# My new method for dealing with parents with no car seats



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.

Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.

I got my $20 and declined his next request. I then wrote into Uber Support and explained the situation and they adjusted 2 more unpaid cancellations for me. So I ended up getting $18.75 in cancellation fees and $20 cash. $38.75 for under 20 minutes of hassle and a few empty miles seems worth it to me.


----------



## W00dbutcher (Jan 14, 2019)

Can you say extortion... Deactivation?


----------



## Palm Beach Driver (Oct 27, 2017)

This qualifies as STUPID WITH A CAPITAL S. Wrong on every level.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

W00dbutcher said:


> Can you say extortion... Deactivation?


How is it extortion in any way, shape or form?



Palm Beach Driver said:


> This qualifies as STUPID WITH A CAPITAL S. Wrong on every level.


Please elaborate on how it's stupid or wrong. If anything, I'm in the morally correct position by blocking these poor excuses for parents from putting their child in harms way and by making it hurt so badly in their pocketbooks that they'll bring a car seat next time.


----------



## Palm Beach Driver (Oct 27, 2017)

If you read the legal definition of extortion, this is a textbook example. It's a slam dunk. You should be deactivated permanently.

Also see bribery and I'll gotten gains.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Palm Beach Driver said:


> If you read the legal definition of extortion, this is a textbook example. It's a slam dunk. You should be deactivated permanently.


No, it's not extortion. If I decline a ping, then it counts against my acceptance rate and if I fall below 85% then I can't see trip duration. So I am incurring a cost by declining their ping. I'm merely asking them to compensate me for what I lose for declining a ping.

This was a simple verbal contract between two consenting parties, and it was executed properly. I gave consideration in exchange for compensation. They were paying me to perform a task, which was to decline their ping.


----------



## Palm Beach Driver (Oct 27, 2017)

Your argument is so bad and legally wrong that a judge would tack on 1000 dollars to the fine for being so ignorant. I can't help that you don't understand it.

It is the " he needed killing" defense from the 90s in Texas. Or if you like it is " the bank robber mentality" from South Carolina. Remember in a court of law the ONLY thing that matters is what is written in the law books. Opinion has no place in a courtroom. Have a nice night. Feel free to be as wrong as you like.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Palm Beach Driver said:


> Your argument is so bad and legally wrong that a judge would tack on 1000 dollars to the fine for being so ignorant. I can't help that you don't understand it.


If you say so. It's funny how you're making these claims that it's extortion or bribery or ill gotten gains, but you're not offering any proof to support your claims.

So please cite me that specific statute(s) in my home state (Minnesota) where what I did is illegal. If you cannot do that, then you need to concede that you're wrong.

Also, if anyone wants to show me where what I did violates Uber's TOS in such a way that I would get deactivated, I'll gladly read that, too.

You all are making these claims, you need to provide the proof.


----------



## BBslider001 (Apr 24, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


So you extorted money from some people? Nice....not really...not at all even. SMFH


----------



## kingcorey321 (May 20, 2018)

W00dbutcher said:


> Can you say extortion... Deactivation?


Your incorrect . What did the driver do incorrectly ? He has to accept every trip or his acc rating will drop. He accepted every trip as he should. These passengers have zero car seat . They are not following the law . this 20 dollar fee would of never been issued to them if there were following policy. I APPLAUD This driver good job . I for now on will also just sit and wait for many no car seat deals let them keep requesting over and over again . I think i have a new mentor !!!!! ( TEACH ME !! ) Driver requests 20 to stop accepting or protecting his accep rating he will stop accepting there pings that is perfectly fine in my opinion. Stop trying to bypass the law and try to force drivers pick you up . 
They did not have to pay the 20. have a damn car seat for the baby


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

BBslider001 said:


> So you extorted money form some people? Nice....not really...not at all even. SMFH


I'll ask you the same question as I asked the last two-- Tell me specifically how what I did was extortion. Cite the extortion statute I'm violating.

Extortion means that I'm forcing someone to pay me to NOT perform an illegal act that would harm them. I'm not doing anything that's illegal by continuing to accept their pings. I'm well within my legal right to do so. They are paying my to not perform a legal action that is well within my right to do. That's simply not extortion.

Again, you're making the claim. You provide the proof to support your claim.


----------



## BBslider001 (Apr 24, 2019)

kingcorey321 said:


> Your incorrect . What did the driver do incorrectly ? He has to accept every trip or his acc rating will drop. He accepted every trip as he should. These passengers have zero car seat . They are not following the law . this 20 dollar fee would of never been issued to them if there were following policy. I APPLAUD This driver good job . I for now on will also just sit and wait for many no car seat deals let them keep requesting over and over again . I think i have a new mentor !!!!! ( TEACH ME !! )


Ummmm, the minute you say to anyone, "pay me X and Y will stop" is the basic definition of extortion. You wanna be taught how to be a depraved POS taking people's money under duress?? Epic. Call Uber support. See what they tell you. Prove me wrong.



dctcmn said:


> I'll ask you the same question as I asked the last two-- Tell me specifically how what I did was extortion. Cite the extortion statute I'm violating.
> 
> Extortion means that I'm forcing someone to pay me to NOT perform an illegal act that would harm them. I'm not doing anything that's illegal by continuing to accept their pings. I'm well within my legal right to do so. They are paying my to not perform a legal action that is well within my right to do. That's simply not extortion.
> 
> Again, you're making the claim. You provide the proof to support your claim.


Um, the burden of proof is on you. Call Uber support and ask them. Let me know how that goes. If I wrong, I will concede. See the above basic definition in a previous post if you can even understand it. Even if it wasn't extortion under the "word" of the law, there is a little thing called the spirit of the law...or ethics. What a chitty thing to do another no matter what they have done.

EXTORTION---the practice of obtaining something, especially money, through force or threats.

I.E.---"give me X and I will leave". I dunno dude, ask a cop or, again, call support. Let us know.


----------



## Palm Beach Driver (Oct 27, 2017)

kingcorey321 said:


> Your incorrect . What did the driver do incorrectly ? He has to accept every trip or his acc rating will drop. He accepted every trip as he should. These passengers have zero car seat . They are not following the law . this 20 dollar fee would of never been issued to them if there were following policy. I APPLAUD This driver good job . I for now on will also just sit and wait for many no car seat deals let them keep requesting over and over again . I think i have a new mentor !!!!! ( TEACH ME !! ) Driver requests 20 to stop requesting there pings that is perfectly fine in my opinion. Stop trying to bypass the law and try to force drivers pick you up .
> They did not have to pay the 20. have a damn car seat for the baby


Wrong. You can applaud all you want. LEGALLY you and he lose. Driver being right wrong or indifferent is of no consequence. The law is EXACTLY as printed. Not open to opinion of what the driver did. He clearly stated what he did and said.



BBslider001 said:


> Ummmm, the minute you say to anyone, "pay me X and Y will stop" is the basic definition of extortion. You wanna be taught how to be a depraved POS taking people's money under duress?? Epic. Call Uber support. See what they tell you. Prove me wrong.
> 
> 
> Um, the burden of proof is on you. Call Uber support and ask them. Let me know how that goes. If I wrong, I will concede. See the above basic definition in a previous post if you can even understand it. Even if it wasn't extortion under the "word" of the law, there is a little thing called the spirit of the law...or ethics. What a chitty thing to do another no matter what they have done.


Yes extortion exhibit a to z.


----------



## kingcorey321 (May 20, 2018)

BBslider001 said:


> Ummmm, the minute you say to anyone, "pay me X and Y will stop" is the basic definition of extortion. You wanna be taught how to be a depraved POS taking people's money under duress?? Epic. Call Uber support. See what they tell you. Prove me wrong.


In my opinion this driver did not do anything incorrectly . Parents had a choice of taking the car seat along with them. Instead risk a child life 
These parents should lose there child and be placed in jail !.


----------



## _Tron_ (Feb 9, 2020)

Dear Willie Sutton: Why do you rob banks?
"Because that's where the money is".

Dear dctcme: Why do you keep accepting pings from the childseat-less parents?
"Because that's where the money is".

As per usual the forum is trouncing someone who is a few degrees off of what is considered right and fair in the world of rideshare driving. No one knows if that is grounds for deactivation with Uber (my vote: unlikely), nor would you likely be prosecuted for extortion (although confronting the pax inside is in my view is a very edgy and inappropriate thing to do. I can't believe they caved).

But look, dctcme, you can't have you cake and eat it to. If you are taking a stand by inserting yourself as moral correction officer for these errant parents, OK. But you are pocketing the windfall profits. Your post said nothing of donating those funds to charity. Because the second you start _profiting _from _moral policing_ you are on a very slippery slope. And that's where you lost me.

I would seriously re-think this whole intervening strategy next time around.


----------



## Palm Beach Driver (Oct 27, 2017)

kingcorey321 said:


> In my opinion this driver did not do anything incorrectly . Parents had a choice of taking the car seat along with them. Instead risk a child life .


Your opinion is of no consequence. The law sir is clear. Sometimes an opinion could be that person a did not shoot person b. The video sir shows he did. Your opinion is your opinion and it holds NONE, ZERO LEGAL WEIGHT


----------



## kingcorey321 (May 20, 2018)

Palm Beach Driver said:


> Your opinion is of no consequence. The law sir is clear. Sometimes an opinion could be that person a did not shoot person b. The video sir shows he did. Your opinion is your opinion and it holds NONE, ZERO LEGAL WEIGHT


My opinion yes this driver did not break any laws . This would not even end up in court. What would happen . They call the police waste there time . Wait the new driver pull up gets pulled over gets some hefty commercial equipment tickets for no car seats over a 5 dollar ride parents also get sighted for child endangerment .


----------



## Palm Beach Driver (Oct 27, 2017)

_Tron_ said:


> Dear Willie Sutton: Why do you rob banks?
> 
> "Because that's where the money is".
> 
> ...


Morals and corrections have nothing to do with the law.


----------



## BBslider001 (Apr 24, 2019)

kingcorey321 said:


> In my opinion this driver did not do anything incorrectly . Parents had a choice of taking the car seat along with them. Instead risk a child life
> These parents should lose there child and be placed in jail !.


I don't give a **** about your opinion. What I DO care about is the truth and being morally and ethically above the fray.


----------



## Cold Fusion (Aug 28, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> I got my $20 and declined his next request. I then wrote into Uber Support and explained the situation and they adjusted 2 more unpaid cancellations for me. So I ended up getting $18.75 in cancellation fees and $20 cash. $38.75 for under 20 minutes of hassle and a few empty miles seems worth it to me.


.....AND working poor Uber drivers wonder why they're Unemployable
in mainstream America 
&#129315;&#128514;&#129315;&#129315;&#129315;


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

BBslider001 said:


> Ummmm, the minute you say to anyone, "pay me X and Y will stop" is the basic definition of extortion.


Since none of you are actually going to post the legal definition of extortion, I will--

extortion n. obtaining money or property by threat to a victim's property or loved ones, intimidation, or false claim of a right (such as pretending to be an IRS agent). It is a felony in all states, except that a direct threat to harm the victim is usually treated as the crime of robbery. Blackmail is a form of extortion in which the threat is to expose embarrassing, damaging information to family, friends or the public.

So I never threatened their property or loved ones and I never made a false claim of a right. I simply said that I would continue to take their ping unless they paid me not to. That's called a verbal contract, not extortion.

This happens all of the time in business. McDonald's has every legal right to build as many McDonalds in as many locations as they are legally zoned to build. However, they choose not to because they have contracts with their franchisees, in which their franchisees pay to not have another McDonalds built within a certain specified distance.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> How is it extortion in any way, shape or form?
> 
> 
> Please elaborate on how it's stupid or wrong. If anything, I'm in the morally correct position by blocking these poor excuses for parents from putting their child in harms way and by making it hurt so badly in their pocketbooks that they'll bring a car seat next time.


When you offered to stop for $20 dollars is extortion. The pax was definitely in wrong but that doesn't make you extorting a $20 out of him right either.

Personally I feel like that's what his sorry ass get but feelings don't change right and wrong.


----------



## _Tron_ (Feb 9, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> extortion n. obtaining money or property by threat to a victim's property or loved ones,


1) Driver threatens to keep canceling if parents fail to pay up
2) Parents refuse
3) Parents therefore can't get a ride
4) Parents order another meal for child due to extended stay at restaurant
5) Child dies of food poisoning from second meal
6) Parents successfully sue driver for attempted extortion.

Prosecuting attorney closing argument excerpt:
"... by threatening to cancel on any further attempt to obtain a ride, and only desist via a payment to the driver, the driver -however unintentional- fostered a set of circumstances whereby the child was placed in harm's way..."

Moral of the story: The driver is DAMNED LUCKY the pax paid up!


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

kingcorey321 said:


> Your incorrect . What did the driver do incorrectly ? He has to accept every trip or his acc rating will drop. He accepted every trip as he should. These passengers have zero car seat . They are not following the law . this 20 dollar fee would of never been issued to them if there were following policy. I APPLAUD This driver good job . I for now on will also just sit and wait for many no car seat deals let them keep requesting over and over again . I think i have a new mentor !!!!! ( TEACH ME !! ) Driver requests 20 to stop accepting or protecting his accep rating he will stop accepting there pings that is perfectly fine in my opinion. Stop trying to bypass the law and try to force drivers pick you up .
> They did not have to pay the 20. have a damn car seat for the baby


Corey don't repeat this. I'm glad it worked out in op favor but this could have definitely taken bad turn. Many times shitty parents are shitty people in general.

OP could've left car to offer to leave for $20 dollars the pax with no car seat could have become violent. Ultimately this could have escalated a simple decline to a dangerous place.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> When you offered to stop for $20 dollars is extortion. The pax was definitely in wrong but that doesn't make you extorting a $20 out of him right either.
> 
> Personally I feel like that's what his sorry ass get but feelings don't change right and wrong.


I posted the legal definition of extortion and the link-- there was no threat to a victim's property or loved ones, intimidation, or false claim of a right.

I also love that all the offended people are now backpeddaling from saying what I did was illegal to that it was immoral. To that I'd say, you live by your morals and don't force them on me. I don't force my morals on you. If you want to feel morally superior, then go ahead and knock yourself out. Moral superiority is just refuge for the insecure to feel better about themselves.

These dirtbags were trying to force me into an illegal act and if I refused to perform the legal act, I was going to incur harm. They were violating the TOS, not me. I have every right to be compensated for my labor and declining a ping is labor.



_Tron_ said:


> 1) Driver threatens to keep canceling if parents fail to pay up
> 2) Parents refuse
> 3) Parents therefore can't get a ride
> 4) Parents order another meal for child due to extended stay at restaurant
> ...


Uber was not their only option. They could've downloaded Lyft and used that. They could've called a taxi or limo (which do not require car seats in my state).

Still, this was an amusing post which only illustrates the insane amount of mental gymnastics it takes to make my actions qualify as extortion. Thank you for making my point for me.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I posted the legal definition of extortion and the link-- there was no threat to a victim's property or loved ones, intimidation, or false claim of a right.
> 
> I also love that all the offended people are now backpeddaling from saying what I did was illegal to that it was immoral. To that I'd say, you live by your morals and don't force them on me. I don't force my morals on you. If you want to feel morally superior, then go ahead and knock yourself out. Moral superiority is just refuge for the insecure to feel better about themselves.
> 
> ...


Actually you refusing to leave unless given money is intimidation.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Actually you refusing to leave unless given money is intimidation.


How so? I have every legal right to be in that parking lot or on the street outside of the parking lot. The act of me being parked close is not intimidating. What am I gonna do? Park them to death?


----------



## _Tron_ (Feb 9, 2020)

Angel on my shoulder says: "Optional method to make extra money when parents don't have a child seat" ...
1) Purchase one of those portable childseats that fold up nice and small (a pax actually had one of these one time).
2) Next time a parent is short the child seat rent her yours for $10

Devil on my other shoulder says: "It's very risky to be a Good Samaritan in this day and age"...
1) Driver rents portable child seat to pax for $10
2) Driver gets in an accident. Child seat comes loose and child goes through windshield. Child dies
3) State sues driver for extortion

Prosecuting attorney closing argument excerpt:
"... by accepting payment for a faulty child seat -however unintentional- fostered a set of circumstances whereby the child was placed in harm's way..."

(I may have my devils and angels mixed up)


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> How so? I have every legal right to be in that parking lot or on the street outside of the parking lot. The act of me being parked close is not intimidating. What am I gonna do? Park them to death?


You are purposely and strategically parking next to pax to intercept their pings for the purpose of personal gain. You want money to leave them in peace so that they may find a ride home.

A judge wouldn't remotely entertain your whole "well technically.." routine. Usually they are actually harder on people that try to pay dumb, it insults the intelligence of all those around them.

Check this out, you got a good one over on a bad pax. Let's just celebrate the guy had to pay for his bad deed because we know they do it all the time. I know we both can agree on that.


----------



## HUberMe (Jun 20, 2017)

In my Opinion, have them cancel for the simple reason of not having a car seat.. if they don’t do exactly what he did.. take the cancellation fee and move on... let the next uber/ lyft driver accept the responsibility or do the same thing and move on.. as long as I am not getting cited for allowing people that damn well know they are supposed to have a car seat.. I don’t care..


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

_Tron_ said:


> But look, dctcme, you can't have you cake and eat it to. If you are taking a stand by inserting yourself as moral correction officer for these errant parents, OK. But you are pocketing the windfall profits. Your post said nothing of donating those funds to charity. Because the second you start _profiting _from _moral policing_ you are on a very slippery slope. And that's where you lost me.
> 
> I would seriously re-think this whole intervening strategy next time around.


I'm not inserting myself into anything. I got called to a ping from yet another passenger who doesn't care what happens to their own child if they get hurt, as long as they're not inconvenienced to bring a car seat with them-- as long as they can sue Uber and or me if I get in an accident.

I'm also not being the moral police. My statement was simply that I was in the morally correct position by not forgoing my right (and requirement) to take a ping. The morally incorrect position would be to just ignore the next ping and let it go to another unsuspecting driver who might give the ride, so there was no financial consequence to the garbage parents/passengers.



TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> You are purposely and strategically parking next to pax to intercept their pings for the purpose of personal gain. You want money to leave them in peace so that they may find a ride home.
> 
> A judge wouldn't remotely entertain your whole "well technically.." routine. Usually they are actually harder on people that try to pay dumb, it insults the intelligence of all those around them.
> 
> Check this out, you got a good one over on a bad pax. Let's just celebrate the guy had to pay for his bad deed because we know they do it all the time. I know we both can agree on that.


Incorrect. I am under no obligation to spend money out of my own pocket to drive away from them because they're knowingly violating the contract they freely signed with Uber. I am under no obligation to go offline and miss an opportunity for a ride because they're knowingly violating the TOS that they freely agreed to when they signed up for the app.

Also, what if I drive away from them and I still get their ping? Now I have to turn around and waste more time. What if I go offline for a few minutes and when I come back on, I still get their ping? My best option was to be compensated for my labor and lost opportunity, when I declined the ping.


----------



## ABQuber (Jan 30, 2019)

Legal or not, it was wrong. Collecting 3 cancel fees and then going in and demanding more? Wow. You held their ride hostage.

I would have gone offline for a few minutes, let someone else accept the ride after the second cancel. You were certainly compensated for your time by that point. 

Yeah, they messed up twice. No car seat and not trying the Lyft app at some point.

Not saying what they did was right, but it’s learned behavior. Some drivers let them get away with it, so of course they’re gonna try it again.

To sit there and collect $40 off them and call it teaching them a lesson... Nah. You just greedy.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

_Tron_ said:


> Angel on my shoulder says: "Optional method to make extra money when parents don't have a child seat" ...
> 1) Purchase one of those portable childseats that fold up nice and small (a pax actually had one of these one time).
> 2) Next time a parent is short the child seat rent her yours for $10
> 
> ...


Now this is a recipe for getting sued. By providing the car seat you are warranting that it is the correct size for the child, that it's been installed properly and that there are no recalls for the seat (and car seats get recalled all of the time).


----------



## UberBeemer (Oct 23, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request.


Sorry dude. That's extortion.


----------



## MadTownUberD (Mar 11, 2017)

This my friends is an illustration of what happens when you attempt to best @dctcmn in a battle of wits!

The fact that he went into the restaurant was super gutsy....wow!!!!! I don't even like hanging out at pickup long enough to collect a fee if they're standing right there. People can snap and turn violent.

Very cute story @dctcmn , and nice profits, but I think your hypothetical example of "declining a ping" costing you is a little silly. Since they kept requesting all you had to do was go offline for a few minutes and they would have gotten another driver, allowing you to pop online and get another opportunity. You were power tripping. I'm not necessarily criticizing it because I've made similar stinks myself on occasion.

And I'm certainly not going to tell you how to conduct your affairs! Great thread.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

ABQuber said:


> To sit there and collect $40 off them and call it teaching them a lesson... Nah. You just greedy.


It can be both. I'll call fair compensation to make up for all of the times I've wasted 20 minutes on a dirtbag pax with no carseat and walked away with $3.75.



UberBeemer said:


> Sorry dude. That's extortion.


Again, for the 10th time. How so?

Post the statute that provides the legal definition of extortion, specifically in my state, and tell me specifically how what I did qualifies. You're making the claim, you provide the proof.

Funny that no one has been able to prove that claim. I still have not seen one Minnesota state statute posted here.

Y'all are good at making claims, then disappearing when you have to prove those claims.


----------



## UberBeemer (Oct 23, 2015)

This type of behavior gives us all a bad name. Taking one cancel fee should be enough, but you kept going back to the well, then committed extortion to get yet another $20. Very petty, thug-like move. If they report this fraud, kiss your account goodbye.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I'm not inserting myself into anything. I got called to a ping from yet another passenger who doesn't care what happens to their own child if they get hurt, as long as they're not inconvenienced to bring a car seat with them-- as long as they can sue Uber and or me if I get in an accident.
> 
> I'm also not being the moral police. My statement was simply that I was in the morally correct position by not forgoing my right (and requirement) to take a ping. The morally incorrect position would be to just ignore the next ping and let it go to another unsuspecting driver who might give the ride, so there was no financial consequence to the garbage parents/passengers.
> 
> ...


You skipped around the part of you going into the restaurant to ask for money to leave &#128521;. That's the very part that is what classifies this as extortion.

Had you just set there and collected cancellation some could call it immoral but its legal.

The second you exited your vehicle to ask for money to leave is when you entered different territory.


----------



## BBslider001 (Apr 24, 2019)

Whatever helps you sleep dude. Our choices separate us from the ones that rise above and the ones that bottom feed. Good on ya for choosing the latter. Legal or not, which it isn't, it's a parasite move. I'm out. Happy trails....


----------



## UberBeemer (Oct 23, 2015)

Mn 609.27, coercion 
"
*Subdivision 1.Acts constituting.*

Whoever orally or in writing makes any of the following threats and thereby causes another against the other's will to do any act or forbear doing a lawful act is guilty of coercion and may be sentenced as provided in subdivision 2:

(1) a threat to unlawfully inflict bodily harm upon, or hold in confinement, the person threatened or another, when robbery or attempt to rob is not committed thereby; "

You robbed them 3 times via cancel fees, then coerced them into giving you another $20. I could see a reasonable expectation of the first fee. But then you should have declined the next, and would not likely have received additional pings.

Congratulations. You are an admitted criminal.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

MadTownUberD said:


> This my friends is an illustration of what happens when you attempt to best @dctcmn in a battle of wits!
> 
> The fact that he went into the restaurant was super gutsy....wow!!!!! I don't even like hanging out at pickup long enough to collect a fee if they're standing right there. People can snap and turn violent.
> 
> ...


lol. These people would flip out when they hear what I do when I get pinged to a high school or middle school.

You know I'm done playing nice with dirtbags. The first 200-300 times I went to pings with toddlers and no car seats was cute. It's just not cute anymore. These people need to be hurt financially to the greatest extent possible. They know exactly what they're doing. If I get back some of the money I've lost over the years, then no one should blame me one bit.

I love the look the parents give me when I tell them they need a car seat. It's the look of total shock and disbelief. "_What? How come no one ever told me I need a car seat for my infant? This is news to me!" _Then they look at me like I'm the jerk. Sorry, you know damn well your toddler needs a car seat.

I'm in total disbelief that the people here in this forum are defending these sub-human parents, when they would sue us drivers for every last penny if we took the ride and got in an accident. They would ruin our whole lives if we gave them the chance. I truly believe that some of these parents are hoping we get in an accident so they can sue us. It's a set up and there are too many people here that just roll over and take it.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> I'm in total disbelief that the people here in this forum are defending these sub-human parents...


I won't defend the parent or the Uber driver.

There's nothing in this story to be proud of.


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

You must be so proud of yourself.


----------



## Deceptive (Oct 29, 2019)

Hes trying to justify how much of a POS he is with over explaining and using the same examples over and over again.

"YeAh, I cOlLeCtEd 3 Cfs. ThEn WeNt iN tO DeMaNd MoRe $$$"

Legally, technically, morally whatever else "ally" you come up with, you extorted the passenger for $20 bucks. Congrats dude. You really taught him

A judge would immediately notice what you were trying to do and shove the gavel right up ya...


----------



## Bork_Bork_Bork (May 20, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


First off, kudos for you for not taking the kid without the proper seat! Buuuuut....not for being a common thief. If that dude reports you for extorting him, and make NO mistake about it, that's what you did, you'll be deactivated....and you should be. We don't need anymore than we already have as drivers......


----------



## Jon Stoppable (Dec 11, 2019)

Take the $20 to Wal-mart and buy a booster seat for $15 and spend the rest on Mentos. Then go back to the restaurant and accept the ping.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> You skipped around the part of you going into the restaurant to ask for money to leave &#128521;. That's the very part that is what classifies this as extortion.
> 
> Had you just set there and collected cancellation some could call it immoral but its legal.
> 
> The second you exited your vehicle to ask for money to leave is when you entered different territory.


Not at all. I never threatened any physical harm, confinement or illegal act, which is necessary for extortion. I went inside to propose a settlement to our impasse. They freely accepted. Everyone got what they wanted and everyone was a little bit mad. That's how you know it was a fair deal for all sides.


----------



## MadTownUberD (Mar 11, 2017)

Jon Stoppable said:


> Take the $20 to Wal-mart and buy a booster seat for $15 and spend the rest on Mentos. Then go back to the restaurant and accept the ping.


Wait wait...wouldn't you just eat the child in this situation??!? Based on your recent posts.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

UberBeemer said:


> Mn 609.27, coercion
> "
> *Subdivision 1.Acts constituting.*
> 
> ...


I did not threaten any bodily harm or to hold them in confinement. Either one of those are necessary components for extortion in Minnesota. Thank you for proving my point for me.



SHalester said:


> You must be so proud of yourself.


I'm certainly not ashamed.



Deceptive said:


> Hes trying to justify how much of a POS he is with over explaining and using the same examples over and over again.
> 
> "YeAh, I cOlLeCtEd 3 Cfs. ThEn WeNt iN tO DeMaNd MoRe $$$"
> 
> ...


I've proven multiple times in this thread how what I did does not fit the definition of extortion in Minnesota (and I suspect any other state). You people simply don't know what extortion is and what extortion is not.



Jon Stoppable said:


> Take the $20 to Wal-mart and buy a booster seat for $15 and spend the rest on Mentos. Then go back to the restaurant and accept the ping.


And if the car seat isn't the right size for the child or it's installed properly, then I get sued? That doesn't sound like a very smart thing for me to do at all.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> Not at all. I never threatened any physical harm, confinement or illegal act, which is necessary for extortion. I went inside to propose a settlement to our impasse. They freely accepted. Everyone got what they wanted and everyone was a little bit mad. That's how you know it was a fair deal for all sides.


That's not where the law of extortion ends. Any more questions.

Essentially if they would have called police at best they would have been issued a $500 ticket. You on the other hand could've been facing felony charges.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Bork_Bork_Bork said:


> First off, kudos for you for not taking the kid without the proper seat! [email protected]@@@ you for being a common thief. If that dude reports you for extorting him, and make NO mistake about it, that's what you did, you'll be deactivated....and you should be. We don't need anymore scumbags than we already have as drivers......


What's he going to report me for? Refusing to allow him to violate the TOS and Minnesota law?

Please cite the specific clause in Uber's TOS that I violated and where that violation calls for me to be deactivated. Until your do that, this is just, like, your opinion man.

Again, you're making the claim. You provide the proof.


----------



## UberBeemer (Oct 23, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> Not at all. I never threatened any physical harm, confinement or illegal act, which is necessary for extortion. I went inside to propose a settlement to our impasse. They freely accepted. Everyone got what they wanted and everyone was a little bit mad. That's how you know it was a fair deal for all sides.


You're gravely mistaken about having to threaten harm. You coerced them like a highwayman. You shook them down. You admitted to committing a crime. And you went even further by bragging about it being a pattern.


----------



## ABQuber (Jan 30, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> What's he going to report me for? Refusing to allow him to violate the TOS and Minnesota law?
> 
> Please cite the specific clause in Uber's TOS that I violated and where that violation calls for me to be deactivated. Until your do that, this is just, like, your opinion man.
> 
> Again, you're making the claim. You provide the proof.


Well, according to TOS, you should have cancelled under "passenger made me feel unsafe" option and then reported it to Uber. They would have made it so you couldn't be paired with them again I'm sure.

However you did it was a violation of TOS and that's what would get you deactivated or at least a time out.


----------



## Jon Stoppable (Dec 11, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> And if the car seat isn't the right size for the child or it's installed properly, then I get sued? That doesn't sound like a very smart thing for me to do at all.


Boosters don't get installed, they sit on the seat and you buckle the kid with the car's belt. It's enough to get you out of a ticket if the kid is three and up.

If you are worried about being sued, you're in the wrong line of work. Also, then you shouldn't try stunts like this. It will cost the pax nothing to sue you in small claims for the $20. I have no idea what would happen, but it would make a good case for Judge Wapner and cost you a day of work.


----------



## Dekero (Sep 24, 2019)

Repeat after me.... SHUFFLE


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> That's not where the law of extortion ends. Any more questions.
> 
> View attachment 420062


I didn't threaten him with financial harm. He was free to stop ordering an Uber ride at any point. He could have used Lyft or called a taxi. I merely told him what was going to happen if he continued to use Uber while knowingly violating the Terms of Service and one option to change course.


----------



## Chorch (May 17, 2019)

BBslider001 said:


> Ummmm, the minute you say to anyone, "pay me X and Y will stop" is the basic definition of extortion. You wanna be taught how to be a depraved POS taking people's money under duress?? Epic. Call Uber support. See what they tell you. Prove me wrong.
> 
> 
> Um, the burden of proof is on you. Call Uber support and ask them. Let me know how that goes. If I wrong, I will concede. See the above basic definition in a previous post if you can even understand it. Even if it wasn't extortion under the "word" of the law, there is a little thing called the spirit of the law...or ethics. What a chitty thing to do another no matter what they have done.
> ...


So what do you think he should have done?


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

UberBeemer said:


> You're gravely mistaken about having to threaten harm. You coerced them like a highwayman. You shook them down. You admitted to committing a crime. And you went even further by bragging about it being a pattern.


You posted the MN statute and the MN statute requires the threat of harm or confinement. You posted it, not me.



ABQuber said:


> Well, according to TOS, you should have cancelled under "passenger made me feel unsafe" option and then reported it to Uber. They would have made it so you couldn't be paired with them again I'm sure.
> 
> However you did it was a violation of TOS and that's what would get you deactivated or at least a time out.


Citation needed. Please provide.


----------



## Steven Ambrose (Sep 25, 2016)

I have no words. I don't know if I should applaud or deplore this.....


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Jon Stoppable said:


> Boosters don't get installed, they sit on the seat and you buckle the kid with the car's belt. It's enough to get you out of a ticket if the kid is three and up.
> 
> If you are worried about being sued, you're in the wrong line of work. Also, then you shouldn't try stunts like this. It will cost the pax nothing to sue you in small claims for the $20. I have no idea what would happen, but it would make a good case for Judge Wapner and cost you a day of work.


I'm not interested in not getting a ticket. I'm interested in not getting sued for my life savings because a scumbag doesn't give two shits about their own child.

I'm also unconcerned about getting sued in small claims court for $20. You're being ridiculous and you know it.


----------



## MadTownUberD (Mar 11, 2017)

I'm going to modify my reaction to the OP and state that this is hilarious. The whole situation illustrates how game-like it is to use Uber. Pax game the system all the time. The guy was willing to give up $20+ because he knew he STILL was getting a deal by ordering an Uber instead of a cab etc.

Small claims court for $20? Really??!?! I think everyone has better things to do than send this one through litigation, even if it might be illegal (I'm not persuaded yet on that point).


----------



## Jon Stoppable (Dec 11, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> You're being ridiculous and you know it.


Um, I'm not the one who started a thread fishing for praise over their new earnings strategy.

Anyway, if you are involved in an at-fault accident where a pax kid in pax's car seat gets hurt or killed, you're gonna get sued. So buy insurance.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I didn't threaten him with financial harm. He was free to stop ordering an Uber ride at any point. He could have used Lyft or called a taxi. I merely told him what was going to happen if he continued to use Uber while knowingly violating the Terms of Service and one option to change course.


Yes that falls under financial harm. You ensnared pax in a monetized cancellation loop to your advantage.

Which you wouldn't stop unless given bribe by pax. This is what happens when people think they are smarter than the law they do stupid things.

The only correction I need to make is in your state it's less than $300 a misdemeanor.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Jon Stoppable said:


> Um, I'm not the one who started a thread fishing for praise over their new earnings strategy.
> 
> Anyway, if you are involved in an at-fault accident where a pax kid in pax's car seat gets hurt or killed, you're gonna get sued. So buy insurance.


It's a discussion board and we're discussing this situation. I could just as quickly accuse you of "_fishing for praise_" by sticking your finger in the wind and agreeing with the gaggle of pearl clutchers in this thread. So that attempt at an insult is really meaningless.

Getting sued and getting a judgment are two different things. Anybody can get sued. I do have extra insurance. My state is also no-fault state when it comes to personal injury, so as long as I'm not doing anything negligent, like giving a ride to an infant without a car seat, I'm covered.


----------



## ABQuber (Jan 30, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> Citation needed. Please provide.


Alright, I'm gonna post 2 separate things here. It also doesn't specifically say in the "guidelines" that you will be deactivated if a rider reports you drunk, but this is what they'll point to when this situation happens


----------



## OldBay (Apr 1, 2019)

This only works in a town with one uber.


----------



## Jon Stoppable (Dec 11, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> so as long as I'm not doing anything negligent, like giving a ride to an infant without a car seat, I'm covered


Great, we agree then. Enjoy your Mentos!


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Yes that falls under financial harm. You ensnared pax in a monetized cancellation loop to your advantage.
> 
> Which you wouldn't stop unless given bribe by pax. This is what happens when people think they are smarter than the law they do stupid things.
> 
> The only correction I need to make is in your state it's less than $300 a misdemeanor.


The pax was freely ordering another ride through Uber. I didn't ensnare them in anything. They were free to call a taxi at any time.

Also, I don't write the Uber dispatch algorithm, so I really have no control who it assigns rides to. For all I know, after 8 cancellations, it might go to the next closest driver.

And now you're talking about bribery-- so now you'll need to post the MN statute on bribery. I'm gonna let you know that since I'm not a public official or a witness at a trial, the MN statute doesn't apply in this instance.

Are you really saying that if I slip the Maitre D a $20 bill to not sit me by the bathroom, or to skip the line that I'm guilty of criminal bribery in Minnesota? lol. Y'all are too much.


----------



## OldBay (Apr 1, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> lol. These people would flip out when they hear what I do when I get pinged to a high school or middle school.
> 
> You know I'm done playing nice with dirtbags. The first 200-300 times I went to pings with toddlers and no car seats was cute. It's just not cute anymore. These people need to be hurt financially to the greatest extent possible. They know exactly what they're doing. If I get back some of the money I've lost over the years, then no one should blame me one bit.
> 
> ...


You are acting like what you did is in defense of the toddlers, but actually you're just doing it to make a buck.

The problem I see with this is that it's flirting with deactivation. If someone is serious about rideshare, they won't do this, just like they won't speed excessively.

Its clear that you're at the point that you DGAF anymore.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

OldBay said:


> You are acting like what you did is in defense of the toddlers, but actually you're just doing it to make a buck.
> 
> The problem I see with this is that it's flirting with deactivation. If someone is serious about rideshare, they won't do this, just like they won't speed excessively.
> 
> Its clear that you're at the point that you DGAF anymore.


It can be both in defense of toddlers and to make a buck. Are you going to crusade against car seat manufacturers next? That's literally their business model-- protect toddlers *and *make a buck.

Actions can be done for two separate, yet complimentary motivations.


----------



## OldBay (Apr 1, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> Actions can be done for two separate, yet complimentary motivations.


Sure, ok.

But the real point is that you DGAF anymore. That rider could easily have escalated and claimed extortion or blackmail. Asking for a cash tip is enough to get you deactivated. You're flirting with disaster.

Your actions while possibly amusing, aren't rational.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> The pax was freely ordering another ride through Uber. I didn't ensnare them in anything. They were free to call a taxi at any time.
> 
> Also, I don't write the Uber dispatch algorithm, so I really have no control who it assigns rides to. For all I know, after 8 cancellations, it might go to the next closest driver.
> 
> ...


It's not about if the pax had other options. The attempt is enough to be charged in itself.

You run out of logical roadway to defend your actions so now you are moving the goal post and shifting the conversation to what your pax could have done.

Your legal loopholes you're trying to cling to are just logical loopholes that only other drivers would entertain.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

ABQuber said:


> Alright, I'm gonna post 2 separate things here. It also doesn't specifically say in the "guidelines" that you will be deactivated if a rider reports you drunk, but this is what they'll point to when this situation happens
> View attachment 420080
> View attachment 420081


I read nothing in here that applies to my situation or that stipulated deactivation.

Thanks again for making my point for me.

I appreciate that you have your opinion on this. I'm not telling you that you have to do things like I do. Likewise, I don't have to do things like you do. We'll both deal with the consequences of our actions.

If by some ridiculous twist of fate I would get deactivated for this, it's a hill I'll happily die on.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> The pax was freely ordering another ride through Uber.


He was trying to order another ride. But he had a driver who was messing with him.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> It's not about if the pax had other options. The attempt is enough to be charged in itself.
> 
> You run out of logical roadway to defend your actions so no you are moving the goal post and shifting the conversation to what your pax could have done.
> 
> Your legal loopholes you're trying to cling to are just logical loopholes that only other drivers would entertain.


I'm not shifting the goalpost at all. My contention from the beginning is that what I did was completely legal and doesn't meet any of the requirements for extortion and also doesn't violate the TOS. That's still my position.

I think you're being silly by even suggesting that what I did was extortion, much less that any law enforcement agency would do anything but laugh the passenger out of the station for wasting their time.


----------



## Deceptive (Oct 29, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> If by some ridiculous twist of fate I would get deactivated for this, it's a hill I'll happily die on.


Sure, that's what they all say. You'll be driving for lyft if not already


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Coachman said:


> He was trying to order another ride. But he had a driver who was messing with him.


Oh, and he wasn't screwing with me? I had already explained to him that he couldn't legally get a ride. He kept ordering in hopes of finding a driver that would break the law and endanger his child.

Poor him.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> ...what I did was completely legal and doesn't meet any of the requirements for extortion.


extortion: the practice of obtaining something, especially money, through force or threats.



dctcmn said:


> Oh, and he wasn't screwing with me?


Not in any universe.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

OldBay said:


> Sure, ok.
> 
> But the real point is that you DGAF anymore. That rider could easily have escalated and claimed extortion or blackmail. Asking for a cash tip is enough to get you deactivated. You're flirting with disaster.
> 
> Your actions while possibly amusing, aren't rational.


Oh, now it's BLACKMAIL!!!

Y'all are hilarious. How long until I'm accused of murdering this entire family? Treason? Genocide?

If you're just gonna make up crimes to charge me with, you might as well go big.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I'm not shifting the goalpost at all. My contention from the beginning is that what I did was completely legal and doesn't meet any of the requirements for extortion and also doesn't violate the TOS. That's still my position.
> 
> I think you're being silly by even suggesting that what I did was extortion, much less that any law enforcement agency would do anything but laugh the passenger out of the station for wasting their time.


Keep doing exactly what you're doing and eventually you will meet a pax that does call law enforcement to scene.

You will be at the mercy of that offical, if they cite it misdemeanor extortion then you will have to get a lawyer and fight an uphill criminal case.

Think on this, this is a driver forum where most of your peers are likely to agree with you. At this point it looks like 70% or more disagree.

The general public and law tends to favor the pax by a large margin. We have countless examples of this. So keep playing your game thinking law enforcement is going to have a good chuckle with you if they are called out.


----------



## ABQuber (Jan 30, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I read nothing in here that applies to my situation or that stipulated deactivation.
> 
> Thanks again for making my point for me.
> 
> ...


This exactly applies to your situation.

The guideline is to report your exact situation to Uber. You clearly did not follow it since you continued to get the requests.

Failure to follow guidelines can result in deactivation. Especially if pax complained hard enough.

Second, you demanded cash to release them from your improper cancellations, so they could try to get another ride. That's harming Ubers brand and/or reputation.

Just sayin. Had pax pursued it, you certainly would have been granted that request on said hill. lol.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> Oh, now it's BLACKMAIL!!!
> 
> Y'all are hilarious. How long until I'm accused of murdering this entire family? Treason? Genocide?
> 
> If you're just gonna make up crimes to charge me with, you might as well go big.


Extortion, blackmail, bribery is all within the same bag of tricks. Stop acting like everyone is accusing you of something new everytime, it's all in the same category.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

OldBay said:


> Sure, ok.
> 
> But the real point is that you DGAF anymore. That rider could easily have escalated and claimed extortion or blackmail. Asking for a cash tip is enough to get you deactivated. You're flirting with disaster.
> 
> Your actions while possibly amusing, aren't rational.


I'd say that I care now more than ever.

First I'm illegal, then I'm immoral, now I'm irrational.

Please tell me how asking to be compensated for declining a ping and lowering my acceptance rate, or going offline and not being productive is now irrational?


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> First I'm illegal, then I'm immoral, now I'm irrational.


How about you just admit you didn't handle it well and move on?


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Extortion, blackmail, bribery is all within the same bag of tricks. Stop acting like everyone is accusing you of something new everytime, it's all in the same category.


Extortion: needs threat of harm or confinement (not present in my case)
Bribery: needs to be a public official or court witness (not present in my case)
Blackmail: need the threat of releasing damaging or embarrassing information (not present in my case)

They all might be in the same general category, but they are all different crimes that have specific requirements. None of those requirements were met in my situation.

Y'all are just throwing crap against the wall at this point.

Listen, I don't really care if you would do what I did. I don't care if you think it's immoral. But don't say it was illegal, because it wasn't and it's silly to suggest that it is. There are better and more interesting arguments to be made against what I did.



Coachman said:


> How about you just admit you didn't handle it well and move on?


I'll admit that I didn't handle every other car seat issue well in my driving history. I let those other dirtbag parents off too easily. There's probably some kid who got injured out there because a $5 cancellation fee doesn't sting enough and Uber will just refund the fee anyway.

Shame on the past me for doing that.


----------



## 5☆OG (Jun 30, 2019)

Sitting there was a D move. Dont you have better things to do then act like a 3 year old? Forget that its unprofessional. It shows a lack of value of both parties time and a clear misunderstanding in valuing your time. If that customer wanted to be vindictive he could fabricate a story that might get you deactivated. They were wrong to expect you to take a child without a seat..as it turns out you already had a childs seat...you were sitting in it


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> Extortion: needs threat of harm or confinement (not present in my case)
> Bribery: needs to be a public official or court witness (not present in my case)
> Blackmail: need the threat of releasing damaging or embarrassing information (not present in my case)
> 
> ...


Okay message Uber support and tell them exactly what you told us, post the conversation &#128514;

Since you followed all laws and tos rules you have nothing to worry about.

We will wait

Also I've already post evidence that extortion extends beyond your definition of it.









As I said in the same category... smh


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

ABQuber said:


> This exactly applies to your situation.
> 
> The guideline is to report your exact situation to Uber. You clearly did not follow it since you continued to get the requests.
> 
> ...


I did report it to Uber, though. And they awarded me two more cancellation fees.

As for deactivation, that's pure speculation on your part. For all I (or you) know, the passenger did complain and Uber told them to go pound sand as soon as they saw my report that they had no car seat.

Stop with the speculation. Stop with the ridiculous legal charges. Stop with the morality speeches.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> I'll admit that I didn't handle every other car seat issue well in my driving history. I let those other dirtbag parents off too easily. There's probably some kid who got injured out there because a $5 cancellation fee doesn't sting enough and Uber will just refund the fee anyway.


There's nothing in the way you handled this that suggests you were interested in anybody's welfare but your own.


----------



## Wildgoose (Feb 11, 2019)

Want to see you tomorrow without getting deactivated or getting temporary deactivation while being under investigation. 
Rider has power to say Uber that you are under influence.


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I did report it to Uber, though. And they awarded me two more cancellation fees.
> 
> As for deactivation, that's pure speculation on your part. For all I (or you) know, the passenger did complain and Uber told them to go pound sand as soon as they saw my report that they had no car seat.
> 
> Stop with the speculation. Stop with the ridiculous legal charges. Stop with the morality speeches.


Did you tell them you went in the restaurant to ask for $20 to leave?

You keep skipping over that part for some reason...&#129300;


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Okay message Uber support and they them exactly what you told us, post the conversation &#128514;
> 
> Since you followed all laws and tos rules you have nothing to worry about.
> 
> ...


I didn't define extortion. The State of Minnesota did. That's what matters here. Roget's 21st Century Thesaurus' definition doesn't matter either. Am I going to Thesaurus prison now?

Again, I'm confused as to why I am doing work to email Uber when you're making the claim that I'd be deactivated. You're making the claim, you provide the proof.

My claim is that I did what I did, but did not get deactivated, and that there's no language in the TOS that states that I will be deactivated for doing what I did. All I have to prove is that I'm not deactivated. I can't really post language from the TOS that doesn't exist, because you cannot prove a negative.


----------



## TXUbering (May 9, 2018)

I'm curious if the OP has rideshare insurance on their vehicle, and if not, if he/she would be ok with a pax that decides to ping them continuously and cancel before the expired time because they think it's immoral that the driver doesn't have the proper insurance.

While there is a lot wrong in my state, they do get this right.



> Are any passenger vehicles exempt from the child passenger safety law? Yes - vehicles for hire: taxi cabs, limousines, hired shuttles, public transit buses and also passenger vehicles in which all seating positions equipped with safety seat systems and safety belts are occupied


 from https://www.dps.texas.gov/director_staff/public_information/childpasssafetyfaqs.pdf

The responsibility should always be on the parent/guardian. If the parent/guardian doesn't want to lug around a child seat, then that's on their shoulders. I will say this, I make it a point to drive more cautious when I carry a child, and I've had maybe 2-3 out of about 15 riders that actually had a child seat with them.

I actually grew up in an era where it was perfectly ok for my mother to carry me in her arms in the front seat without having to wear a seatbelt herself. But, it seems like with every generation, we slowly begin to let others delegate common sense behavior.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Did you tell them you went in the restaurant to ask for $20 to leave?
> 
> You keep skipping over that part for some reason...&#129300;


That didn't happen during the ping, so it's none of Uber's business. I'm not an employee of Uber, I'm an independent contractor. As an independent contractor I can work for Uber, Lyft or myself at any point in time. The passenger was paying me, working for myself as a sole proprietor, to not take work that I'm entitled to accept from Uber.

It would be no different than if I had a client who paid me to be on call for them and either turn the Uber app off or decline pings, so as to be available for their work (or no work).

It's funny how y'all want us to be Uber's employees when it suits you and independent contractors when it suits you.



TXUbering said:


> I'm curious if the OP has rideshare insurance on their vehicle, and if not, if he/she would be ok with a pax that decides to ping them continuously and cancel before the expired time because they think it's immoral that the driver doesn't have the proper insurance.


I do have ride share insurance.

I have passengers that cancel multiple times on me because they're looking to get a minivan or SUV slumming it down on UberX, or they cancel because they're hoping to get a hot female driver, or they think they can get a luxury car. I don't like it, but it's within their legal right to do so and Uber doesn't seem to think that it violates the TOS.

Am I ok with it? Every time it happens I write into Uber support requesting a cancellation fee for every cancelled request after the first one. Sometimes I get it, sometimes I don't. Since I'm still driving for Uber, I suppose that means I'm ok with it.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> The passenger was paying me, working for myself as a sole proprietor, to not take work that I'm entitled to accept from Uber.


You're just embarrassing yourself at this point.

You weren't planning on taking any work. You were holding him hostage.


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

don't forget to claim that $20 as income, ok?
So glad I have 2 boosters in my car at all times. sheesh.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Coachman said:


> You're just embarrassing yourself at this point.
> 
> You weren't planning on taking any work. You were holding him hostage.


I was planning on taking every ping that was sent my way that was under 8 minutes away and over 15 minutes in duration. If anything, he was holding me hostage from getting legitimate pings. If he would've just not requested for 5 minutes I probably would've been gone on another ride. There's no way I'm losing the ability to see trip duration for $3.75 or $20 or even $38.75.

Remember, I told the parents that I would take every ping, not that I would turn down every ping but theirs.

Although a nice added bonus was getting my acceptance rate up a few percentage points. Passenger cancels count positively toward acceptance rate.


----------



## 5☆OG (Jun 30, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I was planning on taking every ping that was sent my way that was under 8 minutes away and over 15 minutes in duration. If anything, he was holding me hostage from getting legitimate pings. If he would've just not requested for 5 minutes I probably would've been gone on another ride. There's no way I'm losing the ability to see trip duration for $3.75 or $20 or even $38.75.
> 
> Remember, I told the parents that I would take every ping, not that I would turn down every ping but theirs.
> 
> Although a nice added bonus was getting my acceptance rate up a few percentage points. Passenger cancels count positively toward acceptance rate.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

SHalester said:


> don't forget to claim that $20 as income, ok?
> So glad I have 2 boosters in my car at all times. sheesh.


Don't worry, I won't forget. I'm very aggressive with my deductions, but I never cheat on my taxes. If you claim a deduction and you're not entitled to it, the penalty is just the difference in tax, so there's no real consequence. If you exclude income, that's fraud and it's a big deal. I'm already tax positive on Ubering, so there's no real need to cheat.

Speaking of which, I'm surprised no one has accused me of tax fraud on this thread yet (or war crimes). Throw it on the pile with extortion, genocide and other crimes against humanity.

Y'all will have me in the electric chair before this is over, and Minnesota doesn't even have capital punishment. I'm sure someone will accuse me of a Federal crime soon.


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> I was planning on taking every ping that was sent my way that was under 8 minutes away and over 15 minutes in duration. If anything, he was holding me hostage from getting legitimate pings. If he would've just not requested for 5 minutes I probably would've been gone on another ride. There's no way I'm losing the ability to see trip duration for $3.75 or $20 or even $38.75.
> 
> Remember, I told the parents that I would take every ping, not that I would turn down every ping but theirs.
> 
> Although a nice added bonus was getting my acceptance rate up a few percentage points. Passenger cancels count positively toward acceptance rate.


You are a thief and a liar and should be deactivated ASAP.


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> . I'm sure someone will accuse me of a Federal crime soon.


just keep posting, you will hit the 50 limit and then no more drivel from you for a while.
All was ok until you hustled them for the $20. And then hustled Uber for even more. Sometimes it is best not to post what makes YOU proud as you will find few agree with you. tata


----------



## 5☆OG (Jun 30, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> Don't worry, I won't forget. I'm very aggressive with my deductions, but I never cheat on my taxes. If you claim a deduction and you're not entitled to it, the penalty is just the difference in tax, so there's no real consequence. If you exclude income, that's fraud and it's a big deal. I'm already tax positive on Ubering, so there's no real need to cheat.
> 
> Speaking of which, I'm surprised no one has accused me of tax fraud on this thread yet (or war crimes). Throw it on the pile with extortion, genocide and other crimes against humanity.
> 
> Y'all will have me in the electric chair before this is over, and Minnesota doesn't even have capital punishment. I'm sure someone will accuse me of a Federal crime soon.


And the award for most drama in a thread goes to.....


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> Speaking of which, I'm surprised no one has accused me of tax fraud on this thread yet (or war crimes). Throw it on the pile with extortion, genocide and other crimes against humanity.


Most people who behave badly find a way to paint themselves as the victim.


----------



## XLnoGas (Dec 20, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> No, it's not extortion. If I decline a ping, then it counts against my acceptance rate and if I fall below 85% then I can't see trip duration. So I am incurring a cost by declining their ping. I'm merely asking them to compensate me for what I lose for declining a ping.
> 
> This was a simple verbal contract between two consenting parties, and it was executed properly. I gave consideration in exchange for compensation. They were paying me to perform a task, which was to decline their ping.


Why didn't you just go offline for someone else to get the ping? It's offline , 2 minutes.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

XLnoGas said:


> Why didn't you just go offline for someone else to get the ping? It's offline , 2 minutes.


He doesn't even need to go offline. Just ignore one ping. God forbid it might hurt his AR. But after all, he was the victim here.


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request.
> 
> I got my $20 and declined his next request. I then wrote into Uber Support and explained the situation and they adjusted 2 more unpaid cancellations for me. So I ended up getting $18.75 in cancellation fees and $20 cash. $38.75 for under 20 minutes of hassle and a few empty miles seems worth it to me.


@HPClays , we have a *real Stone Cold Multiplier*, here!

We shall have to call together The Board:

@Jo3030 , @3.75 , @koyotemohn , @New2This and @Another Uber Driver .

This one MUST be entered into the _Annals of the Shirlington Shuffle._

To the Original Poster: TOP WORK. Sir; top work indeed!



Dekero said:


> Repeat after me.... SHUFFLE


That is just what Original Poster did. It is truly one for the Annals. I see that we have had a few Uber Boy Scouts, Lyft Camp Fire Girls and Uber Thralls post _their_ comments, although only one of the regulars has bothered; thus far, at least. Give the topic some time, the usual Uber Boy Scouts, Lyft Camp Fire Girls, Uber Thralls Uber Shills and Uber Trolls will show up here. I am waiting for one, in particular who is well known to certain posters on the various boards.








Chorch said:


> So what do you think he should have done?


............precisely what he did do..............................I salute and congratulate him for it.


----------



## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> How is it extortion in any way, shape or form?


 I don't think a discussion over whether or not this was extortion is the point. Extortion means "pay me money or I will do something you don't want". And by that logic, the judge in traffic court extorted money from me. "Pay me money [traffic ticket fine] or I will do something you don't want [put you in jail]". Not too helpful.

So the defining word is not important, what's important is the risk that you took. A pax may not take kindly to being extorted and could easily retaliate by putting in a false service dog refusal complaint or other story against you. You know that Uberlyft's mission is to protect and serve its pax - best case would be 2 day suspension; worst case you're done.

Based on this unlevel playing field, my advice would be take no crap from pax, but don't antagonise them when you don't have to. And certainly not for a few bucks.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Coachman said:


> Most people who behave badly find a way to paint themselves as the victim.


I'm completely cool with you and everyone else in this thread thinking that I behaved in a way that you wouldn't. That's your opinion, your right and your morality. My problem is with people saying demonstrably false things like that what I did was illegal or that it violated Uber's TOS. You don't have the right to say false things without getting corrected.

There are people who think it's immoral to race mix. There are people who think it's immoral to be gay. There are people who think it's immoral to be Catholic, or Protestant or Atheist. You have every right to live by your morality. You do not have the right to force me or anyone else to live by your morality.

In my morality, if you aren't bringing any harm to me, then I'm not bringing any harm to you. However, if you are bringing harm to me, then I have every right to not only defend myself in the present, but to harm you back to the extent that I believe that you'll never try it again (within the bounds of the law)-- call it future defense. Wasting my time, productivity and opportunity by acting in a way that you know asks me to do something illegal gets me wasting your time until I determine that I'm compensated.

I am glad that we're back to me just being a jerk and not a felon.


----------



## New2This (Dec 27, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


This is beyond beautiful.


----------



## 5☆OG (Jun 30, 2019)

This thread has more drama then an all you can eat sausage night at a san francisco bath house


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

New2This said:


> This is beyond beautiful.


_D'ya' s'pose_ that Original Poster has any material for the "Love Letters to PAX" topic on our Very Own Washington Boards? We always welcome out of market posts to it, or, to any other topic there, for that matter..


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

And right on cue the morons arrive to cheer the OP on.


----------



## TXUbering (May 9, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> I do have ride share insurance.
> 
> I have passengers that cancel multiple times on me because they're looking to get a minivan or SUV slumming it down on UberX, or they cancel because they're hoping to get a hot female driver, or they think they can get a luxury car. I don't like it, but it's within their legal right to do so and Uber doesn't seem to think that it violates the TOS.
> 
> Am I ok with it? Every time it happens I write into Uber support requesting a cancellation fee for every cancelled request after the first one. Sometimes I get it, sometimes I don't. Since I'm still driving for Uber, I suppose that means I'm ok with it.


Justifying a dick move because of someone else's dick move is a dick^2 move. We get it, you don't want to give a child a ride that doesn't have a child safety seat, but ultimately you badgered a family that was just out trying to enjoy an evening. The best thing would've been to cancel the ride, explain to the parents why you cancelled the ride (even though in Texas you wouldn't be breaking a law, the parents would be) and move on. You took it too far.


----------



## kingcorey321 (May 20, 2018)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Corey don't repeat this. I'm glad it worked out in op favor but this could have definitely taken bad turn. Many times shitty parents are shitty people in general.
> 
> OP could've left car to offer to leave for $20 dollars the pax with no car seat could have become violent. Ultimately this could have escalated a simple decline to a dangerous place.


not me .im to old to try a trick like this ! Im just impressed with side of his balls to pull this off


----------



## TheDevilisaParttimer (Jan 2, 2019)

Another Uber Driver said:


> @HPClays , we have a *real Stone Cold Multiplier*, here!
> 
> We shall have to call together The Board:
> 
> ...


No fair everyone on your drivers council approves everything anti rideshare and anti pax &#128514;

I'm calling in the big guns the anti drivers bending rules council, you made me do this @MiamiKid , @Cold Fusion , @got a p , @ANT 7, @dauction












kingcorey321 said:


> not me .im to old to try a trick like this ! Im just impressed with side of his balls to pull this off


Yeah gotta give op some credit, he got a set on him to go into the restaurant and ask for money to leave. It is priceless and legendary


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

_High_ _moronicity_ is a failure to recognise that this is America:

In God We Trust, All Others Pay Cash (or American Express, where accepted).

Uber Boy Scouts, Lyft Camp Fire Girls and Uber Thralls seem to forget that.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

TXUbering said:


> The best thing would've been to cancel the ride, explain to the parents why you cancelled the ride (even though in Texas you wouldn't be breaking a law, the parents would be) and move on. You took it too far.


I did explain to the parents why they needed to cancel the ride. Why should I cancel when I've dedicated my miles, my time and my opportunity to take other rides in a good faith attempt to fulfill the ride? Why should I come away empty handed and worse off than I was before I accepted the ping? So I let the timer run down and cancelled the ride because they refused to do what was right.

They 100% knew that they were asking me to do something illegal. They also continued to request rides after it had been explained to them that what they wanted was illegal. They deserved everything they got and more in my opinion. If anything, I didn't take it far enough, but what am I gonna do? Call Child Protective Services? Call the police and have them ticket the next poor driver who got the ping and needs the ride to feed his/her family or doesn't know the law? No. There's only one set of dirtbags in this scenario and it's the parents.

In Minnesota, I would have been breaking the law and I would've gotten the ticket if I had given the ride. I easily could've lost my license, if I got a judge that would do the right thing. I certainly would've lost the rest of my night's earnings.


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> I'll ask you the same question as I asked the last two-- Tell me specifically how what I did was extortion. Cite the extortion statute I'm violating.
> 
> Extortion means that I'm forcing someone to pay me to NOT perform an illegal act that would harm them. I'm not doing anything that's illegal by continuing to accept their pings. I'm well within my legal right to do so. They are paying my to not perform a legal action that is well within my right to do. That's simply not extortion.
> 
> Again, you're making the claim. You provide the proof to support your claim.


You should be aware that the laws are always being written to prosecute and convict the ones who narrowly skate by because of semantics. In your case, arguments can be made to a judge (who cares not a wit about acceptance rates) that in the known action of repeatedly taking these requests without the intention to fulfill them, ILLEGALLY IMPRISONED them. They would claim quite rationally that the stranding and harasing you were doing placed them in duress, and that the demand you made was both extortion and ransom, to be paid and was paid for their freedom. As for Uber, a cancellation reason of no car seat takes you out of the loop and does not penalize you. So, you placed a family in fear, and made money you forced from them. They deserved a fine perhaps, but you could, in my layperson opinion, be called up to prison if prosecuted.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

LADryver said:


> You should be aware that the laws are always being written to prosecute and convict the ones who narrowly skate by because of semantics. In your case, arguments can be made to a judge (who cares not a wit about acceptance rates) that in the known action of repeatedly taking these requests without the intention to fulfill them, ILLEGALLY IMPRISONED them. They would claim quite rationally that the stranding and harasing you were doing placed them in duress, and that the demand you made was both extortion and ransom, to be paid and was paid for their freedom. As for Uber, a cancellation reason of no car seat takes you out of the loop and does not penalize you. So, you made miney, placed a family in fear, and made money you forced from them.


lmao.

I'm back to being a felon. I ILLEGALLY IMPRISONED this poor, poor family in a steakhouse.

Honestly, where do you people come from?


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> lmao.
> 
> I'm back to being a felon. I ILLEGALLY IMPRISONED this poor, poor family in a steakhouse.
> 
> Honestly, where do you people come from?


When they made the requests and you repeatedly rejected them, were they able to leave?


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> I ILLEGALLY IMPRISONED this poor, poor family in a steakhouse.


Anyone who is willing to pay the check can imprison me in a steak house!


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> Don't worry, I won't forget. I'm very aggressive with my deductions, but I never cheat on my taxes. If you claim a deduction and you're not entitled to it, the penalty is just the difference in tax, so there's no real consequence. If you exclude income, that's fraud and it's a big deal. I'm already tax positive on Ubering, so there's no real need to cheat.
> 
> Speaking of which, I'm surprised no one has accused me of tax fraud on this thread yet (or war crimes). Throw it on the pile with extortion, genocide and other crimes against humanity.
> 
> Y'all will have me in the electric chair before this is over, and Minnesota doesn't even have capital punishment. I'm sure someone will accuse me of a Federal crime soon.


Yup. It does have that patina. Now but about tax deductions. The IRS is a lot of things. They are an information agency, a collection agency, and an enforcement agency. The difference between being in contact with the collection division and the criminal investigation division is in the intention and extent of an innapropriate deduction. You are right, about the collection division, but you have never met the criminal investigation division. I did (former IRS). They do not send letters.

It seems to me like you are very ignorant and should enroll in school. Find a community college.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

LADryver said:


> When they made the requests and you repeatedly rejected them, were they able to leave?


They absolutely were able to leave- by foot, by taxi, by Lyft, by Limo, by walking to the bus stop and taking the next bus, by calling a parent, relative or friend and having them go get their car seat and drive it to them, by posting that they need a ride with a carseat that fits a toddler on Craigslist or Nextdoor, by asking someone else in the restaurant if they had a carseat and could give them a ride home.

I did not in any way imprison them. That's simply laughable and honestly embarrassing that you're asserting that I was. They do not have the right to convenience. They do not have the right to an illegal ride. They do not have the right to use Uber.



LADryver said:


> Yup. It does have that patina. Now but about tax deductions. The IRS is a lot of things. They are an information agency, a collection agency, and an enforcement agency. The difference between being in contact with the collection division and the criminal investigation division is in the intention and extent of an innapropriate deduction. You are right, about the collection division, but you have never met the criminal investigation division. I did (former IRS). They do not send letters.
> 
> It seems to me like you are very ignorant and should enroll in school. Find a community college.


So now I'm a tax cheat because I report all of my income and take all of my deductions? I hope they don't give me consecutive sentences on tops of all my false imprisonment, extortion, bribery and "ill gotten gains" (still my favorite) charges.

What d'ya think I'm gonna get for all these crimes? life? death?

This forum has really jumped the shark.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

BBslider001 said:


> Ummmm, the minute you say to anyone, "pay me X and Y will stop" is the basic definition of extortion


So I guess exterminators and plumbers are extortionists now?
Moron Tard....
I mean jfc...


----------



## MadTownUberD (Mar 11, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> They absolutely were able to leave- by foot, by taxi, by Lyft, by Limo, by walking to the bus stop and taking the next bus, by calling a parent, relative or friend and having them go get their car seat and drive it to them, by posting that they need a ride with a carseat that fits a toddler on Craigslist or Nextdoor, by asking someone else in the restaurant if they had a carseat and could give them a ride home.
> 
> I did not in any way imprison them. That's simply laughable and honestly embarrassing that you're asserting that I was. They do not have the right to convenience. They do not have the right to an illegal ride. They do not have the right to use Uber.
> 
> ...


Correct me if I'm wrong sir but you sound like a ...

a....

....a free market capitalist and a libertarian!!!!


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> So I guess exterminators and plumbers are extortionists now?
> Moron Tard....
> I mean jfc...


If the plumber shuts off the water to your house and demands $20 to turn it back on that's extortion.


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> They absolutely were able to leave- by foot, by taxi, by Lyft, by Limo, by walking to the bus stop and taking the next bus, by calling a parent, relative or friend and having them go get their car seat and drive it to them, by posting that they need a ride with a carseat that fits a toddler on Craigslist or Nextdoor, by asking someone else in the restaurant if they had a carseat and could give them a ride home.
> 
> I did not in any way imprison them. That's simply laughable and honestly embarrassing that you're asserting that I was. They do not have the right to convenience. They do not have the right to an illegal ride. They do not have the right to use Uber.
> 
> ...


Your reading comprehension is not all it should be. I did not call you a cheat. I just corrected your impression that there is no seriousness to inappropriate deductions. As for imprisonment, the requestor proved he felt IMPRISONED by paying you. Did you suggest his choices to him?


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

Coachman said:


> If the plumber shuts off the water to your house and demands $20 to turn it back on that's extortion.


And you typing out that sentence makes me wonder how you survive a shower.

Pax was attempting to break the law.
REPEATEDLY 
Fair game...


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

MadTownUberD said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong sir but you sound like a ...
> 
> a....
> 
> ....a free market capitalist and a libertarian!!!!


I'm a Nordic Model Social Democrat. So I'm a capitalist through and through, but capitalism should be the engine for achieving a greater social good (societal progression). In this instance, my capitalism achieves the greater social good by punishing the social cancer of driving your toddler around without a car seat. If you can afford to eat at a steakhouse, you can afford to pay for a car seat (or pay a $38.75 fine). Sweden, Norway, Finland and Iceland would approve.


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> And you typing out that sentence makes me wonder how you survive a shower.
> 
> Pax was attempting to break the law.
> REPEATEDLY
> Fair game...


He was stupid but not fair game.
If he was fair game it could have been for a call to the police.

"The *penalties for failing to* comply *with car seat* laws are also up to the state. Typically considered a traffic offense, *fines* can range anywhere from $10 to $500 and more for subsequent offenses. Some states also use the driver's license point system to penalize noncompliance.Jul 24, 2018"


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

LADryver said:


> He was stupid but not fair game.
> If he was fair game it could have been for a call to the police.
> 
> "The *penalties for failing to* comply *with car seat* laws are also up to the state. Typically considered a traffic offense, *fines* can range anywhere from $10 to $500 and more for subsequent offenses. Some states also use the driver's license point system to penalize noncompliance.Jul 24, 2018"


Right so the pax was repeatedly attempting to involve him in a crime?
Yes?
Correct?
As far as I'm concerned the unlawful, criminal pax was clearly and repeatedly disrupting op's business and income.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

LADryver said:


> Your reading comprehension is not all it should be. I did not call you a cheat. I just corrected your impression that there is no seriousness to inappropriate deductions. As for imprisonment, the requestor proved he felt IMPRISONED by paying you. Did you suggest his choices to him?


If you claim a legitimate tax deduction in error and it's denied, you only owe the amount that you would have paid had you not claimed the deduction. It's not a crime to claim a deduction in error and you're only back to square 1. Now, if you're falsifying the underlying data, then that's fraud and that's an issue.

I suspect you understand completely what I'm saying, but have run out of legitimate arguments, so you're being deliberately obtuse.

Stop with the imprisonment claim. It's stupid. If you think I imprisoned him, then call the police. Do I need to inform him that he can walk out of the steakhouse. Imprisonment is not defined at "not being able to go home when I want". Imprisonment is "I can't leave this place." They could leave the restaurant whenever they wanted by many different means. Heck, they could've called the cops to get them out of there, if they really felt imprisoned. Your imprisonment argument beyond dumb.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

LADryver said:


> If he was fair game it could have been for a call to the police.


Snitch


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> Right so the pax was repeatedly attempting to involve him in a crime?
> Yes?
> Correct?
> As far as I'm concerned the unlawful, criminal pax was disrupting op's business and income.


No, he repeatedly took the request knowing it was the same one. He could have driven away, cancelled, anything, and if so inclined anonymously call police if he was so ecumenical about the rightness, but in the end he left the one to commit the "crime" with someone else. He did agree to the crime in the end but not before collecting all that money. He smiled through his little Midwest teeth and thought he found an easy mark.

Pure justice is at the end of a ticket book. Just let the cop get to the restaurant. See the kid. Ask about the car seat. Done.




dctcmn said:


> If you claim a legitimate tax deduction in error and it's denied, you only owe the amount that you would have paid had you not claimed the deduction. It's not a crime to claim a deduction in error and you're only back to square 1. Now, if you're falsifying the underlying data, then that's fraud and that's an issue.
> 
> I suspect you understand completely what I'm saying, but have run out of legitimate arguments, so you're being deliberately obtuse.
> 
> Stop with the imprisonment claim. It's stupid. If you think I imprisoned him, then call the police. Do I need to inform him that he can walk out of the steakhouse. Imprisonment is not defined at "not being able to go home when I want". Imprisonment is "I can't leave this place." They could leave the restaurant whenever they wanted by many different means. Heck, they could've called the cops to get them out of there, if they really felt imprisoned. Your imprisonment argument beyond dumb.


Wow. You really do not understand. Like basic concepts. Did you finish grade school? "Inappropriate" does not mean an error. Errors are clear to resolve. Intentionally taken deductions they are not entitled to are often cases for tax fraud. People write off vet bills. They claim their dead relatives as dependents. They write off piano lessons for their parakeet. And so on.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

LADryver said:


> He smiled through his little Midwest teeth and thought he found an easy mark.


"_little Midwest teeth_" is the weirdest insult so far in this thread. I love the desperation of that insult. It's so pathetic it's kindof charming.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

LADryver said:


> He could have driven away, cancelled, anything


Not his problem, why should he? So the onus is on OP to conduct biz elsewhere?
The child endangering pax disrupted business and should be charged triple for attempting to harm op's income and ability earn.

How do you know? Maybe OP lost a great long profitable trip due to the actions and repeated illegal requests of the law breaking pax?


----------



## rushbudgie (Nov 7, 2016)

Seems the OP is still with Uber so nothing illegal in their rules & conditions. Just like ANThonyBore DaneCook said, pax attempted to break the law repeatedly, fair game. Pax will game the system to our resentment, OP got one back. Bravo


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> Not his problem, why should he? So the onus is on OP to conduct biz elsewhere?
> The child endangering pax disrupted business and should be charged triple for attempting to harm op's income and ability earn.
> 
> How do you know? Maybe OP lost a great long profitable trip due to the actions and repeated illegal requests of the law breaking pax?


The Relativity of the thing is key here. He would not get the request again if he cancels it for not having a car seat. It flags the account on the side of Uber. Whatever, and If-ever Uber does a thing they at least do not rematch the request to the driver. The infraction is a traffic thing. Nobody elevates it to Child Services. Perhaps they should, but the driver did nothing to increase justice in his community. He found a sucker.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

LADryver said:


> Wow. You really do not understand. Like basic concepts. Did you finish grade school? "Inappropriate" does not mean an error. Errors are clear to resolve. Intentionally taken deductions they are not entitled to are often cases for tax fraud. People write off vet bills. They claim their dead relatives as dependents. They write off piano lessons for their parakeet. And so on.


OK. So am I doing any of that? No. So there's no issue. I've been filing tax returns as a small business owner for decades and never had a collection or criminal action taken against me. Maybe I'll have one next year for not claiming my extortion money from the dude whose family I falsely imprisoned in a steakhouse because it was a bribe and blackmail (and "ill gotten gains" but there's no line on my 1040 for "ill gotten gains" so I don't know where to claim that because I obviously didn't finish grade school because they kicked me out for smiling through my "little Midwestern teeth").

So I guess we'll see. Unless the state gives me the lethal injection that I deserve for my crimes before the IRS can audit me.


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> "_little Midwest teeth_" is the weirdest insult so far in this thread. I love the desperation of that insult. It's so pathetic it's kindof charming.


Really? And you think parakeets have piano lessons?


----------



## DriveLV (Aug 21, 2019)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> Right so the pax was repeatedly attempting to involve him in a crime?
> Yes?
> Correct?
> As far as I'm concerned the unlawful, criminal pax was clearly and repeatedly disrupting op's business and income.


Good arguments, counselor - pax is guilty of attempted conspiracy and tortious interference.

Pax sentenced to a fine of $20 cash + in app cancellation fees.

Next case!


----------



## forqalso (Jun 1, 2015)

Child car seats are not a requirement in Minnesota in a rideshare. Uber still may require one, though. Uber's website says:
*Car seats*
Drivers and riders should comply with local laws when traveling with infants and small children. When riding with small children, it's the account holder's responsibility to provide a car seat. Children age 12 and under should travel in the back seat.

Minnesota law on car seats:
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/169.685*Subd. 6.Exceptions.*
(3) a person while operating a motor vehicle for hire, including a taxi, airport limousine, and bus, but excluding a rented, leased, or borrowed motor vehicle


----------



## dauction (Sep 26, 2017)

forqalso said:


> Child car seats are not a requirement in Minnesota in a rideshare. Uber still may require one, though. Uber's website says:
> *Car seats*
> Drivers and riders should comply with local laws when traveling with infants and small children. When riding with small children, it's the account holder's responsibility to provide a car seat. Children age 12 and under should travel in the back seat.
> 
> ...


I pulled that up a couple months ago. And agree it does seem to cover Rideshare

I still don't allow small kids without a booster seat though. Just a moral judgement. The seat belts in my Lincoln cross right at the neck for kids. KNOWING THAT .. Life after an accident and kid in my car dies.. life would suck because I "knew" the seat belt position would be dangerous for kids.


----------



## Mash Ghasem (Jan 12, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> *My new method for dealing with parents with no car seats*


8 pages later, and the old method is still better: start the ride, and throw them off a bridge to teach them a lesson :biggrin::roflmao:


----------



## dauction (Sep 26, 2017)

Still would love to see all autos come with built in booster seats likethe Dodge Vans have .. they just flip up












Mash Ghasem said:


> 8 pages later, and the old method is still better: start the ride, and throw them off a bridge to teach them a lesson :biggrin::roflmao:


Since we are discussing safety I assume you throw them off with a ..


----------



## Mash Ghasem (Jan 12, 2020)

dauction said:


> Since we are discussing safety I assume you throw them off with a ..
> 
> View attachment 420194


Hells no!

Throw them off the bridge and let them use their carseats as floatation devices... oh wait... they HAVE no carseats... let them sort it out!


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


Excellent


----------



## JDS5768 (Jan 2, 2020)

legendary thread here


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

Palm Beach Driver said:


> Your argument is so bad and legally wrong that a judge would tack on 1000 dollars to the fine for being so ignorant. I can't help that you don't understand it.
> 
> It is the " he needed killing" defense from the 90s in Texas. Or if you like it is " the bank robber mentality" from South Carolina. Remember in a court of law the ONLY thing that matters is what is written in the law books. Opinion has no place in a courtroom. Have a nice night. Feel free to be as wrong as you like.


I would not handle the situation this way; however, strongly support the driver doing so.

And no, this is not extortion by any legal definition. Not in this country.

If you're correct, however, am sure I'm headed to prison!


----------



## ghrdrd (Jun 26, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


Lucky for you you didn't get a 9mm slug to the forehead. 
Playing with fire in the gun crazed US of A.


----------



## got a p (Jan 27, 2018)

TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> No fair everyone on your drivers council approves everything anti rideshare and anti pax &#128514;
> 
> I'm calling in the big guns the anti drivers bending rules council, you made me do this @MiamiKid , @Cold Fusion , @got a p , @ANT 7, @dauction
> 
> ...


i had a couple order w/o child seat a few days ago, just waited 5 minutes and cancelled. no biggie. as far as getting requests repeatedly and then cancelled i had that one a few months ago, he must have done it 30 times.

i think he was a perv trying to get a female driver - i just kept accepting, my acceptance rate went up &#129322;


----------



## bobby747 (Dec 29, 2015)

CASH AOS TOS U ARE COOKED IMHO


----------



## Jon Stoppable (Dec 11, 2019)

See, the key phrase is "new method". If it was "funny thing I did", it would be good for a laugh. But if you try the $20 bit with every pax without a seat, I'm gonna bet it doesn't end well. Probably not in a court of law, rather the arbritration court of U/L.

But hey, free country man. Free for you, free for the pax, free for U/L.


----------



## MadTownUberD (Mar 11, 2017)

ghrdrd said:


> Lucky for you you didn't get a 9mm slug to the forehead.
> Playing with fire in the gun crazed US of A.


I think you must be watching too many American movies and TV shows. In reality there are not rampant wild west style shootouts. Yes there is gun violence but it's usually related to inner city gang activity and/or crimes of passion such as murder/suicides. An average Joe trying to transport his family home isn't going to shoot someone and risk going to prison for life.

And only a small percentage of the population is "packing" at any given time; it's simply inconvenient. I know this because I have a CWP and I've tried walking around with a firearm; unless you have the right kind of clothing or the weapon is small, you tend to be paranoid that people can see it.

That said, I would have been concerned about the situation escalating to uncomfortable levels, such as a screaming match inside the restaurant. OP's got guts!!!


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> I did explain to the parents why they needed to cancel the ride. Why should I cancel when I've dedicated my miles, my time and my opportunity to take other rides in a good faith attempt to fulfill the ride? Why should I come away empty handed and worse off than I was before I accepted the ping? So I let the timer run down and cancelled the ride because they refused to do what was right.
> 
> They 100% knew that they were asking me to do something illegal. They also continued to request rides after it had been explained to them that what they wanted was illegal. They deserved everything they got and more in my opinion. If anything, I didn't take it far enough, but what am I gonna do? Call Child Protective Services? Call the police and have them ticket the next poor driver who got the ping and needs the ride to feed his/her family or doesn't know the law? No. There's only one set of dirtbags in this scenario and it's the parents.
> 
> In Minnesota, I would have been breaking the law and I would've gotten the ticket if I had given the ride. I easily could've lost my license, if I got a judge that would do the right thing. I certainly would've lost the rest of my night's earnings.


You are a liar and a cheater. Why do you care anyway?. If you don't want to drive them fine but you kept accepting the ping, waiting to collect your 3.78$ and on top you went and asked for 20$?

like I said I hope you get deactivated .


----------



## MadTownUberD (Mar 11, 2017)

The queen &#128120; said:


> You are a liar and a cheater. Why do you care anyway?. If you don't want to drive them fine but you kept accepting the ping, waiting to collect your 3.78$ and on top you went and asked for 20$?
> 
> like I said I hope you get deactivated .


How long have you been driving / how many trips have you done?


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

MadTownUberD said:


> How long have you been driving / how many trips have you done?


Driving for 3 3/2 years. 7000 trips. I would never do that . If parents have no car seat I cancel the ride and move on.


----------



## BBslider001 (Apr 24, 2019)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> So I guess exterminators and plumbers are extortionists now?
> Moron Tard....
> I mean jfc...


Yeah, I am definitely not the moron in this situation. You know exactly what I meant so your b******* move on trying to twist my words so that you can have your feelings validated is a parasite attempt at best.


----------



## Hardtime (Feb 4, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


Hahahaha


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

LADryver said:


> They write off piano lessons for their parakeet. And so on.





LADryver said:


> And you think parakeets have piano lessons?


If the owner of said parakeet uses it in a performing animal act for which said owner receives taxable income, he can write off the parakeet's piano lessons. I would, of course, check with a tax professional who is qualified to dispense tax advice before doing this, but, in the aforementioned case, it would appear a legitimate business expense.



forqalso said:


> Minnesota law on car seats:
> *Subd. 6.Exceptions.*
> (3) a person while operating a motor vehicle for hire, including a taxi, airport limousine, and bus, but excluding a rented, leased, or borrowed motor vehicle


I did not follow the link. Despite that, one might want to read the appropriate "Definitions" section.

My first question would be: Does Minnesota Law distinguish between Public and Private Vehicles for Hire?

District of Columbia Law _does_. District of Columbia Law considers taxicabs and limousines to be Public Vehicles for Hire. Uber/Lyft/VIA cars are _P_rivate Vehicles for Hire.

If I am driving my cab:

I can use the bus lanes. TNC cars can not.
I am not held responsible for seat belt use by my passengers. TNC drivers are.
Between the hours of Six P.M. and Six A.M. I need not use a seat belt if I am hauling a passenger or pulling to the kerb to take on one.
I can accept street hails. TNC drivers can not.
I am exempt from any of the car seat requirements in the District of Columbia. TNC drivers are held responsible for compliance, NOT the parent(s)

These are just some of the distinctions. I list them solely for the purpose of examples. Other states and jurisdictions do distinguish between public and private vehicles for hire.

Does this law simply serve to shift the responsibility from the driver to the child's guardian when a vehicle for hire is involved?

What happens in the case where the driver is renting the taxicab?

If this exemption does apply to TNC vehicles in Minnesota, does it apply only if the driver actually owns the vehicle? ....or does it also apply if the TNC driver has rented or borrowed his vehicle?


----------



## MadTownUberD (Mar 11, 2017)

The queen &#128120; said:


> Driving for 3 3/2 years. 7000 trips. I would never do that . If parents have no car seat I cancel the ride and move on.


Ok. But I can see why someone would be jaded after the 100th time. I've got more than 5000 trips and I can count on one hand the number of times I've had to deal with this. But I don't drive in an area with large swaths of urban neighborhoods, where this activity seems rampant, like OP does.


----------



## BBslider001 (Apr 24, 2019)

Chorch said:


> So what do you think he should have done?


driven away, plain and simple. Anybody with an IQ above 75 could have figured that out. Rise above if you dare and are able.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

forqalso said:


> Child car seats are not a requirement in Minnesota in a rideshare. Uber still may require one, though. Uber's website says:
> *Car seats*
> Drivers and riders should comply with local laws when traveling with infants and small children. When riding with small children, it's the account holder's responsibility to provide a car seat. Children age 12 and under should travel in the back seat.
> 
> ...


Uber and Lyft are not defined as "for hire vehicles" in Minnesota. In Minnesota, they are their own definition, and they absolutely need car seats. I started way back when you had to actually meet and go through one on one training with an Uber and Lyft rep before you could go out to give your first ride. They explained the need for a carseat and that the rules for taxis don't apply to us during that training. They consistently said that "_if it is illegal when you're not driving Uber, it's illegal when you are driving Uber_".

Here's the relevant section that defines TNCs...

65B.472 TRANSPORTATION NETWORK FINANCIAL RESPONSIBILITY. Subdivision 1.Definitions. (a) Unless a different meaning is expressly made applicable, the terms defined in paragraphs (b) through (g) have the meanings given them for the purposes of this chapter. (b) A "digital network" means any online-enabled application, software, website, or system offered or utilized by a transportation network company that enables the prearrangement of rides with transportation network company drivers. (c) A "personal vehicle" means a vehicle that is used by a transportation network company driver in connection with providing a prearranged ride and is: (1) owned, leased, or otherwise authorized for use by the transportation network company driver; and (2) *not a taxicab, limousine, or for-hire vehicle.*


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

I'm with you dctcmn. Good for you teaching these people a lesson. 

The only illegal activity here was the pax trying to risk their child's life and put the driver at risk of liability for it. That poor family trying to get home and being imprisoned at the restaurant (lol) totally knew they were doing something illegal. If anything the pax was interfering with the driver's ability to do business by attempting to do something illegal.

If you get pinged and drive to pick someone up, and the ride falls through for whatever reason, you are well within your rights to keep sitting there (rather than wasting dead miles) and keep accepting pings. To not do so incurs a cost to you as a driver. 

There's no reason why any driver should take a cost to themselves and their business just to let a pax off the hook when they are trying to do something illegal.

This pax was trying to game the system and get another driver who would let them break the rules. After the first driver refused they should have sought some alternative means of transportation. The fault is totally on them.

If a driver asked $20 cash to give the ride it would be against TOS. But taking cash for declining a ping is not. 

There's no extortion because there's no threat, no deception, no force, no coercion, no intimidation, no violation of any rights. Pax has no right whatsoever to use an Uber. The driver did not bait the pax into something illegal or compromising, vice versa the pax was baiting the driver into something illegal.

I can't believe how dumb some of the comments are here. If this did go to court the judge would throw the book at the pax. Pax is not going to take any legal action because they were 100% in the wrong.


----------



## Legalizeit0 (Jul 26, 2017)

Horrible.

Treat people the way you would like to be treated. Now theses people will never tip another driver and probably give others low ratings because they are so pissed off at you for extorting them.


----------



## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

I'm amazed you got that many repeat pings from them. In my area if you cancel a ride it is very unusual to get the ride request again. It does occasionally happen but not often.


----------



## Working4peanuts (Jan 16, 2018)

Palm Beach Driver said:


> If you read the legal definition of extortion, this is a textbook example. It's a slam dunk. You should be deactivated permanently.
> 
> Also see bribery and I'll gotten gains.


It's not a quid pro quo because he never used those exact words...


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

MadTownUberD said:


> Ok. But I can see why someone would be jaded after the 100th time. I've got more than 5000 trips and I can count on one hand the number of times I've had to deal with this. But I don't drive in an area with large swaths of urban neighborhoods, where this activity seems rampant, like OP does.


It's not about being jaded. It's about evolving and refining my responses to passenger initiated problems to maximize my profits or minimize my losses.



Legalizeit0 said:


> Horrible.
> 
> Treat people the way you would like to be treated. Now theses people will never tip another driver and probably give others low ratings because they are so pissed off at you for extorting them.


This is exactly the way I would want someone to treat me if I were asking them to break the law and endanger my child on my behalf.

I would actually want to be treated worse than I treated him. I would hope someone would beat the crap out of me if I ever tried to do something like that.


----------



## MadTownUberD (Mar 11, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> It's not about being jaded. It's about evolving and refining my responses to passenger initiated problems to maximize my profits or minimize my losses.
> 
> This is exactly the way I would want someone to treat me if I were asking them to break the law and endanger my child on my behalf.
> 
> I would actually want to be treated worse than I treated him. I would hope someone would beat the crap out of me if I ever tried to do something like that.


Start a thread describing what you do at middle schools! Alluded to earlier


----------



## DriveLV (Aug 21, 2019)

MadTownUberD said:


> Start a thread describing what you do at middle schools! Alluded to earlier


Couldn't that get him on a list or something? Or at least the police and local vigilantes looking for him?


----------



## MadTownUberD (Mar 11, 2017)

DriveLV said:


> Couldn't that get him on a list or something? Or at least the police and local vigilantes looking for him?


Rideshare related silly. I assume basically some form of shuffling minors.


----------



## DriveLV (Aug 21, 2019)

MadTownUberD said:


> Rideshare related silly. I assume basically some form of shuffling minors.


There you go again ... "shuffling minors"
:biggrin:


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> And you typing out that sentence makes me wonder how you survive a shower.
> 
> Pax was attempting to break the law.
> REPEATEDLY
> Fair game...


Then why didn't OP just call the police? Because the OP didn't give two hoots about the child, that's why. He was only concerned about his own inconvenience.

See below:


dctcmn said:


> It's not about being jaded. It's about evolving and refining my responses to passenger initiated problems to maximize my profits or minimize my losses.


----------



## XLnoGas (Dec 20, 2019)

OP will be deactivated soon enough with his/her attitude. Let him/her go and there will be one less driver to compete with. 😊


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Coachman said:


> Then why didn't OP just call the police? Because the OP didn't give two hoots about the child, that's why. He was only concerned about his own inconvenience.
> 
> See below:


It's possible to be concerned with two things at the same time. It's also possible to be less concerned with one thing and more concerned with another thing, but still have concern for both.


----------



## XLnoGas (Dec 20, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> It's possible to be concerned with two things at the same time. It's also possible to be less concerned with one thing and more concerned with another thing, but still have concern for both.


What goes around comes around buddy!! You'll get yours soon enough


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

XLnoGas said:


> OP will be deactivated soon enough with his/her attitude. Let him/her go and there will be one less driver to compete with. &#128522;


The bootlickers on here have been telling me that for years. Again, people say I'm gonna get deactivated, but no one can post the language from the TOS that I violated. We're 9 pages into the thread now. If the language existed, it would have been posted by now.


----------



## XLnoGas (Dec 20, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> The bootlickers on here have been telling me that for years. Again, people say I'm gonna get deactivated, but no one can post the language from the TOS that I violated. We're 9 pages into the thread now. If the language existed, it would have been posted by now.


Friend.. it only takes one report. Keep on doing you.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

XLnoGas said:


> What goes around comes around buddy!! You'll get yours soon enough


I don't believe in that nonsense. The universe operates on cause and effect and that's it. There's no karma, no god's punishment, no destiny-- none of that mumbo jumbo.

Those are lies people tell themselves because they can't see cause and effect.



XLnoGas said:


> Friend.. it only takes one report. Keep on doing you.


I could get reported for anything at any time. I could get reported because some dirt bag wants a free ride. Any of us could.

If you give enough rides it's probably going to happen. I'm not going to live in fear and and act like a doormat because someone might report me.

I have no problem dealing with the consequences of my actions.


----------



## DriverMark (Jan 22, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


Congrats! Here is your "Uber Dick" badge.


----------



## XLnoGas (Dec 20, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I don't believe in that nonsense. The universe operates on cause and effect and that's it. There's no karma, no god's punishment, no destiny-- none of that mumbo jumbo.
> 
> Those are lies people tell themselves because they can't see cause and effect.
> 
> ...


Good luck in life. I would never hire you. Hopefully if we ever do meet in real life I can help you see the brighter side in people. I'm sorry you have a negative outlook on life.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

XLnoGas said:


> Good luck in life. I would never hire you. Hopefully if we ever do meet in real life I can help you see the brighter side in people. I'm sorry you have a negative outlook on life.


I don't have a negative outlook at all. I have a neutral outlook. I try to see things as they are. I saw someone trying to take advantage of me, so I didn't allow them to do that.

It wasn't illegal, it wasn't a TOS violation and it wasn't immoral.

Just because you wouldn't do it the same way, it doesn't mean anything more than that.

I'm also retired, so I'm not applying to be anyone's employee.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> I saw someone trying to take advantage of me, so I didn't allow them to do that.


People who behave badly often try to portray themselves as the victim.


----------



## Syn (Jun 30, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> What's he going to report me for? Refusing to allow him to violate the TOS and Minnesota law?


He can make up plenty of reasons to report you. That he smelled alcohol in your car, that you wouldn't allow his emotional support animal, etc - take your pick. Whose side do you think Uber would take - yours or pax's?


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Coachman said:


> People who behave badly often try to portray themselves as the victim.


People who make themselves doormats to goober often try to portray ill behaved pax as victims.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

goobered said:


> People who make themselves doormats to goober often try to portray ill behaved pax as victims.


You don't have to be a doormat. If you arrive at a pickup and decide for whatever reason not to do the ride, fine. Shuffle, collect your $4, then move on. Anything beyond that is just being a dick.


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> I don't have a negative outlook at all. I have a neutral outlook. I try to see things as they are. I saw someone trying to take advantage of me, so I didn't allow them to do that.
> 
> It wasn't illegal, it wasn't a TOS violation and it wasn't immoral.
> 
> ...


You are a cheater . I hate cheaters .


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Coachman said:


> You don't have to be a doormat. If you arrive at a pickup and decide for whatever reason not to do the ride, fine. Shuffle, collect your $4, then move on. Anything beyond that is just being a dick.


There's no reason why a driver should have to move on, decline pings or go offline just because a pax keeps pinging to get away with something illegal. All of those options incur a cost to the driver's business, as does taking the time to call Rohit to report the pax. If pax want to waste driver's time with repetitive BS pings they should pay up. Uber should tack on a surcharge to the pax after repeated pings get cancelled and flag the account for review. This driver did the next driver who might have gotten that ping a favor.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

goobered said:


> There's no reason why a driver should have to move on, decline pings or go offline just because a pax keeps pinging to get away with something illegal. All of those options incur a cost to the driver's business, as does taking the time to call Rohit to report the pax. If pax want to waste driver's time with repetitive BS pings they should pay up. Uber should tack on a surcharge to the pax after repeated pings get cancelled and flag the account for review. This driver did the next driver who might have gotten that ping a favor.


Nonsense. Drive away. Ignore the rider's next ping. Move on. It's no skin off your nose.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Coachman said:


> Nonsense. Drive away. Ignore the rider's next ping. Move on. It's no skin off your nose.


Uh how many times did this pax ping? How far do you drive until you're not the nearest driver anymore?

Dead miles, time ignoring pings, time offline, time filing reports is a loss of money.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Syn said:


> He can make up plenty of reasons to report you. That he smelled alcohol in your car, that you wouldn't allow his emotional support animal, etc - take your pick. Whose side do you think Uber would take - yours or pax's?


Any passenger could do that at any time for any reason.



Coachman said:


> People who behave badly often try to portray themselves as the victim.


I'm not portraying myself as the victim because I didn't allow myself to be a victim. He did attempt to make me a victim.

I have no problem turning the hunter into the hunted.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> I'm not portraying myself as the victim because I didn't allow myself to be a victim. He did attempt to make me a victim.
> 
> I have no problem turning the hunter into the hunted.


I guess you showed him who's boss.


----------



## Syn (Jun 30, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> Any passenger could do that at any time for any reason.


True, but chances are much higher of that happening when you get pax mad.


----------



## Freddie Blimeau (Oct 10, 2016)

Coachman said:


> He was only concerned about his own inconvenience.


OK, so like what are you complaining about, man?



The queen &#128120; said:


> I hate cheaters .


So, like, Your Majesty, could you like tell us how come you like Lyft & Uber?


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

Freddie Blimeau said:


> OK, so like what are you complaining about, man?


What? Only people who agree with the OP should respond?


----------



## WEY00L (Mar 6, 2019)

Wow...the level of stupidity of Uber drivers is mind boggling.
If you drive to the pick up and cancel the ride for a justified reason you have a right to collect the cancellation fee.
When you threaten someone unless they pay you $20 then you are committing the crime of extortion.
You had ZERO legal right to collect $20.
You can make up whatever excuse you want, but it doesn't change the fact that you are scum and need to be deactivated.


----------



## DriveLV (Aug 21, 2019)

Uber could choose to not re-ping a driver once we have cancelled (or declined) a pax. Instead, Uber chooses to continue pinging the same driver over and over. If the driver declines//ignores the ping, they are penalized. Anyone ever had their acceptance rating decline multiple percentage points from one pax? Uber "support" will not assist you with this no matter how many times you explain how unfair it is.

Uber and the pax created this situation. Uber and the pax could have prevented this situation

@dctcmn merely chose to play in the sandbox. He shouldn't have to spend money driving away (which might not have even mattered), nor should he have the result of negative stats on his record, or take a "time out" from money making opportunities all because a pax is being a tool.

Pax didn't have to pay up - he could have waited (instead of @dctcmn waiting) until after @dctcmn got another ping and drove away. Pax decided this was the fastest and most unsafe way to get his child home - and chose this option.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

WEY00L said:


> Wow...the level of stupidity of Uber drivers is mind boggling.
> If you drive to the pick up and cancel the ride for a justified reason you have a right to collect the cancellation fee.
> When you threaten someone unless they pay you $20 then you are committing the crime of extortion.
> You had ZERO legal right to collect $20.
> You can make up whatever excuse you want, but it doesn't change the fact that you are scum and need to be deactivated.


Did you actually read the thread? The applicable Minnesota statute was quoted and linked and what I did doesn't qualify as extortion (or any other crime that the pearl clutchers have alleged).

I get that you don't like what I did. That's your opinion and you have the right to it. I also have the right to not care one bit about your opinion.

However, you cannot say that I committed a crime, because that's already been disproven in this thread.

And I agree that I didn't have a legal right to collect $20. I came to an agreement with another party where they paid me $20 in exchange for me turning down work. It was a simple verbal contract and there's nothing illegal about that.


----------



## Poopy54 (Sep 6, 2016)

dctcmn said:


> I'll ask you the same question as I asked the last two-- Tell me specifically how what I did was extortion. Cite the extortion statute I'm violating.
> 
> Extortion means that I'm forcing someone to pay me to NOT perform an illegal act that would harm them. I'm not doing anything that's illegal by continuing to accept their pings. I'm well within my legal right to do so. They are paying my to not perform a legal action that is well within my right to do. That's simply not extortion.
> 
> Again, you're making the claim. You provide the proof to support your claim.


What a turd.....you extorted them by staying in the same place with a plan to extort them, and **** with them. You cant justify this at all.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

DriveLV said:


> Uber could choose to not re-ping a driver once we have cancelled (or declined) a pax. Instead, Uber chooses to continue pinging the same driver over and over. If the driver declines//ignores the ping, they are penalized. Anyone ever had their acceptance rating decline multiple percentage points from one pax? Uber "support" will not assist you with this no matter how many times you explain how unfair it is.


Right...all Uber needs to do is either prevent those pings from going back to the same driver, or else give the driver the ability to block those pings. Goes back to the whole question of employee vs. contractor.


----------



## DriveLV (Aug 21, 2019)

Poopy54 said:


> What a turd.....you extorted them by staying in the same place with a plan to extort them, and @@@@ with them. You cant justify this at all.


Using that logic, you might say the pax was attempting to extort @dctcmn 
Unless @dctcmn drove the pax and his child home illegally, the pax would continue preventing @dctcmn from earning a living (by pinging him over and over)

@dctcmn had clean hands going to that location to take a ride funneled to him by Uber. Funneled to him over and over and over again.
Pax had unclean hands in wanting @dctcmn to violate the law.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

DriveLV said:


> @dctcmn had clean hands going to that location to take a ride funneled to him by Uber. Funneled to him over and over and over again.


The first time he accepted the ping he had clean hands. After that he was being a dick.


----------



## Woohaa (Jan 15, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> I got my $20 and declined his next request. I then wrote into Uber Support and explained the situation and they adjusted 2 more unpaid cancellations for me. So I ended up getting $18.75 in cancellation fees and $20 cash. $38.75 for under 20 minutes of hassle and a few empty miles seems worth it to me.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Coachman said:


> The first time he accepted the ping he had clean hands. After that he was being a dick.


Pax had it coming and was practically begging for it.


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

Freddie Blimeau said:


> OK, so like what are you complaining about, man?
> 
> So, like, Your Majesty, could you like tell us how come you like Lyft & Uber?


Yes, I was in management for more than 20 years. I quit and was a stay at home mom. Do Uber and now Lyft part time only. For trips and vacations. I love to travel . I am back at my old job now and do RS from work back home.

having extra 30.000-35.000$ for vacations is amazing . Also I pay no bills.

many other questions I might answer or are you satisfied?


----------



## Wild Colonial Boy (Dec 26, 2019)

The age old question whether something is legal or moral. Accepting cancellation fees one after the other is legal, but is it moral. Asking for money to stop doing it is illegal and also immoral. There’s always a fine line between the two, but then again, let he/she who is without sin cast the first stone...


----------



## DriveLV (Aug 21, 2019)

Wild Colonial Boy said:


> let he/she who is without sin cast the first stone...


"I got a pile of rocks right here!" - Jesus


----------



## South Shore Driver (Jan 17, 2017)

In cases like this job # 1 is to protect yourself. This blows all other considerations out of the water. It takes 1 passenger to say something false about you to get you deactivated.


----------



## 4000 rides (Feb 9, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


Hmm. I see two cancellations one minute apart... Don't they give the passengers two minutes to cancel? There's just something wrong with this whole story... You must have chosen your victim very carefully, because there could be problems with others even trying this--provided it's true as written.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

4000 rides said:


> Hmm. I see two cancellations one minute apart... Don't they give the passengers two minutes to cancel? There's just something wrong with this whole story... You must have chosen your victim very carefully, because there could be problems with others even trying this--provided it's true as written.


Delayed earnings update was why the (I believe) the cancels show one minute apart. They were further apart IRL.


----------



## W00dbutcher (Jan 14, 2019)

Just when you thought you heard of everything you got some nut bag like this shows up and tells a story like this

Morally he's wrong but in his eyes he did nothing wrong. That's what's wrong with the people today, they have no moral compass.

With that being said I hope the best to you and your life in your sad pathetic little world.

After all, you can't fix stupid.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

W00dbutcher said:


> That's what's wrong with the people today, they have no moral compass.


Oh they have a moral compass. It's just broken. There's always been a culture on UP.net that treats drivers as victims.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

What sort of moral compass points towards taking the fall for someone who risks their child's life?


----------



## 3.75 (Sep 29, 2017)

Another Uber Driver said:


> @HPClays , we have a *real Stone Cold Multiplier*, here!
> 
> We shall have to call together The Board:
> 
> ...


I approve. This is the best thing to have happened to an uber driver.

My only question is why did the pax give the driver $20?


----------



## DriveLV (Aug 21, 2019)

3.75 said:


> My only question is why did the pax give the driver $20?


Too lazy to download the Lyft pax app?


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Coachman said:


> Oh they have a moral compass. It's just broken. There's always been a culture on UP.net that treats drivers as victims.


Your morals are yours. Mine are mine. The problem starts when you try to force me into your morality. That's just people trying to exercise unwarranted power and control over others.

Now, if you want to feel like you're morally superior to me, knock yourself out. Some people just like to feel like they're superior to others. I don't understand where that need comes from-- insecurity maybe?-- maybe self esteem issues?


----------



## MichaelMax (Jan 5, 2017)

To the op, I'm not going to read all the replies to this, but you are a POS and should be deactivated immediately. And charged with extortion and fraud.


----------



## Fuzzyelvis (Dec 7, 2014)

UberBeemer said:


> Mn 609.27, coercion
> "
> *Subdivision 1.Acts constituting.*
> 
> ...


 You clearly don't know the legal definition of "robbed."

I don't have a problem with continuing to accept pings. The customer can move away to get a new driver if he wants. I don't see why we should have to move for them. Demanding $20 was stupid and will get him deactivated if the customer complains.

But there's nothing even close to robbery here.

I'm guessing you've never actually BEEN robbed.

Y


ABQuber said:


> Alright, I'm gonna post 2 separate things here. It also doesn't specifically say in the "guidelines" that you will be deactivated if a rider reports you drunk, but this is what they'll point to when this situation happens
> View attachment 420080
> View attachment 420081


You can report but meanwhile the pax is still pinging you. And good luck explaining to Rohit that you still should get Diamond status or whatever bonus etc is around that's dependent on acceptance or cancellation rate if you don't accept or cancel.


----------



## UberBeemer (Oct 23, 2015)

Fuzzyelvis said:


> I'm guessing you've never actually BEEN robbed.


I feel robbed of IQ points reading posts like yours. Does that count?


----------



## ABQuber (Jan 30, 2019)

Fuzzyelvis said:


> You clearly don't know the legal definition of "robbed."
> 
> I don't have a problem with continuing to accept pings. The customer can move away to get a new driver if he wants. I don't see why we should have to move for them. Demanding $20 was stupid and will get him deactivated if the customer complains.
> 
> ...


You missed the point in the article though. Upon arrival, seeing there was no carseat for the child, he should have cancelled the ride, logged out and reported to Uber. It would not affect the cancellation rate and would have stopped future pings. Just cancelling for the unsafe reason probably would have stopped pairing them.

My only point there was if he wanted to do the proper thing, that was it. And going about it the way He did, likely left him wide open should the pax call in to complain as it clearly states a guideline which he did not follow, since he continued to get pinged. Second article shows, failure to follow guidelines can result in deactivation.

Second, demanding cash to decline their ride, would certainly fall under harming Ubers brand and/or reputation, since he didn't follow guidelines and chose his own way out. It's no different than me showing up for a ride and telling them to just pay me a little less cash than what Uber is charging and I'll cancel the ride and take them. Same principle.

I was all for it, until he said he went in and demanded more cash to release them. And then got 2 more fees on top of it. Crossed a line for me, why I chimed in. Yeah he said "Uber awarded him 2 cancel fees so they saw nothing wrong with it", but since we weren't on the phone call, who knows how he spun it. I'm guessing he definitely left the part out about going in and demanding the extra $20 or they wouldn't be getting an Uber anytime soon.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

The problem is that Uber's 'guidelines' cause drivers to lose money while taking the time to go offline and report the pax.

Pax who pull this kind of crap are usually repeat offenders who just keep trying for passive or uninformed drivers. These folks most likely should have already had their account flagged long before this. Their persistence is the biggest sign that they are used to getting away with it. How many other drivers didn't follow proper procedure?


----------



## Fuzzyelvis (Dec 7, 2014)

ABQuber said:


> You missed the point in the article though. Upon arrival, seeing there was no carseat for the child, he should have cancelled the ride, logged out and reported to Uber. It would not affect the cancellation rate and would have stopped future pings. Just cancelling for the unsafe reason probably would have stopped pairing them.
> 
> My only point there was if he wanted to do the proper thing, that was it. And going about it the way He did, likely left him wide open should the pax call in to complain as it clearly states a guideline which he did not follow, since he continued to get pinged. Second article shows, failure to follow guidelines can result in deactivation.
> 
> ...


I have tried to get Uber to take off a cancel or adjust acceptance rate because of too many pax or no car seat etc. Often it just didn't happen or took so long it wasn't worth it. Did you get what I said about Rohit?

The only CONSISTENT way to get a cancel fee without hassle is to wait 5 minutes and no show.

As I also pointed out, meanwhile you're being pinged by the rider you're trying to report.

I don't GAF that he got the $20 off a pax who doesn't give a crappy about his own kid, but it was a stupid move.


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

one would think the Uber system would grow a brain and not give the ping to the same POS over and over again. sheesh.


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> Did you actually read the thread? The applicable Minnesota statute was quoted and linked and what I did doesn't qualify as extortion (or any other crime that the pearl clutchers have alleged).
> 
> I get that you don't like what I did. That's your opinion and you have the right to it. I also have the right to not care one bit about your opinion.
> 
> ...


Like I said you are a cheater. People like you make the Uber drivers to own bad names . Shame on you . Are you that desperate to get the cancellation money? Are you that desperate to ask the pax for 20$?

I feel sorry for you.


----------



## ABQuber (Jan 30, 2019)

Fuzzyelvis said:


> I have tried to get Uber to take off a cancel or adjust acceptance rate because of too many pax or no car seat etc. Often it just didn't happen or took so long it wasn't worth it. Did you get what I said about Rohit?
> 
> The only CONSISTENT way to get a cancel fee without hassle is to wait 5 minutes and no show.
> 
> ...


I definitely get what you're saying, yes. It's my default as well no matter what the reason just so I always get the fee as well. He already had 3 fees though. More than compensated. Then he went for the jugular. Didn't agree with it. Also didn't agree with him saying he did everything above board. You don't care, it bothered me.

EDIT: Also, as I pointed out, had you followed guidelines you'd log out to do the report and you'd be getting no pings from anyone.


----------



## Adis (Oct 17, 2017)

Next time you do this and end up getting shot, don't be shocked that you are laying in hospital w a bullet in you.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

goobered said:


> The problem is that Uber's 'guidelines' cause drivers to lose money while taking the time to go offline and report the pax.


How much money do you figure you lose when you report a pax?


----------



## DAG (Mar 1, 2016)

I'm surprised you were re-pinged so many times. Where were other drivers? UBER shuts me down, turns me off after a couple of consecutive CANCELs, then sends me a nasty-gram for CANCELing.

Also, I would never extort a rider for $20 or any amount.


----------



## HPClays (Jun 27, 2016)

Another Uber Driver said:


> @HPClays , we have a *real Stone Cold Multiplier*, here!
> 
> We shall have to call together The Board:
> 
> ...


Yes, this is the pinnacle of rideshare. I have accepted 7 pings (5 Uber, 2 Lyft) in a row from such a person, for a different probably less egregious offense, but I haven't ever gotten them to pay me for relief. FIVE STARS and a badge for STANDING ON PRINCIPLE.

Thank you for setting an example.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

goobered said:


> repeat offenders


"You da first driver dat Eva said no"

These dung people are fair game.
They know exactly what they are doing and they're the same "people" who will fabricate a story for a $5 ride credit.
Ohhh and best believe, they will be the first "people" in line to sue your ass if you accept that ride and end up in a fender bender.

Take the bus losers..


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> Your morals are yours. Mine are mine. The problem starts when you try to force me into your morality. That's just people trying to exercise unwarranted power and control over others.
> 
> Now, if you want to feel like you're morally superior to me, knock yourself out. Some people just like to feel like they're superior to others. I don't understand where that need comes from-- insecurity maybe?-- maybe self esteem issues?


Are you in Anonymous?


----------



## Poopy54 (Sep 6, 2016)

DriveLV said:


> Using that logic, you might say the pax was attempting to extort @dctcmn
> Unless @dctcmn drove the pax and his child home illegally, the pax would continue preventing @dctcmn from earning a living (by pinging him over and over)
> 
> @dctcmn had clean hands going to that location to take a ride funneled to him by Uber. Funneled to him over and over and over again.
> Pax had unclean hands in wanting @dctcmn to violate the law.


He saw the pax name over and over again....Just don't accept the ride and move on, after the second or third time, he knew what he was doing, he wasn't trying to protect a child from irresponsible parents.


----------



## LyftUberFuwabolewa (Feb 7, 2019)

I used to feel bad for people and turn my app off after a "no car seat" cancellation. Now I figure it's on them. Why should I lose money? Usually people will cancel if you get them again.

WHY DOESN'T THE APP BLOCK PEOPLE YOU JUST CANCELLED ON?


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Poopy54 said:


> He saw the pax name over and over again....Just don't accept the ride and move on, after the second or third time, he knew what he was doing, he wasn't trying to protect a child from irresponsible parents.


Yep, I 100% did know what I was doing. It's also possible to do something for more than one motivation (I don't know why that's such a tough concept for people here to grasp). I can act in such a way that I make money *and* protect a child *and* punish the dirtbag parents *and* get personal satisfaction from doing so.

Here's another example-- I can eat to enjoy the taste of something *and* give my body nutrients. You wouldn't say, "well, he's only eating to enjoy the taste of the food and not for nutrients" so his motivations were flawed. Right? If you think about it, almost all of our actions are taken to fulfill multiple goals. One motivation doesn't invalidate the other.


----------



## Diamondraider (Mar 13, 2017)

kingcorey321 said:


> My opinion yes this driver did not break any laws . This would not even end up in court. What would happen . They call the police waste there time . Wait the new driver pull up gets pulled over gets some hefty commercial equipment tickets for no car seats over a 5 dollar ride parents also get sighted for child endangerment .


The Interesting feature of his plan is that to get a refund the passenger must contact Uber separately for each cancellation fee. As we know those phone calls will eat up a large part of the afternoon. Also, if the police are called the passenger will not be able to show that a specific driver earned all of the cancellation fees. Uber doesn't consolidate those cancellations either. It is possible the transaction is illegal based on municipality laws or state regulations for excepting cash for services. And enterprising attorney who has loads of time to waste might try to fit this into a RICO statute violation. In that case they would include Uber as they are the party making this all possible.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

The queen &#128120; said:


> Like I said you are a cheater. People like you make the Uber drivers to own bad names . Shame on you . Are you that desperate to get the cancellation money? Are you that desperate to ask the pax for 20$?
> 
> I feel sorry for you.


If you want to feel sorry for me, then that's your right. I cannot control how you decide to feel. I also don't care.

You don't agree with what I did and that's also your right. It's my right to not care how you feel. There are 7.5 billion people on the planet and not everyone is going to agree with everything any of us do. Some people think race mixing is morally wrong. Some people think that being gay is morally wrong. Some people think that being religious is morally wrong and some people think that being an Atheist is morally wrong.

*Just look at this thread. About half of the people disagree with what I did and about half agree with me.* Some people think it was brilliant and some people think it was stupid. So you posting the same thing over and over and over again isn't going to change that. You are just another meaningless opinion in a sea of meaningless opinions.

Your opinion is not important just because it's yours or because you keep on posting it over and over again in this thread in response to nothing.

The only real difference between you and me is that you've convinced yourself that you're somehow special enough to tell other people how to run their lives. You think that you're important enough to determine who should get deactivated and who should not. You think that you get to decide who is giving Uber a bad name and who is not. If any of those things were actually true, then you would have the power to control me or the power to deactivate me. You don't have that power because you are in no way special or powerful or the moral arbiter for anything except for yourself. By acting as if you are, all you are doing is lying to yourself-- telling yourself that you're special or morally superior. Many people who act like you are profoundly insecure and cannot come to grips with the fact that they are nothing more than a speck of dust in this cold and uncaring universe that could wipe you out of existence and memory with one solar flare.

So you've told me what you think of me and I've told you what I think of you. Did finally I give you the attention you were desperately crying out for by posting empty insults at me?

So bask in your moral superiority over me-- soak it up, enjoy it, savor it. Walk a little taller today knowing that you a simply a higher quality individual than someone else on the internet. To me, that's pathetic and self serving, but then again you don't have to care about my opinions of you.


----------



## Diamondraider (Mar 13, 2017)

LyftUberFuwabolewa said:


> I used to feel bad for people and turn my app off after a "no car seat" cancellation. Now I figure it's on them. Why should I lose money? Usually people will cancel if you get them again.
> 
> WHY DOESN'T THE APP BLOCK PEOPLE YOU JUST CANCELLED ON?


The app should absolutely block people you just canceled. There are many reasons beyond just the obvious.



dctcmn said:


> Since none of you are actually going to post the legal definition of extortion, I will--
> 
> extortion n. obtaining money or property by threat to a victim's property or loved ones, intimidation, or false claim of a right (such as pretending to be an IRS agent). It is a felony in all states, except that a direct threat to harm the victim is usually treated as the crime of robbery. Blackmail is a form of extortion in which the threat is to expose embarrassing, damaging information to family, friends or the public.
> 
> ...


RICO case can be made



dctcmn said:


> Since none of you are actually going to post the legal definition of extortion, I will--
> 
> extortion n. obtaining money or property by threat to a victim's property or loved ones, intimidation, or false claim of a right (such as pretending to be an IRS agent). It is a felony in all states, except that a direct threat to harm the victim is usually treated as the crime of robbery. Blackmail is a form of extortion in which the threat is to expose embarrassing, damaging information to family, friends or the public.
> 
> ...


RICO case can be made


TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> You skipped around the part of you going into the restaurant to ask for money to leave &#128521;. That's the very part that is what classifies this as extortion.
> 
> Had you just set there and collected cancellation some could call it immoral but its legal.
> 
> The second you exited your vehicle to ask for money to leave is when you entered different territory.


^^^^^this



dctcmn said:


> Not at all. I never threatened any physical harm, confinement or illegal act, which is necessary for extortion. I went inside to propose a settlement to our impasse. They freely accepted. Everyone got what they wanted and everyone was a little bit mad. That's how you know it was a fair deal for all sides.


You must realize that they may counter your actions with their own version of extreme behavior. I am sure some of the arbitrary deactivation's we see in this forum on a daily basis our passengers will get smart and realize they will never get their cancellation fees back from you but they will make the next driver pay by losing their job. I am sure many false accusations are due to Passengers believing they were wronged by a previous driver.

Sure, Lyft has made a cartoon out of the word community but your actions certainly do not need anyone's community better.



dctcmn said:


> Not at all. I never threatened any physical harm, confinement or illegal act, which is necessary for extortion. I went inside to propose a settlement to our impasse. They freely accepted. Everyone got what they wanted and everyone was a little bit mad. That's how you know it was a fair deal for all sides.


You better hope the mother isn't a nurse assigned to your next colonoscopy


dctcmn said:


> Not at all. I never threatened any physical harm, confinement or illegal act, which is necessary for extortion. I went inside to propose a settlement to our impasse. They freely accepted. Everyone got what they wanted and everyone was a little bit mad. That's how you know it was a fair deal for all sides.


You must realize that they may counter your actions with their own version of extreme behavior. I am sure some of the arbitrary deactivation's we see in this forum on a daily basis our passengers will get smart and realize they will never get their cancellation fees back from you but they will make the next driver pay by losing their job. I am sure many false accusations are due to Passengers believing they were wronged by a previous driver.

Sure, Lyft has made a cartoon out of the word community but your actions certainly do not need anyone's community better.



dctcmn said:


> Not at all. I never threatened any physical harm, confinement or illegal act, which is necessary for extortion. I went inside to propose a settlement to our impasse. They freely accepted. Everyone got what they wanted and everyone was a little bit mad. That's how you know it was a fair deal for all sides.


You better hope the mother isn't a nurse assigned to your next colonoscopy


dctcmn said:


> Not at all. I never threatened any physical harm, confinement or illegal act, which is necessary for extortion. I went inside to propose a settlement to our impasse. They freely accepted. Everyone got what they wanted and everyone was a little bit mad. That's how you know it was a fair deal for all sides.


You must realize that they may counter your actions with their own version of extreme behavior. I am sure some of the arbitrary deactivation's we see in this forum on a daily basis our passengers will get smart and realize they will never get their cancellation fees back from you but they will make the next driver pay by losing their job. I am sure many false accusations are due to Passengers believing they were wronged by a previous driver.

Sure, Lyft has made a cartoon out of the word community but your actions certainly do not need anyone's community better.


dctcmn said:


> I'm not interested in not getting a ticket. I'm interested in not getting sued for my life savings because a scumbag doesn't give two shits about their own child.
> 
> I'm also unconcerned about getting sued in small claims court for $20. You're being ridiculous and you know it.


and you're not interested in the risk of deactivation because you are wealthy and only do this to keep busy in between rounds at Pebble Beach

This forum is best read under the influence



MadTownUberD said:


> I'm going to modify my reaction to the OP and state that this is hilarious. The whole situation illustrates how game-like it is to use Uber. Pax game the system all the time. The guy was willing to give up $20+ because he knew he STILL was getting a deal by ordering an Uber instead of a cab etc.
> 
> Small claims court for $20? Really??!?! I think everyone has better things to do than send this one through litigation, even if it might be illegal (I'm not persuaded yet on that point).


I am going to start following each op who begins a thread with these antics. In the future, when I read about the deactivation for false accusations, I will reference the list of people I follow here to see if there is a correlation



dctcmn said:


> I'd say that I care now more than ever.
> 
> First I'm illegal, then I'm immoral, now I'm irrational.
> 
> Please tell me how asking to be compensated for declining a ping and lowering my acceptance rate, or going offline and not being productive is now irrational?


"Please hurry officer. The man just cornered me with my baby and demanded money. I am trapped. I fear for my life. He was sitting in front of the building for the last 30 minutes and I cannot get anyone to help me. He is blocking my phone from requesting another driver and he keeps collecting money from me. I'm very scared and he had a bulge in his pocket that might be a weapon He came into the building and demanded money from me. He said I couldn't leave unless I paid him. A man that was there at the time gave him $20 and he went away but I am afraid he is going to come back and harm me please send many police officers with really big guns"



dctcmn said:


> Yep, I 100% did know what I was doing. It's also possible to do something for more than one motivation (I don't know why that's such a tough concept for people here to grasp). I can act in such a way that I make money *and* protect a child *and* punish the dirtbag parents *and* get personal satisfaction from doing so.
> 
> Here's another example-- I can eat to enjoy the taste of something *and* give my body nutrients. You wouldn't say, "well, he's only eating to enjoy the taste of the food and not for nutrients" so his motivations were flawed. Right? If you think about it, almost all of our actions are taken to fulfill multiple goals. One motivation doesn't invalidate the other.


Another example: How to turn $20 into a trip to the pokey



XLnoGas said:


> Why didn't you just go offline for someone else to get the ping? It's offline , 2 minutes.


The amazing thing about this thread is that A lot of the folks that are offended by the OP action, are the same people that extol the virtues of shuffling.

The only positive feedback I can provide to the OP is that I admire they have the balls to do it the peoples face rather than the icky shuffle that so many people here love


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Diamondraider said:


> The app should absolutely block people you just canceled. There are many reasons beyond just the obvious.
> 
> 
> RICO case can be made
> ...


Now you're adding RICO to the extortion, robbery, blackmail, bribery and false imprisonment charges and you're adding me getting sexually assaulted to getting shot, beat up and deactivated as my possible punishments. The shark is getting whiplash from watching you people jump it so many times.

I know that this could never be the best thread ever on UP, but it's getting close to being a classic.

I'm not concerned with the risk of deactivation because I haven't done anything that violates the TOS. We're 11+ pages into the thread and no one has posted a single clause from the TOS that I've violated, let alone a clause that threatens deactivation on the first offense.

I'm also not concerned with getting charged with RICO, extortion, bribery, blackmail or false imprisonment because no one has posted Minnesota or Federal Statutes that apply to what I did.

You people need to understand that *saying* something is true and *proving* that something is true are two totally different things. It's not a crime just because you so desperately want it to be a crime. So when I see proof, I'll start taking you threats and fear-mongering seriously.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Coachman said:


> How much money do you figure you lose when you report a pax?


Hard to say, it would depend on how busy it is, how long the call takes, and how far out of the way you drove for the pax. I don't do rideshare anymore and I rarely reported anyone when I did. It was too much trouble. I stopped doing rideshare partly because there were more and more instances where I needed to report pax and not enough time to deal with it.

I only do delivery now. Support calls to Uber usually take at least 10 minutes of my time. I may have to turn down several pings during that time. If I miss only one delivery that's anywhere from $5-20. I run 2-3 apps at the same time so could be losing up to 3 trips. Uber will only pay me $3-5 for whatever I had to call them for. Rohit will drag out the call much longer than needed reading his script, putting me on hold to call the restaurant or customer, then pleading with me to be satisfied with his response and take the survey. I only call if it's absolutely necessary to report an issue. Either way I lose money. If I just cancel a trip and move on, I lose the time and miles I already invested in it. If I call, I lose even more time. During a busy time of day it's potentially a heavy hit to my earnings.


----------



## Diamondraider (Mar 13, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> Now you're adding RICO to the extortion, robbery, blackmail, bribery and false imprisonment charges and you're adding me getting sexually assaulted to getting shot, beat up and deactivated as my possible punishments. The shark is getting whiplash from watching you people jump it so many times.
> 
> I know that this could never be the best thread ever on UP, but it's getting close to being a classic.
> 
> ...


You need to understand that *saying* something is truth in the Uber world; *proving* something is not necessary


----------



## Jon Stoppable (Dec 11, 2019)

It works just as well to send a message to support and thus avoids having to talk to humans :ninja:


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

LyftUberFuwabolewa said:


> WHY DOESN'T THE APP BLOCK PEOPLE YOU JUST CANCELLED ON?


............precisely; if I did not want it the first time, why would I want it the second, third or fourth? Lyft is even funnier. Sunday it offered me a job with a small ride bonus. The job was too difficult to cover to make it worth my bother even with the ride bonus. I declined it. Two minutes later, it offers me the same job, but at *base rates*. If I am not going to accept a job with a bonus, why would I accept it with none?



dctcmn said:


> Here's another example-- I can eat to enjoy the taste of something *and* give my body nutrients. You wouldn't say, "well, he's only eating to enjoy the taste of the food and not for nutrients" so his motivations were flawed.


_Edo ut vivam sed non vivo ut edam._
(I eat so that I can live, but I do not live so that I can eat)
--Cicero



Diamondraider said:


> The Interesting feature of his plan is that to get a refund the passenger must contact Uber separately for each cancellation fee. As we know those phone calls will eat up a large part of the afternoon.


Thank you for pointing out that. I was not aware that this was Uber policy. This makes it even more diabolical and even more worthy of inclusion in _The Annals of the Shirlington Shuffle._ It already is going to be included, as we have a majority vote of the Committee in favour thereof. This makes it even better.



dctcmn said:


> You don't agree with what I did and that's also your right.


What I fail to understand is what my Resident Stoner pointed out about her statement, the point of which I suspect that she missed. She claims to "hate" "cheaters", but likes Uber and Lyft. If those two are not among the "cheaters", I am at a loss to figure out what I should include among "cheaters".



Diamondraider said:


> The app should absolutely block people you just canceled. There are many reasons beyond just the obvious.


This is one of the drawbacks of diigital/computer/GPS/satellite based call assignment. This flaw, though, could easily be corrected with some programming language.



Diamondraider said:


> RICO case can be made


A collective of some of the more authoritarian pro-choice organisations tried to make a RICO case against some of the more extreme pro-life organisations. The lower courts threw out the case in short order.



Diamondraider said:


> our passengers will get smart and realize they will never get their cancellation fees back from you but they will make the next driver pay by losing their job. I am sure many false accusations are due to Passengers believing they were wronged by a previous driver.


This might not be an inaccurate assessment. Witness: In the Washington Market in particular, when Uber (and to a lesser degree, Lyft) steals from us, we get it back by a string of shuffles. There is, at times, collateral damage to customers who were not involved in the incident that gave rise to the shuffle. Your theoretical comparison is not without merit and is worthy of consideration and discussion. If a discussion on it does proceed, I would be interested to see how it plays out, if due to no other reason than simple intellectual curiosity.



Diamondraider said:


> icky shuffle









dctcmn said:


> Now you're adding RICO


Calling that a RICO violation goes far beyond the pale. This, of course, passes over one incident's failure to qualify as on ongoing criminal enterprise.


----------



## Deadmiler69 (Jan 11, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> If you say so. It's funny how you're making these claims that it's extortion or bribery or ill gotten gains, but you're not offering any proof to support your claims.
> 
> So please cite me that specific statute(s) in my home state (Minnesota) where what I did is illegal. If you cannot do that, then you need to concede that you're wrong.
> 
> ...


Bottom line is your an asshole for preventing a family from getting home. You really aren't nearly as important as you think you are. Regardless of any law.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Diamondraider said:


> You need to understand that *saying* something is truth in the Uber world; *proving* something is not necessary


I completely understand that. So if someone wants to smoke a joint or drink a beer or shoot up in my car, I should just let them because they might file a false claim against me? If someone wants me to do an off app stop or wait for 15 minutes while they do their grocery shopping I should just let them?

Anyone can file a false report at any time for any reason. Do you really think that I'm going to get deactivated when I can show that this passenger cancelled ride after ride after ride? All I have to do is inform Uber that they tried to bring a toddler without a car seat. The multiple passenger cancellations are all the proof I need for my side of the story.

After all of that, could I still get deactivated? Sure. Like I said, I'm retired and I'll just go do something else, or maybe just go fishing if I get deactivated.

*I think this is the real rub for so many people here-- If you are dependent on Uber, then you have to live in fear of deactivation and that forces you do be a powerless doormat to passengers and to Uber. *I do not, so I have a lot more autonomy. For me, Uber is an arm's length transaction. I don't need them and they don't need me. I don't need to make emotional decisions based in fear of losing my driver account. That's why it works so well for me.

You're free to resent me for that, but my level of autonomy from Uber is something that everyone here should be striving for.


----------



## Wardell Curry (Jul 9, 2016)

This is all Uber's fault. They make acceptance rate and cancel rate matter so drivers have every incentive to accept most trips and not cancel trips unless absolutely necessary. Although one could argue the driver could have driven off or turned the app off after the first cancel fee, maybe he was in a prime zone with good potential. And the pax is also an idiot. Of he just cancelled the trip in the first place, the driver probably wouldn't have done what he did afterward. Some pax are very dumb.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Deadmiler69 said:


> Bottom line is your an @@@@@@@ for preventing a family from getting home. You really aren't nearly as important as you think you are. Regardless of any law.


The pax prevented themselves from going home by not following the law. By not planning ahead of time to bring a child seat. By not having a contingency plan in case their plan to break the law fell through. By repeatedly trying to break the law by requesting another Uber. By not making alternative arrangements to travel.

Quoting this from another thread because it is relevant here:


Stevie The magic Unicorn said:


> when asked the same yes/no question 10 times in a row. Support will say
> 
> 3 yes
> 3 no
> ...


----------



## Deadmiler69 (Jan 11, 2020)

goobered said:


> The pax prevented themselves from going home by not following the law. By not planning ahead of time to bring a child seat. By not having a contingency plan in case their plan to break the law fell through. By repeatedly trying to break the law by requesting another Uber. By not making alternative arrangements to travel.
> 
> Quoting this from another thread because it is relevant here:


I did say regardless of any law......which means I don't care if the OP is in the right or wrong LEGALLY. If they do not want to break the law, it is totally fine and I am 100% okay with the original cancellation fee.

The rest is where I have major issues.

They are not the only U/L on the planet. Therefore it is conceivable that the next driver may be more prepared for this situation and have a car seat available so parents with children can safely get home and everyone wins.

If another man came into a restaurant where I was and demanded $20 in order to move so that I have the opportunity to get another car, I would pay him the $20 and then smash his window so it was the last $20 he made that night. Nobody is that important and I would gladly spend a night in jail and replace the windshield, just to ruin this terrible persons life. Don't take your anger at Uber out on the passenger, that so pathetic.

The fact that this dbag was willing to sit there for an hour doing this just to make $38 tells me they have bigger issues in life that need addressing. This is just a family trying to get home, you are a rideshare driver, not the police. IF they truly were concerned for anything other than $4 cancellations, they would have called the police to intervene.

You jokesters spend SO much time trying to be fake ass lawyers to collect $4-5 on a cancellation. Every visit to the hub or phone call is time they could've been making real $ driving. It's sad. Enjoy your net $6 an hour that way!

All that being said, I DO think U/L should do something about this. A simple solution would be to have a Car seat option in the app that would trigger a 5%-10% fare increase for drivers willing to carry proper child restraint systems.


----------



## Diamondraider (Mar 13, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> I completely understand that. So if someone wants to smoke a joint or drink a beer or shoot up in my car, I should just let them because they might file a false claim against me? If someone wants me to do an off app stop or wait for 15 minutes while they do their grocery shopping I should just let them?
> 
> Anyone can file a false report at any time for any reason. Do you really think that I'm going to get deactivated when I can show that this passenger cancelled ride after ride after ride? All I have to do is inform Uber that they tried to bring a toddler without a car seat. The multiple passenger cancellations are all the proof I need for my side of the story.
> 
> ...


You said you completely understand and then you proceed to explain how you will reply to the deactivation complaint. You missed the second half of the sentence proving is not part of the Uber platform when you're gone you're gone and it won't be for the reason that he hopes you connected to the rider

On the bright side, should you ever take a job at a funeral home, you may have plenty of opportunity to steal personal belongings of the deceased. Recommend you get in that field as it is always growing


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Deadmiler69 said:


> I did say regardless of any law......which means I don't care if the OP is in the right or wrong LEGALLY. If they do not want to break the law, it is totally fine and I am 100% okay with the original cancellation fee.
> 
> The rest is where I have major issues.
> 
> ...


It was $38.75 for 20 minutes, not an hour.

Also, add smashed windows to getting sexually assaulted, shot, beat up and deactivated as acceptible punishments for my actions by the pearl clutching crowd in this thread--

--and y'all are lecturing me on morality? Really? lol


----------



## Deadmiler69 (Jan 11, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> You're free to resent me for that, but my level of autonomy from Uber is something that everyone here should be striving for.


I have an incredible amount of autonomy from Uber without having to be terrible human being. The two are not dependent on each other.

Next time, just go buy a Snickers, you're not the same when you are hungry Grandpa dbag.



dctcmn said:


> It was $38.75 for 20 minutes, not an hour.
> 
> Also, add smashed windows to getting sexually assaulted, shot, beat up and deactivated as acceptible punishments for my actions by the pearl clutching crowd in this thread--
> 
> --and y'all are lecturing me on morality? Really? lol


Those other ones are a bit aggressive. I just want you to have a bad night without being able to earn more. If I can't get home, you can't work. Seems fair.



dctcmn said:


> It was $38.75 for 20 minutes, not an hour.


Add another 4 hours of typing to try and mamsplain what a terrible human being you can be.



Another Uber Driver said:


> If I am not going to accept a job with a bonus, why would I accept it with none?


Maybe because it's a computer and doesn't have the capability to understand how important you are, so therefore it just sends pings to the nearby online signals till someone accepts the ride.

Do you have any idea how much a computer that reads minds cost????


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

Don't waste your time with this guy. The fact that he needs to go tit for tat with every single person who challenges him speaks for itself. He has a superiority complex and thinks he's the smartest guy in the room. Probably why he is a long time UberX grinder. Too bad you can't fix stupid. Oh...ask him his opinion for honoring a specific requested route by a passenger.


----------



## Crosbyandstarsky (Feb 4, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


Call the police


----------



## bobbbobbobb (Apr 12, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


I think it's stupid. If you do it enough, Uber will eventually figure out what you're doing and will deactivate you because you're creating ill feelings about their service. And they don't have to give a reason for deactivating you, so your position is extremely weak.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Deadmiler69 said:


> I did say regardless of any law......which means I don't care if the OP is in the right or wrong LEGALLY. If they do not want to break the law, it is totally fine and I am 100% okay with the original cancellation fee.
> 
> The rest is where I have major issues.


The rest is partly the fault of Uber continuing to ping the same driver, and mostly the fault of the pax continuing to request an Uber when they know it's not the right way to transport a child without a car seat.

The paxhole is the main problem here. The actions and intentions of the pax have both legal and moral implications that make the law pertinent here. The law is a social agreement that implies morality or moral judgements. It makes no sense to simply disregard the law, or disregard the intent of the paxhole to disregard the law, in order to pass moral judgement on someone who is blocking that intent.



> They are not the only U/L on the planet. Therefore it is conceivable that the next driver may be more prepared for this situation and have a car seat available so parents with children can safely get home and everyone wins.


Yes, it is conceivable. It's not at all likely. But if so, it means that the driver has agreed to bear an extra cost they are not being compensated for. Not only the cost of the car seat, but the incredibly risky liability involved with providing one. The point being that pax who attempt to transport children without car seats are absolutely incurring extra costs to drivers no matter how you slice the situation.



> *If another man came into a restaurant where I was and demanded $20 in order to move so that I have the opportunity to get another car, I would pay him the $20 and then smash his window so it was the last $20 he made that night. Nobody is that important and I would gladly spend a night in jail and replace the windshield, just to ruin this terrible persons life. Don't take your anger at Uber out on the passenger, that so pathetic.*


Umhmmn. If that's how you would handle it then you are the one who seems to have "issues" here. Lol.

In any case smashing someone's windshield is not going to ruin their life. But it may ruin yours and a few others. Especially if the child you are trying to transport without a car seat gets taken by social services while you spend the night in jail and possibly get sent for a mental health or anger management evaluation.



> The fact that this dbag was willing to sit there for an hour doing this just to make $38 tells me they have bigger issues in life that need addressing.


Coming from someome who would smash someone's windshield over $20 and willingly go to jail for it thinking it will "ruin [that] terrible person's life." Ohhhhhkay. Please tell us all what bigger issues we have in life.



> This is just a family trying to get home, you are a rideshare driver, not the police. IF they truly were concerned for anything other than $4 cancellations, they would have called the police to intervene.


The family has other ways to get home...or if they don't have other options, or can't afford it, they shouldn't be taking a child out to a restaurant with no car seat.



> You jokesters spend SO much time trying to be fake ass lawyers to collect $4-5 on a cancellation. Every visit to the hub or phone call is time they could've been making real $ driving. It's sad. Enjoy your net $6 an hour that way!


Every ping from a paxhole trying get the driver to break the law is time they could transport someone else who is not trying to game the system.



> All that being said, I DO think U/L should do something about this. A simple solution would be to have a Car seat option in the app that would trigger a 5%-10% fare increase for drivers willing to carry proper child restraint systems.


It would open drivers up to so much liability it wouldn't be worth it. It's not realistic for drivers to carry an array of car seats for different size children, weigh and measure them to ensure the proper size and keep up to date on recalls.

Bottom line. Having children is a big responsibility. It's irresponsible and selfish to expect other people to bear the costs of caring for children (especially when it comes to things that aren't necessities, like going out to eat.) But that's a way bigger discussion which I suspect is the real issue triggering people so much here.


----------



## UberXXXjeep (Feb 25, 2020)

I usually stick around for a few cancellations. Then I call in and report the low life that eventually picks them up to Police, CYS, Uber, and Lyft.


----------



## Deadmiler69 (Jan 11, 2020)

goobered said:


> The rest is partly the fault of Uber continuing to ping the same driver, and mostly the fault of the pax continuing to request an Uber when they know it's not the right way to transport a child without a car seat.
> 
> The paxhole is the main problem here. The actions and intentions of the pax have both legal and moral implications that make the law pertinent here. The law is a social agreement that implies morality or moral judgements. It makes no sense to simply disregard the law, or disregard the intent of the paxhole to disregard the law, in order to pass moral judgement on someone who is blocking that intent.
> 
> ...


First off, I actually meant to say "night" not "life". Im not THAT triggered by this. Made it look more aggressive than intended.

Actually you make a decent point.

Not being a parent, I did not consider all the liability with proper car seat and the regulations that go along with it. It does place an undue burden and potential liability for the driver, regardless of the risk of being caught. If reported, drivers would lose access to the platforms with no recourse, which is unfair. Out of all of this, it's one thing I think we'd all agree that rideshare companies have to find a way to deal with disputed deactivations.

When I actually look at the situation, I'm just mad that a dude walked into a restaurant and demanded $20 from another man in front of his family. I find that incredibly disrespectful, and flew off the handle. I would probably have still broken his window after making sure he wasn't in it at the time, which would've made my night worse than his, so in fact you are right, i should work on that. That being said, I don't care if it's his "right" to do it, just move on and let someone else deal. Was that restaurant that important? Even if this family was "breaking the law", it's so petty for that driver to make it HIS responsibility to stop it. I kinda just want people to be nicer to each other instead of treating someone so disrespectfully as to demand compensation for something so trivial, legal or not.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

goobered said:


> The rest is partly the fault of Uber continuing to ping the same driver...


I love how you try to blame Uber. The system is designed so that a driver accepts rides that he intends to take. That's why it gives the driver the discretion to accept or decline. It assumes the driver has a brain and will use good judgment.



> ...and mostly the fault of the pax continuing to request an Uber when they know it's not the right way to transport a child without a car seat..


So his alternative is to call a taxi... in which case his child will still ride home without a car seat. Right?


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Deadmiler69 said:


> First off, I actually meant to say "night" not "life". Im not THAT triggered by this. Made it look more aggressive than intended.
> 
> Actually you make a decent point.
> 
> Not being a parent, I did not consider all the liability with proper car seat and the regulations that go along with it. It does place an undue burden and potential liability for the driver, regardless of the risk of being caught. If reported, drivers would lose access to the platforms with no recourse, which is unfair. Out of all of this, it's one thing I think we'd all agree that rideshare companies have to find a way to deal with disputed deactivations.


Yes. It's a huge liability issue. It's not that simple to just provide a car seat, no matter how good your intentions are. I personally wouldn't take that risk. And what if the pax shows up with more than one child? Can a driver reasonably provide 2 or more seats for children of varying age, weight, and height? Pax who try to pull this usually have more than one rugrat.



> When I actually look at the situation, I'm just mad that a dude walked into a restaurant and demanded $20 from another man in front of his family. I find that incredibly disrespectful, and flew off the handle. I would probably have still broken his window after making sure he wasn't in it at the time, which would've made my night worse than his, so in fact you are right, i should work on that. That being said, I don't care if it's his "right" to do it, just move on and let someone else deal. Was that restaurant that important? Even if this family was "breaking the law", it's so petty for that driver to make it HIS responsibility to stop it. I kinda just want people to be nicer to each other instead of treating someone so disrespectfully as to demand compensation for something so trivial, legal or not.


It's not a petty or trivial issue. For one thing, if it was, you wouldn't be that mad about it.

The parents know if their child is supposed to be in a seat or not. They know how old the child is, how tall they are and how much they weigh. They probably have a seat for the child at home. Even if they don't drive, someway somehow their child is going to ride in a car to go somewhere so they need a seat. They know they are putting their child at serious risk by not using it. They also know they are putting one over on the driver.

I have very little to no sympathy people who do this. They don't care that they are risking their child's life, much less that they are placing an undue burden on the driver, putting the driver at risk of a ticket or much much worse. They also don't care that they are wasting the driver's time with requests that cannot be fulfilled. They are disrespectful, they are sneaky, they impose costs and bog the whole rideshare system down with their BS.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

LADryver said:


> He would not get the request again if he cancels it for not having a car seat.


This is false.
At least in my experience.
Hell I drove past a woman who was flailing her arms and screaming. She thought I had the power to recognize her without a picture.
When she approached my vehicle it went like this:

Pax: "Why YOU drive past me, you saw me!!!!" What the **** is you problem!!!"

Me: "You can ****ing walk now! Enjoy!!!"

I reported her as a safety concern, collected BUT guess what?
Got the same ping when I went back online.
So guess what I did?
Repeated the process.
Report, collect.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Coachman said:


> I love how you try to blame Uber. The system is designed so that a driver accepts rides that he intends to take. That's why it gives the driver the discretion to accept or decline. It assumes the driver has a brain and will use good judgment.
> 
> So his alternative is to call a taxi... in which case his child will still ride home without a car seat. Right?


If that's the risk they are prepared to take, they should choose a service where it's legal to do that.

There's no reason for Uber to keep sending pings to the same driver after a cancellation.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

Deadmiler69 said:


> I would pay him the $20 and then smash his window so it was the last $20 he made that night.


Criminals support criminal behavior.
Not at all surprised...
Great advice criminal.
Since you're willing to escalate the situation to assault and destruction of property we'll just exclude you from this conversation mr. criminal.


----------



## Deadmiler69 (Jan 11, 2020)

goobered said:


> Yes. It's a huge liability issue. It's not that simple to just provide a car seat, no matter how good your intentions are. I personally wouldn't take that risk. And what if the pax shows up with more than one child? Can a driver reasonably provide 2 or more seats for children of varying age, weight, and height? Pax who try to pull this usually have more than one rugrat.
> 
> It's not a petty or trivial issue. For one thing, if it was, you wouldn't be that mad about it.
> 
> ...


We will have to agree to disagree and on the last part. To each their own. I don't get caught up in legalities so much that I spend my whole night trying to get rid of passengers.


----------



## Jon Stoppable (Dec 11, 2019)

I had a pax today with two kids, I had my booster for the older kid (he didn't have one) and made him get the seat for the little one. Made an $11 XL fare that took me within three miles of my house, so I called it a day and cashed in my earnings for food :ninja:


----------



## Deadmiler69 (Jan 11, 2020)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> Criminals support criminal behavior.
> Not at all surprised...
> Great advice criminal.


Wasn't advice. Just an overreaction that would knowingly get me in trouble. I don't handle people extorting me very well.


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

Diamondraider said:


> The Interesting feature of his plan is that to get a refund the passenger must contact Uber separately for each cancellation fee. As we know those phone calls will eat up a large part of the afternoon. Also, if the police are called the passenger will not be able to show that a specific driver earned all of the cancellation fees. Uber doesn't consolidate those cancellations either. It is possible the transaction is illegal based on municipality laws or state regulations for excepting cash for services. And enterprising attorney who has loads of time to waste might try to fit this into a RICO statute violation. In that case they would include Uber as they are the party making this all possible.


Rico is multiple participants


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

Deadmiler69 said:


> I don't handle people extorting me very well.


And I don't handle pax attempting to ruin my life and disrupt my income because they are too lazy, stupid or careless to purchase a car seat.


----------



## Deadmiler69 (Jan 11, 2020)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> And I don't handle pax attempting to ruin my life and disrupt my income because they are too lazy, stupid or careless to purchase a car seat.


Hahahahaha your life isn't ruined. You got paid $3.75-5 for the original cancellation. The rest is the driver being stubborn. Don't be such a baby.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

Deadmiler69 said:


> Hahahahaha your life isn't ruined. You got paid $3.75-5 for the original cancellation. The rest is the driver being stubborn. Don't be such a baby.


So not only are you in favor of assault but you also have trouble reading.
Please don't reproduce.


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> So not only are you in favor of assault but you also have trouble reading.
> Please don't reproduce.


I kind of look at it as a Marine style "code red" where the collective is simply giving him some corrective action that he has so rightfully earned.


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> This is false.
> At least in my experience.
> Hell I drove past a woman who was flailing her arms and screaming. She thought I had the power to recognize her without a picture.
> When she approached my vehicle it went like this:
> ...


This woman did not have a car seat? And you did not report it as not having a car seat? I did mean specifically the multiple choice selected reason of "no car seat". They will not repeat that particular kind of request. One of the problems between Uber and drivers is that drivers do not use the accurate reasons. Whatever Uber weaknesses some drivers do not give a chance. In this case of safety concern I would likewise cancel the ride, and did so, with a man who labeled his account with one letter of the alphabet. If I get pinged again I decline or ignore it. I have turned down some rides and stopped requests while I was too close. I am not a machine so I can make adjustments and I am not so desperate that I have to make every second count. I can give up two minutes.



UbeRoBo said:


> I kind of look at it as a Marine style "code red" where the collective is simply giving him some corrective action that he has so rightfully earned.


You can't handle the truth.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

LADryver said:


> This woman did not have a car seat?


No my point was that they will pair you with the same rider again even if you cancel for a valid reason.
In this case I reported the woman as a safety concern after I cancelled her for rider behavior.

And yes I have received the same ping after cancelling for no car seat.
It happens all the time.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Deadmiler69 said:


> We will have to agree to disagree and on the last part. To each their own. I don't get caught up in legalities so much that I spend my whole night trying to get rid of passengers.


Not considering legalities could cost you your livelihood as a driver and get you in serious hot water. But if you're willing to spend a night in jail over $20 you probably don't care.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

goobered said:


> But if you're willing to spend a night in jail over $20 you probably don't care.


Clearly a "valued partner"


----------



## DriveLV (Aug 21, 2019)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> Clearly a "valued partner"


Uber Pro Diamond replaced the Daily Snack reward with a Weekly Bail reward.

Uber will front your bail (up to $100) once a week if you maintain Diamond status. It's an important benefit for all drivers!


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

DriveLV said:


> Uber Pro Diamond


I declined a 14 mile pick up so the Dean from Full Sail University of Phoenix informed me that I was to leave online class and never return.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

UbeRoBo said:


> Oh...ask him his opinion for honoring a specific requested route by a passenger.


I'll gladly tell them-- As an independent contractor, it's my right to take whichever route I choose. If the passenger wants a different route than I want, then they can pay me whatever I require to take their route. If not, then we take my route. If the passenger wants, then they can 1* me and ask to never be paired with me again. That's my right as an independent contractor and that's the passenger's right as the passenger.

*I'll also gladly tell them what you said that you would do if you were the passenger-- you said that you would file a false report that the driver was impaired with Uber so they would get fired or at least suspended for a few days.*

Now what you said you would do is not within the passenger's right. It's funny how you say that you're such an advocate for Uber drivers, but you would jump at the chance to lie about us to get us fired.

---------------------------------
Since you're here, you'll be interested to know that I gave a ride to a flight attendant yesterday. We were talking and she said how much she hated being a flight attendant because she'd been sexually assaulted multiple times by the creepy gross pilots that she has to work with. Every flight she gets hit on and groped. She fears the layovers the most, because that when the pilots just won't take no for an answer. She says she'd tried to file complaints with the airline, but the pilots' union always defends the pilots and no one gets fired. So then things just get worse and worse. The poor thing seemed like she had PTSD. She said she would quit but she has a kid and her mom has health issues and if she quit they'd all be homeless. I asked her if there was even one good pilot out there that would stand up for her. She said no, *that* *every last one of the commercial airline pilots were the worst possible type of sub-human piece of garbage and the pilots' union knows it and promotes the never ending sexual assaults by defending them*. She used the term "epidemic" to describe how rampant the repugnant sexual brutality was from the pilots.

I didn't want to believe her, but then she told me to read this article... 12 Flight Attendants Open Up About Being Harassed By Pilots and Other Coworkers. Shocking stuff. What a bunch of dirt bags airline pilots are.


----------



## MichaelMax (Jan 5, 2017)

Pax should have smashed ops face, like I would have.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Diamondraider said:


> You said you completely understand and then you proceed to explain how you will reply to the deactivation complaint. You missed the second half of the sentence proving is not part of the Uber platform when you're gone you're gone and it won't be for the reason that he hopes you connected to the rider
> 
> On the bright side, should you ever take a job at a funeral home, you may have plenty of opportunity to steal personal belongings of the deceased. Recommend you get in that field as it is always growing


I've had every passenger complaint against me disregarded by Uber after they heard my side of the story. So I completely understand what you're saying, it's just that what you're saying isn't accurate. Funny, I haven't had a passenger complaint for years now.

Now, if a passenger made the claim that a driver was drunk, then Uber has no choice but to immediately suspend the driver. That's not Uber's choice, they have to do that because of their agreement with CPUC.


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

LOL....Leave it to the the village idiot to post fake news.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Deadmiler69 said:


> Add another 4 hours of typing to try and mamsplain what a terrible human being you can be.


So now your criticism is that I posted content on a discussion board and then discussed it with people? That's such a weird criticism.

Yeah, I'm a terrible person to people who are terrible to me first. I'll admit that I rooted for John Rambo, but I'm sure you're the type that wanted Sheriff Teasle to win.


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

Says the liberal You just can't make this stuff up.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

UbeRoBo said:


> Says the liberal You just can't make this stuff up.


Are you talking about me, the flight attendant who I gave a ride to or the 12 flight attendants in the article? Or all 14 of us? We're all liars?

It's funny how you, Harvey Weinstein, Jeffery Epstein and the Catholic Church all claim that so many victims of sexual assault are lying.


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

You're a total liar. No pilot is going to risk their $20 million dollar career playing Harvey Weinstein. If your claim was true it would be in the news. LOL


----------



## DustyToad (Jan 10, 2018)

Deadmiler69 said:


> First off, I actually meant to say "night" not "life". Im not THAT triggered by this. Made it look more aggressive than intended.
> 
> Actually you make a decent point.
> 
> ...


It takes a mature adult to reevaluate themselves and make a correction like you did here. I commend you for that and think everyone can respect it.

I agree with almost everything the OP did and why they did it. But if it were me I would not have gone inside the restaurant to ask for $. 
I handle these situations differently.

I disagree with you about how you say it was petty to make it the OP's responsibility to stop the pax. If we don't stop them from applying undue burden on us as drivers then who will? It's happened to me hundreds of times.

Uber and Lyft do zero to prevent their customers from breaking the child seat or unaccompanied minor TOS/Law. They make $ on completed rides. Not canceled ones. They carry zero liability if you choose to break the TOS by driving them.

When you cancel and choose "no child seat" or "unaccompanied minor" from the reasons they provide, you have informed Uber that their customer has just broken their TOS and tried to break the law. At this point they should suspend their account until a "specialized team investigates the claim". Just like they would suspend your driver account if their customer reported you for breaking the TOS and law.

How I handle these situations is this: Tell the rider that I don't take kids without car seats. 
I explain that it is illegal and I'm not willing to take that risk for the $11 dollars I'd make from doing the ride.

While I'm waiting for the timer to time out I call Uber Critical Support Line (800) 285-6172. They immediately ask if you're safe. I reply that I'm fine but a rider has a small child who may be in danger. After they verify who I am I tell them what happened. I inform them that it's happening right now it's the people who I have an open ride with (if the pax didn't cancel by this time) or the last one on my account. At this point Uber definitely knows exactly who the pax is who is breaking the TOS and could very easily suspend their account if they (benefited from doing so) wanted too.

So I'll go on to tell them since they refuse to suspend their account that I intend to take things into my own hands. I intend to record their pax (who I am reporting to you right now) have another Uber pic them up without a child seat. I intend to get the description of the vehicle and registration number and report the endangerment to the local police.

They always ask if there is anything else I would like them to include in the report. I tell them I want to make sure I am compensated for the cancel fee and my time their customers cost me.

So while asking for the $20 isn't something I'm willing to do my way is probably more damaging and more of a waste than the OP's way.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

UbeRoBo said:


> You're a total liar. No pilot is going to risk their $20 million dollar career playing Harvey Weinstein. *If your claim was true it would be in the news.* LOL


The news:

12 Flight Attendants Open Up About Being Harassed By Pilots

Pilots accused of drugging, raping female flight attendants

Ex-Middleboro Flight Attendant Sues Delta Following Rape Allegation Against Pilot

She says a pilot raped her, and now she's afraid of running into him at an airport

Flight Attendant Mandalena Lewis was enjoying a layover in Hawaii with her WestJet co-workers the night she says a pilot pinned her down and tried to force her to have sex.

A flight attendant is suing after she discovered the pilot and co-pilot were watching a livestream video of the lavatory from the cockpit

FOR FLIGHT ATTENDANTS, SEXUAL ASSAULT ISN'T JUST COMMON, IT'S ALMOST A GIVEN

A flight attendant formerly employed by Alaska Airlines has filed a civil case against the carrier, claiming that she was fired after she reported she had been drugged and raped by a first officer during an August 2017 work trip


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

DustyToad said:


> So I'll go on to tell them since they refuse to suspend their account that I intend to take things into my own hands. I intend to record their pax (who I am reporting to you right now) have another Uber pic them up without a child seat. I intend to get the description of the vehicle and registration number and report the endangerment to the local police.


What do you think the police do with your information?


----------



## Civilianpoppy (Feb 26, 2020)

That’s so over the top, especially when you went in and asked for 20 cash . It’s kind of ... I wanna say new agey pirate? Also bordering on harassment? But you might argue that they should have stopped interacting with you sooner... they don’t seem too smart or ‘responsible‘ letting themselves be taken advantage of like that. Aren’t there other drivers who might have got that? 

I don’t really see why this is wrong though, it’s an example of human behavior between two people with an AI ...? We should be aware of these things and how the platform runs. And a big question I have is, were they rich? I’d say there’s like a sliding scale here . If you do irresponsible things people can and will take advantage of that sometime. Keep hustlin 🤣🤣


----------



## DustyToad (Jan 10, 2018)

Coachman said:


> What do you think the police do with your information?


Probably not much...


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Civilianpoppy said:


> That's so over the top, especially when you went in and asked for 20 cash . It's kind of ... I wanna say new agey pirate? Also bordering on harassment? But you might argue that they should have stopped interacting with you sooner... they don't seem too smart or 'responsible' letting themselves be taken advantage of like that. Aren't there other drivers who might have got that?
> 
> I don't really see why this is wrong though, it's an example of human behavior between two people with an AI ...? We should be aware of these things and how the platform runs. And a big question I have is, were they rich? I'd say there's like a sliding scale here . If you do irresponsible things people can and will take advantage of that sometime. Keep hustlin &#129315;&#129315;


They were rich enough to eat out at a steakhouse.

I wouldn't do this to a mom at a crisis nursery, for example. If I told her it was illegal to do what she was doing and didn't listen and still kept pinging me, I'd keep taking the ping, but I wouldn't demand money to stop.

I've found that seeing trip duration nets me about $3-5/hr more on average, so if they want to ping me and cancel 20 times in 20 minutes, I'll eventually get that money back in the ability to turn down more garbage pings.

Some suburban jerk at a steakhouse or McMansion wants to try this, then I'm at least going to try to get paid.



DustyToad said:


> Probably not much...


In my state the police wouldn't do anything to the parents. It's the driver's responsibility and it's the driver's ticket. That's why it's such a garbage move in my state. The parents are in no jeopardy whatsoever and they're asking the driver to take all of the risk. There's only upside for the parents, especially since they don't care about their own child.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

UbeRoBo said:


> LOL....Leave it to the the village idiot to post fake news.





UbeRoBo said:


> Says the liberal You just can't make this stuff up.


Hey can you do us all a favor and at least have the stones to @ the person you're referring to?
You're soft babe...


----------



## UberTrent9 (Dec 11, 2018)

Palm Beach Driver said:


> This qualifies as STUPID WITH A CAPITAL S. Wrong on every level.


S/he's probably one of those "this car ain't moving for no $3.75 cent rides, blah blah blah" folks. Then they wonder why their cancellation rate is high & they're on the brink of deactivation.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

UberTrent9 said:


> cancellation rate is high


Gasp!!!!
lol

Pawn...



UberTrent9 said:


> BA in Business Admin


----------



## UberTrent9 (Dec 11, 2018)

UberBeemer said:


> This type of behavior gives us all a bad name. Taking one cancel fee should be enough, but you kept going back to the well, then committed extortion to get yet another $20. Very petty, thug-like move. If they report this fraud, kiss your account goodbye.


You can bet if s/he does get the boot, they'll be on here whining, saying how "unfair Uber was to them", & how they're thinking of suing Uber.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

Palm Beach Driver said:


> This qualifies as STUPID WITH A CAPITAL S. Wrong on every level.


Bahahahaha holy shit!
You are incredibly clever!
See I initially thought it was just a regular ol lower case stupid with an s
But then you nailed the punchline with that whole caps lock S thing.
BRILLIANT!
Seriously my side hurts hahahaha
Keep up the good work man!
YOU ARE KILLIN IT with a capital K


----------



## UberTrent9 (Dec 11, 2018)

ANThonyBoreDaneCook said:


> Gasp!!!!
> lol
> 
> Pawn...
> ...


Umm, I do have a BA in Business Admin & Public Management.

Do you? Doubt you have anything more than an 8th grade education, considering you have the intelligence of a wet napkin.


----------



## ANThonyBoreDaneCook (Oct 7, 2019)

UberTrent9 said:


> wet napkin.


How many times are you going to edit that post Mr. BA?

PS
"pet rock" wasn't funny either...
0/2


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

UberTrent9 said:


> S/he's probably one of those "this car ain't moving for no $3.75 cent rides, blah blah blah" folks. Then they wonder why their cancellation rate is high & they're on the brink of deactivation.


I'm at 2% cancellation at the moment. I already said I can see trip duration in this thread, so you know it's 4% or under.

I save my cancels for 2 or 3 stoppers with short trip duration.

Boosting acceptance rate is one of the reasons why I'll keep taking re-pings. Every time they ping me, then cancel, my AR goes up. You wanna ping me 20 times and cancel? Go for it.


----------



## UberTrent9 (Dec 11, 2018)

OldBay said:


> You are acting like what you did is in defense of the toddlers, but actually you're just doing it to make a buck.
> 
> The problem I see with this is that it's flirting with deactivation.
> 
> Its clear that you're at the point that you DGAF anymore.


You know when s/he "suddenly" will GAF? When s/he's deactivated.



TheDevilisaParttimer said:


> Did you tell them you went in the restaurant to ask for $20 to leave?
> 
> You keep skipping over that part for some reason...&#129300;


No, I'm sure he conveniently left that part out.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

UberTrent9 said:


> You know when s/he "suddenly" will GAF? When s/he's deactivated.


I haven't been deactivated yet and no one has posted any clause of the TOS that I've violated in 14 pages, so I'm beginning to suspect that no such clause exists.

Also, like I said 10 pages ago, I'm retired, so I'll just go fishing a few more times a week than I already do if I get deactivated. Maybe I'll go play bingo.

Y'all love to fearmonger on here. I wish I could bet you on me getting deactivated. It's easy to make predictions when you put nothing on the line to back those predictions up.


----------



## UberTrent9 (Dec 11, 2018)

LADryver said:


> They write off piano lessons for their parakeet. And so on.


Lmao! I did this, shhhh! (J/k)



dctcmn said:


> Did you actually read the thread? The applicable Minnesota statute was quoted and linked and what I did doesn't qualify as extortion (or any other crime that the pearl clutchers have alleged).
> 
> I get that you don't like what I did. That's your opinion and you have the right to it. I also have the right to not care one bit about your opinion.
> 
> ...


You do realize that by creating this thread & boasting about what you did, anyone here can c&p this into a support email or email it to corporate & they WILL investigate. They dont need your name, they can simply work in conjunction with ds and find out who you are, then most likely deactivate you while they investigate. After all, You posted the info/proof of the ride & what you did here, so it won't be very hard for them to figure it all out.

This thread also includes proof/evidence of you boasting about taking/demanding $20 or you'll stop taking their pings. You've also admitted to not telling Uber about the little $20 bonus thingy, hmm.

Perhaps you should take another posters advice here & re-enroll in a local elementary school in your neighborhood, as you clearly suffer in the intelligence department.

Infact, I believe I still have an email address for corporate/Uber Fraud Department now that I think about it. Hmm, what to do.

I think you won't like the outcome op.




dctcmn said:


> Are you talking about me, the flight attendant who I gave a ride to or the 12 flight attendants in the article? Or all 14 of us? We're all liars?
> 
> It's funny how you, Harvey Weinstein, Jeffery Epstein and the Catholic Church all claim that so many victims of sexual assault are lying.


Do you have 100% factual, credible, easily verifiable proof that Weinstein is/was a rapist and that he supposedly "raped" anyone? If so, you're the only one that does have said proof.

Please post it here, so that we may all see it? Not something your dog told you either, 100% credible proof, yes or no?


----------



## WindyCityAnt (Feb 24, 2019)

OP seems to not have a child to pay for on all those paybacks your about to receive. 

Uber will give him all the money back, if they found out you extorted him? Well... Bye! 👋


----------



## UberTrent9 (Dec 11, 2018)

WindyCityAnt said:


> OP seems to not have a child to pay for on all those paybacks your about to receive.
> 
> Uber will give him all the money back, if they found out you extorted him? Well... Bye! &#128075;


According to him, He's done nothing wrong & it's the pax fault for all that happened. We'll have to wait & see what happens.


----------



## calimade (Apr 13, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


I thought this was normal. Sucks that other drivers are picking up easy cancel money


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

UberTrent9 said:


> You do realize that by creating this thread & boasting about what you did, anyone here can c&p this into a support email or email it to corporate & they WILL investigate. They dont need your name, they can simply work in conjunction with ds and find out who you are, then most likely deactivate you while they investigate. After all, You posted the info/proof of the ride & what you did here, so it won't be very hard for them to figure it all out.
> 
> This thread also includes proof/evidence of you boasting about taking/demanding $20 or you'll stop taking their pings. You've also admitted to not telling Uber about the little $20 bonus thingy, hmm.
> 
> ...


1. Post the clause of the TOS that I violated. Then post where that clause says that I will be deactivated for violating that clause for the first time. Alleging that I'll be deactivated and proving that I'll be deactivated are two different things. I haven't been deactivated and no one has been able to post the language from the TOS in 15 pages of dialogue (and you won't be able to either, because the clause doesn't exist), so I'm not worried. So you just keep on saying that I'll be deactivated and I'll just keep on being not deactivated.

2. Between the time that I accept a ping and the time I complete the ride, I am Uber's contractor. They have certain limited rights to tell me how to behave between those times. Outside of those times, they have no right to tell me how to act and they have no right to know what I do. There is only one exception to that rule, which is that I cannot solicit out of app rides (cash rides, private rides, etc.) to passengers who I've given rides to through the app. Since I was not actively working for Uber (I was in between accepted pings) when the verbal contract was proposed, agreed to and executed, it's none of Uber's business. So they have no right to know that what happened during that time, at least from me. If they want me to tell them what I do when I'm between rides, then they can pay me for that information and I get to set the price. *It's amazing to me how many people here have no clue what their actual rights are as an IC and how quickly they're willing to give up their rights and demand that others give up their rights*. Doormats will be doormats, I guess.



UberTrent9 said:


> Do you have 100% factual, credible, easily verifiable proof that Weinstein is/was a rapist and that he supposedly "raped" anyone? If so, you're the only one that does have said proof.
> 
> Please post it here, so that we may all see it? Not something your dog told you either, 100% credible proof, yes or no?


Really? You really don't mind being wrong about things, do you?

Harvey Weinstein convicted of rape at New York trial


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

Not every scenario is spelled out in the TOS as to what can get you banned or not. You need to apply some common sense here which I know is very hard for you. If Uber got wind of what you did and deactivated your account, I don't think your case would have much merit if you filed an unfair dismissal law suit. JMHO but I don't think Uber would think too highly of what you did and you certainly did a great job of making yourself look like a total a$$ here. Well done


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

UbeRoBo said:


> Not every scenario is spelled out in the TOS as to what can get you banned or not. You need to apply some common sense here which I know is very hard for you. If Uber got wind of what you did and deactivated your account, I don't think your case would have much merit if you filed an unfair dismissal law suit.


The contract allows Uber to de-activate you for no reason. That "no reason" provision is enforceable. The driver de-activated for no reason has no recourse. Ask me how I know this.


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

Another Uber Driver said:


> The contract allows Uber to de-activate you for no reason. That "no reason" provision is enforceable. The driver de-activated for no reason has no recourse. Ask me how I know this.


Exactly, the OP is just way too obtuse to realize that.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

UbeRoBo said:


> Not every scenario is spelled out in the TOS as to what can get you banned or not. You need to apply some common sense here which I know is very hard for you. If Uber got wind of what you did and deactivated your account, I don't think your case would have much merit if you filed an unfair dismissal law suit. JMHO but I don't think Uber would think too highly of what you did and you certainly did a great job of making yourself look like a total a$$ here. Well done


I'm not interested in taking advice from someone who financially supports ALPA, the protector of rapists. Maybe ALPA's lawyers could moonlight for other dirtbags like Cosby, Weinsein & Epstein. Oh wait, you guys probably keep them too busy.

12 Flight Attendants Open Up About Being Harassed By Pilots 
Pilots accused of drugging, raping female flight attendants 
Ex-Middleboro Flight Attendant Sues Delta Following Rape Allegation Against Pilot 
She says a pilot raped her, and now she's afraid of running into him at an airport 
Flight Attendant Mandalena Lewis was enjoying a layover in Hawaii with her WestJet co-workers the night she says a pilot pinned her down and tried to force her to have sex. 
A flight attendant is suing after she discovered the pilot and co-pilot were watching a livestream video of the lavatory from the cockpit 
FOR FLIGHT ATTENDANTS, SEXUAL ASSAULT ISN'T JUST COMMON, IT'S ALMOST A GIVEN 
A flight attendant formerly employed by Alaska Airlines has filed a civil case against the carrier, claiming that she was fired after she reported she had been drugged and raped by a first officer during an August 2017 work trip


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> I'm not interested in taking advice from someone who financially supports ALPA, the protector of rapists. Maybe ALPA's lawyers could moonlight for other dirtbags like Cosby, Weinsein & Epstein. Oh wait, you guys probably keep them too busy.
> 
> 12 Flight Attendants Open Up About Being Harassed By Pilots
> Pilots accused of drugging, raping female flight attendants
> ...


LOL, says the guy who used to work for ALPA and is now retired driving UberX. Guess that didn't work out to well for ya did it.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Another Uber Driver said:


> The contract allows Uber to de-activate you for no reason. That "no reason" provision is enforceable. The driver de-activated for no reason has no recourse. Ask me how I know this.


Exactly, that's what it means to be an independent contractor where the contract is terminable without notice by either party, for any or no reason. If people would actually read the TOS that they signed, they'd understand that. As long as the underlying reason for termination is not illegal (gender, race, disability, etc), either party can end it at any time.

Any of us can get deactivated at any time for doing nothing. I could start a thread about how I gave a wonderful ride to an elderly woman and helped her with her groceries and someone could correctly point out that I could get deactivated for that.

Telling someone that they could get deactivated is a meaningless statement.



UbeRoBo said:


> LOL, says the guy who used to work for ALPA and is now retired driving UberX. Guess that didn't work out to well for ya did it.


I voluntarily stopped working for ALPA when I got enough vision into their inner workings to see what a bunch of degenerates they were. It's disgusting how the endless amount of hours that we put in for pilots, so that you could keep your rights after 9/11, have been abused to sexually assault the weak and powerless with impunity. The airlines were ready to destroy you and you never would've gotten those rights back.

You have to realize that you're not special. Pilots are just rapey truck drivers of the sky.

I retired at a younger age than you are now, so it worked out great for me. Uber is the perfect thing for me because I can work whenever I want and take as much time off as I want and do whatever I want whenever I want. I don't have to dress up in some ridiculous uniform that my company forces me to wear, like some Air Force officer wannabe, that's for sure. I also don't have to pay money to defend rapists, but I'm guessing you feel like that's a job perk.


----------



## MemphisDave (May 5, 2016)

I applaud your refusing to disobey the law and to put child (or multiple children) safety at risk. I've come upon the same situation myself, but simply refused the ride.
I'm unsure if I followed proper procedure, but couldn't determine if the children needed safety seats or not (via state law), so passed on the ride and went about my night.


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> I'm not interested in taking advice from someone who financially supports ALPA, the protector of rapists. Maybe ALPA's lawyers could moonlight for other dirtbags like Cosby, Weinsein & Epstein. Oh wait, you guys probably keep them too busy.
> 
> 12 Flight Attendants Open Up About Being Harassed By Pilots
> Pilots accused of drugging, raping female flight attendants
> ...


Just the fact that you asked the pax to give you 20$ makes you a thief, a crook and a liar. Like I said I hope you will be deactivated soon.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

The queen &#128120; said:


> Just the fact that you asked the pax to give you 20$ makes you a thief, a crook and a liar. Like I said I hope you will be deactivated soon.


I see you're back for your daily dose of moral superiority.

So you're telling me the exact same thing you told me in:
Post #100
Post #155
Post #187
and
Post #224

Keep posting the exact same thing over and over again and I'll keep on not caring about your opinion.


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> I see you're back for your daily dose of moral superiority.
> 
> So you're telling me the exact same thing you told me in:
> Post #100
> ...


And yet here you are responding to me telling you the same everyday . Come here puppy &#128054;


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

The queen &#128120; said:


> And yet here you are responding to me telling you the same everyday . Come here puppy &#128054;


Well, it is my thread, right? If someone posts a topic on a discussion board, they should be willing to discuss the topic. That's how discussion boards work.

So you come into a thread that I started and post something directed at me and you're criticizing me for responding to you? Such a weird criticism.

So in a few hours, when you're feeling down and a little insecure about yourself, come back and call me a cheater and tell me that I should be deactivated for the 6th time. Then you can feel better about yourself and for a little while until the endorphins dissipate, believing that you are a much, much better person than I am.

Call it my gift to you. I'm always trying to make the world a better place.


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> Well, it is my thread, right? If someone posts a topic on a discussion board, they should be willing to discuss the topic. That's how discussion boards work.
> 
> So you come into a thread that I started and post something directed at me and you're criticizing me for responding to you? Such a weird criticism.
> 
> ...


Never felt insecure in my life. Yes I am better than you. .would never have done that


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> Any of us can get deactivated at any time for doing nothing. I could start a thread about how I gave a wonderful ride to an elderly woman and helped her with her groceries and someone could correctly point out that I could get deactivated for that.
> 
> Telling someone that they could get deactivated is a meaningless statement.


What a dumb comment.


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

Coachman said:


> What a dumb comment.


Consider the source.


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Thread lock coming.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

SHalester said:


> Thread lock coming.


"_Opposing opinions are encouraged. Appropriate discourse confronts the idea, not the member._"

I'm confronting two of her ideas...
1. She's never been insecure in her life. 
2. She's a better person than me.

And I'm posting two screenshots of her own posts, which she freely posted in this public forum just 10 days ago, to confront her ideas. If it's confrontational to post someone's own content that appears to contradict their own ideas to confront their ideas, then why do we even have a search function that keeps track of historical posts?


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> "_Opposing opinions are encouraged. Appropriate discourse confronts the idea, not the member._"
> 
> I'm confronting two of her ideas...
> 1. She's never been insecure in her life.
> ...


For information, not for vindictiveness.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

LADryver said:


> For information, not for vindictiveness.


Absolutely. The information we've posted in the past should match up with the information that we post in the present. That's the only way we can determine if someone is telling the truth. Our past posts are our credibility.


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> You've never felt insecure in your life? Never?
> 
> View attachment 421369
> 
> ...


Never felt insecure . So I was drinking . Does it makes me insecure? Nope.
I still and will never do what you did to the pax. So take your higher wannabe persona and go F yourself.
I am not ashamed of my life or how I conducted / conduct myself . So try harder


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> Absolutely. The information we've posted in the past should match up with the information that we post in the present. That's the only way we can determine if someone is telling the truth. Our past posts are our credibility.


WE owe YOU _NOTHING_!
But while we are on the subject, how about this post of yours from April of 2019?

*"The cancellation fee pays better than most rides for minors, with none of the mileage or wear and tear on the car. I like things just the way they are. Schools are guaranteed profit from 1:30-3:30 pm every weekday."*

And in the same month but a different thread, this:

*"How to cancel Lyft for no child seat?*
*You have to contact the Lyft Critical Response Line It's a pain, but they'll bonus you $5 for reporting the incident. I do this while I'm waiting for the no-show timer to run down. Many times I'll get that $5 fee as well. $10 for my time, miles and headache makes the call worth it. I don't think Uber gives you anything for selecting the "No Car Seat" in the drop down menu."*


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

LADryver said:


> For information, not for vindictiveness.


You can post whatever you want about me. I am not ashamed .
At least I don't steal money from poor pax like you do . I stand tall. You will never .


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

The queen &#128120; said:


> You can post whatever you want about me. I am not ashamed .
> At least I don't steal money from poor pax like you do . I stand tall. You will never .


I'm not posting anything about you. I'm posting your own content.

Do you really think that if someone's parents cannot afford college they should have to go to "minority college"?


----------



## HPRohit (Apr 9, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> If you want to feel sorry for me, then that's your right. I cannot control how you decide to feel. I also don't care.
> 
> *Just look at this thread. About half of the people disagree with what I did and about half agree with me.* Some people think it was brilliant and some people think it was stupid. So you posting the same thing over and over and over again isn't going to change that. You are just another meaningless opinion in a sea of meaningless opinions.
> 
> ...


Where do I sign up for your newsletter?


----------



## Jon Stoppable (Dec 11, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> Do you really think that if someone's parents cannot afford college they should have to go to "minority college"?


That has to mean junior college, because tuition at most HBCUs is about the same as other comparable schools, especially the state HBCUs. In VA the HBCUs are about 10% lower, vs. community college which is like half.

Plenty of smart kids do two years at CC and then transfer, saving themselves five figures on the price of their degree.


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> You've never felt insecure in your life? Never?
> 
> View attachment 421369
> 
> ...





dctcmn said:


> I'm not posting anything about you. I'm posting your own content.
> 
> Do you really think that if someone's parents cannot afford college they should have to go to "minority college"?


what I am saying is if you don't have money for afford an expensive college send your kids to community colleges. Why put that kind of strain to your child. I would never do that to my kids.

I am not ashamed of what I am posting. At least I don't steal money or exstort money from people like you .



dctcmn said:


> I'm not posting anything about you. I'm posting your own content.
> 
> Do you really think that if someone's parents cannot afford college they should have to go to "minority college"?


I stand by my own contend. You are a cheater and a thief . I was a drunk . I Stand by that as well. Not ashamed .


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

The queen &#128120; said:


> what I am saying is if you don't have money for afford an expensive college send your kids to community colleges. Why put that kind of strain to your child. I would never do that to my kids.
> 
> I am not ashamed of what I am posting. At least I don't steal money or exstort money from people like you .


So you refer to community college as minority college? WTF is wrong with you? That's so blatantly racist.



The queen &#128120; said:


> I stand by my own contend. You are a cheater and a thief . I was a drunk . I Stand by that as well. Not ashamed .


You're not a cheater or a thief and I've never wanted to kill my spouse, thought I'd pooped myself in my bed or asked my 17 year old child to find me a rehab center and I don't refer to community colleges as minority colleges.

I've never claimed to be a better person than you, but I certainly don't think that I could ever possibly be a worse person than you.


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> So you refer to community college as minority college? WTF is wrong with you? That's so blatantly racist.


Everyone understood what I meant .you of course need to focus on that now to prove your work point.
WTF is wrong with you to blatantly shuffle the poor pax multiple times and then have the balls to ask him to demand and extorting 20$?

that is so blatantly the behavior of a crook, a liar and a thief.
You make good Uber drivers look bad .



dctcmn said:


> So you refer to community college as minority college? WTF is wrong with you? That's so blatantly racist.
> 
> 
> You're not a cheater or a thief and I've never wanted to kill my spouse, thought I'd pooped myself in my bed or asked my 17 year old child to find me a rehab center and I don't refer to community colleges as minority colleges.
> ...


You are.



The queen &#128120; said:


> Everyone understood what I meant .you of course need to focus on that now to prove your work point.
> WTF is wrong with you to blatantly shuffle the poor pax multiple times and then have the balls to ask him to demand and extorting 20$?
> 
> that is so blatantly the behavior of a crook, a liar and a thief.
> ...


At least I learned from my mistakes. You I am sure have done that in the past and I am sure you are keeping doing it.

nothing you can say will ever make me ashamed for my past when I was a alcoholic. NOTHING . I stand tall in front of you and I am proud of myself and what I have become.
You not so much .
And now I will ignore you. Have a nice day .


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

dctcmn said:


> How is it extortion in any way, shape or form?
> 
> 
> Please elaborate on how it's stupid or wrong. If anything, I'm in the morally correct position by blocking these poor excuses for parents from putting their child in harms way and by making it hurt so badly in their pocketbooks that they'll bring a car seat next time.


Can't stand these customers w/o car seats, unaccompanied minors, etc. Refuse to take them, and always collect the cancel fee.

However, to rinse, and repeat, again and again is downright unethical. Yes, keep it up and you'll be deactivated.

Quit while you're ahead.

My two cents.
&#128526;



dctcmn said:


> I'm not posting anything about you. I'm posting your own content.
> 
> Do you really think that if someone's parents cannot afford college they should have to go to "minority college"?


DAMN SKIPPY, I think parents, who can't afford a four year, expensive university should send their kids to a community college!

What is wrong with that?


----------



## Sproutski (Aug 23, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

That is because the behavior of the driver took precedence. Other threads on the topic address it. But none of the others profess or confess a business model built around exploitation of these misguided parents.


----------



## Atavar (Aug 11, 2018)

Check your local laws also. In Minnesota a child seat is not required in a car for hire such as taxi, limo, bus or RS


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

Kevin Kargel said:


> Check your local laws also. In Minnesota a child seat is not required in a car for hire such as taxi, limo, bus or RS


But I would still require one.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

Kevin Kargel said:


> Check your local laws also. In Minnesota a child seat is not required in a car for hire such as taxi, limo, bus or RS


I looked for our Texas law on this and it's not really clear. The law exempts "vehicles for hire" but doesn't specifically address rideshare use.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Kevin Kargel said:


> Check your local laws also. In Minnesota a child seat is not required in a car for hire such as taxi, limo, bus or RS


We've already pointed out in this thread that, under Minnesota law--
1. Only airport limousines, taxi, buses and for-hire vehicles are exempted from car seat laws.. 
2. Ride Share vehicles cannot be a taxi cab, limousine or for-hire vehicle. We are not classified as for hire vehicles in Minnesota. We are our own designation called a "Transportation Network vehicle". We have different rules than taxis or limos.

We absolutely need a car seat to transport infants or toddlers in Minnesota. Also, it's the driver's ticket, just fyi.


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

Coachman said:


> I looked for our Texas law on this and it's not really clear. The law exempts "vehicles for hire" but doesn't specifically address rideshare use.


When that occurs and an issue arises, the fact that it is undefined is greater advantage than disadvantage. You could hardly be held responsible for it if it was about auntie passenger, so I would take that. We are and are not those things. We are also, and most significantly not the law makers.


----------



## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

MadTownUberD said:


> In reality there are not rampant wild west style shootouts.


Yes, those are very rare. Even here in Texas.

That said, "Do you feel lucky?"


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

Christinebitg said:


> Yes, those are very rare. Even here in Texas.
> 
> That said, "Do you feel lucky?"


Make my day.


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

dctcmn said:


> We've already pointed out in this thread that, under Minnesota law--
> 1. Only airport limousines, taxi, buses and for-hire vehicles are exempted from car seat laws..
> 2. Ride Share vehicles cannot be a taxi cab, limousine or for-hire vehicle. We are not classified as for hire vehicles in Minnesota. We are our own designation called a "Transportation Network vehicle". We have different rules than taxis or limos.
> 
> We absolutely need a car seat to transport infants or toddlers in Minnesota. Also, it's the driver's ticket, just fyi.


Strongly agree. And will gladly sit in the car, windows rolled, wait out timer, smile and collect cancel fee. Next?


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

MiamiKid said:


> Strongly agree. And will gladly sit in the car, windows rolled, wait out timer, smile and collect cancel fee. Next?


Or in a fools case, rinse and repeat a few times and then go into the establishment and extort $20 out of the passenger.


----------



## MiamiKid (May 24, 2016)

UbeRoBo said:


> Or in a fools case, rinse and repeat a few times and then go into the establishment and extort $20 out of the passenger.


Nope, do it once and move on. Rinse, and repeat, is beneath my class.
&#128526;


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

MiamiKid said:


> Nope, do it once and move on. Rinse, and repeat, is beneath my class.
> &#128526;


I think rinse, repeat and extort is beneath all of our class...well except for the OP. He is so proud of what he did he is here bragging about it and defending it. You just can't make this stuff up.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Funny how people keep rinsing and repeating their comments here to say they wouldn't rinse and repeat.


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

goobered said:


> Funny how people keep rinsing and repeating their comments here to say they wouldn't rinse and repeat.


They would happily rinse and repeat their opinions. It is the topic of rinsing and repeating an action they have an opinion about that they are rinsing and repeating.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

LADryver said:


> They would happily rinse and repeat their opinions. It is the topic of rinsing and repeating an action they have an opinion about that they are rinsing and repeating.


If it makes you happy, have at it, but it doesn't change anything.


----------



## exotik (Dec 29, 2019)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


I agree with a portion as their baby is their legacy, important, precious cargo, at a restaurant, parents could have afforded a carseat

I would not have went inside that is wrong to ask for money... but I have learned a new idea from you. If I receive the next ping, accept and let time run out...so if 2 back to back pings are from them, why should we waste time and drive away? Get the 2 cancels, obviously ping is coming to same driver, so then log off for a moment 2-5 mins...then log back on..it what I have done...


----------



## Gone_in_60_seconds (Jan 21, 2018)

W00dbutcher said:


> Can you say extortion... Deactivation?


Yes, Uber is never on the driver's side. So, deactivation maybe imminent.


----------



## Ubersinger (Dec 15, 2017)

Loser


----------



## sellkatsell44 (Oct 25, 2015)

Parents who order Uber’s or Lyfts with kids who need to be in a car seat but do not bring their own are IDIOTS and SELFISH.

unless there’s an “uber with car seat” option I’m unaware of.

car seats take up space in a car.

The number of pple who take luggage with them to the airport and need trunk space or have more than 2 friends with them when they order uber/lyft far outnumber the parents who have kids under x height/ y weight and needs a car seat but don’t have their own damn car to drive around.

Therefore by not realizing this, they’re idiots. And by expecting that the driver has it anyways, is selfish because then the driver is stuck with the car seat and if the next ride is someone with 3-4 pple and/or a rider with luggage... then the driver cannot service:


----------



## The queen 👸 (Jan 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> We've already pointed out in this thread that, under Minnesota law--
> 1. Only airport limousines, taxi, buses and for-hire vehicles are exempted from car seat laws..
> 2. Ride Share vehicles cannot be a taxi cab, limousine or for-hire vehicle. We are not classified as for hire vehicles in Minnesota. We are our own designation called a "Transportation Network vehicle". We have different rules than taxis or limos.
> 
> We absolutely need a car seat to transport infants or toddlers in Minnesota. Also, it's the driver's ticket, just fyi.


I don't dispute that. Kids must be in car seat . What I have a issue is you constantly shuffling the pax and then demanding the pax to give you 20$. And that makes you a thief and a crook. You are the worse Uber driver and you need to be deactivated. You could have driven away and yet you constantly took the 3.95& and then you went to for the kill by stealing a the pax of 20$. Shame on you


----------



## Dave Bust (Jun 28, 2017)

I always shake down my drunk passengers,,,

with the passed out ones,,I just take the cash right out of the wallet or pocketbook


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

For everyone who insists on incorrectly using the term "extortion" in this thread-- there is a major difference between "extortion" and "leverage". I did not extort the passenger into agreeing to pay me $20, I leveraged him (them, really, I don't know why the mom is getting off so easily in this thread, she's just as much at fault as the dad).

Why did I leverage him? Because he attempted to leverage me first. If he would not have tried to leverage me, then we would have went our separate ways. There is nothing illegal with leveraging someone in a transaction-- it's simply how business is done. Every raise that you've negotiated with an employer or client was a leverage move, every discount you've negotiated on a car is a leverage move. The problem with attempting leverage moves is that they can leave you open for a counter move, which is what happened here.



The queen &#128120; said:


> I don't dispute that. Kids must be in car seat . What I have a issue is you constantly shuffling the pax and then demanding the pax to give you 20$. And that makes you a thief and a crook. You are the worse Uber driver and you need to be deactivated. You could have driven away and yet you constantly took the 3.95& and then you went to for the kill by stealing a the pax of 20$. Shame on you


I'm not shuffling the pax. Shuffling is a very specific method, and this wasn't a shuffle. You should know this being in DC.

I get paid to drive. I don't drive for free. You need to explain to me why it is my responsibility to drive away on my own dime or why it is my responsibility to turn off the app and incur opportunity costs because some dirtbag is trying to leverage me into an illegal act.

How is it my responsibility to drive away, but not the passengers' responsibility to stop requesting and call a taxi or a relative with a car seat to give them a legal ride home?

You won't be able to answer because all you have in your bag of tricks is name calling.


----------



## W00dbutcher (Jan 14, 2019)

The only thing you did was taking advantage of a situation. Morally it was wrong but your eyes obviously your s*** don't stink. It's pretty much the census everybody thinks you're not worth the air you breathe. So just leave it at that cuz you're not going to convince anybody else other than that.


----------



## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> there is a major difference between "extortion" and "leverage".


Leverage... Is that your latest euphemism for it? You jacked him up for money.

Any time you're asking a pax for money, to NOT do something for him, you've gone off the rails.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

W00dbutcher said:


> The only thing you did was taking advantage of a situation. Morally it was wrong but your eyes obviously your s*** don't stink. It's pretty much the census everybody thinks you're not worth the air you breathe. So just leave it at that cuz you're not going to convince anybody else other than that.


Quit misrepresenting the truth. So far, about 40 people in this thread who have agreed with me vs about 35 that have disagreed.

And many of the 35 who have disagreed want me shot, punched in the face, beat up and sexually assaulted over $20. Yeah, you're a real moral bunch.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> I get paid to drive. I don't drive for free. You need to explain to me why it is my responsibility to drive away on my own dime or why it is my responsibility to turn off the app and incur opportunity costs because some dirtbag is trying to leverage me into an illegal act.
> 
> How is it my responsibility to drive away, but not the passengers' responsibility to stop requesting and call a taxi or a relative with a car seat to give them a legal ride home?
> 
> You won't be able to answer because all you have in your bag of tricks is name calling.


Exactly. Why shouldn't these parents have a responsibility to STOP IMPOSING COSTS ON THE DRIVER.

I'm guessing people have either not fully accounted for these costs in their own driving, or just stay in denial of it thinking they can afford to give away freebies to people who want to take advantage, seem disadvantaged, whatever.

Pretty much no one who does rideshare can afford to be giving away freebies to pax.



sellkatsell44 said:


> Parents who order Uber's or Lyfts with kids who need to be in a car seat but do not bring their own are IDIOTS and SELFISH.
> 
> unless there's an "uber with car seat" option I'm unaware of.
> 
> ...


Yes. There's no way it would be reasonable to expect this of a driver. Car seats take up too much space, and besides it has to be the right size for the child.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Christinebitg said:


> Leverage... Is that your latest euphemism for it? You jacked him up for money.
> 
> Any time you're asking a pax for money, to NOT do something for him, you've gone off the rails.


Non-compete clauses compensate people to not do something. Non-disclosure agreements compensate people to not do something. Right of first refusal agreements compensate people to not do something. Have those gone off the rails? Are those shake downs?

Again, this is a standard business practice. I had every legal right to stay online and accept his pings. He had every legal right to stop requesting or keep requesting. He wanted to control my actions (stop taking his pings). I have every right to demand and be compensated for that.

Lets do a thought experiment:

What if the dude came out to me and asked me to go offline or to stop taking his pings and I said I would stop for $20. He pays me and I stop. Would y'all still want to shoot me, punch me or sexually assault me in that scenario? 
What if the dude came out and offered to give me $20 to stop taking his pings and I accepted? Should I still be punched, shot or sexually assaulted then?
If the answer to either one of those is no, then all you really have a problem with is that I was the one who proposed a settlement for the impasse.


----------



## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> What if the dude came out and offered to give me $20 to stop taking his pings and I accepted?


Lets follow that thought experiment a little farther, shall we?

Since he DIDN'T actually come looking for you, where does that leave you?

Now again, lets say he did come looking for you. I could see maybe taking his money. But NOOO, you felt the need to get out of your car and go looking for HIM.

It's not as if he caught you off guard with an offer. No, you thought about it and decided it made sense to seek him out for it. It was a slimeball move.

He probably posted somewhere else. Saying, "I can't believe what happened to me last night."


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> I'm not shuffling the pax. Shuffling is a very specific method, and this wasn't a shuffle. You should know this being in DC.


.......a pure and simple shuffle, no, but a variation thereon? Yes.



dctcmn said:


> I get paid to drive. I don't drive for free.


I was never the biggest fan of this guy, but I do have a reputation for giving credit where it is due, despite my opinions of the one due the credit. @Desertdriver could not repeat this enough: *A*lways *B*e *C*ompensated. This applies to _any _business venture, but it goes double for TNC work, given the paltry sums that the TNCs pay us. In order to make a profit in this business, you must make the most efficient use of your time possible. Anything that reduces this efficiency costs you money. You must keep your costs to a minimum.

This is business. The objective is to make a profit. "People" and "Public Service" are strictly secondary concerns. Jack London went as far as to state thatb"competitive capitalism and altruism are mutually destructive entities; they _can not_ co-exist."



W00dbutcher said:


> It's pretty much the census everybody thinks you're not worth the air you breathe.


Many of us actually understand why he did what he did. I might not have done it, but I do understand from where he is coming. Similarly; I do not chuck lost and found articles. I turn them in to the authorities. Despite that, I do understand why some people do chuck them.

You are a fellow hacker, so you and I understand more than most here. Despite that, I m ust disagree with you on this one.



dctcmn said:


> about 40 people in this thread who have agreed with me vs about 35 that have disagreed.


I will take your word for it on your numbers, as I am not going to bother to take a count. It does seem close. Those who would damn you do seem to be louder than those who either cheer you or at least understand what you were doing.



goobered said:


> Pretty much no one who does rideshare can afford to be giving away freebies to pax.


^^^^^^^^this, this, _this, _*this*, THIS, *THIS* and *THIS*^^^^^^^^

@Desertdriver put it best: *A*lways *B*e *C*ompensated.



Christinebitg said:


> He probably posted somewhere else. Saying, "I can't believe what happened to me last night."


I might not bet even the telephone bill on that, but I would bet the same Sacagawea that I offered to bet @DasÜberMama on something else.

Collecting might be difficult, though, as proof might not be the easiest to find.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Christinebitg said:


> Lets follow that thought experiment a little farther, shall we?
> 
> *Since he DIDN'T actually come looking for you, where does that leave you?*
> 
> ...


Since he didn't come looking for me, it left me as the one to decided to propose a settlement to our impasse. Since you could see taking his money if he was the one offering, then you're not being consistent when you have a problem with me offering. He initiated the impasse. He continued forcing the stalemate just as much as I did. So either one of us had the right to offer a way forward and either one of us had the right to accept or refuse.

I hope he did post about it somewhere and I hope I find it. I hope he finds this thread. I'd love to discuss it with him at length.



Another Uber Driver said:


> Those who would damn you do seem to be louder than those who either cheer you or at least understand what you were doing.


Those who would damn me also want shockingly violent punishments for me (rape, getting beaten, getting shot). That tells me all I need to know about their side.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> Those who would damn me also want shockingly violent punishments for me (rape, getting beaten, getting shot). That tells me all I need to know about their side.


Yep, and over $20. It's insane how anyone thinks they can claim the moral high ground by calling for such violence.

In the time that a paxhole wastes with just one BS ping, there could be another pax just down the street who would be a $20 ride. But you miss it because of the paxhole.

I figure people are looking at this as if they are only losing some pocket change by having their time wasted or going offline. You never know, you could be losing a nice trip. $20 seems like a fair amount to me.


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

A thread lock would be mercy.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

goobered said:


> Yep, and over $20. It's insane how anyone thinks they can claim the moral high ground by calling for such violence.


That's what make this thread so interesting to me, but it shouldn't be surprising. The people who tend to force their personal morals on others typically have a deep seeded need to control others. If they cannot do it through words, they'll resort to violence next.

Human history is Exhibit A for this point.


----------



## Steven Ambrose (Sep 25, 2016)

Another Uber Driver said:


> Anyone who is willing to pay the check can imprison me in a steak house!


I will join you..... I'll bring the wine.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> Non-compete clauses compensate people to not do something. Non-disclosure agreements compensate people to not do something. Right of first refusal agreements compensate people to not do something. Have those gone off the rails? Are those shake downs?


Ask Michael Avenatti.


----------



## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> it left me as the one to decided to propose a settlement to our impasse.


"Settlement?!? Are F kidding me??


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> Those who would damn me also want shockingly violent punishments for me (rape, getting beaten, getting shot). That tells me all I need to know about their side.


They are the bearers of the Double Standard.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> Those who would damn me also want shockingly violent punishments for me (rape, getting beaten, getting shot). That tells me all I need to know about their side.


Once again, you're the victim.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Coachman said:


> Once again, you're the victim.


Not at all. I'm not a victim because I do not allow myself to be one.

I'm only noting that the moralist crowd is also the violent crowd. Moral policing is not and has never been about morality, it's always been about controlling others. This thread is evidence of that.



Christinebitg said:


> "Settlement?!? Are F kidding me??


We were at an impasse and my proposal did settle the impasse, didn't it?


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> Moral policing is not and has never been about morality, it's always been about controlling others. This thread is evidence of that.


Morality isn't about who's the better person. And it's not about control. It's about making the decision to do the right thing rather than the wrong thing. People who poo poo morality usually do so in order to justify bad behavior.


----------



## Reynob Moore (Feb 17, 2017)

You think you are balls deep inside that couple. 

The only problem is ultimately you have penetrated yourself unprecedented.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Coachman said:


> Morality isn't about who's the best person. And it's not about control. It's about making the decision to do the right thing rather than the wrong thing.


"_The right thing rather than the wrong thing_" is a completely subjective judgment. You have the right to to determine that for yourself and I respect that. You would not do what I did, and I would never demand that you did. Likewise, I have the right to determine that for myself, but you refuse to respect that. That's where your morality becomes about trying to influence and control my actions. The violent fantasies of the moral brute squad toward me certainly arises that desire of control, don'tcha think? I mean one dude on your side fantasizes about a nurse giving me a proctology exam. I'm not sure I trust your side's moral compass at this point.

Objectively, we have what's legal and contractual. I haven't broken any laws and I haven't violated Uber's TOS. That's not even in dispute after 19 pages of dialogue, where not 1 person has been able to post a link to a law or a contractual clause that I've violated. Every post and every page that passes without either of those things strengthens my position.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> Objectively, we have what's legal and contractual. I haven't broken any laws and I haven't violated Uber's TOS.


There are a lot of things that are both legal and contractually permissible that aren't the right thing to do.

There are drivers here who shuffle pax from Walmart. They aren't penalized.


----------



## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> haven't violated Uber's TOS.


Not even remotely true.

You can't accept cash from a rider to do a trip instead of using Uber's app. Do you think that if the guy complained to Uber you wouldn't get deactivated?


----------



## FLKeys (Dec 27, 2018)

sellkatsell44 said:


> unless there's an "uber with car seat" option I'm unaware of.


Some markets have a car seat option:


----------



## BBslider001 (Apr 24, 2019)

This dude is funny...and a bottom feeder. There was no "impasse". Know your vocab OP....oh wait, that's prolly a little difficult for you.

You could have risen above and driven away to find another trip and make yourself available. An "impasse" is a stalemate or "hitting a wall"....not a disagreement where you profit off of the back of someone else. Whether he was wrong or not does not matter. You lack ethics and morality, PERIOD! Legal? That is questionable. Sorry ass behavior? That is a fact.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Christinebitg said:


> Not even remotely true.
> 
> You can't accept cash from a rider to do a trip instead of using Uber's app. Do you think that if the guy complained to Uber you wouldn't get deactivated?


I didn't accept cash to do a trip. I accepted cash to decline a ping. When you find language in the TOS about that, feel free to post it.

I don't know if the guy complained or not. Maybe he didn't because he knew there was nothing to complain about, or maybe he did and Uber told him to go pound sand.

All we know is that I didn't get deactivated or suspended, which is evidence for my side of the argument.


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

sellkatsell44 said:


> unless there's an "uber with car seat" option I'm unaware of.


That option is available in the Capital of Your Nation. I do not know if it is available in San Francisco. I would think that it would be. Another way around it in the Capital of Your Nation is either to order Uber Taxi or Uber Black. In the District of Columbia, taxicabs are exempt from the car seat requirement. Limousines with a D.C. L-Plate are also exempt. If you went with the Uber Black option, you would have to get a car with a D.C. L-Plate to get around it.

I do not know the law in California on exemptions to the car seat rule. If limousines are exempt, Uber Black is still available in SF. Uber Taxi is no longer available, there.



dctcmn said:


> You would not do what I did, and I would never demand that you did.


It would have taken far more to get me to do what you did with this, but, I do not disagree with your doing it.



Coachman said:


> There are a lot of things that are both legal and contractually permissible that aren't the right thing to do.


" Just because you 'can' do something does not necessarily mean that you 'should' ". Do keep in mind, this is coming from someone who does not disagree with Original Poster.

]


Coachman said:


> Do you think that if the guy complained to Uber you wouldn't get deactivated?


At best, he would have the money taken out of what Uber owed him.  Uber would have then given him a nastygram with a virtual finger wagging that warned him not to do it, again. At worst, it could have been De-Activation Station. Keep in mind, I do not disagree with how he handled it. Still, this possibility might have kept me from doing it.



dctcmn said:


> Maybe he didn't because he knew there was nothing to complain about, or maybe he did and Uber told him to go pound sand.


One of the difficulties in assessing the consequences of this occurrence, be they potential or actual, is Uber's (and Lyft's, for that matter) inconsistencies in dealing with anything. I have read complaints from drivers about being de-activated because they told the customer that they would return a lost and found item the next evening and would not leave their home to drive fifty miles to return it yesterday. Conversely, I have heard and read complaints from passengers that Uber refused to do anything when a driver balked at ever returning and item that he acknowledged that he had. Add to that my reading complaints from customers that Uber refused to do anything when a driver charged them cash fee for returning an item. These Boards are full of complaints from drivers about being de-activated for charging a cash fee to return a lost article.



dctcmn said:


> All we know is that I didn't get deactivated or suspended


....................Y-E-T; although if you have not heard anything after thirty days pass, odds are that you will not. Generally, though, these people are quick to complain, so the odds are slightly in your favour that you got away with this.

From your discourse, I am gathering that you did assess the situation before you acted. You would do well to keep up that practice in the future, especially if a similar situation confronts you.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Another Uber Driver said:


> One of the difficulties in assessing the consequences of this occurrence, be they potential or actual, is Uber's (and Lyft's, for that matter) inconsistencies in dealing with anything. I have read complaints from drivers about being de-activated because they told the customer that they would return a lost and found item the next evening and would not leave their home to drive fifty miles to return it yesterday. Conversely, I have heard and read complaints from passengers that Uber refused to do anything when a driver balked at ever returning and item that he acknowledged that he had. Add to that my reading complaints from customers that Uber refused to do anything when a driver charged them cash fee for returning an item. These Boards are full of complaints from drivers about being de-activated for charging a cash fee to return a lost article.


That's why it is impossible to know what Uber's policy would be on this...there isn't one. There's no consistency in enforcing a policy even when they do have one.

It's likely that support wouldn't even understand the nature of the complaint since this isn't a common one. Usually seems like they just look for the script that most closely matches one or two keywords.


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Another Uber Driver said:


> . I do not know if it is available in San Francisco.


It isn't, but should. I have 2 boosters in my car. Charge more, pay driver more. Amen.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

goobered said:


> That's why it is impossible to know what Uber's policy would be on this...there isn't one.


They'd probably classify in their suspected fraud category. That's what usually happens when a driver is seen to be manipulating the system for his own financial advantage.


----------



## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> I didn't accept cash to do a trip. I accepted cash to decline a ping.


Actually, you demanded cash to leave him alone.

I'm surprised he didn't tell you to go F yourself.

I think you'd be well advised not to try it in places like Texas, where we have a lot of firearms.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Coachman said:


> They'd probably classify in their suspected fraud category. That's what usually happens when a driver is seen to be manipulating the system for his own financial advantage.


1. No citation given.
2. No example given of this ever happening in the history of Uber.

You're very good at making a claim and very bad at supporting that claim.



Christinebitg said:


> Actually, you demanded cash to leave him alone.
> 
> I'm surprised he didn't tell you to go F yourself.
> 
> I think you'd be well advised not to try it in places like Texas, where we have a lot of firearms.


I didn't demand cash, I proposed a solution that included me being compensated for foregoing work, the ability to take work and the hit to my acceptance rate. I gave him an if/then scenario and he accepted it as a solution. He was the one who was refusing to leave me alone by continuing to request an illegal ride.

Again, with your violent fantasies. *Moralizing people = violent people*. This thread has proven that, for sure.


----------



## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> 2. No example given of this ever happening in the history of Uber.


You don't have to hang around this site very long to see the "I got deactivated because a pax lied" threads.


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

Christinebitg said:


> I'm surprised he didn't tell you to go F yourself.


..........as am I; I certainly would have at least simply declined. This one reason, out of several, why this occurrence has been entered into the _Annals of the Shirlington Shuffle_.



dctcmn said:


> 2. No example given of this ever happening in the history of Uber.


I do not recall seeing anyone's posting a similar occurrence on these Boards. It does not mean that similar has not occurred, it is just that I have yet to see it. Further, I can not think of anything similar that happened in my years in this business.



Christinebitg said:


> You don't have to hang around this site very long to see the "I got deactivated because a pax lied" threads.


....which is why I did post previously that the passenger "has not complained Y-E-T", or words similar.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Christinebitg said:


> You don't have to hang around this site very long to see the "I got deactivated because a pax lied" threads.


Sure, but that could happen at any point in time for any reason. I could have done what you suggested-- shown up at this steakhouse, politely informed them that I could not legally give the ride, not charged them a cancel fee and driven away and they still could have lied about something to attempt to get me fired.

You really don't see how what you're threatening could happen to me if I followed your advice? So yours is really an irrelevant point isn't it?


----------



## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

dctcmn said:


> You really don't see how what you're threatening


You are seriously mistaken if you think I'm threatening you in any way.

But if you want to get deactivated, keep doing what you're doing.

There's no threat in there. Just a statement of fact, about the natural consequences of your actions.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Another Uber Driver said:


> ....which is why I did post previously that the passenger "has not complained Y-E-T", or words similar.


Well, this thread is already 8 days old (the event happened a while before that), so the most likely scenario, nothing is going to happen. If something does happen, I'm always happy to deal with the consequences of my actions and I'll post about it here.

Here's the real question-- if nothing ever does happen to me as a result of this, will anyone here admit that they were wrong? Of course not. It's not about being right or wrong for these people, it's about attempting to control other people's actions through threats of deactivation and fear of violence.



Christinebitg said:


> You are seriously mistaken if you think I'm threatening you in any way.
> 
> But if you want to get deactivated, keep doing what you're doing.
> 
> There's no threat in there. Just a statement of fact, about the natural consequences of your actions.


Oh come on, you're editing a post from a completely different response. I'm saying you're using the potential of deactivation as a threat.

You are certainly imagining violence against me-- "_I think you'd be well advised not to try it in places like Texas, where we have a lot of firearms_." Which is pretty sick, seeing as this is over $20 and kid without a car seat. If that really is how it would go down in Texas as a "_natural consequence of my actions_", then y'all got bigger problems than me to worry about.


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> Well, this thread is already 8 days old (the event happened a while before that), so the most likely scenario, nothing is going to happen.


As I did let you know in a previous post, my experience dictates that if nothing has happened thus far, the odds _ain't none too good that it's gonna'_. In my long experience, most people who are going to complain do so within seventy two hours Between seventy two hours and seven days, the odds drop by the day, but, circumstances do dictate that some people can not submit a complaint in a timely manner. Between seven and thirty days, the odds drop geometrically by the day. If the potential complainant has done nothing after thirty days, most will consider it to be the case that it could not have been that big a deal. By rulemaking, the Taxicab Commission here would not consider complaints submitted more than thirty days after the occurrence. That rule still exists.

Given the advance of technology, most people now can submit a complaint the same day and do so with very little bother on their part. I can do my back and forths with Rohit as I eat a snack and sit at my computer. It is just too easy, these days. You mention that this topic is eight days old. I will take a conservative tack and assume that the incident occurred six days before you posted the original post. As most Uber/Lyft users are quick to complain, I would guess that you are in the clear after fourteen days. I would not bet the rent on it, but, give it until Wednesday, and I will bet the telephone bill on it.

Even back before the advance of technology, if I did not get at least a telephone call from a complainant by the time that two weeks had past, it was rare that I heard anything. Occasionally, a letter of complaint would arrive that much after the fact, but not often. If the postmark on the letter was within the thirty day period, I would at least look into the complaint. I did have one letter arrive more than thirty days after an occurrence. It was a pretty serious matter. The complainant was from Japan and had mailed the letter from there. She was quite distressed about the occurrence, but, both date on the letter and postmark were within the thirty day period. Thus, I did act. What was really funny about that one was that three months after that, the Taxicab Commission sent a letter to my company with a copy of her letter and a sharply worded demand to know what the company was planning to do about this matter. I sent back a very courteous and businesslike reply that we had received that same letter on ____________ date,, had summoned the driver before the Board of Directors and had kicked him out of the company. I added that we had done our worst; we could not revoke or suspend his hack licence as we did not issue it.



dctcmn said:


> If something does happen, I'm always happy to deal with the consequences of my actions and I'll post about it here.


I always have had less of a complaint with anyone who is willing to accept the consequences of his actions. Often, I have no complaint. Usually, if I do have one, it is due to the initial inconvenience that someone's actions might have caused me. Despite that, as long as he is willing to make it good, I do have a hard time complaining in the end.



dctcmn said:


> Here's the real question-- if nothing ever does happen to me as a result of this, will anyone here admit that they were wrong? Of course not


I doubt that. Their thinking will actually be similar to mine. My thought is that you were fortunate that you did not get a complaint despite my not disagreeing with your actions. I do not disagree with your actions, but, if there were a complaint, _eye wooden be the guy what you gots to convince_.

Those people would not require convincing, either. Still, likely what they will tell you is that you got away with it this time, "but next time you will get popped and get what you deserve" or something similar.

I am not sure what would happen if someone did complain about what you did or something similar. Indeed, we both agree that both Uber and Lyft are sorely lacking in any consistency with how they treat anything. You do not necessarily have to violate any written "policy" to suffer adverse consequences. In fact, you can be de-activated at any time, for any reason or, for no reason.

The last is enforceable. Ask me how I know this.


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circular_reasoning


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Another Uber Driver said:


> Those people would not require convincing, either. Still, likely what they will tell you is that you got away with it this time, "but next time you will get popped and get what you deserve" or something similar.


Correct. So there is no way for them to be proven wrong or for me to be proven right. Even if I wrote into support and explained in detail what I did, if one agent said that it was fine, they'd just say that I was lucky and the next agent would say that I should be deactivated. Which is why it's such weak argument on their part. An agent could deactivate any one of us at any time for any or no reason.

Which is why they have to come up with ridiculous hypothetical situations that end in violence to enhance their threats--
"_If you were in Texas, you'd get shot."
"If I were the passenger, I'd punch you in the face." 
"If the passenger's wife was the nurse at your next proctology exam, you'd get sexually assaulted". _(Sill my favorite one. I think that's more a fantasy on that dude's part than anything else. It's a bit suspicious to me how he jumped to that so quickly.)

Bootlickers hate non-bootlickers more than anything else. Misery desires company, I guess.



SHalester said:


> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circular_reasoning


How so? Be specific and cite examples.

I'm going out driving, so you have all day to answer.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Christinebitg said:


> Actually, you demanded cash to leave him alone.
> 
> I'm surprised he didn't tell you to go F yourself.
> 
> I think you'd be well advised not to try it in places like Texas, where we have a lot of firearms.


Lol, people who are too lazy and entitled to carry a car seat are not going to carry a gun. Most people who do carry guns would think this couple should take more responsibility and pay up.



Another Uber Driver said:


> Given the advance of technology, most people now can submit a complaint the same day and do so with very little bother on their part. I can do my back and forths with Rohit as I eat a snack and sit at my computer.


You must have a lot more patience with Rohit than I do. I can't eat when I'm yelling in exasperation.



dctcmn said:


> Correct. So there is no way for them to be proven wrong or for me to be proven right. Even if I wrote into support and explained in detail what I did, if one agent said that it was fine, they'd just say that I was lucky and the next agent would say that I should be deactivated. Which is why it's such weak argument on their part. An agent could deactivate any one of us at any time for any or no reason.


Exactly...whether or not someone gets deactivated has no bearing whatsoever on whether they did right or wrong, followed TOS or not, followed the law or not, handled the situation appropriately or not, etc. It just random so it has no meaning. Trying to use random or unpredictable events to determine what's right or wrong borders on superstition, like someone believing that a natural disaster was sent by God to punish people. It's how people try to find security in things that are unpredictable.



> Which is why they have to come up with ridiculous hypothetical situations that end in violence to enhance their threats--
> "_If you were in Texas, you'd get shot."
> "If I were the passenger, I'd punch you in the face."
> "If the passenger's wife was the nurse at your next proctology exam, you'd get sexually assaulted". _(Sill my favorite one. I think that's more a fantasy on that dude's part than anything else. It's a bit suspicious to me how he jumped to that so quickly.)


Very revealing insights into the minds and morality of other people. Lol.


----------



## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

goobered said:


> people who are too lazy and entitled to carry a car seat are not going to carry a gun. Most people who do carry guns would think this couple should take more responsibility and pay up.


That's a true statement.

The key word there is "most."

"Do you feel lucky?"


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> Bootlickers hate non-bootlickers more than anything else. Misery desires company, I guess.


So somebody who advises you to cancel, take your cancel fee, and move on is a bootlicker?

I haven't seen a single poster in this thread tell you to suck it up and do the ride without the car seat.


----------



## Another Uber Driver (May 27, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> _"If the passenger's wife was the nurse at your next proctology exam, you'd get sexually assaulted". _(Sill my favorite one. I think that's more a fantasy on that dude's part than anything else. It's a bit suspicious to me how he jumped to that so quickly.)


 :laugh:



dctcmn said:


> I'm going out driving, so you have all day to answer.


:laugh:


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Coachman said:


> So somebody who advises you to cancel, take your cancel fee, and move on is a bootlicker?
> 
> I haven't seen a single poster in this thread tell you to suck it up and do the ride without the car seat.


Someone who says I'm *required* to either go offline, decline their next ping or drive away without just compensation is a bootlicker. Absolutely. You are saying that I need to roll over and take a loss (no matter how small that loss might be) when a passenger is trying to leverage me into an illegal act over the fear that he might report me, shoot me, punch me or his wife might be my proctology nurse. The passenger's attempt to leverage me backfired on him and put me in the position to leverage him. For you to say that I am *required* to forego using that leverage is requiring me to be his doormat and is emboldening him to make the next driver his doormat.

Again, I respect any driver's right to go offline or decline their ping as a business choice. That's the difference between y'all and me. I respect your choices even if I don't agree with them or I wouldn't do the same.


----------



## TimmyWeekend (Jan 17, 2020)

I would’ve just left the area. But that’s me.


----------



## BBslider001 (Apr 24, 2019)

TimmyWeekend said:


> I would've just left the area. But that's me.


Yup, seems anyone with some integrity would have. It isn't valued anymore these days. Everyone thinks they "get theirs" and they think they deserve to at the expense of others. It's what separates humans from parasites.


----------



## Bonmot (Dec 14, 2018)

I think we could best evaluate this encounter by splitting it into two parts. 
Part 1: Canceling the ride and then staying in place while the riders try to request another ride.
Part 2: Requesting cash to stop doing Part 1.

Part 1 is a clever strategy which I intend to implement in the future, both for car seats and for underage riders.
Part 2 is little more problematic. I don't believe it would rise to the level of being defined as "extortion". In common law, extortion is generally applied to cases of explicit or implied threats of violence. It's why mobsters can be charged with extortion for demanding "protection" money from business owners. It's what happens when the school bully steals your lunch money in exchange for not beating you up. I think the OP's request for cash to take actions to allow the rider to hail a less ethical driver willing to break laws or TOS and endanger their children is a legitimate act from a legal standpoint. If you call a plumber to your house for a burst pipe and they demand payment to shut off your water and fix the pipe, you wouldn't have a legal case of extortion against them. 
A driver hanging out in a public area waiting for rides is engaging in a legal commercial activity. Canceling an illegal ride request is also a legal activity and is actually a _proscribed _activity. Requesting a nominal payment to clear the area doesn't seem unreasonable to me. Whether it's morally acceptable or not is a personal choice. It certainly isn't less moral than a rider requesting a driver break child seat laws and/or Uber TOS and risk getting deactivated.

To get around the moral dilemma, I'd suggest a *third alternative*. Rather than voluntarily clearing the area to enable the rider to put their child and another driver at risk, and rather than staying put to prevent them from doing those things, I would offer the rider the choice of changing the destination and adding a stop so *one *of the parents could go to Target or Walmart to buy a booster, then return them to the original pick-up location, then take them home. Immediately afterwards I would 1-star them ("Rider Behavior") and call Uber and describe the incident to prevent any potential retribution complaint from the rider. Based on similar calls I've had with Uber involving underage riders, I believe Uber would consider you a hero, for whatever that's worth.

I've done similar in cases of underage riders. I tell them I can't take minors alone. I keep this section of the TOS open in a browser to circumvent the inevitable argument that "I do this all the time". Then I tell them if an adult comes along I'll take them (usually to school) and then bring the parent home. Twice this has been accepted and twice rejected. One of the accepteds even gave me a tip and hopefully have been taught that if they want to use Uber to transport their kid, they will have to come with them even if it means taking a round trip.


----------



## StephenT (Oct 25, 2016)

dctcmn said:


> lol. These people would flip out when they hear what I do when I get pinged to a high school or middle school.
> 
> You know I'm done playing nice with dirtbags. The first 200-300 times I went to pings with toddlers and no car seats was cute. It's just not cute anymore. These people need to be hurt financially to the greatest extent possible. They know exactly what they're doing. If I get back some of the money I've lost over the years, then no one should blame me one bit.
> 
> ...


I know I wimped out only reading to post #60 [thus far] but legal or not, violate TOS or not , and whether the parents were right, wrong, or whatever - your behavior was a dick move. It would have cost you so little to simply Decline the next ping [from this rider] and let another Driver decide whether to compromise the law or also get into it with the parents. One decline would not jeopardize your acceptance, and in California at least, Acceptance Rates no longer mean anything. Can't speak for other Markets, but if you did 10 Trips that day and declined one request, I think you would be ok. There might very be something in the TOS that refers to whether a Driver is responsible for teaching Riders a lesson, or not - though it wouldn't be in your favor.
Instead you continued to hassle and in a very tangible way hold this family hostage and berate them. you were in a position of power, yes even as a uber driver, and you used that position to "teach them a lesson" and prevent them from using their preferred app [uber] to leave the restaurant - just so you could extort cancellation fee after cancellation fee from them, until they tried to take control and cancelled on you.
You stayed in the immediate area and continued to accept the trip requests knowing full well you had zero intention of transporting them. Doesn't matter if you were right ro wrong. you were a dick. Oh wait, then you got out of your vehicle and confronted them face to face and asked for money, a specific amount even, to stop being a nuisance in their lives. It might have been borderline if you had informed them you are simply trying to earn a living and there repeated requests are costing you money. See where the conversation goes, maybe they offer you compensation to let them roll the dice with the next driver. But no, you continue to hold then hostage and extort money.

I've had confrontations with [unaccompanied] minors, or those traveling without a carseat and small children. Take the first cancelation and move on. Then report to Uber. It's unlikely uber really does anything, but let the next Driver deal with it and you go back to doing what you supposed to be doing - driving and giving rides; not policing and certainly giving citations for cash/money to stop harassing them.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

BBslider001 said:


> Yup, seems anyone with some integrity would have. It isn't valued anymore these days. Everyone thinks they "get theirs" and they think they deserve to at the expense of others. It's what separates humans from parasites.


Exactly. Shuffling is a great example. There are a handful of reasons where a shuffle is valid. The rest of the time it's just stealing. Shuffling somebody because they're at a grocery store is outright theft.


----------



## Bonmot (Dec 14, 2018)

StephenT said:


> Doesn't matter if you were right ro wrong. you were a dick.


As far as I'm concerned, the OP is not a "dick". I consider them a hero.

There are others involved in this scenario who could better be tagged with the sobriquet "dick".

First and foremost are parents who try to put their kids at risk of injury or death, and put drivers at risk of deactivation, because they are either too cheap or too lazy to provide the proper, legally mandated safety equipment for riding in a car. There is absolutely no justification for this. It is beyond credulity that anyone with a child can be ignorant of the necessity of a car seat and any claim that they "didn't know" they needed one is either an outright lie or, at best, willful ignorance. Full car seats can be had for less than $50 retail and child boosters for less than $20. For people you can't afford even this amount, there are usually community resources available for acquiring free seats. It just takes a minimal effort to locate them.

The second dicks are Uber management for not doing more to curtail abuse of this policy. If they were serious about protecting children by enforcing these rules they could easily initiate procedures for denying access to riders who try to ignore them. This goes for underage riders as well as car seats. Uber could also be much more aggressive at deactivating drivers that choose to ignore these rules. If it became known that the odds of being fired were greatly increased in the event a driver was discovered ignoring child safety laws, drivers would be more likely to stop accepting these rides and parents would be more likely to stop expecting drivers to ignore them.

And thirdly, the drivers who do choose to ignore these basic safety standards are absolutely dicks. They are devoid of morals or ethics, willing to put their job at risk and children at risk for the sake of a few dollars. If any of the respondents on this post accusing the OP of being a dick are among the drivers who carry kids unsafely then you can go f*** yourselves because you have no right to judge as you are unconscionable scum. As long as our fellow drivers continue to be greedy, opportunistic dicks by enabling unfit parents to put their kids at risk for lack of a minimal effort to protect them, then the OP, other conscientious drivers and myself will continue to do whatever we can to make them realize it would just be simpler and cheaper to meet these minimal standards.

If any drivers reading this are offended by being accused of being low-life scum, I'd be more than curious and likely amused to hear what justifications you have to offer for your decisions. Your excuses are more than likely to come across as sadly pathetic but give it a go if like.


----------



## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

Bonmot said:


> proscribed


I think the word you're looking for "prescribed."


----------



## Bonmot (Dec 14, 2018)

Christinebitg said:


> I think the word you're looking for "prescribed."


Thanks, you're absolutely right! My bad.


----------



## StephenT (Oct 25, 2016)

Bonmot said:


> As far as I'm concerned, the OP is not a "dick". I consider them a hero.
> 
> There are others involved in this scenario who could better be tagged with the sobriquet "dick".
> 
> ...


Lol. Way to quote less than a single sentence to make your point.
Regardless, I respect your opinion that you feel the OP was entirely justified in all his actions and behavior. I disagree, but we are all entitled to our opinions. 
The fact is the OP exerted his power and control over the situation, manipulated it for his own pleasure and personal (financial) gain and likely caused an entire family stress. Not undue stress as I completely agree the family needed a carseat and should not be burdening uber drivers with the risk. However totally not the point as his job was to pick up passengers and drop them off. 
He knew full well the guy was continuing to try to get a driver match. Ignoring/Rejecting a single ping during a driving shift is not going to impact his earnings - certainly no more than playing the cancel the ping request and cry to uber support. Only because he coerced the family to pay what the OP determined to be a reasonable penalty/fee/bribe/compensation in exchange for the OP turning his back.
Why the high and mighty power play only to finally be placated by a measly $20?

If the OP truly was looking out for the welfare of the child and the safety he would not have left the family stranded with $20 less cash and several uber cancellations charges on their account. He left them in no better state, and in fact a more degrade state, then before he mounted his high horse and opted to "teach them a lesson". The result of that was 30 minu7tes of games, a $20 cash payoff, and torment.

Were the Parents "wrong"? Sure. Yes. No question. We all drive, we've all faced this situation. However, what's is better, a single driver giving them a shakedown and torturing them for better part of an hour while they just want to go home, only to finally leave and they get a new driver that actually takes them --- or the first driver, the OP, refuses to drive them and moves on. The next driver refuses to take them and moves on. A third driver refuses to take them and moves on..... now you have Uber and Uber Drivers telling the parents to be more responsible. The scenario as written is one big jerk of an uber driver in the parents eye's and anyone that will listen.
There are a dozen coulda/woulda/shoulda's - noone knows one parent would have been willing to go get a booster or another vehicle and return. We weren't there nor could predict the future. The OP should have explained the reason and moved on (ignored the ping he knew was right there). I had the exact same scenario, except with 2 riders with open cups of alcohol. They finally cancelled and I drove to the front of the apt complex. I got a second ping and accepted before realizing ti was them. They cancelled when realized it was me. They re-requested - I lost zero money by ignoring that third ping. They got another Driver to appeal their tragic case (we don't want to pour out our booze). And a minute or so later I got a ping form a new pax.

What about uber and management are they the dicks in this scenario? LOL, do we even have to question it. Yeah, they create the situation, they don't screen pax, etc. etc. Still doesn't mean you can enforce your personal beliefs, morals, etc onto others in the guise of protecting and doing them a favor - until you are paid off that is.

And third, other Drivers that ignore the rules, laws, guidelines etc. Again, absolutely they are dicks too. They make it harder for other drivers that do follow rules. Are they part of the story here? Nope, it is only about the OP and how he handled the situation. Which was taking control and power over the pax until he was financially compensated, then turned a blind eye. Again, we can't predict the future and how the next driver would treat these people. Ideally politely and with respect and if pushed to transport illegally or unsafely (for those in Tx where it is not mandatory), inform of the reason, cancel and move on to the next pax.

Why accept ping after ping when you know the pax and have no plans to give the ride? That is what the OP did until he then opted to go inside the restaurant and have a face to face. The OP thinks he had the high moral ground, was justified, and on and on - but he showed his true colors when he compromised all that for $20. He sold out. 
Do I side with the family/pax? No, they were in the wrong, but I am a decent human being and have empathy for their situation which was exacerbated by the OP's actions. He didn't offer a solution or help, he caused stress and coerced a monetary payout which then apparently squelched his stated 'for the betterment of all' behavior.
Why not call Police, or CPS, or contact Uber. Instead of extorting (yeah said it) the $20, suggest the pax call a cab which is not under legal requirement to have a booster. The pax was in the wrong, doesn't mean OP should be the one to jerk him around over it when he had the knowledge and power to help. 
And it isn't just the behavior. Then it is posting publicly online looking for pats on the back. This obviously was his schoolyard playground and he bullied that pax and then boasted here of his exploits and exploitation of 'the system'. 
Again, just my opinion and how I read it. But I am not the same type of person as others apparently.


----------



## Bonmot (Dec 14, 2018)

I guess this is a "juicy" topic because it opens dialog on multiple issues such as legality, TOS and ethics.


> The fact is the OP exerted his power and control over the situation, manipulated it for his own pleasure and personal (financial) gain and likely caused an entire family stress. Not undue stress as I completely agree the family needed a carseat and should not be burdening uber drivers with the risk. However totally not the point as his job was to pick up passengers and drop them off.
> He knew full well the guy was continuing to try to get a driver match. Ignoring/Rejecting a single ping during a driving shift is not going to impact his earnings - certainly no more than playing the cancel the ping request and cry to uber support. Only because he coerced the family to pay what the OP determined to be a reasonable penalty/fee/bribe/compensation in exchange for the OP turning his back.
> Why the high and mighty power play only to finally be placated by a measly $20?


In my earlier post I deliberately avoided this specific aspect of the interaction, the $20 release fee. I was trying to focus on the idea that the overall strategy was one that could apply consequences to bad behavior in contrast to "letting it slide" and so encouraging the behavior. I admit that I do disagree with this particular aspect of the strategy. I wouldn't (and won't) include this in my interactions with this type of situation. I don't think it's fair to conclude that the OP was doing this out of some sort of perverse pleasure, nor that it was a power-play. It's more likely that they thought of it as one more way to convey the overall goal of making the rider realize that, in the future, it would be better to simply comply with the safety standards and just start bringing a damn car seat rather than risk a repeat confrontation. But I'm uncomfortable with the fact that a reasonable person _could _interpret this as a form of extortion (though not necessarily in the legal sense) for personal gain.



> However, what's is better, a single driver giving them a shakedown and torturing them for better part of an hour while they just want to go home, only to finally leave and they get a new driver that actually takes them --- or the first driver, the OP, refuses to drive them and moves on. The next driver refuses to take them and moves on. A third driver refuses to take them and moves on..... now you have Uber and Uber Drivers telling the parents to be more responsible. The scenario as written is one big jerk of an uber driver in the parents eye's and anyone that will listen.


The flaw in this reasoning is that it is far from likely that the rider will have multiple drivers refuse them. That's precisely the problem. One driver refusing to disregard the TOS is an aberration. Abusive riders play the odds. One driver turns them away and drives off and the next driver takes them; it's no big deal. And more often than not, the first driver _will _take them. If the goal is to provide consequences for disregarding the rules, driving off after the first cancellation won't accomplish that. It may be a fine line between providing "consequences" and meting out "punishment", but I think it's an important distinction. I don't believe the driver should be punishing riders for bad behavior, but I also see nothing wrong with demonstrating what the consequences might be if the rider chooses to continue the bad behavior. That's why I don't think we should be assessing fines but I believe it is constructive to clearly make the point that if you don't provide the proper safety equipment, or if you try to allow your child to ride alone, then there is a risk that you will incur multiple cancel fees and a degree of inconvenience. So to be clear, my personal opinion is that it's not okay to ask for $20 to leave the area but it is okay to use three or four fruitless pings to create the understanding that the rider is risking more than they care for if they try to game the system. I suspect three or four pings should be enough to communicate this concept, at which point I would clear out. Hopefully the rider would choose to take the necessary steps to eliminate this risk in the future.

I'm just trying to strike a balance between inflicting vindictive punishment on a Pax and just letting them skate.



> If the OP truly was looking out for the welfare of the child and the safety he would not have left the family stranded with $20 less cash and several uber cancellations charges on their account. He left them in no better state, and in fact a more degrade state, then before he mounted his high horse and opted to "teach them a lesson". The result of that was 30 minu7tes of games, a $20 cash payoff, and torment.


Even if you and I agree that the OP's approach was excessive, it pales in comparison to the lesson they would learn if their child went flying through the windshield in a head-on collision because they weren't properly restrained.



> I had the exact same scenario, except with 2 riders with open cups of alcohol. They finally cancelled and I drove to the front of the apt complex. I got a second ping and accepted before realizing ti was them. They cancelled when realized it was me. They re-requested - I lost zero money by ignoring that third ping. They got another Driver to appeal their tragic case (we don't want to pour out our booze). And a minute or so later I got a ping form a new pax.


I'm sorry, but I can't believe you are suggesting that refusing a child without a car seat is even remotely similar to refusing a couple of yahoos with open containers. If I deny them service, I move on. If another driver is willing to put up with this nonsense, who cares? If they repeat this action every week and usually get away with it, who cares? If a driver wants to deal with getting the smell of alcohol out of their car when the yahoos spill their cups, that's on them. Same with risking getting pulled over and cited if open containers are illegal in a car. There's no use crying over spilled gin. Children aren't cups of hooch. They are the innocent and powerless. They depend on adults to protect them. The parents/guardians are the first and most responsible for this protection, but if they fail then society as a whole has a duty to intervene to whatever degree is appropriate. And obviously "appropriate" is often going to be quite subjective with only each individual's conscience to guide them.



> And third, other Drivers that ignore the rules, laws, guidelines etc. Again, absolutely they are dicks too. They make it harder for other drivers that do follow rules. Are they part of the story here? Nope, it is only about the OP and how he handled the situation. Which was taking control and power over the pax until he was financially compensated, then turned a blind eye.


I see that you're focusing almost exclusively on the $20 which I hope I've now made clear I agree was a step too far. But the dick drivers that enable bad behavior in riders are very much part of the story because without them this encounter never would have happened. Based on my very limited experience, I strongly _suspect _that the majority of drivers ignore the laws and TOS regarding car seats and underage riders. I can't do anything to address their behavior but I can take some measured and (I hope more) reasonable steps to demonstrate to the Pax that heir actions have consequences.

One final thought, at the risk of expanding the already complex scope of this discussion.....
The family could also be considered to have let themselves be played by the driver. When the driver came in to demand payment to clear the area, they could have just told them, "No, we're going to hang out here for a while. We're in no hurry. If you want to sit outside and not make any money, feel free." Chances are if they just stopped requesting rides the driver would have got a ping from another Pax and would have left on their own. Either way, I'd give most drivers ten minutes _tops_ before they gave it up. Or, the family could have requested a Lyft. I'm sure they would have enjoyed driving off in a Lyft while the Uber driver kicked rocks.


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

BBslider001 said:


> Yup, seems anyone with some integrity would have. It isn't valued anymore these days. Everyone thinks they "get theirs" and they think they deserve to at the expense of others. It's what separates humans from parasites.


Integrity isn't in his DNA. He has proven that over and over and over again here. Don't let his little fan club fool you.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

StephenT said:


> However, what's is better, a single driver giving them a shakedown and *torturing them for better part of an hour* while they just want to go home,
> 
> The fact is the OP exerted his power and control over the situation, manipulated it for his own pleasure and personal (financial) gain and likely caused an entire family stress. Not undue stress as I completely agree the family needed a carseat and should not be burdening uber drivers with the risk. However totally not the point as his job was to pick up passengers and drop them off.
> He knew full well the guy was continuing to try to get a driver match. Ignoring/Rejecting a single ping during a driving shift is not going to impact his earnings - certainly no more than playing the cancel the ping request and cry to uber support. Only because he coerced the family to pay what the OP determined to be a reasonable penalty/fee/bribe/compensation in exchange for the OP turning his back.
> ...


You have your right to your own opinion, but you don't have the right to your own facts.

It wasn't the "_better part of an hour_" and it wasn't "_30 minutes of games_". It was 18 minutes between the first and last cancellation, plus 2 minutes of making a deal. 20 minutes. I also didn't net a "measly $20", I ended up netting $38.75, which is ok for 20 minutes of hassle. Why $20? Because it's small enough amount to get but not a large enough amount to make a scene over on their part. If I thought I could've gotten $50, I would've asked for that. Most people don't carry around $50 in cash anymore.

And "torture"? lmao. Throw it on the pile of extortion, false imprisonment, bribery, theft and other crimes against humanity that this thread has already convicted me for. I should rename this the hyperbole thread. The fact that your side has to exaggerate and make stuff up shows that you don't have a strong argument.

Also, I do think what I did has a greater chance of having them bring a car seat next time. The husband was embarrassed in front of his wife and whoever else saw in the restaurant. She was embarrassed in a social situation. That probably stung more than the almost $50 they were out after cancel fees and paying me $20. Don't underestimate how a good dose of public shaming can motivate people to change. It certainly is a larger motivation to change than a few Uber drivers cancelling on them and driving away quietly.

"_Treat others how you would want to be treated_." Isn't that the golden rule? I like that. If I ever brought my child or grandchild in a car without the proper car seat, I would hope that some good Samaritan would come along and teach me a lesson I that wouldn't soon forget.


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

Bonmot said:


> Thanks, you're absolutely right! My bad.
> View attachment 424949


The correction is incorrect and the admission is incorrect "Proscribed" is protocol set out by an authority, and "prescribed" is an order by a physician.


----------



## Christinebitg (Jun 29, 2018)

LADryver said:


> "Proscribed" is protocol set out by an authority,


Proscribe -- forbid, especially by law


----------



## ABQuber (Jan 30, 2019)

Bonmot said:


> As far as I'm concerned, the OP is not a "dick". I consider them a hero.
> 
> There are others involved in this scenario who could better be tagged with the sobriquet "dick".
> 
> ...


I have to differ slightly here. The first dick was the Uber that took them to the restaurant. Had this whole thing happened while they were home, they probably would have just grabbed a car seat.

By the time this driver got there, they were effectively stranded and just trying to get home the same way they got there. (I'm assuming they must have taken an Uber there)


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

Christinebitg said:


> Proscribe -- forbid, especially by law


nevermind &#128580;


----------



## Noexcuse19 (Oct 31, 2019)

Wow this thread is the most-answered thread I've ever seen on this site


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

Noexcuse19 said:


> Wow this thread is the most-answered thread I've ever seen on this site


Because it was written by a guy who has nothing better to do in his retirement than go tit for tat with anyone who challenges him. Between that and his 10,000+ UberX rides it sounds like a hell of a retirement. Pretty sad and pathetic actually.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

UbeRoBo said:


> Because it was written by a guy who has nothing better to do in his retirement than go tit for tat with anyone who challenges him. Between that and his 10,000+ UberX rides it sounds like a hell of a retirement. Pretty sad and pathetic actually.


Some times I have better things to do, some times I don't. On the times I don't, I drive. On the times I do, I don't drive.

For example, I spent a month with friends in Miami and the Keys this winter. I didn't drive one second during that time. I'm driving today, but if a buddy calls me up and wants to grab a drink, or has tickets to the game, then I'll finish the ride I'm on, log off and go hang with them.

That's kind of the point of why I do it. I can work when I feel like it and don't when I don't feel like it. If you can find me another thing that pays more where I can decide on a minute by minute basis if I want to work, I'm all ears.


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> Some times I have better things to do, some times I don't. On the times I don't, I drive. On the times I do, I don't drive.
> 
> For example, I spent a month with friends in Miami and the Keys this winter. I didn't drive one second during that time. I'm driving today, but if a buddy calls me up and wants to grab a drink, or has tickets to the game, then I'll finish the ride I'm on, log off and go hang with them.
> 
> That's kind of the point of why I do it. I can work when I feel like it and don't when I don't feel like it. If you can find me another thing that pays more where I can decide on a minute by minute basis if I want to work, I'm all ears.


You wont mind being deactivated then. Well, in the Philipines the rep did not see a problem so your standard is foriegn to be sure, so unless an American rep gets to view this you seem safe. You may not be deactivated, and are being encouraged by people who do not know what freedom means or who have American laws. So my statement is simple: You are now on my Ignore setting. I do not want to see another phrase of yours.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

Bonmot said:


> Based on my very limited experience, I strongly _suspect _that the majority of drivers ignore the laws and TOS regarding car seats and underage riders.


Probably so. Some of it may just be cluelessness. Uber and Lyft don't do enough to inform drivers. Then you get into a lot of gray area where it's hard to tell how old they are. One time I picked up parents and two children who were borderline old enough or big enough. They swore the kids didn't need car seats. I think they were lying but I just rolled with it and took them anyway. Those parents had their two young children out very late at a brewery. There were cops watching us about 10 feet away and that could have gone either way but they really didn't seem to care at all. I thought if the cops don't care then no one is going to back me up on this so I'm better off just not making a fuss. The police here probably ignore the laws as much or more than drivers.


----------



## StephenT (Oct 25, 2016)

dctcmn said:


> You have your right to your own opinion, but you don't have the right to your own facts.
> 
> It wasn't the "_better part of an hour_" and it wasn't "_30 minutes of games_". It was 18 minutes between the first and last cancellation, plus 2 minutes of making a deal. 20 minutes. I also didn't net a "measly $20", I ended up netting $38.75, which is ok for 20 minutes of hassle. Why $20? Because it's small enough amount to get but not a large enough amount to make a scene over on their part. If I thought I could've gotten $50, I would've asked for that. Most people don't carry around $50 in cash anymore.
> 
> ...


I didn't make up facts , I inferred on your recount. You mentioned a ping, then educating the pax and waiting out the 5 minute cancellation. Then multiple pings and cancelations. I can see how it may have only been 18-20 minutes. But reading your account certainly gave the feeling it was longer. Doesn't change anything else I stated. So you thought, I'm teaching the guy a lesson (and his wife is completely un-empowered? pretty chauvinist, hey.) - the important part is you considered with effort how much to challenge the guy for in cash so you could be removed from the equation.

I do really enjoy your "The fact that your side" comment. WTF is that? you know nothing about me other than what I have posted. I have made the case that I would not have behaved similarly, and though I shared a story very similar regarding open containers I have the same for underage solo riders and parents and children w/o carseats. I'm not a member of some group out to shame you. How exactly is this "your side" group you have lumped me into? Someone with a different moral compass than you, maybe. But I never affiliated myself to any group of people (except for those I consider decent humans). Nor do I make stuff up and even if I did it certianly wouldn't be to try and lend credit to a weak argument. I simply don't agree with how you handled it. I completely understood your frustration. Even your original motives. But if the entire thing only took 20 minutes or less, after 6 minutes is where I believe you began to mishandle it. Which wasn't really even the issue. It was once you posted and starting looking for accolades but got negative feedback. 
You are as guilty of speculation as I of inferring data [facts] from your OP. You have no proof whatsoever that your actions would change the future.

It is obvious you and I interpret the Golden Rule differently, as I am one to help out a situation or excuse myself rather than exacerbate it. I've argued with a parent, I've left them on the side of the road and told them to call a cab or get a carseat. I've not stayed in a bad situation and asked for money from a potential pax in order to leave them be. If you are such a good samaritan, you payed that $20 forward right?


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

ABQuber said:


> I have to differ slightly here. The first dick was the Uber that took them to the restaurant. Had this whole thing happened while they were home, they probably would have just grabbed a car seat.
> 
> By the time this driver got there, they were effectively stranded and just trying to get home the same way they got there. (I'm assuming they must have taken an Uber there)


I agree it's a problem that another driver probably took them there to begin with (and who knows, they could be getting rides like that all the time so they come to expect it.) But first and foremost the parents are at fault because they know better. They know the age, size, and weight of their child and they know what the law is, so they should have just brought the car seat. They counted on a driver either not knowing, not paying attention or being willing to break the law.

If they pulled this crap at the restaurant, continuing to request a ride over and over even after being refused, they probably did it on the way to the restaurant too. They might not have come from home, they might be travelling out of town without a car seat. They might be spending the whole day out going place to place with the kid and goshdarnit it's just too inconvenient to carry round a car seat. We don't know the whole story, all we know is they were at a steakhouse.

They weren't exactly stranded...but if they were, they put themselves in that situation.



StephenT said:


> Ignoring/Rejecting a single ping during a driving shift is not going to impact his earnings - certainly no more than playing the cancel the ping request and cry to uber support.


You don't know that...pings and earnings are so unpredictable there's absolutely no way to say that with any certainty. The fact that these parents pinged even once could have seriously impacted a driver's earnings, much less to do so over and over again. It could be a slow area. It could take 15 minutes to get out of range of being their closest driver.

It's not always so simple to just go offline, drive away or decline pings. It may be easier to do that in one market and very hard to do it in another. I think that's what some of you are not considering here. Some markets suck so much that every single ping matters. Yes it could seriously impact your earnings, or your acceptance rate.



> Why the high and mighty power play only to finally be placated by a measly $20?


Huh...I see the pax's repeated requests to break the law as a power play and the driver's offer to settle for $20 as very lenient.



> If the OP truly was looking out for the welfare of the child and the safety he would not have left the family stranded with $20 less cash and several uber cancellations charges on their account.


If the parents had been looking out for the welfare of their child they would not have been in this stupid, unnecessary predicament to begin with. They did it to themselves.



> The next driver refuses to take them and moves on. A third driver refuses to take them and moves on..... now you have Uber and Uber Drivers telling the parents to be more responsible.


Except that it's not likely to happen that way, and the parents probably know it since they kept requesting another driver.


----------



## LADryver (Jun 6, 2017)

goobered said:


> I agree it's a problem that another driver probably took them there to begin with (and who knows, they could be getting rides like that all the time so they come to expect it.) But first and foremost the parents are at fault because they know better. They know the age, size, and weight of their child and they know what the law is, so they should have just brought the car seat. They counted on a driver either not knowing, not paying attention or being willing to break the law.
> 
> If they pulled this crap at the restaurant, continuing to request a ride over and over even after being refused, they probably did it on the way to the restaurant too. They might not have come from home, they might be travelling out of town without a car seat. They might be spending the whole day out going place to place with the kid and goshdarnit it's just too inconvenient to carry round a car seat. We don't know the whole story, all we know is they were at a steakhouse.
> 
> ...


$20 is the price at Target for a car seat. Could have bought one for the family. But didn't.


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

LADryver said:


> $20 is the price at Target for a car seat. Could have bought one for the family. But didn't.


Yes, the family could have gone to Target or Walmart first and bought one.


----------



## sd1303 (Nov 11, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> if a buddy calls me up and wants to grab a drink, or has tickets to the game, then I'll finish the ride I'm on, log off and go hang with them.


You aren't going to ask the pax to pay $20 to finish their ride? Very generous.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

StephenT said:


> I didn't make up facts , I inferred on your recount. You mentioned a ping, then educating the pax and waiting out the 5 minute cancellation. Then multiple pings and cancelations. I can see how it may have only been 18-20 minutes. But reading your account certainly gave the feeling it was longer. Doesn't change anything else I stated. So you thought, I'm teaching the guy a lesson (and his wife is completely un-empowered? pretty chauvinist, hey.) - the important part is you considered with effort how much to challenge the guy for in cash so you could be removed from the equation.
> 
> I do really enjoy your "The fact that your side" comment. WTF is that? you know nothing about me other than what I have posted. I have made the case that I would not have behaved similarly, and though I shared a story very similar regarding open containers I have the same for underage solo riders and parents and children w/o carseats. I'm not a member of some group out to shame you. How exactly is this "your side" group you have lumped me into? Someone with a different moral compass than you, maybe. But I never affiliated myself to any group of people (except for those I consider decent humans). Nor do I make stuff up and even if I did it certianly wouldn't be to try and lend credit to a weak argument. I simply don't agree with how you handled it. I completely understood your frustration. Even your original motives. But if the entire thing only took 20 minutes or less, after 6 minutes is where I believe you began to mishandle it. Which wasn't really even the issue. It was once you posted and starting looking for accolades but got negative feedback.
> You are as guilty of speculation as I of inferring data [facts] from your OP. You have no proof whatsoever that your actions would change the future.
> ...


1. The dude was the account holder. I dealt with the dude because he was the account holder. I've already said that I hold the woman just as responsible for endangering the life of the child as the dude. However, the dude was the one who was trying to leverage me into an illegal act. If I went after the woman when it wasn't her name on the account, you all would just accuse me of being a woman hater or bullying her or some such nonsense.

2. By "your side", I mean people who exaggerate, thereby making a weak point stronger. "_Torture_" and "_the better part of an hour_" are both exaggerations on your part, and those exaggerations make your side of the argument stronger than what it should be. I only see those types of exaggerations coming from one side of the argument in this thread.

3. It's also funny that you accuse me of speculation the very next sentence after posting pure speculation about my motivations for starting this thread ("_you posted and started looking for accolades_")-- like somehow you can know what was inside of my head when I started the thread. I posted it for discussion and I expected it to be a controversial, but interesting discussion. It's not like I just joined UP.net yesterday, so I know what to expect when I post something like this. 22 pages and 426 responses later, it has been discussed and at least some people have found it interesting, right?

4. I take your point that I cannot know how these parents are going to react in the future-- maybe they'll strap their child on the roof of their car from now on, maybe the parents went home and beat the $20 out of the kid-- we cannot know. However, if we had to know how our actions will affect others before we acted, no one could ever act. All we can do is forecast the effects of our actions to the best of our ability before acting. In my best estimation, this will deter them more than encourage them from ordering an Uber without a car seat in the future. Your estimation might be different based on your experience and that's fine.

5. I don't think I paid that specific $20 forward. Since the incident, I have invested or donated $20 toward better causes than eating at a steakhouse and endangering children. So $20 has been used for a better purpose than it otherwise could have been. Since money is fungible, is that good enough? Or does it have to be that specific $20 bill for your morality to be satisfied? Also, people are allowed to perform and action for more than one motivation. There is nothing wrong with teaching someone a lesson and profiting off of it. There is nothing wrong with me teaching someone the consequences of trying to leverage me into an illegal act without me teaching them a lesson about endangering a child. An action does not have to be perfect in the logical extreme to be the correct act.


----------



## Deceptive (Oct 29, 2019)

This thread is still going? Beating the dead horse at this point


----------



## UbeRoBo (Nov 19, 2015)

The smartest guy in the room has to keep convincing himself. I think driving UberX 40-50 hours per week in his retirement years is starting to get to him. Let him keep wasting his time here convincing himself that he did nothing wrong. What a fool. Like they say, you can't fix cheap and you can't fix stupid.


----------



## Daddyfatsacks10 (Nov 12, 2016)

I see you don’t have nothing better to do


----------



## uberdrivert1 (Feb 1, 2020)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


There is something know one has mentioned. Everybody is on the train about extortion and bribery. What if the driver took this ride and got stopped by the popo. What do you think would happen to the driver. NOT the parents! Can you say a ticket, court date, fines, court costs, loss of work. I applaud for taking taking action and being proactive to protect themselves. Maybe teach a couple of parents how to do the right thing the next time. WE HAVE TO PROTECT OURSELVES AT ALL TIMES... am i wrong??


----------



## Asificarewhatyoudontthink (Jul 6, 2017)

dctcmn said:


> I took a ping from a restaurant and when I arrived, two adults and a toddler came out without a car seat. I told them that I couldn't give the ride and that they needed to cancel. They didn't cancel, so I let the timer run down and collected the cancel fee. I stayed parked right in front of the restaurant. Immediately, they re-requested and I took the ping again. We repeat the process 2 more times, so now I have 3 cancel fees racked up.
> 
> Then they start requesting, seeing that it's me, then cancelling within the first 2 minutes. I still don't move. After 5 attempts, I walked into the restaurant and told the dude that I wasn't moving and that I was going to take every ping and that he was being charged $5 for every cancellation. I told him to give me $20 cash and I'll decline his next request. Otherwise, I would sit there and do it all night.
> 
> ...


Yeah, agree with refusing the ride. 
Agree with the cancelation fee. 
Also agree with anyone mentioning that the extortion is not only wrong, it violates your contract with Uber (criminal activity) and when/if the rider files a complaint you will face deactivation.



dctcmn said:


> I'll ask you the same question as I asked the last two-- Tell me specifically how what I did was extortion. Cite the extortion statute I'm violating.
> 
> Extortion means that I'm forcing someone to pay me to NOT perform an illegal act that would harm them. I'm not doing anything that's illegal by continuing to accept their pings. I'm well within my legal right to do so. They are paying my to not perform a legal action that is well within my right to do. That's simply not extortion.
> 
> Again, you're making the claim. You provide the proof to support your claim.


Actually extortion and blackmail both do not require the action you take to be illegal. 
In both cases you are extracting money by coercion under threat of an undesirable act.

That undesirable act may be, very well, legal.

If you don't pay me 50.00 I will report you to child welfare for endangering your child's life.

The threat is to perform a legal action.

Also, withholding that action, while morally ambiguous, is not a crime either unless you are employed in a mandatory reporting field (teacher/lawyer/doctor etc).


----------



## StephenT (Oct 25, 2016)

uberdrivert1 said:


> There is something know one has mentioned. Everybody is on the train about extortion and bribery. What if the driver took this ride and got stopped by the popo. What do you think would happen to the driver. NOT the parents! Can you say a ticket, court date, fines, court costs, loss of work. I applaud for taking taking action and being proactive to protect themselves. Maybe teach a couple of parents how to do the right thing the next time. WE HAVE TO PROTECT OURSELVES AT ALL TIMES... am i wrong??


Oy. I don't think anywhere in the 400 threads it was suggested the driver compromise the law, his own ethics, or endanger the child by taking the ride. You are an IC for Uber and your hired task is to transport people from point A to point B. Uber [shamelessly] relies on Driver's to also educate Riders. It is not your, as an IC, an Uber employee, or bystander, to "teach the family a lesson". 
OP worked the system to acquire multiple cancellations, then challenged the pax to hand over cash in exchange for finally not being a nuisance and preventing the pax from ordering [another] ride. I still contend the way it was all handled was anything but a teaching moment; and that is the problem with the scenario.

Everything else is conjecture. We don't know the previous driver that dropped them at the restaurant didn't have a car seat and transported them safely and legally. We don't know the next responding driver wouldn't have a car seat. Nor do we know whether or not the next ant would be willing to transport without a car seat.

And none of it matters. It is beyond the scope of the OP actions. If there were actually any question of that, on the basis of some higher ground or fighting for the welfare of the child, that all went away the moment the driver requested a $20 cash payment in exchange to reject/ignore the next ping [from the same pax]. He rejected the request, sending the ping to another driver, and drove off all smug after calling uber (to report the multiple cancellations not the rider attempting to transport without a car seat).
The OP gets bent out of shape when people respond with legal terms. I won't say he extorted the pax [though personally not legally I believe he did]. I'm sure the OP would justify his action and refute that he accepted a bribe to turn a blind eye as well. Again, solely my own opinoin and I am smart enough to know I can't convince people that disagree to change their view (especially if it meant they were in the wrong and having to admit it), but it appears to me to be the very definition of a bribe - simply my opinion and how I live my life. 
your mileage may vary and you are entitled to your opinions.


----------



## Iann (Oct 17, 2017)

My wife is a Child Welfare worker (CPS) I just take a picture of the offending parent. 

If I get any shit from the parent about the reason I'm canceling is from them not having a car seat I tell them I will forward there picture to the Child Welfare website. 
It's actually funny to see their expression change to Oh Shit face. 

As far as I know Child Welfare won't do anything but it's funny how they change attitudes really quick when you mention Child Welfare.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

StephenT said:


> He rejected the request, sending the ping to another driver, and drove off all smug after calling uber (to report the multiple cancellations not the rider attempting to transport without a car seat).
> 
> The OP gets bent out of shape when people respond with legal terms. I won't say he extorted the pax [though personally not legally I believe he did]. I'm sure the OP would justify his action and refute that he accepted a bribe to turn a blind eye as well.


I did report the passenger to support for not having a car seat (when contacted Uber to explain the situation in an attempt to get more cancel fees).

I don't get bent out of shape when people respond with legal terms, but I do ask that people post the applicable state or federal statute when accusing me of a crime. I don't think that's too much to ask. Take your bribery assertion-- in Minnesota, bribery only applies if the person soliciting or accepting the bribe is either (1) a public officer or employee or (2) a witness in a trial. Since I'm neither of those two things, there is no crime of bribery no matter how much you want it to be. The appropriate term for the transaction between myself and the passenger would be "conducting business".

Also, I don't need to be teaching the passenger a lesson about endangering their child, I only need to be teaching them a lesson about trying to leverage me into an illegal act. That 100% is my business and my prerogative and I am not a bystander in that attempt. Now, if they also learn the lesson about bringing a car seat, then that's a bonus and everyone wins if that happens.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> Also, I don't need to be teaching the passenger a lesson about endangering their child, I only need to be teaching them a lesson about trying to leverage me into an illegal act.


We're not in the business of "teaching passengers lessons."

And you're not fooling anybody by pretending to be the victim here. Poor you. Somebody tried to "force you into an illegal act."


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Coachman said:


> We're not in the business of "teaching passengers lessons."
> 
> And you're not fooling anybody by pretending to be the victim here.


We're independent contractors. We can be in as many businesses as we want to be at any point in time, as long as they don't violate our contracts or the law.

I'm also not pretending to be a victim. I wasn't a victim because I didn't allow myself to become one.


----------



## Coachman (Sep 22, 2015)

dctcmn said:


> We're independent contractors. We can be in as many businesses as we want to be at any point in time, as long as they don't violate our contracts or the law.
> 
> I'm also not pretending to be a victim. I wasn't a victim because I didn't allow myself to become one.


It's funny how "teaching him a lesson" and lining your own pockets are one and same thing. Nobody's buying your altruistic act.


----------



## dctcmn (Sep 21, 2017)

Coachman said:


> It's funny how "teaching him a lesson" and lining your own pockets are one and same thing. Nobody's buying your altruistic act.


I never claimed I was being altruistic. People can act for more than one reason. I can act to try to make money *and* teach him a lesson at the same time.

And if I'm not trying to line my pockets, then why would I be out driving in the first place?


----------



## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

If ever there ever needed to be a thread lock.... round n round. S h e e s h


----------



## goobered (Feb 2, 2020)

StephenT said:


> It is not your, as an IC, an Uber employee, or bystander, to "teach the family a lesson". OP worked the system to acquire multiple cancellations, then challenged the pax to hand over cash in exchange for finally not being a nuisance and preventing the pax from ordering [another] ride.


You are missing a word here, I guess you meant to say "not your job." That's beside the point. It's also not the driver's job to decline pings from the same pax, or go offline or drive away to avoid them. Strictly doing one's job means accepting pings, giving rides to pax who follow the law and company policy, and refusing rides to those who don't.

Uber and Lyft both leverage penalties for not accepting pings, because ideally they want drivers to accept them all. If they could program a robot or SDC to follow company policy to the letter, it would accept every ping, and automatically take a cancellation fee on every ride request that could not be completed. That would not be "working the system." It would simply be operating according to company policy. It would be up to the pax to not be stupid and continue requesting illegal rides from the robot.

This is pure speculation but imagine if the vehicle arriving to pickup pax without a child seat was a company carr. It could be an SDC somehow programmed to correctly identify the need for a car seat (it's not outside the realm of possibility that the seats in an SDC could estimate the height and weight of each passenger.) Or, it could be an Uber or Lyft owned vehicle driven by an employee who would then refuse the ride. Would either Uber or Lyft waste their own resources by ignoring ride requests, driving away or going offline just to avoid one pax who does not follow the terms or service?

No, if this was happening on either the company's dime, Uber or Lyft would either temporarily restrict that pax from requesting rides pending further investigation, OR...they would continue accepting pings and collecting cancellation fees. One option costs them more company resources, and the other makes them money, so I'm pretty sure we can all guess which one they would go for.

Do you think either of these companies would hesitate to charge additional service fees to pax for repeatedly requesting rides that cannot be completed, such as a $20 service fee?

It is similar to charging a fee for a bounced check or early cancellation of a contract. Or, it is more along the lines of charging fees to customers who repeatedly request "free estimates" or service calls that require sending out drivers and company vehicles to a person's home or business. When customers waste company resources, and/or impede the ability to do business with other paying customers, the business is well within their rights to impose a fee. And that's what you might call a "teaching moment."

As it stands now, drivers are independent contractors, and as such you run your own business. Uber and Lyft both leave it up to the driver to manage and absorb the costs and risks of running their business. They primarily consider themselves to be "payment processors" with an eye towards potential legal liabilities. They are set up to process payments for rides only, not for anything else. Accepting cash for anything else goes beyond the scope of what they do. They just want their cut on the rides, and they don't want contractors using their service to obtain leads to run a business without giving them their cut.

When a pax makes a request for an illegal ride, they are leveraging multiple costs and risks on the driver to coerce agreement. If you don't understand the impact this has on the driver's bottom line, perhaps you have not fully accounted for those costs.

An IC is well within their rights to impose costs on a customer who is leveraging costs against them and impeding their ability to do business with other customers. That is the contractor's prerogative, and it teaches a lesson about imposing costs on a business without fair reciprocity. It may additionally get them to think about the risk they are taking to their child's life, but that's up to the pax. I would agree, it's not up to a driver to teach them that.


----------



## Bears Fan (Oct 28, 2018)

Very unethical at best.


----------

