# Lyft Weighs in the Ruling - Provides more specifics than Uber



## _Tron_ (Feb 9, 2020)

Just go this email from Lyft. It makes reference to only hiring 10-20% of drivers. Would hire only full time drivers...


*Take action to keep your flexibility *Earlier this week the State of California obtained a court order that would take away your ability to earn with Lyft when and where you want - and it could prevent you from driving with Lyft altogether. We want to make sure you have the latest information on what the court order means for you, what we're doing, and how you can help.


*What's at stake? *The court order requires Lyft to make all drivers employees after August 20. We know that's not what most drivers want - surveys show 70% of drivers want to remain independent contractors. And it poses some crucial challenges to the platform. Here's why:
*Reducing the number of drivers who can use Lyft *
We could only hire a small number of you - we'd likely aim to hire 10-20% of the Californians who drive with us now. We would likely have to choose those who drive full-time over those who drive part-time, not the 80% of drivers who do this fewer than 20 hours a week.
*Limiting the amount you can earn *
Drivers who get hired as employees would likely have a set hourly wage and no ability to earn more on top of that.
*Assigning scheduled shifts *
We would need to plan and structure your hours ahead of time. We'd tell you when and where to show up for your driving shift, with no additional opportunities to earn. You'd likely have to accept all rides.
*Stranding thousands of Californians *
The communities who rely on us for essential transportation would likely face higher fares, longer wait times, or no service at all.
*What we're doing *First, we are asking the court to hold off on implementing this order until the voters can decide in November. If the court denies our request and forces us to move to an employee model, we will have no choice but to suspend rideshare in California. We don't want that to happen, and we understand it would be happening at the worst possible time, when many Californians are struggling to make ends meet.


*What you can do *We know there is a better way to get drivers more benefits - like *a minimum earnings guarantee, mileage reimbursement, a health care subsidy, and occupational accident insurance* - while still keeping your flexibility. The ballot measure, Prop 22, protects your flexibility while guaranteeing the benefits you've told us you care most about. We believe voters, not the courts or politicians, should decide in November. Please sign up to join the campaign today, and let other drivers know to sign up as well.


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## PioneerXi (Apr 20, 2018)

After months of silence the first written words from Lyft attempts to install fear in drivers.

We would only hire some of you.
Your earnings would be limited.
You would be assigned shift.
But the greedy pricks did mention higher fares for passengers.

Lyft. *YOU* had ample opportunity before this ten day compliance order. Think of it as California Terms of Service.

If you don't agree, you can choose to not operate.

Let the dice roll Lyft.


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## JimKE (Oct 28, 2016)

The problem with this part...








is that a lot of readers here will think Lyft is just being dramatic.

But the fact is, that's a pretty realistic statement except for the "Stranding thousands of Californians" silliness.

Lyft *would have to hire far fewer drivers* than now use their platform.

Your *earnings would be limited*. You'd be paid $X/hour, and you'd work a certain number of hours. And for that, you'd be paid a certain amount every pay cycle. That's it -- no less, no more. Not one penny more.

And you *would have a schedule* that you'd have to work.

And you'd most certainly *have to accept all rides*. You'd be an employee, after all.

You think a grocery cashier can refuse to check out a customer because they don't like what the customer selected? Naw.

And _"the communities who rely on us"_  would be just fine. Public pressure, if not actual legislation, would require that "underserved communities" receive the service they desire.


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## _Tron_ (Feb 9, 2020)

There's some kind of poetic justice here. As cabbies have been morphing into Uberlike entities, Uber\Lyft are looking a lot more like traditional taxis than... taxis.

How long until we hear about drive A driving for 12 hours, and then driver B gets into the same car for 12 more hours? And they split the payments/maint.


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## mbd (Aug 27, 2018)

_Tron_ said:


> There's some kind of poetic justice here. As cabbies have been morphing into Uberlike entities, Uber\Lyft are looking a lot more like traditional taxis than... taxis.
> 
> How long until we hear about drive A driving for 12 hours, and then driver B gets into the same car for 12 more hours? And they split the payments/maint.


I think in the looting city known as Chicago, Lyft considered that concept. 
Drivers would drive Lyft's car for few hours a day . Hertz now has 800,000 cars available for sale.


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## Fusion_LUser (Jan 3, 2020)

_Tron_ said:


> Just go this email from Lyft. It makes reference to only hiring 10-20% of drivers. Would hire only full time drivers...
> 
> 
> *Take action to keep your flexibility *Earlier this week the State of California obtained a court order that would take away your ability to earn with Lyft when and where you want - and it could prevent you from driving with Lyft altogether. We want to make sure you have the latest information on what the court order means for you, what we're doing, and how you can help.
> ...


That's a pretty scary letter from Lyft, huh? Thing is Lyft really really really really screws the driver now so after AB5 I can't think of another POS company that will be totally petty and vindictive as Lyft will be to the ants when they become employees!

And that hourly pay is all you ants get no matter how much the pax pays should be the biggest worry for any AB5 shill out there. You are not going to get a base hourly rate then get the usual amount you bring in per hour. You are going to get a set amount and that asspenny of an amount will be what is paid to you before they take out taxes, insurance, union dues... etc.


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## I will crack Lyft hacks (Aug 5, 2019)

Fusion_LUser said:


> That's a pretty scary letter from Lyft, huh? Thing is Lyft really really really really screws the driver now so after AB5 I can't think of another POS company that will be totally petty and vindictive as Lyft will be to the ants when they become employees!
> 
> And that hourly pay is all you ants get no matter how much the pax pays should be the biggest worry for any AB5 shill out there. You are not going to get a base hourly rate then get the usual amount you bring in per hour. You are going to get a set amount and that asspenny of an amount will be what is paid to you before they take out taxes, insurance, union dues... etc.


F EM THEN!

Let them hire 20% full timers. While we all know 40% part timers would end up much cheaper.

Let them try to not serve Black Lives Matter hoods and see the backlash.

Let them not offer any service to disabled in underserved communities and see what happens.

F EM

Pay Poop rates and try to find 20% to do it full time? Ahh, I don't know. Maybe they might find a few people.

I assume AB5 is the driverless car and it's here, now I gotta deal with it and figure it out.

Good Bye Lyft!
It was a nice ride buddy.
C.A. Drivers can deactivate Lyft and download the next Cartel in town.

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## Stevie The magic Unicorn (Apr 3, 2018)

_Tron_ said:


> How long until we hear about drive A driving for 12 hours, and then driver B gets into the same car for 12 more hours? And they split the payments/maint.


Company taxis don't split the maintenance between the drivers, the company eats the repair costs, and the drivers just pay their flat fee and that's it.

This only makes sense under if there is either a medallion system, or a quota to the number of taxis.'

You'll get better revenue by having twice as many cars run for the same number of miles because you won't have to run lousy hours, you can also focus the shifts so that you can get better coverage on the busy times and not so good when it's slow.

IE scheduling 75% of your drivers to cover 4:30 Am to 8:00 am, 85% of your drivers to work 8:00 PM to 3:00 AM friday, and saturday. Running your cars 24/7 you can't be that flexible with scheudling,

And if you retire your cars at 350,000 miles it's irrelevant to cost PER MILE if your running them around the clock or not anyway.

The only reason running them around the clock makes any sense is if and only if,

Your limited to the number of cars you can have on the road.


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

10 or 20%. Well nice to see I got that part right....but with Lyft. Uber will be in the same boat: not all get in. Yikes.


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## Fusion_LUser (Jan 3, 2020)

I will crack Lyft hacks said:


> F EM THEN!


There you go! F EM. F EM TO HELL.

What about your little migrant friends? What are they going to do now that you got them banned from Lyft? Why don't you care about the migrants who will lose their job? Wow you really hate them, huh? F those migrants, right? Let them get a real job!


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## SHalester (Aug 25, 2019)

Well, uber did say this 2 months ago:
https://www.cnet.com/news/uber-says...ose-work-if-theyre-reclassified-as-employees/
I suspect there will be an Uber letter again on this very topic with scary things that 'might' happen.


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## Don'tchasethesurge (Dec 27, 2016)

Am I suppose to be scared? Am
I suppose to feel bad for poor lyft... uber and lyft had enjoy treating us like wanna be employees but didn’t wanna pay... oh well now suck it lyft


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## Illini (Mar 14, 2019)

Lyft is positioning this as a threat. Ummm, they just described millions of jobs across the US.
Anyway, I call BS. They'd hire all part-timers so that they don't have to pay benefits.


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## I will crack Lyft hacks (Aug 5, 2019)

Fusion_LUser said:


> There you go! F EM. F EM TO HELL.
> 
> What about your little migrant friends? What are they going to do now that you got them banned from Lyft? Why don't you care about the migrants who will lose their job? Wow you really hate them, huh? F those migrants, right? Let them get a real job!


I misspoke. I should have said guy in saturated market making crap, could be white, might be harmed more by all this. while the Indian hustler cherry picking making 50$ hour Would properly be negatively effected. 
Either way neither one had a say when Labor and politicians signed off on AB5.

Now the only thing we are sure is the rates will be similar to Taxi rates and anyone can get a Taxi license for a small fee. (most cities don't need medallions)

So to my little white friend in a formerly saturated market, I would say get a Taxi license.

If the drivers are still around with their cars, passengers are there as the pandemic cools, rates are similar, all they need is a app To connect them. Its just 25k for God sake.

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## TBone (Jan 19, 2015)

Hilarious. Time for the California folks to start looking real jobs.


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

_Tron_ said:


> Just go this email from Lyft. It makes reference to only hiring 10-20% of drivers. Would hire only full time drivers...
> 
> 
> *Take action to keep your flexibility *Earlier this week the State of California obtained a court order that would take away your ability to earn with Lyft when and where you want - and it could prevent you from driving with Lyft altogether. We want to make sure you have the latest information on what the court order means for you, what we're doing, and how you can help.
> ...


There's a lot of thing Uber/ Lyft "could" do.

What they won't be able to do is keep dropping rates.

On the contrary as minimum wage goes up, drivers pay will go up as well.


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## Paul Vincent (Jan 15, 2016)

Uber made some real changes in California. I think they've complied with AB5. We can refuse as many rides as we want without getting timed out. Uber only takes 20 or 25% of the fair, no more, no less. We can see how far we're driving to pick somebody up and if it's going to be a $3 ride we don't have to go drive 15 miles to pick them up. We don't have to take any $3 rides. Uber ask to be separated from Lyft in this action but I guess it didn't work. Lyft still sucks balls.


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## Bart McCoy (Nov 4, 2014)

Paul Vincent said:


> We can see how far we're driving to pick somebody up and if it's going to be a $3 ride we don't have to go drive 15 miles to pick them up. We don't have to take any $3 rides. Uber ask to be separated from Lyft in this action but I guess it didn't work. Lyft still sucks balls.


so cali shows destinqtion or what you will get paid on the trip before you pick up pax?


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

_Tron_ said:


> Just go this email from Lyft. It makes reference to only hiring 10-20% of drivers. Would hire only full time drivers...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ok, Lyft; don't let the door hit you on the way out.



TBone said:


> Hilarious. Time for the California folks to start looking real jobs.


Yep. It was good for a while (2014 - 2018 were the good years for me) but it looks like "the gig's up". Indeed time to start looking for a job.


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## Paul Vincent (Jan 15, 2016)

Bart McCoy said:


> so cali shows destinqtion or what you will get paid on the trip before you pick up pax?


Yes,we now get the pickup location, drop off location, potential earnings and how long it will take to pick up the person how long the drive itself will take with the person in the car.
Oh wait the best part... Uber takes just a flat 25% of the fair. If the fair is $100 Uber takes 25 you get 75.no more upfront pricing where Uber can take 65% of the fair.


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## #professoruber (Feb 19, 2018)

For a technology company, #lyft is very slow to implement new technologies. Their solution is the least to find the path that requires the least amount of investment. Ok, we will just rely on 20% of the drivers. Idiots!


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## Tesladriver (Apr 10, 2019)

JimKE said:


> The problem with this part...
> View attachment 498094
> 
> is that a lot of readers here will think Lyft is just being dramatic.
> ...


Don't forget if you are employee, the minimum they have to pay for is the minimal wage plus the $ 0.58 / miles (even the dead miles) I think that's better than 80% of the drivers can make ( not sure what gonna happen with the premium platforms) 40 hours 1000 miles week $1100 income...not too scary for me


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## WHOber72 (Jul 4, 2018)

Bart McCoy said:


> so cali shows destinqtion or what you will get paid on the trip before you pick up pax?


Yes


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## Bart McCoy (Nov 4, 2014)

Paul Vincent said:


> Yes,we now get the pickup location, drop off location, potential earnings and how long it will take to pick up the person how long the drive itself will take with the person in the car.
> Oh wait the best part... Uber takes just a flat 25% of the fair. If the fair is $100 Uber takes 25 you get 75.no more upfront pricing where Uber can take 65% of the fair.


not too bad, thanks for the info. I'm still on 20% around here, but any time you answer a ping, its potluck, you don't know if you going 2 miles or 22 miles


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## Fusion_LUser (Jan 3, 2020)

Tesladriver said:


> Don't forget if you are employee, the minimum they have to pay for is the minimal wage plus the $ 0.58 / miles (even the dead miles) I think that's better than 80% of the drivers can make ( not sure what gonna happen with the premium platforms) 40 hours 1000 miles week $1100 income...not too scary for me


What is with all these ants and their race to the bottom? I've never so many people happy that they will get minimum wage. If you are working Uber/Lyft for less than minimum wage now you are doing this wrong.

For most ants they make will above $15 an hour and because losers who can't do anything for themselves can't even manage to make $15 an hour driving the rest of us will now be locked in to crap minimum wage where we have to pick up everyone and anyone as employees.


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## The Gift of Fish (Mar 17, 2017)

Fusion_LUser said:


> What is with all these ants and their race to the bottom? I've never so many people happy that they will get minimum wage. If you are working Uber/Lyft for less than minimum wage now you are doing this wrong.
> 
> For most ants they make will above $15 an hour and because losers who can't do anything for themselves can't even manage to make $15 an hour driving the rest of us will now be locked in to crap minimum wage where we have to pick up everyone and anyone as employees.


Don't forget that under AB5 drivers will also get mileage reimbursement.

Also, it is California that devised, passed and is now enforcing AB5 because it wants payroll tax money from the gig companies. Do you think CA cares about the workers? Lol, it's all about money. AB5 did not come about because of "loser ants" - you're putting blame in the wrong place.


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## Fusion_LUser (Jan 3, 2020)

The Gift of Fish said:


> Don't forget that under AB5 drivers will also get mileage reimbursement.
> 
> Also, it is California that devised, passed and is now enforcing AB5 because it wants payroll tax money from the gig companies. Do you think CA cares about the workers? Lol, it's all about money. AB5 did not come about because of "loser ants" - you're putting blame in the wrong place.


I'm not talking about the blue plague in Sacramento who wants a bigger piece of the cake.

I'm talking about the ants here on UP who are all giddy about getting minimum wage. Even minimum wage with miles is laughable considering that you will now be picking up the fattest of the fattest pax at Wal*Mart for minimum wage before taxes and everything else that is taken out of your pay.

So enjoy your race to the bottom AB5 parrots.


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## Ambiguous (Jun 18, 2015)

Fusion_LUser said:


> That's a pretty scary letter from Lyft, huh? Thing is Lyft really really really really screws the driver now so after AB5 I can't think of another POS company that will be totally petty and vindictive as Lyft will be to the ants when they become employees!
> 
> And that hourly pay is all you ants get no matter how much the pax pays should be the biggest worry for any AB5 shill out there. You are not going to get a base hourly rate then get the usual amount you bring in per hour. You are going to get a set amount and that asspenny of an amount will be what is paid to you before they take out taxes, insurance, union dues... etc.


it's 120% the min wage plus .30cents a mile


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## observer (Dec 11, 2014)

Ambiguous said:


> it's 120% the min wage plus .30cents a mile


That's what Uber wants.

120% only while on way to customer from ping acceptance.

Uner AB5 you get 100% of minimum wage from the time you log on, till you get to customer, wait for customer, drop off customer and get to new customer. All the way until you log off.

Assuming just from ping to drop off Uber is paying you 80% less.

On miles again you will lose Uber only pays miles from customer to drop off.

Under AB5 you get paid miles from the time you log on till the time you log off to go home. All miles.

Again, you lose at least half the mileage under Uber.


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## Fusion_LUser (Jan 3, 2020)

Ambiguous said:


> it's 120% the min wage plus .30cents a mile


CA minimum wage is $13 for 2020 so ants get $15.6 per house plus a lotto winning like amount of .30 a mile. Wow I will be rolling in the money big time. Where do I sign up to give fat pax rides to Wal*Mart in the most dangerous part of the city? For $15 I'll do *ANYTHING*!!!!


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## MikhailCA (Dec 8, 2019)

Fusion_LUser said:


> CA minimum wage is $13 for 2020 so ants get $15.6 per house plus a lotto winning like amount of .30 a mile. Wow I will be rolling in the money big time. Where do I sign up to give fat pax rides to Wal*Mart in the most dangerous part of the city? For $15 I'll do *ANYTHING*!!!!


Hold on, hold on not so fast, you should become organs donor before signing up.


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## Ambiguous (Jun 18, 2015)

Fusion_LUser said:


> CA minimum wage is $13 for 2020 so ants get $15.6 per house plus a lotto winning like amount of .30 a mile. Wow I will be rolling in the money big time. Where do I sign up to give fat pax rides to Wal*Mart in the most dangerous part of the city? For $15 I'll do *ANYTHING*!!!!


the min wage is $15 an hour for Uber since they would have more than the allotted employees to pay $13.25


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## Fusion_LUser (Jan 3, 2020)

Ambiguous said:


> the min wage is $15 an hour for Uber since they would have more than the allotted employees to pay $13.25


With money like that rolling in before taxes and whatever wonderful deductions Uber/Lyft take out it's only a matter of time before I can buy that new Porsche 911 I've been looking at.

I'll be in my new 2020 911 sometime in 2087!


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## AvisDeene (Jun 7, 2019)

> like *a minimum earnings guarantee, mileage reimbursement, a health care subsidy, and occupational accident insurance* - while still keeping your flexibility.


If they had respected their drivers and offered this a long time ago, along with better mileage rates, things wouldn't have gotten to where they are today. I hope they crash and burn. They deserve far worse.


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