# Uber Fee Increase / GST



## MyRedUber (Dec 28, 2015)

For those concerned about today's increase in Uber Fee to cover their GST, here's a calculation or two to set your mind at rest.
For those who were on 20% rate (calculations are similar for other rates):

Before:
$20.00 Fare
$4.00 Less Uber Fee
$1.82 Less GST on Fare
$14.18 Income.

After:
$20.00 Fare
$4.40 Less Uber Fee (now includes GST)
$1.82 Less GST on Fare
$0.40 Plus GST claimable from ATO
$14.18 Income.

There's no difference in the customer's fare or in the driver's income. The $0.40 GST gets passed from the driver to Uber to the ATO to the driver.


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## ST DYMPHNA son (Aug 10, 2017)

MyRedUber said:


> For those concerned about today's increase in Uber Fee to cover their GST, here's a calculation or two to set your mind at rest.
> For those who were on 20% rate (calculations are similar for other rates):
> 
> Before:
> ...


...Please...don't take away a joy from the people who are only happy when they have something to be unhappy about...


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## Astro63 (May 27, 2017)

So do you think it would be easier and acceptable to simply pay one eleventh of whatever we receive from Uber to the ATO? Less any usual GST claims for expenses like fuel etc.


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## MyRedUber (Dec 28, 2015)

Astro63 said:


> So do you think it would be easier and acceptable to simply pay one eleventh of whatever we receive from Uber to the ATO? Less any usual GST claims for expenses like fuel etc.


It may be easier, but it would get you into trouble with the ATO.
GST is calculated on the full fare paid by the customer, including any extras such as surge, motorway tolls, etc.


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## UberDriverAU (Nov 4, 2015)

Astro63 said:


> So do you think it would be easier and acceptable to simply pay one eleventh of whatever we receive from Uber to the ATO? Less any usual GST claims for expenses like fuel etc.


That's pretty much what you will end up doing, but you'd still need to _report_ GST on the full fare.


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## MyRedUber (Dec 28, 2015)

UberDriverAU said:


> That's pretty much what you will end up doing, but you'd still need to _report_ GST on the full fare.


No. You need to calculate, report and pay GST based on the full payment by the customer, less any GST on expenses, including Uber fee.
If you don't fully understand it, enlist the help of an accountant.


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## UberDriverAU (Nov 4, 2015)

MyRedUber said:


> No. You need to calculate, report and pay GST based on the full payment by the customer, less any GST on expenses, including Uber fee.
> If you don't fully understand it, enlist the help of an accountant.


I understand it perfectly well. He asked if he could simply pay GST on the amount received less other GST credits, and this would indeed give the right amount of money that needs to be paid to the ATO. This wouldn't satisfy the reporting requirements though, because the full fare and other fees need to be included in your sales figures, and Uber's fees need to be included in purchases.


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## MyRedUber (Dec 28, 2015)

UberDriverAU said:


> and this would indeed give the right amount of money that needs to be paid to the ATO.


No it would not. Please stop giving incorrect advice on such an important matter. Anyone following your advice risks trouble with the ATO.


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## UberDriverAU (Nov 4, 2015)

MyRedUber said:


> No it would not. Please stop giving incorrect advice on such an important matter. Anyone following your advice risks trouble with the ATO.


Fare: $110.00
Uber Fee: $24.20
Payout: $85.80
GST on Fare: $10.00
GST on Uber Fee: $2.20
Net GST: $7.80 = $10.00 - $2.20
GST on Payout: $7.80 = Net GST

The numbers don't lie.


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## MyRedUber (Dec 28, 2015)

UberDriverAU said:


> So do you think it would be easier and acceptable to simply pay one eleventh of whatever we receive from Uber to the ATO? Less any usual GST claims for expenses like fuel etc.
> That's pretty much what you will end up doing, but you'd still need to _report_ GST on the full fare.


This is wrong.
Your numbers may be correct, but your advice is not.


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## UberDriverAU (Nov 4, 2015)

MyRedUber said:


> This is wrong.
> Your numbers may be correct, but your advice is not.


You need to learn how to read.


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## Ben Hall (Apr 15, 2016)

Who is John Galt? , could you please bring Andy around?


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## Who is John Galt? (Sep 28, 2016)

Ben Hall said:


> Who is John Galt? , could you please bring Andy around?


Thank you, Ben. Another Groundhog Day and as always, it is a pleasure to post another picture of the wonderful and recherché Andie.
This one is cropped quite extensively, as some may blush. 
I was going to post one of my 'black label' selection but I'm not sure if I have any miss demeanor credits left 
Enjoy.










2445 x 3570 and 1.19MB, if anyone wants the larger size. 
Sorry I won't provide the un-cropped version.


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## Paul Collins (Dec 12, 2016)

UberDriverAU said:


> Fare: $110.00
> Uber Fee: $24.20
> Payout: $85.80
> GST on Fare: $10.00
> ...


Yet your 'advice' was he will be the same if he just paid 1/11 of what he received. Dear me.... an expert?

Payout :$85.80
GST as 1/11 of that:$7.80
GST credit from Uber:$2.20
Net GST:$5.60

GST is not 1/11 of what the driver receives. Your 'advice' is incorrect and should be ignored.

'He asked if he could simply pay GST on the amount received less other GST credits, and this would indeed give the right amount ofmoney that needs to be paid to the ATO.' is not correct at all.



Astro63 said:


> So do you think it would be easier and acceptable to simply pay one eleventh of whatever we receive from Uber to the ATO? Less any usual GST claims for expenses like fuel etc.


No.


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## UberDriverAU (Nov 4, 2015)

Paul Collins said:


> Yet your 'advice' was he will be the same if he just paid 1/11 of what he received. Dear me.... an expert?
> 
> Payout :$85.80
> GST as 1/11 of that:$7.80
> ...


You're not very good at maths are you? I posted the correct equality (GST on Payout = GST on Fare - GST on Uber Fee = Net GST = $10.00 - $2.20 = $7.80), whereas you've posted an inequality ($10.00 - $2.20 ≠ $7.80 - $2.20).


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## ST DYMPHNA son (Aug 10, 2017)

...he might be not good at maths but his efforts to prove that he is are second to none...
Who is John Galt ,Thanks for awarding The Andie for this thread as it becoming very boring to see again and again stuff about the GST where the only solution is to deal with an accountant if one is not an accountant oneself


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## MyRedUber (Dec 28, 2015)

UberDriverAU said:


> You're not very good at maths are you? I posted the correct equality (GST on Payout = GST on Fare - GST on Uber Fee = Net GST = $10.00 - $2.20 = $7.80), whereas you've posted an inequality ($10.00 - $2.20 ≠ $7.80 - $2.20).


Just because two calculations arrive at the same result does not make your method correct.
If there is any variable in there, such as a bridge toll, your method will leave the driver with a fine from the ATO for tax avoidance.
Ignorance of the law, or following advice from someone who doesn't understand the law, is not an acceptable defence for that poor driver.

The driver's GST liability of calculated on the total amount paid by the customer.

UberDriverAU, your advice is wrong. Please stop repeating it.


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## Paul Collins (Dec 12, 2016)

UberDriverAU said:


> You're not very good at maths are you? I posted the correct equality (GST on Payout = GST on Fare - GST on Uber Fee = Net GST = $10.00 - $2.20 = $7.80), whereas you've posted an inequality ($10.00 - $2.20 ≠ $7.80 - $2.20).


This is not correct. For an 'expert' to advise anyone that GST can be calculated as 1/11 of what the driver receives, then to deduct GST credits for the Uber fee and other expenses is madness. I suppose you are anonymous for a reason.

'He asked if he could simply pay GST on the amount received less other GST credits, and this would indeed give the right amount ofmoney that needs to be paid to the ATO.'


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## UberDriverAU (Nov 4, 2015)

Paul Collins said:


> then to deduct GST credits for the Uber fee and other expenses is madness.


Nowhere have I said this, it is madness of your own creation that you are attributing to me for whatever reason.


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## Paul Collins (Dec 12, 2016)

UberDriverAU said:


> Nowhere have I said this, it is madness of your own creation that you are attributing to me for whatever reason.


If you thought that is what he was asking, then your comprehension skills are lacking. You are not very good at reading, are you?


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## MyRedUber (Dec 28, 2015)

UberDriverAU, please stop. You're giving incorrect advice. You are going to be responsible for some drivers being fined by the ATO.


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## ST DYMPHNA son (Aug 10, 2017)

Paul Collins said:


> This is not correct. For an 'expert' to advise anyone that GST can be calculated as 1/11 of what the driver receives, then to deduct GST credits for the Uber fee and other expenses is madness. I suppose you are anonymous for a reason.
> 
> 'He asked if he could simply pay GST on the amount received less other GST credits, and this would indeed give the right amount ofmoney that needs to be paid to the ATO.'


...you are supposing too much...so what is your supposition for anyone to be anonymous on this forum???is being a Paul Collins would make anyone righteous???is that what you are saying???
It is a personal responsibility for a person to seek an advice about the GST if one is obligated to pay one and place to get is from a Professional Tax Agent and you are not the one.
My worry is that all those threads about minute differences with GST are just a diversion from keeping people from seeing real problems that uber does not want us to see....keep them occupied with "peanuts"so they will have no time to direct their attention to a big problems...
Uber cut from our take we should be asking about ,22% or 27% is unheard robbery and I suspect that uber has planted "stooges"and some of those might even not know that they are used by uber to keep drivers from even thinking about it...
...so keep going posting a useless stuff about GST,as for myself I rather pay for a professional services as I would advice anyone who is not sure about their Tax obligations...


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## UberDriverAU (Nov 4, 2015)

MyRedUber said:


> UberDriverAU, please stop. You're giving incorrect advice. You are going to be responsible for some drivers being fined by the ATO.


Read what I said again. The correct amount would be paid, but the reporting requirements would not be met. That is 100% accurate.


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## MyRedUber (Dec 28, 2015)

UberDriverAU said:


> Read what I said again. The correct amount would be paid, but the reporting requirements would not be met. That is 100% accurate.


Read this very carefully: The driver's GST liability is calculated from the total amount paid by the customer.
Anything else is incorrect. If there are any variables in the equation, your method of calculation will give an incorrect result.
Please stop promoting your wrong understanding.


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## Paul Collins (Dec 12, 2016)

UberDriverAU said:


> Read what I said again. The correct amount would be paid, but the reporting requirements would not be met. That is 100% accurate.


But that is not what the poster was asking. You 'assumed' that he would not deduct the gst on the Uber fee. Might have been best to clarify with him before telling him that he could use the amount received as 1/11 minus ALL GST credits.
You are not good at asking questions it seems. Only giving mixed up incorrect advice.

Your calculations did not account for the 55 cents booking fee, which does have GST payable on it and no GST credit from Uber now, so anyway of looking at your advice is wrong.


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## Lowestformofwit (Sep 2, 2016)

Paul Collins said:


> You are not good at asking questions it seems. Only giving mixed up incorrect advice.


"Takes one to know one"
That's fairly obvious.; but then you always have the luxuries of flip-flopping on your previous posts and/or going back and deleting them if they contradict your current position.


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## Paul Collins (Dec 12, 2016)

And of course you can provide links to such?
Now what about the 55 cents and the incorrect numbers?


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## Lowestformofwit (Sep 2, 2016)

Paul Collins said:


> And of course you can provide links to such?
> Now what about the 55 cents and your incorrect numbers?


Think you've replied to the wrong poster.
But then, some of us "aren't very good at reading".
Never mind- you can always delete your post....


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## Lowestformofwit (Sep 2, 2016)

Paul Collins said:


> I delete posts when I feel that I have only fed the trolls, a bit like now.


Or when someone calls you out on your mealy-mouthed duplicity?


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## UberDriverAU (Nov 4, 2015)

Paul Collins said:


> Your calculations did not account for the 55 cents booking fee, which does have GST payable on it and no GST credit from Uber now, so anyway of looking at your advice is wrong.


Paul, Paul, Paul. How else would you like to demonstrate your misunderstanding? Because Uber now operates through an Australian company, all of Uber's fees are now subject to GST, and therefore drivers can claim a GST credit for all of Uber's fees. Because Uber takes 100% of the booking fee, the GST owed on it is completely cancelled out by the GST credit claimable on the deduction. The result of that is the booking fee does not change the net amount of GST payable by drivers.

Is there anything else you'd like to be educated about?

Lowestformofwit: I've quoted this one for posterity.


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## Paul Collins (Dec 12, 2016)

UberDriverAU said:


> Paul, Paul, Paul. How else would you like to demonstrate your misunderstanding? Because Uber now operates through an Australian company, all of Uber's fees are now subject to GST, and therefore drivers can claim a GST credit for all of Uber's fees. Because Uber takes 100% of the booking fee, the GST owed on it is completely cancelled out by the GST credit claimable on the deduction. The result of that is the booking fee does not change the net amount of GST payable by drivers.
> 
> Is there anything else you'd like to be educated about?
> 
> Lowestformofwit: I've quoted this one for posterity.


There is no GST claimable in the booking fee. That is a fee from UberOS. Perhaps share a link to correct me? The extra 5 cents is gone, and I have not seen any information regarding the booking fee from uber as being GST inclusive in terms of a GST credit. Quite the opposite in fact.


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## UberDriverAU (Nov 4, 2015)

Paul Collins said:


> There is no GST claimable in the booking fee. That is a fee from UberOS. Perhaps share a link to correct me? The extra 5 cents is gone, and I have not seen any information regarding the booking fee from uber as being GST inclusive in terms of a GST credit. Quite the opposite in fact.












Paul, you didn't get an email from Uber?

https://uberpeople.net/threads/changes-to-your-services-agreement.218561/


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## Paul Collins (Dec 12, 2016)

So you have nothing? Uber indicate it will be GST claimable but in their example there do not show that.I suppose we will have to wait for the first pay statement after Dec 1.

https://www.uber.com/en-AU/blog/gst-your-partner-agreement/

GST on expenses ; $2.50 not $2.55.









If the total fare, including the booking fee was $10, as $9.45 plus 55 cents, then perhaps...But uber indicate they are taking 25% of the $10....mmmmmm


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## UberDriverAU (Nov 4, 2015)

Paul Collins said:


> So you have nothing? Uber indicate it will be GST claimable but in their example there do not show that.I suppose we will have to wait for the first pay statement after Dec 1.
> 
> https://www.uber.com/en-AU/blog/gst-your-partner-agreement/


Please highlight which part of the following sentence you're having trouble understanding:

Rasier Pacific Pty Ltd is an Australian company registered for GST, therefore all their fees are inclusive of GST.

They even have an ABN now, as required:

https://abr.business.gov.au/SearchByAbn.aspx?SearchText=27622365833


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## ST DYMPHNA son (Aug 10, 2017)

Paul Collins said:


> There is no GST claimable in the booking fee. That is a fee from UberOS. Perhaps share a link to correct me?


...do you know about 57 Millions accounts compromised by hackers and it is possible that details of yours and my account might be in their hands????,you are "flogging a death horse" with this GST,how many threads are there on the forum?????,plenty,and you are involved in most of them...what is the reason behind???
there is so many more things we should worry about...
...when you ring your mates at uber next time,please ask how secure are our accounts as there is no 100% surety that hackers don't have them!!!!...
Thanks Paul.....and after clearing up this little inconvenience we can ask about other things like their cut which out of any decency ....


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## UberDriverAU (Nov 4, 2015)

Paul Collins said:


> GST on expenses ; $2.50 not $2.55.


The service fee is not the booking fee. For whatever reason they have not included the booking fee in their example. The only difference will be GST on Sales and GST on Expenses should both be $0.05 more.


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## Paul Collins (Dec 12, 2016)

Got is, so uber just 'left it out'....once again, lets wait and see what the first pay statement show after Dec 1.
My money is on the GST credit only being on the service fee.


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## UberDriverAU (Nov 4, 2015)

Paul Collins said:


> My money is on the GST credit only being on the service fee.


How much money?


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## ST DYMPHNA son (Aug 10, 2017)

Paul Collins said:


> Got is, so uber just 'left it out'....once again, lets wait and see what the first pay statement show after Dec 1.
> My money is on the GST credit only being on the service and booking fee.


..."caught again with pants down"... 
Paul,this is sensless


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## Paul Collins (Dec 12, 2016)

UberDriverAU said:


> How much money?


A $50 to charity if I am wrong.
App data and invoice data below. It does indicate the 55 cents is GST inc and that has always been the case, the issue is the 55cents as a fee that we are charged from uber going to be 50cents plus a 5 cents get credit. Not sure about that....
I could be wrong, but once again, I will wait until the first pay statement to verify.



















Not a mention on how the 55cent booking fee charged by uber will be taxed in their current agreement.
https://uber.app.box.com/s/943pcpwmxomgene5c1kul99zbs7c3426
I certainly did not see any mention of the booking fee in their email. Implied, but not direct and given its 'absence' from the example, I will once again what.

'Please note that from 1 December 2017, your agreement with Uber will change. To ensure Uber remains compliant with specific local legislation, your agreement will now be with two Uber entities; one based in the Netherlands (Uber B.V.) that will provide you with a licence to use the Driver App, which will still be for free, and another based in Australia (Rasier Pacific Pty Limited) (Rasier) that will provide you with associated Uber Services for a service fee. The agreement will be governed by local NSW law.

You will see that we have also simplified the agreement for clarity. We highly encourage you to read in full your updated Services Agreement and your updated Service Fee Addendum which you must agree to in order to continue to access the Driver App and Uber Services from 1 December 2017.

There are some additional changes included in the updated agreement; some of the key ones are explained below.

*GST*
As you will be contracting with a local Australian company for the UberServices, GST will apply to all fees charged to you from 1 December 2017 (including the service fee you pay for the Uber Services). Importantly, because of this change, you should be able to claim the GST back on these fees if you're registered for GST. For more information about how these updates may impact your GST obligations, please read this blog.

*Fares & fees*
Other than the GST changes to the service fee explained above, there are no changes to your service fee or fares at this time. However, there will be some changes to the fare and service fee provisions of the agreement to allow flexibility for new ways of doing things. In particular, Rasier will have the right to change the model used to determine the service fee. You would always receive at least 14 days notice before this happened and of course it's your choice whether you agree to the change by continuing to use the UberServices.

As you may be aware, in some circumstances the fare you charge your riders can be adjusted (e.g. for inefficient route or technical error). However, in more serious situations like fraud or rider complaints, or for payment processing errors, Rasier will have the right to cancel or require you to reimburse a fare by various means, including deducting these amounts from future fares owed to you or debiting your card on file or bank account on record.

*Momentum*
Finally, the terms that govern your access to the Momentum program, which you can review here, will also be updated effective from 1 December 2017 such that you will have a contract with Uber Pacific Pty Limited, another local Australian entity.

Thank you for partnering with Uber"










So that would mean 55cents plus 10%, or a 60 cent charge. What a mess.....


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## ST DYMPHNA son (Aug 10, 2017)

Paul Collins said:


> A $50 to charity if I am wrong.
> App data and invoice data below. It does indicate the 55 cents is GST inc and that has always been the case, the issue is the 55cents as a fee that we are charged from uber going to be 50cents plus a 5 cents get credit. Not sure about that....
> I could be wrong, but once again, I will wait until the first pay statement to verify.
> 
> ...


...once again...
...more sure one is that one is right,more severe consequences when one is wrong...


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## Sydney Uber (Apr 15, 2014)

ST DYMPHNA son said:


> ...once again...
> ...more sure one is that one is right,more severe consequences when one is wrong...


Clearly ST DYMP you are challenged with the concept that UBER is not the all charitable, saintly lily-white organisation that you profess it to be. It's done nothing wrong, UBER has nothing to answer for.

Uber choose to take the route of arrogant law-breaker when in the early days, Uber's protestations to regulators regarding Lyft's illegal activities fell on deaf ears. Uber had a legal App, using only licensed Black Car operators at that stage. Two wrongs make a right, along with years thumbing it's nose at jurisdictional tax and transport laws around the globe has seen its extraordinary growth.

So what Authority would convince you of UBER's Tax and Commission pilfering of the many hardworking drivers?

You brush aside your peers with such disdain, (straight from the UBER playbook it seems).

A CPA accountant? Lawyer? a class action fighting to return to you and all drivers what has been taken from us as drivers?

In the end everyone answers to a higher authority.


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