# Cancellation Fees, Referral Bonus Shenanigans | An Attempt To Fix Them.



## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

Drivers have to stop just complaining about bogus Uber practices. Instead Drivers should make a concerted effort to expose these policies, with the hope of shaming Uber into changing them.

I'm starting this thread for Drivers to go back over their Trip History to list how many *Qualifying* Cancellations they had, and how many they actually got paid for.

Same thing for any kind of Referral Bonus. Please only list referral bonus that you are sure you actually qualified for.

So please post On Topic on this thread. I will then try to get an expose' written on the topic.

Thank you!


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## scrurbscrud (Sep 11, 2014)

There is no way to actually document in the Uber system if you had a 'qualifying cancel.' I've been paid by Lyft, *but never by Uber*. And have had many many. They just aren't worth with screwing time wise and trying to get an email response from Uber. There simply is no documentation available other than our say so. AND it tends to draw unnecessary (potentially bad) attentions from the local office. They don't pay for bad address runs either, which again are many many. They will go out of their way to find out if a cancel or bad address is the drivers fault (which is every time a pax complains) but will never pay if it wasn't a drivers fault unless you are forced into whining for your 5 dollar bill.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

A qualifying cancel is where a driver cancels if the pax is a no show 5 minutes after hitting Arrived and calling the pax. Then the Driver hits Cancel - No Show. 
But way too often the Driver is not paid the Cancellation Fee by Uber citing "First Cancel" exclusion.

https://uberpeople.net/threads/robbed-of-a-cancellation-fee.1560/


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

scrurbscrud said:


> They just aren't worth with screwing time wise and trying to get an email response from Uber. There simply is no documentation available other than our say so. AND it tends to draw unnecessary (potentially bad) attentions from the local office.


The intent of this thread is to be proactive in combating the inherent unfairness of Uber's cancellation policy. 
At least Lyft has taken some steps towards compensating drivers wasting their time on Cancellations & making Pax Pickup more expeditious.
https://uberpeople.net/threads/lyft-gets-cancellations-right-uber-should-take-notes.5010/#post-69619
https://uberpeople.net/threads/uber...s-riders-cancellation-window.3326/#post-69921


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## DjTim (Oct 18, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> A qualifying cancel is where a driver cancels if the pax is a no show 5 minutes after hitting Arrived and calling the pax. Then the Driver hits Cancel - No Show.
> But way too often the Driver is not paid the Cancellation Fee by Uber citing "First Cancel" exclusion.
> 
> https://uberpeople.net/threads/robbed-of-a-cancellation-fee.1560/


I don't know if this helps - but I've been paid by both Lyft and Uber for every cancellation I've had. I think it's easier to track Uber, because it's in the partners website in 15 to 30 minutes. For Lyft - you only see it if it's on the e-mail the next morning.

I always keep track when I have to cancel and I've followed the directions (wait, call, and then cancel). I just checked my statements and I have 30 dollars for Lyft and 15 for Uber.


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## grUBBER (Sep 11, 2014)

Some times I no-show a rider with a 4.3 rating and get paid $0.
It's hard to believe it's their first no-show. 
Uber should pay drivers for that every time and absorb that first no-show if they feel so generous.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

I guess UberX drivers are very content with Uber's policies and practices on Cancellation Fees and Referral Bonuses.


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## oracleofdoom (Nov 5, 2014)

They should also be paying for wrong addresses. That's a total waste of gas. Last one they emailed me for feedback, and when I explained, they agreed it was user error on the passenger's part (the address was their destination, rather than where they wanted to be picked up). But they don't pay for it.


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## DjTim (Oct 18, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> I guess UberX drivers are very content with Uber's policies and practices on Cancellation Fees and Referral Bonuses.


I don't want to say I'm content, but I don't have a dog in that fight yet. If I were to get screwed out of a cancellation fee - I've got something to ***** about I'll join the *****ing. I think your absolutely right - if your not getting paid for things for cancellations or bonuses you should have a good avenue to contact and get the correct payment.

This reminds me of the "waiting time" crap I had to put up with for the messenger company I worked for back in the day. 5 minutes free - anything after that was on the clock. I can't remember what was charged per minute. customers would abuse this all the time. Excuses ranged from "Driver is dumb, I don't pay for drivers to find me, I don't pay for drivers to carry out stuff, I don't pay drivers to wait at the delivery because they have to go through security". It was all depended on the size of the account - if they spend so many dollars they get so many free BS complaints.


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## scrurbscrud (Sep 11, 2014)

It is much easier for Uber to screw drivers rather than customers, that much is a certainty. Who then is going to win? It sure ain't gonna be the drivers.

There is one ingrained rule for all large .corp and we all know it very well by now.

The CUSTOMER is always right no matter what and yeah, even if it costs YOU money. It doesn't cost Uber a damn dime to screw us does it?


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## scrurbscrud (Sep 11, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> I guess UberX drivers are very content with Uber's policies and practices on Cancellation Fees and Referral Bonuses.


It's probably a little more complex than what you are trying to pose Chi.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

DjTim said:


> I don't want to say I'm content, but I don't have a dog in that fight yet.


Do you happen to know @UL Driver SF , he used to be a prodigious poster @uberpeople.net ?


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## DjTim (Oct 18, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> Do you happen to know @UL Driver SF , he used to be a prodigious poster @uberpeople.net ?


Sorry I don't. I took a quick look at UL Driver SF's profile - I didn't start here until after their last post. I know assumptions are the mother of all ****ups, but his name has SF (SanFrancisco?). I'm in Chicago like you.

Let me take that back - his last time here was Oct 9th. either way - don't know the person.


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## Courageous (Sep 18, 2014)

I've been paid for a couple or three cancel, "no shows". Market still so new here, I suspect the first time cancellations are legitimate at this point. I will be paying attention though.


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## pengduck (Sep 26, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> A qualifying cancel is where a driver cancels if the pax is a no show 5 minutes after hitting Arrived and calling the pax. Then the Driver hits Cancel - No Show.
> But way too often the Driver is not paid the Cancellation Fee by Uber citing "First Cancel" exclusion.
> 
> https://uberpeople.net/threads/robbed-of-a-cancellation-fee.1560/


Seems like every time I have one of these it's there first time.


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## pengduck (Sep 26, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> Drivers have to stop just complaining about bogus Uber practices. Instead Drivers should make a concerted effort to expose these policies, with the hope of shaming Uber into changing them.
> 
> I'm starting this thread for Drivers to go back over their Trip History to list how many *Qualifying* Cancellations they had, and how many they actually got paid for.
> 
> ...


I think you should add the guarentees they offer and then don't pay. For Halloween we had guarentees and they did not honor them saying over the 4 hour period I had made more than the guarentee. The same thing with Saturday yet I was paid as previously with each hour being seperate.


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## IbedrivinUX (Oct 20, 2014)

First time should still pay the driver, Uber should absorb it, We moved it cost us money and time and isn't that what we are here for? To make money! I know here comes a rash of hate messages of why Uber shouldn't have to pay but I don't care just my opinion and "I'm sticking to it" Like the other night I got a same rider ping me 4 times, I acrpted each and everyone of them, I didn't want my acceptance rate to go down and they cancelled everyone of them, I just sat still after the first one waiting to see if they were going to cancel again and again and again they sure did!


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## oracleofdoom (Nov 5, 2014)

No, IbedrivinUX, no hate here. I agree. It costs us time and money to go to a location where someone is going to cancel. That is time in which we might've missed a more lucrative request. If they aren't going to charge the customer, they should pay the drivers and eat the cost.


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## AintWorthIt (Sep 30, 2014)

I started Lyft last weekend and had two cancellations, paid for both. I've been doing Uber for close to 4 months and been paid for 1. It's a joke.


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## UberFrolic (Sep 18, 2014)

All uber drivers... Let's all start working for lyft. That should cause disruption.


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## duggles (Aug 25, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> I guess UberX drivers are very content with Uber's policies and practices on Cancellation Fees and Referral Bonuses.


What do you really want us to do? There's nothing to document if they say it's a first time cancellation.

I had a rider recently that cancelled on me about 8 minutes after the request (about 6 after arrival) because they wanted to bring open alcohol containers into my car. They said they'd find a driver who would allow them, so I sat and waited for them to cancel. Uber didn't pay.

Hammered Uber with several emails and got a response that was: Manager here. Sorry, really wish there was something we can do. However it was a 1st time cancellation and that policy can not be changed. There is no way to pay you for this cancellation. Uber on.


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## Tim In Cleveland (Jul 28, 2014)

I have been paid for ONE cancel out of at least 20 of them and ZERO wrong addresses meanwhile Uber ignore suggestions on making the app easiet to use. If the pin is being dropped more than 100 yards from the GPS location of the customer, a warning should pop up stating "Do you want to be picked up where you are?" It's one in 10,000 customers that is ordering the Uber for someone else and needs a different location. It really burns me up that our suggestions are ignored and we get no compensation for the time and miles if a misplaced pin.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

duggles said:


> What do you really want us to do?


My hope is that this thread has many drivers posting about their experience with getting paid Cancellation Fee, and Referral Bonuses by Uber. Include any emails to substantiate your post.
Then this thread can be used by reporters to write on the problem, and hopefully shame Uber into revising these policies.


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## UberFrolic (Sep 18, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> My hope is that this thread has many drivers posting about their experience with getting paid Cancellation Fee, and Referral Bonuses by Uber. Include any emails to substantiate your post.
> Then this thread can be used by reporters to write on the problem, and hopefully shame Uber into revising these policies.


Chi1cabby has a point. You may think that being on this message board is pointless and no progress is being made. Progress is always made by doing something even if feels minuscule .

Be a squeaky wheel and eventually someone will hear. My .02


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## IbedrivinUX (Oct 20, 2014)

Uberfrolic not only that but just stop working under normal pricing, wait off line till the surges hit and then jump on grab a surge price ride and then drive them to their destination and then go off line again. They can't stop us from doing that if we all did it!


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## IbedrivinUX (Oct 20, 2014)

I get something out of each complaint I send in to Uber they normally see things my way and pay me for the cancelled ride. I wish these drunks on Saturday night would stop ordering only to cancel once we get the horses turn towards them. That makes me mad!


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## newsboy559 (Oct 14, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> My hope is that this thread has many drivers posting about their experience with getting paid Cancellation Fee, and Referral Bonuses by Uber. Include any emails to substantiate your post.
> Then this thread can be used by reporters to write on the problem, and hopefully shame Uber into revising these policies.


I am dealing with this right now. Here is my email string:

Nov 15 01:40

On my invoice this evening, 11/14, I again am showing $0 for two fares that I had to cancel due to the riders. During my conversations with customer service last week, it was explained that there was no need to contact you for cancellation fees because if I was owed a fee, it would automatically show up as $5. That clearly is not the case. Here are my notes regarding these two cancellations this evening:

10:16 p.m. received ping from Hotel Broadview. Pulled up front within a couple minutes. Arrived at 10:19. Waited three minutes and called rider. No answer. Left message. Waited another two minutes and sent text. No response. Canceled at 10:26 pm. Rider no show.

12:20 a.m. received ping at 3rd and Oliver. Arrived to location to find nobody there. Called rider. No answer. He called back immediately and said I was at the wrong location. I apologized and explained that I was right on top of the location he put in the app and asked where he was located. He was clearly drunk, slurring words, and had a hard time telling me his address. He told me I needed to learn basic GPS rules when I said I didn't know where he was if he wasn't at the location he put in the app. I finally figured out he was on Kingsrow, a few blocks away, and told him I would be right there. I arrived to find him on the front porch, being helped by a friend because he couldn't walk. He called me on his phone from the front porch and explained that he would be out in a few minutes. I said OK and asked if it would be OK for me to go ahead and start the fare. He said yes and his friend began helping him walk toward my car. As I rolled the window down, I could hear him being disrespectful toward me, saying it should not have taken me that long to get to his location. He and his friend began fighting and then both fell over onto the ground near my car. I told them they were better off calling for another driver and cancelled the trip. At that point, he began calling me derogatory names as I drove away. There was no other appropriate option but to choose "do not charge."

Please confirm that I will be paid the $5 cancellation fee for both of these trips, as I did everything per Uber's policies and procedures. Neither of these cancellations pertains to being the rider's first time for cancellation, as both of these trips were cancelled by me, the driver, due to either being a no show or a belligerent drunk. I incurred costs while responding to these requests and simply cannot afford to not be reimbursed for those costs.

Sincerely,

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi,

Thanks for reaching out regarding these trip cancellations. These occasions were the first time these riders canceled a trip (still applies even when the driver initiates the cancellation) or it was canceled within five minutes. We waive the cancellation fee for a rider's first cancellation in order to ensure they do not have a bad experience in their early interactions with our product.

With this, we sent the rider a very direct email regarding the policy and that cancellations may cause a waste of time and gas for their driver. If the rider cancels within 5 minutes, no cancellation fee will apply.

If you have any other questions, please let me know or check out our FAQ.

Best,

Tara S.
Uber 
Partner Support Site

*

*PRO TIP* Always email us from the email address linked to your account to help us find your account information more quickly.**
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tara,

This is BS! Did you not read my email??? These cancellations WERE NOT DONE BY THE RIDER!!! ME, THE DRIVER, CANCELED THESE FARES. ACCORDING TO UBER'S POLICY, THESE TYPES OF CANCELLATIONS ARE NOT COVERED BY THE 5 MINUTE RULE!!!

These cancellations need to be paid to me. This is a terrible policy that causes drivers to waste gas and time. Of course, Uber doesn't have to worry about that cost. Only the drivers do.

As my email clearly states, this is YOUR policy, not mine. Plus, I seriously doubt that this was the first cancellation for the second example I gave you. I have driven this person several times before. She has even created some trouble in the past. I notice that her rating is 4.7.

This is a clear example of how Uber "partners" are definitely not independent contractors. They are employees hired by the company.


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## chi1cabby (May 28, 2014)

newsboy559 said:


> I am dealing with this right now. Here is my email string:


Thanx for posting @newsboy559 !

@LAuberX I remember you posting about your easy breezy way of canceling if the pax doesn't show up in 5 mins of hitting Arrived. What is your aggregate experience in getting the Cancellation Fee paid?


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## LastGenerationHumanDriver (Oct 18, 2014)

I almost never get the cancellation fee paid, and it seems completely arbitrary. I use a stopwatch, and cancel at 5:10. Does anyone think that there's a material difference in waiting 6 minutes?


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## newsboy559 (Oct 14, 2014)

LastGenerationHumanDriver said:


> I almost never get the cancellation fee paid, and it seems completely arbitrary. I use a stopwatch, and cancel at 5:10. Does anyone think that there's a material difference in waiting 6 minutes?


I don't think waiting an extra minute is going to matter much. Uber clearly just doesn't care. I had five cancellations tonight. The most egregious one was with a woman who cancelled shortly after I pulled up after driving four miles to her. It was clearly more than five minutes and judging by her 4.6 rating, I'm fairly certain that it wasn't her first cancellation. But guess what? A big fat goose egg $0 on my invoice!

I'm wondering if it would be worth sending some of my email strings with CSR to the class action lawyer.


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## Mazda3 (Jun 21, 2014)

@newsboy559, You don't have a leg to stand on. According to the contract that YOU signed:

"In the event the User cancels a Request after you arrive at the designated pick-up location or does not show after you have waited at least 10 minutes, the User is subject to a cancellation fee. The amount of the cancellation fee will be as specified in the Service Fee Schedule. Notwithstanding the foregoing, you acknowledge and agree that, in the Company's sole discretion, a User's cancellation fee may be waived, in which case you will have no entitlement to any such fee."

So it is YOUR policy as well as Uber's because you signed off on the contract. I know it sucks. The only reason I know this at the moment because I never get paid any cancellation fees and I'm getting tired of it. I had to look up the contract because I was getting ready to fight a huge battle over it and read there's nothing we can do. I got the same canned email that you got.


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## scrurbscrud (Sep 11, 2014)

Mazda3 said:


> @newsboy559, You don't have a leg to stand on. According to the contract that YOU signed:
> 
> "In the event the User cancels a Request after you arrive at the designated pick-up location or does not show after you have waited at least 10 minutes, the User is subject to a cancellation fee. The amount of the cancellation fee will be as specified in the Service Fee Schedule. Notwithstanding the foregoing, you acknowledge and agree that, in the Company's sole discretion, a User's cancellation fee may be waived, in which case you will have no entitlement to any such fee."
> 
> So it is YOUR policy as well as Uber's because you signed off on the contract. I know it sucks. The only reason I know this at the moment because I never get paid any cancellation fees and I'm getting tired of it. I had to look up the contract because I was getting ready to fight a huge battle over it and read there's nothing we can do. I got the same canned email that you got.


My time and efforts are more valuable than dinking around for the 5 bucks. I'd just a soon cancel without pay and move on rather than stew for 10 min. for the 5'er which requires extensive tracking and followup. Screw it. It's just part of the game.

To make $ you have to make the wheels turn with pax no matter what. A driver does have to take some bad and some imperfections as a normal course of business no matter how frustrating it can and often is.


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## Mazda3 (Jun 21, 2014)

The time and effort was worth it. Uber paid me my $5.


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## newsboy559 (Oct 14, 2014)

scrurbscrud said:


> My time and efforts are more valuable than dinking around for the 5 bucks. I'd just a soon cancel without pay and move on rather than stew for 10 min. for the 5'er which requires extensive tracking and followup. Screw it. It's just part of the game.
> 
> To make $ you have to make the wheels turn with pax no matter what. A driver does have to take some bad and some imperfections as a normal course of business no matter how frustrating it can and often is.


Certainly, I understand, but when the problem is this widespread and downright egregious, it could translate into thousands of dollars over the course of a year for just one driver. If people wouldn't just bend over and let Uber rape them, maybe they would change their thinking.

It's not a matter of just not being able to collect on the $5 each time. It's a matter of also factoring in the extra gas and mileage that seriously affects our bottom line over time.

The way I see it, this matter and the deceptive tipping policy by Uber are the two most concerning things about the company.


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## LastGenerationHumanDriver (Oct 18, 2014)

The last night I chose to drive (Friday) I had 4 cancelations, a few of which were passengers rated between 4 and 4.5 (highly probable that they'd had a rider no show before). I used a stopwatch, waited until 5 mins 15 seconds, and received 0 cancellation fees. I suspect Uber is charging the customer and just pocketing these fees, in most instances. If they're going to keep this bullshit up, I'm just going to cancel when I've been waiting for a customer for more than 2 mins, 2 mins 30 seconds or so...


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## AintWorthIt (Sep 30, 2014)

2 more cancellations this weekend. I'm even waiting longer than five minutes. Neither one paid. Had one cancel on Lyft paid $5.


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## Watson (Sep 29, 2014)

To chi1cabby comments from last Wednesday. I had a student from USF in Tampa the other night tell me she was doing a marketing research project at school on ridesharing, but was having trouble learning about the drivers. So I gave her this blog address and told her check it out. Also, had some other paxs that say how great the service is and how can they help make sure it survives. I tell them to read this blog and see what the drivers are dealing with from Uber. We need the pax to not only help fight regulatory agencies but also push Uber to treat the drivers more fairly.


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## oracleofdoom (Nov 5, 2014)

On Friday night, I had one guy, Bobby, send me a request on Lyft, and immediately cancel, five times. Lyft paid me: zero dollars. How the f*** do they let somebody do that?


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## duggles (Aug 25, 2014)

oracleofdoom said:


> On Friday night, I had one guy, Bobby, send me a request on Lyft, and immediately cancel, five times. Lyft paid me: zero dollars. How the f*** do they let somebody do that?


If I ever get the same request twice in a row, I usually sign off for a minute or two to allow it to go to someone else before coming back to me again.


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## Dan_ator26 (Aug 15, 2014)

pengduck said:


> I think you should add the guarentees they offer and then don't pay. For Halloween we had guarentees and they did not honor them saying over the 4 hour period I had made more than the guarentee. The same thing with Saturday yet I was paid as previously with each hour being seperate.


I agree. I remember in the past that they would count each hour separate, but since the week before Halloween they tally it in aggregate. I went back and forth with Uber but they would not budge, only thing I could get them to agree to is that the language in the guarantees email from them is misleading.


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## Dan_ator26 (Aug 15, 2014)

chi1cabby said:


> I guess UberX drivers are very content with Uber's policies and practices on Cancellation Fees and Referral Bonuses.


I hate their policy, and have complained to them. As far as I am concerned, the first time cancellation forgiveness is fine, because often the cancel is accidental or something, but that should come out of Uber's pockets, not mine, in the same way that they do with the first ride free thing. The driver still gets paid for his/her service (or gas, tolls, etc.) Also, even the 5 minute thing is bogus because I can go pretty far in 5 minutes, so if I get a request, hop on the highway, then 4.5 minutes later get cancelled, I am out of position and have wasted gas. As far as I can tell, the 5 minute is from when I accepted the ride but maybe that isn't so? If it is indeed from when I hit 'arrived' then that sucks even more. Especially in El Paso where sometimes I drive 20 minutes to get to the location, since there aren't always too many drivers out.


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## pengduck (Sep 26, 2014)

Dan_ator26 said:


> I agree. I remember in the past that they would count each hour separate, but since the week before Halloween they tally it in aggregate. I went back and forth with Uber but they would not budge, only thing I could get them to agree to is that the language in the guarantees email from them is misleading.


I save all my e-mails because I know down the road Uber will have to pay us for a lot of things. Problem is your going to need your records, because I'm sur Uber's server will crash ala the IRS.


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## oracleofdoom (Nov 5, 2014)

I just would've thought Lyft would be more on top of that what with the SLOGing.


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## HisShadowX (May 19, 2014)

scrurbscrud said:


> It's probably a little more complex than what you are trying to pose Chi.


He's talking about a GOA which is an industry standard in the Taxi and the towing industry.


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## glcspuhler (Dec 14, 2014)

To make a good experience for Drivers, which in turn makes great experience for Riders, Uber (the multi-billion dollar company) should eat the $5.00 cancel fee and always pay the Driver no matter what. They should pay the $5.00 fee to Drivers for ALL cancellations. $5.00 here and there adds up fast, and I have wasted time and miles, and it is really getting annoying. I'd love to quit, but I cannot. Uber is yet another stingy, greedy corporation; really sad and pathetic.


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## Neil Strong (Dec 10, 2014)

Had 3 On Saturday. Two No shows and 1 rider cancel. I was not paid for any of them and UberAnnArbor cited first time cancel for the rider cancel. The two no shows i need to contact UberDetroit for still.


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## Neil Strong (Dec 10, 2014)

And all 3 were turned down citing rider's first cancel


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