# Unfair to penalize for dropping blocks close to Check-In



## 6Yankee5 (Feb 25, 2017)

Today I picked up a one hour block at 10:57 am. The start time is 11:00 am. I live 35 minutes away. I had no choice but to drop it.
For that I can expect a nasty email plus time-out. That is not fair! 

Some people might say that I should fish closer to the warehouse. Well! I never know which warehouse I will get blocks from since we can pick up blocks from UTX4 & UTX7 as well as restaurants. So, the best I can do is to stay between both warehouses when I fish. And with all of that I still end up with the unpleasant e mail from Amazon Flex. Totally, not fair! 

I propose to Amazon Flex, that this is a recipe for creating disgruntled drivers and not conducive to fostering maximum productivity!


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## Showa50 (Nov 30, 2014)

Why accept if you know you can't make it? 

You're excuse/argument seems ludicrous.


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## cheerose (Aug 29, 2014)

Exactky -- you should be able to see which warehouse/location the block is for. If you know where they are and how long it will take you to get there / you'll know which blocks you can/can't take. 

Do I wish that the app took Location Services into account when offering blocks? Sure... but they don't


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## 6Yankee5 (Feb 25, 2017)

cheerose said:


> Exactky -- you should be able to see which warehouse/location the block is for. If you know where they are and how long it will take you to get there / you'll know which blocks you can/can't take.
> 
> Do I wish that the app took Location Services into account when offering blocks? Sure... but they don't


How many blocks have you secured after taking the time to carefully read all the information before you click on the ACCEPT bar?

Sir/Madam: I do not wish to judge you, so tell me,. Are you trying to deliberately trying to misunderstand what I am saying, or you are unable to understand and empathize?



Showa50 said:


> Why accept if you know you can't make it?
> 
> You're excuse/argument seems ludicrous.


Have you been able to say anything positive in all the numerous post you have on the various forum?


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## flexian (Aug 16, 2016)

Showa50 said:


> Why accept if you know you can't make it?


#HesTalkingAboutPrimeNowNotLogistics


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## Shangsta (Aug 15, 2016)

Your argument has been discussed here before. In some places, if you look to see whether a block if feasible you will have already lost the opportunity for it. I get that. 

However if they let people drop a block without penalty it would allow for the bot folks to further cheat the system. 

Ultimately when you accept a block you are responsible. I would rather get less blocks and know I can work the ones I grab then grab ones I maybe cannot do and get deactivated


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## flexian (Aug 16, 2016)

at some WHs (Prime Now) its not possible to see the restaurant delivery waiting location until after accepting the block and hitting "Start" to start deliveries

getting it w/2 minutes to spare, even being 1/4 a mile from some of these locations a driver still has no way 2 get there in time

the system worked fine back when drivers could drop blocks anytime

the catch is the blocks went right back out for all to have a shot at them

as far as i can tell they changed that bc specific ppl were being "directed" to certain blocks at the then-nightly drop but would throw them back, for all to see, which is the opposite of what the wh intended

now when a forfeit occurs the block disappears for the wh ppl to decide what to do, thus adding the human element back in (with predictable results)

even when picking up blocks theres this strange lag now while they decide which driver suits their affinities/neuroses/kickback-list before adding the shift to the driver's calendar


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## Ubercal (Jul 25, 2016)

6Yankee5 said:


> How many blocks have you secured after taking the time to carefully read all the information before you click on the ACCEPT bar?


Most of them in my case, yes taking the extra half second to confirm has cost me blocks. But I'd rather that happen, than continously take blocks I can't make and get deactivated.


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## Showa50 (Nov 30, 2014)

6Yankee5 said:


> Have you been able to say anything positive in all the numerous post you have on the various forum?


All the time 

Learn to spoof if you are so worried about dropping shifts.

See I just helped you.


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## geekorama (Jun 6, 2016)

6Yankee5 said:


> Today I picked up a one hour block at 10:57 am. The start time is 11:00 am. I live 35 minutes away. I had no choice but to drop it.
> For that I can expect a nasty email plus time-out. That is not fair!
> 
> Some people might say that I should fish closer to the warehouse. Well! I never know which warehouse I will get blocks from since we can pick up blocks from UTX4 & UTX7 as well as restaurants. So, the best I can do is to stay between both warehouses when I fish. And with all of that I still end up with the unpleasant e mail from Amazon Flex. Totally, not fair!
> ...


You're absolutely right, you cannot get a block if you thoroughly put thought lasting more than 1 second into whether or not you should accept a block. It's an issue for both the driver and Amazon.

1) they need to get blocks filled
2) you want blocks, but if you wait too long to accept, it'll be gone before you read it

The issue here is definitely on Amazon's end. They need to have some sort of filter for people that are currently too far away to properly make it to the dispatch location. Perhaps you should send an email and make it a suggestion. Make sure you let them know in the email that you have a suggestion, so they don't give you brainless canned responses about why you shouldn't accept the block, etc. Because they will.

Ask them to forward the email to management or the programmers, and they will. I do it all the time. Good luck.


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## jester121 (Sep 6, 2016)

geekorama said:


> Ask them to forward the email to management or the programmers, and they will. I do it all the time. Good luck.


LOL sure they will....

There's an in-app feedback feature that might actually be seen by someone, at least that has a chance of being read.


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## 6Yankee5 (Feb 25, 2017)

flexian said:


> at some WHs (Prime Now) its not possible to see the restaurant delivery waiting location until after accepting the block and hitting "Start" to start deliveries
> 
> getting it w/2 minutes to spare, even being 1/4 a mile from some of these locations a driver still has no way 2 get there in time
> 
> ...


I wonder if it because I am cynical.


Ubercal said:


> Most of them in my case, yes taking the extra half second to confirm has cost me blocks. But I'd rather that happen, than continously take blocks I can't make and get deactivated.


At UTX7, any delay to accept will be result in a red bar. The blocks you fail to grab sometimes will be all you will see all day!



Showa50 said:


> All the time
> 
> Learn to spoof if you are so worried about dropping shifts.
> 
> See I just helped you.


I refuse to do anything illegal or immoral. The benefit is not worth the effort.



Shangsta said:


> Your argument has been discussed here before. In some places, if you look to see whether a block if feasible you will have already lost the opportunity for it. I get that.
> 
> However if they let people drop a block without penalty it would allow for the bot folks to further cheat the system.
> 
> Ultimately when you accept a block you are responsible. I would rather get less blocks and know I can work the ones I grab then grab ones I maybe cannot do and get deactivated


I always wonder if the frequent updates for the app would make it more difficult for the bot folks.


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## Caliblk22 (Dec 25, 2016)

What is bot folks? I'm see these words so often


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## K5UBER (Dec 10, 2014)




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## Shangsta (Aug 15, 2016)

Caliblk22 said:


> What is bot folks? I'm see these words so often


People who use apps to grab blocks for them


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## 6Yankee5 (Feb 25, 2017)

Caliblk22 said:


> What is bot folks? I'm see these words so often


'bot' is the short name for "ROBOTS". Robot is an automatic programs that does whatever task that it is programed to do. For instance, some 'bots' search the internet for websites and index them in a database. Some 'bot' are used in video games to auto-aim weapon and allow players to cheat. Some bots will auto click on specific points in video games so that other players wont raid your compound while you are away from the game.

Someone got the bright idea to use these autoclickers or 'bot', in the Amazon Flex App. It is programed to click on specific points on the screen to refresh and accept blocks.
The release of new versions doesn't seem to address the advantages of the 'bot people'. I was happy to see a version that require a swipe to refresh the screen. For some reason, that version was replaced by another version of the amazon app that require taps instead of swipes to refresh the screen when fishing.



K5UBER said:


> View attachment 100814


That is good news!
5 minutes to drop a block that I can't work!
very GOOD NEWS!
I had faith that someone WITH AUTHORITY was listening to drivers gripe about it on this forum.


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## miauber1x831 (May 5, 2016)

K5UBER said:


> View attachment 100814


I grabbed a block over a week ago with a start time 25 minutes later and dropped it not even a minute later. Was wondering why I never received a Customer Expectation e-mail. Now I know why. This new policy makes much more sense.


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## GaryG83 (Jan 26, 2017)

You guys in America must have it tough if you don't even have time to look at the time of the block before you accept. I have literally seen blocks staying under Offers for 15 - 20 minutes before anyone accepts them, occasionally they even pass the start time and simply vanish because no one has accepted them.

As long as a notification isn't issued, if I'm fishing and a block comes up I know if I want it I'm almost guaranteed to get it.


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## UberPasco (Oct 18, 2015)

GaryG83 said:


> You guys in America must have it tough if you don't even have time to look at the time of the block before you accept. I have literally seen blocks staying under Offers for 15 - 20 minutes before anyone accepts them, occasionally they even pass the start time and simply vanish because no one has accepted them.
> 
> As long as a notification isn't issued, if I'm fishing and a block comes up I know if I want it I'm almost guaranteed to get it.


Ahhh, I remember the good ol' days....


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## GaryG83 (Jan 26, 2017)

UberPasco said:


> Ahhh, I remember the good ol' days....


Yeah I'm not expecting it to always be this way, but lets hope it stays this way as long as possible...


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## uberer2016 (Oct 16, 2016)

K5UBER said:


> View attachment 100814


This explains why I have been able to drop blocks within 45 minutes of start time that I wasn't able to make it and never got the expectation emails. Great idea by Amazon here! Thank goodness.


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## SPC in MN (Aug 2, 2016)

A very simple solution on Amazon's part would be to implement a 10 second "Are you Sure?" countdown timer that would pop up right anyone gets a successfull block. The person would then have 10 seconds to review the block in detail and would be able to drop it back into the cue if he/she decided that they did not want the block (WITH NO PENALTY or PUNISHMENT FROM SEEING OTHER BLOCKS!!), if they do nothing after 10 seconds, then the block is theres and they would have to deal with the consequences of dropping it and all the penalties and punishments that go with it.

THis isn't that hard, it's just the programmers for Amazon have no clue what it is like for the drivers. We had one of them from corporate in our depot taking surveys on their app, and they seemed baffled at how fast blocks go and how people are constatntly tapping their phones, they had no idea it was like that.


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## WMUber (Mar 22, 2016)

SPC in MN said:


> A very simple solution on Amazon's part would be to implement a 10 second "Are you Sure?" countdown timer that would pop up right anyone gets a successfull block. The person would then have 10 seconds to review the block in detail and would be able to drop it back into the cue if he/she decided that they did not want the block (WITH NO PENALTY or PUNISHMENT FROM SEEING OTHER BLOCKS!!), if they do nothing after 10 seconds, then the block is theres and they would have to deal with the consequences of dropping it and all the penalties and punishments that go with it.
> 
> THis isn't that hard, it's just the programmers for Amazon have no clue what it is like for the drivers. We had one of them from corporate in our depot taking surveys on their app, and they seemed baffled at how fast blocks go and how people are constatntly tapping their phones, they had no idea it was like that.


A double Accept or an Accept with a 10 second pause will not stop the bots or people blindly swiping. Right now Amazon doesn't punish, it acts as if you are not available to work those hours (otherwise you would have kept the block, right).

If you are given time to confirm, then Amazon should punish drivers who blindly accept by locking them out for 24 hours.

Remember, the driver who gets reserved blocks for 10:00 am to 2:00 pm on Monday, but rejects/forfeits them because they are not available to work that time screwed the driver who truly was available (or possibly only could work that time) out of a shift. Yes, life happens. So maybe one time a month a driver can forfeit/decline a reserved block without penalty. But the second decline/forfeit should lead to an automatic 24-hour lockout and a complete removal of the following week's grey dots.


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## SPC in MN (Aug 2, 2016)

WMUber said:


> A double Accept or an Accept with a 10 second pause will not stop the bots or people blindly swiping. Right now Amazon doesn't punish, it acts as if you are not available to work those hours (otherwise you would have kept the block, right).
> 
> If you are given time to confirm, then Amazon should punish drivers who blindly accept by locking them out for 24 hours.
> 
> Remember, the driver who gets reserved blocks for 10:00 am to 2:00 pm on Monday, but rejects/forfeits them because they are not available to work that time screwed the driver who truly was available (or possibly on could work that time) out of a shift. Yes, life happens. So maybe one time a month a driver can forfeit/decline a reserved block without penalty. But the second decline/forfeit should lead to an automatic 24-hour lockout and a complete removal of the following week's grey dots.


The way it is now is not going to stop bots...nothing will stop them. This isn't about stopping bots, its about giving everyone enough time to read the block we successfully grab so we can have 10 seconds to reject it back without penalty. Those who claim they have enough time to read the blocks before accepting them obviously do not work in the vast majority of the depots where doing so is simply impossible without missing the block completely. Something has to be done, and it will in time I am sure.


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## oicu812 (Aug 29, 2016)

Now you have 5 minutes. Problem solved.


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## mke (Dec 19, 2016)

SPC in MN said:


> The way it is now is not going to stop bots...nothing will stop them. This isn't about stopping bots, its about giving everyone enough time to read the block we successfully grab so we can have 10 seconds to reject it back without penalty. Those who claim they have enough time to read the blocks before accepting them obviously do not work in the vast majority of the depots where doing so is simply impossible without missing the block completely. Something has to be done, and it will in time I am sure.


They could stop bots if they wanted, have a 30 second lockout with a unique confirmation code to type,ala ticketmaster, would stop all but the best bots from grabbing blocks.

But again why amazon do it unless they are getting no shows for shifts. Amazon doesn't care who gets the shifts, it just wants the packages delivered. Anyone who uses bots and doesn't show multiple times will be booted anyways.


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## yucklyftline (Mar 23, 2016)

mke said:


> They could stop bots if they wanted, have a 30 second lockout with a unique confirmation code to type,ala ticketmaster, would stop all but the best bots from grabbing blocks.


Have you ordered from ticketmaster?! Impossible to get hot tix because of bots.

Now they have you click on an array of pictures that contain whatever it is they're asking for.

In all fairness, they're not really bots, but a room in India filled with a bunch of workers with computers typing in codes faster than you ever can.


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## mke (Dec 19, 2016)

yucklyftline said:


> Have you ordered from ticketmaster?! Impossible to get hot tix because of bots.
> 
> Now they have you click on an array of pictures that contain whatever it is they're asking for.
> 
> In all fairness, they're not really bots, but a room in India filled with a bunch of workers with computers typing in codes faster than you ever can.


There's always a better mousetrap to be built, until they come up with something else and then someone builds another. People will try as long as there is money to be made, there is no way to stop everything. But for flex, c'mon how far will people actually go to work for $18 an hour? Doubt it's worth it.

The India idea is interesting though, can't wait for someone to outsource getting blocks to a low paying country...lmao just thinking of how rediculous that would be. Desperate times call for desperate measures.


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## flexian (Aug 16, 2016)

maybe best thing is to use multi-factor biometric authentication

i believe once AWS supports this, so too will the Flex app (after some time)

otherwise - for them - not worth the effort

terrible gig


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## strongarm (May 15, 2015)

Stop fishing. when a block is posted it has day and time. if you can't make it don't accept it. everyone knows what KISS stands for. I almost got deactivated for accepting blocks that I couldn't make.


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## flexian (Aug 16, 2016)

strongarm said:


> Stop fishing.


how would someone get blocks without fishing?


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## oicu812 (Aug 29, 2016)

wait for notifications


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## flexian (Aug 16, 2016)

i think i get a couple of those a week, not good enough


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## CatchyMusicLover (Sep 18, 2015)

flexian said:


> how would someone get blocks without fishing?


By knowing when they drop.


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## flexian (Aug 16, 2016)

CatchyMusicLover said:


> By knowing when they drop.


i wish it were that easy

we can get it down to a range and try from there

......but thats the definition of fishing

unless u mean cronyism, getting ur wh buddies to drop them at times when no one expects them

but the only way to defend against that is to, again, fish for them constantly

an extreme example are the overnight drops

only the botz get those


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## CatchyMusicLover (Sep 18, 2015)

Well then....I guess the other suggestion is to move to a place (such as Las Vegas) where drops ARE consistent.


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## flexian (Aug 16, 2016)

much easier to simply ignore the "no fishing" guy


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## SavageSvage (Nov 14, 2016)

Waiting for a specific time Doesn't work at my station. At least not anymore, it used to be that blocks would drop on the hour 24hrs in advance.. Then maybe 2 hours before.. Now it's just around a certain time but. Never at the same time exactly.. You just gotta know from when to go when you gotta be fishing.


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