# Letting Meter Run Long & Tipping



## LackJack (Dec 1, 2014)

Hi, I'm a pax. I'm hoping you can help (or beat me).

I've had three drivers recently let the meter run long after I've got out of the car. At first I thought it was a mistake, but now it seems like it's a regular occurrence. If it was just one block I wouldn't care but driving another half-mile? (I'm dropped off in parking lots or residential streets with on-street parking)

I'm not rich, Uber is my backup for when I miss a bus, desperate for a quick ride or it's late out. The reason I prefer Uber over the other RS services I've investigated is because I don't have to worry about tip (I made a point of investigating this fact [forum wouldn't let me post a link]). I want a simple experience and I need to know actual cost before I step foot in the car (I *always* use fare estimate feature). I rely on that estimate being accurate and not having to worry about determining a tip.

However, letting the meter run long seems like a sort of back-handed tip. Which got me to thinking... Is there an unspoken tip-required policy among drivers? My feeling is that if Uber says "no tip" then passengers shouldn't tip and drivers shouldn't drive for Uber because they aren't paying the actual market rate.

I'm not a "base fare" but I'm usually no more than $10-$15. Again, I feel I use the fare estimator so a driver knows what they are getting.

I have a feeling the driver-opinion is "you must tip." I seriously dislike this, though, because it means a few things (a) I have to find cash, not just any cash, but singles before I take a ride, (b) I have to tip based on the fare-estimate, yes I'm bad at math, I'm the guy that takes the 2 minutes to calculate tip at restaurants (I don't go out that often), (c) I'm creating the expectation that tip is the norm for all passengers and (d) Uber isn't any cheaper, for me, than the other RSes.

I feel that drivers should drive only if the going rate is acceptable to them, if not, my feeling is don't drive -- wait until the surge is on or use a different service. I believe in paying a living wage.

However, I realize there is the pax rating system and I may be getting low ratings because I don't tip, meaning it takes longer for me to get a car. Putting aside the fact that I think *Uber is super idiotic for not realizing the perverted incentives they are encouraging*, I'm wondering if the only way to get high ratings is to go ahead and tack on my own 20% to any Uber ride I want to take and carry around the cash necessary?

I would prefer we operate more like the UK, we price and pay the actual rate. I don't know how you go "above and beyond" when it comes to Uber unless I do something to seriously inconvenience you (making you wait, mis-marking the pin, changing destinations, carrying lots of stuff, or anything that isn't a normal ride).

However, I'm not oblivious to the fact that Uber has a reputation for being cut-throat and unfair to drivers. I want a better understanding on *the actual requirement to receive the best from the Uber service*. If that means tipping 20% on every ride so I keep my rating high enough to get the quickest service, then I can accept that, even if I dislike it.

As far as letting the meter run -- I'm not cool with this -- is it common? I rate all my drivers 5 stars but this last one (which drove two blocks down, turned left and drove another half-mile) I requested a fare review saying the driver must have forgot to turn off the meter.

Perhaps I'm out of line here but I'll try to sum up my questions.
1. Is it common to let the meter run long?
2. Is it appropriate to ask the driver to stop the meter when you get out of the car? Or is that just asking for low-star rating and you should just trust and request fare review?
3. Is tipping a required unspoken rule?
4. Is there a cut-off amount (say fares under $20 should be tipped at 20% but above that no worries?) or is it universal 20% for every ride?
5. Do drivers discuss in pax-ratings whether the pax tips or not? Is this a major factor?
(just saw the poll function below, so I'll add the tip question!)

I'm sure my cheapness offends some people but poor means you pinch pennies and trust people to keep their word (Uber) when they set a policy, not rely on hidden fees or expectations (e.g. if Uber was serious about a no-tip policy they'd police it).

Thanks for any helpful feedback, I really appreciate the Uber drivers and the 2am pickups when I've broken down or got stuck at a Metro station but I don't want to be part of the problem.


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## Optimus Uber (Oct 7, 2014)

Welcome to the forum. As far as answers to your questions you're going to get allot of different answers. 

You can't judge all of us by the responses you are about to receive and you may not still be clear after the responses because it depends on the individual.

From the consumer end of it, if the meter runs long, I would rate and ask for the fare review. I wouldn't say anything to the driver. Let uber deal with it. No reason your rank should take the hit if 
The driver is letting the meter run long.

Tipping is up to you. Even a couple of dollars is,always cool. Makes one feel appreciated. No matter what the total trip costs.

Wouldn't you feel good, if someone went out of their way and kicked you back with a couple of bucks? Many of these drivers are in their cars ip to 12 hours,a day or more, fatigue will make them cranky, couple of bucks will make them feel appreciated.

Fact is uber screwed up with the whole, the tip is included in the fare. It doesn't hit their pocket book so they have no issue throwing it in. Yet they take the first dollar of every trip for their own tip. With some BS talk of things it covers.

Regardless, me personally, do not hold it against you if I dont get a tip. The ranking for me is binary, you're either a 5 or a 1. Only way to get a one from me is to be so drunk you can't keep your eyes open, you can't get out of the car on your own and definitely if you hurl.

As far as ignoring a pickup, dont take it personal. The drivers cherry pick. They can tell how good the ride is by the pickup address. They love to pick up from hotels. So if you're close to a hotel, ping from there. If it is a lower class area if the city, you're going to have an issue getting a car. Just the,way it is.


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## Verminator (Sep 12, 2014)

LackJack said:


> Hi, I'm a pax. I'm hoping you can help (or beat me).
> 
> I've had three drivers recently let the meter run long after I've got out of the car. At first I thought it was a mistake, but now it seems like it's a regular occurrence. If it was just one block I wouldn't care but driving another half-mile? (I'm dropped off in parking lots or residential streets with on-street parking)
> 
> ...


I can't speak for all other drivers, but I end the trip when the last passenger exits the vehicle, or when I return to the vehicle if I'm offloading luggage.


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## ElectroFuzz (Jun 10, 2014)

You know that he let the meter run long because you see it on the
map that's included with email receipt?....... if so not cool.

Or do you think he let it run long because it took some time for the price to pop up
on your phone.
If so remember, sometimes there is a lag, sometimes it's long, it does not mean that your
driver let the meter run long.

As far as tipping, if you liked the service, tip your driver.
It doesn't mater how much, a $1 is a million times better then $0


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## Uber Jax (Sep 30, 2014)

There is a simple solution to end your problems about the meter running long in lieu of a tip.
(This practice is absolutely wrong and the driver should be fired). 

Simply ask the driver at the end of the ride (before you get out) how much the fare was.
Or ask to see the fare on his driver app. Problem solved!  

My personal practice has always been this ...

I always inform my passengers when I *start *the ride and then again when I *end *the ride!
I show them what the fare was and I also show them what I rate them!


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## LAuberX (Jun 3, 2014)

Ask to see the fare, problem averted.

Then give him AT LEAST! $2.00


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## reluctantuber (Nov 21, 2014)

There is no real excuse for letting the meter run long. That being said I have had technical issues where the app take a little while to end trip or crashes before I end trip. Eithet way if it ran long it is a matter of feet or maybe blocks. If you clearly see on map they rang long definitely ask for a fare review with no hesitation. As an aside that wont affect your rating as we wont see that until well after we have rated you.

I do agree with UberJax's advice as well as a solution.

So far as tipping I give out plenty of 5s without a tip. For me a tip isn't expected but always welcome. I may be in the minority in that on this forum. That being said I do believe with Ubers significant fare cuts they should make it easier for customers to have the option to tip via the app.

I start docking stars for long waits, bad behavior, rudeness, bad navigation, etc. Ive only given a handful of 1s.


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## grUBBER (Sep 11, 2014)

Too long
I'm not gonna read this crap.
One thing I can say is that you're full of crap. 
I can help you calculate the tip. 
Write it down! 
It's $5. Every time. 
Keep those singles for the bus.


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## Optimus Uber (Oct 7, 2014)

I have had issues were I can't turn the meter off coz I'm so high in the hills there is no cell signal. So I go slowly down the hill until cell signal returns and end the trip, normally it would be less than a $1.

So if you're living in the Hollywood hills, just the way it is until the cell companies put a booster/repeater up where you live.


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## grUBBER (Sep 11, 2014)

Optimus Uber said:


> I have had issues were I can't turn the meter off coz I'm so high in the hills there is no cell signal. So I go slowly down the hill until cell signal returns and end the trip, normally it would be less than a $1.
> 
> So if you're living in the Hollywood hills, just the way it is until the cell companies put a booster/repeater up where you live.


I couldn't start the meter in the hills till I got to Laurel/Lookout
My passenger lives up there and tells me to keep driving him for free till the bottom of the hill.
I cleared my tip odometer to see how much I have to sponsor him and his super nice lifestyle.
It was 1.1 miles and probably 4 minutes down the hill before I could start the trip.
I could convert it to $$ and say what I paid to drive him for "free"
The fare ended up close to an uber minimum $4 and the guy didn't tip.
I rated him a 5 for his lovely English accent and solving the problem with "just drive all the way down the hill and you will gain your phone signal"

Also, I hope he won't complain after we drop him off up there and roll down the hill with the meter on.


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## LackJack (Dec 1, 2014)

ElectroFuzz said:


> You know that he let the meter run long because you see it on the
> map that's included with email receipt?....... if so not cool.


I checked the map.



grUBBER said:


> One thing I can say is that you're full of crap.
> I can help you calculate the tip.
> Write it down!
> It's $5. Every time.
> Keep those singles for the bus.


Thanks for the insight, right back at ya.


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## LookyLou (Apr 28, 2014)

I have never heard of a driver admitting to doing this intentionally.


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## No-tippers-suck (Oct 20, 2014)

@LackJack :

1.) No the ride should be started as you enter the car and be ended the moment you left the car.
Sometimes I meet Pax that tell me to end the fare while they still sit in my car and that is totally annoying.
However a driver shouldn't be unfair and sometimes it happens always in the Hollywood Hills to me I have no service on my phone so I sometimes can't end the ride immediately.
I don't even know how Uber handles this situation because it's not even my fault.

2.) EXACTLY as mentioned it's like not trusting and you could also ask a driver if he wil kidnap you, don't do it rather contact uber if it's happen so they can fix the correct fare afterwards.
As you mentioned you would understand if it was within the next block or so but not another half mile away. (1/2 mile = $0.60 cents so even that wouldn't ruin you but it's unfair from the driver
I totally agree with you.

3.) You see my username  right? Let me say that I will always give at least a little tip for example just tonight I gave the Pizza Guy $5 (usually I would give $2 or $3) but his first words were "happy holidays Sir.." Well I don't want to embarrass myself for not tipping him. It's still your decision if you tip or not you should not be forced to tip.

4.) Especially on short trips around $4 to $10 Tipping really really support us the most because Uber lies to everybody by saying that we pay %20 Fee to Uber.
But since they take $1 out of our base price (they can call it however they want it's still our base price dirty liars!) so we pay up to 40% on very short trips, still we are very friendly about it unlike the stories I hear from our pax about their previous short taxi rides.. (I was a taxidriver so I know that this is very true)
We want to make you feel very welcome never mind if you spend $4 or $40 dollars but paying $1 out of 40 dollars doesn't hurt us as much as on very short trips.
I would still give a tip even if not 20% on long trips but if everybody would at least drop a small appreciation we sure would start having water on demand again.
however it's your decision.

5.) That really depends.. I was talking about not giving the 5th star unless people tip, but in reality I meet so many nice people and I can't be mad at them..
but if someone lets me wait 10mins (App not running until you sit in my car) AND doesn't reimburse me for waiting with a appropriate tip I will definitely not want to see this person again which means 3Star is the maximum I can give for that.

two weeks ago I was driving a Rocksinger with two hot ladies and and he had a lot of demands.. pull up all the way to the water fountain.. turn the Air off, radiostation bla bla...
it was a supershort trip for $4 but when he got out he dropped me a $20  so of course he got 5Stars from me He could have gotten a SUV for the same price..


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## sublibrarian (Dec 1, 2014)

I am a pax as well.

My boyfriend and I live in Vancouver where Uber is banned and regular taxi cabs are horrible. So last week we went to L.A and one of the things we were excited to try was Uber.

We took 4 rides. One with UberX and the rest with Uber Black SUV. Our experience was great. We had 3 amazing drivers (all but one) who offered us water, gum, opened the door for us and were attentive and kind. One of them took us from the Promenade in Santa Monica to the Walk of Fame, it was a $70 ride, but there was a lot of traffic and it felt like he should have gotten more from it. I ALWAYS leave great tips when I am served well, sometimes in restaurants if I am satisfied I will tip 30%. However we didn't tip our Uber drivers and I now realize it was a mistake. I wish I could contact the guys who drove me to fix it but the app doesn't let me. In any case, let me explain why because I think this might be happening to other passengers as well, and maybe this is the reason you guys aren't being tipped as much as you would like:

We looked up Uber etiquette and everywhere we read it said we should not tip our drivers. It was stated that a 20% tip was already calculated and included into our fare, and that we shouldn't tip them. We felt it made sense since one of the main reasons to use Uber is so you don't have to carry cash on you. So even when I would have normally tipped these drivers (and they were fantastic) I didn't, against my own judgement. Now I realized after the fact and after reading these forums that it says it is calculated only for Uber Taxi (and not UberBlack SUV) but to a normal client who is not familiar with the Uber system and different lines, and all he reads is that you don't have to tip anyone. Here is a screen cap of the Uber website where the tip etiquette is:










I go to L.A often so if any of my drivers by any chance sees this: if we ever meet again I will make it up to you with a big tip next time. If I had known you guys expect a tip I would have tipped you. (Except for Ahmed: you kinda sucked.. you talked on your phone while driving me and you didn't speak english, your SUV was in dismal condition too)










So in short: this is Uber's fault. They should do something about their tipping system because it is obviously broken. They should either give you your 20% tips right away, create a "tip your driver" button that I can press from my phone and enter any amount I want, or they should at least remove the "you don't need to tip your driver" portion from their website because it is very confusing.

I hope you are having a good weekend.


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## No-tippers-suck (Oct 20, 2014)

@sublibrarian :

I can see that you're one of our most welcome and awesome pax.. (UberX just for $4.. shame on you )
But I am sure he did NOT complain that it was just a very short ride and this should be your experience hopefully all the time with us.)
Yes especially for the UberX ride he would have welcomed a few bucks extra very very much. But yes it's absolutely NOT YOUR FAULT !
Uber is to blame and we are to explain our situation to you with the hope that you guys understand us. The $4 ride paid $1 out of his base fare PLUS the 20% Uber currently cuts
A TOTAL OF 40% UBER FEE IS THE CASE 

When I see the Uber Black fares I am considering if I should replace "Ahmed" nobody needs him obviously 

Thank you for sharing this with us.


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## sublibrarian (Dec 1, 2014)

Why "shame on me"? It was at least a 15 block ride. I don't understand the idea that I am hurting someone by requesting (and paying) for the service he provides. No passenger has to have a clue about how taxi driving works. I am not a taxi driver, I couldn't possibly know this. In my mind when I ask for a cab I am giving the guy work which is a good thing. I understand there are ins and outs to every job, but you can't expect the passenger to know this or make him feel like he is insulting you for not knowing what driving a cab entails. I think calling me an "awesome" pax in a sarcastic way was uncalled for. Especially when I am coming here, to your forum, out of my own volition: means I am doing research to find a way to be a better passenger.

As of the UberX ride it was my first Uber ride ever. I was expecting to get a black SUV type of cab because I didn't know the difference between the lines and all of that, I simply requested a cab expecting a black one and got a normal one instead. The driver was an grandpa type playing hits from the 60s (knock two times on the ceiling if you want meeeeee) and I thought he was adorable. I asked him to explain Uber to me, I asked about tipping, he said tips were included, and even then I actually did tip him $5 because I had cash on me and I didn't understand how it was possible for a ride that long to be so cheap, I figured there was some sort of mistake because nowhere in America (the continent) a 15 block ride is 4 bucks. If Jack (the driver) is reading this forum he will corroborate my story.

I also don't find a Uber cut of 40% shocking. They are providing you the costumers. You simply have to turn on your app and you get clients. Many businesses work through agencies and their cut is usually anywhere between 50% and 70%. In the same way I don't know how taxi driving works, you do not know the inner workings of an internet start-up such as Uber. They also have shit to pay to be able to provide the service to us the passengers, but also to you, their partners. They have to pay for servers, techs, workers, and all the infrastructure which is not cheap. They too have a business to run that is expensive on their end. The simple idea that your cab has an icon that moves through the map on my phone as you drive down the street costs them money. All you see is the clients they "feed" you, but their job goes beyond what you see, has expenses that you can't even imagine, in the same manner the taxi driver business has a million expenses the passenger never sees, and that I could never predict. All in all, you work for Uber and they promote your cab among their client base. This has value, this is what you are paying for. If you don't think what they offer is worth it then you should probably drive for something else.


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## No-tippers-suck (Oct 20, 2014)

Well, I will not argue with you but it seems that you did not understand my response at all.

1.) So you tipped the UberX driver with $5 bucks for a short $4 ride means you did appreciate a good service at a low price.
The words awesome has nothing to do with sarcastic and I even put a smiley behind that.. well miscommunication.

2.) 40% is actually VERY SHOCKING because I almost believe that you might even think that Uber eventually even owns and operates the cars provided for service.
If I have to bring my own equipment and pay for all costs including Gas as the biggest factor how could I pay 20% for "just getting connected to the rider?
I see that you are not a "pennypincher" (AGAIN IT'S NOT SARCASTIC!)
You are willing to pay extra as you just confirmed, you will be one of those pax to keep us alive.

cuts are usually between 50% and 70% you wrote ?? I have never ever heard about that high fees anywhere in the transportation business.
Iam now 11-13 years in this business and I did Taxi and Limo, I was also an employee first then I got my own "medaillion" franchise from the city and I never paid anything close to 50%
during the time I was self employed. 

As a Taxi driver back in the years I first worked for 50% of the fees but the owners then even paid for the gas and provided the cars. I was never at risk.
Later they changed that concept and stated the taxidrivers as "independent contractors" BECAUSE otherwise they were under the minimum wage.
I can google to that article where the exact year for that along the complete story can be found.

hopefully I could clarify the prior miscommication.
I don't want to sound disrespectful, that was not the point of my message.


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## sublibrarian (Dec 1, 2014)

Oh, okay, sorry about that. Sometimes over the internet it is hard to read the tone, and since your name is "no-tippers-suck" I assumed you were being sarcastic. My bad.

When I talked about the agency cut I didn't mean in the transportation business, but other businesses. One that comes to mind is stripping and webcam modelling. Most strip clubs will require a stage fee, plus 50% of every dance the strippers sell, and sometimes even a portion of their tips. Strippers also have to tip the DJ, the bouncer, the bar tenders, and the house mom. Cam modelling websites which are similar to Uber in a sense because they provide costumers over a similar infrastructure will take up to 70 cents out of every dollar the models make. I know this because I have worked closely with the industry. But it happens in other industries as well such as event planning and house cleaning.

I see what you mean about the cab being yours and having to pay for expenses out of your own pocket. But let me ask you one thing.. if you have worked in other situations where the company provided the cabs and even the gas and still gave you 50%, why not go back there? I am a firm believer that if you aren't satisfied with something in your life you must change it! complaining will never solve anything... that is just my outlook.


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## No-tippers-suck (Oct 20, 2014)

great the miscommunication is now clear.. I should mention that I came from Germany two years ago and my expression in English maybe sometimes different than from some other drivers who are born here but I am sure it's still better than your "favorite black car driver you earlier mentioned" lol.. 
Also my username of course ! I totally understand,

Let me mention first that WE (the independent contracted drivers should outreach to the passengers, YOU!
to explain the situation as it really is, because I am sure that you really like the Uber concept as much as I like it.
but it's full of flaws that are unfair towards the driver. Just for example the tipping should be at least implemented in the App
but not as an forced Tip that you have to pay even if you were absolutely not satisfied with driver, car or anything else.
Also you don't want to have to worry about having a few dollar bills on hand since one of the best features is that this system is cashless and yes it works great.

Please imagine what happens if "I" along with many other drivers will consider not to participate on the Uber or any other platform any longer.
WE the drivers of the "first hour" highly motivated and with great customer service skills will disappear and we will be replaced with desperate drivers..
desperate because they currently may have no source of income and they are even happy to average at $5 per hour..

Just think back to the times when uber started, there were NO hammer attacks, no kidnapping, no known accidents (well accidents will always happen but they also always happened in the taxi industry, that's why we have to carry the commercial insurance) 
The drivers of "hour one" were the highly motivated drivers many professional taxi and limo drivers among them (such as me and many others here in this forum)
Some were not experienced but all of us were superfriendly and customer oriented. 
WE MADE UBER TO WHAT UBER BECAME TODAY.

To answer your question: "why not go back there"

Yes I am currently considering it but now the taxi business is also changing a lot.
The medaillion owners won't offer a 50% / 50% risk anymore because they just lease the cabs, for let's say $500 per week for one shift 
and you still pay for gas and car washes, with the current business situation this is less than 50% of the gross fares.

Also the Dispatchers are usually expecting their bribe, the Hotel Consierge.. simply everybody wants a piece of the cake.
So I was superhappy when Uber came up and I thought why should we have to deal with the taxiowners that screwed us over for years?

I was really happy about the opportunity to drive for Uber.


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## Realityshark (Sep 22, 2014)

LackJack said:


> Hi, I'm a pax. I'm hoping you can help (or beat me).
> 
> I've had three drivers recently let the meter run long after I've got out of the car. At first I thought it was a mistake, but now it seems like it's a regular occurrence. If it was just one block I wouldn't care but driving another half-mile? (I'm dropped off in parking lots or residential streets with on-street parking)
> 
> ...


About 10% of my Pax actually tip. I wish more would. That being said, and the fact that Uber sells the fact that tipping is not necessary means that you don't have to tip. I suggest that you don't leave the car until the driver turns off the "meter". To avoid an awkward situation, ask the driver to turn off the meter because you want to know how much the ride cost you. That's the only way the driver can tell you. Also, let the driver know you are rating him/her a "5". That will also help the uncomfortable feeling of making him turn off the "meter".


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

An extra 1/2 mile would only get the driver a dollar or two at best. Why would a driver risk losing access? It's not worth the money. I would assume it was an accident or a network error. Personally, I don't end the trip until the customer gets out. While you're in the car, you're using the service. I have had lingerers.

Also, leaving the ride active prevents the driver from receiving other calls, so s/he might miss the next $20 ride with a good-tipping rider because s/he wants to milk a dollar or two?

The Uber training videos instruct us to tell customers tipping is not necessary with the Uber system, but if a passenger insists, then you can accept it. So tipping IS allowed.

If you don't want to tip, don't tip. I doubt you'll get lower ratings for it. But in the states, you tip cab drivers, and I'm being told by riders that Uber is cheaper than a cab, yet tips are few and far between.

But, yes, you can ask how much the ride is, and if the app is lagging, the driver can show you that it's not coming up, but you will get an email once it goes through. When you see the screen where the driver can rate the passenger, then you know the ride has ended.


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## JaxBeachDriver (Nov 27, 2014)

sublibrarian said:


> I didn't understand how it was possible for a ride that long to be so cheap, I figured there was some sort of mistake because nowhere in America (the continent) a 15 block ride is 4 bucks.


This is because Uber has cut fares to be as competitive as possible, but kept their cut the same, and added the $1 fee that they get off the top of each and every single ride.

And this is not a cab. These are our own personal vehicles. We pay for all maintenance and gas ourselves. Also, we are not Uber employees, but rather independent contractors, which means we pay more in taxes.

A $10 ride breaks down like this:
-$1 safe rider fee
-$1.80 to Uber
Driver gets $7.20

Out of that, he has to pay for gas and maintenance on his car (did someone say this is roughly 56 cents per mile?). Then deduct 13.6 percent for FICA taxes. At the end of all that, the driver is taking less than $5, probably. And that's not even counting the gas and mileage it took him/her to get to you.

An extra dollar goes a long way in making it worth the driver's time.

If you want to know how we feel about it, this is how we feel. If you are looking for someone to say that all drivers are greedy for hoping for a tip, you're not going to find that here. Uber advertises that drivers get a lot more than they actually do. If you look at just straight income and not expenses, sometimes it looks good. Once we figure in expenses, we see how little we are actually making.

And, personally, I don't rate riders lower if they don't tip. I assume they don't know, and I'm not the type to shake someone down for a few nickels. So I wouldn't worry too much about that, as long as you are polite and considerate (don't make the driver wait 5 to 10 minutes to pick you up, etc).


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## Oc_DriverX (Apr 29, 2014)

My $.02 will echo many of the comments already made:

It is hard to believe the drivers would leave the meter running after the ride. The benefits from doing it are pretty low. And, there are many downsides to it. In a worst case, you risk being deactivated if there is a pattern. You are also not able to pick up a new ride. As others have mentioned, there have been a few times where I have had trouble closing a ride down, usually due to connectivity or network problems.

My policy on ending the ride is that I wait until everyone is out of the car or I have returned from emptying the trunk and everyone is out of the car. If you have ever ended a trip and had a lingerer in the car, you will end up adopting that policy. And, as drivers know, once you say the ride has ended, you are in fact, back online. So, if a customer is still in the car, how can I accept a new trip? I am also not crazy about having the customer wait for the fare. Sometimes the fare does not come up instantly. Also, by waiting, you may feel the need to rate the customer while they are looking for the fare.

I do not expect tips as a driver. When I first started, I tended to toe the Uber line and tried to turn them down. These days, after price cuts, I may make a token effort to mention that they are not required, but otherwise I will accept them with a smile and a "thank you". Even a dollar or two is greatly appreciated, especially because of the good feeling that Uber does not have their grubby hands in your pocket taking their 20% of the tip.

I certainly would not downgrade a passenger for not giving a tip for an average ride. The common reason that I drop a star off the ratings is making me wait. Two other common reasons are slamming my doors and leaving trash in the car. I give most of my passengers a five. I will admit that a tip may turn an otherwise "four star" rating to a five.


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## ElectroFuzz (Jun 10, 2014)

JaxBeachDriver said:


> An extra 1/2 mile would only get the driver a dollar or two at best.


Yeah, more like $0.70 in most markets


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

LackJack said:


> Hi, I'm a pax. I'm hoping you can help (or beat me).
> 
> I've had three drivers recently let the meter run long after I've got out of the car. At first I thought it was a mistake, but now it seems like it's a regular occurrence. If it was just one block I wouldn't care but driving another half-mile? (I'm dropped off in parking lots or residential streets with on-street parking)
> 
> ...


I am not going to respond to every point. But I will say this, letting the meter run long is never ok, sometimes in poor service areas, it takes longer to close out a ride and sometimes it requires moving to get a better signal. As far as tipping goes, if the fare is not surged, it would be very encouraged to tip. Uber and Lyft drivers are basically taxi drivers, but because the fares are much lower, we also get less per ride on average. Businessweek did a study on tips for cabbies (the most obvious parallel), and here is what they found: for cabbies in NYC who get paid with a credit card, the most common tip amount is 20%, only 7% get no tip. This was an extensive study, covering more than 55 million rides. So, the question is, if an Uber ride is 40% less than a cab ride, and 93% of people tip their cabbies, why should it be any different on an Uber when all Uber did is re-iterate that a tip is "not necessary"? Tipping is never required (by definition), but certain industry workers such as waiters, bartenders, cabbies, and doormen make a significant portion of their earnings from tips, that is why the underlying prices of the food, drink and fares are as low as they are.

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-07-31/heres-how-much-you-should-be-tipping-your-cab-driver


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## Roogy (Nov 4, 2014)

I haven't been offered a tip yet. I've done 25 rides in my 5 weeks, doing it very part-time. Only one passenger even asked about it. She was my very first fare, and I told her "tip is included in the fare". Oops, but again that was my first ride and I bought the company line.

Reality is, even if Uber paid us more, the same drivers here would still be complaining about pax who didn't tip and would still be low-rating them. If you're making $10/hr, you'd rather get $12. If you're making $20, you'd rather get $24. Look at athletes for whom $15M is "not enough". Almost everyone thinks they should be getting a little more.

I really don't care about getting a tip from pax, and every single one of my riders I have rated a "5" at the end of the trip. Lack of tip does not factor into my rating of them whatsoever. They've all been pleasant enough so they all get 5's.

I do wish that when Uber said "tip is included" that it actually was included. You should be able to see it on your paycheck the same way you see their $1 "rider fee".


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## frndthDuvel (Aug 31, 2014)

I start docking stars for long waits said:


> Why would you dock for bad navigation? Bad navigation likely results in higher fares does it not? I prefer when Riders play GPS. They mostly always believe they know the better routes, and often they do in some areas. If something goes wrong it is on them.


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## pengduck (Sep 26, 2014)

Roogy said:


> I haven't been offered a tip yet. I've done 25 rides in my 5 weeks, doing it very part-time. Only one passenger even asked about it. She was my very first fare, and I told her "tip is included in the fare". Oops, but again that was my first ride and I bought the company line.
> 
> Reality is, even if Uber paid us more, the same drivers here would still be complaining about pax who didn't tip and would still be low-rating them. If you're making $10/hr, you'd rather get $12. If you're making $20, you'd rather get $24. Look at athletes for whom $15M is "not enough". Almost everyone thinks they should be getting a little more.
> 
> ...


Well let me give you my number for last week. 47 trips after mileage and uber fees my net pay for 4 days was (drum roll please) $11.40. Hell yes tip!


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## Roogy (Nov 4, 2014)

pengduck said:


> Well let me give you my number for last week. 47 trips after mileage and uber fees my net pay for 4 days was (drum roll please) $11.40. Hell yes tip!


$11.40 for 47 trips. LOL that is 24 cents per trip. Why would you stick with this job? Open a lemonade stand.


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## reluctantuber (Nov 21, 2014)

That's a fair point. They almost always take a longer way mileage wise. My issue with bad navigation is more last second navigation (turn here with no advance notice) or wait until last second to say turn left while we are in the right lane. After each turn I used to ask these people what's next, but realized that annoyed them so now I shut up. Without fail they'll stop paying attention and then either make us miss a turn or give me those last second directions. If you are going to navigate pay attention otherwise just give me the damn address.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Roogy said:


> I haven't been offered a tip yet. I've done 25 rides in my 5 weeks, doing it very part-time. Only one passenger even asked about it. She was my very first fare, and I told her "tip is included in the fare". Oops, but again that was my first ride and I bought the company line.
> 
> Reality is, even if Uber paid us more, the same drivers here would still be complaining about pax who didn't tip and would still be low-rating them. If you're making $10/hr, you'd rather get $12. If you're making $20, you'd rather get $24. Look at athletes for whom $15M is "not enough". Almost everyone thinks they should be getting a little more.
> 
> ...


Uber used to say that, and it used to be a line item on your pay statement. Then they lowered rates by over 40% and changed the word "included" to "not necessary". You read that right: they cut our pay and told people no need to worry about it. They are now being sued in a nationwide class action lawsuit for false advertising to the passengers which directly impacts our income. Their court defense so far is that drivers don't have standing to sue because they admit to lying to passengers, but not the drivers. According to a Businessweek study, 93% of all cab fares tip. The most common amount is 20%. The fact is that tipping a cabbie is very common practice and at 93% occurrence it is expected in our culture, even if it is "not necessary". Cab fare is also 40% higher in most markets than uber fares, and uber takes over 20%, so yeah, i believe that the pax should pass on a few dollars of those savings to their drivers. http://mobile.businessweek.com/arti...ow-much-you-should-be-tipping-your-cab-driver


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## MKEUber (Aug 20, 2014)

So let me get this straight, you use a service that is about 1/3rd less than a Taxi, but refuse to tip? I have doubts about your story on the drivers letting the meter run on multiple occasions. But I am sure being such a cheap ass millennial (did I guess right? You're a Millennial, aren't ya?), you check every fare after your done to make sure not an extra foot or second was taken. Post screen shots or else I am calling bullshit on your SOB story.


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## Luberon (Nov 24, 2014)

As a driver I appreciate every tip even 1$ but I don't lower the pax rating for a tipless trip. Also I NEVER deliberately leave the meter running. However I had multiple instances in which the old uber iPhone freezes and has to be rebooted before I could end a ride. Besides am human and on rare instances forget to log off in time. I felt insulted over thanksgiving when a pax accused me of running the meter. She insisted that I should show her the trip has ended and she could not comprehend that being in driver mode means I have ended her trip and rated her as well. Many pax also express displeasure at the slightest deviation from the gps route feeling you are about to get one on them. I guess a few bad apples spoil the bunch


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## Uber9 (Nov 16, 2014)

Great post, love the details posted by the " My boyfriend and I live in Vancouver where Uber is banned and regular taxi cabs are horrible. So last week we went to L.A and one of the things we were excited to try was Uber." - Kudos to you, we need 100% riders like you.

Every pax I had said it is great tip is included and my response is - [Tips are not included in UberX (what I drive) and tips are not required]

So far in my 330 trips Ubering 2 left me a tip, one gave me a $10 for a $35 ride and another gave me a $5 for a $11 ride, now this makes me drive more for Uber.

Star Rating:- Every rider gets a 5 star rating (exceptions noted below) from me and I don't refuse to pickup pax with as low as 3.5 star rating and most turn out to be good. Rider star rating is not the deciding factor for me when I decide to accept a ping request. And I have not seen any rider so far with lower than 3.5 star rating

Exceptions:- a) You are 2 or more in the car and swear non stop like you are from a Ghett0 makes me give you a 4 star.
b) You eat cookies or burger in my clean car makes me give you a 4 star
c) You pinged me and it cost me to drive 11 miles to your location for a ride that you needed ringed at $5.65 made me give you a 3 star - reason is simple it costs me more than what I get paid to take you for a very short ride. I may be UberX but your ride experience is in an expensive three year old $53K car. Don't get me wrong, I will take short trips all day long but make sure your app shows time estimate about 5 minutes or less.
d) If you brag about how you gave 1 star to another Uber driver, you deserved a 4 star from me and I tried hard to give you a 1 star but was not able to come up with a reason to do so.

Tips for riders: a) Don't request a ride in the Boston and surrounding areas if the time estimate on your app shows 15 or more minutes and you only need a very short ride, for long rides it is okay.
b) Please shower daily as I hate stinking riders in my clean car
c) Don't bring in pets in my car unless it is a service dog, but feel free to call the driver and ask if he or she hesitates for a non service dog pet in the car, if so then cancel the trip but do so within 5 minutes or you get charged for cancellation
d) Tips are appreciated but you don't have to tip a minimum wage earner(uber driver) but don't hesitate to give a 5 star rating unless your uber driver is rude to you or took you a very long way to your destination
e) Most uber drivers do this part time so please don't treat them like cabbies
f) If you feel comfortable don't hesitate to sit in the front with the uber driver, I do get asked this many times and I tell them it is their choice and I do not mind either way and yes many lone riders sit with me in the front passenger seat.


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