# Okay Folks, I Will Need A Hand . . .



## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Somebody has to do it. Please help me get it started

http://fundly.com/rideshare-association​


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## Luberon (Nov 24, 2014)

Kicked in with my 25 cents...


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Somebody has to do it. Please help me get it started
> 
> http://fundly.com/rideshare-association​


Problem with your idea is that there are already class action lawsuits going on right now. Funded by lawyers doing it on contingency. At least one of the major lawsuits is about employee classification, which, if the lawsuit is successful (or possibly even if it isn't), the rideshare companies will have to change the way they do business. I fail to see what good a lawyer can do with $20k against the industry.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

The 20k is to start the Association, membership will have to run it. If you do not think that we need nation-wide representation you are wrong, if we are subject to these lawsuits we may need representation more than we do now.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Luberon said:


> Kicked in with my 25 cents...


Thank You sir! C'mon folks put up or shut up. I don't want my ass hanging out here to be their target for nothing


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> The 20k is to start the Association, membership will have to run it. If you do not think that we need nation-wide representation you are wrong, if we are subject to these lawsuits we may need representation more than we do now.


Easy answer: stop driving for Lyft or Uber if it isn't profitable.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

RideshareGuru said:


> Easy answer: stop driving for Lyft or Uber if it isn't profitable.


We have over maybe 180,000 rideshare drivers nation-wide and we still take bullshit instead of making money . . . We need representation, not stupid responses.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Here is a reason we need representation: Do you realize that your contract with Uber allows for the negotiation of Service Fees? Wouldn't you like it if someone did that for us all so we weren't working for less than minimum wage? For at least three days I encouraged everyone read their contracts to see if anybody else saw what I saw, nobody even mentioned this portion of our contract. We need representation.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> We have over maybe 180,000 rideshare drivers nation-wide and we still take bullshit instead of making money . . . We need representation, not stupid responses.


If you think that stopping driving for them is a dumber answer than giving you money that they don't have, you need your head examined. I'm no fan of Uber by any means, check my post history. You'll forgive me if I don't trust someone who just shows up asking for money when others are willing to do the legal work for free. Some people sign santander leases, my response to them is : The stupid shall be punished. That would probably be your target audience to give you money; the people that were stupid enough to sign santander leases. There's a guy on this forum, @painfreepc, he might be able to get you names of people willing to donate to your cause, probably kick in a few bucks himself.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Here is a reason we need representation: Do you realize that your contract with Uber allows for the negotiation of Service Fees? Wouldn't you like it if someone did that for us all so we weren't working for less than minimum wage?


Yeah, I read the contract, and it specifically says you can only negotiate lower rates with the rider. Nice try. I think the contract flies in the face of IC law, but that issue is already being decided in court right now.


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## Truth & Facts (Jan 15, 2015)

In a fight, you need to know the enemy's strong and weak points.
Who likes Uber? The government? The news media? The drivers? The investors? The riders?

I would say only investors, riders and dumb drivers like Uber. If Uber loses money or market share, the investors will dump it as a used condom.

My daily practice is to piss off the bad riders first and non-tipping cheap riders next. Uber promises riders a fast, reliable and cheap service. As being an independent contractor, I will practice this way: slowly drive to pickup pin location, or never show up, or provide a safe ride only (anything more than a safe ride need to pay upfront).

There are so many ways to piss off *bad riders *or even discourage the *dumb drivers*. Use your brain. Uber days can be numbered now.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

RideshareGuru said:


> If you think that stopping driving for them is a dumber answer than giving you money that they don't have, you need your head examined. I'm no fan of Uber by any means, check my post history. You'll forgive me if I don't trust someone who just shows up asking for money when others are willing to do the legal work for free. Some people sign santander leases, my response to them is : The stupid shall be punished. That would probably be your target audience to give you money; the people that were stupid enough to sign santander leases. There's a guy on this forum, @painfreepc, he might be able to get you names of people willing to donate to your cause, probably kick in a few bucks himself.


If you think sitting here on this forum dooing nothing but *****ing is going to change things, you are wrong. We have legal recourse built into our contract than none of you has mentioned at all during my time attending this site, why not? I want to hire an Attorney and set up an Association for drivers and into the future. What is your contribution? To ***** about someone trying to do something? Sit on your backside and ***** all you want, but either put up or shut up because I have put my ass out here to be their target and I haven't the time nor desire to mess around with you. I do not have to do this. Would anybody else like to do this instead of me? Does anybody see where I am going with this or are you too short-sighted to realize we can win the day by uniting together?


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

RideshareGuru said:


> Yeah, I read the contract, and it specifically says you can only negotiate lower rates with the rider. Nice try. I think the contract flies in the face of IC law, but that issue is already being decided in court right now.


I believe you need to learn how to read a bit better.


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## Uberdawg (Oct 23, 2014)

Luberon said:


> Kicked in with my 25 cents...


It says one donor and $25 raised. Sure you put that decimal in the right place?


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Uberdawg said:


> It says one donor and $25 raised. Sure you put that decimal in the right place?


Yes, and that was done right after I posted the page and announced it here. At least one person on this forum wants to do more than ***** about things.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Listen Folks, I have hours invested in doing this, plus a little cash. If you guys do not think it worth it, then I should stop wasting my time and effort. But understand, as grown adult men and women you do not have reason to ***** if you intend to do nothing about it. I put myself out here doing this because I think 160,000 voices united are a damn loud voice that can create change. I will not end up being the President of this Association, I will not end up in charge of any of this. Elections will be held to set those positions and frankly I am not political enough to serve such position. But, I can at least try to get the ball rolling. It is entirely up to you. Promote this and get behind it, it won't hurt you at all and it is far more beneficial than sitting here doing nothing but arguing with Uber shills sent here to discourage anything like this. I say we need an Association with legal support to work for the betterment of rideshare driver for the future of rideshare.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> "Similarly, you and the Company shall always have the right to negotiate a Service Fee different from the pre-‐arranged fee. The purpose of the pre-‐arranged Service Fee is only to act as the default fee in the event neither party negotiates a different amount. "


You may want to read it again: "The parties acknowledge and agree that as between you and Company, the Fare is a recommended amount, and the primary purpose of the pre-‐arranged Fare Is to act as the default amount in the event you do not negotiate a different amount. You shall always have the right to:

(i) Charge a fare that is less than the pre-‐arranged Fare; Or (ii) negotiate, at your request, a Fare That is lower than the pre-‐arranged Fare (each of

(ii) And (ii) herein, a "Negotiated Fare"). Company Shall consider all such requests from you in good faith."

Section 4.1 of the November contract. You have to read the full sentence to get the context. But I'm sure you knew that, right? Again though slick, why should anyone give you a dime when there's lawyers doing stuff for us for free, when you've proven you can't even read and comprehend a contract?


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Listen Folks, I have hours invested in doing this, plus a little cash. If you guys do not think it worth it, then I should stop wasting my time and effort. But understand, as grown adult men and women you do not have reason to ***** if you intend to do nothing about it. I put myself out here doing this because I think 160,000 voices united are a damn loud voice that can create change. I will not end up being the President of this Association, I will not end up in charge of any of this. Elections will be held to set those positions and frankly I am not political enough to serve such position. But, I can at least try to get the ball rolling. It is entirely up to you. Promote this and get behind it, it won't hurt you at all and it is far more beneficial than sitting here doing nothing but arguing with Uber shills sent here to discourage anything like this. I say we need an Association with legal support to work for the betterment of rideshare driver for the future of rideshare.


And televangelists told people on welfare to send them money to improve their lot in life too, do you see them getting any better?


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> I believe you need to learn how to read a bit better.


Again, I posted the quote, section 4.1 in case you want to read the whole sentence.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Just a cautionary tale to anyone who feels the need to donate: There is no guarantee that this guy won't just keep the money that you "donate". The fundly FAQs spell it out pretty explicitly. If he doesn't reach his goal, he still keeps all of the money. There is no oversight and no recourse, it is a "donation". Read what he wrote already about negotiation of service fees, it's in section 4.1 of the contract, he left out the part about only being able to negotiate a lower fare. The guy is a scammer.We all know that the Uber contract is full of BS, but there are already some major class action lawsuits in front of courts right now, against Uber and Lyft to force them into federal compliance with employment laws. Giving this guy money is the same as throwing it into a wishing well.

https://fundly.com/how-does-it-work


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

RideshareGuru said:


> You may want to read it again: "The parties acknowledge and agree that as between you and Company, the Fare is a recommended amount, and the primary purpose of the pre-‐arranged Fare Is to act as the default amount in the event you do not negotiate a different amount. You shall always have the right to:
> 
> (i) Charge a fare that is less than the pre-‐arranged Fare; Or (ii) negotiate, at your request, a Fare That is lower than the pre-‐arranged Fare (each of
> 
> ...


Where are you reading this from. I do not have any of this in my contract. And, **** you! I at least5 tried to do more than you Mr, ****ingGuru Who the **** are you to talk shit to anyone? You are not doing shit but running your ****ing lip. What are you doing to improve anything? NOTHING! At least I am trying to do something positive. It is because of ********* like you that companies like Uber win. And let's back up a minute. What Attorneys are doing what for free? Are you talking about the decisions regarding employee/contractor? That has nothing to do with shit here. That decision will likely create a whole bunch of other issues that will continue to put real payment from reaching us, and those attorneys are not working for free at all, wait until you see their settlement. Tell you what, I'll agree to nominate you for Association President if you will just STFU and let grown ups discuss this. BTW, MY contract says none of what you are posting. I have no (I) or (ii) in my contract.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Well that didn't take long. Truth hurts folks, expose bullshitters and see how they blow up.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Where are you reading this from. I do not have any of this in my contract. And, **** you! I at least5 tried to do more than you Mr, ****ingGuru Who the **** are you to talk shit to anyone? You are not doing shit but running your ****ing lip. What are you doing to improve anything? NOTHING! At least I am trying to do something positive. It is because of ********* like you that companies like Uber win. And let's back up a minute. What Attorneys are doing what for free? Are you talking about the decisions regarding employee/contractor? That has nothing to do with shit here. That decision will likely create a whole bunch of other issues that will continue to put real payment from reaching us, and those attorneys are not working for free at all, wait until you see their settlement. Tell you what, I'll agree to nominate you for Association President if you will just STFU and let grown ups discuss this. BTW, MY contract says none of what you are posting. I have no (I) or (ii) in my contract.


I'm pretty sure that anyone who wants to read their contact will find it though. Section 4.1 clear as day.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

RideshareGuru said:


> Well that didn't take long. Truth hurts folks, expose bullshitters and see how they blow up.


You exposed nothing except that you do not care for the future of rideshare and your fellow drivers. That and my lack of desire to tolerate ********* such as yourself when there is far more important work to be done. You are nothing but a troll or a shill, and that my friend is the truth.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Does anybody have the sections he says are in the contracts?


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

RideshareGuru said:


> Problem with your idea is that there are already class action lawsuits going on right now. Funded by lawyers doing it on contingency. At least one of the major lawsuits is about employee classification, which, if the lawsuit is successful (or possibly even if it isn't), the rideshare companies will have to change the way they do business. I fail to see what good a lawyer can do with $20k against the industry.


We will need representation far more subsequent to the conclusion of these class-action cases than we do now.


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## UberXinSoFlo (Jan 26, 2015)

Rich, I get that you're upset, you did get suckered (at least that's how it sounds from your other posts). Unfortunately you are in the minority that got suckered so badly. 

You cannot be upset at those that are not in as deep as you. Most of the X drivers on here have either quit or just do it for the guarantees. Attacking people that don't share your frustration, will not help your cause. 

Think about how many cities Uber is in, don't you think that many attorneys around the country have picked through that contract thoroughly? Any attorney would love to be the one that found that one line in the contract that made it illegal and lead a class action lawsuit against Uber. Raising $20k to hire an uninterested attorney will not inspire him more than an eager attorney that is doing it proactively. 

There are many ways to go against uber, but I, personally, do not think this is the way. If you do decide to proceed, then best of luck!


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Does anybody have the sections he says are in the contracts?


Here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/rlp3o4oylh0zt4n/Partner Agreement November 10 2014.pdf


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> You exposed nothing except that you do not care for the future of rideshare and your fellow drivers. That and my lack of desire to tolerate ********* such as yourself when there is far more important work to be done. You are nothing but a troll or a shill, and that my friend is the truth.


A troll or a shill? Hmmmm, I told truth to your lies, and I'm completely for the class action suits. Sounds like you're libeling me.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

UberXinSoFlo said:


> Rich, I get that you're upset, you did get suckered (at least that's how it sounds from your other posts). Unfortunately you are in the minority that got suckered so badly.
> 
> You cannot be upset at those that are not in as deep as you. Most of the X drivers on here have either quit or just do it for the guarantees. Attacking people that don't share your frustration, will not help your cause.
> 
> ...


Let's be honest: $20k won't do a damn thing to fight uber. All it will do is let this guy recoup some of his own personal losses. If anyone on here wants to know who's telling the truth, simply look at your November partner agreement in section 4.1 and see who correctly quoted it.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

IndyDriver said:


> Here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/rlp3o4oylh0zt4n/Partner Agreement November 10 2014.pdf


Is the same section as i quoted, just not the whole thing. 4.1


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

RideshareGuru said:


> Is the same section as i quoted, just not the whole thing. 4.1


Yeah. Section 4.4 also states service fees are set by Uber and Uber has the right to change at any time.


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

I want to clarify my stance here, also. I do think Rideshare Drivers need a national voice, but you've gotta get the facts straight first.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> We will need representation far more subsequent to the conclusion of these class-action cases than we do now.


So give you $20k now, well before the conclusion of any of the class action suits, right? Wow, you won't give this up will you? I've already proven that you either don't know what you're talking about when it comes to the contract, or you are wildly trying to deceive people into giving you money (most likely its both) and anyone who cares to read the contract can see that. I'd have some respect for you if you just told the world the truth about your funding account: it's charity for you because you allowed yourself to be bent over and reamed hard by uber. There's precedent for cyber begging for things like this, your problem is you're not a hot chick.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

IndyDriver said:


> I want to clarify my stance here, also. I do think Rideshare Drivers need a national voice, but you've gotta get the facts straight first.


This guy is just trying to get himself a handout. He's relying on the ignorance of people just like uber does.


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

RideshareGuru said:


> This guy is just trying to get himself a handout. He's relying on the ignorance of people just like uber does.


True or not, I'm not donating money to someone quoting a dated contract for their cause. I haven't seen enough of his other posts to make a character judgement.

Let's see what he finds after reading the new contract all drivers had to agree to in November. Realistically, I don't know of many rideshare drivers who can afford to give money away. It's going to take a hell of a lot more than 20k to get the wheels rolling anyway.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

IndyDriver said:


> True or not, I'm not donating money to someone quoting a dated contract for their cause. I haven't seen enough of his other posts to make a character judgement.
> 
> Let's see what he finds after reading the new contract all drivers had to agree to in November. Realistically, I don't know of many rideshare drivers who can afford to give money away. It's going to take a hell of a lot more than 20k to get the wheels rolling anyway.


That's why i called BS on him from the start, unrealistic and has no idea about what he's talking about.


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## Uber-Doober (Dec 16, 2014)

IndyDriver said:


> Here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/rlp3o4oylh0zt4n/Partner Agreement November 10 2014.pdf


^^^
How would you negotiate a higher or lower fare?


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> How would you negotiate a higher or lower fare?


My best guess would be if you wanted to cut someone a break on a surge fare. Or if you take a bad route/otherwise bad experience to still get a 5 star.

I assume you would just submit a fare review explaining,


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## UberXinSoFlo (Jan 26, 2015)

IndyDriver said:


> My best guess would be if you wanted to cut someone a break on a surge fare. Or if you take a bad route/otherwise bad experience to still get a 5 star.
> 
> I assume you would just submit a fare review explaining,


Maybe if you felt that you gave sub-par performance you could email uber and ask them to remove the tip. Ya know, the tip that uber gives us for every trip.


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## Uber-Doober (Dec 16, 2014)

IndyDriver said:


> My best guess would be if you wanted to cut someone a break on a surge fare. Or if you take a bad route/otherwise bad experience to still get a 5 star.
> 
> I assume you would just submit a fare review explaining,


^^^
How would you do that on the app?


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

Uber-Doober said:


> ^^^
> How would you do that on the app?


The fare review button or whatever they changed it to on the last update. I don't have it anymore, I got deactivated last month. I just Lyft on occasion these days.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

IndyDriver said:


> Here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/rlp3o4oylh0zt4n/Partner Agreement November 10 2014.pdf


I will be damned. I have no such contract. HTF did we get screwed this bad. Hell, I got screwed with a car, the rest of you guys got raped with this contract, man am I sorry for taking shit back yonder. Holy shit, raped.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

RideshareGuru said:


> This guy is just trying to get himself a handout. He's relying on the ignorance of people just like uber does.


First of All; To all you *********, my intent was nothing less than honest. I wanted nothing but for us as a united voice. I have no desire to play politics and it was written in the setup that any money went to the Association and no one individual controlled it. My intent was sincere and until last night I have never seen that contract. Man, we are screwed unless a favorable response on the class-actions. Regardless, we still need a united voice. Does anybody want to take it from where I have it . . .


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> First of All; To all you *********, my intent was nothing less than honest. I wanted nothing but for us as a united voice. I have no desire to play politics and it was written in the setup that any money went to the Association and no one individual controlled it. My intent was sincere and until last night I have never seen that contract. Man, we are screwed unless a favorable response on the class-actions. Regardless, we still need a united voice. Does anybody want to take it from where I have it . . .


So, you admit that you don't even know the current state of affairs regarding uber and that the class action suits are imperative first steps to getting anywhere, right? My question still stands then: given that we are probably years away from resolution of any class action suits against uber, and they will probably change in reason to those suits, what good does giving you (or anyone for that matter) $20k do?


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Now, I have another question. Why doesn't the November contract show in my dashboard on the Uber site?


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Now, I have another question. Why doesn't the November contract show in my dashboard on the Uber site?


If you got deactivated they're not going to update your contract.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

RideshareGuru said:


> So, you admit that you don't even know the current state of affairs regarding uber and that the class action suits are imperative first steps to getting anywhere, right? My question still stands then: given that we are probably years away from resolution of any class action suits against uber, and they will probably change in reason to those suits, what good does giving you (or anyone for that matter) $20k do?


Contrary to the fact that the November contract does not show in my dashboard and thus I made an honest error, the need for a unified voice still exists. If and when the Class-Actions are responded to, the need for representation will be much more necessary. And, you are not giving me money for anything. You are giving you money collectively to put together an Association to represent us. I DO NOT need to be the one doing this, any one of you can do it for us. I will gladly get out of the way so you can do it. And, I do not appreciate the accusatory bullshit one bit. You seem to know everything, you set up the Association, get officers elected and into place for every city we serve, and set up legal representation for each city if necessary as well as prepare all the documents necessary to form the Association in every State we serve in, get everything together call for a meeting to vote on all the documents to approve submission, have the Attorney check for legal issues, and then write the check from your personal check book to start it off, and then give us a reason to unify our voice to reach positive result. I will support you! You obviously believe that the Class-Actions cover all the bases, they do not. But, I will not argue with you. I will not make false accusation about you. I will not make any negative comment about you at all. I WILL SUPPORT YOU AND YOU DO NOT EVEN USE YOUR REAL NAME, but you know more than I and we need someone that knows more than me, so please, YOU DO IT!

Because contrary to the crap you spit everywhere, we still need a united voice and representation.

And, you owe me an apology you ****.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Contrary to the fact that the November contract does not show in my dashboard and thus I made an honest error, the need for a unified voice still exists. If and when the Class-Actions are responded to, the need for representation will be much more necessary. And, you are not giving me money for anything. You are giving you money collectively to put together an Association to represent us. I DO NOT need to be the one doing this, any one of you can do it for us. I will gladly get out of the way so you can do it. And, I do not appreciate the accusatory bullshit one bit. You seem to know everything, you set up the Association, get officers elected and into place for every city we serve, and set up legal representation for each city if necessary as well as prepare all the documents necessary to form the Association in every State we serve in, get everything together call for a meeting to vote on all the documents to approve submission, have the Attorney check for legal issues, and then write the check from your personal check book to start it off, and then give us a reason to unify our voice to reach positive result. I will support you! You obviously believe that the Class-Actions cover all the bases, they do not. But, I will not argue with you. I will not make false accusation about you. I will not make any negative comment about you at all. I WILL SUPPORT YOU AND YOU DO NOT EVEN USE YOUR REAL NAME, but you know more than I and we need someone that knows more than me, so please, YOU DO IT!
> 
> Because contrary to the crap you spit everywhere, we still need a united voice and representation.
> 
> And, you owe me an apology you ****.


I owe you nothing. I was right about everything I said. Calling people a "****" is no way to try to get an apology. You are just like everyone else; you don't like getting called out, and when it's so obvious that you are wrong, you go to name calling. Your reputation is destroyed, not mine. I'm not giving you or any organisation like yours a dime. I recommend that no one else does either. My simple advice to all drivers is this:
Read the contract
Don't sign a santander lease, in fact, don't buy a car for ubering period
Know what your expenses are (hint: much more than just gas)
Be honest with yourself about what you are making after expenses
If McDonald's employees make more than you, get a job at McDonald's
Don't give this asshole (or any other asshole) any of your money


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## Lidman (Nov 13, 2014)

From a legal standpoint the best type of labor lawyers like Shannon Liss-Riordan et el. I'm just using this one particular lawyer as example of someone has fought against companies like starbucks/uber on behalf of the employees/IC etc.

But the obvious thing like rideguru shared is to let go of uber. Whether or not rates can be negotiated remains to be seen. (Not likely), but one can stop enabling uber simply by not driving for them. Sorry if some of this is redundant.

I wonder if Randy shears ghost is amongst us.


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## puber (Aug 31, 2014)

Which lawyer dou you want to hire, what did he say to you?


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

@Rich Brunelle
I've been battling Uber's duplicity towards it's own drivers since Aug 2014.
As you can see by @RideshareGuru setting upon you, this is a thankless effort. I for one applaud you. But you can gauge other forum members support by looking at:
1) Posts Applauding your initiative
2) likes to your post
3) Posts coming to your defense
4) donated money.

My conclusion is that most Uber Drivers are just fine with things just as they are. Or that they just like *****ing about Uber constantly, rather than Lyft a finger to change things.


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## UberHammer (Dec 5, 2014)

puber said:


> Which lawyer dou you want to hire, what did he say to you?


This is my question as well.

When suing a $40 billion company, a lawyer charges the plaintiff nothing, because the lawyer is going to get a ton of money from the judgement when they win. And this is why the lawyer won't take the case unless they think they can win. Any lawyer who would charge the plaintiff is a lawyer who is his covering his ass because he thinks he will lose. Why would you want to pay such a lawyer?


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> @Rich Brunelle
> I've been battling Uber's duplicity towards it's own drivers since Aug 2014.
> As you can see by @RideshareGuru setting upon you, this is a thankless effort. I for one applaud you. But you can gauge other forum members support you by looking at:
> 1) Posts Applauding your initiative
> ...


Here's the thing: uber drivers aren't a static group of people. The workforce is constantly changing through constant onboardings, deactivations, and people quitting. Some people use uber for part time or gap stop income. Others try to make it a full time job. Rates in some markets are good and drivers there can turn a decent profit. The stated goal of uber is to make transportation so cheap that people stop buying cars though, and that means eventually all rates are coming down. It's not worth the time and effort to keep driving for uber if your market isn't making you any money. And it's damn sure not worth spending money to try to get them to change their ways when there are ongoing lawsuits. I stopped driving for uber long ago. If uber changes their policies in a way that is favorable to drivers, i may drive for them again. In the meantime though, I'll leave it up to the lawyers and uber's own policies towards their drivers to bring them down. I believe if you are dumb enough to drive for $0.50/mile, you should be exploited.


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## NightRider (Jul 23, 2014)

RideshareGuru said:


> You may want to read it again: "The parties acknowledge and agree that as between you and Company, the Fare is a recommended amount, and the primary purpose of the pre-‐arranged Fare Is to act as the default amount in the event you do not negotiate a different amount. You shall always have the right to:
> 
> (i) Charge a fare that is less than the pre-‐arranged Fare; Or (ii) negotiate, at your request, a Fare That is lower than the pre-‐arranged Fare (each of
> 
> ...


I'll run this by an attorney later, but I believe that first sentence ends in "different amount" -full stop-. Note that it does not say "negotiate a _lower_ amount." I'm pretty sure this is Uber's lawyers trying to be slick and say one thing, but then try to mislead the reader with everything after that first sentence.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

All of what you've said is true. But that doesn't explain you calling @Rich Brunelle integrity into question.
Drivers need an association. Local Drivers Associations (LDAs) that can be coordinated by a National Drivers Association.
Drivers may be making money or not making money, they may be FT or PT, but they could use some unity of voice & representative leadership. Right now Uber has it's lawyers, lobbyists & PR operation, but drivers have no voice.
I've posted about this before:

The solution is for Drivers to actively inform other Drivers of this forum and to then form *Local Driver Associations (LDAs)*. These LDAs can then coordinate a *National Plan of Action* to force Uber to amend it's policies.

https://uberpeople.net/threads/poll...tation-to-the-best-of-my-ability.10943/page-2


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## Jeremy Joe (Jan 16, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> All of what you've said is true. But that doesn't explain you calling @Rich Brunelle integrity into question.
> Drivers need an association. Local Drivers Associations (LDAs) that can be coordinated by a National Drivers Association.
> Drivers may be making money or not making money, they may be FT or PT, but they could use some unity of voice & representative leadership. Right now Uber has it's lawyers, lobbyists & PR operation, but drivers have no voice.
> I've posted about this before:
> ...


Forming an LDA and then an NPA is a brilliant form of action. But getting drivers to unite is in reality very very difficult.

Look at it this way, there are 160,000 Uber drivers in the US. If drivers were frustrated enough to want change to occur, you'd expect at least 20% to be active on this forum. So that's 32,000 - but in reality, there are hardly 15 members who actively contribute here.

When you put that in perspective, you'll begin to grasp what a monumental task it will be to get enough drivers to unite.


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## Montgomery (Jan 7, 2015)

For this association to have any strength or power you would have to get the members to agree to a work stoppage (strike) when it is deemed necessary, just like an Union. We all know this isn't happening here.


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## Jeremy Joe (Jan 16, 2015)

Montgomery said:


> For this association to have any strength or power you would have to get the members to agree to a work stoppage (strike) when it is deemed necessary, just like an Union. We all know this isn't happening here.


Exactly, a STRIKE is practically impossible because of surge pricing. Plus rather than think long term and strike, drivers would rush out when they see it surge out of greed or more likely, desperation.


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## UberXinSoFlo (Jan 26, 2015)

Jeremy Joe said:


> Exactly, a STRIKE is practically impossible because of surge pricing. Plus rather than think long term and strike, drivers would rush out when they see it surge out of greed or more likely, desperation.


You need to do the opposite right now with the guarantees. Once they end the guarantees they are going to have to put out some numbers to justify removing it. They need to be able to say and defend that by dropping it 20% that they increased the average drivers' hourly fares by XX%. If more drivers online and drop that average, it will hurt them far more. Think about it, they want you to log off and go away, that way the remaining drivers will get more in fares.

I'm not sure about other markets, but in Miami it seems they are putting up fake surges for XL, it would seem like they are trying to get the customers to call 2 Xs instead of 1 XL. The XL is constantly surging 2-3x. I've seen areas with more XLs than Xs, but the XL was still surging and the X wasn't. They need X drivers to get busy and justify those cuts.


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## Uberdawg (Oct 23, 2014)

NightRider said:


> I'll run this by an attorney later, but I believe that first sentence ends in "different amount" -full stop-. Note that it does not say "negotiate a _lower_ amount." I'm pretty sure this is Uber's lawyers trying to be slick and say one thing, but then try to mislead the reader with everything after that first sentence.


I think this is right. The contract says :

"In addition, the parties acknowledge and agree that as between you and Company, the Fare is a recommended amount, and *the primary purpose of the pre-arranged Fare is to act as the default amount in the event you do not negotiate a different amount.*"

Never says you can't negotiate a higher amount.


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## UberXinSoFlo (Jan 26, 2015)

NightRider said:


> I'll run this by an attorney later, but I believe that first sentence ends in "different amount" -full stop-. Note that it does not say "negotiate a _lower_ amount." I'm pretty sure this is Uber's lawyers trying to be slick and say one thing, but then try to mislead the reader with everything after that first sentence.


Might be something here.. Does anyone with experience driving as an IC for other companies know if they have ever been able to negotiate the charge with clients? Maybe as ICs we are allowed to set our own rate, that's why they have to include that clause, but then added that we cannot increase it. Why else would that clause be in there? There is no real way for us to change the fare, wouldn't make since to even put it in there.

Would be nice if we could accept the trip, text the client and say that we, as the IC, are currently charging a $5 cash surcharge. If they don't want to pay it then they can cancel and get the next IC.


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## Txchick (Nov 25, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> @Rich Brunelle
> I've been battling Uber's duplicity towards it's own drivers since Aug 2014.
> As you can see by @RideshareGuru setting upon you, this is a thankless effort. I for one applaud you. But you can gauge other forum members support by looking at:
> 1) Posts Applauding your initiative
> ...


Exactly!! Agree 100% as we say in Texas Uber Drivers gripping constantly "all hat no cattle" which means griping with no action taken.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

RideshareGuru said:


> I owe you nothing. I was right about everything I said. Calling people a "****" is no way to try to get an apology. You are just like everyone else; you don't like getting called out, and when it's so obvious that you are wrong, you go to name calling. Your reputation is destroyed, not mine. I'm not giving you or any organisation like yours a dime. I recommend that no one else does either. My simple advice to all drivers is this:
> Read the contract
> Don't sign a santander lease, in fact, don't buy a car for ubering period
> Know what your expenses are (hint: much more than just gas)
> ...


Yes you do owe myself and everyone driving rideshare an apology. You started right from the git trying to attack my character when you do not even know me, you have come out entirely against ay effort to unify drivers, and have accused me of trying to rip off fellow drivers. To what end? I came here, *****ed, listened, and *****ed some more. Then I stuck my ass out there to try ands do something that might one day provide a positive result for drivers. So what I have a different contract and I didn't realize it. I never promised to be the "all informed" did I? The fact is the 160,000 plus drivers need to do something to create a unification of drivers. I invited you to do it. I invited everyone on this forum to do it. But, you won't do it will you? You don't see how the unification of 1/10th of our drivers could be a hell of a better voice than we have now and regardless your belief, we do need an Association. I will concede you are right about the contract. By why would Uber not put any contract drivers responsible to acknowledge on the drivers dash board? The November contract is not on my dash board. That does not alter the need for an Association. It actually speaks to the need for one. We need someone to keep abreast of all the bullshit they pull on us, so why not an association? Obviously, you have been around a while. If you have concerns about how I am setting up the Association, then you do it, or become an interim officer and help me do it. But, stop talking shit about me like you know me and accusing me of doing something wrong when I am trying to do something right.

How many others have tried to do something positive only to be ridiculed by you? At least I use my real name and do not hide behind a user name when I say what I have to say. Do you? No. you talk shit, make accusations, and slander people while hiding your true identity. I don't! You want to know who I am? Google me! There is not a thing hidden about me. I don't even care who starts an Association, so long as someone starts one. The need for us to unify will not diminish with the resolve of the class-action cases and the formation of the Association will not happen over night but will somewhere down the road provide for all of us the opportunity to be heard. So why do you want to shut that down? Sure, I am pissed at Uber. But, I am not seeking to take advantage of anybody else to get even. I operate on a much larger scale. What would cause more problems for any company that treats their workers as Uber does? An Association that could one day speak for 160,000 plus people at the same time. You do not have the right to stop such an association being formed, and while I recognize you have the right to your opinion, you do not have the right to attack my character or my honesty in trying to act for the betterment of all of us, including yourself, without knowing if I am sincere or not. And, I will say this again . . . I will support anyone else doing it. I do not need to be the one doing all this extra work for people that do not appreciate it in the first place. But, it needs to be done.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> @Rich Brunelle
> I've been battling Uber's duplicity towards it's own drivers since Aug 2014.
> As you can see by @RideshareGuru setting upon you, this is a thankless effort. I for one applaud you. But you can gauge other forum members support by looking at:
> 1) Posts Applauding your initiative
> ...


I am beginning to see the what you mean. This does not mean that the formation of an Association is a bad idea. I am sorry to see that there is so little support for such. I would have expected other to have been willing to become active participants in it's formation and growth. I didn't expect to be attacked in this forum and have my character questioned when nobody else is trying to do anything. Frankly, I am quite disappointed in how this has worked out. But, I do want to thank you for your supportive defense in my favor, it is appreciated.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

UberXinSoFlo said:


> Might be something here.. Does anyone with experience driving as an IC for other companies know if they have ever been able to negotiate the charge with clients? Maybe as ICs we are allowed to set our own rate, that's why they have to include that clause, but then added that we cannot increase it. Why else would that clause be in there? There is no real way for us to change the fare, wouldn't make since to even put it in there.
> 
> Would be nice if we could accept the trip, text the client and say that we, as the IC, are currently charging a $5 cash surcharge. If they don't want to pay it then they can cancel and get the next IC.


Presently SideCar is the only rideshare that allows the driver to change his rates. It is built into their app.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

UberHammer said:


> This is my question as well.
> 
> When suing a $40 billion company, a lawyer charges the plaintiff nothing, because the lawyer is going to get a ton of money from the judgement when they win. And this is why the lawyer won't take the case unless they think they can win. Any lawyer who would charge the plaintiff is a lawyer who is his covering his ass because he thinks he will lose. Why would you want to pay such a lawyer?


Because an Association does not hire a Lawyer to jump into a class-action. An Association hire a Lawyer to ensure the Association is legal and properly structured and meets the necessary requirements to speak for the membership, and then on an ongoing basis responds to the acts of the company to ensure agreement is reached as necessary not to cause harm to the membership. And, if necessary to file for relief of an act by the company, through the courts. Such as right now, an Attorney could file an injunction to require Uber either demonstrate to the courts that reasonable incomes are being earned by the drivers or change their rates until the matter could be formally reviewed by the courts.


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## RideshareGuru (Nov 17, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Yes you do owe myself and everyone driving rideshare an apology. You started right from the git trying to attack my character when you do not even know me, you have come out entirely against ay effort to unify drivers, and have accused me of trying to rip off fellow drivers. To what end? I came here, *****ed, listened, and *****ed some more. Then I stuck my ass out there to try ands do something that might one day provide a positive result for drivers. So what I have a different contract and I didn't realize it. I never promised to be the "all informed" did I? The fact is the 160,000 plus drivers need to do something to create a unification of drivers. I invited you to do it. I invited everyone on this forum to do it. But, you won't do it will you? You don't see how the unification of 1/10th of our drivers could be a hell of a better voice than we have now and regardless your belief, we do need an Association. I will concede you are right about the contract. By why would Uber not put any contract drivers responsible to acknowledge on the drivers dash board? The November contract is not on my dash board. That does not alter the need for an Association. It actually speaks to the need for one. We need someone to keep abreast of all the bullshit they pull on us, so why not an association? Obviously, you have been around a while. If you have concerns about how I am setting up the Association, then you do it, or become an interim officer and help me do it. But, stop talking shit about me like you know me and accusing me of doing something wrong when I am trying to do something right.
> 
> How many others have tried to do something positive only to be ridiculed by you? At least I use my real name and do not hide behind a user name when I say what I have to say. Do you? No. you talk shit, make accusations, and slander people while hiding your true identity. I don't! You want to know who I am? Google me! There is not a thing hidden about me. I don't even care who starts an Association, so long as someone starts one. The need for us to unify will not diminish with the resolve of the class-action cases and the formation of the Association will not happen over night but will somewhere down the road provide for all of us the opportunity to be heard. So why do you want to shut that down? Sure, I am pissed at Uber. But, I am not seeking to take advantage of anybody else to get even. I operate on a much larger scale. What would cause more problems for any company that treats their workers as Uber does? An Association that could one day speak for 160,000 plus people at the same time. You do not have the right to stop such an association being formed, and while I recognize you have the right to your opinion, you do not have the right to attack my character or my honesty in trying to act for the betterment of all of us, including yourself, without knowing if I am sincere or not. And, I will say this again . . . I will support anyone else doing it. I do not need to be the one doing all this extra work for people that do not appreciate it in the first place. But, it needs to be done.


**** off and die in a fire. You will get nothing from me. Not a dime, not an apology, absolutely nothing.


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

UberXinSoFlo said:


> Might be something here.. Does anyone with experience driving as an IC for other companies know if they have ever been able to negotiate the charge with clients? Maybe as ICs we are allowed to set our own rate, that's why they have to include that clause, but then added that we cannot increase it. Why else would that clause be in there? There is no real way for us to change the fare, wouldn't make since to even put it in there.
> 
> Would be nice if we could accept the trip, text the client and say that we, as the IC, are currently charging a $5 cash surcharge. If they don't want to pay it then they can cancel and get the next IC.


I mean, it doesn't say it can't be higher. I just read it as Uber will only make adjustments to a fare that are lower than their pricing. That $5 surcharge may skirt it. Curious to hear what @NightRider comes back with.


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## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Somebody has to do it. Please help me get it started
> 
> http://fundly.com/rideshare-association​


Uber is apparently using us all like guinea pigs. So what'd the association do? Have u considered helping other experiment subjects and pawns? Cadavers, lab rats, insects, etc?


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

The full text of sec 4.1 that discusses fares:

In addition, the parties acknowledge and agree that as between you and Company, the Fare is a recommended amount, and the primary purpose of the pre-arranged Fare is to act as the default amount in the event you do not negotiate a different amount. You shall always have the right to: (i)charge a fare that is less than the pre-arranged Fare; or (ii) negotiate, at your request, a Fare that is lower than the pre-arranged Fare (each of (i) and (ii) herein, a “Negotiated Fare”). Company shall consider all such requests from you in good faith.

If they are acting as our payment processor and solely our payment processor (to call us IC's), how do they have the right to only accept fares negotiated for lower than standard amount? Just because we accepted the contract? 

Either way, I don't see why one couldn't use a square etc reader for a surcharge or take cash. If they are just our payment processor and won't set fares that allow you to be profitable, who says you can't have another payment processor? Would probably get you deactivated once a rider reports it...I wish I was an attorney and knew how to read this damn lingo.


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## Sydney Uber (Apr 15, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> We have over maybe 180,000 rideshare drivers nation-wide and we still take bullshit instead of making money . . . We need representation, not stupid responses.


Nothing stopping folk who enjoy driving, picking up riders and seeing their City, from getting the appropriate licensing, operating permits and setting their own prices that they are happy to work for.

Or alternatively drive for another licensed operation part-time, you'll know what you will get paid, tipping is the rule and encouraged and you wont be putting your own car at increased risk whilst wearing it out.


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## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

Sydney Uber said:


> Nothing stopping folk who enjoy driving, picking up riders and seeing their City, from getting the appropriate licensing, operating permits and setting their own prices that they are happy to work for.
> 
> Or alternatively drive for another licensed operation part-time, you'll know what you will get paid, tipping is the rule and encouraged and you wont be putting your own car at increased risk whilst wearing it out.


That sounds smart, but most drivers are still in the USA. Being smart shows you ain't from round these parts. Keep it simple and refrain from such words as "whilst." Much of your audience say while and pronounces it wall.


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## Lidman (Nov 13, 2014)

Sydney Uber said:


> Nothing stopping folk who enjoy driving, picking up riders and seeing their City, from getting the appropriate licensing, operating permits and setting their own prices that they are happy to work for.
> 
> Or alternatively drive for another licensed operation part-time, you'll know what you will get paid, tipping is the rule and encouraged and you wont be putting your own car at increased risk whilst wearing it out.


 Spot on!!! I remember over decade ago when I delivered for Domino's Pizza, using my own vehicle. The first two years I made decent money until the wear and tear started rearing it's ugly head. By the 3nd of the third year and a few thousand $$ plucked down in auto repairs, I gave it up. My biggest mistake was doing it full time.

I can understand how it would easy to overlook the potential wear and tear when starting out with a new car. I am glad I only drive for lyft on occasion and rent the vehicle from a relative, who rents several of them for other commercial purposes.


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## Sydney Uber (Apr 15, 2014)

John Anderson said:


> That sounds smart, but most drivers are still in the USA. Being smart shows you ain't from round these parts. Keep it simple and refrain from such words as "whilst." Much of your audience say while and pronounces it wall.


Potatoe - Potartoe
Tomartoe - Tomaytoe


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## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

Sydney Uber said:


> Potatoe - Potartoe
> Tomartoe - Tomaytoe


Is u talkin about taters and tamaters?


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## Lidman (Nov 13, 2014)

There was a member here (forget his screen name) with a Joseph Stalin icon that used to post here. His input would be great on a thread like this. A good voice of reason.


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

John Anderson said:


> Is u talkin about taters and tamaters?


Don't ferget to warsh them taters and tamaters before you eat!


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## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

IndyDriver said:


> Don't ferget to warsh them taters and tamaters before you eat!


Wut yall knows bout fresh warshed taters up thar in Hoosierland. Ain't yall a grocery market only sossahty?


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> I will be damned. I have no such contract. HTF did we get screwed this bad. Hell, I got screwed with a car, the rest of you guys got raped with this contract, man am I sorry for taking shit back yonder. Holy shit, raped.


I get it. Went through the exact same misunderstanding of current contract when I got deactivated and @chi1cabby provided both versions. Why Uber doesn't provide access to it anywhere is definitely beyond me but probably another act of deception since they force it to the Driver app and you must agree to go online. Best of luck in your endeavor.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

John Anderson said:


> Uber is apparently using us all like guinea pigs. So what'd the association do? Have u considered helping other experiment subjects and pawns? Cadavers, lab rats, insects, etc?


We haven't formed the Association yet.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

RideshareGuru said:


> **** off and die in a fire. You will get nothing from me. Not a dime, not an apology, absolutely nothing.


This is actually a shame. You likely would be a valuable asset to the Association. You've been around a while, you have your head in the game, yes you likely would be a valuable asset.


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## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

Rich Brunelle said:


> We haven't formed the Association yet.


Much luck on it. The only problem with a labor movement of this type is the timing. The last labor movement was successful because all involved were either American or Americanized. At this time, immigrants are anything but assimilated. So, if you start an English speaking strike or Boycott, the others will go on as usual.

Remember, we are talking about people who don't even know to wait their turn in a dept store line.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

John Anderson said:


> Much luck on it. The only problem with a labor movement of this type is the timing. The last labor movement was successful because all involved were either American or Americanized. At this time, immigrants are anything but assimilated. So, if you start an English speaking strike or Boycott, the others will go on as usual.
> 
> Remember, we are talking about people who don't even know to wait their turn in a dept store line.


So, do we just roll over and play dead for them? I simply do not understand anyone opposing unifying our voice, creation of a group, with intent to take it to them as a group. Why would you oppose such? Your voice is not being heard alone. Nobody on this web site is taking any action to try anything, so why not do this?


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## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

Rich Brunelle said:


> This is actually a shame. You likely would be a valuable asset to the Association. You've been around a while, you have your head in the game, yes you likely would be a valuable asset.


I'm absolutely shocked shitless by all this mother****ing cursing and bullshit assed attitudes. We need to come together with a clean mouth and clean words to ****ing get along. I don't know what some of these mother****ers are thinking but they are going to learn today to act with some decorum and politeness and as if they got a mother****ing modicum of sense.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

John Anderson said:


> I'm absolutely shocked shitless by all this mother****ing cursing and bullshit assed attitudes. We need to come together with a clean mouth and clean words to ****ing get along. I don't know what some of these mother****ers are thinking but they are going to learn today to act with some decorum and politeness and as if they got a mother****ing modicum of sense.


Thank You John, I apologize for my loose use of unacceptable words. My frustration is not adequate excuse for my conduct.


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## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

Rich Brunelle said:


> So, do we just roll over and play dead for them? I simply do not understand anyone opposing unifying our voice, creation of a group, with intent to take it to them as a group. Why would you oppose such? Your voice is not being heard alone. Nobody on this web site is taking any action to try anything, so why not do this?


The United States conceded its place in world politics in the 1990s with the globalization bullshit. We all sat by stupidly while money was offshored right in our faces. If you want an effective argument against the crappy lifestyle in this country, you'd have to argue with Indians and Chinese. They believe the American lifestyle could move down a few notches still. Not joking, ask an immigrant from those places.


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## The Geek (May 29, 2014)

Lidman said:


> There was a member here (forget his screen name) with a Joseph Stalin icon that used to post here. His input would be great on a thread like this. A good voice of reason.


That would be @DriversOfTheWorldUnite ; perhaps he'll come out of 'hiatus' for us...


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## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Thank You John, I apologize for my loose use of unacceptable words. My frustration is not adequate excuse for my conduct.


I was talking about rideshareguru. Lol. You don't curse, do you?


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

John Anderson said:


> I was talking about rideshareguru. Lol. You don't curse, do you?


Yes, I must admit . . . I gave it as much as received it I think.


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> So, do we just roll over and play dead for them? I simply do not understand anyone opposing unifying our voice, creation of a group, with intent to take it to them as a group. Why would you oppose such? Your voice is not being heard alone. Nobody on this web site is taking any action to try anything, so why not do this?


I did try at one point. I emailed the holy Kalanick in December. He forwarded to my area's GM, who emailed me to set up a time to discuss my concerns over the phone. I coordinated with our local FB group to prioritize issues/concerns to discuss and was prepared. Of course, he never followed through with calling me at the times I suggested within his parameters or replying to any further emails, so I ended up blowing up on him on the day of winter rate cuts and getting deactivated as a result. I lost interest afterwards. I'd be happy to contribute if A) I had the money, and B) there was a framework of how the association was going to approach issues/a better plan of attack than it currently stands. My biggest issue is how the hell are you going to reach enough drivers to make it work? Request rides, send a text with the link, and then cancel?

Even when I was a part of the Indy Uber FB group, we probably had 10-15% of drivers in the area at best. I do believe Uber is knowingly exploiting drivers, but they also know it is all but impossible for them to organize in any numbers that matter.


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## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

IndyDriver said:


> I did try at one point. I emailed the holy Kalanick in December. He forwarded to my area's GM, who emailed me to set up a time to discuss my concerns over the phone. Of course, he never followed through with calling me at the times I suggested within his parameters or replying to any further emails, so I ended up blowing up on him on the day of winter rate cuts and getting deactivated as a result. I lost interest afterwards. I'd be happy to contribute if A) I had the money, and B) there was a framework of how the association was going to approach issues/a better plan of attack than it currently stands. My biggest issue is how the hell are you going to reach enough drivers to make it work? Request rides, send a text with the link, and then cancel?
> 
> Even when I was a part of the Indy Uber FB group, we probably had 10-15% of drivers in the area at best. I do believe Uber is knowingly exploiting drivers, but they also know it is all but impossible for them to organize in any numbers that matter.


You reached the blessed, the hallowed, the anointed? Were you nervous?


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

John Anderson said:


> You reached the blessed, the hallowed, the anointed? Were you nervous?


Not really. I was more worried about saying something to get myself deactivated than anything else, which I ended up doing anyway. I was actually slightly impressed in the moment that they were making an effort to reach out to a driver.


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## Fuzzyelvis (Dec 7, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Where are you reading this from. I do not have any of this in my contract. And, **** you! I at least5 tried to do more than you Mr, ****ingGuru Who the **** are you to talk shit to anyone? You are not doing shit but running your ****ing lip. What are you doing to improve anything? NOTHING! At least I am trying to do something positive. It is because of ********* like you that companies like Uber win. And let's back up a minute. What Attorneys are doing what for free? Are you talking about the decisions regarding employee/contractor? That has nothing to do with shit here. That decision will likely create a whole bunch of other issues that will continue to put real payment from reaching us, and those attorneys are not working for free at all, wait until you see their settlement. Tell you what, I'll agree to nominate you for Association President if you will just STFU and let grown ups discuss this. BTW, MY contract says none of what you are posting. I have no (I) or (ii) in my contract.


Then I think you're the only one without that on your contract.


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## Fuzzyelvis (Dec 7, 2014)

Jeremy Joe said:


> Exactly, a STRIKE is practically impossible because of surge pricing. Plus rather than think long term and strike, drivers would rush out when they see it surge out of greed or more likely, desperation.


Strikes work because the union pays people while they strike. Also there is a picket line and scabs (those crossing it) are at best stigmatized. We have no picket line and no way to chase down scabs if if we could organize.


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## Chauffeur_James (Dec 12, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Where are you reading this from. I do not have any of this in my contract. And, **** you! I at least5 tried to do more than you Mr, ****ingGuru Who the **** are you to talk shit to anyone? You are not doing shit but running your ****ing lip. What are you doing to improve anything? NOTHING! At least I am trying to do something positive. It is because of ********* like you that companies like Uber win. And let's back up a minute. What Attorneys are doing what for free? Are you talking about the decisions regarding employee/contractor? That has nothing to do with shit here. That decision will likely create a whole bunch of other issues that will continue to put real payment from reaching us, and those attorneys are not working for free at all, wait until you see their settlement. Tell you what, I'll agree to nominate you for Association President if you will just STFU and let grown ups discuss this. BTW, MY contract says none of what you are posting. I have no (I) or (ii) in my contract.


Yeah, I can't wait to give my money to this "professional" that cusses like a sailor. What great representation we would get from a guy like you. My money will definitely be safe in his hands lol


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## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

Fuzzyelvis said:


> Strikes work because the union pays people while they strike. Also there is a picket line and scabs (those crossing it) are at best stigmatized. We have no picket line and no way to chase down scabs if if we could organize.


This was when workers were American. They no longer are. They're Indian. Uber could flip a penny in their cars and they'd still drive.


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## Truth & Facts (Jan 15, 2015)

This forum does not have 10,000 members yet.
Is this a forum for Uber drivers?
Actually, on this forum, there are more people on Uber payroll or riders than the drivers.


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## Fuzzyelvis (Dec 7, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> So, do we just roll over and play dead for them? I simply do not understand anyone opposing unifying our voice, creation of a group, with intent to take it to them as a group. Why would you oppose such? Your voice is not being heard alone. Nobody on this web site is taking any action to try anything, so why not do this?


you can form whatever group you want I'm all for it I'm just not about to give you any money


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## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

Fuzzyelvis said:


> you can form whatever group you want I'm all for it I'm just not about to give you any money


Um, you're going to have to give up some money.


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

It appears to me that some members here are so jaded by their bad experience with Uber that they have no desire to contribute anything to help improve the future state of the industry. Reminds me of a couple professors I had in college that couldn't stand that we could accomplish the same work on a computer in minutes that took them hours to do by hand when they were in school and assigned busywork that contributed nothing to my education.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Chauffeur_James said:


> Yeah, I can't wait to give my money to this "professional" that cusses like a sailor. What great representation we would get from a guy like you. My money will definitely be safe in his hands lol


Well, I was in fact a sailor in our Navy long ago, but I never intended to lead the Association nor be the representative of the drivers. I am trying to set up the Association from there officers would be nominated and elected. I have said repeatedly that I have no desire to play politics and that someone with a more political demeanor would be necessary for the job. There would need be all sorts of folks involved rather than myself. Surely, we can all see that we would need a smooth talking person with a hard to piss off temperament for the job. But, first we have to get all that in place and that is what I was trying to do.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Truth & Facts said:


> This forum does not have 10,000 members yet.
> Is this a forum for Uber drivers?
> Actually, on this forum, there are more people on Uber payroll or riders than the drivers.


That is believable.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Fuzzyelvis said:


> you can form whatever group you want I'm all for it I'm just not about to give you any money


Sorry friend, my pockets do not run that deep. I already have enough financial obligations that I support on my own. But, I guarantee you I will likely be the amongst the higher contributors to this if it continues. But, I am curious. What would it take for you folks to contribute to moving this forward? I put the donation amount at $25.00 because that is really pocket change. I piss that much away just buying crap from the local 7-11 store. Would lowering it to $10.00 make it more appealing to you? I mean, how low would I have to go to get you to trust that I do the right thing with your money? And, I do not have to do this alone. Anybody can ask to be an interim officer prior to elections. You tell me . . . what do you want me to do. This is not my Association, it is an Association that is owned by it's membership in which no one person has control or access to the money.


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## NightRider (Jul 23, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> I mean, how low would I have to go to get you to trust that I do the right thing with your money?


I hear there's a company doing experiments (of questionable ethics) trying to find out something quite similiar.


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## Txchick (Nov 25, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Sorry friend, my pockets do not run that deep. I already have enough financial obligations that I support on my own. But, I guarantee you I will likely be the amongst the higher contributors to this if it continues. But, I am curious. What would it take for you folks to contribute to moving this forward? I put the donation amount at $25.00 because that is really pocket change. I piss that much away just buying crap from the local 7-11 store. Would lowering it to $10.00 make it more appealing to you? I mean, how low would I have to go to get you to trust that I do the right thing with your money? And, I do not have to do this alone. Anybody can ask to be an interim officer prior to elections. You tell me . . . what do you want me to do. This is not my Association, it is an Association that is owned by it's membership in which no one person has control or access to the money.


I do think lowering it to $10.00 would help.


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## NightRider (Jul 23, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Sorry friend, my pockets do not run that deep. I already have enough financial obligations that I support on my own. But, I guarantee you I will likely be the amongst the higher contributors to this if it continues. But, I am curious. What would it take for you folks to contribute to moving this forward? I put the donation amount at $25.00 because that is really pocket change. I piss that much away just buying crap from the local 7-11 store. Would lowering it to $10.00 make it more appealing to you? I mean, how low would I have to go to get you to trust that I do the right thing with your money? And, I do not have to do this alone. Anybody can ask to be an interim officer prior to elections. You tell me . . . what do you want me to do. This is not my Association, it is an Association that is owned by it's membership in which no one person has control or access to the money.


Serious answer: what target would we be looking to reach? In general, I'd say $10 is more realistic. If the right person (someone fairly known amongst the driver community that actively participate in online forums either here or reddit or wherever else) were to reach out to this online active community base, then $5 per person might even end up being a sufficient amount.


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## Txchick (Nov 25, 2014)

NightRider said:


> I hear there's a company doing experiments (of questionable ethics) trying to find out something quite similiar.


And you are referring to what???


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## NightRider (Jul 23, 2014)

Txchick said:


> And you are referring to what???


Our illustrious "partner", who else?


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Txchick said:


> I do think lowering it to $10.00 would help.


Okay, I set another donation level for $10.00 which will also be considered the 1st year of membership dues to the Association.


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## Chauffeur_James (Dec 12, 2014)

Truth & Facts said:


> This forum does not have 10,000 members yet.
> Is this a forum for Uber drivers?
> Actually, on this forum, there are more people on Uber payroll or riders than the drivers.


I really would find it hard to believe that Uber would waste time and money having people try to make uber look better than it is.

I think quite a few people on here are taxi drivers posing as Uber drivers trying to scare people away from Uber, because up until the most recent rate cuts you could have actually made a decent living driving for Uber, and I did. I made over $2,000 driving part time for Uber over the course of a month, but after the rate cuts this is just a dream.


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## Long time Nyc cab driver (Dec 12, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Somebody has to do it. Please help me get it started
> 
> http://fundly.com/rideshare-association​











Here's a hand


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## Long time Nyc cab driver (Dec 12, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> That is believable.


Donate to me instead.


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## Uber-Doober (Dec 16, 2014)

John Anderson said:


> That sounds smart, but most drivers are still in the USA. Being smart shows you ain't from round these parts. Keep it simple and refrain from such words as "whilst." Much of your audience say while and pronounces it wall.


^^^
Does it really matter how many 'partners' are in a poster's country or for that matter what country? 
Come on. 
You all work for the same impersonal juggernaut that does business periodically out of local hotel rooms and is currently seeing what the economic snapping point is for their drivers. 
Unity, Bro.... Unity.


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## Long time Nyc cab driver (Dec 12, 2014)

RideshareGuru said:


> This guy is just trying to get himself Da handout. He's relying on the ignorance of people just like uber does.


Donate to me, I'm honest as the day's are long.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Long time Nyc cab driver said:


> Donate to me, I'm honest as the day's are long.


Yes, I believe you would also be a valuable asset


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

IndyDriver said:


> I did try at one point. I emailed the holy Kalanick in December. He forwarded to my area's GM, who emailed me to set up a time to discuss my concerns over the phone. I coordinated with our local FB group to prioritize issues/concerns to discuss and was prepared. Of course, he never followed through with calling me at the times I suggested within his parameters or replying to any further emails, so I ended up blowing up on him on the day of winter rate cuts and getting deactivated as a result. I lost interest afterwards. I'd be happy to contribute if A) I had the money, and B) there was a framework of how the association was going to approach issues/a better plan of attack than it currently stands. My biggest issue is how the hell are you going to reach enough drivers to make it work? Request rides, send a text with the link, and then cancel?
> 
> Even when I was a part of the Indy Uber FB group, we probably had 10-15% of drivers in the area at best. I do believe Uber is knowingly exploiting drivers, but they also know it is all but impossible for them to organize in any numbers that matter.


So, why don't you climb on board and help me do this?


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> @Rich Brunelle
> I've been battling Uber's duplicity towards it's own drivers since Aug 2014.
> As you can see by @RideshareGuru setting upon you, this is a thankless effort. I for one applaud you. But you can gauge other forum members support by looking at:
> 1) Posts Applauding your initiative
> ...


Any chance you would like to join me in setting this up?


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## IndyDriver (Nov 6, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> So, why don't you climb on board and help me do this?


I'm not opposed by any means. It is something that needs to be done and I've got plenty of downtime right now.


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## puber (Aug 31, 2014)

I have an idea.

you should email zimmer your link and ask lyft to fund you.

they would do it themselves, but they would love to use a ****ed in a head driver to mess with uber's reputation


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## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Somebody has to do it. Please help me get it started
> 
> http://fundly.com/rideshare-association​


Having the right idea and doing it right can be light years apart. 
You just don't sound like the right guy to be doing this kind of thing.
Nice idea, but most of what I'm hearing about it is in your comments, that's not going to cut it.
Without have some kind of federal or state legal status with legal priviledges, so drivers' can have some kind of power, what good will it do? What are you going to do with the money? You have not told us what it's all about, how it will be organized, what are the dues, what are the benefits, and is the vision, plan, etc. You just want people to send you money, for what? Some vague promise? You need a slick website with the total vision and plan, your approach so far is no where on a high enough plateau where I would feel confident in giving money to. Yeah, I know even that takes some money, and some doing, but no one puts up a crowd funding pitch for a national or international organization idea on fumes , with nothing, no website, no professionals ( business people, legislators with whom you sought some counsel as to how to go about it etc etc) and a video, with some good video footage of the plan, maybe a congressman behind the idea. What is your background, what qualifies you do be doing this? Yeah, " I'm going to turn it over to someone else" ??? This is your plan? Jeezus f^ck, man, you honestlly think that puts you on the high road just because you have this idea, that the idea is needed, (and I agree that it is), but hey, this isn't cutting it, to be frank. You think you'are going to throw up a crowd funding pitch and drivers are going to send you enough money for the idea to get off the ground? First thing ( in my opinion ) you should do is create it legally, a non-profit corp, put the legal shell into place so the money is deductible. You, yes you, yourself, need to put some skin in the game if you want anyone to take you seriously. I really don't think you've thought this through, or you understand what such an undertaking really requires for even a remote chance of success, and you're not in the ballpark for having a chance to get off the ground.

Good luck, your heart's in the right place, but that's nowhere near enough. I could be wrong, who knows, but I'm not feelin' it, so far. 
By the way, challenging you or not sending you a nickel doesn't equal sitting around and *****ing or being equal to being an Uber shill, and you need to put a stop to that kind of language, here and now.


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## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Where are you reading this from. I do not have any of this in my contract. And, **** you! I at least5 tried to do more than you Mr, ****ingGuru Who the **** are you to talk shit to anyone? You are not doing shit but running your ****ing lip. What are you doing to improve anything? NOTHING! At least I am trying to do something positive. It is because of ********* like you that companies like Uber win. And let's back up a minute. What Attorneys are doing what for free? Are you talking about the decisions regarding employee/contractor? That has nothing to do with shit here. That decision will likely create a whole bunch of other issues that will continue to put real payment from reaching us, and those attorneys are not working for free at all, wait until you see their settlement. Tell you what, I'll agree to nominate you for Association President if you will just STFU and let grown ups discuss this. BTW, MY contract says none of what you are posting. I have no (I) or (ii) in my contract.


You are the wrong guy for this. I wouldn't give you a nickel. Hot heads don't get shit done.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Oscar Levant said:


> You are the wrong guy for this. I wouldn't give you a nickel. Hot heads don't get shit done. So you are the grown up? Get off your high horse, asshole.


And another superior being steps up to the plate. Excuse me, but you do not even know me. What you are referring to is part of a chain of comments in which I was being berated by another gentleman that doesn't know me, who pushed a few buttons, and yes I got pissed. I didn't come here for your personal attack. I came here with an idea. I came here with a damn good idea, and got treated quite poorly by an individual that also doesn't know me. I apologize for losing my temper, there is no excuse. But, what you haven't considered is that I never intended to be the head of the Association, only to get it set up. There will need be nominations and elections. I have already stated on more than one occasion that I have no desire to do it as I am not into politics and do not have the proper temperament to do it.

I also have invited anyone else to step up and make the effort. Would you like to set up an Association to represent RideShare Drivers nation-wide? I will support you every step of the way. No, you aren't interested? Well, I'll be damned. Then why are you trying to cause me grief while I make the effort? We can sit on this web site and complain all day long and get nothing done, or we can do something. You want to find fault with me for making the effort?


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## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> And another superior being steps up to the plate. Excuse me, but you do not even know me. What you are referring to is part of a chain of comments in which I was being berated by another gentleman that doesn't know me, who pushed a few buttons, and yes I got pissed. I didn't come here for your personal attack. I came here with an idea. I came here with a damn good idea, and got treated quite poorly by an individual that also doesn't know me. I apologize for losing my temper, there is no excuse. But, what you haven't considered is that I never intended to be the head of the Association, only to get it set up. There will need be nominations and elections. I have already stated on more than one occasion that I have no desire to do it as I am not into politics and do not have the proper temperament to do it.
> 
> I also have invited anyone else to step up and make the effort. Would you like to set up an Association to represent RideShare Drivers nation-wide? I will support you every step of the way. No, you aren't interested? Well, I'll be damned. Then why are you trying to cause me grief while I make the effort? We can sit on this web site and complain all day long and get nothing done, or we can do something. You want to find fault with me for making the effort?


I don't usually use swear words, I'm editing the post if possible. I was ticked. my first post, is the one to read, the just of which is that given what I'm seeing so far, you dont seem like the guy for this project. A well thought out plan, with a website, a video with some names backing the idea, ( advisors with experience to give the idea cred ), and a good dose of humility, is the way to go. Being high horsey, condescending, or telling others to STFU, hey man, that is not the way to do it.

My ponit is, you don't sound like the right guy to be asking anyone for money. You should find someone who is so capable, someone with experience, and see if you can persuade someone wh0 can do it, do it.

Nor am I the right guy for it, I just don't have the energy for it, and I'm involved with other goals,, like pitching my music and photography sites.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Oscar Levant said:


> Having the right idea and doing it right can be light years apart.
> You just don't sound like the right guy to be doing this kind of thing.
> Nice idea, but most of what I'm hearing about it is in your comments, that's not going to cut it.
> Without have some kind of federal or state legal status with legal priviledges, so drivers' can have some kind of power, what good will it do? What are you going to do with the money? You have not told us what it's all about, how it will be organized, what are the dues, what are the benefits, and is the vision, plan, etc. You just want people to send you money, for what? Some vague promise? You need a slick website with the total vision and plan, your approach so far is no where on a high enough plateau where I would feel confident in giving money to. Yeah, I know even that takes some money, and some doing, but no one puts up a crowd funding pitch for a national or international organization idea on fumes , with nothing, no website, no professionals ( business people, legislators with whom you sought some counsel as to how to go about it etc etc) and a video, with some good video footage of the plan, maybe a congressman behind the idea. What is your background, what qualifies you do be doing this? Yeah, " I'm going to turn it over to someone else" ??? This is your plan? Jeezus f^ck, man, you honestlly think that puts you on the high road just because you have this idea, that the idea is needed, (and I agree that it is), but hey, this isn't cutting it, to be frank. You think you'are going to throw up a crowd funding pitch and drivers are going to send you enough money for the idea to get off the ground? First thing ( in my opinion ) you should do is create it legally, a non-profit corp, put the legal shell into place so the money is deductible. You, yes you, yourself, need to put some skin in the game if you want anyone to take you seriously. I really don't think you've thought this through, or you understand what such an undertaking really requires for even a remote chance of success, and you're not in the ballpark for having a chance to get off the ground.
> ...


I have done quite a bit of the work already and I do not intend on setting this all up myself. The first thing to be done is to bring on an attorney and set up the association structure, bring in some interim officers and start getting the word out to others. But, I cannot do much without adequate cash flow to retain an attorney and money to advertise to other rideshare drivers to join. I am not asking for nothing but pocket change from any of you and your trust that I will do what is right with it. You don't think buying a 10.00 or 25.00 ticket is worth the risk? Then don't do it. I am not going to beg or try to force you to do anything. I simply believe that we ne4ed to form an association to unify the voices of the RideShare drivers so that we have a stronger voice than we presently have. So, if I take your $10.00 and invest it in flyers that I personally stand out in the SFO TNC lot passing out these flyers to drivers asking them to join us, will you have gotten your 10.00 worth? If those flyers attract 5 drivers to join us, I have already put your money to good use and done more than you in support of us as drivers. So please, if you want to help me, climb on board. If you don't then rather than talk against me, do something productive and supportive. You may think you have a grasp on how much work this is, I assure you it is more work than I intended to do. So how about a little help. If not help, how about support. If not support, how about just getting off my ass so I can do it without your negativity.


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## Oscar Levant (Aug 15, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> I have done quite a bit of the work already and I do not intend on setting this all up myself. The first thing to be done is to bring on an attorney and set up the association structure, bring in some interim officers and start getting the word out to others. But, I cannot do much without adequate cash flow to retain an attorney and money to advertise to other rideshare drivers to join. I am not asking for nothing but pocket change from any of you and your trust that I will do what is right with it. You don't think buying a 10.00 or 25.00 ticket is worth the risk? Then don't do it. I am not going to beg or try to force you to do anything. I simply believe that we ne4ed to form an association to unify the voices of the RideShare drivers so that we have a stronger voice than we presently have. So, if I take your $10.00 and invest it in flyers that I personally stand out in the SFO TNC lot passing out these flyers to drivers asking them to join us, will you have gotten your 10.00 worth? If those flyers attract 5 drivers to join us, I have already put your money to good use and done more than you in support of us as drivers. So please, if you want to help me, climb on board. If you don't then rather than talk against me, do something productive and supportive. You may think you have a grasp on how much work this is, I assure you it is more work than I intended to do. So how about a little help. If not help, how about support. If not support, how about just getting off my ass so I can do it without your negativity.


Here's my advice. FWIW

First off, cancel the crowd funding. It's way too soon for that. You need advice from professionals who know how to structure this thing.

Then you need a well thought out, plan. That would entail a group effort of like - minded professionals who've done things like this,
how to put a website, a video, how to get endorsements, and a competent plan with a vision.

Without such things, you're just dreamin'. It's like you jumped into a large boat, and you're the only pilot on it, but who has no training, whatsoever, on yachting and seamanship, like someone who doesn't know port from starboard, etc. That's what I'm seeing so far.

Good luck

PS, constructive criticism is not negativity, quite the opposite.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Oscar Levant said:


> I don't usually use swear words, I'm editing the post if possible. I was ticked. my first post, is the one to read, the just of which is that given what I'm seeing so far, you dont seem like the guy for this project. A well thought out plan, with a website, a video with some names backing the idea, ( advisors with experience to give the idea cred ), and a good dose of humility, is the way to go. Being high horsey, condescending, or telling others to STFU, hey man, that is not the way to do it.
> 
> My ponit is, you don't sound like the right guy to be asking anyone for money. You should find someone who is so capable, someone with experience, and see if you can persuade someone wh0 can do it, do it.
> 
> Nor am I the right guy for it, I just don't have the energy for it, and I'm involved with other goals,, like pitching my music and photography sites.


The message that irritated you was my getting irritated at another guy. And yes, I blew it. But for once, I just wish rather than argue with me, my fellow drivers would just pitch in your little $10.00 to $25.00 and let me try to make a difference. Is it really so much to ask? I am not looking to fight or argue with any of you. I just want us to be able to stand together and be heard. There are far too many of us not to be a strong unified voice. And, I do not intend to be beat up the whole time I do this. I am tired of watching us being taken advantage of and I am trying to do something about it. The interaction you saw earlier was because I have a different contract than the other fella and rather than him politely tell me that there was a newer contract involved, he got all offensive and accusatory. Okay so the contracts are different. All the more reason for an Association. So, here I am . . . Just trying to make a difference.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Oscar Levant said:


> Here's my advice. FWIW
> 
> First off, cancel the crowd funding. It's way too soon for that. You need advice from professionals who know how to structure this thing.
> 
> ...


Thanks


----------



## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Oscar Levant said:


> Here's my advice. FWIW
> 
> First off, cancel the crowd funding. It's way too soon for that. You need advice from professionals who know how to structure this thing.
> 
> ...


Thank you for your input.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Any chance you would like to join me in setting this up?


Sure @Rich Brunelle .
I'll pitch in.


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## John Anderson (Jan 12, 2015)

chi1cabby said:


> Sure @Rich Brunelle .
> I'll pitch in.


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## Long time Nyc cab driver (Dec 12, 2014)

Lidman said:


> There was a member here (forget his screen name) with a Joseph Stalin icon that used to post here. His input would be great on a thread like this. A good voice of reason.


You mean the communist dude , Joseph Stalin probably killed more Russians than Hitler did.


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## Sacto Burbs (Dec 28, 2014)

Ladies and Gentlemen, your attention please.

1. This thread is much more interesting when you ignore the OP.

2. Forced surge. That is the power we drivers have. Not strike, FORCED SURGE.

3. You make $10/hr net. Pay a non-driver in your city $10/hr to hand out UberPeople.net cards to Uber drivers. The person *Walks around downtown and goes to cars that show on the app. On this forum, we have posters from most cities. The card explains how a forced surge works. We just post what the target surge is for the day/night and how to do it. Start small, say 1.5.


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

So I skimmed this thread a bit and I'm sorry I don't have confidence as you will be the right individual for the job. Hiring a lawyer as your first order of business is not the first step. It comes much later.

1) you need to create a numbered corporation and select a board of governance.
2) Publish a charter on what you plan on doing and what the reason for the association will be and who it represents.
3) Get a website and create a membership structure for the association
4) Start to do meetings with both Uber and line up to meet politicians where the majority of your membership you represent resides. If you have no membership yet...start with your own state. Blog the results and show you have a plan. Results are what drives people to a cause.

Show results to drive more members.

All this will not cost $20,000 try $2000 if you are not good at keeping costs down.

I suggest you pick members of your board with talents that can help you start this like people who have run their own companies and can donate about 10 hours a week to start.

But hey...you little group is US only based on what I seen. So I'm out. And I have my own ways I'm dealing with things up here. And it doesn't involve a costly legal battle.


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## Sacto Burbs (Dec 28, 2014)

I volunteer the OP, because he's so keen to take action, to be the person responsible for creating the forced surge thread under his name and keeping it updated.


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## NightRider (Jul 23, 2014)

Sacto Burbs said:


> Ladies and Gentlemen, your attention please.
> 
> 1. This thread is much more interesting when you ignore the OP.
> 
> ...


I have a feeling that the second you post sufficient details on how to accomplish #2, the system will be reprogrammed to work around it.

The best thing to do would be a small, localized test of your concept. That means organizing with some of your fellow drivers in your market and getting together for some trails to measure things and stuff.


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## Sacto Burbs (Dec 28, 2014)

Already done - in Hoboken. This cuts to the core competence of the technology platform which is manipulating surges. There is no workaround for this on their end.

The test has already been done in one city. The next test needs to be done in three cities at the same time. Start a conversation with me to volunteer.


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## NightRider (Jul 23, 2014)

Actionjax said:


> But hey...you little group is US only based on what I seen. So I'm out. And I have my own ways I'm dealing with things up here. And it doesn't involve a costly legal battle.


Your post was great up until this point.. why does every post here have to include some minimum amount of jab? This is merely rhetorical, and not specifically pointed at you. I do think you provide good solid advice with what you said and appreciate the productive contribution.


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

NightRider said:


> Your post was great up until this point.. why does every post here have to include some minimum amount of jab? This is merely rhetorical, and not specifically pointed at you. I do think you provide good solid advice with what you said and appreciate the productive contribution.


That wasn't a jab....it was in the crowd funding and felt it was short sighted to do a US only group. But I can see how that came across. Fact is I have meetings lined up with our politicians and Uber here in Toronto to add some field prospective. So that Uber has a place here but our politicians don't get blindsided with Ubers pretty numbers.

I was hoping the Taxi industry in the meantime would start to find ways to improve on their model and close the gap of customer complaints. But they are to busy bashing Uber trying to run them out of town.

My stance...Uber has a place in the city. They just need to have their nuts cut off so they don't multiply the way they are doing it today unchecked.


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## NightRider (Jul 23, 2014)

Actionjax said:


> That wasn't a jab....it was in the crowd funding and felt it was short sighted to do a US only group. But I can see how that came across. Fact is I have meetings lined up with our politicians and Uber here in Toronto to add some field prospective. So that Uber has a place here but our politicians don't get blindsided with Ubers pretty numbers.
> 
> I was hoping the Taxi industry in the meantime would start to find ways to improve on their model and close the gap of customer complaints. But they are to busy bashing Uber trying to run them out of town.
> 
> My stance...Uber has a place in the city. They just need to have their nuts cut off so they don't multiply the way they are doing it today unchecked.


It might have been the "you little group [sic]", which may have a completely different meaning north of the border.


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## NightRider (Jul 23, 2014)

"...and your little group, too!"


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

NightRider said:


> View attachment 4848
> 
> "...and your little group, too!"


Now that's funny, and ya that does sound sarcastic when I read it back. lol


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## NightRider (Jul 23, 2014)

Actionjax said:


> Now that's funny, and ya that does sound sarcastic when I read it back. lol


..and I just realized the human Q-Tip is actually bubble wrap. duh!  Thanks google image search.


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

Yep. it's the UberX insurance policy. With full coverage.


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## Long time Nyc cab driver (Dec 12, 2014)

A drivers association has to start at a local level, the OP or anyone else doesn't have what it takes to start a national drivers association.

In Nyc there is a drivers association called the Taxi Workers Alliance, the were other Taxi owners Guilds .



If you would want to organize ride share workers, a union like the Teamsters would be a good choice, I think I remember reading something about doing that.

With a union you could hold no work nation wide strikes, that would get Uber's attention believe me. Especially if you did it for a week and anyone working gets their head broken by the Teamsters.

In the limousine industry, workers are also taken advantage of, I've only met one limousine driver in my life in NYC that belonged to the Teamsters, so I know that it is possible to be unionized.

There are a lot of people against Unions , but they're not all bad, the only reason Uber exploits people is because they can.

Your only choice now is to quit working for them, but as many people write here, there's always fresh meat, including the OP who I think intimated that he purchased a car with Santander. That's not too smart.


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

Long time Nyc cab driver said:


> A drivers association has to start at a local level, the OP or anyone else doesn't have what it takes to start a national drivers association.
> 
> In Nyc there is a drivers association called the Taxi Workers Alliance, the were other Taxi owners Guilds .
> 
> ...


I may not be a fan of unions. But because they are already organized and have clout....it's not a bad bet. Just do your research...you don't want to find you are paying huge monthly dues that dip into your profits and then you are just trading off fare increases to pay someone else.

But by far a good idea since right now no one can get organized on their own.


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## Long time Nyc cab driver (Dec 12, 2014)

Actionjax said:


> I may not be a fan of unions. But because they are already organized and have clout....it's not a bad bet. Just do your research...you don't want to find you are paying huge monthly dues that dip into your profits and then you are just trading off fare increases to pay someone else.
> 
> But by far a good idea since right now no one can get organized on their own.


If you make two or three times what you're making now, paying dues wouldn't hurt. My sister and my father belonged to unions and we're well paid because of belonging to a union. 
Work at Wal Mart and start to organize a union and see how quickly you get fired.


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

Long time Nyc cab driver said:


> If you make two or three times what you're making now, paying dues wouldn't hurt. My sister and my father belonged to unions and we're well paid because of belonging to a union.
> Work at Wal Mart and start to organize a union and see how quickly you get fired.


I have seen the good and bad with unions. I have never been a fan as sometimes their logic is not in alignment with what's happening in their sectors overall. Autoworkers unions were part of the problems in Detroit. Not to say that the ****ed up management shouldn't take most of the blame on the collapse. But from what I could see Unions tried to pick at the bones till there was nothing left. And in most cases you can't squeeze blood from a stone.

On the other side, I think the steelworkers unions have done a great thing for their memberships. Teamsters I don't know enough about them other than they were thugs for hire. But again that may not have much truth to it...I just don't know. (I may have watched too much Casino)


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## CJ ASLAN (Sep 13, 2014)

http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshh51ZoN8gqJd1r49LL


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

CJ ASLAN said:


> http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshh51ZoN8gqJd1r49LL


Great tried to click the link at work....now I got a security incident logged with IT....lol. Guess I will check it out when I get home.


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## Long time Nyc cab driver (Dec 12, 2014)

Actionjax said:


> Teamsters I don't know enough about them other than they were thugs for hire.


That's what you need to counter one thug, Travis Kalanick with a thug union. My father worked for Ford Motor Company, and yes the company did screw up by making cars made to fall apart once the car was paid off.
My sister worked in the television industry and she would have to had killed somebody to get fired.
Some unions take more than they give and some are really good.


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## Long time Nyc cab driver (Dec 12, 2014)

Actionjax said:


> Great tried to click the link at work....now I got a security incident logged with IT....lol. Guess I will check it out when I get home.


It's a hip hop video, I didn't watch it though.


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

Long time Nyc cab driver said:


> That's what you need to counter one thug, Travis Kalanick with a thug union. My father worked for Ford Motor Company, and yes the company did screw up byour making cars made to fall apart once the car was paid off.
> My sister worked in the television industry and she would have to had killed somebody to get fired.
> Some unions take more than they give and some are really good.


Travis is no Thug. He is one of those wimps holding an assault rifle.. Anyone can be tough with the right tools. First sign of a fist fight they shit their pants.


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## pengduck (Sep 26, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> Here is a reason we need representation: Do you realize that your contract with Uber allows for the negotiation of Service Fees? Wouldn't you like it if someone did that for us all so we weren't working for less than minimum wage? For at least three days I encouraged everyone read their contracts to see if anybody else saw what I saw, nobody even mentioned this portion of our contract. We need representation.


You might want to double check that part. I believe it says a client may negotiate a lower fare.


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## CJ ASLAN (Sep 13, 2014)

Actionjax said:


> Great tried to click the link at work....now I got a security incident logged with IT....lol. Guess I will check it out when I get home.


haha my job is super strict with internet access..I promise it's nothing bad, just a dumbass video I wanted to share.


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

pengduck said:


> You might want to double check that part. I believe it says a client may negotiate a lower fare.


And the right to negotiate a service fee can be interpreted you emailing a CSR to get either a cleaning fee or a cancel fee. Doesn't mean you can start to create your own. But I am just guessing on what I read into the statement.


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## Sacto Burbs (Dec 28, 2014)

Those moose people know they are the best in the world, eh, but wouldn't dream of saying so.

Hey Action how come you did t 'like' the post where I called you a git?


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

I liked it....I like all your posts. 

Just may have missed giving the like out.


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## NightRider (Jul 23, 2014)

pengduck said:


> You might want to double check that part. I believe it says a client may negotiate a lower fare.


Just for the sake of clarity, here's that section again (underlining is mine):

4.1 *Fare Calculation and Your Payment.* You are entitled to charge a fare for each instance of
completed Transportation Services provided to a User that are obtained via the Uber Services
("Fare"), where such Fare is calculated based upon a base fare amount plus mileage and/or time
amounts, as detailed for the applicable Territory ("Fare Calculation"). You are also entitled to
charge User for any Tolls, taxes or fees incurred during the provision of Transportation Services,
and, if applicable. You: (i) appoint Company as your limited payment collection agent solely for
the purpose of accepting the Fare, applicable Tolls and, depending on the region and/or if
requested by you, applicable taxes and fees from the User on your behalf via the payment processing
functionality facilitated by the Uber Services; and (ii) agree that payment made by User to Company
shall be considered the same as payment made directly by User to you. In addition, the parties
acknowledge and agree that as between you and Company, the Fare is a 
recommended amount, and the primary purpose of the pre-‐arranged Fare is to act as the 
default amount in the event you do not negotiate a different amount. You shall always have the
right to: (i) charge a fare that is less than the pre-‐arranged Fare; or (ii) negotiate, at your
request, a Fare that is lower than the pre-‐arranged Fare (each of (i) and (ii) herein, a
"Negotiated Fare"). Company shall consider all such requests from you in good faith. Company agrees to remit to
you on at least a weekly basis: (a) the Fare less the applicable Service Fee; (b) the Tolls; and
(c) depending on the region, certain taxes and ancillary fees. If you and Uber have
separately agreed, Company may deduct other amounts from the Fare prior to remittance to you (e.g.,
vehicle financing payments, lease payments, mobile device usage charges, etc.).

The stuff about "You shall always have the right to..." makes clear *SOME* examples of how you could "negotiate a different amount", it very much DOES NOT say that those examples are an all-inclusive list, it says nothing about NOT having the right to negotiate a higher amount.

Unfortunately, I haven't had the time to run this by any one of the attorneys I know. I'm hoping to get the chance tomorrow.


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## UberHammer (Dec 5, 2014)

pengduck said:


> You might want to double check that part. I believe it says a client may negotiate a lower fare.


Actually it says "negotiate a different amount". Here is is from section 4.1 from the contract:



> In addition, the parties acknowledge and agree that as between you and Company, the Fare is a recommended amount, and the primary purpose of the pre-arranged Fare is to act as the default amount in the event you do not negotiate a different amount.


The contract goes on by making a point that a "fare that is less" and a "fare that is lower" is a right of the driver:



> You shall always have the right to: (i) charge a fare that is less than the pre-arranged Fare; or (ii) negotiate, at your request, a Fare that is lower than the pre-arranged Fare (each of (i) and (ii) herein, a "Negotiated Fare").


Of course the driver has that right given the fare is established in the contract as nothing more than a "recommend amount". It's also the right of the driver to charge a "fare that is more" and a "fare that is greater". Charing less and charging more are BOTH rights of a driver in a contract where the fare is just "recommended" by Uber. Just because the contract mentions one of the rights that come from a "recommended" amount and not the other right that comes from a "recommend" amount does not LIMIT the rights of the driver. Uber's lawyers wrote the contract citing one right and ignoring the other to make it appear that the driver has no right to charge more. Of course they have the right. The fare is nothing more than just a "recommended amount".


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## jackstraww (Jan 20, 2015)

Listen Rich-
I dont think that people here disagree with the notion that having a voice ,having representation,, wouldn't be a good thing- it would be. However, this battle is not to be underestimated. You have Uber, you have taxi/limo commissions in every city and state clamoring that uber be regulated. There are pending class action lawsuits.
There are criminal issues , there are car leasing issues, there are issues upon ****in issues.....
Jeeesez, the President of the US even had to get involved. Sure , it would be nice to have a voice,,and your to be commended for your enthusiasm. I just think trying to finance any movement ,10-20 bucks at a time is a gigantic undertaking - While I support you and can agree with your ideology - what is needed is a massive influx of cash and law team willing to take on the fight for the drivers. I also think as long as we,re considered contractors ,its much harder to stand as one. How can there be total unity..if we are all separate.
Its not like we,re all employees of Uber .(even though we are,,,,,that's another battle)
I also think Uber knows this.
Startups use contractors for the simple reason that they are a lot cheaper than employees. When you're an independent contractor, your employer does not have to consider paying into Social Security or withholding taxes. So even though we are in the same hot water,,we are all in different boats- 
Hey,Im not a lawyer,organizer, or a politician - Those are the types support is needed from.
Sooner or later enough of the right people will see the the injustice that the drivers face and get behind us. Its happening already. It,s a painfully slow process....we all know the saying 
_"The wheels of justice_ turn slowly, but grind exceedingly fine".- - -Keep fighting the good fight,my friend
best
jack


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## NightRider (Jul 23, 2014)

jackstraww said:


> How can there be total unity..if we are all separate.


Mark my words: Next set of guarantees will require we maintain a distance of atleast 50 feet from other drivers at all times in order to qualify.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> Sure @Rich Brunelle .
> I'll pitch in.


@Rich Brunelle , on second thought, I think it'd be best that I not be involved in foundational work of this association, since I'm not an UberX Driver.
Sorry!


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## Sacto Burbs (Dec 28, 2014)

Actionjax - what are your talking points with the politicians. Share so we can replicate. Raquel kept saying that Sacramento is considering a minimum fare but I can't find anything about it. I could go direct to my relevant politician if I had a nice set of talking points.

I almost got another unaccompanied minor today except I put my foot down. Account holder was a woman, a man comes out with the kid, I say an adult must come with me on the trip, expecting him to go in and put on a pair shoes and go round trip to school with the kid. He goes inside and comes back out saying account holder's going to cancel the trip.

I think that's one area that the politicians absolutely have to make rules about. Talk about public safety issues.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

Actionjax said:


> So I skimmed this thread a bit and I'm sorry I don't have confidence as you will be the right individual for the job. Hiring a lawyer as your first order of business is not the first step. It comes much later.
> 
> 1) you need to create a numbered corporation and select a board of governance.
> 2) Publish a charter on what you plan on doing and what the reason for the association will be and who it represents.
> ...


 You offer some good advice. I wonder why folks would even suggest my not having confidence in my ability to get this up and running. Frankly with so much negativity, how do you folks face the day. I mean, would it hurt ya to wish me luck and show a little support? I have been working on everything you have noted above, but have to disagree with waiting for the Lawyer. I intend that everything about this Association be filed properly, the right tax structure, the right membership structure, and the money all nice and legal. I have already invited a few people to help and the door is open to others if they would like to hop on board. These volunteers will be the interim board officers and may be nominated to continue if they wish. And, I am not opposed to crossing borders to foreign soil, but know nothing about the laws abroad or above in your case. Another reason for an attorney to be on bo0ard for the set up. As for the money amount, what do you think a law firm is going to want for a retainer to respond to our legal needs? 48 states with their own set of laws, insurance, and policy . . . 10k might not be enough. Keep in mind this law firm is not for the class-action cases before the Court right now. This law firm is to ensure we do not get the shaft now and after the class action decisions, to ensure insurance meets our needs, to protect us from being run over by others. Attorneys cost money here in California. Some states may still have attorneys that will take chickens and goats in payment, but here in California they want the real deal dollar. Besides, with the response I have received thus far, I may as well be grasping at straws for money, but I guess I will work that out when I cross that bridge.

I tell you though, I sure would like a little more positive support here.


----------



## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

jackstraww said:


> Listen Rich-
> I dont think that people here disagree with the notion that having a voice ,having representation,, wouldn't be a good thing- it would be. However, this battle is not to be underestimated. You have Uber, you have taxi/limo commissions in every city and state clamoring that uber be regulated. There are pending class action lawsuits.
> There are criminal issues , there are car leasing issues, there are issues upon ****in issues.....
> Jeeesez, the President of the US even had to get involved. Sure , it would be nice to have a voice,,and your to be commended for your enthusiasm. I just think trying to finance any movement ,10-20 bucks at a time is a gigantic undertaking - While I support you and can agree with your ideology - what is needed is a massive influx of cash and law team willing to take on the fight for the drivers. I also think as long as we,re considered contractors ,its much harder to stand as one. How can there be total unity..if we are all separate.
> ...


Thank You. Have a little faith my friend, all it takes is a little to start the ball rolling. One of the things we are all missing is when you are a Independent Contractor your pay amount has to be enough to run your business and pay your own taxation, workman's comp, social security, and etc. None of us is getting paid enough to do that. So do we sit or do we do something. I may fall flat on my face with this, but not from the opposition. If I could get 1/2 of the drivers to become members at $10.00 each, I have no doubt we could make a difference. Face it, we are letting Travis take our money right out of our pockets and doing nothing. Why not give me a couple dollars and see what I can do? Follow that with a little support and hell , I might take over the planet.


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## Rich Brunelle (Jan 15, 2015)

pengduck said:


> You might want to double check that part. I believe it says a client may negotiate a lower fare.


this has already been discussed, I have a different contract in my profile.


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

Sacto Burbs said:


> Actionjax - what are your talking points with the politicians. Share so we can replicate. Raquel kept saying that Sacramento is considering a minimum fare but I can't find anything about it. I could go direct to my relevant politician if I had a nice set of talking points.
> 
> I almost got another unaccompanied minor today except I put my foot down. Account holder was a woman, a man comes out with the kid, I say an adult must come with me on the trip, expecting him to go in and put on a pair shoes and go round trip to school with the kid. He goes inside and comes back out saying account holder's going to cancel the trip.
> 
> I think that's one area that the politicians absolutely have to make rules about. Talk about public safety issues.


The main one is proper regulations. Fare minimums that can not drop below a certain mark without council approval. Transparent insurance including the right to have the paperwork submitted to council by Uber to operate. Also that Uber must maintain driver records and submit to audit to ensure they are completing proper checks on drivers, maintenance records, and oversight on complaints.

In a nutshell the government needs to have a hand in letting uber operate but there needs to be oversight that they are doing their job. I have compiled a list but don't want to share everything over the internet. This is a touchy subject and rather wait till we pass a few more meetings. Uber has been responsive to change but still want to run with impunity behind a wall of secrets. That's what needs to change most....transparency. As for the government well I'm not going to say anything right now other than its a work in progress. And there is progress.


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

Rich Brunelle said:


> You offer some good advice. I wonder why folks would even suggest my not having confidence in my ability to get this up and running. Frankly with so much negativity, how do you folks face the day. I mean, would it hurt ya to wish me luck and show a little support? I have been working on everything you have noted above, but have to disagree with waiting for the Lawyer. I intend that everything about this Association be filed properly, the right tax structure, the right membership structure, and the money all nice and legal. I have already invited a few people to help and the door is open to others if they would like to hop on board. These volunteers will be the interim board officers and may be nominated to continue if they wish. And, I am not opposed to crossing borders to foreign soil, but know nothing about the laws abroad or above in your case. Another reason for an attorney to be on bo0ard for the set up. As for the money amount, what do you think a law firm is going to want for a retainer to respond to our legal needs? 48 states with their own set of laws, insurance, and policy . . . 10k might not be enough. Keep in mind this law firm is not for the class-action cases before the Court right now. This law firm is to ensure we do not get the shaft now and after the class action decisions, to ensure insurance meets our needs, to protect us from being run over by others. Attorneys cost money here in California. Some states may still have attorneys that will take chickens and goats in payment, but here in California they want the real deal dollar. Besides, with the response I have received thus far, I may as well be grasping at straws for money, but I guess I will work that out when I cross that bridge.
> 
> I tell you though, I sure would like a little more positive support here.


I do wish you luck. But I would rather see you succeed. I been part of starting 3 different boards (2 non profit and 1 charity) and the lawyer Was not high on the list. And I don't think its needed still. Power comes from membership.


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## Casandria (Dec 20, 2014)

@NWAüber Very bad form! You have no right to make another member's personal information public.


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## NWAüber (Sep 11, 2014)

Casandria said:


> @NWAüber Very bad form! You have no right to make another member's personal information public.


I didn't make anything public, you idiot. It was already out there for the world to see:

http://www.whitepages.com/name/Richard-Brunelle/San-Leandro-CA/29ww4n3


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## Casandria (Dec 20, 2014)

NWAüber said:


> I didn't make anything public, you idiot. It was already out there for the world to see:


Only if someone goes digging for it. You're an asshat and your response only confirms that.


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## NWAüber (Sep 11, 2014)

Casandria said:


> Only if someone goes digging for it. You're an asshat and your response only confirms that.


So it only exists if someone looks for it? That statement is even more moronic than your last.

It was there before I looked for it, it was there when I looked for it, and I'll bet it's still there AFTER I've found it.


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

NWAüber said:


> I didn't make anything public, you idiot. It was already out there for the world to see:
> 
> http://www.whitepages.com/name/Richard-Brunelle/San-Leandro-CA/29ww4n3


It's still a bit of a shady thing to post.


----------



## NWAüber (Sep 11, 2014)

Actionjax said:


> It's still a bit of a shady thing to post.


No more, or less, than asking for $20,000 from a bunch of strangers I suppose.


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## Casandria (Dec 20, 2014)

He's being an ass in several threads. I haven't ignored anyone yet, but he was really irritating me so ignorance is bliss


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## Actionjax (Oct 6, 2014)

NWAüber said:


> No more, or less, than asking for $20,000 from a bunch of strangers I suppose.


Asking and getting are two different things. If people want to back crowdfunding and get screwed in the process I say let them. I don't think the OP was trying to do anything devious by his actions. And it may be out there, but calling it out here is probably not the best way to get a point across.

Just saying.


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## Casandria (Dec 20, 2014)

I personally think the OP is chasing unicorns, but this is the best place to post to try and get something like that going if you want to and I think posting his private information, no matter how publicly available it may be was uncalled for and done just to be ugly.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

NWAüber said:


> I didn't make anything public, you idiot. It was already out there for the world to see:





NWAüber said:


> No more, or less, than asking for $20,000 from a bunch of strangers I suppose.


I see what you are upto. You didn't like the fact that Rich was making an effort to start a Driver's Association. So you post his personal info. Even though it might be available freely online, it's still a violation of forum decorum. 
This shows your angle on the forum.


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## NWAüber (Sep 11, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> This shows your angle on the forum.


It does? Oh.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

NWAüber said:


> It does? Oh.


It certainly points where your interest lies. You would have deleted the personal info at the first mention, instead of dragging it out.


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## NWAüber (Sep 11, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> It certainly points where your interest lies. You would have deleted the personal info at the first mention, instead of dragging it out.


My interest lies in making money. And at $1.65/mile, I have no complaints yet.


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## Jeremy Joe (Jan 16, 2015)

Rich Brunelle said:


> You offer some good advice. I wonder why folks would even suggest my not having confidence in my ability to get this up and running. Frankly with so much negativity, how do you folks face the day. I mean, would it hurt ya to wish me luck and show a little support? I have been working on everything you have noted above, but have to disagree with waiting for the Lawyer. I intend that everything about this Association be filed properly, the right tax structure, the right membership structure, and the money all nice and legal. I have already invited a few people to help and the door is open to others if they would like to hop on board. These volunteers will be the interim board officers and may be nominated to continue if they wish. And, I am not opposed to crossing borders to foreign soil, but know nothing about the laws abroad or above in your case. Another reason for an attorney to be on bo0ard for the set up. As for the money amount, what do you think a law firm is going to want for a retainer to respond to our legal needs? 48 states with their own set of laws, insurance, and policy . . . 10k might not be enough. Keep in mind this law firm is not for the class-action cases before the Court right now. This law firm is to ensure we do not get the shaft now and after the class action decisions, to ensure insurance meets our needs, to protect us from being run over by others. Attorneys cost money here in California. Some states may still have attorneys that will take chickens and goats in payment, but here in California they want the real deal dollar. Besides, with the response I have received thus far, I may as well be grasping at straws for money, but I guess I will work that out when I cross that bridge.
> 
> I tell you though, I sure would like a little more positive support here.


I think one of the posters above gave you a good explanation as to why your Association idea will not be practical. Think Walmart - their workers have been unable to unite, despite the advantage of having a centralized workplace where they can physically meet and talk to each other daily. How do you expect such a thing to work with Uber drivers?

Plus another reason is many see Uber as a part time gig or a temporary stopgap gig till they get a job, they would not care about joining any such association when this is not their primary job.

Then there's surge pricing. Strikes are impossible with surge pricing. 10 strike, 20 step in.

Then also there's the problem of perception. While US citizens look at 5-6 bucks an hour as pathetic (and I certainly don't blame them for that), you got to realize that so many Uber drivers are immigrants who view it as a fair amount of money, because their living costs are extremely low and they would make much less back home.

I truly appreciate you're taking this initiative, all I am doing here by writing this is to save you time and effort because this is simply not going to work. I read some of your other posts where you wrote about losing out by buying a new car for Uber. I can imagine how you must be feeling and I know jobs are tough for those over 50.

A suggestion, look at Starbucks, I was there last week late and found at least 2 baristas well into their 50s working there. They pay 12 an hour and you have to deal with fairly decent respectful customers, plus your car won't get beat up and it's not as embarassing as working at McDonald's.

My suggestion is think about alternate income sources and put this Uber nightmare behind you. It will achieve you nothing and only destroy your health in the process.


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## Jeremy Joe (Jan 16, 2015)

Casandria said:


> Only if someone goes digging for it. You're an asshat and your response only confirms that.


Just looking at his avatar pic speaks volumes of his character. What grown man sticks his tongue out? That's what 15 year old girls do.

I should have hit the Ignore button on him a long time back, but I am about to do it now.

sure he'll reply soon .....probably calling me an idiot and saying that's not his own pic, but then what else do you expect....even if not his own photo, it still reflects his level of immaturity.


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## Jeremy Joe (Jan 16, 2015)

Long time Nyc cab driver said:


> ....there's always fresh meat, including the OP who I think intimated that he purchased a car with Santander. That's not too smart.


That's indeed, not smart AT freakin' ALL.

Stay away from Santander!!


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## Sacto Burbs (Dec 28, 2014)

OP stated clearly in an early post that he uses his real name and photo and sent us to his blog. He wants us to know all about him.

Poster is wierd but OP is a self promoter and therefore a public person. And most importantly...not funny.


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## Casandria (Dec 20, 2014)

Crap, I'm a self-promoter, too.


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## Sacto Burbs (Dec 28, 2014)

Wow, who's talking about 15-year-old girls with their tongues hanging out. A little too out there for me.


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## Bill Feit (Aug 1, 2014)

Arkansas...isn't that were Clinton is from?


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## Sacto Burbs (Dec 28, 2014)

He also posted that he only lives two hours away from me and dislike my posts so much that he would gladly come and do nasty things to me. The OP is a sicko making violent threats. He should be reported, not encouraged.

1*


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## Long time Nyc cab driver (Dec 12, 2014)

Sacto Burbs said:


> He also posted that he only lives two hours away from me and dislike my posts so much that he would gladly come and do nasty things to me. The OP is a sicko making violent threats. He should be reported, not encouraged.
> 
> 1*


Is it worth the trip for him ?


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## Sacto Burbs (Dec 28, 2014)

Such things cannot be known, grasshopper.


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