren't realizing is that being a contractor has huge tax benefits for many of us. If I was an employee I would lose 30% of what I'm making now.
> 
> ...


It's not just about you, it's about all the drivers, even the ones in Detroit and Tampa making 24 cents a mile.

Nothing stopping Uber from taking a 50% commission starting tomorrow.

You think it's great now. Wait til Uber pulls the rug out from under you.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Undermensch said:


> They actually can't right now, not as a union at least. Unions aren't allowed for independent contractors because the government sees price negotiations in that case as price fixing.
> 
> That's why the unions are only able to form associations of drivers. It's not quite clear if they could get automatic signups and dues or whether they could call strikes, etc. Could take years to sort out how they will work.


Not sure what it is you're trying to say here since everything you're saying is wrong

It doesn't sound like you've ever had a union job. I've had several union jobs in my life and I never have had anything less than great pay and outstanding benefits. I think you've been drinking the Republican union-busting kool-aid.


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## Slavic Riga (Jan 12, 2016)

Squirming Like A Toad said:


> The union workers I know are government workers and they all think their job sucks. Unions have their priorities too, and it's not us. What do you think they are, a bunch of philanthropists? A little envelope to the union official and management can still do whatever they want, and you have even less recourse.
> 
> The Uber system as we know it cannot exist as a service relying on union employees. They can take their ball and go home in any market that tries imposing that. If you are looking for full-time, career employment maybe this isn't for you, I'm just filling up my retirement fund with it.


Yup. Being a Government Employee/workers will say their jobs sucks, because they don't like completing the jobs they are doing & all of them have or do
P/T gigs. They dig a hole & want contractors to fill it up. Hence, their jobs sucks.

*Have you noticed what happens when City managers & City try or have tried Firing or getting rid of a CITY/GOVT. WORKER or CONTRACT. The workers UNION & UNION DUES COME INTO PLAY to save their jobs, they don't do. *
Did they mention this to you. Of Course it was not mentioned. City workers are lazy.
We, Drivers work hard. Don't open app, no ping no money but, we are always cheated by Uber on our earnings, through lower fares, higher commissions & bullied with deactivation for not accepting pings or acceptable ratings. Some Riders don't even rate drivers & it goes against us.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Tequila Jake said:


> Have you been informed of the ramifications of being an employee? It is common practice for employers to forbid employees to work for a direct competitor. Uber can define Lyft, any taxi company, any delivery service as a competitor even if Uber's service is not in your market.
> 
> They definitely won't permit you to simultaneously work multiple companies at the same time.
> 
> ...


I've had several jobs in my life working for competitors. There's no law anywhere preventing anyone from working for a competing conpany.

You've been drinking the Uber kool-aid that they've been blackmailing drivers by threatening to prevent you from working a competitor in order to strong arm you into staying as an independent contractor.

The only jobs where they would require you from working for a competitor is an executive position. It's safe to assume none of us are executives making salaries where they would not want us to reveal trade secrets to a competitor.


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## Russ Reed (Mar 30, 2016)

Do YOU REALLY get 25% taken off PLUS dues to Teamsters. Please think this stuff through


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

JaniceCT said:


> unions and teamsters are scum. only interested in collecting more union dues. stay away!


I'm sorry you think union workers should be working for free.

You live in a real world where people actually get paid to do things. Clearly you think you should get paid to do your job but union workers who fight to negotiate a good union contract with great pay and great benefits and worker protections should get nothing for their services but that's not how it works in the real world.


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## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

Archie8616 said:


> ...Question, are you able to drive your taxi and just log in and start taking Uberx requests? I remember someone saying they requested an Uber, but the taxi showed up.


Some taxi-hater UberX driver in Vermont posted that some time back. I have heard some of my customers mention similar.

Uber offers taxis, here, which it does not offer anywhere in Colorado. When you choose Uber Taxi (you slide the thing to the extreme right, here) you summon a regular, licenced taxicab driven by a driver with a hack licence. It is the same kind of taxi that you would hail on the street or call for on a telephone (or, in some places, summon by e-Hail application, such as Curb, Uber Taxi, Hail-o [Europe and Asia, only], [email protected] or Arro, to name a few). You summon and pay for your taxicab through the Uber application, just as you would do with any other Uber. I have Uber Taxi.

On taxis covering UberX calls: A little while back, here, Uber ran an experiment for one Morning Rush Hour, only. It invited Uber Taxi drivers to log in and opt in to accept UberX trips. It offered some nice guarantees and easy-to-meet conditions. There were some legal problems with it. I did send a rather long e-Mail to Uber about it with a *PLEASE ESCALATE* in the subject line. The outsourced CSR who read it must have done that, because someone in Management did see it and actually *called me on the telephone*(!). I tried several times to return his call, but he never did respond. Finally, I received the usual canned, non-answer from someone who may or may not have been outsourced. As the Management person would not return my call, and, as I received a canned, non-answer, I let drop the matter. Uber has not repeated the experiment, although I do expect that it will recur, at some point.

Truthfully, it is not a bad idea. Uber would have to continue its guarantees. It would not go well on Uber Pool, either. The most important thing would be that it would have to clear it with all of the regulators in the Washington Metropolitan Area. It would need to address the "high-flagging" issue in the District of Columbia. It would need to address the issues in Virginia of: 1) registering out of state taxicabs with the Commonwealth as TNC vehicles and 2) a District taxicab's picking up and dropping in the Commonwealth of Virginia, even if it is not doing taxicab work. In the State of Maryland, the issues would be the same as Number Two in Virginia as well as allowing a taxicab to do TNC work. Maryland is planning to register and licence drivers, not vehicles, although it will be keeping vehicle information. There is a further potential problem in Prince George's County, Maryland: to keep it brief, cab here can pick up outside of their jurisdiction if the customer is returning to the jurisdiction where the cab is licenced. While that often is honoured more in its breach than its keeping, still, the exception is Prince George's County. Only taxicabs licenced there can pick up there, regardless of where the customer is going. Uber would need some clarification and an assent from the regulators, there, as well.

So, in answer to what I think is really your question, right now, in this market, at least, a cab driver can not log on to the UberX platform and run UberX calls in his cab. I do drive UberX, as well, but I have a car other than my cab to do it. If the cab driver is driving a District of Columbia cab, and, is registered with Uber, he can log on to the Uber Taxi platform, and run Uber Taxi trips.

Uber offers taxis only in certain markets:

U.S. of A.: Boston, Washington, Chicago, San Francisco, Honolulu.

In addition, in New York City, Uber offers UberT. The user uses UberT, in New York City, _*ONLY*_, to summon his taxicab(Yellow or Green), only. The user must pay the driver. This applies ONLY to New York City. Anywhere else that you use Uber to summon a regular taxicab, you both summon and pay for it through the application.

Finally, for the U.S. of A., Uber offers "For Hire" in Seattle. It appears that there are two classes of taxis in Seattle, Taxicab and For Hire. While I have received some explanation of the difference from the Seattle posters on this board, I still am not one hundred per cent sure how each one does things.

Canada: Montreal and Toronto.

Australia: Sydney

Germany: Berlin.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Russ Reed said:


> Do YOU REALLY get 25% taken off PLUS dues to Teamsters. Please think this stuff through


lol no union job takes 25% of their wages. Some people been drinkin way too much of the Republican union-busting kool-aid.

It's maybe $30 a paycheck. Big fricken deal when it comes to having a great contract


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## Slavic Riga (Jan 12, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> I've had several jobs in my life working for competitors. There's no law anywhere preventing anyone from working for a competing conpany.
> 
> You've been drinking the Uber kool-aid that they've been blackmailing drivers by threatening to prevent you from working a competitor in order to strong arm you into staying as an independent contractor.
> 
> The only jobs where they would require you from working for a competitor is an executive position. It's safe to assume none of us are executives making salaries where they would not want us to reveal trade secrets to a competitor.


Even Executives work for competing industries or competitor. Their new position & classification, BOARD MEMBER.
Don't believe, get Prospectus of two companies in the same industry & check the staff section of Directors & Board Members.


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Not sure what it is you're trying to say here since everything you're saying is wrong
> 
> It doesn't sound like you've ever had a union job. I've had several union jobs in my life and I never have had anything less than great pay and outstanding benefits. I think you've been drinking the Republican union-busting kool-aid.


Got it. We're not having a debate because you're correct on all points and can't see any other point of view.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Slavic Riga said:


> Even Executives work for competing industries or competitor. Their new position & classification, BOARD MEMBER.
> Don't believe, get Prospectus of two companies in the same industry & check the staff section of Directors & Board Members.


Yes, do some google searches. Sometimes you will have "executives" with what are called "non-competing clauses". When they leave a company they can't work for a competing company for X amount of months yada yada. This will never happen with drivers. It's simply a ploy to hang over our heads to scare us into going for a settlement.

It's called spin doctoring. Google it.


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## Russ Reed (Mar 30, 2016)

Undermensch said:


> Got it. We're not having a debate because you're correct on all points and can't see any other point of view.


Wait, Im sorry you never paid Union dues or registration. I think you may need to review your pay stubs. Im almost certain they collected on top of your great pay.


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> It's not just about you, it's about all the drivers, even the ones in Detroit and Tampa making 24 cents a mile.
> 
> Nothing stopping Uber from taking a 50% commission starting tomorrow.
> 
> You think it's great now. Wait til Uber pulls the rug out from under you.


Once again, that has nothing to do with contractor vs employee status.

I prefer contractor.

Now, regarding having an organization that represents our point of view and doesn't let Uber enforce only their point of view, I'm moderately for that, as I have stated previously. If you weren't so bent on arguing with everyone you might have noticed that.

An organization / union could be a waste or it could be great. I don't think it would cause rates to go lower and I don't think it would cause rules to get tighter, so that at least would be an improvement over the previously established trends.

But supporting an organization / union and wanting employee status are not the same thing, as even the Teamsters was able to figure out quickly.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Undermensch said:


> Got it. We're not having a debate because you're correct on all points and can't see any other point of view.


Oh yeah, I apologize for standing up for us drivers. I apologize for trying to look after ALL the drivers, not just me. I'm talking about the guys in Detroit and Tampa making 24 cents a mile.

Yes, I really have some nerve to NOT bury my head in the sand and act like Uber is doing them a service by making them work for peanuts.

The nerve of me to argue on their behalf using common sense and logic.


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

Russ Reed said:


> Wait, Im sorry you never paid Union dues or registration. I think you may need to review your pay stubs. Im almost certain they collected on top of your great pay.


Huh? Who are you arguing with and why?


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Oh yeah, I apologize for standing up for us drivers. I apologize for trying to look after ALL the drivers, not just me. I'm talking about the guys in Detroit and Tampa making 24 cents a mile.
> 
> Yes, I really have some nerve to NOT bury my head in the sand and act like Uber is doing them a service by making them work for peanuts.
> 
> The nerve of me to argue on their behalf using common sense and logic.


If you really support unionization you might want to stop posting. You're not doing the effort any favors by attacking people that are in at least moderately in favor of it.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

https://www.google.com/search?q=non...ms-tmobile-us&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8

Why don't all of you please explain exactly which jobs you've had in your life where you were forced to sign a non-competing clause? I'm really interested in hearing from you.

There is no legal reason, no logical reason why Uber would have to require us to not work for another company.

Does taco bell force employees to not work for burger king ? No. I can go on and on. The only types of jobs where this happens are executive positions.


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## KevRyde (Jan 27, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> I challenge each and every one of you to go out and find someone in a union job and ask them about their benefits and pay.


Also ask them if they can decide to start work and leave work whenever or whatever time of the day or night that it suits them, or if they can skip out on work any time or any day just because they don't feel like working, or if they can be employees of two competing companies at once, or...


uberdriverfornow said:


> Why don't all of you please explain exactly which jobs you've had in your life where you were forced to sign a non-competing clause? I'm really interested in hearing from you.


When I went to work as an employee of IBM in 1985 and then again with Siemens in the 1990's; when I went to work as an employee of American Express Financial Advisors in 2002 and then again as a franchisee - e.g., "independant contractor" - of Ameriprise Financial Services in 2006.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Undermensch said:


> If you really support unionization you might want to stop posting. You're not doing the effort any favors by attacking people that are in at least moderately in favor of it.


You must be delusional.

Then again most trolls are.


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## Old Rocker (Aug 20, 2015)

So, hook up with a corrupt, mafia controlled organization to help drivers organize and negotiate with Uber?


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Old Rocker said:


> So, hook up with a corrupt, mafia controlled organization to help drivers organize and negotiate with Uber?


Even if the Teamsters were still mafia-controlled, which it hasn't been since the 1960's, it would still be better than nothing.

I'm not interested in Uber having the power to change my pay rates at will, daily, with no input from me.

I'm not interested in Uber constantly raising the booking fee while lowering my rates so they can scheme to make more money on my back.


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> https://www.google.com/search?q=non...ms-tmobile-us&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8
> 
> Why don't all of you please explain exactly which jobs you've had in your life where you were forced to sign a non-competing clause? I'm really interested in hearing from you.
> 
> ...


It's standard for office jobs.

I recall seeing that Lyft was going to offer optional Employee status, but only for people who agreed to work *only* for Lyft and not for competing platforms.

Taco Bell and Burger King doesn't care what the restaurant workers do with their time. One worker working at another restaurant in town is not going to give that other restaurant a competitive advantage. But you can bet that their office workers are prohibited from doing this. Knowing the marketing plans of Burger King would definitely help you if you also ran marketing at Taco Bell and you can bet they would not allow that to happen. No way.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Undermensch said:


> It's standard for office jobs.
> 
> I recall seeing that Lyft was going to offer optional Employee status, but only for people who agreed to work *only* for Lyft and not for competing platforms.
> 
> Taco Bell and Burger King doesn't care what the restaurant workers do with their time. One worker working at another restaurant in town is not going to give that other restaurant a competitive advantage. But you can bet that their office workers are prohibited from doing this. Knowing the marketing plans of Burger King would definitely help you if you also ran marketing at Taco Bell and you can bet they would not allow that to happen. No way.


More specifically, it's for white collar jobs, not for blue collar jobs like ours.


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## Russ Reed (Mar 30, 2016)

Undermensch said:


> Huh? Who are you arguing with and why?


No arguement just going back to your point when saying everything your saying is wrong and ending with the Republican kool-aid...

To me when reading this, it comes of close-minded to an open opinion, whether that opinion is valid OR not!

I brought up the pay, because while you may have had great benefits and jobs, which I commend, Unions still take like every other company. You just don't work for free with a Union.

Organized labor is a great idea, HOWEVER look at someone else's vantage point. I think you prompted knee jerk reactions from everyone. There-in lies the problem with forums, you cannot deduce tone.


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## DriverX (Aug 5, 2015)

Squirming Like A Toad said:


> Doesn't make much sense. So we send money to the Teamsters, and we get...?
> 
> When you work for a union they control everything about your job, and they obviously can't do that when we are responsible for our own cars and our own working times and places. Nobody forces us to take a fare and if a union driver doesn't some other driver will.
> 
> All this will end up doing is making the Teamsters a de facto regulatory authority over rideshare and independent drivers won't be allowed, you'll end up having to drive for a company they control that will be no different than a taxi company.


You are a taxi driver, get over it.


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## Old Rocker (Aug 20, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Even if the Teamsters were still mafia-controlled, which it hasn't been since the 1960's, it would still be better than nothing.
> 
> I'm not interested in Uber having the power to change my pay rates at will, daily, with no input from me.
> 
> I'm not interested in Uber constantly raising the booking fee while lowering my rates so they can scheme to make more money on my back.


Man, just read the news. Corruption is still alive and well in the Teamsters with leaders being hit with RICO's on a regular basis. It may not be "the mafia," but they still engage in organized crime.


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## DriverX (Aug 5, 2015)

AllenChicago said:


> Can the Teamsters force all drivers who pay their monthly dues to display a sticker on their window under the Uber sticker? In effect, strong-arming all drivers to join the union, because the drivers who don't have this sticker are subjecting their cars to mysteriously being vandalized with spray paint, or something.


Why did you put a uber sticker on your car? THere is no laws saying you have to do that.


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## Russ Reed (Mar 30, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> https://www.google.com/search?q=non...ms-tmobile-us&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8
> 
> Why don't all of you please explain exactly which jobs you've had in your life where you were forced to sign a non-competing clause? I'm really interested in hearing from you.
> 
> ...


Correction, I come from Food and Bev and retail its conflict of interest. Its up to the discretion of the Store Manager at times. But it is NOT condoned by corporate, its called trading insider secrets.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Old Rocker said:


> Man, just read the news. Corruption is still alive and well in the Teamsters with leaders being hit with RICO's on a regular basis. It may not be "the mafia," but they still engage in organized crime.


Nothing says we are forced to use Teamsters as our union.


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

Russ Reed said:


> No arguement just going back to your point when saying everything your saying is wrong and ending with the Republican kool-aid...
> 
> To me when reading this, it comes of close-minded to an open opinion, whether that opinion is valid OR not!
> 
> ...


You lost me. I can't tell if you are for or against unions.

As I've said before, I'm not against it, I'm actually moderately for it, but I don't know for sure that it will help. It might, it might not. I'd also want to know what it's going to cost me.

Now, the thing you see me railing on about is I do NOT want to be an employee. I want to retain my independent contractor status and a Teamsters rep was quoted as saying they talked to drivers and found that the majority of drivers want to remain independent contractors as well. I do take offense to people claiming that is a nefarious intention, it is not: it is the desire of the majority of drivers and for good reason (tax purposes).


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## DriverX (Aug 5, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Are you being serious?
> 
> Why do I want to be an employee?
> 
> ...


wait are you saying a pizza guy only makes $1.50 per delivery? That really sux, I'd drive rideshare instead. I think that IC is the best but as long as we don't get deactivated for canceling requests that aren't profitable or do not fit into our operation area or schedule. The abilit to make money si there but you have to be willing to hold out for surge rates and push the rate higher in order to make it worth your while. Read this forum for info on how to be more profitable before you clamour on to the employee thing. As soon as your an employee you have to work when and for how long they want you to and that is why your only making $1.50 per trip.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

DriverX said:


> wait are you saying a pizza guy only makes $1.50 per delivery? That really sux, I'd drive rideshare instead. I think that IC is the best but as long as we don't get deactivated for canceling requests that aren't profitable or do not fit into our operation area or schedule. The abilit to make money si there but you have to be willing to hold out for surge rates and push the rate higher in order to make it worth your while. Read this forum for info on how to be more profitable before you clamour on to the employee thing. As soon as your an employee you have to work when and for how long they want you to and that is why your only making $1.50 per trip.


You get $1.50 reimbursement for mileage and gas for each delivery on top of your regular pay.


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## DriverX (Aug 5, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> You get $1.50 reimbursement for mileage and gas for each delivery on top of your regular pay.


so that's like 2 or 3 deliveries per hour average? Can I only deliver pizzas during the most busy times? or do I have to put in an 8 hour grind with only like 2 busy hours on my shift? DO I have to wear a goofy hat or shirt with a corporate logo on it? do I have to put a giant sign on my roof? these are all the things you'll have to do as an employee, but not as an IC.

We want higher rates and more control, that all! We want IC status so we can do our own taxes! I pay like no tax as an IC why would I want them jacking me on payroll taxes and over priced health insurance? I don't want my employer having anything to do with my healthcare. make the rate $2 a mile and everyone wins. or set it lower with a minimum of $10 TO THE DRIVER. being an employee is no fun and a bad deal for people who understand how to make money doing this.


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## Squirming Like A Toad (Apr 7, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Even if the Teamsters were still mafia-controlled, which it hasn't been since the 1960's, it would still be better than nothing.
> 
> I'm not interested in Uber having the power to change my pay rates at will, daily, with no input from me.
> 
> I'm not interested in Uber constantly raising the booking fee while lowering my rates so they can scheme to make more money on my back.


If they do that, stop driving. They're trying to make as much money as they can just like we are. Every one of us has the power to "go on strike" if we don't like what we're being offered and then they make nothing, while we're still free to drive for Lyft or do whatever else we want to do. Eventually it will come to an equilibrium where Uber, drivers, and riders are all getting something they are satisfied with.


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## Snowtop (Nov 11, 2014)

A simple history lesson would help people understand that the rise and dominance of unions in the 2oth century was directly related to the management of companies treating employee's atrociously. Read Ida Tarbell or Upton Sinclair to get an idea. The US has changed since those times with the advent of many government entities that protect workers from unscrupulous employers. Child labor laws, anti discrimination laws, OSHA and hundreds of others have created a better environment for all employees.

I am not a fan of unions. I think they took advantage of there power in the last half of the century. In some cases drove jobs out of this country and in others put companies out of business. 

However, Uber is a different animal. Because we are not employees we do not have the same protections that are afforded to employees and Uber is taking full advantage.

I can also see where full time drivers may be interested and yes have a need to organize...the part times would probably not benefit.


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## Tequila Jake (Jan 28, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> I've had several jobs in my life working for competitors. There's no law anywhere preventing anyone from working for a competing conpany.
> 
> You've been drinking the Uber kool-aid that they've been blackmailing drivers by threatening to prevent you from working a competitor in order to strong arm you into staying as an independent contractor.
> 
> The only jobs where they would require you from working for a competitor is an executive position. It's safe to assume none of us are executives making salaries where they would not want us to reveal trade secrets to a competitor.


You're right that there is no law because it can be covered in the employee agreement. It's not just executive positions. In many companies, including the one I work for, it encompasses all positions (5000+ employees). Here's the pertinent part of the employment code of ethics (with the company name redacted):
*
• Outside employment and other volunteer or charitable activities*
_COMPANY does not prohibit all outside employment, but you must make sure that any outside 
employment or other activities do not negatively impact your work at COMPANY, cause you to misuse COMPANY information 
or resources, or result in unfair consequences to COMPANY. Teammates are not permitted to take any 
outside job with a company that is in the same business as COMPANY or is in any way in competition 
with COMPANY, may not use COMPANY's resources to conduct any outside business regardless of whether 
it conflicts with COMPANY's business, and may not conduct outside business during COMPANY working 
hours regardless of whether the outside business is competitive with COMPANY's business._


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## Slavic Riga (Jan 12, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Yes, do some google searches. Sometimes you will have "executives" with what are called "non-competing clauses". When they leave a company they can't work for a competing company for X amount of months yada yada. This will never happen with drivers. It's simply a ploy to hang over our heads to scare us into going for a settlement.
> 
> It's called spin doctoring. Google it.


I am In total agreement with you & support in what you are saying & stating.
Somebody has to stand up or we all will be driven to despair. Maybe 15% will be well off without protection, Majority people need protection & especially from a company that changes TOS Agreements to suit them at short notice & just as the driver is switching tha app to go 'ONLINE'.


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## Zebonkey (Feb 2, 2016)

MikesUber said:


> Labor union says it has received "overwhelming outreach" from Uber drivers seeking benefits and a stronger voice on the job.
> 
> Source: http://www.cnet.com/news/uber-drivers-seek-to-team-up-with-teamsters/
> 
> ...


I would join teamsters, if there is a better explanation of what they offer.
Teamsters are the reason, that middle class happened, and unions offer a lot.
I have no problem, contributing to a union, but our situation is, somewhat, ambiguous. So far we were denied by the court to be employees. 
I am considered to be a business owner. I need to hear a lot more from the union, and I am, actually, one of the full time drivers for over three years, who has a lot invested in "Ubering".


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## Tequila Jake (Jan 28, 2016)

uberdriverfornow said:


> https://www.google.com/search?q=non...ms-tmobile-us&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8
> 
> Why don't all of you please explain exactly which jobs you've had in your life where you were forced to sign a non-competing clause? I'm really interested in hearing from you.
> 
> ...


The only jobs where this DOESN'T happen are Taco Bell & Burger King .. is that the type of employment you're striving for.

The only job I've had in the last 30+ years where I didn't have a non-compete was when I had my own business. Even at a company like Starbucks there is clause that no employee, including baristas, may work for a competitor (Assistant Store Managers and above have non-competes that extend after employment).

(I will acknowledge the case can be made that barista is a higher skilled level job than rideshare driver).


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## I_Like_Spam (May 10, 2015)

Tequila Jake said:


> The only jobs where this DOESN'T happen are Taco Bell & Burger King .. is that the type of employment you're striving for.
> .


Jimmy Johns , the sandwich chain, has their associates sign a non-compete which extends for 2 years after they leave employment.


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## superdeals (Apr 25, 2016)

Some of you need to stop listen to your politicians who are owned by big business. *Politicians have a great union of their own.* _When they need anything, they just VOTE it in for themselves._ They tell you that a union will take your money unlike the salaries they are making, above $170,00 a year and they don't work half the year. Check it out for yourself when they tell you about so called takers. They are the BIGGEST takers of all.

*Nothing is perfect, but a union will still look out for your benefit better than a company, who only desire is to make money on your back.* People without unions suffer at the hands of people like Uber daily. You alone can not win against a large company... It takes numbers! It will only get worse as Uber tries to run everyone else out of business, like Walmart, and then you just left the frying pan to the fire.

Uber is getting big money from out side interest because they tell them they have any liabilities. You should check out Uber's worth and see how they get so big so fast. Even the threat of a union will make Uber start to treat drivers better. And yes they will pay their lobbyist to get to Congress and tell them that unions goes against your best interest. *Funny how they are willing to pay BIG money to lobbyist and not a dollar more to drivers!*


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## Tedgey (Jan 29, 2016)

The Teamsters are a union. Union members are required to have jobs. We don't, we're business owners. We are on the opposite side of the table than the teamsters. I agree the drivers should form some sort of a guild of some sort but that's different from a union. If we form a union we'll have to become employees and that's the LAST thing I want to be, an Uber employee.

We should form a guild and it should be administered and led by drivers not by an outside union.


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## Undermensch (Oct 21, 2015)

superdeals said:


> Some of you need to stop listen to your politicians who are owned by big business. *Politicians have a great union of their own.* _When they need anything, they just VOTE it in for themselves._ They tell you that a union will take your money unlike the salaries they are making, above $170,00 a year and they don't work half the year. Check it out for yourself when they tell you about so called takers. They are the BIGGEST takers of all.
> 
> *Nothing is perfect, but a union will still look out for your benefit better than a company, who only desire is to make money on your back.* People without unions suffer at the hands of people like Uber daily. You alone can not win against a large company... It takes numbers! It will only get worse as Uber tries to run everyone else out of business, like Walmart, and then you just left the frying pan to the fire.
> 
> Uber is getting big money from out side interest because they tell them they have any liabilities. You should check out Uber's worth and see how they get so big so fast. Even the threat of a union will make Uber start to treat drivers better. And yes they will pay their lobbyist to get to Congress and tell them that unions goes against your best interest. *Funny how they are willing to pay BIG money to lobbyist and not a dollar more to drivers!*


I wouldn't assume people get their opinions from listening to politicians.

I'm of two minds on unions: I don't want them in my primary job, but I'm interested in it for ride sharing.

Why? Did some politician influence me? Am I a crazy left wing / right wing / Democrat Republican / shill / scab / jerk / etc? No. None of those.

My primary job is software development. People in that industry have vastly difference skill levels, they aren't easily measurable / quantifiable, and years of experience does not predict ability well. In that industry I'd be upset if I was in a union because my skill and pay would be set primarily based on years of service and that's not right. I work hard, I work smart, and I produce way more than others. I want the pay for that and I get it.

Ride sharing is a low skill job where the drivers are commodities (they are essentially interchangeable so long as they don't get tons of complaints against them). Because we are interchangeable we are at risk of being pushed out for no real reason and or "partner company" has all the power when changing terms and rates. Furthermore, Uber has a practical monopoly in many markets as there are either no other options or no options with drivers regularly available, which means drivers cannot simply work for another "partner company" if they don't like Uber's terms. This is the perfect example of where a union is able to help without hurting people.

So there you have it: I have two opinions on unions.

What's silly is that a union would probably end up helping Uber: by saving themselves from their own poor decisions. For example, Uber drivers were regularly available in the Freehold, NJ region before the January rate cuts. Since then there are no drivers there. I get pings from there and I won't go because they are 20 minutes away and I'm not getting stuck in an area where riders have given up because there are almost never drivers. If Uber was forced to raise rates and implement a "pay to pick me up" feature then they'd be able to more quickly expand into markets that they shut themselves out of. It would really be hilarious if this ended up benefitting them.


----------



## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

AllenChicago said:


> Can the Teamsters force all drivers who pay their monthly dues to display a sticker on their window under the Uber sticker? In effect, strong-arming all drivers to join the union, because the drivers who don't have this sticker are subjecting their cars to mysteriously being vandalized with spray paint, or something.


Unions have legal empowerment if employees of a company vote them in. i doubt they will have the same kind of clout for an association of independent contractors, but it might help, depending on how much dues are. If it's nominal, might be a good idea. Worth trying, I say. and they are experienced at it. Better than a bunch of noobs forming an association.


----------



## I_Like_Spam (May 10, 2015)

Oscar Levant said:


> depending on how much dues are. If it's nominal, might be a good idea. Worth trying, I say. and they are experienced at it. Better than a bunch of noobs forming an association.


Depends on what you would call "nominal". Union business agents, local presidents and the like earn a pretty decent living, and enough would have to be collected to make it worth their while. I don't think they'd bother petitioning to represent unless they could see much less than $50 a month per member. The limousines they ride in aren't free you know. Although I guess they might be able to swing a deal with uber black if they got the contract.


----------



## JJ/Uber/Miami (Jun 24, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Are you being serious?
> 
> Why do I want to be an employee?
> 
> ...


1000% AGREE. Being an IC is great if you get to set your own prices/fees, but when you are essentially being controlled in every aspect of the relationship (except being told WHEN to drive), that is defined as subservience, which = EMPLOYEE.

Under the current regime, drivers are much better off under the employee status, whereby joining a Union would be a huge benefit. Uber is charging exorbitant fees anyway for using their crappy a** app -- might as well redirect those funds toward union membership. At least drivers will get more of a ROI than they do presently with having to eat ALL the expenses while Uber raids your pockets even more after the fact.


----------



## I_Like_Spam (May 10, 2015)

JJ/Uber/Miami said:


> Under the current regime, drivers are much better off under the employee status, whereby joining a Union would be a huge benefit. Uber is charging exorbitant fees anyway for using their crappy a** app -- might as well redirect those funds toward union membership. At least drivers will get more of a ROI than they do presently with having to eat ALL the expenses while Uber raids your pockets even more after the fact.


You are assuming that the Teamsters would be able to make a better deal than what Uber is offering now.

I'm not sure what carrot or stick they would be able to deliver. I guess they could go to the utility commissions and lobby for higher fares, but that would really be the end of the sharing economy where prices are flexible due to surges and that.


----------



## JJ/Uber/Miami (Jun 24, 2015)

JaniceCT said:


> unions and teamsters are scum. only interested in collecting more union dues. stay away!


Excuse me, but Uber is also the SCUM you describe unions as, only interested in sucking drivers dry with their high ass fees after making sure ALL the expenses are on you as well.

Tell me how that is any different? Yet you sure as hell keep driving for them. Where is the logic in that??


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Tequila Jake said:


> The only jobs where this DOESN'T happen are Taco Bell & Burger King .. is that the type of employment you're striving for.
> 
> The only job I've had in the last 30+ years where I didn't have a non-compete was when I had my own business. Even at a company like Starbucks there is clause that no employee, including baristas, may work for a competitor (Assistant Store Managers and above have non-competes that extend after employment).
> 
> (I will acknowledge the case can be made that barista is a higher skilled level job than rideshare driver).


Umm, really ? Incredible lie there.

https://www.google.com/search?q=non...ms-tmobile-us&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8

Not only does starbucks not have a non compete clause but they are unenforceable in california anyhow

Try harder.


----------



## BentleyK9 (Oct 12, 2015)

You knew the terms when we all started in this job. We make our own hours, work when we want. I dont need or will ever need a 3rd party dictating what, when , and where to work...
Dont like Uber, go flip burgers.. 
Just my opinion. Everyone entitled to it.


----------



## Kruhn (Sep 24, 2015)

Squirming Like A Toad said:


> The union workers I know are government workers and they all think their job sucks. Unions have their priorities too, and it's not us. What do you think they are, a bunch of philanthropists? A little envelope to the union official and management can still do whatever they want, and you have even less recourse.
> 
> The Uber system as we know it cannot exist as a service relying on union employees. They can take their ball and go home in any market that tries imposing that. If you are looking for full-time, career employment maybe this isn't for you, I'm just filling up my retirement fund with it.


Well, I actually took a unionized worker and did not work for the government said he liked very much. He works for a construction company with a union. Yeah, there were issues, but there was a safety net for them including job placement after the projects ended.

I find your characterization of union leaders as thugs. Yes, the Mafia did get involved in the labor movement, but perhaps you were not aware that management *regularly* hired its own uniformed thugs, through private contractors. The Pinkerton Company was the most famous of those rackets.

The union serves as a counterbalance to the employer and worked very well until it got eroded in the 70s. I would suggest you brush up on US Labor history, my young Padawan. Read on the Haymarket Riots, The Triangle Shirtwaist Factory Fire of 1911, the Ludlow Massacre, and then you might understand why there is a need for someone to keep them honest.

This caricature of what a union worker does or doesn't do needs to stop. Ignorance may be bliss for some, but the reality is that Uber needs someone to keep them honest.


----------



## Kruhn (Sep 24, 2015)

james berry said:


> You knew the terms when we all started in this job. We make our own hours, work when we want. I dont need or will ever need a 3rd party dictating what, when , and where to work...
> Dont like Uber, go flip burgers..
> Just my opinion. Everyone entitled to it.


Yeah I knew the terms, what I did not expect was for them to then change it anytime they wanted it without warning while paying a car they convinced you to get through their own leasing company.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

ubershiza said:


> Hoffa wouldn't be caught dead in an uber!


yeah - but then again, Hoffa hasn't been caught dead anywhere.


Chicago88 said:


> But I do believe the small protests I've seen if continued could bring some change.


What leads you to that conclusion? - it certainly isn't the impact they've had [not!] so far.


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

I_Like_Spam said:


> I don't see that kind of thing coming down in 2016, maybe in the 1950's or 60's, but not today. Union members aren't that aggressive nowadays, or maybe there just aren't that many true believers.
> 
> Besides, the union would be collecting their agency fee upfront, and straight from the Uber treasury, it wouldn't be their top priority to get your heart and soul into the effort, since they will already have the cash.


Certain conventions may specify Union drivers only . . .that would be the extent of it.
Perhaps a " Drivers Association "?
What are the goals ?
To include all Transportation ?
Or to be ride share specific in orientation ?
An Association ,could have an Uber and Lyft board member sit in.to realize realistic goals.

Lobbyists need to be hired to push pro driver legislation.
They can also lobby interests of Uber and Lyft.
We need to establish common ground with Uber and Lyft , then advance mutual goals.
You think the people who invest in Uber are pro union.?

This landscape affects far more than just Uber or Lyft.


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Well, each has to decide.
Do we want a Goose dinner ?
Or Golden Eggs ?


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Tequila Jake said:


> 50 cents per ride is an insane amount of money, especially since it will come out after Uber's cut. My cut of a minimum fare ride would go from $2.85 to $2.35, an 18% pay cut with no guarantee of any increase.
> 
> I drive part time, about 100-150 rides per month, and would not be willing to pay $600-$900 per year.


I drive full time.
Why should I pay 10 times as much to be equal.
A ratio must be forged.


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Bottom line.
Teamsters Union is Political clout.
If we group with ALL Transportation workers, we have to make concessions.licensing,insurance,background, all the same as cab drivers.
What is it worth to you ?

The government regulation may be swimming up the same stream soon.

How do YOU want to play it ?


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Old Rocker said:


> So, hook up with a corrupt, mafia controlled organization to help drivers organize and negotiate with Uber?


There is no 'mafia' as you think of it.
Only businessmen and politicians.

Enforcement is by legislation.


----------



## Squirming Like A Toad (Apr 7, 2016)

Kruhn said:


> Well, I actually took a unionized worker and did not work for the government said he liked very much. He works for a construction company with a union. Yeah, there were issues, but there was a safety net for them including job placement after the projects ended.
> 
> I find your characterization of union leaders as thugs. Yes, the Mafia did get involved in the labor movement, but perhaps you were not aware that management *regularly* hired its own uniformed thugs, through private contractors. The Pinkerton Company was the most famous of those rackets.
> 
> ...


There is someone keeping them honest. Us. Why the HELL would you accept a fare in your own car, if you do not like the pay and the conditions under which you are accepting it?

You're a business owner, and what makes you the owner is the fact you can sell your business or convert it to some other use any time you want. Uber's only recourse is to stop sending you pings, they cannot tell you what to do. It's just like any other relationship between a company and a contractor. Now you want this union to try and strongarm a big company into giving your private car company more business, and under your terms.

There already is a model for this in that some truck drivers drive for a company and others are owner operators. Which is better? Every trucker has a different opinion on that and each has its advantages. But there is a lot to be said for being an owner operator. Lots of guys are company drivers only because they can't afford their own rig, but every guy who drives his own rig would be hired by a company if he chose to drive for one, so there is not one of them who would rather be an employee.


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Snowtop said:


> A simple history lesson would help people understand that the rise and dominance of unions in the 2oth century was directly related to the management of companies treating employee's atrociously. Read Ida Tarbell or Upton Sinclair to get an idea. The US has changed since those times with the advent of many government entities that protect workers from unscrupulous employers. Child labor laws, anti discrimination laws, OSHA and hundreds of others have created a better environment for all employees.
> 
> I am not a fan of unions. I think they took advantage of there power in the last half of the century. In some cases drove jobs out of this country and in others put companies out of business.
> 
> ...


History: research Blair Mountain


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

JJ/Uber/Miami said:


> Excuse me, but Uber is also the SCUM you describe unions as, only interested in sucking drivers dry with their high ass fees after making sure ALL the expenses are on you as well.
> 
> Tell me how that is any different? Yet you sure as hell keep driving for them. Where is the logic in that??


If you belittle your company in the public eye,you belittle yourself.

If the goal is to better drivers quality of life,I am for it.

If the goal is to punish Uber, I see no gain.


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Kruhn said:


> Well, I actually took a unionized worker and did not work for the government said he liked very much. He works for a construction company with a union. Yeah, there were issues, but there was a safety net for them including job placement after the projects ended.
> 
> I find your characterization of union leaders as thugs. Yes, the Mafia did get involved in the labor movement, but perhaps you were not aware that management *regularly* hired its own uniformed thugs, through private contractors. The Pinkerton Company was the most famous of those rackets.
> 
> ...


Arlo Guthrie's dad did a song on Ludlow 
( I do not endorse socialist goals )


----------



## SEAL Team 5 (Dec 19, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> It will continue to change in Uber's favor until we stop it with a union contract.


Uber could care less about a union contract. They're not a union company. Uber will just keep hiring more drivers. Just as easy as you became an Uber driver, so it is for the 100's of 1000's others. The ignorance in America is alive and well. You guys have two choices, drive for Uber or don't drive for Uber.


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

We must DEFINE ourselves before any accord can be reached.

Until then,we are hearding cats.


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

SEAL Team 5 said:


> Uber could care less about a union contract. They're not a union company. Uber will just keep hiring more drivers. Just as easy as you became an Uber driver, so it is for the 100's of 1000's others. The ignorance in America is alive and well. You guys have two choices, drive for Uber or don't drive for Uber.


Lobbyists and legislation.
It is happening anyway.
Look at S.F. business licenses.
We can only hope to shape it's architecture,its going up with or without us.


----------



## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

tohunt4me said:


> Arlo Guthrie's dad did a song on Ludlow


"_Arlo Guthrie's dad.._." lmao - Woody would have loved that. 



tohunt4me said:


> If you belittle your company in the public eye,you belittle yourself.


Sure - but Uber is _NOT_ my company. And Uber is _NOT_ my employer.
Uber is my supplier - my vendor... I pay THEM - they don't pay me.
It says so right there in my licensing agreement with them.
It also says in that agreement that I do _NOT_ represent Uber.

And, btw, they're not such a great vendor to have - but they do send me more 'leads' than any other vendor I work with.


----------



## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> "_Arlo Guthrie's dad.._." lmao - Woody would have loved that.


I'll be lucky if 1/2 here know of Arlo . . .

(" you can have anything you want, at Alice's restaurant "
Working the system,manipulation of set rules for advantageous outcomes. There are many who have much to learn,and little time to do so. )


----------



## Cocobird (Dec 9, 2015)

MikesUber said:


> Labor union says it has received "overwhelming outreach" from Uber drivers seeking benefits and a stronger voice on the job.
> 
> Source: http://www.cnet.com/news/uber-drivers-seek-to-team-up-with-teamsters/
> 
> ...


Stupid people


----------



## Cocobird (Dec 9, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Furthermore, maybe you like how Uber keeps raising the booking fee and lowering the rates ? I don't. That will never change until we are a union. It will continue to change in Uber's favor until we stop it with a union contract.


It will happen more often.


----------



## Schweisshund (Feb 28, 2016)

They (teamsters) certainly did not get the impression from me that I wanted their services. In fact, if they put their dirty hands in my cookie jar, I will lop them off.


----------



## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Yes, do some google searches. Sometimes you will have "executives" with what are called "non-competing clauses". When they leave a company they can't work for a competing company for X amount of months yada yada. This will never happen with drivers. It's simply a ploy to hang over our heads to scare us into going for a settlement.
> 
> It's called spin doctoring. Google it.


Actually, noncompetes are unenforceable in California.

Some companies ask employees to sign them thinking employees don"t know better and trying to fool them into thinking they are binding.

They are not.

I was asked to sign a noncompete, binding arbitration, no class action employment contract after I had been working six months.

I refused, telling them it was not in my best interests to sign. This was 2 1/2 years ago. I am still employed there.


----------



## SEAL Team 5 (Dec 19, 2015)

Zebonkey said:


> and I am, actually, one of the full time drivers for over three years, who has a lot invested in "Ubering".


You were here from the start of the X platform. You've been through many price cuts and work full time. Wouldn't you want to get some commercial insurance and do your own "fare for hire". And just use Uber on the side and to incur their clients


----------



## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

Snowtop said:


> A simple history lesson would help people understand that the rise and dominance of unions in the 2oth century was directly related to the management of companies treating employee's atrociously. Read Ida Tarbell or Upton Sinclair to get an idea. The US has changed since those times with the advent of many government entities that protect workers from unscrupulous employers. Child labor laws, anti discrimination laws, OSHA and hundreds of others have created a better environment for all employees.
> 
> I am not a fan of unions. I think they took advantage of there power in the last half of the century. In some cases drove jobs out of this country and in others put companies out of business.
> 
> ...


Part timers would benefit with higher fares and protections just like full timers. The fair thing to do would be, as someone mentioned earlier, a small per fare charge. Dimes and Quarters add up.


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

observer said:


> Actually, noncompetes are unenforceable in California.
> 
> Some companies ask employees to sign them thinking employees don"t know better and trying to fool them into thinking they are binding.
> 
> ...


I know, i meant from a worst case scenario standpoint, but that only applies in states where they are allowed.

I elaborated in a later post.


----------



## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

I_Like_Spam said:


> You are assuming that the Teamsters would be able to make a better deal than what Uber is offering now.
> 
> I'm not sure what carrot or stick they would be able to deliver. I guess they could go to the utility commissions and lobby for higher fares, but that would really be the end of the sharing economy where prices are flexible due to surges and that.


Exactly how much is Uber paying you to post here ?


----------



## Squirming Like A Toad (Apr 7, 2016)

tohunt4me said:


> If you belittle your company in the public eye,you belittle yourself.
> 
> If the goal is to better drivers quality of life,I am for it.
> 
> If the goal is to punish Uber, I see no gain.


Good point. Riders are reading this, giving them a bad feeling about riding with us hurts us just as much as Uber.


----------



## Tedgey (Jan 29, 2016)

JJ/Uber/Miami said:


> 1000% AGREE. Being an IC is great if you get to set your own prices/fees, but when you are essentially being controlled in every aspect of the relationship (except being told WHEN to drive), that is defined as subservience, which = EMPLOYEE.
> 
> Under the current regime, drivers are much better off under the employee status, whereby joining a Union would be a huge benefit. Uber is charging exorbitant fees anyway for using their crappy a** app -- might as well redirect those funds toward union membership. At least drivers will get more of a ROI than they do presently with having to eat ALL the expenses while Uber raids your pockets even more after the fact.


These are all legit issues which can be addressed through some type of collective bargaining. The trouble is, how do you get all these Uber drivers, 1% of them on this site, nobody even knows anybody else, in 20 different cities, how do you get them all together and form some kind of concensus?


----------



## SEAL Team 5 (Dec 19, 2015)

Tedgey said:


> how do you get all these drivers in 20 different cities all together and form some kind of concensus?


Easily, have them all sign up to become Uber drivers. Oh, they already did that and are regretting every minute.


----------



## Zebonkey (Feb 2, 2016)

SEAL Team 5 said:


> You were here from the start of the X platform. You've been through many price cuts and work full time. Wouldn't you want to get some commercial insurance and do your own "fare for hire". And just use Uber on the side and to incur their clients


I drive SUV, so I am a lot better off, than Uber-X. But yes, I was there, when it started. I never thought, it was a good idea to drive for Uber-X. Even at old rates, the math did not add up. Once, back a few years ago, Uber "included" me to take Uber-X calls. And I was not even aware of it. They just did. So I take a call. SF to Oakland and then to Alameda. On my "black" rates it would be about 150. Nice ride. But it was X - 35 bucks. It took me three days to opt out of X. Son of a *****!


----------



## Zebonkey (Feb 2, 2016)

Here is the thing, I think, that part-timers **** this shit up . I drive full time Black-SUV, and have nothing to fall back on. It is my primary income. I depend on Uber. Uber corporate has a lot of problems, but I need it to be a success. I make fairly decent money, working for Uber. It pays my way. My ridiculous condo fees. If Teamsters back our shit up, I will join them. I need two things from them: pension plan and health insurance.


----------



## SEAL Team 5 (Dec 19, 2015)

Zebonkey said:


> Here is the thing, I think, that part-timers &%[email protected]!* this shit up . I drive full time Black-SUV, and have nothing to fall back on. It is my primary income. I depend on Uber. Uber corporate has a lot of problems, but I need it to be a success. I make fairly decent money, working for Uber. It pays my way. My ridiculous condo fees. If Teamsters back our shit up, I will join them. I need two things from them: pension plan and health insurance.


A pension plan and health insurance from a union that will never have contract with Uber will cost you about $800 a month in union dues.


----------



## Schweisshund (Feb 28, 2016)

SEAL Team 5 said:


> A pension plan and health insurance from a union that will never have contract with Uber will cost you about $800 a month in union dues.


And that is the reason I never gave the impression I wanted their "help" aka, stupid high number fees taken from my pay.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

MikesUber said:


> Labor union says it has received "overwhelming outreach" from Uber drivers seeking benefits and a stronger voice on the job.
> 
> Source: http://www.cnet.com/news/uber-drivers-seek-to-team-up-with-teamsters/
> 
> ...


POST # 1/MikesUber: Bostonian Bison
Thanks You for this
MULTIPLI-Hyperlinked CNET.com Article
[with Substantive Printout...AHEM] of
Interest to ANYONE NOT A BILLIONaire
[like TravvyBoi & GirlyGurley].

That it is Your F.....O.....U.....R.....T.....H
"Featured Thread" IS Significant...although
I doubt that Management will issue any
sort of Certificate of Appreciation, because
THAT WOULD INFER that you're Some
Kind of Better than UnRecognized Fellow
Members, and we just can't have that
Meritocracy Roun' N'yeah...it COULD BE
BRANDED as "Disruptive".


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

Chicago88 said:


> Getting public awareness around how deceitful Uber is would be much more effective than a union. Higher pay isn't going to be a part of the rideshare world. Lower pay and lower quality of drivers/cars is what pax want - yes, lower quality car is what pax want because that comes automatically with lower quality driver... Select and black car will always have a market but Uber X is going to be beat up cars with sketchy drivers, you can see that already starting.


POST # 11/Chicago88: Yeeaaahhhh...no.
Sounds like YOU'D
EXPECT them to be wearing.....

*☆ ☆ " S K E T C H E R S " ?☆ ☆*


----------



## JJ/Uber/Miami (Jun 24, 2015)

tohunt4me said:


> If you belittle your company in the public eye,you belittle yourself.
> 
> If the goal is to better drivers quality of life,I am for it.
> 
> If the goal is to punish Uber, I see no gain.


First of all, Uber is NOT my company and never has been, even for the short time I was foolish enough to utilize their app. And if you think belittling a corrupt company for wrongdoing has any bearing on my own personal character you are completely moronic. This is how whistle blowers and strikers promote positive change. I dare you to cross a picket line and tell people they are belittling themselves by their actions. 

Second, the public should be aware of the predatory nature of this company in dealing with both drivers and pax. The amount of permissions they require just for downloading their app alone should outrage people. Why do they need that much access to private info ??

Third, punishing Uber by any legal means necessary to change their practices will most assuredly better the quality of life for BOTH drivers and pax. If you remember not so long ago, pax were not complaining about $2 a mile rates and drivers were most satisfied. Uber just wanted to crush their competition (the taxi industry) by any means necessary even if it meant the financial ruin of their driver/partners. Well, they have succeeded and in a most putrid way by ruining the lives and finances of a majority of the people who would have helped them take over the world essentially.

You're all for bettering the quality of life for drivers, you say? Well, status quo in Uber Land will not even come close to accomplishing that. If you can see no gain in punishing an entity for bad/illegal behavior, I hope you never sit on a jury or unleash any children you have raised upon our society. We are suffering enough......


----------



## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

Casuale Haberdasher said:


> POST # 11/Chicago88: Yeeaaahhhh...no.
> Sounds like YOU'D
> EXPECT them to be wearing.....
> 
> *☆ ☆ " S K E T C H E R S " ?☆ ☆*


hey - I just bought a pair of Sketchers yesterday.


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

Zebonkey said:


> Here is the thing, I think, that part-timers &%[email protected]!* this shit up . I drive full time Black-SUV, and have nothing to fall back on. It is my primary income. I depend on Uber. Uber corporate has a lot of problems, but I need it to be a success. I make fairly decent money, working for Uber. It pays my way. My ridiculous condo fees. If Teamsters back our shit up, I will join them. I need two things from them: pension plan and health insurance.


POST # 123/Zebonkey: W O R D ...U P !


----------



## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

Another Uber Driver said:


> Here, the cab drivers are not employees of the cab companies. They affiliate with a company by contract. Either they own or rent their cabs. While many of the limousine drivers here are employees, not all are. Some have their own limousines and do work for this or that limousine company under contract.
> 
> I drive a taxicab and I do not care whether or not you are an employee of Uber, Lyft, Split or Honest Alfie's TNC service. For my purposes, I would prefer to remain an independent contractor, because it allows me to drive the UberX car (with its concommitant substandard rates)only when the cab is out of service or I think that it will be an excessively slow cab day and I drive the UberX car as substandard pay is better than no pay. I do not want Uber's telling me to leave the cab and its acceptable rates parked while I drive the UberX car for its substandard rates.


POST # 12/@AnotherUberDriver: As Mod-
erator, you MAY
HAVE Sufficient Influence to Suggest to
Ownership that via "ForuModo" Wizardry
[or just an UNused Feature] that YOUR
Avatar could vacillate between P.O.ed
"Tweetybird" for the Serious S*** AND
The Beatific Boddhisatva-like option 
when Serene Genteelity is Warranted
AND Community-Appropriate.

FranklyBein'Bison: Jus' trillin', s'all !


----------



## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

Zebonkey said:


> Here is the thing, I think, that part-timers &%[email protected]!* this shit up . I drive full time Black-SUV, and have nothing to fall back on. It is my primary income. I depend on Uber. Uber corporate has a lot of problems, but I need it to be a success. I make fairly decent money, working for Uber. It pays my way. My ridiculous condo fees. If Teamsters back our shit up, I will join them. I need two things from them: pension plan and health insurance.


What is the 'this shit' that you think part-timers "&%[email protected]!*"-up?
Uber? - TNCs?
... or the livery industry?
(because I'm pretty sure that the definition of a 'disruptive business model' is one that: _&%[email protected]!'s this shit up)_


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## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

JJ/Uber/Miami said:


> First of all, Uber is NOT my company and never has been, even for the short time I was foolish enough to utilize their app. And if you think belittling a corrupt company for wrongdoing has any bearing on my own personal character you are completely moronic. This is how whistle blowers and strikers promote positive change. I dare you to cross a picket line and tell people they are belittling themselves by their actions.
> 
> Second, the public should be aware of the predatory nature of this company in dealing with both drivers and pax. The amount of permissions they require just for downloading their app alone should outrage people. Why do they need that much access to private info ??
> 
> ...


POST # 128/JJ/Uber/Miami: W O W. . . .
He's going to
"feel that" in the Morning ! "Going Gen-
erational" was Cruel and Vichyssoise.


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## AllenChicago (Nov 19, 2015)

SEAL Team 5 said:


> A pension plan and health insurance from a union that will never have contract with Uber will cost you about $800 a month in union dues.


If you get hurt or sick and can't drive full-time for awhile, money will be deducted from each day's compensation, until $800 is collected, won't it? Ouch! Hopefully there will be Union Disability Insurance included in that $800 premium.


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## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Are you being serious?
> 
> Why do I want to be an employee?
> 
> ...


POST # 7/uberdriverfornow: "Nothing
is 
O B V I O U S to the U N I N F O R M E D !"


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## SEAL Team 5 (Dec 19, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Are you being serious?
> 
> Why do I want to be an employee?
> 
> Probably because I want better pay. Probably because I want to be reimbursed for my vehicle expenses which will ONLY happen if I'm an employee.


If you want to be an employee then why did you sign up to become an Uber driver in the first place?


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## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

tohunt4me said:


> Hoffa, hasn't been caught dead anywhere . . .
> He may be in Cuba sipping Pina Colodas . . .


POST # 35/tohunt4me: S U R E ! Jimmy
Hoffa sipping
a Cuba Libre ....at A G E... 1 0 3 . 2 ?

Pondering Bison: Hmmmm....


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## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

JaniceCT said:


> unions and teamsters are scum. only interested in collecting more union dues. stay away!


POST # 33/JaniceCT : FAMILY MEMBER,
HUH ?
By "Blood" or Marriage ? Too soon ?


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## Casuale Haberdasher (Dec 7, 2014)

uberdriverfornow said:


> I've had several jobs in my life working for competitors. There's no law anywhere preventing anyone from working for a competing conpany.
> 
> You've been drinking the Uber kool-aid that they've been blackmailing drivers by threatening to prevent you from working a competitor in order to strong arm you into staying as an independent contractor.
> 
> The only jobs where they would require you from working for a competitor is an executive position. It's safe to assume none of us are executives making salaries where they would not want us to reveal trade secrets to a competitor.


POST #"47/uberdriverfornow: On behalf
of 8th Notable AND
Great "Great Laker" Michael - Cleveland 
I will offer his Preferred Reply:

"I RESEMBLE that Remark !"


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## ricmut (Jun 22, 2015)

Squirming Like A Toad said:


> Doesn't make much sense. So we send money to the Teamsters, and we get...?
> 
> When you work for a union they control everything about your job, and they obviously can't do that when we are responsible for our own cars and our own working times and places. Nobody forces us to take a fare and if a union driver doesn't some other driver will.
> 
> All this will end up doing is making the Teamsters a de facto regulatory authority over rideshare and independent drivers won't be allowed, you'll end up having to drive for a company they control that will be no different than a taxi company.


Looks like you are happy with meagre rates we pulling in


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

ricmut said:


> Looks like you are happy with meagre rates we pulling in


How in the world did you conclude that from what Squirming Like A Toad said?


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

ricmut said:


> Looks like you are happy with meagre rates we pulling in


There's really no point taking anything that Uber Shill serious so don't let it get to you.

There's a few of em around here.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> How in the world did you conclude that from what Squirming Like A Toad said?


It might have to do with drivers in certain markets making 24 cents a mile.

Nothing short of a union contract will EVER force Uber to change. But I think you know that.

I'm sure you love how those drivers are making 24 cents a mile.


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## ricmut (Jun 22, 2015)

All uber screwing people. We have 48 states remaining to sue them. Change is coming soon.i can see fares increasing this year.i can see drivers all up fighting for their rights .
Hey drivers try doing lyft both.as much as you sideline lyft yiu just making uber more daring and not care about anyone apart from uber


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> It might have to do with drivers in certain markets making 24 cents a mile.


What markets are those? Specifically.


> Nothing short of a union contract will EVER force Uber to change. But I think you know that.
> I'm sure you love how those drivers are making 24 cents a mile.


You sure are sure of a lot of things you don't know anything about... very impressive.


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## uber strike (Jan 10, 2016)

finding the answer is very simple... would uber welcome drivers starting a union??? if the answer is no, then we must join a union.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

JJ/Uber/Miami said:


> First of all, Uber is NOT my company and never has been, even for the short time I was foolish enough to utilize their app. And if you think belittling a corrupt company for wrongdoing has any bearing on my own personal character you are completely moronic. This is how whistle blowers and strikers promote positive change. I dare you to cross a picket line and tell people they are belittling themselves by their actions.
> 
> Second, the public should be aware of the predatory nature of this company in dealing with both drivers and pax. The amount of permissions they require just for downloading their app alone should outrage people. Why do they need that much access to private info ??
> 
> ...


My spawn has long been unleashed.
Perhaps they need further guidance and training ?
I have pretty much allowed them to shape themselves,besides basic guidance in social graces.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> What markets are those? Specifically.
> You sure are sure of a lot of things you don't know anything about... very impressive.


In Detroit they were making 30 cents a mile. After Uber's commission it's 24 cents a mile.

https://uberpeople.net/threads/30-cents-a-mile-how-on-earth.53488/

Why don't you explain to the class just how exactly you plan on forcing them to raise the rates back up, if it doesn't happen by way of a union contract ?

I also would like you to explain to the class how you plan on preventing Uber from continuously raising the booking fee ?


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## Snowtop (Nov 11, 2014)

uberdriverfornow said:


> In Detroit they were making 30 cents a mile. After Uber's commission it's 24 cents a mile.
> 
> https://uberpeople.net/threads/30-cents-a-mile-how-on-earth.53488/
> 
> ...


Kinda of convenient that you left off the .30 per minute ($18.00 per hour) out of your post.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> In Detroit they were making 30 cents a mile. After Uber's commission it's 24 cents a mile.


You're wrong - and misleading people.
The Detroit rate was $.030/mi *AND $0.35 cents a minute*.
It was a test to put more value on the TIME and less on the mileage
(and to drive Lyft and GM insane at a time when GM was investing $500mil into Lyft).

I ran the numbers comparing the rates in CLE ($0.77/mi & $0.13/min) vs DET for min fare, 3 mile and 5 mile trips
and they came out nearly identically.
And I posted the results somewhere here in UberP.net
And just as importantly, the Detroit per mile rate you quoted to back up your false claim of $0.24/mi isn't even the current rate of earnings - Detroit is now at $0.70/mile and $0.15/min


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> You're wrong - and misleading people.
> The Detroit rate was $.030/mi *AND $0.35 cents a minute*.
> It was a test to put more value on the TIME and less on the mileage
> (and to drive Lyft and GM insane at a time when GM was investing $500mil into Lyft).
> ...


Even at 70 cents a mile, that comes out to about 52 cents a mile, which is less than what the IRS even allows you to deduct as necessary expenses at 55 cents a mile. The fact of the matter is that Uber can and will change the rates at will to any amount.

You still didn't answer my question as to how you plan on forcing Uber to give everyone a fair rate, if not through collective bargaining.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Even at 70 cents a mile, that comes out to about 52 cents a mile


STOP quoting just one portion (mileage) of what makes up the total fare and conveniently leaving out the other portion (time). And also neglecting to mention that a min fare ride pays an effective rate of $2+/mile.


> which is less than what the IRS even allows you to deduct as necessary expenses at 55 cents a mile.


Discussed ad nauseum here, what you can deduct as an allowance in lieu of actual expenses has nothing whatsoever to do with the fares charged by Uber or the earnings paid by Uber.


> The fact of the matter is that Uber can and will change the rates at will to any amount.


Yup - it's called running a business.
And that's what they're doing (badly, imo).


> You still didn't answer my question as to how you plan on forcing Uber to give everyone a fair rate, if not through collective bargaining.


Who made it my job to force anyone else to do anything?
No one is forcing me to driver Uber (or Lyft).
Who's forcing you?

I voice my opinion to Uber by my actions
(Starting #UberOffTuesdays, writing opinion pieces, hopefully helping newer drivers understand the systems and the costs involved in driving).
I drive when it is MOST profitable for me - and accept rides that are only likely to be profitable for me. When the rates were higher, I drove further to do pick-ups and accepted more ride requests. My actions (combined with those of hundreds of others in my market) let Uber know what we are willing to do - and not do. THAT is how Uber makes decisions - data-driven decisions based on the metrics they measure, implemented to maximize service levels and minimize costs. Duh.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> Discussed ad nauseum here, what you can deduct as an allowance iin lieu of actualk expenses has nothing whatysoever to do with the fares charged by Uber or the earnings paid by Uber.Yup - it's called running a business.
> And that's what they're doing (badly, imo).Who made it my job to force anyone else to do anything?
> No one is forcing me to driver Uber (or Lyft).


No driver working for Uber is "running a business". We are working for Uber while the app is on. I know it. You know it. Everyone knows it. At some point you need to wake up and realize it instead of living in denial.



Michael - Cleveland said:


> Who's forcing you?


What the hell kind of point is that exactly ?



Michael - Cleveland said:


> I voice my opinion to Uber by my actions
> (Starting #UberOffTuesdays, writing opinion pieces, hopefully helping newer drivers understand the systems and the costs involved in driving).
> I drive when it is MOST profitable for me - and accept rides that are only likely to be profitable for me. When the rates were higher, I drove further to do pick-ups and accepted more ride requests. My actions (combined with those of hundreds of others in my market) let Uber know what we are willing to do - and not do. THAT is how Uber makes decisions - data-driven decisions based on the metrics they measure, implemented to maximize service levels and minimize costs. Duh.


So like I said and have proven, only through a union contract will anything change. You can choose to bury your head in the sand and do nothing and that's your choice. I'm talking about real actions not just talking and when this judge rejects this ridiculous settlement that you appear to love, and we get reclassified as employees then we will get to take real action. And you can cry all you want about it. I can speak for all drivers when I say we want a constant decent pay with no constant threat of our pay being constantly reduced and good working conditions.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> No driver working for Uber is "running a business". We are working for Uber while the app is on. I know it. You know it. Everyone knows it. At some point you need to wake up and realize it instead of living in denial.


What the hell is is with people here thinking they know what all other people are doing? What flippn' arrogance. Are you aware that there are business owners with several cars that run their livery service using Uber? Do some drivers 'work for Uber' in the real sense - sure. But then there are people like me, too... who don't work for Uber - we make Uber work for us. I pay Uber 20% of the fares I am allowed to charge a lead they provide me. If they send me a lead that doesn't pan out - I charge Uber $4 for it.

You want to paint every diver with the same brush?
Fine - but leave me out of your painting.


> So like I said and have proven, only through a union contract will anything change.


Ok - here we go again with another contributor self-proclaiming they have 'proven' something that they can't even discuss honestly and truthfully.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> What the hell is is with people here thinking they know what all other people are doing? What flippn' arrogance. Are you aware that there are business owners with several cars that run their livery service using Uber? Do some drivers 'work for Uber' in the real sense - sure. But then there are people like me, too... who don't work for Uber - we make Uber work for us. I pay Uber 20% of the fares I am allowed to charge a lead they provide me. If they send me a lead that doesn't pan out - I charge Uber $4 for it.
> 
> You want to paint every diver with the same brush?
> Fine - but leave me out of your painting.
> ...


Nobody says you have to want what most Uber drivers want. You've constantly maintained that you're happy to be controlled by Uber and have no reason to want this settlement rejected because you think they are doing you right now. Hey, that's your choice.

Almost everyone else is tired of Uber's antics and wants real change.

If they weren't constantly treating us badly maybe we'd be more apt to give them the benefit.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Nobody says you have to want what most Uber drivers want. You've constantly maintained that you're happy to be controlled by Uber and have no reason to want this settlement rejected because you think they are doing you right now. Hey, that's your choice.


You are wrong - You don't know anything about what I want - and OBVIOUSLY don't know anything about what I've stated here.


> Almost everyone else is tired of Uber's antics and wants real change.


And you also seem to think that you can give credence to what YOU want by claiming you know what others want. That's just sad.


> If they weren't constantly treating us badly maybe we'd be more apt to give them the benefit.


"WE" don't give Uber anything (other than our time, money and the use of our cars, that is)...
Uber is not in business to make drivers happy.
You and I and every other driver out there may wish that they were - but that's not what their business plan calls for.
The sooner you understand that, the sooner you can start driving with a company that does want to keep drivers happy.
Or get a real job. Or start a different business. Or go to school.

*Uber's *[despicable]* business model is to keep a driver on the road just long enough to keep the Uber service level to riders acceptable 
with drivers who haven't yet figured out that they are losing money while turning their cars into junk... 
and to then replace that driver with a new one who will pay higher fees, with a newer car, 
and then to repeat the process until they can start replacing drivers with autonomous cars.*

Want to protest against Uber's business plan?
Then stop driving Uber and stop using Uber for rides.


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## uberdriverfornow (Jan 10, 2016)

Michael - Cleveland said:


> You are wrong - You don't know anything about what I want - and OBVIOUSLY don't know anything about what I've stated here.And you also seem to think that you can give credence to what YOU want by claiming you know what others want. That's just sad.


Are you saying most drivers don't want a decent pay and decent working conditions ? Honestly, I'd be surprised if you said they did, going by your history.



Michael - Cleveland said:


> "WE" don't give Uber anything (other than our time, money and the use of our cars, that is)...
> Uber is not in business to make drivers happy.
> You and I and every other driver out there may wish that they were - but that's not what their business plan calls for.
> The sooner you understand that, the sooner you can start driving with a company that does want to keep drivers happy.
> Or get a real job. Or start a different business. Or go to school.


There's a difference between saying Uber should make us happy vs me saying they shouldn't treat us badly. Let that sink in.

Nobody says a company should treat employees great. They simply shouldn't treat employees badly.



Michael - Cleveland said:


> *Uber's *[despicable]* business model is to keep a driver on the road just long enough to keep their service level to riders acceptable with drivers who haven't yet figured out that they are losing money while turning their cars into junk... and to then replace that driver with a new one who will pay higher fees, with a newer car, and then to repeat the process until they can start replacing drivers with autonomous cars.*
> 
> Want to protest against Uber's business plan?
> Then stop driving Uber and stop using Uber for rides.


Yes, I'm sure you want some of the drivers to stop driving. That's not going to happen any time soon. Most of us love our jobs, we just don't love what Uber is doing. You can love Uber's antics all you want.


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

uberdriverfornow said:


> Are you saying most drivers don't want a decent pay and decent working conditions ?


I'm saying that neither you nor I have the right or the knowledge to speak for a half million drivers who each have their own idea of what they want: what they want from their work - what they want from Uber. There are drivers who *want* to see Uber offer an employment opportunity. There are drivers who would stop driving if they had to become employees. There are drivers who aren't sure and would need to see what an employment situation looks like. From ALL of the surveys and research I've read, the overwhelming majority of drivers (over 70%) say they drive less than full-time - and around 40% drive less than 8 hours per week. It wouldn't be a big surprise to anyone to find that those drivers want to remain independent contractors. All drivers want to earn enough to cover their costs and make a profit. Kalanick should burn in hell for all eternity for how he has directed Uber to exploit drivers for the benefit of his own purposes... but his policies are his choice (until shown to be illegal).


> Honestly, I'd be surprised if you said they did, going by your history.


When you've read my ~5,000 posts here, then you can talk about my history. Until then - stop putting words in my mouth.


> There's a difference between saying Uber should make us happy vs me saying they shouldn't treat us badly. Let that sink in.


And you let this sink in: YOU don't get to decide what is being 'treated badly' by Uber for all drives. For every one of us that cries 'foul' about Uber, there are others who have no complaint - and we do not get to speak for them just because we think we have it all figured out.


> Nobody says a company should treat employees great. They simply shouldn't treat employees badly.


The Uber *employees* I talk to love the company. It's the independent contractors (*drivers, CSRs*) that feel they are treated badly.
A lot of Independent Contractors get treated badly. Part of the price some of us pay for being independent.
I know this though: in coming close to two years driving, I've [mostly] known the rules (been scolded repeatedly) - and never once received a check late.

I've also stopped driving when something changed that, in my opinion, didn't look like it could work for me...
and I didn't start to drive again until I figured out how to make it work for me. If I can't make a profit - I don't drive.
That's a luxury not everyone has - and I understand that.


> Yes, I'm sure you want...


Can you open your mouth without telling someone else what they think or what they want?


> ...some of the drivers to stop driving.


 - keep making stuff up and putting that into other people's mouths - and then claiming that you have slayed the strawman. Your arguments are transparent and tiresome.


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## kakauber (Apr 20, 2016)

MikesUber said:


> Labor union says it has received "overwhelming outreach" from Uber drivers seeking benefits and a stronger voice on the job.
> 
> Source: http://www.cnet.com/news/uber-drivers-seek-to-team-up-with-teamsters/
> 
> ...


Who is going to pay for that. I will be left with nothing.


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## I_Like_Spam (May 10, 2015)

uber strike said:


> finding the answer is very simple... would uber welcome drivers starting a union??? if the answer is no, then we must join a union.


Uber might welcome a union, for several reasons.

1. It would raise Uber's bonafides with the progressive movement, generating good will and more business.

2. It would relieve Uber of the obligation to talk with each driver individually, as the union would be the exclusive bargaining agent for all the drivers. If a driver had a complaint about anything, the email back to them from Uber would be to contact the business agent.

3. Since dues/agency fees would be based upon the revenues each driver generates, the union would have the same interest as Uber in policing drivers who might be driving "off app" where Uber is kept out of the loop and out of the cash stream. Having someone watching your back is a good idea when you are trying to supervise someone clean across the country. "Off meter" trips are what made taxi drivers basically unsupervisable and led to the current situation where those guys are all lease drivers and no longer commission drivers.


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