# Waymo starts to open driverless ride-hailing service to the public



## Lissetti (Dec 20, 2016)

October 8, 2020

Waymo,  the Google  self-driving-project-turned-Alphabet unit, is beginning to open up its driverless ride-hailing service to the public.

The company said that starting today, members of its Waymo One service will be able to take family and friends along on their fully driverless rides in the Phoenix area. Existing Waymo One members will have the first access to the driverless rides - terminology that means no human behind the wheel. However, the company said that in the next several weeks more people will be welcomed directly into the service through its app, which is available on Google Play and the App Store.

Waymo said that 100% of its rides will be fully driverless - which it has deemed its "rider only" mode. That 100% claim requires a bit of unpacking. The public shouldn't expect hundreds of Waymo-branded Chrysler Pacifica minivans - no human behind the wheel - to suddenly inundate the entire 600-plus square miles of the greater Phoenix area.

Waymo has abut 600 vehicles in its fleet. About 300 to 400 of those are in the Phoenix area. Waymo wouldn't share exact numbers of how many of these vehicles would be dedicated to driverless rides. However, Waymo CEO John Krafcik  explained to TechCrunch in a recent interview that there will be various modes operating in the Phoenix area. Some of these will be "rider only," while other vehicles will still have trained safety operators behind the wheel. Some of the fleet will also be used for testing.

"We're just ready from every standpoint," Krafcik told TechCrunch. "And how do we know we're ready? We've had our wonderful group of early riders, who've helped us hone the service, obviously not from a safety standpoint because we've had the confidence on the safety side for some time, but rather more for the fit of the product itself." He added that these early riders helped the company determine if the product was "delivering satisfaction and delight for them."

Later this year, Waymo will relaunch rides with a trained vehicle operator to add capacity and allow us to serve a larger geographical area. Krafcik said the company is in the process of adding in-vehicle barriers between the front row and rear passenger cabin for in-vehicle hygiene and safety.

Waymo operates in about a 100-square-mile area. The driverless or "rider only" service area that will be offered to Waymo One members is about 50 square miles, Krafcik said.

Despite the various caveats, this is still a milestone - one of many the company has achieved in the past decade. The past five years has been particularly packed, starting with Steve Mahan, who is legally blind, taking the "first: driverless ride in the company's Firefly prototype on Austin's city streets in 2015. More than a dozen journalists experienced driverless rides in 2017 on a closed course at Waymo's testing facility in Castle. Then last November, TechCrunch took one of the first driverless rides in a Waymo Pacifica minivan along the public streets of a Phoenix suburb.

The company scaled its commercial product even as these demos and testing continued. In 2017, Waymo launched its early rider program, which let vetted members of the public, who had signed non-disclosure agreements, hail its self-driving cars in the Phoenix area. Those autonomous vehicles all had human safety operators behind the wheel.

Waymo then launched Waymo One, a self-driving ride-hailing service aimed for public use, no NDA strings attached. But again, those rides all had human safety operators in the driver's seat, ready to take over if needed. Waymo slowly moved its early rider program members into the more open Waymo One service. It also started experimenting with charging for rides and expanded its footprint - or geofenced service area. Today, the company charges for rides across all of its programs (early rider and Waymo One) in the Phoenix area. The Waymo One service (with human safety operators) is about 100 square miles in Phoenix suburbs like Chandler.

The first meaningful signs that Waymo was ready to put people in vehicles without human safety operators popped up last fall when members of its early rider program received an email indicating that driverless rides would soon become available.

And they did. These driverless rides were limited and free. And importantly, still fell under the early rider program, which had that extra NDA protection. Waymo slowly scaled until about 5 to 10% of its total rides in 2020 were fully driverless for its exclusive group of early riders under NDA. Then COVID-19 hit and the service was halted. The company has continued testing with its safety drivers in Arizona and California. That has raised some concerns among those workers about the dual issue of catching COVID and dealing with air quality issues caused by wildfires in California.

Waymo said it has added new safety protocols due to COVID-19, including requiring users to wear masks, having hand sanitizer in all vehicles and conducting what Krafcik described as a cabin flush - essentially a four to five-time increase in air volume sent through the vehicle - after every ride.

Krafcik also said Waymo will soon add the all-electric Jaguar I-Pace to the mix, first testing them on public roads and then adding the vehicles to the early rider program.

https://techcrunch.com/2020/10/08/w...riverless-ride-hailing-service-to-the-public/


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## Jst1dreamr (Apr 25, 2019)

Future news report.........Waymo puts 10,000,000 ride share drivers in homeless camps as politicians line their pockets with large payouts for allowing tech companies to destroy the world.


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## ANT 7 (Oct 14, 2018)

I bet you they use 10 cars only or some ridiculous low number in that even more utterly ridiculous 50 square mile area.

The tech frauds need to keep their stocks high and keep up appearances of this white elephant concept moving forward. Ergo, the PR announcement today.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

Lissetti said:


> View attachment 513846
> 
> October 8, 2020
> 
> ...


Arizona Vultures are Excited by this Decision !
















Any Minute Now . . .


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

ANT 7 said:


> I bet you they use 10 cars only or some ridiculous low number in the even more utterly ridiculous 50 square mile area.
> 
> The tech frauds need to keep their stocks high and keep up appearances of this white elephant concept moving forward. Ergo, the PR announcement today.


I wonder if the horse pulled buggy manufacturers of 1910 said the same thing when they first heard the name Henry Ford.
Just wondering.


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## Ubereater (Dec 25, 2015)

"There are some ideas so absurd that only an intellectual could believe them."

George Orwell.


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

Google/Alphabet provided moneys for Lyft...Waymo was using Lyft riders for experimentation....
Google and Uber don’t get along either.:thumbup:


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## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

UberBastid said:


> I wonder if the horse pulled buggy manufacturers of 1910 said the same thing when they first heard the name Henry Ford.
> Just wondering.


They were never "threatened" by the name Henry Ford. Their competitor was the railroad. 
"Long before Americans ever saw the first car touch U.S. soil, travel was an unforgivably uncomfortable endeavor. It's difficult to look out of your window and think of a time when there weren't any roads in North America, but that's exactly how it was. Up until the late 19th century, before the introduction of the automobile, there were very few major highways or roads on which to travel, and most people went by *either horse-driven coach or railway*."



ANT 7 said:


> The tech frauds need to keep their stocks high and keep up appearances


That is correct. From a different article about this topic - " These driverless vehicles aren't totally alone in the wilderness. Waymo has a team of remote employees who watch the real-time feeds of each vehicle's eight cameras and can help, with the push of a button, if the software runs into a difficult spot and needs a human eye to figure out what's going on. But Waymo insists these remote operators won't be "joy-sticking" the cars, which are outfitted with a bevy of cameras and sensors that help it "see" its surroundings. The car will be making most of the driving decisions itself thanks to its large computer system and artificial intelligence software." - https://www.theverge.com/2020/10/8/21507814/waymo-driverless-cars-allow-more-customers-phoenix

Also, The Information wrote about this in February


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> They were never "threatened" by the name Henry Ford.


Right, that's my point.
In 1910 they didn't even hardly know who he was.

Yet, in less than 20 years he put them _all_ out of business.
The railroad didn't. Ford did.


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

UberBastid said:


> Right, that's my point.
> In 1910 they didn't even hardly know who he was.
> 
> Yet, in less than 20 years he put them _all_ out of business.
> The railroad didn't. Ford did.


https://www.cnet.com/news/alphabet-...wont-ever-be-able-to-drive-in-all-conditions/
It'll be decades before autonomous cars are widespread on the roads -- and even then, they won't be able to drive themselves in certain conditions, the chief executive of Waymo said Tuesday.

John Krafcik, head of the self-driving car unit of Google parent company Alphabet, said that though driverless cars are "truly here," they aren't ubiquitous yet. And he doesn't think the industry will ever be able to drive at any time of year in any weather and any condition, the highest driving rating. Driving in all conditions can be difficult for humans too, he noted.


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## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

UberBastid said:


> Right, that's my point.
> In 1910 they didn't even hardly know who he was.
> 
> Yet, in less than 20 years he put them _all_ out of business.
> The railroad didn't. Ford did.


Car expansion and affordability along with heavy road construction policies affected railroad usage and future growth.

Trains performances, comfort, and military and commercial usage eliminated the horses.

I am afraid you got it all wrong, thinking that Ford was ever competing with "horse pulled buggy manufacturers". That is simply false.


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## Wildgoose (Feb 11, 2019)

Driverless cars will be good for personal ride those only needs a few ride in a day and when owners know that driverless cars will be safe in their area.
But for the RS, not only there are many trips required but also there are many pick up and drop off required in many area. Many Streets are always in reconstruction. So that is why I don't believe that the driverless cars are ready for RS market yet.


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## bethswannns (Mar 22, 2020)

ANT 7 said:


> I bet you they use 10 cars only or some ridiculous low number in that even more utterly ridiculous 50 square mile area.
> 
> The tech frauds need to keep their stocks high and keep up appearances of this white elephant concept moving forward. Ergo, the PR announcement today.


it will work in a residential suburbs with less than 100k population with very little traffic lights or constructions or people on the streets or cars..

after a few months later, they can claim victory how good their technology is..


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> I am afraid you got it all wrong, thinking that Ford was ever competing with "horse pulled buggy manufacturers". That is simply false.


Yea, you're right.
The automobile did not put horse-pulled carriages out of business.
Not at all.

Back in 1920 people did not either hitch up the horse, or crank up the car to go downtown; they jumped on a train at the train stop right in front of their farm. When Bonnie and Clyde robbed a bank ... they took a train for the get away.
Yup.
There are as many carriages being manufactured today as there was a hundred years ago.


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## tohunt4me (Nov 23, 2015)

UberBastid said:


> Yea, you're right.
> The automobile did not put horse-pulled carriages out of business.
> Not at all.
> 
> ...


Hard to get the airbags in carriages !


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

tohunt4me said:


> Hard to get the airbags in carriages !


ever been behind a horse when it farts?
talk about an air bag.


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## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

UberBastid said:


> There are as many carriages being manufactured today as there was a hundred years ago.


I see you want to be sarcastic. I stay by and with the reality.

People back than chose the horse over the car because there were no roads. Paved roads. Unpaved was muddy and got the cars stuck. Unpaved dried out after a rain, was crazy bumpy for a car.

Take a look (at sec.10)





So the car adoption pushed towards creating more paved roads, because pavement was not good for horses.

"The Model T Ford Pressures Road Development
Henry Ford debuted the low-priced, mass-produced Model T Ford in 1908. Now that an automobile was within reach for many more Americans, it created more desire for better roads. Rural voters lobbied for paved roads with the slogan, "Get the farmers out of the mud!" Federal-Aid Road Act of 1916 created the Federal-Aid Highway Program.
from - https://www.thoughtco.com/history-of-american-roads-4077442

The order was horses - to trains - to cars - to paved roads - to cars expansion.

Also take a look at some city pictures and admire the horse pulled trolleys


















No cars.

Only horses, hose pulled carriages and trolleys, and trains. So when they arrived, the cars replaced the rail vehicles, not the horses.

Do you think those people were taking the cars out of the imagines intentionally, to confuse the future generations?


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## IRME4EVER (Feb 17, 2020)

Jst1dreamr said:


> Future news report.........Waymo puts 10,000,000 ride share drivers in homeless camps as politicians line their pockets with large payouts for allowing tech companies to destroy the world.


Waymo charges the same as rideshare, from what the ABC 15 NEWS (Phoenix, AZ.) was saying.
Well, remember the Uber autonomous cars here in Scottsdale and Tempe. Before the woman got killed by a stupid operator watching "Voice" on Hulu? Uber gave $ to the family but was later found not guilty. But the driver was.


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

jocker12 said:


> I see you want to be sarcastic. I stay by and with the reality.
> 
> People back than chose the horse over the car because there were no roads. Paved roads. Unpaved was muddy and got the cars stuck. Unpaved dried out after a rain, was crazy bumpy for a car.
> 
> ...


OK, so to revise my original post ... the one that started this shit ...
"I wonder if people who made horse drawn buggy's were concerned when they heard the name Lionel."
(they make trains, right?)


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## Jst1dreamr (Apr 25, 2019)

IRME4EVER said:


> Waymo charges the same as rideshare, from what the ABC 15 NEWS (Phoenix, AZ.) was saying.
> Well, remember the Uber autonomous cars here in Scottsdale and Tempe. Before the woman got killed by a stupid operator watching "Voice" on Hulu? Uber gave $ to the family but was later found not guilty. But the driver was.


I am not interested in the cost. I think it is stupid to promote anything that puts people in the welfare line all in name of technology. Technology will never be the saving grace of man kind.


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## sasu66 (Sep 7, 2020)

mbd said:


> Google/Alphabet provided moneys for Lyft...Waymo was using Lyft riders for experimentation....
> Google and Uber don't get along either.:thumbup:


 The Chief Ai Scientist of Uber has joined Google. 
https://syncedreview.com/2020/09/13...hahramani-joins-google-brain-leadership-team/


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

sasu66 said:


> The Chief Ai Scientist of Uber has joined Google.
> https://syncedreview.com/2020/09/13...hahramani-joins-google-brain-leadership-team/


And we all know how brilliant Uber's AI is!!


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

So let me get this straight...

The driverless car has....

A remote "not driver" monitoring it,

and either...

A backup driver.

or a "chase van" with 2 drivers following it?

Correct me if i'm wrong but i'm counting 1-3 _drivers_ per "driverless" car.


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## jocker12 (May 11, 2017)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> So let me get this straight...
> 
> The driverless car has....
> 
> ...


Yup.

Somebody from their leading team took the decision to demo few Waymo vans without anybody inside, to keep the public interested and believe Waymo is moving forward. But when you look behind the facade, there is a remote monitor ready to take control, and a chasing minivan, with a driver also ready to immediately move the chased "driver-less" car if it gets stuck in traffic somehow.

Considering how everybody has a smartphone with a camera that can immediately record a potential Waymo "driver-less" embarrassing event (and make them look like what they are), they keep 3 people (remote monitor, chasing van driver and chasing van Waymo employee for chased van potential trouble) more or less "connected" to the robot.


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> So let me get this straight...
> 
> The driverless car has....
> 
> ...


Hahahaha!! I guess technically they're correct about their cars being "driverless" that way but what a joke. Only Google can absorb the massive financial losses they must be incurring.


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## Hackenstein (Dec 16, 2014)

Yeah great that's what the country needs, automating millions of jobs out of existence.

Maybe they can use their tech to open some of those euthanasia centers from Soylent Green.


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## x100 (Dec 7, 2015)

something tells me they will end up being equipped with an operator to sell you refreshments, nuts & chips.


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

x100 said:


> something tells me they will end up being equipped with an operator to sell you refreshments, nuts & chips.


well that's a fascinating idea. 99% of the time they load luggage clean spills and babysit drunks. The other 1% they can take control and navigate the car between the 3 "wrong way" signs some dipstick putup in an intersection to screw with everyone.

I mean it solves the problem of figuring out who throws drunks out of a car when they pass out or refuse to leave the vehicle. It also drastically reduces the amount of empty miles the vehicle has to drive to get back to the detailing shop every 5 minutes.

Or... they can just save money and get a cheaper non SDV car since my suspicion is you'll never be able to take the human out of the chauffeur ride.


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## UberBastid (Oct 1, 2016)

Hackenstein said:


> Yeah great that's what the country needs, automating millions of jobs out of existence.


Had that convo with a restaurant manager just last night.
She wanted me to use that screen computer thing to do my own charges.
"Not a chance. I don't work here."
She said she could not process my card, I'd have to do it.
"Great," says I, "thanks for the meal'' and started to leave.

Suddenly. She decided she would DO HER DAMN JOB.
I asked her, "How long before I have to go up to the pass to fetch my own meal?"

Yes, I tipped.
My wait person was exceptional.
Her boss was a *****.


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## Hackenstein (Dec 16, 2014)

UberBastid said:


> Had that convo with a restaurant manager just last night.
> She wanted me to use that screen computer thing to do my own charges.
> "Not a chance. I don't work here."
> She said she could not process my card, I'd have to do it.
> ...


Sounds like maybe it's COVID related? (not touching anything)


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## CaptainZazi (Oct 4, 2020)

Lissetti said:


> View attachment 513846
> 
> October 8, 2020
> 
> ...












Not going to work for a very long time, GPS the weak link..........


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## Johnny Mnemonic (Sep 24, 2019)

goneubering said:


> https://www.cnet.com/news/alphabet-...wont-ever-be-able-to-drive-in-all-conditions/
> It'll be decades before autonomous cars are widespread on the roads -- and even then, they won't be able to drive themselves in certain conditions, the chief executive of Waymo said Tuesday.
> 
> John Krafcik, head of the self-driving car unit of Google parent company Alphabet, said that though driver-less cars are "truly here," they aren't ubiquitous yet. And he doesn't think the industry will ever be able to drive at any time of year in any weather and any condition, the highest driving rating. Driving in all conditions can be difficult for humans too, he noted.


Nice to see someone in the tech industry being honest. I'm not a Luddite, and I'm sure one day driver-less cars will be the norm.

My issue is with hucksters that have been constantly saying, "in a year or two," for the past two decades.


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

Johnny Mnemonic said:


> Nice to see someone in the tech industry being honest. I'm not a Luddite, and I'm sure one day driver-less cars will be the norm.
> 
> My issue is with hucksters that have been constantly saying, "in a year or two," for the past two decades.


They will only be the norm in specialized situations in my opinion.


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## AngelAdams (Jan 21, 2019)

Jst1dreamr said:


> Future news report.........Waymo puts 10,000,000 ride share drivers in homeless camps as politicians line their pockets with large payouts for allowing tech companies to destroy the world.


It can't be worse than working for free.


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> So let me get this straight...
> 
> The driverless car has....
> 
> ...


It's too bad the Tomato isn't here anymore.


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## CaptainZazi (Oct 4, 2020)

AngelAdams said:


> It can't be worse than working for free.


Rideshare current day slavery it really is that simple.


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

CaptainZazi said:


> Rideshare current day slavery it really is that simple.


Just STOP. Something like 96% of Uber drivers are gone in a year. Why? Because they have FREEDOM.

When you wave the slavery flag you lose all credibility.


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## CaptainZazi (Oct 4, 2020)

goneubering said:


> Just STOP. Something like 96% of Uber drivers are gone in a year. Why? Because they have FREEDOM.
> 
> When you wave the slavery flag you lose all credibility. :frown:


Look, there are similarities, if you do it full time in 99% of situations after expenses you can only afford cheap food, cheap place to live and cheap clothes, all things slave owners provided, now some don't have a choice there is nothing else for them out there but most can quit this is true, really the only difference from slave situation.


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## sasu66 (Sep 7, 2020)

CaptainZazi said:


> Look, there are similarities, if you do it full time in 99% of situations after expenses you can only afford cheap food, cheap place to live and cheap clothes, all things slave owners provided, now some don't have a choice there is nothing else for them..


 You're absolutely right but I don't agree with the "there is nothing else for them" claim. Uber for example, they should be spending money on drivers, train them, teach them how machine learning and AI really works. Eventually these jobs will disappear but that doesn't mean people cannot be trained starting from today for new jobs or better opportunities. Of course as a horrible company Uber wouldn't even spend dime on drivers but that's where regulation comes to play.


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## CaptainZazi (Oct 4, 2020)

sasu66 said:


> You're absolutely right but I don't agree with the "there is nothing else for them" claim. Uber for example, they should be spending money on drivers, train them, teach them what machine learning is, how AI really works. Eventually these jobs will disappear but that doesn't mean people cannot be trained starting from today for new jobs or better opportunities. Ofcourse as a horrible company Uber wouldn't even spend dime on drivers but that's where regulation comes to play.


There are many unemployable people doing rideshare this is part of reason they get away with paying so poorly, many times it's not due to people being stupid or not trained it's due to not having the ability to work with others or just choose not to with this difficult society to deal with.


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## sasu66 (Sep 7, 2020)

CaptainZazi said:


> There are many unemployable people doing rideshare


You can make those people employable. It's not an impossible mission. Rideshare is dead end for those people. That means isolation. At the end of the day they are part of this society. If guided properly, they can make a better future for themselves and their families. If ignored, they'll lose their potential and turn into a liability to the society.


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

sasu66 said:


> You can make those people employable. It's not an impossible mission. Rideshare is dead end for those people. That means isolation. At the end of the day they are part of this society. If guided properly, they can make a better future for themselves and their families. If ignored, they'll lose their potential and turn into a liability to the society.


Uber might do that if they were a good corporate citizen. Obviously they're not so deal with reality instead of fantasy.


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## sasu66 (Sep 7, 2020)

goneubering said:


> Uber might do that if they were a good corporate citizen. Obviously they're not so deal with reality instead of fantasy.


 No one should accept this as normal, reality or not.


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

sasu66 said:


> No one should accept this as normal, reality or not.


Life will be tough if you ignore reality.


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## Buckiemohawk (Jun 23, 2015)

They going to get so dirty and the upkeep is going to be super expensve


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## sasu66 (Sep 7, 2020)

goneubering said:


> Life will be tough if you ignore reality.


 It's like saying if you can't prevent rape then enjoy it.


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## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

Jst1dreamr said:


> Future news report.........Waymo puts 10,000,000 ride share drivers in homeless camps as politicians line their pockets with large payouts for allowing tech companies to destroy the world.


Good thing I switched to GrubHub, let's see waymo deliver a four cheese tortellini with toMAHtos !


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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

Buckiemohawk said:


> They going to get so dirty and the upkeep is going to be super expensve


.

Oh you want to go to a shopping center?

These things will dump you on the wrong side of the street in traffic because it _Thinks_ you _arrived._
How often does a GPS put the destination on the wrong side of the street, or put a business on a road that's 100s or 1000s of feet from the road.

Anyone who has ever cleaned a 711 bathroom (or even stepped into one at 3:00 am) will tell you that humans can't be trusted to take care of things and without supervision they will destroy them fast enough.

Who would take a dirty stinking self driving machine that can never find you, gets lost, smells like the bathroom of a Bankok Horse house, except with more dirty needles (because Thai horses all are diabetic) laying about. If the current state of GPS navigation can be translated into a cars ability to navigate they are SCREWED.

My feeling is that even if they are safe they will never be able to be used as a for-hire system. At best it will be a self driving AID... most useful in long highway trips.

IF anything I think this could negatively affect the airline industry more. I think it would be awesome to sleep in the comfort of the back seat of my car all night rather than flying in an airport.

"OK kids... everyone get your PJs on and we'll watch Disney Plus until we fall asleep, and by the time we wake up we'll be almost to Disney world!"

Sleeping in the car on an 12 hour drive?

Versus flying?

Yeah that's not a bad idea at all to me...

https://abcnews.go.com/US/google-maps-shortcut-colorado-turns-muddy-mess-hundred/story?id=63946068
This is one example from one day of People following GPS and getting into trouble.

Self driving cars will be like that, except worse...


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## goneubering (Aug 17, 2017)

sasu66 said:


> It's like saying if you can't prevent rape then enjoy it.


You have a very twisted view. Goodbye.


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## sasu66 (Sep 7, 2020)

goneubering said:


> You have a very twisted view. Goodbye.


I'm free to speak my mind and my mind says I don't have to accept your reality. Not everyone wants to obey your master.


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