# Insurance in Upstate NY



## dmcgeary1965

Ride sharing is finally arriving in upstate NY and I was hoping to hit the ground running when it was available at the end of the month, but I've run into a roadblock. I can't find an insurance company that will give me a ride sharing policy yet in NY. I'm not going to shell out 100-200 dollars a month for a commercial policy.

Has anyone from my area researched this yet?


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## NYGUY

I've been waiting for this information as well and didn't they alo say DMV would be part of the process?


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## dmcgeary1965

NYGUY said:


> I've been waiting for this information as well and didn't they alo say DMV would be part of the process?


Yes they did. Earlier news articles said the DMV was supposed to issue their regulations concerning ride-sharing in early May. Obviously that hasn't happened.

I've got emails out to other insurance agents. If I hear anything useful, I'll post here.


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## dmcgeary1965

The DMV just issued their regulations concerning ride sharing. Hopefully, this means the insurance companies can offer ride sharing insurance policies soon.


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## John Binner

Same boat here, Albany area. GEICO is my policy now, they are not ready and do not write commercial in NY. I tried Progressive, same deal. Progressive referred me to a company in Albany, "who was just as a meeting today about this" and they too are NOT ready to write a policy. And NOW, to top it off, because I called GEICO first, they now want paperwork from me stating I am not driving commercially on my personal policy. AND they want proof from Uber that I cancelled, if I choose to not drive at all.

This is a cluster-F


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## dmcgeary1965

I have GEICO also. Also in Albany area. I guess I'm lucky they didn't ask me for all that extra paperwork. Still waiting on replies from some other insurance agents. I'll post with any updates.


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## John Binner

I was being A good boy, and called them to ask. Next day, paperwork arrived in email. lol Either way, seems if they catch you, they will drop you, is what I was told.


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## dmcgeary1965

Here's what I have so far. Still haven't found a company that has a policy ready to cover ride sharing.

GEICO - No ride-sharing coverage AND they will cancel your personal policy if you use your car for ride sharing.
Nationwide - No ride sharing coverage, but they are fine with you driving for Uber, they just won't cover you while the Uber app is on.
Progressive/Allstate - No ride sharing coverage.
State Farm - At some point will offer a ride-sharing addendum to your personal policy to cover gap in Phase I, but that coverage is not 
available yet either.

Unbelievable.


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## John Binner

I have cancelled my Uber account and driver account. Until NY can un-screw itself, I won't be risking it.


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## Uberdriverjorge

Why are you looking for ride sharing insurance. I thought we get from uber when ride is taking place


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## John Binner

You do. But you still need insurance wrapped around that, and companies won't cover your personal driving. In my case, Geico threatened to drop me if they found out.

Just tried nationwide. "No longer writing auto policies in N.Y."

This is starting to get as bad as health insurance.


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## dmcgeary1965

Uberdriverjorge said:


> Why are you looking for ride sharing insurance. I thought we get from uber when ride is taking place


Uber does cover your vehicle during Phase 2 and Phase 3 (when you've accepted a request and when you actually have a passenger in the car). But Uber only offers the bare minimum of insurance while you have the app on but haven't accepted a request yet (Phase 1). If you have your app on waiting for a request and you get in an accident, damage to your vehicle will NOT be covered by Uber OR your personal insurance policy (unless you lie to your insurance company, which you shouldn't do.) Liability limits are also very low during that phase.

Some may be fine with that risk during Phase I. I'm not.


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## Uberdriverjorge

While logged onto the Uber application provided by Company and available to receive User requests, but prior to being matched with a User, Company provides primary automobile liability insurance in the amount of $75,000 for death and bodily injury per person, $150,000 for death and bodily injury per
incident and $25,000 for property damage. This coverage is primary unless you maintain insurance designed for P2P or other commercial use while logged into
the mobile application. In addition, during this period Company provides Uninsured/Underinsured Motorist coverage in the amount of $25,000 for bodily injury per person and $50,000 per accident, and $50,000 for the death of one person and $100,000 for death per incident. Company also provides Personal Injury Protection coverage in the amount of $50,000.


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## John Binner

I'm aware of that. GEICO And others have an exclusion for your personal insurance that DOES NOT ALLOW use for uber, lyft, etc. So if they catch you, they will drop you. Therefore not worth the risk to me.


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## Uberdriverjorge

Well I'm going to assume something is going to happen soon. We can't be the only ones starting Uber in the capital district..


The Winfield Group
3 Corporate Drive, Suite 200
Clifton Park, NY 12065
tel: 518-371-0075
fax: 518-371-0675
web: www.winfieldgroup.com


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## dmcgeary1965

Uberdriverjorge said:


> Well I'm going to assume something is going to happen soon. We can't be the only ones starting Uber in the capital district..


The last agent I spoke to seemed to believe it was because the state DMV took so long to issue insurance regulations in regard to ride-sharing that there are no insurance policies available yet for Uber, etc. The DMV was supposed to issue the regulations in early May, but didn't do it until last week.


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## Uberdriverjorge

My app is finally activated. Has anyone been activated in the capital district?


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## Maven

There is one company you may be able to work with in NY State. More info:
https://uberpeople.net/threads/non-commercial-auto-insurance-in-nys.175003/
https://uberpeople.net/forums/RocklandWestchester/


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## dmcgeary1965

Although Liberty Mutual won't cancel your policy for ride-sharing, they don't provide coverage for the Phase I gap.


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## Usalikhov

How about in Long Island? Have you guys found any insurance company? 
Allstate offers rideshare options but not with NY yet...https://www.allstate.com/auto-insurance/ride-for-hire.aspx


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## tommay911

It's a joke that Uber promotes and promotes the New York State ridesharing yet doesn't care to help in the insurance process


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## Maven

tommay911 said:


> It's a joke that Uber promotes and promotes the New York State ridesharing yet doesn't care to help in the insurance process


It's a really BAD joke for anyone in NYS who gets into an accident without proper coverage and relies upon the insurance provided by Uber/Lyft, especially during Phase-1.


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## dmcgeary1965

Maven said:


> It's a really BAD joke for anyone in NYS who gets into an accident without proper coverage and relies upon the insurance provided by Uber/Lyft, especially during Phase-1.


I was thinking that same thing. How many drivers are going to be out there who didn't do the research that we did? And have no idea that they're not covered adequately during Phase 1 or that their personal policy could get cancelled for driving.


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## tommay911

Well phase 1 isn't that when there's no pax? Cops won't have to know what I was doing before a pax got in the car..


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## Maven

dmcgeary1965 said:


> I was thinking that same thing. How many drivers are going to be out there who didn't do the research that we did? And have no idea that they're not covered adequately during Phase 1 or that their personal policy could get cancelled for driving.


Most new drivers have no idea of the risks they accept when driving for Uber/Lyft because they are not told. A lie by omission. If the subject come up during the application process, Uber trots out the insurance they do provide while online, but few applicants understand enough about auto insurance to appreciate the gaps. No collision, comprehensive, or UM/UIM in Phase 1. In Phases 2&3, Uber's deductible is $1000, Lyft's $2500. Both their insurance companies have terrible reputations.


tommay911 said:


> Well phase 1 isn't that when there's no pax? Cops won't have to know what I was doing before a pax got in the car..


There is no PAX in both phases 1 (online waiting for request) & 2 (driving to pickup). However, the insurance provided by Uber is much better in Phase 2. A cop called to the scene of an accident will not know and generally not care if you are driving for Uber at the time of the accident unless you mention it or they see the application running on your phone. Your insurer will care, but generally rely on the honesty of the policyholder to report accurately. Knowingly lying is fraud. In rare circumstances, your insurer may demand a letter from Uber that you are not working for them.


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## Dcraw86

Which insurance companies don't care if you do Uber?


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## Maven

Dcraw86 said:


> Which insurance companies don't care if you do Uber?


If you can afford more expensive commercial insurance then all forms of rideshare are included. This has long been required for all NYC drivers. However, if you are not doing rideshare full-time then the cost of commercial insurance is difficult to justify.

For personal (non-commercial) insurance, only Liberty Mutual currently allows rideshare in NYS, at no additional cost, but does not provide any coverage if you are online. Many other insurers outside NYS have various provisions for rideshare drivers, but they do not yet sell these in NYS.


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## tommay911

Maven said:


> If you can afford more expensive commercial insurance then all forms of rideshare are included. This has long been required for all NYC drivers. However, if you are not doing rideshare full-time then the cost of commercial insurance is difficult to justify.
> 
> For personal (non-commercial) insurance, only Liberty Mutual currently allows rideshare in NYS, at no additional cost, but does not provide any coverage if you are online. Many other insurers outside NYS have various provisions for rideshare drivers, but they do not yet sell these in NYS.





Maven said:


> If you can afford more expensive commercial insurance then all forms of rideshare are included. This has long been required for all NYC drivers. However, if you are not doing rideshare full-time then the cost of commercial insurance is difficult to justify.
> 
> For personal (non-commercial) insurance, only Liberty Mutual currently allows rideshare in NYS, at no additional cost, but does not provide any coverage if you are online. Many other insurers outside NYS have various provisions for rideshare drivers, but they do not yet sell these in NYS.


Liberty mutual allows ride share insurance but not when you're online? Makes no sense?


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## Maven

tommay911 said:


> Liberty mutual allows ride share insurance but not when you're online? Makes no sense?


At least with LM, your personal insurance will not be immediately cancelled when it is discovered that you do rideshare. In all other respects, you are correct. It is not as good as a rideshare rider/endorsement or commercial. When online, you are dependent on the insurance provided by Uber/Lyft that has huge gaps. See https://uberpeople.net/threads/non-commercial-auto-insurance-in-nys.175003/


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## steveK2016

dmcgeary1965 said:


> I was thinking that same thing. How many drivers are going to be out there who didn't do the research that we did? And have no idea that they're not covered adequately during Phase 1 or that their personal policy could get cancelled for driving.


Independent contractors and adults are responsible to ensure that they are properly insured for their level of activities.

It's adulting 101. The problem is drivers assume they are covered, regardless of whether Uber advises them or not. The proper thing to do is call your insurance agent and confirm that you are covered for a specific activity. They will advise you on whether or not you are covered. If you fail to perform this step, who's fault is it?


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## TaroTeaFan

https://newsroom.uber.com/nys-ridesharing-insurance/


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## Maven

TaroTeaFan said:


> uber nys-ridesharing-insurance/


Thanks for the link. Unfortunately, Uber's NYS insurance has the same huge gaps in coverage as in other states, including

No collision and No comprehensive in phase 1.
$1,000.00 deductible in phases 2&3 (better than Lyft's $2500.00)
Do you know of any NYS insurers that will cover these gaps outside of NYC? Most NYS insurers, other than Liberty Mutual, will cancel a personal auto insurance policy upon discovering anyone listed on the policy is doing rideshare, even part-time. Liberty Mutual does not provide any coverage while online. Here's the detail of what Uber does provide.
_____

*Insurance for Ridesharing Drivers with Uber in New York*
June 27, 2017 Posted by Uber










With the passage of 2018 New York fiscal budget, ridesharing officially comes to New York State. Pursuant to New York's ridesharing laws, Uber Transportation Network Company Driver Partners (TNC Drivers) are covered by Uber's group ridesharing insurance while connected to the Digital Network. A summary of this coverage is below:

*While on a prearranged trip (on your way to pick up a rider and while a rider is in your car):*


*$1.25 million of liability coverage per accident*. Uber holds a group ridesharing insurance policy with $1.25 million of coverage per accident. A TNC Driver's liability to third parties is covered from the moment a TNC Driver accepts a Prearranged Trip to its conclusion. This policy is expressly primary to any personal auto coverage.
*$1.25 million of supplementary uninsured/underinsured motorist bodily injury coverage per accident*. In the event that another motorist causes an accident with a Transportation Network Company Vehicle (TNC Vehicle) and the motorist doesn't carry adequate insurance or is uninsured, this coverage protects against bodily injury to all occupants of the TNC Vehicle. This is important to ensure protection in a hit and run.
*No fault coverage (e.g., Personal Injury Protection)*. This state required coverage protects all occupants of the TNC Vehicle for medical and health expenses, lost earnings, and other reasonable and necessary expenses resulting from vehicle related injuries up to $50,000.
*Contingent comprehensive and collision insurance*. If a TNC Driver holds personal comprehensive and collision insurance, this policy covers physical damage occurring to that TNC Vehicle during a trip, up to the actual cash value or cost of repair, whichever is less, of the TNC Vehicle, with a $1,000 deductible.* NOTE*: This coverage only applies on a Prearranged Trip - you may want to consider purchasing your own comprehensive and/or collision insurance coverage for the times you are waiting for a trip request. For more information, please see here.
*App on, waiting for a trip request:*


*$75,000/$150,000/$25,000 of coverage between trips*. During the time that a TNC Driver is available to receive ride requests or is between trips, we maintain a group ridesharing policy that covers the TNC Driver's liability for bodily injury up to $75,000 per injury per accident with a total of $150,000 per accident and up to $25,000 for property damage.
*Uninsured motorist bodily injury coverage per accident*. In the event that another motorist causes an accident with a TNC Vehicle and the motorist is uninsured, this coverage protects against bodily injury to all occupants of the TNC Vehicle. This coverage provides up to $25,000 in injury liability per person ($50,000 per accident) and $50,000 per person for death ($100,000 per accident). This is important to ensure protection in a hit and run.
*No fault coverage (e.g., Personal Injury Protection)*. This state required coverage protects you for medical and health expenses, lost earnings, and other reasonable and necessary expenses resulting from vehicle related injuries up to $50,000.
*Offline*


You are subject to state financial responsibility laws while offline. Uber does not maintain any auto insurance coverage during this period of time. You can learn more about these requirements from the New York Department of Financial Services here.
*Coverage for Commercial Drivers*

Uber rides in New York City are regulated by the NYC Taxi and Limousine Commission, which requires commercial insurance policies for each individual vehicle. Accidents that happen on rides originating in New York City are covered by those commercial policies that are maintained by the driver. Outside New York City, Uber may partner with drivers who are licensed and insured commercially by other jurisdictions. Those rides may be booked under the names UberBLACK, UberSUV, UberTAXI, and UberT, among others, and accidents happening on those rides are covered by the commercial insurance maintained by the driver.

*NOTE: *This summary does not amend or alter any terms or conditions of Uber's group ridesharing insurance. Please see group insurance policies (linked above) for full details.

*IMPORTANT DISCLOSURE:* *THE INSURER NAMED HEREIN IS NOT LICENSED BY THE STATE OF NEW YORK, NOT SUBJECT TO ITS SUPERVISION, AND IN THE EVENT OF THE INSOLVENCY OF THE INSURER, NOT PROTECTED BY THE NEW YORK STATE SECURITY FUNDS. THE POLICY MAY NOT BE SUBJECT TO ALL OF THE REGULATIONS OF THE DEPARTMENT OF FINANCIAL SERVICES PERTAINING TO POLICY FORMS. *

*INSURER*: James River Insurance Company is an eligible excess lines carrier in New York. Here's the information about James River's eligibility.
_____

Eligible Effective Date: 07/07/1989
Financial Summary is attached

JAMES RIVER INSURANCE COMPANY
COLUMBUS, OH (Domicile)
6641 WEST BROAD STREET (Home Office)
SUITE 300
RICHMOND, VA 23230


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## JPU

Uberdriverjorge said:


> Well I'm going to assume something is going to happen soon. We can't be the only ones starting Uber in the capital district..
> 
> 
> The Winfield Group
> 3 Corporate Drive, Suite 200
> Clifton Park, NY 12065
> tel: 518-371-0075
> fax: 518-371-0675


I was just given the winfield group for long island. Im going to call them wednesday.... i was told at state farm they did not but might in the future... gave me someone else who referred me to the winfield group. Therefore to my knowledge if you dont tell them and they find out.. they are capable of cancelling your insurance to the last renewal and/or underinsuring you at the date you signed up at which makes you inelligible for ANY INSURANCE since you havent had coverage for a long time and will pay a high risk insurance policy. Either way until this changes i wont be doing it


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## JPU

UPDATE: 

I called winfield group. They do NOT do uber. 
Liberty Mutual on the other hand i called and went to meet the rep and he welcomed me with open arms. He stated although i can get personal insurance (business is uber) i will not be covered when the passengers are IN the car. He said there is no way to tell if i am logged in or not at that particular time, only if there are passengers. Hence i now have a quote with liberty mutual with understanding that i will be ubering. Now to do it without fear of getting dropped. (Hopefully)

Happy ubering!!!!!!


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## dmcgeary1965

So, if you're in an accident with your app on, your insurance agent encouraged you to LIE? Essentially committing insurance fraud? Doesn't matter whether you likely wouldn't get caught, I wouldn't trust any insurance agent who told me that.

The Liberty Mutual agent that I spoke with was very upfront with me in saying that he would not recommend driving with the insurance gap as it is.


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## uberguy19481948

JPU said:


> UPDATE:
> 
> I called winfield group. They do NOT do uber.
> Liberty Mutual on the other hand i called and went to meet the rep and he welcomed me with open arms. He stated although i can get personal insurance (business is uber) i will not be covered when the passengers are IN the car. He said there is no way to tell if i am logged in or not at that particular time, only if there are passengers. Hence i now have a quote with liberty mutual with understanding that i will be ubering. Now to do it without fear of getting dropped. (Hopefully)
> 
> Happy ubering!!!!!!


I called my insurance broker this morning about Liberty Mutual and they are not doing ride sharing endorsements which means you wouldn't be covered. I agree with DMCgeary1965, your insurance broker shouldn't be advising you to lie about the work you are doing with your vehicle.

Be careful. You have to remember that Uber's insurance policy is contingent on the fact you'd have to report an accident to your own insurance first and get denied from them first before you can put in a claim with Uber's insurance policy. You're playing it wild by assuming Liberty Mutual won't cancel you for ride sharing. Call yourself, ask them directly, get the person's name and extension number if they give you a positive yes you won't be cancelled so at least you can reference back to it later should anything happen. Your agent/broker can deny saying that you won't be cancelled!

And don't forget you aren't covered in Phase 1 with Liberty Mutual :-/


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## JPU

He did not tell me to lie about anything. He said that there is no way to proove that i was logged in on the app.. the only time its proven as if i have someone in the car


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## uberguy19481948

JPU said:


> He did not tell me to lie about anything. He said that there is no way to proove that i was logged in on the app.. the only time its proven as if i have someone in the car


Do you have an Uber decal? If you hit someone during Phase 1 and they report the accident to your insurance company and they start out by saying, "I was hit by an Uber on so and so date and so and so time..."

There's a lot of "what if" scenarios. I'm just saying be careful. You don't want to be in a legal situation where you are god forbid responsible for damages on someone else's vehicle and get disclaimed. Or what if you're badly injured? Do you have medical insurance that would cover your injuries? It would suck if you're stuck with a bunch of medical bills.

You're saying it can't be proven the app was on, ok, that might be true but if you do have an accident during Phase 1 and report the claim without disclosing you were Ubering at the time isn't that lying???

Read your policy careful, make sure they are ok with what you are doing.

Just be safe rather than sorry about it later! I'm not trying to rain on your parade but Uber doesn't have your back in these situations.


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## JPU

Well it wouldnt be ethical of him to tell me i wouldnt be dropped if the company would drop you. That wouldnalso be fraud and lying


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## dmcgeary1965

JPU said:


> Well it wouldnt be ethical of him to tell me i wouldnt be dropped if the company would drop you. That wouldnalso be fraud and lying


I can confirm from multiple sources that Liberty Mutual is fine with people driving for Uber. They just won't cover anything once the app is turned on. They will not drop you for driving for Uber.


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## JPU

dmcgeary1965 said:


> I can confirm from multiple sources that Liberty Mutual is fine with people driving for Uber. They just won't cover anything once the app is turned on. They will not drop you for driving for Uber.


Thank you. Thats all that i was trying to say... just trying to help. Now to wait for the times to update and ridesharing insurance comes to new york


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## Dcraw86

If or when will upstate New York's insurance companies start providing rideshare insurance???

*New Member*
If or when will upstate New York's insurance companies start providing rideshare insurance???

*New Member*
If or when will upstate New York's insurance companies start providing rideshare insurance???


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## dmcgeary1965

GEICO just informed me that they will not be renewing my personal auto policy. Simply because I ASKED them about ridesharing insurance a couple months ago.


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## tommay911

dmcgeary1965 said:


> GEICO just informed me that they will not be renewing my personal auto policy. Simply because I ASKED them about ridesharing insurance a couple months ago.


That's unfortunate. I have heard many times of GEICO doing that. Sorry.


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## Maven

Dcraw86 said:


> If or when will upstate New York's insurance companies start providing rideshare insurance???
> *New Member: *If or when will upstate New York's insurance companies start providing rideshare insurance???


We do not yet know, as has been stated several times. Watch this space.


dmcgeary1965 said:


> GEICO just informed me that they will not be renewing my personal auto policy. Simply because I ASKED them about ridesharing insurance a couple months ago.


Other drivers should take your unfortunate experience as a lesson. *Never* identify yourself to Geico or your current insurer when asking a rideshare question. Safest to work through an independent agent. If you are cancelled because of ridesharing then check out Liberty Mutual (which allows rideshare, but does not cover you while ridesharing), until something better becomes available.


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## JPU

Maven said:


> We do not yet know, as has been stated several times. Watch this space.
> 
> Other drivers should take your unfortunate experience as a lesson. *Never* identify yourself to Geico or your current insurer when asking a rideshare question. Safest to work through an independent agent. If you are cancelled because of ridesharing then check out Liberty Mutual (which allows rideshare, but does not cover you while ridesharing), until something better becomes available.


Its just easier to just switch to liberty mutual instead of asking your regular insurer..... its not worth getting blacklisted and you can always go back later


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## ChaseWolf

I checked my GEICO policy contract. The base policy says there is no coverage for "vehicles used to carry passengers or goods for hire." Sounds like I'm f'd, right? However, I have a policy amendment with my renewal that revises the exclusion to "[no coverage] *while the vehicle is being used *as a public or livery conveyance, including [...] in connection with a transportation network company." (my bold)

So, GEICO has specifically amended the language (in my contract, at least) to acknowledge TNC driving, and reduced the exclusion period from "vehicles used to carry passengers" to "while the vehicle is being used to carry passengers."

The contract also states the conditions under which they can cancel your coverage. Even in the case of fraud or misrepresentation, it says they must notify you in writing 20 days prior to the effective date of the cancellation. So yes, they can choose not to renew your policy, or they can cancel your policy in 20 days, but this whole idea of them retroactively cancelling and leaving you uninsurable is not realistic.

It would suck to have the cheapest available insurance provider cut you off, but you're not _doomed._


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## Maven

ChaseWolf said:


> I checked my GEICO policy contract. The base policy says there is no coverage for "vehicles used to carry passengers or goods for hire." Sounds like I'm f'd, right? However, I have a policy amendment with my renewal that revises the exclusion to "[no coverage] *while the vehicle is being used *as a public or livery conveyance, including [...] in connection with a transportation network company." (my bold)
> 
> So, GEICO has specifically amended the language (in my contract, at least) to acknowledge TNC driving, and reduced the exclusion period from "vehicles used to carry passengers" to "while the vehicle is being used to carry passengers."
> 
> The contract also states the conditions under which they can cancel your coverage. Even in the case of fraud or misrepresentation, it says they must notify you in writing 20 days prior to the effective date of the cancellation. So yes, they can choose not to renew your policy, or they can cancel your policy in 20 days, but this whole idea of them retroactively cancelling and leaving you uninsurable is not realistic.
> 
> It would suck to have the cheapest available insurance provider cut you off, but you're not _doomed._


The good news is that there is at least one other part-time TNF insurer in many states The bad news that is not yet true for NYS. Liberty Mutual is, at best, a partial solution, which allows you to rideshare, but provides no coverage while ridesharing, leaving you with the insufficient insurance automatically provided by Uber/Lyft. Commercial insurance is always available, but is designed and priced for full-time taxi-drivers.

Regardless of how you interpret Geico contracts, their actual policy in NYS is:

Cancel personal policies of people they determine do TNF (including ridesharing).
Flag policies of people they suspect do TNF for #1 at the earliest opportunity.
Force TNF people onto the more expensive commercial product.
Eventually, when it becomes available, offer a hybrid policy to part-time TNF drivers.
You can always consult a lawyer before or after you personal policy is cancelled by Geico to see if a lawsuit has any reasonable chance. If you do then please let the forum know what he says


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## ChaseWolf

No, if GEICO cancels my policy, I will have 20 days to sign up with Allstate or Liberty Mutual. I will not consider suing.


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## 221CNY_UBERdrvr

USAA, for those who have access to it, knows I'll be driving for Uber. It is not a problem for them. However, they do not cover under any of the thee Phases.

I'm currently looking into commercial coverage and personal insurance.


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## SalCoughdrop

Any updates on any of this? Looking into commercial insurance but it looks pricey. Unless someone has a recommendation on affordable commercial insurance in upstate NY?


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## scrooge64

Maven said:


> It's a really BAD joke for anyone in NYS who gets into an accident without proper coverage and relies upon the insurance provided by Uber/Lyft, especially during Phase-1.


It does seem that the greatest risk to the Uber/Lyft driver from an insurance standpoint is having an accident in "Phase 1" (app turned on while trying to solicit passengers). I wonder if a good risk management strategy would be to ensure that a driver would remain safely parked in Phase 1. Then, be ready to accept a request when one comes in. At that time, the driver would be in Phase 2 (going to pick up the passenger(s). Once the passenger(s) are picked up, the driver would be in Phase 3 until drop-off. At drop-off, the driver could either remain online (now Phase 1) if parking is safe, or go off line and drive to a safe parking place, park, then go back online. May be a good risk management strategy until insurance companies in NY offer ride sharing insurance.


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## Maven

scrooge64 said:


> It does seem that the greatest risk to the Uber/Lyft driver from an insurance standpoint is having an accident in "Phase 1" (app turned on while trying to solicit passengers). I wonder if a good risk management strategy would be to ensure that a driver would remain safely parked in Phase 1. Then, be ready to accept a request when one comes in. At that time, the driver would be in Phase 2 (going to pick up the passenger(s). Once the passenger(s) are picked up, the driver would be in Phase 3 until drop-off. At drop-off, the driver could either remain online (now Phase 1) if parking is safe, or go off line and drive to a safe parking place, park, then go back online. May be a good risk management strategy until insurance companies in NY offer ride sharing insurance.


Remaining parked when in Phase-1 is a strategy used by some drivers to minimize risk of accidents. Another strategy is going offline immediately after drop-off until you reach your "desired spot" to park and go back online in Phase-1. This is especially true if in NYC or other geo-fenced areas where you will not get requests anyway.


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## Jeffrey Bohan

Any companies providing ridesharing endorsements in Upstate NY yet??


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## shadowjos

Maven said:


> Remaining parked when in Phase-1 is a strategy used by some drivers to minimize risk of accidents. Another strategy is going offline immediately after drop-off until you reach your "desired spot" to park and go back online in Phase-1. This is especially true if in NYC or other geo-fenced areas where you will not get requests anyway.


Thank you for your suggestions.
I have been searching periodically since September 2017 but to this day I have not been able to find any company offering this kind of policy. I am back on the road using the strategy that you recommend but I would like to be able to just have a policy and be able to work with more confidence.
Any suggestions or recommendations are welcomed.


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## Jeffrey Bohan

I received a reply from State Farm saying they would allow on a personal policy as long as mileage wasn't more than 50% of what I would normally drive. Not sure how that is figured out.


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## shadowjos

Jeffrey Bohan said:


> I received a reply from State Farm saying they would allow on a personal policy as long as mileage wasn't more than 50% of what I would normally drive. Not sure how that is figured out.


I'd like to assume that the language in that statement means that the vehicle should not be 100% for business (i.e you bought a second vehicle specifically for Uber and that's your main source of income) and only occasional personal use. Must be a way to legally cover themselves.
They told you that you can drive for Uber but, how about coverage? Did they include a rideshare clause on your current policy? Did they increase your premium a little to include this coverage?


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## Jeffrey Bohan

You are correct, they are not including a ride-share clause, just allowing you to do so (under uber and lyft insurance) on a personal policy. Meaning they won't cancel you for doing this as long as it is less than 50% of mileage. It seems that all the insurance companies are taking time to develop this in Upstate NY (could be something having to do with state government requirements or the insurance companies don't like the requirements?). How long has it taken in other states once allowed by state legislatures? This might give a clue when insurance companies will add Upstate NY to their lists. Geico has 39 states it has this coverage in so far, so its not like they don't want to do it at all.


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## shadowjos

Jeffrey Bohan said:


> You are correct, they are not including a ride-share clause, just allowing you to do so (under uber and lyft insurance) on a personal policy. Meaning they won't cancel you for doing this as long as it is less than 50% of mileage. It seems that all the insurance companies are taking time to develop this in Upstate NY (could be something having to do with state government requirements or the insurance companies don't like the requirements?). How long has it taken in other states once allowed by state legislatures? This might give a clue when insurance companies will add Upstate NY to their lists. Geico has 39 states it has this coverage in so far, so its not like they don't want to do it at all.


I have owned vehicles (Only personal, not business or rideshare) and lived as an adult in two states, Texas and NY. I can tell you that in Texas it is so easy to obtain any kind of insurance, even gap insurance was only a couple of bucks every six months on the same personal policy. So definitely in other states it is probably much easier for insurance companies to offer new products. I would definitely recommend to our friends in other states reading this to shell out a few extra bucks for a robust insurance package, buy additional coverage, disability and so on if it is available to you. NY seems to be much slower than most other states when it comes to insurance. Not sure about the benefits/protections to consumers or political implications that may be the reason behind this.

I suspect that Upstate will get rideshare insurance options much quicker than us here in the NYC suburbs, as we inevitably end up driving to NYC to do drop offs very often. Even to go from one area of my region (Nassau and Suffolk counties) to another area (Westchester and Rockland counties) we have to pass through areas of NYC (Queens and the Bronx) and insurance NYC is a whole other deal.

Any information is appreciated. I hope we can have options soon so we can all make money and be properly covered.


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## Jefo

So far on Long Island there still isn't any ride share ins. that i can find. they say that state farm won't cover you during ride share. and won't drop you if you do . also Liberty Mutual is the same so i've been told.


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## JPU

State farm will definately drop you if they find out. Liberty mutual is the only one who wont currently. I am with them


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## shadowjos

Hello all, It's July 2018 and I still cannot find any rideshare insurance options for non- NYC drivers. Has anyone had any luck?


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## islanddriver

Still no company's


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## 221CNY_UBERdrvr

As I recall, from another thread on the subject of companies that won't cancel on you - Nation Wide is one. Personal experience is that USAA (for my fellow Veterans out there) won't drop you either.

NYC requires commercial insurance. The rest of the state does not. No company provides Phase One coverage at all, for now.


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## islanddriver

Also state farm and liberity mutial


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## Rhogue

Gap coverage wasn't offered by any company until recently from what I have heard as it was pending state approval. Recently Allstate acquired that approval and is now offering rideshare endorsement on personal policies which covers all phases. You can ask your local Allstate agent for further information, or you can contact an agent I use personally:

Agent Information:
Michael Thomas
Office: 585-334-1780
Fax: 585-334-4189
Cell: 585-738-1781
Email: [email protected]


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