# Uber’s Business Isn’t Built to Help Disabled People



## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

*Uber's Business Isn't Built to Help Disabled People*
http://www.wired.com/2015/08/uber-disability/


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## UberNorthStar (Jul 7, 2015)

I cannot afford a van, much less a wheelchair accessible one. _*If *_ I could find an agency willing to loan ( yes,, laugh) me one during daylight hrs, I would be more than happy to accommodate those who are unable to leave their wheelchairs.

My background includes training as a certified nurses aid, and family care giving for elderly relatives one of whom needed to learn how to transfer from wheelchair to bed among other places.

I took on the Uber Platform hoping I could help the elderly & disabled.

*Constructive* sugestations and encouragement, anyone?


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## Michael - Cleveland (Jan 1, 2015)

My personal opinion is that Uber is foolish not to invest a certain number of vehicles per major city, 
train drivers to use them, and then make use of the vehicles available to those trained drivers at no cost. 
Small investment: HUGE benefits (including PR).


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## Ca$h4 (Aug 12, 2015)

The most constructive suggestion is to start with the facts, not political correctness and ideological nonsense. "Disabled People" are not the same as "Abled People." They take more time to service whether you like it or not!!!!! Yet they insist they want to be treated like they are not -- specifically they don't want to be charged more then "abled people." Paratransit is the category the disabled should be serviced by -- not regular taxi, black car, livery, etc. . If any city created a "universal hailing app" and a "paratransit category" that drivers could voluntary choose, the drivers would do that paratransit service if they made the same or more than the other segmments -- taxi, black car, livery, etc. Drivers go to where they make the most money for their time -- duh. Forget the political correctness and ideological nonsese, and set rates to make a fair days wage by adjusting the number vehicles yearly to balance supply and demand.


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## UberNorthStar (Jul 7, 2015)

Excuse me? _*Disabled people should have the same access to transportation as "able-bodied" people.*_

Yes, it _could take more time _to help a disabled person into a vehicle. Most times people who need to transfer know how to do it quickly because they know how to. To me the ones who might take longer are those who are relegated to wheelchairs due to their medical problem & need a lift to put them into the van.

If a driver has training and experience to deal with disabilities, it is a piece of cake to help a person into the vehicle!

<Addition> If treated with dignity instead of contempt, a disabled person might give a far better gratuity than an able-bodied person. Think about it.


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## Ca$h4 (Aug 12, 2015)

Exactly, training is the essential ingredient because there are many types of disabilities. Training should be for paratransit. You have to train to service the blind and their dogs, the legally blind, dialysis patients in various degrees of health - some close to death, cancer patients in various stages of therapy, people on various medications for physical and mental problems. Wheelchairs are not always a piece of cake, some people can be very heavy -- 300 lbs.(which by the way can break your car seat) , others may not be very hygenic! Lots of drivers don't want to deal with these types of customers. so paratransit should be volumtary and the app should cover the whole city so there is plenty of work.


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## UberNorthStar (Jul 7, 2015)

Ca$h4 said:


> Lots of drivers don't want to deal with these types of customers. so paratransit should be voluntary and the app should cover the whole city so there is plenty of work.


I am one willing to deal with most disabilities. Training & experience are part of my qualifications, and am always willing to learn.

Servicing the blind in my experience was no big deal. The blind I have dealt with knew how to enter & leave a car. Their dogs knew their place. A service dog for the blind is usually 
better-kept than I keep my dogs.


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## Ca$h4 (Aug 12, 2015)

Maybe you could find a chuch or non-profit serving the disabled who would let you keep their van 24/7 if you drove people around for a modest wage during the day. I'm sure you would do a good job.


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## groot (Jul 7, 2015)

Uber's business is built to disable people.


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## UberNorthStar (Jul 7, 2015)

groot said:


> Uber's business is built to disable people.


One of my first posts stated I have owned 3 successful businesses -- Tupperware, Avon, and a typing service before PCs were common in the home. This one will not be a failure. (If it is, as Mom used to say, it will be over my dead body!) The loss I incur may offset the taxes I pay on a joint income.

If anything Uber is not disabling me. It is spurring me to beat them at their own game.



Ca$h4 said:


> Maybe you could find a chuch or non-profit serving the disabled who would let you keep their van 24/7 if you drove people around for a modest wage during the day. I'm sure you would do a good job.


 TY 

I have a connection with a company that fits cars & vans with adaptive devices for the disabled. I am going to check with them Monday. I plan to present myself to organizations that support people with spinal cord injuries, people with cerebral palsy, people with epilepsy, and people who use service dogs.

I cannot help everyone. During daylight hours I can help at least three people to/from destinations. It is a lofty dream that is now my goal. Count me in as that old ant determined to move a rubber tree plant. 

The insurance part, unless under the organization, is cost prohibitive to me. I am unable to find insurance that will sell me commercial insurance for less than $10k/year. . And I am still looking.

<Addition: Just called a friend who works for the big city & has a disability. She may have a connection.>


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

Ca$h4 said:


> The most constructive suggestion is to start with the facts, not political correctness and ideological nonsense. "Disabled People" are not the same as "Abled People." They take more time to service whether you like it or not!!!!! Yet they insist they want to be treated like they are not -- specifically they don't want to be charged more then "abled people." Paratransit is the category the disabled should be serviced by -- not regular taxi, black car, livery, etc. . If any city created a "universal hailing app" and a "paratransit category" that drivers could voluntary choose, the drivers would do that paratransit service if they made the same or more than the other segmments -- taxi, black car, livery, etc. Drivers go to where they make the most money for their time -- duh. Forget the political correctness and ideological nonsese, and set rates to make a fair days wage by adjusting the number vehicles yearly to balance supply and demand.


Keeping in mind the fact that it would be illegal to charge them more for the same service and it is illegal to deny them service based on their disability. According to Uber, every Uber driver knows this.


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

Ca$h4 said:


> Exactly, training is the essential ingredient because there are many types of disabilities. Training should be for paratransit. You have to train to service the blind and their dogs, the legally blind, dialysis patients in various degrees of health - some close to death, cancer patients in various stages of therapy, people on various medications for physical and mental problems. Wheelchairs are not always a piece of cake, some people can be very heavy -- 300 lbs.(which by the way can break your car seat) , others may not be very hygenic! Lots of drivers don't want to deal with these types of customers. so paratransit should be volumtary and the app should cover the whole city so there is plenty of work.


You guys have your heart in the right place, but the reality is that Uber will never offer any sort of training in the near future. Offering training would make a stronger case that drivers are employees.

The only way I see Uber training drivers is if they are ordered to by a court.


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## Fuzzyelvis (Dec 7, 2014)

Demon said:


> Keeping in mind the fact that it would be illegal to charge them more for the same service and it is illegal to deny them service based on their disability. According to Uber, every Uber driver knows this.


That's why a higher price has to be subsidized by charging the able bodied more. That's how a caring society works. But Uber is all about rampant capitalism.

All it would take is a 10 cent surcharge on other Uber rides (or God Forbid, take a portion of the SRF) to fund the extra expense of vehicles for the disabled. The driver could get paid more to make up for the extra time and the disabled pax still pays the same.

This is how public transit works (although may just be from general taxes) Also for the elderly. Taxis are made to do it by the government. Uber simply doesn't, or in the case of Houston, pays a pathetic amount to put off doing it until later.


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

Fuzzyelvis said:


> That's why a higher price has to be subsidized by charging the able bodied more. That's how a caring society works. But Uber is all about rampant capitalism.
> 
> All it would take is a 10 cent surcharge on other Uber rides (or God Forbid, take a portion of the SRF) to fund the extra expense of vehicles for the disabled. The driver could get paid more to make up for the extra time and the disabled pax still pays the same.
> 
> This is how public transit works (although may just be from general taxes) Also for the elderly. Taxis are made to do it by the government. Uber simply doesn't, or in the case of Houston, pays a pathetic amount to put off doing it until later.


If Uber bought vehicles for the disabled it would need a driver and that driver would then have a stronger case to be an employee. So Uber will never do that.


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## UberNorthStar (Jul 7, 2015)

Demon said:


> You guys have your heart in the right place, but the reality is that Uber will never offer any sort of training in the near future. Offering training would make a stronger case that drivers are employees.


I have the training I need through experience as a family caregiver and am always willing to learn.


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

UberNorthStar said:


> I have the training I need through experience as a family caregiver and am always willing to learn.


But you'll never get training from Uber, nor will Uber insure any vehicle a charitable group might allow you to use to pick up those with disabilities who need a ride.


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## Fuzzyelvis (Dec 7, 2014)

Demon said:


> If Uber bought vehicles for the disabled it would need a driver and that driver would then have a stronger case to be an employee. So Uber will never do that.


If Uber paid $5 a mile to those using a van with a lift etc they would get drivers who already have one for a family member into the game.

If they paid an extra $10 to anyone transporting a rider with a service dog that would cut down on refusals of such.

They could offer a "bonus" to anyone who completes certain training.

There are many ways to do this. The simple fact is they don't want to.


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

Fuzzyelvis said:


> If Uber paid $5 a mile to those using a van with a lift etc they would get drivers who already have one for a family member into the game.
> 
> If they paid an extra $10 to anyone transporting a rider with a service dog that would cut down on refusals of such.
> 
> ...


I agree with you. Uber doesn't want to deal with riders who have disabilities. That should tell everyone exactly what kind of company Uber is.


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## UberNorthStar (Jul 7, 2015)

Demon said:


> Keeping in mind the fact that it would be illegal to charge them more for the same service and it is illegal to deny them service based on their disability. According to Uber, every Uber driver knows this.


Did I say I would charge more? I said one might get a better tip from someone with a disability.



Demon said:


> But you'll never get training from Uber, nor will Uber insure any vehicle a charitable group might allow you to use to pick up those with disabilities who need a ride.


Did I say I need training? NO! I can learn from those who have disabilities as to how to help them if indeed they needed help over an above the knowledge I have.

Whoever owns the vehicle would be responsible for the insurance.

Anything else you want to toss in? You are picking a battle with the wrong person.


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## Demon (Dec 6, 2014)

UberNorthStar said:


> Did I say I would charge more? I said one might get a better tip from someone with a disability.
> 
> Did I say I need training? NO! I can learn from those who have disabilities as to how to help them if indeed they needed help over an above the knowledge I have.
> 
> ...


I'm not picking a battle at all. No one said you would charge more, and Uber discourages tipping.

Let me be very clear on this, Uber should be training anyone who drives for them on how to deal with passengers with disabilities. As a company Uber doesn't get to decide who they train and who they don't, they should be training everyone. Since they haven't done that, Uber find themselves in the mess they are now in with multiple lawsuits for ADA violations.

If you want their insurance to cover you, you need to be their employee.

For the 2nd time, your heart seems to be in the right place, but Uber has picked this battle.


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## UberNorthStar (Jul 7, 2015)

Demon said:


> Uber should be training anyone who drives for them on how to deal with passengers with disabilities.


I understand your point. Uber's point is they are a "technology company" and I am an independent contractor. On that basis I own a business & the name Uber is not part of the business name. It is up to me as a driver to obtain any training I need to deal with disabilities, not Uber's. Travis & company probably have no idea as to how to deal with people who are not in their world.

If I am able to drive a van owned by a non profit, Uber will have proof the van is insured by the non profit. I will _not_ need Uber insurance. I think I have the angles figured out. I hope people who know me on this forum will support.me.

BTW, according to the UBER training video, Uber wants a driver to say "It's not necessary" if offered a tip. The next sentence is & I quote, "If the customer insists, go ahead & take it. You've earned it!  As a former waitress I am not going to refuse a tip when offered one. I've earned it! 

JM2¢W


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## TwoFiddyMile (Mar 13, 2015)

All this speculation is funny.
Cabs run wheelchair vans because they are required to. 
Some cities offer discounted medallions to owners who launch a liberty van because of the extra expense of the van. 
You cannot charge more for a non ambulatory wheelchair ride than a regular cab ride.
Most handicapped people take specialized non taxi wheelchair service. 
It's extraordinarily expensive, but it's prescheduled and shared- it's not taxi work.


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## UberNorthStar (Jul 7, 2015)

TwoFiddyMile said:


> You cannot charge more for a non ambulatory wheelchair ride than a regular cab ride.
> Most handicapped people take specialized non taxi wheelchair service.
> It's extraordinarily expensive, but it's prescheduled and shared- it's not taxi work.


Laugh all you want, TFM. I am serious.

Again, did I say I would charge more? No.

A disability is what one is born with or acquires in their lifetime. A handicap is what they make of it_.
_
Many people confined to wheelchairs either have their vehicle adapted so they can drive, or a van with a lift & someone else drives them. I am very aware of non-taxi transportation services as I used one to transport my father to my stepmom's funeral.

No, it is not taxi work. It is care giving work in which I have plenty of experience. You are speaking about wheelchairs. What about people who have service dogs, people who have medical problems that prevent them from driving? I can service those people with no problem.

One of my unpaid jobs was "Mom's Taxi." When I went out of town to take care of my mother-in-law, my husband marveled at how I managed to transport four children from school to/from after various school activities five days a week.

Never underestimate the power of a woman.


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